August 27, 2025 • 32 mins
What does it mean to run a "boutique" architecture firm in today's market? Nate Webster, partner at ARCA Design in Asheville, North Carolina, reveals the strategic advantages of staying small and nimble while delivering projects ranging from custom homes to $20 million museums.
Growing up as the son of a residential contractor, Webster developed an early appreciation for construction before discovering his passion for design in high school. While he initially planned to work in larger markets after graduating from UNC Charlotte, the opportunity to join ARCA Design brought him back to Western North Carolina immediately—a decision he hasn't regretted.
Since becoming a partner in 2021, Webster has navigated the transition from employee to business owner while maintaining the firm's distinctive approach. Unlike many architecture practices where partners primarily focus on bringing in business, ARCA partners remain deeply involved in the design process. This hands-on approach stems from the founding partners' desire to avoid the pitfalls they experienced at larger regional firms where client relationship management often displaced creative work.
Perhaps most striking is ARCA's commitment to work-life balance. Webster shares how the firm supported his wife (also an ARCA architect) with flexible work arrangements after their first child was born—in 2018, well before remote work became commonplace. This family-first philosophy permeates their culture without compromising their professional standards or growth.
When asked about their business strategy, Webster acknowledges areas for improvement like marketing but emphasizes that their growth comes primarily from quality service and meaningful relationships. Their philosophy is refreshingly straightforward: focus on your craft first, and success will follow.
For architects, designers, and entrepreneurs alike, Webster's journey offers valuable insights into building a business that balances professional excellence with personal priorities. Tune in to discover how this boutique firm maintains its creative edge while creating space for what matters most.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hey there, Welcome to this week's episode of Epic
Entrepreneurs.
I'm super pumped today, butbefore I get to our guest, I
just want to remind you we'vegot coming up on September 23rd,
the Asheville Business Summit.
The website is wncsummitcom.
Make sure to get your ticketsout there on there.
Look, I'm pumped today.
We've got Nate Webster.
(00:24):
He's a partner in ARCA Design.
I'm going to let him tell youwhat that is.
For those of you who don't knowme, I'm Bill Gilliland.
I own Action Coach BusinessGrowth Partners and one of the
founders of the AshevilleBusiness Summit.
So, Nate, hey, tell us aboutyou and ARCA.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Yeah, thanks for having me on today.
It's the first podcastappearance for me, so it should
be fun.
But yeah, my name is NateWebster.
I'm a partner at Arca Design.
We're here in Asheville, northCarolina, and we're a small
boutique architecture firm.
We definitely primarily providecommercial design services, but
(01:03):
we kind of dip our toe into theresidential design market as
well.
And, yeah, we kind ofintentionally try to keep
ourselves in that boutique kindof category to allow us to be a
little bit more nimble and workon a variety of project types.
But yeah, I grew up in this area, uh, from waynesville, um, and
(01:26):
my dad's a residentialcontractor.
So I kind of grew up with thatinterest of construction and the
technical aspects of of whatthat is and then, in, uh, in
high school, started to developan interest in design and
creative kind of explorations.
And then I had a teacher uh,coach ronhart was my drafting
teacher.
He encouraged me to look intoarchitecture as it kind of
explorations.
And then I had a teacher uh,coach Ron Hart was my drafting
teacher and he encouraged me tolook into architecture as it
(01:48):
kind of combines those twothings.
And then went to school at UNCCharlotte and studied there and
had planned to kind of movearound to different cities and
and uh, get the experience ofworking in larger markets and
some larger firms.
Uh, but had a great job offerwith ARCA coming out of school
and, um, yeah, it's kind of the.
(02:09):
The rest is history, I guess,as they say.
But uh, yeah, it's been a great, a great setup for me here.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
But it's pretty hard to say no to western north
carolina right for sure.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
Yeah, I knew that.
Uh, growing up here and growingup in waynesville, I knew that
I wanted to settle here andraise my family here, but didn't
expect for it to be immediatelyafter school.
But it's wouldn't have it anyother way yeah, I was.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
I was actually born in ashville, didn't actually
grow up there, I grew up down insouth carolina, but I knew we,
we knew we'd be back and uh, ittook us a little longer than we
thought.
Actually we got here a littlequicker than we thought because
we thought it might just be aretirement thing.
But yeah, so we've been back awhile.
But yeah, let me ask you, I gota question about the boutique
(02:53):
thing.
What does that mean?
Like what exactly?
You know?
How would you define that?
Speaker 2 (02:59):
I would say that that's something that our
founding partners, brian Moffittand Alan McGuinn, intentionally
set up when they started ourfirm.
So they both come from abackground that's more kind of a
larger regional corporate firmmodel, where they were in an
Asheville office of a firm thathad offices in Winston-Salem and
(03:20):
Charlotte up in Virginia and inSouth Carolina Salem and
Charlotte, up in Virginia and inSouth Carolina and there were
definitely some pros to thatmodel but there were some cons
and I think a lot ofarchitecture firms and there are
definitely benefits to it butend up having a focus or a niche
that they work within, and Ithink that that was something
(03:40):
that they didn't want tonecessarily do.
So when we say that we're aboutique firm, I think that that
just echoes the level of careand kind of attention that each
design gets.
They're all kind ofcustom-tailored solutions to the
client's needs and to theirwhatever site requirements they
(04:02):
may have, whether it's anexisting building or a vacant
lot.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Yeah, and I love that .
Well, let me ask you somebusiness stuff.
If you had to start from squareone in business, what would you
do differently?
Speaker 2 (04:17):
That's a good question.
You and I had kind of talked alittle bit earlier and touched
on the fact that my role atArcade Design as one of the
partners is a little bit fresher.
I became a partner here in 2021.
So I feel like in some ways,I'm still very much and I'm sure
I would say the same thing 30years from now but learning
(04:38):
about being a business ownerevery day.
But I think that we are everyday, but I think that we are in
some in.
In some ways, we try to to tokeep our everything kind of
streamlined, maybe to a fault,to where we we maintain
responsibilities of things thatwould would maybe be better
(05:00):
performed by by other people.
So having having other people onstaff that could maybe do some
of those tasks like, forinstance, um, the, the role that
marketing plays in our firm, wekind of have kind of ebb and
flow with what role that playsin how we, how we do that.
