July 16, 2025 • 33 mins
Today’s guest is the inspiring Dr. Susie—author of Sow in Tears, Reap in Joy, a profound memoir of healing, resilience, and reclamation. Dr. Susie’s journey begins in the shadows of a childhood shaped by a narcissistic mother and the weight of generational trauma. That early pain led her into a marriage that mirrored her upbringing—one where her voice was silenced so deeply that, when asked what she wanted for a simple Secret Santa gift, she didn’t even know how to answer.
But Dr. Susie’s story doesn’t end in the dark. She is a mother of two grown daughters, and after surviving a tumultuous first marriage, she’s done the deep, transformative work to heal not only herself but her relationships. Today, she stands in her truth, having rebuilt connection with her children and created a life filled with joy, authenticity, and love alongside her wonderful new husband.
Dr. Susie is here to share her hard-earned wisdom, the tools that helped her reclaim her life, and the hope that no matter how deep the wounds, healing is always possible. Let’s welcome her to From Wounds to Wisdom.
www.linkedin.com/susiemierzwik/
www.facebook.com/susan.mierzwik/
barbiemoreno.com
IG@BarbieSpeaker
Season 2
Unraveling the Mind: From Mental Struggles to Inner Strength.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome.
Today's guest is the inspiringDr Susie.
She's the author of so in TearsReap in Joy, a profound memoir
of healing, resilience andreclamation.
Dr Susie's journey begins inthe shadows of a childhood
shaped by a narcissistic motherand the weight of generational
trauma.
That early pain led her into amarriage that actually mirrored
(00:24):
her upbringing, one where hervoice was silenced so deeply
that when asked what she wantedfor a simple secret Santa gift,
she didn't even know how toanswer.
But Dr Susie's journey doesn'tend in the dark.
She is a mother of two growndaughters and, after surviving a
tumultuous first marriage,she's done the deep daughters.
(00:46):
And, after surviving atumultuous first marriage, she's
done the deep, transformativework to heal not only herself
but her relationships.
Today she stands in her truth,having rebuilt connection with
her children and created a lifefilled with joy, authenticity
and love alongside her wonderfulnew husband.
Dr Susie is here to share herheart and wisdom, the tools that
helped her reclaim her life,and the hope that, no matter how
(01:09):
deep the wounds, healing isalways possible.
Let's welcome her to the FromWounds to Wisdom podcast.
Thank you so much for beinghere with us today.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Thank you, Barbie.
I am so happy to be on yourplatform today with your guests.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
I love that you are an author and I love the name of
your book.
I believe you have a copy rightthere with you right, yes, I do
.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
People are interested .
Can you see it?
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Yep, exactly, and we will have a link to that book in
our description in the podcast.
So, if anybody's interested,love the title.
Absolutely excited to hearabout your story and what led
you to writing a book with thattitle and with your information
and sharing your story.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Well, I guess that's a good place to begin.
I was actually a participant inseveral other collaborative
books prior to 2020.
And at that point my mentor, drRobbie Motter, said when are
you going to write your book?
And I thought, wow, well, I'vealready written three other
(02:13):
chapters in other books, so whynot?
So I sat down and it was duringCOVID, so we all had time on our
hands and I actually had abanker's box of journals that I
had saved from my earlychildhood onward.
Some of them went as far backas third grade, and here I was
(02:34):
sharing my dear diary momentsfor decades, and then journals
as an adult which reflected myfeelings.
Adult which reflected myfeelings.
So what I decided to do wasjust write one chapter at a time
, because if somebody says writea book, it's like, oh my God, I
can't write a book, buteverybody can write one chapter
(02:55):
at a time.
So I gave myself the task ofsitting down for two hours a
night and kind of had to boltmyself to the chair, because
going through all this traumaagain reading it, was very
tumultuous, so I was actually intears as I was typing, but
that's what started me on theprocess.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Well, I love that.
I know as an author myself inmy From Wounds to Wisdom book.
Having to go back into thattime is hard because you have to
come from a place of not tryingto blame.
Once you're trying to, you workon that right.
It's not about placing blame onthe parents.
I don't know how you feel aboutthat but it's about
understanding where they camefrom and why then you then had
(03:40):
the wounds that you had.
What do you, what's yourthoughts on that?
Speaker 2 (03:43):
You are exactly right , barbie, because through the
process initially I felt badthat I had this upbringing.
Like why did I have to come upin this particular way?
But on further examination ofmy story I realized that my
mother and father had come fromdepression era families.
(04:05):
My grandparents were both newimmigrants Actually, all four of
them were new immigrants to ourcountry had to work their
fingers to the bone.
It was during the depression.
It was just about work, work,work, survive, survive, survive.
And there was a lot of traumain their early lives.
Just a few times in her life,when my mom was alive, she
(04:27):
explained to me just a few tinydetails of an abusive dad and an
abusive sister.
So then I was able to see thatthese people who were my parents
were just as broken.
They came from circumstancesthat they certainly didn't
thrive in and that they did thebest they could.
But I didn't want the trauma tocontinue onward.
(04:49):
So I knew I had to do the deepwork of healing myself so that I
wouldn't perpetuate all thisdrama and drama.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
Before.
So I have two questions.
One, I'd like to talk aboutwhat your definition of a
narcissist is, because obviouslythere's, like you know, the
regular definition, but we livethings differently.
And then the second thing is Iwant to talk about with your two
daughters how your generationaltrauma I know that you worked
on yourself, but maybe thatwasn't during the time that you
were raising them, so then howthat changed.
So let's start with what's yourdefinition of a narcissist?
Speaker 2 (05:22):
Okay, and I have to preface this by saying with
what's your definition of anarcissist?
Okay, and I have to prefacethis by saying I didn't have any
definitions of this in my mind.
I thought that this was how afamily was.
It was just how mom was.
It was just how dad was, to saywhat kind of a person she was.
My mom was in control ofeverything.
She controlled my dad.
She controlled the fourchildren.
I was the oldest and we werejust like four little boxes in a
(05:46):
multi-pack of cereal.
We all had to do the same thing, wear the same thing.
We all took music lessons.
We all wore the same uniform.
It was like we were littlesoldiers growing up.
Nobody cared about how you feltor what you thought about
anything.
They gave you the opinion thatthey wanted you to have.
So I learned at a very early ageto be quiet, be like a mushroom
(06:08):
, stay under the radar, don'tmake waves.
And it wasn't until decadeslater that I learned what this
meant.
Well, my mother was even incharge of my dad.
He wasn't allowed to speak outin any way, shape or form.
It became a little bit moreapparent to me as I became an
adult.
But again, you live in thislittle bubble that is your world
(06:30):
.
The time I realized that myfamily wasn't the quote norm, so
to speak, if there is such athing was when I went away to
college, because that was thefirst time I had exposure to
other families, other patternsof living, and I saw, wow, other
families actually joked, hadfun together.
(06:52):
We're silly, you know, but inour family everything was very
straight-laced, very dogmatic,very authoritative.
You know, if you talk back back, you got punished, whether
physically, with a hair brush ora spanking spoon.
