April 28, 2025 • 47 mins
Happiness is something everyone wants but no one seems to attain it! Our culture defines happiness by what we hang in our closet, park in our garage, and deposit in our bank account, but that’s wrong! Listen as Pastor Max Lucado reveals the secret held by the happiest people on earth and how you can find enduring joy that always delivers!
Today's Resource: How Happiness Happens
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Episode Transcript
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S1 (00:15):
Please enjoy this encore edition of equip with Chris Brooks. Well,
hey there folks, welcome to another exciting edition of Equipped
with Chris Brooks. I am so glad you tuned in.
We've been praying for you. Why don't you strap on
your seat belt? We're going to navigate through the contours
of culture, as always, with the lens of the biblical
worldview on. But before we do that, let me remind
(00:36):
you that this is the day that the Lord has made.
He has given it as a gift, so that you
and I might rejoice and be glad in it. So
let's do just that. Let's follow the words of the
Apostle Paul. Let's rejoice in the Lord always. And again
I say, rejoice. With that. I welcome you into what
will be a very encouraging, uh, uplifting and provocative edition
(00:58):
of equip. Let me start by asking a question. How
happy are you? When was the last time you thought
about that question? Consider your happiness. Kind of took the
pulse of your joy. Well, if you're like most Americans,
sadly you're not doing that well in that area. We're
struggling in the area of happiness and joy, which, by
(01:19):
the way, are two interchangeable concepts according to Scripture. National
surveys agree that happiness is not happening for most Americans,
according to a recent Harris Poll. Surveys of American happiness
at its highest point. Now listen to this. At its
highest point, only one third of Americans surveyed said they
(01:39):
were happy at the highest point in this survey. A
collection of data of American happiness. Only one third of
Americans said, hey, I'm happy. Two thirds said, no, I'm not.
On the opposite end of the spectrum, estimates concerning clinical
depression forecast that we are about ten times more likely
(02:04):
to struggle with clinical depression than a century ago. The
World Health Organization forecasts that depression will become the second
leading cause of disease worldwide. These are serious realities and
they have even more serious implications. And we know it.
We see it all around us. This is partly the
reality of living in a broken world, but it's also
(02:27):
the reality that many of us have not been taught
clearly and have not really been presented with what the
scriptures give us concerning how we are here in the
Body of Christ in the 21st century, can experience the
happiness that is promised to us in Scripture. Proverbs 16
and 20 says this. Happy is the one who trusts
(02:50):
in the Lord. I believe that's true. So today we're
going to talk about happiness. We're going to talk about
why it's so elusive. We're going to talk about how
we can achieve it and experience it, and maybe even
more importantly, how we can help others to experience it
as well. I am so fired up to talk with
my guest today. It is Max Lucado Though. Best selling
(03:13):
New York Times author. Many of you know Max already.
He's a preacher with a storyteller's gift. He has a
pastor's heart and a poet's pen. His books have sold
over 130 million copies around the world. He is a
great man of God, with a tender heart for the Lord.
And he's joining me today to talk about his newest project,
(03:36):
How Happiness Happens. Max, how are you today?
S2 (03:39):
Um, a lot better now, hearing that wonderful introduction. Man,
you covered the territory there and set us up, I think,
for a really good conversation. Thank you very much.
S1 (03:50):
So, man, what caused you at this point, Max, to
say I need to undertake a project that really focuses
on happiness?
S2 (04:00):
Well, the data that you shared, uh, was a tipping
point for me. Uh, in intuitively, I sensed that, uh,
People live with this cloud of perpetual grayness over them.
But I just thought, well, maybe that's because I'm a
pastor and I see people at their low points. But
(04:22):
when I read that statistic, uh, that Harris poll that
says that the happiness level is the lowest that it's
ever been, and that only 1 in 3 Americans, uh, can,
can conjure up enough, uh, happiness to check. Yes, on
the happiness questionnaire. Uh, then I thought, well, something's wrong.
(04:45):
Something's something's wrong here. Uh, and and so I wanted
to talk about happiness and try to address these these questions.
Should we be happy? Uh, does God want us to
be happy? Where do we find happiness? Uh, is happiness
make a difference in our health, in our relationships, in
(05:07):
our success? Uh, and so I became kind of a
fascinated with the whole idea of happiness. And it ended
up presenting a series of lessons to our church. And
it seemed to be very well received. And so I
turned those those that research that I did and presentations
(05:27):
to the church. I turned those, uh, messages into, into
this manuscript. And now it's this book, how happiness happens.
S1 (05:35):
I'm so grateful you did. And I want to encourage
everyone who's listening. I wish I could airdrop this book
across America, but I can't do that. But what you
can do is go to our website, equip Radio.com, and
order your copy today. How happiness happens, I believe, is biblical. Max,
that God does want us to experience joy. He wants
(05:57):
us to experience happiness. And I do believe that our
ability to experience that not only has personal benefit, but
it becomes an attractional tool of evangelism as well.
S2 (06:09):
I agree 100%, 100%, and I can't imagine anybody who
would think that God wants his people to be unhappy. Now,
I understand that happiness is a, for many people, a challenge.
So my working definition of happiness is a deeply rooted
(06:33):
sense of contentment. It's a conviction that there is a
good God, and we're headed to a great destination, and
that he is overseeing the affairs of mankind in a
way that's that's that's fitting for his divine purpose. I
don't want us to think that happiness is a sense
of giddiness. Uh, happiness is not always even a good mood.
(06:57):
But happiness is simply that conviction that we have, that
there's a good God, and we're headed to a great place,
and that God is overseeing all of our lives. I
believe that's right. And I agree with you. I think
that God wants his people to be contagiously happy contagiously content. Uh,
because we live in a world that is weary and weary,
(07:20):
we're weary of everything. We don't trust anything we, especially
in our political climate. We don't. We're just we're just
cautious and skeptical and cynical. And in addition, we become weary.
We're weary with relationships that don't work and and advertisements
that promise to deliver happiness. But don't um, and, and
(07:42):
we're kind of there's a sadness as a result among us.
So I think, I think if we as, as, as
God's children can embrace this definition of happiness and embrace
the strategies that God gives us to be happier people,
then you're right. I agree 100%. This could be the
greatest evangelistic tool that we have.
S1 (08:05):
Well, it's become so problematic. This whole lack of happiness.
Lack of joy in our in our world, in our
culture that social scientists have been focused on this before
we came on the air. I talked to you about
Arthur Brooks, who is the former head of American Enterprise Institute.
He's been writing on this, as well as other social scientists,
(08:25):
prominent ones, saying, hey, we have a huge problem here.
And I do think that the gospel is the answer
to what ails the human heart, the human psyche and
the human soul. And I think it's really important that
we celebrate the fact that thought leaders like yourself have
gotten out in front and said, wait a minute, to
all the social scientists, God's word has something to say
(08:47):
about this, folks. We're going to dive deep into this.
And again, I want to encourage you to get a
copy of How Happiness Happens, the latest by Max Lucado,
by going to our website, equip radio. Before we're all
said and done, we'll talk about the effects of social
media on happiness. What about the never ending political cycles
and the tension that comes from living in a hyper
(09:08):
partisan culture. What about if you're living with an unhappy person?
Is happiness possible there? Mexico has a lot to say
about it, but let me ask this question, Max. Why
is happiness, in your opinion, so elusive in particular for
the believer?
S2 (09:26):
That's a great question. And by the way, you always
ask the greatest questions.
S1 (09:30):
I appreciate.
S2 (09:31):
That. You know, I think we live in a day
and age in which, more than any other generation in
the history of the world is saturated by a sophisticated,
well-funded advertising, uh, initiative that exists to tell us we
(09:53):
are deficient. When you think about when you think about
how advertisement works. Advertisement. To be successful must convince me
that I need something before I'll buy something, right? It's
just that simple. It must convince me that I'm unhappy
and offer a product that they promise will make me happy.
(10:14):
It's pretty simple. So all day long. Now, now. So
keep that in mind. And then remember, no one has
been in a day. And that is in which we
are more subject to advertisements than this day and age. Uh,
from billboards to television to to to radio to online products. Uh,
you just can't. You can't escape it. So all day long,
(10:36):
I'm being told that my hair is too thin, my
waistline is too big, my clothes are out of style.
My car is too old. And. And the subliminal message
is I'm just falling short. I'm just falling short. And
the subliminal promise is the suggested promise is happiness is
(10:57):
always a purchase away, a move away, a transfer away.
A house away. A spouse away. If I can just
do this, I'll be happy. Now what happens is we
are happy. Perhaps for a time. But then the whole
cycle begins again. And when you get to be an
(11:18):
old man like me, if you have bought into that
for years, you become cynical and jaded because you think
to yourself, well, I've been promised happiness all my life,
and I've not received it. Well, the truth is, you've
been buying into a system that is very sophisticated, extremely
(11:39):
well funded, and that. And that requires you to believe
you're deficient before you can be sufficient with their product.