I mean, like in our office I endup managing all the social
(05:22):
media, um outreach and stufflike that, which, when that's on
the forefront of my mind, Ithink it's I do a decent job at
it, but it's certainly not mypriority, and so to kind of to
think about marketing in a in adifferent way, I think would be
pretty useful.
But then at the same time, inour business it's so much about
(05:44):
client relationship and so muchof our work comes from repeat
clients or client referencesfrom contractors.
There's a big part of ourindustry is kind of helping each
other out with referencingcontractors to tell owners that
need that and vice versa.
(06:05):
Contractors will will give ourreference to people often.
So we, we think of what we doevery day as a form of marketing
.
That the our, our clientrelationships that we maintain
and the work that we put out isis marketing in a sense, um, but
I think that you can do that toa fault as well, to where you
you kind of put the traditionalmarketing on the back burner.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
Yeah, I mean, you likely didn't go to school to be
an architect, to do marketing,but, on the other hand, you know
, in a professional servicesfirms, a lot of times the
partners are the rainmakers, youknow.
So they're the ones that haveto bring in the business for the
firm.
So it's an interesting question.
It's great learning.
So what else have you learned,like what are some of the other
(06:49):
learnings that you've had as anowner and an employer since 2021
, when you became a partner?
Speaker 2 (07:01):
That's a good question.
It's probably one that I shouldreflect on on a regular basis to
be better equipped in myday-to-day work.
But I think we've had someexperiences where I don't think
I mentioned being a smaller firm.
We have five architects onstaff and three of us are our
(07:22):
active partners partners, um anduh, but there's really within
the way that we've structuredour company at this point um,
there's not a ton of uhdelegation that that happens.
Uh, we do have people that comein like we just had our summer
intern go back to school.
Um, and that's definitely ablind spot for me in terms of
(07:46):
when we have staff in the office, whether they're temporary or
longer term, being in themindset and well equipped to be
able to pass on tasks to otherpeople that we've got that are
certainly in the position to beable to perform those.
And I think that in the nearfuture we'll be expanding our
(08:08):
workforce a little bit.
So, that's something that Ithink your question was more
what have I learned?
But that might be forecasting alittle bit.
Something that I'm going to beneeding to learn a little bit
more is, rather than kind ofgetting of uh, knowing
everything that you've got toget done and trying to do it
yourself, um, learning how to uh, to communicate, uh, the way
(08:33):
that you need something to bedone, and and uh and um to be
able to get, have those tasksdone, is, is, uh, is is a really
valuable um knowledge and anduh and uh, and asset for sure.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
Yeah, I think one of the great transitions as a
business owner is when you canmove from the question how can I
do something?
To who can I get to do it?
Yes, yeah that's a greattransition.
Let me what do you?
I mean, you've been a partnerfor a little while.
What are some of themisconceptions about being a
partner in the marketplace?
Speaker 2 (09:14):
I think my answer would be limited really just to
the architecture field, butmaybe in the professional
services field as a whole.
But I think that a commonmisconception that I would think
is that and it's very true whatyou said about the partners
kind of bringing in work andfinding the leads and stuff like
(09:36):
that, but at least in the waythat we've set it up at Arca is
we may be responsible for thatand that is kind of the biggest
transition from being anemployee to a partner is that
that responsibility and burdento to generate the work, but we
still are just as involved inthe execution of the work.
So I think, and that's kind ofwhere, when Brian and Alan
(10:01):
started ARCA and wanted toretain some of those the pros of
that kind of larger regionalcorporate business model but
then get rid of some of the cons, alan had led that Asheville
office and his entire kind ofnot entire, but the vast
majority of his workload was tomaintain those relationships and
bring in new work and hadreally lost that hands-on aspect
(10:25):
of the design tasks that we allkind of love so much.
And with at least with the waythat we've set it up at AR, at
arc, where all the partners arecertainly responsible for
bringing in work, but we remain,and uh, intimately involved
with the, the design process,with each, with each project
(10:47):
yeah, and I love that.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
Hey, what do you attribute your growth to?
Speaker 2 (10:56):
in our case, I would say that it's definitely just
the level of service and qualityof service provided.
And we talk about growth oftenand how we want to approach it,
because I think that a lot oftimes, growth is seen as adding
employees or needing to get moreoffice space and stuff like
(11:17):
that, and we're at a breakingpoint where we need to do that
for sure.
But we've certainly seen growthin terms of revenue, and not
only the number of projects thatwe're working on, but the
quality of projects that we'reworking on is a big thing.
But I think that we attributethat to the quality of service
(11:38):
that we provide and being ableto do it in a timely and
cost-effective manner, I think,in terms of the value that's
provided.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
Yeah, and I like it.
It always comes up that there's.
You know, everybody thinksthere's a difference between you
know there's a big contrastbetween business and personal
life.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
So how do you balance the demands of business and
your personal life?
That's another thing where Ithink that our model is a little
bit different than a lot ofother architecture firm models,
or at least what I had come toexpect coming out of school and
I I my um first job out ofschool was at architecture
design, but I'd worked at anumber of architecture firms um
while I was in school and and uhto to uh to get me through that
(12:31):
time as well.
But um there, it was prettyapparent in my uh initial
interviews with with the companythat there was a uh an abnormal
um emphasis placed on home lifeand family, which was very
attractive to me as someone whothat that's is my number one
priority.
For sure.
Um have a wife and two, twogirls, two daughters at home and
(12:55):
another one on the way.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
And congratulations.
That's awesome, thank you, yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
Thanks, but um that, um, yeah, I'm very blessed to be
in a, in an office where thereis not the expectation that my
family suffer um for uh, in inin the name of, of, of my
business or what I've got goingon, yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
That's a great.
That's a great to me, that's agreat advertisement for Archer,
because they've you've created aculture there that allows for
that.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
Yeah, yeah, for sure, yeah, and it's it.
It at the risk of going off ina little bit of a tangent, my
wife is also an architect and isone of our architects here at
Arca Design, but when our firstdaughter was born, she had spent
the kind of normal 12-weekmaternity leave at home and she
(13:49):
was getting ready to have tocome back into the office.
And at the time I was not apartner and one of our founding
partners, brian was asking mehow my wife Cindy felt about
coming back into the office, andat the time I was.
