April 14, 2025 • 24 mins
Two Jons with a trailer, a walk-behind mower, and absolutely zero business education decided to start a landscaping company. Seven years later, they're maintaining the grounds at Amazon's Asheville facility and transforming backyards into community-building spaces. This is the refreshingly honest story of Smith & Lloyd Landscaping.
Jon Lloyd pulls back the curtain on the entrepreneurial journey with disarming candor. "We should have charged more," he admits, reflecting on years of undervaluing their expertise. The growth strategy that propelled their success? Simply showing up and doing good work.
The conversation explores entrepreneurial myths and realities. John shares wisdom about selecting clients (sometimes "the juice isn't worth the squeeze"), managing work-life balance during busy seasons, and the two non-negotiable qualities he looks for in employees. His advice for aspiring business owners is both practical and profound.
About Jonathan:
Jonathan Lloyd moved to Asheville, NC in 2015, after spending most of his life in his hometown of Honesdale, Pennsylvania. Jon received his Bachelor's degree in Landscape Architecture from Penn State University in University Park, Pennsylvania, before gaining over a decade of experience in landscaping and construction.
With his extensive knowledge of design and craftsmanship, Jon is dedicated to creating exquisite designs for both function and artistry in the Asheville and Hendersonville area. He and his partner, John, founded their landscaping company to deliver top-notch services to residents and management companies.
Thanks for Listening. You may contact me at https://billgilliland.actioncoach.com/
All the best!
Bill
Thanks for listening. Please hit the subscribe button, leave us a 5 star review, and share this podcast. You can reach me at williamgilliland@actioncoach.com.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hey there, welcome to this week's episode of Epic
Entrepreneurs.
I am really excited.
I'm here with John Lloyd ofSmith Lloyd Landscaping and
Design and I can't wait to hearthis story.
Hi, john, hey, how are youdoing?
I'm good, tell us a little bitabout Smith and Lloyd.
What's the story there?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Story.
Short story I'll try to make.
It is yeah, I moved here in2015.
I became good friends with aguy named John Smith and one of
our friends was doinghardscaping His his business was
named the yard fathers and hewas doing lawn care and
(00:46):
hardscaping and he decided Ijust want to focus on
hardscaping.
So he asked us if we wanted tobuy some of his uh, residential
lawn account and, uh, mybusiness partner, john I know
it's confusing, we're both namedJohn but yeah, he was like
doing grounds maintenance for abig medical facility at the time
(01:07):
and I have a background, I havea degree in landscape
architecture.
So we figured, you know, wecould build something here and
this is like a little place tostart.
So, yeah, we bought thoseaccounts from him and we just he
had his dad's old trucks, webought a trailer and we bought a
walk behind mower and juststarted working.
(01:29):
And uh, you know, over the yearsit's grown a lot and we've kind
of honed down our services.
We used to kind of just dowhatever people asked um in the
beginning but we've, um, youknow, now we, we, we, we
primarily do, uh, full groundsmaintenance um.
So people, you know, want theiryard mowed, their mulch done,
(01:52):
hedging, their leaves cleaned upin the winter.
We just kind of give them awhole package of what it's going
to be for the year and and, uh,they sign up that way.
And the same thing withcommercial contracts.
We do the big Amazon facilityhere in Asheville and a couple
other big ones like that, butthose are kind of our bread and
(02:14):
butter.
And then we also do landscapedesign and install like patios,
retaining walls.
Outdoor living in general, likeoutdoor places, like community,
is really important to me.
So I really love designingoutdoor spaces where people can
get together, hang out, you know, create memories and have fun.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Yeah, that's cool, that's a great mission to create
community and to enhancecommunity and I think that's I
think a lot of people end up inWestern North Carolina are all
about community.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Yep, yep.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Yeah, yeah, that's, that's cool.
Well, let's, let's.
Let's talk about business for aminute.
Like if you had to start overin business, what would you do
differently?
Speaker 2 (03:07):
I would have taken a business class.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Neither one of us had ever taken a single class on
business or anything.
We just, you know, did all thepaperwork, start the business
and got a QuickBooks account anda CPA that worked on it once a
year and that was we juststarted going, you know, without
(03:34):
really knowing anything aboutbusiness.
So, yeah, I would do a littleresearch and find out.
You know best practices andkind of order of operations and
where not to outstretch yourself, and you know things like that.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Yeah, it's.
You know any kind of schoolreally.
I mean, I don't you know dentalschool, medical school,
landscape architecture,engineering, it doesn't really
matter, they don't.
You have to go get the businesseducation.
So they're not, it's not partof the curriculum, so to speak.
