November 21, 2024 • 54 mins
Check out my guest appearance on RealClearTalk this week, and check out the show wherever you find this podcast!!
Show notes from the episode:
Steve B has been sober since May 28th, 2021, and is the host of gAy A: The Queer Sober Hero Show.
Having isolating during his drinking, he has only begun embracing his interests in leather, fetish, and kink in sobriety- something he believes is necessary for him in order to live a full, happy, and sober life.
He is forever grateful for his sober family, his podcasting community, and kinksters like you!
#RealClearFetishTalksRealClearPlay
Music: Valence - Infinite [NCS Release]
Instagram: @gayapodcast
Instagram: @juststevesrq
All podcast platforms:
gAy A: The Queer Sober Hero Show
#RealClearFetishTalksRealClearPlay
Music: Valence - Infinite [NCS Release]
Recorded on 17th October 2024 on Zoom, see original video on YouTube:
https://youtu.be/Q0aY-8QvW6U
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Hey, there are super soberheroes and welcome to gay.
A it's your host server, Steve,the podcast guy here with 1,268
days of continuous sobriety.
And I am so grateful for therecent guest appearance that I
had on the real clear fetish.
Podcasts and YouTube show realclear talks.
(00:21):
It was an amazing experience.
I did the recording a about amonth ago and it is in the
podcasting magic of timingcoming out this weekend on the
16th of November.
So Ralph was nice enough to giveme the audio so that I can also
share with all of you.
It was an amazing interview.
It was longer than my generalepisodes, and he dug deep and
(00:43):
asked a lot of questions aboutthings that I haven't gone over.
And quite some time and I've didit through a different angle and
a different lens.
It was an amazing episode.
I was so grateful to be on itand he has tons of other amazing
content, just like me.
He's been doing his show forquite some time.
And so if you loved thisepisode, which I think you will,
because he's interviewing me andyou listened to the show and I
(01:05):
show up to it quite regularly.
So it's getting to know me in adifferent way, but it's also
getting to know him and hisamazing show and the what he's
doing over there.
So if this is an episode thatstrikes your fancy, make sure
that the next step for you is togo and click on over to his
show, which will be in the shownotes so that you can follow it.
There's already seven seasons ofcontent and more great content
(01:26):
on the way.
So definitely worth checking outand enjoy the content.
Ralf (01:45):
Hi and welcome to Real Clear Fetish Talks Real Clear
Play, a podcast that deals withkink, sober life and everything
in between.
This is the start of seasoneight.
I'm very excited.
I am now 40 years old, but whenthis comes out, it's like a
month into that.
So yes, a new decade for me.
So that's fantastic.
(02:06):
This time we're going to theStates to talk to Steve.
Hi, Steve.
Hello there, Ralph.
Thank you for having me.
Of course.
It's not a problem.
How are we doing?
I'm doing great.
You're not in an area with a
Steve (02:20):
hurricane, are you?
This time last week I was, yes.
I was in Sarasota, so I wasimpacted where I did lose power.
Our airport's down because theterminal roof fell.
So we are recovering, but thishas been the first couple of
days where I'm almost back to aroutine, back into doing podcast
interviews and podcasting on myown and stuff like that.
(02:41):
So it's good to get back to reallife.
Ralf (02:44):
Oh, yeah.
Us watching it over here.
It's scary stuff.
Steve (02:47):
Yeah.
Ralf (02:47):
Where we have it's a storm if a wheelie bin falls over, let
alone a whole roof of anairport.
Like with every episode I dofour standard questions at the
start, and then we'll just seewhere the conversation goes.
What do you prefer I call you?
Names, pronouns, and title.
Steve (03:03):
My name is Steve and then I, with my podcast, go by Sober
Steve, and then my pronouns arehe, him, and don't have an
official title.
I, depending on the person I'mwith, I'm in that age where if
the guy's younger, they'recalling me daddy, and if I'm
younger, I'm calling them daddy,so it'll end like I'm boy at
(03:23):
that point.
So it really just depends on theperson, the dynamics.
depending on who
Ralf (03:27):
stands in front of you.
Yes.
Exactly.
I recognize that one very muchfor myself.
Tell me a little bit about
Steve (03:33):
yourself.
I got sober during the pandemic,so I had been drinking was my
drug of choice.
Once I started drinking,Anything else sounds great and
good fun to me, but that waswhat really destroyed my life.
Growing up though, I was apretty late bloomer.
I always loved rules, like I wasa big rule follower.
(03:54):
So I didn't drink because it waswrong and bad and that's what
grown ups did.
So I was like so excited to whenI got old enough to drink.
I remember being fascinatedabout What that age would be
because it seemed to bedifferent for different people
But I remember at a sleepoverparty like trying alcohol in
like fourth or fifth grade andthinking it tasted bad So
therefore it must be because i'mtoo young and it'll taste better
(04:16):
in a couple years when i'm oldenough It'll just magically
taste better having like bathtubgin from your grandmother's
basement Like I didn'tunderstand like the whole
concept of it So it's just butlike I wasn't fascinated enough
to where I was going to breakthe rules because I knew it was
wrong And I shouldn't be doingit.
So I stayed away from it Youuntil after prom in high school,
and these people feeling otheredand bullied for being a very
(04:39):
flamboyant kid, my entire schoolcareer, basically, I was then
all of a sudden, the life of theparty, where everyone was
telling me, like, how And howsilly it was.
And where was this Steve thewhole time?
And we love this Steve.
And when can we see, when can wehang out again?
And all of a sudden I was rightat the end of saying goodbye to
all these people forever whomade my life hell for four
(05:00):
years.
I was finally accepted.
But it also I clung to that sideof the night for the longest
time, but it was only in mysorority and doing step work and
things like that, where I forgotthat the second half of that
night was, like, the guy I waswith, like, when we were hooking
up I got messy and sloppy andthen downright cruel to him and
blacked out.
I was blacked out at that point,but, there were amends to be
made from my first blackoutnight drinking, and I still woke
(05:21):
up the next morning I can't waitto do that again.
And from then on, it didn'tmatter what the rules were about
drinking I knew I needed todrink as much as I could, and I
was able to still control itover rules that I set up around
times and places for as long asI could, but COVID really was I
think a lot of us that hadcontrol, lost control, because
(05:42):
all these rules about you can'tdrink at the office the office
is your home now, but you candrink at home, And, they don't
notice if you're, what's in yourcoffee cup in the morning, as
long as you're still showing upto work and doing your job.
All of a sudden, like, all thesesafe cards that I had in place
started falling apart at thesame time as as I was drinking
more, and the strain that it didon my marriage, because, At the
(06:03):
time my husband and I weremonogamous, but the first thing
I would forget in my blackoutwas, like, the monogamy part of
our marriage, and so I'dblackout and cheat on him, and
it could only happen so manytimes before he was like,
Something's gotta stop, and I atthat point, that would finally
admitted he had known that I hadbeen drinking enough because he
was married to me, but I alwayswas also very it was because I
(06:25):
was on an empty stomach, or Iwas, like, I would hide how
much.
So sometimes he was also justmystified as to how I was so
drunk, because he would have noidea how much I had been secret
drinking in addition to thepublic drinking.
He knew things weren't addingup, but it was the first time,
like, where I was, like, I havea problem.
So I tried and started going todifferent 12 step meetings until
(06:46):
I found one that worked, Andthat kind of helps.
teach me that during that firstlike year how to be like a
normal person again.
But I also knew real quicklythat wasn't the only answer for
me.
I had already been podcastingwith my husband about movies and
tv shows and no one listened andwe did everything wrong about
podcasting possible.
(07:06):
But it was like it was great forus and brought us together with
something fun to do.
And then it gave me the tools tothat like when I got sober and I
was trying to binge all thesesober gay podcasts or searching
sober queer sober this andcouldn't find much at the time
like three years ago three and ahalf years ago I was like I know
how to make one so I started mypodcast gay a and that was my
(07:28):
chance to connect with otherpeople that might not
necessarily including some 12step people that's where
especially I found a lot of myfirst guests but then meeting
people online from other stepsLike other fellowship programs
besides mine, which was basedaround alcohol, but also people
who got sober using otherprograms or other ways or.
Woke up and just stoppedsomehow.
I don't know.
It blows my mind because I needlike sets of like again like
(07:50):
rules like I need do this dothis as long as I can follow my
prescription of like how tofunction like I've learned what
that is over the past three anda half years of what I need to
like be at my best self but likeI just love also hearing other
perspectives so I say that'shelped keep me sober just as
much as anything else.
Ralf (08:07):
You've already answered the question, but I'll ask it
anyway.
Completely sober, clear headed,or a social drinker?
Steve (08:13):
Completely sober, yes.
Ralf (08:16):
And you, you mentioned earlier that with drinking, you
would go on to the next bit, andthat would just sound fun.
So Yes.
I See, I wasn't an alcoholic,but I was also very much oh,
I'll do this now.
So it's a little bit reverse towhat our situations are, but
similar.
Yeah,
Steve (08:36):
I joke because I learned like in recovering doing
different roundups and soberexperiences and even kinky
experiences where there's asober people that like my people
generally or CMA people liketheir meth heads like I that's
the people that I vibe with butthe first time in college when I
was exposed to that drug it wasa very like upsetting traumatic
experience where I was exposedto without knowing it was in my
(08:57):
system and then It was just itfreaked me out enough to scare
me and like it takes a lot toscare me away from something but
that was enough where I likeafter talking with so many other
people like thank god it wasn'twith a hot guy or a hot group of
guys with a positive experiencebecause I would have been like
Off to the races and like gimmemore because that's what it was
like with everything else Soit's like the moment I started
smoking weed It was like i'llsmoke all the weed I can get if
(09:18):
it was gimme cocaine Everyonehad to hide their cocaine from
me in college They learned realquickly because my solution was
to do all of it like You That'show it was with everything, but
luckily in my experience themeth scared me enough away where
that wasn't the same thing forme.
Ralf (09:33):
Oh god, I wish meth had scared me away, but no, it did
not.
Last question, what is clearplayto you and why is it important?
Steve (09:42):
Clearplay to me not only is being, like, sober in the sex
that you're having, but for meespecially having Developed more
like my kinky side and tappinginto it in my sobriety It's also
the communication like clearcommunication because I
oftentimes would use sex todisassociate and to shut down
and detach from the real worldand so here I've learned in my
(10:06):
sobriety and exploring my kinkshow much I love like being
connected to the person that I'mwith and Just like having that
energy exchange like amplifyingour energies together You Rather
than it be like one of us justtaking all the energy from the
other.
There's a time and a place forthat as well.
But like in general, I love itwhen we can amplify each other's
experiences by being soconnected where I'm able to, I
(10:27):
had so much shame around thetype of sex that I wanted to
have where I wasn't even able tophysically have it for so many
years.
But like now that I love thatnot only can I be having the
sex, but I'm also not going tobe ashamed of the sex that I'm
having.
I'll talk about the sex withanyone who wants to listen to me
talk about it.
Because I just, I feel like it'ssomething that.
So many of us want to do or aredoing but are afraid to talk
(10:48):
about that if people who arealready loud by nature Like me
and you like who want to like dopodcasts or shows about it Like
have people just to get loud andit makes someone who might be
afraid or ashamed of it feelless shame I
Ralf (11:02):
think one of the things for me, at least, I'm always
been quite sex positive and Ithink it's to do with my
upbringing.
Sex was never taboo in my house.
My mom would rather have us comeand ask things than being
ashamed of it.
And so I'm sure some peoplewould think me and my mom's
relationship is a bit relaxedbut She knows about the levers,
(11:23):
she's seen my dog cage it's nota big deal and that makes it a
lot easier to explore and so on.
Lockdown, and then you say itstarted falling apart.
Up until that then, and up untilthat point, and it's actually
something we probably haven'tdived into in the last episode,
so you would call yourself afunctioning alcoholic?
Steve (11:44):
I had been, yeah, I was, to the point where.
If you got close enough to me,you knew something was wrong,
but I was very good at keepingthe picture outside and the
people at arm's length, as longas I was like, at arm's length,
my life looked perfect and thatwas very much the way that I was
raised by my parents, they mightget home from work and tell my
younger brother and I that wewere pieces of shit that they
(12:05):
never wished they adopted usbecause we forgot to vacuum up
after the dog's shedding for theday.
But, at the same time, like,when we went out, we were, like,
the big, smiley, happy familywhere everything was perfect.
And that's what was drilled intome, is it didn't matter how
dysfunctional it was.
Inside your home or like whatyou were feeling like mom and
dad could be fighting you andyour brother could be fighting.
(12:25):
Like the whole family could beat war with each other and like
afraid to leave the bedrooms atnight because of who might yell.
But at the same time, like whenwe go out, we're all like lovey
dovey being the perfect family.
So that's when I was.
In my alcoholism, it was verymuch like I had to find, I had
to be in a relationship becauseit helps having that kind of I
(12:46):
would say accountability, but atthe same time it was also like
someone to help take care of meif I got sloppier cover some of
the holes that I couldn't takecare of myself because I was
blacking out left and right ordrinking more than I should.