These things even had names.
(07:13):
They lived in the kitchen and,uh, you know, sometimes it was
just go to your room or or timeout, but there was no speaking
your mind in any way, shape orform.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
So I want to address that because, from from my
journey and learning, somebodywho is trying to control
everything is obviously comingfrom a place of their own trauma
that if I can just controleverything, then I won't lose
the control and then I can, I,can, I.
I don't have to be vulnerable,right, so that's their thing is
(07:46):
they're trying to not bevulnerable.
So, as you went through yourtransformation and you learned
about your mom, do you feel thatthat's something?
That is what she was trying todo is by control she was trying
to limit her vulnerability.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Yes, I do, because she wouldn't allow any other
points of view at all.
In other words, she even gotmad if my dad wanted to put
extra salt on his food at therestaurant.
She would actually kick himunder the table because in her
mind there was only one propermethod to do it, which was her
way.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
So why do you think your dad would put up with that?
Speaker 2 (08:24):
He was a survivor, so he just had to live under the
radar.
And another interesting thingmy dad also had a hearing loss
from a very early age.
So my whole entire life he worehearing aids.
And they weren't the little,tiny, invisible ones, you know,
those big ones that they hadback in the old days, tiny,
(08:45):
invisible ones, you know thosebig ones that they had back in
the old days.
But I kind of think, but Idon't have any knowledge.
My dad probably tuned it out toa great degree.
Speaker 1 (08:51):
I'm pretty sure my husband tunes me out too.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
No, but my dad actually had a legitimate
physical disability, but I knowthat most of the time he would
stay working in his workshopbecause that was his happy place
and then, you know, come out atmealtimes or you know other
times like that.
But that's probably how hesurvived by just being under the
radar and tuning it all out asmuch as he could.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
He had his own little like repeat, right, kind of off
topic, but understandably so.
So, about the hearing aids, myson is partially deaf and he
wears hearing aids.
But prior to his hearing aids,we just thought he was the
happiest kid alive because hedidn't hear all of the
background noise.
Right, he still is extremelyhappy, but, and he doesn't
(09:36):
actually wear his hearing aidsunless he goes to school,
because it allows him to live inthat little fantasy world which
we absolutely love, but that'soff topic.
So, as a mother, you are youthen.
So let's just go back to youmarried somebody very similar to
your mom, which is absolutely anormal pattern, right, we know
what's familiar, like you said,even though you learned in
college that that wasn't thenormal family, which, again,
(10:00):
what's normal.
We always go towards what'sfamiliar.
So, even if we know that that'snot healthy for us.
We will go that direction,right.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
You marry this man.
That's a narcissist.
Was he controlling, like your?
Speaker 2 (10:11):
mother.
Well, not initially, and Ithink I was in that honeymoon
phase it just felt so free to beaway from my family that I
think, if you know, I was on adesert island or, you know, on
the top of a mountain.
Anything else would have been arelief, you see.
But I have to say, even thoughI knew nothing about psychology
(10:33):
or any of this other stuff Ilearned decades later there was
a familiarity about ourupbringings that felt
comfortable.
We both came from veryauthoritative families.
We both went to Catholic school, which was extremely
authoritative, where the nunswould actually wrap you on the
(10:55):
knuckles if you did somethingyou know, or shame you.
Yeah, there was a lot of shamegoing on, and he told me
incidents that happened in hisearly life that echoed feelings
of what I had.
So it felt like we were twopeas in a pod.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
You bonded over your trauma Exactly, and you will
feel this like immense,especially because if you're
drawn to a narcissist, youprobably already have that in
your past, right?
So they love bomb you, and I'massuming that he kind of did the
same thing with you.
You can correct me if I'm wrong, but then they then they show
their true colors at some point,right, right, tell me about
that.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Well, he was a Navy pilot, so I was very proud of
that.
But I self-identified as MrsFlying Pilot.
So again, I wasn't Susie, I wasMrs Somebody else.
So that when he divorced meafter 24 years, it was like, oh
my God, I lost my uniform.
Now I don't know who I'msupposed to be.
(12:00):
Even though I was a teacher,even though I was the mother of
two girls, I self-identified asMrs Flying Pilot, you see,
because that was my safeumbrella.
Now I didn't have that.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
And so I have to say.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Excuse me, let me just add one more thing.
Since he was flying around theworld, at this point things
started to go a little south.
Hmm, because he would be gonefor, like you know, a week at a
time, two weeks at a time, thencome back and want to be Daddy
Santa, see.
(12:36):
So in the meantime I wasoverwhelmed, you know, with a
full-time job, two girls, a hugehouse.
We had a six-bedroom, four-bathhouse in the suburbs with huge
property, and I was trying tomanage all these different
pieces, and then daddy Santawould fly in for a few days and
try to be in control, you see.
(12:59):
And then he was extremelyabusive emotionally to our
daughters.
But since I grew up not havinga voice, I didn't feel like I
had the place to have a voice inthis either.
So he would say things like I'mgoing to send you to reform
school if you talk back, or youknow ridiculous outlandish
(13:20):
things.
So my daughters had to liveunder the radar as well.
And I didn't know it's hard tobelieve, but I didn't know that
this was abuse, that it wasnarcissism, that I was supposed
to protect them.
That's like you know, decadeslater.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
Right, and you wouldn't know, because that's
not what you saw growing up.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
That is what I learned.
I was just, you know, used toan authoritative system.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
And that's the problem with generational trauma
, because we don't know thatit's different and it takes
somebody thinking outside of thebox to say, hey, wait a minute,
this doesn't feel right and I'mgoing to actually explore it.
And then what happensoftentimes is the family doesn't
understand.
You know, the people around usare like what are you doing?
That's not normal.
Like why are you doing that?
You hate us, like you're makingus look out.
(14:08):
You know, look like a bad guy,right?
And you have to be strong tocontinue your journey and say
you know what?
I'm gonna figure out what thisis.
so I don't, I don't pass this on, tell me about your daughters
because if they did deal withemotional abuse and and it
sounds like verbal, um, uh, Idon't know if there was any
physical or not in your home,but but you know how do you come
(14:30):
from that.
What did they like?
Did they for a long time?
Did they have a problem withyou?
Did they feel like you didn'tback them?
Like what was your relationshiplike?
Speaker 2 (14:40):
It was not close.
And I say there was somephysical punishment, because I
was growing up with a spankingspoon and a hairbrush, and so
was my husband, and even thebelt.
So those kind of disciplinesystems were apparent in our
home, you know, for quite a fewyears probably, and, as I say, I
(15:00):
thought that was the norm.
If the kid's bad, they'resupposed to get a spanking.
But as they got older and gotinto college, they became more
of their own selves.
But it wasn't until I wasdivorced and was able to look
back on all this stuff that Irealized there was dysfunction,
(15:20):
because they never spoke up tome, of course.
Why would they?
Right?
I was not safe for them Right.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
Right.
So talk to me about your.
What was your?
I mean, sometimes there's likeone time right that we like can
say like this is whattransformed me, and sometimes
there's just.