So, yeah, that's, that's,that's great, that's great
advice.
(04:15):
So so you have learned somethings over the years.
What?
What are some of the biggestlearnings you've had as as an
owner and an employer?
Speaker 2 (04:22):
the biggest learnings you've had as an owner and an
employer.
To first was to charge more.
We didn't charge nearly enoughwhen we started.
For years we didn't chargeenough.
We may still not charge quiteenough, but we basically just
took what we were both makinghourly and kind of increased it
(04:44):
by 50% and and charged that forour hourly rate, which was just
you know, and we ended upprobably getting paid less than
we were at our jobs before.
Another big thing is just notsaying yes to everything and
trying to get a feel, for if youknow if a customer actually
(05:05):
wants to spend money, for if, uh, you know if a customer
actually wants to spend moneyand if they're, you know, have a
realistic expectation of whatthey want and how much that's
going to cost and and um and Ihaven't run into this a lot but
just some customers you meet andyou just get a feeling of
they're going to a lot.
But just some customers you meetand you just get a feeling of
they're going to, they're goingto be really hard to work with
(05:28):
and it may the juice may not beworth the squeeze with it and
being able to just walk awayfrom that.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Yeah, that's okay, cause they'll probably work well
with somebody else.
Yeah, yeah, I mean it's aninteresting one that the one
about not saying yes toeverything is big.
I have a mentor named Paul Dunnwho's a great guy and I don't
know, he's probably close tohe's in his late 70s, for sure
Maybe 80.
I don't know he, he's a, buthe's, you know, one of these
really enthusiastic guys.
(05:56):
And he said, bill, you know,success is what you say no to,
you know.
And I'm like, yeah, he well, hesays it's what you say no to,
or who you say no to.
So it's both of the same thingsyou just said, like not every
not every client is a greatclient for you.
Not every job is a great job foryou, and in your business they
you've got to have a great joband a great client to make it
(06:19):
useful.
So yeah, it's, it's.
Uh.
Yeah, it's, it's all about fitand it's okay if it's not a fit.
That's a hard lesson to learn.
What do you think some of themisconceptions are about running
a business?
Speaker 2 (06:37):
I think a lot of people probably think you get to
take a lot of time off and havekind of an easy life, that
other people are doing all thehard work, and I think it's
possible to get to a point wheremaybe you know I could have
that, but it's not.
(06:58):
It doesn't seem like I don'tknow.
I think I'm just kind of thekind of person who's going to
even if I delegate more and thenI have less to do, I'm just
going to take on more anyway,sure, yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
It's just working differently, yeah, and working
smarter.
It's not working.
Yeah, it's not, it's workingdifferently.
It doesn't mean you don't work.
I mean look, and everybody, Imean you see some business
owners that do a great job andthey've got a team and the
business more or less workswithout them.
You know what?
They work their butt off to getthere.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
They didn't just, it wasn't just handed to them no
yeah, no, yes, I mean with, wedidn't have any investors or
anyone you know, anyone thatloaned us money to start off.
We just kind of built it fromthe ground up and and hearing
(07:53):
people you know say stuff likeoh, it must be nice, or like
stuff like that.
You know, when you get a newtruck and it's, it's just like
man, you have no idea, like youknow.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, and it's you know.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, and it'syou know, and I mean you still
got to pay for the truck, right?
I mean it's not, you know,that's not.
It's not like if you go to workfor somebody else and they have
trucks, you get a truck.
You don't have to pay for it.
Somebody, you know, the companypays for it.
So I mean you do earn it, butmean it's an interesting thing
(08:23):
too.
So what do you attribute yourgrowth to?
Speaker 2 (08:29):
I think it was just showing up and doing good work.
Yeah, that was what someonegave us, that advice, in the
beginning, and we were both justkind of those people to begin
with.
And, yeah, you know, most ofit's grown from just word of
(08:52):
mouth.
We haven't really marketed atall.
I just did a video, had itproduced, that we'll put on
Facebook ads probably in thenext couple weeks, but that's
the first time I've reallycreated any type of advertising.
Yeah, well it makes sense toany type of advertising.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
Yeah, well, it makes sense.
I mean, when you start out youdon't have a ton of money for
marketing, so you invest timeand invest in the work that it
takes to meet people and get outthere and make it happen in
word of mouth, and then you cantrade back some of your time
with money once you get a littlebit of cash flow.
(09:33):
Yeah, yeah, yeah so yeah, it'sa good thing.
So we talked about this alittle bit.
But how do you balance likepersonal life and demands of
running a business?
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Very carefully, I don't know.
I go in and out of being prettygood with that and then being
not so good with it.
