Episode 403: ⚠️ Mastering the Art of Podcasting and AI in the Workplace ⚠️

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome everyone to another episode of Dynamics
Corner.
What does it take to do all ofthis, Brad?
I'm your co-host, Chris.

Speaker 2 (00:09):
And this is Brad.
This episode was recorded onJanuary 13th 2025.
Chris, Chris, Chris.
What does it take to do all ofthis?
That is a full question With us.
Today, we had the opportunityto speak with a guest to learn
about that, as well as rules andwhat is time for money, and

(00:34):
he's also another individualthat does all of this and then
some, With us.
Today, we had the opportunityto speak with Mark Smith.
Good morning, sir.

(01:00):
How are you doing?
The man himself and yourselfexcellent.
Thank you, excellent.
I I really enjoy speaking withuh podcast participants from
your location because you cometo us from the future that's
right, that's right it's tell mewhat.

Speaker 3 (01:19):
What lotto numbers?
What?
What's your next lotto comingup?
I'll tell you the numbers thatwin exactly, if you would please
do so.

Speaker 2 (01:27):
Um, it's.
It's something interesting tothink about as well, too,
because I think you're 18 hoursahead of us or ahead of me,
which yeah, is it.
I think he's 18 hours ahead.

Speaker 3 (01:39):
Of us it's morning, to him it's afternoon it's 8 am
in the morning for me on januarythe 14th to him it's afternoon.

Speaker 2 (01:46):
It's 8 am in the morning for me on january the
14th let's see, it's january the13th here.

Speaker 3 (01:55):
Wow, crazy a is it, isn't it crazy?
I tell you what I wish theycould.
They could update time zonestuff, you know, and, like one,
get rid of daylight savings allaround the world, and, um, I
reckon there'd be a new, modernway of doing time because, you
know, the current time systemwas based on, I think, the
railroad system is why they putthis concept of time zones.
It had to do with the railroadsystem way back in the day.
I remember reading years agoand I just think once again it's

(02:18):
something that we've inherited,like the QWERTY keyboard.

Speaker 2 (02:21):
Yes, it's one of those things that have been
around and we work withimplementations of ERP software
and in the case you work withPower Platform and such, which
we'll talk about on top of a fewother things.
But we always tell everybodydon't just do something, because
you've always done it.
I agree with you Get rid ofdaylight savings time.
We don't need it, and I eventhink we could get rid of time

(02:42):
zones, because I think we couldadapt to what we do at specific
times.
We go to bed and we wake up.
It doesn't need to be it wouldbe so much easier.
And then it would be on thesame day and you wouldn't be in
the future.

Speaker 3 (02:59):
Yeah, yeah, exactly Exactly.

Speaker 2 (03:02):
And also happy new year Same to you and we always
see Australia starts the newyear off, because early in the
morning for us it's January 1st,that's right For those in
Australia.
I've never been to Australia.

Speaker 3 (03:17):
I have to get over there With the MVP program back
when I joined, everybody aroundthe world, well out in the
Northern Hemisphere, would bewaiting for the 1st of January
to find out if they had.
You know if you're going to getit for the first time.
If you're going to get it andfor me it was always the 2nd of

(03:37):
January I had to wait till right.
It was never on the 1st, it wasactually on the 2nd you had an
extra day to wait.
It was weird, it was actually onthe second, you had an extra
day to wait.

Speaker 2 (03:46):
It was weird.
It was weird.
Yeah, that is funny it is.
It is Several things I waslooking to speak with you about
today and I appreciate your timeand taking the time to speak
with us.
Even so, from the future, andif anything happens, just let me
know so I can prepare as I goto bed tonight for the morning.

Speaker 3 (04:05):
I'll let you know when the apocalypse goes to
happen before it actually does,so you've got time to prep.

Speaker 2 (04:12):
I've got 21 hours.

Speaker 3 (04:13):
Yeah, there you go.

Speaker 1 (04:14):
He's 21 hours ahead of me, that is crazy.

Speaker 2 (04:19):
It's almost a day that's a day.
Is that challenging for youBecause I don't even know?
Is it challenging for youBecause I know here in the
United States most of theanybody within that region?
Do you have challenges?
Do you always go by?

(04:48):
You know UTC, or what do you doto?

Speaker 3 (04:50):
adapt.
The biggest thing is usingthings, tools now right to
mitigate it, but the hardestthing for me, like my company,
is a UK based company and we'reexactly 12 hours different, so
if I'm doing it 11 pm my time,it's 11 am in the morning there.
But getting that crossover inbusiness hours is difficult many

(05:16):
times, and so I've just gotused to working.
I'll work from anything frommidnight through to the early
hours of the morning.
That's like one shift of my day, and then the next shift is in
my daylight hours.

Speaker 1 (05:30):
How does that deal with your sleep?

Speaker 3 (05:31):
Yeah, yeah, I function pretty good on six
hours.
If I get six hours, I'm goodwith that, and yeah it works.

Speaker 2 (05:42):
You think you're good with it.
Read the book why we Sleep.
I read it recently.
Listen, think you're good withit.
Read the book why we Sleep.
I read it recently.

Speaker 3 (05:47):
Listen, I have an aura ring.

Speaker 1 (05:51):
And.

Speaker 3 (05:51):
I do monitor a lot and I'm trying to maintain to
get to like seven hours of sleep, just because I know it's good
for my health.

Speaker 2 (06:02):
But yeah, age is definitely excessive.
Oh, it is, it is.
It depends on what's going onin my life with the impact on
sleep.
But there was a period afterreading that book I made some
adjustments, not that the booktold me to make any adjustments.
The book just explains thephysiological effects of sleep
and things on sleep and therewere several days that I finally

(06:24):
felt refreshed, where I sleptthe entire I didn't get tired
the entire day, which was agreat feeling.
But you having that staggeredshift must be a challenge.

Speaker 3 (06:33):
Yeah, it's not all the time, right, it's periodic.
It's if I'm on a contract withMicrosoft and I'm delivering
training, you know I'll have afour hour block from, let's say,
2amm or something like that,depending on daylight saving
time zones and things, but I'moften doing pacific time in that
case in the us um no pacifictime.

Speaker 2 (06:54):
Yeah, that's the 18 hours, yeah it's 21 for him that
must be crazy with someonewho's just close to you, because
they would be 23 hours, sothey're closer to you
geographically but further fromyou.
So yeah, if you really thinkabout this time zone thing, we
do need to do away with it,because but like all these

(07:17):
things, like you know imperialand metric measurements, you got
big countries left and rightinside of the roads.

Speaker 3 (07:27):
You got big countries left and right inside of the
roads.
Those things you know.
People will die on their hillof why it needs to be the way it
always has been.

Speaker 2 (07:32):
So that's wild when the us was talking about
switching to the metric systemmany years ago I think I was
young.
I was all for it because it'sso much easier to just have.
I understand it's so mucheasier to have one system.
But I do also understand whythey say we already have so many
things in production.
But that mentality goes back towhat I'm saying Just because
you've done something foreverdoesn't mean you need to do it,

(07:54):
and eventually that would falloff.
So anything new would be all inthe metric system and anything
old would eventually either be atreasure or a valuable souvenir
.

Speaker 1 (08:09):
But it would fall off A relic If you watch Silo,
it'll be a relic.
That's a great show, by the way.

Speaker 3 (08:18):
Awesome.
Next week's the final.

Speaker 2 (08:20):
Which show is that again?

Speaker 3 (08:21):
Silo, it's on Apple.

Speaker 2 (08:24):
Silo.
I'm looking for a new show towatch With.

Speaker 1 (08:26):
Becca.

Speaker 3 (08:27):
Ferguson it's such a good show.
It's so good.
I've just got back into sci-fia bit because of AI and just how
you.
What has been sci-fi in thepast has become our reality in
so many different ways, and so Ilove this whole concept and

(08:47):
also I'm putting myself inbecause you know, the premise is
something happened on earth.
They put big boreholes down tothe earth and built these like
150, 200, story down into theearth um little cities that 10
000 people live in and, ofcourse, you're just getting a
lens of one silo, not realizingthat there's 50 of them.

Speaker 1 (09:07):
I'll have to check it out.
I just check it out, right.

Speaker 2 (09:09):
I will, I will.
I'm looking, as I had mentioned, I'm looking for a new show.
I just finished Tulsa Kingseason two last night, so I try
to watch one show.

Speaker 3 (09:25):
It's part of my routine to unwind in the evening
before I go to bed.
So it is an unwinding thing,right, like if I come off a
podcast or a, a meeting you knowat, you know, between 10 and 11
o'clock at night, um, becauseI'm doing time zone in the uk, I
will just be my brain's fizzingand it just.
You need something to settle it, you know you do.

Speaker 1 (09:41):
That's why I do a book and a show before bed and I
don't know, silas, when it'slike sometimes you watch movies
where, like, it requires you tothink it's like wow, this is
fascinating.
Silas, one of them, you knowit's like wow it could happen,
yeah, yeah that's the thing,right.

Speaker 3 (09:57):
I love any show that's kind of on the brink of
reality, and that's why I thinkI've liked sci-fi again a lot,
because in the era of ai thatwe're living in, you can just
see so much more things becomingplausible yes, I agree with you
on shows that could be real.

Speaker 2 (10:19):
I don't like those far-fetched.
You know chris runs into a bar.
You know 14 000 men shoot athim with a gun and he never gets
hit, but he manages to killeverybody.
Those I don't get into, butthose that are plausible I get
so into, because it's like thatcould be real.

Speaker 3 (10:36):
It's believable that it could happen.
My pet peeve in movies is whenthe protagonist almost gets
beaten up to the point of deathor whatever.
But you know they're theprotagonist, so they're not,
they're gonna win.
Yeah.
And you know, like in fightscenes and stuff, they almost

(10:56):
get there, you know, beatentotally down, and then last
minute it's like there's a newwind of strength they have and
they come back right and you'rejust like, come on, like yeah
and I have those conversations.