Like you know, I began and Istarted noticing things.
Tell me about your journey intofinding healing.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
Okay, well, that was a long journey because obviously
you're not going to heal 40years overnight, right.
But the thing that helped me, Iguess crack the code, so to
speak, was going to a therapist.
Since the marriage was rocky inthe last at least five years, I
did go to therapy.
My husband refused to go, butafter he left me he said, oh,
(16:08):
we'll go to therapy and workthings out.
But he only went once and theysaid all the problems were mine.
So I knew that was ridiculousyeah.
So I continued to go on my own.
When he finally left me, I wentto a divorce recovery group.
But again in the first sixmonths when I went to the
divorce recovery group, butagain in the first six months
(16:29):
when I went to the divorcerecovery group, he had been
saying to me oh, we'll workthings out, we'll go to therapy.
You know, this is just atemporary separation.
So that was my mindset, youknow, hoping and wishing for the
best, you know, with fingerscrossed.
So I felt like a fish out ofwater.
I couldn't even relate to theseother people.
They were divorced.
(16:49):
It's like what my husband saidwe're going to get back together
.
So that was a different mindset, you see.
So that session, you know, sixmonths or whatever of divorce
recovery was like being a fishout of water.
I couldn't breathe their oxygenand they couldn't breathe my
oxygen.
But I didn't give up.
So six months later I was downthe path, farther and as part of
(17:15):
my survival strategy, which Imentioned in my book look in,
look out, look up I had beenpraying and I realized at this
point God, I've been praying forthis marriage to heal, but
you're not answering that prayerand I know God has a plan.
So I thought, well, if hedoesn't have plan A, he must
have plan B.
So I pictured myself goingthrough this fiery door, just
(17:40):
like going through the ring offire you sometimes see at the
circus.
I knew I had to get intoanother place in life and I
didn't have any idea what it was, what it looked like, but I
knew I just had to like hold onand go straight ahead.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
Which takes courage.
Yeah, it takes courage.
You say the same thing everytime you talk about your husband
and you say that he left mewhen my husband left me.
You said that like four times,and that statement for me is
very interesting, because it's aand I hope I don't offend when
I say this, but the way that itcomes across as a powerless
(18:16):
statement.
Yes, can you tell me why yousay it that way?
Speaker 2 (18:21):
Yeah, that's how I felt the whole time.
I was married and, like I say,I identified as Mrs Flying Pilot
.
I didn't think I was allowed tosay Pilot.
I didn't think I was allowed tosay no, I didn't think I was
allowed to contradict them, eventhough the girls were suffering
.
To me, it was just like well,you're a kid, you get spanked.
Your dad yells at you, your momyells at you.
(18:41):
You know what I mean?
That was just like so much ofthe norm.
I didn't realize that it wasbad stuff.
I just felt like I had to dowhat he said.
Speaker 1 (18:52):
Like he had all the power.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
Yeah, because he decided to leave you.
He took his power and he saidI'm done here, I'm leaving, and
you had no choice.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
No, and I didn't feel I had any power at all.
Because, the thing is, Ithought, well, I don't have
anybody I can go to.
Because the thing is, I thought, well, I don't have anybody I
can go to my family, such thatthey were were 3,000 miles away
and didn't even have anypartaking of our life as it was,
but I knew I couldn't talk tothem.
It was six months after myhusband left that I was able to
(19:23):
tell them.
My husband left and my dad saiddon't you feel guilty?
Speaker 1 (19:29):
Don't you feel guilty , don't you feel guilty, so he
put it on you I should be guiltybecause he left and he used to
run around.
Yeah, I was going to ask youthat question, yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
And then my sister said to me well, susie, if you
had been a better wife, he wouldhave stayed again.
Right See, with family likethis, who needs enemies?
Speaker 1 (19:51):
Right so.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
I literally felt like I had no options.
I just had to stay until thebitter end.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
And when he left you?
Why did he leave you?
What was his reasoning?
Speaker 2 (20:01):
Because he had another girlfriend.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
Yeah, so that's very common too.
Right?
A narcissist will not move onuntil they have somebody else to
move on to.
Right.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
So that's very common too right.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
A narcissist will not move on until they have
somebody else to move on toRight?
Speaker 2 (20:12):
Yeah, that would be heartbreaking.
Yeah, and the thing is he hadhad other affairs during the
marriage.
But you know what I forgave him, we made up, even though he
gave me a physical legacy thatwas very painful.
Speaker 1 (20:29):
Tell me about your daughters and how you uh you and
them repaired your relationshipand what it's like today.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
You know what?
It's been a hard road becauseboth of them have had to go
through therapy.
My oldest daughter is atherapist and, uh, she has a lot
of wounds as she's growing, herraising their daughter.
She's very, extremelyprotective of my granddaughter.
(20:57):
I think it's probably partiallybecause of what she went
through as a child, right.
You see.
Also, she's in a new generation, the feeling generation.
Now, discipline is not a thing,right, I wish that it were
(21:23):
closer.
I've apologized to her for allthe stuff I didn't know.
My other daughter, who's stillsingle, has suffered more
because she was the younger one,so she was still in early high
school when her dad left, yousee, and she suffered severely.
(21:43):
But over the years, as she'sgone through her therapy and her
journey, she has gainedautonomy and a voice and
boundaries, and I didn't evenknow boundaries existed.
I read about it when I wasgetting divorced, you know, I
just thought it was a fencebetween your house and the
neighbor, right.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
You know, but how old is your daughter that has the
child?
Speaker 2 (22:05):
She's 44 and the other one is 41.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
The reason why I ask is I'm 45 and I feel like
there's a parallel between yourdaughter and myself and the
raising of the children.
Like I can tell you when,because I was abused and I was
hit with a belt and all kinds ofemotional neglect and all that
stuff.
But what happened is when I hadmy children, I put up a big
boundary I don't talk to my dad,but with my mom and my mom's.
(22:32):
Not a bad person, but becauseof the way that the experiences
that I had, I never 100% trustedher and so I controlled the
amount of time that was spentwhere she could go with them and
all of these different things.
And when I let go of thecontrol a little bit, something
happened that made me go oh see,don't trust you, right?
(22:54):
And so I can understand that,that that path that your
daughter is on, and I also knowthat at some point, especially
if she's a therapist, she willunderstand that you did the best
, that you knew how to do.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Yeah, I know, and that's a very painful part of my
life, and I still feel the paintoday because the many times
I've asked if my granddaughtercan spend the night, or if we
can go on an outing like me andmy husband with her to a park or
you know any event, it's alwaysno, but not just like oh no,
(23:28):
you know we're, we're going togo pick apples today.
It's just like no, like likewhat was I thinking?
And I have to admit I'm really-worried that my granddaughter is
going to be so wary that she'snever going to feel comfortable.
Speaker 1 (23:44):
Yeah, yeah, and I have to say and I'm guilty of
the same thing, right, Like soI'm like you can't drive with my
children because you're not.