Like it's spring right now, youknow I'll find myself working,
you know, most of the day andthen maybe going out to eat with
(10:08):
some people my family and thenI'm going back home and just
getting on the computer anddoing some estimates for a
couple hours at night.
And that's not what I normally,you know, do, but just
sometimes the work just callsfor that and, um, I don't know,
I try to exercise and stuff.
I think that helps a lot withstress, just like, you know,
(10:31):
getting that anxiousness out ofmy body.
Things don't seem asoverwhelming and stressful when
that happens.
And I'd say perspective too.
Like you know, I'll get in thismindset where, if I just don't
get these things done, I don'tget back to these people like
everything's going to fall apartand that's just not the reality
(10:56):
of the, the situation.
Like there's stuff, likethere's stuff that could just
not get done and things will befine.
Um, you know, we haven't lostreally many customers at all
over the years and I think, justpicking up the phone, um, I
went and looked at a place, uhlast week and the guy told me I
was the only one who answeredthe phone.
(11:16):
He called about 14 differentlandscaping companies.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
It is so simple.
I mean I promise you it's sosimple.
Talk to people.
Answer the phone.
I mean everybody's busy rightnow.
It's not like they're in plentyof work and so, yeah, I mean it
always lasts when I hear that,oh, I just answered the phone, I
just talk to people, I justcall them, I call people back,
(11:43):
you know.
Yeah, I mean you know it's Ialways I'm like it's not that
hard, guys, just answer thephone.
Talk to people.
Yeah, talk to the people.
So what do you look for in goodemployees?
Like, what qualities do youlook for when you're hiring team
members?
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Well, it depends what area they're working in.
You know weed whacking in thesummer and 90 degree weather.
You know not everyone's cut outfor that and it's hard to know
whether someone's going to beable to handle that or not.
You know when they're applyingand coming on to start, but the
(12:30):
biggest thing I'll say is justshowing up and being teachable.
And people think they knoweverything and you can't really
teach them anything.
They're pretty much useless Ifthey don't show up useless.
I've hired people and just theydon't show up the first day and
they're just, uh, just this isthe weirdest thing that someone
(12:54):
and then have them twist youLike you could just let me know.
You know, I think those are thetwo biggest things, like just
being open-minded and teachableto learn new things and just
being there.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
Yeah, I like it.
Show up and be teachable.
I mean, it's good advice forany.
You know I it's a there's arash of.
I don't understand it because Idon't know what, what the deal
is.
I mean, you know, do what yousay you're going to do.
Essentially, I don't, I don't.
I mean, if you don't want towork, fine, pick up the phone
and call me and tell me you'renot, you're not coming.
(13:30):
Not, you're not coming.
Uh, I'm okay with that, I justbut you know that's a terrible
thing to just to just to notshow up and I've, and there's a
rash of it, yeah, I'll be theremonday, we'll start and boom,
not starting, I mean I'm notcoming.
It's crazy, it's craziest thingI've ever seen I get it yeah,
yeah, I don't even want peoplethat are like kids these days.
(13:52):
You know, and it's not kids, Idon't know what it is, it's.
I mean, it's just lack ofcommon courtesy and there's.
You know, there's no excuse forbad manners.
I don't care.
If you don't want to work, fine, just let someone know what you
go for.
Go work for somebody else, well.
But there, you know, themisconception is that there
aren't people out there.
There are plenty of people outthere who want to work.
(14:12):
You have to work a littleharder than we did a few years
ago, but right now there arestill people out there.
You just have to do the work.
So let me give you some quickfire questions.
Epic is an acronym, and so justmaybe a word or a sentence
about each word.
So the E is education.
So what are your thoughts oneducation?
Speaker 2 (14:37):
I think it's good to educate employees on our common
practices and how we want thingsdone, because I can't be on
every job, I can't tell peopleour standards and be there.
So having people looking atthat and controlling that and
just instilling that in each ofour employees of, like, this is
(14:58):
how we want a property to lookwhen we're pulling away.
That keeps things prettycongruent and, yeah, that's what
came to mind.
Education.
Speaker 1 (15:12):
Perfect, yeah, so the P is planning.
What are your thoughts onplanning?
Speaker 2 (15:18):
Planning.
Oh man, I wish I was better atplanning.
Really, I didn't plan a whole,we didn't plan.
You know, planning wasn't partof our business model.
Let me ask you a question?
Speaker 1 (15:32):
I think you're, so I'm going to challenge you on
that.
If you were going to do alandscape, you're a landscape
designer.
You have to plan.
By definition, you are a goodplanner.
