February 11, 2025 • 31 mins
It's time for another CX Pulse Check. We're thrilled to have Dr. Amy Climer, a leading expert in creativity and innovation, sharing her insights. Together, we explore tech advancements that are transforming customer experiences and creating new challenges.
We look at how we can navigate the fine line between innovation and distraction as technology evolves, offering a fresh perspective on capturing consumer attention amidst fragmented media consumption. We also delve into the intricacies of consumer data privacy, considering AI as a tool for empowering consumers to manage their data. Tune in for a thought-provoking exploration of the trends redefining commerce and community today.
About Dr. Amy Climer:
Dr. Amy Climer is a speaker, trainer, and coach who teaches teams how to innovate on demand. She developed the Deliberate Creative™ Team Scale to help teams understand how to increase their creativity. She hosts The Deliberate Creative™ podcast and she is the designer of Climer Cards, a creativity and teambuilding tool. Amy has a Ph.D. in Leadership and Change.
Check out Amy's new book, Deliberate Creative Teams, at https://climerconsulting.com/book/.
Follow Amy on...
- Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/climerconsulting
- LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amyclimer/
- X/Twitter: https://twitter.com/amyclimer
- Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/amyclimer/
Articles Mentioned:
Turning Screen Time Into Seamless, Personalized Shopping: The Future of in-Car Commerce (PYMNTS) -- https://www.pymnts.com/connectedeconomy/2025/turning-screen-time-into-seamless-personalized-shopping-the-future-of-in-car-commerce/
Your Next Apartment Rental May Also Be a Marketing Campaign (The Wall Street Journal) -- https://www.wsj.com/articles/your-next-apartment-rental-may-also-be-a-marketing-campaign-cdfa339f
Consumer Loyalty 2025: Why Data Transparency Matters More Than Discounts (Ad Age) -- https://adage.com/article/opinion/consumer-loyalty-2025-why-data-transparency-matters-more-discounts/2599816
Resources Mentioned:
Take the CXI® Compass assessment -- CXICompass.com
Experience Investigators Website -- experienceinvestigators.com
Want to ask a question? Visit askjeannie.vip to leave Jeannie a voicemail! (And don't forget to follow Jeannie on LinkedIn! www.linkedin.com/in/jeanniewalters/)
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jeannie Walters (00:09):
Hi everyone, I'm Jeannie Walters and this is
the Experience Action Podcastand it's one of my favorite
episodes our monthly CX PulseCheck.
This is where we look at what'shappening in the world around
customer experiences maybe somethings you've heard about, maybe
some things you haven't anddiscuss what's, what can we
learn from it?
What do we want to take awayfrom these real life examples?
(00:32):
As always, I have a veryspecial co-host here.
I am delighted to invite myfriend, Dr.
Amy Climer to the stage here.
Hi Amy!
Amy Climer (00:42):
Hi Jeannie, how are you?
Jeannie Walters (00:44):
I'm great, I'm so thrilled you're here, and Amy
and I got to know each other atthe CSP Summit, which is the
Certified Speaking Professionaldesignation we both have, and
Amy is doing amazing thingsaround creativity and teamwork
and all sorts of things.
So, Amy, I would love for youto not only tell them about
yourselves, but also about yourupcoming book.
Amy Climer (01:07):
Okay, great.
Thanks, Jeannie, for having mehere.
So most of what I do is I'm aninnovation consultant or I
advise companies on how to bemore innovative and I teach
their teams the elements theyneed to be creative together and
help them figure out hey,what's next?
What's next in our work.
And most of what I do, or Ishouldn't say most, some of what
(01:30):
I do is based on my PhDresearch and it culminated in
this brand new book that's justout.
Jeannie Walters (01:36):
So pretty!
Amy Climer (01:36):
Thank you, I'm so excited.
Deliberate Creative Teams (01:38):
How to Lead for Innovative Results,
and it's for leaders who wanttheir teams to be more
innovative, but they don't quiteknow where to start.
And so I teach a system,because innovation is a system,
it's not just like this one-offthing you're going to do here
and there.
So I get into all the detailsin the book and I'm really
excited about it.
Jeannie Walters (01:58):
Well, we're so thrilled you're here because,
you know, one of the pieces ofour framework around customer
experience is experientialinnovation, because if you're
learning all this about yourcustomers and you're applying
all the best practices but younever actually take that to
innovate around what they'retelling you or what you think
they might need in the future,then what are we doing.
Right?
(02:18):
Like that has to be part of it.
So I'm so excited I am.
I was lucky enough to get alittle early copy of the book,
and I am exploring it right nowand I'm very excited about it.
So I can't wait for others toreally understand what it is you
bring to the table and learnfrom this about exactly what you
said.
It's a system, it's a way toapproach innovation that will
(02:40):
help you really get the resultsthat you want.
So, because of that, I had somefun picking topics for us,
because I thought about, like,what is innovation really?
It's trying things, it'sgetting out there, it's
exploring what could be next, orwhat should be next, even, and
so I found a few headlines thatI thought would be fun to
explore.
We both had a chance to look atthese articles, and so this
(03:04):
first one is from I always callit payments, but it's payments
without the vowels, it's P-Y-M-Eor sorry, p-y-m-n-t-s dot com,
and this headline says turningscreen time into seamless,
personalized shopping, thefuture of in-car commerce.
And that stuck out to me for acouple of reasons.
(03:26):
One is when was the last timeyou were driving and were
involved with commerce like inthe moment, right?
Like, are we doing that?
Maybe we are, and we shouldn'tbe, but this really is thinking
about the screens that a lot ofcars have now the way AI is
introduced, and so the concepthere wasn't really about what we
(03:47):
might be familiar with with,like, if you're using a Google
Maps, sometimes it says, hey,here's a gas station nearby, but
this is more about integratingthat with the actual car
electronics and way finding andall that, where it says, oh,
you're a little low on gas rightnow, so it knows the
information about you and yourcar and it says, if you want to,
(04:10):
there's this.
You know you're in this trafficjam.
Why don't you just pull off,have a cup of coffee while you
gas up your car, or charge upyour car, as the case may be?
And so I was kind of strugglingwith this a little bit, because
it feels like we're always sodistracted anyway, and maybe
when we're driving we shouldn'tbe.
(04:30):
But, Amy, I'm really curiouswhat you think about this.
Amy Climer (04:34):
My first thought was no.
And then I got to the bottom ofthe article and it says it's
already here.
Yeah, every manufacturer exceptTesla has it embedded.
And then Tesla, they have theirown version.
So same difference, that'sright.
Yeah, I feel like you knowthere are a lot of people that I
don't drive a whole lot becauseI work from home, and so I mean
(04:57):
I might, in some weeks might,drive 10 miles at most.
Jeannie Walters (05:01):
Yeah.
Amy Climer (05:01):
But you know a lot of people.
They really value that time assort of quiet time space to be
away from the distractions youknow, maybe listen to some music
.
So I just thought, oh my gosh,just what we need is another
distraction.
So, yeah, I definitely am a bitconcerned about it.
Jeannie Walters (05:29):
Well, and I think one of the things that if
we flip the conversation about,why would they even try this?
