On this week’s episode of Enneagram IRL, we meet with Chrissy Lavdovksy, the passionate founder and lead designer of GLDN Jewelry: a studio she started a decade ago with just fifty bucks in her pocket…and organically grew into the beloved brand it is today. Her dream was to create personal, meaningful jewelry that connects people to their stories and makers to their craft through conscious, thoughtful practices. Chrissy’s enthusiasm for design and love for exploring our humanness became the cornerstones of GLDN, transforming jewelry into intrinsically charged keepsakes that represent what you care about most.
GLDN just launched their biggest labor of love yet: the Enneagram Collection that they spent four years designing. The collection features a reversible necklace for every enneagram type, with custom symbols hand-illustrated by Chrissy to represent each type’s gift and guiding light.
Use code NINETYPES at checkout for 15% off the Enneagram Collection or any of their timeless, ethically-made staples.
🔗 Connect with GLDN!
💻 https://gldn.com/
📷 Instagram: @itsgldn
📱 TikTok: @itsgldn
🔗 Connect with Steph!
💻 https://ninetypes.co/
📷 Instagram: @ninetypesco
🎥Youtube: @stephbarronhall
Here are the key takeaways:
- Chrissy’s background and what inspired her to create GLDN
- Discovering the system & gaining self-awareness as a Seven through the Enneagram
- “Pain for me was boredom”
- GLDN’s Enneagram collection: How did Chrissy develop the concept?
- Chrissy walks through each Enneagram type’s “Gift” and “Guiding Light” of the pendants
- Highlighting the virtues in our growth path
- “You don’t have to be chasing. It is in you. It is here.”
- What skills and practices have helped Chrissy as a Type Seven
- Gratitude vs. Enthusiasm
- Steph talks about her perspective on the “Gift” and “Guiding Light” for Three
- Where to find GLDN and the Enneagram Collection
Resources mentioned in this episode:
Not sure about your type? Get my free self-typing guide and a series of six emails to walk you through the whole process. Sign up here: https://ninetypes.co/selftyping-guide
Want to keep learning about the Enneagram? Grab Steph’s new book, Enneagram in Real Life! Find the book, ebook, or audiobook wherever books are sold.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Chrissy (00:00):
it's really important.
(00:00):
I think for people who arestarting out in the Enneagram to
know that that sort ofsuperficial sort of intro that
you get at the beginning islike, don't get turned off by
that yet
Steph Barron Hall (00:12):
Yeah,
Chrissy (00:12):
there are, there are ways it's almost like semantics,
you know, they're like, Oh, youavoid things.
You know, pain, but, but Ididn't realize that pain for me
was boredom or lack ofinspiration.
You know, that was what causedme pain.
It wasn't things that weredifficult per se, you know,
like, difficult by, you know,traditional sort of metrics of
(00:33):
what people would want to avoid.
So, you know, and it's thosetypes that you have to be
careful of assumptions.
When you're reading thesuperficial results of your, of
your tests.
And, that's almost like mymission.
I'm just like, just hang inthere.
Just dig a little deeper.
Trust me.
It's like, it's going to be soworth it anyways, but it's been,
yeah, it's been a great journey.
(01:02):
Welcome back to another episodeof any grim in real life a
podcast where we explore how toapply our Enneagram knowledge in
our daily lives.
I'm your host Steph Barron hall.
And on today's episode, I'minterviewing.
Chrissy laptops key.
Chrissy loved off ski is apassionate founder and lead
designer of golden jewelry, astudio.
She started a decade ago withjust 50 bucks in her pocket and
(01:23):
organically grew.
Into the beloved brand.
It is today.
Her dream was to createpersonal, meaningful jewelry
that connects people to theirstories and makers to their
craft through consciousthoughtful practices.
Chrissy's enthusiasm for designand love for exploring our
humanness became thecornerstones of golden.
Transforming jewelry intointrinsically charged keepsakes
(01:46):
that represent what you careabout most.
Golden Jess launched theirbiggest labor of love yet the
Enneagram collection that theyspent four years designing the
collection.
Features reversible necklacesfor every Enneagram type with
custom symbols hand illustratedby Chrissy to represent each
type's gift and guiding light.
And I actually had theopportunity to chat with Chrissy
(02:07):
a little bit back in 2019.
'cause I too thought it would bereally cool to have some sort of
Enneagram.
Jewelry, whether that wasnecklaces or rings, something
like that.
Um, however, I am not a jewelrydesigner and so I really loved
the jewelry that golden createsand golden is spelled G L D N.
So I thought it would be reallycool to see them create
(02:29):
something.
And I reached out and Chrissyand I chatted a bit and she had
already been working on thisEnneagram collection at the
time, which was so exciting tome.
Uh, because I couldn't believethat somebody was that
interested in the Enneagram aswell.
And also, she said she wasexcited to release the
collection soon.
(02:49):
And I was thrilled about that.
fast forward to end of lastyear.
And I finally got the word thatthey were releasing this
collection and golden was sokind to send me, um, one of
their necklaces.
And I love it.
If you watch the podcast onYouTube.
You probably see me wearingthis.
Uh, gold necklace with like asmall square looking pendant on
(03:10):
it.
and that's the golden necklaceand I love it.
It's so cute.
It goes with everything and Ireally love the meaning behind
it.
So in today's podcast, we'regoing to talk through what she
means by the gift and theguiding light of each type.
You'll notice that she'shighlighting some positive
aspects of the types, as well aswhat we commonly refer to as the
(03:30):
virtue in the Enneagram world.
So the guiding light kind ofaligns well with the virtue in
my perspective.
Um, and so you'll get to heartoday a little bit about
Chrissy's thought process.
Uh, she created that, um, butshe is very knowledgeable in the
Enneagram, so it was really funto get to chat with her about
this and.
As a special gift golden hasoffered all of us, a discount
(03:51):
code.
So you can use nine types, alluppercase.
N I N E T Y P E S at checkoutfor 15% off the Instagram
collection or any of theirtimeless.
Ethically made staples.
And you'll find that link andthe discount code in the show
notes.
Of course.
So I am so thrilled to sharethis interview with you because
(04:15):
not only is it a product that Ireally loved, but also when I
saw the concepts for each of thedesigns, I could easily
recognize how well, the creatorreally knew the Enneagram and I
also noticed how thoughtfullythey were designed and how
beautiful they are.
So they have these small icons.
Again, you can see them, I willlink them up for you.
If you just want to look at whatthe icons look like.
(04:37):
but they are a great gift.
or something for yourself.
Um, if that's what you'reinterested in.
So without further ado, I hopethat you really enjoy this
podcast episode.
As we talk about Chrissy's pathto finding her type.
her inner worked journey withthe Enneagram and all the things
that she's been doing at goldenover the last 10 years that have
(04:58):
kind of culminated into thisreally beautiful collection that
she's created.
And I also shared my thoughts onthe pendant.
Um, and the icons, as well asthe words that were chosen for
my type.
So I hope you.
Enjoy this episode.
And without further ado here ismy conversation with Chrissy
left ops QI.
Steph Barron Hall (05:17):
Well, Chrissy, welcome to the podcast.
Chrissy (05:19):
Thank you.
I'm really excited to be here.
Steph Barron Hall (05:21):
Yeah.
I'm so excited to talk with you,um, about the Enneagram and your
company, Golden.
That's how you say it, right?
Chrissy (05:29):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (05:30):
I just stumbled over that because
that's how I always say it in mymind.
Okay.
Chrissy (05:34):
Yeah.
It's spelled, spelled GL at theend, but I mean, everyone,
everyone just calls it golden.
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (05:40):
yeah.
Tell me a little bit about yourbackground and what inspired you
to create Golden.
Chrissy (05:47):
Yeah.
I, um, I always done a lot ofcreative things in my life ever
since I can remember, I've justbeen making whatever it might
be, quilts, furniture, pottery,just, just something.
I love, I love the creativeprocess.
And, um, I think what oftenhappened was I would be.
(06:09):
Wanting to make things forpeople as gifts, as a way to
share.
It almost was like gifting wasmy love language.
And, um, I think what really,what I really loved about it was
trying to come up with somethingthat was especially thoughtful
or personal that I could givethem so that they would feel
(06:30):
seen or appreciated.
And.
I wasn't good at like sayingthose things.
So I felt like if I could showthem through whatever it was
making, they'd reallyunderstand.
And when I found jewelry, it, itwas just, it felt like such an
obvious place to land and toreally stay because there's
(06:51):
jewelry is just so intrinsicallycharged with meaning and
especially like the types ofjewelry that we're making now.
With these thoughtful,personalized details.
It really, it really does makepeople feel seen and it's just
such a beautiful way to sharethis love of creating and and,
um, creating these connectionswith others.
(07:11):
So, yeah, that's kind of how itall, how it all started.
Like, we started on Etsy andthen it's.
It just sort of grew from there.
And, um, now we've got afantastic team of makers here in
La Conner that are, that arereally, um, that are really
passionate about creating andsharing these, these things with
people.
And that, that heart of goldenis, is really the same.
So yeah, it's been awesome.
Steph Barron Hall (07:33):
so cool.
Yeah.
I've been a fan actually formany years.
Um, I just really appreciate thesimplicity of a lot of the work
that you do.
Um, but also like the intricacy,which I'm really excited to talk
about the Enneagram collectionin a moment, but
Chrissy (07:48):
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (07:49):
before we get there, I do want to hear a
little bit about how youdiscovered the Enneagram.
Mm hmm.
Chrissy (07:55):
Well, I feel like, I feel like it was something that,
that, uh, had been on my radar alittle bit.
Like I'd heard a couple, acouple of times.
I've heard about it, but Ihadn't really known that it was
what it, what it was until Iheard some of the people on our,
on the, on the creative teamtalking about it.
(08:17):
And I instantly, um, you know,jumped in.
I was like, what is this that Ihaven't heard about?
Because I'd always like, ifthere's ever been a personality
test, I'm on it ever since I canremember.
It's like, I've always felt likeI've been, I've been fascinated
with my mind and how things areworking because I've.
Always just felt a little bitlike too much, I guess, for lack
(08:38):
of a better word, like a littletoo intense or just a little
bit, I don't know.
And it just always caused somuch self reflection and this
desire, this hunger to try andunderstand myself, like what was
wrong, you know, and how, whatcan I do to sort of feel like I
am like more normal or whateveryou want to call it.
And, and so, when the Enneagramcame up, you know, I jumped on
(08:58):
it, I took the test and, It cameback that I was, a seven, which
I was like, yeah, there's noway.
There's no way I'm a seven.
Um, I thought I read through thedescriptions.
I'm like, oh yeah, I'm a four.
Like.
You know, this whole idea oflike, something's sort of broken
in me, whatever, you know, camebefore.
So, but the, the idea of theseven sure, the enthusiast, like
(09:20):
I can relate to that, but thisidea of like it being about like
avoiding pain, I'm like, no, no,like if there's something
difficult or hard, like I go, Igo in, like I double down, like,
there's no way I don't avoid, Idon't avoid anything.
And so this is the sort of like.
Uh, I guess self reflection.
I couldn't stop thinking aboutit.
I just couldn't stop thinkingabout it because it was telling
me I was something and I waslike, very sure that it was
wrong.
And so I remember taking thetest again a few few months
(09:42):
later.
And yep, it was exactly the sameresults.
And so I was like, okay, maybethere's something here I'm
missing.
And that was kind of, I thinkthe beginning of it.
I decided I needed to really digin a little deeper and, and, and
look at things.
And, it wasn't until I, untilI,, learned about, like the
wings and how, and how differenttypes could show up really
(10:04):
differently or how, yourinstinctual variants could have
a lot of impact as well on like,I'm a sexual seven.
I think.
That definitely like looks a lotdifferent than what I was
thinking about what a sevenwould look like.
and so anyways, there was, therewas this sort of back and forth
of exploring and when I got thebook, the wisdom of the
(10:24):
Enneagram and there are thosecharts of health, that was
really the turning point for me,because on the chart for the
seven, I remember the mostunhealthy state it said the
sevens can often show up asbipolar.
And I had been diagnosed asbipolar years ago, like just
(10:44):
after college.
And, that was, that was a realmoment for me.
Cause I realized there's,there's a really good chance
here that I've got some blindspots that I am not aware of.
And.
I got really serious aboutlearning everything I could
about the Enneagram at thatpoint.
And it was the most fast, likefabulous catalyst for my, my
(11:05):
growth and evolution that it wasjust amazing.