And that doesn't work. That doesn't work. And I think
what we're seeing today is a generation, uh, my generation
who's who's the first generation to really live in the
full force of this coming at us through television, radio
(12:03):
and now an additional layer. And the younger generations coming
at us through online advertisement. And if we don't, if
we don't educate ourselves and remind ourselves that this happiness
promise doesn't work, uh, it's going to even get worse.
And disclosing this and helping people find the better strategy
for happiness is, is really the the goal, I think,
(12:26):
of of the church and of and of the scriptures.
S1 (12:29):
The enemy of our souls wants to war against us
by taking away the one thing that all of us crave,
and that is happiness, happiness and joy in Jesus. But
my guest today, Max Lucado, says that finding lasting joy
is possible even in a world full of comparison, disappointment,
(12:49):
and unmet expectations. Folks, this is going to be a
great conversation. I promise you. You're going to want to
stick and stay and not change that down. Because as
we go forward in this conversation, we're going to hit
on some of the key areas and give you the
surprising secret to lasting happiness. How does happiness happen? Well,
I'm glad you asked. We're going to answer that question
(13:11):
on the other side of this break. While we are
on a short break, I want you to go to
our website equip radio.org. Let's equip radio.org. Order your copy today.
Secure your copy of How Happiness Happens. Don't forget. Also
social is available to you and go to social media
now and join the conversation. We always love your thoughts,
(13:33):
your comments and your questions. Whatever you do, you make
sure you stay right there. Much more to come. Next
up on equip with Chris Brooks. As a dad, a friend,
(13:54):
and a neighbor, I share your concerns over the growing
problems in our culture. That's why unequipped, we tackle the
tough issues. Learning how to respond with grace and truth.
We're looking for like minded partners to stand with us.
Would you be willing to become an Equipper today and
this role? You'll give a monthly donation to support the
Ministry of Equip and as an Equipper, you'll receive insider benefits,
such as a bi weekly email that contains pastoral messages
(14:17):
prepared just for you. Become an equipper today by calling
888644 4144 or go to Equip radio.org. Chris Brooks here
reminding you that today's program is pre-recorded. While we won't
be taking calls, we do want to connect with you
on social media. Hey there folks, welcome back to equip
(14:38):
with Chris Brooks, talking to author pastor Max Lucado about
his project How Happiness Happens. Taking a deep dive into
why not only Americans broadly, but Christians as well, why
we are so unhappy and how we can experience the
lasting joy that we should have in Jesus, even in
(15:02):
the face of a falling world. Let me ask this as, uh, Max,
as you looked at the research, obviously guys like you
and I are going to filter all of this through
the lens of Scripture. How is your study of Scripture
informed the way that you understand happiness?
S2 (15:20):
Well, I think that an understanding of Scripture reveals to
us that God really does want us to be happy. Uh,
we can walk away thinking that, um, disciples are perpetually
serious and somber and, um, and I, I don't necessarily
think that we can, in seeking to be like Christ,
(15:43):
exclude the wonderful promises that come at us in Scripture.
You think about even the sermon on the Mount that
begins with five promises. Bless. I'm sorry, nine Promises that
blessed are, blessed are, blessed are. And we know that
word is a a form of happiness. I think there's
about 3000 references to happiness in the Bible. When you
(16:07):
include everything from merriment to joy to celebration. Wow. I mean,
happiness is. And and and even we as parents, we
as parents, we want our kids to be happy. How
much more would God, who's the perfect father, want us
to be happy? And so I think, I think that understanding, uh,
(16:28):
happiness through the lens of Scripture is enough to give
me an aspiration to say, Lord, I, I want to
be happy like you want me to be happy. And
as a result, I, I think that he reveals a
strategy to lead us into a place where happiness is
more than just a passing emotion.
S1 (16:46):
So let me ask the question that I'm sure a
lot of my listeners are thinking, at least I know
I am. Was Jesus a happy person?
S2 (16:54):
Oh, yes, by all means. I mean, my goodness, he
passed the kid test.
S1 (17:02):
You know, kids.
S2 (17:03):
Can sniff out a phony, right?
S3 (17:05):
They can. And, uh, and and.
S2 (17:06):
Kids are never attracted to a grump. I mean, they
can pick up on a grump in a heartbeat. And
Jesus had to tell his disciples. Let the children come
to me. The kids wanted to come to Christ. They
wanted to be around him. I think the fact that
he attracted large crowds, uh, tells us that he was happy. I,
I think the fact that he was invited to parties,
(17:29):
that he went to weddings and one wedding, he was
even put in charge of the wine list. I think
the fact that the enemies of Christ, the religious leaders,
criticized him for hanging out with people who hosted big
parties and events, suggests that Jesus was a likable, happy person.
(17:49):
And so, yeah, I think you can make a great
case that Jesus that had a smile on his face.
I would imagine he knew how to whistle. And that
he whistled, uh, and that he was just a joy
to be around. How does it mean he didn't clean
out a temple or two? That doesn't mean that.
S4 (18:06):
He didn't preach.
S2 (18:07):
On serious topics like sin and.
S4 (18:10):
Death.
S2 (18:11):
And, uh, and, and calling on people to be loyal
to their family and manage their money well. It don't
mean that he was, uh, shallow or naive, but it
does mean that he was able to walk this earth
that was is full of corruption, and yet do so
in a joyful manner.
S1 (18:29):
Yeah. As far as I can understand, in studying the scriptures,
there's not much distinction that the scriptures make between happiness
and joy. I think we make a lot of distinction there.
I've heard people say, well, happiness is kind of a
temporary or shallow emotion. Joy is more enduring, but I
think the scriptures deal with those interchangeably. And you talked
about blessed being a one expression of many in this vein,
(18:52):
but I do think about how this whole concept, this
whole reality, whole desire for joy and happiness is so
undermining our day. And you talked about a couple of
the threats. I love to kind of delve into a
couple of the threats before we give what I think
is the heart of your book, and that is the
secret to experiencing it. But what about social media? I
(19:13):
often ask myself, how would Jesus and the apostles lived
in an Instagram Twitter type of world?
S2 (19:19):
Man, are you nailing it today with your questions because
that is really an issue. It seriously is. I'm on Instagram,
we have social media, we have Facebook account, and I,
I think I am not proud of the way that
I look to see how many followers I have. I
wish I could say I'm totally oblivious to that.
S4 (19:40):
Sure.
S2 (19:41):
Um, but the truth of the matter is, it is
yet another opportunity for us to engage in one of
the most futile exercises in life. And that is comparison.
When we compare ourselves with others, he or she has
more than we do. He or she drives faster or
looks better. In social media is a petri dish that
(20:04):
that gives birth to this toxic comparison. And so I
think it is really an issue that we have to
take seriously. My daughter I have three daughters. Um, my
middle daughter is really on a crusade to get her
generation off of social media. Believe it or not.
S4 (20:22):
Wow. And she's trying.
S2 (20:23):
To convince people to at least take a only be
on social media on weekends because she's come to believe
that that there's something mentally that happens to us when
we continually look at pictures of people who are capturing
a moment in their day, and it's being portrayed like
every minute of that, of their day is like that moment,
(20:45):
and they compare that moment to their moments that they're experiencing,
which may be just the opposite of what that person
is going through. And she said, it is just so
impossible for us to not compare ourselves with others. And
so it's a serious thing. I think it needs to
be managed very, very carefully.
S1 (21:05):
You bring it up, and I want to just delve
a little bit deeper, because I think it is a
serious societal problem. And bravo for your daughter. I think
she is in many ways leading the way in what
the research will later on confirm in some ways is
already confirming. And that is something deeply emotional happens within us,
but also something deeply spiritual happens within us when we're
(21:29):
constantly in the world of comparison. And in many ways,
I struggle with the thought of the fact that I
have right now, children who praise God have not been
exposed to it. Uh, they're my oldest is a pre-teen,
but yet I know that world is coming for them.
How do we. And this is a little bit different
focused in the book, but I want to hear your thoughts.
(21:52):
How do we guard our hearts and guard our homes
in this in this type of environment?
S2 (21:58):
Well, the objective again, what a great question. I'd like
to know your thoughts on it too. Um, but I
think our objective is to have an identity that is
based solely on what God has said about us.
S4 (22:12):
Yes.
S2 (22:12):
So we have to understand that our identity does not
depend upon. It's not hinged upon what somebody else thinks
about us. Um, if I can, if I can be
so secure in the promises of Scripture that tell me
I've been bought with the greatest commodity in the history
of the universe, and that is the blood of Jesus Christ,
(22:35):
that I am indwelt with only pure power in the universe,
and that is the Holy Spirit, that I'm being protected
by the only providential protection in the universe. And that
is the love of my life. The care of my
loving father. That should be enough. And it is enough.