But it also, was about gettingthe boyfriend to become the
husband so that then we can getthe house so that we can get the
Kids so that we can you know the2.
5 kids so that we can get tothis so that we can have this
perfect life where like almosteven though because like I was
(13:10):
gay I I grew up in the age oflike where will and grace was on
tv to the point where I goteight different box sets of
season one in college fromdifferent people who just didn't
know what to give me as a giftso they just got me Will and
Grace.
But like with that show I wasalso like very raised by like
the people around me that if youwere like Will it was okay.
If you were trying to find yourhusband to settle down to raise
(13:31):
the family and like basically bestraight but like having sex
with dudes and just swap out thewife for the husband like it was
going to be more acceptable thanif you were, Dating around or
like seeing multiple people orlike being a little bit more
flamboyant or not having a moretraditional job, like a lawyer,
but being something like anactor, entertainer.
I was raised where that was bad.
(13:52):
Don't do that.
That won't be accepted as longas you look like Will, you're
going to be accepted, but youcan't look like Jack.
And so that was very much what Iwas trying with my life
subconsciously, but I've workedthrough this like in sobriety
and therapy and coaching and allof that.
Yeah.
But that's very much what I wastrying to do, and it was
shattered because the covenhappened right around the time
that my husband and I weretrying to adopt a child from the
(14:12):
foster care system who is 17 andat the time we didn't realize
was like, very mentally unwelland having her in our, on our
home.
During the trial period of likeit became very clear that like
it was not going to work out Itwasn't healthy for any of us,
but it was so unhealthy thatlike for me and him together We
were like this is it like wejust are gonna put that off the
(14:33):
table right now But at that timeif my entire life was this
timeline of what it should belike Saying I can't do this.
I can't do that.
Like I won't do the kinky sex Iwon't go out to like circuit
parties.
I won't do clubs.
I won't do this.
I won't You Because I'm tryingto follow this like perfect
trajectory of what my life wouldbe like and then all of a sudden
it stops like a crack searchshatters at this road where like
(14:56):
everything past it all of asudden doesn't exist anymore
because it all from there wasbased off of this adoption
working out and that's likebeing these dads and living this
perfect American fantasy lifeand so like after being like a
Oh, what do I do?
I didn't want to figure out whatI wanted to do.
I just wanted to drink the painaway until I didn't feel
anything.
And so I did that for Itprobably was like three to six
(15:19):
months afterwards where I waslike every day and it just was
at work again Like I was workingin a sales, sales and marketing
job at a senior living communitylike that was being built So
it's like from the ground up andi'm selling ten thousand dollar
deposits For these seniors ortheir like loved ones to pick
out these apartments, but likei'm taking them up and down the
elevators That are three storieshigh and I've been drinking all
(15:41):
day long and it's like a fouro'clock product I must smell
like the vodka or the whiskeythat i've been drinking like
there's no way now in sobrietyThat I know I didn't when I was
taking up the elevator withthese tours with these clients
with my boss with these regionaldirectors But no one said
anything about it because I wasmaking them stupid amounts of
money So like they didn't careit was when I got sober and all
(16:05):
of a sudden like I had to take acouple days off because I was
like Physically going throughdetoxes and not able to focus on
a conversation And then like Iall of a sudden wasn't the life
of the party happy hour guyanymore that all of a sudden
they were like Oh that's whenthey started if anything my
sobriety was, like, a bad thingfor them, because it hurt their
pockets, and my performance ofwhat I was known for doing to
(16:28):
make them money.
But, yeah, they were more thanhappy to look the other way, as
long as everything was great.
My husband was more than happyto look the other way, as long
as I was, you know, keeping thestory going as long as things
looked okay on the outside, likeall these other people around
me, as long as I kept going, butit got for me to the point where
I was like waking up at three orfour o'clock in the morning not
(16:49):
only like physically ill fromdetox, but also just like
mentally and emotionally likeupset that I didn't have any
aneurysm in my sleep and justnot wake up at all because I
just didn't want to go throughthe cycle of spending like the
first hour of the morning like,Going through my phone, being
like, who did I call?
Who did I text?
Who did I DM?
Who did I message to saysomething?
Tiptoeing around my husband tofigure out if I have to
(17:10):
apologize for anything, or ifeven not remembering what
happened then getting sick onthe way to work, and pretending
it's stomach problems, and notthe gallon of liquor a day I'm
drinking, and then saying I'mnever going to do it ever again,
to be doing it by the time I wasdone with my morning meetings at
9 o'clock in the morning.
It just was, like, it got tired.
It was Similar to my drinkingcareer it was fun for a while
(17:33):
until it wasn't and that lastbit, like, when I said screw the
rules, screw the guidebook I'mjust gonna drink as much as I
want and black out and whateverhappens and not care whether I
lived or died it didn't, itwasn't fun for very long.
And I'm, like, when finally myhusband was like, you something
needs to change, I was sorelieved that I was able to
finally because I wouldn't, Iwas at the point again where I
(17:53):
was like, I wasn't activelysuicidal, but I was like, hoping
to die, and no one around me wasstopping me.
And he was the first person totry and stop me and say I'll
listen, just tell me.
And I finally did, and thankGod, because here we are today.
Ralf (18:08):
Yeah, I think, as the loved ones, it's always
difficult to watch.
And sometimes, some loved ones,and I can't talk for your
husband, of course, but you alsogo in a little bit of denial.
About what's going on.
You don't want to really faceit.
I have, I know of people wherethey're in relationships where
(18:29):
one is not doing so well and theother one is not aware of it.
As far as I'm aware is that iscrazy to me how they wouldn't
notice.
But then again.
You are very quick to just turna blind eye to the signs, or you
won't quite, don't want quite tobelieve it, that it is an issue.
(18:50):
I'm assuming you've workedthrough all this with your
husband now, and you're Yes, forsure.
Steve (18:56):
Yeah the first especially the first year was, like, about
so much healing.
The first 90 days, even, becausepart of my rock bottom involved
him catching another bout ofinfidelity.
There was a time of healingwhere, even though we were
married, I still wasn't havingsex with him in early recovery.
It was, like, 90 days tosomewhere between my third and
fourth month of sobriety when wefinally had sex together.
(19:16):
And even that was, like, a bigdeal for me, because it was the
first time where, Like I, wehad, without drinking I had sex,
but I had always been at leaststoned or something.
And so it was the first timethat I had sober sex with my
husband, in our marriage, whichis wild to think that I didn't
realize I had a problem untileight years into it, but it was
a big deal, but a lot of healingneeded to be happening, not only
in that aspect of then alsoreally taking like just like
(19:39):
being just about me and him andhealing us but then also just I
felt this like psychic change asthey talk about in the rooms
like pretty quickly where likebetween the podcast like holding
my ass accountable where I waslike I can't fuck up people are
watching now but like also justlike also having my program and
being like, wow I see all thesepeople who I want what they
have, and they're telling me howto get it, and I'm going to do
(19:59):
anything and I felt the change,but he had been with me for so
many years where I was saying,I'll never do it again, I'll
never do it again.
I was the boy who cried wolf atthat point.
So I remember there was alsosome friction like around the
three to six month mark where Ifelt like I had grown and I was
catapulted into this like newplane of existence and he was
still like waiting for therelapse, like waiting for the
(20:21):
other shoe to drop, waiting forthings not to work out.
And I was like, how do you notbelieve it?
But of course now that I've alsogotten past it and I'm out of
the woods and of course, now Iknow that because I've done that
so many times without.
the support and background andcommunity that I was building,
and I tried to do it on my own,and I just can never do it.
It was only when I connectedwith other people in other ways,
(20:41):
like not just with the programs,with the podcasts like that.
I was like, the connections,what for me has always been
like, what helps keep me sobermore than reading or meditating,
like all of that is extra bonuswork and like homework and or
the course work to get thefoundations laid.
But like day to day, what keepsme sober is talking to another
sober person.
Ralf (21:00):
That.
I don't do 12 step myself now,but that's the power of the
room.
It's sitting in a room with,let's say, 20 complete
strangers, and you havesomething in common.
That doesn't necessarily have tobe a recovery room.
That can be any room.
If you mentioned earlier you dida movie podcast, you have some,
(21:20):
you have a connection with yourhusband where you can sit and
talk about movies.
That's connection.
And at the end of the day,that's all we want is
connection.
And it's just about finding thesame wavelength of people and
that's, like you say with thepodcast, it keeps you level, it
keeps you sane, and it alsokeeps you accountable.
(21:41):
Trust me, I feel veryaccountable doing this as well,
because I've had some lovelyinteractions, I've done a couple
events since last season, and Ido have people coming up to me.
And, I don't quite know what todo with it, so I'm just like So
weird.
I know, it's I don't like theword celebrity, because that is
(22:02):
not what I am.
But, people do know who I am,which is wild to me.
Because I'm just this littlecisgendered white guy sitting
with a microphone, how original.
Talking about sex and beingsober, and that's it.
It's just A thing I startedduring
Steve (22:21):
COVID.
Yeah but I mean what you'redoing is so huge because even
for me my first two years ofsobriety was very much like me
falling into like my old habitsof trying to build the perfect
life.
I was just trying to build itaround what being sober looked
like to a lot of the like themajority of people that I would
see in the rooms and like tothat it still was like very
traditional and sex wasn'treally talked about in a lot of
(22:44):
the places like the meetings Iwas going through the spaces
that I was finding online even.
Until I eventually found aleather recovery groups, and a
leather kink communities thathad sober people, and I was
like, oh my god, because myfirst sexual fantasy as a kid
was involved me being, like,tied down and surrounded by
dudes, and that's still right upthere with my top ten types of
(23:05):
fantasies I can come up with butI was so afraid my entire like
sexual adulthood like in myaddiction to really explore that
because that was wrong in thesame way i had all these rules
about drinking to try and keepme under control i had all these
like rules about sex where istill ended up having sex with
like hundreds of guys in my 20sbut i felt like it was okay
(23:26):
because i was basically doordashing dick to my apartment
like after i was wasted ratherthan going out to a bar and
finding it that way I don't knowwhy, or because it was like, not
wearing leather, but it waslike, I was already, I had them
walk in, I was already like,face down, ass up, or whatever
was going on I told myself whatI was doing was okay, because it
was like, not kinky, or leather,or didn't look like the bad
(23:49):
stuff on TV, or that peoplelooked down on or judge, but
that was the stuff that Iwanted, and so I just had a
whole bunch of really crappyvanilla sex for years, And
that's what I thought likemarriage was supposed to be like
and everything even then andthen it was like only like after
realizing like two and a halfyears into sobriety like between
that with sex kind of hitting adead end where I was like I
(24:10):
needed more but also just liketrying to be the perfect sober
person and be like all I'm doingso much service I resent it like
I thought that was like the goalis to do if I'm doing service at
seven meetings like seven nightsa week like that's me winning at
sobriety if I have so many thatI can't keep track of them like
if I'm doing All these, if I'mlike doing service for this
organization in New York Citythat's like making me want to
(24:31):
shoot myself every single time Ihear Facebook Messenger go off
is that really what like theperfect sober person looks like?
Like it, that it wasn't for meand like I realized like there
were things that needed tochange, like I needed to like,
if I'm going to be living thesecond life, the second like the
shot at life, because there's noway I should be alive right now
if it wasn't for a higher power.
(24:52):
Looking out for me like it needsto be like my life the way that
I want to live it and thatinvolves like talking with my
husband about like respectfullyopening up the marriage in a way
where like he's comfortable withit.
I'm comfortable with it.
And we're communicating aboutit.
And when he gives boundaries Irespect them, which is like
something I could never do if Iwasn't sober because there are
things that we compromise onthat I'm not like in love with,
(25:14):
but I, I understand them, Irespect them, but things like
respect go out the window if Ihave alcohol or drugs in my
system and it starts with myselfif I'm drinking or using drugs
the respect for me goes, and soonce it's gone for me, like, how
am I going to respect anyoneelse around me if I can't
respect myself?
And so being able to show up tolike these situations and be
able to say like this, these aremy wants and needs, like not
(25:34):
only with like my marriage, butalso building my life up to be
like all these things that I waswaiting for I'll do this one day
I'll join like a community thatway I'll do, I'll start
exercising this day or join thegym that day or, all these
things that I was waiting for, Ijust started doing and like in
the past like year, almost like10 to 12 months of doing that is
like when I've had this kind oflike second awakening of
(25:54):
sobriety.
And it's really just startedwith like me telling my husband
I need to have kinky sex.
And from there, that confidencein the bedroom started happening
outside the bedroom.
That's
Ralf (26:03):
fantastic.
It's, I think a lot of peoplewere like, when they, may I ask
how old you are?
I am 38.
38.
Oh, plenty of time.
I do sometimes talk with peoplewhere they go, Oh, it's too
late.
We can't change what our sexlife is now.
I'm really curious, but it'sjust not gonna happen.
(26:25):
I'm just like, no, you can startwhenever you want to.
