January 25, 2024 • 40 mins
Making an impact in healthcare, but on your terms.
Imagine replacing the relentless hours of shift work with the autonomy to set your own schedule, all while continuing to make a profound impact on patients' lives. Carolyn Marshall (The Mama Coach) is a Registered Nurse who now owns a private practice in Sudbury, Ontario.
Key Takeaways:
- Career pivots for nurses who want to transition away from night shifts
- How the Mama Coach certification process works and who qualifies
- Ways nurses can bring their skills into a business and become an entrepreneur
- How to market your small business / private practice
- Overcoming lifestyle and health challenges resulting from shift work
This episode will inspire healthcare professionals to contemplate the rich opportunities in personalized services such as lactation consulting and prenatal education.
Support the show:
☕️buymeacoffee.com/whatsyourfree
About the show:
Sam Laliberte - entrepreneur, digital nomad and freedom seeker, hosts the Freedom Lifestyle Podcast to expose people to the many ways you can design your dream life and unlock your own version of the freedom lifestyle. Her guests have empowered themselves through flexible work as a way to “have it all” - financial, location AND schedule freedom.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
I left my staff nurse job to go get my masters and
then I like leaped into anotherjob, like that's not it.
So then I just keep leapinguntil I'm happy.
I think it's also a goodreminder that like a pension
isn't worth being unhappy for.
Are you happy now?
So happy, I'm so much happier.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
You're listening to the Freedom Lifestyle podcast
series.
I'm sharing relatable storiesof freedom seekers who ditched
conventional office life andcourageously asked for more.
The energy just completelyshifted my entire being just
felt so free.
My business was stillgenerating income while I was on
the beach.
I decided to quit and just stayat home.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
I really can't work for anyone but me.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
It's literally just doing whatever the hell you want
to do.
As for me, I'm your host, sam,and I've spent the last four
years creating a business thatallows me to work from anywhere.
The Freedom Lifestyle looksdifferent for everyone.
What's your free?
You're listening to a newepisode of the Freedom Lifestyle
podcast, where I sharerelatable stories from everyday
(01:08):
people who have found a way toleverage flexible work
arrangements to design theirlives.
If you are new here, welcome.
I'm so excited to introduce youto this week's speaker.
And if you've been listeningfor a while, please make sure
you hit subscribe or follow onyour app and maybe even leave me
a short review.
It really helps more freedomseekers find this show.
(01:30):
If you're new here, give it alisten.
If you love it, then maybe youwant to hit subscribe at the end
.
So today's freedom seeker isCarolyn Marshall, who is a
registered nurse who now owns aprivate practice.
What's really interesting aboutCarolyn is I have got a lot of
nurses in my family, in myfriend group, and most of them
(01:55):
are not very happy about thelifestyle it provides.
If you know any nurses, youknow that one, they're heroes,
but two, they're typically doing12-hour shifts, 7pm to 7am or
7am to 7pm so hard on your body,so hard on your lifestyle, so
hard on your relationships.
And this was Carolyn'sexperience, and she basically
(02:17):
didn't settle for that lifestyle.
While she loved the impact shewas making as a nurse and
specifically she wanted tocontinue to support women and
women's health, she knew that noamount of security or pension
or any of the perks and benefitsshe got as a nurse was worth
her being unhappy forever.
So after five years of being anacute nurse, working those
(02:39):
12-hour shifts, she thentransitioned to more of a
clinical setting where she was anurse educator working 9-5
hours.
Amazing thinking okay, this isnow my path to a better
lifestyle, turns out in manyways it got even worse and now
she's almost three years intonurse entrepreneurship.
She has now created her ownbusiness.
(03:01):
You can find her onlinethemumicoachcarolin, on
Instagram, and now she's aregistered nurse who shares
science-backed parenting tips,from childbirth defeating to
sleep and more.
She really helps you navigateparenthood with her and with the
support of a nurse.
So we learned a lot about whateven are your options when you
(03:23):
are a nurse who's unhappy withshift work and what different
paths can you pursue.
How she made this transition tobecoming a nurse entrepreneur,
figuring out what her offerswere going to be, what she
wanted to specialize in and, ofcourse, learning how to become
an entrepreneur.
Now it's up to her to acquireall of her customers, to market
herself and to set up herbusiness in a way that's going
(03:45):
to be sustainable and supporther lifestyle long term.
Three years in, carolyn ishappy and on track to be well
surpassing all of the perks andbenefits she had in that more
secure path.
This is an amazing conversation.
Know for the delay.
Meet Carolyn.
Carolyn, welcome to the FreedomLifestyle podcast.
(04:07):
How's your day going today?
Good, pretty good.
How are you?
I'm good.
I'm ending my day with thisinterview.
I've been so looking forward tospeaking with you.
As I mentioned in our littlepreview call before we hopped on
, I have so many nurses in myfamily who are struggling with
the lifestyle, and so when youreached out to me with an update
(04:28):
on what's been going on in yourlife, I was just so excited to
have you on the show.
Speaker 1 (04:32):
I'm so excited to be able to share that with you,
because a lot of nurses we don'tget taught to be entrepreneurs
in nursing school Totally.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
So let's start off with an easy one.
I ask all my guests where areyou taking this call today and
what would you normally be doingright now if you weren't on
this call with me?
Speaker 1 (04:51):
So I'm from Sudbury, Ontario, and that is where I am
today.
I'm in my home office, which Iwork out of.
Most of the time I workvirtually, but I also work in
home with other clients.
I wasn't on this call today.
I might be, at a home birth.
So I'm working on acertification for a child birth
certification and I'm trying toobserve out of hospital birth.
(05:13):
So I might be doing that, but Iwould say a typical day I would
probably be finishing upcharting and sending a plan to a
private client.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
And how much of that is a contrast to your old life.
How were you living before?
That wasn't working for you?
What would you normally bedoing right now, then, in your
old life?
Speaker 1 (05:33):
When I left the acute care system in hospital.
It'll be two years, two and ahalf years, and I think I would
be rushing home right now.
I didn't really live far fromthe hospital, because if you're
from Sudbury nothing's that far,but I would probably be very
unhappy when I came home andthen rushing to do dinner and
sometimes taking that out on mypartner.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
Yeah, yeah, totally fair, because it was the 12 hour
shifts, right?
You're either doing.
Is it like 6 am to 6 pm or 6 pmto 6 pm?
How does it work?
It depends where you work.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
When I was a staff nurse, I would work 7 to 7,
which was a long day, whether itstarted at night or in the
morning.
In my last five years in mycareer at the hospital, I was a
nurse educator, so I did work myday to Friday.
Technically my hours were 7.30to 3.30, but I often stayed till
4.30 or later.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Hmm.
So even when you made thatshift, it still felt like a
grind and you were just reallytired.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
If anything, I would say it got worse being a staff
nurse.
There are advantages to that,even when I compared it to my
transition into the educatorrole.
When you leave for the day,you're done, there's no more.
You go home and you make thecare is transitioned to the next
nurse, and it's just on thiscontinuous pattern.
When I was the educator, thatwas not the experience that I
(06:54):
had.
Whatever I didn't finish, I hadto finish the next day and more
projects would get piled upwhere you identify more needs,
so it never really felt like Iwas finished.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
That's interesting.
You say that because a lot ofpeople say that about
entrepreneurs.
They say, well, you're alwayson, you're never not building
your business, you're not everthinking about growth, you're
just always on as anentrepreneur.
Do you feel like that's true?
Speaker 1 (07:20):
I do, but it feels so much different because it's for
me, as opposed to being givengoals that you have to work
towards from someone else, thatcan feel a little bit more
empowering.
I do something because I wantto and it feels less like work.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Amazing.
I want to dive into thesebusiness models but I am curious
a little bit about yourpersonal story and how you got
into nursing as a career.
We both grew up in Sudbury,ontario.
We were in the similar networks.
I know what the limitationswere like for me, the guidance
counselors, and what my pathswere.
(07:56):
I was told I should be anaccountant and that was the
career path that was recommendedfor me.
So what can you tell us abouthigh school and choosing to
pursue nursing, and whatoriginally connected you to this
career path?
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Honestly, high school I think I knew I wanted to be
in healthcare.
I really liked anatomy andbiological science.
There are some restrictions interms of what nursing schools
you could go to, depending onthe math courses you took.
I felt safe staying in Sudbury,so I did stay here, but I think
what really led me to it was Ireally liked helping people in
crisis.
I have a strong passion forwomen's health and children and
(08:34):
babies, so it seemed like anatural fit to go into nursing.
There's not a lot of helpthat's completely focused in
women and children.
I did at one point think aboutgoing into midwifery, but then I
learned more about that careerand that's not for me.
A lot of on-call, a lot ofdoctors they don't really have a
schedule.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Got it Okay.
The lifestyle piece I know is abig shocker for a lot of nurses
At least the nurses in my life.
They're similar to what yousaid, just natural caretakers in
a lot of the sense, reallyinterested in science and health
, wanting to take care of people, have the capacity to take care
(09:14):
of people.
