October 29, 2025 • 28 mins
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In this episode of "Food Allergy and Your Kiddo," Dr. Alice Hoyt welcomes back Tamara Hubbard (@foodallergycounselor) to discuss the impact of recent studies on peanut allergy prevention and how parents of children with food allergies may be feeling about this news.
The conversation highlights the importance of community support, evolving guidelines, and the emotional journey of parenting children with food allergies.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Hello and welcome to Food Allergy and Your Kiddo.
I'm your host, Dr.
Alice Hoyt.
Delighted to have my friend andcolleague, Tamara Hubbard, back
on the podcast.
Hey Tamara, how are you?
I'm good.
How are you?
I'm great.
Thanks so much for joining meback today.
Um, and so soon after our lastdiscussion, where I was
(00:27):
delighted to share your book,May Contain Anxiety.
Speaker (00:30):
How's it going?
So far, so good.
We just had a wonderful eventto celebrate its birth into the
world and um getting young.
It is like birthing a baby.
Writing a book is kind of likegrowing and birthing a baby.
So that's how I've beenreferencing it.
But it's going well.
And um more than that, I'mhearing it's helping people,
families, and that was theintention behind it.
(00:51):
So that makes me happy.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
That's so awesome.
Yeah, if if you're listening,you haven't checked out that
episode or interviewed Tamara onher book, May Contain Anxiety,
Managing the Overwhelm ofParenting Children with Food
Allergies.
You should totally check itout.
Um, if you don't know Tamra,she's a licensed clinical
professional counselor andfamily therapist, all about
(01:15):
evidence-based therapeuticsupport.
She really is, um, she's reallyamazing.
Tamra and I work together onwhat's now the Academy of Food
Allergy Counseling.
You want to talk a little bitabout that before we dive into
what we're talking about, whichis some recent food allergy news
and how it's impacting foodallergy families?
Speaker (01:36):
Yeah, because I think it could relate and be useful
for some people.
And it's really just the topicwe're talking about.
So the Academy of Food AllergyCounseling is an organization,
nonprofit organization that Icreated initially called the
Food Allergy CounselingProfessional Network.
And one of its resources is thewell-known Food Allergy
Counseling Directory that helpsfamilies and clinicians connect
(01:59):
with allergy-informed, licensedmental health professionals in
their state or in their area ofthe world.
And then, so that's what'sfacing the community and the
practitioners.
But what's facing the therapistand what's useful for the
therapists at the Academy ofFood Allergy Counseling is a
network of those of us workingin the food allergy and allergic
disease counseling niche.
(02:19):
And then we're also nowproviding education for
therapists to help bring more ofthem into the fold.
So it's all about supportingthe community with food
allergies and allergicconditions, supporting their
emotional and mental health andwellness needs.
So yeah, very proud of theorganization and everything
that's come from it.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
It's amazing.
It really is amazing.
And that's, you know, why Iguess last, I don't know, the
last few years when you've beenreally building it, and then you
know, we had been talking andand how to continue growing this
really just amazing, amazingnetwork for therapists, for
families, you know, bringing itinto the Teal Schoolhouse
(03:00):
family, which supports theCodana organization that I lead.
It's it's just been such awonderful, it's I mean, I love
working with you.
You know that, Tamara.
Yeah.
Um, but I do it's it's such awonderful resource.
And so if you haven't checkedout the Academy of Food Allergy
Counseling, definitely check itout.
If you have a kiddo with foodallergy, chances are, you do if
(03:23):
you're listening to this podcastor you love a child who has a
food allergy, check it out.
There are definitely timeswhere all of us can benefit from
having some some guidance whenwe're going going through
something, and especially havinga kiddo with a food allergy.
Um, you know, just parenting ingeneral, it's like, okay, I'm
I'm doing great in this seasonof life, and then that season's
(03:43):
over, and then you're figuringout the next thing, right,
Tamra?
Speaker (03:47):
Yep, absolutely.
The only constant in life ischange, and so that that applies
here too.
Yep.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
That is so true.
That's so true.
And, you know, change, there isa little bit of change um going
on.
And that's that's why I wantedto have you back today because
we were talking offline aboutstuff.
Um, Tamara and I, or fulldisclosure, Tamara and I are
friends, and we talk a lot aboutum life and food allergy life.
And recently there was a studypublished in Pediatrics, which
(04:18):
is the journal of the AmericanAcademy of Pediatrics.
And what the study demonstratedwas that early, the early
introduction of peanutrecommendations that were made
in 2015 through a consensusstatement, and then in 2017
through the National Institutesof Health, specifically the
National Institute of Allergyand Infectious Disease, the N I
(04:41):
A I D, they updated theirguidelines in 2017 to encourage
introduction of peanut aroundfour to six months of age.
So much earlier than theprevious guidance.
The previous guidance, um, andI'll I'll back up a little bit,
as you've heard me talk about onthe podcast before, the uptick
(05:05):
in peanut allergy was firstnoted in the 1990s.
We don't know why, but we don'tknow why it was happening then,
right?
But it was noticed morechildren were having
anaphylactic reactions topeanuts than prior, than
previous to that time.
And so expert opinion was well,let's have kids avoid these
foods until their immune systemis more ready for it.
(05:27):
Translation.
Let's delay the introduction ofcommonly allergenic foods.
By 2008, it was pretty clearthat was the wrong thing because
not only peanut but other foodallergies um were increasing in
incidence.
And so in 2008, the AAP walkedback that 2000 guidance um kind
(05:47):
of quietly, really.
Speaker (05:48):
Honestly, I did not know about that.
And I was having childrenaround that time.
So that tells you it was prettyquiet.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Pretty quiet.
Yeah, because there stillwasn't data.
There weren't the studies thatwe have now, which we'll get to
in a minute, that very clearlydemonstrated what we should do.
I mean, it was pretty clearthat delaying it wasn't helping.
So let's get rid of that.
But it was kind of quiet.
And around that same time,Gideon Lack, amazing allergist
(06:17):
researcher, had been noticingthat in Israel they had other
food allergies.
Little kiddos had other foodallergies, but they didn't have
a lot of peanut allergy.
And he's like, hmm, what's upwith that?
And realized, recognized thatone of the first foods babies
get in Israel is this littlepuff called bumba.