You know, not that she's not agood driver, but she's oblivious
, and I hate to say that, butthat's just the case, and I
don't feel safe that she wouldmake the right decisions with
them.
Right so, and it's the samething.
It's like can they spend thenight?
No, I can.
They can spend the night if Igo, but you can't have them by
(24:05):
yourself.
And it's this thing where it'slike, it's, I know it's
heartbreaking to her.
Yeah, I know.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
Well, at least you know that.
I don't even know if mydaughter realizes that.
Yeah, she might not realize ituntil she's a grandma, exactly.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
And that's what it takes, right.
Sometimes it takes our childrendoing the same thing to us that
we did to our parents in orderfor us to realize that.
I know that for me, with my momand this wasn't where I thought
the conversation would go, butbecause I see such parallels in
it that I 100% understand thatshe did the best that she did
your daughter will come to thatconclusion at the same time, and
(24:40):
she herself has said one of theworst things that she ever did
was beat us with the belt and dothose kinds of things.
But that's how she was raised,just like that's how you were
raised, right, right, and you dowhat you know.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
Yeah, it wasn't until I was in college that I
realized it wasn't a universalphenomena, you know, but it is a
generational thing.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
Your generation, that was how you guys were punished.
And so some of that generationwas like no, I'm not going to do
it again, but for the most partthat's how you were punished
and so that's what you guysthought was punishment.
And, like you said, mygeneration is like the feely
feely generation where we'relike we're never going to do
that to our children, yeah, butwe also society changed a lot
(25:24):
too, that's how it was when youwere young, right?
Yeah, it's how it was when I wasyoung but then you know,
society changed and was like no,no, no, you don't do that to
your children and made us, youknow um, so scared that we would
repeat those patterns.
That I think it also made usfeel like our parents were so
horrible.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2 (25:45):
Yeah, talk to me about how you found your current
husband.
Well, as I say, part of myhealing modality was looking in
to myself, looking out forsupport and looking up to God.
So throughout my life I'vealways prayed, and that comes
out in my story as well.
Even when I was a new mom, Ihad to be hospitalized for three
(26:09):
weeks right after she was bornand I didn't have any family.
So they were all on the EastCoast and I said God, you got to
send me somebody to help.
My husband was in the Navy.
They wouldn't give him any timeoff.
I was a new mom and somebodycame from my church and
volunteered to take care of mynewborn.
This was an answer to prayer,you see.
(26:32):
So I learned at a very earlyage that God's in charge.
Even though things might becrumbling, he's out there
somewhere directing traffic.
So when I was going through thehard times of my divorce, I was
always praying God, can youheal this, you know, can we come
back together, et cetera.
And then, when the six monthmark passed and he didn't heal
(26:56):
it, my husband said it's all myfault.
You know why should his handsof it?
Then I said okay, god's got adifferent plan for me, so I have
to go forth, you see.
So that is what prompted me tostart looking.
I went to a Christian singlesorganization and they had dances
and so forth, and now I feltlike, okay, I'm looking for
(27:18):
another partner and I wantedanother partner who was going to
appreciate me, because I hadlearned by that time, with all
my healing, that I had a lot ofvalue.
The first one just didn't seeit, wasn't able to appreciate it
, you see.
So that led me to my currenthusband, and we've been married
(27:39):
for 22 years.
Speaker 1 (27:41):
So for people who are listening to this and not
watching it on YouTube, butthey're listening on like
Spotify or Apple you can see theglow in your face when you talk
about your husband.
There's like a sparkle thatcomes out yes.
Have you forgiven yourself?
Speaker 2 (27:55):
I have forgiven myself for the things that I
didn't know when raising mydaughters.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Yes, have you forgiven your parents?
Speaker 2 (28:03):
Yes, I have, because it was in writing this book that
I saw how they were victims oftheir own abusive childhoods.
You know, and you know, when Iwas a young adult, in my 20s or
something, and I was starting tolearn more things, I suggested
to my parents that they go to aassertiveness training class.
You know they have these in thecommunity, like in senior
(28:25):
centers and whatnot.
My mother went one time.
She was so outraged she neverwent back because they were
trying to show you thedifference between assertive, um
, uh, passive and um.
I'd have forgot what the middlebound bound was.
But anyway, since she was sofrozen in her responses to
(28:48):
everything, if she couldn't bein charge of everything 100%,
she couldn't handle it.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
Right and that is your history with her right.
That's 100% your history withher.
Speaker 2 (29:01):
Right.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
So the podcast is From Wounds to Wisdom.
We heard your wounds.
Give us your wisdom.
Speaker 2 (29:07):
My wisdom is that, no matter what we go through and
we all go through so many darkpassages of light you know we're
on a high hill and then we godown to the valley and back and
forth.
I call it the surviving life.
When your lifeboat hits therapids, we all can heal.
But it's a journey and it takestime.
It's not going to happenovernight.
(29:28):
But the three keys I try tostress with everyone is first,
we have to look in.
I had to look to myself and saywhat didn't I learn the first
go around?
That would have helped me, yousee.
Then I had to do learning.
I had to read a lot of booksabout dysfunction.
I had to go to therapy and thisis the reaching out part.
(29:49):
I had to reach out for reliablesources of support.
My family was of zero support.
They blamed me.
You see, I needed strongsupport systems.
So the second divorce recoverygroup, my therapist, bible study
, people that I could socializewith on the outside that was a
(30:09):
support system.
And then I had to look up toGod because I knew that he was
driving the boat, but I didn'tknow where the boat was going.
I just knew he had adestination.
So we have to hang on withfaith that you know there is a
plan with support, that otherscan help us, and that we have to
(30:29):
look in and see okay, we didn'tget it right on the first go
around or this chapter, but wecan rewrite it.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
The letting go and in your way of letting go to your
God is such a difference thanyour mother.
It's right there in the factthat you're allowed to let go
just shows how much you'velearned from your life, because
you're not trying to control itlike she did right, right, yeah,
and we have very little controlyeah, we have almost no control
(30:58):
, that's almost none.
Speaker 2 (31:00):
It's hard enough to control ourself or our own
emotions.
Yeah, and everything else ispretty much.
We're on the lifeboat and thelifeboat's going to go through
whatever journey the river takesus.
Speaker 1 (31:12):
Yeah, yeah, love it.
Speaker 2 (31:14):
But we still have our little compass though the look
in, look out and look up,because that can guide us along
the journey.
We don't know what's around thecurve.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
And I agree you have to heal in community.
I don't think anybody can healalone.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
Right.
Yeah, because we don't learnall the other pieces.
Speaker 1 (31:32):
And you need the support.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (31:34):
Everybody wants to feel like they matter.
Yeah, I love it.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
And it's sad when you come from a family that makes
you feel like you didn't matterRight.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
Yeah, and that's hard to move through right.
Move through and learn from.
Tell us if somebody isinterested in learning more
about you, how they find you,and then remind us the name of
your book reaping reap and joy atransformational journey.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
And the best way to find me is on my website, which
is HTTPS suzymierswickcom.
Spell it for us, please.
Yes, S-U-S-I-E-M-I-E-R-Z-W-I-K.