And it sounds to me the wayyou've talked about trying to
uphold this perfection andperfection in a heteronormative
way, has just blocked stuff thatwas already there.
You can, my personal view is, behappy you didn't find kink in
(26:46):
alcoholism, because it's fuckingdifficult to split them.
In that aspect, it's a littlebit easier for you.
So when did you start exploringyour kink after your surprise?
You said around two years after,
Steve (26:57):
or?
Yeah, I would say that I startedgoing to leather and kink
recovery meetings online, Iwould say, a little over a year
and a half ago, sporadicallyvery much dipping my toe in, not
going regularly, but it wasabout last October, so about
yeah, a year now, when I was,like, I'm going to go to this
meeting regularly, I'm going toshare whether I want to or not
I'm going to Trade phonenumbers.
(27:18):
I'm going to connect withpeople.
I'm going to follow them online.
I'm going to start doing myhomework rather than just saying
I have kinky interests, butactually figure out what that
looks like and making a list ofthings I know I want to try,
things I know I don't want totry, things I'll maybe try and
start then as I'm, like, goingout into the real world trying
to find people I can do thosethings with safely and sanely
and having that consent where,we can try it and I tend to just
(27:40):
for the longest time, I had moresuccess anytime I was traveling,
especially because you go tosober events, you're going to
find sober kinky people.
You go to kinky events, you'regoing to find kinky sober
people, because there's always alittle overlap when you're in
one of these kind of areas, but,being able to find these safe
places outside of my ownbackyard where I'm able to
explore, where there's also nofear of judgment of what people
online might think, becauseit's, they won't see me on their
(28:02):
grid.
My friends and neighbors are allthat kind of stuff.
Doing that very early on gave methe chance where now I was able
to then manifest it more locallyin a more sustainable situation
where I'm able to have the sexlife that I've always dreamed of
at the same time as starting toreally explore what kink and
leather and, like, all of thatmeans to me, as well as just You
(28:23):
know, communication of justtalking about my wants and needs
inside and outside of thebedroom, because I was always
very submissive in the bedroomand outside the bedroom.
And I've learned in my sobrietyI can be dominant on both sides.
And it's really fun being ableto like, take what I'm learning
in the bedroom and then be like,Talking about it outside the
bedroom, not just like talkingabout and educating, but also
(28:43):
being able to be more dominantwork or being, and when I talk
feeling more confident and whatI'm talking about, because, if
you could some of the things I'mdoing in the bedroom behind
closed doors, I could do thingson the street, a lot easier.
It feels oh, it's that is
Ralf (28:56):
so true.
And like gear does something aswell.
It changes your posture.
It changes your confidence.
It's the feel of it.
My main thing is lever, ofcourse.
And I've had so many people goesRalph, your posture changes when
you have lever on.
I was like, yeah, it's heavy ashell, but no, it does.
You stand a bit taller.
(29:16):
And.
I sometimes have a, like yousay, you'd bring it into your
workplace or so on, thisconfidence you sometimes have
with doing kink.
I sometimes struggle bringingthat with me sometimes because I
can come off really confidentwhen I'm out, but actually not
so confident out of gear.
So it's nice that you can mergethe
Steve (29:39):
two.
It helped me a lot because likearound that same time that I
started like getting kinky, Ialso started just fitness and
exercising and moving.
But like it was when I startedbeing able to like, lift or move
or push around like 120 140pounds.
And I like in my mind, a lightbulb went off or I was like,
just pretend it's a twink.
All of a sudden, I was like, Imoved it up.
And I was like, now, it's like Iwant to get started.
(29:59):
Strong enough where I could doit with like muscle daddies and
like now I'm up to like the 200.
So it's that was like for me,almost like I equated like the
two things together of themotivation of what I was doing
in the bedroom, like to what Iwas doing at the gym of like
with the pounds.
And it was just funny the waythat worked.
But it was motivating for me fora while or just like thinking
about if I could do this in thebedroom, I could do this at the
gym.
Or like on the flip side, likeas I was getting more confident
(30:21):
in my physical strength, like itmade a lot of the things that I
had always like.
fantasize about doing, but maybenot have been physically capable
of doing, a lot easier to do nowthat I'm more in shape.
So it's been a lot of fun,seeing those two kind of evolve
together too.
Ralf (30:35):
Yeah, I'm having the strength to sometimes as as a
dominant, it can be quitedifficult because I don't like
brat behavior.
A brat likes to fight back.
I don't have a lot of physicalstrength.
So I was like, I don't want abrat because I wouldn't be able
to fight them off.
And that's not a good look for atop.
Steve (30:56):
Yeah, I've learned that like about switching is like
something I've really found toenjoy when I find like a guy
where we can bounce off where Ican be dominant and submissive
or have that flip or that mix ofboth, which has been fun because
even like out in the streets,like before I discovered leather
and kink, just like being trulyversatile and enjoying both of
those experiences, it's veryhard because anyone online I've
(31:17):
learned who says they'reversatile, that's like code for
bottom 90 percent of the time,like top 10 percent of the time.
So finding like the true 50 50split it seems to almost be
easier in like the leather andkink community, just because
people seem to be more open tomore experiences sexually
anyway.
And again, it very much is likeabout that kind of connection
that you can build with someoneas well, where I'll do things
(31:38):
with someone like I'm vibingwith that I normally wouldn't
consider.
I had never even entertained orflirted with the idea of being
fisted before but then I have areally hot daddy like over me
with four fingers deep and he'sasking me Have you ever thought
about it?
And I was like not until now inthis way, you know It will shift
when you're with the rightperson the right environment and
while I haven't gotten there yetlike now that's like on my maybe
(32:01):
list when before it wasn'tbecause the right person brought
it up at the right time in thatright situation and all of a
sudden something opened like upin me like physically and
literally but I was about to sayliterally yes yeah literally but
like you know you never knowwhen you're open to trying like
for me at least like I'velearned in my real life I had so
many rules about what you canand can't do and that translated
(32:23):
to what I can and can't dosexually that Part of this new
version of me is sexually Idon't have these rules of what I
can and can't do.
I have probably not, maybe notbut there's always gonna be room
for compromise or room for me tobe surprised because, same thing
with my life, as long as I'mopen to be wrong, open to be
open to something new happening,it's gonna be a more exciting
Ralf (32:42):
ride.
Like, when it comes to kink,it's just exploring.
It's finding out what works andwith you and I recognize The kid
in the candy store in you fromwhen I started when I was 22, so
I'm old hat now.
But it is that like lust for it.
It's I didn't have to tryeverything.
(33:02):
Why limit myself?
And that's amazing.
And it's also, I hate beingcheesy, but it is that gift of
sobriety and clearness andbeing.
present and wanting to do thesethings.
So it's just so important.
And I'm so happy that you shareyour experiences on your
(33:23):
podcast.
Tell me a little bit about thepodcast you do.
Steve (33:26):
Sure, yeah, my podcast is called Gay A, which I thought
was hysterical when I got sober,because it's a pun on AA, but
gay.
But I also realized it makes itvery hard to find, and also if
you don't get it, you can neverget it.
The full title now is Gay A, TheQueer Sober Hero Show.
Searching queer and sober helpsyou find it a lot easier.
But it's a weekly podcast hasbeen coming out since my 90th
(33:50):
day of sobriety like I've hadover 200 episodes now So if you
love a good binge It's there foryou Every single week.
It's a mix of interviews as wellas topics So I try and when I'm
a new guest come on I'll havethem share their experience
strength and hope for 10 15minutes and I'll ask them
questions about it that come outof the conversation and then
(34:11):
I'll also the people who likeare really engaging and But also
engaging during the episode thelisteners love them and then
they engage like afterwards withsharing and stuff like that will
oftentimes come back on for liketopic episodes where they're
like, I want to talk about thistopic or that topic.
So that's a lot where I got intoa lot of sex, dating,
relationships, kink, that typeof stuff comes up because it's,
(34:31):
people come on and they werelike, okay, I've already done
the general here's how I gotsober.
And here's my life today.
What do we want to talk aboutnext?
And that's something that a lotof people like, really need to
hear about and there's room fordifferent perspectives on it.
The same way that there's I alsolove that.
It's the range of queer peoplethat I get.
So it's not only just, gay men,but it's I have trans people and
(34:51):
lesbians and I was trying tomake sure that my guests are as
rainbow and diverse as ourcommunity is to represent that.
When I got sober the purpose ofthat podcast, and I try and
always tell people we paint thatyou can go through traumatic
shit, like, when you share whathappened don't skip over the
dark stuff, because we've allgotten through it, but the main
focus of my show is about thepositive, amazing stuff that's
(35:12):
going on today in our lives,that's why it's the Sober Hero
Show, is because I thought thatmy life would be over when I got
sober, that's why I put it offfor so long, it's because I
thought it was game over you'dnever have fun again, but I'm
having more fun than I ever, Hadbefore, I'm having better sex
than I've ever had before, Ihave a healthier marriage than
I've ever had before, healthierfriendships Like in a community,
(35:33):
like my life is a thousand timesbetter In sobriety than it ever
was drinking and it's not evenme pretending anymore It's like
authentically better and that'sjust like a gift of being sober
But I try and show that topeople that if you can find my
podcast on YouTube Before earlyin sobriety like hang in there
And if you fall like if yourelapse like I try to also make
(35:54):
sure at least like half of myguests have relapses Part of
their story because it's notpart of mine yet But it's not
part of mine yet in part becauseof all my guests that are
constantly reminding me thatlike It's not better out there,
girl.
Don't do it.
But also at least they also havegiven me the strength where I
also do know that if it everdoes happen, I'll just come back
as soon as I can because thelonger that I'm out, it does, it
(36:14):
gets harder as well because we,who knows what might happen.
I've gotten so much strengthfrom my guests across the
different communities that ithelps show me other parts of
myself along the way.
Ralf (36:25):
I do find sometimes when I talk to people in early
recovery, it is it's a powerfulreminder of where I was at and I
don't want to go back to that.
Have I had wobbles?
Absolutely.
And I've been quite honest aboutthem and around clean time
birthdays.
It's tricky.
It's just keeping yourselfaccountable and speaking what's
(36:47):
in your head.
That's so important when youwant to keep sober, clear headed
and happy.
There is no light without thedark and we can, I can
definitely look back and some ofthe really dark situations and
that's ridiculous.
Why would I do that?
You have to have a sense ofhumor about it.
(37:07):
Because some of the situations Iput myself in, oh my God
Steve (37:11):
it's crazy.
Yeah, I try and just look ateverything with humor because
like it's so fucked up some ofit that if you're not like
Laughing you're gonna cry andlike I'd rather I'm the type
where I was like I've alwaysthought laughter was like an
easier way to deal with thingsthan crying It's partly
deflecting but also just like ingeneral like I'm like, how could
like some of the things I lookback on It's just like I must be
an alcoholic and it must be likea brain thing because I can so
(37:34):
smart and so So many other wayslike I but then when it comes to
like alcohol when it comes todrugs like I did some of the
stupidest and like even at timeslike alcohol drugs and like sex
and like kind of the triotogether like I did some of the
stupidest most like fucked upshit that no sane person like
sane whatever that looks likewould ever do and but then like
when I'm like but now like I'msober I would never do that and
(37:57):
I'm like but like even then Iwas like I thought that it was
fine the next morning like clearheaded or but it was like I
wasn't clear headed because Iwas still like an alcoholic that
wasn't dealing with my shit.
So it's just been great beingable to deal with the stuff that
comes up because one thing likeI thought when life when I got
sober was that all of a suddennothing bad would ever happen
again.
I've learned that also doesn'thappen like that's also not
(38:19):
true.
And just to keep going even whenthings don't do go wrong or you
get curveballs or hurricaneshappen.
Yeah, you, yeah,
Ralf (38:27):
you just have quite a few hurricanes in this state.
Quite scary stuff.
It's just important to be honestwhere you're at and what works
and so on.
I always say, always say topeople just There is the
relapsing of using drugs oralcohol, but you can also
mentally relapse, you can getinto old patterns or old fault
(38:48):
ways, or your brain startstelling you stories.
And I've definitely, in thatway, I've relapsed a couple of
times in the last seven years.
And that's where honesty isimportant to go, okay, this is
what I've done.
This is How it made me feel.
This is how I want to move onfrom it.
And what do I learn from it?
(39:08):
And that's important.
A lot of people get reallyashamed if they've engaged in,
not necessarily the action offull relapse, but just engaged
in some of those old behaviors.
And I'm just like, Like youmentioned earlier, it's not
about perfection.
It's just about being happy andthen leave the shit behind.
(39:29):
It's just much easier.
Steve (39:31):
I definitely had peaks and valleys in my sobriety where
thank God for batching contentwhere I'm able to interview and
like really work a program realhard with eight or nine awesome
interviews, because then if I dodisconnect and isolate for a
month and fall into some ofthat, like stinking thinking
that It's gonna get me introuble, like someone will snap
me out of it.
And but at the same time I'vebeen able to still have my
content be consistent, even ifmy sobriety hasn't always been
(39:54):
as great as it seems like on theoutside.