I was not a partner and uh, orone of our founding partners.
Brian was asking me how my wifeCindy felt about coming back
into the office.
I said oh, you know, she's uh,some days she's excited about it
and some days it's tragic thethought of of uh having to leave
the baby and not be with her,and this was in 2018.
(14:10):
Um, so, before COVID and allthat kind of stuff and off the
cuff, you just say well, youknow, if she wants to, she can
just work from home until thebaby's a year old and that'll be
fine.
We'll see where it goes.
So that was before the workfrom home craze and all that.
And you know that's not anemployee handbook or anything
like that.
That's just the leadership ofour firm prioritizing our family
(14:34):
health.
The leadership of our firmprioritizing our family health.
And that's just one example ofmany ways that our company has
prioritized our personal lives,and I think that that reflects
in the care that we bring intoour work and into each project.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
Yeah, it goes to my next question a little bit.
But how do you and maybe thishasn't come up yet for you, but
what do you look for inemployees?
Speaker 2 (15:07):
That's a great question.
We've been talking about that alittle bit recently.
We've had the same.
So the only employees that webrought on since I've become a
partner have been part time, so,like some renters, and I think
that for us, with only havingfive people, culture fit is a
big thing.
Yeah, and because we've beenworking together for or 10, at
(15:34):
least David and Brian and I arethe current partners.
We've all been working togetherfor 10 years and Alan and Brian
have been working together forI don't even know how long,
probably 20.
And not that we want to create ahomogenous work culture, but
there's a rapport that we wouldwant to maintain.
(15:55):
So culture fit is is a good, isa big thing, and in our field of
design, talent is is really thebiggest thing.
I mean, when I was in school, Ihad really explored the
possibility of going into um,get my uh postgraduate degree
and uh, at the time I wascontemplating uh one to
potentially pursue being aprofessor, uh, which would
require that.
(16:16):
But when it became clear to methat I really just wanted to
practice, through counsel fromsome other architects and others
, they advised me that thepostgraduate was not necessarily
essential in terms ofmarketability in the
professional environment.
(16:37):
Not that there's not benefit tothat.
There certainly is.
But if we're evaluating twoapplicants for a job and one
doesn't have as impressive of aportfolio but has a master's
degree, and another has all thecredentials that they need, but
it's a bachelor's degree, butthey have a really impressive
(16:58):
portfolio and a good workproduct, then we're going to
lean more towards the design,talent and work product.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Yeah, well, the results matter, right?
Sure, yeah, yeah, let's go tothe quick fire round.
So I've got this is just like acouple of sentences on each
topic.
The BEPIC is a acronym that wecame up with a number of years
ago, that we it's helpful forsuccess, but so the B stands for
(17:26):
bring the energy.
So what are your thoughtsaround energy?
Speaker 2 (17:31):
I think that in our case where I would say that at
times I can be lacking, for sure, but I think that it's
important we can be a prettyrestrained group in our office
but to bring the energy andexcitement to each project and
(17:51):
each problem that needs to besolved I mean, that's really
what most careers are, but thatcertainly rings true in
architecture is problem solving,and if you don't approach each
problem with the same enthusiasm, then you're not going to.
You risk not finding as asuccessful solution.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
Yeah, I mean, there's different forms of energy.
Right, it doesn't have to belike rah-rah all the time, but
you can bring good energy to,like you said, solving a problem
or designing a space or abuilding or whatever.
So I think it's great, allright.
So what's your thought about Eis education.
What's your thought abouteducation?
Speaker 2 (18:30):
Yeah, in terms of like a continuing aspect or
education as a training tool.
Speaker 1 (18:40):
It can be anything.
I mean, it's about you know.
You know when we, when we cameup with this, the idea was you
know that I was looking for anacronym for success Like what,
what are some of thecharacteristics of very
successful people?
And one of them I found wasthat they were continuously
educating.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
Yeah, yeah, great, yeah, I mean there's.
I saw one of your previousepisodes.
You were talking with a guythat, funny enough, his office
was kind of down the same roadbut does a construction.
Continuing education programsyeah, yeah, yeah.
In architecture there's somepretty strenuous, strenuous but
pretty strict outlines in termsof what we have to fulfill on a
(19:19):
continuing education standpoint.
I think a lot of times that canresult in just kind of checking
a box and not necessarily beingsuper fruitful.
Continuing education that I tryto prioritize that wouldn't
(19:39):
necessarily be um, uh,credentialed in any way is uh,
in our, in our field, uh,precedent study.
So I try to take time, uh, notnecessarily on a daily basis,
but try to be intentional abouttaking time and looking at work
that other architects around theworld are are doing, um, to
kind of get inspired by whatother folks are doing, find
other ways to solve problems orother types of materials that
(20:00):
people are using, so that wedon't just get into solving
problems the same way over andover again.
And so I think that would beone way that I, at least in my
aspect, try to focus onmaintaining an education and
keeping tabs on that.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
Yeah, I mean.
I mean there's the educationthat you have to have, which is
the, you know, the continuingeducation credits that you have
in your profession.
That rarely is enough forsuccess.
That's just enough to keep youcertified as an actual
practicing architect, andthere's a lot of that in a lot
(20:43):
of professions.
And I think I know in my earlycareer I took the education that
came to me and I didn't do alot of self education.
So I applaud you for doing this.
You know, doing the proactiveself education that's going to
help you be more successful inyour business, whether that's
technical or business educationor whatever it is.
That's awesome.
Speaker 2 (21:04):
Yeah, education is a funny thing in architecture.
I had the first architect thatI worked for when I was in
school told me something that Idon't think I'll ever forget.
He said architects are poorlyeducated but highly trained.
Told me something that I don'tthink I'll ever forget.
He said architects are poorlyeducated but highly trained.
But so in architecture there'sa a pretty, a pretty strenuous
education that we have to get to, to get the the accredited
(21:27):
degrees to be able to, tocontinue on in our path to
licensure, and it's it's a greatprocess, um process.
Some people um hate it and somepeople love it, just with what's
asked of you.