And I, and I realized thatreally what it was, was that my
whole strategy.
Towards life was that, you know,it had a whole bunch of like,
you know, trauma in my, in mychildhood and all that sort of
thing.
And I'd positively reframed it.
I'm like, no, this made me a badass has made me strong.
(11:27):
This made me whatever.
And I thought that I was totallyunaffected by it.
And so I just kept moving and Ikept moving and I kept moving so
that I didn't have to feelanything.
And how did that manifest?
Like sometimes I just, you know,get totally manic at any cost.
I just didn't want to stop andfeel.
And so it was just like, wow,all of a sudden it unlocked all
of this awareness for me.
That, I just hadn't tapped intobefore and, like what an awesome
(11:52):
tool, you know, like, likehaving these, these, these
frameworks that can really giveyou insights and that, yeah, for
blind spots.
Right.
So anyways, I was really excitedabout that.
and.
That was, yeah, the beginning ofmy, my, my passion for the
Enneagram.
And then obviously the next stepwas I had to tell everybody I
knew, like, you guys got tolike, get into this.
(12:13):
This is everything, you know,and I mean, I've taken all the
tests, like Mars Briggs and likeDiscovery Insights, like all of
them.
They were great.
Sure.
But nothing gave me the, thisnew level of self awareness, I
think.
Yeah,
Steph Barron Hall (12:30):
Yeah, absolutely.
I, I agree with that.
And also I work with a lot ofteams and, like that's
primarily, you know, what I do.
And so frequently they'll,somebody will say something
like, I've taken a bunch ofthese, but this is the first one
that's really stuck.
Or like, this is the first onethat really resonates.
(12:50):
and I think that that's reallyhelpful and important because
like you're saying, you know, Icould understand.
You know, based on variousthings that you said, like why
you would really gravitatetoward type four and then kind
of looking at the deepermotivations.
You're like, Oh no, now I'mstarting to see this.
Like just questioning, do I havethese blind spots?
Chrissy (13:10):
yeah, well, it was things like, I think that that's
really, it's really important.
I think for people who arestarting out in the Enneagram to
know that that sort ofsuperficial sort of intro that
you get at the beginning islike, don't get turned off by
that yet
Steph Barron Hall (13:26):
Yeah,
Chrissy (13:26):
there are, there are ways it's almost like semantics,
you know, they're like, Oh, youavoid things.
You know, pain, but, but Ididn't realize that pain for me
was boredom or lack ofinspiration.
You know, that was what causedme pain.
It wasn't things that weredifficult per se, you know,
like, for, I guess, difficult.
Those are difficult for me,difficult by, you know,
(13:47):
traditional sort of metrics ofwhat people would want to avoid.
So, you know, and it's thosetypes that you have to be
careful of assumptions.
When you're reading thesuperficial results of your, of
your tests.
And, yeah, that's like, that'salmost like my mission.
I'm just like, just hang inthere.
Just dig a little deeper.
Trust me.
It's like, it's going to be soworth it anyways, but it's been,
(14:11):
yeah, it's been a great journey.
I'm curious for you.
Like, what was that, like, didyou have that moment of.
You know, oh wait, there'ssomething here.
Like I need, like when, what wasthat for you,
Steph Barron Hall (14:22):
Yeah.
I remember so when I first tookthe test or, you know, just a
random one online, it said theAchiever and my immediate
reaction was like, yes, I won,you know, just such a three
Chrissy (14:35):
I love it.
Steph Barron Hall (14:36):
but then pretty soon thereafter, I, um,
was reading more about it and.
Just like recently, just beforeI kind of found the Enneagram, I
had started noticing that Ishowed up differently at work
versus at school.
Like at work, I let peoplebelieve like, I'm this sort of
way.
And honestly, at work, I was, Iwas more opinionated about my
(14:57):
real perspective.
And not at school, but like atmy church community at the time,
when I was in a churchcommunity, you know, I just like
let them believe that I kind ofaligned with a lot of their
views, even though I really,really didn't like, you know, At
like a soul level.
Yeah.
I was like, absolutely not.
and so I just noticed that I hadthese different sides of myself.
(15:18):
And so, sometimes people saylike threes don't want these
people to, to mix or minglebecause they're afraid of what
might happen.
and I remember feeling that atthe time and being like, Oh wow.
Like it was this feeling offeeling so exposed.
like, oh my gosh, people can seeme.
And I am not fooling people.
Like I think I am, that was kindof the thing for me that really
(15:41):
stuck out.
and so then it just started medown this whole process.
Chrissy (15:46):
yeah.
Yeah.
It's cool.
Steph Barron Hall (15:49):
Yeah.
So one thing that I reallyappreciate, and even talking
with you, I can hear some of italready, but, I really
appreciate it about theEnneagram collection is that.
It has like this deeper meaningbehind each of the pieces.
and I wonder if you can share alittle bit about developing
these concepts because, like I'mwearing mine today, which
people, if they're watching onYouTube, they can see, and how,
(16:12):
you know, on the front, you havesomething that like that type
shows, and then on the otherside, it's like something that
they need more of internally.
and I'm wondering if you canshare a little bit more about
how you came up with that idea.
Chrissy (16:25):
Yeah.
I, I'd been wanting to do anEnneagram, like bring the
Enneagram and jewelry togethersomehow for years.
As soon as I got excited aboutit and I'm like, okay, okay, we
need to make some talisman orsomething.
And, but, you know, it's funny,I tried so hard on it for many
times and I kept coming back toit and nothing worked.
(16:46):
Really felt right.
And what I realized, last yearwas that it was because I was
trying to choose like one sortof concept to, to represent each
type.
And it just didn't feel right tome because I love the Enneagram
for it's, it feels dynamic.
(17:07):
It feels like a journey to me.
It feels like, it feels like ablueprint of.
Like a, like a pathway for youtowards self actualization, like
nine paths, basically that, thatare, unique paths to, to being,
to self mastery.
And it's, it's, it's just, it'snot about being stagnant and
being, and being stuck in thiscertain identity.
(17:29):
And so, I went back to the, thedrawing board and originally I
wanted to do Along the lines ofwhen each type is at their most
healthy state, where they're,where they're just thriving, it,
it really felt like they eachhad like a, like a unique gift
that they brought to the world.
(17:50):
And, so originally I was like,okay, I'm going to focus on that
instead as, as almost like, likean aspirational state.
And I'm like, that's just, Idon't know.
It just still just didn't quitefeel right.
So back to the drawing boardagain.
Some reason I started thinkingabout like life lessons, like,
like for each type, like, isthere, is there like a, a mantra
(18:10):
or something that is really the,the, the, the, the key for that
type to get across?
To help them on that on thispath, and that's where we landed
on this idea of of, like, aguiding light.
Essentially, this, this sort ofanchor point, this, this, the,
the most important concept foreach type that would really
(18:31):
ground them in their truth sothat their strengths.
Are, are both amplified and, andmanifested positively rather
than potentially becoming ashadow side, which oftentimes
our, our strengths can, canbecome.
And, and so, it was really,it's, it, it was really, really
fun process because I, I sort ofwent back and I looked at like,
(18:54):
just generally, okay, look atlike, what are life, what are
the life lessons?
Like if I, if I wanted, if I wasgonna write a kid's book early,
even with my son, like what arethe, what are the core life
lessons that I feel like.
All wisdom can sort of getdistilled down to, you know,
and, and after writing them allout, it was, it was so cool
because they, they really didactually kind of like laid lined
(19:16):
up pretty beautifully with.
The, the, the guiding lightsthat we had come up with for
each type.
And, and while we can, any,anyone can benefit from the
lessons of all types, of course,I mean, you know, who doesn't
need to get reminded of theirintrinsic worth at any point,
or, or, you know, Need the needto be present or whatever.
(19:38):
They're all beautiful lessons.
But the thing is, is that I feellike there's a, there's a lesson
that is particularly challengingfor your type because it is,
it's intention with your naturalstrategy and that's, and that
ends up being the real secret.
(19:59):
Self mastery, so the cool thingwas I'd at the same time, I'd
been working on this project of,symbols that had been, that I
had started like eight yearsago, probably just as almost
like a little side art projectwhere, I think I was really
excited about just design andthe power of composition to
(20:20):
evoke feeling.
like you can imagine like, likea vertical line has, it has a
really different feeling than ahorizontal line or a, or a
diagonal line that feels dynamicor a dotted line versus a solid
line.
They all, so if you startputting together these different
compositional elements, theyreally evoke a different
feeling.
And so I'd started creating thiscollection of symbols to
(20:43):
represent.
Almost like the human experiencein a way, and it had been part
of my, I guess, self reflection,you know, I'd take something
like courage, let's say, and I'mlike, okay, what really is at
the heart of courage?
What is courage about?
Is it, what is it about?
And how, if you, if I had todistill this down into a really
simple symbol.
Like, how would that, how wouldthat look?
(21:03):
And so there, it was just thisprocess that again, it was
almost like therapeutic for me.
And so when I had, had this,this idea for the Enneagram too,
and then I had these, it waslike, what?
Perfect.
These, there's going to be sucha beautiful marriage of them
together.
And, and it ended up that I,there was art, there was a
symbol for almost everything.
Everything except for, I think,the type eight, guiding light of
(21:25):
letting go.
I had to create a new symbol forthat, but that was the only one
that was, that, that wasn't inthat original collection.
So it was a beautiful, way tobring those two things together.
Steph Barron Hall (21:33):
Yeah, that's so cool.
I really like that and I don'tknow if you remember this, but
in 2019 I was trying to findsomebody who would do an Ingram
collections and I emailed you
Chrissy (21:45):
Do you remember me saying that I had been working
on something?
Steph Barron Hall (21:48):
Yes, and you showed me some of the sketches I
think and I was like, oh, that'sreally cool I can't wait to make
them up because obviously I'mnot a like jewelry designer.
I have
Chrissy (21:56):
was so long ago.
Yeah, I know, and I'm notkidding, I've been working on it
since.
I thought I was close then.
Do you remember me saying, it'salmost, it's almost, yeah.
No, I changed my mind.
Like, it's not ready.
It's not ready.
Steph Barron Hall (22:09):
I think that it's worth it.
And I think what, you know, youended up with is really
beautiful.
so you have your gift, which Ialso think is really cool.
because it's really easy for meanyway, with the Enneagram and
just with myself, like I justtend to be really self critical.
and so I get caught up in likeall of the things that I wish I
could change.
I was just talking with aSomebody this week, a client who
(22:32):
was like, I just hate my type.
And I think that's common,especially for threes, who just
learned about the Enneagram andthey're like, Oh no, people can
see me.
so I love that you framed it asa, as a positive aspect, even
like the thing that, you know,you're shining forth in
personality, there can still besome positive thing, but also
(22:53):
you have the guiding light aswell.
Chrissy (22:55):
right.
Yeah, I think that that'ssomething that I don't know,
maybe I just naturally do as aseven.
I don't know, but I, but I don'tsee it like that somehow.
I mean, I do, but to me, all ofthose things that are like,
quote unquote, like wrong witheach type or whatever are like,
I'm like, that's just, that'sjust like an awareness of your
blind spot.
This is awesome.
(23:16):
Now, you know, and like, you canbe aware of it and everything's
going to be like, everything'sgoing to be awesome now, you
know, like, I don't know.
So I'm really thinking about itin that, in that way, just.
as a, as a, yeah, I mean,there's just such beauty in
every type.
And, and again, like, I mean,you know, we, we have, we have
every type in us as well, youknow?
(23:37):
And so, um, yeah, I feel, I feellike just being aware of the, of
the strengths that we each haveand we each bring to any
situation is just such a, a niceway to, a nice, nice,
perspective and, and a way to,to think about things.
Steph Barron Hall (23:54):
I wonder if we could run through each of the
symbols, like not the symbolsthemselves, but like talk about
each gift and guiding
Chrissy (24:02):
Yeah.
Yeah, for sure.
I would love to, let's do it.
Okay.
Okay.
So which one do you want tostart with?
Steph Barron Hall (24:07):
let's start with type one.
Chrissy (24:09):
So type one, this was actually the hardest one for me.
Type one.
The, the gift is integrity., AndI actually changed this one at
the last minute and now I'mlike, no, I'm so glad I changed
it.
Like it should be integrity, butit, which is funny.
Cause I just made a new friendwho happened to be a one at the
time.
And I was just blown away by hisintegrity.
(24:29):
Like, I just couldn't, Icouldn't believe it.
Like, I mean, you, this is howyou live.
Like this is, this is genuine.