You know it's so hard to getpeople's attention today.
It's so hard to break throughthe whole idea of.
You know you used to be able toguarantee almost that most of
the country would sit down andwatch 60 Minutes, right, like
that was a guarantee, so youcould advertise there and get a
message out.
Now none of us watch live TVanymore.
We are finding our media basedon so many different things that
(05:54):
now it's so segmented.
I just watched the Grammys, youknow, and I was like so excited
if I actually recognized one ofthe musicians, because some of
them I was like wait what?
How far behind am I?
Amy Climer (06:07):
Exactly.
Jeannie Walters (06:08):
But we all have our little pockets, and so I
thought this was interestingbecause, to your point, a lot of
people drive a lot and theyspend a lot of time in their
cars.
51% of consumers are expressinginterest in AI features.
So they're saying that, but Iwonder if they really know what
that means and what that meansfor access to their information
(06:30):
and their data.
So my hope here because Iunderstand the innovation
argument here but my hope isthat they are very transparent
and um able to really givepeople the control so that
somebody like you who might notwant these distractions, you can
just turn that off.
(06:51):
You can say, don't bother mewith this.
Somebody else who drives a lotmight say, yeah, let me know the
coolest new spot in town.
Right, that I can, that's on myway to work or on my way home.
So I think that there are lotsof ways to personalize this.
They didn't really get intothat too much in this article,
so I'm curious.
I hope that's kind of the next,the next wave here.
Amy Climer (07:14):
Yeah, I can see where you know, maybe if you're
traveling and you're in a newplace that you've never been and
you might turn on like, hey,give me recommendations for cool
cafes or something, and it wasable to learn your type of
preferences, then that could bereally helpful.
I think the interesting thingabout this and I know with your
background, Jeannie, andconsumer experience and
(07:35):
marketing, this is a constanttug is this feels like something
that's very good for thecompany that's advertising, but
not necessarily very good forthe consumer.
It makes me think of, like thosegas station pumps, there's the
TV thing.
Yeah, and I'm just like, oh mygosh, seriously, we do not need
(07:55):
to constantly be bombarded, andif there's a mute button on it I
will push it or just try towalk away.
But I wonder, how can thecompanies who are using this,
how can they do it in a waythat's actually helpful for the
driver?
And to me it almost gets intolike a little bit of an ethical
(08:16):
issue of you know, how much areyou going to be bombarding
people, and is it just aboutgetting them to buy, or is it
about really nurturing arelationship with them?
Jeannie Walters (08:26):
It's a great question, and I think the other
thing that we talk about a lothere is, you know, people want
choices, they want options,people have different
preferences and I kind ofbristle when I hear terms like
digital customer.
I'm like no, no, no, when nobodyjust raises their hand and says
, oh, always put me in thischannel, no matter what.
Right, because it's contextualas well, it's kind of in the
(08:48):
moment, and I would love to seejust more visible and easy
control over that.
Because I think about, you know, there is lots of data out
there that says it's not justthe screen that can be
distracting, even if you're onhands-free a phone call that can
(09:11):
be distracting to your driving.
And so you think about maybeolder people who, um, are
fiddling with technology thatmaybe they're not as familiar
with.
Right, like what, what can wedo to make this so easy and
straightforward that maybebefore you, before you take the
drive, it says what would youlike on this drive?
Because the whole idea that weall kind of have to decide our
fate in a data permission form,it's different for every person
(09:39):
and maybe every drive, right?
So I think that's where I wouldlike to see this go.
Amy Climer (09:45):
I agree with you.
I think it would be reallyimportant for the consumer to
have a lot of control.
I mean, even to the point thatmaybe every time they get in the
car they have to answer yes inorder to see it so kind of
opting in as opposed to optingout.
But I also was thinking, goingback to what is valuable for the
driver, the consumer.
I wonder, you know, instead ofsaying like hey, pull over to
(10:08):
this gas station and get youryou know, the new Snickers
flavor or whatever, it's, likewhat if it's?
Hey, there's a traffic jamcoming up that you know it might
be a little bit stressful,Would you like me to play some
calming music?
Jeannie Walters (10:21):
I love that.
Amy Climer (10:22):
Or hey, you're in the midst of a traffic jam, it's
going to be a while.
Would you like me to to leadyou through a breathing exercise
?
Or, even better, you're like,hey, we notice your heart rate's
going up.
I guess eventually it could dothat.
Jeannie Walters (10:38):
Yeah, connected to your, to your health watch,
and yeah, exactly, I love thatidea.
Amy Climer (10:44):
I think there's some ways to use this technology
that's like truly beneficial.
Yes, not just like oh cool, Igot a new type of coffee or new
Snickers bar, you know whateverit is.
Yeah, so that would be reallyinteresting to see is who's
going to get really creative.
Jeannie Walters (10:59):
I love that.
Amy Climer (11:01):
Can I add one more thing?
So in my book I talk about thedefinition of creativity,
because we use this word a lot,and so the definition that I use
is that creativity is noveltythat is valuable, and I would
definitely say this counts fornovel.
Right?
Like this is something that wereally maybe that's happening a
little bit, but not much.
(11:21):
It's very different, it's new,it's unique, that's really cool.
And then my question is is itvaluable and that's of course
that's also in the eye of thebeholder, right.
Like it might be reallyvaluable to the company, but not
so much to the consumer, and soI would just encourage
companies to think about that ishow can they make it truly
valuable?
Jeannie Walters (11:41):
I love that word valuable too, because one
of the things we're seeing isthat customers are more, they're
savvier now.
They're savvier about how theirinformation is being used.
They're savvier about the factthat they do have maybe more of
a voice, more control, than theyused to in the past and they're
using that to say if you don'talign with my values, then I'm
(12:03):
either, I'm not going to shopwith you, I'm going to tell
people not to shop with you, I'mgoing to.
I mean, we're seeing this inreal time right now, with some
decisions being made aroundwhich retailers to go to.
People are selling certaintypes of cars right now based on
alignment of values.
So, one thing that comes upagain and again right now is
(12:23):
sustainability and how importantthat is to people and how
they're really looking for waysto live a more sustainable
lifestyle.
This isn't, you know, everybody, but there are.
There's a segment, and you know, I was thinking wouldn't it be
cool if you could kind of checka box that says sustainable and
it says, well, over here is aindependent used bookstore or a
(12:45):
library or you know anindependent coffee house.
Like you could actually segmenteven more so that the choices
that are presented are notnecessarily just the kind of
ordinary but the ones that alignwith your values.
So there, I agree, there's lotsof ways that I think you and I
are being creative right now.
We are, we're getting lots ofideas.
(13:09):
I know, right, like just okay,so somebody go figure all that
out so that Amy and I can take adrive and find all the cool
places.
So, but you know this, this kindof idea that it's so hard to
break through seems to be atheme in some of the things that
I picked, because this nextheadline, instead of about
(13:29):
driving, it's literally aboutwhere we live.
And this is from the WallStreet Journal and the headline
is your next apartment rentalmay also be a marketing campaign
.
And I'm going to read the subheadline here too.