But really you spend five orsix years focusing on what ends
up being about 15, 10 and 15% of, I think, what actually the
(21:48):
actual day-to-day being anarchitect is, so that that
education is really entirely,almost entirely focused on the
conceptual design aspect, andthen so really you spend a long
period of time focused on thatand then when you get done with
school and start your requiredinternship and exam period,
(22:09):
that's you really kind of hitthe ground running with your
education Then because there'sso much more in the technical
aspect and climate relations andcontract negotiations and stuff
like that.
That is a huge part of what wedo on the day to day, that we
don't necessarily get educatedas good as we probably should in
school, I would say.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
But the school is great, but the real education
starts after school.
Yeah for sure.
Yeah, yeah.
No, I like it All right.
The P in Epic is planning andit seems like an appropriate
thing to talk about as anarchitect.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
Yeah, yeah, planning man, that's a noun and an
adjective in our sorry, a nounand a verb in our field,
definitely.
I mean, I definitelyimmediately jumped to kind of
master planning, which is anaspect of something that we will
do for clients, often at thebeginning stages of a project
(23:02):
and often in collaboration withother consultants, engineers and
landscape architects.
But, yeah, that's, that's a,that's one, that's that's wide
arching for sure.
I mean, planning reallybranches into what I would say
we do on a on a daily basis, forsure.
But but yeah, planning in termsof the, the, the design process
(23:27):
as a whole, what we're, whatwe're trying to accomplish with
each phase, yeah, that's a bigone for sure.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
Yeah, so AI is inspiration.
So where do you findinspiration?
Speaker 2 (23:40):
Yeah, I think I kind of touched on that with the
education piece.
I mean, I, I personally find itby uh, appreciating and looking
at work of other architectsthat I admire, um and uh, other
folks like I think some otherpeople in our office might find
it more by walking around, uh,some of our communities like B
think some other people in ouroffice might find it more by
walking around some of ourcommunities like Biltmore
Village and some of the areas atAsheville where we have
(24:02):
beautiful pieces of preservedhistoric architecture.
But yeah, that's one of thethings that's really neat about
our field is, know, you'resurrounded by it all the time.
I read, I read a quote once, uhit was, it was this book that
was.
Uh, I think it was calledinterviews in new york or
(24:23):
something, where they would justinterview random people and
they asked this woman what herfavorite art form was and uh, in
which that that's kind of acontentious debate within the
architecture field is whetherarchitecture is in fact in an
art form or not, which, you know, one of those arguments can can
kind of come across as a littlebit more pretentious, but her
reason for saying thatarchitecture was her favorite
(24:45):
art form was because everybodyhas a frame of reference for it,
um.
So, like, there's art and musicand everybody um has experienced
things in different ways, buteverybody experiences and has a
frame of reference forarchitecture in a pretty
intimate way and we try to keepthat in mind when we're working
on smaller scale projects likehouses.
I work on the majority of ourresidential work in our firm and
(25:11):
it's always I always try toprioritize that being a
collaborative effort, becausewhile I'm the, I may be the
design professional.
The people that I'm designingthe house for have lived in a
number of houses throughouttheir lives and have very valid
perspectives on what they findto be successful and
unsuccessful.
So, yeah, definitely keep anopen mind in terms of what they
(25:33):
bring to the table and what theymight suggest.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Yeah, yeah, I love that.
I love that.
I think I mean, one of the coolthings about architecture to me
is it's art and it's functional, so it's not just you know
there's, there's.
To me that's great because that, that may that mean.
That's the sort of intersectionof form and function.
You know it's a great thing.
(25:59):
All right, the C in EPIC iscommitment.
What are your thoughts aroundcommitting?
Speaker 2 (26:05):
and commitment.
I mean, I was raised to valuethat extremely.
So, yeah, it's kind of a just agiven thing If you, if you
(26:30):
commit to to perform a task oror to to meet someone's, to meet
someone's needs on a on aclient relation basis, it's just
you kind of, you have to haveto see that through and it's
kind of hard to imagine that notbeing the case.
I mean, it's I don't reallyknow of a viable alternative.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Yeah, I love it, love it.
Yeah, it's a sort of way oflife.
You do what you're saying and Ilove that.
Yeah, it's a way of life foryou.
That's a good way to put it.
Yeah, it's not a.
The decision's been made.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Yeah, I's not a it's not a.
Speaker 1 (26:57):
It's the decisions been made, mm?
Hmm, yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2 (26:59):
All right.
Speaker 1 (26:59):
So what words of advice would you give to other
professionals or other businessowners who are looking to grow?
Speaker 2 (27:20):
Uh, man, while the and I think that highlights to
me that what is has kind ofmaybe been a something that
we've overlooked in our growth,like what we were talking about
earlier with with the marketingaspect, um, I would imagine that
young business owners likemyself that maybe don't have the
structure that's beenestablished under them myself
that maybe don't have thestructure that's been
established under them Like I'vebeen fortunate to have here
with ARCA, might, might needfill the need to prioritize
(27:43):
marketing campaigns or or reallykind of doing big pushes on
social media and catchy stufflike that.
But I would say, focus on yourcraft, you know, like really
hone in on what it is that youdo, and that your number one
marketing tool should be to toperform your craft as good as
possible.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
I love that.
Perform your craft as best youcan.
I love that.
Yeah, yeah, it's an it's.
It's an interesting one.
In construction I have a lot.
We have a lot of clients inbuilding and construction
professional services, but youdo have to do some
self-promotion For sure.
(28:25):
I've known plenty of builderswho are great builders, who
didn't make it because themarketing just wasn't good
enough.
They didn't, or they were tooperfectionistic.
It's an interesting one.
So, let's wrap it up here.
What is the best way forsomeone to get in touch with you
?
Somebody wants to do businessor partner with you, or they
(28:49):
need some architectural services.
What is the best way for themto get a hold of you?
Speaker 2 (28:54):
Yeah, I would say just to um, reach out to us via
our.
Our website is arca, the arcadash designcom.
Um, there's a, there's acontact tab there where it'll
send to to kind of our generalemail.
My, my personal email isnatewebster at arca-designcom.
Um, and yeah, like I don'tthink I really touched on it,
(29:17):
great, but we're a smallerarchitecture firm.
We'll work on everything from asmall two-bedroom house to we
did the Asheville Art Museumdowntown, so $30 million art
museum to 30, or, sorry, $20million art museum to $30
million medical manufacturingplant.
We really kind of have a wide,wide range of uh of of projects
(29:41):
that we that we work on.