Speaker 2 (11:10):
I said because, if that was, if you watched a bar
fight, a bar fight doesn't lastfor 30 minutes.
A bar fight typically lasts fora couple hits and then people
are down and out, whatever.
The only show that I said willsay that I liked and it goes
with what you had said, was gameof thrones, because game of
thrones you could like somebody.
You watched them and they didlike they, they really did that

(11:31):
well because, yeah, yeah, theprotagonist was the protagonist
until he was dead.
Yeah, you know it's not likethree seasons later, where you
know he got beat up and shot andhe's hanging on, you know, by
limb, by limb, that's all goodfun.

Speaker 3 (11:45):
You know what though?
The only fight type movies backin the day, steven Seagal right
.

Speaker 1 (11:51):
Yes.

Speaker 3 (11:52):
His movies it never looked like he was going to lose
the fight Right.
But you go to a James Bondmovie you go to any of these,
they almost look like they'regoing to, you know, get taken
out and then they recover andit's like the other thing is
some of the hits and fights herelike there's no way that person
would have come off the ground.
Yeah, absolutely correct.
And it's the same thing Likeepisode two of season one.

Speaker 2 (12:13):
We already know there's three seasons.
Yeah, the guy's not dying.
Yeah, but but with that, beforewe jump into the conversation.
I could talk about this allafternoon or all morning or
whatever we are today, butbefore we jump into the
conversation, would you mindtelling us a little bit about
yourself?

Speaker 3 (12:35):
Yes, I'm a guy, I have a microphone 21 hours in
the future.
Yeah, yeah, this is the future.
Talking to you, yeah, so whatdo I say about myself?
I love tech, I love life, Ilove the future of possibilities
.
I love the fact that we're notdefined by who we're brought up.

(12:59):
You know, you can change things.
One phrase I I love and I readit in a book by this indian
author some years ago was theconcept of brules, um, which is
basically a play on the wordrules and the play on the word
bullshit.
Right, bullshit, rules arebrules, and that often we're

(13:19):
brought up with these rules inour life that are literally your
parents.
They were trying to control youin a situation, so they made a
rule If you pull a face and thewind changes, your face is going
to get stuck like that, right,that's an extreme one, but the
thing is is that there's so manymore subtle ones that you have

(13:40):
through life.
And the example he gave in thebook was, you know, he's brought
up in india a culture, ofcourse, where they don't tend to
eat cows or meat and amcdonald's came to town and he
saw the burger, you know, andthe big juicy patty in it, and
he said to his mom, I'm gonnaeat that and, like she, like you
can't.
Well, you can't becausereligious reasons, blah, blah,

(14:02):
blah.
He was like, yeah, that was abullshit rule, that was a brawl.
So he goes, he went.
Nah, that was the best decisionof his life, totally loved it,
you know.
And the thing is is that there'sso many subtle ones, of those
that condition us, though, inlife.
And so, you know, in the areaof tech, you know Satya, I just
watched an hour and a half longpodcast of him yesterday that he

(14:25):
just recently did, and he goesback to that whole how he moved
Microsoft by.
You know Carol Dweck's book,mindsets fixed in an open
mindset, and I just think thatthis you can really be, and, of
course, if the folks that have amindset to go, no, you can't.

(14:46):
You know, you can do and bewhatever you want in this tech
space, um, that you want.
If you want it like it ispossible.
I just love the like unlimitednature of things.
So I know that's a weird way ofdescribing who I am, but it
kind of gives you a feel of howI think and yeah, I appreciate
that, I really appreciate that.

Speaker 2 (15:05):
Uh, something else that you do is you do podcasts
yeah, yeah, and I just I justlaunched it.

Speaker 3 (15:12):
Well, I haven't launched it, I've just recorded
my first episode of a total newpodcast, uh, tail ender last
week.
So I've been podcasting foreight years now.

Speaker 2 (15:22):
Um, I think today I just published 641, 41st episode
, um 641 episodes in eight years, that's that's amazing and a
few few that is amazing, and Isee so many podcasts popping up,
and podcasts are becoming morepopular as far as listenership

(15:46):
is concerned, because I, to me,they're easy.
I listen to a lot of thembecause you hear information
from other people, right it's nolonger just uh, somebody that
has a big corporation or a lotof financing, because now you
get a microphone, they have manyservicesailable for you to
publish it, rather inexpensiveand you can put Information out.

(16:08):
There's a lot of good contentAvailable and I like it.

Speaker 3 (16:13):
There's a rawness to it as well, like even watching
this video with Sachi the otherday, which was a video podcast.
Is how it was done.
He had two Interviewers and Ifeel you get an insight into
somebody that can't be fullycurated right they asked him
questions and you could see hewould pause.

(16:34):
He had to think about how he wasgoing to respond.
You could see, in somesituations he had to play um
very tactfully because hedoesn't want to release um nda
stuff that's coming, you know.
And then there's the whole.
You could see him dartingaround legal ramifications of

(16:55):
how he could answer right, andso it was just.
It was interesting to see thatum, the choreography, if you
like, of the conversation andthen also the interviewer
knowing, when they had exhausteda line of questioning, that no

(17:15):
matter how much they pressed it,he wasn't going any further,
and to be able to read thatnuance.
And I suppose this is the way Ilook at it, because last week I
did three days of my podcastrecording and I record in three
days a month.
That's when I do my recordings.
So I did three days, abouteight podcasts a day last week

(17:36):
Tuesday, wednesday, thursday.
So, and the thing is here, I am, you know, my eighth year of
doing it and it could get tired.
Yet that week was the mostinvigorating week to me ever,
because I just feel like youkeep going to a new level of I
so want to connect with thisguest that I've got on and

(17:59):
really go.
I suppose what I've come assuper, super curious about other
people's lenses on whatever, asin their view, what I mean by
lenses on the world andeverybody has something to
contribute and the way they lookat it can totally change the
way I look at it, and so it'sbecoming, you know, I was saying

(18:21):
to my wife, I'm just lovingrecording this year.
It's just so, you know,exciting to me and I just feel
like we're uncovering newconcepts and ideas all the time
and I use that to feed mynarrative and how, whatever I'm
working on.
So, yeah, it's definitely notI'm not getting sick of it, it's

(18:42):
just like I feel like 2025 isjust a whole new power band, you
know, level up.
I feel the same.
I feel the same.

Speaker 2 (18:53):
You had so much in there that I want to comment on
and I have to wait.
So three days a month you doyour recordings.

Speaker 3 (19:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:01):
And you did eight podcasts a day over those three
days yeah that has to be prettyexhausting, number one.
But also to go back to what yousaid with the, the being
invigorated by the conversationwith the guests.
One thing I know that I getchris and I talk about this, but
I'll speak for myself for themoment.

(19:21):
Chris can comment on histhoughts on it, but I have a
feeling I understand histhoughts as well from our
conversations.
That's one of the things I havea passion about with this, I
think, with technology, in theway that the world is in the
opportunity to meet individualsfrom different cultures,
different countries, differentorganizations, to be able to

(19:42):
talk with them and really get agood understanding not even a
good understanding, but just toget, as you had mentioned, the
perspective of someone else.
It's enlightening in a sense,and I've learned so much from
just doing this podcast with theconversations.

Speaker 1 (20:00):
So yeah, I feel the same way, because you do have a
brand new perspective of thethings that you think you knew
or I knew, and realize like, oh,that's a good way to put it,
and the fact that, uh, thetechnology now it allows us to
do this right, like I mean,you're 21 hours ahead of me and

(20:20):
and being able to learn how doyou use certain technology in
your part of the world that'sdifferent from mine, and it does
allows me to go back andrethink of how I should approach
certain things as well.

Speaker 2 (20:35):
It's fascinating.

Speaker 1 (20:36):
And I'm white belt for life, right?
I always tell Brad that.

Speaker 3 (20:39):
It's like that's my mindset.

Speaker 1 (20:40):
I got to learn it.
I got to learn it.

Speaker 3 (20:42):
That is so cool.
I'm going to note that one downstraight off.
It was just like a connectingconcept, right.

Speaker 2 (20:48):
Yeah, very cool it's.
Another good thing with thepodcast is Chris Adventure.
You just many people I'vebecome friendly with too, and
you know everybody bringssomething to it as well, and
it's always great to see somesomeone in person.
And I enjoy Chris's saying too,because in this day, 2025, the

(21:11):
way technology is moving and howmany things are being created,
you know it's not like it was.
You know, a thousand years ago,a hundred years ago, I mean,
how long did it take to you know, for us to forge steel?
you know back from hands.
You know, if you look at theamount of time it took in the
Industrial Revolution to createthings versus the amount of time
it does now.
Nobody can know everything.

(21:32):
You can know some things, and Idon't even think anybody can
know anything about a particulartopic anymore.
I think you can know a lot, soyou are always constantly
learning.
So you've done eight years, 641episodes.
You definitely have to have apassion for it and you have how
many different podcasts that youdo?

Speaker 3 (21:53):
So I have one podcast called the Microsoft Business
sorry, that was the old name,the Microsoft Innovation Podcast
podcast and within it there isnow five shows.

(22:14):
So there's the.
The og was, when I was justdynamics 365.
Right, this is pre-powerplatform days and so it was very
much focused around that and sosome of the shows have changed
names over time or I've retiredthe show.
So as my career kind oftransitioned from Dynamics into
Power Platform that show, thePower Platform show became one
of my key shows.