Honestly, thank goodness,because I don't have any of
those traits.
I really don't.
That's just me totally beinghonest.
That's not natural for me to bethat way.
I can provide value and supportpeople in other ways.
But nurses really are heroes inso many ways.
But then I feel like they becomenurses, which is a competitive
(09:36):
industry in school to get into.
They're hard programs.
You have to excel in educationprior to that and you are
working hard.
Then all of a sudden you getintroduced to shift work.
That is typically when I seethem start to break.
To me, we should be talking toyoung people about what is that
lifestyle going to be like,because you can predict it ahead
(09:57):
of time.
Were you ever thinking aboutwhat would your day-to-day look
like when you were pursuing thatcareer?
What were you focused on whenyou were pursuing it?
Speaker 1 (10:06):
No, you don't even think about it.
You just know that that's whereyou're going to go.
Most people do work in shiftwork and most people do move
right into acute care becauseit's the best paying job that
you can get as a nurse,especially as an entry-level
nurse.
You're totally right, it is abit of a culture shock to miss
things.
You graduate, maybe you're 23,24,.
(10:28):
All your friends have everyweekend off.
You don't.
You work holidays.
I thought I would get used toit.
I think I thought I would justget used to it and I never did.
Every holiday I missed with myfamily, I took it really hard.
I was a missed opportunity.
You almost feel a little bitguilty about that because you
see so many other nurses come inon their days off to work
(10:51):
holidays and get over time andmake extra money or just
volunteer to come in.
You feel guilty that you're notokay with it, but I think we
don't get permission to be like.
I don't like shift work.
It was also really hard on mybody.
The first year that I worked Ihad a lot of heartburn, which I
later found out is very common.
(11:12):
When you work a lot of nightshifts, your circadian rhythm is
all messed up, so I did end upon medication for a couple of
months just to settle her down.
It's awkward.
You also don't get a lot oftime to.
You don't get your schedule toomany months in advance, so when
friends are making plans likesix months from now, you have no
idea if you can commit to suchplans.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
And what was the dialogue amongst your nurse
colleagues?
Were other people sharing thisfeeling and discussing it
amongst yourselves, or did youfeel alone in that?
Speaker 1 (11:41):
I think I probably felt more alone, like some
nurses would be okay with it.
But it also depended on wherethey were in their life, like if
they were single, it sometimesdidn't matter If they were
married.
Many of the nurses I workedwith husbands worked in the
mines so they were also shiftwork so it was just really part
of their lifestyle and it wasfine.
And some people are veryfocused on just.
(12:02):
You know they want to be anacute care nurse.
They know this is the best waythey can make the most amount of
money with their degree.
They find a patient populationthey really like and they just
kind of like surrender to it.
It just wasn't for me.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
And that's totally fair.
Yeah, you're the one who has toget up every day and live this
life, and if such a big part ofour lives are our careers and
are how we work, and so, yeah,it should be more socially
acceptable to just say I don'tlike my life with this job and
you've been pivoting quite a bitwith it, which I'm not even
(12:35):
aware of.
These really nine to fiveoptions.
My brother-in-law is a nurseand he's working in a clinic
that has traditional nine tofive hours and he said it
literally changed his life.
He has two young kids now andhis wife's a doctor, and so that
was the decision they made.
What are options for nurses whoare listening to this, who have
(12:56):
the shift work, who maybe wantthe nine to five hours?
What are your options that youcan pursue?
Speaker 1 (13:01):
The options are limited.
From like what you'reexplaining, like the clinic jobs
do, which generally work Mondayto Friday, those Monday to
Friday nursing jobs are hard toget.
There's usually an applicationprocess.
One of the things that can befrustrating for nurses is we're
generally unionized.
In Canada Almost every hospitalis.
There's very few exceptions.
(13:22):
So you're working in aunionized environment.
You apply to a position andoften seniority will determine
whether that position is goingto be given to you or not,
necessarily your skill set,which can be another frustrating
part of that.
So you can be uncomfortablewith your job.
They're few and far between andit doesn't matter if you're a
new nurse.
You're probably not getting it.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
How were you successful in moving away from
the shift work to more of a nineto five?
What worked for you?
Speaker 1 (13:47):
I did actually.
I went back to school.
I got my graduate degree innursing, so that did give me an
edge over other nurses.
It's hard to work in anenvironment where everybody has
a baccalaureate.
As part of becoming a nurse youhave to have a baccalaureate
degree, so getting graduateeducation was a one up for me.
I did publish a few studies inmy master's.
(14:08):
I did a lot of posterpresentations.
I applied like all over Canadaand did a couple of those.
I did a lot of other things,like more speaking, more
academic writing, and theopportunity just happened to
come up at the right time.
Like there is also that pieceof like luck that came to me.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
And at that point where you thinking okay, this is
how I do it, all I've got.
The nine to five lifestyle wasprobably more accommodating for
other aspects in your life.
Tell me more.
How long did you survive inthat role?
Speaker 1 (14:40):
I survived.
another five years I survived sofar Five and a kid I tried
really hard, like I really didthink it was the end, all or at
least part of my progressionthroughout my career.
I knew that every time you makea step you just see more things
you want to change and then Icould see how I could increase
or how I could develop my skillsand keep kind of like climbing
(15:02):
up the ladder to affect morechange.
And that was like one baby steptowards that.
But it's frustrating.
Once you get in it you see therestrictions.
You start to see like yourvalues you know are lower in the
totem pole In terms of what Ireally thought I was going to be
able to do.
I thought I'd be able toaccomplish more of my own goals
and I think it was a bit of ashock for me to figure out over
(15:24):
time that that is not what thatposition was.
I also watched nursing change.
I came into healthcare at avery interesting time.
When I started 12 years ago.
Nursing was very different andI kind of watched our public
healthcare system change in thelast 12 years, not always in the
best ways, and watching thatdecline also was difficult and
(15:45):
many nurses feel that who'vebeen in the system for more than
a few years they've seen thechanges and it does make it hard
to hold on.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Yeah, I'm curious what changes you're comfortable
sharing.
And also you mentioned youthought it was going to help you
achieve your goals.
So of course, your goals werebetter lifestyle, not having to
take heartburn medication, notcoming home cranky and taking it
out on our family.
But what were your goals?
That you thought that this new9 to 5 educator position right?
Speaker 1 (16:13):
Yeah, I think I would say my new goals were really to
improve patient outcomes on agrander scale, just doing it one
on one, obviously, there's notalways as much change.
Yes, you directly affect thatone family and it's so
validating.
But to think that I could helpnurses all do that because we
all have similar skills, it wasdefinitely my goal in terms of
(16:34):
what changed.
I mean, if you read the news,publicly funded healthcare is a
challenge.
I wouldn't say I know how tofix it, but watching everything
become about other people'sgoals was hard to watch and,
depending on where you work, itcould feel suffocating.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Yeah, another big thing for nurses is the amount
of money that you can make.
I know my sister is I think shejust turned 30 and she's pretty
much capped out for the mostpart in how much money she can
make potentially for the rest ofher career.
When you shift into educatorwork, is there more income that
can be made?
(17:11):
Is that a factor in a perk?
Speaker 1 (17:14):
I actually made less.
Oh my goodness, why.
So I would make more per hour.
But one of the advantages ofshift work often when you're in
a unionized environment is thatyou make shift premiums.
So if you work in evening or anight or a weekend, you would
make a few extra dollars perhour.
So because I worked days only,I no longer was eligible for
(17:37):
shift premiums.
So I actually made a fewhundred dollars less a month
when it all worked out, wow.
But I had the trade of thehours, so you would hope it
would be worth it.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
And making a bit more of an impact.
If you were really helping thenext generation of nurses making
a change when you see there'san issue in the industry.
I'm sure was rewarding but notenough.
So what comes next?
I know I have a little bit of apreview from us talking.
You discovered a program, buttell me how you go five years
(18:07):
shift nurse, five years nurseeducator, nine to five and now
two years entrepreneur, or howlong has it been?
It'll be three in January.
Congratulations.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
How did this?
Speaker 2 (18:18):
get on your radar.
Were you seeking it out?
What did something happen whereyou just discovered it and
leaned into the opportunity?
Speaker 1 (18:24):
I think I was ready to leave before COVID and then
while I was trying to givesomething like a second try.
There is something aboutnursing where you just feel like
you are not good enough Ifyou're unable to stay in a acute
care system.
It's some sort of pride that weall have.
So I was really trying to stayand then COVID hit and then I
(18:46):
felt super trapped because howcould I leave during the
scariest thing to ever hit ourhealth care system?
So I stayed.
Within about six months I didend up on a stress leave.
From the amount of work I wasdoing and the stress that I had
in my position.
I had to do a lot of reflection.
I went to a counselor.
(19:07):
We talked a lot about what washappening to me and reflecting
on my own personal goals Do Iwant to be 32 on a stress leave?
And I decided that that waskind of the end point for me.
I've always really wanted towork in breastfeeding.
It's one of the very specificniches within PEADS that I
(19:27):
always liked.