The question is, you've justnever been taught to do the plan
on the other side, on someother things.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Yeah, as far as plan for growth and like structure
and uh yeah like um, scaling thebusiness like that is stuff
that I'm all learning.
You know right now that I wasagain.
I never went to a businessclass, so I never even thought
about that type of stuff.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
Perfect, got it.
Yeah, yeah, we can end withthat.
What uh I inspiration?
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Inspiration.
Yeah, I've gotten a lot ofinspiration from people older
than me in the trades and howthey live, how they treat their
(16:42):
employees.
I've had really good bosses inthe past who were great models
as far as being a good boss.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
I took a lot of that with me.
Yeah, I like it.
I like it how about Ccommitment.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
Yeah, I relate that to what we talked about earlier
just showing up and doing goodwork.
I mean, each contract we signwith somebody is a commitment to
do what's in that contract.
So we commit to it and do that.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
I love that.
I love that.
Yeah, that's great.
So what do you wish somebodyhad told you that you know now,
before you went into business.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
Hmm, that it was going to be really really really
hard for quite a while.
I guess, someone wouldn't havethat insight without knowing my
(17:48):
background and having nobackground in business, wouldn't
have that insight withoutknowing my you know background
and having no background inbusiness.
But um yeah, I didn't.
I didn't know how, how much ofa struggle it was going to be
just to figure out how to do it.
And I don't know that thatdeterred me either, though, to
be honest.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
No, that wouldn't.
I mean there are some.
I mean I've said over timethere's some things that I
wouldn't have done and probablynever would have if I'd known
how hard they were going to be,but now I'm glad I did them.
So there's a difference.
But yeah, I think you can makethat across the board.
If you talk to somebody who'sbeen in business for years, you
just say, hey look, you're goingto have to work hard.
(18:29):
I mean, this is a journey.
It doesn't happen overnight.
It takes months and years.
It doesn't take days and weeks.
This is an ongoing marathon.
It's a marathon really, it'snot a sprint.
So I love that.
I love that.
So what would you say to otherbusiness owners or entrepreneurs
(18:53):
who are looking to grow?
Speaker 2 (18:57):
Um, probably do some research about it and figure out
.
You know, like in in mybusiness, you know, example is
is.
You know example is my business, I mean sure, getting a bunch
of new accounts, you know, andgrowing, you know, the the
income is great.
(19:19):
But if you're not ready toreally scale and you don't have
all these procedures in place ofhow the crews run, how they
load up in the morning, whatthey do when they get back to
the shop, upkeeping all themaintenance on the, you know, if
you have double the mowers,that's double the maintenance,
double the blade sharpening,double the weed eaters, double
(19:40):
the supplies they need.
So it's easy to kind of go outand get more business but then
if you're not ready for it, allthese big gaps are going to.
You know, all these littleholes in the business are going
to get much bigger real quick ifyou're not ready for it.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Yeah, that's good advice.
So grow responsibly, basically.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
Yeah, prepare for it.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
Yeah, get in there.
So this has been great.
Anything else you'd like to sayor add, or tell us about your
business?
Speaker 2 (20:19):
No, you know, the one thing, when we were just
talking about like advice we got, I think the best advice we got
was just a pension, becauseit's the one thing you pay.
That pays you back.
When I was in my 20s and stuffI worked for contractors.
I just paid attention to howthey were doing stuff.
(20:42):
Now I have a generalcontracting business, also Just
paying attention to people thatknew what they were doing.
You know, you can learn a lotand then make money doing those
those things that you've maybelearned.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
Yeah, I love that.
Pay attention.
I love that.
Yeah, be observant, be you know, be a sponge.
Yeah, you know.
One of my mentors I remember Iwas he said, he, he said it
doesn't matter what kind of jobyou get, bill, just be a sponge,
learn, but learn as much as youcan wherever you go, and, and,
(21:19):
and, be a sponge, and I and Ithink what you can, take what
you can and kind of leave therest um, that some people aren't
going to be great models oflike what to you know what to do
, but they may be.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
they may really know what they're doing in other
areas.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
Yeah, they may be a model of what not to do, and so
that's okay too.
You know, pay attention to thattoo, because hey, I don't want
to do it that way, you know, asyou're growing up.
So how does someone get intouch with you if they want to
get some landscaping done, havea maintenance, you know, get
(21:54):
their yards taken care of, orsounds like you do some general
contracting too.
What, what do you do there?
Speaker 2 (22:00):
tell us about that before we go um, what we've been
doing a lot of is, uh, stuffafter the storm, after the
hurricane.
So, um, a couple houses out inblack mountain that were hit by
trees, that had the roof come in.
You know, we're coming in andputting a new porch on a new
roof.