Like you just, you just such alike solid compass towards like,
what is, I mean, anyways, andit's not that I don't, that I
don't try and trying to do it,but I just have doubt constantly
about which is actually like,right, you know, or, or good.
(24:49):
And so his just.
Absolute like true north towardsintegrity was so, it was so
compelling to me.
And, I had had like improvementor something like that kind of a
four.
And now, anyway, so integrity isthe gift and the guiding light
is acceptance.
and then for two, the, the giftis connection, really connecting
(25:11):
with others and that, that depthand being able to see, seeing
others and and Meeting themthere and that sort of thing.
I think such a beautiful giftof, of twos.
and the, the guiding light isworthiness and for three, the,
the gift is achievement guidinglight is authenticity and for
(25:33):
fours, it is.
The gift is, uniqueness, thegift is uniqueness and the
guiding light is connectedness.
that one, yeah, that one I feellike sometimes people are like,
what do you mean by that?
And really it's just that likeoneness with all, like, it's
just that, that knowing that youbelong and you are connected to,
to, to things and to all things.
(25:55):
And, for fives.
It is, competence or expertiseor that, that, that symbol is
really about like, knowledge andthat sort of thing.
And, I don't know, I get stuck alot of times on the pinpointing
the exact right word for, forfires, but the, the guiding
light is abundance.
And for six, the, the gift is,the gift is protection.
(26:20):
And
Steph Barron Hall (26:21):
Mm hmm.
Chrissy (26:21):
that one again was challenging for me.
Because the, the idea of likesecurity and security and, and,
and loyalty and all that sort ofthing, what it, what it ended up
feeling like to me was the realsort of underlining thing was,
you This need to protect othersand their space and their, their
community and, and all that sortof thing.
(26:43):
And so that is almost like afoundational element for, for,
all of those things.
I felt like, like the idea ofbeing like protecting, and then
the guiding light of faith,mostly in themselves.
Steph Barron Hall (26:59):
Mm
Chrissy (26:59):
And, and then for sevens, the is enthusiasm and
the guiding light of presence,being present.
For eights, it's, taking chargeand then like letting go.
And for nines, it is harmony,the gift of harmony.
And, self empowerment for,
Steph Barron Hall (27:20):
like that.
Chrissy (27:21):
for their guiding light.
Steph Barron Hall (27:24):
So with the guiding lights, I'm curious
because I noticed that theyalign a lot with the virtues of
the Enneagram and I'm curious ifthat was intentional.
Mm hmm.
Chrissy (27:33):
That's a great question.
Not, not directly intentional.
No, I mean, gosh, I should showyou the spreadsheets.
Like there were so many datapoints that I was looking at for
this kind of thing, because, youknow, Yeah, so yes, I'm sure
like that was definitely likepart of what I was looking at
for sure.
Steph Barron Hall (27:50):
Yeah, because I just noticed that as you're
going through and even likegoing back to four of
connectedness, like describingit as being one with all of
humanity and like almost likethe, the whole concept of, you
know, growth or forest is about,yes, it's like beautiful that
you are distinct andsignificant, but like, you're
not, you know, separate, you'renot like a different kind of
(28:13):
species or something like.
You are one of the people, youknow, like, and everyone has
their own uniqueness andeveryone has their own
similarities and kind of thatblending in that actually, you
know, can be really scary for,for four is just like for all of
us.
I think when we're not in agreat place, our, our virtues
and our like higher ideals are,you know, essential self or
(28:36):
whatever is really scary.
Right.
when we read the description,we're not ready there for it yet
when it's scary, but,
Chrissy (28:43):
It's such a good point.
I love that you just said that.
Yeah, it's true.
And because a lot of timesthat's where I feel like if you
read your That sort of guidinglight.
And you're like, oh hell no,you're like, mm, it's probably
because it's the right one.
But when I think of that forpresence for me, it just makes
me uncomfortable, you know?
Steph Barron Hall (29:03):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And then you think about, youknow, I've worked with some type
seven clients about this imageof sobriety for the virtue.
And even like sometimes forseven clients, like there can be
this, resistance to the conceptof, being grounded.
Chrissy (29:21):
Yeah.
It's feel it, it does.
It feels scary.
It's funny that you mentionedthat because, in the last four
years, I've really doubled downon all my like, you know,
therapy and personal growthwork, and it really again, and
because of that discovery that Ihad with.
The, that chart.
So I'm like, you know what?
I don't think I'm bipolar.
I think I just haven't dealtwith my shit yet.
You know, I'm like, okay, it'stime, Chrissy.
(29:43):
It's time.
You got it.
You got to slow down and, youknow, dig into that.
And, and that was one of thethings that came up for me, like
right at the beginning was I'venever felt grounded in my life.
I don't even know what thatmeans.
And, it's such an unsettlingfeeling, but, but I would take
that any day over feeling stuckor, especially if I'm stuck in
(30:03):
feeling, you know, so there was,I did a lot of work with just
around, like you said, like thatidea of, of, being grounded and,
And the coolest thing is thatit's almost like the whole time
I've been, I've been obsessivelyseeking fullness and intensity
and just like fullness of life.
(30:25):
This idea that I just want tosqueeze every ounce out of
things and, and not miss, likeif there's a potential
experience, that's like almost,I just want it to be epic.
I want everything to be epic.
Like if you start doing this andyou're like, but it could be
this.
And so you start thinking abouthow you could make it even
better.
And, and, and so it's just this.
Constant, you know, seeking.
(30:46):
And once I, once I was able toget a handle on how to be
present, I realized that likethat everything that I've been
searching for and craving isactually in the moment that that
bliss and fullness that you feelwhen you are truly present.
(31:06):
It's just, it's just.
It's, it's, it's, it's, it'severything and it's, it's just
been, it's been, I actually feellike I'm a different person now
than I was two years ago forreal transformation and it is
because of that ability to now Ican be present.
I actually feel grounded most ofthe time and it's just been a
(31:29):
massive shift.
Steph Barron Hall (31:31):
Yeah, that's incredible, and that's really
hard work for sevens.
I know.
And, you know, it's hard workfor all of us, but yeah, I think
it's hard work for sevens.
And, one of the metaphors Ireally like to use when I think
about the Enneagram is, Youknow, we're looking through a
pinhole, right?
Like our, our type just causeit, we only have like this small
pinhole of like visibility intohow the world really is.
(31:53):
And so, the growth work that wedo is to like really zoom out
and to be able to see more ofthe full picture.
And, you know, for sevens, it'slike, okay, I can, I have like
this very specific vision ofwhat it will look like.
to have more fullness.
And in reality, if you just, youknow, open the lens a little bit
(32:15):
more than you can see
Chrissy (32:16):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (32:17):
that it's already here.
Chrissy (32:18):
It's, it's way easier.
I mean, it's actually not, butit is like, you don't have to be
chasing.
Like it's, it is in you, it ishere.
And it's been, and the beautifulthing is that presence actually
amplifies my strength.
Like I feel like the enthusiasmI feel for any moment and, and
(32:42):
what is around me.
It's like, I feel like myselfmore, more than I ever have.
Steph Barron Hall (32:50):
Yeah.
Chrissy (32:52):
because it, all that chasing felt empty at the, in
the end, but I know it's, the,the irony of it.
Steph Barron Hall (32:57):
I'm curious, because I'm sure that if sevens
are listening, they're like,okay, how the heck did she like
black magic this situation tofind this?
Like, what skills or practiceshave been most useful for you?
Chrissy (33:10):
okay.
Well, there, I would say themost important thing was
actually being able tounderstand, be able to get out
of my body a little bit and see,see my mind working.
That like through meditation, Iuse the waking up app.
I use the waking up app and itjust, it was, it's just a
fantastic way to just train yourmind and be able to see your
(33:35):
thoughts as thoughts and not asyour, as you like separating
thoughts from your actual being.
That was almost like the.
Foundation for that.
I, I feel like I didn't realizethat.
I'm not my thoughts, you know,I, I honored my thoughts way too
much before.
And, so that was the, that wasthe first step.
(33:57):
And, and then I feel like justpracticing, well, practicing
actual, like gratitude.
I, I hesitate to say gratitudebecause.
I often confuse that withenthusiasm, you know what I
mean?
Like so, but actual gratitude,like peaceful gratitude where
(34:18):
you just appreciate what is asit is compared to what I often
do, which is I appreciated it somuch.
And then I'm like, and now, youknow, what's next and like,
where can we take this?
And, and so.
that that peaceful gratitude, Ithink, has been has been a huge,
and finding that just ineveryday things again.
(34:40):
It's almost like a type ofmeditation looking at a leaf and
just really looking at that leafand seeing the details in it.
And it's like, it almost bringsme to tears.
Now.
I don't sounds like.
It's cheesy, but I can look atanything pretty much now and I
feel just this like beingoverwhelmed by this, the majesty
of life, you know, and theworld.
(35:01):
And, so I think just sort ofnurturing that in yourself and,
and, I think that can be areally good place to start.
And then, know, it's, it'sfunny, but I did, I don't know
if you've heard of RTT therapy,but like rapid transformational
therapy, that was by far themost impactful form of therapy
I'd done.
I tried tons of different thingsand talk therapy.
(35:21):
This really didn't help me thatmuch.
Cause I'm already in my head allthe, like, I don't, I do not.
Yeah.
So that was huge.
And that, created a really goodfoundation.
It essentially reprogrammed alot of the, The sort of core
beliefs that I hadn't, didn'teven realize I had, and made,
made space for new ones thatreally served me.
(35:43):
So yeah, those are, those are, I
Steph Barron Hall (35:45):
Yeah.
Chrissy (35:46):
yeah, the most impactful.
Steph Barron Hall (35:50):
Those are excellent.
And I think so helpful,especially because they're so
accessible for people.
Like, I think sometimes, youknow, we get really intimidated
with growth work because we'relike, Oh my gosh, like I'm going
to have to buy all theseexpensive things or like do all
this expensive therapy.
And you know, even just startingwith podcast or not podcast,
(36:10):
meditation, even a meditationapp.
Like there are tons of greatfree ones.
I use insight timer a lot, whichis free.
and, or, you know, looking at aleaf, like, I think that that's
really cool.
and I love the differentiationbetween.
enthusiasm and peacefulgratitude.
because like, I can see wherethat would get confused and how
(36:30):
enthusiasm is just like, Youknow, it's just like throwing
gasoline on the fire.
It's like, let's go, you know,if, if this fire is big, let's
see how much bigger we can makeit.
And you know, having thatperspective of there's a
different way to experiencegratitude.
Chrissy (36:45):
Yeah.
Yeah.
It is funny because, I have toalso catch myself on when I'm
feeling gratitude for something.
Not my next thing is often like,who could I share this with?
Who else would love this too,you know, rather than just being
present in that moment.
it's another like sneaky way oflike, what's next?
The whole, yeah.
So, yeah.
(37:05):
How do you feel about your, the,the guiding light for three?
Steph Barron Hall (37:08):
Yeah, I think it's really helpful.
so I think authenticity reallyaligns well with veracity.
and I think.
It's been a process for me.
So like last year I went throughthis season of burnout and I'm
still kind of coming out of itin a sense.
Like I have not made it backonto like social medias and
stuff like that.
but through this season ofburnout, I finally kind of like
(37:30):
realized like I don't actuallyhave capacity anymore to do
things that don't feel.
Aligned.
obviously everyone has to washtheir dishes.
You know what I mean?
but like.
What I mean is to show up inspaces where it's like, it feels
not aligned.
And so I think, sorry, what Imean by that is, doing things
(37:53):
that it's like, well, this isjust the way that it has to be
done.
Like some people have thesecertain.
Ways that you're supposed towrite a sales page or sell
coaching or like how much yourcoaching packages should cost
and all these things.
And it's just been a discoveryprocess of like, if I don't want
to do that, then I'm not goingto do it that way.
(38:14):
and I think that that's beenreally important for me.
And so I think it's a reallyhelpful part of the process.
it's hard for me sometimes tothink of achievement as a gift.
because I had this real, like,belief that anything about the
three that kind of camenaturally.
Was bad and it should it'ssomething to get rid of right?
(38:36):
and so I worked for a long timeon just suppressing anything
that was like three ish if I didwant to like push really hard at
something I would just be likeno we can't do that That's
wrong.
That's, that's bad.
And I think there's like other,other reasons kind of for that,
but it's just been in like thelast year again.
or even like the last six monthsthat I've been like, Oh, like it
(38:57):
can be like a really helphealthy and helpful and
beautiful thing to have thatside of me.
