October 31, 2025 • 61 mins
Ryan Joyce, former CIA spy, now applies CIA-level tradecraft to protect brokers, carriers, and shippers from modern freight scams.
The key lesson: safety isn’t security. Perfect inspections won’t stop a stolen load, and fake digital vetting is easy to spoof. What works is physical truth. genlogs built a network of roadside sensors tracking millions of trucks daily—verifying who’s really on the road, where, and with what equipment. When that footprint’s missing, fraud risk spikes.
Pair that with one classic spy move—call a historical, verified number when something feels off—and even sophisticated scams crumble. The same intelligence that exposes fraud also boosts profits: knowing which carriers are real, nearby, and active slashes deadhead and tightens shipper alignment.
This episode is your blueprint for using spy skills to outsmart freight fraud and grow safer, stronger networks. Subscribe, share, and tell us the tactic you’ll try first.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:19):
Hey, welcome to this week's episode of Freight 360.
Got a special guest, Ryan Joycefrom Gen Logs, is with us today.
Nate is traveling.
I believe he's on hisanniversary trip this week,
actually in Florida, somewhereup north.
So it'll be the two of us.
And speaking of anniversaries,um, Brian just got back from his
honeymoon, recently married.
He was traveling all over thecountry.
(00:40):
We just jumped right into it,man.
How was it being out on theroads?
Dude, it was awesome.
SPEAKER_01 (00:44):
I was out on the roads for three and a half
weeks.
My wife and I were van camping.
Uh, and the coolest thing wasthis van was almost at truck
driver level in terms of height.
And so I finally got to kind ofexperience what it's like
rolling down the roads andlooking left and right.
Uh, and and we saw a ton oftrucks out there.
Um, obviously, from the gen logsperspective, we were constantly
(01:05):
looking at it new locations toput up our cameras around the
roads.
So we actually started a channelinternally called Project
Honeymoon.
And as I was out there, I wasmarking all of these different
places to put our cameras up inthe Northeast.
We were up in Maine, went toAcadia, New Hampshire, Vermont,
and then came down through NewYork, uh, Pennsylvania into West
Virginia.
(01:25):
And uh, when I was up in NewYork, I we were actually right
near, uh, went almost closer toBuffalo.
And I realized, like, if I'mfilling in for Nate this week, I
should have been wearing myBill's jacket.
Exactly, instead of my Gen Mog'sjacket.
But uh I can't fill Nate'sshoes, but at least I can uh
it's great to fill in andhopefully is a great
anniversary.
SPEAKER_00 (01:46):
Yeah, and I think it's gonna be a really good
episode.
Before we jump into likeindustry stuff and things, I
want to lead off with a storythat I found out a couple weeks
ago about Top Gun.
And I just want you to kind oftake it from there because one,
I mean, I grew up in the 80s,and like that was like the
coolest movie.
We played in the woodspretending we were Maverick and
(02:08):
Goose.
So, like, I have so many fondmemories of that movie coming
out, and an I saw you, you and Ihave talked, I mean, we've known
each other for years now.
I had no idea that this storyexisted.
And I just kind of want you tojust kick it off of it because I
feel like it's a really coolstory.
SPEAKER_01 (02:25):
Yeah, well, it's it's less my story to tell and
more my dad's really cool story,but I'll kind of relay it where
my dad actually uh got recruitedto the Naval Academy to play
lacrosse and graduated in 1979,where he then got slotted to go
to flight school.
So he went down to Pensacola,uh, started flying uh planes
there, and then got selected togo fly the F-14 Tomcat, which
(02:48):
was kind of new, slick, justcame out in the 70s, and uh they
were gearing up.
And so he got posted outactually in San Diego and uh
flew, did a few deployments, andthen got selected to go through
Top Gun.
Now, back then, Top Gun was notacknowledged publicly.
It was kind of a top secretprogram for the best of the best
uh of pilots.
(03:09):
And so as he was going throughTop Gun, right before he kicked
off, uh uh the local newspaperapproached the Navy and said,
Hey, we've heard of this thingcalled Top Gun.
We would like to write anarticle about it.
Uh, could we do that?
And the Navy kind of thoughtabout it and said, you know,
maybe that'll actually be goodfor recruiting the next
generation of fighter pilots.
(03:29):
So they agreed and they selectedmy dad and three other
classmates to essentially thisthis journalist was tied at his
hip for the few weeks that hewent through Top Gun.
And each week he would write alittle article about it, what it
was like to go through this thebest of the best fighter town
USA Top Gun uh flight school.
(03:49):
And uh, and so when that allwrapped up, that those articles
were all republished underAviation magazine under the
article titled Top Guns.
Well, Paramount bought therights to that article, Top
Guns, and wrote the screenplayTop Gun, literally based off of
my dad and those three othersgoing through.
(04:10):
And as if that wasn't coolenough, uh, my dad was actually
selected to go back to Top Gunas a flight instructor right
when they were filming themovie.
And so as he was doing theflying end type Top Gun the
second time around, they wouldliterally just hand him a
helmet, like Goose's helmet, forthe day, put the camera in the
(04:31):
cockpit, and that's actually mydad doing a lot of those flying
scenes in the movie.
And he got invited with my momto the premiere.
Uh, they met Tom Cruise, therest of the cast.
Uh, super cool story, and um,and that's the background.
And you could look it up, it'slike written about before my
dad, Tom Joyce, um, has Top Gunfame.
SPEAKER_00 (04:52):
What is it and it's honestly like that is so cool
because, like, again, like Ivividly remember watching that
movie like in my living room asI was probably like seven or
eight, maybe like maybe aroundnine, because it's like late
80s, I think, when it came out.
And I'm like literally rememberrunning around and playing in
the woods and stuff and beinglike Maverick and Goose and
Iceman.
(05:13):
And when I saw that, I was like,that is like the coolest shit
that I've I it for sure thatI've seen all year, if not in a
very long time, that like yourdad was literally goose in the
movie, which is just like I feellike the coolest story ever.
SPEAKER_01 (05:24):
And I gotta close it out with like just a story that
gives me goosebumps, where Iactually went to go see Top Gun
2 with my dad for the firsttime.
Oh, that's awesome.
So we're sitting next to eachother in the theater, and he
says beforehand, almost kind oflike teary-eyed, he's like, you
know what?
I can't wait to watch thismovie.
It's just sad that they're notgonna have an actual F-14 in the
(05:45):
movie because it wasdecommissioned back in the 90s,
like early 2000s.
Well, sure enough, for those whohave seen, not it's like not to
do a little spoiler alert here,yeah.
But right at the end, they comeacross an old F-14.
And when they pull off thattarp, I looked to the side and
saw my dad, and sure enough, hestarted to tear up because it
was you know that that planefrom his youth that now was back
(06:09):
in the movie and was franklylike saving the day at the end.
I just love that.
SPEAKER_00 (06:13):
And it's so cool.
Like, I literally havegoosebumps because, like, I
don't know, as I guess you getolder, maybe when you're
married, for sure when you havekids, like you just think about
those things differently,whether it's the appreciation or
the nostalgia.
But like to me, like that is socool because it's like not only
was that like very impactful,but for even folks that weren't
around then, like that was hugein the 80s because, like, this
(06:36):
is like the Cold War.
This is like you're growing upin a completely different world
than it is now, and like thatmovie was like the antithesis of
exactly that conflict, and itwas like all of it kind of came
to a head in that movie.
So, like anybody thinking backon that period, that is like
this quintessential piece oflike not only just pop pop
culture, but like the wholezeitgeist of the entire world
(06:59):
was like that moment in thatmovie, and it was so cool that
they did it again, which wasawesome.
I thought the second movie wasalso really good, but then when
I saw that, I'm like, that islike the coolest shit that I've
seen in recent memories.
SPEAKER_01 (07:10):
It's an awesome story.
Uh, my dad's my hero, so it'slike super cool to be able to
tell his story a little bit.
Um, but I agree.
They did it.
It is so rare that you make asequel that actually matches the
the original.
And I thought they did aphenomenal job with uh Top Gun
2.
I hope there's not a Top Gun 3because I don't think you could
keep it going, but we couldleave it at two.
SPEAKER_00 (07:30):
Agreed.
Um, well, for anybody that kindof doesn't know you, like that's
a decent segue into at least alittle bit of your career
pre-gen logs for just anybodythat is new to gen logs and what
we've been working on.
I know you've been on the showbefore.
We've talked about it a lot, butwhy don't you give some people
because like I think that waspretty foundational into your
(07:50):
early adulthood, early career,which actually is how gen logs
came to existence in the firstplace, right?
SPEAKER_01 (07:56):
Yeah, for sure.
I mean, my dad actually finishedhis career, uh, decommissioned
one of the squadrons, VF-111,which is the Sundowners on the
West Coast in California beforegetting posted to the Pentagon
as deputy chief of all navalaviation.
So he kind of rose through theranks.
Uh, he was an 06, a captain forthose who come out of the
military.
And uh, and he was in thePentagon on 9-11 when the plane
(08:21):
hit hit his office.
Um, fortunately, it hit justunderneath his office.
He was in the third ring insidethe Pentagon on the top floor,
and it blew out everythingbelow, and he narrowly escaped
with his life that day, asliterally the floors caving in,
fire everywhere.
I mean, it was just a crazy andchaotic time.
I was a senior in high school atthe time, and I could tell you
(08:43):
the morning of September 11th,2001, all I wanted to do was
flirt with girls and playbasketball after school.
That's literally it.
Yep.
After that happened, and Ithought I had lost my dad, only
to find that I hadn't, but itwas definitely a wake-up call
for me.
I didn't know what I wanted todo with the future, uh, my own
future.
I went to bed that night,committed to learn everything I
could about the history,culture, language, or religion
(09:04):
of the people that would do thatand make sure it never happened
again.
Fast forward a few years later,I actually studied abroad in the
Middle East, I learned Arabic,and I ended up getting recruited
into the CIA, where I spent afew uh few years of my life
living in the Middle East with ajob was to recruit foreign
sources, aka al-Qaeda, and ISISguys, to provide us information,
(09:27):
uh secret information to makesure that 9-11 never happened
again.
And so I followed through onthat background.
You might wonder, like, what amI doing in freight today?
SPEAKER_00 (09:37):
Um, but there's a segue, right?
And it all does kind of cometogether.
SPEAKER_01 (09:42):
There is a segue, and you know, it's taken me a
little while to really put thisinto words because I felt it,
but I didn't know how toarticulate it.
And and one of the things thatwe struggled with inside of CIA.
In fact, for anyone who'slistening right now, if you go
to CIA.gov and you go to theupper right-hand corner, there's
a button there that says reportinformation.
And sure enough, no matter whereyou are in the world, it's gonna
(10:04):
walk you through how to accessthe dark web and provide
information to the CIA.
I mean, it's literally it itwalks you through that steps
there.
So I came about in this in theCIA during this digital era of
informants around the world,being able to provide secret
information to or bring it toour attention without us ever
meeting them face to face tobegin with.
(10:26):
But for those who know, like uhif you're working with a high
risk or high, you know, highloss uh ratio of whatever you
might be involved in, you wantto at some point meet someone
face to face.
You want to have a conversationwith them.
You want to know that they'reeither not a double agent trying
to provide you bad information,or worse, they're not trying to
lure you out to kill you.
(10:47):
And unfortunately at the CIA, wehad gotten it wrong a few times
where I've had colleagues thathave been killed or injured when
they've gone out to meet asource for the first time, only
to find out that we were beingset up or ambushed.
And so at CIA, we had to find away when you had never met
someone face to face, basicallyyou were only having these
digital-only transactions.
(11:08):
How could you know that youcould trust them?
How did you know that they werereal?
How did you know that theinformation they wanted you to
provide you was valid, that theyweren't trying to set you up?
And the way we solved that atCIA was using satellite sensors
or hearing from other sources.
It's what we called all sourceintelligence back in the CIA or
in the intelligence community.
(11:29):
Fast forward to today, and everybroker that's listening to this
knows the danger these days ofdealing with a digital only
persona.
You post on DAT or another loadboard, you get 30 carriers that
write in, you know, saying, Hey,I can carry that load for you.
And you're trying to siftthrough who's real that can
(11:50):
actually run this load, or who'swho's trying to set me up to
steal it, um, or or at leastdouble broker it and take a
margin.
And it is really difficult whenyou're dealing with digital only
identities to figure that out,unless you're using different
types of vectors or all sourceintelligence.
And so there was a little bit ofa uh a way that I kind of came
(12:12):
to Genlogs and my twoco-founders, Blake and Joe, were
critical in this process.
But the bottom line is wedecided to take the entire
playbook of what we learned theintelligence community,
specifically through the lasttwo decades of the global war on
terror, and apply it totrucking.
So we like to joke that we usedto track terrorists and now we
track trucks, but it's using CIAcaliber methodology to solve a
(12:36):
2025 problem in the truckingindustry.
And fortunately, we've beensuccessful because we go beyond
just this digital-only pervetting capability to actually
bring in the physical footprintof carriers into the mix.
When we talked about satellitesensors and other sources at
CIA, we do the same thing atGenlogs.
We've actually invested millionsof dollars to put an entire
(13:00):
nationwide network of roadsidecameras along all major
interstates, freight lanes,highways, collecting on truck
patterns, truck footprints.
We collect now 15 million truckimages a day.
We just surpassed 2 billionimages in our holdings on
trucks.
And on a regular basis, we'reseeing over 90% of four higher
carriers in our data.