On redoing all the drywall, theflooring, the trim, the paint
(22:21):
um, we're mostly doing likeremodel stuff at this point.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
All right, that's good to know, because we sure do
need it.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
There are a lot of houses with blue tarps still on
them oh, yeah, yeah and um, asfar as getting a hold of me um
smithandlloydcom yep our website.
You can find us on google smithand lloyd landscaping and
design.
Yep, uh, send me an email,jonathan at smithandlloydcom.
Her phone number is on ourGoogle account, but it's
(22:52):
828-600-1030.
Speaker 1 (22:56):
And I love it.
I love it.
That's great.
Hey, this has been good.
I really appreciate you beingon here.
Thanks for being.
There's a lot of good info here.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Good Thank you.
It was a pleasure being on.
Thanks for asking me to do it.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
And until next time.
Hey there, welcome to this week's episode of Epic
Entrepreneurs.
I am really excited.
I'm here with John Lloyd ofSmith Lloyd Landscaping and
Design and I can't wait to hearthis story.
Hi, john, hey, how are youdoing?
I'm good, tell us a little bitabout Smith and Lloyd.
What's the story there?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Story.
Short story I'll try to make.
It is yeah, I moved here in2015.
I became good friends with aguy named John Smith and one of
our friends was doinghardscaping His his business was
named the yard fathers and hewas doing lawn care and
(00:46):
hardscaping and he decided Ijust want to focus on
hardscaping.
So he asked us if we wanted tobuy some of his uh, residential
lawn account and, uh, mybusiness partner, john I know
it's confusing, we're both namedJohn but yeah, he was like
doing grounds maintenance for abig medical facility at the time
(01:07):
and I have a background, I havea degree in landscape
architecture.
So we figured, you know, wecould build something here and
this is like a little place tostart.
So, yeah, we bought thoseaccounts from him and we just he
had his dad's old trucks, webought a trailer and we bought a
walk behind mower and juststarted working.
(01:29):
And uh, you know, over the yearsit's grown a lot and we've kind
of honed down our services.
We used to kind of just dowhatever people asked um in the
beginning but we've, um, youknow, now we, we, we, we
primarily do, uh, full groundsmaintenance um.
So people, you know, want theiryard mowed, their mulch done,
(01:52):
hedging, their leaves cleaned upin the winter.
We just kind of give them awhole package of what it's going
to be for the year and and, uh,they sign up that way.
And the same thing withcommercial contracts.
We do the big Amazon facilityhere in Asheville and a couple
other big ones like that, butthose are kind of our bread and
(02:14):
butter.
And then we also do landscapedesign and install like patios,
retaining walls.
Outdoor living in general, likeoutdoor places, like community,
is really important to me.
So I really love designingoutdoor spaces where people can
get together, hang out, you know, create memories and have fun.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Yeah, that's cool, that's a great mission to create
community and to enhancecommunity and I think that's I
think a lot of people end up inWestern North Carolina are all
about community.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Yep, yep.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Yeah, yeah, that's, that's cool.
Well, let's, let's.
Let's talk about business for aminute.
Like if you had to start overin business, what would you do
differently?
Speaker 2 (03:07):
I would have taken a business class.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Neither one of us had ever taken a single class on
business or anything.
We just, you know, did all thepaperwork, start the business
and got a QuickBooks account anda CPA that worked on it once a
year and that was we juststarted going, you know, without
(03:34):
really knowing anything aboutbusiness.
So, yeah, I would do a littleresearch and find out.
You know best practices andkind of order of operations and
where not to outstretch yourself, and you know things like that.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Yeah, it's.
You know any kind of schoolreally.
I mean, I don't you know dentalschool, medical school,
landscape architecture,engineering, it doesn't really
matter, they don't.
You have to go get the businesseducation.
So they're not, it's not partof the curriculum, so to speak.
So, yeah, that's, that's,that's great, that's great
advice.
(04:15):
So so you have learned somethings over the years.
What?
What are some of the biggestlearnings you've had as as an
owner and an employer?
Speaker 2 (04:22):
the biggest learnings you've had as an owner and an
employer.
To first was to charge more.
We didn't charge nearly enoughwhen we started.
For years we didn't chargeenough.
We may still not charge quiteenough, but we basically just
took what we were both makinghourly and kind of increased it
(04:44):
by 50% and and charged that forour hourly rate, which was just
you know, and we ended upprobably getting paid less than
we were at our jobs before.
Another big thing is just notsaying yes to everything and
trying to get a feel, for if youknow if a customer actually
(05:05):
wants to spend money, for if, uh, you know if a customer
actually wants to spend moneyand if they're, you know, have a
realistic expectation of whatthey want and how much that's
going to cost and and um and Ihaven't run into this a lot but
just some customers you meet andyou just get a feeling of
they're going to a lot.