Suzymierswickcom.
You can get my book.
You can also access all theother books that I collaborate
in, and you can also seebusiness links and many podcasts
(32:38):
, testimonials and lots of othergood stuff.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
Well, thank you for sharing your wounds and giving
us your wisdom.
We are very grateful for yourtime.
Thank you, barbie.
It was just a pleasure being onyour platform.
Thank you.
I will have all of the linksthat were mentioned by suzy in
our description of this podcastand I hope that you do take the
opportunity to look at her bookand share in what she has to
share with the world.
Thank you so much.
Thank you, perfect, good let's.
Welcome.
Today's guest is the inspiringDr Susie.
She's the author of so in TearsReap in Joy, a profound memoir
of healing, resilience andreclamation.
Dr Susie's journey begins inthe shadows of a childhood
shaped by a narcissistic motherand the weight of generational
trauma.
That early pain led her into amarriage that actually mirrored
(00:24):
her upbringing, one where hervoice was silenced so deeply
that when asked what she wantedfor a simple secret Santa gift,
she didn't even know how toanswer.
But Dr Susie's journey doesn'tend in the dark.
She is a mother of two growndaughters and, after surviving a
tumultuous first marriage,she's done the deep daughters.
(00:46):
And, after surviving atumultuous first marriage, she's
done the deep, transformativework to heal not only herself
but her relationships.
Today she stands in her truth,having rebuilt connection with
her children and created a lifefilled with joy, authenticity
and love alongside her wonderfulnew husband.
Dr Susie is here to share herheart and wisdom, the tools that
helped her reclaim her life,and the hope that, no matter how
(01:09):
deep the wounds, healing isalways possible.
Let's welcome her to the FromWounds to Wisdom podcast.
Thank you so much for beinghere with us today.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Thank you, Barbie.
I am so happy to be on yourplatform today with your guests.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
I love that you are an author and I love the name of
your book.
I believe you have a copy rightthere with you right, yes, I do
.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
People are interested .
Can you see it?
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Yep, exactly, and we will have a link to that book in
our description in the podcast.
So, if anybody's interested,love the title.
Absolutely excited to hearabout your story and what led
you to writing a book with thattitle and with your information
and sharing your story.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Well, I guess that's a good place to begin.
I was actually a participant inseveral other collaborative
books prior to 2020.
And at that point my mentor, drRobbie Motter, said when are
you going to write your book?
And I thought, wow, well, I'vealready written three other
(02:13):
chapters in other books, so whynot?
So I sat down and it was duringCOVID, so we all had time on our
hands and I actually had abanker's box of journals that I
had saved from my earlychildhood onward.
Some of them went as far backas third grade, and here I was
(02:34):
sharing my dear diary momentsfor decades, and then journals
as an adult which reflected myfeelings.
Adult which reflected myfeelings.
So what I decided to do wasjust write one chapter at a time
, because if somebody says writea book, it's like, oh my God, I
can't write a book, buteverybody can write one chapter
(02:55):
at a time.
So I gave myself the task ofsitting down for two hours a
night and kind of had to boltmyself to the chair, because
going through all this traumaagain reading it, was very
tumultuous, so I was actually intears as I was typing, but
that's what started me on theprocess.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Well, I love that.
I know as an author myself inmy From Wounds to Wisdom book.
Having to go back into thattime is hard because you have to
come from a place of not tryingto blame.
Once you're trying to, you workon that right.
It's not about placing blame onthe parents.
I don't know how you feel aboutthat but it's about
understanding where they camefrom and why then you then had
(03:40):
the wounds that you had.
What do you, what's yourthoughts on that?
Speaker 2 (03:43):
You are exactly right , barbie, because through the
process initially I felt badthat I had this upbringing.
Like why did I have to come upin this particular way?
But on further examination ofmy story I realized that my
mother and father had come fromdepression era families.
(04:05):
My grandparents were both newimmigrants Actually, all four of
them were new immigrants to ourcountry had to work their
fingers to the bone.
It was during the depression.
It was just about work, work,work, survive, survive, survive.
And there was a lot of traumain their early lives.
Just a few times in her life,when my mom was alive, she
(04:27):
explained to me just a few tinydetails of an abusive dad and an
abusive sister.
So then I was able to see thatthese people who were my parents
were just as broken.
They came from circumstancesthat they certainly didn't
thrive in and that they did thebest they could.
But I didn't want the trauma tocontinue onward.
(04:49):
So I knew I had to do the deepwork of healing myself so that I
wouldn't perpetuate all thisdrama and drama.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
Before.
So I have two questions.
One, I'd like to talk aboutwhat your definition of a
narcissist is, because obviouslythere's, like you know, the
regular definition, but we livethings differently.
And then the second thing is Iwant to talk about with your two
daughters how your generationaltrauma I know that you worked
on yourself, but maybe thatwasn't during the time that you
were raising them, so then howthat changed.
So let's start with what's yourdefinition of a narcissist?
Speaker 2 (05:22):
Okay, and I have to preface this by saying with
what's your definition of anarcissist?
Okay, and I have to prefacethis by saying I didn't have any
definitions of this in my mind.
I thought that this was how afamily was.
It was just how mom was.
It was just how dad was, to saywhat kind of a person she was.
My mom was in control ofeverything.
She controlled my dad.
She controlled the fourchildren.
I was the oldest and we werejust like four little boxes in a
(05:46):
multi-pack of cereal.
We all had to do the same thing, wear the same thing.
We all took music lessons.
We all wore the same uniform.
It was like we were littlesoldiers growing up.
Nobody cared about how you feltor what you thought about
anything.
They gave you the opinion thatthey wanted you to have.
So I learned at a very early ageto be quiet, be like a mushroom
(06:08):
, stay under the radar, don'tmake waves.
And it wasn't until decadeslater that I learned what this
meant.
Well, my mother was even incharge of my dad.
He wasn't allowed to speak outin any way, shape or form.
It became a little bit moreapparent to me as I became an
adult.
But again, you live in thislittle bubble that is your world
(06:30):
.
The time I realized that myfamily wasn't the quote norm, so
to speak, if there is such athing was when I went away to
college, because that was thefirst time I had exposure to
other families, other patternsof living, and I saw, wow, other
families actually joked, hadfun together.
(06:52):
We're silly, you know, but inour family everything was very
straight-laced, very dogmatic,very authoritative.
You know, if you talk back back, you got punished, whether
physically, with a hair brush ora spanking spoon.
These things even had names.
(07:13):
They lived in the kitchen and,uh, you know, sometimes it was
just go to your room or or timeout, but there was no speaking
your mind in any way, shape orform.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
So I want to address that because, from from my
journey and learning, somebodywho is trying to control
everything is obviously comingfrom a place of their own trauma
that if I can just controleverything, then I won't lose
the control and then I can, I,can, I.
I don't have to be vulnerable,right, so that's their thing is
(07:46):
they're trying to not bevulnerable.
So, as you went through yourtransformation and you learned
about your mom, do you feel thatthat's something?