It says branded residencies areexpanding from multi-million
dollar penthouses to affordablerentals, like New Jersey's Fiat
(13:51):
House.
Now, you probably know thatFiat is not a housing
development, it's a car brand,and they are trying to find ways
to really put the brand infront of people.
And the story of this was reallythe juxtaposition between these
branded residents exist already, but they're very high-end.
(14:14):
They're, you know, um brandslike I think there was, uh,
Aston Martin and some reallyhigh-end uh yeah, I'm looking
right now Bulgari, Armani, thosetypes of things, and so they
were multimillion dollar homesthat you bought into.
Now these branded residenciesare saying, well, no, you can
(14:39):
rent an apartment here, and theonly thing you really give up is
that it has some sprinkles ofFiat branding.
Like they mentioned, some ofthe planters are shaped like
their cars, which I thought waspretty cute.
But the advantage for Fiat isthat they put their brand on the
building and so all the peopledriving by and everything, they
get that level of exposure allthe time.
(15:00):
And then the renters kind ofmove in and out and maybe it
doesn't mean anything to them,it's just part of the building.
But I think that this speaks tothe idea that brands used to
have this way of connecting topeople.
That was very standardized.
I mean, the joke that peopleused to throw around was if your
(15:22):
mom used Tide, you used Tide,right, they didn't even have to
do anything.
That was just what happened.
And now people are morediscerning, they are more likely
to switch brands, all of thesethings.
So it's about again gettingthat brand out there in just
really creative ways.
So I'm curious what did youthink of this as far as
innovation and creativity andall the things that we love
(15:44):
talking about?
Amy Climer (15:45):
I mean, I would say again, you know, it does check
that definition.
This definitely, as far ascreativity goes, it's novelty,
it's novel.
And then the question is itvaluable?
And then I think again is, towho, to whom?
And my first thought whenreading the article was like, oh
gosh, I hope I never have tolive in a place like this.
And then I started thinking you, you know what, what, if, like,
(16:09):
if the marketers and thecreative teams that are working
on this, if they're asking thepeople who live there like, hey,
what do you need in your life,what, what's missing, not like,
hey, what do you need in thelobby?
Per se, but just, you know,what do you need?
And maybe focusing more on thatexperience and facilitating
experience for the people thatlive in the building.
(16:30):
Um, particularly I was thinkingabout, you know, I'm sure you've
heard Jeannie, that we'rehaving this like loneliness
epidemic in the country, and youknow, I mean I don't live, I
live in a house, I don't live inan apartment complex, but like,
I think there's it's verycommon that you probably just
see people every day and youdon't even know their names and
(16:52):
that just kind of increases that, um, that distance that we have
.
And I just recently had thisinteresting experience.
I live in Asheville, NorthCarolina, and a few months ago
Hurricane Helene hit and for 48hours, nobody in the city had
electricity, wifi, cell service,no way to communicate with
(17:14):
anyone.
And what happened is peoplestarted going to each other's
houses and knocking on the doorsand I know my neighbors I don't
know all of them, but and yeah,people started coming over and
when they came over, I was likeso excited to see them, whereas,
you know, the day before, whenI had cell service, I would be
like who is at my front door?
(17:35):
You know, I've been allannoying, right, but it made me
think about oh right, this iswhat we used to do.
Jeannie Walters (17:42):
That's right.
Amy Climer (17:43):
I think those connections were in some ways
easier, or maybe I should justsay they were different.
And so, yeah, I was thinkinglike how could companies address
some big issues and also getcreative in their marketing and
potential seller products?
Jeannie Walters (17:59):
Well, that's a really interesting angle because
I think that's something thatresidential properties have
really been trying to nurture.
But it's challenging, right?
And the prior Surgeon Generalwho really talked about
loneliness as an epidemic, hesaid something in an interview
that just totally stuck with mebecause he said you know, if you
(18:20):
go to a college dining hall, itused to be the loudest place on
campus because everybody wastalking.
He said now it's quiet becausethey're just sitting on their
phones and they're eating ontheir own.
And I think that there is thiswhole shift of like how we
interact with each other.
And we had a client years andyears ago who had realized like
(18:43):
people wanted they actuallywanted less living space in
their apartments because theydidn't have the stuff anymore.
Like people don't have as manybooks, they didn't have their
big album collections, you know,like things like that that all
got smaller because ofelectronics.
They didn't need that, but whatthey wanted was a place in the
lobby to work on their laptop.
(19:05):
What they wanted was someplacewhere they could be surrounded
by people, even if they're notreally socializing, just to have
that place.
So they invested more in likethe common spaces and had
smaller apartments, so they gotmore people in the building, but
they invested more in reallyhow do we make the common spaces
?
And they started doingbarbecues and different things
(19:25):
to really get people to get toknow each other.
Because I agree that this issomething that I think a lot of
people are struggling with andorganizations are struggling
with even how to nurture it.
Because one of the things weran into with that client was
they said well, we have peopleat the front desk.
We asked them to host abarbecue and they're like I'm
not talking to people, right,like I don't want to talk to
anybody.
Amy Climer (19:46):
Yeah, exactly.
Jeannie Walters (19:52):
So, but people, right, like, I don't want to
talk to anybody, yeah, exactlyso.
But this idea of like, could werally around a brand like there
are people who really identifywith different brands like so
could this be a way to make thatconnection?
Absolutely.
Could you do more with that andhave people have more of an
experience instead of just atransaction with the brand and
build that relationship seemsseems like it should work right?
Um, that's hard to do when,because I bet the people who
(20:15):
spend 22 million dollars on apenthouse they might not know
their neighbors.
Amy Climer (20:20):
Right, yeah, but people who rent, sure yeah, and
that's interesting too, just,you know, in the, in those two
groups of people would havedifferent desires and needs, and
I think that's part of thehopefully, the responsibility
that those who are doing themarketing would think about,
like, okay, how do I segment abit?
(20:40):
You know, maybe you have somevarious events and one's kind of
targeted to this group and theother to that group, even though
maybe they're both open to bothgroups.
And yeah, I think there'sthere's countless opportunities
and possibilities.
Jeannie Walters (20:54):
Absolutely, Absolutely.
So really interesting, and Ithink it's going to be something
we're going to see more andmore and more of.
But everything, everything kindof old is new again, right,
Like when it comes to how we,how we build communities, how we
do all of that, because we'rerealizing like hey, when we did
knock on our neighbor's doors,that was kind of a nice
(21:15):
experience, so we're you know,maybe some of that we'll be
coming back to.
But and I'm also glad that youare out of that period I know
you all are still dealing with alot of the aftermath of that
and that was quite harrowing, soI'm glad that you and your
neighbors are doing okay.
Amy Climer (21:31):
We're doing much better.
Yes.
Jeannie Walters (21:33):
Good, good, so okay.
So one last one.
We don't have to talk too longabout this, but I felt like this
kind of went along with whatwe're talking about, where we
talk about personalizing and AIthat really relies on people's
data and their personal data,like it's saying, yes, you can
look at every purchase I've evermade and, yes, you can see my
(21:53):
zip code and my, you know mysalary, and like all of that.