(13:21):
Uh, those last 10%, we believethat they're either sitting out
this really bad freightrecession, or they're the ones
you want to avoid that are notactually out there running
freight, but are sitting inEastern Europe, Mexico, or other
places trying to steal yourloads.
So that's a little bit ofbackground on how this came to
be.
SPEAKER_00 (13:39):
And I want to do like a kind of like a side
tangent on this that I think isreally important, right?
Because I think when people aretrying to optimize, right, like
and everybody tries to get moredone in less time with less
friction, right?
So, like for sure, there's apush just from like a capitalism
point of view, of businessesneeding to get more efficient.
But there's always thattrade-off, right?
Because if you push too far,right, you take on more risk,
(14:02):
right?
You need those things, but youalso need to verify.
And the other thing that I thinkis important for anyone
listening is for sure, like thecarriers that listen to the show
and follow this from thetrucking side, is that like this
is not a replacement for whatyou said is like relationships.
At the end of the day, like,let's just take the CIA example.
You, I mean, literally juststating, like, in a very
stressful situation withextremely high stakes where
(14:25):
people's lives are on the line,you are going to put your life
on the line to meet somebodyface to face, of which that
other person is going to do.
That's how important that pieceis, right?
And in the freight world, thisis not a replacement for having
conversations and havingrelationships, because at the
end of the day, that is thegoal.
What these tools allow you to dois be more efficient in who
(14:47):
you're going to choose to meet,whether it is in person, on the
phone, spend time with,negotiate either RFPs, loads,
lanes, finding the right fit,the right carrier that you can
trust, the carrier finding theright broker they can work with,
without having to, like yousaid, sift through dozens and
dozens out of a hundred ofhonestly, like either bad
(15:09):
actors, people that have badfaith might steal either the
money for the load, the wholeload, or mislead somebody.
Like the whole point is tocreate trust faster in a way
that is also more efficient foreverybody in the market.
And it really does benefit allof the parties.
We've talked about this evenprior to gen logs when we first
met of like this really doescreate like a win, a win and a
(15:31):
win for both a shipper havingbetter capacity, better fits,
the carrier having better laneswith what they're running, and
the broker being able tofacilitate these things more
efficiently, more effectively,and with higher trust and less
loss, right?
Which I think, again, foranybody out there, like that is
the goal.
That's what we should be doing.
That's literally our job.
(15:51):
But as we've pushed towardsprofitability and doing things
faster, I think a lot of thesethings have not got as much
emphasis or as much time andeffort as they should.
And I think that's whatcriminals have taken advantage
of.
Like they know that, right?
Hey, if you're moving fast andyou're not paying attention,
you're pretty vulnerable toloss, no matter how you define
(16:11):
it, right?
SPEAKER_01 (16:12):
Yeah, I fully agree.
And I think in many ways, we aremonitoring the wrong things in
the industry.
And I'll give you an example.
Like there are couldn't agreemore.
There are carriers that have uhslightly bad out-of-service
scores that will not steal yourfreight.
Yep.
And there are carriers that haveperfect out-of-service scores
that will steal your freight.
(16:33):
As at or someone posing as thatcarrier is what I should say.
Yes.
So, like, there's two differentthings there's safety and then
there's security.
You know, bad safety does notnecessarily translate to they're
definitely now gonna steal yourfreight.
Correct.
The other thing, too, is thereare absolutely carriers that uh
use an office building thatanother carrier is in.
(16:53):
And therefore, they're gonnahave an address that's going to
have two carriers from that sameaddress.
And in many systems, that'sgonna be a, hey, sorry, you guys
are sharing an address, that isa fraud or a risk issue.
And and while I think thosethings are good to look at,
they're good to kind of bring ina more holistic review.
It if you're moving too fast andall of a sudden you're saying,
(17:13):
like, hey, out of service scoreslook good, uh, no shared
addresses or phone numbers.
Uh, they're they have greenchecks in my digital-only
vetting platform.
And then boom, freight, youknow, freight goes, and you
wonder, like, how did that getstolen?
Well, I and and we can get intothis a little bit more, but
GenLog's just completed our400th investigation for free for
(17:34):
the industry.
So last November we announced wewere going to start providing
investigations.
If you had a load stolen, youwere gonna come to us, we were
gonna help out.
Um, and and we have, and wefollowed through on that
promise.
We don't charge anyone for theseinvestigations, but it does give
us incredible insight into thetrends that are happening across
the industry.
And the common thread we haveseen is whenever we investigate
(17:57):
a stolen load, we look at thecarrier and our platform, we
look at their physical footprinton the road.
Their physical footprint iseither one of two things it does
not exist, or they are operatingin a completely different part
of the country or they have adifferent equipment type than
was actually needed for the loadthat was stolen.
And it's really put intoperspective for me that you need
(18:18):
to measure what matters, orultimately you could be doing a
hundred little things that youhope will all overlap to protect
you, but you're missing one bigthing.
And at Genlogs, where about theone big thing?
Is this carrier real?
Are they repeatedly runninglanes recently and do they have
the right equipment?
SPEAKER_00 (18:37):
And I want to go back to what you said, right?
For anyone out there, guess whoalso knows what your vetting
criteria are?
The criminals.
So, hey, if you're looking atout of service, if you're
looking for this, this, and thischeckbox, they can mimic that.
They can create the exact samething where they appear to be
the best carrier with thecorrect insurance with the best
(18:59):
out of service.
They know that's what they needto get the green light.
That is doable, right?
So it's not as if like thatinformation is proprietary and
that like criminals don't knowwhat these criteria are.
Like they're aware they can alsoeither buy brokerages or started
them or buy trucking companies.
They have the same informationthat was being used to sift them
(19:20):
out.
And the thing that gets me themost, this is the thing that
bothers me, I think, even almostas much as the theft, is that
when a carrier is a victim offraud, meaning like somebody
hacks a carrier, somebody stealsa load, all of these systems
flag that carrier and go, hey,they were reported for fraud.
(19:41):
Now the carrier did nothingwrong.
They were a victim.
And then every one of theseplatforms goes, hey, stay away
from them.
So not only did they end up onthe short end of the stick as a
victim, but then they're furtherpenalized by all of these
systems going, stay away fromthis carrier because they got
hacked.
Well, so now they're getting theshaft twice.
(20:02):
And like to me, the way thewhole industry has gone about
addressing this risk has put allof this on the carrier side.
And carriers are already in adepressed market, rates are
down, there's tons of issueswith CDLs and everything else
that anyone's seen in the news,with what you know, the FMCSA is
trying to crack down on.
And we've done a bunch ofcontent on that.
So, like, not only are they in ahard situation economically,
(20:25):
they have other people on theirside of the industry also making
(21:16):
it harder.
And then when they're a victimof theft, they get further
penalized.
And to me, nobody just reallythought about the fact that,
like, we need to cooperate tosolve this, not alienate the
most important part of thetransaction, which is the people
actually moving this freight,which is the thing that has
always really just gotten to me.
SPEAKER_01 (21:35):
Yeah, I mean, uh, for those that spend any time on
subreddit freight brokers, youknow what carriers think about
certain vetting platforms herethat they feel like they are
getting, you know, they theysneeze the wrong direction, and
all of a sudden it's, hey, donot use for the next 60, 90
days.
Yep.
And and I my heart really goesout to to these carriers,
especially when they are victimsof some type of hacking event or
(21:58):
otherwise.
And that's why I think the thesmart carriers actually look at
gen logs as overwatch andprotection rather than you know,
uh peering in or any type oflike surveillance state.
At the end of the day, weactually have uh we do a few
things.
First of all, we exclude allprivate vehicles from our data.
But recently we we instituted aprivacy layer where basically we
(22:21):
blur every window of everyvehicle that we collect.
So we are not in the business ofcollecting on truck drivers.
We're in the business ofcollecting that a truck was out
there at a time and place.
That physical footprint is whatcan protect a carrier that's
been hacked from all of a suddenloads getting stolen.
That if they're if the brokersthey deal with are realizing
(22:43):
that, hey, someone like reachedout to me about a load, but it
didn't match.
Like you haven't been there, oryou don't even have the right
equipment type, like something'samiss here, and then reaching
out to that carrier.
And you and I have chatted aboutit because I love that you are
the one that says there's liketwo big things you can do to
stop uh fraud.
You can, you know, instead ofusing, let's say you don't even
(23:05):
have any of these digitalvetting platforms at all, you
don't use them at all, but youdo these two things.
Number one is you check thephysical footprint of a carrier
out there.
Are they real, recent, runningthe right reins with lanes with
the right equipment?
That's number one.
Number two, if something doesn'tadd up, you call the number that
you've had in your TMS for yearsnow.
(23:26):
Yeah.
Give that phone number a call,give the last phone number,
email, reach out to that to say,hey, what's going on?
And like you said, that's whereyou actually find out what's
what's what's what's at stake.
SPEAKER_00 (23:39):
And I want to talk about what you guys uncovered in
the investigations, but like thething I want to say is in
everyone that has come throughus, whether it's clients,
brokers, reach out for help,whether I'm sending it to the
Genlogs investigation team, inevery single one of these, and
there's, I mean, probably closeto a hundred over the past
couple of years that like I wasinvolved in in some way.
The first thing I do is go tothe oldest phone number in any
(24:01):
of the tools, even if it's justthe FMCSA, call that old phone
number.
And in every single one, it'sliterally my first call, within
two minutes, that person tellsme exactly what happened.
They're like, Yeah, don't book aload.
Somebody hacked me, or hey,somebody said they were going to
buy my trucking company, theygot my login, changed all my
info, don't book a load.
Every single one.
And I'm like, okay, like I knownot everybody's going to make a
(24:25):
phone call every time they booka load because of all these
automations.
But like, again, sometimes theoldest, simplest things can be
the most effective.
Because if a carrier gets theirnumber changed, every every
system shows what it used to be.
And if you just call that oldone and again look at the
footprints, those two things,again, I haven't seen any stolen
(24:48):
theft where I wasn't able tofind out at least what went
wrong that quickly, right?
And those two things I think areincredible preventative measures
that are low cost, pretty loweffort.
Again, it is a little differentthan automation.
Everybody wanted to runeverything on AI.
But again, that also makes youmore vulnerable.
What did you guys find in thesehundreds of investigations?
(25:10):
Any commonalities, commonthreads?
SPEAKER_01 (25:13):
Yeah.
And almost all, you know, Ithink the the big concerning
thing for me, and this gets backto those common threads, is
we've actually witnessed a risein some of the Facebook groups
or other groups out there of uhsold USDOTs or USDOTs or MC
numbers that are for sale.
Um, and I think what's moreconcerning to me is some of
those that are for sale say,hey, it comes with a bank
(25:36):
account, an email, and a phonenumber.
And so all of a sudden yourealize that holy cow, this
carrier that's actually in goodstanding in all these platforms
could be going out of business,selling all of the contact
capabilities to now say, like,hey, you did call the phone
number, you have that.
And that's what I think is kindof the threat vector that
concerns me the most.
(25:56):
But in in all of those instanceswhere it was even more
sophisticated like that, what wenoticed is that we saw a carrier
every day, let's say, for thelast three years.
And then all of a sudden, we didnot see them for a month.
And it was that gap of notseeing a carrier at all that was
one of the biggest uh tells thathey, something's amiss,
(26:18):
something is different here.
Um, and if you permit me, I'llkind of uh show.
We had um, for those that haveprobably heard about the story,
Shaquille O'Neal had a hundredand eighty thousand dollar Range
Rover stolen uh last week.
It was getting detailed um by acompany that they were detailing
it in Georgia, and the pickupwas in Georgia, it was bringing
it down to Baton Rouge,Louisiana, and it vanished.
(26:41):
And the police report actuallyput out what the carrier, the
DOT of the carrier and the name,when they were actually uh when
when it was stolen.
I'm gonna go ahead and try toshare screen and I'll explain it
for those that are on audioonly.
So, what I'm showing here isfirst line trucking LLC.
The US DOT was 2543 uh two threesix nine uh six nine.
(27:05):
That's it.
Um once again, two five four twothree six nine.
Now, when we looked and this I'mshowing the genlogs platform
here, and you look at wherewe've seen in the last 30 days
there, underneath the carrier,we get the FMCSA contact, and
then we have the confirmedlocations over the last 30 days.
If I zoom out here and look atthe entire map of the United
(27:27):
States, you have them domicileddown in West Lico, Texas, and
they have not been observedanywhere in the United States
over the last 30 days.
Now they were 90 days ago.
They were, if I go a year agowhere we've seen them in the
last year, we've actually seenthem in Texas, we've seen them
in California.
Um, 90 days we saw them inCalifornia, and then boom, they
(27:49):
disappeared 30 days ago.
They are not, they're just noton the road.
SPEAKER_00 (27:54):
Well, and for anyone listening, where that is in
Texas, it looks like it is likea stone's throw from Mexico.
And I'm not saying that therearen't legitimate businesses
there, but again, it does makeyou want to ask a few questions
when you haven't seen anysightings in a month, and
they're physically located wherethere's not a lot of auto moves
(28:17):
between anybody.
SPEAKER_01 (28:19):
Yeah, 100%.
And this is like this is common.
I I have dozens of examples ofthat.
When when a theft happens, weask, hey, what was the USDOT
that stole it?
And then boom, we look up andyou look at the last 30 days and
and they just don't existanymore.
When you look at 30 days prior,90 days prior, they were very
active around the roads and allof a sudden they disappeared.
(28:41):
And this is just showing whatthe pattern what is happening.