I was fortunate enough to beable to just resign with zero
plans, so that's what I did.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
So you quit without your plan of what you're going
to do next.
Were you consideringentrepreneurship?
It sounded like you werestarting to think about what
your specialties were, yourniches were.
Did you have mentors in thisspace?
How were you even finding whatcareer paths could be right for
you, knowing that you had acounselor who was like, hey,
this lifestyle doesn't work foryou, but then what?
Speaker 1 (19:56):
I read some books over the summer about private
lactation practices so there'sdifferent certifications you can
get for that.
The gold standard is somethingcalled an IBCLC, which is an
internationally board certifiedlactation consultant.
So it's an internationalcertification.
There is unfortunately noCanadian equivalent, which is
(20:16):
often the case in Canada.
We don't have a lot of womenfocused certifications.
So I knew someone I was havingtrouble meeting some of the
requirements to become an IBCLCat that time because of COVID,
so I decided to keep looking.
One of my girlfriends had ababy and she said why don't you
(20:37):
look at this link?
She had had a nurse come to herhome and help her with
breastfeeding.
Her name was the mama coach andshe was part of a brand.
So I checked out the brand, Ifilled out the form and I had my
interview with the originalmama coach, carrie Bruno.
I now have a license agreementto work in Northeastern Ontario,
so I have my own privatenursing practice but I work
(20:59):
within the mama coach brand.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
Wow, okay.
So what is the mama coach brand?
Is this just for nurses, or whowould qualify to be part of a
program like this?
Speaker 1 (21:09):
So the mama coach is very specific you have to be a
registered nurse or a nursepractitioner.
And right now it did start inCanada, which is so exciting.
Carrie's from Calgary and she'sa very inspiring woman to work
under.
She has a big vision.
There's Canadian ones, there'sAmericans, there's also a new
group in New Zealand, australiaand the UK, which is super
(21:31):
exciting.
But yes, for being a registerednurse and nurse practitioner is
a requirement.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Okay, I was just looking that up.
I need to send that to mysister immediately.
I'm curious if this is even onher radar, because I know she
spends a lot of time thinkingabout this and she's a labor and
delivery nurse.
So I think there's a lot ofshared values in terms of
wanting to focus in that sectorand I think breastfeeding and
lactation services is not thatfar of a jump.
(21:57):
So I'm curious if this is onher radar.
Were you surprised you hadn'theard about it before when you
discovered it?
Speaker 1 (22:03):
Yes, you don't learn anything about entrepreneurship,
at least in your baccalaureate.
In my graduate degree, wetalked about it for half a class
, maybe.
It's definitely not somethingthat's focused on and there's
quite a few restrictions whileyou're working with your college
, so it's also brand new.
It feels like we're at thefront of something which is so
(22:24):
exciting.
That's probably not on a lot ofpeople's minds.
I would say if anyone was anurse and they were thinking
about private practice, thefirst thing that comes to their
mind is likely an aestheticnurse that does like Botox.
It's similar, other than Idon't do any physical skills
like that.
I just focus on education.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
Hmm, yeah, that's how I lost my family doctor.
She went and started a Botoxskin lab and the more I learned
about it, the more I understoodwhy.
When I would hear about howmuch money she was making in the
hours and all this, I'm like,okay, I guess that makes sense,
but pretty annoying, like weneed these healthcare workers,
and so it's great that you'restill staying in it in a
(23:05):
different way, and so you saidyou're not hands on now, but you
consider yourself having aprivate practice.
What did you learn from themama coach program and what are
your offers that you're bringinginto the market now?
Speaker 1 (23:17):
So when you sign up with the mama coach, she
provides us several days of likeintensive training.
So she offers a bunch ofdifferent programs.
You are allowed to work withinthose programs and you don't
have to offer all of them, butshe gives training on each one.
So right now I offer prenataleducation, lactation or feeding
(23:37):
support services.
So, like, no matter how youfeed your baby, I support you,
whether it's formula, bottlepumping or breast.
I am a certified sleepconsultant through training
through the mama coach, soworking on even just improving
sleep with newborns up untillike preschoolers.
We also do potty training,which is like a newer program.
I actually quite enjoy pottytraining.
(23:58):
I get a lot of good feedbackfrom it.
When we're successful Nursesreally care about poop.
If anyone's going to be excitedfor you, it'll be me.
I do that.
I am a certified CPR instructoras well, so I do a lot of like
informal CPR training, but Istill do some CPR certification
for other healthcare providersas well and I do just like
(24:21):
feeding, pregnancy, sleep, pottytraining.
I do both group stuff online.
I do a lot of virtual groupclasses, but I would say the
number one thing that I likedoing is breastfeeding support
in home.
There's something incrediblypowerful about empowering a
woman to do how she wants tofeed her baby in her own space.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Hmm, I bet that's so beautiful.
What are some of the othertrainings you could do through
mama coach and specialize inthat you're not doing?
Speaker 1 (24:50):
She has a new program , but I don't think I can tell
you what it is.
I was launching in March, butliterally it's never ending and
we're probably going to be theone stop shop for moms, for both
mothers health, like women'shealth and children as she
continues to develop.
It's only started in 2015.
So I feel like we're just justgetting started.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Amazing.
So she really helped you withhow to offer that as a service
and how to develop your offersand what you want to specialize
in.
There's a whole other piece ofbecoming an entrepreneur, which
is setting up your business,learning how to market, learning
how to acquire customers.
Did you get support in theprogram to do that?
If not, how are you learninghow to do that?
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Yeah, we do.
We have frequent businesscoaching.
We made strategic plans lastquarter, like before the summer.
We're always getting businesscoaching and professional
development.
So the professional developmentis usually like the clinical
part, but we're always lookingat new ways to market lots of
social media training.
That's probably one of the mostdifficult parts of this is
(25:55):
because I don't have a storefriend, which I know is similar
for other entrepreneurs.
It's hard to get your name outthere.
Social media is where new momsare, so I do my best on a few
platforms.
I recently joined TikTok and Ifeel like I haven't quite
figured that one out yet.
I'm avoiding it.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
I'm avoiding it for as long as possible.
I don't need another app to beaddicted to.
Right, I judge everything, butI do think it's powerful.
So many of my younger cousins,even when I went home for the
holidays, were like you reallyneed to be on TikTok.
Your videos should be on TikTok.
I'm like, okay, okay, maybe.
But, yeah, I haven't tackledthat either, and so I would
(26:34):
consider Sudbury and I'm sureother people would too as more
of a smaller market.
How are you finding customersin Sudbury, at help that?
You stayed.
You went to high school thereand you stayed and you built
your career there.
So imagine you have a waystronger connections to the
community than I have afterleaving and potentially coming
back.
How are you finding yourclientele there?
Speaker 1 (26:56):
I would say still, I probably get 80% of my clients
on social media.
But you are correct, Like I hadlots of connections and that
100% gave me an advantage when Istarted this, Working directly
with midwives, pediatricians,obstetricians, family doctors.
Knowing who I was was all anadvantage for me, but that
didn't mean I didn't have to,like you know, hit the pavement
(27:18):
and make sure people knew what Iwas doing.
I was also one of the firstpeople to do that in surgery.
When you're the first person,you're half of the time.
I was explaining what a privatenurse was, let alone like the
services I provide.
They were confused what I wasdoing, it seems like for the
majority, or at least for amillion with my name now.
So that is rewarding.
(27:39):
Sometimes when I go into momgroups, they already mentioned
that they follow me on socialmedia.
I went to a wedding this summerin Elliott Lake and I had three
separate families come up to meat the wedding.
It was like a not a super closefriend, but three separate
families came up to me and hadtaken my courses, which was an
amazing feeling for me.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
That's amazing and you didn't know, because you
have passive products wheresomeone can just take your
course without having to workactively one-on-one with you.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
They were a lot of group clients so I don't always
remember every single groupclient.
I probably run like four groupclasses a month and they can
have various amount ofparticipants and at the
beginning I ran way more becauseI was just trying to get anyone
to know who I was.
But they did a lot of work tolike market yourself, especially
with a home-based business.
(28:28):
Totally, and I don't sell aproduct.
Speaker 2 (28:31):
Okay, but you do, you sell a service.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
Yeah, the service I think the product would be.
It would just be like adifferent.
I can see how it would be verydifferent.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
Yeah, totally.
And also, who's paying for this?
Because in your nursingexperience prior to this and
correct me if I'm wrong inOntario of course healthcare is
covered, and so people were ableto come see you and not having
their own personal income be afactor whether they wanted to
benefit from your service.
Who's paying for your servicesnow?
Speaker 1 (29:03):
The clients have to pay me directly.
So at this time insurancereally private health insurance
hasn't really caught up to likewhat's happening.
So we don't always get privatehealth insurance covering our
end services, despite me beingin our end.
But it's just with restrictionswithin the programs that they
offer.
Sometimes health spendingaccounts will reimburse clients
(29:24):
for it.
I can't do any direct billing,but they're paying out of pocket
for these services.
Speaker 2 (29:30):
Has that been a barrier?