It is enough. But the challenge is that I tend
(22:57):
to think my happiness and my identity is rooted in
what's on my business card or or or or what my, uh,
bank account says. Or what? My car. The car I drive.
And that that's that's just something we've got to fight against, Chris.
I just think we've got to say, ah, man, I'm
(23:17):
to be known by God is enough for me. And
just build my identity right there.
S4 (23:23):
Would you agree?
S1 (23:24):
Well said, well said. I, I do, I do agree
with that. And I think that as moms and dads,
we need to never underestimate, uh, what the what the
power of parental face time is. Right? Yes, sir. We
know a lot of our kids are getting face time
with technology, but they need face time with moms and dads.
(23:44):
And as they get that, I think that becomes a safeguard.
And as we keep our face in the book instead
of on Facebook, you know, I think we're I think
we'll do we'll do well. Let me ask this question.
Another another great challenge. And I mentioned this earlier, maybe
just with one minute, I'd love for you to talk
about the political reality. We live in a hyper political world.
(24:07):
Can happiness be possible when we have 24 hour news cycles?
S2 (24:11):
Boy, you know what? I think sometimes we got to
turn the TV off. We do. And, um, my wife
and I have tried over the last few months, maybe
a year, to just watch for our evening entertainment, old movies,
and for us, old is 80s and 90s.
S4 (24:30):
Right?
S1 (24:31):
Right, right.
S2 (24:32):
But, you know, kind of the chick flicks she, she
calls them.
S4 (24:35):
Because.
S2 (24:36):
We found that as we sit there and would bounce
back and forth between CNN and Fox, uh, we would
begin to grumble. I mean literally grumble. Oh, he doesn't
know what he's talking about. Oh, she's just angry. Oh,
they've got an axe to grind. And we both came
to a realization. Is this what we want to do?
Do we want to sit here and use this evening
(24:58):
that we have to just get mad? And it was
taking our happiness away. And so we don't permit ourselves
much time watching Fox and CNN any longer. It's just
a choice that we've made, and it sure has helped
us to go to bed in a better mood.
S1 (25:15):
Well, I can only imagine, and I'm grateful for that wisdom.
And sometimes, folks, it's not just about what you expose
yourself to. It's about what you keep your heart guarded from.
And we need to make sure we are good guards
of our heart. Listen, we have to prepare for another break.
But when we come back, I promise you, I'm going
to talk to Max about, um, these one, another statements
(25:38):
in the Bible and how these statements have really helped
him to understand the source of true happiness and how
we can experience it. And how we can help to
give it away and help others to experience it as well.
We'll also get, uh, get into, um, some family relationship dynamics.
What do we do? With a person who's the opposite
(25:59):
of us? And what if the opposite one lives in
our own home and under our own roof? We're going
to make sure we keep it real on the other
side of this break. So you don't change that doubt.
Much more to come with Max Lucado next up on equip.
Today's program has been pre-recorded so our phone lines are
(26:19):
not open. Welcome back to equip with Chris Brooks. Before
we go back to Mr. Max Lucado, let me say
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(26:41):
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(27:02):
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(27:29):
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888644 4144. Today we're talking about how happiness happens with
(28:13):
author and pastor Max Lucado. And we've talked about what
Scripture has to say about happiness. And we've also looked
at some of the social factors on why it's so elusive. But, Max,
we have, um, not delved into these wonderful one another
passages about 59 of them show up in our Bibles.
(28:36):
Talk about what these one another Passages have meant to
you and why you believe they're so essential to happiness?
S2 (28:45):
Well, the essential meaning of and promise of happiness that
comes through Scripture, uh, says that happiness begins with the
relationship with God through Jesus Christ. And happiness is accelerated
as we give it away, as we give it away. Basically, uh,
doing good does good for the doer. And the more
(29:08):
we do good for others, the happier we are. And
I think that's why Jesus said it is more blessed
to give than receive. It's happiness happens by making other
people happy. We really find that to be true. And
and and as a result, the Scripture has practical ways
that we can make other people happy. Uh, and we
(29:32):
call these the one another verses. And like you mentioned,
there's 59 of them, at least in the scriptures. I
reduced them down to to ten. I tried to catalogue
them all under ten headings, because nobody wants to read
a book that has 59 chapters. That wouldn't make anybody happy.
And so, uh, I, I took ten, I created ten, uh,
(29:55):
of I'm sorry, I took ten of the one another
verses that that seemed to be everything from the most
quickly adaptable to the most difficult to achieve. And I
think we can do these. I really do everything from
serve one another. Uh, encourage one another, teach one another,
greet one another. Forgive one another. Happiness can happen as
(30:18):
we begin giving these, uh, taking these these opportunities to
bring out the happiness in other people.
S1 (30:28):
So which one for Max Lucado seems to be the
most prominent out of all of those? Uh, one another passages.
And obviously each one is powerful. But which one on
the personal level has spoken deeply to you?
S2 (30:43):
You know, can can I answer that with the one
that's has been most surprising and then the one that's
been the most difficult? Uh, the one that's most surprising
is the command to greet one another. I am surprised, uh,
number one, that I had gotten into the habit of
not noticing people, uh, walking into an office building and
(31:05):
not noticing the receptionist or checking out of the grocery
store line and not paying attention to the person who
who's checking me out, uh uh, or or in any
number of situations. And so I felt encouraged and challenged
to greet people, to greet people, as you know, scripture
so well, Chris, and you know that especially the apostle
(31:28):
Paul was always saying, greet one another. And, uh, in
the book of Romans, toward the end of the epistle,
there's a chapter that is primarily taken up with tell
people hello comments. Greet so and so. Greet so and so.
Greet so and so. Uh. And the message there is
greeting people matters. And why is this true? It's true
(31:52):
because it causes me to get out of myself and
into the world of someone else. You know, our world
can get so small. But if I make it a
habit to greet every person, make eye contact, offer a
genuine hello, then, uh, immediately I'm out of my world
and into their world, and I've elevated their world just
(32:15):
a bit.
S4 (32:16):
So we can do that.
S2 (32:16):
Immediately. You don't have to go to any university to
learn how to greet other people. The one that's most
difficult for me is one that's probably difficult for a
lot of people, and that is forgive one another. And
sometimes it's just hard to forgive people. We all get
beat up and bruised along life's way. We we get neglected, ignored,
(32:37):
or even, uh, offended. And and finding how to bring
forgiveness to others is not easy. And yet it is
absolutely essential in happiness. One of the research projects I
came across was from Duke University that listed the eight
characteristics of happy people. Of those eight, four had to
(32:59):
do with releasing resentments. And we know this. We know
that we're not happy when we're harboring a grudge. And
so it's much to our benefit to find a way
to forgive those who have offended us. So to answer
your question, I've got one that that surprised me. But
I've also got one another passage that challenges me.
S1 (33:20):
Well, I want to tell you the one that I'm
so glad that our culture does not embrace as much,
and that is, greet one another with a holy kiss.
I'm glad I don't have to do that. I'm telling you,
that would be a struggle. But we do have to
greet one another and we got to work on that.
But let me let me ask this question because for me,
(33:41):
I think, um, and man, I've been thinking about this
all day and leading up to this interview, which ones
I struggle with the most, the ones that I feel
like I do better at. Um, and to be honest
with you, this whole accept one another is, um, man,
that's a that's a tough one in particular when it
(34:03):
comes to accepting someone who, um, we would describe as
the opposite one, the one that seems so different than us. Um, maybe.
And you've highlighted this in your book. Maybe they vote
different than us, or maybe they come from a different
ethnic background than us. Talk about that whole sense of
(34:24):
loving and accepting the one who's opposite.
S2 (34:30):
Yeah, and I think you're right. I. I think that
would be on the challenging end of the spectrum. Uh,
the passage there from the book of Romans says accept
one another, then even as Christ accepts you. I think
about how Christ accepted me. Um, I, I became to
be a follower of Christ when I was 20 years old. Uh,
(34:52):
by then I had just made a mess out of
my life. I was a heavy drinker. Um, I was immoral. Uh,
I was a fighter. Um, I was, um, I was misogyny, misogynistic. I,
I had a I had an arrogant view of male superiority. Um,
(35:13):
as I look back on my situation there, Chris, I,
I would not if I were a father, I would
not have allowed my daughter to go out with me.
S4 (35:22):
I, I.
S2 (35:23):
Was.
S4 (35:23):
Just.
S2 (35:23):
Not a a a good, healthy person and, um, I, I,
I found the grace of Christ, or better said, the
grace of Christ found me. And and I've a sense
that Jesus accepted me. He accepted me. Now, to be clear,
he didn't accept my way of life. He didn't accept
my my, uh, arrogance. And he didn't accept my tendency
(35:47):
to to brawl and to and to fight. But what
he accepted is what he could do inside me and
and how he could change me. And and and I'm
a slow work in progress, you know. Uh, but but
I believe he accepted me and said I will begin
to work to change you. So when I accept somebody,
(36:09):
I'm not saying that I agree with everything they say. Um,
I'm not saying that I have to, uh, change my
viewpoint to match theirs, but what I'm saying is, I
accept them as a work of God, that God created them.