That is what she was trying todo is by control she was trying
to limit her vulnerability.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Yes, I do, because she wouldn't allow any other
points of view at all.
In other words, she even gotmad if my dad wanted to put
extra salt on his food at therestaurant.
She would actually kick himunder the table because in her
mind there was only one propermethod to do it, which was her
way.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
So why do you think your dad would put up with that?
Speaker 2 (08:24):
He was a survivor, so he just had to live under the
radar.
And another interesting thingmy dad also had a hearing loss
from a very early age.
So my whole entire life he worehearing aids.
And they weren't the little,tiny, invisible ones, you know,
those big ones that they hadback in the old days, tiny,
(08:45):
invisible ones, you know thosebig ones that they had back in
the old days.
But I kind of think, but Idon't have any knowledge.
My dad probably tuned it out toa great degree.
Speaker 1 (08:51):
I'm pretty sure my husband tunes me out too.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
No, but my dad actually had a legitimate
physical disability, but I knowthat most of the time he would
stay working in his workshopbecause that was his happy place
and then, you know, come out atmealtimes or you know other
times like that.
But that's probably how hesurvived by just being under the
radar and tuning it all out asmuch as he could.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
He had his own little like repeat, right, kind of off
topic, but understandably so.
So, about the hearing aids, myson is partially deaf and he
wears hearing aids.
But prior to his hearing aids,we just thought he was the
happiest kid alive because hedidn't hear all of the
background noise.
Right, he still is extremelyhappy, but, and he doesn't
(09:36):
actually wear his hearing aidsunless he goes to school,
because it allows him to live inthat little fantasy world which
we absolutely love, but that'soff topic.
So, as a mother, you are youthen.
So let's just go back to youmarried somebody very similar to
your mom, which is absolutely anormal pattern, right, we know
what's familiar, like you said,even though you learned in
college that that wasn't thenormal family, which, again,
(10:00):
what's normal.
We always go towards what'sfamiliar.
So, even if we know that that'snot healthy for us.
We will go that direction,right.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
You marry this man.
That's a narcissist.
Was he controlling, like your?
Speaker 2 (10:11):
mother.
Well, not initially, and Ithink I was in that honeymoon
phase it just felt so free to beaway from my family that I
think, if you know, I was on adesert island or, you know, on
the top of a mountain.
Anything else would have been arelief, you see.
But I have to say, even thoughI knew nothing about psychology
(10:33):
or any of this other stuff Ilearned decades later there was
a familiarity about ourupbringings that felt
comfortable.
We both came from veryauthoritative families.
We both went to Catholic school, which was extremely
authoritative, where the nunswould actually wrap you on the
(10:55):
knuckles if you did somethingyou know, or shame you.
Yeah, there was a lot of shamegoing on, and he told me
incidents that happened in hisearly life that echoed feelings
of what I had.
So it felt like we were twopeas in a pod.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
You bonded over your trauma Exactly, and you will
feel this like immense,especially because if you're
drawn to a narcissist, youprobably already have that in
your past, right?
So they love bomb you, and I'massuming that he kind of did the
same thing with you.
You can correct me if I'm wrong, but then they then they show
their true colors at some point,right, right, tell me about
that.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Well, he was a Navy pilot, so I was very proud of
that.
But I self-identified as MrsFlying Pilot.
So again, I wasn't Susie, I wasMrs Somebody else.
So that when he divorced meafter 24 years, it was like, oh
my God, I lost my uniform.
Now I don't know who I'msupposed to be.
(12:00):
Even though I was a teacher,even though I was the mother of
two girls, I self-identified asMrs Flying Pilot, you see,
because that was my safeumbrella.
Now I didn't have that.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
And so I have to say.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Excuse me, let me just add one more thing.
Since he was flying around theworld, at this point things
started to go a little south.
Hmm, because he would be gonefor, like you know, a week at a
time, two weeks at a time, thencome back and want to be Daddy
Santa, see.
(12:36):
So in the meantime I wasoverwhelmed, you know, with a
full-time job, two girls, a hugehouse.
We had a six-bedroom, four-bathhouse in the suburbs with huge
property, and I was trying tomanage all these different
pieces, and then daddy Santawould fly in for a few days and
try to be in control, you see.
(12:59):
And then he was extremelyabusive emotionally to our
daughters.
But since I grew up not havinga voice, I didn't feel like I
had the place to have a voice inthis either.
So he would say things like I'mgoing to send you to reform
school if you talk back, or youknow ridiculous outlandish
(13:20):
things.
So my daughters had to liveunder the radar as well.
And I didn't know it's hard tobelieve, but I didn't know that
this was abuse, that it wasnarcissism, that I was supposed
to protect them.
That's like you know, decadeslater.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
Right, and you wouldn't know, because that's
not what you saw growing up.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
That is what I learned.
I was just, you know, used toan authoritative system.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
And that's the problem with generational trauma
, because we don't know thatit's different and it takes
somebody thinking outside of thebox to say, hey, wait a minute,
this doesn't feel right and I'mgoing to actually explore it.
And then what happensoftentimes is the family doesn't
understand.
You know, the people around usare like what are you doing?
That's not normal.
Like why are you doing that?
You hate us, like you're makingus look out.
(14:08):
You know, look like a bad guy,right?
And you have to be strong tocontinue your journey and say
you know what?
I'm gonna figure out what thisis.
so I don't, I don't pass this on, tell me about your daughters
because if they did deal withemotional abuse and and it
sounds like verbal, um, uh, Idon't know if there was any
physical or not in your home,but but you know how do you come
(14:30):
from that.
What did they like?
Did they for a long time?
Did they have a problem withyou?
Did they feel like you didn'tback them?
Like what was your relationshiplike?
Speaker 2 (14:40):
It was not close.
And I say there was somephysical punishment, because I
was growing up with a spankingspoon and a hairbrush, and so
was my husband, and even thebelt.
So those kind of disciplinesystems were apparent in our
home, you know, for quite a fewyears probably, and, as I say, I
(15:00):
thought that was the norm.
If the kid's bad, they'resupposed to get a spanking.
But as they got older and gotinto college, they became more
of their own selves.
But it wasn't until I wasdivorced and was able to look
back on all this stuff that Irealized there was dysfunction,
(15:20):
because they never spoke up tome, of course.
Why would they?
Right?
I was not safe for them Right.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
Right.
So talk to me about your.
What was your?
I mean, sometimes there's likeone time right that we like can
say like this is whattransformed me, and sometimes
there's just.
Like you know, I began and Istarted noticing things.
Tell me about your journey intofinding healing.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
Okay, well, that was a long journey because obviously
you're not going to heal 40years overnight, right.
But the thing that helped me, Iguess crack the code, so to
speak, was going to a therapist.
Since the marriage was rocky inthe last at least five years, I
did go to therapy.
My husband refused to go, butafter he left me he said, oh,
(16:08):
we'll go to therapy and workthings out.
But he only went once and theysaid all the problems were mine.
So I knew that was ridiculousyeah.
So I continued to go on my own.