I mean, I imagine it has to be,so how are you overcoming that
for people?
Speaker 1 (29:36):
It absolutely is a barrier and I wish I could offer
it for free.
I mean, some of it is.
I don't really have controlover it.
The price kind of it, then thatis a hard part of that for me.
Working in acute care for solong and feeling like everybody
deserves my services andeveryone is equal and everyone
should have the same access likeaccessibility is so important
(29:57):
to me as a nurse.
Unfortunately, I can't changethe prices, like my experience
and education or worth withtheir work.
I have applied for a couple ofthose like by now, okay, later,
so I do have those options atcheckout.
So, like Cecil, I think I havepay bright, but those are
available.
That's kind of like what I canoffer.
Other than that, it's like kindof calling your health
(30:19):
insurance to see if they'llcover it, because you do get a
copy of the receipt with myregistration number on it, so
it's on there to submit.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
And you mentioned that it's a pretty regulated
industry that you have to workwithin.
I know that my mother-in-law asa therapist.
She even has regulations on howmuch she can charge for her
services.
Does that apply to you?
Can you just price yourproducts however you want, or
how does that work in terms ofthe pricing?
Speaker 1 (30:47):
We work under your correct, under the college
documents for independentpractice.
It's not as specific forpricing.
It just says like you shouldn'tbe charging exuberant amounts
for your services and try andcompare them to others.
It's not as prescriptive assome other health care
professions.
I believe like there's peoplelike massage and physios where
there's like they're given likesort of a rate that they have to
(31:08):
charge.
But they do give us guidance onlike even the way we're allowed
to use our advertising, how wecan recommend products, how we
can't use testimonials as partof our advertising, those types
of restrictions.
We just have to be reallycareful about how we market.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
Okay, cool.
Well, there's so much to learnfor you.
Are you enjoying learning aboutentrepreneurship?
I know so often when I workwith entrepreneurs who found
their passion and figured outhow to create a product around
their passion.
They just want to be deliveringthe service, and then having to
acquire customers is justannoying part of it.
Are you getting more of thehang of being on social media
(31:46):
and acquiring customers?
Are you even perhaps enjoyingit?
Speaker 1 (31:50):
I think I'm enjoying all parts of it.
I think the one thing I didn'tlike which is funny, because you
said you were supposed to be anaccountant but like bookkeeping
is not my thing, so bookkeepingwould be like the worst.
I am enjoying social media morethan I thought I would.
Actually, I have a real goingviral right now.
So, like when something goodhappens, like that it's like
reinforcing, seeing like agradual increase in your
(32:12):
followers and like really likenurturing that community.
Like it's not a amount, it'snot about the amount of
followers you have, it's likewhether they're engaging with
you or not.
So I find like working towardsthat goal makes me also feel
like less like an influencer andmore like someone who's
actually helping.
But you're right, I do want todo the service but, like you
know, working as an entrepreneurlike this is really allowing me
(32:33):
to do the service when I want.
I booked a client a few weeksago on a Sunday and they don't
always work Sundays, it's notopen on my online booking form.
I had time, I could do it andwe just we did it and I just it
was like the best appointmentand they were so grateful for it
and I'm just, it's just.
I feel so lucky that I'm ableto like do that for someone when
(32:53):
I can, and they're also equallyas grateful.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
I bet you put in the form that your number one
freedom value is schedulefreedom.
What have you learned aboutyourself through this process
that made you answer that way?
Speaker 1 (33:09):
I really don't like to get up in the morning.
I'm working at the hospital.
Everything says is 7 30 in themorning.
Oh my gosh, I mean I don't thinkI realized how much I hate that
, like being forced to get up ata certain hour and like have my
morning so structured in orderto be functional at 7 30.
I know my brain doesn'tfunction that well at 7 30 in
(33:30):
the morning.
I know my peak hours they startafter 10.
I really enjoy the schedulefreedom.
I like being able to bookappointments during the day If I
need to see someone or get myhair done or whatever, and then
I just work later in the nightand that just sees my
personality to just be kind oflike flexible and all over the
place.
I really like that.
Speaker 2 (33:50):
And you said you're doing the virtual programs as
well, not just in home care inSudbury, ontario, and so is
there a restriction around whoyou can serve online.
Is it anyone in Canada?
Is it anyone in the world?
How global can we go?
Speaker 1 (34:05):
I mean, some of it depends on where you live.
So, like Ontario's guidance islike you can serve people
outside, but you have to followthat where the guidelines for
where they live within Canadayou would also have to look at
your insurance.
So I currently mostly just doOntario.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
Okay, got it.
Do you think things are goingto change in your industry where
private practice, specificallywith the services you offer,
will start to become supportedby the health insurance
providers in Canada and inOntario, so that they don't
actually have to pay for it?
I am not sure you don't knowwhat's going to happen.
Speaker 1 (34:40):
I really don't.
It's really hard to predictafter having some conversations
with, like manual life and someof the other you know, private
health insurance companies.
They often try to limit us innurses and you know there's
several kinds of nurses.
There's RNs and then there'sRPMs and RNs and RPMs can do
different controlled acts.
I don't work any under any incontrolled acts because I don't
(35:02):
work with a physician, sothey're always trying to get the
cheaper person to accomplishthe task.
So, because anyone can doeducation, I'm not sure that
it'll go that way.
It would be nice if we couldget something similar to the
United States has the lactationnetwork, where they work
directly to pay for lactationservices and they work with the
(35:24):
insurance companies to help pay.
It would be nice if Canada hadsomething like that.
Speaker 2 (35:29):
Yeah Well, it also sounds like you were able to
take this leap without a plan,like you mentioned.
You quit without any plan,really, and so you walked away
from your income.
You also walked away from apension, which my sister
mentioned.
In Ontario, the hospitals oftendo contribution matching.
(35:50):
So how did you actually do that?
How are you able to just stophaving income for a period of
time to play and explore thisuncertainty that was now your
future?
Speaker 1 (36:01):
I think some of that was I was in a privileged
position with my householdincome to like make that leap.
The other part was you know youcan give yourself so many years
If I'm unable to start savingfor myself with long term saving
or look at other methods oflong term saving for retirement,
whether that's investing orlooking into like other avenues
(36:22):
like that.
I mean you have to kind of justhave to leap and like trust
that you're going to be able todo the work and like use that as
motivation to really get yourincome to where you want it to
be so that you can still do that.
I hear that argument a lot likewhere people can't imagine
losing their pension because itis so generous in healthcare in
(36:42):
Ontario specifically, and that'sjust part of that unionized
environment.
It's a very hard mental shiftto leave a unionized environment
where you have a high rate ofpay and you have really really
good benefits and a really goodpension, to leave and just kind
of like not know where you'regoing.
Speaker 2 (36:59):
And do you feel, or have you seen yourself in your
business that you were bettingon something that would provide
more income than you could havehad in those old careers and
then being able to contributeeven more to your pension?
Like, is that the risk thatyou're taking right now?
Yeah, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:18):
And you know digital products like passive income as
well as what I'm doing and Ithink about really working on
like the combination of thingsis like how that is possible.
It's just a lot of work to doall the things, but you kind of
just got to dive in.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
Well, I'm so happy for you.
Thanks so much for coming onand sharing all of this with us.
It sounds like you have a lotof courage.
You mentioned you had thehousehold income and that
privileged situation in terms ofthe numbers probably to take
that leap, but also the mindsetto be able to endure uncertainty
and the risk of leaving behindsomething that was secure and
(37:54):
safe.
What do you attribute thatcourageous mindset to?
Speaker 1 (37:58):
I think I've always been that way.
I left my staff in her job togo get my masters, and then I
like leaped into another job andlike that's not it.
So then I just keep leapinguntil I'm happy.
I think it's also a goodreminder that like a pension
isn't worth being unhappy for.
Are you happy now?
Speaker 2 (38:16):
So happy, so much happier, amazing.
Well, that is the perfect placeto end, carolyn.
You are awesome.
I'm so glad you reached out tome.
I know I learned so much.
I'm going to send the MamaCoach website to my sister right
now.
If people want to follow along,either as nurses who are
aspiring nurse entrepreneurs, orpotentially mamas who want to
(38:38):
learn more about your offers andservices, where should we point
them?
Speaker 1 (38:42):
I'm most active on Instagram, so I'm at
themamacochcarolin, but I'm alsoon Facebook and frequently not
frequently TikTok.
Speaker 2 (38:52):
Soon to be TikTok.
You'll see me there next, folks.
Amazing.
Okay, we'll include all ofthose links in the show notes.
Thank you so much, carolyn.
I'm so happy for you.
Thanks, sam.
Thanks for tuning into anotherepisode If this one inspired you
to take action.
But you could use some help onyour plan, or perhaps you've got
too many ideas bouncing aroundin that beautiful brain of yours
(39:15):
.
You'd love some clarity on yourstrategy, what you should
pursue first and why.
Well, I am now offeringone-on-one freedom coaching
sessions.
You can book these atbuymeacoffeecom.
Slash what's your free.
This is our opportunity to havea virtual coffee together.