Um, so really no, um, noproject is is off the table.
But yeah, we're always eager toto do what we can to improve
the beauty of our builtenvironment.
Um, and we try to approach eachproject with that same level of
care.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
No, I love that.
Yeah, I love that.
That is, I mean, it's one ofthe advantages of being nimble.
You can decide, hey, do we wantto do this project or not?
And is it a good project for us?
Is it a good project for ourcommunities?
Yeah, it's a good project forthe client, so it's a
(30:19):
win-win-win.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
I guess yeah, exactly .
Speaker 1 (30:20):
Yeah, I love that.
Hey, so fantastic.
Thanks for being part of uscommunity and for all you're
doing.
We certainly are lookingforward to seeing your continued
growth.
Hey, thanks for that and untilnext time all the best.
Hey there, Welcome to this week's episode of Epic
Entrepreneurs.
I'm super pumped today, butbefore I get to our guest, I
just want to remind you we'vegot coming up on September 23rd,
the Asheville Business Summit.
The website is wncsummitcom.
Make sure to get your ticketsout there on there.
Look, I'm pumped today.
We've got Nate Webster.
(00:24):
He's a partner in ARCA Design.
I'm going to let him tell youwhat that is.
For those of you who don't knowme, I'm Bill Gilliland.
I own Action Coach BusinessGrowth Partners and one of the
founders of the AshevilleBusiness Summit.
So, Nate, hey, tell us aboutyou and ARCA.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Yeah, thanks for having me on today.
It's the first podcastappearance for me, so it should
be fun.
But yeah, my name is NateWebster.
I'm a partner at Arca Design.
We're here in Asheville, northCarolina, and we're a small
boutique architecture firm.
We definitely primarily providecommercial design services, but
(01:03):
we kind of dip our toe into theresidential design market as
well.
And, yeah, we kind ofintentionally try to keep
ourselves in that boutique kindof category to allow us to be a
little bit more nimble and workon a variety of project types.
But yeah, I grew up in this area, uh, from waynesville, um, and
(01:26):
my dad's a residentialcontractor.
So I kind of grew up with thatinterest of construction and the
technical aspects of of whatthat is and then, in, uh, in
high school, started to developan interest in design and
creative kind of explorations.
And then I had a teacher uh,coach ronhart was my drafting
teacher.
He encouraged me to look intoarchitecture as it kind of
explorations.
And then I had a teacher uh,coach Ron Hart was my drafting
teacher and he encouraged me tolook into architecture as it
(01:48):
kind of combines those twothings.
And then went to school at UNCCharlotte and studied there and
had planned to kind of movearound to different cities and
and uh, get the experience ofworking in larger markets and
some larger firms.
Uh, but had a great job offerwith ARCA coming out of school
and, um, yeah, it's kind of the.
(02:09):
The rest is history, I guess,as they say.
But uh, yeah, it's been a great, a great setup for me here.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
But it's pretty hard to say no to western north
carolina right for sure.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
Yeah, I knew that.
Uh, growing up here and growingup in waynesville, I knew that
I wanted to settle here andraise my family here, but didn't
expect for it to be immediatelyafter school.
But it's wouldn't have it anyother way yeah, I was.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
I was actually born in ashville, didn't actually
grow up there, I grew up down insouth carolina, but I knew we,
we knew we'd be back and uh, ittook us a little longer than we
thought.
Actually we got here a littlequicker than we thought because
we thought it might just be aretirement thing.
But yeah, so we've been back awhile.
But yeah, let me ask you, I gota question about the boutique
(02:53):
thing.
What does that mean?
Like what exactly?
You know?
How would you define that?
Speaker 2 (02:59):
I would say that that's something that our
founding partners, brian Moffittand Alan McGuinn, intentionally
set up when they started ourfirm.
So they both come from abackground that's more kind of a
larger regional corporate firmmodel, where they were in an
Asheville office of a firm thathad offices in Winston-Salem and
(03:20):
Charlotte up in Virginia and inSouth Carolina Salem and
Charlotte, up in Virginia and inSouth Carolina and there were
definitely some pros to thatmodel but there were some cons
and I think a lot ofarchitecture firms and there are
definitely benefits to it butend up having a focus or a niche
that they work within, and Ithink that that was something
(03:40):
that they didn't want tonecessarily do.
So when we say that we're aboutique firm, I think that that
just echoes the level of careand kind of attention that each
design gets.
They're all kind ofcustom-tailored solutions to the
client's needs and to theirwhatever site requirements they
(04:02):
may have, whether it's anexisting building or a vacant
lot.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Yeah, and I love that .
Well, let me ask you somebusiness stuff.
If you had to start from squareone in business, what would you
do differently?
Speaker 2 (04:17):
That's a good question.
You and I had kind of talked alittle bit earlier and touched
on the fact that my role atArcade Design as one of the
partners is a little bit fresher.
I became a partner here in 2021.
So I feel like in some ways,I'm still very much and I'm sure
I would say the same thing 30years from now but learning
(04:38):
about being a business ownerevery day.
But I think that we are everyday, but I think that we are in
some in.
In some ways, we try to to tokeep our everything kind of
streamlined, maybe to a fault,to where we we maintain
responsibilities of things thatwould would maybe be better
(05:00):
performed by by other people.
So having having other people onstaff that could maybe do some
of those tasks like, forinstance, um, the, the role that
marketing plays in our firm, wekind of have kind of ebb and
flow with what role that playsin how we, how we do that.
I mean, like in our office I endup managing all the social
(05:22):
media, um outreach and stufflike that, which, when that's on
the forefront of my mind, Ithink it's I do a decent job at
it, but it's certainly not mypriority, and so to kind of to
think about marketing in a in adifferent way, I think would be
pretty useful.
But then at the same time, inour business it's so much about
(05:44):
client relationship and so muchof our work comes from repeat
clients or client referencesfrom contractors.
There's a big part of ourindustry is kind of helping each
other out with referencingcontractors to tell owners that
need that and vice versa.
(06:05):
Contractors will will give ourreference to people often.
So we, we think of what we doevery day as a form of marketing
.