You have a real carrier that'sout there, they may be
struggling to make ends meet,given where rates are, where
insurance has gone up, all ofthat.
They, you know, it's theythey're finally, I call it kind
of like the last gasp um herethat they're like, you know
what, I can't do this anymore.
And I'm already in debt a littlebit, I'm uh filed bankruptcy or
(29:03):
whatever.
And someone is willing to pay me$20,000 for for my USD or MC if
I give them my my cell phonenumber or associate with it.
Sure.
That in all of these vettingplatforms, they might still look
good because they were goodyesterday and they were good the
day before, but now something'smaterially changed with their
(29:23):
physical footprint on the road.
And that's where we're seeingthe issues, which is why it can
be a little manual.
We we or has been over the lastyear, if you're dealing with a
new carrier to have to go intogen logs to say, well, let me
type in their DOT, let me take alook and make sure everything
looks good.
Well, that all changes uh nextmonth.
Next month, we're actuallyreleasing our entire compliance
(29:45):
suite where it's gonna have allof the, you know, hey, they must
have an MC, they they uh mustnot have changed their legal
name recently, and you could putpass or fail or needs review in
there.
But at the very top of the list,at the very top of the list, we
have carrier observations.
The carrier must have beenobserved by gen logs within the
last, and then you set thetimeline.
(30:07):
You want it in the last weekbecause you're even more
concerned about high value, highrisk loads.
Sure, do that.
If you want to last 30 days, sobe it.
But you toggle that on, and younow only uh when you check a DOT
or an MC uh from you post on aload board and and it hits your
email and you're doing a run anduh check, and we're gonna
(30:28):
automate a lot of these checksgoing forward with both uh
integrations right into the TMSor plugins into the email,
that's gonna be the first passfail.
Hey, are they still active?
If they're not, we just we justsaved a$300,000 theft because
everything else could still betrue, they could still be in
good standing on whateverdigital vetting platform you
(30:49):
use, but they're not active onthe roads anymore.
And that's a big tell.
So this is a great example.
When the shack theft happened, Iwas like, gosh darn, we could
have stopped this.
Like, had they been justchecking the last 30 days, they
can't get to Texas to Georgiawithout going past.
A number of our cameras.
In fact, uh, you know, yesterdaythere was a uh an overturned
(31:12):
trailer on I-59 Mississippi witha bunch of monkeys that were in
there.
And they talked about it.
Really?
I didn't see that.
Yeah, like a great.
Here's uh for those looking atthe screen, they truck hauling
monkeys infected with hepatitisC herpes and COVID overturns on
(31:32):
a highway.
And uh, and that's absolutelytrue.
It happened.
Well, minutes, I'm talking 28minutes before this flipped
over.
We actually saw that trailer onI-59 in Ellisville, Mississippi.
You therefore, like, we havesuch sensor coverage now that
you cannot operate on the roadsand not be seen by us,
(31:54):
especially if you're doing a lotof heavy interstate travel,
which trying to get from Texasup to Georgia, uh, and when
you've not been seen at all inthe 30 days is just not
feasible.
And now Shaquille O'Neal, hisRange Rovers somewhere, you
know, over the Atlantic, headedto Mexico, Europe or Mexico.
Yeah.
And and yeah, and it allhappened because the broker that
(32:16):
brokered that that car movementdidn't have gem logs or didn't
automate the checks.
So, anyways, that's I'm gonnaget off my soapbox now, but
that's just so important becauseit would solve 99% of these
these cases.
SPEAKER_00 (32:28):
It would have, right?
And again, just to reiterate,what we just showed is that that
carrier is located in Texas, wassupposed to pick up a vehicle in
Georgia and would have had todriven past the sensors in order
to pick it up and hasn't beenseen in 30 days.
That's what we're saying of likeverification.
Hey, were they just seen onestill in business?
And the answer to that was no.
(32:48):
And second of all, were theyseen driving to go pick up my
shipment?
And the answer to that was no,right?
So those two things, you havetwo giant red flags that would
have meant find another carrier.
And the thing that I also wantedto talk about there, that I
don't know if we chatted aboutthis, but I've had clients now
that do just auto transport.
And specifically, I had one inChicago that moved all high-end
(33:12):
sports cars, mostly likeporches.
So, like six-figure and up carsalmost every one of their moves.
The thing we found, and this wasthree years ago or two years
ago.
So it's been a while, and I knowthis hasn't been fixed.
It's likely gotten worse, isthat we saw more double
brokering in auto transport thanany other niche in the entire
industry that I've ever seen.
(33:33):
Because there's two other loadboards that basically most
companies use.
You can still book autotransport through DAT, and some
of that happens, but and Ican't, my mind's blanking.
There's two specific load boardsthat really all of the auto
moves go through.
And how we really uncovered thiswas since you know he's his
customers are literally thedealerships.
We started looking at these.
(33:54):
I think this is when we startedactually getting MVP up, where I
was able to see this.
And I go, these MCs lookstrange.
So he drove to the dealership,right?
And I said, go and either callthe guy there selling the car
and have him check what truck ispicking this up, or go there and
see this.
And he did this for a month.
Honestly, if he moved 40 carsthat month, 38 of them were
(34:18):
double brokered.
None of the trucks that wereshowing up to pick up these
vehicles were the MCs he booked.
And what we found, which wascompletely rampant in that side
of the industry, was that thebigger carriers would just book
loads all over the load boardand then they would double
broker them or unlicensed brokerthem to another smaller carrier,
and none of them had insurance.
(34:39):
That was the kicker, right?
It wasn't necessarily that thesecars were getting stolen.
But what we realized when we dugin is I'm like, you're moving a
$250,000 car on a truck that hasno insurance, like literally no
insurance.
You thought you booked thislarge carrier with a$500,000
cargo policy.
They gave the load to anothercarrier that had no cargo
(35:00):
policy, which is how they wereable to move it cheaper because
they're not paying forinsurance.
The big carrier made an extra$200 to give the load to the
company with no insurance.
And then his cars were justgetting shipped all over the
country, uninsured, like notunderinsured, completely
uninsured.
And we use some of these thingsand these tools that we're
talking about to literallyuncover this, and it was
(35:21):
systemic.
And it's got to be as rampant asit was then.
Because nothing has come alongand addressed this other than
the tools and the things thatwe're talking about.
Like literally, gen logs was theonly way we were able to see
these things were occurring,right?
And this is three, this is likeV1 of Genlogs.
Like this is going back when thesensor density was a fraction of
(35:41):
what it is now, and it's onlygotten better since then.
SPEAKER_01 (35:43):
Yeah, a hundred percent.
And you know what?
It's actually one of my favoritestories uh is we have uh one of
our customers is Packer Freightin Green Bay, uh, Wisconsin.
And they are they don't do carhaulers at all or any auto
transport.
And yet one of their customersreached out and said, Hey, I I
know this is not part of usmoving our freight and this and
(36:04):
that, but I trust you guys.
I got to get a car fromWisconsin down to Florida uh
here.
Could you help me out?
Now, the Packer Freight guyssaid, you know, it isn't our
core uh what we do.
And yet we have gen logs, solet's take a look.
And and that's exactly what theydid.
They looked inside of ourplatform and they said, we're
gonna search from just carhaulers that can run from Green
(36:27):
Bay down to Miami.
And and I forget who it was, butin this case, um, I'm pulling up
my screen again, and that's theexact search that I did.
In this case, Green Bay,Wisconsin, down to Orlando,
Florida.
We get CRC transport.
Uh, we noticed that with ourobservations of their equipment,
they've had 100% car haulers outon the road.
Well, if I zoom in on our map,you can actually see the pink
(36:50):
dots in our map is where they'vebeen in the last, let's say, 24,
12 to 24 hours.
And and we could prove that theywere running the lane from
Wisconsin down to Florida.
And it was the same vehiclerunning that.
So it was a lane that they wererepeatedly doing.
They had great, like out ofservice vehicle scores.
They didn't have any red flags,none of the above.
(37:12):
And so Packer Freight felt like,you know what?
We feel comfortable looking atGenlogs to reach out.
They they booked that vehicleand they did so cheaper than all
of the other quotes that theircustomer had gotten elsewhere.
The vehicle arrived safe ontime, and that customer is now
even more loyal to them thanthey, you know, were before.
(37:32):
And they had this tool thatallowed them to do that and to
do so confidently.
SPEAKER_00 (37:36):
And not only, right, not only did were they able to
find it quickly, right?
But they were able to find one,and this is really important,
that was the right fit for thecarrier and the shipment, right?
And when you match those twothings up, the cost is lower.
The cost is lower because you'renot paying a driver to deadhead.
You're not paying somebody to godrive all the way out of
(37:59):
wherever they're already goingto go pick up your shipment,
which costs the driver money,right?
And everyone kind of doesn'tthink about that of like, hey, a
truck's a truck.
Why would I pay more for one orthe other?
Like, well, because the one's200 miles away empty, and one is
five miles away empty.
And that's guy's got to drivethere, burn fuel, and get there.
And when you can actually getmore efficient with choosing the
(38:21):
carriers that like actually needand want the load, like they
literally probably had emptyslots on that car hauler were
already in Wisconsin a few timesthat week, right?
So for them, it's like, hey, wecan make a couple extra hundred
bucks.
It's on our way, no problem.
And you can see they're doingthat.
It works for everybody.
Like you said, the customer ishappy.
(38:42):
The broker didn't takeadditional risk, even though
they're not used to shippingthese types of commodities.
Like it's the first time theymoved it, but they were able to
do it without taking this giantrisk of fielding hundreds of
phone calls and trying to guessdoes this company really do
this?
Or are they gonna give it toanother company?
Do they have the equipment?
Well, just because they have it,are they actually operating it?
(39:03):
Is it really on the roads?
And this is all of thatobscurity or opaqueness than the
industry that like nobody hadvisibility before, but now
Genlogs provides in a way thatis like fast, effective, and
efficient to actually use.
SPEAKER_01 (39:17):
100%.
And I'm gonna just share screenone last time for those that are
listening.
I'll I'll narrate it as well.
You know, what I'm showing ishere's that footprint, CRC
transport.
They're doing car haulers.
That's what we're observing outthere on the roads.
This is their footprint over thelast three years, but I can go
down a year, 90 days, 30 days.
I can look where they have beenin the last seven days, and you
(39:38):
can literally see them up inWisconsin, down through Georgia,
into Florida.
But with one button, I can clickour view on the asset locator.
And when I click that, it isgoing to pull up that carrier
and the images we've observed ofthat carrier.
And here we like can see carhaulers.
We know that they're running carhaulers.
(39:58):
I also see them in Wisconsin.
I saw them in Wisconsin uh lateyesterday, and I can observe
that hey, they are real CRCtransport.
They do have that equipment,they are running in that area.
Um, uh, and you can see theblurring that we apply.
That's like the privacy that weare now enabling.
And but at least me as a brokercan look and be like, oh,
(40:21):
they're legit.
Uh, they have the equipment,they're running the lanes,
they're not on anyone's D D andU lists.
Now, like I can feel comfortablemoving forward.
And that's what we want.
Like, form that relationshipnow.
Um, do that across, like, we doHeavy Hall, we do Hazmat, we do
all of these.
We have now our own ability tosearch for those.
(40:44):
So we open up for brokerages,like we say the riches are in
the niches, like it is nowavailable to you to get into
whatever niche area that's gonnapay better, but it's
traditionally been justdifficult to source carriers.
(41:49):
You can see entire marketcapacity here, know that they
are real, reach out, book, andthen move on to the the next
load.
Uh and I really do believe this.
There were the customers that wehave, which we're nearing a
hundred brokerage customers outthere, they talk about freight
for uh fraud and theft as if itwas now a past issue they had to
(42:11):
deal with.
And they are now looking atlike, how do we grow our
brokerage using genlog shipperintelligence data?
Um, how do we like tackle harderRFPs that are going to pay
better with bigger shippers?
Because now we have a trackrecord that we can tell
shippers, oh yeah.
The last time we had a loadstolen was I think it was 2023,
2024.
(42:32):
And then they're like, so youdon't have to worry about that
with us.
Let's gain your business.
This is how we vet carriers.
They show them the genlogsplatform, and man, they are
signing more and more customers.
And so there's really adivergence right now.
There's those that are trying tosurvive in 2025, and there's
those that are thriving in 2025.
And I and I'm proud to say thatwe're part of the latter
(42:53):
solution.
SPEAKER_00 (42:54):
It is.
I want to segue and come rightback to that point.
And the thing that I want topoint out, right, is for years,
right, trucking companies arelike, how do I get more
business?
But how do I get the rightbusiness?
And for anyone out there, thereason that this is the case,
and I always use this example,is like even the biggest
carriers do not run all over thecountry.
(43:15):
Like you can take the largestcarriers, whether it's Werner or
JB Hunt, like they are notrunning every lane in the
country because it's notefficient and it's not
profitable to just send yourtrucks everywhere all the time.
They look for strategic shippersthat fit in where they're
already running, just fronthaul, backhaul is a simple
example.
So, like there are denser areasof certain carriers where they
(43:38):
are a better fit.
That's how the supply chainoperates, right?
And it moves depending on what'sshipping in the country.
So it's not stagnant and it doeschange.
But carriers have always kind ofrelied on like, I'll put a
website together to try to getmore business or call brokers
and hope they find me, or it'sreally a lot reactive of hoping
(43:59):
they get found for the rightloads or posting their trucks
up.