And again, that's like myperfectionist thing coming in
that I have to also feelcomfortable now that I've built
this community, like, when Istruggle to also not only be the
guy cheering everyone else on,but also be able to say I'm
struggling, help me.
And I haven't gotten there yet.
But One day, I know that's agoal that I need to work towards
because, yeah, it's hard for meto admit when I need help or
(40:16):
when I'm struggling.
And that's why during thehurricane I just took the week
off from social media, ratherthan even saying anything,
because I didn't want to sayanything sad or bad.
Even in sobriety, we still are,like, I know what I'm doing
isn't the healthiest behavior,but I still find myself doing it
if I'm not, aware of it.
I think
Ralf (40:33):
it's important acknowledging it that it does
happen and it's all it's not allperfection and it's not all
about figuring everything out inone go that comes down the line.
So since becoming kinky, sowhat's your favorite piece of
gear and what is The thing thatsurprised you the most.
Steve (40:55):
I would say my favorite piece of gear is what I'm
wearing right now.
It's, I got it from Mr.
S.
Leather.
So it's my first real leatherpiece that wasn't purchased off
of Amazon.
Where it can pass the sniff testat, when I go to Leather Pride
in Orlando.
Where they know it won't bebasically the Amazon Basics
version of leather.
It's definitely the piece that Iwork for this and I would say it
was just I learned like early onin sobriety that like when I
(41:19):
didn't have to worry aboutwhiskey dick that I am a pretty
good top as well, but like itwas like, I think it was like in
exploring my kink that learningthat I can be dominant was like,
it was like very surprising forme because my first time like
going through even like reallylike my biggest fears were like
how Dominant what I viewed asdominant like traits like
dominant though What I wouldconsider like I was afraid of
(41:41):
how dominant I could get likethat I could raise my voice that
I could get angry at times thatI could get here All these like
feelings that I tried associatedwith dominance that weren't
dominance They were like toxicbehaviors that I just got mixed
in from the way that I wasraised But having to separate
that and realize like that I canbe dominant without having to be
Those bad negative things andthat I like it and it's I think
(42:04):
it's fun and if I'm with someonewho like wants it, it's like
really fun.
And that was just surprisingbecause I very much had always
been, very submissive, it's likelittle sub Steve, and all of a
sudden now, like my two playpartners, I'm the dominant, like
top 80 to 90 percent of thetime.
(42:24):
I'm having like the best time ofmy life right now with it.
So it's just like a big changefrom where I was a year
Ralf (42:30):
or two ago.
I was about to say, if you'relistening to the podcast, you
won't be able to see it.
But if you're watching, youcould see a little twinkle in
Steve's eye when he's talkingabout dominating, which is
absolutely lovely because thatis also the twinkle I get
because it's the weird thing is.
I would never categorize myselfas being an alpha kind of type.
(42:50):
I'm probably more beta, really,if I'm honest.
So being the dominant in thebedroom is this like, is this
reversed of who I actually am inreal life.
And that's why I enjoy it.
Also, I think it's a little bitof a revenge on all the bullies
in my school.
To be honest
Steve (43:10):
Yeah, but like I also I love that i'm able to have that
twinkle in my eye and be presentright now Because like my one
partner has more leather andkink experience than me but even
like the other day they werelike you're making me feel like
i'm like a young kid who's likegood at sex again Because we're
able to like bounce off of eachother and enjoy it like that So
but that's the thing is likeI've learned in sobriety, and
(43:31):
especially with leather and kinkmy favorite part of these kink
scenes is after not only workingit out before and with the
communication, but just thatafterwards you can laugh about
her have that is fun.
I always enjoyed fun sex andI've been in so many encounters
where someone would be turnedoff by the fact that I might
giggle or laugh about something,but I'm, like, at the end of the
day it's fun.
Some of the shit that we'redoing in the bedroom is like
(43:53):
really freaky and like reallyawkward and really uncomfortable
and if you're jabbing it in atthe wrong angle like if I want
to giggle a little bit to dealwith the humor like if I'm you
know if there's a fumble here orthere's something awkward like a
little comic relief shouldn't belike a game over turn off and so
I love that.
Like in sobriety a lotespecially with kinky sober sex
(44:13):
that like a lot of the peoplethat i'm having sex with also
agree That like sex should befun like all of this should be
fun, even if we get even ifwe're pretending to be really
dominant and butch for The scenethat we're in and like when i'm
done with it I can go back tobeing like a little flamboyant
not to worry about what they'regoing to think of me because
there's the difference betweenwho I am and like, as a person,
what I am bringing to thebedroom at times.
(44:35):
And it's been really funexploring that.
It's
Ralf (44:37):
those dark and light nuances of one's personality and
what you find out you're intoand what it can bring up
emotionally.
And.
Some of it can be reallyhealing.
I've now found out in the lastyear or so I was diagnosed with
ADHD Two, three years ago, and Ifound out as a submissive my
brain goes quiet.
(44:59):
Yeah, I was just like, oh whoneeds wrestling?
I just, I'll just be atsomeone's boots.
Much easier.
Steve (45:05):
There you go.
Yeah, and see I've been with myADHD always very like in tune
with that side of things Butthere's just like also something
like I've known even like beforeexploring kink full I've had
partners where I'm like spankme.
I always knew I liked beingspanked Now that I have dealt
with the whole idea of ifsomeone is wanting me to spank
them, and they're consenting,and we learn how hard is too
(45:25):
hard, and this and that that Ilove the impact play of doing
that to someone else as well,which is something that I would
have been terrified for had Inot, because I was always afraid
what if, the what ifs of what ifI hurt someone, but now that
I've learned, I couldn't do thatwhen I was, like, drinking,
because you didn't have thatcommunication, but now that I
can have that communication andwork it out, I can explore it
safely I love that type ofstuff.
(45:47):
And again, it was like asurprise that I flipped what I
was expecting or what I've beenused to in sobriety, but it's a
beauty of being able to be clearand communicate with my
partners.
Ralf (45:58):
Just to take a complete U turn, you mentioned your failed
movie podcast earlier in theepisode.
I am a massive movie buff.
Steve (46:08):
So it still is up.
I pay the five bucks a month.
It's called a lifetime ofhappiness.
And again, like the titledoesn't even tell you it's about
movies, no one could find it.
And also every week was acompletely different genre.
So like you have to like reallyuniquely love what we love
specifically.
It's, but but again, there, wedid make it like 150, almost 200
(46:32):
episodes.
So like people can go through itnow and we'll get an email
saying, from Buzzsprout beinglike you got 50 downloads
because someone found like 50movies of the 150 that were
there because we do a lot ofhorror things like that where
they'll find chunks andsections, but it is very ADHD,
especially since it was twodifferent personalities were
like I choose a movie hechoosing movies so you could
(46:54):
tell that there was a battle ofwills at times.
Ralf (46:56):
Is your genre horror?
Is that what do you like?
Steve (46:59):
Both of us love bond over our love of horror.
We love all, everything horror.
We do the horror theme parks.
We do right now we're lovingDragula.
We love anything scary, spooky.
We love that.
But, I, my stuff, I've always,I'm born, In 86.
So a lot of my stuff that, likeif I call it a classic, it's
from like the nineties or ts andif he calls it a classic thing
(47:22):
that he's in his like midforties, it's from like the
early eighties or lateseventies.
And so we have that kind of,you'll see a lot of like cuts
from like the eighties where itwas like my first time being
exposed to this movie very much.
So me showing him something fromthe two thousands where he's I'm
so glad I missed this.
So it was some of these movieswere acts of love for the other,
but then also some we truly lovetogether.
(47:43):
So it's always a fun blend.
Ralf (47:45):
I guess as horror fans, it's, we also get a little bit
off on being scared.
And that's part of kink as well.
And also it makes it a hell of alot easier to find a costume for
Halloween.
Steve (47:57):
Yes.
Although I love all of thatmixing my gear with the
Halloween stuff.
My husband's that's thecheatingest cheating Halloween
thing ever.
Now, especially now that I'm inworse shape this year a joke
that I'm gonna go through isClausen.
Just the two weeks leading up toHalloween, just pictures of me
in my costumes with just a maskand a harness.
And he's that's not a costume.
You need makeup.
(48:18):
You need accessories.
And I was like, I could justwear a harness and a mask.
And he's that's not.
a real costume.
I said, we'll see what myfollowers think.
Ralf (48:25):
It's almost the gay version of the white girl's
bunny suit.
Steve (48:30):
Exactly.
Ralf (48:32):
That's what I'm doing next week.
I'm going to a birthday and it'sa Halloween birthday.
So I'm doing big boots, redboiler suit red eye contact
lenses and probably some rubber.
Steve (48:44):
Being new to kink, I'm learning that it's fucking
expensive, leather, so you gottaget that mileage out of it.
If we can at least use it forHalloween once a year, give us
the pass, please, because weinvest in enough where we don't
need to go out and buy anothercostume up for spending money on
leather.
So what is your favorite horrormovie, as we are on the topic?
My favorite my favorite horrorfranchise is the screen, the
(49:07):
screen movies, like all of thescreen movies I love, I would
say for sure.
We
Ralf (49:12):
can bin the last one, to be honest, but never mind that's
my view on it.
Oh, I hated it, absolutely hatedit.
But my favorite is A Nightmareon Elm Street.
Oh,
Steve (49:21):
yes, that's
Ralf (49:22):
also good.
Steve (49:23):
I love the first one.
Especially
Ralf (49:25):
I literally just got it on 4k desk.
So that will be watching forthis weekend.
I think
Steve (49:31):
and then Chucky.
I've fell in love with more withthe TV show putting all the
movies together.
I'm so upset that it wascanceled after the 3rd season.
But I have a new love of themovies after watching the show
for sure as well.
Ralf (49:44):
Oh, the show is so great.
It's made by gay man and it's soqueer coded, sometimes not so
queer coded.
Not very coded at all.
It's very queer.
And that's what I love about it.
And they have this villaincharacter that is actually quite
woke when it comes to the LGBTstuff.
And it's Oh, I just like killingpeople, but I'm not a monster.
(50:06):
So it's very important to haverepresentation, and I love the
horror and crossovers with LGBT,there's been so much of it, it's
the New York season of AmericanHorror Story was just, it was, I
thought it was art, I thought itwas so beautifully done.
It was horror, it was kink, youcan't go wrong with Russell
(50:28):
Tobey with a moustache.
And it was just so good, and itwas also beautifully done around
the AIDS crisis.
I thought it was, like, aperfect season.
Steve (50:40):
I enjoyed the beginning part of the season.
The ending was just a little toocerebral for me, but I like my
slashers a little more slashery,
Ralf (50:49):
I'll put Texas Chainsaw Massacre 2 on for you.
Alright, sounds good.
It's a date.
But we're coming to the end ofthe episode.
It's absolutely been a joy tohave you on.
If there's any piece of adviceyou would give to someone in
early recovery, what would itbe?
Steve (51:07):
I would say that it's never too late to try something
new.
I certainly, especially in earlyrecovery, take time to heal.
I'm glad that I took that firstyear to really learn how to
function as a normal human.
Because I didn't know how to dothat before.
I grew up being, like, thinkingeveryone got the handbook of,
like, how to be a normal personthe day that I was, like, sick
with mono in school.
I didn't get it.
(51:28):
But after that challengeyourself because I thought
sobriety and about life ingeneral was about building a
comfortable life I learnedespecially like through kink
like I'm like being challengedto be uncomfortable through kink
that that same Beinguncomfortable a little bit in
real life as well pushingyourself being a little afraid
but doing it anyway, and ifyou're finding yourself like in
(51:49):
this kind of Circle findingsomething to push yourself out
so that you keep moving forwardYou That's been something that I
had never explored so much of mysexuality until my sobriety, and
even then it took me some timeinto sobriety to have the
confidence to be able toactually go for it.
But I now that I have all theseyears ahead of me, I have plenty
of time to make up for losttime, and I will, trust me.
(52:11):
But it's not just the lessonsthat I've learned in the
bedroom, but taking that outsideto be, like, Always push
yourself like don't get into arut don't get into a routine
because I thought that was goingto be the definition of a
perfect life of my perfect lifeis always moving forward now
always figuring out what my nextkind of competition or obstacle
or marathon or thing I'm goingto do to challenge myself
because that's what I'm doingbetter if I get Thank you.
(52:35):
bored, I get lazy, and then Iget complacent, and then my
sobriety's at risk.
So I'd much rather keep movingforward.
Ralf (52:42):
Fantastic.
And if anyone's listened orwatched, and they connected with
something you said, where canthey get a hold of you?
Steve (52:49):
You can find a whole bunch more of me and my guests
on my show, Gay A Podcast.
So that's on Instagram, as wellas on all podcast players at Gay
A Podcast.
And then I try and keep thatjust to more just Sobriety, if
you want more of just me as aperson.
I'm also at JustSteveSRQ, that'sthe airport code for Sarasota.
So it's at JustSteveSRQ for mypersonal page.
(53:11):
That's where I'll do more likemy leather stuff and my, like my
little slutty stories and stuff.