When he finally left me, I wentto a divorce recovery group.
But again in the first sixmonths when I went to the
divorce recovery group, butagain in the first six months
(16:29):
when I went to the divorcerecovery group, he had been
saying to me oh, we'll workthings out, we'll go to therapy.
You know, this is just atemporary separation.
So that was my mindset, youknow, hoping and wishing for the
best, you know, with fingerscrossed.
So I felt like a fish out ofwater.
I couldn't even relate to theseother people.
They were divorced.
(16:49):
It's like what my husband saidwe're going to get back together
.
So that was a different mindset, you see.
So that session, you know, sixmonths or whatever of divorce
recovery was like being a fishout of water.
I couldn't breathe their oxygenand they couldn't breathe my
oxygen.
But I didn't give up.
So six months later I was downthe path, farther and as part of
(17:15):
my survival strategy, which Imentioned in my book look in,
look out, look up I had beenpraying and I realized at this
point God, I've been praying forthis marriage to heal, but
you're not answering that prayerand I know God has a plan.
So I thought, well, if hedoesn't have plan A, he must
have plan B.
So I pictured myself goingthrough this fiery door, just
(17:40):
like going through the ring offire you sometimes see at the
circus.
I knew I had to get intoanother place in life and I
didn't have any idea what it was, what it looked like, but I
knew I just had to like hold onand go straight ahead.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
Which takes courage.
Yeah, it takes courage.
You say the same thing everytime you talk about your husband
and you say that he left mewhen my husband left me.
You said that like four times,and that statement for me is
very interesting, because it's aand I hope I don't offend when
I say this, but the way that itcomes across as a powerless
(18:16):
statement.
Yes, can you tell me why yousay it that way?
Speaker 2 (18:21):
Yeah, that's how I felt the whole time.
I was married and, like I say,I identified as Mrs Flying Pilot
.
I didn't think I was allowed tosay Pilot.
I didn't think I was allowed tosay no, I didn't think I was
allowed to contradict them, eventhough the girls were suffering
.
To me, it was just like well,you're a kid, you get spanked.
Your dad yells at you, your momyells at you.
(18:41):
You know what I mean?
That was just like so much ofthe norm.
I didn't realize that it wasbad stuff.
I just felt like I had to dowhat he said.
Speaker 1 (18:52):
Like he had all the power.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
Yeah, because he decided to leave you.
He took his power and he saidI'm done here, I'm leaving, and
you had no choice.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
No, and I didn't feel I had any power at all.
Because, the thing is, Ithought, well, I don't have
anybody I can go to.
Because the thing is, I thought, well, I don't have anybody I
can go to my family, such thatthey were were 3,000 miles away
and didn't even have anypartaking of our life as it was,
but I knew I couldn't talk tothem.
It was six months after myhusband left that I was able to
(19:23):
tell them.
My husband left and my dad saiddon't you feel guilty?
Speaker 1 (19:29):
Don't you feel guilty , don't you feel guilty, so he
put it on you I should be guiltybecause he left and he used to
run around.
Yeah, I was going to ask youthat question, yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
And then my sister said to me well, susie, if you
had been a better wife, he wouldhave stayed again.
Right See, with family likethis, who needs enemies?
Speaker 1 (19:51):
Right so.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
I literally felt like I had no options.
I just had to stay until thebitter end.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
And when he left you?
Why did he leave you?
What was his reasoning?
Speaker 2 (20:01):
Because he had another girlfriend.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
Yeah, so that's very common too.
Right?
A narcissist will not move onuntil they have somebody else to
move on to.
Right.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
So that's very common too right.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
A narcissist will not move on until they have
somebody else to move on toRight?
Speaker 2 (20:12):
Yeah, that would be heartbreaking.
Yeah, and the thing is he hadhad other affairs during the
marriage.
But you know what I forgave him, we made up, even though he
gave me a physical legacy thatwas very painful.
Speaker 1 (20:29):
Tell me about your daughters and how you uh you and
them repaired your relationshipand what it's like today.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
You know what?
It's been a hard road becauseboth of them have had to go
through therapy.
My oldest daughter is atherapist and, uh, she has a lot
of wounds as she's growing, herraising their daughter.
She's very, extremelyprotective of my granddaughter.
(20:57):
I think it's probably partiallybecause of what she went
through as a child, right.
You see.
Also, she's in a new generation, the feeling generation.
Now, discipline is not a thing,right, I wish that it were
(21:23):
closer.
I've apologized to her for allthe stuff I didn't know.
My other daughter, who's stillsingle, has suffered more
because she was the younger one,so she was still in early high
school when her dad left, yousee, and she suffered severely.
(21:43):
But over the years, as she'sgone through her therapy and her
journey, she has gainedautonomy and a voice and
boundaries, and I didn't evenknow boundaries existed.
I read about it when I wasgetting divorced, you know, I
just thought it was a fencebetween your house and the
neighbor, right.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
You know, but how old is your daughter that has the
child?
Speaker 2 (22:05):
She's 44 and the other one is 41.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
The reason why I ask is I'm 45 and I feel like
there's a parallel between yourdaughter and myself and the
raising of the children.
Like I can tell you when,because I was abused and I was
hit with a belt and all kinds ofemotional neglect and all that
stuff.
But what happened is when I hadmy children, I put up a big
boundary I don't talk to my dad,but with my mom and my mom's.
(22:32):
Not a bad person, but becauseof the way that the experiences
that I had, I never 100% trustedher and so I controlled the
amount of time that was spentwhere she could go with them and
all of these different things.
And when I let go of thecontrol a little bit, something
happened that made me go oh see,don't trust you, right?
(22:54):
And so I can understand that,that that path that your
daughter is on, and I also knowthat at some point, especially
if she's a therapist, she willunderstand that you did the best
, that you knew how to do.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Yeah, I know, and that's a very painful part of my
life, and I still feel the paintoday because the many times
I've asked if my granddaughtercan spend the night, or if we
can go on an outing like me andmy husband with her to a park or
you know any event, it's alwaysno, but not just like oh no,
(23:28):
you know we're, we're going togo pick apples today.
It's just like no, like likewhat was I thinking?
And I have to admit I'm really-worried that my granddaughter is
going to be so wary that she'snever going to feel comfortable.
Speaker 1 (23:44):
Yeah, yeah, and I have to say and I'm guilty of
the same thing, right, Like soI'm like you can't drive with my
children because you're not.
You know, not that she's not agood driver, but she's oblivious
, and I hate to say that, butthat's just the case, and I
don't feel safe that she wouldmake the right decisions with
them.
Right so, and it's the samething.
It's like can they spend thenight?
No, I can.
They can spend the night if Igo, but you can't have them by
(24:05):
yourself.
And it's this thing where it'slike, it's, I know it's
heartbreaking to her.
Yeah, I know.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
Well, at least you know that.
I don't even know if mydaughter realizes that.
Yeah, she might not realize ituntil she's a grandma, exactly.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
And that's what it takes, right.
Sometimes it takes our childrendoing the same thing to us that
we did to our parents in orderfor us to realize that.
