August 11, 2025 • 17 mins
During the Rural Roadie, Matt and Wade sat down with Taranaki dairy farmer, Dave England, to explore his transition from engineering to dairy farm ownership. At 28, Dave and wife, Hollie made the decision to enter the dairy industry, advancing from a 200-cow lower order role to managing a 600-cow operation within a year. By intentionally working with progressive farmers, Dave rapidly developed his skills and built the equity needed to step into a 310 cow 50/50 sharemilking role. His disciplined approach to budgeting and consistent delivery on financial projections earned the banks' trust and laid the foundation for future growth.
Now at the helm of a high-performing System 5 dairy operation with 1000 cows and newly acquired land, Dave shares the strategies that have shaped his success. He emphasises the importance of proactively seeking opportunities, maintaining strong financial literacy, and surrounding yourself with a trusted team. Listeners will walk away with practical advice: know your numbers, treat every farm as your own, and build a reputation that opens doors in the farming community.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
G'day and welcome to Feed for Thought, a regular
podcast from Pioneer coveringeverything from farm systems to
crops and products and much,much more.
Welcome back, or welcome to theRural Roadie and the Feed for
Thought podcast.
We've got Dave England here.
We're based in the Taranaki,parked up at a colleague's place
and we're cracking into this,so welcome, dave.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
Thanks for having me Pleasure.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
Dave, we've known you for a few years now and been
around different farming systemsand got to know you quite well.
But one thing we kind of pickedup was that you've been through
a journey into ownership.
We wanted to kind of delve intothat a bit today.
So, yeah, thanks for joining us.
But before we kind of kick thisoff, just so we have a bit of
(00:51):
understanding, around your farmsystem, can you just give us a
bit of an idea or a bit of adownload.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
Yep 50-50 shear milking 1,000 cows in Nauri,
central Tauranaki System 5 farm,315 hectares effective flat to
rolling all spring calving.
We do milk our lates into June,usually work for around that.
60 days dry.
65 days dry Feeds, mainly madeup of maize, PK, ddg, molasses,
(01:18):
all fed on a feed pad.
32 hectares maize grown on farm, 550 tonnes maize bought in, no
other crops grown at all.
And then we have our own farmwhich is 320 cows at Kāponga,
which is going up to 420 cowsnext year.
We've recently purchased ablock next to that so it'll be
going up.
That's a System 4 farm.
(01:38):
We've got a contract milker onthere which is my younger
brother which him and his wifedo it, so we're very lucky in
that respect.
We grew eight hectares of maizeon farm last year but it was a
little bit too much, with a bitof regrassing and stuff we want
to do up there.
So we've grown four hectaresthis year and 10 hectares will
be bought in.
Actually there's more than 10hectares bought in this year
because we're going up innumbers.
(01:59):
Next, year, so yeah, it'd beabout 15 hectares bought in.
Yeah, cool.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
And you kept on saying we, and there was Holly.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
Where is Holly?
Speaker 1 (02:12):
She's a bit shy on chatting on here.
She just didn't want to bestuck in the Caribbean.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
Yeah, she thought four was enough.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
Yeah, so yeah, so sorry.
Myself and Holly and our threegirls run that.
Yeah nice.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
And you've mentioned the system a few times, so is
that something that's evolved,or have you been running that
kind of system for a while?
Speaker 3 (02:29):
We've probably been running that system right from
the start.
To be fair, we've alwaysenjoyed feeding cows and having
the ability to juggle thingsaround depending on the season,
and just that.
Security of feed.
Our first job was actually asystem for farm.
I actually started offengineering.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Oh right, feed Our first job was actually a system
for farm I actually started offengineering, so I haven't farmed
for my whole life really.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
I was 28 and got into farming and Holly was working
at the vets as a vet nurse.
Actually, she was running asmall farm herself as well 120
cows.
We made the leap.
We had a property at the time alittle farmlet, so we couldn't
really afford to go on wages, Iguess.
So we um approached a local guywho had a lower order job going
(03:09):
200 cows, and we jumped intothat.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Oh, nice, that was your first job.
Yeah, oh yeah, straight into it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Welcome to dairy yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
So it was quite a milestone when I had my first
down a cow.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
To be fair, and put that bag in the bag what have I
got to do, yeah?
Speaker 3 (03:24):
yeah, it was.
I had to ring up my old man.
No, we grew up.
Both grew up on dairy farms, soit wasn't a shock or anything.
We had a few clues.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
So your mum and dad are South Taranaki.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
Yep yeah they're on South Taranaki.