(22:34):
Then I had a show called thePower 365 show where I only
interviewed Microsoft FTEs onthat show, generally product
team type folks on that show.
It's now been renamed to theco-pilot show because every
Microsoft employee needs to bethinking about selling AI
nowadays Now that Microsoft isan AI company, and so that's

(22:57):
been a transition that I've made.
I have another show, that is theMVP show, where I endeavored to
interview all the MVPs inMicrosoft BizApps and that was
like four or five years ago.
I started that thinking that Iwould exhaust that list and I
have never been able to exhaustthat list and that's only

(23:20):
BizApps MVPs.
I just made the decision inabout November last year is that
I'm going to stop justrecording Microsoft BizApps MVPs
and I'm going to go broader.
I'm going to just seek out MVPsthat I reckon have a different

(23:42):
view on things and tech, and mychanges that I've seen and how
my career has evolved is that Icannot just stick within the one
vertical category anymore,because I feel everything's
blending, and particularly ai isblending everything.
You know m365 has becomemassively on my radar in the

(24:03):
last year because of copilot,and if you want to edit them
with copilot studio, which was abiz apps product, you've got
this whole blend now, and nowwith um foundry, it's like now
we're over in the azure space.
Um, everything ai has somethingto do with data.
So that means well, you've gotto go into to fabric, right?

(24:25):
You can't not be in fabric umas part of it, and then security
is always prevalent.
So that takes you into purviewyou, and so I'm just finding you
.
Where I've traditionally stayedwithin the single lane, it's now
in the consulting with the, thetype of customers I work with.
I've got to have this broaderlens of microsoft's full

(24:47):
offering to bring to the to bear.
But of course I'm no longer.
My role is no longer working ona specific tool like people.
Other people do that, but Ineed to be able to be able to
stretch strategy more broadlyacross this entire tool set
rather than just one.
So the exposure is justincreasing.
Then I have this other showcalled the Ecosystem Show, and

(25:11):
that's five of us that go on andwe just riff on whatever around
ecosystem architecture, and soonce again, that's bringing
really.
It's more aimed, I suppose,suppose at enterprise architects
the conversation and reallyholistically looking at your
entire data estate, your entiretool stack and this can involve

(25:37):
um outside microsoft.
So you know, would that be pega, sap, oracle service, now any
number of other products?
But how do you really look atecosystem as an architecture
model?
Because it really affects whereyou let data reside, and in the

(25:58):
past, most ecosystems are builtaround a single big thing, like
if it's SAP is your core thing,and then it's a case of
everyone try to retrofiteverything into that one thing,
and so you don't necessarily getthe best outcome for the
organization.
So that one's just a great onewhere it's a totally different
format than just, you know,one-to-one interviewing.

(26:20):
And then the one that I justkicked off is the, the um.
The ai advantage is a new showthat I'm just uh about.
So just uh recorded one episodelast week.
We'll get probably two episodesmore in the can before I go to
publish, just so I've got it ina pipeline of that.
But this is all about how do Ire-skill, no matter what my job

(26:46):
in an AI world, so how do I?

Speaker 2 (26:51):
apply the skills I need to grow.

Speaker 3 (26:58):
If I'm a school teacher, if I'm a lawyer, if I'm
a CEO, the way you work youneed to totally re-skill, and so
it's really going to bebringing people on that are what
are they doing to re-skill?
Because I'm really into AI froma how do I practically apply it
?
Because I feel there's so muchone snake oil out there, there's

(27:19):
so much marketing out there andthere's so much um theory out
there.
But I want to know how do Ipractically move the dial in
what I do each day that I can?
Because I think the biggestadvantage we have as humans that
I don't think robots and or aiis going to have is our ability

(27:42):
to potentially 100x what we do,because if we cyborg ourselves
with AI right, in other words,we use AI to enhance and assist
everything we do.

Speaker 2 (27:55):
This is where the sci-fi is coming in right here,
just like the good old.

Speaker 3 (27:58):
Well, here's the crazy thing.
Right, this device.
Right, people have been acyborg for some time.
They just don't realize it'scalled a, a smartphone.
But how much of everything dowe do is an extension?
Ourselves are now extended tothis device in some way, so we

(28:21):
are now electronically assistedin just about everything we do
all the time.

Speaker 2 (28:26):
Yes, I could talk to you for days.
I could already tell, becausethere's so much to unpack on
here.
You're doing a lot of shows.

Speaker 1 (28:37):
You are doing a lot.

Speaker 2 (28:38):
I do want to get back to that re-skilling for AI,
also with the position of AIencompassing and blending
everything together, because inessence it does, because now AI
is, I almost think we'll be ableto have that point of create me

(29:00):
this thing, you go to bed, youwake up and it's there 100%.

Speaker 3 (29:04):
I believe and it's there, a hundred percent I
believe that future's coming.

Speaker 2 (29:05):
And then the reskilling is true as well.
Some of these things are toughto put your head around.
You really have to open yourmind and release the bounds.
It goes back to your brules,which I'm going to take that as
well.
We put ourselves in boxes andwe think that some things are
not possible, ourselves in boxesand we think that some things

(29:27):
are not possible.
But you have to take a stepback, because you do need to
think differently when you'reworking with AI.
Just like you know how manyyears ago we used to go into the
field and pick vegetables andthen we created machinery to
make that job easier and theneventually do most of it for us,
right?
So then the person that managedthe farm, they would do other

(29:48):
things, but they had tobasically reskill themselves to
become more productive, I guessyou could say for lack of better
terms for the conversation, uh,within there.
So we need to do that.
So I can't wait to hear thatone.
I I just, can you just throw meon?

Speaker 1 (30:02):
I just want to listen to the conversations and just
jump in and just chime in everynow and then, get tuned in on
those.

Speaker 2 (30:08):
That is, that is fast .
That topic is fascinating to me, it's interesting to me, but
now you have all these shows soI want to just we're gonna,
we'll branch off to the ai andthe power platform and stuff
momentarily, if we have theopportunity, yeah.
But I see a lot of podcasts.
I I talk a lot of individuals.
A podcast, Chris and I do thispodcast and we know what it
takes to to to put up thepodcast and what drives the

(30:29):
podcast to.
You know, keep it alive.
How do you?
How do you do it?
So you do three days a month,24 episodes according.
If my math is right, I can domath still soon I won't be able
to, and then my smartphonedevice will be plugged into my
head and it would just come upfor me.
I wouldn't even have to think.
It would just say 24 episodes.

(30:50):
How do you keep up with it?
How do you manage this?
How do you produce it?
How do you keep up with thework?
And you obviously have a familyand a job with it.

Speaker 3 (31:04):
You obviously have a family and a job with it.
Yeah, so I've always my thingin business and in life.
That is my kind of the way Iview things is how can I scale
Right?
How can I scale anything I do?

(31:27):
When I, when I started my 90-daymentoring challenge I was in
London at the time and I didn'twant to interview sorry, I
didn't want to mentor three orfour people a year I was like
how could I, how could I mentora hundred people a year?
How could I mentor a thousandpeople a year?
Like right now I'm looking, howcan I mentor two thousand
people a year?
Um, like right now I'm looking,how can I mentor 2,000 people a
year?
And so I look at everythingfrom how can I scale something?

(31:48):
And one of the things that youknow years ago, before I got
into IT, I was in the medicalindustry and around
manufacturing and clean roomsand I had this mentor that I
actually went to North Africawith, who is a scientist for

(32:08):
this organization called theFred Hollows Foundation, and
what they do is that a lot ofpeople go blind because they get
cataract blindness in thatcountry costing $30, chop out
the lens at the front of the eyeon both eyes and put in what's
called an interocular lens,which is made out of Perspex

(32:31):
basically, and somebody that wastotally blind can now totally
see 100%, and good for him, wowfor $30.
For $30.

Speaker 2 (32:42):
Which currency?
Because $30 in the UnitedStates isn't even getting you a
pen in the opera, in the.

Speaker 3 (32:48):
In the reception room right, 30 us and in in.
If I, if you were to do thatoperation right now in the U?
S, that's about a 15 to $20,000operation.
If I was doing it in my country, that would be around a five
thousand dollar operation, um todo that right.
So here's the crazy thing.

(33:09):
So this guy you know um, so theguy went with.
But anyhow, this big conceptaround this, this word kaizen,
which is a um, a japanese term,right of constant improvement,
and so I, I use that, I and andI look at and I look at scaling
through batching, if I can stopcontext switching and get into a

(33:30):
mindset of of, let's say, inthis case, podcasting.
I know my day is going to flowso well because I am not doing
podcasting one episode here andthen I'm off working on an ERD
for a project or sitting downand having an executive

(33:52):
discussion in the next meeting.
I block out those three daysTuesday, wednesday, thursday
because it works well with thetime offset for Mondays and
Fridays and other people's timezones and I use Calendly for
scheduling.
I have a lady in Canada thatruns all my scheduling of the
guests, so she handles.

(34:13):
You know, apart from me I willalways identify the guest.
But just here's an example ofscale.
But just here's an example ofscale.
So on the weekend I extractedfrom the Ignite website every
single person that deliveredfrom Microsoft an Ignite session

(34:36):
on AI, right, cross-referencethat.
So I extract that, I give it tomy scheduling lady and I get
her to put that into aspreadsheet.
Was their session, what was thesession title, what was their
name, what's their linkedin url,which she has gone and looked
up on linkedin for that person,right?

(34:56):
I then reached out to 63 ofthose people with a personal
message about the Ignite session.
They did and I'm not saying Iwant them to come and talk about
that particular session, I'msaying, hey, I want to talk
about AI with you.
And I then, basically, you know, created a template, swapped

(35:23):
out their name, their sessionand that was it, and added their
email address.
And so I went through, sentthose all out Now today, because
of time zone, right, coming onwith the US, et cetera.
Now they're flowing in andpodcasting gives you
unbelievable access.

Speaker 2 (35:43):
Yes.

Speaker 3 (35:44):
I don't care if Judson at Microsoft, right,
who's like one level down fromSatya, did a session, I've
emailed him, I've reached out tohim, right, and of course one
of my things are you might feelyou're not the right fit, so who
on your team is?
And so this morning I have anemail here where this guy has

(36:07):
introduced me to the lady thatauthored microsoft graph wow
that's excellent.
I've looked her up on linkedin.
She's a vice, so she's a vicepresident of that category and
he has referred, referred herand she's in the email thread
now with her boss saying, hey,you should come on this podcast.