They're God's idea. And God doesn't have bad ideas, is
(36:29):
so he must. And she must be here for a reason,
for a purpose, and I can. I can love that
potential that's inside of them. Uh, and I think that's
a desperate message for this day and age, don't you?
You've already mentioned a couple of.
S4 (36:42):
Times, absolutely, in today's.
S2 (36:44):
Program that this is a very divisive era in which
we live.
S1 (36:49):
Yeah. And I agree, and I think that it starts
at home. I really believe it starts at home, because
how are we going to demonstrate acceptance with strangers, which
we're called to do. And, and this love, if we
can't do it with those under our same roof. And
it's not easy, but I believe that we have been
given the secret weapon of the Holy Spirit to empower
(37:12):
us to be able to do that. You've dedicated an
entire chapter of your book to prayer, and I would
have to assume it's precisely for this reason, because we
need some supernatural help to live this out, don't we?
S2 (37:26):
We do. We do. You know, I'm a pastor and
I get to preach. Uh, not every weekend, but many weekends.
And right now, our church. I'm preaching a series on
the Holy Spirit. And I'm learning so much, so much.
And I'm. I'm blessed by the thought that the presence
of God is inside of us, inside of me as
(37:46):
our helper, our comforter, comforter.
S4 (37:49):
And.
S2 (37:49):
Our advocate to to give us the strength to love
people who are hard to love. And you're right, sometimes
that person who is hard to love is your parent
or your child. Somebody under your roof, your sibling. Uh, boy,
I can't tell you how many times people tell me
that their sibling is the most difficult person in their life,
(38:12):
but God will help us here. And and I think,
I think pray for one another is the one another
command that kicks in when relationships are especially difficult? Maybe
you don't feel like you can talk to that person.
Maybe you don't feel like you can forgive that person.
Maybe you don't feel like you can, uh, teach or
(38:32):
admonish or even encourage that person. That's okay. Your first
step is to pray for them. Pray for them. And
you know, when you're praying for someone, you are imitating
Jesus who always intercedes for us. And so do not
over do not, do not, uh, underestimate the power of
(38:55):
praying for somebody. But and and also, when you pray
for somebody that increases your own happiness because you will
sense the Holy Spirit working in your heart to create
a deeper respect for that human being. And also you'll
give to that person. Uh, you'll give to God the
burden you carry for that person. You cannot carry burdens
(39:16):
for people, but you can carry burdens and give them
to God. And that's what we do when we pray.
And so I think pray for one another is an
absolutely essential part of, uh, learning how happiness happens.
S1 (39:32):
Max. So well said. And I will say this. Maybe
the opposite of the equal opposite of increasing your happiness
is decreasing your resentment, your frustrations in life. And I
will tell you that it is such a joy for
me when I'm praying for someone, even someone who has
gotten on my bad side. It does limit the amount
(39:54):
of resentment that I carry in my heart. Prayer is transformational, folks.
When we got to take a short break. But when
we come back, there's a challenge that Max wants to
give to you, and I want to give to you
as well. So again, don't change that dial. I hope
you're enjoying the interview. You'll enjoy the book much more.
Go to the website, equip radio.org. Order your copy today.
(40:16):
We'll ship it right out to you and I promise
you you will be blessed. Whatever you do, don't change
that dial. The best is yet to come. Next up
on unequipped with Chris Brooks.
S5 (40:33):
Sharing your faith can be challenging. How do you confidently
engage with questions about truth, technology, and culture while staying
grounded in Scripture? That's why Chris Brooks has chosen apologetics
for an ever changing culture as our gift. When you
support equip this month, it will help you provide thoughtful,
informed answers to the pressing questions of our time. Request
(40:57):
your copy today with a gift of any amount. Call
(888)Â 644-4144 or visit Equip radio.org.
S1 (41:10):
Welcome back to equip with Chris Brooks. Max Lucado has
been my guest and what a joy it is to
have Max. Okay, Max, let's talk about this challenge that
your book and your ministry is issuing to all of us.
What is it?
S4 (41:24):
It's a 40.
S2 (41:25):
Day challenge to make 100 people happy. And when I
say that, I'm challenging people to take the next 40
days and set out to make a difference in the
lives of 100 people by intentionally putting the one another
verses into play. So over the next 40 days, look
(41:46):
for opportunities to encourage someone to greet, someone to teach,
someone to admonish, forgive, and and, and and keep a journal.
And when you get home in the evening or or
sometime during the day, make a note of these interactions
that you had and what you learned from them, what
you sense, uh, God taught you through them. You'll be
(42:09):
so glad you did this. I did this, of course, myself,
and I found it to be very invigorating, but I
was surprised how challenging it was. Uh, it's not easy
to to to to live with an outward focus, but,
you know, it's a lot more fun than to live
with an inward focus.
S1 (42:27):
You know, I love this. You say in your book,
you can't control your genetics. You aren't in charge of
the weather, the traffic, who occupies any political office. But
you can always increase the number of smiles on the planet.
This is what we're after, isn't it?
S2 (42:44):
Absolutely. You are the light of the world. Jesus said.
You're the salt of society, Jesus said. And so we
already are, that we can have the capacity to bring
light into dark places, to change the flavor of every
place that we go. We can be light and salt
in any situation. So let's let's accept this, uh, special anointing,
(43:07):
special call, special privilege that we have and and carry
this out in the world. And and boy, I tell
you what, it's just so much fun.
S4 (43:17):
It's just it's so much fun.
S1 (43:18):
It absolutely is. And what I love about it is
that it takes us from being complainers to being difference makers.
I'll never forget Max traveling to northern Uganda. I was
in the Gulu region of Uganda, and the governor there
was taking my team and I on a tour. And
just a bright, very, um, intelligent leader have been, uh,
(43:41):
educated in the West and brought all of that back
to help to lead his home country. And he says
to me, while we're on this tour, Christy, you know
the difference between a complainer and a difference maker. And
I didn't know how to respond to that. I didn't
know if I was going to be the point of
the joke, if you know what I mean. And he
says to me, the difference between a complainer and a
(44:03):
difference maker is not in what they see. Both see
the brokenness of the world and the culture around them.
But a complainer says something needs to be done about this.
A difference maker says I need to do something about this. Yeah,
so similar in response, but such a huge gulf in
(44:25):
between those two statements, I think, Max, it's true that
we all can see the brokenness of the world around us.
I think all of us are saying, man, anger is
too high. Depression rates are running rampant. Suicide. Man seems
to be on the front page of so many of
our newspapers and headlines. We all know that the the
(44:46):
rage that seems to be a part of our culture
is so pervasive. Uh, the difference is not in what
we see, Max. I think the difference is in how
we respond to it and what it seems to me
that your book, your Challenge, this happiness challenge is encouraging
us to do is to move from saying something needs
(45:08):
to be done about this, to saying, I need to
do something about it. And it seems to me that
it starts with a prayer and a smile, that if
we can embrace those two things, we can begin to
see happiness happen all around us.
S2 (45:24):
And imagine if we all did that. Imagine if every
one of us decided, okay, over the next 40 days,
I'm going to make a hundred people's lives just a
little bit better. I'm going to put a smile on
a hundred faces. You know, um, I'm not saying that's
going to change the world, but then again, it could.
(45:45):
What we need is a happiness revolution. And it begins
when when people who have reason to be the happiest
on earth. And that's those of us who are known
and loved and bought by God. When when we live
out our our blessings and and and share them in
a joyful, willing, generous way with others, who knows what
(46:07):
might happen?
S1 (46:09):
Well, you've gotten us. You've gotten us going. And I
would just simply ask, as we close, if you could
join me in prayer as I pray for us to
embrace this happiness challenge, because I really do believe it's
the key to seeing change. Father, I pray right now
that you would help Christians, believers, maybe even those who
are listening right now. The Lord be the happiest in
(46:30):
our culture and society. You've given us your presence, the
gift of the Holy Spirit, the promise of the resurrection
of all believers, the Lord in Christ. And so, Lord,
I just pray that we would live it out. In
Jesus name, Amen and amen. Max, thanks for joining me today.
S4 (46:48):
Thank you.
S1 (46:49):
Folks, I want you to get a copy of the
happiness gift that Max has given us through the book,
How Happiness Happens. Do so at our website. Equip Radio.com.
And until we're together again, remember, as always, equip with
Chris Brooks is a production of Moody Radio, a ministry
of Moody Bible Institute.