Ralf (53:17):
Fantastic.
Fantastic.
Thank you very much for comingon.
Yeah.
Thank you so much for having me.
And that was Steve, and this wasthe first episode of season
eight, and it's been absolutelya joy to talk to you about his
journey into sobriety and hisjourney into kinkness.
And I'm so excited for what'sgoing to happen, and hopefully
I'll see him sometime over inAmerica when I get over there.
(53:39):
But until then, stay kinky, staysober, and play safe.
Bye!
Hey, there are super soberheroes and welcome to gay.
A it's your host server, Steve,the podcast guy here with 1,268
days of continuous sobriety.
And I am so grateful for therecent guest appearance that I
had on the real clear fetish.
Podcasts and YouTube show realclear talks.
(00:21):
It was an amazing experience.
I did the recording a about amonth ago and it is in the
podcasting magic of timingcoming out this weekend on the
16th of November.
So Ralph was nice enough to giveme the audio so that I can also
share with all of you.
It was an amazing interview.
It was longer than my generalepisodes, and he dug deep and
(00:43):
asked a lot of questions aboutthings that I haven't gone over.
And quite some time and I've didit through a different angle and
a different lens.
It was an amazing episode.
I was so grateful to be on itand he has tons of other amazing
content, just like me.
He's been doing his show forquite some time.
And so if you loved thisepisode, which I think you will,
because he's interviewing me andyou listened to the show and I
(01:05):
show up to it quite regularly.
So it's getting to know me in adifferent way, but it's also
getting to know him and hisamazing show and the what he's
doing over there.
So if this is an episode thatstrikes your fancy, make sure
that the next step for you is togo and click on over to his
show, which will be in the shownotes so that you can follow it.
There's already seven seasons ofcontent and more great content
(01:26):
on the way.
So definitely worth checking outand enjoy the content.
Ralf (01:45):
Hi and welcome to Real Clear Fetish Talks Real Clear
Play, a podcast that deals withkink, sober life and everything
in between.
This is the start of seasoneight.
I'm very excited.
I am now 40 years old, but whenthis comes out, it's like a
month into that.
So yes, a new decade for me.
So that's fantastic.
(02:06):
This time we're going to theStates to talk to Steve.
Hi, Steve.
Hello there, Ralph.
Thank you for having me.
Of course.
It's not a problem.
How are we doing?
I'm doing great.
You're not in an area with a
Steve (02:20):
hurricane, are you?
This time last week I was, yes.
I was in Sarasota, so I wasimpacted where I did lose power.
Our airport's down because theterminal roof fell.
So we are recovering, but thishas been the first couple of
days where I'm almost back to aroutine, back into doing podcast
interviews and podcasting on myown and stuff like that.
(02:41):
So it's good to get back to reallife.
Ralf (02:44):
Oh, yeah.
Us watching it over here.
It's scary stuff.
Steve (02:47):
Yeah.
Ralf (02:47):
Where we have it's a storm if a wheelie bin falls over, let
alone a whole roof of anairport.
Like with every episode I dofour standard questions at the
start, and then we'll just seewhere the conversation goes.
What do you prefer I call you?
Names, pronouns, and title.
Steve (03:03):
My name is Steve and then I, with my podcast, go by Sober
Steve, and then my pronouns arehe, him, and don't have an
official title.
I, depending on the person I'mwith, I'm in that age where if
the guy's younger, they'recalling me daddy, and if I'm
younger, I'm calling them daddy,so it'll end like I'm boy at
(03:23):
that point.
So it really just depends on theperson, the dynamics.
depending on who
Ralf (03:27):
stands in front of you.
Yes.
Exactly.
I recognize that one very muchfor myself.
Tell me a little bit about
Steve (03:33):
yourself.
I got sober during the pandemic,so I had been drinking was my
drug of choice.
Once I started drinking,Anything else sounds great and
good fun to me, but that waswhat really destroyed my life.
Growing up though, I was apretty late bloomer.
I always loved rules, like I wasa big rule follower.
(03:54):
So I didn't drink because it waswrong and bad and that's what
grown ups did.
So I was like so excited to whenI got old enough to drink.
I remember being fascinatedabout What that age would be
because it seemed to bedifferent for different people
But I remember at a sleepoverparty like trying alcohol in
like fourth or fifth grade andthinking it tasted bad So
therefore it must be because i'mtoo young and it'll taste better
(04:16):
in a couple years when i'm oldenough It'll just magically
taste better having like bathtubgin from your grandmother's
basement Like I didn'tunderstand like the whole
concept of it So it's just butlike I wasn't fascinated enough
to where I was going to breakthe rules because I knew it was
wrong And I shouldn't be doingit.
So I stayed away from it Youuntil after prom in high school,
and these people feeling otheredand bullied for being a very
(04:39):
flamboyant kid, my entire schoolcareer, basically, I was then
all of a sudden, the life of theparty, where everyone was
telling me, like, how And howsilly it was.
And where was this Steve thewhole time?
And we love this Steve.
And when can we see, when can wehang out again?
And all of a sudden I was rightat the end of saying goodbye to
all these people forever whomade my life hell for four
(05:00):
years.
I was finally accepted.
But it also I clung to that sideof the night for the longest
time, but it was only in mysorority and doing step work and
things like that, where I forgotthat the second half of that
night was, like, the guy I waswith, like, when we were hooking
up I got messy and sloppy andthen downright cruel to him and
blacked out.
I was blacked out at that point,but, there were amends to be
made from my first blackoutnight drinking, and I still woke
(05:21):
up the next morning I can't waitto do that again.
And from then on, it didn'tmatter what the rules were about
drinking I knew I needed todrink as much as I could, and I
was able to still control itover rules that I set up around
times and places for as long asI could, but COVID really was I
think a lot of us that hadcontrol, lost control, because
(05:42):
all these rules about you can'tdrink at the office the office
is your home now, but you candrink at home, And, they don't
notice if you're, what's in yourcoffee cup in the morning, as
long as you're still showing upto work and doing your job.
All of a sudden, like, all thesesafe cards that I had in place
started falling apart at thesame time as as I was drinking
more, and the strain that it didon my marriage, because, At the
(06:03):
time my husband and I weremonogamous, but the first thing
I would forget in my blackoutwas, like, the monogamy part of
our marriage, and so I'dblackout and cheat on him, and
it could only happen so manytimes before he was like,
Something's gotta stop, and I atthat point, that would finally
admitted he had known that I hadbeen drinking enough because he
was married to me, but I alwayswas also very it was because I
(06:25):
was on an empty stomach, or Iwas, like, I would hide how
much.
So sometimes he was also justmystified as to how I was so
drunk, because he would have noidea how much I had been secret
drinking in addition to thepublic drinking.
He knew things weren't addingup, but it was the first time,
like, where I was, like, I havea problem.
So I tried and started going todifferent 12 step meetings until
(06:46):
I found one that worked, Andthat kind of helps.
teach me that during that firstlike year how to be like a
normal person again.
But I also knew real quicklythat wasn't the only answer for
me.
I had already been podcastingwith my husband about movies and
tv shows and no one listened andwe did everything wrong about
podcasting possible.
(07:06):
But it was like it was great forus and brought us together with
something fun to do.
And then it gave me the tools tothat like when I got sober and I
was trying to binge all thesesober gay podcasts or searching
sober queer sober this andcouldn't find much at the time
like three years ago three and ahalf years ago I was like I know
how to make one so I started mypodcast gay a and that was my
(07:28):
chance to connect with otherpeople that might not
necessarily including some 12step people that's where
especially I found a lot of myfirst guests but then meeting
people online from other stepsLike other fellowship programs
besides mine, which was basedaround alcohol, but also people
who got sober using otherprograms or other ways or.
Woke up and just stoppedsomehow.
I don't know.
It blows my mind because I needlike sets of like again like
(07:50):
rules like I need do this dothis as long as I can follow my
prescription of like how tofunction like I've learned what
that is over the past three anda half years of what I need to
like be at my best self but likeI just love also hearing other
perspectives so I say that'shelped keep me sober just as
much as anything else.
Ralf (08:07):
You've already answered the question, but I'll ask it
anyway.
Completely sober, clear headed,or a social drinker?
Steve (08:13):
Completely sober, yes.
Ralf (08:16):
And you, you mentioned earlier that with drinking, you
would go on to the next bit, andthat would just sound fun.
So Yes.
I See, I wasn't an alcoholic,but I was also very much oh,
I'll do this now.
So it's a little bit reverse towhat our situations are, but
similar.
Yeah,
Steve (08:36):
I joke because I learned like in recovering doing
different roundups and soberexperiences and even kinky
experiences where there's asober people that like my people
generally or CMA people liketheir meth heads like I that's
the people that I vibe with butthe first time in college when I
was exposed to that drug it wasa very like upsetting traumatic
experience where I was exposedto without knowing it was in my
(08:57):
system and then It was just itfreaked me out enough to scare
me and like it takes a lot toscare me away from something but
that was enough where I likeafter talking with so many other
people like thank god it wasn'twith a hot guy or a hot group of
guys with a positive experiencebecause I would have been like
Off to the races and like gimmemore because that's what it was
like with everything else Soit's like the moment I started
smoking weed It was like i'llsmoke all the weed I can get if
(09:18):
it was gimme cocaine Everyonehad to hide their cocaine from
me in college They learned realquickly because my solution was
to do all of it like You That'show it was with everything, but
luckily in my experience themeth scared me enough away where
that wasn't the same thing forme.
Ralf (09:33):
Oh god, I wish meth had scared me away, but no, it did
not.
Last question, what is clearplayto you and why is it important?
Steve (09:42):
Clearplay to me not only is being, like, sober in the sex
that you're having, but for meespecially having Developed more
like my kinky side and tappinginto it in my sobriety It's also
the communication like clearcommunication because I
oftentimes would use sex todisassociate and to shut down
and detach from the real worldand so here I've learned in my
(10:06):
sobriety and exploring my kinkshow much I love like being
connected to the person that I'mwith and Just like having that
energy exchange like amplifyingour energies together You Rather
than it be like one of us justtaking all the energy from the
other.
There's a time and a place forthat as well.
But like in general, I love itwhen we can amplify each other's
experiences by being soconnected where I'm able to, I
(10:27):
had so much shame around thetype of sex that I wanted to
have where I wasn't even able tophysically have it for so many
years.
But like now that I love thatnot only can I be having the
sex, but I'm also not going tobe ashamed of the sex that I'm
having.
I'll talk about the sex withanyone who wants to listen to me
talk about it.
Because I just, I feel like it'ssomething that.
So many of us want to do or aredoing but are afraid to talk
(10:48):
about that if people who arealready loud by nature Like me
and you like who want to like dopodcasts or shows about it Like
have people just to get loud andit makes someone who might be
afraid or ashamed of it feelless shame I
Ralf (11:02):
think one of the things for me, at least, I'm always
been quite sex positive and Ithink it's to do with my
upbringing.
Sex was never taboo in my house.
My mom would rather have us comeand ask things than being
ashamed of it.
And so I'm sure some peoplewould think me and my mom's
relationship is a bit relaxedbut She knows about the levers,
(11:23):
she's seen my dog cage it's nota big deal and that makes it a
lot easier to explore and so on.
Lockdown, and then you say itstarted falling apart.
Up until that then, and up untilthat point, and it's actually
something we probably haven'tdived into in the last episode,
so you would call yourself afunctioning alcoholic?
Steve (11:44):
I had been, yeah, I was, to the point where.
If you got close enough to me,you knew something was wrong,
but I was very good at keepingthe picture outside and the
people at arm's length, as longas I was like, at arm's length,
my life looked perfect and thatwas very much the way that I was
raised by my parents, they mightget home from work and tell my
younger brother and I that wewere pieces of shit that they
(12:05):
never wished they adopted usbecause we forgot to vacuum up
after the dog's shedding for theday.
But, at the same time, like,when we went out, we were, like,
the big, smiley, happy familywhere everything was perfect.
And that's what was drilled intome, is it didn't matter how
dysfunctional it was.
Inside your home or like whatyou were feeling like mom and
dad could be fighting you andyour brother could be fighting.
(12:25):
Like the whole family could beat war with each other and like
afraid to leave the bedrooms atnight because of who might yell.
But at the same time, like whenwe go out, we're all like lovey
dovey being the perfect family.
So that's when I was.
In my alcoholism, it was verymuch like I had to find, I had
to be in a relationship becauseit helps having that kind of I
(12:46):
would say accountability, but atthe same time it was also like
someone to help take care of meif I got sloppier cover some of
the holes that I couldn't takecare of myself because I was
blacking out left and right ordrinking more than I should.
But it also, was about gettingthe boyfriend to become the
husband so that then we can getthe house so that we can get the
Kids so that we can you know the2.
5 kids so that we can get tothis so that we can have this
perfect life where like almosteven though because like I was
(13:10):
gay I I grew up in the age oflike where will and grace was on
tv to the point where I goteight different box sets of
season one in college fromdifferent people who just didn't
know what to give me as a giftso they just got me Will and
Grace.