Speaker 2 (36:31):
That's amazing.
See that's the way to do it.
I like that.
Yes, chris, I'm taking notes,don't you worry.

Speaker 3 (36:38):
And so and here's the other thing, the number I've
had multiple CVPs from Microsofton the podcast.
I would never have that accessto these people outside of
having a platform that allows meto elevate them.
Just wouldn't be interested,wouldn't be interested and so I

(36:59):
do everything on a scale.
So, as I say, she does all thatscheduling and so there's a
two-part process to that.
I always do a briefing callright with them where we're
going to think about topics andthemes, but also lets them feel
comfortable that because for along time was funny in
podcasting I'd have people reachout and go you should have

(37:21):
grilled that person on thatpoint.
You should not let them off thehook on that like and I'm like
listen, I'm not a celebritytabloid I'm gonna hold you to an
account like.
The last thing I want is myguests to feel uncomfortable on
the show, because I want them tocome back next year or the year
after as they've progressed intheir careers.

(37:43):
I want it to be a goodexperience for them, and so
that's extremely important to me.
And so what else do I do?

Speaker 2 (37:53):
That is important, by the way, and we have the same
belief with that is we want tohave a conversation with
somebody because we want peopleto come back to speak with us
again, but we also want otherpeople to speak with us.
So some think that the podcastis meant to be a point to put
someone on the hot seat.
I mean, yes, you can ask themquestions if you know of

(38:14):
something or whatever, but youdo have to know when to stop,
because it's important and Ithink that's where some podcasts
become more successful, becausethe people listening to it can
relate to the conversation.
It's not rehearsed and it's nota marketing, you know, again,
for the sake of the conversation, it's not a pre-planned,
pre-fabricated conversation.

(38:35):
It's a real world conversationwith, in your case, some of the
members of the Microsoft teamthat you know hold positions for
products or areas that aresignificant, and that's a key
point.

Speaker 1 (38:48):
Yeah, we focus a lot on the human side because you
know there's always going to betechnology and people behind the
product, but we want to knowwho that person is.
You know they're someone thatthey can relate to, like what
Brad is saying, right, and it'sseeing from someone else's
perspective and where they'recoming from.
So in a way, for me, the way Iview it, it's seeing from
someone else's perspective andwhere they're coming from.
Um, so in a way, for me, theway I view it, it's almost like

(39:09):
an indirect mentorship, becauseI'm sure people are maybe
listening and said hey, thatsounds like me.
How did they get there?
And then they share their story.
It's like, oh, I see the paththey took and, um, and hearing
that in return it.
That's what I thrive and Ienjoy that getting to know
people.

Speaker 3 (39:26):
Yeah, I like it.
I like it.
So, just to wrap that out, I umso use cattle calendarly to do
all the scheduling.
That just aligns all thedifferent time zones right so
easily.
Um, and then I do the podcastrecording.
I use riverside like this, evenlike I'm impressed with your
guys background.

(39:47):
I haven't seen that featurethat I could change out that
background and I noticed it wason the land in as well.
Um, are you on the veryexpensive plan?

Speaker 2 (39:57):
I don't know.
It was one of those I paid forthe year um.
I'll have to look at the planto see which plan we have.

Speaker 3 (40:05):
It's the same plan as me, because, as in from the,
the plan above, this is liketens of thousands of dollars,
it's like yeah it's, it's weirdhow they go.
It's like economical because Iwas like one day I was like book
a call with us to talk aboutthe next level and what you get.
So I had this call and it'slike, yeah, it's about ten

(40:27):
thousand dollars a year.
I'm like, yeah, I'm a hobbypodcaster.
Like that ain't necessary.
Like this is just all I want todo is allow another person on my
account, right, so I could havea separate login, which is
that's amazing.

Speaker 2 (40:43):
Oh yeah, it's funny how that goes.
It goes from one person to twopeople, but the cost for one to
two people you might as wellwrite your own software.

Speaker 3 (40:55):
I think it is a great tool, though it makes.
I can't say enough how and theyjust keep improving it.
I've never come across a pieceof software.

Speaker 2 (41:05):
They keep dropping value all the time yeah, every
day and I really appreciate thetechnology that.
When chris and I started, westarted like most people.
We started with teams, then wewent to Zoom go to meeting or
Zoom.

Speaker 1 (41:20):
Then we went to Zoom.

Speaker 2 (41:22):
And then, you know, as we got more into it, had more
guests and sort of you know forlack of a better term was found
on sort of niche.
We're like we really need to beable to have separate audio
tracks, separate video tracksand.
Riverside's method of locallysaving and uploading those so

(41:42):
you get the web recording andthose is wonderful, because I
can't tell you how many callswe've had with individuals such
as yourself that are way awayand you have internet issues,
you have connectivity issues andwhen the final publication
comes, you can't even tell thatthere was a challenge.

Speaker 3 (42:01):
So this dude blew my mind last week.
He was from Spain and he worksfor Microsoft on doing a lot of
their stuff that goes to YouTubeand so I wanted to do a behind
the scenes like how does it allwork?
And he blew my mind withRiverside.

(42:24):
He gets, he gets his get hitthe the interviewer from
Microsoft to log on on asmartphone into Riverside and
just set that up at a on youknow, a tripod or whatever, and
that's another total, differentcamera view, so I can actually
be logged in twice with my phoneas another camera whoa wait,
wait a second, wait a second.

Speaker 1 (42:41):
So yeah, unbelievably man mind-blowing because you
can just mute the phone rightwhile you just have another
video and think about it, and soone of his things that he does
is hold on a second so I canrecord.

Speaker 2 (42:54):
I'm so if I logged in on my phone right now, right
right now, you in on my phoneright now, right now you could
join this session right now.

Speaker 1 (43:00):
And have a different camera angle.

Speaker 3 (43:02):
And now have a camera angle up to the side or
wherever you place it, and it'sgoing to record its own channel,
right, its own video.
So now you're just creatingB-roll that you can use to mix
up.
So this guy, what he does forthe topness at microsoft, what
he does is he jumps out of umcharacter and talks to his

(43:24):
audience while he's interviewingsomebody, as he does this.
So what he does is that he'llturn to the camera and go can
you believe what this guy'ssaying?
And then when they do that, cutthat up and post.
It looks like it's justperfectly and he'll do a cup.
You know a couple of those thatwill never make the cut, but on

(43:45):
camera, on the video, it justmight look so cool because he's
just like breaking the third oneis you know so to speak from a
dramatic perspective.

Speaker 2 (43:54):
Yeah, they use riverside too that's, yeah, I
can't say enough how greatriverside is.
But, chris, you know exactlywhat I'm thinking.
Because because, do youremember the time?
We had a time where chrislogged in?
I logged in, we went, everybodywas in the same room and we
couldn't, you know, get it alltogether.
We wanted the camera, but themicrophones were picking up.
It became a challenge becauseof the feedback.

Speaker 1 (44:15):
But now, with that, wow it's such a I'm always
learning from you mark, becauselast time we spoke, you gave me
some stuff you both?

Speaker 3 (44:24):
would you know if you're both in the same room?
On that scenario, both gotmobile phones right, so now you
got two other cameras.
You're going to add theadditional camera feeds right to
the maximum that riverside willtake.

Speaker 2 (44:34):
Yeah, I think it's eight people you can have into a
call which.

Speaker 1 (44:39):
I'm mind blown.
Now I am Chris.
This is See, we're alwayslearning something from Mark.
You see, his OG's been this fora long time.
I'm learning, I'm learning.

Speaker 2 (44:49):
It was 641 episodes it's so I see a lot of podcasts
coming and going in.
You know the course of my dayand the course of my week.
And I understand it.

Speaker 3 (45:06):
Is there even a loo?
What they're committing to?

Speaker 2 (45:09):
Yeah, that's what I was going to say.
So a question I have here andwhat you just spoke about with
you know some of the thingshaving someone help you.
There is work behind it.
It does look easy to just sitdown and have a conversation,
but there's post-production ifyou want it to look well, if you
want it to sound well.
So I see a lot of them come andgo, but you've been doing it

(45:31):
for eight years 641 episodesshows that have transitioned
appropriately as the timeschange, because you need to
update and stay fresh.
If you could give advice, ortwo things one advice to
somebody who's interested instarting a podcast or who has a
podcast, what you think thatthey should know, or some words

(45:52):
of wisdom to be successful withstarting a podcast, continuing a
podcast, and what it takes fora podcast to be produced.

Speaker 3 (46:04):
I would say the fundamental thing that you need
to nail is the ability to listen, and I know it's not technical
or anything, but the reason thatI've gone so long is that my
fundamental goal from day onewas to use the podcast.
The reason the selfish reason Istarted podcasting was I needed

(46:27):
a practical way to learn how tolisten.

Speaker 2 (46:32):
Interesting.
I like that.

Speaker 3 (46:33):
Right, I'd been in management positions for so long
.
I was really good at tellingpeople what to do and that I was
the smartest person in the roomalways.
Right, that's how I acceleratedmy career, because I was
generally the smartest person inthe room, and with that comes a

(46:55):
belief that you're movingbeyond a white belt right to use
your medical.
Yeah, that was good, that wasgood and, and I want to, um, I
really wanted to like, honestly,I had a sign on my computer, uh
, like a post-it note on myscreen, which said shut the fuck

(47:17):
up, um, which was telling mebecause I would see that ask
your question and then shut up,let them tell.
You know, not have to add mystory to everything.
You know why my view is thisand blah, blah, blah.
No, it's, let's make them thesuperstar and let's really
listen, and that's why I'velearned so much, so much, so

(47:39):
much from my guests.
So that's the fundamental thing.
The other thing don't expendmoney on tech.
Do it for the minimum you canuntil you realize that this is
something you seriously want todo.
And on day one you might beserious, like I just saw someone
mentioned this morning onanother call that I had with a
guy in Brazil and he was sayingyeah, I've just been invited to

(48:00):
be a guest on this podcast andyou know this individual started
this podcast.
I've just finished mentoringhim on my 90-day mentoring
challenge last year and he'sdoing like so many things and I
know it's almost like he'strying lots of things.
But will he be podcasting in ayear's time?
I don't know.