It doesn't mean I have to bedriven by it, but I can offer
Chrissy (39:06):
it's fantastic.
I mean, as long as you're, it'saligned with what you are truly,
what you truly care about.
I mean, the ability to actuallybe efficient with resources and
your time and being able to getpeople on board and make
something happen, I mean, it'sjust such a superpower, you
know?
And I feel like.
(39:26):
Yeah, I don't know.
I know I can.
I can see exactly what you'resaying.
I know where you're coming from.
but from the outside, I'm just,that's just like, wow, what a
great, what a great, natural,natural gift, as long as, of
course, it's, it's feelingaligned with you and, and, and
your, and your truth and thatsort of thing, for sure.
Steph Barron Hall (39:47):
Yeah.
And I
Chrissy (39:47):
are you feeling about it now, though?
Do you feel like you can leaninto it a bit more?
Steph Barron Hall (39:51):
Yeah, I mean, I'm starting to and I think,
what I'm recognizing is thedifference between, you know,
achievement in the sense of likebuilding things and like doing
things that are like useful inthe world, versus kind of
achievement for achievement sakeor, running myself ragged for
that.
So.
It's hard work, right?
(40:12):
Because, like, I want it tohappen overnight.
Like, I want it to be doneyesterday, but finding ways to
do work that I'm reallypassionate about, which I do get
to do.
I'm, like, super lucky to beable to do that, but also to
make sure that I am, yes,working hard and intentionally
at it.
Like, I think that's, like, Ifind a lot of, meaning in that,
(40:33):
but also, you know, Making spacefor the other things that are
important to me in my life, andkind of having a bit of
separation between work andhome, which when you own your
own business, it just, it allblends.
Chrissy (40:48):
own challenge, for sure.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I
Steph Barron Hall (40:52):
I'm curious, about, totally lost my train of
thought.
Um, oh, I wanted to ask if youhave gotten pushback on any of
the other, like, little words.
Yeah.
Chrissy (41:05):
haven't actually, I thought I was going to get a lot
more, but that's also just, Ithink, how my mind works.
I, I'm not skeptical, but, Ihave this definite lens of wait,
but what about this?
And, and so I was expecting.
A lot of people to bequestioning, why did you choose
this?
It should be this or, but I'mreally surprised actually.
(41:25):
And I, and I don't know, Iwonder if it's because of the,
we, we did add a, like a, likean apparent, like an explanation
behind the words, which I thinkis really important because a
word, it can just be interpretedso many different ways, right.
And it's really, it's reallyabout the sentiment, the concept
more than like the specificword.
(41:45):
So, Yeah, it's been yeah, Ihaven't we haven't had much of
that of light I mean, we'll seewhat happens.
I don't know
Steph Barron Hall (41:53):
no, I was just curious.
I think,
Chrissy (41:55):
People coming in with with ideas and that to be
honest, that's part of why Ithink I was and the reason why
it was taking so long toactually sort of publish this
was I wanted to feel really sureabout it and it, that's hard to,
it's hard to feel really surewhen we're talking about
concepts and language and thatsort of thing and, and the
(42:18):
possibilities for things to beinterpreted different ways and,
and whatnot.
So, at some, at some point, youhave to stop worrying about it
being perfect and just, youknow, get it out there.
Steph Barron Hall (42:29):
yeah, absolutely.
Chrissy (42:30):
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (42:32):
I was kind of thinking about that.
I mean, I, I noticed as you werewalking through them that it
really was an exercise in likelimitation, you know, especially
as a seven, I'm sure to likedeclare one word for each of
these categories for each type.
but like for type eight, I guesstype eight is the only one
that's two words or something.
Right.
Chrissy (42:51):
Yeah.
Letting go.
I mean, is there a word forthat?
Like, I don't know.
Steph Barron Hall (42:55):
well, the thing that.
It evokes for me is like afeeling of lightness.
Like, apes so often carry theworld on their shoulders.
Like.
And they kind of, especiallylike social aids, which I ended
up working a lot with socialaids, but just in general, they,
they just, they're so protectiveof everyone, not just
themselves, but of, of people intheir lives.
(43:17):
And like, they carry so much.
And so the concept of letting goto me just reminds me of that
concept of like lightness of, ofnot having to carry so much of a
burden, And letting go of a lotof the stuff that they have had
to carry.
especially like a lot of thetime we see that AIDS are
(43:38):
parentified as children.
And so,
Chrissy (43:44):
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (43:45):
ability, it aligns with innocence.
Chrissy (43:47):
I can see that, that, that lightness.
Yeah.
I feel like, For me, a lot of ittoo, at least the eights that I
had in my life, I felt like theletting go piece almost had, it
had a lot to do with makingspace for other energies and
others opinions and other, thatsort of thing to, to sort of
come in.
Like it's almost like lettinggo, but also letting down your
(44:09):
guard, letting down that wall,letting down, because you don't
know if you, if you, Believe theuniverse is on your side.
You can let, you need to letthat goodness in.
And, and so there's a, there'san element of that for me that
I, again, it was really hard tonot, um, but doing all this,
(44:30):
doing all these, all this workto, to be thinking about the
people in my life, becauseobviously it's a very small,
small, tiny sampling of theactual, like what's out there of
every types.
But, but still, I mean, I, Ihave so many eights in my life
and that was always like a, likea pain point when I could just
feel them, this, this, thisresistance to actually like,
(44:54):
they wouldn't allow themselvesto be permeable at all, in, in,
in certain points, especially ifthere was any.
conflict and I felt like thatwas, it limits the, it limits
the experience, their, their,their experience, potential
experience.
Yeah, but I do love the symbolfor that one.
Letting go.
(45:14):
That's one of my favorite ones.
Steph Barron Hall (45:16):
They're all so good.
And I, I, I'm not a fan of likeEnneagram, like, Merch,
basically.
I mean, I, I did start mybusiness creating like coffee
mugs, but I Would not probablywear like a t shirt that had
like I'm a three on it But Ilike that it's not Like there is
(45:40):
a steeper meaning and ifsomebody doesn't know about it,
they're not gonna know.
Chrissy (45:45):
Do you, do you feel like, I know you said at the
beginning, you weren't excitedabout being a three, but do you
feel differently now?
Steph Barron Hall (45:52):
Um
Chrissy (45:53):
working towards, towards
Steph Barron Hall (45:55):
Yeah, I think I think I do feel differently,
but mostly just because I'veworked so much on like self
acceptance and self compassionover the last few years.
So I think that feels different.
I think I can see some of thegood things, you know, about
three as well, like, that haveallowed me to do a lot of like
the teaching and the type ofwork that I do naturally
(46:15):
because.
I'm not afraid to get up on thestage, you know, like, I think
it's fun.
a lot of people are totallyterrified and
Chrissy (46:23):
am one of those people.
Yeah,
Steph Barron Hall (46:29):
for all of us.
And so, yeah, I think I canappreciate some
Chrissy (46:32):
I love threes.
I have so many threes.
I find that like threes, threes,sevens and eights, I find the
most, I have it most of my life,except lately nines, so many
nines in my,
Steph Barron Hall (46:42):
Hmm.
Chrissy (46:44):
It's interesting.
My son's a nine.
He's taught me so much.
Oh my gosh.
He's my, my best teacher,actually.
Steph Barron Hall (46:50):
Just like manifesting that like peaceful
gratitude, like you were saying.
Chrissy (46:54):
can be in contentment.
He's just like, he's just sohappy with whatever is at the
moment.
Like, it's just, do you wantanything?
No, I'm good.
You know, like, what, what doyou mean?
Like, but you could have allthese things like you don't want
ice cream or like, you know,it's just so interesting.
He just, he's very content andlike, yeah, peaceful energy.
It's, it's really, it's reallybeautiful to be around.
(47:16):
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (47:17):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I do appreciate that.
And I've been noticing that alot lately, just how, for so
many of us, the people in ourlives, you know, a lot of the
time it's like opposite thetract.
Right.
And so they bring out somedifferent things that we, we
need to learn from.
Okay.
Chrissy (47:35):
Yep.
I agree.
I agree.
Well, it's funny because I thinkthat in a way, actually, like,
if I look at my past, it was,you know, sevens, threes and
eights.
Why?
Probably because they keptmoving too and I didn't have to
slow down, right?
But now I feel like if I look atit, I've just have a lot more of
a range of types and especiallya lot of nines and, yeah, it's,
(47:59):
it's like, I'm, I'm okay nowjust chilling and.
You know, that sort of thing.
And, yeah, it's been, it's beennice.
Steph Barron Hall (48:07):
Yeah, that's beautiful.
Well done on all of your growthwork.
I think that that's really
Chrissy (48:12):
It's scary.
Right?
Gosh, it's scary.
But honestly, like the Enneagramwas the, was really the
catalyst.
I didn't realize that like.
There was as much stuff underthere as there was because I'm a
master at making everything Likechanging the story so that
everything is actually awesome.
So I had no idea Yeah, yeah,it's good.
Steph Barron Hall (48:37):
Yeah.
Um, well, okay, before we getinto our final few questions,
where can everyone find Goldenand especially this collection?
Chrissy (48:48):
Yeah, so we are we only sell online at at golden.
com GLDN.
com There, there should be, youshould see links to the
Enneagram collection, but ifnot, you can just search
Enneagram, um, on, on our site.
And other than that, uh, onsocial, you can find us on
(49:10):
Instagram and TikTok at it'sgolden, spelled out G L D E N N
E G T, of course.
And yeah.
That's, those are the mainspots, yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (49:21):
gonna link that up in the show notes, of
course, and, uh, show everyonewhat my, um, wear it all the
time.
I actually, the first week I hadthis necklace, I had a horrible
allergic reaction to something.
And I was like, no, please don'tbe to the necklace.
It wasn't.
Everything was fine.
(49:41):
I became allergic to alpacasweaters, suddenly out of
nowhere.
Chrissy (49:47):
Me too, and it's the worst because they're so soft
and amazing.
Steph Barron Hall (49:51):
I know it was sudden.
I was like, oh my gosh, now Ihave hives all the time.
Anytime I wear that.
Um, so yes, thrilled with thenecklace.
I definitely want to showeveryone.
Um, it's.
So beautiful.
Um, so final two closingquestions that I ask all of my
guests.
So first one is, tell me about abook that has helped you refresh
(50:11):
you or shaped you in the lastyear.
Chrissy (50:14):
Ooh, it, it's, I actually came, re read a book
that I had been reading a lot atthe beginning of my which is The
Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle,and it's just, it's just such a
fantastic place to start or tobook to go back to, to refresh
that, that awareness of your, ofyour mind and your thought
(50:36):
patterns.
And, and it's just, it's aboutpresence and, I find it just
really grounding, actually.
That's really, that's probablythe best word to describe it.
Steph Barron Hall (50:48):
Beautiful.
I love that.
Okay.
finally, what is a piece ofadvice that has really stuck
with you?
Chrissy (50:54):
The one, the advice I think I've been coming back to
the most lately is somethingthat I heard in, in actually the
waking up meditation app that I,that I use, and it's, This may
be the last time, so savor themoment, essentially, and this
(51:18):
concept of this might be thelast time you drive to work, or
this might be the last time yougo skiing, or this might be the
last time you visit this place,and I remind myself of that as
much as I can whenever there's,whenever I feel like there's
this, this, this beautifulmoment happening, but I'm not
really present in it.
I'm, I'm already moving on tothe next thing.
(51:38):
And I take a moment andhonestly, like 30 seconds of
feeling it, like, like lettingyourself feel like this is the
last time I'm going to be hereor be with this person.
It's so moving.
It's so moving.
It just fills you with so muchgratitude.
And, it's, it's the best mantra.
I love it.
I actually, I want to get atattoo on my arm.
(52:00):
I've just says the last time,because I feel like it's so
powerful.
it's just a beautiful lens to,to, to see things through.
It's almost like thiscombination of presence and
gratitude together, which Ithink is, is fantastic.
Steph Barron Hall (52:13):
Yeah.
And it forces you to like slowdown and to really see.
Yeah.
I love that.
Beautiful.
Chrissy (52:19):
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (52:20):
Well, thank you so much for joining me
today.
This has been so fun and Ireally appreciate you sharing
all of the things that you'veshared about the, your
perspective on the Enneagramand, this collection.
Like I said, I, I reallyappreciate it.
And I've actually been sharingit with my friends too, just
like in text, be like, Oh mygosh, look at this.
so I really hope that, all ofour listeners love it as well.