Please enjoy this encore edition of equip with Chris Brooks. Well,
hey there folks, welcome to another exciting edition of Equipped
with Chris Brooks. I am so glad you tuned in.
We've been praying for you. Why don't you strap on
your seat belt? We're going to navigate through the contours
of culture, as always, with the lens of the biblical
worldview on. But before we do that, let me remind
(00:36):
you that this is the day that the Lord has made.
He has given it as a gift, so that you
and I might rejoice and be glad in it. So
let's do just that. Let's follow the words of the
Apostle Paul. Let's rejoice in the Lord always. And again
I say, rejoice. With that. I welcome you into what
will be a very encouraging, uh, uplifting and provocative edition
(00:58):
of equip. Let me start by asking a question. How
happy are you? When was the last time you thought
about that question? Consider your happiness. Kind of took the
pulse of your joy. Well, if you're like most Americans,
sadly you're not doing that well in that area. We're
struggling in the area of happiness and joy, which, by
(01:19):
the way, are two interchangeable concepts according to Scripture. National
surveys agree that happiness is not happening for most Americans,
according to a recent Harris Poll. Surveys of American happiness
at its highest point. Now listen to this. At its
highest point, only one third of Americans surveyed said they
(01:39):
were happy at the highest point in this survey. A
collection of data of American happiness. Only one third of
Americans said, hey, I'm happy. Two thirds said, no, I'm not.
On the opposite end of the spectrum, estimates concerning clinical
depression forecast that we are about ten times more likely
(02:04):
to struggle with clinical depression than a century ago. The
World Health Organization forecasts that depression will become the second
leading cause of disease worldwide. These are serious realities and
they have even more serious implications. And we know it.
We see it all around us. This is partly the
reality of living in a broken world, but it's also
(02:27):
the reality that many of us have not been taught
clearly and have not really been presented with what the
scriptures give us concerning how we are here in the
Body of Christ in the 21st century, can experience the
happiness that is promised to us in Scripture. Proverbs 16
and 20 says this. Happy is the one who trusts
(02:50):
in the Lord. I believe that's true. So today we're
going to talk about happiness. We're going to talk about
why it's so elusive. We're going to talk about how
we can achieve it and experience it, and maybe even
more importantly, how we can help others to experience it
as well. I am so fired up to talk with
my guest today. It is Max Lucado Though. Best selling
(03:13):
New York Times author. Many of you know Max already.
He's a preacher with a storyteller's gift. He has a
pastor's heart and a poet's pen. His books have sold
over 130 million copies around the world. He is a
great man of God, with a tender heart for the Lord.
And he's joining me today to talk about his newest project,
(03:36):
How Happiness Happens. Max, how are you today?
S2 (03:39):
Um, a lot better now, hearing that wonderful introduction. Man,
you covered the territory there and set us up, I think,
for a really good conversation. Thank you very much.
S1 (03:50):
So, man, what caused you at this point, Max, to
say I need to undertake a project that really focuses
on happiness?
S2 (04:00):
Well, the data that you shared, uh, was a tipping
point for me. Uh, in intuitively, I sensed that, uh,
People live with this cloud of perpetual grayness over them.
But I just thought, well, maybe that's because I'm a
pastor and I see people at their low points. But
(04:22):
when I read that statistic, uh, that Harris poll that
says that the happiness level is the lowest that it's
ever been, and that only 1 in 3 Americans, uh, can,
can conjure up enough, uh, happiness to check. Yes, on
the happiness questionnaire. Uh, then I thought, well, something's wrong.
(04:45):
Something's something's wrong here. Uh, and and so I wanted
to talk about happiness and try to address these these questions.
Should we be happy? Uh, does God want us to
be happy? Where do we find happiness? Uh, is happiness
make a difference in our health, in our relationships, in
(05:07):
our success? Uh, and so I became kind of a
fascinated with the whole idea of happiness. And it ended
up presenting a series of lessons to our church. And
it seemed to be very well received. And so I
turned those those that research that I did and presentations
(05:27):
to the church. I turned those, uh, messages into, into
this manuscript. And now it's this book, how happiness happens.
S1 (05:35):
I'm so grateful you did. And I want to encourage
everyone who's listening. I wish I could airdrop this book
across America, but I can't do that. But what you
can do is go to our website, equip Radio.com, and
order your copy today. How happiness happens, I believe, is biblical. Max,
that God does want us to experience joy. He wants
(05:57):
us to experience happiness. And I do believe that our
ability to experience that not only has personal benefit, but
it becomes an attractional tool of evangelism as well.
S2 (06:09):
I agree 100%, 100%, and I can't imagine anybody who
would think that God wants his people to be unhappy. Now,
I understand that happiness is a, for many people, a challenge.
So my working definition of happiness is a deeply rooted
(06:33):
sense of contentment. It's a conviction that there is a
good God, and we're headed to a great destination, and
that he is overseeing the affairs of mankind in a
way that's that's that's fitting for his divine purpose. I
don't want us to think that happiness is a sense
of giddiness. Uh, happiness is not always even a good mood.
(06:57):
But happiness is simply that conviction that we have, that
there's a good God, and we're headed to a great place,
and that God is overseeing all of our lives. I
believe that's right. And I agree with you. I think
that God wants his people to be contagiously happy contagiously content. Uh,
because we live in a world that is weary and weary,
(07:20):
we're weary of everything. We don't trust anything we, especially
in our political climate. We don't. We're just we're just
cautious and skeptical and cynical. And in addition, we become weary.
We're weary with relationships that don't work and and advertisements
that promise to deliver happiness. But don't um, and, and
(07:42):
we're kind of there's a sadness as a result among us.
So I think, I think if we as, as, as
God's children can embrace this definition of happiness and embrace
the strategies that God gives us to be happier people,
then you're right. I agree 100%. This could be the
greatest evangelistic tool that we have.
S1 (08:05):
Well, it's become so problematic. This whole lack of happiness.
Lack of joy in our in our world, in our
culture that social scientists have been focused on this before
we came on the air. I talked to you about
Arthur Brooks, who is the former head of American Enterprise Institute.
He's been writing on this, as well as other social scientists,
(08:25):
prominent ones, saying, hey, we have a huge problem here.
And I do think that the gospel is the answer
to what ails the human heart, the human psyche and
the human soul. And I think it's really important that
we celebrate the fact that thought leaders like yourself have
gotten out in front and said, wait a minute, to
all the social scientists, God's word has something to say
(08:47):
about this, folks. We're going to dive deep into this.
And again, I want to encourage you to get a
copy of How Happiness Happens, the latest by Max Lucado,
by going to our website, equip radio. Before we're all
said and done, we'll talk about the effects of social
media on happiness. What about the never ending political cycles
and the tension that comes from living in a hyper
(09:08):
partisan culture. What about if you're living with an unhappy person?
Is happiness possible there? Mexico has a lot to say
about it, but let me ask this question, Max. Why
is happiness, in your opinion, so elusive in particular for
the believer?
S2 (09:26):
That's a great question. And by the way, you always
ask the greatest questions.
S1 (09:30):
I appreciate.
S2 (09:31):
That. You know, I think we live in a day
and age in which, more than any other generation in
the history of the world is saturated by a sophisticated,
well-funded advertising, uh, initiative that exists to tell us we
(09:53):
are deficient. When you think about when you think about
how advertisement works. Advertisement. To be successful must convince me
that I need something before I'll buy something, right? It's
just that simple. It must convince me that I'm unhappy
and offer a product that they promise will make me happy.
(10:14):
It's pretty simple. So all day long. Now, now. So
keep that in mind. And then remember, no one has
been in a day. And that is in which we
are more subject to advertisements than this day and age. Uh,
from billboards to television to to to radio to online products. Uh,
you just can't. You can't escape it. So all day long,
(10:36):
I'm being told that my hair is too thin, my
waistline is too big, my clothes are out of style.
My car is too old. And. And the subliminal message
is I'm just falling short. I'm just falling short. And
the subliminal promise is the suggested promise is happiness is
(10:57):
always a purchase away, a move away, a transfer away.
A house away. A spouse away. If I can just
do this, I'll be happy. Now what happens is we
are happy. Perhaps for a time. But then the whole
cycle begins again. And when you get to be an
(11:18):
old man like me, if you have bought into that
for years, you become cynical and jaded because you think
to yourself, well, I've been promised happiness all my life,
and I've not received it. Well, the truth is, you've
been buying into a system that is very sophisticated, extremely
(11:39):
well funded, and that. And that requires you to believe
you're deficient before you can be sufficient with their product.
And that doesn't work. That doesn't work. And I think
what we're seeing today is a generation, uh, my generation
who's who's the first generation to really live in the
full force of this coming at us through television, radio
(12:03):
and now an additional layer. And the younger generations coming
at us through online advertisement. And if we don't, if
we don't educate ourselves and remind ourselves that this happiness
promise doesn't work, uh, it's going to even get worse.