(48:20):
It'll all depend on whetherthat's the thing that sticks for
him or not.
So but then you get thesepeople that go out and go.
Well, it's all about the tech.
I need to go get all the besttech I need.
You know, I never had the sure.
As you know, um, what is it asure sm7.
I never had that.
On day one, when I was sittingin Nottingham in the United
Kingdom doing a world travel inmy cousin's apartment, I had my

(48:45):
laptop on my surface on my.
The camera was on that, themicrophone, that was it.
You know.
The hum of the fan came throughin the audio.
It was low tech man, I.
But the thing is, sometimes youjust got to get going and then
trust the process that you'llget better.
With time your things willbecome more important.

(49:07):
This is my fourth microphone.
I think I'm on now, as I have,you know, learned and seen
others, and you know my wife isabout to get into podcasting and
I didn't get her a Shure SM7B.
Rode have got a brilliantpodcast microphone out there,

(49:27):
which I think is you know wherethis one's.
This microphone's been aroundfor years and used in the audio
industry.
It's the.
The newer ones are designed forum for the.
You know the world ofpodcasting, but if you get a
blue yeti I'll come and kill younever get a blue yeti
microphone.
It is the shittiest soundingover so many background noises

(49:50):
with that right, um, that thatsomebody could ever use, um, but
yeah, so you iterate over timeand, like even Riverside, you
know the current software thatI'm using.
I've been through fourdifferent other softwares even
that were dedicated forpodcasting, outside of those
ones, like you know, I'verecorded on Skype for business.

(50:12):
I wouldn't say I record on link.
I think Link had gone by thetime I first started podcasting.

Speaker 2 (50:18):
Wow, talk about a time machine.

Speaker 3 (50:20):
It's crazy.
It's crazy the stuff that.
But you get better and you getbetter and you know there's
multiple different formats thatyou can do podcasts in.
That's why I've just foundrecently I'm branching out into
like only last year did I do asolo podcast for the first time,
recording where I riffed for 30minutes myself and I was like,

(50:44):
wow, I had never done that and Iusually took 30 minutes talking
to myself on air.

Speaker 2 (50:49):
Um, but yeah, it was crazy, it's crazy and as long as
you get something out of it foryourself, that's all that
matters matters.
What you had just mentioned isimportant To me.
Listening to you goes to yourpoint and that is also something
that I have learned.
I get anxious sometimes tospeak because I don't want to
lose my train of thought, so Itry to jot down notes of things

(51:11):
so I can go back to it, becauseI want to hear what you have to
say.
Because speaking with someonelike you, you have so much to me
in the short words that you'resaying Like you just talked
about some things, but youuncover it so much about what it
takes to be a podcast about.
You know you don't need thetech, you just need the process.
You need to, and I think alsonot having the tech helps you

(51:33):
with the process, because youlearn how to progress, not just
saying I have the fanciest micand now the microphone's not
working, so this is garbage,it's you kind of have to go
through the evolution of it,which is important.
And the big thing is the passionfor it, which what I heard you

(51:54):
say I'm just going with you,like these are the things that I
was thinking with it, tellingyou my story.
Right, what you just told menot to do, I'll do so it's.
But for you to be able to sitand talk with yourself and just
go off and talk says a lot,because you have a passion for
the podcast, you have a passionfor the topic that you want to

(52:16):
speak about, which is anotherthing that you know.
If I could throw in somethingis is you have to have a passion
behind this, because it is.
It is a lot of work, and if youthink of it as work or you
think you're going to get X fromit, you're not, it's, it's
something that you have to do,it for the reason of passion,

(52:37):
and we, we have planning callstoo, when I tell everybody,
chris, and when we talked, also,it's, you know, if it's
relatable and somebody can getsomething from it.
And every single time I say,even if it's only me, yeah,
because my goal is that somebodycan get something from the
podcast, even if it's myself,and I've always appreciated
learning from the individualsthat we speak with, and you do

(52:57):
it by listening.

Speaker 3 (52:58):
Totally, I love it.
I love it.
It's not cheap, by the way.
So my wife, we've got intobusiness together in the last 24
months 12 months really.

Speaker 2 (53:11):
Oh no, I want to hear that story too.

Speaker 3 (53:15):
And so she went through our accounting system
and look at what the cost to runthe podcast was, and I'd never
done that.
It costs 18 000 us a year forme to run my podcast.
That's not including any of mytime, that's just the outgoing
bills.
I pay to run the podcastbecause I don't do my

(53:38):
post-production.
I outsource all that.
So for each one of those showsI have a different
post-production editor, and thisis once again going to
scalability.
If my editor falls over becausethey're in countries all around
the world, those editors, Idon't want to lose my entire,
all my episodes because mypodcast, uh, post-production
person decides it's not for themanymore or switches career or

(54:03):
whatever, right.
And so, yes, yes, I haveindividuals that do all that
work for me.
Um, my thumbnail cover art aguy in nigeria does that for me.
Um, so it's definitely amultinational run operation.
I've got people in Australia,people in the Philippines that

(54:24):
are doing those differentediting of those artifacts and
then, of course, and then you'vegot the whole publishing
schedule making sure it's goingout, it's getting posted on
social media, that you'rewriting the right, you know,
blurbs, titles, all that kind ofstuff which you know.
I use Riverside as my hostingplatform and it has a

(54:46):
functionality in there that mademy podcast viewership really
jump when they bought it out,which was they had embedded AI
and they give you five potentialtitles for this episode based
on the content in the transcript.
Well, you know, just take themvp show, for example.
If you go back three years orfour years, you would say, hey,

(55:08):
it's brad on the mvp show,that's the title of it.
I'm listening.
Hey, it's christoph on the mv.
Like, wow, that's a real hook meinto your episode opening line
right.
Yet now it's much more.
You know detailed.
You know I remember having alady on from Turkey on the show
and you know it brought Turkeyinto the title, it brought a

(55:32):
couple of other things and ofcourse it just expands the
viewership because now peoplethat are going, oh my gosh,
somebody else in Turkey is doingthis and they're all listening
to it, they're sharing it withtheir friends.
Look at this.
And so the AI functionality gotreally, really good.
It's funny.
Now I'm thinking of turningthat off and not paying for that

(55:53):
feature.
It's an extra $20 on Buzzsproutbecause I feel that their LLM
behind it is still 3.5.

Speaker 1 (56:02):
I did notice that.

Speaker 3 (56:03):
And I'm like that's not a good title.
That title is no longer goodenough for my expectation now.
It was way better than what Ihad, and the other thing I
noticed is that it takes toomuch from the opening preamble
as the primary thing of thepodcast.
Because LLMs are inherentlylazy in that right.

(56:24):
They'll take the first littlesegment and go bang.
I'll go with that.
Where I'm wanting to go, I wantthe meat and potatoes towards
the mid and latter half.
That's what I want yourdescription and title to be
based on, and so that's stillgoing to require manual
interaction because it meanswhen I copy the transcript to
say, come up with a title, I'monly going to copy from after

(56:47):
we've done the preamble, theintro, once we're in the meat
and potato.
That's what I want you to buildme the description and or title
on.
So that's a new thing that I'llbe adding to the podcast this
year and using just to enhanceit.

Speaker 1 (57:02):
Yeah, it's a good call out, because we do use
Buzzsprout and I do notice thatit picks up very well in the
first maybe 10 minutes ofconversation and after that I'm
like, what is it talking about?
That's not even close to whatwe were talking about, and so?
But Brad's been giving me allthe descriptions, so it's been,
he's been my AI.

Speaker 2 (57:22):
Yes, yes, I do use the Riverside AI for some.
But, um, you know, we've beenexperimenting with the
descriptions.
Uh, you know, with someguidance and trying to, as you
had mentioned, just get, get itto become more catchy and
something to pick up on thatactually encompasses what
somebody could expect to listento, to bring up but, also every

(57:45):
episode's not for everybody aswell, so it's it's.
It's the other thing with thepodcast is you know you can't
expect to have a million peoplelisten to every single episode.
You just have to put it out andsee that.

Speaker 1 (57:58):
It helps someone.

Speaker 2 (58:00):
Well, I think I mean even over time.
So you could release a podcast.
And I've noticed that you couldrelease a podcast in the first
week or two it's, you know,small listenership and then you
know, a year later, you see,like something we spoke about
last year, all of a sudden itstarts spiking.
Yeah, all of a sudden it startsspiking.
Yeah, you know, so it's.
It's one of those things withpodcasts being, I always say
it's timeless.
Yeah, you don't know when itwill show up, where it will show

(58:20):
up, how it will show up.

Speaker 3 (58:21):
So also my six most successful, you know, is and
based on the number of umdownloads.
Sometimes they're just my mostsurprising.
You know, right now my mostsuccessful podcast was with a
guy in France and it was aboutdoing UX and UI for power apps.

(58:44):
And this guy had no experienceon power apps or at all, and he
wasn't a Microsoft person, right, he was a designer.
And it's my most download watchepisodes of all time.

Speaker 1 (58:58):
Interesting, that's interesting.

Speaker 2 (59:01):
I went for somebody outside the game yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:04):
I'd be curious to see ours was actually the
architecture behind BusinessCentral, which is something we
had done with a Microsoftproduct manager, and I was like
which is something we had donewith a Microsoft?

Speaker 2 (59:18):
Product manager, yeah , product manager.
And I was like huh and yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:22):
sometimes we're surprised by some of these
statistics.
You know that there's a marketfor people that are trying to
understand what is keeping upenterprise software and those
are most listened and tuned inInteresting.