But just some customers you meetand you just get a feeling of
they're going to, they're goingto be really hard to work with
(05:28):
and it may the juice may not beworth the squeeze with it and
being able to just walk awayfrom that.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Yeah, that's okay, cause they'll probably work well
with somebody else.
Yeah, yeah, I mean it's aninteresting one that the one
about not saying yes toeverything is big.
I have a mentor named Paul Dunnwho's a great guy and I don't
know, he's probably close tohe's in his late 70s, for sure
Maybe 80.
I don't know he, he's a, buthe's, you know, one of these
really enthusiastic guys.
(05:56):
And he said, bill, you know,success is what you say no to,
you know.
And I'm like, yeah, he well, hesays it's what you say no to,
or who you say no to.
So it's both of the same thingsyou just said, like not every
not every client is a greatclient for you.
Not every job is a great job foryou, and in your business they
you've got to have a great joband a great client to make it
(06:19):
useful.
So yeah, it's, it's.
Uh.
Yeah, it's, it's all about fitand it's okay if it's not a fit.
That's a hard lesson to learn.
What do you think some of themisconceptions are about running
a business?
Speaker 2 (06:37):
I think a lot of people probably think you get to
take a lot of time off and havekind of an easy life, that
other people are doing all thehard work, and I think it's
possible to get to a point wheremaybe you know I could have
that, but it's not.
(06:58):
It doesn't seem like I don'tknow.
I think I'm just kind of thekind of person who's going to
even if I delegate more and thenI have less to do, I'm just
going to take on more anyway,sure, yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
It's just working differently, yeah, and working
smarter.
It's not working.
Yeah, it's not, it's workingdifferently.
It doesn't mean you don't work.
I mean look, and everybody, Imean you see some business
owners that do a great job andthey've got a team and the
business more or less workswithout them.
You know what?
They work their butt off to getthere.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
They didn't just, it wasn't just handed to them no
yeah, no, yes, I mean with, wedidn't have any investors or
anyone you know, anyone thatloaned us money to start off.
We just kind of built it fromthe ground up and and hearing
(07:53):
people you know say stuff likeoh, it must be nice, or like
stuff like that.
You know, when you get a newtruck and it's, it's just like
man, you have no idea, like youknow.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, and it's you know.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, and it'syou know, and I mean you still
got to pay for the truck, right?
I mean it's not, you know,that's not.
It's not like if you go to workfor somebody else and they have
trucks, you get a truck.
You don't have to pay for it.
Somebody, you know, the companypays for it.
So I mean you do earn it, butmean it's an interesting thing
(08:23):
too.
So what do you attribute yourgrowth to?
Speaker 2 (08:29):
I think it was just showing up and doing good work.
Yeah, that was what someonegave us, that advice, in the
beginning, and we were both justkind of those people to begin
with.
And, yeah, you know, most ofit's grown from just word of
(08:52):
mouth.
We haven't really marketed atall.
I just did a video, had itproduced, that we'll put on
Facebook ads probably in thenext couple weeks, but that's
the first time I've reallycreated any type of advertising.
Yeah, well it makes sense toany type of advertising.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
Yeah, well, it makes sense.
I mean, when you start out youdon't have a ton of money for
marketing, so you invest timeand invest in the work that it
takes to meet people and get outthere and make it happen in
word of mouth, and then you cantrade back some of your time
with money once you get a littlebit of cash flow.
(09:33):
Yeah, yeah, yeah so yeah, it'sa good thing.
So we talked about this alittle bit.
But how do you balance likepersonal life and demands of
running a business?
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Very carefully, I don't know.
I go in and out of being prettygood with that and then being
not so good with it.
Like it's spring right now, youknow I'll find myself working,
you know, most of the day andthen maybe going out to eat with
(10:08):
some people my family and thenI'm going back home and just
getting on the computer anddoing some estimates for a
couple hours at night.
And that's not what I normally,you know, do, but just
sometimes the work just callsfor that and, um, I don't know,
I try to exercise and stuff.
I think that helps a lot withstress, just like, you know,
(10:31):
getting that anxiousness out ofmy body.
Things don't seem asoverwhelming and stressful when
that happens.
And I'd say perspective too.
Like you know, I'll get in thismindset where, if I just don't
get these things done, I don'tget back to these people like
everything's going to fall apartand that's just not the reality
(10:56):
of the, the situation.
Like there's stuff, likethere's stuff that could just
not get done and things will befine.