And this is from Ad Age, andthis headline is Consumer
Loyalty in 2025, why datatransparency matters more than
discounts, and the subhead hereis marketers can no longer rely
on deals to reel in first timecustomers, and this was
(22:18):
compelling to me, because thisis something that we've been
talking about a lot with our ourclients is customers are
getting savvier, they understandhow their data is used, they
have questions about it and theyare opting out more than they
used to.
So how do we, how do we givethem what they want through that
transparency, which is morepersonalization and
(22:40):
understanding, and, at the sametime, respect what they want as
far as privacy and and justprotection as well, and so I you
know, this is something that Ithink a lot of brands are
dealing with, and again it comesback to being visible, right
like and really transparentabout this is how we're using it
.
So what are your thoughts onthis?
Amy Climer (23:04):
Yeah, it seems.
I mean, I, I definitely I getthe struggle right, like I.
And I'm thinking, you know,from that consumer angle I have,
this sounds ridiculous, butit's true that I have not bought
things from a company just likeanything, because I didn't want
to be added to their email listand I didn't want to deal with
(23:25):
unsubscribing and dah, dah, dah,and I was just like I'm just
not going to buy that, and youknow, these are mostly smaller
things that I'm thinking of.
But and so I?
But then I was thinking, well,how could this be a positive
again for that consumer?
So how could the company shiftthis?
And I think that teams andcompanies are getting more
(23:47):
transparent about the data.
But I know, certainly when Isee, like oh, here's how we use
your data, like I don't reallyknow what that fully means,
right.
I don't know what they're trulydoing with it.
Like, oh, they're analyzing it.
What might be cool is ifthey'll say, well, like, let us
have access to your data and wewill give you your analysis back
, and to say, hey, here's whatwe discovered about you and you
(24:12):
know, like, we'll continue touse this information to
customize experiences orcustomize our response to you.
But at the same time, I'mlearning about myself, which
could be, kind of interesting,so I don't know if that's how
that would work.
Jeannie Walters (24:27):
Well, it's interesting because one of the
things that, again, we've beentalking about this for years is
this idea that you know every,every retailer, every person,
every interaction that you have.
There should be kind of an easyto use dashboard, in my opinion
, where you say, yes, you canhave this data.
No, not that one, this andevery single access point that
(24:50):
they want.
They explain why.
You know, this will help uspredict when you need your next
thing.
This will help us let you knowto have maintenance on your car.
This you know, whatever it is,because some of those things
we've really grown accustomed toand appreciate, right, we like
when they're proactive, aboutthose reminders, when we don't
wait until something breaks,when you know, oh my gosh, we're
(25:12):
running out of our favoritemoisturizer and it appears on
our doorstep, right, likeamazing.
So some of those things we wantto opt in and say, yes, please
understand, when do I usuallyrun out of this moisturizer?
Send it to me, right, whatever.
So I think that the the examplethat you used it's it's very um
(25:32):
, bogged down in like languagewe don't understand, or things
that, like the normal averageshopper shouldn't have to have a
degree in cyber security tounderstand how their data is
used, and yet it can feel likethat sometimes and then, once
you agree, it's hard to figureout.
Okay, wait, how do I check whatthey're using?
(25:53):
How do I make changes?
All of that.
The other thing that thisarticle didn't talk about, but
something I've been watching, isI were just talking about AI on
the corporate side.
I think customers are going tostart using AI in really
creative ways, like tell me ifthis fits within my warranty and
tell me what I should ask forright.
(26:15):
Like tell me, based on this,how is my data being used and
should I be concerned, and howdo I do this?
Now, of course, that opens up awhole other thing about AI, but
I think that the savvier thatcustomers get, the more prepared
every organization has to be toanswer those tough questions of
(26:36):
how are we using your data?
Yes, you absolutely havecontrol, and here's exactly how
and here's what it's doing foryou and if we can answer those
things in a very transparent way.
I think that's what will buildtrust and loyalty.
But, man, we've got a long wayto go.
We've just got a long way to go, and I think Apple is the one
(26:57):
who kind of really is leadingthis conversation with the way
that they give people controlover do you want this app to
track?
And a lot of people are optingout and that's producing its own
set of challenges for all thesebrands.
But we live in interestingtimes.
Amy Climer (27:13):
We really do.
We really do.
I feel like just your commentabout AI makes me think about
how it's so new, at least on theconsumer side, and I mean, what
a couple of years old.
I don't remember when ChatGPTcame out.
Jeannie Walters (27:25):
I think it was November 22 or 23.
Amy Climer (27:28):
Yeah, yeah, I learned about it initially at a
National Speakers Associationmeeting.
There you go, a CSP event, yeah, two years ago I think.
And I think what I'm noticingin myself is that my biggest
barrier in using AI is just tothink about how to use it.
It's so easy to use, it's justa matter of like, what questions
(27:50):
to ask.
And so just now I'm like, oh,this would be great.
I could just, you know, cut andpaste the disclosure and prop
it in there, you know, pop it inthere and say, hey, what do you
think?
Could I?
How are they using my data?
And I think, as more peopletalk about how they're using
ChatGPT or other tools, then,yes, we're going to get a lot
savvier.
And and I think we I don't knowcause I do also feel like
(28:15):
there's like this generationdifference, that where, like our
generation, uh, are you kind ofgen X?
Jeannie Walters (28:22):
Gen X yeah, proud gen X.
Amy Climer (28:25):
Yeah that we're not used to this, like we didn't
grow up with this level of dataanalysis.
Jeannie Walters (28:32):
Right.
Amy Climer (28:32):
Whereas Gen Z, I don't really think as much about
it.
And so it'll be interesting tosee how this changes and how
some brands maybe have an easiergo of it if they're marketing
towards younger groups.
I don't know.
I don't know enough about it,but it will be interesting to
see how that plays out.
Jeannie Walters (28:50):
Well, and Gen Z has figured out the workarounds
too, like a lot of them haveprivate accounts that they you
know, that they, their parentsdon't know about, or the you
know all these.
So I think that that will be.
The next thing, too, is thatpeople might give exactly the
data that they think will helpthem, instead of the true data
about their themselves and theirbehavior.
(29:10):
So I think we're at the tip ofthe iceberg with all of this,
but it's super fascinating, andI think it all comes down to
understanding who do you want tobe for your customers and what
is important to them, andconstantly working on that
alignment, because expectationschange, the world changes, the
tools change really fast rightnow, and so that's why I don't
(29:34):
know I think creative innovationis so important.
Amy Climer (29:39):
I agree, I'm completely biased though.
Jeannie Walters (29:43):
Amy, remind everybody about your book and
where they can find you, becauseyou've got a lot of great stuff
.
Amy Climer (29:48):
Thanks, yeah, so this is my new book.
Just came out early 2025 hereDeliberate Creative Teams: How
to Lead for Innovative Results,and it's for leaders who want
their teams to be moreinnovative but maybe don't know
where to start and I go into asystem of innovation that's
pretty easy, pretty simple toimplement.