Speaker 2 (59:42):
There's a lot to it.
Well, Mr Mark, I have a millionquestions for you, but I'm
trying to be respectful.
Do you have more time?
Yeah, we can talk forever thenwe can talk forever then about
the podcast stuff, becauseyou've blown my mind on so many
things.
I'm still hung up on the camera.
I still have my favorite newterm called brules.

(01:00:04):
You had taken white belt forlife from Chris.
I'm going to use brules goingforward.

Speaker 1 (01:00:10):
I will say, though, if I take a quick pause, I do
want to say thanks forintroducing us to Podpage,
because it allowed us to kind ofmove and kind of grew up a
little bit right and then wentto PodPage to redo our website,
and so that's very, very helpfultip.

(01:00:31):
So I appreciate that.

Speaker 2 (01:00:32):
Yes, thank you, we're still going through the
transition to PodPage andeverything's on PodPage.
But, as you know, we had movedover there just before the end
of the year and we've been doingthis for close to four years
now.
I can't even believe that it'slike you you've been doing it
for eight.
For us it's almost four years.
It'll be four years and a fewmonths and we have all that

(01:00:53):
content that was brought overand now, obviously, some of the
features that are in PodPage wedidn't have before.
And again, with the timecommitment, we're just going in
slowly and adjusting.
What needs to be adjusted forthe previous episodes and that's
what Chris and I talk about isthat we'll eventually get to it
and the new episodes.

Speaker 3 (01:01:12):
We get the new stuff.
That is another one PodPage andRiverside are the two staples,
in my opinion, that you need tohave, because a hundred percent
featuring functionality, rightit's, it's riverside buzzsprout
and uh okay, yes yeah, and podpage.
I think, like my goal this yearis to get more audience

(01:01:34):
participation, and Podpage has athing called voicemail on it
where somebody can literallyclick a button, they approve
their you know to take audio andthey can record something right
, and so that AI advantage showof multiple times encourage

(01:01:59):
people given a bitly link.
You know I've created a bitlylink, so a short link for them
to be able to access it andleave me a voice message,
because then I'm gonna play thatvoice in a future episode and
address whatever it is, um, or,or speak to whatever they talk
about, but it's allowing thatperson now to come into the show

(01:02:22):
, right, and that's such a coolfeature.

Speaker 1 (01:02:25):
That is a cool feature.

Speaker 3 (01:02:27):
I've had it there for as long as I've had PodPage,
which I don't know how long, howmany years it is now but
nobody's ever used it.
I've never encouraged it, I'venever talked about it.
But I'm wanting a much more aparticipant, uh engagement in
the podcast, if possible usingaudio rather than yeah, that'd
be cool.

Speaker 1 (01:02:45):
Found on the bottom right hand corner, that's it.

Speaker 3 (01:02:47):
Yeah, that's it record your voice.

Speaker 2 (01:02:51):
No, that's pretty amazing well with that, just you
know, just a conversation withus.
Nobody's listening.
We're going to be doing a fewthings this year similar to what
you're doing, just to grow inand branch out.
Have you ever done any livepodcasts?
I thought of doing livepodcasts.
You're talking about thevoicemail to get the audience
participation.

(01:03:11):
What about time zone taken outof the whole conversation?

Speaker 3 (01:03:22):
obviously podcast, which then you then syndicate
afterwards.
Yeah, so for a year, about ayear and a half, I did a weekly
one.
Uh, live, fully live.
Uh, so live stream to youtube.
Um, people would be commenting,like I use obs to to run that
configuration on desktop.
Um, I did it with a mate in theus, in florida, and we would

(01:03:45):
banter and you know.
But the thing is, what wenoticed is that the audience you
would always get your audiencethat were the same people we
didn't find after a year and ahalf that were attracting new
people.
It was just the same core ofloyal followers that wanted to

(01:04:07):
put stuff in the chat and be inthe banter and that type of
stuff.
And so I knocked I knocked iton the head because it just
didn't seem to be going anywhereand that engagement numbers,
right.
One of the things I think thatpeople like podcasts is that
they listen at a time or watchat a time when it's convenient

(01:04:31):
for them.
And what I noticed when Istarted this, it was all around
commute.
What I noticed when I startedthis, it was all around commute
People.
If they're on a train or on abus or whatever method of
commute in their car.
That's when they would put thepodcast on.
The problem with a live in aglobal market is that there's

(01:04:52):
only going to be a fraction ofpeople that their time is free
right now when your time is free, that their time is free right
now when your time is free, andso that's why I've never, you
know, even Riverside has thisnew full live function and stuff
that you could do.
In Florida, I was at aconference and I set up three
cameras on a rig, all runningoff my Surface laptop, and I did

(01:05:16):
full live streaming from theconference floor.
This was pre-COVID and theamount of people that watched
the live was minuscule.
Heaps of people watched theafter the fact and I would just
like I was in the middle of theexpo area and had a whole area

(01:05:42):
cordoned off big backdrop.
You know all provided by theconference organizers.
They thought it was epic.
Right, we're going to do livestreaming from the floor.
And you know Charles Lamana,for example.
I did a 30-minute off-the-cuffinterview with him, both on
cameras.
Boom, I had two chairs.

(01:06:02):
I was in one chair, he was inthe other.
We just sat down and we'd justriff on stuff.
But once again, the live wasmore effort to keep it live.
And you imagine conferenceWi-Fi?
Oh, absolutely.
Although in this case I actuallyhad wired.
One of my prerequisites todoing it is that they had to
give me a wired internetconnection just because I knew

(01:06:25):
conference Wi-Fi is notoriouslybad.
And then the following yearMicrosoft had me do that in
Atlanta at one of theirconferences.
And man, it's just such a onceagain it's more fun the actual
engagement in there and you'dhave people standing around the
peripheral watching what wasgoing on.

(01:06:46):
But the tech is so amazing thatwe could do this on what.
I could fly from the other sideof the world in my suitcase,
equipment-wise, and provide thisamazing, you know, high
fidelity experience.
So I've definitely played withall these things, um, but it's
the traditional podcasting andmainly audio, but I'm going more

(01:07:09):
and more to video podcast now.
Um is is kind of the model it'sworked no, I I I agree with you
on it.

Speaker 2 (01:07:16):
I mean, I think the live is fun and it's also live
is good because if you, as youmentioned, the post-production,
not even the post-production butthe post-broadcast individuals
can still watch.
But I know I listen to a lot ofpodcasts, like you said, and
it's always of opportunity I canlisten to it during the day.
I listen to it usually while I'mworking in the background, and
then I'll pause it if I have ameeting or something.

(01:07:37):
So it's rare that I listen to apodcast from end to end because
I don't have the opportunity,as you mentioned.
If I'm commuting somewhere orif I'm out walking, I stop and
go.

Speaker 3 (01:08:00):
But I do like the live aspect of it because, again
, like you said, you get thecool factor of being maybe at a
location and doing somethinglive and then also, you know,
maybe limit the post-productionthat you need to do, because
it's just yeah, you know one,and done right.

Speaker 2 (01:08:05):
Yeah, yeah, and I've been practicing.
I can do it pretty well nowwith the stream, deck and ob
using obs you know, stream deckis amazing.

Speaker 3 (01:08:15):
Right in anything from Elgato is.
I've just bought more Elgatostuff this week and for me I've
got to bring that all in fromoverseas because it never hits
where.
You know New Zealand for years,but I don't know if you've
noticed.
They've just bought out a hubfor the Stream Deck, a USB hub
that you've actually got tounscrew and it fits inside it

(01:08:37):
and gives you this on-desk hubas well as an SD card reader and
stuff like that.
It's for the Elgato.
That's the latest, this onehere with the knobs and stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:08:50):
I don't have that one , I have just the one with the
buttons.

Speaker 1 (01:08:53):
I use it for the longest time.

Speaker 3 (01:08:55):
That's exactly what I have have you got the foot
pedal one under your desk aswell.
No, I got the foot pedal one.
I'm looking at you now in myElgato HD cam through an Elgato
teleprompter, which is, justhonestly, this alone.
Every person that does Teamscalls needs to get this config

(01:09:17):
because it allows for such amuch better personal experience.
And you're never going.
You know what's the audiencereaction.
What's the audience reaction onother screens.
You're seeing it right in frontof you and I was in this Teams
meeting the other day and I wassaying let's call them truth
bombs that not everybody wantedto hear um, the truth, right,

(01:09:39):
but the thing is, as I wassaying it, I was able to read
everybody's reaction.
Five other people on that calltheir faces were right in front
of me and I'm talking right intothe camera, so I knew I had
their attention.
I could see how they respondedto what I was saying and it just
creates a much more personalexperience when you can, you
know, have this.

(01:10:00):
And it was only MVP summit.
Last year I had another MVPbecause this they weren't even
shipping these around the world.
Pick it up for me, bring it toconference and have it.
And and added he was.
He was, uh, he's another, uh,you know, podcast, a content
creator, and he was like man,why did you buy this, you know?
And like, guess what?

(01:10:20):
He has one now because it'sjust, it is so awesome Much
better than like cameraattachments that have these
little like mirror effects andyou put your iPhone in.
No, it's a proper dedicated,there's screen, the reflection
is a proper extension.
It flips it all by default.
I can teleprompt it as well, ifI, if I, uh wanted to do that.

(01:10:41):
Um, but yeah, solid, solid moretips yeah, I'm, just I'm.

Speaker 2 (01:10:49):
I'm light years behind mark now because the this
I was been practicing over thebreak the holiday break of, you
know, being able to switchscenes, transition scenes and
everything.
I mean OBS we don't use OBS, wejust use Riverside.
But for some of the otherrecordings that I want to do in
2025, I've been messing with OBSand with the Steam Deck.

(01:11:10):
I mean the Stream Deck.
Excuse me, the only thing Iused the Stream Deck before was
to like copy and paste on theMac.