The thing that I really likeabout Gen Logs because I'll hear
from the carri side of like, oh,well, like everybody is
benefiting but us.
Everybody is looking at where wework.
Why aren't we benefiting?
And I'm like, you guys are like,this is free advertising.
And not only is it freeadvertising for the carriers,
(44:22):
but it is free advertising tothe right customers at no cost
because the brokers will findthe carriers that are the right
fit through this platformwithout the carrier spending a
dime.
That example is a perfectexample of how you got CRC
transport business at no cost tothem on a lane that is a perfect
(44:44):
fit on a shipment that they mademoney on without having to do
any additional work because youmade them more visible to the
right people that had thebusiness that they needed, which
matched them up, right?
And it is not a one side of thecoin scenario.
Like this is mutually beneficialto both the carriers, the
brokers, and again, to theshippers, because they're the
ones that need the freight move.
(45:05):
And if it's the right carrier,it's all downstream.
The shipper gets a better rate,whether it's a car or a
truckload of chicken, it doesn'tmatter, right?
The broker does less work, andthe carrier didn't have to spend
any money to be found.
Literally, can you imagineowning a business where people,
your perfect customers, juststart calling you all the time?
Like it's like Google onsteroids, where it's just
(45:27):
literally advertising at no costto you, to the right people with
the right business that youneed.
SPEAKER_01 (45:32):
Yeah, I love that.
And I'm such a believer inoutbound carrier sales.
And I think that the reliance onlike just post and then, you
know, get get a bunch ofresponses and sift through them
and then go with the cheapestrate is what is frankly like
really destroying this industryover time.
Because that cheapest rate, theyare not the best, safest
carriers, and they are often theones that are trying to get
(45:54):
access to your freight for forbad purposes.
Um, what you just said is sotrue.
And I really am passionate abouta vision.
I I talk about this often.
When I think about 2030, I'mconvinced that if Genlogs does
our job well, and you kind ofpaired Gen Logs smartly with
some of these uh agentic AItools, not in a way that takes
(46:17):
away from the relationships, butin a way that says, like, hey,
at least I'm gonna look atwhat's coming up on my TMS.
I'm gonna then figure out arethese carriers like still out
there on the roads, running theright lanes, have the right
equipment?
Um, have they been onboardedwith me?
And if so, then I'm gonna usesome technology to at least to
tender those loads out there.
(46:37):
Say, hey, would you guys likethese loads?
Um, and and if you do that, thenall of a sudden we can now get
this direct kind of, I have aload, I'm finding the right
carrier, I'm putting it in theirhands.
I now know that that carrier isreal legitimate.
I'm not having to wonder, gosh,this is a new carrier I've never
dealt with before, but they'rethey're cheap and you know, I
(46:59):
want to get it done.
Um you will be able to findcarriers that are like, hey,
actually, I do have a truck inDallas right now and I need to
get back to Chicago.
And and instead of deadheading,they're gonna take your freight
at a reduced rate to market.
But you know, you need to knowhow you're gonna find them.
And that's what we reallyenable.
(47:19):
Uh, we we have what I call asthe billion-dollar backhaul
button.
It literally allows you to seewhich carriers are in certain
market right now that likelyneed backhauls.
And that is what uh that that'swhat's driving margin for our
customers.
And I'll end by saying this isthis is backed by empirical
evidence.
We have a customer right nowthat's sharing their margins on
(47:41):
every load they are covering.
When they uh drive and loadsthat they post on the load
boards, they're getting about11% margin these days.
When they source the carrierthrough gen logs, that margin
goes up to 16 to 18 percent.
Wouldn't you love to have 5%more margin across all your
loads?
Like to me, it's a no-brainerwhen it's done well.
SPEAKER_00 (48:03):
And and not only that too, right?
Like, I remember when we werelike conceptualizing what this
should be able to do, right?
And I'm like, we're talking likeeconomically, like your margin
should go up.
And I was always very curious tosee the number you just said in
practice, right?
Because in theory, an academic,like, yeah, economically with
(49:41):
the right carrier and enoughinformation, like you should be
able to drive better margins,but also the carrier is getting
more money because they're notdriving dead miles, they're not
driving around empty toreposition themselves.
It literally is not the brokermade money and the carrier
suffered, which is the firstthing you said.
Yeah.
It is everybody ends up doingbetter, both the carrier, the
(50:05):
broker, and the shipper.
And like the other thing thatthis is is it levels the playing
field, right?
Because somebody asked me thislast week, starting a new
brokerage.
What's the difference betweenlike a CH, a TQL, and an Echo
and like a mid-sized company,right, versus a really small
one?
I'm like, it's just information.
They're like, Well, what do youmean?
I'm like, at the end of the day,if you can find the it's
(50:27):
literally the carrier list.
Like 15 years ago, right?
Like the best broker for movingpipe in Texas, which all
basically moves from like theHouston area out to the oil
fields, out to like Odessa andback and forth.
He literally had a notebook withlike 150 carriers of all of the
trucking companies that ran thatlane.
So anytime there was a pipeload, he could get it covered
(50:50):
because of the information hehad, right?
And yes, there wererelationships that had to also
be facilitated in there.
But like fundamentally, if youhave that list, I could just
call all of them, introducemyself, and literally be able to
provide the same value.
It took that guy 30 years tobuild that list, right?
Genlogs puts in the hands of amid-size or smaller company the
(51:12):
advantage that the big ones hadto build over decades, right?
So at the end of the day, likewhen you have that information,
it doesn't matter if you're atwo-person brokerage or a
5,000-person brokerage.
That is the differentiator.
It is locating the right fitwith the right carrier to move
that load safely and securelywith the correct insurance,
(51:33):
which all can be done in oneplace now.
SPEAKER_01 (51:35):
Couldn't agree with you more.
And I think the really importantpiece to this, uh, it's twofold.
Number one, some of those verylarge brokerages you mentioned,
they are our customers, whichmeans they evaluated our
platform and said, holy cow,we've assembled book on carriers
over the last 30 years, andGenLogs has more than we do.
We need to get this.
(51:56):
And number two, is they all arerenewing for their second year
right now, which in any type ofsoftware product, you just
wouldn't do if you weren'tseeing the return on investment.
And they not only are, butthey're doing so at a larger
contract value, they'reexpanding their use of Gen Logs.
So it's really great that I knowmany of the listeners here,
(52:16):
you're either contemplatingbuilding a brokerage or you're
just getting into it, you'restarting, or whatnot.
You like GenLogs wants to put inyour hands the equivalent of all
of these large brokeragescombined books together.
And all of a sudden, you can goto any shipper and compete by
saying, Oh, you want like uhyeah, I have access to all of
(52:37):
the same carriers, and not onlyaccess, but recently we've
actually gone the extra mile andwe've confirmed dispatch
information for 60,000 carriers.
And these are the top carriers.
We actually took the topcarriers on each lane uh that
will be reliable, that arerunning those lanes every day
with the right equipment, andthose who we went out to and and
(52:58):
sourced the contact information.
So now you you hop on day one,you have whole of market
capacity, you have a way tocontact them, you have a way to
start building those carrierrelationships, and a way to
defend against fraud.
So you can walk into that firstcustomer that you're trying to
land and say, This is what I'mgonna do to keep your freight
(53:18):
safe.
This is what I'm gonna do tokeep rates, you know, uh at uh
industry, you know, lower thanthan industry.
And and you're doing it all withintelligence.
And that's what made that's whatmakes the United States the most
powerful country in the world iswe use, we collect intelligence
and we use that to driveadvantages over our competitors.
And that's what we're putting inyour hands.
SPEAKER_00 (53:39):
Yes.
And I want to point out thatwhere those 60,000 points of
contact, phone numbers andemails came from, was not
purchasing a database, is notfrom the FMCSA, is not just,
hey, we got this from anothercompany.
It was literally verified theold-fashioned way, which is
human beings making phone calls,reaching out, talking to those
(54:03):
people, and making sure that wascorrect, right?
Which is literally what westarted the conversation with,
which is like, yeah, you can buythese anywhere.
People sell them.
I've got carrier lists.
Oh, I can plug into this API,these are all good.
Most of which I've literallybeen in the back end of and are
not what you think they are andare not verified, or have been
verified five years ago.
And yeah, at one point theywere, but like these are
(54:25):
literally phone numbers andemail addresses for these
carriers that like somebodyliterally called, talked to the
human being, and checked andmade sure they were the right
points of contact.
SPEAKER_01 (54:35):
Yeah, and you're gonna love this story, Benjamin.
Is I um that's exactly true.
And we also limited to onlyreaching out to active carriers
that were running lanes likeevery day.
And so this isn't someone thatwent out of business, you know,
two years ago.
It they had to be active, theyhad to be running the lanes,
which brings me to this storythat just happened yesterday is
(54:55):
I had a carrier reach out to uhGenlog's contact website or
email address directly, which iskind of rare.
And they said, like, hey, I justwant to figure out how I update
my contact information with youguys.
Um, we just changed a fewthings, and it kind of smelled a
little funny to me.
And so what I wrote back to themis I I wanted to test that you
(55:16):
could do this, and it wasawesome.
Where I said, uh, I looked upthe actual trucks of the real
carrier out there on the roads,and I got some data points about
it.
And I looked up to make surethat this data couldn't be found
through FMCSA inspection data,and it couldn't.
And I said, Hey, do me a favor,uh you just have to answer two
simple questions, and then wecan update this.
Number one, what cab number isassociated with this license
(55:40):
plate?
And then number two, on thisspecific day, where was this cab
uh number running, a differentcab number, and what was the
commodity that was hauling?
The reason I did that is becausethat first question, you could
maybe get luckier see that.
Second, you have to havehistorical knowledge that's in
your TMS.
And I could see from our imagesthat they were running a load of
(56:02):
gravel.
Now that's like very specific.
Yep.
If you're the real carrier, youanswer that question.
Oh, yeah, we were it was inIdaho, we had, you know, we're
running gravel.
SPEAKER_00 (56:11):
235 is the cap number.
SPEAKER_01 (56:12):
There you go.
If you're if you're and guesswhat?
I haven't heard back from them.
And so it was a fraudster tryingto infiltrate our system.
And we could use real physicaldata to say, just like if you're
applying for a mortgage loan orsomething like that, they run
you through that, know yourcustomer and type some of your
identity, like have you everowned in this area?
(56:32):
What was this address?
SPEAKER_00 (56:34):
Things that only color was the car you had in
2013.
SPEAKER_01 (56:37):
There you go.
We're doing that with historicaldata based on two billion images
that can very quickly tell usdoes this, is this the real
carrier?
Is it someone posing as thatcarrier?
And it's so cool.
SPEAKER_00 (56:49):
I know.
And to be honest, like learningwhat I've even learned this
summer that we were talkingabout of just where and how the
fraud was being perpetrated.
Like, honestly, like there was aperiod, like July and August,
like I was seriously likedepressed for like a month or
two.
Cause I'm like, I don't knowthat this is fixable unless the
(57:09):
government fixes it.
And you've been in thegovernment and we've talked
about this a lot.
And it's like, well, they'retrying, and hey, God bless them.
It seems like they're moving inthat direction, but who knows
when they'll be able to do this.
This is the thing that makes meso happy, honestly, every week
is working on things like thisbecause, like, at the end of the
day, like, if we can solve thisfor the whole industry, like
(57:32):
it's better for everybody.
It's better for the supplychain.
It's safer for everybody, it'smore secure for things we ship
for the military, things thatshouldn't be compromised that we
absolutely know are, right?
And being able to actually fixthis in a way that helps
everybody to me makes this likeone of the, honestly, it's like
(57:54):
one of the high points of likemy career of like projects and
things to have been working onover the past few years.
And also like what I know iscoming down the line that like
honestly, I'm super excitedabout all of this because like
it doesn't just benefit everyonein here, but down the line, I
think there are some even biggerthings that it's gonna be able
to do for the entire industry.
SPEAKER_01 (58:15):
Yeah, and I I I get giddy when I think about what we
can do with the data we'resitting on and what we are um
what we have coming down ourroadmap here in the next year or
two, some of the stuff thatwe've chatted about.
So when we actually get there todo some big reveals, we're gonna
have a big reveal in January onsome uh renewed shipper
intelligence that's just gonnalike knock people's sops off.
(58:35):
And when I say that, I mean wewill have 600,000 different
shipper locations spinning notonly the US but Mexico and
Canada, all of their lanes, theequipment types that they run on
those lanes, and then alsogetting down to the the load
volume on those lanes as well.
Uh that is, I mean, if you'renot using that, then you're not
interested in growing yourbusiness.
(58:56):
So yeah, that's coming soon.
SPEAKER_00 (58:58):
And and again, like that was one of the things I was
most excited about.
Literally before the product wasrolled out.
It's like, like, oh my God.
I'm like, if we can see wherethe trucks are going, then we
can see where the shippers aremoving, which means if you've
got a lane and you need theother end of that, like you
could literally go and just putit in gen logs, find the company
and call them like, hey, I'mliterally driving past your
(59:20):
facility every week with one ofmy drivers.
Hey, so like again, and youalluded to this earlier.
We kind of like went on theother tangent, but like this is
not just securing freight.
This is not just preventingfraud.
This is not just finding bettercarriers for loads.
It allows you to grow yourbusiness by finding the shippers
that you should be callinginstead of just calling a
(59:43):
thousand of them every week,hoping they run a lane that
matches up with your network,whether it's a brokerage or a
carrier, whatever side of it is.
SPEAKER_01 (59:51):
Yeah, work smarter, not harder, man.