Spend an hour getting clarityon how you can unlock more
(39:37):
freedom and flexibility in yourlife.
On these calls, you can ask meanything, but here are some
things that I'm an expert inCreating a location, independent
lifestyle, buildingservice-based and freelance
businesses, leveraging the gigeconomy and platforms like
Fiverr, utilizing podcasts tobuild your personal brand and
(39:59):
developing passive incomestreams.
So book your freedom coachingsession with me at
buymeacoffeecom.
Slash what's your free.
I would love to have a virtualcoffee with you.
I left my staff nurse job to go get my masters and
then I like leaped into anotherjob, like that's not it.
So then I just keep leapinguntil I'm happy.
I think it's also a goodreminder that like a pension
isn't worth being unhappy for.
Are you happy now?
So happy, I'm so much happier.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
You're listening to the Freedom Lifestyle podcast
series.
I'm sharing relatable storiesof freedom seekers who ditched
conventional office life andcourageously asked for more.
The energy just completelyshifted my entire being just
felt so free.
My business was stillgenerating income while I was on
the beach.
I decided to quit and just stayat home.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
I really can't work for anyone but me.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
It's literally just doing whatever the hell you want
to do.
As for me, I'm your host, sam,and I've spent the last four
years creating a business thatallows me to work from anywhere.
The Freedom Lifestyle looksdifferent for everyone.
What's your free?
You're listening to a newepisode of the Freedom Lifestyle
podcast, where I sharerelatable stories from everyday
(01:08):
people who have found a way toleverage flexible work
arrangements to design theirlives.
If you are new here, welcome.
I'm so excited to introduce youto this week's speaker.
And if you've been listeningfor a while, please make sure
you hit subscribe or follow onyour app and maybe even leave me
a short review.
It really helps more freedomseekers find this show.
(01:30):
If you're new here, give it alisten.
If you love it, then maybe youwant to hit subscribe at the end
.
So today's freedom seeker isCarolyn Marshall, who is a
registered nurse who now owns aprivate practice.
What's really interesting aboutCarolyn is I have got a lot of
nurses in my family, in myfriend group, and most of them
(01:55):
are not very happy about thelifestyle it provides.
If you know any nurses, youknow that one, they're heroes,
but two, they're typically doing12-hour shifts, 7pm to 7am or
7am to 7pm so hard on your body,so hard on your lifestyle, so
hard on your relationships.
And this was Carolyn'sexperience, and she basically
(02:17):
didn't settle for that lifestyle.
While she loved the impact shewas making as a nurse and
specifically she wanted tocontinue to support women and
women's health, she knew that noamount of security or pension
or any of the perks and benefitsshe got as a nurse was worth
her being unhappy forever.
So after five years of being anacute nurse, working those
(02:39):
12-hour shifts, she thentransitioned to more of a
clinical setting where she was anurse educator working 9-5
hours.
Amazing thinking okay, this isnow my path to a better
lifestyle, turns out in manyways it got even worse and now
she's almost three years intonurse entrepreneurship.
She has now created her ownbusiness.
(03:01):
You can find her onlinethemumicoachcarolin, on
Instagram, and now she's aregistered nurse who shares
science-backed parenting tips,from childbirth defeating to
sleep and more.
She really helps you navigateparenthood with her and with the
support of a nurse.
So we learned a lot about whateven are your options when you
(03:23):
are a nurse who's unhappy withshift work and what different
paths can you pursue.
How she made this transition tobecoming a nurse entrepreneur,
figuring out what her offerswere going to be, what she
wanted to specialize in and, ofcourse, learning how to become
an entrepreneur.
Now it's up to her to acquireall of her customers, to market
herself and to set up herbusiness in a way that's going
(03:45):
to be sustainable and supporther lifestyle long term.
Three years in, carolyn ishappy and on track to be well
surpassing all of the perks andbenefits she had in that more
secure path.
This is an amazing conversation.
Know for the delay.
Meet Carolyn.
Carolyn, welcome to the FreedomLifestyle podcast.
(04:07):
How's your day going today?
Good, pretty good.
How are you?
I'm good.
I'm ending my day with thisinterview.
I've been so looking forward tospeaking with you.
As I mentioned in our littlepreview call before we hopped on
, I have so many nurses in myfamily who are struggling with
the lifestyle, and so when youreached out to me with an update
(04:28):
on what's been going on in yourlife, I was just so excited to
have you on the show.
Speaker 1 (04:32):
I'm so excited to be able to share that with you,
because a lot of nurses we don'tget taught to be entrepreneurs
in nursing school Totally.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
So let's start off with an easy one.
I ask all my guests where areyou taking this call today and
what would you normally be doingright now if you weren't on
this call with me?
Speaker 1 (04:51):
So I'm from Sudbury, Ontario, and that is where I am
today.
I'm in my home office, which Iwork out of.
Most of the time I workvirtually, but I also work in
home with other clients.
I wasn't on this call today.
I might be, at a home birth.
So I'm working on acertification for a child birth
certification and I'm trying toobserve out of hospital birth.
(05:13):
So I might be doing that, but Iwould say a typical day I would
probably be finishing upcharting and sending a plan to a
private client.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
And how much of that is a contrast to your old life.
How were you living before?
That wasn't working for you?
What would you normally bedoing right now, then, in your
old life?
Speaker 1 (05:33):
When I left the acute care system in hospital.
It'll be two years, two and ahalf years, and I think I would
be rushing home right now.
I didn't really live far fromthe hospital, because if you're
from Sudbury nothing's that far,but I would probably be very
unhappy when I came home andthen rushing to do dinner and
sometimes taking that out on mypartner.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
Yeah, yeah, totally fair, because it was the 12 hour
shifts, right?
You're either doing.
Is it like 6 am to 6 pm or 6 pmto 6 pm?
How does it work?
It depends where you work.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
When I was a staff nurse, I would work 7 to 7,
which was a long day, whether itstarted at night or in the
morning.
In my last five years in mycareer at the hospital, I was a
nurse educator, so I did work myday to Friday.
Technically my hours were 7.30to 3.30, but I often stayed till
4.30 or later.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Hmm.
So even when you made thatshift, it still felt like a
grind and you were just reallytired.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
If anything, I would say it got worse being a staff
nurse.
There are advantages to that,even when I compared it to my
transition into the educatorrole.
When you leave for the day,you're done, there's no more.
You go home and you make thecare is transitioned to the next
nurse, and it's just on thiscontinuous pattern.
When I was the educator, thatwas not the experience that I
(06:54):
had.
Whatever I didn't finish, I hadto finish the next day and more
projects would get piled upwhere you identify more needs,
so it never really felt like Iwas finished.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
That's interesting.
You say that because a lot ofpeople say that about
entrepreneurs.
They say, well, you're alwayson, you're never not building
your business, you're not everthinking about growth, you're
just always on as anentrepreneur.
Do you feel like that's true?
Speaker 1 (07:20):
I do, but it feels so much different because it's for
me, as opposed to being givengoals that you have to work
towards from someone else, thatcan feel a little bit more
empowering.
I do something because I wantto and it feels less like work.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Amazing.
I want to dive into thesebusiness models but I am curious
a little bit about yourpersonal story and how you got
into nursing as a career.
We both grew up in Sudbury,ontario.
We were in the similar networks.
I know what the limitationswere like for me, the guidance
counselors, and what my pathswere.
(07:56):
I was told I should be anaccountant and that was the
career path that was recommendedfor me.
So what can you tell us abouthigh school and choosing to
pursue nursing, and whatoriginally connected you to this
career path?
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Honestly, high school I think I knew I wanted to be
in healthcare.
I really liked anatomy andbiological science.
There are some restrictions interms of what nursing schools
you could go to, depending onthe math courses you took.
I felt safe staying in Sudbury,so I did stay here, but I think
what really led me to it was Ireally liked helping people in
crisis.
I have a strong passion forwomen's health and children and
(08:34):
babies, so it seemed like anatural fit to go into nursing.
There's not a lot of helpthat's completely focused in
women and children.
I did at one point think aboutgoing into midwifery, but then I
learned more about that careerand that's not for me.
A lot of on-call, a lot ofdoctors they don't really have a
schedule.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Got it Okay.
The lifestyle piece I know is abig shocker for a lot of nurses
At least the nurses in my life.
They're similar to what yousaid, just natural caretakers in
a lot of the sense, reallyinterested in science and health
, wanting to take care of people, have the capacity to take care
(09:14):
of people.
Honestly, thank goodness,because I don't have any of
those traits.
I really don't.
That's just me totally beinghonest.
That's not natural for me to bethat way.
I can provide value and supportpeople in other ways.
But nurses really are heroes inso many ways.
But then I feel like they becomenurses, which is a competitive
(09:36):
industry in school to get into.
They're hard programs.
You have to excel in educationprior to that and you are
working hard.
Then all of a sudden you getintroduced to shift work.
That is typically when I seethem start to break.
To me, we should be talking toyoung people about what is that
lifestyle going to be like,because you can predict it ahead
(09:57):
of time.