Chrissy (52:41):
Thank you so much, Stephanie.
I've really enjoyed this.
It's, it's been fantasticspeaking with you.
Thank you.
Steph Barron Hall (52:47):
Thanks.
Thanks so much for listening toEnneagram IRL.
If you love the show, be sure tosubscribe and leave us a rating
and review.
This is the easiest way to makesure new people find the show.
And it's so helpful for a newpodcast like this one, if you
want to stay connected.
Sign up for my email list in theshow notes or message me on
(53:08):
instagram at nine types co totell me your one big takeaway
from today's show I'd love tohear from you.
I know there are a millionpodcasts you could have been
listening to, and I feel sograteful that you chose to spend
this time with me.
Can't wait to meet you rightback here for another episode of
any grim IRL very soon.
The Enneagram and real lifepodcast is a production of nine
(53:31):
types co LLC.
It's created and produced byStephanie Barron hall.
With editing support fromBrandon Hall.
And additional support fromcrits collaborations.
Thanks to dr dream chip for ouramazing theme song and you can
also check out all of theirmusic on spotify
it's really important.
(00:00):
I think for people who arestarting out in the Enneagram to
know that that sort ofsuperficial sort of intro that
you get at the beginning islike, don't get turned off by
that yet
Steph Barron Hall (00:12):
Yeah,
Chrissy (00:12):
there are, there are ways it's almost like semantics,
you know, they're like, Oh, youavoid things.
You know, pain, but, but Ididn't realize that pain for me
was boredom or lack ofinspiration.
You know, that was what causedme pain.
It wasn't things that weredifficult per se, you know,
like, difficult by, you know,traditional sort of metrics of
(00:33):
what people would want to avoid.
So, you know, and it's thosetypes that you have to be
careful of assumptions.
When you're reading thesuperficial results of your, of
your tests.
And, that's almost like mymission.
I'm just like, just hang inthere.
Just dig a little deeper.
Trust me.
It's like, it's going to be soworth it anyways, but it's been,
yeah, it's been a great journey.
(01:02):
Welcome back to another episodeof any grim in real life a
podcast where we explore how toapply our Enneagram knowledge in
our daily lives.
I'm your host Steph Barron hall.
And on today's episode, I'minterviewing.
Chrissy laptops key.
Chrissy loved off ski is apassionate founder and lead
designer of golden jewelry, astudio.
She started a decade ago withjust 50 bucks in her pocket and
(01:23):
organically grew.
Into the beloved brand.
It is today.
Her dream was to createpersonal, meaningful jewelry
that connects people to theirstories and makers to their
craft through consciousthoughtful practices.
Chrissy's enthusiasm for designand love for exploring our
humanness became thecornerstones of golden.
Transforming jewelry intointrinsically charged keepsakes
(01:46):
that represent what you careabout most.
Golden Jess launched theirbiggest labor of love yet the
Enneagram collection that theyspent four years designing the
collection.
Features reversible necklacesfor every Enneagram type with
custom symbols hand illustratedby Chrissy to represent each
type's gift and guiding light.
And I actually had theopportunity to chat with Chrissy
(02:07):
a little bit back in 2019.
'cause I too thought it would bereally cool to have some sort of
Enneagram.
Jewelry, whether that wasnecklaces or rings, something
like that.
Um, however, I am not a jewelrydesigner and so I really loved
the jewelry that golden createsand golden is spelled G L D N.
So I thought it would be reallycool to see them create
(02:29):
something.
And I reached out and Chrissyand I chatted a bit and she had
already been working on thisEnneagram collection at the
time, which was so exciting tome.
Uh, because I couldn't believethat somebody was that
interested in the Enneagram aswell.
And also, she said she wasexcited to release the
collection soon.
(02:49):
And I was thrilled about that.
fast forward to end of lastyear.
And I finally got the word thatthey were releasing this
collection and golden was sokind to send me, um, one of
their necklaces.
And I love it.
If you watch the podcast onYouTube.
You probably see me wearingthis.
Uh, gold necklace with like asmall square looking pendant on
(03:10):
it.
and that's the golden necklaceand I love it.
It's so cute.
It goes with everything and Ireally love the meaning behind
it.
So in today's podcast, we'regoing to talk through what she
means by the gift and theguiding light of each type.
You'll notice that she'shighlighting some positive
aspects of the types, as well aswhat we commonly refer to as the
(03:30):
virtue in the Enneagram world.
So the guiding light kind ofaligns well with the virtue in
my perspective.
Um, and so you'll get to heartoday a little bit about
Chrissy's thought process.
Uh, she created that, um, butshe is very knowledgeable in the
Enneagram, so it was really funto get to chat with her about
this and.
As a special gift golden hasoffered all of us, a discount
(03:51):
code.
So you can use nine types, alluppercase.
N I N E T Y P E S at checkoutfor 15% off the Instagram
collection or any of theirtimeless.
Ethically made staples.
And you'll find that link andthe discount code in the show
notes.
Of course.
So I am so thrilled to sharethis interview with you because
(04:15):
not only is it a product that Ireally loved, but also when I
saw the concepts for each of thedesigns, I could easily
recognize how well, the creatorreally knew the Enneagram and I
also noticed how thoughtfullythey were designed and how
beautiful they are.
So they have these small icons.
Again, you can see them, I willlink them up for you.
If you just want to look at whatthe icons look like.
(04:37):
but they are a great gift.
or something for yourself.
Um, if that's what you'reinterested in.
So without further ado, I hopethat you really enjoy this
podcast episode.
As we talk about Chrissy's pathto finding her type.
her inner worked journey withthe Enneagram and all the things
that she's been doing at goldenover the last 10 years that have
(04:58):
kind of culminated into thisreally beautiful collection that
she's created.
And I also shared my thoughts onthe pendant.
Um, and the icons, as well asthe words that were chosen for
my type.
So I hope you.
Enjoy this episode.
And without further ado here ismy conversation with Chrissy
left ops QI.
Steph Barron Hall (05:17):
Well, Chrissy, welcome to the podcast.
Chrissy (05:19):
Thank you.
I'm really excited to be here.
Steph Barron Hall (05:21):
Yeah.
I'm so excited to talk with you,um, about the Enneagram and your
company, Golden.
That's how you say it, right?
Chrissy (05:29):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (05:30):
I just stumbled over that because
that's how I always say it in mymind.
Okay.
Chrissy (05:34):
Yeah.
It's spelled, spelled GL at theend, but I mean, everyone,
everyone just calls it golden.
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (05:40):
yeah.
Tell me a little bit about yourbackground and what inspired you
to create Golden.
Chrissy (05:47):
Yeah.
I, um, I always done a lot ofcreative things in my life ever
since I can remember, I've justbeen making whatever it might
be, quilts, furniture, pottery,just, just something.
I love, I love the creativeprocess.
And, um, I think what oftenhappened was I would be.
(06:09):
Wanting to make things forpeople as gifts, as a way to
share.
It almost was like gifting wasmy love language.
And, um, I think what really,what I really loved about it was
trying to come up with somethingthat was especially thoughtful
or personal that I could givethem so that they would feel
(06:30):
seen or appreciated.
And.
I wasn't good at like sayingthose things.
So I felt like if I could showthem through whatever it was
making, they'd reallyunderstand.
And when I found jewelry, it, itwas just, it felt like such an
obvious place to land and toreally stay because there's
(06:51):
jewelry is just so intrinsicallycharged with meaning and
especially like the types ofjewelry that we're making now.
With these thoughtful,personalized details.
It really, it really does makepeople feel seen and it's just
such a beautiful way to sharethis love of creating and and,
um, creating these connectionswith others.
(07:11):
So, yeah, that's kind of how itall, how it all started.
Like, we started on Etsy andthen it's.
It just sort of grew from there.
And, um, now we've got afantastic team of makers here in
La Conner that are, that arereally, um, that are really
passionate about creating andsharing these, these things with
people.
And that, that heart of goldenis, is really the same.
So yeah, it's been awesome.
Steph Barron Hall (07:33):
so cool.
Yeah.
I've been a fan actually formany years.
Um, I just really appreciate thesimplicity of a lot of the work
that you do.
Um, but also like the intricacy,which I'm really excited to talk
about the Enneagram collectionin a moment, but
Chrissy (07:48):
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (07:49):
before we get there, I do want to hear a
little bit about how youdiscovered the Enneagram.
Mm hmm.
Chrissy (07:55):
Well, I feel like, I feel like it was something that,
that, uh, had been on my radar alittle bit.
Like I'd heard a couple, acouple of times.
I've heard about it, but Ihadn't really known that it was
what it, what it was until Iheard some of the people on our,
on the, on the creative teamtalking about it.
(08:17):
And I instantly, um, you know,jumped in.
I was like, what is this that Ihaven't heard about?
Because I'd always like, ifthere's ever been a personality
test, I'm on it ever since I canremember.
It's like, I've always felt likeI've been, I've been fascinated
with my mind and how things areworking because I've.
Always just felt a little bitlike too much, I guess, for lack
(08:38):
of a better word, like a littletoo intense or just a little
bit, I don't know.
And it just always caused somuch self reflection and this
desire, this hunger to try andunderstand myself, like what was
wrong, you know, and how, whatcan I do to sort of feel like I
am like more normal or whateveryou want to call it.
And, and so, when the Enneagramcame up, you know, I jumped on
(08:58):
it, I took the test and, It cameback that I was, a seven, which
I was like, yeah, there's noway.
There's no way I'm a seven.
Um, I thought I read through thedescriptions.
I'm like, oh yeah, I'm a four.
Like.
You know, this whole idea oflike, something's sort of broken
in me, whatever, you know, camebefore.
So, but the, the idea of theseven sure, the enthusiast, like
(09:20):
I can relate to that, but thisidea of like it being about like
avoiding pain, I'm like, no, no,like if there's something
difficult or hard, like I go, Igo in, like I double down, like,
there's no way I don't avoid, Idon't avoid anything.
And so this is the sort of like.
Uh, I guess self reflection.
I couldn't stop thinking aboutit.
I just couldn't stop thinkingabout it because it was telling
me I was something and I waslike, very sure that it was
wrong.
And so I remember taking thetest again a few few months
(09:42):
later.
And yep, it was exactly the sameresults.
And so I was like, okay, maybethere's something here I'm
missing.
And that was kind of, I thinkthe beginning of it.
I decided I needed to really digin a little deeper and, and, and
look at things.
And, it wasn't until I, untilI,, learned about, like the
wings and how, and how differenttypes could show up really
(10:04):
differently or how, yourinstinctual variants could have
a lot of impact as well on like,I'm a sexual seven.
I think.
That definitely like looks a lotdifferent than what I was
thinking about what a sevenwould look like.
and so anyways, there was, therewas this sort of back and forth
of exploring and when I got thebook, the wisdom of the
(10:24):
Enneagram and there are thosecharts of health, that was
really the turning point for me,because on the chart for the
seven, I remember the mostunhealthy state it said the
sevens can often show up asbipolar.
And I had been diagnosed asbipolar years ago, like just
(10:44):
after college.
And, that was, that was a realmoment for me.
Cause I realized there's,there's a really good chance
here that I've got some blindspots that I am not aware of.
And.
I got really serious aboutlearning everything I could
about the Enneagram at thatpoint.
And it was the most fast, likefabulous catalyst for my, my
(11:05):
growth and evolution that it wasjust amazing.
And I, and I realized thatreally what it was, was that my
whole strategy.
Towards life was that, you know,it had a whole bunch of like,
you know, trauma in my, in mychildhood and all that sort of
thing.
And I'd positively reframed it.
I'm like, no, this made me a badass has made me strong.
(11:27):
This made me whatever.
And I thought that I was totallyunaffected by it.
And so I just kept moving and Ikept moving and I kept moving so
that I didn't have to feelanything.
And how did that manifest?
Like sometimes I just, you know,get totally manic at any cost.
I just didn't want to stop andfeel.
And so it was just like, wow,all of a sudden it unlocked all
of this awareness for me.
That, I just hadn't tapped intobefore and, like what an awesome
(11:52):
tool, you know, like, likehaving these, these, these
frameworks that can really giveyou insights and that, yeah, for
blind spots.
Right.
So anyways, I was really excitedabout that.
and.
That was, yeah, the beginning ofmy, my, my passion for the
Enneagram.
And then obviously the next stepwas I had to tell everybody I
knew, like, you guys got tolike, get into this.
(12:13):
This is everything, you know,and I mean, I've taken all the
tests, like Mars Briggs and likeDiscovery Insights, like all of
them.