That's what I say.
So we're gonna give you theintelligence to go land that.
Yeah, awesome.
SPEAKER_00 (59:57):
Any final thoughts?
Anything you want to sharebefore we wrap up?
SPEAKER_01 (01:00:01):
You know, in Nate's uh in Nate's debt, I'll just say
go bills.
SPEAKER_00 (01:00:04):
And whether you believe you can or believe you
can't, you're right.
Hey, welcome to this week's episode of Freight 360.
Got a special guest, Ryan Joycefrom Gen Logs, is with us today.
Nate is traveling.
I believe he's on hisanniversary trip this week,
actually in Florida, somewhereup north.
So it'll be the two of us.
And speaking of anniversaries,um, Brian just got back from his
honeymoon, recently married.
He was traveling all over thecountry.
(00:40):
We just jumped right into it,man.
How was it being out on theroads?
Dude, it was awesome.
SPEAKER_01 (00:44):
I was out on the roads for three and a half
weeks.
My wife and I were van camping.
Uh, and the coolest thing wasthis van was almost at truck
driver level in terms of height.
And so I finally got to kind ofexperience what it's like
rolling down the roads andlooking left and right.
Uh, and and we saw a ton oftrucks out there.
Um, obviously, from the gen logsperspective, we were constantly
(01:05):
looking at it new locations toput up our cameras around the
roads.
So we actually started a channelinternally called Project
Honeymoon.
And as I was out there, I wasmarking all of these different
places to put our cameras up inthe Northeast.
We were up in Maine, went toAcadia, New Hampshire, Vermont,
and then came down through NewYork, uh, Pennsylvania into West
Virginia.
(01:25):
And uh, when I was up in NewYork, I we were actually right
near, uh, went almost closer toBuffalo.
And I realized, like, if I'mfilling in for Nate this week, I
should have been wearing myBill's jacket.
Exactly, instead of my Gen Mog'sjacket.
But uh I can't fill Nate'sshoes, but at least I can uh
it's great to fill in andhopefully is a great
anniversary.
SPEAKER_00 (01:46):
Yeah, and I think it's gonna be a really good
episode.
Before we jump into likeindustry stuff and things, I
want to lead off with a storythat I found out a couple weeks
ago about Top Gun.
And I just want you to kind oftake it from there because one,
I mean, I grew up in the 80s,and like that was like the
coolest movie.
We played in the woodspretending we were Maverick and
(02:08):
Goose.
So, like, I have so many fondmemories of that movie coming
out, and an I saw you, you and Ihave talked, I mean, we've known
each other for years now.
I had no idea that this storyexisted.
And I just kind of want you tojust kick it off of it because I
feel like it's a really coolstory.
SPEAKER_01 (02:25):
Yeah, well, it's it's less my story to tell and
more my dad's really cool story,but I'll kind of relay it where
my dad actually uh got recruitedto the Naval Academy to play
lacrosse and graduated in 1979,where he then got slotted to go
to flight school.
So he went down to Pensacola,uh, started flying uh planes
there, and then got selected togo fly the F-14 Tomcat, which
(02:48):
was kind of new, slick, justcame out in the 70s, and uh they
were gearing up.
And so he got posted outactually in San Diego and uh
flew, did a few deployments, andthen got selected to go through
Top Gun.
Now, back then, Top Gun was notacknowledged publicly.
It was kind of a top secretprogram for the best of the best
uh of pilots.
(03:09):
And so as he was going throughTop Gun, right before he kicked
off, uh uh the local newspaperapproached the Navy and said,
Hey, we've heard of this thingcalled Top Gun.
We would like to write anarticle about it.
Uh, could we do that?
And the Navy kind of thoughtabout it and said, you know,
maybe that'll actually be goodfor recruiting the next
generation of fighter pilots.
(03:29):
So they agreed and they selectedmy dad and three other
classmates to essentially thisthis journalist was tied at his
hip for the few weeks that hewent through Top Gun.
And each week he would write alittle article about it, what it
was like to go through this thebest of the best fighter town
USA Top Gun uh flight school.
(03:49):
And uh, and so when that allwrapped up, that those articles
were all republished underAviation magazine under the
article titled Top Guns.
Well, Paramount bought therights to that article, Top
Guns, and wrote the screenplayTop Gun, literally based off of
my dad and those three othersgoing through.
(04:10):
And as if that wasn't coolenough, uh, my dad was actually
selected to go back to Top Gunas a flight instructor right
when they were filming themovie.
And so as he was doing theflying end type Top Gun the
second time around, they wouldliterally just hand him a
helmet, like Goose's helmet, forthe day, put the camera in the
(04:31):
cockpit, and that's actually mydad doing a lot of those flying
scenes in the movie.
And he got invited with my momto the premiere.
Uh, they met Tom Cruise, therest of the cast.
Uh, super cool story, and um,and that's the background.
And you could look it up, it'slike written about before my
dad, Tom Joyce, um, has Top Gunfame.
SPEAKER_00 (04:52):
What is it and it's honestly like that is so cool
because, like, again, like Ivividly remember watching that
movie like in my living room asI was probably like seven or
eight, maybe like maybe aroundnine, because it's like late
80s, I think, when it came out.
And I'm like literally rememberrunning around and playing in
the woods and stuff and beinglike Maverick and Goose and
Iceman.
(05:13):
And when I saw that, I was like,that is like the coolest shit
that I've I it for sure thatI've seen all year, if not in a
very long time, that like yourdad was literally goose in the
movie, which is just like I feellike the coolest story ever.
SPEAKER_01 (05:24):
And I gotta close it out with like just a story that
gives me goosebumps, where Iactually went to go see Top Gun
2 with my dad for the firsttime.
Oh, that's awesome.
So we're sitting next to eachother in the theater, and he
says beforehand, almost kind oflike teary-eyed, he's like, you
know what?
I can't wait to watch thismovie.
It's just sad that they're notgonna have an actual F-14 in the
(05:45):
movie because it wasdecommissioned back in the 90s,
like early 2000s.
Well, sure enough, for those whohave seen, not it's like not to
do a little spoiler alert here,yeah.
But right at the end, they comeacross an old F-14.
And when they pull off thattarp, I looked to the side and
saw my dad, and sure enough, hestarted to tear up because it
was you know that that planefrom his youth that now was back
(06:09):
in the movie and was franklylike saving the day at the end.
I just love that.
SPEAKER_00 (06:13):
And it's so cool.
Like, I literally havegoosebumps because, like, I
don't know, as I guess you getolder, maybe when you're
married, for sure when you havekids, like you just think about
those things differently,whether it's the appreciation or
the nostalgia.
But like to me, like that is socool because it's like not only
was that like very impactful,but for even folks that weren't
around then, like that was hugein the 80s because, like, this
(06:36):
is like the Cold War.
This is like you're growing upin a completely different world
than it is now, and like thatmovie was like the antithesis of
exactly that conflict, and itwas like all of it kind of came
to a head in that movie.
So, like anybody thinking backon that period, that is like
this quintessential piece oflike not only just pop pop
culture, but like the wholezeitgeist of the entire world
(06:59):
was like that moment in thatmovie, and it was so cool that
they did it again, which wasawesome.
I thought the second movie wasalso really good, but then when
I saw that, I'm like, that islike the coolest shit that I've
seen in recent memories.
SPEAKER_01 (07:10):
It's an awesome story.
Uh, my dad's my hero, so it'slike super cool to be able to
tell his story a little bit.
Um, but I agree.
They did it.
It is so rare that you make asequel that actually matches the
the original.
And I thought they did aphenomenal job with uh Top Gun
2.
I hope there's not a Top Gun 3because I don't think you could
keep it going, but we couldleave it at two.
SPEAKER_00 (07:30):
Agreed.
Um, well, for anybody that kindof doesn't know you, like that's
a decent segue into at least alittle bit of your career
pre-gen logs for just anybodythat is new to gen logs and what
we've been working on.
I know you've been on the showbefore.
We've talked about it a lot, butwhy don't you give some people
because like I think that waspretty foundational into your
(07:50):
early adulthood, early career,which actually is how gen logs
came to existence in the firstplace, right?
SPEAKER_01 (07:56):
Yeah, for sure.
I mean, my dad actually finishedhis career, uh, decommissioned
one of the squadrons, VF-111,which is the Sundowners on the
West Coast in California beforegetting posted to the Pentagon
as deputy chief of all navalaviation.
So he kind of rose through theranks.
Uh, he was an 06, a captain forthose who come out of the
military.
And uh, and he was in thePentagon on 9-11 when the plane
(08:21):
hit hit his office.
Um, fortunately, it hit justunderneath his office.
He was in the third ring insidethe Pentagon on the top floor,
and it blew out everythingbelow, and he narrowly escaped
with his life that day, asliterally the floors caving in,
fire everywhere.
I mean, it was just a crazy andchaotic time.
I was a senior in high school atthe time, and I could tell you
(08:43):
the morning of September 11th,2001, all I wanted to do was
flirt with girls and playbasketball after school.
That's literally it.
Yep.
After that happened, and Ithought I had lost my dad, only
to find that I hadn't, but itwas definitely a wake-up call
for me.
I didn't know what I wanted todo with the future, uh, my own
future.
I went to bed that night,committed to learn everything I
could about the history,culture, language, or religion
(09:04):
of the people that would do thatand make sure it never happened
again.
Fast forward a few years later,I actually studied abroad in the
Middle East, I learned Arabic,and I ended up getting recruited
into the CIA, where I spent afew uh few years of my life
living in the Middle East with ajob was to recruit foreign
sources, aka al-Qaeda, and ISISguys, to provide us information,
(09:27):
uh secret information to makesure that 9-11 never happened
again.
And so I followed through onthat background.
You might wonder, like, what amI doing in freight today?
SPEAKER_00 (09:37):
Um, but there's a segue, right?
And it all does kind of cometogether.
SPEAKER_01 (09:42):
There is a segue, and you know, it's taken me a
little while to really put thisinto words because I felt it,
but I didn't know how toarticulate it.
And and one of the things thatwe struggled with inside of CIA.
In fact, for anyone who'slistening right now, if you go
to CIA.gov and you go to theupper right-hand corner, there's
a button there that says reportinformation.
And sure enough, no matter whereyou are in the world, it's gonna
(10:04):
walk you through how to accessthe dark web and provide
information to the CIA.
I mean, it's literally it itwalks you through that steps
there.
So I came about in this in theCIA during this digital era of
informants around the world,being able to provide secret
information to or bring it toour attention without us ever
meeting them face to face tobegin with.
(10:26):
But for those who know, like uhif you're working with a high
risk or high, you know, highloss uh ratio of whatever you
might be involved in, you wantto at some point meet someone
face to face.
You want to have a conversationwith them.
You want to know that they'reeither not a double agent trying
to provide you bad information,or worse, they're not trying to
lure you out to kill you.
(10:47):
And unfortunately at the CIA, wehad gotten it wrong a few times
where I've had colleagues thathave been killed or injured when
they've gone out to meet asource for the first time, only
to find out that we were beingset up or ambushed.
And so at CIA, we had to find away when you had never met
someone face to face, basicallyyou were only having these
digital-only transactions.
(11:08):
How could you know that youcould trust them?
How did you know that they werereal?
How did you know that theinformation they wanted you to
provide you was valid, that theyweren't trying to set you up?
And the way we solved that atCIA was using satellite sensors
or hearing from other sources.
It's what we called all sourceintelligence back in the CIA or
in the intelligence community.
(11:29):
Fast forward to today, and everybroker that's listening to this
knows the danger these days ofdealing with a digital only
persona.
You post on DAT or another loadboard, you get 30 carriers that
write in, you know, saying, Hey,I can carry that load for you.
And you're trying to siftthrough who's real that can
(11:50):
actually run this load, or who'swho's trying to set me up to
steal it, um, or or at leastdouble broker it and take a
margin.
And it is really difficult whenyou're dealing with digital only
identities to figure that out,unless you're using different
types of vectors or all sourceintelligence.
And so there was a little bit ofa uh a way that I kind of came
(12:12):
to Genlogs and my twoco-founders, Blake and Joe, were
critical in this process.
But the bottom line is wedecided to take the entire
playbook of what we learned theintelligence community,
specifically through the lasttwo decades of the global war on
terror, and apply it totrucking.
So we like to joke that we usedto track terrorists and now we
track trucks, but it's using CIAcaliber methodology to solve a
(12:36):
2025 problem in the truckingindustry.
And fortunately, we've beensuccessful because we go beyond
just this digital-only pervetting capability to actually
bring in the physical footprintof carriers into the mix.
When we talked about satellitesensors and other sources at
CIA, we do the same thing atGenlogs.
We've actually invested millionsof dollars to put an entire
(13:00):
nationwide network of roadsidecameras along all major
interstates, freight lanes,highways, collecting on truck
patterns, truck footprints.
We collect now 15 million truckimages a day.
We just surpassed 2 billionimages in our holdings on
trucks.
And on a regular basis, we'reseeing over 90% of four higher
carriers in our data.
(13:21):
Uh, those last 10%, we believethat they're either sitting out
this really bad freightrecession, or they're the ones
you want to avoid that are notactually out there running
freight, but are sitting inEastern Europe, Mexico, or other
places trying to steal yourloads.
So that's a little bit ofbackground on how this came to
be.
SPEAKER_00 (13:39):
And I want to do like a kind of like a side
tangent on this that I think isreally important, right?
Because I think when people aretrying to optimize, right, like
and everybody tries to get moredone in less time with less
friction, right?