(06:38):
It's a little peanut puff, kindof like a Cheeto but peanut,
and like a little babies.
You can just imagine littlebabies kind of like sucking and
gnawing, kind of gnawing on it.
Exposure to peanut much earlierthan two, three years of age,
right?
Like they're babies.
And so he led then the leapstudy, learning early about
(06:58):
peanut that enrolled children atrisk or babies at risk of
developing peanut allergy,meaning he had already
identified that kids with severeeczema or babies with severe
eczema and with egg allergies,they were those two things or
risk factors for peanut allergy,enrolled those kids, had half
of the group start eating peanutbetween four to eleven months
of age at enrollment, and hadthe other group avoid it until
(07:22):
they, until there was achallenge when both groups were
five years of age.
The kids who were eating peanutwere significantly less likely
to have a peanut allergy thanthe kids who had been avoiding
it, demonstrating that earlyintroduction of peanut does
decrease the risk of peanutallergy.
The follow-up to that study hadthe kids who were avoiding it,
(07:44):
or the kids who were eatingpeanut until they were, you
know, at five years of age hadthem stop avoiding it or had
them avoid it.
Wow.
I need to get it together.
Where's my coffee?
Um five years of age.
Um, the kiddos who had beeneating peanut, they said, okay,
well, let's uh let's have youavoid it for a year, rechallenge
(08:04):
them at six years of age, sogave them peanut again at six
years of age, they were stillless likely to have a peanut
allergy.
You might be wondering, well,why'd they have those kids who
are eating it avoiding, uh,start avoiding it for a year?
They wanted to see if this waslike a temporary fix, if they
were just putting a band-aid onsomething.
And then when they kind ofremoved the band-aid, when they
said, okay, avoid no more peanutfor you, no more peanut
band-aid, than if it un unmaskedan allergy, but it it really
(08:29):
didn't.
And so it really demonstratedthat this is a sustained effect
when you get the food into thediet sooner rather than later,
when their babies, four toeleven months of age, the sooner
the better.
Um, that it really has asustained effect of not having
the allergy.
So you're like, okay, Dr.
Hoyt, that was in 2015.
(08:50):
What's the deal now?
Well, it's 2025.
And we know that it does takeabout 10 years for research to
kind of trickle out.
But what this paper inpediatrics demonstrated is that
this effect of decreased amountof peanut allergies and other
food allergies is occurringsince those recommendations were
(09:13):
made in because of that leapstudy.
The leap study is what promptedthat 2015 consensus statement
from the allergy societies tosay, hey, okay, kids should eat
peanut early.
And then 2017, the NIH.
And so what this study wasdemonstrating in pediatrics is
that since those recommendationswere published, the incidence
(09:36):
of peanut allergy and other foodallergies has significantly
decreased, which is amazing.
Like I, as an allergist, like,yes, this is this is what we
knew, like this is what the dataclearly showed, this is what
we're seeing clinically, this iswhat you know we're championing
and we're championing,championing for pediatricians to
(09:57):
really do this because it ishard.
As a pediatrician who haspracticed something for so many
years, it's hard to make achange, especially when you're
concerned that a baby might havea reaction, right?
But this this is what the datasays.
And so for you who list who arelistening, and you have a child
with peanut allergy and you mayhave not been told this, or you
may have been told this, andyour kiddo was just a kiddo
(10:20):
where this didn't work becauseit's not a hundred percent.
Speaker (10:23):
No.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Um, you know, the feelings of this.
And so that's why I wanted tohave Tamara on to talk about the
feelings that some food allergyfamilies are having.
Speaker (10:34):
Yeah.
Well, my family is a family whohas a peanut allergy and was
under the previous guidelines,which now I've just learned
actually, after having been inthis field for this long, I did
not know that there was sort ofthis pause around 2008 saying,
hang on a minute, we know thisisn't right, but we don't quite
know yet what to do.
(10:54):
So that was uh interestingnews.
But we were in that around thattime frame.
And so, yeah, when newinformation like this comes out,
uh for any of us, whether itwas that or maybe we were on
that cusp within those years ofthat guidance changing and and
getting pushed out to thecommunity, we can have a whole
lot of feelings about this,right?
(11:15):
And when we have more than onefeeling that might even be
seemingly contradictory to oneanother, that's called
ambivalence.
And it's completely normal andunderstandable to be ambivalent
about this news.
On one hand, many of us areexcited for the new development
in data, the new development inguidelines, things that are
(11:35):
hopefully going to decrease foodfood allergies and allergic
conditions.
On the other hand, some of usmay be feeling frustration that
this wasn't the case when ourchild was younger and getting
diagnosed.
Um, some of us might feel sadabout that.
Some of us might be angry aboutit.
Uh, and that might give way toeven more feelings.
(11:55):
Guilt, resentment, right?
All of these feelings can getstirred up when news like this
comes out.
We feel both happy and excitedfor the development and
frustrated, sad, angry, guilty,which is not necessary, by the
way.
We'll get into that in amoment.
Hopefully, guilt is notnecessary as an allergy parent,
but we do tend to feel it whenthis kind of information comes
(12:16):
up.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, mom guilt in general,right?
But add something like thisonto it, and it's it's tough,
you know?
Speaker (12:29):
It's hard.
And the one main thing that Ilike to remind people, and I'm
sure you do the same thing, isthat as parents, we're doing the
best we can with theinformation we're given at the
time in which we're dealing withthe challenge.
And so if your child wasdiagnosed years ago like mine
was, that's the information wewere given at that time, and we
did what we could with it,right?
(12:51):
We are not doctors, we are notmost of us.
I can't speak for all of us,we're doctors, we are not
researchers.
And so how would we know that10 years later the guidelines
and the guidance would change?
We wouldn't.
Um, it's this is not unique toallergies and the allergic
disease community.
This happens in all sorts ofhealth condition uh diagnoses
(13:13):
and fields.
We see the evolution ofresearch and data and
guidelines.
Um, even what we see today maychange in 10 years from now.
And so this will keephappening.
New data will come out,feelings will get stirred up.
Um, for some families, youknow, they've been able to sort
of separate themselves enoughfrom that diagnosis period and
(13:37):
move on.
And then this kind ofinformation comes up and it
brings all of that right back tothe surface, right?
Um, so it's about how to handlethat is not to avoid it because
it's going to happen.