They're retired now.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
My brother runs the farm.
Yeah, yeah, I did actually yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
The old man was always pretty strict.
He was like, oh, go do a tradeor something first and then come
back to the farm if you want tolater on.
You know, yeah, but we neveractually went back to the home
farm.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
We went the other way .
Yeah, yeah, decided to carveyour path.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
Yeah, yeah.
So, yeah, lower order.
And so how long did that lastin terms of um?
Yeah, we spent one year there,yeah, and then we went to his
600 cow farm.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
All right, oh yeah, so he obviously found the vein
got a bit carried away.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
So, yeah, I remember still looking in the yard that
day and all these cows and I waslike holy heck, what are we
into here?
Yeah, yeah, um, got staff nowyeah, yeah we're one staff
member I mean holy.
So the kids came to the shed andall that sort of jazz.
It's a bit of a wake up call,but no, it worked really well.
So that's what we sort ofplanned.
The reason we picked thatfarmer at the time was he was a
really progressive guy that I'dseen sort of what he was doing
(04:37):
and sort of we can learn off him.
So tough but fair, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
So you actually went out of your way to seek
employment.
Yeah, we did a little bit yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
Yeah, because we wanted to move fast, because we
got into the game late andobviously we had
responsibilities with a morgueand all that sort of jazz with
the house, yeah, and we had ayoung family at the time, yeah,
yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
So we got right into it, so you wanted to really put
the foot down.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
Yeah, yeah.
So we spent two years and thena 50 50 job actually came up
around the corner, so we appliedfor that and you managed to get
that, so it's 310 cows.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So what's that?
What now you're?
Speaker 1 (05:12):
four years in yeah, 50 share marketing yeah, and and
how did you?
Speaker 2 (05:15):
how did you accumulate the equity or get
yourself to a position?
We sold our house, all right,so we sold the farmer.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
Yeah, yeah, we didn't actually make a whole lot of
money on that, but it was enoughmoney to sort of get us through
the gate, yeah, and we actuallyhad a lot of help from that
employer.
There was 40 or 50-odd cows hedonated to us and bits and
pieces like that, yeah, soldcheaply and bale feeders and
that sort of thing we picked andborrowed.
Yeah, it's sort of been a thingof our career.
(05:42):
I guess Opportunities have comealong before we're probably
really ready for them.
So we spent three years at thatjob and we actually got 800 car
job in Stratford, where wecurrently are Two years into
that 50-50 job, which again itseems crazy.
But yeah, we managed to get abank on the side.
There was only one bank thatwould back us, but we had a
(06:05):
funny feeling that thatopportunity wouldn't come up
again.
So yeah, we big pinched andborrowed and made our way to
that.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
So with that one there.
So one of the things that oftencomes up is, you know, like a
leap from 300 to 800, you know,and you've touched on it, you're
outside the bank limitsprobably a little bit.
I'm on security or, you know,there's probably cash flow to it
right.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Yeah, cash flow to it .
Right, it was just security.
Security usually always kills.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Yeah, yeah.
So how did you work around?
Speaker 3 (06:33):
that.
Well, we were just well out ofour security means and we made a
lot of promises to the bank.
We knew what we could do, yeah,but it didn't help because that
year was straight off the $8payout, I think it was and then
went to $3.90 after that.
So our first two years therewere under the pump, but we
didn't borrow any extra cash oranything like that and we sort
(06:53):
of farmed our way through it,which was good sort of proved to
the bank and you said that youstarted off in that System 4
kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
Have these farms changed along the way or have
they pretty much been Systemfour farms?
Yeah, yeah, they have.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
yeah, so the farm we were at now currently.
So it's actually a thousand now.
The um, our owners, farm ownerspurchased another property next
door so we went from 800 to athousand.
But, um, that was probably asystem three farm when we took
it over and it's yeah, it's goneto system five now.
Yeah, but we've sort of comethrough the ranks with that
system four, five with alwayspasture at the forefront, yeah,
(07:31):
supplements sort of backing usup.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Yeah, know how to make it work.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
Complementing the pasture, yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
Just picking back up with those bank conversations
and we had a little yarn beforethe podcast around like knowing
your numbers and you said, likehaving that relationship was key
with your rural professionals.
What was something?
I mean they put a lot of trustin you.
Then, like what were some ofthe key things that you had to
communicate to them?
Speaker 3 (07:56):
I think it was doing your own budgets, you know, and
not asking.
You're providing the budgetsfor them and telling them what
you're going to do and thensticking to that.