But like with that show I wasalso like very raised by like
the people around me that if youwere like Will it was okay.
If you were trying to find yourhusband to settle down to raise
(13:31):
the family and like basically bestraight but like having sex
with dudes and just swap out thewife for the husband like it was
going to be more acceptable thanif you were, Dating around or
like seeing multiple people orlike being a little bit more
flamboyant or not having a moretraditional job, like a lawyer,
but being something like anactor, entertainer.
I was raised where that was bad.
(13:52):
Don't do that.
That won't be accepted as longas you look like Will, you're
going to be accepted, but youcan't look like Jack.
And so that was very much what Iwas trying with my life
subconsciously, but I've workedthrough this like in sobriety
and therapy and coaching and allof that.
Yeah.
But that's very much what I wastrying to do, and it was
shattered because the covenhappened right around the time
that my husband and I weretrying to adopt a child from the
(14:12):
foster care system who is 17 andat the time we didn't realize
was like, very mentally unwelland having her in our, on our
home.
During the trial period of likeit became very clear that like
it was not going to work out Itwasn't healthy for any of us,
but it was so unhealthy thatlike for me and him together We
were like this is it like wejust are gonna put that off the
(14:33):
table right now But at that timeif my entire life was this
timeline of what it should belike Saying I can't do this.
I can't do that.
Like I won't do the kinky sex Iwon't go out to like circuit
parties.
I won't do clubs.
I won't do this.
I won't You Because I'm tryingto follow this like perfect
trajectory of what my life wouldbe like and then all of a sudden
it stops like a crack searchshatters at this road where like
(14:56):
everything past it all of asudden doesn't exist anymore
because it all from there wasbased off of this adoption
working out and that's likebeing these dads and living this
perfect American fantasy lifeand so like after being like a
Oh, what do I do?
I didn't want to figure out whatI wanted to do.
I just wanted to drink the painaway until I didn't feel
anything.
And so I did that for Itprobably was like three to six
(15:19):
months afterwards where I waslike every day and it just was
at work again Like I was workingin a sales, sales and marketing
job at a senior living communitylike that was being built So
it's like from the ground up andi'm selling ten thousand dollar
deposits For these seniors ortheir like loved ones to pick
out these apartments, but likei'm taking them up and down the
elevators That are three storieshigh and I've been drinking all
(15:41):
day long and it's like a fouro'clock product I must smell
like the vodka or the whiskeythat i've been drinking like
there's no way now in sobrietyThat I know I didn't when I was
taking up the elevator withthese tours with these clients
with my boss with these regionaldirectors But no one said
anything about it because I wasmaking them stupid amounts of
money So like they didn't careit was when I got sober and all
(16:05):
of a sudden like I had to take acouple days off because I was
like Physically going throughdetoxes and not able to focus on
a conversation And then like Iall of a sudden wasn't the life
of the party happy hour guyanymore that all of a sudden
they were like Oh that's whenthey started if anything my
sobriety was, like, a bad thingfor them, because it hurt their
pockets, and my performance ofwhat I was known for doing to
(16:28):
make them money.
But, yeah, they were more thanhappy to look the other way, as
long as everything was great.
My husband was more than happyto look the other way, as long
as I was, you know, keeping thestory going as long as things
looked okay on the outside, likeall these other people around
me, as long as I kept going, butit got for me to the point where
I was like waking up at three orfour o'clock in the morning not
(16:49):
only like physically ill fromdetox, but also just like
mentally and emotionally likeupset that I didn't have any
aneurysm in my sleep and justnot wake up at all because I
just didn't want to go throughthe cycle of spending like the
first hour of the morning like,Going through my phone, being
like, who did I call?
Who did I text?
Who did I DM?
Who did I message to saysomething?
Tiptoeing around my husband tofigure out if I have to
(17:10):
apologize for anything, or ifeven not remembering what
happened then getting sick onthe way to work, and pretending
it's stomach problems, and notthe gallon of liquor a day I'm
drinking, and then saying I'mnever going to do it ever again,
to be doing it by the time I wasdone with my morning meetings at
9 o'clock in the morning.
It just was, like, it got tired.
It was Similar to my drinkingcareer it was fun for a while
(17:33):
until it wasn't and that lastbit, like, when I said screw the
rules, screw the guidebook I'mjust gonna drink as much as I
want and black out and whateverhappens and not care whether I
lived or died it didn't, itwasn't fun for very long.
And I'm, like, when finally myhusband was like, you something
needs to change, I was sorelieved that I was able to
finally because I wouldn't, Iwas at the point again where I
(17:53):
was like, I wasn't activelysuicidal, but I was like, hoping
to die, and no one around me wasstopping me.
And he was the first person totry and stop me and say I'll
listen, just tell me.
And I finally did, and thankGod, because here we are today.
Ralf (18:08):
Yeah, I think, as the loved ones, it's always
difficult to watch.
And sometimes, some loved ones,and I can't talk for your
husband, of course, but you alsogo in a little bit of denial.
About what's going on.
You don't want to really faceit.
I have, I know of people wherethey're in relationships where
(18:29):
one is not doing so well and theother one is not aware of it.
As far as I'm aware is that iscrazy to me how they wouldn't
notice.
But then again.
You are very quick to just turna blind eye to the signs, or you
won't quite, don't want quite tobelieve it, that it is an issue.
(18:50):
I'm assuming you've workedthrough all this with your
husband now, and you're Yes, forsure.
Steve (18:56):
Yeah the first especially the first year was, like, about
so much healing.
The first 90 days, even, becausepart of my rock bottom involved
him catching another bout ofinfidelity.
There was a time of healingwhere, even though we were
married, I still wasn't havingsex with him in early recovery.
It was, like, 90 days tosomewhere between my third and
fourth month of sobriety when wefinally had sex together.
(19:16):
And even that was, like, a bigdeal for me, because it was the
first time where, Like I, wehad, without drinking I had sex,
but I had always been at leaststoned or something.
And so it was the first timethat I had sober sex with my
husband, in our marriage, whichis wild to think that I didn't
realize I had a problem untileight years into it, but it was
a big deal, but a lot of healingneeded to be happening, not only
in that aspect of then alsoreally taking like just like
(19:39):
being just about me and him andhealing us but then also just I
felt this like psychic change asthey talk about in the rooms
like pretty quickly where likebetween the podcast like holding
my ass accountable where I waslike I can't fuck up people are
watching now but like also justlike also having my program and
being like, wow I see all thesepeople who I want what they
have, and they're telling me howto get it, and I'm going to do
(19:59):
anything and I felt the change,but he had been with me for so
many years where I was saying,I'll never do it again, I'll
never do it again.
I was the boy who cried wolf atthat point.
So I remember there was alsosome friction like around the
three to six month mark where Ifelt like I had grown and I was
catapulted into this like newplane of existence and he was
still like waiting for therelapse, like waiting for the
(20:21):
other shoe to drop, waiting forthings not to work out.
And I was like, how do you notbelieve it?
But of course now that I've alsogotten past it and I'm out of
the woods and of course, now Iknow that because I've done that
so many times without.
the support and background andcommunity that I was building,
and I tried to do it on my own,and I just can never do it.
It was only when I connectedwith other people in other ways,
(20:41):
like not just with the programs,with the podcasts like that.
I was like, the connections,what for me has always been
like, what helps keep me sobermore than reading or meditating,
like all of that is extra bonuswork and like homework and or
the course work to get thefoundations laid.
But like day to day, what keepsme sober is talking to another
sober person.
Ralf (21:00):
That.
I don't do 12 step myself now,but that's the power of the
room.
It's sitting in a room with,let's say, 20 complete
strangers, and you havesomething in common.
That doesn't necessarily have tobe a recovery room.
That can be any room.
If you mentioned earlier you dida movie podcast, you have some,
(21:20):
you have a connection with yourhusband where you can sit and
talk about movies.
That's connection.
And at the end of the day,that's all we want is
connection.
And it's just about finding thesame wavelength of people and
that's, like you say with thepodcast, it keeps you level, it
keeps you sane, and it alsokeeps you accountable.
(21:41):
Trust me, I feel veryaccountable doing this as well,
because I've had some lovelyinteractions, I've done a couple
events since last season, and Ido have people coming up to me.
And, I don't quite know what todo with it, so I'm just like So
weird.
I know, it's I don't like theword celebrity, because that is
(22:02):
not what I am.
But, people do know who I am,which is wild to me.
Because I'm just this littlecisgendered white guy sitting
with a microphone, how original.
Talking about sex and beingsober, and that's it.
It's just A thing I startedduring
Steve (22:21):
COVID.
Yeah but I mean what you'redoing is so huge because even
for me my first two years ofsobriety was very much like me
falling into like my old habitsof trying to build the perfect
life.
I was just trying to build itaround what being sober looked
like to a lot of the like themajority of people that I would
see in the rooms and like tothat it still was like very
traditional and sex wasn'treally talked about in a lot of
(22:44):
the places like the meetings Iwas going through the spaces
that I was finding online even.
Until I eventually found aleather recovery groups, and a
leather kink communities thathad sober people, and I was
like, oh my god, because myfirst sexual fantasy as a kid
was involved me being, like,tied down and surrounded by
dudes, and that's still right upthere with my top ten types of
(23:05):
fantasies I can come up with butI was so afraid my entire like
sexual adulthood like in myaddiction to really explore that
because that was wrong in thesame way i had all these rules
about drinking to try and keepme under control i had all these
like rules about sex where istill ended up having sex with
like hundreds of guys in my 20sbut i felt like it was okay
(23:26):
because i was basically doordashing dick to my apartment
like after i was wasted ratherthan going out to a bar and
finding it that way I don't knowwhy, or because it was like, not
wearing leather, but it waslike, I was already, I had them
walk in, I was already like,face down, ass up, or whatever
was going on I told myself whatI was doing was okay, because it
was like, not kinky, or leather,or didn't look like the bad
(23:49):
stuff on TV, or that peoplelooked down on or judge, but
that was the stuff that Iwanted, and so I just had a
whole bunch of really crappyvanilla sex for years, And
that's what I thought likemarriage was supposed to be like
and everything even then andthen it was like only like after
realizing like two and a halfyears into sobriety like between
that with sex kind of hitting adead end where I was like I
(24:10):
needed more but also just liketrying to be the perfect sober
person and be like all I'm doingso much service I resent it like
I thought that was like the goalis to do if I'm doing service at
seven meetings like seven nightsa week like that's me winning at
sobriety if I have so many thatI can't keep track of them like
if I'm doing All these, if I'mlike doing service for this
organization in New York Citythat's like making me want to
(24:31):
shoot myself every single time Ihear Facebook Messenger go off
is that really what like theperfect sober person looks like?
Like it, that it wasn't for meand like I realized like there
were things that needed tochange, like I needed to like,
if I'm going to be living thesecond life, the second like the
shot at life, because there's noway I should be alive right now
if it wasn't for a higher power.
(24:52):
Looking out for me like it needsto be like my life the way that
I want to live it and thatinvolves like talking with my
husband about like respectfullyopening up the marriage in a way
where like he's comfortable withit.
I'm comfortable with it.
And we're communicating aboutit.
And when he gives boundaries Irespect them, which is like
something I could never do if Iwasn't sober because there are
things that we compromise onthat I'm not like in love with,
(25:14):
but I, I understand them, Irespect them, but things like
respect go out the window if Ihave alcohol or drugs in my
system and it starts with myselfif I'm drinking or using drugs
the respect for me goes, and soonce it's gone for me, like, how
am I going to respect anyoneelse around me if I can't
respect myself?
And so being able to show up tolike these situations and be
able to say like this, these aremy wants and needs, like not
(25:34):
only with like my marriage, butalso building my life up to be
like all these things that I waswaiting for I'll do this one day
I'll join like a community thatway I'll do, I'll start
exercising this day or join thegym that day or, all these
things that I was waiting for, Ijust started doing and like in
the past like year, almost like10 to 12 months of doing that is
like when I've had this kind oflike second awakening of
(25:54):
sobriety.
And it's really just startedwith like me telling my husband
I need to have kinky sex.
And from there, that confidencein the bedroom started happening
outside the bedroom.
That's
Ralf (26:03):
fantastic.
It's, I think a lot of peoplewere like, when they, may I ask
how old you are?
I am 38.
38.
Oh, plenty of time.
I do sometimes talk with peoplewhere they go, Oh, it's too
late.
We can't change what our sexlife is now.
I'm really curious, but it'sjust not gonna happen.
(26:25):
I'm just like, no, you can startwhenever you want to.
And it sounds to me the wayyou've talked about trying to
uphold this perfection andperfection in a heteronormative
way, has just blocked stuff thatwas already there.
You can, my personal view is, behappy you didn't find kink in
(26:46):
alcoholism, because it's fuckingdifficult to split them.
In that aspect, it's a littlebit easier for you.
So when did you start exploringyour kink after your surprise?
You said around two years after,
Steve (26:57):
or?