So, like for sure, there's apush just from like a capitalism
point of view, of businessesneeding to get more efficient.
But there's always thattrade-off, right?
Because if you push too far,right, you take on more risk,
(14:02):
right?
You need those things, but youalso need to verify.
And the other thing that I thinkis important for anyone
listening is for sure, like thecarriers that listen to the show
and follow this from thetrucking side, is that like this
is not a replacement for whatyou said is like relationships.
At the end of the day, like,let's just take the CIA example.
You, I mean, literally juststating, like, in a very
stressful situation withextremely high stakes where
(14:25):
people's lives are on the line,you are going to put your life
on the line to meet somebodyface to face, of which that
other person is going to do.
That's how important that pieceis, right?
And in the freight world, thisis not a replacement for having
conversations and havingrelationships, because at the
end of the day, that is thegoal.
What these tools allow you to dois be more efficient in who
(14:47):
you're going to choose to meet,whether it is in person, on the
phone, spend time with,negotiate either RFPs, loads,
lanes, finding the right fit,the right carrier that you can
trust, the carrier finding theright broker they can work with,
without having to, like yousaid, sift through dozens and
dozens out of a hundred ofhonestly, like either bad
(15:09):
actors, people that have badfaith might steal either the
money for the load, the wholeload, or mislead somebody.
Like the whole point is tocreate trust faster in a way
that is also more efficient foreverybody in the market.
And it really does benefit allof the parties.
We've talked about this evenprior to gen logs when we first
met of like this really doescreate like a win, a win and a
(15:31):
win for both a shipper havingbetter capacity, better fits,
the carrier having better laneswith what they're running, and
the broker being able tofacilitate these things more
efficiently, more effectively,and with higher trust and less
loss, right?
Which I think, again, foranybody out there, like that is
the goal.
That's what we should be doing.
That's literally our job.
(15:51):
But as we've pushed towardsprofitability and doing things
faster, I think a lot of thesethings have not got as much
emphasis or as much time andeffort as they should.
And I think that's whatcriminals have taken advantage
of.
Like they know that, right?
Hey, if you're moving fast andyou're not paying attention,
you're pretty vulnerable toloss, no matter how you define
(16:11):
it, right?
SPEAKER_01 (16:12):
Yeah, I fully agree.
And I think in many ways, we aremonitoring the wrong things in
the industry.
And I'll give you an example.
Like there are couldn't agreemore.
There are carriers that have uhslightly bad out-of-service
scores that will not steal yourfreight.
Yep.
And there are carriers that haveperfect out-of-service scores
that will steal your freight.
(16:33):
As at or someone posing as thatcarrier is what I should say.
Yes.
So, like, there's two differentthings there's safety and then
there's security.
You know, bad safety does notnecessarily translate to they're
definitely now gonna steal yourfreight.
Correct.
The other thing, too, is thereare absolutely carriers that uh
use an office building thatanother carrier is in.
(16:53):
And therefore, they're gonnahave an address that's going to
have two carriers from that sameaddress.
And in many systems, that'sgonna be a, hey, sorry, you guys
are sharing an address, that isa fraud or a risk issue.
And and while I think thosethings are good to look at,
they're good to kind of bring ina more holistic review.
It if you're moving too fast andall of a sudden you're saying,
(17:13):
like, hey, out of service scoreslook good, uh, no shared
addresses or phone numbers.
Uh, they're they have greenchecks in my digital-only
vetting platform.
And then boom, freight, youknow, freight goes, and you
wonder, like, how did that getstolen?
Well, I and and we can get intothis a little bit more, but
GenLog's just completed our400th investigation for free for
(17:34):
the industry.
So last November we announced wewere going to start providing
investigations.
If you had a load stolen, youwere gonna come to us, we were
gonna help out.
Um, and and we have, and wefollowed through on that
promise.
We don't charge anyone for theseinvestigations, but it does give
us incredible insight into thetrends that are happening across
the industry.
And the common thread we haveseen is whenever we investigate
(17:57):
a stolen load, we look at thecarrier and our platform, we
look at their physical footprinton the road.
Their physical footprint iseither one of two things it does
not exist, or they are operatingin a completely different part
of the country or they have adifferent equipment type than
was actually needed for the loadthat was stolen.
And it's really put intoperspective for me that you need
(18:18):
to measure what matters, orultimately you could be doing a
hundred little things that youhope will all overlap to protect
you, but you're missing one bigthing.
And at Genlogs, where about theone big thing?
Is this carrier real?
Are they repeatedly runninglanes recently and do they have
the right equipment?
SPEAKER_00 (18:37):
And I want to go back to what you said, right?
For anyone out there, guess whoalso knows what your vetting
criteria are?
The criminals.
So, hey, if you're looking atout of service, if you're
looking for this, this, and thischeckbox, they can mimic that.
They can create the exact samething where they appear to be
the best carrier with thecorrect insurance with the best
(18:59):
out of service.
They know that's what they needto get the green light.
That is doable, right?
So it's not as if like thatinformation is proprietary and
that like criminals don't knowwhat these criteria are.
Like they're aware they can alsoeither buy brokerages or started
them or buy trucking companies.
They have the same informationthat was being used to sift them
(19:20):
out.
And the thing that gets me themost, this is the thing that
bothers me, I think, even almostas much as the theft, is that
when a carrier is a victim offraud, meaning like somebody
hacks a carrier, somebody stealsa load, all of these systems
flag that carrier and go, hey,they were reported for fraud.
(19:41):
Now the carrier did nothingwrong.
They were a victim.
And then every one of theseplatforms goes, hey, stay away
from them.
So not only did they end up onthe short end of the stick as a
victim, but then they're furtherpenalized by all of these
systems going, stay away fromthis carrier because they got
hacked.
Well, so now they're getting theshaft twice.
(20:02):
And like to me, the way thewhole industry has gone about
addressing this risk has put allof this on the carrier side.
And carriers are already in adepressed market, rates are
down, there's tons of issueswith CDLs and everything else
that anyone's seen in the news,with what you know, the FMCSA is
trying to crack down on.
And we've done a bunch ofcontent on that.
So, like, not only are they in ahard situation economically,
(20:25):
they have other people on theirside of the industry also making
(21:16):
it harder.
And then when they're a victimof theft, they get further
penalized.
And to me, nobody just reallythought about the fact that,
like, we need to cooperate tosolve this, not alienate the
most important part of thetransaction, which is the people
actually moving this freight,which is the thing that has
always really just gotten to me.
SPEAKER_01 (21:35):
Yeah, I mean, uh, for those that spend any time on
subreddit freight brokers, youknow what carriers think about
certain vetting platforms herethat they feel like they are
getting, you know, they theysneeze the wrong direction, and
all of a sudden it's, hey, donot use for the next 60, 90
days.
Yep.
And and I my heart really goesout to to these carriers,
especially when they are victimsof some type of hacking event or
(21:58):
otherwise.
And that's why I think the thesmart carriers actually look at
gen logs as overwatch andprotection rather than you know,
uh peering in or any type oflike surveillance state.
At the end of the day, weactually have uh we do a few
things.
First of all, we exclude allprivate vehicles from our data.
But recently we we instituted aprivacy layer where basically we
(22:21):
blur every window of everyvehicle that we collect.
So we are not in the business ofcollecting on truck drivers.
We're in the business ofcollecting that a truck was out
there at a time and place.
That physical footprint is whatcan protect a carrier that's
been hacked from all of a suddenloads getting stolen.
That if they're if the brokersthey deal with are realizing
(22:43):
that, hey, someone like reachedout to me about a load, but it
didn't match.
Like you haven't been there, oryou don't even have the right
equipment type, like something'samiss here, and then reaching
out to that carrier.
And you and I have chatted aboutit because I love that you are
the one that says there's liketwo big things you can do to
stop uh fraud.
You can, you know, instead ofusing, let's say you don't even
(23:05):
have any of these digitalvetting platforms at all, you
don't use them at all, but youdo these two things.
Number one is you check thephysical footprint of a carrier
out there.
Are they real, recent, runningthe right reins with lanes with
the right equipment?
That's number one.
Number two, if something doesn'tadd up, you call the number that
you've had in your TMS for yearsnow.
(23:26):
Yeah.
Give that phone number a call,give the last phone number,
email, reach out to that to say,hey, what's going on?
And like you said, that's whereyou actually find out what's
what's what's what's at stake.
SPEAKER_00 (23:39):
And I want to talk about what you guys uncovered in
the investigations, but like thething I want to say is in
everyone that has come throughus, whether it's clients,
brokers, reach out for help,whether I'm sending it to the
Genlogs investigation team, inevery single one of these, and
there's, I mean, probably closeto a hundred over the past
couple of years that like I wasinvolved in in some way.
The first thing I do is go tothe oldest phone number in any
(24:01):
of the tools, even if it's justthe FMCSA, call that old phone
number.
And in every single one, it'sliterally my first call, within
two minutes, that person tellsme exactly what happened.
They're like, Yeah, don't book aload.
Somebody hacked me, or hey,somebody said they were going to
buy my trucking company, theygot my login, changed all my
info, don't book a load.
Every single one.
And I'm like, okay, like I knownot everybody's going to make a
(24:25):
phone call every time they booka load because of all these
automations.
But like, again, sometimes theoldest, simplest things can be
the most effective.
Because if a carrier gets theirnumber changed, every every
system shows what it used to be.
And if you just call that oldone and again look at the
footprints, those two things,again, I haven't seen any stolen
(24:48):
theft where I wasn't able tofind out at least what went
wrong that quickly, right?
And those two things I think areincredible preventative measures
that are low cost, pretty loweffort.
Again, it is a little differentthan automation.
Everybody wanted to runeverything on AI.
But again, that also makes youmore vulnerable.
What did you guys find in thesehundreds of investigations?
(25:10):
Any commonalities, commonthreads?
SPEAKER_01 (25:13):
Yeah.
And almost all, you know, Ithink the the big concerning
thing for me, and this gets backto those common threads, is
we've actually witnessed a risein some of the Facebook groups
or other groups out there of uhsold USDOTs or USDOTs or MC
numbers that are for sale.
Um, and I think what's moreconcerning to me is some of
those that are for sale say,hey, it comes with a bank
(25:36):
account, an email, and a phonenumber.
And so all of a sudden yourealize that holy cow, this
carrier that's actually in goodstanding in all these platforms
could be going out of business,selling all of the contact
capabilities to now say, like,hey, you did call the phone
number, you have that.
And that's what I think is kindof the threat vector that
concerns me the most.
(25:56):
But in in all of those instanceswhere it was even more
sophisticated like that, what wenoticed is that we saw a carrier
every day, let's say, for thelast three years.
And then all of a sudden, we didnot see them for a month.
And it was that gap of notseeing a carrier at all that was
one of the biggest uh tells thathey, something's amiss,
(26:18):
something is different here.
Um, and if you permit me, I'llkind of uh show.
We had um, for those that haveprobably heard about the story,
Shaquille O'Neal had a hundredand eighty thousand dollar Range
Rover stolen uh last week.
It was getting detailed um by acompany that they were detailing
it in Georgia, and the pickupwas in Georgia, it was bringing
it down to Baton Rouge,Louisiana, and it vanished.
(26:41):
And the police report actuallyput out what the carrier, the
DOT of the carrier and the name,when they were actually uh when
when it was stolen.
I'm gonna go ahead and try toshare screen and I'll explain it
for those that are on audioonly.
So, what I'm showing here isfirst line trucking LLC.
The US DOT was 2543 uh two threesix nine uh six nine.
(27:05):
That's it.
Um once again, two five four twothree six nine.
Now, when we looked and this I'mshowing the genlogs platform
here, and you look at wherewe've seen in the last 30 days
there, underneath the carrier,we get the FMCSA contact, and
then we have the confirmedlocations over the last 30 days.
If I zoom out here and look atthe entire map of the United
(27:27):
States, you have them domicileddown in West Lico, Texas, and
they have not been observedanywhere in the United States
over the last 30 days.
Now they were 90 days ago.
They were, if I go a year agowhere we've seen them in the
last year, we've actually seenthem in Texas, we've seen them
in California.
Um, 90 days we saw them inCalifornia, and then boom, they
(27:49):
disappeared 30 days ago.
They are not, they're just noton the road.
SPEAKER_00 (27:54):
Well, and for anyone listening, where that is in
Texas, it looks like it is likea stone's throw from Mexico.
And I'm not saying that therearen't legitimate businesses
there, but again, it does makeyou want to ask a few questions
when you haven't seen anysightings in a month, and
they're physically located wherethere's not a lot of auto moves
(28:17):
between anybody.
SPEAKER_01 (28:19):
Yeah, 100%.
And this is like this is common.
I I have dozens of examples ofthat.
When when a theft happens, weask, hey, what was the USDOT
that stole it?
And then boom, we look up andyou look at the last 30 days and
and they just don't existanymore.
When you look at 30 days prior,90 days prior, they were very
active around the roads and allof a sudden they disappeared.
(28:41):
And this is just showing whatthe pattern what is happening.
You have a real carrier that'sout there, they may be
struggling to make ends meet,given where rates are, where
insurance has gone up, all ofthat.
They, you know, it's theythey're finally, I call it kind
of like the last gasp um herethat they're like, you know
what, I can't do this anymore.
And I'm already in debt a littlebit, I'm uh filed bankruptcy or
(29:03):
whatever.
And someone is willing to pay me$20,000 for for my USD or MC if
I give them my my cell phonenumber or associate with it.