I guess that's how you buildtrust, I suppose, is fulfilling
what you're going to do and thensticking to that.
I guess that's how you buildtrust, I suppose is fulfilling
what you say you're going to do,yeah, so that's sort of I guess
that's where we've gone to withthat.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Yeah, you also used the word reputation, which I
guess it's when you deliver thebudget and your reputation kind
of Is backing it up, is backingit up?
Yeah, that's right, yeah.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
Yeah, so we've been lucky.
We've had some really good bankmanagers and some have moved on
and then we've managed toreplace that with a good one as
well.
So we've been very lucky andfortunate in that respect as
well.
But there's an odd time we havefought to keep the same bank
manager.
Yeah, yeah, but we've been veryfortunate in that respect.
You really need your banker onside with you, because he's the
one that will go in the back foryou.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
How do you now prioritize, like you've got your
own?
Place and then you want torespect and obviously look after
yeah.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
So, like I said before, we're very lucky, I
guess, with my brother and hiswife there.
They look after things reallywell there.
When we purchased a property, Italked, sat down and talked
with jane and made some groundrules.
I guess that we weren't goingto be purchase a property that
wasn't too far away from ourcurrent property so that if I
had to go up there it wasn't anymore than sort of 10 minutes,
quarter of an hour drive, butyeah, and that I had a good
(09:13):
contract.
Milker on there was key becausethings can go pear-shaped
relatively quick.
But yeah, I guess my main focusis always at a 50-50 job and
then I guess we're in control ofthe other one.
So if something goes a bit slow, yeah, I just always try to
keep a good handle on what'shappening at home.
Yeah, and it's a bigger ship athome.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
The other place is not as big so, yeah, yeah, one
of the things we we hear a lotand I'm sure you've heard it a
lot now too with, uh, you know,like farm ownership's more
difficult now than perhaps youknow, know a decade or two ago.
And even thinking, you know, ifyou rewind the clock or cast
your mind back and think if youwere starting over again, do you
think that's the case?
(09:54):
Or you know, you think youngguys coming in have they got
similar pathway opportunities towhat you had and can do the
same things?
Speaker 3 (10:02):
Yeah, I think they do .
It's just a matter of findingthe right person and evolving
with the times.
I think there's a lot ofopportunities out there.
There's a lot of guys prettykeen to get out, and, whether it
might be to leave money in orhelp you in somehow with equity,
I think it's just a aboutthinking outside the box, I
guess, and not being scared toput a proposal together and take
to somebody.
(10:23):
That's what we've sort of doneover the years.
People seem to appreciatethings if you take a proposal to
them and then they don't haveto think about it as much.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
So you're proactive.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
This is what we're going to this is what we're
proposed to do.
Are you on board?
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Those sorts of things .
So you're saying you're notwaiting for the opportunity to
come?
No, don't wait for it.
Speaker 3 (10:42):
There's plenty of places you can get on TRC maps
and see who's out there.
We've done plenty of that sortof stuff.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
Do a bit of stalking.
Yeah, a bit of stalking neverhurts.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
And then go do a bit of door knocking.
But yeah, there's lease, farmopportunities, all sorts of
opportunities coming up.
It's, yeah, just getting a planearly on how you're going to
get that capital and equitytogether to do it whether it's
raising extra calves or askingyour boss if you can raise some.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Hold you know, do something you know, whatever it
might be, yeah, so you'vementioned that you're a goal
setter and you know that there'sopportunities out there.
Yeah, what is the next three tofive year?
Speaker 3 (11:26):
So Without Don't give away, Holly will tell you no
more land.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
And not to give away any competitive advantage or any
information out there.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
But yeah, no, I think we're probably we'll have 160
odd hectares at the other placefrom next year, so it's that
neighbouring property.
Again, the opportunity came ayear afterward.
I only just bought the firstproperty, so again it wasn't
ideal timing, so I've had topush pretty hard to make that
happen.
It works, it's fine, but Ithink it's probably just a bit
(11:57):
of consolidation time for us atthe moment.
And get that debt paid down andthen we'll see where we go from
there.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
Yeah, hope another neighbouring 60 hectares doesn't
come on the market, that's whatI'm hoping probably.
Speaker 3 (12:11):
No, I think probably the goal for us will be just to
consolidate for a little bit andpay a bit of debt downing,
because a tough year will comeeventually and interest rates
are coming.
Whilst they're coming down atthe moment, they could go up
again, so yeah, Do you go withthe debt reduction?
Speaker 2 (12:26):
What's your approach to that?
Are you going pretty hard at?