The feelings are gonna bethere.
We then have to justacknowledge that, accept that
they're there, let them bethere, process, and move
forward.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
And you talk in your book about different parenting
traps.
Speaker (14:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
Um, how do you feel like this kind of can, I mean,
you have so many so many goodstrategies in your book for
dealing with situations, but isthere a parenting trap that you
feel like parents can fall intowith something like this?
Speaker (14:19):
Yeah, I would say um definitely the certainty trap.
And so the certainty trap iswhen we, you know, we want to be
doubt-free, we want to havezero risk, which is not possible
in life usually.
Um, and we tend it tends todrive behavior like excessive
research, spending time online,not getting sleep or looking
(14:40):
things up.
And so, again, new news andchanges like this can stir up
feelings of, especially for thefamilies who maybe had their
child diagnosed right as thisguidance was changing, or the
couple of years after, and maybetheir pediatrician didn't push
that information out, so theydidn't know.
They might feel like theymissed the boat on this
(15:01):
guidance.
And so they don't want to dothat again.
And so it's a way to avoid morepain or more food allergy
diagnoses or more things tohappen that are, you know,
life-changing.
And so they might seethemselves kind of an uptick in
behaviors where they're tryingto find certainty and make sure
they don't miss anything again,even though likely they didn't
(15:22):
miss it.
It just was a situation at thetime.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
Right.
Right.
You you had an Instagram postthe other day um along these
lines, and you were getting alot in the comments.
Speaker (15:35):
Can you talk a little bit about that?
Yeah, there was a lot of.
Can you watch your handle?
Um, at Food Allergy Counselor.
So that's one of them.
I have a couple, but that's themain one for this purpose.
Um, yeah, so there was a lot ofreally dynamic conversation on
both the Instagram post and theFacebook post.
It was the same post, but um intwo different places.
Families talking just about allof this, right?
(15:58):
All the feelings that come up.
Um, I think they were thrilledthat somebody just sort of put
it out there because I think wecan feel guilty sometimes going,
gosh, I I yes, I'm happy forthe community and the kids who
have avoided peanut allergiesand other allergic uh diagnoses,
but I'm also sad and upset andfeeling, you know, unhappy about
(16:19):
the fact that we didn't.
And so as long as we can justname it and put it out there and
say that it's okay to feel thisway and it's expected to feel
this way.
I think it normalized it forpeople.
And so then they feltcomfortable enough to share
their feelings and theirstories.
And so we had people sharingall of these things that we've
been talking about, and otherscommenting back, going, I I hear
(16:40):
you, I see you.
So what it did was justbasically say, let's be honest.
This can feel hard.
It can feel great, but it canfeel hard too.
And I appreciated that peoplewere vulnerable enough to say
those things.
Um, and we're not judging it.
It is what it is, it's hard andgreat at the same time.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
And did you get anything in the comments about,
well, I did that and it didn'twork, or I was afraid to do
that?
Speaker (17:06):
Yeah, so both.
I saw conversations on both ofthose points.
And that is the hard, an evenharder point still, is if you
followed the guidelines, you didwhat the new guidelines said to
do, and your child was stilldiagnosed with a with a food
allergy.
I think one parent said, um,you know, it's not, what did she
(17:26):
say?
It's not a magic, um, a magicwand.
I'm not using the right phrasethat she said, but it's just a
magic ticket.
That's what she said.
She said, This isn't theguidelines, they are not a magic
ticket.
Speaker 1 (17:36):
Right.
Speaker (17:36):
And I think that that's important to highlight that
even when we do things accordingto the guidance, the new
guidance, it may still not work.
Um for reasons we still don'tknow, and we're trying to figure
that out even still.
That's exactly right.
But that hope is really, reallystrong for families with food
allergies.
Any kind of hope we can hangour hat onto and connect
(18:00):
ourselves to is very strong.
And so when we hope we're gonnahave good outcomes by following
the guidance, and that doesn'thappen, that's gut wrenching.
That's a gut punch, like you'llnever, you know, expect to
feel.
It's it's it's hard.
And so that can bring this backup and and and bring up all
sorts of emotions too, whereunfortunately you didn't get the
magic ticket.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
Right.
Yeah, and I I see that in mypractice where, you know, most
families when they do earlyintroduction, I I exclusively
see families of kids with foodallergies, right?
And so um, when they'repregnant with another child,
we'll focus on doing earlyintroduction.
In most cases, it works.
Now, there are some casesthough where you try to do early
(18:44):
introduction and it's it can becumbersome.
Um, but you try to do it and itdoesn't work.
And so I want to, you know,reassure the families out there
that just and and when if you'relistening, like if you're
listening to this and you'velistened to me talk before, you
know that I am a faithful woman.
(19:04):
I believe that God has a planand that we do not always
understand the plan.
And that for whatever reason,this is the path that we have,
right?
This is this is the path thatwe are on, and we we do the best
we can with that path, um, evenwhen we don't understand it,
even when we hate it, right?
Those are our children thatwe're talking about.
Speaker (19:25):
But we don't have to like any of this, by the way.
Accepting it doesn't mean wehave to like it.
But we don't want to live in,we don't want to live in
rumination and frustration allthe time either.
Right.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
That's exactly right.
And and letting families knowthat even if you had had this
information and you had donethis, it's not a hundred percent
right.
It's not a magic ticket likewhat your commenter said.
And because even when you doit, there are still some kids
that are developing the allergy.
(19:56):
So I also want to encouragefamilies who might be thinking,
oh, well, now there's adecrease.
So now there's gonna be lessstudies about it and less
funding.
I don't see it going that waybecause as a scientist, what I
see is okay, it works in a lotof people, but why isn't it
(20:17):
working in this group?
What's different in this group?
We still have a group to learn.
Speaker (20:20):
We still have things to learn.
I'm glad you brought that upbecause I posted it on another
social media platform and oneperson said something along
those lines if there's adecrease in food allergy
diagnoses for babies, does thatmean we'll have less
accommodations and less focus onit?
And I said, gosh, I hadn'tthought about that, but I really
(20:41):
hope not.
And to your point, you made agood one.
It's not a magic ticket, again,so there's still a lot to
learn, and that doesn't meanthat they don't exist.