And disclosing this and helping people find the better strategy
for happiness is, is really the the goal, I think,
(12:26):
of of the church and of and of the scriptures.
S1 (12:29):
The enemy of our souls wants to war against us
by taking away the one thing that all of us crave,
and that is happiness, happiness and joy in Jesus. But
my guest today, Max Lucado, says that finding lasting joy
is possible even in a world full of comparison, disappointment,
(12:49):
and unmet expectations. Folks, this is going to be a
great conversation. I promise you. You're going to want to
stick and stay and not change that down. Because as
we go forward in this conversation, we're going to hit
on some of the key areas and give you the
surprising secret to lasting happiness. How does happiness happen? Well,
I'm glad you asked. We're going to answer that question
(13:11):
on the other side of this break. While we are
on a short break, I want you to go to
our website equip radio.org. Let's equip radio.org. Order your copy today.
Secure your copy of How Happiness Happens. Don't forget. Also
social is available to you and go to social media
now and join the conversation. We always love your thoughts,
(13:33):
your comments and your questions. Whatever you do, you make
sure you stay right there. Much more to come. Next
up on equip with Chris Brooks. As a dad, a friend,
(13:54):
and a neighbor, I share your concerns over the growing
problems in our culture. That's why unequipped, we tackle the
tough issues. Learning how to respond with grace and truth.
We're looking for like minded partners to stand with us.
Would you be willing to become an Equipper today and
this role? You'll give a monthly donation to support the
Ministry of Equip and as an Equipper, you'll receive insider benefits,
such as a bi weekly email that contains pastoral messages
(14:17):
prepared just for you. Become an equipper today by calling
888644 4144 or go to Equip radio.org. Chris Brooks here
reminding you that today's program is pre-recorded. While we won't
be taking calls, we do want to connect with you
on social media. Hey there folks, welcome back to equip
(14:38):
with Chris Brooks, talking to author pastor Max Lucado about
his project How Happiness Happens. Taking a deep dive into
why not only Americans broadly, but Christians as well, why
we are so unhappy and how we can experience the
lasting joy that we should have in Jesus, even in
(15:02):
the face of a falling world. Let me ask this as, uh, Max,
as you looked at the research, obviously guys like you
and I are going to filter all of this through
the lens of Scripture. How is your study of Scripture
informed the way that you understand happiness?
S2 (15:20):
Well, I think that an understanding of Scripture reveals to
us that God really does want us to be happy. Uh,
we can walk away thinking that, um, disciples are perpetually
serious and somber and, um, and I, I don't necessarily
think that we can, in seeking to be like Christ,
(15:43):
exclude the wonderful promises that come at us in Scripture.
You think about even the sermon on the Mount that
begins with five promises. Bless. I'm sorry, nine Promises that
blessed are, blessed are, blessed are. And we know that
word is a a form of happiness. I think there's
about 3000 references to happiness in the Bible. When you
(16:07):
include everything from merriment to joy to celebration. Wow. I mean,
happiness is. And and and even we as parents, we
as parents, we want our kids to be happy. How
much more would God, who's the perfect father, want us
to be happy? And so I think, I think that understanding, uh,
(16:28):
happiness through the lens of Scripture is enough to give
me an aspiration to say, Lord, I, I want to
be happy like you want me to be happy. And
as a result, I, I think that he reveals a
strategy to lead us into a place where happiness is
more than just a passing emotion.
S1 (16:46):
So let me ask the question that I'm sure a
lot of my listeners are thinking, at least I know
I am. Was Jesus a happy person?
S2 (16:54):
Oh, yes, by all means. I mean, my goodness, he
passed the kid test.
S1 (17:02):
You know, kids.
S2 (17:03):
Can sniff out a phony, right?
S3 (17:05):
They can. And, uh, and and.
S2 (17:06):
Kids are never attracted to a grump. I mean, they
can pick up on a grump in a heartbeat. And
Jesus had to tell his disciples. Let the children come
to me. The kids wanted to come to Christ. They
wanted to be around him. I think the fact that
he attracted large crowds, uh, tells us that he was happy. I,
I think the fact that he was invited to parties,
(17:29):
that he went to weddings and one wedding, he was
even put in charge of the wine list. I think
the fact that the enemies of Christ, the religious leaders,
criticized him for hanging out with people who hosted big
parties and events, suggests that Jesus was a likable, happy person.
(17:49):
And so, yeah, I think you can make a great
case that Jesus that had a smile on his face.
I would imagine he knew how to whistle. And that
he whistled, uh, and that he was just a joy
to be around. How does it mean he didn't clean
out a temple or two? That doesn't mean that.
S4 (18:06):
He didn't preach.
S2 (18:07):
On serious topics like sin and.
S4 (18:10):
Death.
S2 (18:11):
And, uh, and, and calling on people to be loyal
to their family and manage their money well. It don't
mean that he was, uh, shallow or naive, but it
does mean that he was able to walk this earth
that was is full of corruption, and yet do so
in a joyful manner.
S1 (18:29):
Yeah. As far as I can understand, in studying the scriptures,
there's not much distinction that the scriptures make between happiness
and joy. I think we make a lot of distinction there.
I've heard people say, well, happiness is kind of a
temporary or shallow emotion. Joy is more enduring, but I
think the scriptures deal with those interchangeably. And you talked
about blessed being a one expression of many in this vein,
(18:52):
but I do think about how this whole concept, this
whole reality, whole desire for joy and happiness is so
undermining our day. And you talked about a couple of
the threats. I love to kind of delve into a
couple of the threats before we give what I think
is the heart of your book, and that is the
secret to experiencing it. But what about social media? I
(19:13):
often ask myself, how would Jesus and the apostles lived
in an Instagram Twitter type of world?
S2 (19:19):
Man, are you nailing it today with your questions because
that is really an issue. It seriously is. I'm on Instagram,
we have social media, we have Facebook account, and I,
I think I am not proud of the way that
I look to see how many followers I have. I
wish I could say I'm totally oblivious to that.
S4 (19:40):
Sure.
S2 (19:41):
Um, but the truth of the matter is, it is
yet another opportunity for us to engage in one of
the most futile exercises in life. And that is comparison.
When we compare ourselves with others, he or she has
more than we do. He or she drives faster or
looks better. In social media is a petri dish that
(20:04):
that gives birth to this toxic comparison. And so I
think it is really an issue that we have to
take seriously. My daughter I have three daughters. Um, my
middle daughter is really on a crusade to get her
generation off of social media. Believe it or not.
S4 (20:22):
Wow. And she's trying.
S2 (20:23):
To convince people to at least take a only be
on social media on weekends because she's come to believe
that that there's something mentally that happens to us when
we continually look at pictures of people who are capturing
a moment in their day, and it's being portrayed like
every minute of that, of their day is like that moment,
(20:45):
and they compare that moment to their moments that they're experiencing,
which may be just the opposite of what that person
is going through. And she said, it is just so
impossible for us to not compare ourselves with others. And
so it's a serious thing. I think it needs to
be managed very, very carefully.
S1 (21:05):
You bring it up, and I want to just delve
a little bit deeper, because I think it is a
serious societal problem. And bravo for your daughter. I think
she is in many ways leading the way in what
the research will later on confirm in some ways is
already confirming. And that is something deeply emotional happens within us,
but also something deeply spiritual happens within us when we're
(21:29):
constantly in the world of comparison. And in many ways,
I struggle with the thought of the fact that I
have right now, children who praise God have not been
exposed to it. Uh, they're my oldest is a pre-teen,
but yet I know that world is coming for them.
How do we. And this is a little bit different
focused in the book, but I want to hear your thoughts.
(21:52):
How do we guard our hearts and guard our homes
in this in this type of environment?
S2 (21:58):
Well, the objective again, what a great question. I'd like
to know your thoughts on it too. Um, but I
think our objective is to have an identity that is
based solely on what God has said about us.
S4 (22:12):
Yes.
S2 (22:12):
So we have to understand that our identity does not
depend upon. It's not hinged upon what somebody else thinks
about us. Um, if I can, if I can be
so secure in the promises of Scripture that tell me
I've been bought with the greatest commodity in the history
of the universe, and that is the blood of Jesus Christ,
(22:35):
that I am indwelt with only pure power in the universe,
and that is the Holy Spirit, that I'm being protected
by the only providential protection in the universe. And that
is the love of my life. The care of my
loving father. That should be enough. And it is enough.
It is enough. But the challenge is that I tend
(22:57):
to think my happiness and my identity is rooted in
what's on my business card or or or or what my, uh,
bank account says. Or what? My car. The car I drive.
And that that's that's just something we've got to fight against, Chris.
I just think we've got to say, ah, man, I'm
(23:17):
to be known by God is enough for me. And
just build my identity right there.
S4 (23:23):
Would you agree?