They were great.
Sure.
But nothing gave me the, thisnew level of self awareness, I
think.
Yeah,
Steph Barron Hall (12:30):
Yeah, absolutely.
I, I agree with that.
And also I work with a lot ofteams and, like that's
primarily, you know, what I do.
And so frequently they'll,somebody will say something
like, I've taken a bunch ofthese, but this is the first one
that's really stuck.
Or like, this is the first onethat really resonates.
(12:50):
and I think that that's reallyhelpful and important because
like you're saying, you know, Icould understand.
You know, based on variousthings that you said, like why
you would really gravitatetoward type four and then kind
of looking at the deepermotivations.
You're like, Oh no, now I'mstarting to see this.
Like just questioning, do I havethese blind spots?
Chrissy (13:10):
yeah, well, it was things like, I think that that's
really, it's really important.
I think for people who arestarting out in the Enneagram to
know that that sort ofsuperficial sort of intro that
you get at the beginning islike, don't get turned off by
that yet
Steph Barron Hall (13:26):
Yeah,
Chrissy (13:26):
there are, there are ways it's almost like semantics,
you know, they're like, Oh, youavoid things.
You know, pain, but, but Ididn't realize that pain for me
was boredom or lack ofinspiration.
You know, that was what causedme pain.
It wasn't things that weredifficult per se, you know,
like, for, I guess, difficult.
Those are difficult for me,difficult by, you know,
(13:47):
traditional sort of metrics ofwhat people would want to avoid.
So, you know, and it's thosetypes that you have to be
careful of assumptions.
When you're reading thesuperficial results of your, of
your tests.
And, yeah, that's like, that'salmost like my mission.
I'm just like, just hang inthere.
Just dig a little deeper.
Trust me.
It's like, it's going to be soworth it anyways, but it's been,
(14:11):
yeah, it's been a great journey.
I'm curious for you.
Like, what was that, like, didyou have that moment of.
You know, oh wait, there'ssomething here.
Like I need, like when, what wasthat for you,
Steph Barron Hall (14:22):
Yeah.
I remember so when I first tookthe test or, you know, just a
random one online, it said theAchiever and my immediate
reaction was like, yes, I won,you know, just such a three
Chrissy (14:35):
I love it.
Steph Barron Hall (14:36):
but then pretty soon thereafter, I, um,
was reading more about it and.
Just like recently, just beforeI kind of found the Enneagram, I
had started noticing that Ishowed up differently at work
versus at school.
Like at work, I let peoplebelieve like, I'm this sort of
way.
And honestly, at work, I was, Iwas more opinionated about my
(14:57):
real perspective.
And not at school, but like atmy church community at the time,
when I was in a churchcommunity, you know, I just like
let them believe that I kind ofaligned with a lot of their
views, even though I really,really didn't like, you know, At
like a soul level.
Yeah.
I was like, absolutely not.
and so I just noticed that I hadthese different sides of myself.
(15:18):
And so, sometimes people saylike threes don't want these
people to, to mix or minglebecause they're afraid of what
might happen.
and I remember feeling that atthe time and being like, Oh wow.
Like it was this feeling offeeling so exposed.
like, oh my gosh, people can seeme.
And I am not fooling people.
Like I think I am, that was kindof the thing for me that really
(15:41):
stuck out.
and so then it just started medown this whole process.
Chrissy (15:46):
yeah.
Yeah.
It's cool.
Steph Barron Hall (15:49):
Yeah.
So one thing that I reallyappreciate, and even talking
with you, I can hear some of italready, but, I really
appreciate it about theEnneagram collection is that.
It has like this deeper meaningbehind each of the pieces.
and I wonder if you can share alittle bit about developing
these concepts because, like I'mwearing mine today, which
people, if they're watching onYouTube, they can see, and how,
(16:12):
you know, on the front, you havesomething that like that type
shows, and then on the otherside, it's like something that
they need more of internally.
and I'm wondering if you canshare a little bit more about
how you came up with that idea.
Chrissy (16:25):
Yeah.
I, I'd been wanting to do anEnneagram, like bring the
Enneagram and jewelry togethersomehow for years.
As soon as I got excited aboutit and I'm like, okay, okay, we
need to make some talisman orsomething.
And, but, you know, it's funny,I tried so hard on it for many
times and I kept coming back toit and nothing worked.
(16:46):
Really felt right.
And what I realized, last yearwas that it was because I was
trying to choose like one sortof concept to, to represent each
type.
And it just didn't feel right tome because I love the Enneagram
for it's, it feels dynamic.
(17:07):
It feels like a journey to me.
It feels like, it feels like ablueprint of.
Like a, like a pathway for youtowards self actualization, like
nine paths, basically that, thatare, unique paths to, to being,
to self mastery.
And it's, it's, it's just, it'snot about being stagnant and
being, and being stuck in thiscertain identity.
(17:29):
And so, I went back to the, thedrawing board and originally I
wanted to do Along the lines ofwhen each type is at their most
healthy state, where they're,where they're just thriving, it,
it really felt like they eachhad like a, like a unique gift
that they brought to the world.
(17:50):
And, so originally I was like,okay, I'm going to focus on that
instead as, as almost like, likean aspirational state.
And I'm like, that's just, Idon't know.
It just still just didn't quitefeel right.
So back to the drawing boardagain.
Some reason I started thinkingabout like life lessons, like,
like for each type, like, isthere, is there like a, a mantra
(18:10):
or something that is really the,the, the, the, the key for that
type to get across?
To help them on that on thispath, and that's where we landed
on this idea of of, like, aguiding light.
Essentially, this, this sort ofanchor point, this, this, the,
the most important concept foreach type that would really
(18:31):
ground them in their truth sothat their strengths.
Are, are both amplified and, andmanifested positively rather
than potentially becoming ashadow side, which oftentimes
our, our strengths can, canbecome.
And, and so, it was really,it's, it, it was really, really
fun process because I, I sort ofwent back and I looked at like,
(18:54):
just generally, okay, look atlike, what are life, what are
the life lessons?
Like if I, if I wanted, if I wasgonna write a kid's book early,
even with my son, like what arethe, what are the core life
lessons that I feel like.
All wisdom can sort of getdistilled down to, you know,
and, and after writing them allout, it was, it was so cool
because they, they really didactually kind of like laid lined
(19:16):
up pretty beautifully with.
The, the, the guiding lightsthat we had come up with for
each type.
And, and while we can, any,anyone can benefit from the
lessons of all types, of course,I mean, you know, who doesn't
need to get reminded of theirintrinsic worth at any point,
or, or, you know, Need the needto be present or whatever.
(19:38):
They're all beautiful lessons.
But the thing is, is that I feellike there's a, there's a lesson
that is particularly challengingfor your type because it is,
it's intention with your naturalstrategy and that's, and that
ends up being the real secret.
(19:59):
Self mastery, so the cool thingwas I'd at the same time, I'd
been working on this project of,symbols that had been, that I
had started like eight yearsago, probably just as almost
like a little side art projectwhere, I think I was really
excited about just design andthe power of composition to
(20:20):
evoke feeling.
like you can imagine like, likea vertical line has, it has a
really different feeling than ahorizontal line or a, or a
diagonal line that feels dynamicor a dotted line versus a solid
line.
They all, so if you startputting together these different
compositional elements, theyreally evoke a different
feeling.
And so I'd started creating thiscollection of symbols to
(20:43):
represent.
Almost like the human experiencein a way, and it had been part
of my, I guess, self reflection,you know, I'd take something
like courage, let's say, and I'mlike, okay, what really is at
the heart of courage?
What is courage about?
Is it, what is it about?
And how, if you, if I had todistill this down into a really
simple symbol.
Like, how would that, how wouldthat look?
(21:03):
And so there, it was just thisprocess that again, it was
almost like therapeutic for me.
And so when I had, had this,this idea for the Enneagram too,
and then I had these, it waslike, what?
Perfect.
These, there's going to be sucha beautiful marriage of them
together.
And, and it ended up that I,there was art, there was a
symbol for almost everything.
Everything except for, I think,the type eight, guiding light of
(21:25):
letting go.
I had to create a new symbol forthat, but that was the only one
that was, that, that wasn't inthat original collection.
So it was a beautiful, way tobring those two things together.
Steph Barron Hall (21:33):
Yeah, that's so cool.
I really like that and I don'tknow if you remember this, but
in 2019 I was trying to findsomebody who would do an Ingram
collections and I emailed you
Chrissy (21:45):
Do you remember me saying that I had been working
on something?
Steph Barron Hall (21:48):
Yes, and you showed me some of the sketches I
think and I was like, oh, that'sreally cool I can't wait to make
them up because obviously I'mnot a like jewelry designer.
I have
Chrissy (21:56):
was so long ago.
Yeah, I know, and I'm notkidding, I've been working on it
since.
I thought I was close then.
Do you remember me saying, it'salmost, it's almost, yeah.
No, I changed my mind.
Like, it's not ready.
It's not ready.
Steph Barron Hall (22:09):
I think that it's worth it.
And I think what, you know, youended up with is really
beautiful.
so you have your gift, which Ialso think is really cool.
because it's really easy for meanyway, with the Enneagram and
just with myself, like I justtend to be really self critical.
and so I get caught up in likeall of the things that I wish I
could change.
I was just talking with aSomebody this week, a client who
(22:32):
was like, I just hate my type.
And I think that's common,especially for threes, who just
learned about the Enneagram andthey're like, Oh no, people can
see me.
so I love that you framed it asa, as a positive aspect, even
like the thing that, you know,you're shining forth in
personality, there can still besome positive thing, but also
(22:53):
you have the guiding light aswell.
Chrissy (22:55):
right.
Yeah, I think that that'ssomething that I don't know,
maybe I just naturally do as aseven.
I don't know, but I, but I don'tsee it like that somehow.
I mean, I do, but to me, all ofthose things that are like,
quote unquote, like wrong witheach type or whatever are like,
I'm like, that's just, that'sjust like an awareness of your
blind spot.
This is awesome.
(23:16):
Now, you know, and like, you canbe aware of it and everything's
going to be like, everything'sgoing to be awesome now, you
know, like, I don't know.
So I'm really thinking about itin that, in that way, just.
as a, as a, yeah, I mean,there's just such beauty in
every type.
And, and again, like, I mean,you know, we, we have, we have
every type in us as well, youknow?
(23:37):
And so, um, yeah, I feel, I feellike just being aware of the, of
the strengths that we each haveand we each bring to any
situation is just such a, a niceway to, a nice, nice,
perspective and, and a way to,to think about things.
Steph Barron Hall (23:54):
I wonder if we could run through each of the
symbols, like not the symbolsthemselves, but like talk about
each gift and guiding
Chrissy (24:02):
Yeah.
Yeah, for sure.
I would love to, let's do it.
Okay.
Okay.
So which one do you want tostart with?
Steph Barron Hall (24:07):
let's start with type one.
Chrissy (24:09):
So type one, this was actually the hardest one for me.
Type one.
The, the gift is integrity., AndI actually changed this one at
the last minute and now I'mlike, no, I'm so glad I changed
it.
Like it should be integrity, butit, which is funny.
Cause I just made a new friendwho happened to be a one at the
time.
And I was just blown away by hisintegrity.
(24:29):
Like, I just couldn't, Icouldn't believe it.
Like, I mean, you, this is howyou live.
Like this is, this is genuine.
Like you just, you just such alike solid compass towards like,
what is, I mean, anyways, andit's not that I don't, that I
don't try and trying to do it,but I just have doubt constantly
about which is actually like,right, you know, or, or good.
(24:49):
And so his just.
Absolute like true north towardsintegrity was so, it was so
compelling to me.
And, I had had like improvementor something like that kind of a
four.
And now, anyway, so integrity isthe gift and the guiding light
is acceptance.
and then for two, the, the giftis connection, really connecting
(25:11):
with others and that, that depthand being able to see, seeing
others and and Meeting themthere and that sort of thing.
I think such a beautiful giftof, of twos.
and the, the guiding light isworthiness and for three, the,
the gift is achievement guidinglight is authenticity and for
(25:33):
fours, it is.
The gift is, uniqueness, thegift is uniqueness and the
guiding light is connectedness.
that one, yeah, that one I feellike sometimes people are like,
what do you mean by that?
And really it's just that likeoneness with all, like, it's
just that, that knowing that youbelong and you are connected to,
to, to things and to all things.
(25:55):
And, for fives.