There's still a ton of peopleliving with them, and so we
still do need theaccommodations, the education
and the understanding.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
Right.
And if we go back in time tothe 1990s, that's when we
noticed the uptick and we don'tknow what that was about.
Speaker (21:04):
Right.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
And then the problem got worse when we delayed
introduction.
So are we going to go back tolike were those babies who were
developing peanut allergy in the90s?
Were those babies that weren'tbeing exposed to it until later?
Right?
Like, why did those babiesstart developing it in the first
(21:27):
place?
One of the one of the mostcommon questions I get asked is,
well, why are all these foodallergies happening?
And we don't know the answer.
I say, you know, Job had a lotof stuff, but he didn't have
food allergies.
So it really was not a thing.
Allergy itself is a relativelynew condition, really not really
(21:48):
not really reported until the1870s.
Dr.
Thomas Plattsmills has abeautiful article.
Um, it's about 10 years oldnow, actually, on called the
allergy epidemics.
He was asked to write anarticle on the allergy epidemic,
and he said, No, this is not anepidemic.
These are epidemics.
We're talking about seasonalallergies, talking about
(22:11):
childhood asthma, which is oftenan allergic condition, talking
about food allergies, alsotalking about alpha gal allergy,
which is just a horse of atotally different color, right?
Has nothing to do with introearly introduction, not
introduction, has to do withbeing bitten by a tick.
And then you develop an allergyto a sugar that causes delayed
(22:31):
anaphylaxis when you eat redmeat.
It is mind-boggling and notconsistent with other types of
anaphylactic food allergies.
Overall, just highlighting howmuch we don't know.
And while this is amazing news,it is reinforcing what what we
already knew, thanks to Dr.
Lack, thanks to otherresearchers who were doing this
(22:53):
work over a decade ago.
It's not all of the answers.
And if anything, I'm hopefulthat with there being more and
more studies on food allergy,that we are gonna clearly
continue to it's it's like youanswer one question, but then
you have three more questions.
Speaker (23:12):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Right?
Like this isn't going away.
We want it to go away.
We want it to go away, but it'snot going away.
We need to figure out why.
And researchers are working onthat.
There's you know, having a foodallergy is not is not anything
I wish on anybody, right?
Like nobody wants a foodallergy.
But if you're gonna have one,now's the time to have it.
Not five years ago, not 10years ago, not 20 years ago.
(23:36):
It's probably only EpiPen backthen.
Speaker (23:43):
Right, there I think there only was, yeah.
And you can see that divide,you can see that divide, not a
divide in the community wherethey're against each other, but
that sort of that line thatchange in the parents who, you
know, parents of older kidsversus younger kids now.
Um, and so that is hope too.
Again, I I want to reframe thatas hope.
There's hope that there's morefocus on all of this, that
(24:04):
there's hopefully more answerscoming, more information and
knowledge that will also bringup all those mix of feelings
that we feel about the fact thatwe're even in this community.
And so two things I would leavefor those listening is uh lean
into an and mindset.
We can feel happy and sad,excited and frustrated at the
(24:27):
same time about this news.
Let it be there.
Don't fight it, just allow itto be.
Uh, rather than an or.
I can feel happy or I can feelupset about that, right?
No, we can feel multiplefeelings at once.
We can be ambivalent aboutthis, and that is okay.
And the second part of that isto not judge yourself for
feeling that way.
When we're feeling likesomething is hard and
(24:48):
challenging as this might feel,right?
All these feelings about all ofthis new news and development
in the field, we want to meetourselves with self-compassion
because this journey is hardenough as it is, and we don't
need to judge ourselves for thevery real, honest, normal
feelings and responses we'rehaving to this news.
So that might look like saying,hey, yeah, I know I'm feeling a
(25:09):
little angry about that.
Of course I am, that makessense.
You know what?
It's okay.
It's okay to feel all thosefeelings.
You'll get through this, right?
We need to tell ourselves that.
So have all the feelings.
It's okay, you're not the onlyone, and meet yourself with some
self-compassion that it'snormal to feel that way.
Speaker 1 (25:28):
That's so good, Tamara.
I'm so glad.
Um, I'm so glad we're friends,right?
Um, but I'm also so glad thatwe were talking about this, and
I was like, Yeah, this justorganically came up in our
channel.
It really did.
I think you brought it up evenlike, oh, we should do this.
I was like, we a millionpercent should do this.
Speaker (25:47):
Because people are thinking and feeling it.
So let's put it out there,right?
That's the reason why I madethe posts I made this week, is
because as an allergy parent, Ifeel it, right?
As a therapist, I my clients,my patients feel it.
As somebody who's educating thecommunity, I see them feeling
it.
Let's just put it out there,let's normalize it, let's talk
about it.
It's okay.
I love it.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Tamara, thank you so much for coming back on the
show.
And if you're listening,definitely get Tamara's book,
May Contain Anxiety.
It is it is so good, and it hasso many great strategies, not
just for food allergy, but justin general, just like your and
you can feel this and this.
I think that's great.
Speaker (26:28):
Thank you.
Yeah, a lot of that stuff thatI have in there can apply just
in general.
Even my editor who's not anallergy parent was reading one
chapter going, that was reallyhelpful for what was going on
for me this week.
So yeah, thanks for the thanksfor the endorsement and the
encouragement.
I appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (26:42):
You're welcome.
Well, like I told you the otherday, if everybody would read
this, if all my patients wouldread this, I'm amazing patients,
but if all of the allergypatients would read this, it
would make it make everybodyfeel so much more at peace.
And because like you you'vesaid before, like nothing's ever
100% risk-free.
But when you're able to to toplan, when you're able to manage
(27:06):
how you're feeling, when you'refeeling it, um, when you're
able, I know you talk a lotabout clearly anxiety in the
book, and when you're able touse anxiety as a tool and not
let it control you, it can be sohelpful, not just in you and
your kiddo's food allergyjourney, but just your your
lives in general.
So thank you so much.
I love this.
I love your book.
Speaker (27:26):
You're welcome.
And people can read or listento it because it's uh it's an
audiobook as well.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
So well done, ma'am.
Well done.
Okay, we'll talk soon.
Speaker (27:34):
Sounds good.
Thanks for having me on.
Great chat.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
Thanks so much for tuning in.
Remember, I'm an allergist, butI'm not your allergist.