Sure.
That in all of these vettingplatforms, they might still look
good because they were goodyesterday and they were good the
day before, but now something'smaterially changed with their
(29:23):
physical footprint on the road.
And that's where we're seeingthe issues, which is why it can
be a little manual.
We we or has been over the lastyear, if you're dealing with a
new carrier to have to go intogen logs to say, well, let me
type in their DOT, let me take alook and make sure everything
looks good.
Well, that all changes uh nextmonth.
Next month, we're actuallyreleasing our entire compliance
(29:45):
suite where it's gonna have allof the, you know, hey, they must
have an MC, they they uh mustnot have changed their legal
name recently, and you could putpass or fail or needs review in
there.
But at the very top of the list,at the very top of the list, we
have carrier observations.
The carrier must have beenobserved by gen logs within the
last, and then you set thetimeline.
(30:07):
You want it in the last weekbecause you're even more
concerned about high value, highrisk loads.
Sure, do that.
If you want to last 30 days, sobe it.
But you toggle that on, and younow only uh when you check a DOT
or an MC uh from you post on aload board and and it hits your
email and you're doing a run anduh check, and we're gonna
(30:28):
automate a lot of these checksgoing forward with both uh
integrations right into the TMSor plugins into the email,
that's gonna be the first passfail.
Hey, are they still active?
If they're not, we just we justsaved a$300,000 theft because
everything else could still betrue, they could still be in
good standing on whateverdigital vetting platform you
(30:49):
use, but they're not active onthe roads anymore.
And that's a big tell.
So this is a great example.
When the shack theft happened, Iwas like, gosh darn, we could
have stopped this.
Like, had they been justchecking the last 30 days, they
can't get to Texas to Georgiawithout going past.
A number of our cameras.
In fact, uh, you know, yesterdaythere was a uh an overturned
(31:12):
trailer on I-59 Mississippi witha bunch of monkeys that were in
there.
And they talked about it.
Really?
I didn't see that.
Yeah, like a great.
Here's uh for those looking atthe screen, they truck hauling
monkeys infected with hepatitisC herpes and COVID overturns on
(31:32):
a highway.
And uh, and that's absolutelytrue.
It happened.
Well, minutes, I'm talking 28minutes before this flipped
over.
We actually saw that trailer onI-59 in Ellisville, Mississippi.
You therefore, like, we havesuch sensor coverage now that
you cannot operate on the roadsand not be seen by us,
(31:54):
especially if you're doing a lotof heavy interstate travel,
which trying to get from Texasup to Georgia, uh, and when
you've not been seen at all inthe 30 days is just not
feasible.
And now Shaquille O'Neal, hisRange Rovers somewhere, you
know, over the Atlantic, headedto Mexico, Europe or Mexico.
Yeah.
And and yeah, and it allhappened because the broker that
(32:16):
brokered that that car movementdidn't have gem logs or didn't
automate the checks.
So, anyways, that's I'm gonnaget off my soapbox now, but
that's just so important becauseit would solve 99% of these
these cases.
SPEAKER_00 (32:28):
It would have, right?
And again, just to reiterate,what we just showed is that that
carrier is located in Texas, wassupposed to pick up a vehicle in
Georgia and would have had todriven past the sensors in order
to pick it up and hasn't beenseen in 30 days.
That's what we're saying of likeverification.
Hey, were they just seen onestill in business?
And the answer to that was no.
(32:48):
And second of all, were theyseen driving to go pick up my
shipment?
And the answer to that was no,right?
So those two things, you havetwo giant red flags that would
have meant find another carrier.
And the thing that I also wantedto talk about there, that I
don't know if we chatted aboutthis, but I've had clients now
that do just auto transport.
And specifically, I had one inChicago that moved all high-end
(33:12):
sports cars, mostly likeporches.
So, like six-figure and up carsalmost every one of their moves.
The thing we found, and this wasthree years ago or two years
ago.
So it's been a while, and I knowthis hasn't been fixed.
It's likely gotten worse, isthat we saw more double
brokering in auto transport thanany other niche in the entire
industry that I've ever seen.
(33:33):
Because there's two other loadboards that basically most
companies use.
You can still book autotransport through DAT, and some
of that happens, but and Ican't, my mind's blanking.
There's two specific load boardsthat really all of the auto
moves go through.
And how we really uncovered thiswas since you know he's his
customers are literally thedealerships.
We started looking at these.
(33:54):
I think this is when we startedactually getting MVP up, where I
was able to see this.
And I go, these MCs lookstrange.
So he drove to the dealership,right?
And I said, go and either callthe guy there selling the car
and have him check what truck ispicking this up, or go there and
see this.
And he did this for a month.
Honestly, if he moved 40 carsthat month, 38 of them were
(34:18):
double brokered.
None of the trucks that wereshowing up to pick up these
vehicles were the MCs he booked.
And what we found, which wascompletely rampant in that side
of the industry, was that thebigger carriers would just book
loads all over the load boardand then they would double
broker them or unlicensed brokerthem to another smaller carrier,
and none of them had insurance.
(34:39):
That was the kicker, right?
It wasn't necessarily that thesecars were getting stolen.
But what we realized when we dugin is I'm like, you're moving a
$250,000 car on a truck that hasno insurance, like literally no
insurance.
You thought you booked thislarge carrier with a$500,000
cargo policy.
They gave the load to anothercarrier that had no cargo
(35:00):
policy, which is how they wereable to move it cheaper because
they're not paying forinsurance.
The big carrier made an extra$200 to give the load to the
company with no insurance.
And then his cars were justgetting shipped all over the
country, uninsured, like notunderinsured, completely
uninsured.
And we use some of these thingsand these tools that we're
talking about to literallyuncover this, and it was
(35:21):
systemic.
And it's got to be as rampant asit was then.
Because nothing has come alongand addressed this other than
the tools and the things thatwe're talking about.
Like literally, gen logs was theonly way we were able to see
these things were occurring,right?
And this is three, this is likeV1 of Genlogs.
Like this is going back when thesensor density was a fraction of
(35:41):
what it is now, and it's onlygotten better since then.
SPEAKER_01 (35:43):
Yeah, a hundred percent.
And you know what?
It's actually one of my favoritestories uh is we have uh one of
our customers is Packer Freightin Green Bay, uh, Wisconsin.
And they are they don't do carhaulers at all or any auto
transport.
And yet one of their customersreached out and said, Hey, I I
know this is not part of usmoving our freight and this and
(36:04):
that, but I trust you guys.
I got to get a car fromWisconsin down to Florida uh
here.
Could you help me out?
Now, the Packer Freight guyssaid, you know, it isn't our
core uh what we do.
And yet we have gen logs, solet's take a look.
And and that's exactly what theydid.
They looked inside of ourplatform and they said, we're
gonna search from just carhaulers that can run from Green
(36:27):
Bay down to Miami.
And and I forget who it was, butin this case, um, I'm pulling up
my screen again, and that's theexact search that I did.
In this case, Green Bay,Wisconsin, down to Orlando,
Florida.
We get CRC transport.
Uh, we noticed that with ourobservations of their equipment,
they've had 100% car haulers outon the road.
Well, if I zoom in on our map,you can actually see the pink
(36:50):
dots in our map is where they'vebeen in the last, let's say, 24,
12 to 24 hours.
And and we could prove that theywere running the lane from
Wisconsin down to Florida.
And it was the same vehiclerunning that.
So it was a lane that they wererepeatedly doing.
They had great, like out ofservice vehicle scores.
They didn't have any red flags,none of the above.
(37:12):
And so Packer Freight felt like,you know what?
We feel comfortable looking atGenlogs to reach out.
They they booked that vehicleand they did so cheaper than all
of the other quotes that theircustomer had gotten elsewhere.
The vehicle arrived safe ontime, and that customer is now
even more loyal to them thanthey, you know, were before.
(37:32):
And they had this tool thatallowed them to do that and to
do so confidently.
SPEAKER_00 (37:36):
And not only, right, not only did were they able to
find it quickly, right?
But they were able to find one,and this is really important,
that was the right fit for thecarrier and the shipment, right?
And when you match those twothings up, the cost is lower.
The cost is lower because you'renot paying a driver to deadhead.
You're not paying somebody to godrive all the way out of
(37:59):
wherever they're already goingto go pick up your shipment,
which costs the driver money,right?
And everyone kind of doesn'tthink about that of like, hey, a
truck's a truck.
Why would I pay more for one orthe other?
Like, well, because the one's200 miles away empty, and one is
five miles away empty.
And that's guy's got to drivethere, burn fuel, and get there.
And when you can actually getmore efficient with choosing the
(38:21):
carriers that like actually needand want the load, like they
literally probably had emptyslots on that car hauler were
already in Wisconsin a few timesthat week, right?
So for them, it's like, hey, wecan make a couple extra hundred
bucks.
It's on our way, no problem.
And you can see they're doingthat.
It works for everybody.
Like you said, the customer ishappy.
(38:42):
The broker didn't takeadditional risk, even though
they're not used to shippingthese types of commodities.
Like it's the first time theymoved it, but they were able to
do it without taking this giantrisk of fielding hundreds of
phone calls and trying to guessdoes this company really do
this?
Or are they gonna give it toanother company?
Do they have the equipment?
Well, just because they have it,are they actually operating it?
(39:03):
Is it really on the roads?
And this is all of thatobscurity or opaqueness than the
industry that like nobody hadvisibility before, but now
Genlogs provides in a way thatis like fast, effective, and
efficient to actually use.
SPEAKER_01 (39:17):
100%.
And I'm gonna just share screenone last time for those that are
listening.
I'll I'll narrate it as well.
You know, what I'm showing ishere's that footprint, CRC
transport.
They're doing car haulers.
That's what we're observing outthere on the roads.
This is their footprint over thelast three years, but I can go
down a year, 90 days, 30 days.
I can look where they have beenin the last seven days, and you
(39:38):
can literally see them up inWisconsin, down through Georgia,
into Florida.
But with one button, I can clickour view on the asset locator.
And when I click that, it isgoing to pull up that carrier
and the images we've observed ofthat carrier.
And here we like can see carhaulers.
We know that they're running carhaulers.
(39:58):
I also see them in Wisconsin.
I saw them in Wisconsin uh lateyesterday, and I can observe
that hey, they are real CRCtransport.
They do have that equipment,they are running in that area.
Um, uh, and you can see theblurring that we apply.
That's like the privacy that weare now enabling.
And but at least me as a brokercan look and be like, oh,
(40:21):
they're legit.
Uh, they have the equipment,they're running the lanes,
they're not on anyone's D D andU lists.
Now, like I can feel comfortablemoving forward.
And that's what we want.
Like, form that relationshipnow.
Um, do that across, like, we doHeavy Hall, we do Hazmat, we do
all of these.
We have now our own ability tosearch for those.
(40:44):
So we open up for brokerages,like we say the riches are in
the niches, like it is nowavailable to you to get into
whatever niche area that's gonnapay better, but it's
traditionally been justdifficult to source carriers.
(41:49):
You can see entire marketcapacity here, know that they
are real, reach out, book, andthen move on to the the next
load.
Uh and I really do believe this.
There were the customers that wehave, which we're nearing a
hundred brokerage customers outthere, they talk about freight
for uh fraud and theft as if itwas now a past issue they had to
(42:11):
deal with.
And they are now looking atlike, how do we grow our
brokerage using genlog shipperintelligence data?
Um, how do we like tackle harderRFPs that are going to pay
better with bigger shippers?
Because now we have a trackrecord that we can tell
shippers, oh yeah.
The last time we had a loadstolen was I think it was 2023,
2024.
(42:32):
And then they're like, so youdon't have to worry about that
with us.
Let's gain your business.
This is how we vet carriers.
They show them the genlogsplatform, and man, they are
signing more and more customers.
And so there's really adivergence right now.
There's those that are trying tosurvive in 2025, and there's
those that are thriving in 2025.
And I and I'm proud to say thatwe're part of the latter
(42:53):
solution.
SPEAKER_00 (42:54):
It is.
I want to segue and come rightback to that point.
And the thing that I want topoint out, right, is for years,
right, trucking companies arelike, how do I get more
business?
But how do I get the rightbusiness?
And for anyone out there, thereason that this is the case,
and I always use this example,is like even the biggest
carriers do not run all over thecountry.
(43:15):
Like you can take the largestcarriers, whether it's Werner or
JB Hunt, like they are notrunning every lane in the
country because it's notefficient and it's not
profitable to just send yourtrucks everywhere all the time.
They look for strategic shippersthat fit in where they're
already running, just fronthaul, backhaul is a simple
example.
So, like there are denser areasof certain carriers where they
(43:38):
are a better fit.
That's how the supply chainoperates, right?
And it moves depending on what'sshipping in the country.
So it's not stagnant and it doeschange.
But carriers have always kind ofrelied on like, I'll put a
website together to try to getmore business or call brokers
and hope they find me, or it'sreally a lot reactive of hoping
(43:59):
they get found for the rightloads or posting their trucks
up.
The thing that I really likeabout Gen Logs because I'll hear
from the carri side of like, oh,well, like everybody is
benefiting but us.
Everybody is looking at where wework.
Why aren't we benefiting?
And I'm like, you guys are like,this is free advertising.
And not only is it freeadvertising for the carriers,
(44:22):
but it is free advertising tothe right customers at no cost
because the brokers will findthe carriers that are the right
fit through this platformwithout the carrier spending a
dime.