Were you ever thinking aboutwhat would your day-to-day look
like when you were pursuing thatcareer?
What were you focused on whenyou were pursuing it?
Speaker 1 (10:06):
No, you don't even think about it.
You just know that that's whereyou're going to go.
Most people do work in shiftwork and most people do move
right into acute care becauseit's the best paying job that
you can get as a nurse,especially as an entry-level
nurse.
You're totally right, it is abit of a culture shock to miss
things.
You graduate, maybe you're 23,24,.
(10:28):
All your friends have everyweekend off.
You don't.
You work holidays.
I thought I would get used toit.
I think I thought I would justget used to it and I never did.
Every holiday I missed with myfamily, I took it really hard.
I was a missed opportunity.
You almost feel a little bitguilty about that because you
see so many other nurses come inon their days off to work
(10:51):
holidays and get over time andmake extra money or just
volunteer to come in.
You feel guilty that you're notokay with it, but I think we
don't get permission to be like.
I don't like shift work.
It was also really hard on mybody.
The first year that I worked Ihad a lot of heartburn, which I
later found out is very common.
(11:12):
When you work a lot of nightshifts, your circadian rhythm is
all messed up, so I did end upon medication for a couple of
months just to settle her down.
It's awkward.
You also don't get a lot oftime to.
You don't get your schedule toomany months in advance, so when
friends are making plans likesix months from now, you have no
idea if you can commit to suchplans.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
And what was the dialogue amongst your nurse
colleagues?
Were other people sharing thisfeeling and discussing it
amongst yourselves, or did youfeel alone in that?
Speaker 1 (11:41):
I think I probably felt more alone, like some
nurses would be okay with it.
But it also depended on wherethey were in their life, like if
they were single, it sometimesdidn't matter If they were
married.
Many of the nurses I workedwith husbands worked in the
mines so they were also shiftwork so it was just really part
of their lifestyle and it wasfine.
And some people are veryfocused on just.
(12:02):
You know they want to be anacute care nurse.
They know this is the best waythey can make the most amount of
money with their degree.
They find a patient populationthey really like and they just
kind of like surrender to it.
It just wasn't for me.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
And that's totally fair.
Yeah, you're the one who has toget up every day and live this
life, and if such a big part ofour lives are our careers and
are how we work, and so, yeah,it should be more socially
acceptable to just say I don'tlike my life with this job and
you've been pivoting quite a bitwith it, which I'm not even
(12:35):
aware of.
These really nine to fiveoptions.
My brother-in-law is a nurseand he's working in a clinic
that has traditional nine tofive hours and he said it
literally changed his life.
He has two young kids now andhis wife's a doctor, and so that
was the decision they made.
What are options for nurses whoare listening to this, who have
(12:56):
the shift work, who maybe wantthe nine to five hours?
What are your options that youcan pursue?
Speaker 1 (13:01):
The options are limited.
From like what you'reexplaining, like the clinic jobs
do, which generally work Mondayto Friday, those Monday to
Friday nursing jobs are hard toget.
There's usually an applicationprocess.
One of the things that can befrustrating for nurses is we're
generally unionized.
In Canada Almost every hospitalis.
There's very few exceptions.
(13:22):
So you're working in aunionized environment.
You apply to a position andoften seniority will determine
whether that position is goingto be given to you or not,
necessarily your skill set,which can be another frustrating
part of that.
So you can be uncomfortablewith your job.
They're few and far between andit doesn't matter if you're a
new nurse.
You're probably not getting it.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
How were you successful in moving away from
the shift work to more of a nineto five?
What worked for you?
Speaker 1 (13:47):
I did actually.
I went back to school.
I got my graduate degree innursing, so that did give me an
edge over other nurses.
It's hard to work in anenvironment where everybody has
a baccalaureate.
As part of becoming a nurse youhave to have a baccalaureate
degree, so getting graduateeducation was a one up for me.
I did publish a few studies inmy master's.
(14:08):
I did a lot of posterpresentations.
I applied like all over Canadaand did a couple of those.
I did a lot of other things,like more speaking, more
academic writing, and theopportunity just happened to
come up at the right time.
Like there is also that pieceof like luck that came to me.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
And at that point where you thinking okay, this is
how I do it, all I've got.
The nine to five lifestyle wasprobably more accommodating for
other aspects in your life.
Tell me more.
How long did you survive inthat role?
Speaker 1 (14:40):
I survived.
another five years I survived sofar Five and a kid I tried
really hard, like I really didthink it was the end, all or at
least part of my progressionthroughout my career.
I knew that every time you makea step you just see more things
you want to change and then Icould see how I could increase
or how I could develop my skillsand keep kind of like climbing
(15:02):
up the ladder to affect morechange.
And that was like one baby steptowards that.
But it's frustrating.
Once you get in it you see therestrictions.
You start to see like yourvalues you know are lower in the
totem pole In terms of what Ireally thought I was going to be
able to do.
I thought I'd be able toaccomplish more of my own goals
and I think it was a bit of ashock for me to figure out over
(15:24):
time that that is not what thatposition was.
I also watched nursing change.
I came into healthcare at avery interesting time.
When I started 12 years ago.
Nursing was very different andI kind of watched our public
healthcare system change in thelast 12 years, not always in the
best ways, and watching thatdecline also was difficult and
(15:45):
many nurses feel that who'vebeen in the system for more than
a few years they've seen thechanges and it does make it hard
to hold on.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Yeah, I'm curious what changes you're comfortable
sharing.
And also you mentioned youthought it was going to help you
achieve your goals.
So of course, your goals werebetter lifestyle, not having to
take heartburn medication, notcoming home cranky and taking it
out on our family.
But what were your goals?
That you thought that this new9 to 5 educator position right?
Speaker 1 (16:13):
Yeah, I think I would say my new goals were really to
improve patient outcomes on agrander scale, just doing it one
on one, obviously, there's notalways as much change.
Yes, you directly affect thatone family and it's so
validating.
But to think that I could helpnurses all do that because we
all have similar skills, it wasdefinitely my goal in terms of
(16:34):
what changed.
I mean, if you read the news,publicly funded healthcare is a
challenge.
I wouldn't say I know how tofix it, but watching everything
become about other people'sgoals was hard to watch and,
depending on where you work, itcould feel suffocating.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Yeah, another big thing for nurses is the amount
of money that you can make.
I know my sister is I think shejust turned 30 and she's pretty
much capped out for the mostpart in how much money she can
make potentially for the rest ofher career.
When you shift into educatorwork, is there more income that
can be made?
(17:11):
Is that a factor in a perk?
Speaker 1 (17:14):
I actually made less.
Oh my goodness, why.
So I would make more per hour.
But one of the advantages ofshift work often when you're in
a unionized environment is thatyou make shift premiums.
So if you work in evening or anight or a weekend, you would
make a few extra dollars perhour.
So because I worked days only,I no longer was eligible for
(17:37):
shift premiums.
So I actually made a fewhundred dollars less a month
when it all worked out, wow.
But I had the trade of thehours, so you would hope it
would be worth it.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
And making a bit more of an impact.
If you were really helping thenext generation of nurses making
a change when you see there'san issue in the industry.
I'm sure was rewarding but notenough.
So what comes next?
I know I have a little bit of apreview from us talking.
You discovered a program, buttell me how you go five years
(18:07):
shift nurse, five years nurseeducator, nine to five and now
two years entrepreneur, or howlong has it been?
It'll be three in January.
Congratulations.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
How did this?
Speaker 2 (18:18):
get on your radar.
Were you seeking it out?
What did something happen whereyou just discovered it and
leaned into the opportunity?
Speaker 1 (18:24):
I think I was ready to leave before COVID and then
while I was trying to givesomething like a second try.
There is something aboutnursing where you just feel like
you are not good enough Ifyou're unable to stay in a acute
care system.
It's some sort of pride that weall have.
So I was really trying to stayand then COVID hit and then I
(18:46):
felt super trapped because howcould I leave during the
scariest thing to ever hit ourhealth care system?
So I stayed.
Within about six months I didend up on a stress leave.
From the amount of work I wasdoing and the stress that I had
in my position.
I had to do a lot of reflection.
I went to a counselor.
(19:07):
We talked a lot about what washappening to me and reflecting
on my own personal goals Do Iwant to be 32 on a stress leave?
And I decided that that waskind of the end point for me.
I've always really wanted towork in breastfeeding.
It's one of the very specificniches within PEADS that I
(19:27):
always liked.
I was fortunate enough to beable to just resign with zero
plans, so that's what I did.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
So you quit without your plan of what you're going
to do next.
Were you consideringentrepreneurship?
It sounded like you werestarting to think about what
your specialties were, yourniches were.
Did you have mentors in thisspace?
How were you even finding whatcareer paths could be right for
you, knowing that you had acounselor who was like, hey,
this lifestyle doesn't work foryou, but then what?
Speaker 1 (19:56):
I read some books over the summer about private
lactation practices so there'sdifferent certifications you can
get for that.
The gold standard is somethingcalled an IBCLC, which is an
internationally board certifiedlactation consultant.