So talk with your allergistabout what you learned today.
Like, subscribe, share thiswith your friends, and go to
foodallergy in your kiddos.comwhere you can join our
newsletter.
God bless you, and God blessyour family.
Hello and welcome to Food Allergy and Your Kiddo.
I'm your host, Dr.
Alice Hoyt.
Delighted to have my friend andcolleague, Tamara Hubbard, back
on the podcast.
Hey Tamara, how are you?
I'm good.
How are you?
I'm great.
Thanks so much for joining meback today.
Um, and so soon after our lastdiscussion, where I was
(00:27):
delighted to share your book,May Contain Anxiety.
Speaker (00:30):
How's it going?
So far, so good.
We just had a wonderful eventto celebrate its birth into the
world and um getting young.
It is like birthing a baby.
Writing a book is kind of likegrowing and birthing a baby.
So that's how I've beenreferencing it.
But it's going well.
And um more than that, I'mhearing it's helping people,
families, and that was theintention behind it.
(00:51):
So that makes me happy.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
That's so awesome.
Yeah, if if you're listening,you haven't checked out that
episode or interviewed Tamara onher book, May Contain Anxiety,
Managing the Overwhelm ofParenting Children with Food
Allergies.
You should totally check itout.
Um, if you don't know Tamra,she's a licensed clinical
professional counselor andfamily therapist, all about
(01:15):
evidence-based therapeuticsupport.
She really is, um, she's reallyamazing.
Tamra and I work together onwhat's now the Academy of Food
Allergy Counseling.
You want to talk a little bitabout that before we dive into
what we're talking about, whichis some recent food allergy news
and how it's impacting foodallergy families?
Speaker (01:36):
Yeah, because I think it could relate and be useful
for some people.
And it's really just the topicwe're talking about.
So the Academy of Food AllergyCounseling is an organization,
nonprofit organization that Icreated initially called the
Food Allergy CounselingProfessional Network.
And one of its resources is thewell-known Food Allergy
Counseling Directory that helpsfamilies and clinicians connect
(01:59):
with allergy-informed, licensedmental health professionals in
their state or in their area ofthe world.
And then, so that's what'sfacing the community and the
practitioners.
But what's facing the therapistand what's useful for the
therapists at the Academy ofFood Allergy Counseling is a
network of those of us workingin the food allergy and allergic
disease counseling niche.
(02:19):
And then we're also nowproviding education for
therapists to help bring more ofthem into the fold.
So it's all about supportingthe community with food
allergies and allergicconditions, supporting their
emotional and mental health andwellness needs.
So yeah, very proud of theorganization and everything
that's come from it.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
It's amazing.
It really is amazing.
And that's, you know, why Iguess last, I don't know, the
last few years when you've beenreally building it, and then you
know, we had been talking andand how to continue growing this
really just amazing, amazingnetwork for therapists, for
families, you know, bringing itinto the Teal Schoolhouse
(03:00):
family, which supports theCodana organization that I lead.
It's it's just been such awonderful, it's I mean, I love
working with you.
You know that, Tamara.
Yeah.
Um, but I do it's it's such awonderful resource.
And so if you haven't checkedout the Academy of Food Allergy
Counseling, definitely check itout.
If you have a kiddo with foodallergy, chances are, you do if
(03:23):
you're listening to this podcastor you love a child who has a
food allergy, check it out.
There are definitely timeswhere all of us can benefit from
having some some guidance whenwe're going going through
something, and especially havinga kiddo with a food allergy.
Um, you know, just parenting ingeneral, it's like, okay, I'm
I'm doing great in this seasonof life, and then that season's
(03:43):
over, and then you're figuringout the next thing, right,
Tamra?
Speaker (03:47):
Yep, absolutely.
The only constant in life ischange, and so that that applies
here too.
Yep.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
That is so true.
That's so true.
And, you know, change, there isa little bit of change um going
on.
And that's that's why I wantedto have you back today because
we were talking offline aboutstuff.
Um, Tamara and I, or fulldisclosure, Tamara and I are
friends, and we talk a lot aboutum life and food allergy life.
And recently there was a studypublished in Pediatrics, which
(04:18):
is the journal of the AmericanAcademy of Pediatrics.
And what the study demonstratedwas that early, the early
introduction of peanutrecommendations that were made
in 2015 through a consensusstatement, and then in 2017
through the National Institutesof Health, specifically the
National Institute of Allergyand Infectious Disease, the N I
(04:41):
A I D, they updated theirguidelines in 2017 to encourage
introduction of peanut aroundfour to six months of age.
So much earlier than theprevious guidance.
The previous guidance, um, andI'll I'll back up a little bit,
as you've heard me talk about onthe podcast before, the uptick
(05:05):
in peanut allergy was firstnoted in the 1990s.
We don't know why, but we don'tknow why it was happening then,
right?
But it was noticed morechildren were having
anaphylactic reactions topeanuts than prior, than
previous to that time.
And so expert opinion was well,let's have kids avoid these
foods until their immune systemis more ready for it.
(05:27):
Translation.
Let's delay the introduction ofcommonly allergenic foods.
By 2008, it was pretty clearthat was the wrong thing because
not only peanut but other foodallergies um were increasing in
incidence.
And so in 2008, the AAP walkedback that 2000 guidance um kind
(05:47):
of quietly, really.
Speaker (05:48):
Honestly, I did not know about that.
And I was having childrenaround that time.
So that tells you it was prettyquiet.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Pretty quiet.
Yeah, because there stillwasn't data.
There weren't the studies thatwe have now, which we'll get to
in a minute, that very clearlydemonstrated what we should do.
I mean, it was pretty clearthat delaying it wasn't helping.
So let's get rid of that.
But it was kind of quiet.
And around that same time,Gideon Lack, amazing allergist
(06:17):
researcher, had been noticingthat in Israel they had other
food allergies.
Little kiddos had other foodallergies, but they didn't have
a lot of peanut allergy.
And he's like, hmm, what's upwith that?
And realized, recognized thatone of the first foods babies
get in Israel is this littlepuff called bumba.
(06:38):
It's a little peanut puff, kindof like a Cheeto but peanut,
and like a little babies.
You can just imagine littlebabies kind of like sucking and
gnawing, kind of gnawing on it.
Exposure to peanut much earlierthan two, three years of age,
right?