Yeah, definitely yeah, all theway through right from day one
you know, banks have theircriteria, but you're setting
your aspirations a lot higherthan that for debt reduction.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Yeah, we've been very lucky.
We haven't been locked into anyfixed monthly payments or
anything like that.
We've got a bit of a rapportnow that we seem to be able to
pay off debt as we can, so we'renot going into overdraft to pay
at any time of the year.
So, yeah, no, we definitely paythe debt off.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
Yeah, but you'd have to be obviously quite
disciplined with cash flows andplanning.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
Yeah, I'm lucky with.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
Holly keeps me in track with that.
Speaker 3 (13:07):
Only so many motorbikes in the garage and
that sort of thing Mountainbikes, anything else, all the
toys, yeah, yeah, nah, hollydoes all that.
She still runs a cash book andthat sort of stuff and keeps a
good track on what's going onyeah.
Keeps a finger on the pulse.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
And we've got a good accountant who's yeah, sound
advice and that sort of thing aswell.
Yeah, yeah, nice, um, who elsehas been a part of the journey?
I suppose you've obviouslybanks and you know, just dropped
in the accountant.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
Who else has been part of that team, I suppose, or
you know that's yeah, we've hadnutritionalists along the years
have helped us along to makesure, you know, using the right
feeds at the right time andgetting getting a response and
all that sort of jazz.
Um, but mainly, mainly,probably, our banker and
accountant and our and our farmowners.
Yeah, yeah, we've had been verylucky, like I said, with farm
(13:53):
owners.
They've had sound advice andthey've been in the right place
at the right time and just justsurrounding ourselves with yeah,
like I said before, mentor sortof people.
Yeah, like, even now I've stillgot guys that I catch up and
have a yarn, whether the priceof feed or something like that.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
What are you just looping back a little bit to?
I kind of think of young guyslistening to the podcast.
Hopefully there's some youngguys listening to the podcast.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
Probably that demographic's a bit higher than
the older.
You're making assumptions therelistening to the podcast.
Probably that demographic's abit higher than the older.
Speaker 2 (14:21):
Possibly You're making assumptions there, but
you know, for young guys comingthrough, you gave us a few
little sort of tips and adviceactually before this podcast
kicked off.
You know what would be thesorts of things that you'd say
to some of these young guys, andI'm sure you probably do, in
terms of some of your advice tothem about you know committing
to that kind of journey.
Speaker 3 (14:40):
Yeah, like I said earlier about treating the farm
as your own.
You know like even sometimesyou'll spend a bit of your own
money that you probably think atthe time is the farm owner's
cost.
But you know, think big picture.
That will get you theopportunity later on.
The people that you want tonotice will definitely notice
and you'll just get a phone callout of the blue one day or
they'll see.
You know there'll be a bit ofchat at the pub or something.
(15:03):
You know about what you'redoing and that will ultimately
hopefully get the nextopportunity as well.
You know there's those sorts ofthings.
Yeah, like every dollar counts,is another big one Certainly
does for Holly.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Yeah, definitely does .
Speaker 3 (15:18):
It all adds up at the end of the month.
You know, like it might only be50 bucks of something that you
buy um for the farm, but do youreally need that 50 bucks?
Because that only adds 50 bucksto another thousand, or you
know, and before the end of themonth comes it adds up to quite
a big number.
Yeah, so it's just those littlethings, um, yeah, and
surrounding yourself with thepositive, well respected people
you know, yeah yeah, that, thatpoint you made right at the
(15:40):
outset.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
There, you know, matt , and I've been talking about
the.
You know that's that buildingyour brand a little bit yeah, it
is yeah, so people know who youare yeah, they know the job
that you do and the quality andthe standard and the yeah, you
know um and what you do anddeliver.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
Yeah, no, definitely do and going back to before it's
knowing your numbers for thebank, yeah, so that then you can
build you build a good trustwith them so that if you do need
to push the limits or somethingone day, you know they've got
your back.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
Yeah, they're a bit more open to it yeah, yeah, yeah
yeah.
Speaker 3 (16:08):
It's building that rapport, I guess, yeah, good.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
Well, wado anything from you to wrap out.
Speaker 2 (16:15):
No, look, I think there's some great messages in
there and you're a top bloke,dave, and we appreciate you kind
of sharing some of the story.
So you know obviously all thosekind of fundamentals that you
talk about.
You know you're actually livingthose things clearly to get
that outcome.
So hats off to you, mate.
It's a massive achievement andno doubt there's more to come.