Speaker 3 (01:11:16):
Show hidden files and copy and paste plain text.
That was it.
My favorite feature is havingall the time zones that I work
across, having all those clockson it.
Oh right, in front of you I cansee Seattle, london, singapore,
chicago, new York, sydney,brisbane, madrid, zurich, vienna
Sorry, that's Brussels, whatwas the other one not Brisbane?

(01:11:39):
And I've got all those timesthere.
So when I have a guest come onI'm like, yeah, I can see kind
of what time they're in straightaway.
And then the other one I loveis a color picker from the
stream deck, so there'll be acolor on screen and wherever
your cursor is, you just hit thebutton.
It gives you the hex code on it.
I've used that a lot.

Speaker 2 (01:11:59):
I have to use it more .
I have to use it more.
Maybe I'll get.
The issue is I have multiplesetups.
I like to move around.

Speaker 3 (01:12:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:12:06):
So I have basically three workstations here to work
with, so I need to just pick oneand Pick a spot.
Pick a spot and make it cool,like yours.

Speaker 3 (01:12:18):
When I set up my studio which was, once again,
this is only a more recent thingLike I've got sound attenuation
on the walls and stuff likethat.
It made it so much easier.
Like I used to record fromanywhere on the road and you
could tell in the audio qualitythe experience, that type of
thing.
Now I purposely, like I oftenevery conference I go to oh,

(01:12:40):
would you do a podcast live fromthe conference?
No, nope, it's just.
I know when I've got everythingat my fingertips it's going to
be a much better output.
It might seem fun to do at aconference, but I'm like that
means I've got to have a bunchof microphones.
You know, I've got to take myroad um caster desk.

(01:13:05):
No, no, that's a hassle for meto lug that around the world um
I do have a roadie kit thoughthat is, is that size my entire
road kit now, and, uh, that'spretty epic for doing podcasts
at an event.

Speaker 1 (01:13:19):
Podcasts in the road.

Speaker 2 (01:13:21):
Having a dedicated workspace is important because
it's easy to just sit down anddo, versus set up and do and
then break down or whateverWe've tried to do, some live and
some on the road and you learneverything.
You have to try everything andyou learn uh is is is what I can
say with it, and too.

Speaker 3 (01:13:42):
And it's fun, the learning, it is fun.

Speaker 2 (01:13:46):
It is the creativeness is the fun part for
me, um, and the meeting theindividuals as well, too.
I, I have so many things.
I have so many things back tothe AI conversation that we
started off with.
I have so many things, I haveso many things back to the AI
conversation that we started offwith.
You know, not to take away fromthe podcast portion of it, but,
um, so you had mentioned, um,ai and you know, basically just

(01:14:08):
blending everything and the needto reskill.
Um, where do you see AI in thefuture of ERP software, even
power Platform, and now you have, you know, with Copilot Studio,
everybody can create their ownpiece of it Now, within ERP, the
word you know.
Last year the word was Copilot.
This year the word is Agent,which was the tail end of last

(01:14:29):
year Within your, because youwork with Power Platform at this
point, outside of the podcast,where do you see AI as it fits
within the future of theecosystem?

Speaker 3 (01:14:51):
People might not like my answer.

Speaker 2 (01:14:54):
I like your answer.

Speaker 3 (01:14:55):
I can already tell I think it's all going to
disappear, as in.
What I mean by that is that theconcept of you and I
interfacing or building outsolutions is what's going to
disappear.
You know, in the power platformwe have a tool called power

(01:15:15):
automate.
We have power apps.
We have power BI All what Iwould call the hammer, the
screwdriver, the pliers of ourindustry.
Right, they're the tools thatwe use Now.
You might have F&O, you mighthave Business Central, you might
still be on a Narvision system,right?
Or NAV system.

(01:15:36):
The thing is, these are allsoftware that were designed for
us to keyboard in data, run areport, get data out of, look at
inventory levels, look atmanufacturing data, look at
where we are up in the businessprocess.

(01:15:56):
I think all that's going to beabstracted away from us in our
day-to-day lives.
So I'm not saying that softwareis going away.
I'm not saying Power Automate'sgoing away.
But if you have I'm a powerautomate consultant in five
years time on your title, Iwould be shocked because that
will be.
Oh yeah, remember that software.
We know it's running behind thescenes, but all our interfacing

(01:16:20):
, all our comms will happen viauh apis into that data.
We don't care where it is, wedon't care what the interface
over it is, or we will choosethe interface based on what
we're doing right now.
So I think that our role asconsultants in this space is
going to dramatically change inthe next five years.

(01:16:42):
Right, I don't see a long-termstrategy of becoming a power
automate expert, you know froman automation layer.
I don't think RPA has been along term strategy in my career.

Speaker 2 (01:16:55):
I think you hit that because and I think it's
accelerated and it's somethingthat you have to grasp your head
around.
If you look at theconversations on agents, how
agents will work in theirspecific functions, and then the
, the ability of the AI to modeland do things, you will have
and I say this abstractly youwill have data that exists and,

(01:17:16):
as you had mentioned, I'll beable to say I want to see this,
wait a few minutes, and it willbe there.
So that interface that you have, we primarily focus with
Business Central.
I think that will change aswell, too, because now the order
entry system, looking at thesales orders, like that whole
interface, will change to where?

Speaker 1 (01:17:38):
An agent does it for you.

Speaker 2 (01:17:39):
Well, the agent will get the data in Agent can
process some of the data, can dosome of the analysis.
There's certain things that canbe automated, that people
review, but how you review itwill change and how you take
that data and process it willchange and what you process will
change because these systemsare getting faster, more
structured, so that dynamicability to process will change

(01:18:08):
as well.

Speaker 1 (01:18:09):
Mark, you hit a point there that I feel I have the
same opinion, where theconsultant you are today will be
different within the nextcouple of years, because you're
so used to the technical aspectof putting all together,
architecting it.
It's no longer that.

(01:18:30):
It's almost where theconsultant will become more of a
conversational businessconsultant rather than a
specific product, because as aconsultant, you have to look at
the bigger picture and when youlook at a bigger picture you're
looking at differenttechnologies.
Right, it's now becoming that.
It's going to shift.
It's going to be pretty wild.

Speaker 3 (01:18:50):
Massively.

Speaker 2 (01:18:51):
It will go much quicker than it has because we
can say that it has evolved overtime with the way that
technology has advanced withdata processing, with computer
processing and architectureprocessing.
Chris, to your point, I agree,or view that as well.
It's your business knowledgeand how to adapt to that and

(01:19:13):
work with things is going to beimportant Right now, even
looking at ERP implementations,again focusing on Business
Central, now that they'veintroduced the D365 stack, I'll
call it with Power Platform andall those tools Power Automate,
power everything, power Agent,ai you no longer just say let's

(01:19:35):
limit it to the box of BusinessCentral for a business to
process the requirements thatthey have.
It's how can we piece all thesethings together to give someone
what they need to become wherethey'd like to be within their
business?
I'm in alignment with you inthat sense that it will all
disappear.
It will just be like one ofthose robots, right, or one of

(01:19:57):
those systems where it's alljust there.
Just give me this.

Speaker 3 (01:20:02):
I don't care how it's all connected Give me this.
I think we'll have input deviceswhich could be in.
It could be they could betactile input devices, they
could be visual, they could beauditory input devices, right?
And then I think we're going tohave all our screens and you're
going to go, you know, bring meup the three month forecast on

(01:20:25):
product X and put it on thatscreen there and it would have
context of you pointing.
If you had a projection screenor whatever I can put on my iPad
and it will have the context ofall those devices.
But when you ask for that data,it will just be formatted
without the chroma, without thenoise of every interface and it

(01:20:46):
will just be data.
So I'm feeling that how weinterface in the future from a
visual element will look a lotmore like really, really awesome
graphic design on steroids andno interface.
You won't need a hamburger menubecause you're not going to go.
Go up there open.

(01:21:07):
Like you know, the wholeconcept of navigation is going
to go away, right, why will youneed navigation?
You'll just command through toyour next level.
Wherever you want, you'll go.
I need to drill deeper intothose numbers and, by the way,
all our enrichment feeds on anydata set.
So if we're talking about acustomer.
It's found overnight the latestnews item regarding this

(01:21:29):
customer and how it's going toactually plummet their ordering
potential over the next threemonths, and your system's
already updated with that dataand said, hey, we're going to
need to mitigate that bybringing on three new customers
over in this area, but youdidn't think that that's what
you needed to do, but it's gone.
I know that this is going to bethe outcome.
Based on patterns of the last15 years, I think that we're

(01:21:52):
going to be just like being ableto operate at whatever speed
our mind will let us go at, andso I think, man, every
consultant is going to needtheir skills to develop master
communicator skills.
You're going to have to be ableto communicate at all levels.

Speaker 2 (01:22:15):
I've said this to somebody a year or two ago.
I said relationships is goingto be the important part of this
industry, and what I mean byrelationships is what you said
the ability to communicate, theability to share knowledge and
I'm going to take back what yousaid as fast as our minds can
process.
So we're saying, and for thesake of this conversation and
it's a fun conversation, it'sall prediction based on our
thoughts Within five years,we'll be in that state.

(01:22:37):
I'm going to say, within 10years, we're going to go back to
a word that you said, and Iwanted to talk about this as
well, too along with the AI,we're going to be cyborgs.
You're talking about thecontext of devices, I think, if
you look at what we have donemedically with individuals which
is great with the ability tohear again, with the ability to
see again.

(01:22:58):
If somebody has a challenge withone of their limbs because of
an accident or maybe something.
When they were born they had achallenge and they can put a
hand on them so that they cannavigate easier.
You can put some of thesedevices, I think, where that
information will just be there.