Like they're babies.
And so he led then the leapstudy, learning early about
(06:58):
peanut that enrolled children atrisk or babies at risk of
developing peanut allergy,meaning he had already
identified that kids with severeeczema or babies with severe
eczema and with egg allergies,they were those two things or
risk factors for peanut allergy,enrolled those kids, had half
of the group start eating peanutbetween four to eleven months
of age at enrollment, and hadthe other group avoid it until
(07:22):
they, until there was achallenge when both groups were
five years of age.
The kids who were eating peanutwere significantly less likely
to have a peanut allergy thanthe kids who had been avoiding
it, demonstrating that earlyintroduction of peanut does
decrease the risk of peanutallergy.
The follow-up to that study hadthe kids who were avoiding it,
(07:44):
or the kids who were eatingpeanut until they were, you
know, at five years of age hadthem stop avoiding it or had
them avoid it.
Wow.
I need to get it together.
Where's my coffee?
Um five years of age.
Um, the kiddos who had beeneating peanut, they said, okay,
well, let's uh let's have youavoid it for a year, rechallenge
(08:04):
them at six years of age, sogave them peanut again at six
years of age, they were stillless likely to have a peanut
allergy.
You might be wondering, well,why'd they have those kids who
are eating it avoiding, uh,start avoiding it for a year?
They wanted to see if this waslike a temporary fix, if they
were just putting a band-aid onsomething.
And then when they kind ofremoved the band-aid, when they
said, okay, avoid no more peanutfor you, no more peanut
band-aid, than if it un unmaskedan allergy, but it it really
(08:29):
didn't.
And so it really demonstratedthat this is a sustained effect
when you get the food into thediet sooner rather than later,
when their babies, four toeleven months of age, the sooner
the better.
Um, that it really has asustained effect of not having
the allergy.
So you're like, okay, Dr.
Hoyt, that was in 2015.
(08:50):
What's the deal now?
Well, it's 2025.
And we know that it does takeabout 10 years for research to
kind of trickle out.
But what this paper inpediatrics demonstrated is that
this effect of decreased amountof peanut allergies and other
food allergies is occurringsince those recommendations were
(09:13):
made in because of that leapstudy.
The leap study is what promptedthat 2015 consensus statement
from the allergy societies tosay, hey, okay, kids should eat
peanut early.
And then 2017, the NIH.
And so what this study wasdemonstrating in pediatrics is
that since those recommendationswere published, the incidence
(09:36):
of peanut allergy and other foodallergies has significantly
decreased, which is amazing.
Like I, as an allergist, like,yes, this is this is what we
knew, like this is what the dataclearly showed, this is what
we're seeing clinically, this iswhat you know we're championing
and we're championing,championing for pediatricians to
(09:57):
really do this because it ishard.
As a pediatrician who haspracticed something for so many
years, it's hard to make achange, especially when you're
concerned that a baby might havea reaction, right?
But this this is what the datasays.
And so for you who list who arelistening, and you have a child
with peanut allergy and you mayhave not been told this, or you
may have been told this, andyour kiddo was just a kiddo
(10:20):
where this didn't work becauseit's not a hundred percent.
Speaker (10:23):
No.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Um, you know, the feelings of this.
And so that's why I wanted tohave Tamara on to talk about the
feelings that some food allergyfamilies are having.
Speaker (10:34):
Yeah.
Well, my family is a family whohas a peanut allergy and was
under the previous guidelines,which now I've just learned
actually, after having been inthis field for this long, I did
not know that there was sort ofthis pause around 2008 saying,
hang on a minute, we know thisisn't right, but we don't quite
know yet what to do.
(10:54):
So that was uh interestingnews.
But we were in that around thattime frame.
And so, yeah, when newinformation like this comes out,
uh for any of us, whether itwas that or maybe we were on
that cusp within those years ofthat guidance changing and and
getting pushed out to thecommunity, we can have a whole
lot of feelings about this,right?
(11:15):
And when we have more than onefeeling that might even be
seemingly contradictory to oneanother, that's called
ambivalence.
And it's completely normal andunderstandable to be ambivalent
about this news.
On one hand, many of us areexcited for the new development
in data, the new development inguidelines, things that are
(11:35):
hopefully going to decrease foodfood allergies and allergic
conditions.
On the other hand, some of usmay be feeling frustration that
this wasn't the case when ourchild was younger and getting
diagnosed.
Um, some of us might feel sadabout that.
Some of us might be angry aboutit.
Uh, and that might give way toeven more feelings.
(11:55):
Guilt, resentment, right?
All of these feelings can getstirred up when news like this
comes out.
We feel both happy and excitedfor the development and
frustrated, sad, angry, guilty,which is not necessary, by the
way.
We'll get into that in amoment.
Hopefully, guilt is notnecessary as an allergy parent,
but we do tend to feel it whenthis kind of information comes
(12:16):
up.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, mom guilt in general,right?
But add something like thisonto it, and it's it's tough,
you know?
Speaker (12:29):
It's hard.
And the one main thing that Ilike to remind people, and I'm
sure you do the same thing, isthat as parents, we're doing the
best we can with theinformation we're given at the
time in which we're dealing withthe challenge.
And so if your child wasdiagnosed years ago like mine
was, that's the information wewere given at that time, and we
did what we could with it,right?
(12:51):
We are not doctors, we are notmost of us.
I can't speak for all of us,we're doctors, we are not
researchers.
And so how would we know that10 years later the guidelines
and the guidance would change?
We wouldn't.
Um, it's this is not unique toallergies and the allergic
disease community.
This happens in all sorts ofhealth condition uh diagnoses
(13:13):
and fields.
We see the evolution ofresearch and data and
guidelines.
Um, even what we see today maychange in 10 years from now.
And so this will keephappening.
New data will come out,feelings will get stirred up.
Um, for some families, youknow, they've been able to sort
of separate themselves enoughfrom that diagnosis period and
(13:37):
move on.
And then this kind ofinformation comes up and it
brings all of that right back tothe surface, right?
Um, so it's about how to handlethat is not to avoid it because
it's going to happen.
The feelings are gonna bethere.
We then have to justacknowledge that, accept that
they're there, let them bethere, process, and move
forward.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
And you talk in your book about different parenting
traps.