You can find the book on Amazon, Barnes and Noble anywhere
(30:10):
books are sold, and you can findme at climerconsultingcom, and
Climer is spelled C-L-I-M-E-RClimer Consulting, and I'm also
on LinkedIn and all those othersocial media apps.
Jeannie Walters (30:25):
Well, I'm so thrilled that you were able to
join me, especially the at thisbusy time with your book launch,
but I think it's a.
It's a great way to think aboutthings and I'm really excited
for that process to get out tothe world so that people can
really follow this system andinnovate even faster and better
than before.
So thank you so much for beinghere, Amy.
Amy Climer (30:45):
Thank you and thank you, Jeannie.
Jeannie Walters (30:48):
And we'll make sure that all of those links are
in the show notes as well.
And thank you, listeners andviewers, for being here with us
at the Experience Action Podcast.
If you are wondering about yourown level of experiential
innovation, go ahead and checkout cxicompasscom.
That's our assessment thathelps you understand where to
(31:10):
prioritize within your owncustomer experience journey for
your organization.
So check that out atcxicompasscom and don't forget
every other episode I amanswering your questions.
You can leave me a voicemail ataskjeannievip.
Thank you so much for beinghere, thank you to our special
co-host, and I will talk to yousoon.
Hi everyone, I'm Jeannie Walters and this is
the Experience Action Podcastand it's one of my favorite
episodes our monthly CX PulseCheck.
This is where we look at what'shappening in the world around
customer experiences maybe somethings you've heard about, maybe
some things you haven't anddiscuss what's, what can we
learn from it?
What do we want to take awayfrom these real life examples?
(00:32):
As always, I have a veryspecial co-host here.
I am delighted to invite myfriend, Dr.
Amy Climer to the stage here.
Hi Amy!
Amy Climer (00:42):
Hi Jeannie, how are you?
Jeannie Walters (00:44):
I'm great, I'm so thrilled you're here, and Amy
and I got to know each other atthe CSP Summit, which is the
Certified Speaking Professionaldesignation we both have, and
Amy is doing amazing thingsaround creativity and teamwork
and all sorts of things.
So, Amy, I would love for youto not only tell them about
yourselves, but also about yourupcoming book.
Amy Climer (01:07):
Okay, great.
Thanks, Jeannie, for having mehere.
So most of what I do is I'm aninnovation consultant or I
advise companies on how to bemore innovative and I teach
their teams the elements theyneed to be creative together and
help them figure out hey,what's next?
What's next in our work.
And most of what I do, or Ishouldn't say most, some of what
(01:30):
I do is based on my PhDresearch and it culminated in
this brand new book that's justout.
Jeannie Walters (01:36):
So pretty!
Amy Climer (01:36):
Thank you, I'm so excited.
Deliberate Creative Teams (01:38):
How to Lead for Innovative Results,
and it's for leaders who wanttheir teams to be more
innovative, but they don't quiteknow where to start.
And so I teach a system,because innovation is a system,
it's not just like this one-offthing you're going to do here
and there.
So I get into all the detailsin the book and I'm really
excited about it.
Jeannie Walters (01:58):
Well, we're so thrilled you're here because,
you know, one of the pieces ofour framework around customer
experience is experientialinnovation, because if you're
learning all this about yourcustomers and you're applying
all the best practices but younever actually take that to
innovate around what they'retelling you or what you think
they might need in the future,then what are we doing.
Right?
(02:18):
Like that has to be part of it.
So I'm so excited I am.
I was lucky enough to get alittle early copy of the book,
and I am exploring it right nowand I'm very excited about it.
So I can't wait for others toreally understand what it is you
bring to the table and learnfrom this about exactly what you
said.
It's a system, it's a way toapproach innovation that will
(02:40):
help you really get the resultsthat you want.
So, because of that, I had somefun picking topics for us,
because I thought about, like,what is innovation really?
It's trying things, it'sgetting out there, it's
exploring what could be next, orwhat should be next, even, and
so I found a few headlines thatI thought would be fun to
explore.
We both had a chance to look atthese articles, and so this
(03:04):
first one is from I always callit payments, but it's payments
without the vowels, it's P-Y-M-Eor sorry, p-y-m-n-t-s dot com,
and this headline says turningscreen time into seamless,
personalized shopping, thefuture of in-car commerce.
And that stuck out to me for acouple of reasons.
(03:26):
One is when was the last timeyou were driving and were
involved with commerce like inthe moment, right?
Like, are we doing that?
Maybe we are, and we shouldn'tbe, but this really is thinking
about the screens that a lot ofcars have now the way AI is
introduced, and so the concepthere wasn't really about what we
(03:47):
might be familiar with with,like, if you're using a Google
Maps, sometimes it says, hey,here's a gas station nearby, but
this is more about integratingthat with the actual car
electronics and way finding andall that, where it says, oh,
you're a little low on gas rightnow, so it knows the
information about you and yourcar and it says, if you want to,
(04:10):
there's this.
You know you're in this trafficjam.
Why don't you just pull off,have a cup of coffee while you
gas up your car, or charge upyour car, as the case may be?
And so I was kind of strugglingwith this a little bit, because
it feels like we're always sodistracted anyway, and maybe
when we're driving we shouldn'tbe.
(04:30):
But, Amy, I'm really curiouswhat you think about this.
Amy Climer (04:34):
My first thought was no.
And then I got to the bottom ofthe article and it says it's
already here.
Yeah, every manufacturer exceptTesla has it embedded.
And then Tesla, they have theirown version.
So same difference, that'sright.
Yeah, I feel like you knowthere are a lot of people that I
don't drive a whole lot becauseI work from home, and so I mean
(04:57):
I might, in some weeks might,drive 10 miles at most.
Jeannie Walters (05:01):
Yeah.
Amy Climer (05:01):
But you know a lot of people.
They really value that time assort of quiet time space to be
away from the distractions youknow, maybe listen to some music
.
So I just thought, oh my gosh,just what we need is another
distraction.
So, yeah, I definitely am a bitconcerned about it.
Jeannie Walters (05:29):
Well, and I think one of the things that if
we flip the conversation about,why would they even try this?
You know it's so hard to getpeople's attention today.
It's so hard to break throughthe whole idea of.
You know you used to be able toguarantee almost that most of
the country would sit down andwatch 60 Minutes, right, like
that was a guarantee, so youcould advertise there and get a
message out.
Now none of us watch live TVanymore.
We are finding our media basedon so many different things that
(05:54):
now it's so segmented.
I just watched the Grammys, youknow, and I was like so excited
if I actually recognized one ofthe musicians, because some of
them I was like wait what?
How far behind am I?
Amy Climer (06:07):
Exactly.
Jeannie Walters (06:08):
But we all have our little pockets, and so I
thought this was interestingbecause, to your point, a lot of
people drive a lot and theyspend a lot of time in their
cars.
51% of consumers are expressinginterest in AI features.
So they're saying that, but Iwonder if they really know what
that means and what that meansfor access to their information
(06:30):
and their data.
So my hope here because Iunderstand the innovation
argument here but my hope isthat they are very transparent
and um able to really givepeople the control so that
somebody like you who might notwant these distractions, you can
just turn that off.
(06:51):
You can say, don't bother mewith this.