That the our, our clientrelationships that we maintain
and the work that we put out isis marketing in a sense, um, but
I think that you can do that toa fault as well, to where you
you kind of put the traditionalmarketing on the back burner.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
Yeah, I mean, you likely didn't go to school to be
an architect, to do marketing,but, on the other hand, you know
, in a professional servicesfirms, a lot of times the
partners are the rainmakers, youknow.
So they're the ones that haveto bring in the business for the
firm.
So it's an interesting question.
It's great learning.
So what else have you learned,like what are some of the other
(06:49):
learnings that you've had as anowner and an employer since 2021
, when you became a partner?
Speaker 2 (07:01):
That's a good question.
It's probably one that I shouldreflect on on a regular basis to
be better equipped in myday-to-day work.
But I think we've had someexperiences where I don't think
I mentioned being a smaller firm.
We have five architects onstaff and three of us are our
(07:22):
active partners partners, um anduh, but there's really within
the way that we've structuredour company at this point um,
there's not a ton of uhdelegation that that happens.
Uh, we do have people that comein like we just had our summer
intern go back to school.
Um, and that's definitely ablind spot for me in terms of
(07:46):
when we have staff in the office, whether they're temporary or
longer term, being in themindset and well equipped to be
able to pass on tasks to otherpeople that we've got that are
certainly in the position to beable to perform those.
And I think that in the nearfuture we'll be expanding our
(08:08):
workforce a little bit.
So, that's something that Ithink your question was more
what have I learned?
But that might be forecasting alittle bit.
Something that I'm going to beneeding to learn a little bit
more is, rather than kind ofgetting of uh, knowing
everything that you've got toget done and trying to do it
yourself, um, learning how to uh, to communicate, uh, the way
(08:33):
that you need something to bedone, and and uh and um to be
able to get, have those tasksdone, is, is, uh, is is a really
valuable um knowledge and anduh and uh, and asset for sure.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
Yeah, I think one of the great transitions as a
business owner is when you canmove from the question how can I
do something?
To who can I get to do it?
Yes, yeah that's a greattransition.
Let me what do you?
I mean, you've been a partnerfor a little while.
What are some of themisconceptions about being a
partner in the marketplace?
Speaker 2 (09:14):
I think my answer would be limited really just to
the architecture field, butmaybe in the professional
services field as a whole.
But I think that a commonmisconception that I would think
is that and it's very true whatyou said about the partners
kind of bringing in work andfinding the leads and stuff like
(09:36):
that, but at least in the waythat we've set it up at Arca is
we may be responsible for thatand that is kind of the biggest
transition from being anemployee to a partner is that
that responsibility and burdento to generate the work, but we
still are just as involved inthe execution of the work.
So I think, and that's kind ofwhere, when Brian and Alan
(10:01):
started ARCA and wanted toretain some of those the pros of
that kind of larger regionalcorporate business model but
then get rid of some of the cons, alan had led that Asheville
office and his entire kind ofnot entire, but the vast
majority of his workload was tomaintain those relationships and
bring in new work and hadreally lost that hands-on aspect
(10:25):
of the design tasks that we allkind of love so much.
And with at least with the waythat we've set it up at AR, at
arc, where all the partners arecertainly responsible for
bringing in work, but we remain,and uh, intimately involved
with the, the design process,with each, with each project
(10:47):
yeah, and I love that.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
Hey, what do you attribute your growth to?
Speaker 2 (10:56):
in our case, I would say that it's definitely just
the level of service and qualityof service provided.
And we talk about growth oftenand how we want to approach it,
because I think that a lot oftimes, growth is seen as adding
employees or needing to get moreoffice space and stuff like
(11:17):
that, and we're at a breakingpoint where we need to do that
for sure.
But we've certainly seen growthin terms of revenue, and not
only the number of projects thatwe're working on, but the
quality of projects that we'reworking on is a big thing.
But I think that we attributethat to the quality of service
(11:38):
that we provide and being ableto do it in a timely and
cost-effective manner, I think,in terms of the value that's
provided.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
Yeah, and I like it.
It always comes up that there's.
You know, everybody thinksthere's a difference between you
know there's a big contrastbetween business and personal
life.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
So how do you balance the demands of business and
your personal life?
That's another thing where Ithink that our model is a little
bit different than a lot ofother architecture firm models,
or at least what I had come toexpect coming out of school and
I I my um first job out ofschool was at architecture
design, but I'd worked at anumber of architecture firms um
while I was in school and and uhto to uh to get me through that
(12:31):
time as well.
But um there, it was prettyapparent in my uh initial
interviews with with the companythat there was a uh an abnormal
um emphasis placed on home lifeand family, which was very
attractive to me as someone whothat that's is my number one
priority.
For sure.
Um have a wife and two, twogirls, two daughters at home and
(12:55):
another one on the way.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
And congratulations.
That's awesome, thank you, yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
Thanks, but um that, um, yeah, I'm very blessed to be
in a, in an office where thereis not the expectation that my
family suffer um for uh, in inin the name of, of, of my
business or what I've got goingon, yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
That's a great.
That's a great to me, that's agreat advertisement for Archer,
because they've you've created aculture there that allows for
that.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
Yeah, yeah, for sure, yeah, and it's it.
It at the risk of going off ina little bit of a tangent, my
wife is also an architect and isone of our architects here at
Arca Design, but when our firstdaughter was born, she had spent
the kind of normal 12-weekmaternity leave at home and she
(13:49):
was getting ready to have tocome back into the office.
And at the time I was not apartner and one of our founding
partners, brian was asking mehow my wife Cindy felt about
coming back into the office, andat the time I was.
I was not a partner and uh, orone of our founding partners.
Brian was asking me how my wifeCindy felt about coming back
into the office.
I said oh, you know, she's uh,some days she's excited about it
and some days it's tragic thethought of of uh having to leave
the baby and not be with her,and this was in 2018.
(14:10):
Um, so, before COVID and allthat kind of stuff and off the
cuff, you just say well, youknow, if she wants to, she can
just work from home until thebaby's a year old and that'll be
fine.
We'll see where it goes.
So that was before the workfrom home craze and all that.
And you know that's not anemployee handbook or anything
like that.
That's just the leadership ofour firm prioritizing our family
(14:34):
health.
The leadership of our firmprioritizing our family health.
And that's just one example ofmany ways that our company has
prioritized our personal lives,and I think that that reflects
in the care that we bring intoour work and into each project.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
Yeah, it goes to my next question a little bit.