Speaker 3 (16:35):
Bring on the next 60 hectares next door just not too
soon you're brave saying it whenHolly's not here.
Yeah, I know that's right.
I don't think she'll handlemuch more.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
Anyway, mate, it's been bloody good having you on
the Feed for Thought podcast andjumping in the caravan while
we're on this rural roadietripping around.
So thanks for joining us, mate,and thanks, wade winning.
Thanks very much, and we'lltalk to you all next time.
Thanks, mate.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
Thank you very much, cheers.
G'day and welcome to Feed for Thought, a regular
podcast from Pioneer coveringeverything from farm systems to
crops and products and much,much more.
Welcome back, or welcome to theRural Roadie and the Feed for
Thought podcast.
We've got Dave England here.
We're based in the Taranaki,parked up at a colleague's place
and we're cracking into this,so welcome, dave.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
Thanks for having me Pleasure.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
Dave, we've known you for a few years now and been
around different farming systemsand got to know you quite well.
But one thing we kind of pickedup was that you've been through
a journey into ownership.
We wanted to kind of delve intothat a bit today.
So, yeah, thanks for joining us.
But before we kind of kick thisoff, just so we have a bit of
(00:51):
understanding, around your farmsystem, can you just give us a
bit of an idea or a bit of adownload.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
Yep 50-50 shear milking 1,000 cows in Nauri,
central Tauranaki System 5 farm,315 hectares effective flat to
rolling all spring calving.
We do milk our lates into June,usually work for around that.
60 days dry.
65 days dry Feeds, mainly madeup of maize, PK, ddg, molasses,
(01:18):
all fed on a feed pad.
32 hectares maize grown on farm, 550 tonnes maize bought in, no
other crops grown at all.
And then we have our own farmwhich is 320 cows at Kāponga,
which is going up to 420 cowsnext year.
We've recently purchased ablock next to that so it'll be
going up.
That's a System 4 farm.
(01:38):
We've got a contract milker onthere which is my younger
brother which him and his wifedo it, so we're very lucky in
that respect.
We grew eight hectares of maizeon farm last year but it was a
little bit too much, with a bitof regrassing and stuff we want
to do up there.
So we've grown four hectaresthis year and 10 hectares will
be bought in.
Actually there's more than 10hectares bought in this year
because we're going up innumbers.
(01:59):
Next, year, so yeah, it'd beabout 15 hectares bought in.
Yeah, cool.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
And you kept on saying we, and there was Holly.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
Where is Holly?
Speaker 1 (02:12):
She's a bit shy on chatting on here.
She just didn't want to bestuck in the Caribbean.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
Yeah, she thought four was enough.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
Yeah, so yeah, so sorry.
Myself and Holly and our threegirls run that.
Yeah nice.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
And you've mentioned the system a few times, so is
that something that's evolved,or have you been running that
kind of system for a while?
Speaker 3 (02:29):
We've probably been running that system right from
the start.
To be fair, we've alwaysenjoyed feeding cows and having
the ability to juggle thingsaround depending on the season,
and just that.
Security of feed.
Our first job was actually asystem for farm.
I actually started offengineering.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Oh right, feed Our first job was actually a system
for farm I actually started offengineering, so I haven't farmed
for my whole life really.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
I was 28 and got into farming and Holly was working
at the vets as a vet nurse.
Actually, she was running asmall farm herself as well 120
cows.
We made the leap.
We had a property at the time alittle farmlet, so we couldn't
really afford to go on wages, Iguess.
So we um approached a local guywho had a lower order job going
(03:09):
200 cows, and we jumped intothat.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Oh, nice, that was your first job.
Yeah, oh yeah, straight into it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Welcome to dairy yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
So it was quite a milestone when I had my first
down a cow.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
To be fair, and put that bag in the bag what have I
got to do, yeah?
Speaker 3 (03:24):
yeah, it was.
I had to ring up my old man.
No, we grew up.
Both grew up on dairy farms, soit wasn't a shock or anything.
We had a few clues.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
So your mum and dad are South Taranaki.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
Yep yeah they're on South Taranaki.
They're retired now.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
My brother runs the farm.
Yeah, yeah, I did actually yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
The old man was always pretty strict.
He was like, oh, go do a tradeor something first and then come
back to the farm if you want tolater on.
You know, yeah, but we neveractually went back to the home
farm.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
We went the other way .
Yeah, yeah, decided to carveyour path.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
Yeah, yeah.
So, yeah, lower order.
And so how long did that lastin terms of um?