Speaker (14:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
Um, how do you feel like this kind of can, I mean,
you have so many so many goodstrategies in your book for
dealing with situations, but isthere a parenting trap that you
feel like parents can fall intowith something like this?
Speaker (14:19):
Yeah, I would say um definitely the certainty trap.
And so the certainty trap iswhen we, you know, we want to be
doubt-free, we want to havezero risk, which is not possible
in life usually.
Um, and we tend it tends todrive behavior like excessive
research, spending time online,not getting sleep or looking
(14:40):
things up.
And so, again, new news andchanges like this can stir up
feelings of, especially for thefamilies who maybe had their
child diagnosed right as thisguidance was changing, or the
couple of years after, and maybetheir pediatrician didn't push
that information out, so theydidn't know.
They might feel like theymissed the boat on this
(15:01):
guidance.
And so they don't want to dothat again.
And so it's a way to avoid morepain or more food allergy
diagnoses or more things tohappen that are, you know,
life-changing.
And so they might seethemselves kind of an uptick in
behaviors where they're tryingto find certainty and make sure
they don't miss anything again,even though likely they didn't
(15:22):
miss it.
It just was a situation at thetime.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
Right.
Right.
You you had an Instagram postthe other day um along these
lines, and you were getting alot in the comments.
Speaker (15:35):
Can you talk a little bit about that?
Yeah, there was a lot of.
Can you watch your handle?
Um, at Food Allergy Counselor.
So that's one of them.
I have a couple, but that's themain one for this purpose.
Um, yeah, so there was a lot ofreally dynamic conversation on
both the Instagram post and theFacebook post.
It was the same post, but um intwo different places.
Families talking just about allof this, right?
(15:58):
All the feelings that come up.
Um, I think they were thrilledthat somebody just sort of put
it out there because I think wecan feel guilty sometimes going,
gosh, I I yes, I'm happy forthe community and the kids who
have avoided peanut allergiesand other allergic uh diagnoses,
but I'm also sad and upset andfeeling, you know, unhappy about
(16:19):
the fact that we didn't.
And so as long as we can justname it and put it out there and
say that it's okay to feel thisway and it's expected to feel
this way.
I think it normalized it forpeople.
And so then they feltcomfortable enough to share
their feelings and theirstories.
And so we had people sharingall of these things that we've
been talking about, and otherscommenting back, going, I I hear
(16:40):
you, I see you.
So what it did was justbasically say, let's be honest.
This can feel hard.
It can feel great, but it canfeel hard too.
And I appreciated that peoplewere vulnerable enough to say
those things.
Um, and we're not judging it.
It is what it is, it's hard andgreat at the same time.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
And did you get anything in the comments about,
well, I did that and it didn'twork, or I was afraid to do
that?
Speaker (17:06):
Yeah, so both.
I saw conversations on both ofthose points.
And that is the hard, an evenharder point still, is if you
followed the guidelines, you didwhat the new guidelines said to
do, and your child was stilldiagnosed with a with a food
allergy.
I think one parent said, um,you know, it's not, what did she
(17:26):
say?
It's not a magic, um, a magicwand.
I'm not using the right phrasethat she said, but it's just a
magic ticket.
That's what she said.
She said, This isn't theguidelines, they are not a magic
ticket.
Speaker 1 (17:36):
Right.
Speaker (17:36):
And I think that that's important to highlight that
even when we do things accordingto the guidance, the new
guidance, it may still not work.
Um for reasons we still don'tknow, and we're trying to figure
that out even still.
That's exactly right.
But that hope is really, reallystrong for families with food
allergies.
Any kind of hope we can hangour hat onto and connect
(18:00):
ourselves to is very strong.
And so when we hope we're gonnahave good outcomes by following
the guidance, and that doesn'thappen, that's gut wrenching.
That's a gut punch, like you'llnever, you know, expect to
feel.
It's it's it's hard.
And so that can bring this backup and and and bring up all
sorts of emotions too, whereunfortunately you didn't get the
magic ticket.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
Right.
Yeah, and I I see that in mypractice where, you know, most
families when they do earlyintroduction, I I exclusively
see families of kids with foodallergies, right?
And so um, when they'repregnant with another child,
we'll focus on doing earlyintroduction.
In most cases, it works.
Now, there are some casesthough where you try to do early
(18:44):
introduction and it's it can becumbersome.
Um, but you try to do it and itdoesn't work.
And so I want to, you know,reassure the families out there
that just and and when if you'relistening, like if you're
listening to this and you'velistened to me talk before, you
know that I am a faithful woman.
(19:04):
I believe that God has a planand that we do not always
understand the plan.
And that for whatever reason,this is the path that we have,
right?
This is this is the path thatwe are on, and we we do the best
we can with that path, um, evenwhen we don't understand it,
even when we hate it, right?
Those are our children thatwe're talking about.
Speaker (19:25):
But we don't have to like any of this, by the way.
Accepting it doesn't mean wehave to like it.
But we don't want to live in,we don't want to live in
rumination and frustration allthe time either.
Right.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
That's exactly right.
And and letting families knowthat even if you had had this
information and you had donethis, it's not a hundred percent
right.
It's not a magic ticket likewhat your commenter said.
And because even when you doit, there are still some kids
that are developing the allergy.
(19:56):
So I also want to encouragefamilies who might be thinking,
oh, well, now there's adecrease.
So now there's gonna be lessstudies about it and less
funding.
I don't see it going that waybecause as a scientist, what I
see is okay, it works in a lotof people, but why isn't it
(20:17):
working in this group?
What's different in this group?
We still have a group to learn.
Speaker (20:20):
We still have things to learn.
I'm glad you brought that upbecause I posted it on another
social media platform and oneperson said something along
those lines if there's adecrease in food allergy
diagnoses for babies, does thatmean we'll have less
accommodations and less focus onit?
And I said, gosh, I hadn'tthought about that, but I really
(20:41):
hope not.
And to your point, you made agood one.
It's not a magic ticket, again,so there's still a lot to
learn, and that doesn't meanthat they don't exist.
There's still a ton of peopleliving with them, and so we
still do need theaccommodations, the education
and the understanding.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
Right.
And if we go back in time tothe 1990s, that's when we
noticed the uptick and we don'tknow what that was about.