But how do you and maybe thishasn't come up yet for you, but
what do you look for inemployees?
Speaker 2 (15:07):
That's a great question.
We've been talking about that alittle bit recently.
We've had the same.
So the only employees that webrought on since I've become a
partner have been part time, so,like some renters, and I think
that for us, with only havingfive people, culture fit is a
big thing.
Yeah, and because we've beenworking together for or 10, at
(15:34):
least David and Brian and I arethe current partners.
We've all been working togetherfor 10 years and Alan and Brian
have been working together forI don't even know how long,
probably 20.
And not that we want to create ahomogenous work culture, but
there's a rapport that we wouldwant to maintain.
(15:55):
So culture fit is is a good, isa big thing, and in our field of
design, talent is is really thebiggest thing.
I mean, when I was in school, Ihad really explored the
possibility of going into um,get my uh postgraduate degree
and uh, at the time I wascontemplating uh one to
potentially pursue being aprofessor, uh, which would
require that.
(16:16):
But when it became clear to methat I really just wanted to
practice, through counsel fromsome other architects and others
, they advised me that thepostgraduate was not necessarily
essential in terms ofmarketability in the
professional environment.
(16:37):
Not that there's not benefit tothat.
There certainly is.
But if we're evaluating twoapplicants for a job and one
doesn't have as impressive of aportfolio but has a master's
degree, and another has all thecredentials that they need, but
it's a bachelor's degree, butthey have a really impressive
(16:58):
portfolio and a good workproduct, then we're going to
lean more towards the design,talent and work product.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Yeah, well, the results matter, right?
Sure, yeah, yeah, let's go tothe quick fire round.
So I've got this is just like acouple of sentences on each
topic.
The BEPIC is a acronym that wecame up with a number of years
ago, that we it's helpful forsuccess, but so the B stands for
(17:26):
bring the energy.
So what are your thoughtsaround energy?
Speaker 2 (17:31):
I think that in our case where I would say that at
times I can be lacking, for sure, but I think that it's
important we can be a prettyrestrained group in our office
but to bring the energy andexcitement to each project and
(17:51):
each problem that needs to besolved I mean, that's really
what most careers are, but thatcertainly rings true in
architecture is problem solving,and if you don't approach each
problem with the same enthusiasm, then you're not going to.
You risk not finding as asuccessful solution.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
Yeah, I mean, there's different forms of energy.
Right, it doesn't have to belike rah-rah all the time, but
you can bring good energy to,like you said, solving a problem
or designing a space or abuilding or whatever.
So I think it's great, allright.
So what's your thought about Eis education.
What's your thought abouteducation?
Speaker 2 (18:30):
Yeah, in terms of like a continuing aspect or
education as a training tool.
Speaker 1 (18:40):
It can be anything.
I mean, it's about you know.
You know when we, when we cameup with this, the idea was you
know that I was looking for anacronym for success Like what,
what are some of thecharacteristics of very
successful people?
And one of them I found wasthat they were continuously
educating.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
Yeah, yeah, great, yeah, I mean there's.
I saw one of your previousepisodes.
You were talking with a guythat, funny enough, his office
was kind of down the same roadbut does a construction.
Continuing education programsyeah, yeah, yeah.
In architecture there's somepretty strenuous, strenuous but
pretty strict outlines in termsof what we have to fulfill on a
(19:19):
continuing education standpoint.
I think a lot of times that canresult in just kind of checking
a box and not necessarily beingsuper fruitful.
Continuing education that I tryto prioritize that wouldn't
(19:39):
necessarily be um, uh,credentialed in any way is uh,
in our, in our field, uh,precedent study.
So I try to take time, uh, notnecessarily on a daily basis,
but try to be intentional abouttaking time and looking at work
that other architects around theworld are are doing, um, to
kind of get inspired by whatother folks are doing, find
other ways to solve problems orother types of materials that
(20:00):
people are using, so that wedon't just get into solving
problems the same way over andover again.
And so I think that would beone way that I, at least in my
aspect, try to focus onmaintaining an education and
keeping tabs on that.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
Yeah, I mean.
I mean there's the educationthat you have to have, which is
the, you know, the continuingeducation credits that you have
in your profession.
That rarely is enough forsuccess.
That's just enough to keep youcertified as an actual
practicing architect, andthere's a lot of that in a lot
(20:43):
of professions.
And I think I know in my earlycareer I took the education that
came to me and I didn't do alot of self education.
So I applaud you for doing this.
You know, doing the proactiveself education that's going to
help you be more successful inyour business, whether that's
technical or business educationor whatever it is.
That's awesome.
Speaker 2 (21:04):
Yeah, education is a funny thing in architecture.
I had the first architect thatI worked for when I was in
school told me something that Idon't think I'll ever forget.
He said architects are poorlyeducated but highly trained.
Told me something that I don'tthink I'll ever forget.
He said architects are poorlyeducated but highly trained.
But so in architecture there'sa a pretty, a pretty strenuous
education that we have to get to, to get the the accredited
(21:27):
degrees to be able to, tocontinue on in our path to
licensure, and it's it's a greatprocess, um process.
Some people um hate it and somepeople love it, just with what's
asked of you.
But really you spend five orsix years focusing on what ends
up being about 15, 10 and 15% of, I think, what actually the
(21:48):
actual day-to-day being anarchitect is, so that that
education is really entirely,almost entirely focused on the
conceptual design aspect, andthen so really you spend a long
period of time focused on thatand then when you get done with
school and start your requiredinternship and exam period,
(22:09):
that's you really kind of hitthe ground running with your
education Then because there'sso much more in the technical
aspect and climate relations andcontract negotiations and stuff
like that.
That is a huge part of what wedo on the day to day, that we
don't necessarily get educatedas good as we probably should in
school, I would say.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
But the school is great, but the real education
starts after school.
Yeah for sure.
Yeah, yeah.
No, I like it All right.
The P in Epic is planning andit seems like an appropriate
thing to talk about as anarchitect.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
Yeah, yeah, planning man, that's a noun and an
adjective in our sorry, a nounand a verb in our field,
definitely.