(01:23:19):
It's weird, in a sense, thatyou can think it and it will
come, based upon all theinformation that's there, even
today, with the phone, as youhad talked about, or on the
computer in conversation.
I'm anti using the phone, likewhen we're eating dinner and
such, so we can have that humaninteraction, unless it's the

(01:23:40):
concept of sharing something orwe're talking about something,
we need to look it up.
But how often do you lookthings up now and how fast do
you get the response?
Even now, with all the searchengines no longer listing the
websites, they give you the AIsummary first, and then you can
link to the websites for furtherinformation.
So that is not that far offBefore some of us would dream

(01:24:01):
that this isn't our lifetime.
I'm an old dude.
This is my lifetime.

Speaker 1 (01:24:07):
We'll see this the way you mentioned earlier, mark
um.
You know you, when youdescribed yourself, it's, it's,
it's.
You know you got to thinkoutside the box now be able to
not be confined within theparameters of what that
technology does you.
You have to really think aboutthat now further and learning
about other products andservices, and then allows you to

(01:24:28):
become a better businessconsultant rather than a power
automate consultant yeah, sototally, and I think people need
to get smarter about timehorizons.

Speaker 3 (01:24:39):
You know I need to get this done because it's you
know, it's going to be too late,otherwise I'm 53 and as and
I've so I've had 30 years in acareer, right, and I feel like
that and, by the way, that's mythird career, so I had, I had
two others prior to going intoIT and at my age I feel like I'm

(01:25:05):
just starting over and I've gotanother 50 years to go, right,
and so I think that some thingsaround, oh, you need to play,
you need to be fast, becauseit's going to be too late.
I am now looking at how I'meducating myself.
Is, for the long, another 50years, right?
And I know that, if I can pointto people that are 50 and they

(01:25:29):
think life's on the decay, we'reon the tail end, we're in our
final years.
You know it's a path toretirement.
Here I'm just like man, the,we're just getting started and
and when you talk about cyborg,I think you know within 50 years
we could, we could become amortal right, meaning that every

(01:25:49):
medical condition is solvableand the only reason people die
of old age it's not because ofold age.
It's a disease in old age.
Right, it's a degenerativedisease generally that kills old
people.
So I think there's no reasonwhy the body couldn't last 150
years if it was medicallymaintained from.

(01:26:13):
Everything was repairable.

Speaker 2 (01:26:16):
It's not only that, it's you supplement it.
We talked about the cyborg withthe mind, with information.
Those are all parts of aging,unfortunately, where cognitively
you slow down.
For lack of better terms, it'sjust a part of age.
But if you can augment thatwith being a cyborg, all of that
information is still there.

(01:26:37):
You don't forget thatinformation.
You can repair and enhance yourbody in a sense to keep it
moving.
Like, what do you need to keepmoving?
You need oxygen, you need bloodwhat is who's to say?

Speaker 1 (01:26:57):
this is like sci-fi this is sci-fi on steroids in a
sense, why can't you take all ofyou, put it on a system that
someone had a conversation withyou and that could be long gone,
but someone could still have aconversation with me.
It's possible.

Speaker 2 (01:27:14):
It's absolutely possible.
It's possible now.
The function of your heart isto pump blood.
The function of your lungs isto expel waste.
You put oxygen in your body.
It goes and collects waste, soyou expel the waste.
Who's to say that can't be amechanical function that works

(01:27:34):
with your body?
And look how small the phone is.
The challenge is now we do havethose devices that can keep
individuals alive in thehospital, but they're large
devices.
Drop those devices to where itcan be small.
Thankfully we have pacemakers.
We have other devices like thattoday.

(01:27:55):
Just imagine that At scale.
At scale for the rest of thebodily functions.
Chris, to your point, you'll bearound forever.
It's sad that the world'spopulation will have a challenge
.

Speaker 1 (01:28:08):
My mind will be around forever, but it will even
be your mind at that point.

Speaker 2 (01:28:13):
You'll just have all of the information of the world.

Speaker 3 (01:28:16):
We don't have to worry about world population
sizing because so many countries, including China, some of the
biggest populations in the world, Japan, etc.
They're all in a populationdecline because of government
policy and now human natureselfishness, if you like.
I don't support a kid.
That's my money yes, are youcrazy?

(01:28:39):
This is about my life?

Speaker 2 (01:28:41):
no, I don't know.
I've talked to many generationsbehind ours and they don't want
you so.

Speaker 3 (01:28:46):
So there's that whole thing.
I don't think we're going tooverpopulate.

Speaker 2 (01:28:49):
I think, if anything, we're declining in that,
thankfully, yes, I want theturtles and the birds to live,
to be honest with you, I saythat statement.
I say with all sincerity I carefor the planet and the animals
and the structures of the planet.
I don't want to say more sothan people, but more so than
people.
But I think the population willgo down.

(01:29:09):
I say that in jest, because nowyour companion will also be a
cyborg Dude you can fit in an SDcard forever.

Speaker 1 (01:29:21):
That's it.
You can fit in an.

Speaker 2 (01:29:23):
SD card.
I mean, we say some of this injest, or at least I do, but it's
add the sci-fi to it.
If you go back, even to thesci-fi movies, all that stuff
seems to be coming true, likewith the imaginations, yeah, but
the advances in technology areare increasing exponentially in

(01:29:43):
shorter periods of time to whereyou you had mentioned, mark.
50 years is a new horizon.
It's not a decline, it's I'mjust starting.
Add more ability to not havesome of the declining features
of age and you will be 120 yearsold, sitting down saying, ok,

(01:30:03):
yeah yeah, yeah, I'm thinkingthis with my process.
This is will we ever get to apoint where nobody works?

Speaker 3 (01:30:12):
I think the problem is the word work and the
understanding of that.
Are we going to get to thepoint where we don't have to
trade time for money?
Absolutely?
Are we ever going to stopcreating?
Are we ever going to stopinventing?
For me, my goal right now is toeliminate creating, uh, doing

(01:30:35):
trading time for money, right assoon as I have got the
mechanism, which I'm well on theway to doing is allowing money
to produce money, um, which iswhat most wealthy people do,
right, they use mailbox moneychris to create wealth.
Yeah, is that?
Then?
I have got like an unlimitedsupply of projects I want to

(01:30:57):
work on that.
Don't make money, but they'reprojects.
I want to work on their ideas.
I want to bring to life myoldest son.
He's 19, and the property I'mon here is an acre and a half
and he goes.
You've just created Minecraftin real life and I'm like that's

(01:31:17):
exactly right, that's exactlywhat, because we used to play
Minecraft all the way through,you know, as younger years.
And now I have created a realMinecraft that it's not blocky
but it's me creating the worldlike trees, plants, food,
everything, um, you know I'vegot a centropic forest and

(01:31:38):
everything that I'm developingbecause I want to one reduce my
sustainability footprint.
But I have unlimited projects.
I have unlimited number ofcountries and locations I want
to see and people I want to gosee and spend time with, and um,
if I didn't have to trade timefor money, that would be epic,

(01:31:59):
sooner or later better that isthe goal but I'm still back.

Speaker 2 (01:32:06):
talk about getting something from the podcast.
I got the most from this, Ithink that definition of work,
trading time for money.
It goes back to the concept ofwhat we started the episode with
.
What we just mentioned is youhave to change your thought
process to the limits that youknow today, Because those limits

(01:32:28):
won't be there, or thoseboundaries or those rules.
It all comes together.
Those rules that we have thattell us how we have to do
something, keep us in a box, andthe reality is we don't have to
stay in that box in the senseand can move forward and have to
look at things differently.
All this within my lifetime too.

Speaker 1 (01:32:51):
You only have a couple of years on yourself
Fascinating within your lifetime.

Speaker 2 (01:32:55):
I'm just.
I don't even know what to sayanymore.
And it's not that I ran out ofthings to say.

Speaker 1 (01:32:59):
I'm just left speechless because my mind
You're going through sciencefiction.

Speaker 2 (01:33:03):
My mind is processing so many things with the
conversation that we've had thismorning, this afternoon, this
evening it's.
I could do this for days andfor hours, but we do have to
trade time for money, uh all ofus in the year of 2025 but uh,

(01:33:25):
mark, thank you for taking thetime to speak with us.
It's been an enlighteningconversation.
We didn't get a chance to talka lot about the power platform
stuff that I had hoped to.
Hopefully we can do that atsome point in the future.
I know you have a busy schedule.
I'll reach out to youafterwards and maybe we can go.
Good, we can try to keep it.
It's a powerful platform, but Idon't know with us, this group,
but, uh, thank you for all thatyou do, thank you for all that

(01:33:46):
you do, thank you for all thatyou do for the community and the
podcast that you have.
If anyone's looking to maybeget in contact with you to learn
about some of the great thingsthat you're doing, find more
information about your podcast,find about your roadblocks in
real life and some of the othergreat things that you work on,
how would they do so?

Speaker 3 (01:34:03):
So LinkedIn, best way to get me.
You can't miss me.
Nz365 guy.
In fact, if you just type thatinto any um, llm or search
engine or whatever you want, allroads point to rome, as in they
will, they'll all point to me.

Speaker 2 (01:34:18):
Nz365 guy excellent and I love that sign.
I've been waiting for a signjust like that for years.
I'm going to have to get one.
Chris, we'll have to make it.

Speaker 1 (01:34:28):
I shared one with you .
I know I just have to order it.

Speaker 3 (01:34:30):
I really appreciate the background.
Yeah, that's it.
You got a spot for it.
You both got spots for thatabsolutely, I'll put somewhere.
But thank you again for yourtime.

Speaker 2 (01:34:40):
We appreciate it.
Look forward to speak with youagain soon.
Ciao, ciao.

Speaker 1 (01:34:43):
Take care, mark ciao, ciao thank you, chris, for Take
care, mark you, for all of ourlisteners tuning in as well.

(01:35:04):
You can find Brad atdeveloperlifecom, that is
D-V-L-P-R-L-I-F-Ecom, and youcan interact with them via
Twitter D-V-L-P-R-l-i-n-o doti-o, and my twitter handle is

(01:35:31):
mattalino16.
And see, you can see thoselinks down below in their show
notes.
Again, thank you everyone.
Thank you and take care.

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