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May 2, 2021 74 min

Today’s guest is Nic McKinley. Nic fuses counterintelligence methods with technology to solve big problems. One of those problems is human trafficking. By starting DeliverFund in 2014, Nic started the first nonprofit organization to apply counterterrorism methodologies to fight human trafficking. They disrupt the human trafficking market by providing intelligence and specialized analytics about human trafficking activities to law enforcement authorities. Nic is also the CEO of Verafi, a private intelligence and due diligence firm specializing in collecting, analyzing, and presenting intelligence so organizations can make confident decisions about key hires and investments. So, what makes Nic uniquely qualified to start and run these two organizations? Well, as an experienced Special Agent at the CIA and an Air Force Pararescueman, Nic understands the ramifications of bad intelligence and the disastrous consequences of poorly researched decisions. In this interview, we get into Nic’s time in the Air Force and the CIA, fighting human trafficking with DeliverFund, Verafi, and much more.


00:02:31 Growing up in Billings, Montana and sense of service

00:04:41 Interest in becoming an Air Force Pararescueman (PJ)

00:06:26 His time as a PJ

00:10:08 Initial interest in intelligence

00:14:29 Spending a couple years rescuing investment bankers

00:17:31 Joining the CIA

00:19:01 Differences between the CIA and the FBI

00:21:06 His role in the CIA and covert action

00:25:53 Is he the real Jack Ryan?

00:28:53 Why he hasn't owned a TV in 20 years

00:30:07 Handling personal relationships while in the CIA

00:34:30 Optimizing performance as a CIA Agent

00:36:35 Biggest takeaways from working in the CIA

00:39:28 Why he started DeliverFund

00:43:05 State of the human trafficking industry

00:47:43 Identifying a human trafficking victim

00:49:21 The problem with only focusing on rescuing victims

00:50:39 How people can support DeliverFund

00:51:56 Ultimate vision for DeliverFund

00:53:08 Why he started Verafi

00:56:37 Hypothetical use case for Verafi and why companies should use it

01:04:49 Biggest challenges facing Verafi as they look to grow over the coming years

01:06:52 Ultimate vision for Verafi

01:07:20 What he wants to accomplish 5 years from now

01:08:04 His daily routine

01:08:51 His driving force

01:12:36 Parting words of wisdom around decision making


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