Speaker (21:04):
Right.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
And then the problem got worse when we delayed
introduction.
So are we going to go back tolike were those babies who were
developing peanut allergy in the90s?
Were those babies that weren'tbeing exposed to it until later?
Right?
Like, why did those babiesstart developing it in the first
(21:27):
place?
One of the one of the mostcommon questions I get asked is,
well, why are all these foodallergies happening?
And we don't know the answer.
I say, you know, Job had a lotof stuff, but he didn't have
food allergies.
So it really was not a thing.
Allergy itself is a relativelynew condition, really not really
(21:48):
not really reported until the1870s.
Dr.
Thomas Plattsmills has abeautiful article.
Um, it's about 10 years oldnow, actually, on called the
allergy epidemics.
He was asked to write anarticle on the allergy epidemic,
and he said, No, this is not anepidemic.
These are epidemics.
We're talking about seasonalallergies, talking about
(22:11):
childhood asthma, which is oftenan allergic condition, talking
about food allergies, alsotalking about alpha gal allergy,
which is just a horse of atotally different color, right?
Has nothing to do with introearly introduction, not
introduction, has to do withbeing bitten by a tick.
And then you develop an allergyto a sugar that causes delayed
(22:31):
anaphylaxis when you eat redmeat.
It is mind-boggling and notconsistent with other types of
anaphylactic food allergies.
Overall, just highlighting howmuch we don't know.
And while this is amazing news,it is reinforcing what what we
already knew, thanks to Dr.
Lack, thanks to otherresearchers who were doing this
(22:53):
work over a decade ago.
It's not all of the answers.
And if anything, I'm hopefulthat with there being more and
more studies on food allergy,that we are gonna clearly
continue to it's it's like youanswer one question, but then
you have three more questions.
Speaker (23:12):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Right?
Like this isn't going away.
We want it to go away.
We want it to go away, but it'snot going away.
We need to figure out why.
And researchers are working onthat.
There's you know, having a foodallergy is not is not anything
I wish on anybody, right?
Like nobody wants a foodallergy.
But if you're gonna have one,now's the time to have it.
Not five years ago, not 10years ago, not 20 years ago.
(23:36):
It's probably only EpiPen backthen.
Speaker (23:43):
Right, there I think there only was, yeah.
And you can see that divide,you can see that divide, not a
divide in the community wherethey're against each other, but
that sort of that line thatchange in the parents who, you
know, parents of older kidsversus younger kids now.
Um, and so that is hope too.
Again, I I want to reframe thatas hope.
There's hope that there's morefocus on all of this, that
(24:04):
there's hopefully more answerscoming, more information and
knowledge that will also bringup all those mix of feelings
that we feel about the fact thatwe're even in this community.
And so two things I would leavefor those listening is uh lean
into an and mindset.
We can feel happy and sad,excited and frustrated at the
(24:27):
same time about this news.
Let it be there.
Don't fight it, just allow itto be.
Uh, rather than an or.
I can feel happy or I can feelupset about that, right?
No, we can feel multiplefeelings at once.
We can be ambivalent aboutthis, and that is okay.
And the second part of that isto not judge yourself for
feeling that way.
When we're feeling likesomething is hard and
(24:48):
challenging as this might feel,right?
All these feelings about all ofthis new news and development
in the field, we want to meetourselves with self-compassion
because this journey is hardenough as it is, and we don't
need to judge ourselves for thevery real, honest, normal
feelings and responses we'rehaving to this news.
So that might look like saying,hey, yeah, I know I'm feeling a
(25:09):
little angry about that.
Of course I am, that makessense.
You know what?
It's okay.
It's okay to feel all thosefeelings.
You'll get through this, right?
We need to tell ourselves that.
So have all the feelings.
It's okay, you're not the onlyone, and meet yourself with some
self-compassion that it'snormal to feel that way.
Speaker 1 (25:28):
That's so good, Tamara.
I'm so glad.
Um, I'm so glad we're friends,right?
Um, but I'm also so glad thatwe were talking about this, and
I was like, Yeah, this justorganically came up in our
channel.
It really did.
I think you brought it up evenlike, oh, we should do this.
I was like, we a millionpercent should do this.
Speaker (25:47):
Because people are thinking and feeling it.
So let's put it out there,right?
That's the reason why I madethe posts I made this week, is
because as an allergy parent, Ifeel it, right?
As a therapist, I my clients,my patients feel it.
As somebody who's educating thecommunity, I see them feeling
it.
Let's just put it out there,let's normalize it, let's talk
about it.
It's okay.
I love it.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Tamara, thank you so much for coming back on the
show.
And if you're listening,definitely get Tamara's book,
May Contain Anxiety.
It is it is so good, and it hasso many great strategies, not
just for food allergy, but justin general, just like your and
you can feel this and this.
I think that's great.
Speaker (26:28):
Thank you.
Yeah, a lot of that stuff thatI have in there can apply just
in general.
Even my editor who's not anallergy parent was reading one
chapter going, that was reallyhelpful for what was going on
for me this week.
So yeah, thanks for the thanksfor the endorsement and the
encouragement.
I appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (26:42):
You're welcome.
Well, like I told you the otherday, if everybody would read
this, if all my patients wouldread this, I'm amazing patients,
but if all of the allergypatients would read this, it
would make it make everybodyfeel so much more at peace.
And because like you you'vesaid before, like nothing's ever
100% risk-free.
But when you're able to to toplan, when you're able to manage
(27:06):
how you're feeling, when you'refeeling it, um, when you're
able, I know you talk a lotabout clearly anxiety in the
book, and when you're able touse anxiety as a tool and not
let it control you, it can be sohelpful, not just in you and
your kiddo's food allergyjourney, but just your your
lives in general.
So thank you so much.
I love this.
I love your book.
Speaker (27:26):
You're welcome.
And people can read or listento it because it's uh it's an
audiobook as well.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
So well done, ma'am.
Well done.
Okay, we'll talk soon.
Speaker (27:34):
Sounds good.
Thanks for having me on.
Great chat.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
Thanks so much for tuning in.
Remember, I'm an allergist, butI'm not your allergist.
So talk with your allergistabout what you learned today.
Like, subscribe, share thiswith your friends, and go to
foodallergy in your kiddos.comwhere you can join our
newsletter.
God bless you, and God blessyour family.
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