S1 (23:24):
Well said, well said. I, I do, I do agree
with that. And I think that as moms and dads,
we need to never underestimate, uh, what the what the
power of parental face time is. Right? Yes, sir. We
know a lot of our kids are getting face time
with technology, but they need face time with moms and dads.
(23:44):
And as they get that, I think that becomes a safeguard.
And as we keep our face in the book instead
of on Facebook, you know, I think we're I think
we'll do we'll do well. Let me ask this question.
Another another great challenge. And I mentioned this earlier, maybe
just with one minute, I'd love for you to talk
about the political reality. We live in a hyper political world.
(24:07):
Can happiness be possible when we have 24 hour news cycles?
S2 (24:11):
Boy, you know what? I think sometimes we got to
turn the TV off. We do. And, um, my wife
and I have tried over the last few months, maybe
a year, to just watch for our evening entertainment, old movies,
and for us, old is 80s and 90s.
S4 (24:30):
Right?
S1 (24:31):
Right, right.
S2 (24:32):
But, you know, kind of the chick flicks she, she
calls them.
S4 (24:35):
Because.
S2 (24:36):
We found that as we sit there and would bounce
back and forth between CNN and Fox, uh, we would
begin to grumble. I mean literally grumble. Oh, he doesn't
know what he's talking about. Oh, she's just angry. Oh,
they've got an axe to grind. And we both came
to a realization. Is this what we want to do?
Do we want to sit here and use this evening
(24:58):
that we have to just get mad? And it was
taking our happiness away. And so we don't permit ourselves
much time watching Fox and CNN any longer. It's just
a choice that we've made, and it sure has helped
us to go to bed in a better mood.
S1 (25:15):
Well, I can only imagine, and I'm grateful for that wisdom.
And sometimes, folks, it's not just about what you expose
yourself to. It's about what you keep your heart guarded from.
And we need to make sure we are good guards
of our heart. Listen, we have to prepare for another break.
But when we come back, I promise you, I'm going
to talk to Max about, um, these one, another statements
(25:38):
in the Bible and how these statements have really helped
him to understand the source of true happiness and how
we can experience it. And how we can help to
give it away and help others to experience it as well.
We'll also get, uh, get into, um, some family relationship dynamics.
What do we do? With a person who's the opposite
(25:59):
of us? And what if the opposite one lives in
our own home and under our own roof? We're going
to make sure we keep it real on the other
side of this break. So you don't change that doubt.
Much more to come with Max Lucado next up on equip.
Today's program has been pre-recorded so our phone lines are
(26:19):
not open. Welcome back to equip with Chris Brooks. Before
we go back to Mr. Max Lucado, let me say
thank you. Thank you. And thank you. Each one of
you who support the program prayerfully and financially are so
important to this ministry. We cannot be here behind this
microphone each and every day without God's grace and your generosity,
(26:41):
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And I'm so grateful for you. Together, you and I
are helping to equip Christians to more effectively live, share,
and defend their faith in particular with a focus on
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you've been listening for some time and you've been blessed
(27:02):
by our guests, by our resources, by the daily encouragement
that comes from this program. And you've been thinking about
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Why don't you pause for just a moment? Today's a
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(27:29):
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(27:49):
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888644 4144. Today we're talking about how happiness happens with
(28:13):
author and pastor Max Lucado. And we've talked about what
Scripture has to say about happiness. And we've also looked
at some of the social factors on why it's so elusive. But, Max,
we have, um, not delved into these wonderful one another
passages about 59 of them show up in our Bibles.
(28:36):
Talk about what these one another Passages have meant to
you and why you believe they're so essential to happiness?
S2 (28:45):
Well, the essential meaning of and promise of happiness that
comes through Scripture, uh, says that happiness begins with the
relationship with God through Jesus Christ. And happiness is accelerated
as we give it away, as we give it away. Basically, uh,
doing good does good for the doer. And the more
(29:08):
we do good for others, the happier we are. And
I think that's why Jesus said it is more blessed
to give than receive. It's happiness happens by making other
people happy. We really find that to be true. And
and and as a result, the Scripture has practical ways
that we can make other people happy. Uh, and we
(29:32):
call these the one another verses. And like you mentioned,
there's 59 of them, at least in the scriptures. I
reduced them down to to ten. I tried to catalogue
them all under ten headings, because nobody wants to read
a book that has 59 chapters. That wouldn't make anybody happy.
And so, uh, I, I took ten, I created ten, uh,
(29:55):
of I'm sorry, I took ten of the one another
verses that that seemed to be everything from the most
quickly adaptable to the most difficult to achieve. And I
think we can do these. I really do everything from
serve one another. Uh, encourage one another, teach one another,
greet one another. Forgive one another. Happiness can happen as
(30:18):
we begin giving these, uh, taking these these opportunities to
bring out the happiness in other people.
S1 (30:28):
So which one for Max Lucado seems to be the
most prominent out of all of those? Uh, one another passages.
And obviously each one is powerful. But which one on
the personal level has spoken deeply to you?
S2 (30:43):
You know, can can I answer that with the one
that's has been most surprising and then the one that's
been the most difficult? Uh, the one that's most surprising
is the command to greet one another. I am surprised, uh,
number one, that I had gotten into the habit of
not noticing people, uh, walking into an office building and
(31:05):
not noticing the receptionist or checking out of the grocery
store line and not paying attention to the person who
who's checking me out, uh uh, or or in any
number of situations. And so I felt encouraged and challenged
to greet people, to greet people, as you know, scripture
so well, Chris, and you know that especially the apostle
(31:28):
Paul was always saying, greet one another. And, uh, in
the book of Romans, toward the end of the epistle,
there's a chapter that is primarily taken up with tell
people hello comments. Greet so and so. Greet so and so.
Greet so and so. Uh. And the message there is
greeting people matters. And why is this true? It's true
(31:52):
because it causes me to get out of myself and
into the world of someone else. You know, our world
can get so small. But if I make it a
habit to greet every person, make eye contact, offer a
genuine hello, then, uh, immediately I'm out of my world
and into their world, and I've elevated their world just
(32:15):
a bit.
S4 (32:16):
So we can do that.
S2 (32:16):
Immediately. You don't have to go to any university to
learn how to greet other people. The one that's most
difficult for me is one that's probably difficult for a
lot of people, and that is forgive one another. And
sometimes it's just hard to forgive people. We all get
beat up and bruised along life's way. We we get neglected, ignored,
(32:37):
or even, uh, offended. And and finding how to bring
forgiveness to others is not easy. And yet it is
absolutely essential in happiness. One of the research projects I
came across was from Duke University that listed the eight
characteristics of happy people. Of those eight, four had to
(32:59):
do with releasing resentments. And we know this. We know
that we're not happy when we're harboring a grudge. And
so it's much to our benefit to find a way
to forgive those who have offended us. So to answer
your question, I've got one that that surprised me. But
I've also got one another passage that challenges me.
S1 (33:20):
Well, I want to tell you the one that I'm
so glad that our culture does not embrace as much,
and that is, greet one another with a holy kiss.
I'm glad I don't have to do that. I'm telling you,
that would be a struggle. But we do have to
greet one another and we got to work on that.
But let me let me ask this question because for me,
(33:41):
I think, um, and man, I've been thinking about this
all day and leading up to this interview, which ones
I struggle with the most, the ones that I feel
like I do better at. Um, and to be honest
with you, this whole accept one another is, um, man,
that's a that's a tough one in particular when it
(34:03):
comes to accepting someone who, um, we would describe as
the opposite one, the one that seems so different than us. Um, maybe.
And you've highlighted this in your book. Maybe they vote
different than us, or maybe they come from a different
ethnic background than us. Talk about that whole sense of
(34:24):
loving and accepting the one who's opposite.
S2 (34:30):
Yeah, and I think you're right. I. I think that
would be on the challenging end of the spectrum. Uh,
the passage there from the book of Romans says accept
one another, then even as Christ accepts you. I think
about how Christ accepted me. Um, I, I became to
be a follower of Christ when I was 20 years old. Uh,
(34:52):
by then I had just made a mess out of
my life. I was a heavy drinker. Um, I was immoral. Uh,
I was a fighter. Um, I was, um, I was misogyny, misogynistic. I,
I had a I had an arrogant view of male superiority. Um,
(35:13):
as I look back on my situation there, Chris, I,
I would not if I were a father, I would
not have allowed my daughter to go out with me.
S4 (35:22):
I, I.
S2 (35:23):
Was.
S4 (35:23):
Just.
