October 31, 2024 • 22 mins
Hey there, super sober heroes! 🦸🏽♂️ This week on Gay A, Sober Steve is thrilled to welcome back a fan-favorite guest and globetrotter, Frankie New! Steve and Frankie dive into a topic close to Frankie's heart: Traveling in Sobriety.
In This Episode: Join Steve and Frankie as they discuss the unique adventures and perspectives that come with sober travel. From finding queer-friendly destinations and the occasional surprise doll museum to embracing the joy of being fully present in each moment, Frankie shares insights on the empowering freedom that sobriety brings to his journeys. Here’s what else to look forward to:
- 🎒 Sober Travel Tips: How to stay grounded, prioritize safety, and find enjoyment—wherever in the world you are.
- 🌏 Navigating Different Cultures: Frankie's experiences with queer and sober spaces across continents and why he feels more comfortable than ever traveling solo.
- 💫 Rediscovering Fun and Connection: How being sober has allowed Frankie to connect more deeply with the places he visits and the people he meets.
Follow Frankie on Instagram and TikTok at @FashionQueerHistorian to keep up with his latest journeys and fascinating research!
Follow Us Here, and on all the Socials @gAyApodcast
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Steve (00:03):
Hey there, it's Sober Steve, the podcast guy, and
welcome to Gay A, the QueerSober Hero Show.
I am here with 1, 238 DaysSober, and welcoming back friend
and family of the pod, Frankie,welcome back!
Frank (00:20):
Hello! Good to be back.
Thank you for having me again.
Steve (00:24):
Yes, you are, like I mentioned, family at this point
to me, because you've been on awhole bunch, but us alcoholics
also forget, so whether someoneforgot who you were or they're
newer to the show, why don't youintroduce yourself to people?
Frank (00:36):
Sure! Frankie here, based in New York.
I just celebrated 13 years inSeptember.
A little over 13 years now soberand grateful to be here.
Steve (00:50):
Yeah.
I am grateful to have you backon.
And this week we'll be havingthe focus on travel because of
you being on the show, I followyou and keep up with all of your
adventures and you've been allaround the world.
So tell me like what's been newsince your last guest spot,
which I think has been at thispoint, almost about.
(01:11):
I'm horrible with podcast timingand magic, but it feels like
it's been almost a year.
Frank (01:15):
Yes, I think so.
It was around the end of theyear when we recorded last
talking about beingentrepreneurs.
And you were talking about yourbusiness ventures as well,
venturing out.
And yeah, it's been I feel likeit's been a whirlwind since that
point in a lot of the best ways.
(01:37):
I am still freelancing full timemostly, but I'm also officially
back in school full time.
I actually just hit the sixmonth point on that, which is
wild to think.
And yeah, this year just seemsto be flying by.
Yeah, very much in theentrepreneur spirit and
(01:59):
adventures of traveling.
I had the opportunity to headover to London in April to
present at a conference.
And then from there I traveledfrom London to Wellington, New
Zealand which took about 35hours.
Wow.
It's going to school on theother side of the world is quite
(02:22):
the adventure.
Steve (02:24):
I can only imagine, and I can say that because I have not
traveled much, so yeah, thatthis will certainly be fun to
get into.
So with all of your adventures,and like especially reflecting
back on the past year, whatwould you say is your favorite
part of being sober today?
Frank (02:41):
Favorite part of being sober and getting the chance to
travel so much in the last yearis traveling.
And it's really that being soberallows me to be 100 percent
present I am someone that, like,when I travel, I tend to travel
alone and I like to soak upevery single minute when I am in
(03:04):
a place.
I am someone that can be a nightowl and back at it pretty early
in the morning on the adventure,checking out everything.
Steve (03:16):
Yeah, I definitely love that in sobriety you get to be
both a morning person and anight person and they don't
conflict with each other on aphysical level.
Frank (03:25):
Yes.
And I can fully remembereverything that I did.
Steve (03:29):
Yeah, and also looking at your life today, what would you
say is your favorite part ofbeing a member of the queer
community?
Frank (03:37):
Being a part of the queer community is really great.
For me being a part of it isalso where my research is rooted
in my PhD studies is rooted inqueer studies.
I'm able to shine a light.
Further within the queercommunity on these stories
around doll play and things ofthat I'm focusing on in my
(03:59):
research thesis.
So that makes me very happy tobe not only a part of the queer
community, but also bringing tolight particular stories that
feel very important to be heard.
Steve (04:12):
Yeah I definitely love and admire that about you about
just like how you're vocal aboutthe things you're passionate
about and history is alwayssomething that was never really
fun for me in school.
But I'm learning like I lovequeer history and like
interesting fun history or giveme history as something
interesting but it's just, itwas the school history that
wasn't so That's as much mything, but, I remember watching
(04:34):
like the book of Queer on HBOMax and I was like, Oh, I love
this type of stuff when it'slike fun history.
Frank (04:40):
Yes, exactly.
There's so many facets ofhistory, I too was not a big fan
of what was forced upon if youwill, within schools and such.
There's just so much morefascinating facets of history,
and for me, like my obsession isdolls, but from a queer lens.
(05:02):
Not only looking at the historyof queer dolls, but looking at
how as queer individuals weinteract with dolls and things
of that world.
Steve (05:12):
I love that.
And especially, I know that alot of my listeners are going to
be American.