Um, you know, we haven't lostreally many customers at all
over the years and I think, justpicking up the phone, um, I
went and looked at a place, uhlast week and the guy told me I
was the only one who answeredthe phone.
(11:16):
He called about 14 differentlandscaping companies.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
It is so simple.
I mean I promise you it's sosimple.
Talk to people.
Answer the phone.
I mean everybody's busy rightnow.
It's not like they're in plentyof work and so, yeah, I mean it
always lasts when I hear that,oh, I just answered the phone, I
just talk to people, I justcall them, I call people back,
(11:43):
you know.
Yeah, I mean you know it's Ialways I'm like it's not that
hard, guys, just answer thephone.
Talk to people.
Yeah, talk to the people.
So what do you look for in goodemployees?
Like, what qualities do youlook for when you're hiring team
members?
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Well, it depends what area they're working in.
You know weed whacking in thesummer and 90 degree weather.
You know not everyone's cut outfor that and it's hard to know
whether someone's going to beable to handle that or not.
You know when they're applyingand coming on to start, but the
(12:30):
biggest thing I'll say is justshowing up and being teachable.
And people think they knoweverything and you can't really
teach them anything.
They're pretty much useless Ifthey don't show up useless.
I've hired people and just theydon't show up the first day and
they're just, uh, just this isthe weirdest thing that someone
(12:54):
and then have them twist youLike you could just let me know.
You know, I think those are thetwo biggest things, like just
being open-minded and teachableto learn new things and just
being there.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
Yeah, I like it.
Show up and be teachable.
I mean, it's good advice forany.
You know I it's a there's arash of.
I don't understand it because Idon't know what, what the deal
is.
I mean, you know, do what yousay you're going to do.
Essentially, I don't, I don't.
I mean, if you don't want towork, fine, pick up the phone
and call me and tell me you'renot, you're not coming.
(13:30):
Not, you're not coming.
Uh, I'm okay with that, I justbut you know that's a terrible
thing to just to just to notshow up and I've, and there's a
rash of it, yeah, I'll be theremonday, we'll start and boom,
not starting, I mean I'm notcoming.
It's crazy, it's craziest thingI've ever seen I get it yeah,
yeah, I don't even want peoplethat are like kids these days.
(13:52):
You know, and it's not kids, Idon't know what it is, it's.
I mean, it's just lack ofcommon courtesy and there's.
You know, there's no excuse forbad manners.
I don't care.
If you don't want to work, fine, just let someone know what you
go for.
Go work for somebody else, well.
But there, you know, themisconception is that there
aren't people out there.
There are plenty of people outthere who want to work.
(14:12):
You have to work a littleharder than we did a few years
ago, but right now there arestill people out there.
You just have to do the work.
So let me give you some quickfire questions.
Epic is an acronym, and so justmaybe a word or a sentence
about each word.
So the E is education.
So what are your thoughts oneducation?
Speaker 2 (14:37):
I think it's good to educate employees on our common
practices and how we want thingsdone, because I can't be on
every job, I can't tell peopleour standards and be there.
So having people looking atthat and controlling that and
just instilling that in each ofour employees of, like, this is
(14:58):
how we want a property to lookwhen we're pulling away.
That keeps things prettycongruent and, yeah, that's what
came to mind.
Education.
Speaker 1 (15:12):
Perfect, yeah, so the P is planning.
What are your thoughts onplanning?
Speaker 2 (15:18):
Planning.
Oh man, I wish I was better atplanning.
Really, I didn't plan a whole,we didn't plan.
You know, planning wasn't partof our business model.
Let me ask you a question?
Speaker 1 (15:32):
I think you're, so I'm going to challenge you on
that.
If you were going to do alandscape, you're a landscape
designer.
You have to plan.
By definition, you are a goodplanner.
The question is, you've justnever been taught to do the plan
on the other side, on someother things.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Yeah, as far as plan for growth and like structure
and uh yeah like um, scaling thebusiness like that is stuff
that I'm all learning.
You know right now that I wasagain.
I never went to a businessclass, so I never even thought
about that type of stuff.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
Perfect, got it.
Yeah, yeah, we can end withthat.
What uh I inspiration?
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Inspiration.
Yeah, I've gotten a lot ofinspiration from people older
than me in the trades and howthey live, how they treat their
(16:42):
employees.
I've had really good bosses inthe past who were great models
as far as being a good boss.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
I took a lot of that with me.
Yeah, I like it.
I like it how about Ccommitment.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
Yeah, I relate that to what we talked about earlier
just showing up and doing goodwork.
I mean, each contract we signwith somebody is a commitment to
do what's in that contract.
So we commit to it and do that.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
I love that.