Yeah, we spent one year there,yeah, and then we went to his
600 cow farm.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
All right, oh yeah, so he obviously found the vein
got a bit carried away.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
So, yeah, I remember still looking in the yard that
day and all these cows and I waslike holy heck, what are we
into here?
Yeah, yeah, um, got staff nowyeah, yeah we're one staff
member I mean holy.
So the kids came to the shed andall that sort of jazz.
It's a bit of a wake up call,but no, it worked really well.
So that's what we sort ofplanned.
The reason we picked thatfarmer at the time was he was a
really progressive guy that I'dseen sort of what he was doing
(04:37):
and sort of we can learn off him.
So tough but fair, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
So you actually went out of your way to seek
employment.
Yeah, we did a little bit yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
Yeah, because we wanted to move fast, because we
got into the game late andobviously we had
responsibilities with a morgueand all that sort of jazz with
the house, yeah, and we had ayoung family at the time, yeah,
yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
So we got right into it, so you wanted to really put
the foot down.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
Yeah, yeah.
So we spent two years and thena 50 50 job actually came up
around the corner, so we appliedfor that and you managed to get
that, so it's 310 cows.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So what's that?
What now you're?
Speaker 1 (05:12):
four years in yeah, 50 share marketing yeah, and and
how did you?
Speaker 2 (05:15):
how did you accumulate the equity or get
yourself to a position?
We sold our house, all right,so we sold the farmer.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
Yeah, yeah, we didn't actually make a whole lot of
money on that, but it was enoughmoney to sort of get us through
the gate, yeah, and we actuallyhad a lot of help from that
employer.
There was 40 or 50-odd cows hedonated to us and bits and
pieces like that, yeah, soldcheaply and bale feeders and
that sort of thing we picked andborrowed.
Yeah, it's sort of been a thingof our career.
(05:42):
I guess Opportunities have comealong before we're probably
really ready for them.
So we spent three years at thatjob and we actually got 800 car
job in Stratford, where wecurrently are Two years into
that 50-50 job, which again itseems crazy.
But yeah, we managed to get abank on the side.
There was only one bank thatwould back us, but we had a
(06:05):
funny feeling that thatopportunity wouldn't come up
again.
So yeah, we big pinched andborrowed and made our way to
that.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
So with that one there.
So one of the things that oftencomes up is, you know, like a
leap from 300 to 800, you know,and you've touched on it, you're
outside the bank limitsprobably a little bit.
I'm on security or, you know,there's probably cash flow to it
right.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Yeah, cash flow to it .
Right, it was just security.
Security usually always kills.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Yeah, yeah.
So how did you work around?
Speaker 3 (06:33):
that.
Well, we were just well out ofour security means and we made a
lot of promises to the bank.
We knew what we could do, yeah,but it didn't help because that
year was straight off the $8payout, I think it was and then
went to $3.90 after that.
So our first two years therewere under the pump, but we
didn't borrow any extra cash oranything like that and we sort
(06:53):
of farmed our way through it,which was good sort of proved to
the bank and you said that youstarted off in that System 4
kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
Have these farms changed along the way or have
they pretty much been Systemfour farms?
Yeah, yeah, they have.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
yeah, so the farm we were at now currently.
So it's actually a thousand now.
The um, our owners, farm ownerspurchased another property next
door so we went from 800 to athousand.
But, um, that was probably asystem three farm when we took
it over and it's yeah, it's goneto system five now.
Yeah, but we've sort of comethrough the ranks with that
system four, five with alwayspasture at the forefront, yeah,
(07:31):
supplements sort of backing usup.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Yeah, know how to make it work.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
Complementing the pasture, yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
Just picking back up with those bank conversations
and we had a little yarn beforethe podcast around like knowing
your numbers and you said, likehaving that relationship was key
with your rural professionals.
What was something?
I mean they put a lot of trustin you.
Then, like what were some ofthe key things that you had to
communicate to them?
Speaker 3 (07:56):
I think it was doing your own budgets, you know, and
not asking.
You're providing the budgetsfor them and telling them what
you're going to do and thensticking to that.
I guess that's how you buildtrust, I suppose, is fulfilling
what you're going to do and thensticking to that.
I guess that's how you buildtrust, I suppose is fulfilling
what you say you're going to do,yeah, so that's sort of I guess
that's where we've gone to withthat.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Yeah, you also used the word reputation, which I
guess it's when you deliver thebudget and your reputation kind
of Is backing it up, is backingit up?
Yeah, that's right, yeah.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
Yeah, so we've been lucky.