It is, competence or expertiseor that, that, that symbol is
really about like, knowledge andthat sort of thing.
And, I don't know, I get stuck alot of times on the pinpointing
the exact right word for, forfires, but the, the guiding
light is abundance.
And for six, the, the gift is,the gift is protection.
(26:20):
And
Steph Barron Hall (26:21):
Mm hmm.
Chrissy (26:21):
that one again was challenging for me.
Because the, the idea of likesecurity and security and, and,
and loyalty and all that sort ofthing, what it, what it ended up
feeling like to me was the realsort of underlining thing was,
you This need to protect othersand their space and their, their
community and, and all that sortof thing.
(26:43):
And so that is almost like afoundational element for, for,
all of those things.
I felt like, like the idea ofbeing like protecting, and then
the guiding light of faith,mostly in themselves.
Steph Barron Hall (26:59):
Mm
Chrissy (26:59):
And, and then for sevens, the is enthusiasm and
the guiding light of presence,being present.
For eights, it's, taking chargeand then like letting go.
And for nines, it is harmony,the gift of harmony.
And, self empowerment for,
Steph Barron Hall (27:20):
like that.
Chrissy (27:21):
for their guiding light.
Steph Barron Hall (27:24):
So with the guiding lights, I'm curious
because I noticed that theyalign a lot with the virtues of
the Enneagram and I'm curious ifthat was intentional.
Mm hmm.
Chrissy (27:33):
That's a great question.
Not, not directly intentional.
No, I mean, gosh, I should showyou the spreadsheets.
Like there were so many datapoints that I was looking at for
this kind of thing, because, youknow, Yeah, so yes, I'm sure
like that was definitely likepart of what I was looking at
for sure.
Steph Barron Hall (27:50):
Yeah, because I just noticed that as you're
going through and even likegoing back to four of
connectedness, like describingit as being one with all of
humanity and like almost likethe, the whole concept of, you
know, growth or forest is about,yes, it's like beautiful that
you are distinct andsignificant, but like, you're
not, you know, separate, you'renot like a different kind of
(28:13):
species or something like.
You are one of the people, youknow, like, and everyone has
their own uniqueness andeveryone has their own
similarities and kind of thatblending in that actually, you
know, can be really scary for,for four is just like for all of
us.
I think when we're not in agreat place, our, our virtues
and our like higher ideals are,you know, essential self or
(28:36):
whatever is really scary.
Right.
when we read the description,we're not ready there for it yet
when it's scary, but,
Chrissy (28:43):
It's such a good point.
I love that you just said that.
Yeah, it's true.
And because a lot of timesthat's where I feel like if you
read your That sort of guidinglight.
And you're like, oh hell no,you're like, mm, it's probably
because it's the right one.
But when I think of that forpresence for me, it just makes
me uncomfortable, you know?
Steph Barron Hall (29:03):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And then you think about, youknow, I've worked with some type
seven clients about this imageof sobriety for the virtue.
And even like sometimes forseven clients, like there can be
this, resistance to the conceptof, being grounded.
Chrissy (29:21):
Yeah.
It's feel it, it does.
It feels scary.
It's funny that you mentionedthat because, in the last four
years, I've really doubled downon all my like, you know,
therapy and personal growthwork, and it really again, and
because of that discovery that Ihad with.
The, that chart.
So I'm like, you know what?
I don't think I'm bipolar.
I think I just haven't dealtwith my shit yet.
You know, I'm like, okay, it'stime, Chrissy.
(29:43):
It's time.
You got it.
You got to slow down and, youknow, dig into that.
And, and that was one of thethings that came up for me, like
right at the beginning was I'venever felt grounded in my life.
I don't even know what thatmeans.
And, it's such an unsettlingfeeling, but, but I would take
that any day over feeling stuckor, especially if I'm stuck in
(30:03):
feeling, you know, so there was,I did a lot of work with just
around, like you said, like thatidea of, of, being grounded and,
And the coolest thing is thatit's almost like the whole time
I've been, I've been obsessivelyseeking fullness and intensity
and just like fullness of life.
(30:25):
This idea that I just want tosqueeze every ounce out of
things and, and not miss, likeif there's a potential
experience, that's like almost,I just want it to be epic.
I want everything to be epic.
Like if you start doing this andyou're like, but it could be
this.
And so you start thinking abouthow you could make it even
better.
And, and, and so it's just this.
Constant, you know, seeking.
(30:46):
And once I, once I was able toget a handle on how to be
present, I realized that likethat everything that I've been
searching for and craving isactually in the moment that that
bliss and fullness that you feelwhen you are truly present.
(31:06):
It's just, it's just.
It's, it's, it's, it's, it'severything and it's, it's just
been, it's been, I actually feellike I'm a different person now
than I was two years ago forreal transformation and it is
because of that ability to now Ican be present.
I actually feel grounded most ofthe time and it's just been a
(31:29):
massive shift.
Steph Barron Hall (31:31):
Yeah, that's incredible, and that's really
hard work for sevens.
I know.
And, you know, it's hard workfor all of us, but yeah, I think
it's hard work for sevens.
And, one of the metaphors Ireally like to use when I think
about the Enneagram is, Youknow, we're looking through a
pinhole, right?
Like our, our type just causeit, we only have like this small
pinhole of like visibility intohow the world really is.
(31:53):
And so, the growth work that wedo is to like really zoom out
and to be able to see more ofthe full picture.
And, you know, for sevens, it'slike, okay, I can, I have like
this very specific vision ofwhat it will look like.
to have more fullness.
And in reality, if you just, youknow, open the lens a little bit
(32:15):
more than you can see
Chrissy (32:16):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (32:17):
that it's already here.
Chrissy (32:18):
It's, it's way easier.
I mean, it's actually not, butit is like, you don't have to be
chasing.
Like it's, it is in you, it ishere.
And it's been, and the beautifulthing is that presence actually
amplifies my strength.
Like I feel like the enthusiasmI feel for any moment and, and
(32:42):
what is around me.
It's like, I feel like myselfmore, more than I ever have.
Steph Barron Hall (32:50):
Yeah.
Chrissy (32:52):
because it, all that chasing felt empty at the, in
the end, but I know it's, the,the irony of it.
Steph Barron Hall (32:57):
I'm curious, because I'm sure that if sevens
are listening, they're like,okay, how the heck did she like
black magic this situation tofind this?
Like, what skills or practiceshave been most useful for you?
Chrissy (33:10):
okay.
Well, there, I would say themost important thing was
actually being able tounderstand, be able to get out
of my body a little bit and see,see my mind working.
That like through meditation, Iuse the waking up app.
I use the waking up app and itjust, it was, it's just a
fantastic way to just train yourmind and be able to see your
(33:35):
thoughts as thoughts and not asyour, as you like separating
thoughts from your actual being.
That was almost like the.
Foundation for that.
I, I feel like I didn't realizethat.
I'm not my thoughts, you know,I, I honored my thoughts way too
much before.
And, so that was the, that wasthe first step.
(33:57):
And, and then I feel like justpracticing, well, practicing
actual, like gratitude.
I, I hesitate to say gratitudebecause.
I often confuse that withenthusiasm, you know what I
mean?
Like so, but actual gratitude,like peaceful gratitude where
(34:18):
you just appreciate what is asit is compared to what I often
do, which is I appreciated it somuch.
And then I'm like, and now, youknow, what's next and like,
where can we take this?
And, and so.
that that peaceful gratitude, Ithink, has been has been a huge,
and finding that just ineveryday things again.
(34:40):
It's almost like a type ofmeditation looking at a leaf and
just really looking at that leafand seeing the details in it.
And it's like, it almost bringsme to tears.
Now.
I don't sounds like.
It's cheesy, but I can look atanything pretty much now and I
feel just this like beingoverwhelmed by this, the majesty
of life, you know, and theworld.
(35:01):
And, so I think just sort ofnurturing that in yourself and,
and, I think that can be areally good place to start.
And then, know, it's, it'sfunny, but I did, I don't know
if you've heard of RTT therapy,but like rapid transformational
therapy, that was by far themost impactful form of therapy
I'd done.
I tried tons of different thingsand talk therapy.
(35:21):
This really didn't help me thatmuch.
Cause I'm already in my head allthe, like, I don't, I do not.
Yeah.
So that was huge.
And that, created a really goodfoundation.
It essentially reprogrammed alot of the, The sort of core
beliefs that I hadn't, didn'teven realize I had, and made,
made space for new ones thatreally served me.
(35:43):
So yeah, those are, those are, I
Steph Barron Hall (35:45):
Yeah.
Chrissy (35:46):
yeah, the most impactful.
Steph Barron Hall (35:50):
Those are excellent.
And I think so helpful,especially because they're so
accessible for people.
Like, I think sometimes, youknow, we get really intimidated
with growth work because we'relike, Oh my gosh, like I'm going
to have to buy all theseexpensive things or like do all
this expensive therapy.
And you know, even just startingwith podcast or not podcast,
(36:10):
meditation, even a meditationapp.
Like there are tons of greatfree ones.
I use insight timer a lot, whichis free.
and, or, you know, looking at aleaf, like, I think that that's
really cool.
and I love the differentiationbetween.
enthusiasm and peacefulgratitude.
because like, I can see wherethat would get confused and how
(36:30):
enthusiasm is just like, Youknow, it's just like throwing
gasoline on the fire.
It's like, let's go, you know,if, if this fire is big, let's
see how much bigger we can makeit.
And you know, having thatperspective of there's a
different way to experiencegratitude.
Chrissy (36:45):
Yeah.
Yeah.
It is funny because, I have toalso catch myself on when I'm
feeling gratitude for something.
Not my next thing is often like,who could I share this with?
Who else would love this too,you know, rather than just being
present in that moment.
it's another like sneaky way oflike, what's next?
The whole, yeah.
So, yeah.
(37:05):
How do you feel about your, the,the guiding light for three?
Steph Barron Hall (37:08):
Yeah, I think it's really helpful.
so I think authenticity reallyaligns well with veracity.
and I think.
It's been a process for me.
So like last year I went throughthis season of burnout and I'm
still kind of coming out of itin a sense.
Like I have not made it backonto like social medias and
stuff like that.
but through this season ofburnout, I finally kind of like
(37:30):
realized like I don't actuallyhave capacity anymore to do
things that don't feel.
Aligned.
obviously everyone has to washtheir dishes.
You know what I mean?
but like.
What I mean is to show up inspaces where it's like, it feels
not aligned.
And so I think, sorry, what Imean by that is, doing things
(37:53):
that it's like, well, this isjust the way that it has to be
done.
Like some people have thesecertain.
Ways that you're supposed towrite a sales page or sell
coaching or like how much yourcoaching packages should cost
and all these things.
And it's just been a discoveryprocess of like, if I don't want
to do that, then I'm not goingto do it that way.
(38:14):
and I think that that's beenreally important for me.
And so I think it's a reallyhelpful part of the process.
it's hard for me sometimes tothink of achievement as a gift.
because I had this real, like,belief that anything about the
three that kind of camenaturally.
Was bad and it should it'ssomething to get rid of right?
(38:36):
and so I worked for a long timeon just suppressing anything
that was like three ish if I didwant to like push really hard at
something I would just be likeno we can't do that That's
wrong.
That's, that's bad.
And I think there's like other,other reasons kind of for that,
but it's just been in like thelast year again.
or even like the last six monthsthat I've been like, Oh, like it
(38:57):
can be like a really helphealthy and helpful and
beautiful thing to have thatside of me.
It doesn't mean I have to bedriven by it, but I can offer
Chrissy (39:06):
it's fantastic.
I mean, as long as you're, it'saligned with what you are truly,
what you truly care about.
I mean, the ability to actuallybe efficient with resources and
your time and being able to getpeople on board and make
something happen, I mean, it'sjust such a superpower, you
know?
And I feel like.
(39:26):
Yeah, I don't know.
I know I can.
I can see exactly what you'resaying.
I know where you're coming from.
but from the outside, I'm just,that's just like, wow, what a
great, what a great, natural,natural gift, as long as, of
course, it's, it's feelingaligned with you and, and, and
your, and your truth and thatsort of thing, for sure.
Steph Barron Hall (39:47):
Yeah.
And I
Chrissy (39:47):
are you feeling about it now, though?
Do you feel like you can leaninto it a bit more?
Steph Barron Hall (39:51):
Yeah, I mean, I'm starting to and I think,
what I'm recognizing is thedifference between, you know,
achievement in the sense of likebuilding things and like doing
things that are like useful inthe world, versus kind of
achievement for achievement sakeor, running myself ragged for
that.