Somebody else who drives a lotmight say, yeah, let me know the
coolest new spot in town.
Right, that I can, that's on myway to work or on my way home.
So I think that there are lotsof ways to personalize this.
They didn't really get intothat too much in this article,
so I'm curious.
I hope that's kind of the next,the next wave here.
Amy Climer (07:14):
Yeah, I can see where you know, maybe if you're
traveling and you're in a newplace that you've never been and
you might turn on like, hey,give me recommendations for cool
cafes or something, and it wasable to learn your type of
preferences, then that could bereally helpful.
I think the interesting thingabout this and I know with your
background, Jeannie, andconsumer experience and
(07:35):
marketing, this is a constanttug is this feels like something
that's very good for thecompany that's advertising, but
not necessarily very good forthe consumer.
It makes me think of, like thosegas station pumps, there's the
TV thing.
Yeah, and I'm just like, oh mygosh, seriously, we do not need
(07:55):
to constantly be bombarded, andif there's a mute button on it I
will push it or just try towalk away.
But I wonder, how can thecompanies who are using this,
how can they do it in a waythat's actually helpful for the
driver?
And to me it almost gets intolike a little bit of an ethical
(08:16):
issue of you know, how much areyou going to be bombarding
people, and is it just aboutgetting them to buy, or is it
about really nurturing arelationship with them?
Jeannie Walters (08:26):
It's a great question, and I think the other
thing that we talk about a lothere is, you know, people want
choices, they want options,people have different
preferences and I kind ofbristle when I hear terms like
digital customer.
I'm like no, no, no, when nobodyjust raises their hand and says
, oh, always put me in thischannel, no matter what.
Right, because it's contextualas well, it's kind of in the
(08:48):
moment, and I would love to seejust more visible and easy
control over that.
Because I think about, you know, there is lots of data out
there that says it's not justthe screen that can be
distracting, even if you're onhands-free a phone call that can
(09:11):
be distracting to your driving.
And so you think about maybeolder people who, um, are
fiddling with technology thatmaybe they're not as familiar
with.
Right, like what, what can wedo to make this so easy and
straightforward that maybebefore you, before you take the
drive, it says what would youlike on this drive?
Because the whole idea that weall kind of have to decide our
fate in a data permission form,it's different for every person
(09:39):
and maybe every drive, right?
So I think that's where I wouldlike to see this go.
Amy Climer (09:45):
I agree with you.
I think it would be reallyimportant for the consumer to
have a lot of control.
I mean, even to the point thatmaybe every time they get in the
car they have to answer yes inorder to see it so kind of
opting in as opposed to optingout.
But I also was thinking, goingback to what is valuable for the
driver, the consumer.
I wonder, you know, instead ofsaying like hey, pull over to
(10:08):
this gas station and get youryou know, the new Snickers
flavor or whatever, it's, likewhat if it's?
Hey, there's a traffic jamcoming up that you know it might
be a little bit stressful,Would you like me to play some
calming music?
Jeannie Walters (10:21):
I love that.
Amy Climer (10:22):
Or hey, you're in the midst of a traffic jam, it's
going to be a while.
Would you like me to to leadyou through a breathing exercise
?
Or, even better, you're like,hey, we notice your heart rate's
going up.
I guess eventually it could dothat.
Jeannie Walters (10:38):
Yeah, connected to your, to your health watch,
and yeah, exactly, I love thatidea.
Amy Climer (10:44):
I think there's some ways to use this technology
that's like truly beneficial.
Yes, not just like oh cool, Igot a new type of coffee or new
Snickers bar, you know whateverit is.
Yeah, so that would be reallyinteresting to see is who's
going to get really creative.
Jeannie Walters (10:59):
I love that.
Amy Climer (11:01):
Can I add one more thing?
So in my book I talk about thedefinition of creativity,
because we use this word a lot,and so the definition that I use
is that creativity is noveltythat is valuable, and I would
definitely say this counts fornovel.
Right?
Like this is something that wereally maybe that's happening a
little bit, but not much.
(11:21):
It's very different, it's new,it's unique, that's really cool.
And then my question is is itvaluable and that's of course
that's also in the eye of thebeholder, right.
Like it might be reallyvaluable to the company, but not
so much to the consumer, and soI would just encourage
companies to think about that ishow can they make it truly
valuable?
Jeannie Walters (11:41):
I love that word valuable too, because one
of the things we're seeing isthat customers are more, they're
savvier now.
They're savvier about how theirinformation is being used.
They're savvier about the factthat they do have maybe more of
a voice, more control, than theyused to in the past and they're
using that to say if you don'talign with my values, then I'm
(12:03):
either, I'm not going to shopwith you, I'm going to tell
people not to shop with you, I'mgoing to.
I mean, we're seeing this inreal time right now, with some
decisions being made aroundwhich retailers to go to.
People are selling certaintypes of cars right now based on
alignment of values.
So, one thing that comes upagain and again right now is
(12:23):
sustainability and how importantthat is to people and how
they're really looking for waysto live a more sustainable
lifestyle.
This isn't, you know, everybody, but there are.
There's a segment, and you know, I was thinking wouldn't it be
cool if you could kind of checka box that says sustainable and
it says, well, over here is aindependent used bookstore or a
(12:45):
library or you know anindependent coffee house.
Like you could actually segmenteven more so that the choices
that are presented are notnecessarily just the kind of
ordinary but the ones that alignwith your values.
So there, I agree, there's lotsof ways that I think you and I
are being creative right now.
We are, we're getting lots ofideas.
(13:09):
I know, right, like just okay,so somebody go figure all that
out so that Amy and I can take adrive and find all the cool
places.
So, but you know this, this kindof idea that it's so hard to
break through seems to be atheme in some of the things that
I picked, because this nextheadline, instead of about
(13:29):
driving, it's literally aboutwhere we live.
And this is from the WallStreet Journal and the headline
is your next apartment rentalmay also be a marketing campaign
.
And I'm going to read the subheadline here too.
It says branded residencies areexpanding from multi-million
dollar penthouses to affordablerentals, like New Jersey's Fiat
(13:51):
House.
Now, you probably know thatFiat is not a housing
development, it's a car brand,and they are trying to find ways
to really put the brand infront of people.
And the story of this was reallythe juxtaposition between these
branded residents exist already, but they're very high-end.
(14:14):
They're, you know, um brandslike I think there was, uh,
Aston Martin and some reallyhigh-end uh yeah, I'm looking
right now Bulgari, Armani, thosetypes of things, and so they
were multimillion dollar homesthat you bought into.
Now these branded residenciesare saying, well, no, you can
(14:39):
rent an apartment here, and theonly thing you really give up is
that it has some sprinkles ofFiat branding.
Like they mentioned, some ofthe planters are shaped like
their cars, which I thought waspretty cute.
But the advantage for Fiat isthat they put their brand on the
building and so all the peopledriving by and everything, they
get that level of exposure allthe time.
(15:00):
And then the renters kind ofmove in and out and maybe it
doesn't mean anything to them,it's just part of the building.
But I think that this speaks tothe idea that brands used to
have this way of connecting topeople.