We've had some really good bankmanagers and some have moved on
and then we've managed toreplace that with a good one as
well.
So we've been very lucky andfortunate in that respect as
well.
But there's an odd time we havefought to keep the same bank
manager.
Yeah, yeah, but we've been veryfortunate in that respect.
You really need your banker onside with you, because he's the
one that will go in the back foryou.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
How do you now prioritize, like you've got your
own?
Place and then you want torespect and obviously look after
yeah.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
So, like I said before, we're very lucky, I
guess, with my brother and hiswife there.
They look after things reallywell there.
When we purchased a property, Italked, sat down and talked
with jane and made some groundrules.
I guess that we weren't goingto be purchase a property that
wasn't too far away from ourcurrent property so that if I
had to go up there it wasn't anymore than sort of 10 minutes,
quarter of an hour drive, butyeah, and that I had a good
(09:13):
contract.
Milker on there was key becausethings can go pear-shaped
relatively quick.
But yeah, I guess my main focusis always at a 50-50 job and
then I guess we're in control ofthe other one.
So if something goes a bit slow, yeah, I just always try to
keep a good handle on what'shappening at home.
Yeah, and it's a bigger ship athome.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
The other place is not as big so, yeah, yeah, one
of the things we we hear a lotand I'm sure you've heard it a
lot now too with, uh, you know,like farm ownership's more
difficult now than perhaps youknow, know a decade or two ago.
And even thinking, you know, ifyou rewind the clock or cast
your mind back and think if youwere starting over again, do you
think that's the case?
(09:54):
Or you know, you think youngguys coming in have they got
similar pathway opportunities towhat you had and can do the
same things?
Speaker 3 (10:02):
Yeah, I think they do .
It's just a matter of findingthe right person and evolving
with the times.
I think there's a lot ofopportunities out there.
There's a lot of guys prettykeen to get out, and, whether it
might be to leave money in orhelp you in somehow with equity,
I think it's just a aboutthinking outside the box, I
guess, and not being scared toput a proposal together and take
to somebody.
(10:23):
That's what we've sort of doneover the years.
People seem to appreciatethings if you take a proposal to
them and then they don't haveto think about it as much.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
So you're proactive.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
This is what we're going to this is what we're
proposed to do.
Are you on board?
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Those sorts of things .
So you're saying you're notwaiting for the opportunity to
come?
No, don't wait for it.
Speaker 3 (10:42):
There's plenty of places you can get on TRC maps
and see who's out there.
We've done plenty of that sortof stuff.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
Do a bit of stalking.
Yeah, a bit of stalking neverhurts.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
And then go do a bit of door knocking.
But yeah, there's lease, farmopportunities, all sorts of
opportunities coming up.
It's, yeah, just getting a planearly on how you're going to
get that capital and equitytogether to do it whether it's
raising extra calves or askingyour boss if you can raise some.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Hold you know, do something you know, whatever it
might be, yeah, so you'vementioned that you're a goal
setter and you know that there'sopportunities out there.
Yeah, what is the next three tofive year?
Speaker 3 (11:26):
So Without Don't give away, Holly will tell you no
more land.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
And not to give away any competitive advantage or any
information out there.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
But yeah, no, I think we're probably we'll have 160
odd hectares at the other placefrom next year, so it's that
neighbouring property.
Again, the opportunity came ayear afterward.
I only just bought the firstproperty, so again it wasn't
ideal timing, so I've had topush pretty hard to make that
happen.
It works, it's fine, but Ithink it's probably just a bit
(11:57):
of consolidation time for us atthe moment.
And get that debt paid down andthen we'll see where we go from
there.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
Yeah, hope another neighbouring 60 hectares doesn't
come on the market, that's whatI'm hoping probably.
Speaker 3 (12:11):
No, I think probably the goal for us will be just to
consolidate for a little bit andpay a bit of debt downing,
because a tough year will comeeventually and interest rates
are coming.
Whilst they're coming down atthe moment, they could go up
again, so yeah, Do you go withthe debt reduction?
Speaker 2 (12:26):
What's your approach to that?
Are you going pretty hard at?
Yeah, definitely yeah, all theway through right from day one
you know, banks have theircriteria, but you're setting
your aspirations a lot higherthan that for debt reduction.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Yeah, we've been very lucky.
We haven't been locked into anyfixed monthly payments or
anything like that.
We've got a bit of a rapportnow that we seem to be able to
pay off debt as we can, so we'renot going into overdraft to pay
at any time of the year.