So.
It's hard work, right?
(40:12):
Because, like, I want it tohappen overnight.
Like, I want it to be doneyesterday, but finding ways to
do work that I'm reallypassionate about, which I do get
to do.
I'm, like, super lucky to beable to do that, but also to
make sure that I am, yes,working hard and intentionally
at it.
Like, I think that's, like, Ifind a lot of, meaning in that,
(40:33):
but also, you know, Making spacefor the other things that are
important to me in my life, andkind of having a bit of
separation between work andhome, which when you own your
own business, it just, it allblends.
Chrissy (40:48):
own challenge, for sure.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I
Steph Barron Hall (40:52):
I'm curious, about, totally lost my train of
thought.
Um, oh, I wanted to ask if youhave gotten pushback on any of
the other, like, little words.
Yeah.
Chrissy (41:05):
haven't actually, I thought I was going to get a lot
more, but that's also just, Ithink, how my mind works.
I, I'm not skeptical, but, Ihave this definite lens of wait,
but what about this?
And, and so I was expecting.
A lot of people to bequestioning, why did you choose
this?
It should be this or, but I'mreally surprised actually.
(41:25):
And I, and I don't know, Iwonder if it's because of the,
we, we did add a, like a, likean apparent, like an explanation
behind the words, which I thinkis really important because a
word, it can just be interpretedso many different ways, right.
And it's really, it's reallyabout the sentiment, the concept
more than like the specificword.
(41:45):
So, Yeah, it's been yeah, Ihaven't we haven't had much of
that of light I mean, we'll seewhat happens.
I don't know
Steph Barron Hall (41:53):
no, I was just curious.
I think,
Chrissy (41:55):
People coming in with with ideas and that to be
honest, that's part of why Ithink I was and the reason why
it was taking so long toactually sort of publish this
was I wanted to feel really sureabout it and it, that's hard to,
it's hard to feel really surewhen we're talking about
concepts and language and thatsort of thing and, and the
(42:18):
possibilities for things to beinterpreted different ways and,
and whatnot.
So, at some, at some point, youhave to stop worrying about it
being perfect and just, youknow, get it out there.
Steph Barron Hall (42:29):
yeah, absolutely.
Chrissy (42:30):
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (42:32):
I was kind of thinking about that.
I mean, I, I noticed as you werewalking through them that it
really was an exercise in likelimitation, you know, especially
as a seven, I'm sure to likedeclare one word for each of
these categories for each type.
but like for type eight, I guesstype eight is the only one
that's two words or something.
Right.
Chrissy (42:51):
Yeah.
Letting go.
I mean, is there a word forthat?
Like, I don't know.
Steph Barron Hall (42:55):
well, the thing that.
It evokes for me is like afeeling of lightness.
Like, apes so often carry theworld on their shoulders.
Like.
And they kind of, especiallylike social aids, which I ended
up working a lot with socialaids, but just in general, they,
they just, they're so protectiveof everyone, not just
themselves, but of, of people intheir lives.
(43:17):
And like, they carry so much.
And so the concept of letting goto me just reminds me of that
concept of like lightness of, ofnot having to carry so much of a
burden, And letting go of a lotof the stuff that they have had
to carry.
especially like a lot of thetime we see that AIDS are
(43:38):
parentified as children.
And so,
Chrissy (43:44):
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (43:45):
ability, it aligns with innocence.
Chrissy (43:47):
I can see that, that, that lightness.
Yeah.
I feel like, For me, a lot of ittoo, at least the eights that I
had in my life, I felt like theletting go piece almost had, it
had a lot to do with makingspace for other energies and
others opinions and other, thatsort of thing to, to sort of
come in.
Like it's almost like lettinggo, but also letting down your
(44:09):
guard, letting down that wall,letting down, because you don't
know if you, if you, Believe theuniverse is on your side.
You can let, you need to letthat goodness in.
And, and so there's a, there'san element of that for me that
I, again, it was really hard tonot, um, but doing all this,
(44:30):
doing all these, all this workto, to be thinking about the
people in my life, becauseobviously it's a very small,
small, tiny sampling of theactual, like what's out there of
every types.
But, but still, I mean, I, Ihave so many eights in my life
and that was always like a, likea pain point when I could just
feel them, this, this, thisresistance to actually like,
(44:54):
they wouldn't allow themselvesto be permeable at all, in, in,
in certain points, especially ifthere was any.
conflict and I felt like thatwas, it limits the, it limits
the experience, their, their,their experience, potential
experience.
Yeah, but I do love the symbolfor that one.
Letting go.
(45:14):
That's one of my favorite ones.
Steph Barron Hall (45:16):
They're all so good.
And I, I, I'm not a fan of likeEnneagram, like, Merch,
basically.
I mean, I, I did start mybusiness creating like coffee
mugs, but I Would not probablywear like a t shirt that had
like I'm a three on it But Ilike that it's not Like there is
(45:40):
a steeper meaning and ifsomebody doesn't know about it,
they're not gonna know.
Chrissy (45:45):
Do you, do you feel like, I know you said at the
beginning, you weren't excitedabout being a three, but do you
feel differently now?
Steph Barron Hall (45:52):
Um
Chrissy (45:53):
working towards, towards
Steph Barron Hall (45:55):
Yeah, I think I think I do feel differently,
but mostly just because I'veworked so much on like self
acceptance and self compassionover the last few years.
So I think that feels different.
I think I can see some of thegood things, you know, about
three as well, like, that haveallowed me to do a lot of like
the teaching and the type ofwork that I do naturally
(46:15):
because.
I'm not afraid to get up on thestage, you know, like, I think
it's fun.
a lot of people are totallyterrified and
Chrissy (46:23):
am one of those people.
Yeah,
Steph Barron Hall (46:29):
for all of us.
And so, yeah, I think I canappreciate some
Chrissy (46:32):
I love threes.
I have so many threes.
I find that like threes, threes,sevens and eights, I find the
most, I have it most of my life,except lately nines, so many
nines in my,
Steph Barron Hall (46:42):
Hmm.
Chrissy (46:44):
It's interesting.
My son's a nine.
He's taught me so much.
Oh my gosh.
He's my, my best teacher,actually.
Steph Barron Hall (46:50):
Just like manifesting that like peaceful
gratitude, like you were saying.
Chrissy (46:54):
can be in contentment.
He's just like, he's just sohappy with whatever is at the
moment.
Like, it's just, do you wantanything?
No, I'm good.
You know, like, what, what doyou mean?
Like, but you could have allthese things like you don't want
ice cream or like, you know,it's just so interesting.
He just, he's very content andlike, yeah, peaceful energy.
It's, it's really, it's reallybeautiful to be around.
(47:16):
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (47:17):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I do appreciate that.
And I've been noticing that alot lately, just how, for so
many of us, the people in ourlives, you know, a lot of the
time it's like opposite thetract.
Right.
And so they bring out somedifferent things that we, we
need to learn from.
Okay.
Chrissy (47:35):
Yep.
I agree.
I agree.
Well, it's funny because I thinkthat in a way, actually, like,
if I look at my past, it was,you know, sevens, threes and
eights.
Why?
Probably because they keptmoving too and I didn't have to
slow down, right?
But now I feel like if I look atit, I've just have a lot more of
a range of types and especiallya lot of nines and, yeah, it's,
(47:59):
it's like, I'm, I'm okay nowjust chilling and.
You know, that sort of thing.
And, yeah, it's been, it's beennice.
Steph Barron Hall (48:07):
Yeah, that's beautiful.
Well done on all of your growthwork.
I think that that's really
Chrissy (48:12):
It's scary.
Right?
Gosh, it's scary.
But honestly, like the Enneagramwas the, was really the
catalyst.
I didn't realize that like.
There was as much stuff underthere as there was because I'm a
master at making everything Likechanging the story so that
everything is actually awesome.
So I had no idea Yeah, yeah,it's good.
Steph Barron Hall (48:37):
Yeah.
Um, well, okay, before we getinto our final few questions,
where can everyone find Goldenand especially this collection?
Chrissy (48:48):
Yeah, so we are we only sell online at at golden.
com GLDN.
com There, there should be, youshould see links to the
Enneagram collection, but ifnot, you can just search
Enneagram, um, on, on our site.
And other than that, uh, onsocial, you can find us on
(49:10):
Instagram and TikTok at it'sgolden, spelled out G L D E N N
E G T, of course.
And yeah.
That's, those are the mainspots, yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (49:21):
gonna link that up in the show notes, of
course, and, uh, show everyonewhat my, um, wear it all the
time.
I actually, the first week I hadthis necklace, I had a horrible
allergic reaction to something.
And I was like, no, please don'tbe to the necklace.
It wasn't.
Everything was fine.
(49:41):
I became allergic to alpacasweaters, suddenly out of
nowhere.
Chrissy (49:47):
Me too, and it's the worst because they're so soft
and amazing.
Steph Barron Hall (49:51):
I know it was sudden.
I was like, oh my gosh, now Ihave hives all the time.
Anytime I wear that.
Um, so yes, thrilled with thenecklace.
I definitely want to showeveryone.
Um, it's.
So beautiful.
Um, so final two closingquestions that I ask all of my
guests.
So first one is, tell me about abook that has helped you refresh
(50:11):
you or shaped you in the lastyear.
Chrissy (50:14):
Ooh, it, it's, I actually came, re read a book
that I had been reading a lot atthe beginning of my which is The
Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle,and it's just, it's just such a
fantastic place to start or tobook to go back to, to refresh
that, that awareness of your, ofyour mind and your thought
(50:36):
patterns.
And, and it's just, it's aboutpresence and, I find it just
really grounding, actually.
That's really, that's probablythe best word to describe it.
Steph Barron Hall (50:48):
Beautiful.
I love that.
Okay.
finally, what is a piece ofadvice that has really stuck
with you?
Chrissy (50:54):
The one, the advice I think I've been coming back to
the most lately is somethingthat I heard in, in actually the
waking up meditation app that I,that I use, and it's, This may
be the last time, so savor themoment, essentially, and this
(51:18):
concept of this might be thelast time you drive to work, or
this might be the last time yougo skiing, or this might be the
last time you visit this place,and I remind myself of that as
much as I can whenever there's,whenever I feel like there's
this, this, this beautifulmoment happening, but I'm not
really present in it.
I'm, I'm already moving on tothe next thing.
(51:38):
And I take a moment andhonestly, like 30 seconds of
feeling it, like, like lettingyourself feel like this is the
last time I'm going to be hereor be with this person.
It's so moving.
It's so moving.
It just fills you with so muchgratitude.
And, it's, it's the best mantra.
I love it.
I actually, I want to get atattoo on my arm.
(52:00):
I've just says the last time,because I feel like it's so
powerful.
it's just a beautiful lens to,to, to see things through.
It's almost like thiscombination of presence and
gratitude together, which Ithink is, is fantastic.
Steph Barron Hall (52:13):
Yeah.
And it forces you to like slowdown and to really see.
Yeah.
I love that.
Beautiful.
Chrissy (52:19):
Yeah.
Steph Barron Hall (52:20):
Well, thank you so much for joining me
today.
This has been so fun and Ireally appreciate you sharing
all of the things that you'veshared about the, your
perspective on the Enneagramand, this collection.
Like I said, I, I reallyappreciate it.
And I've actually been sharingit with my friends too, just
like in text, be like, Oh mygosh, look at this.
so I really hope that, all ofour listeners love it as well.
Chrissy (52:41):
Thank you so much, Stephanie.
I've really enjoyed this.
It's, it's been fantasticspeaking with you.
Thank you.
Steph Barron Hall (52:47):
Thanks.
Thanks so much for listening toEnneagram IRL.
If you love the show, be sure tosubscribe and leave us a rating
and review.
This is the easiest way to makesure new people find the show.
And it's so helpful for a newpodcast like this one, if you
want to stay connected.
Sign up for my email list in theshow notes or message me on
(53:08):
instagram at nine types co totell me your one big takeaway
from today's show I'd love tohear from you.
I know there are a millionpodcasts you could have been
listening to, and I feel sograteful that you chose to spend
this time with me.
Can't wait to meet you rightback here for another episode of
any grim IRL very soon.
The Enneagram and real lifepodcast is a production of nine
(53:31):
types co LLC.
It's created and produced byStephanie Barron hall.
With editing support fromBrandon Hall.
And additional support fromcrits collaborations.
Thanks to dr dream chip for ouramazing theme song and you can
also check out all of theirmusic on spotify
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