I know that for me, with my momand this wasn't where I thought
the conversation would go, butbecause I see such parallels in
it that I 100% understand thatshe did the best that she did
your daughter will come to thatconclusion at the same time, and
(24:40):
she herself has said one of theworst things that she ever did
was beat us with the belt and dothose kinds of things.
But that's how she was raised,just like that's how you were
raised, right, right, and you dowhat you know.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
Yeah, it wasn't until I was in college that I
realized it wasn't a universalphenomena, you know, but it is a
generational thing.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
Your generation, that was how you guys were punished.
And so some of that generationwas like no, I'm not going to do
it again, but for the most partthat's how you were punished
and so that's what you guysthought was punishment.
And, like you said, mygeneration is like the feely
feely generation where we'relike we're never going to do
that to our children, yeah, butwe also society changed a lot
(25:24):
too, that's how it was when youwere young, right?
Yeah, it's how it was when I wasyoung but then you know,
society changed and was like no,no, no, you don't do that to
your children and made us, youknow um, so scared that we would
repeat those patterns.
That I think it also made usfeel like our parents were so
horrible.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2 (25:45):
Yeah, talk to me about how you found your current
husband.
Well, as I say, part of myhealing modality was looking in
to myself, looking out forsupport and looking up to God.
So throughout my life I'vealways prayed, and that comes
out in my story as well.
Even when I was a new mom, Ihad to be hospitalized for three
(26:09):
weeks right after she was bornand I didn't have any family.
So they were all on the EastCoast and I said God, you got to
send me somebody to help.
My husband was in the Navy.
They wouldn't give him any timeoff.
I was a new mom and somebodycame from my church and
volunteered to take care of mynewborn.
This was an answer to prayer,you see.
(26:32):
So I learned at a very earlyage that God's in charge.
Even though things might becrumbling, he's out there
somewhere directing traffic.
So when I was going through thehard times of my divorce, I was
always praying God, can youheal this, you know, can we come
back together, et cetera.
And then, when the six monthmark passed and he didn't heal
(26:56):
it, my husband said it's all myfault.
You know why should his handsof it?
Then I said okay, god's got adifferent plan for me, so I have
to go forth, you see.
So that is what prompted me tostart looking.
I went to a Christian singlesorganization and they had dances
and so forth, and now I feltlike, okay, I'm looking for
(27:18):
another partner and I wantedanother partner who was going to
appreciate me, because I hadlearned by that time, with all
my healing, that I had a lot ofvalue.
The first one just didn't seeit, wasn't able to appreciate it
, you see.
So that led me to my currenthusband, and we've been married
(27:39):
for 22 years.
Speaker 1 (27:41):
So for people who are listening to this and not
watching it on YouTube, butthey're listening on like
Spotify or Apple you can see theglow in your face when you talk
about your husband.
There's like a sparkle thatcomes out yes.
Have you forgiven yourself?
Speaker 2 (27:55):
I have forgiven myself for the things that I
didn't know when raising mydaughters.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Yes, have you forgiven your parents?
Speaker 2 (28:03):
Yes, I have, because it was in writing this book that
I saw how they were victims oftheir own abusive childhoods.
You know, and you know, when Iwas a young adult, in my 20s or
something, and I was starting tolearn more things, I suggested
to my parents that they go to aassertiveness training class.
You know they have these in thecommunity, like in senior
(28:25):
centers and whatnot.
My mother went one time.
She was so outraged she neverwent back because they were
trying to show you thedifference between assertive, um
, uh, passive and um.
I'd have forgot what the middlebound bound was.
But anyway, since she was sofrozen in her responses to
(28:48):
everything, if she couldn't bein charge of everything 100%,
she couldn't handle it.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
Right and that is your history with her right.
That's 100% your history withher.
Speaker 2 (29:01):
Right.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
So the podcast is From Wounds to Wisdom.
We heard your wounds.
Give us your wisdom.
Speaker 2 (29:07):
My wisdom is that, no matter what we go through and
we all go through so many darkpassages of light you know we're
on a high hill and then we godown to the valley and back and
forth.
I call it the surviving life.
When your lifeboat hits therapids, we all can heal.
But it's a journey and it takestime.
It's not going to happenovernight.
(29:28):
But the three keys I try tostress with everyone is first,
we have to look in.
I had to look to myself and saywhat didn't I learn the first
go around?
That would have helped me, yousee.
Then I had to do learning.
I had to read a lot of booksabout dysfunction.
I had to go to therapy and thisis the reaching out part.
(29:49):
I had to reach out for reliablesources of support.
My family was of zero support.
They blamed me.
You see, I needed strongsupport systems.
So the second divorce recoverygroup, my therapist, bible study
, people that I could socializewith on the outside that was a
(30:09):
support system.
And then I had to look up toGod because I knew that he was
driving the boat, but I didn'tknow where the boat was going.
I just knew he had adestination.
So we have to hang on withfaith that you know there is a
plan with support, that otherscan help us, and that we have to
(30:29):
look in and see okay, we didn'tget it right on the first go
around or this chapter, but wecan rewrite it.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
The letting go and in your way of letting go to your
God is such a difference thanyour mother.
It's right there in the factthat you're allowed to let go
just shows how much you'velearned from your life, because
you're not trying to control itlike she did right, right, yeah,
and we have very little controlyeah, we have almost no control
(30:58):
, that's almost none.
Speaker 2 (31:00):
It's hard enough to control ourself or our own
emotions.
Yeah, and everything else ispretty much.
We're on the lifeboat and thelifeboat's going to go through
whatever journey the river takesus.
Speaker 1 (31:12):
Yeah, yeah, love it.
Speaker 2 (31:14):
But we still have our little compass though the look
in, look out and look up,because that can guide us along
the journey.
We don't know what's around thecurve.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
And I agree you have to heal in community.
I don't think anybody can healalone.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
Right.
Yeah, because we don't learnall the other pieces.
Speaker 1 (31:32):
And you need the support.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (31:34):
Everybody wants to feel like they matter.
Yeah, I love it.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
And it's sad when you come from a family that makes
you feel like you didn't matterRight.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
Yeah, and that's hard to move through right.
Move through and learn from.
Tell us if somebody isinterested in learning more
about you, how they find you,and then remind us the name of
your book reaping reap and joy atransformational journey.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
And the best way to find me is on my website, which
is HTTPS suzymierswickcom.
Spell it for us, please.
Yes, S-U-S-I-E-M-I-E-R-Z-W-I-K.
Suzymierswickcom.
You can get my book.
You can also access all theother books that I collaborate
in, and you can also seebusiness links and many podcasts
(32:38):
, testimonials and lots of othergood stuff.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
Well, thank you for sharing your wounds and giving
us your wisdom.
We are very grateful for yourtime.
Thank you, barbie.
It was just a pleasure being onyour platform.
Thank you.
I will have all of the linksthat were mentioned by suzy in
our description of this podcastand I hope that you do take the
opportunity to look at her bookand share in what she has to
share with the world.
Thank you so much.
Thank you, perfect, good let's.
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