I love that.
Yeah, that's great.
So what do you wish somebodyhad told you that you know now,
before you went into business.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
Hmm, that it was going to be really really really
hard for quite a while.
I guess, someone wouldn't havethat insight without knowing my
(17:48):
background and having nobackground in business, wouldn't
have that insight withoutknowing my you know background
and having no background inbusiness.
But um yeah, I didn't.
I didn't know how, how much ofa struggle it was going to be
just to figure out how to do it.
And I don't know that thatdeterred me either, though, to
be honest.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
No, that wouldn't.
I mean there are some.
I mean I've said over timethere's some things that I
wouldn't have done and probablynever would have if I'd known
how hard they were going to be,but now I'm glad I did them.
So there's a difference.
But yeah, I think you can makethat across the board.
If you talk to somebody who'sbeen in business for years, you
just say, hey look, you're goingto have to work hard.
(18:29):
I mean, this is a journey.
It doesn't happen overnight.
It takes months and years.
It doesn't take days and weeks.
This is an ongoing marathon.
It's a marathon really, it'snot a sprint.
So I love that.
I love that.
So what would you say to otherbusiness owners or entrepreneurs
(18:53):
who are looking to grow?
Speaker 2 (18:57):
Um, probably do some research about it and figure out
.
You know, like in in mybusiness, you know, example is
is.
You know example is my business, I mean sure, getting a bunch
of new accounts, you know, andgrowing, you know, the the
income is great.
(19:19):
But if you're not ready toreally scale and you don't have
all these procedures in place ofhow the crews run, how they
load up in the morning, whatthey do when they get back to
the shop, upkeeping all themaintenance on the, you know, if
you have double the mowers,that's double the maintenance,
double the blade sharpening,double the weed eaters, double
(19:40):
the supplies they need.
So it's easy to kind of go outand get more business but then
if you're not ready for it, allthese big gaps are going to.
You know, all these littleholes in the business are going
to get much bigger real quick ifyou're not ready for it.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Yeah, that's good advice.
So grow responsibly, basically.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
Yeah, prepare for it.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
Yeah, get in there.
So this has been great.
Anything else you'd like to sayor add, or tell us about your
business?
Speaker 2 (20:19):
No, you know, the one thing, when we were just
talking about like advice we got, I think the best advice we got
was just a pension, becauseit's the one thing you pay.
That pays you back.
When I was in my 20s and stuffI worked for contractors.
I just paid attention to howthey were doing stuff.
(20:42):
Now I have a generalcontracting business, also Just
paying attention to people thatknew what they were doing.
You know, you can learn a lotand then make money doing those
those things that you've maybelearned.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
Yeah, I love that.
Pay attention.
I love that.
Yeah, be observant, be you know, be a sponge.
Yeah, you know.
One of my mentors I remember Iwas he said, he, he said it
doesn't matter what kind of jobyou get, bill, just be a sponge,
learn, but learn as much as youcan wherever you go, and, and,
(21:19):
and, be a sponge, and I and Ithink what you can, take what
you can and kind of leave therest um, that some people aren't
going to be great models oflike what to you know what to do
, but they may be.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
they may really know what they're doing in other
areas.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
Yeah, they may be a model of what not to do, and so
that's okay too.
You know, pay attention to thattoo, because hey, I don't want
to do it that way, you know, asyou're growing up.
So how does someone get intouch with you if they want to
get some landscaping done, havea maintenance, you know, get
(21:54):
their yards taken care of, orsounds like you do some general
contracting too.
What, what do you do there?
Speaker 2 (22:00):
tell us about that before we go um, what we've been
doing a lot of is, uh, stuffafter the storm, after the
hurricane.
So, um, a couple houses out inblack mountain that were hit by
trees, that had the roof come in.
You know, we're coming in andputting a new porch on a new
roof.
On redoing all the drywall, theflooring, the trim, the paint
(22:21):
um, we're mostly doing likeremodel stuff at this point.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
All right, that's good to know, because we sure do
need it.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
There are a lot of houses with blue tarps still on
them oh, yeah, yeah and um, asfar as getting a hold of me um
smithandlloydcom yep our website.
You can find us on google smithand lloyd landscaping and
design.
Yep, uh, send me an email,jonathan at smithandlloydcom.
Her phone number is on ourGoogle account, but it's
(22:52):
828-600-1030.
Speaker 1 (22:56):
And I love it.
I love it.
That's great.
Hey, this has been good.
I really appreciate you beingon here.
Thanks for being.
There's a lot of good info here.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Good Thank you.
It was a pleasure being on.
Thanks for asking me to do it.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
And until next time.
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