So it's an internationalcertification.
There is unfortunately noCanadian equivalent, which is
(20:16):
often the case in Canada.
We don't have a lot of womenfocused certifications.
So I knew someone I was havingtrouble meeting some of the
requirements to become an IBCLCat that time because of COVID,
so I decided to keep looking.
One of my girlfriends had ababy and she said why don't you
(20:37):
look at this link?
She had had a nurse come to herhome and help her with
breastfeeding.
Her name was the mama coach andshe was part of a brand.
So I checked out the brand, Ifilled out the form and I had my
interview with the originalmama coach, carrie Bruno.
I now have a license agreementto work in Northeastern Ontario,
so I have my own privatenursing practice but I work
(20:59):
within the mama coach brand.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
Wow, okay.
So what is the mama coach brand?
Is this just for nurses, or whowould qualify to be part of a
program like this?
Speaker 1 (21:09):
So the mama coach is very specific you have to be a
registered nurse or a nursepractitioner.
And right now it did start inCanada, which is so exciting.
Carrie's from Calgary and she'sa very inspiring woman to work
under.
She has a big vision.
There's Canadian ones, there'sAmericans, there's also a new
group in New Zealand, australiaand the UK, which is super
(21:31):
exciting.
But yes, for being a registerednurse and nurse practitioner is
a requirement.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Okay, I was just looking that up.
I need to send that to mysister immediately.
I'm curious if this is even onher radar, because I know she
spends a lot of time thinkingabout this and she's a labor and
delivery nurse.
So I think there's a lot ofshared values in terms of
wanting to focus in that sectorand I think breastfeeding and
lactation services is not thatfar of a jump.
(21:57):
So I'm curious if this is onher radar.
Were you surprised you hadn'theard about it before when you
discovered it?
Speaker 1 (22:03):
Yes, you don't learn anything about entrepreneurship,
at least in your baccalaureate.
In my graduate degree, wetalked about it for half a class
, maybe.
It's definitely not somethingthat's focused on and there's
quite a few restrictions whileyou're working with your college
, so it's also brand new.
It feels like we're at thefront of something which is so
(22:24):
exciting.
That's probably not on a lot ofpeople's minds.
I would say if anyone was anurse and they were thinking
about private practice, thefirst thing that comes to their
mind is likely an aestheticnurse that does like Botox.
It's similar, other than Idon't do any physical skills
like that.
I just focus on education.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
Hmm, yeah, that's how I lost my family doctor.
She went and started a Botoxskin lab and the more I learned
about it, the more I understoodwhy.
When I would hear about howmuch money she was making in the
hours and all this, I'm like,okay, I guess that makes sense,
but pretty annoying, like weneed these healthcare workers,
and so it's great that you'restill staying in it in a
(23:05):
different way, and so you saidyou're not hands on now, but you
consider yourself having aprivate practice.
What did you learn from themama coach program and what are
your offers that you're bringinginto the market now?
Speaker 1 (23:17):
So when you sign up with the mama coach, she
provides us several days of likeintensive training.
So she offers a bunch ofdifferent programs.
You are allowed to work withinthose programs and you don't
have to offer all of them, butshe gives training on each one.
So right now I offer prenataleducation, lactation or feeding
(23:37):
support services.
So, like, no matter how youfeed your baby, I support you,
whether it's formula, bottlepumping or breast.
I am a certified sleepconsultant through training
through the mama coach, soworking on even just improving
sleep with newborns up untillike preschoolers.
We also do potty training,which is like a newer program.
I actually quite enjoy pottytraining.
(23:58):
I get a lot of good feedbackfrom it.
When we're successful Nursesreally care about poop.
If anyone's going to be excitedfor you, it'll be me.
I do that.
I am a certified CPR instructoras well, so I do a lot of like
informal CPR training, but Istill do some CPR certification
for other healthcare providersas well and I do just like
(24:21):
feeding, pregnancy, sleep, pottytraining.
I do both group stuff online.
I do a lot of virtual groupclasses, but I would say the
number one thing that I likedoing is breastfeeding support
in home.
There's something incrediblypowerful about empowering a
woman to do how she wants tofeed her baby in her own space.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Hmm, I bet that's so beautiful.
What are some of the othertrainings you could do through
mama coach and specialize inthat you're not doing?
Speaker 1 (24:50):
She has a new program , but I don't think I can tell
you what it is.
I was launching in March, butliterally it's never ending and
we're probably going to be theone stop shop for moms, for both
mothers health, like women'shealth and children as she
continues to develop.
It's only started in 2015.
So I feel like we're just justgetting started.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Amazing.
So she really helped you withhow to offer that as a service
and how to develop your offersand what you want to specialize
in.
There's a whole other piece ofbecoming an entrepreneur, which
is setting up your business,learning how to market, learning
how to acquire customers.
Did you get support in theprogram to do that?
If not, how are you learninghow to do that?
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Yeah, we do.
We have frequent businesscoaching.
We made strategic plans lastquarter, like before the summer.
We're always getting businesscoaching and professional
development.
So the professional developmentis usually like the clinical
part, but we're always lookingat new ways to market lots of
social media training.
That's probably one of the mostdifficult parts of this is
(25:55):
because I don't have a storefriend, which I know is similar
for other entrepreneurs.
It's hard to get your name outthere.
Social media is where new momsare, so I do my best on a few
platforms.
I recently joined TikTok and Ifeel like I haven't quite
figured that one out yet.
I'm avoiding it.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
I'm avoiding it for as long as possible.
I don't need another app to beaddicted to.
Right, I judge everything, butI do think it's powerful.
So many of my younger cousins,even when I went home for the
holidays, were like you reallyneed to be on TikTok.
Your videos should be on TikTok.
I'm like, okay, okay, maybe.
But, yeah, I haven't tackledthat either, and so I would
(26:34):
consider Sudbury and I'm sureother people would too as more
of a smaller market.
How are you finding customersin Sudbury, at help that?
You stayed.
You went to high school thereand you stayed and you built
your career there.
So imagine you have a waystronger connections to the
community than I have afterleaving and potentially coming
back.
How are you finding yourclientele there?
Speaker 1 (26:56):
I would say still, I probably get 80% of my clients
on social media.
But you are correct, Like I hadlots of connections and that
100% gave me an advantage when Istarted this, Working directly
with midwives, pediatricians,obstetricians, family doctors.
Knowing who I was was all anadvantage for me, but that
didn't mean I didn't have to,like you know, hit the pavement
(27:18):
and make sure people knew what Iwas doing.
I was also one of the firstpeople to do that in surgery.
When you're the first person,you're half of the time.
I was explaining what a privatenurse was, let alone like the
services I provide.
They were confused what I wasdoing, it seems like for the
majority, or at least for amillion with my name now.
So that is rewarding.
(27:39):
Sometimes when I go into momgroups, they already mentioned
that they follow me on socialmedia.
I went to a wedding this summerin Elliott Lake and I had three
separate families come up to meat the wedding.
It was like a not a super closefriend, but three separate
families came up to me and hadtaken my courses, which was an
amazing feeling for me.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
That's amazing and you didn't know, because you
have passive products wheresomeone can just take your
course without having to workactively one-on-one with you.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
They were a lot of group clients so I don't always
remember every single groupclient.
I probably run like four groupclasses a month and they can
have various amount ofparticipants and at the
beginning I ran way more becauseI was just trying to get anyone
to know who I was.
But they did a lot of work tolike market yourself, especially
with a home-based business.
(28:28):
Totally, and I don't sell aproduct.
Speaker 2 (28:31):
Okay, but you do, you sell a service.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
Yeah, the service I think the product would be.
It would just be like adifferent.
I can see how it would be verydifferent.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
Yeah, totally.
And also, who's paying for this?
Because in your nursingexperience prior to this and
correct me if I'm wrong inOntario of course healthcare is
covered, and so people were ableto come see you and not having
their own personal income be afactor whether they wanted to
benefit from your service.
Who's paying for your servicesnow?
Speaker 1 (29:03):
The clients have to pay me directly.
So at this time insurancereally private health insurance
hasn't really caught up to likewhat's happening.
So we don't always get privatehealth insurance covering our
end services, despite me beingin our end.
But it's just with restrictionswithin the programs that they
offer.
Sometimes health spendingaccounts will reimburse clients
(29:24):
for it.
I can't do any direct billing,but they're paying out of pocket
for these services.
Speaker 2 (29:30):
Has that been a barrier?
I mean, I imagine it has to be,so how are you overcoming that
for people?
Speaker 1 (29:36):
It absolutely is a barrier and I wish I could offer
it for free.
I mean, some of it is.
I don't really have controlover it.
The price kind of it, then thatis a hard part of that for me.
Working in acute care for solong and feeling like everybody
deserves my services andeveryone is equal and everyone
should have the same access likeaccessibility is so important
(29:57):
to me as a nurse.
Unfortunately, I can't changethe prices, like my experience
and education or worth withtheir work.
I have applied for a couple ofthose like by now, okay, later,
so I do have those options atcheckout.