S2 (35:23):
Not a a a good, healthy person and, um, I, I,
I found the grace of Christ, or better said, the
grace of Christ found me. And and I've a sense
that Jesus accepted me. He accepted me. Now, to be clear,
he didn't accept my way of life. He didn't accept
my my, uh, arrogance. And he didn't accept my tendency
(35:47):
to to brawl and to and to fight. But what
he accepted is what he could do inside me and
and how he could change me. And and and I'm
a slow work in progress, you know. Uh, but but
I believe he accepted me and said I will begin
to work to change you. So when I accept somebody,
(36:09):
I'm not saying that I agree with everything they say. Um,
I'm not saying that I have to, uh, change my
viewpoint to match theirs, but what I'm saying is, I
accept them as a work of God, that God created them.
They're God's idea. And God doesn't have bad ideas, is
(36:29):
so he must. And she must be here for a reason,
for a purpose, and I can. I can love that
potential that's inside of them. Uh, and I think that's
a desperate message for this day and age, don't you?
You've already mentioned a couple of.
S4 (36:42):
Times, absolutely, in today's.
S2 (36:44):
Program that this is a very divisive era in which
we live.
S1 (36:49):
Yeah. And I agree, and I think that it starts
at home. I really believe it starts at home, because
how are we going to demonstrate acceptance with strangers, which
we're called to do. And, and this love, if we
can't do it with those under our same roof. And
it's not easy, but I believe that we have been
given the secret weapon of the Holy Spirit to empower
(37:12):
us to be able to do that. You've dedicated an
entire chapter of your book to prayer, and I would
have to assume it's precisely for this reason, because we
need some supernatural help to live this out, don't we?
S2 (37:26):
We do. We do. You know, I'm a pastor and
I get to preach. Uh, not every weekend, but many weekends.
And right now, our church. I'm preaching a series on
the Holy Spirit. And I'm learning so much, so much.
And I'm. I'm blessed by the thought that the presence
of God is inside of us, inside of me as
(37:46):
our helper, our comforter, comforter.
S4 (37:49):
And.
S2 (37:49):
Our advocate to to give us the strength to love
people who are hard to love. And you're right, sometimes
that person who is hard to love is your parent
or your child. Somebody under your roof, your sibling. Uh, boy,
I can't tell you how many times people tell me
that their sibling is the most difficult person in their life,
(38:12):
but God will help us here. And and I think,
I think pray for one another is the one another
command that kicks in when relationships are especially difficult? Maybe
you don't feel like you can talk to that person.
Maybe you don't feel like you can forgive that person.
Maybe you don't feel like you can, uh, teach or
(38:32):
admonish or even encourage that person. That's okay. Your first
step is to pray for them. Pray for them. And
you know, when you're praying for someone, you are imitating
Jesus who always intercedes for us. And so do not
over do not, do not, uh, underestimate the power of
(38:55):
praying for somebody. But and and also, when you pray
for somebody that increases your own happiness because you will
sense the Holy Spirit working in your heart to create
a deeper respect for that human being. And also you'll
give to that person. Uh, you'll give to God the
burden you carry for that person. You cannot carry burdens
(39:16):
for people, but you can carry burdens and give them
to God. And that's what we do when we pray.
And so I think pray for one another is an
absolutely essential part of, uh, learning how happiness happens.
S1 (39:32):
Max. So well said. And I will say this. Maybe
the opposite of the equal opposite of increasing your happiness
is decreasing your resentment, your frustrations in life. And I
will tell you that it is such a joy for
me when I'm praying for someone, even someone who has
gotten on my bad side. It does limit the amount
(39:54):
of resentment that I carry in my heart. Prayer is transformational, folks.
When we got to take a short break. But when
we come back, there's a challenge that Max wants to
give to you, and I want to give to you
as well. So again, don't change that dial. I hope
you're enjoying the interview. You'll enjoy the book much more.
Go to the website, equip radio.org. Order your copy today.
(40:16):
We'll ship it right out to you and I promise
you you will be blessed. Whatever you do, don't change
that dial. The best is yet to come. Next up
on unequipped with Chris Brooks.
S5 (40:33):
Sharing your faith can be challenging. How do you confidently
engage with questions about truth, technology, and culture while staying
grounded in Scripture? That's why Chris Brooks has chosen apologetics
for an ever changing culture as our gift. When you
support equip this month, it will help you provide thoughtful,
informed answers to the pressing questions of our time. Request
(40:57):
your copy today with a gift of any amount. Call
(888)Â 644-4144 or visit Equip radio.org.
S1 (41:10):
Welcome back to equip with Chris Brooks. Max Lucado has
been my guest and what a joy it is to
have Max. Okay, Max, let's talk about this challenge that
your book and your ministry is issuing to all of us.
What is it?
S4 (41:24):
It's a 40.
S2 (41:25):
Day challenge to make 100 people happy. And when I
say that, I'm challenging people to take the next 40
days and set out to make a difference in the
lives of 100 people by intentionally putting the one another
verses into play. So over the next 40 days, look
(41:46):
for opportunities to encourage someone to greet, someone to teach,
someone to admonish, forgive, and and, and and keep a journal.
And when you get home in the evening or or
sometime during the day, make a note of these interactions
that you had and what you learned from them, what
you sense, uh, God taught you through them. You'll be
(42:09):
so glad you did this. I did this, of course, myself,
and I found it to be very invigorating, but I
was surprised how challenging it was. Uh, it's not easy
to to to to live with an outward focus, but,
you know, it's a lot more fun than to live
with an inward focus.
S1 (42:27):
You know, I love this. You say in your book,
you can't control your genetics. You aren't in charge of
the weather, the traffic, who occupies any political office. But
you can always increase the number of smiles on the planet.
This is what we're after, isn't it?
S2 (42:44):
Absolutely. You are the light of the world. Jesus said.
You're the salt of society, Jesus said. And so we
already are, that we can have the capacity to bring
light into dark places, to change the flavor of every
place that we go. We can be light and salt
in any situation. So let's let's accept this, uh, special anointing,
(43:07):
special call, special privilege that we have and and carry
this out in the world. And and boy, I tell
you what, it's just so much fun.
S4 (43:17):
It's just it's so much fun.
S1 (43:18):
It absolutely is. And what I love about it is
that it takes us from being complainers to being difference makers.
I'll never forget Max traveling to northern Uganda. I was
in the Gulu region of Uganda, and the governor there
was taking my team and I on a tour. And
just a bright, very, um, intelligent leader have been, uh,
(43:41):
educated in the West and brought all of that back
to help to lead his home country. And he says
to me, while we're on this tour, Christy, you know
the difference between a complainer and a difference maker. And
I didn't know how to respond to that. I didn't
know if I was going to be the point of
the joke, if you know what I mean. And he
says to me, the difference between a complainer and a
(44:03):
difference maker is not in what they see. Both see
the brokenness of the world and the culture around them.
But a complainer says something needs to be done about this.
A difference maker says I need to do something about this. Yeah,
so similar in response, but such a huge gulf in
(44:25):
between those two statements, I think, Max, it's true that
we all can see the brokenness of the world around us.
I think all of us are saying, man, anger is
too high. Depression rates are running rampant. Suicide. Man seems
to be on the front page of so many of
our newspapers and headlines. We all know that the the
(44:46):
rage that seems to be a part of our culture
is so pervasive. Uh, the difference is not in what
we see, Max. I think the difference is in how
we respond to it and what it seems to me
that your book, your Challenge, this happiness challenge is encouraging
us to do is to move from saying something needs
(45:08):
to be done about this, to saying, I need to
do something about it. And it seems to me that
it starts with a prayer and a smile, that if
we can embrace those two things, we can begin to
see happiness happen all around us.
S2 (45:24):
And imagine if we all did that. Imagine if every
one of us decided, okay, over the next 40 days,
I'm going to make a hundred people's lives just a
little bit better. I'm going to put a smile on
a hundred faces. You know, um, I'm not saying that's
going to change the world, but then again, it could.
(45:45):
What we need is a happiness revolution. And it begins
when when people who have reason to be the happiest
on earth. And that's those of us who are known
and loved and bought by God. When when we live
out our our blessings and and and share them in
a joyful, willing, generous way with others, who knows what
(46:07):
might happen?
S1 (46:09):
Well, you've gotten us. You've gotten us going. And I
would just simply ask, as we close, if you could
join me in prayer as I pray for us to
embrace this happiness challenge, because I really do believe it's
the key to seeing change. Father, I pray right now
that you would help Christians, believers, maybe even those who
are listening right now. The Lord be the happiest in
(46:30):
our culture and society. You've given us your presence, the
gift of the Holy Spirit, the promise of the resurrection
of all believers, the Lord in Christ. And so, Lord,
I just pray that we would live it out. In
Jesus name, Amen and amen. Max, thanks for joining me today.
S4 (46:48):
Thank you.
S1 (46:49):
Folks, I want you to get a copy of the
happiness gift that Max has given us through the book,
How Happiness Happens. Do so at our website. Equip Radio.com.
And until we're together again, remember, as always, equip with
Chris Brooks is a production of Moody Radio, a ministry
of Moody Bible Institute.
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