That was very standardized.
I mean, the joke that peopleused to throw around was if your
(15:22):
mom used Tide, you used Tide,right, they didn't even have to
do anything.
That was just what happened.
And now people are morediscerning, they are more likely
to switch brands, all of thesethings.
So it's about again gettingthat brand out there in just
really creative ways.
So I'm curious what did youthink of this as far as
innovation and creativity andall the things that we love
(15:44):
talking about?
Amy Climer (15:45):
I mean, I would say again, you know, it does check
that definition.
This definitely, as far ascreativity goes, it's novelty,
it's novel.
And then the question is itvaluable?
And then I think again is, towho, to whom?
And my first thought whenreading the article was like, oh
gosh, I hope I never have tolive in a place like this.
And then I started thinking you, you know what, what, if, like,
(16:09):
if the marketers and thecreative teams that are working
on this, if they're asking thepeople who live there like, hey,
what do you need in your life,what, what's missing, not like,
hey, what do you need in thelobby?
Per se, but just, you know,what do you need?
And maybe focusing more on thatexperience and facilitating
experience for the people thatlive in the building.
(16:30):
Um, particularly I was thinkingabout, you know, I'm sure you've
heard Jeannie, that we'rehaving this like loneliness
epidemic in the country, and youknow, I mean I don't live, I
live in a house, I don't live inan apartment complex, but like,
I think there's it's verycommon that you probably just
see people every day and youdon't even know their names and
(16:52):
that just kind of increases that, um, that distance that we have
.
And I just recently had thisinteresting experience.
I live in Asheville, NorthCarolina, and a few months ago
Hurricane Helene hit and for 48hours, nobody in the city had
electricity, wifi, cell service,no way to communicate with
(17:14):
anyone.
And what happened is peoplestarted going to each other's
houses and knocking on the doorsand I know my neighbors I don't
know all of them, but and yeah,people started coming over and
when they came over, I was likeso excited to see them, whereas,
you know, the day before, whenI had cell service, I would be
like who is at my front door?
(17:35):
You know, I've been allannoying, right, but it made me
think about oh right, this iswhat we used to do.
Jeannie Walters (17:42):
That's right.
Amy Climer (17:43):
I think those connections were in some ways
easier, or maybe I should justsay they were different.
And so, yeah, I was thinkinglike how could companies address
some big issues and also getcreative in their marketing and
potential seller products?
Jeannie Walters (17:59):
Well, that's a really interesting angle because
I think that's something thatresidential properties have
really been trying to nurture.
But it's challenging, right?
And the prior Surgeon Generalwho really talked about
loneliness as an epidemic, hesaid something in an interview
that just totally stuck with mebecause he said you know, if you
(18:20):
go to a college dining hall, itused to be the loudest place on
campus because everybody wastalking.
He said now it's quiet becausethey're just sitting on their
phones and they're eating ontheir own.
And I think that there is thiswhole shift of like how we
interact with each other.
And we had a client years andyears ago who had realized like
(18:43):
people wanted they actuallywanted less living space in
their apartments because theydidn't have the stuff anymore.
Like people don't have as manybooks, they didn't have their
big album collections, you know,like things like that that all
got smaller because ofelectronics.
They didn't need that, but whatthey wanted was a place in the
lobby to work on their laptop.
(19:05):
What they wanted was someplacewhere they could be surrounded
by people, even if they're notreally socializing, just to have
that place.
So they invested more in likethe common spaces and had
smaller apartments, so they gotmore people in the building, but
they invested more in reallyhow do we make the common spaces
?
And they started doingbarbecues and different things
(19:25):
to really get people to get toknow each other.
Because I agree that this issomething that I think a lot of
people are struggling with andorganizations are struggling
with even how to nurture it.
Because one of the things weran into with that client was
they said well, we have peopleat the front desk.
We asked them to host abarbecue and they're like I'm
not talking to people, right,like I don't want to talk to
anybody.
Amy Climer (19:46):
Yeah, exactly.
Jeannie Walters (19:52):
So, but people, right, like, I don't want to
talk to anybody, yeah, exactlyso.
But this idea of like, could werally around a brand like there
are people who really identifywith different brands like so
could this be a way to make thatconnection?
Absolutely.
Could you do more with that andhave people have more of an
experience instead of just atransaction with the brand and
build that relationship seemsseems like it should work right?
Um, that's hard to do when,because I bet the people who
(20:15):
spend 22 million dollars on apenthouse they might not know
their neighbors.
Amy Climer (20:20):
Right, yeah, but people who rent, sure yeah, and
that's interesting too, just,you know, in the, in those two
groups of people would havedifferent desires and needs, and
I think that's part of thehopefully, the responsibility
that those who are doing themarketing would think about,
like, okay, how do I segment abit?
(20:40):
You know, maybe you have somevarious events and one's kind of
targeted to this group and theother to that group, even though
maybe they're both open to bothgroups.
And yeah, I think there'sthere's countless opportunities
and possibilities.
Jeannie Walters (20:54):
Absolutely, Absolutely.
So really interesting, and Ithink it's going to be something
we're going to see more andmore and more of.
But everything, everything kindof old is new again, right,
Like when it comes to how we,how we build communities, how we
do all of that, because we'rerealizing like hey, when we did
knock on our neighbor's doors,that was kind of a nice
(21:15):
experience, so we're you know,maybe some of that we'll be
coming back to.
But and I'm also glad that youare out of that period I know
you all are still dealing with alot of the aftermath of that
and that was quite harrowing, soI'm glad that you and your
neighbors are doing okay.
Amy Climer (21:31):
We're doing much better.
Yes.
Jeannie Walters (21:33):
Good, good, so okay.
So one last one.
We don't have to talk too longabout this, but I felt like this
kind of went along with whatwe're talking about, where we
talk about personalizing and AIthat really relies on people's
data and their personal data,like it's saying, yes, you can
look at every purchase I've evermade and, yes, you can see my
(21:53):
zip code and my, you know mysalary, and like all of that.
And this is from Ad Age, andthis headline is Consumer
Loyalty in 2025, why datatransparency matters more than
discounts, and the subhead hereis marketers can no longer rely
on deals to reel in first timecustomers, and this was
(22:18):
compelling to me, because thisis something that we've been
talking about a lot with our ourclients is customers are
getting savvier, they understandhow their data is used, they
have questions about it and theyare opting out more than they
used to.
So how do we, how do we givethem what they want through that
transparency, which is morepersonalization and
(22:40):
understanding, and, at the sametime, respect what they want as
far as privacy and and justprotection as well, and so I you
know, this is something that Ithink a lot of brands are
dealing with, and again it comesback to being visible, right
like and really transparentabout this is how we're using it
.
So what are your thoughts onthis?
Amy Climer (23:04):
Yeah, it seems.
I mean, I, I definitely I getthe struggle right, like I.
And I'm thinking, you know,from that consumer angle I have,
this sounds ridiculous, butit's true that I have not bought
things from a company just likeanything, because I didn't want
to be added to their email listand I didn't want to deal with
(23:25):
unsubscribing and dah, dah, dah,and I was just like I'm just
not going to buy that, and youknow, these are mostly smaller
things that I'm thinking of.