So, yeah, no, we definitely paythe debt off.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
Yeah, but you'd have to be obviously quite
disciplined with cash flows andplanning.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
Yeah, I'm lucky with.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
Holly keeps me in track with that.
Speaker 3 (13:07):
Only so many motorbikes in the garage and
that sort of thing Mountainbikes, anything else, all the
toys, yeah, yeah, nah, hollydoes all that.
She still runs a cash book andthat sort of stuff and keeps a
good track on what's going onyeah.
Keeps a finger on the pulse.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
And we've got a good accountant who's yeah, sound
advice and that sort of thing aswell.
Yeah, yeah, nice, um, who elsehas been a part of the journey?
I suppose you've obviouslybanks and you know, just dropped
in the accountant.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
Who else has been part of that team, I suppose, or
you know that's yeah, we've hadnutritionalists along the years
have helped us along to makesure, you know, using the right
feeds at the right time andgetting getting a response and
all that sort of jazz.
Um, but mainly, mainly,probably, our banker and
accountant and our and our farmowners.
Yeah, yeah, we've had been verylucky, like I said, with farm
(13:53):
owners.
They've had sound advice andthey've been in the right place
at the right time and just justsurrounding ourselves with yeah,
like I said before, mentor sortof people.
Yeah, like, even now I've stillgot guys that I catch up and
have a yarn, whether the priceof feed or something like that.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
What are you just looping back a little bit to?
I kind of think of young guyslistening to the podcast.
Hopefully there's some youngguys listening to the podcast.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
Probably that demographic's a bit higher than
the older.
You're making assumptions therelistening to the podcast.
Probably that demographic's abit higher than the older.
Speaker 2 (14:21):
Possibly You're making assumptions there, but
you know, for young guys comingthrough, you gave us a few
little sort of tips and adviceactually before this podcast
kicked off.
You know what would be thesorts of things that you'd say
to some of these young guys, andI'm sure you probably do, in
terms of some of your advice tothem about you know committing
to that kind of journey.
Speaker 3 (14:40):
Yeah, like I said earlier about treating the farm
as your own.
You know like even sometimesyou'll spend a bit of your own
money that you probably think atthe time is the farm owner's
cost.
But you know, think big picture.
That will get you theopportunity later on.
The people that you want tonotice will definitely notice
and you'll just get a phone callout of the blue one day or
they'll see.
You know there'll be a bit ofchat at the pub or something.
(15:03):
You know about what you'redoing and that will ultimately
hopefully get the nextopportunity as well.
You know there's those sorts ofthings.
Yeah, like every dollar counts,is another big one Certainly
does for Holly.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Yeah, definitely does .
Speaker 3 (15:18):
It all adds up at the end of the month.
You know, like it might only be50 bucks of something that you
buy um for the farm, but do youreally need that 50 bucks?
Because that only adds 50 bucksto another thousand, or you
know, and before the end of themonth comes it adds up to quite
a big number.
Yeah, so it's just those littlethings, um, yeah, and
surrounding yourself with thepositive, well respected people
you know, yeah yeah, that, thatpoint you made right at the
(15:40):
outset.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
There, you know, matt , and I've been talking about
the.
You know that's that buildingyour brand a little bit yeah, it
is yeah, so people know who youare yeah, they know the job
that you do and the quality andthe standard and the yeah, you
know um and what you do anddeliver.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
Yeah, no, definitely do and going back to before it's
knowing your numbers for thebank, yeah, so that then you can
build you build a good trustwith them so that if you do need
to push the limits or somethingone day, you know they've got
your back.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
Yeah, they're a bit more open to it yeah, yeah, yeah
yeah.
Speaker 3 (16:08):
It's building that rapport, I guess, yeah, good.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
Well, wado anything from you to wrap out.
Speaker 2 (16:15):
No, look, I think there's some great messages in
there and you're a top bloke,dave, and we appreciate you kind
of sharing some of the story.
So you know obviously all thosekind of fundamentals that you
talk about.
You know you're actually livingthose things clearly to get
that outcome.
So hats off to you, mate.
It's a massive achievement andno doubt there's more to come.
Speaker 3 (16:35):
Bring on the next 60 hectares next door just not too
soon you're brave saying it whenHolly's not here.
Yeah, I know that's right.
I don't think she'll handlemuch more.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
Anyway, mate, it's been bloody good having you on
the Feed for Thought podcast andjumping in the caravan while
we're on this rural roadietripping around.
So thanks for joining us, mate,and thanks, wade winning.
Thanks very much, and we'lltalk to you all next time.
Thanks, mate.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
Thank you very much, cheers.
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