That example is a perfectexample of how you got CRC
transport business at no cost tothem on a lane that is a perfect
(44:44):
fit on a shipment that they mademoney on without having to do
any additional work because youmade them more visible to the
right people that had thebusiness that they needed, which
matched them up, right?
And it is not a one side of thecoin scenario.
Like this is mutually beneficialto both the carriers, the
brokers, and again, to theshippers, because they're the
ones that need the freight move.
(45:05):
And if it's the right carrier,it's all downstream.
The shipper gets a better rate,whether it's a car or a
truckload of chicken, it doesn'tmatter, right?
The broker does less work, andthe carrier didn't have to spend
any money to be found.
Literally, can you imagineowning a business where people,
your perfect customers, juststart calling you all the time?
Like it's like Google onsteroids, where it's just
(45:27):
literally advertising at no costto you, to the right people with
the right business that youneed.
SPEAKER_01 (45:32):
Yeah, I love that.
And I'm such a believer inoutbound carrier sales.
And I think that the reliance onlike just post and then, you
know, get get a bunch ofresponses and sift through them
and then go with the cheapestrate is what is frankly like
really destroying this industryover time.
Because that cheapest rate, theyare not the best, safest
carriers, and they are often theones that are trying to get
(45:54):
access to your freight for forbad purposes.
Um, what you just said is sotrue.
And I really am passionate abouta vision.
I I talk about this often.
When I think about 2030, I'mconvinced that if Genlogs does
our job well, and you kind ofpaired Gen Logs smartly with
some of these uh agentic AItools, not in a way that takes
(46:17):
away from the relationships, butin a way that says, like, hey,
at least I'm gonna look atwhat's coming up on my TMS.
I'm gonna then figure out arethese carriers like still out
there on the roads, running theright lanes, have the right
equipment?
Um, have they been onboardedwith me?
And if so, then I'm gonna usesome technology to at least to
tender those loads out there.
(46:37):
Say, hey, would you guys likethese loads?
Um, and and if you do that, thenall of a sudden we can now get
this direct kind of, I have aload, I'm finding the right
carrier, I'm putting it in theirhands.
I now know that that carrier isreal legitimate.
I'm not having to wonder, gosh,this is a new carrier I've never
dealt with before, but they'rethey're cheap and you know, I
(46:59):
want to get it done.
Um you will be able to findcarriers that are like, hey,
actually, I do have a truck inDallas right now and I need to
get back to Chicago.
And and instead of deadheading,they're gonna take your freight
at a reduced rate to market.
But you know, you need to knowhow you're gonna find them.
And that's what we reallyenable.
(47:19):
Uh, we we have what I call asthe billion-dollar backhaul
button.
It literally allows you to seewhich carriers are in certain
market right now that likelyneed backhauls.
And that is what uh that that'swhat's driving margin for our
customers.
And I'll end by saying this isthis is backed by empirical
evidence.
We have a customer right nowthat's sharing their margins on
(47:41):
every load they are covering.
When they uh drive and loadsthat they post on the load
boards, they're getting about11% margin these days.
When they source the carrierthrough gen logs, that margin
goes up to 16 to 18 percent.
Wouldn't you love to have 5%more margin across all your
loads?
Like to me, it's a no-brainerwhen it's done well.
SPEAKER_00 (48:03):
And and not only that too, right?
Like, I remember when we werelike conceptualizing what this
should be able to do, right?
And I'm like, we're talking likeeconomically, like your margin
should go up.
And I was always very curious tosee the number you just said in
practice, right?
Because in theory, an academic,like, yeah, economically with
(49:41):
the right carrier and enoughinformation, like you should be
able to drive better margins,but also the carrier is getting
more money because they're notdriving dead miles, they're not
driving around empty toreposition themselves.
It literally is not the brokermade money and the carrier
suffered, which is the firstthing you said.
Yeah.
It is everybody ends up doingbetter, both the carrier, the
(50:05):
broker, and the shipper.
And like the other thing thatthis is is it levels the playing
field, right?
Because somebody asked me thislast week, starting a new
brokerage.
What's the difference betweenlike a CH, a TQL, and an Echo
and like a mid-sized company,right, versus a really small
one?
I'm like, it's just information.
They're like, Well, what do youmean?
I'm like, at the end of the day,if you can find the it's
(50:27):
literally the carrier list.
Like 15 years ago, right?
Like the best broker for movingpipe in Texas, which all
basically moves from like theHouston area out to the oil
fields, out to like Odessa andback and forth.
He literally had a notebook withlike 150 carriers of all of the
trucking companies that ran thatlane.
So anytime there was a pipeload, he could get it covered
(50:50):
because of the information hehad, right?
And yes, there wererelationships that had to also
be facilitated in there.
But like fundamentally, if youhave that list, I could just
call all of them, introducemyself, and literally be able to
provide the same value.
It took that guy 30 years tobuild that list, right?
Genlogs puts in the hands of amid-size or smaller company the
(51:12):
advantage that the big ones hadto build over decades, right?
So at the end of the day, likewhen you have that information,
it doesn't matter if you're atwo-person brokerage or a
5,000-person brokerage.
That is the differentiator.
It is locating the right fitwith the right carrier to move
that load safely and securelywith the correct insurance,
(51:33):
which all can be done in oneplace now.
SPEAKER_01 (51:35):
Couldn't agree with you more.
And I think the really importantpiece to this, uh, it's twofold.
Number one, some of those verylarge brokerages you mentioned,
they are our customers, whichmeans they evaluated our
platform and said, holy cow,we've assembled book on carriers
over the last 30 years, andGenLogs has more than we do.
We need to get this.
(51:56):
And number two, is they all arerenewing for their second year
right now, which in any type ofsoftware product, you just
wouldn't do if you weren'tseeing the return on investment.
And they not only are, butthey're doing so at a larger
contract value, they'reexpanding their use of Gen Logs.
So it's really great that I knowmany of the listeners here,
(52:16):
you're either contemplatingbuilding a brokerage or you're
just getting into it, you'restarting, or whatnot.
You like GenLogs wants to put inyour hands the equivalent of all
of these large brokeragescombined books together.
And all of a sudden, you can goto any shipper and compete by
saying, Oh, you want like uhyeah, I have access to all of
(52:37):
the same carriers, and not onlyaccess, but recently we've
actually gone the extra mile andwe've confirmed dispatch
information for 60,000 carriers.
And these are the top carriers.
We actually took the topcarriers on each lane uh that
will be reliable, that arerunning those lanes every day
with the right equipment, andthose who we went out to and and
(52:58):
sourced the contact information.
So now you you hop on day one,you have whole of market
capacity, you have a way tocontact them, you have a way to
start building those carrierrelationships, and a way to
defend against fraud.
So you can walk into that firstcustomer that you're trying to
land and say, This is what I'mgonna do to keep your freight
(53:18):
safe.
This is what I'm gonna do tokeep rates, you know, uh at uh
industry, you know, lower thanthan industry.
And and you're doing it all withintelligence.
And that's what made that's whatmakes the United States the most
powerful country in the world iswe use, we collect intelligence
and we use that to driveadvantages over our competitors.
And that's what we're putting inyour hands.
SPEAKER_00 (53:39):
Yes.
And I want to point out thatwhere those 60,000 points of
contact, phone numbers andemails came from, was not
purchasing a database, is notfrom the FMCSA, is not just,
hey, we got this from anothercompany.
It was literally verified theold-fashioned way, which is
human beings making phone calls,reaching out, talking to those
(54:03):
people, and making sure that wascorrect, right?
Which is literally what westarted the conversation with,
which is like, yeah, you can buythese anywhere.
People sell them.
I've got carrier lists.
Oh, I can plug into this API,these are all good.
Most of which I've literallybeen in the back end of and are
not what you think they are andare not verified, or have been
verified five years ago.
And yeah, at one point theywere, but like these are
(54:25):
literally phone numbers andemail addresses for these
carriers that like somebodyliterally called, talked to the
human being, and checked andmade sure they were the right
points of contact.
SPEAKER_01 (54:35):
Yeah, and you're gonna love this story, Benjamin.
Is I um that's exactly true.
And we also limited to onlyreaching out to active carriers
that were running lanes likeevery day.
And so this isn't someone thatwent out of business, you know,
two years ago.
It they had to be active, theyhad to be running the lanes,
which brings me to this storythat just happened yesterday is
(54:55):
I had a carrier reach out to uhGenlog's contact website or
email address directly, which iskind of rare.
And they said, like, hey, I justwant to figure out how I update
my contact information with youguys.
Um, we just changed a fewthings, and it kind of smelled a
little funny to me.
And so what I wrote back to themis I I wanted to test that you
(55:16):
could do this, and it wasawesome.
Where I said, uh, I looked upthe actual trucks of the real
carrier out there on the roads,and I got some data points about
it.
And I looked up to make surethat this data couldn't be found
through FMCSA inspection data,and it couldn't.
And I said, Hey, do me a favor,uh you just have to answer two
simple questions, and then wecan update this.
Number one, what cab number isassociated with this license
(55:40):
plate?
And then number two, on thisspecific day, where was this cab
uh number running, a differentcab number, and what was the
commodity that was hauling?
The reason I did that is becausethat first question, you could
maybe get luckier see that.
Second, you have to havehistorical knowledge that's in
your TMS.
And I could see from our imagesthat they were running a load of
(56:02):
gravel.
Now that's like very specific.
Yep.
If you're the real carrier, youanswer that question.
Oh, yeah, we were it was inIdaho, we had, you know, we're
running gravel.
SPEAKER_00 (56:11):
235 is the cap number.
SPEAKER_01 (56:12):
There you go.
If you're if you're and guesswhat?
I haven't heard back from them.
And so it was a fraudster tryingto infiltrate our system.
And we could use real physicaldata to say, just like if you're
applying for a mortgage loan orsomething like that, they run
you through that, know yourcustomer and type some of your
identity, like have you everowned in this area?
(56:32):
What was this address?
SPEAKER_00 (56:34):
Things that only color was the car you had in
2013.
SPEAKER_01 (56:37):
There you go.
We're doing that with historicaldata based on two billion images
that can very quickly tell usdoes this, is this the real
carrier?
Is it someone posing as thatcarrier?
And it's so cool.
SPEAKER_00 (56:49):
I know.
And to be honest, like learningwhat I've even learned this
summer that we were talkingabout of just where and how the
fraud was being perpetrated.
Like, honestly, like there was aperiod, like July and August,
like I was seriously likedepressed for like a month or
two.
Cause I'm like, I don't knowthat this is fixable unless the
(57:09):
government fixes it.
And you've been in thegovernment and we've talked
about this a lot.
And it's like, well, they'retrying, and hey, God bless them.
It seems like they're moving inthat direction, but who knows
when they'll be able to do this.
This is the thing that makes meso happy, honestly, every week
is working on things like thisbecause, like, at the end of the
day, like, if we can solve thisfor the whole industry, like
(57:32):
it's better for everybody.
It's better for the supplychain.
It's safer for everybody, it'smore secure for things we ship
for the military, things thatshouldn't be compromised that we
absolutely know are, right?
And being able to actually fixthis in a way that helps
everybody to me makes this likeone of the, honestly, it's like
(57:54):
one of the high points of likemy career of like projects and
things to have been working onover the past few years.
And also like what I know iscoming down the line that like
honestly, I'm super excitedabout all of this because like
it doesn't just benefit everyonein here, but down the line, I
think there are some even biggerthings that it's gonna be able
to do for the entire industry.
SPEAKER_01 (58:15):
Yeah, and I I I get giddy when I think about what we
can do with the data we'resitting on and what we are um
what we have coming down ourroadmap here in the next year or
two, some of the stuff thatwe've chatted about.
So when we actually get there todo some big reveals, we're gonna
have a big reveal in January onsome uh renewed shipper
intelligence that's just gonnalike knock people's sops off.
(58:35):
And when I say that, I mean wewill have 600,000 different
shipper locations spinning notonly the US but Mexico and
Canada, all of their lanes, theequipment types that they run on
those lanes, and then alsogetting down to the the load
volume on those lanes as well.
Uh that is, I mean, if you'renot using that, then you're not
interested in growing yourbusiness.
(58:56):
So yeah, that's coming soon.
SPEAKER_00 (58:58):
And and again, like that was one of the things I was
most excited about.
Literally before the product wasrolled out.
It's like, like, oh my God.
I'm like, if we can see wherethe trucks are going, then we
can see where the shippers aremoving, which means if you've
got a lane and you need theother end of that, like you
could literally go and just putit in gen logs, find the company
and call them like, hey, I'mliterally driving past your
(59:20):
facility every week with one ofmy drivers.
Hey, so like again, and youalluded to this earlier.
We kind of like went on theother tangent, but like this is
not just securing freight.
This is not just preventingfraud.
This is not just finding bettercarriers for loads.
It allows you to grow yourbusiness by finding the shippers
that you should be callinginstead of just calling a
(59:43):
thousand of them every week,hoping they run a lane that
matches up with your network,whether it's a brokerage or a
carrier, whatever side of it is.
SPEAKER_01 (59:51):
Yeah, work smarter, not harder, man.
That's what I say.
So we're gonna give you theintelligence to go land that.
Yeah, awesome.
SPEAKER_00 (59:57):
Any final thoughts?
Anything you want to sharebefore we wrap up?
SPEAKER_01 (01:00:01):
You know, in Nate's uh in Nate's debt, I'll just say
go bills.
SPEAKER_00 (01:00:04):
And whether you believe you can or believe you
can't, you're right.
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