But and so I?
But then I was thinking, well,how could this be a positive
again for that consumer?
So how could the company shiftthis?
And I think that teams andcompanies are getting more
(23:47):
transparent about the data.
But I know, certainly when Isee, like oh, here's how we use
your data, like I don't reallyknow what that fully means,
right.
I don't know what they're trulydoing with it.
Like, oh, they're analyzing it.
What might be cool is ifthey'll say, well, like, let us
have access to your data and wewill give you your analysis back
, and to say, hey, here's whatwe discovered about you and you
(24:12):
know, like, we'll continue touse this information to
customize experiences orcustomize our response to you.
But at the same time, I'mlearning about myself, which
could be, kind of interesting,so I don't know if that's how
that would work.
Jeannie Walters (24:27):
Well, it's interesting because one of the
things that, again, we've beentalking about this for years is
this idea that you know every,every retailer, every person,
every interaction that you have.
There should be kind of an easyto use dashboard, in my opinion
, where you say, yes, you canhave this data.
No, not that one, this andevery single access point that
(24:50):
they want.
They explain why.
You know, this will help uspredict when you need your next
thing.
This will help us let you knowto have maintenance on your car.
This you know, whatever it is,because some of those things
we've really grown accustomed toand appreciate, right, we like
when they're proactive, aboutthose reminders, when we don't
wait until something breaks,when you know, oh my gosh, we're
(25:12):
running out of our favoritemoisturizer and it appears on
our doorstep, right, likeamazing.
So some of those things we wantto opt in and say, yes, please
understand, when do I usuallyrun out of this moisturizer?
Send it to me, right, whatever.
So I think that the the examplethat you used it's it's very um
(25:32):
, bogged down in like languagewe don't understand, or things
that, like the normal averageshopper shouldn't have to have a
degree in cyber security tounderstand how their data is
used, and yet it can feel likethat sometimes and then, once
you agree, it's hard to figureout.
Okay, wait, how do I check whatthey're using?
(25:53):
How do I make changes?
All of that.
The other thing that thisarticle didn't talk about, but
something I've been watching, isI were just talking about AI on
the corporate side.
I think customers are going tostart using AI in really
creative ways, like tell me ifthis fits within my warranty and
tell me what I should ask forright.
(26:15):
Like tell me, based on this,how is my data being used and
should I be concerned, and howdo I do this?
Now, of course, that opens up awhole other thing about AI, but
I think that the savvier thatcustomers get, the more prepared
every organization has to be toanswer those tough questions of
(26:36):
how are we using your data?
Yes, you absolutely havecontrol, and here's exactly how
and here's what it's doing foryou and if we can answer those
things in a very transparent way.
I think that's what will buildtrust and loyalty.
But, man, we've got a long wayto go.
We've just got a long way to go, and I think Apple is the one
(26:57):
who kind of really is leadingthis conversation with the way
that they give people controlover do you want this app to
track?
And a lot of people are optingout and that's producing its own
set of challenges for all thesebrands.
But we live in interestingtimes.
Amy Climer (27:13):
We really do.
We really do.
I feel like just your commentabout AI makes me think about
how it's so new, at least on theconsumer side, and I mean, what
a couple of years old.
I don't remember when ChatGPTcame out.
Jeannie Walters (27:25):
I think it was November 22 or 23.
Amy Climer (27:28):
Yeah, yeah, I learned about it initially at a
National Speakers Associationmeeting.
There you go, a CSP event, yeah, two years ago I think.
And I think what I'm noticingin myself is that my biggest
barrier in using AI is just tothink about how to use it.
It's so easy to use, it's justa matter of like, what questions
(27:50):
to ask.
And so just now I'm like, oh,this would be great.
I could just, you know, cut andpaste the disclosure and prop
it in there, you know, pop it inthere and say, hey, what do you
think?
Could I?
How are they using my data?
And I think, as more peopletalk about how they're using
ChatGPT or other tools, then,yes, we're going to get a lot
savvier.
And and I think we I don't knowcause I do also feel like
(28:15):
there's like this generationdifference, that where, like our
generation, uh, are you kind ofgen X?
Jeannie Walters (28:22):
Gen X yeah, proud gen X.
Amy Climer (28:25):
Yeah that we're not used to this, like we didn't
grow up with this level of dataanalysis.
Jeannie Walters (28:32):
Right.
Amy Climer (28:32):
Whereas Gen Z, I don't really think as much about
it.
And so it'll be interesting tosee how this changes and how
some brands maybe have an easiergo of it if they're marketing
towards younger groups.
I don't know.
I don't know enough about it,but it will be interesting to
see how that plays out.
Jeannie Walters (28:50):
Well, and Gen Z has figured out the workarounds
too, like a lot of them haveprivate accounts that they you
know, that they, their parentsdon't know about, or the you
know all these.
So I think that that will be.
The next thing, too, is thatpeople might give exactly the
data that they think will helpthem, instead of the true data
about their themselves and theirbehavior.
(29:10):
So I think we're at the tip ofthe iceberg with all of this,
but it's super fascinating, andI think it all comes down to
understanding who do you want tobe for your customers and what
is important to them, andconstantly working on that
alignment, because expectationschange, the world changes, the
tools change really fast rightnow, and so that's why I don't
(29:34):
know I think creative innovationis so important.
Amy Climer (29:39):
I agree, I'm completely biased though.
Jeannie Walters (29:43):
Amy, remind everybody about your book and
where they can find you, becauseyou've got a lot of great stuff
.
Amy Climer (29:48):
Thanks, yeah, so this is my new book.
Just came out early 2025 hereDeliberate Creative Teams: How
to Lead for Innovative Results,and it's for leaders who want
their teams to be moreinnovative but maybe don't know
where to start and I go into asystem of innovation that's
pretty easy, pretty simple toimplement.
You can find the book on Amazon, Barnes and Noble anywhere
(30:10):
books are sold, and you can findme at climerconsultingcom, and
Climer is spelled C-L-I-M-E-RClimer Consulting, and I'm also
on LinkedIn and all those othersocial media apps.
Jeannie Walters (30:25):
Well, I'm so thrilled that you were able to
join me, especially the at thisbusy time with your book launch,
but I think it's a.
It's a great way to think aboutthings and I'm really excited
for that process to get out tothe world so that people can
really follow this system andinnovate even faster and better
than before.
So thank you so much for beinghere, Amy.
Amy Climer (30:45):
Thank you and thank you, Jeannie.
Jeannie Walters (30:48):
And we'll make sure that all of those links are
in the show notes as well.
And thank you, listeners andviewers, for being here with us
at the Experience Action Podcast.
If you are wondering about yourown level of experiential
innovation, go ahead and checkout cxicompasscom.
That's our assessment thathelps you understand where to
(31:10):
prioritize within your owncustomer experience journey for
your organization.
So check that out atcxicompasscom and don't forget
every other episode I amanswering your questions.
You can leave me a voicemail ataskjeannievip.
Thank you so much for beinghere, thank you to our special
co-host, and I will talk to yousoon.
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