Yeah, I would say that I startedgoing to leather and kink
recovery meetings online, Iwould say, a little over a year
and a half ago, sporadicallyvery much dipping my toe in, not
going regularly, but it wasabout last October, so about
yeah, a year now, when I was,like, I'm going to go to this
meeting regularly, I'm going toshare whether I want to or not
I'm going to Trade phonenumbers.
(27:18):
I'm going to connect withpeople.
I'm going to follow them online.
I'm going to start doing myhomework rather than just saying
I have kinky interests, butactually figure out what that
looks like and making a list ofthings I know I want to try,
things I know I don't want totry, things I'll maybe try and
start then as I'm, like, goingout into the real world trying
to find people I can do thosethings with safely and sanely
and having that consent where,we can try it and I tend to just
(27:40):
for the longest time, I had moresuccess anytime I was traveling,
especially because you go tosober events, you're going to
find sober kinky people.
You go to kinky events, you'regoing to find kinky sober
people, because there's always alittle overlap when you're in
one of these kind of areas, but,being able to find these safe
places outside of my ownbackyard where I'm able to
explore, where there's also nofear of judgment of what people
online might think, becauseit's, they won't see me on their
(28:02):
grid.
My friends and neighbors are allthat kind of stuff.
Doing that very early on gave methe chance where now I was able
to then manifest it more locallyin a more sustainable situation
where I'm able to have the sexlife that I've always dreamed of
at the same time as starting toreally explore what kink and
leather and, like, all of thatmeans to me, as well as just You
(28:23):
know, communication of justtalking about my wants and needs
inside and outside of thebedroom, because I was always
very submissive in the bedroomand outside the bedroom.
And I've learned in my sobrietyI can be dominant on both sides.
And it's really fun being ableto like, take what I'm learning
in the bedroom and then be like,Talking about it outside the
bedroom, not just like talkingabout and educating, but also
(28:43):
being able to be more dominantwork or being, and when I talk
feeling more confident and whatI'm talking about, because, if
you could some of the things I'mdoing in the bedroom behind
closed doors, I could do thingson the street, a lot easier.
It feels oh, it's that is
Ralf (28:56):
so true.
And like gear does something aswell.
It changes your posture.
It changes your confidence.
It's the feel of it.
My main thing is lever, ofcourse.
And I've had so many people goesRalph, your posture changes when
you have lever on.
I was like, yeah, it's heavy ashell, but no, it does.
You stand a bit taller.
(29:16):
And.
I sometimes have a, like yousay, you'd bring it into your
workplace or so on, thisconfidence you sometimes have
with doing kink.
I sometimes struggle bringingthat with me sometimes because I
can come off really confidentwhen I'm out, but actually not
so confident out of gear.
So it's nice that you can mergethe
Steve (29:39):
two.
It helped me a lot because likearound that same time that I
started like getting kinky, Ialso started just fitness and
exercising and moving.
But like it was when I startedbeing able to like, lift or move
or push around like 120 140pounds.
And I like in my mind, a lightbulb went off or I was like,
just pretend it's a twink.
All of a sudden, I was like, Imoved it up.
And I was like, now, it's like Iwant to get started.
(29:59):
Strong enough where I could doit with like muscle daddies and
like now I'm up to like the 200.
So it's that was like for me,almost like I equated like the
two things together of themotivation of what I was doing
in the bedroom, like to what Iwas doing at the gym of like
with the pounds.
And it was just funny the waythat worked.
But it was motivating for me fora while or just like thinking
about if I could do this in thebedroom, I could do this at the
gym.
Or like on the flip side, likeas I was getting more confident
(30:21):
in my physical strength, like itmade a lot of the things that I
had always like.
fantasize about doing, but maybenot have been physically capable
of doing, a lot easier to do nowthat I'm more in shape.
So it's been a lot of fun,seeing those two kind of evolve
together too.
Ralf (30:35):
Yeah, I'm having the strength to sometimes as as a
dominant, it can be quitedifficult because I don't like
brat behavior.
A brat likes to fight back.
I don't have a lot of physicalstrength.
So I was like, I don't want abrat because I wouldn't be able
to fight them off.
And that's not a good look for atop.
Steve (30:56):
Yeah, I've learned that like about switching is like
something I've really found toenjoy when I find like a guy
where we can bounce off where Ican be dominant and submissive
or have that flip or that mix ofboth, which has been fun because
even like out in the streets,like before I discovered leather
and kink, just like being trulyversatile and enjoying both of
those experiences, it's veryhard because anyone online I've
(31:17):
learned who says they'reversatile, that's like code for
bottom 90 percent of the time,like top 10 percent of the time.
So finding like the true 50 50split it seems to almost be
easier in like the leather andkink community, just because
people seem to be more open tomore experiences sexually
anyway.
And again, it very much is likeabout that kind of connection
that you can build with someoneas well, where I'll do things
(31:38):
with someone like I'm vibingwith that I normally wouldn't
consider.
I had never even entertained orflirted with the idea of being
fisted before but then I have areally hot daddy like over me
with four fingers deep and he'sasking me Have you ever thought
about it?
And I was like not until now inthis way, you know It will shift
when you're with the rightperson the right environment and
while I haven't gotten there yetlike now that's like on my maybe
(32:01):
list when before it wasn'tbecause the right person brought
it up at the right time in thatright situation and all of a
sudden something opened like upin me like physically and
literally but I was about to sayliterally yes yeah literally but
like you know you never knowwhen you're open to trying like
for me at least like I'velearned in my real life I had so
many rules about what you canand can't do and that translated
(32:23):
to what I can and can't dosexually that Part of this new
version of me is sexually Idon't have these rules of what I
can and can't do.
I have probably not, maybe notbut there's always gonna be room
for compromise or room for me tobe surprised because, same thing
with my life, as long as I'mopen to be wrong, open to be
open to something new happening,it's gonna be a more exciting
Ralf (32:42):
ride.
Like, when it comes to kink,it's just exploring.
It's finding out what works andwith you and I recognize The kid
in the candy store in you fromwhen I started when I was 22, so
I'm old hat now.
But it is that like lust for it.
It's I didn't have to tryeverything.
(33:02):
Why limit myself?
And that's amazing.
And it's also, I hate beingcheesy, but it is that gift of
sobriety and clearness andbeing.
present and wanting to do thesethings.
So it's just so important.
And I'm so happy that you shareyour experiences on your
(33:23):
podcast.
Tell me a little bit about thepodcast you do.
Steve (33:26):
Sure, yeah, my podcast is called Gay A, which I thought
was hysterical when I got sober,because it's a pun on AA, but
gay.
But I also realized it makes itvery hard to find, and also if
you don't get it, you can neverget it.
The full title now is Gay A, TheQueer Sober Hero Show.
Searching queer and sober helpsyou find it a lot easier.
But it's a weekly podcast hasbeen coming out since my 90th
(33:50):
day of sobriety like I've hadover 200 episodes now So if you
love a good binge It's there foryou Every single week.
It's a mix of interviews as wellas topics So I try and when I'm
a new guest come on I'll havethem share their experience
strength and hope for 10 15minutes and I'll ask them
questions about it that come outof the conversation and then
(34:11):
I'll also the people who likeare really engaging and But also
engaging during the episode thelisteners love them and then
they engage like afterwards withsharing and stuff like that will
oftentimes come back on for liketopic episodes where they're
like, I want to talk about thistopic or that topic.
So that's a lot where I got intoa lot of sex, dating,
relationships, kink, that typeof stuff comes up because it's,
(34:31):
people come on and they werelike, okay, I've already done
the general here's how I gotsober.
And here's my life today.
What do we want to talk aboutnext?
And that's something that a lotof people like, really need to
hear about and there's room fordifferent perspectives on it.
The same way that there's I alsolove that.
It's the range of queer peoplethat I get.
So it's not only just, gay men,but it's I have trans people and
(34:51):
lesbians and I was trying tomake sure that my guests are as
rainbow and diverse as ourcommunity is to represent that.
When I got sober the purpose ofthat podcast, and I try and
always tell people we paint thatyou can go through traumatic
shit, like, when you share whathappened don't skip over the
dark stuff, because we've allgotten through it, but the main
focus of my show is about thepositive, amazing stuff that's
(35:12):
going on today in our lives,that's why it's the Sober Hero
Show, is because I thought thatmy life would be over when I got
sober, that's why I put it offfor so long, it's because I
thought it was game over you'dnever have fun again, but I'm
having more fun than I ever, Hadbefore, I'm having better sex
than I've ever had before, Ihave a healthier marriage than
I've ever had before, healthierfriendships Like in a community,
(35:33):
like my life is a thousand timesbetter In sobriety than it ever
was drinking and it's not evenme pretending anymore It's like
authentically better and that'sjust like a gift of being sober
But I try and show that topeople that if you can find my
podcast on YouTube Before earlyin sobriety like hang in there
And if you fall like if yourelapse like I try to also make
(35:54):
sure at least like half of myguests have relapses Part of
their story because it's notpart of mine yet But it's not
part of mine yet in part becauseof all my guests that are
constantly reminding me thatlike It's not better out there,
girl.
Don't do it.
But also at least they also havegiven me the strength where I
also do know that if it everdoes happen, I'll just come back
as soon as I can because thelonger that I'm out, it does, it
(36:14):
gets harder as well because we,who knows what might happen.
I've gotten so much strengthfrom my guests across the
different communities that ithelps show me other parts of
myself along the way.
Ralf (36:25):
I do find sometimes when I talk to people in early
recovery, it is it's a powerfulreminder of where I was at and I
don't want to go back to that.
Have I had wobbles?
Absolutely.
And I've been quite honest aboutthem and around clean time
birthdays.
It's tricky.
It's just keeping yourselfaccountable and speaking what's
(36:47):
in your head.
That's so important when youwant to keep sober, clear headed
and happy.
There is no light without thedark and we can, I can
definitely look back and some ofthe really dark situations and
that's ridiculous.
Why would I do that?
You have to have a sense ofhumor about it.
(37:07):
Because some of the situations Iput myself in, oh my God
Steve (37:11):
it's crazy.
Yeah, I try and just look ateverything with humor because
like it's so fucked up some ofit that if you're not like
Laughing you're gonna cry andlike I'd rather I'm the type
where I was like I've alwaysthought laughter was like an
easier way to deal with thingsthan crying It's partly
deflecting but also just like ingeneral like I'm like, how could
like some of the things I lookback on It's just like I must be
an alcoholic and it must be likea brain thing because I can so
(37:34):
smart and so So many other wayslike I but then when it comes to
like alcohol when it comes todrugs like I did some of the
stupidest and like even at timeslike alcohol drugs and like sex
and like kind of the triotogether like I did some of the
stupidest most like fucked upshit that no sane person like
sane whatever that looks likewould ever do and but then like
when I'm like but now like I'msober I would never do that and
(37:57):
I'm like but like even then Iwas like I thought that it was
fine the next morning like clearheaded or but it was like I
wasn't clear headed because Iwas still like an alcoholic that
wasn't dealing with my shit.
So it's just been great beingable to deal with the stuff that
comes up because one thing likeI thought when life when I got
sober was that all of a suddennothing bad would ever happen
again.
I've learned that also doesn'thappen like that's also not
(38:19):
true.
And just to keep going even whenthings don't do go wrong or you
get curveballs or hurricaneshappen.
Yeah, you, yeah,
Ralf (38:27):
you just have quite a few hurricanes in this state.
Quite scary stuff.
It's just important to be honestwhere you're at and what works
and so on.
I always say, always say topeople just There is the
relapsing of using drugs oralcohol, but you can also
mentally relapse, you can getinto old patterns or old fault
(38:48):
ways, or your brain startstelling you stories.
And I've definitely, in thatway, I've relapsed a couple of
times in the last seven years.
And that's where honesty isimportant to go, okay, this is
what I've done.
This is How it made me feel.
This is how I want to move onfrom it.
And what do I learn from it?
(39:08):
And that's important.
A lot of people get reallyashamed if they've engaged in,
not necessarily the action offull relapse, but just engaged
in some of those old behaviors.
And I'm just like, Like youmentioned earlier, it's not
about perfection.
It's just about being happy andthen leave the shit behind.
(39:29):
It's just much easier.
Steve (39:31):
I definitely had peaks and valleys in my sobriety where
thank God for batching contentwhere I'm able to interview and
like really work a program realhard with eight or nine awesome
interviews, because then if I dodisconnect and isolate for a
month and fall into some ofthat, like stinking thinking
that It's gonna get me introuble, like someone will snap
me out of it.
And but at the same time I'vebeen able to still have my
content be consistent, even ifmy sobriety hasn't always been
(39:54):
as great as it seems like on theoutside.
And again, that's like myperfectionist thing coming in
that I have to also feelcomfortable now that I've built
this community, like, when Istruggle to also not only be the
guy cheering everyone else on,but also be able to say I'm
struggling, help me.
And I haven't gotten there yet.
But One day, I know that's agoal that I need to work towards
because, yeah, it's hard for meto admit when I need help or
(40:16):
when I'm struggling.
And that's why during thehurricane I just took the week
off from social media, ratherthan even saying anything,
because I didn't want to sayanything sad or bad.