I mean, I definitelyimmediately jumped to kind of
master planning, which is anaspect of something that we will
do for clients, often at thebeginning stages of a project
(23:02):
and often in collaboration withother consultants, engineers and
landscape architects.
But, yeah, that's, that's a,that's one, that's that's wide
arching for sure.
I mean, planning reallybranches into what I would say
we do on a on a daily basis, forsure.
But but yeah, planning in termsof the, the, the design process
(23:27):
as a whole, what we're, whatwe're trying to accomplish with
each phase, yeah, that's a bigone for sure.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
Yeah, so AI is inspiration.
So where do you findinspiration?
Speaker 2 (23:40):
Yeah, I think I kind of touched on that with the
education piece.
I mean, I, I personally find itby uh, appreciating and looking
at work of other architectsthat I admire, um and uh, other
folks like I think some otherpeople in our office might find
it more by walking around, uh,some of our communities like B
think some other people in ouroffice might find it more by
walking around some of ourcommunities like Biltmore
Village and some of the areas atAsheville where we have
(24:02):
beautiful pieces of preservedhistoric architecture.
But yeah, that's one of thethings that's really neat about
our field is, know, you'resurrounded by it all the time.
I read, I read a quote once, uhit was, it was this book that
was.
Uh, I think it was calledinterviews in new york or
(24:23):
something, where they would justinterview random people and
they asked this woman what herfavorite art form was and uh, in
which that that's kind of acontentious debate within the
architecture field is whetherarchitecture is in fact in an
art form or not, which, you know, one of those arguments can can
kind of come across as a littlebit more pretentious, but her
reason for saying thatarchitecture was her favorite
(24:45):
art form was because everybodyhas a frame of reference for it,
um.
So, like, there's art and musicand everybody um has experienced
things in different ways, buteverybody experiences and has a
frame of reference forarchitecture in a pretty
intimate way and we try to keepthat in mind when we're working
on smaller scale projects likehouses.
I work on the majority of ourresidential work in our firm and
(25:11):
it's always I always try toprioritize that being a
collaborative effort, becausewhile I'm the, I may be the
design professional.
The people that I'm designingthe house for have lived in a
number of houses throughouttheir lives and have very valid
perspectives on what they findto be successful and
unsuccessful.
So, yeah, definitely keep anopen mind in terms of what they
(25:33):
bring to the table and what theymight suggest.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Yeah, yeah, I love that.
I love that.
I think I mean, one of the coolthings about architecture to me
is it's art and it's functional, so it's not just you know
there's, there's.
To me that's great because that, that may that mean.
That's the sort of intersectionof form and function.
You know it's a great thing.
(25:59):
All right, the C in EPIC iscommitment.
What are your thoughts aroundcommitting?
Speaker 2 (26:05):
and commitment.
I mean, I was raised to valuethat extremely.
So, yeah, it's kind of a just agiven thing If you, if you
(26:30):
commit to to perform a task oror to to meet someone's, to meet
someone's needs on a on aclient relation basis, it's just
you kind of, you have to haveto see that through and it's
kind of hard to imagine that notbeing the case.
I mean, it's I don't reallyknow of a viable alternative.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Yeah, I love it, love it.
Yeah, it's a sort of way oflife.
You do what you're saying and Ilove that.
Yeah, it's a way of life foryou.
That's a good way to put it.
Yeah, it's not a.
The decision's been made.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Yeah, I's not a it's not a.
Speaker 1 (26:57):
It's the decisions been made, mm?
Hmm, yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2 (26:59):
All right.
Speaker 1 (26:59):
So what words of advice would you give to other
professionals or other businessowners who are looking to grow?
Speaker 2 (27:20):
Uh, man, while the and I think that highlights to
me that what is has kind ofmaybe been a something that
we've overlooked in our growth,like what we were talking about
earlier with with the marketingaspect, um, I would imagine that
young business owners likemyself that maybe don't have the
structure that's beenestablished under them myself
that maybe don't have thestructure that's been
established under them Like I'vebeen fortunate to have here
with ARCA, might, might needfill the need to prioritize
(27:43):
marketing campaigns or or reallykind of doing big pushes on
social media and catchy stufflike that.
But I would say, focus on yourcraft, you know, like really
hone in on what it is that youdo, and that your number one
marketing tool should be to toperform your craft as good as
possible.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
I love that.
Perform your craft as best youcan.
I love that.
Yeah, yeah, it's an it's.
It's an interesting one.
In construction I have a lot.
We have a lot of clients inbuilding and construction
professional services, but youdo have to do some
self-promotion For sure.
(28:25):
I've known plenty of builderswho are great builders, who
didn't make it because themarketing just wasn't good
enough.
They didn't, or they were tooperfectionistic.
It's an interesting one.
So, let's wrap it up here.
What is the best way forsomeone to get in touch with you
?
Somebody wants to do businessor partner with you, or they
(28:49):
need some architectural services.
What is the best way for themto get a hold of you?
Speaker 2 (28:54):
Yeah, I would say just to um, reach out to us via
our.
Our website is arca, the arcadash designcom.
Um, there's a, there's acontact tab there where it'll
send to to kind of our generalemail.
My, my personal email isnatewebster at arca-designcom.
Um, and yeah, like I don'tthink I really touched on it,
(29:17):
great, but we're a smallerarchitecture firm.
We'll work on everything from asmall two-bedroom house to we
did the Asheville Art Museumdowntown, so $30 million art
museum to 30, or, sorry, $20million art museum to $30
million medical manufacturingplant.
We really kind of have a wide,wide range of uh of of projects
(29:41):
that we that we work on.
Um, so really no, um, noproject is is off the table.
But yeah, we're always eager toto do what we can to improve
the beauty of our builtenvironment.
Um, and we try to approach eachproject with that same level of
care.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
No, I love that.
Yeah, I love that.
That is, I mean, it's one ofthe advantages of being nimble.
You can decide, hey, do we wantto do this project or not?
And is it a good project for us?
Is it a good project for ourcommunities?
Yeah, it's a good project forthe client, so it's a
(30:19):
win-win-win.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
I guess yeah, exactly .
Speaker 1 (30:20):
Yeah, I love that.
Hey, so fantastic.
Thanks for being part of uscommunity and for all you're
doing.
We certainly are lookingforward to seeing your continued
growth.
Hey, thanks for that and untilnext time all the best.
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