So, like Cecil, I think I havepay bright, but those are
available.
That's kind of like what I canoffer.
Other than that, it's like kindof calling your health
(30:19):
insurance to see if they'llcover it, because you do get a
copy of the receipt with myregistration number on it, so
it's on there to submit.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
And you mentioned that it's a pretty regulated
industry that you have to workwithin.
I know that my mother-in-law asa therapist.
She even has regulations on howmuch she can charge for her
services.
Does that apply to you?
Can you just price yourproducts however you want, or
how does that work in terms ofthe pricing?
Speaker 1 (30:47):
We work under your correct, under the college
documents for independentpractice.
It's not as specific forpricing.
It just says like you shouldn'tbe charging exuberant amounts
for your services and try andcompare them to others.
It's not as prescriptive assome other health care
professions.
I believe like there's peoplelike massage and physios where
there's like they're given likesort of a rate that they have to
(31:08):
charge.
But they do give us guidance onlike even the way we're allowed
to use our advertising, how wecan recommend products, how we
can't use testimonials as partof our advertising, those types
of restrictions.
We just have to be reallycareful about how we market.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
Okay, cool.
Well, there's so much to learnfor you.
Are you enjoying learning aboutentrepreneurship?
I know so often when I workwith entrepreneurs who found
their passion and figured outhow to create a product around
their passion.
They just want to be deliveringthe service, and then having to
acquire customers is justannoying part of it.
Are you getting more of thehang of being on social media
(31:46):
and acquiring customers?
Are you even perhaps enjoyingit?
Speaker 1 (31:50):
I think I'm enjoying all parts of it.
I think the one thing I didn'tlike which is funny, because you
said you were supposed to be anaccountant but like bookkeeping
is not my thing, so bookkeepingwould be like the worst.
I am enjoying social media morethan I thought I would.
Actually, I have a real goingviral right now.
So, like when something goodhappens, like that it's like
reinforcing, seeing like agradual increase in your
(32:12):
followers and like really likenurturing that community.
Like it's not a amount, it'snot about the amount of
followers you have, it's likewhether they're engaging with
you or not.
So I find like working towardsthat goal makes me also feel
like less like an influencer andmore like someone who's
actually helping.
But you're right, I do want todo the service but, like you
know, working as an entrepreneurlike this is really allowing me
(32:33):
to do the service when I want.
I booked a client a few weeksago on a Sunday and they don't
always work Sundays, it's notopen on my online booking form.
I had time, I could do it andwe just we did it and I just it
was like the best appointmentand they were so grateful for it
and I'm just, it's just.
I feel so lucky that I'm ableto like do that for someone when
(32:53):
I can, and they're also equallyas grateful.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
I bet you put in the form that your number one
freedom value is schedulefreedom.
What have you learned aboutyourself through this process
that made you answer that way?
Speaker 1 (33:09):
I really don't like to get up in the morning.
I'm working at the hospital.
Everything says is 7 30 in themorning.
Oh my gosh, I mean I don't thinkI realized how much I hate that
, like being forced to get up ata certain hour and like have my
morning so structured in orderto be functional at 7 30.
I know my brain doesn'tfunction that well at 7 30 in
(33:30):
the morning.
I know my peak hours they startafter 10.
I really enjoy the schedulefreedom.
I like being able to bookappointments during the day If I
need to see someone or get myhair done or whatever, and then
I just work later in the nightand that just sees my
personality to just be kind oflike flexible and all over the
place.
I really like that.
Speaker 2 (33:50):
And you said you're doing the virtual programs as
well, not just in home care inSudbury, ontario, and so is
there a restriction around whoyou can serve online.
Is it anyone in Canada?
Is it anyone in the world?
How global can we go?
Speaker 1 (34:05):
I mean, some of it depends on where you live.
So, like Ontario's guidance islike you can serve people
outside, but you have to followthat where the guidelines for
where they live within Canadayou would also have to look at
your insurance.
So I currently mostly just doOntario.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
Okay, got it.
Do you think things are goingto change in your industry where
private practice, specificallywith the services you offer,
will start to become supportedby the health insurance
providers in Canada and inOntario, so that they don't
actually have to pay for it?
I am not sure you don't knowwhat's going to happen.
Speaker 1 (34:40):
I really don't.
It's really hard to predictafter having some conversations
with, like manual life and someof the other you know, private
health insurance companies.
They often try to limit us innurses and you know there's
several kinds of nurses.
There's RNs and then there'sRPMs and RNs and RPMs can do
different controlled acts.
I don't work any under any incontrolled acts because I don't
(35:02):
work with a physician, sothey're always trying to get the
cheaper person to accomplishthe task.
So, because anyone can doeducation, I'm not sure that
it'll go that way.
It would be nice if we couldget something similar to the
United States has the lactationnetwork, where they work
directly to pay for lactationservices and they work with the
(35:24):
insurance companies to help pay.
It would be nice if Canada hadsomething like that.
Speaker 2 (35:29):
Yeah Well, it also sounds like you were able to
take this leap without a plan,like you mentioned.
You quit without any plan,really, and so you walked away
from your income.
You also walked away from apension, which my sister
mentioned.
In Ontario, the hospitals oftendo contribution matching.
(35:50):
So how did you actually do that?
How are you able to just stophaving income for a period of
time to play and explore thisuncertainty that was now your
future?
Speaker 1 (36:01):
I think some of that was I was in a privileged
position with my householdincome to like make that leap.
The other part was you know youcan give yourself so many years
If I'm unable to start savingfor myself with long term saving
or look at other methods oflong term saving for retirement,
whether that's investing orlooking into like other avenues
(36:22):
like that.
I mean you have to kind of justhave to leap and like trust
that you're going to be able todo the work and like use that as
motivation to really get yourincome to where you want it to
be so that you can still do that.
I hear that argument a lot likewhere people can't imagine
losing their pension because itis so generous in healthcare in
(36:42):
Ontario specifically, and that'sjust part of that unionized
environment.
It's a very hard mental shiftto leave a unionized environment
where you have a high rate ofpay and you have really really
good benefits and a really goodpension, to leave and just kind
of like not know where you'regoing.
Speaker 2 (36:59):
And do you feel, or have you seen yourself in your
business that you were bettingon something that would provide
more income than you could havehad in those old careers and
then being able to contributeeven more to your pension?
Like, is that the risk thatyou're taking right now?
Yeah, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:18):
And you know digital products like passive income as
well as what I'm doing and Ithink about really working on
like the combination of thingsis like how that is possible.
It's just a lot of work to doall the things, but you kind of
just got to dive in.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
Well, I'm so happy for you.
Thanks so much for coming onand sharing all of this with us.
It sounds like you have a lotof courage.
You mentioned you had thehousehold income and that
privileged situation in terms ofthe numbers probably to take
that leap, but also the mindsetto be able to endure uncertainty
and the risk of leaving behindsomething that was secure and
(37:54):
safe.
What do you attribute thatcourageous mindset to?
Speaker 1 (37:58):
I think I've always been that way.
I left my staff in her job togo get my masters, and then I
like leaped into another job andlike that's not it.
So then I just keep leapinguntil I'm happy.
I think it's also a goodreminder that like a pension
isn't worth being unhappy for.
Are you happy now?
Speaker 2 (38:16):
So happy, so much happier, amazing.
Well, that is the perfect placeto end, carolyn.
You are awesome.
I'm so glad you reached out tome.
I know I learned so much.
I'm going to send the MamaCoach website to my sister right
now.
If people want to follow along,either as nurses who are
aspiring nurse entrepreneurs, orpotentially mamas who want to
(38:38):
learn more about your offers andservices, where should we point
them?
Speaker 1 (38:42):
I'm most active on Instagram, so I'm at
themamacochcarolin, but I'm alsoon Facebook and frequently not
frequently TikTok.
Speaker 2 (38:52):
Soon to be TikTok.
You'll see me there next, folks.
Amazing.
Okay, we'll include all ofthose links in the show notes.
Thank you so much, carolyn.
I'm so happy for you.
Thanks, sam.
Thanks for tuning into anotherepisode If this one inspired you
to take action.
But you could use some help onyour plan, or perhaps you've got
too many ideas bouncing aroundin that beautiful brain of yours
(39:15):
.
You'd love some clarity on yourstrategy, what you should
pursue first and why.
Well, I am now offeringone-on-one freedom coaching
sessions.
You can book these atbuymeacoffeecom.
Slash what's your free.
This is our opportunity to havea virtual coffee together.
Spend an hour getting clarityon how you can unlock more
(39:37):
freedom and flexibility in yourlife.
On these calls, you can ask meanything, but here are some
things that I'm an expert inCreating a location, independent
lifestyle, buildingservice-based and freelance
businesses, leveraging the gigeconomy and platforms like
Fiverr, utilizing podcasts tobuild your personal brand and
(39:59):
developing passive incomestreams.
So book your freedom coachingsession with me at
buymeacoffeecom.
Slash what's your free.
I would love to have a virtualcoffee with you.
Popular Podcasts
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.