Even in sobriety, we still are,like, I know what I'm doing
isn't the healthiest behavior,but I still find myself doing it
if I'm not, aware of it.
I think
Ralf (40:33):
it's important acknowledging it that it does
happen and it's all it's not allperfection and it's not all
about figuring everything out inone go that comes down the line.
So since becoming kinky, sowhat's your favorite piece of
gear and what is The thing thatsurprised you the most.
Steve (40:55):
I would say my favorite piece of gear is what I'm
wearing right now.
It's, I got it from Mr.
S.
Leather.
So it's my first real leatherpiece that wasn't purchased off
of Amazon.
Where it can pass the sniff testat, when I go to Leather Pride
in Orlando.
Where they know it won't bebasically the Amazon Basics
version of leather.
It's definitely the piece that Iwork for this and I would say it
was just I learned like early onin sobriety that like when I
(41:19):
didn't have to worry aboutwhiskey dick that I am a pretty
good top as well, but like itwas like, I think it was like in
exploring my kink that learningthat I can be dominant was like,
it was like very surprising forme because my first time like
going through even like reallylike my biggest fears were like
how Dominant what I viewed asdominant like traits like
dominant though What I wouldconsider like I was afraid of
(41:41):
how dominant I could get likethat I could raise my voice that
I could get angry at times thatI could get here All these like
feelings that I tried associatedwith dominance that weren't
dominance They were like toxicbehaviors that I just got mixed
in from the way that I wasraised But having to separate
that and realize like that I canbe dominant without having to be
Those bad negative things andthat I like it and it's I think
(42:04):
it's fun and if I'm with someonewho like wants it, it's like
really fun.
And that was just surprisingbecause I very much had always
been, very submissive, it's likelittle sub Steve, and all of a
sudden now, like my two playpartners, I'm the dominant, like
top 80 to 90 percent of thetime.
(42:24):
I'm having like the best time ofmy life right now with it.
So it's just like a big changefrom where I was a year
Ralf (42:30):
or two ago.
I was about to say, if you'relistening to the podcast, you
won't be able to see it.
But if you're watching, youcould see a little twinkle in
Steve's eye when he's talkingabout dominating, which is
absolutely lovely because thatis also the twinkle I get
because it's the weird thing is.
I would never categorize myselfas being an alpha kind of type.
(42:50):
I'm probably more beta, really,if I'm honest.
So being the dominant in thebedroom is this like, is this
reversed of who I actually am inreal life.
And that's why I enjoy it.
Also, I think it's a little bitof a revenge on all the bullies
in my school.
To be honest
Steve (43:10):
Yeah, but like I also I love that i'm able to have that
twinkle in my eye and be presentright now Because like my one
partner has more leather andkink experience than me but even
like the other day they werelike you're making me feel like
i'm like a young kid who's likegood at sex again Because we're
able to like bounce off of eachother and enjoy it like that So
but that's the thing is likeI've learned in sobriety, and
(43:31):
especially with leather and kinkmy favorite part of these kink
scenes is after not only workingit out before and with the
communication, but just thatafterwards you can laugh about
her have that is fun.
I always enjoyed fun sex andI've been in so many encounters
where someone would be turnedoff by the fact that I might
giggle or laugh about something,but I'm, like, at the end of the
day it's fun.
Some of the shit that we'redoing in the bedroom is like
(43:53):
really freaky and like reallyawkward and really uncomfortable
and if you're jabbing it in atthe wrong angle like if I want
to giggle a little bit to dealwith the humor like if I'm you
know if there's a fumble here orthere's something awkward like a
little comic relief shouldn't belike a game over turn off and so
I love that.
Like in sobriety a lotespecially with kinky sober sex
(44:13):
that like a lot of the peoplethat i'm having sex with also
agree That like sex should befun like all of this should be
fun, even if we get even ifwe're pretending to be really
dominant and butch for The scenethat we're in and like when i'm
done with it I can go back tobeing like a little flamboyant
not to worry about what they'regoing to think of me because
there's the difference betweenwho I am and like, as a person,
what I am bringing to thebedroom at times.
(44:35):
And it's been really funexploring that.
It's
Ralf (44:37):
those dark and light nuances of one's personality and
what you find out you're intoand what it can bring up
emotionally.
And.
Some of it can be reallyhealing.
I've now found out in the lastyear or so I was diagnosed with
ADHD Two, three years ago, and Ifound out as a submissive my
brain goes quiet.
(44:59):
Yeah, I was just like, oh whoneeds wrestling?
I just, I'll just be atsomeone's boots.
Much easier.
Steve (45:05):
There you go.
Yeah, and see I've been with myADHD always very like in tune
with that side of things Butthere's just like also something
like I've known even like beforeexploring kink full I've had
partners where I'm like spankme.
I always knew I liked beingspanked Now that I have dealt
with the whole idea of ifsomeone is wanting me to spank
them, and they're consenting,and we learn how hard is too
(45:25):
hard, and this and that that Ilove the impact play of doing
that to someone else as well,which is something that I would
have been terrified for had Inot, because I was always afraid
what if, the what ifs of what ifI hurt someone, but now that
I've learned, I couldn't do thatwhen I was, like, drinking,
because you didn't have thatcommunication, but now that I
can have that communication andwork it out, I can explore it
safely I love that type ofstuff.
(45:47):
And again, it was like asurprise that I flipped what I
was expecting or what I've beenused to in sobriety, but it's a
beauty of being able to be clearand communicate with my
partners.
Ralf (45:58):
Just to take a complete U turn, you mentioned your failed
movie podcast earlier in theepisode.
I am a massive movie buff.
Steve (46:08):
So it still is up.
I pay the five bucks a month.
It's called a lifetime ofhappiness.
And again, like the titledoesn't even tell you it's about
movies, no one could find it.
And also every week was acompletely different genre.
So like you have to like reallyuniquely love what we love
specifically.
It's, but but again, there, wedid make it like 150, almost 200
(46:32):
episodes.
So like people can go through itnow and we'll get an email
saying, from Buzzsprout beinglike you got 50 downloads
because someone found like 50movies of the 150 that were
there because we do a lot ofhorror things like that where
they'll find chunks andsections, but it is very ADHD,
especially since it was twodifferent personalities were
like I choose a movie hechoosing movies so you could
(46:54):
tell that there was a battle ofwills at times.
Ralf (46:56):
Is your genre horror?
Is that what do you like?
Steve (46:59):
Both of us love bond over our love of horror.
We love all, everything horror.
We do the horror theme parks.
We do right now we're lovingDragula.
We love anything scary, spooky.
We love that.
But, I, my stuff, I've always,I'm born, In 86.
So a lot of my stuff that, likeif I call it a classic, it's
from like the nineties or ts andif he calls it a classic thing
(47:22):
that he's in his like midforties, it's from like the
early eighties or lateseventies.
And so we have that kind of,you'll see a lot of like cuts
from like the eighties where itwas like my first time being
exposed to this movie very much.
So me showing him something fromthe two thousands where he's I'm
so glad I missed this.
So it was some of these movieswere acts of love for the other,
but then also some we truly lovetogether.
(47:43):
So it's always a fun blend.
Ralf (47:45):
I guess as horror fans, it's, we also get a little bit
off on being scared.
And that's part of kink as well.
And also it makes it a hell of alot easier to find a costume for
Halloween.
Steve (47:57):
Yes.
Although I love all of thatmixing my gear with the
Halloween stuff.
My husband's that's thecheatingest cheating Halloween
thing ever.
Now, especially now that I'm inworse shape this year a joke
that I'm gonna go through isClausen.
Just the two weeks leading up toHalloween, just pictures of me
in my costumes with just a maskand a harness.
And he's that's not a costume.
You need makeup.
(48:18):
You need accessories.
And I was like, I could justwear a harness and a mask.
And he's that's not.
a real costume.
I said, we'll see what myfollowers think.
Ralf (48:25):
It's almost the gay version of the white girl's
bunny suit.
Steve (48:30):
Exactly.
Ralf (48:32):
That's what I'm doing next week.
I'm going to a birthday and it'sa Halloween birthday.
So I'm doing big boots, redboiler suit red eye contact
lenses and probably some rubber.
Steve (48:44):
Being new to kink, I'm learning that it's fucking
expensive, leather, so you gottaget that mileage out of it.
If we can at least use it forHalloween once a year, give us
the pass, please, because weinvest in enough where we don't
need to go out and buy anothercostume up for spending money on
leather.
So what is your favorite horrormovie, as we are on the topic?
My favorite my favorite horrorfranchise is the screen, the
(49:07):
screen movies, like all of thescreen movies I love, I would
say for sure.
We
Ralf (49:12):
can bin the last one, to be honest, but never mind that's
my view on it.
Oh, I hated it, absolutely hatedit.
But my favorite is A Nightmareon Elm Street.
Oh,
Steve (49:21):
yes, that's
Ralf (49:22):
also good.
Steve (49:23):
I love the first one.
Especially
Ralf (49:25):
I literally just got it on 4k desk.
So that will be watching forthis weekend.
I think
Steve (49:31):
and then Chucky.
I've fell in love with more withthe TV show putting all the
movies together.
I'm so upset that it wascanceled after the 3rd season.
But I have a new love of themovies after watching the show
for sure as well.
Ralf (49:44):
Oh, the show is so great.
It's made by gay man and it's soqueer coded, sometimes not so
queer coded.
Not very coded at all.
It's very queer.
And that's what I love about it.
And they have this villaincharacter that is actually quite
woke when it comes to the LGBTstuff.
And it's Oh, I just like killingpeople, but I'm not a monster.
(50:06):
So it's very important to haverepresentation, and I love the
horror and crossovers with LGBT,there's been so much of it, it's
the New York season of AmericanHorror Story was just, it was, I
thought it was art, I thought itwas so beautifully done.
It was horror, it was kink, youcan't go wrong with Russell
(50:28):
Tobey with a moustache.
And it was just so good, and itwas also beautifully done around
the AIDS crisis.
I thought it was, like, aperfect season.
Steve (50:40):
I enjoyed the beginning part of the season.
The ending was just a little toocerebral for me, but I like my
slashers a little more slashery,
Ralf (50:49):
I'll put Texas Chainsaw Massacre 2 on for you.
Alright, sounds good.
It's a date.
But we're coming to the end ofthe episode.
It's absolutely been a joy tohave you on.
If there's any piece of adviceyou would give to someone in
early recovery, what would itbe?
Steve (51:07):
I would say that it's never too late to try something
new.
I certainly, especially in earlyrecovery, take time to heal.
I'm glad that I took that firstyear to really learn how to
function as a normal human.
Because I didn't know how to dothat before.
I grew up being, like, thinkingeveryone got the handbook of,
like, how to be a normal personthe day that I was, like, sick
with mono in school.
I didn't get it.
(51:28):
But after that challengeyourself because I thought
sobriety and about life ingeneral was about building a
comfortable life I learnedespecially like through kink
like I'm like being challengedto be uncomfortable through kink
that that same Beinguncomfortable a little bit in
real life as well pushingyourself being a little afraid
but doing it anyway, and ifyou're finding yourself like in
(51:49):
this kind of Circle findingsomething to push yourself out
so that you keep moving forwardYou That's been something that I
had never explored so much of mysexuality until my sobriety, and
even then it took me some timeinto sobriety to have the
confidence to be able toactually go for it.
But I now that I have all theseyears ahead of me, I have plenty
of time to make up for losttime, and I will, trust me.
(52:11):
But it's not just the lessonsthat I've learned in the
bedroom, but taking that outsideto be, like, Always push
yourself like don't get into arut don't get into a routine
because I thought that was goingto be the definition of a
perfect life of my perfect lifeis always moving forward now
always figuring out what my nextkind of competition or obstacle
or marathon or thing I'm goingto do to challenge myself
because that's what I'm doingbetter if I get Thank you.
(52:35):
bored, I get lazy, and then Iget complacent, and then my
sobriety's at risk.
So I'd much rather keep movingforward.
Ralf (52:42):
Fantastic.
And if anyone's listened orwatched, and they connected with
something you said, where canthey get a hold of you?
Steve (52:49):
You can find a whole bunch more of me and my guests
on my show, Gay A Podcast.
So that's on Instagram, as wellas on all podcast players at Gay
A Podcast.
And then I try and keep thatjust to more just Sobriety, if
you want more of just me as aperson.
I'm also at JustSteveSRQ, that'sthe airport code for Sarasota.
So it's at JustSteveSRQ for mypersonal page.
(53:11):
That's where I'll do more likemy leather stuff and my, like my
little slutty stories and stuff.
Ralf (53:17):
Fantastic.
Fantastic.
Thank you very much for comingon.
Yeah.
Thank you so much for having me.
And that was Steve, and this wasthe first episode of season
eight, and it's been absolutelya joy to talk to you about his
journey into sobriety and hisjourney into kinkness.
And I'm so excited for what'sgoing to happen, and hopefully
I'll see him sometime over inAmerica when I get over there.
(53:39):
But until then, stay kinky, staysober, and play safe.
Bye!
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