We can know how Americans viewdolls with gender in America,
but especially with all yourtravels and your studies about
different cultures, there areany cultures where the way that
they treat gender, sexuality,and dolls has surprised you?
Frank (05:29):
I would say I haven't really come across any wild
surprises I would say thatanother thing too that's just
crazy is the fact that I've hadthe opportunity to travel the
world and talk about, queerBarbie and queer doll history to
me is wild in itself.
Like never in a million years,if you told me 15 years ago, I
(05:52):
would be doing this travelingthe world going to conferences
and talking about queer Barbie Iwould have said you were crazy.
It's a really pinch me kind oflife and I don't take any of it
for granted.
I find that a lot of timesespecially within Barbie history
there tends to be a very Onesided view of this doll's
(06:14):
history.
Feedback I get from conferencesis that a lot of people are
surprised to hear about thisangle from Queer Lens and it's
such a it's such a vastbackground, not just in terms of
queer doll history, but alsowithin my studies I'm focusing
on looking at the interactionsthat queer individuals had with
(06:36):
dolls as a kid.
So many of us had to play withdolls in secret due to a lot of
toxic masculine ideals that wereshoved upon many of us and this
notion that playing with dollswill make you gay the funny
thing is for myself and some ofthe interviewees that I've had
it's Don't play with dollsbecause that will make you gay,
but here, play with this GI Joe,that will make you gay, and it's
(06:59):
muscled and usually in a uniformwhich opens a whole nother can
of worms.
Steve (07:06):
Yeah, I definitely can relate to that because I see on
the internet about like how likethe 80s are wild with like
cartoons but you'll see justlike leather daddies on like He
Man and like some of the subtexton some of that and that was
like the straight masculinestuff but God forbid you played
with Barbies.
Frank (07:22):
So it is interesting.
Yeah so it's such a fascinatingtwist.
But yeah, it's really been awild ride having these
opportunities to present myresearch and now getting the
chance to study full time inWellington, New Zealand and the
adventures that I had over thelast year.
(07:44):
So I got to go down to NewZealand for six weeks to begin
the program and so I traveledfrom London, and there was
London to Shanghai, and thenShanghai to Auckland, New
Zealand.
And then, while I was overthere, so I seem to have this
knack for finding doll museumsin the weirdest places.
(08:06):
And so I travelled over toMelbourne, Australia when I was
down under.
And there is a doll museum inthe middle of nowhere.
It's right outside ish ofMelbourne.
And it's just a random one roomdoll museum that's curated by
one individual, seems like maybea passion project.
(08:28):
And it's, yeah, and it's just inthe middle of nowhere.
And and then recently I took atrip to Montreal for the weekend
and I came across this on Googleand it was listed as a permanent
Barbie museum.
So I was like, Oh, that soundsfascinating.
And so I went to Montreal tocheck that out for the most
(08:49):
part.
And once I realized, like, whereit was, it means any word of
museum is, really, it's it'sliterally in a kind of like a
mall, but it's like anentertainment mall.
And there's like various I don'tknow, it looks like there might
have been like a casinosomewhere in there, and there
(09:09):
were other like kid orientedgames, and then there was this
room on the third level that waslike this Barbie exhibition.
And it was just literally a roomof dolls surrounded around the
room like encases.
There was actually, there was noemployees or any of that and it
(09:30):
was just like little placards ofwhat, the doll was.
So yeah that's been interestingon my travels, these sort of
like random doll museums in themiddle of nowhere.
Steve (09:42):
I love that.
And being that you're travelingnow, has that been something
that, is new in sobriety aswell, or what was your
relationship like with travelingaround when you were growing up?
Frank (09:54):
Traveling, I would say I really did not do a lot of with
something that I was not reallyexposed to, or having a family
that had the money to be able totravel growing up generally so I
grew up in New Orleans.
And for the most part any placethat we went was via a car.
So it was like going to Biloxior going to Memphis.
(10:17):
I had relatives that lived inMemphis as a kid.
So it was generally like in thatscope in which we stayed.
And it really wasn't into mythirties and into writing when I
really started traveling and itwas actually my ex husband that
I can thank for planting thattravel bug in me because the
(10:40):
first time that I traveledabroad was accompanying my ex on
a trip to Paris.
And it really started there.
And I was on that first trip.
I've just been hungry to do moreand I've had great opportunities
to travel.
And this year I got to feel alot of Europe that I haven't had
(11:03):
the chance to presented at aconference in Talon in Estonia
in July.
And so I flew into Helsinki.
And I spent about a day and ahalf in Helsinki, and then took
a ferry over to Tallinn and thenafter the conference, I flew
into Prague, and from Prague, Itrained all the way to London.
(11:27):
So I took the train from Pragueto Berlin to Cologne to
Amsterdam to Antwerp, and thenAntwerp to London over the
course of 19 days.
Steve (11:36):
Wow.
Yeah, that's a lot.
I know that it's one of thosethings where my husband and I
even before we got married weresaying, Oh, we'll get our
passports.
Once we get married, because weknew the name change was going
to happen, but we've beenmarried for eight years now and
we haven't even gotten ourpassports yet.
So like we've traveled like inthe States, some places, like
we've done, we've gone to Vegas,which like, I think will be more
fun to try again, sober.
(11:57):
Cause that was right before mysobriety.
But like I, and now in sobriety,I've gotten to even go out to
California, which was like myfirst time on the West coast.
So I'm seeing more of America inmy sobriety than I've ever
really seen before, but I stillhave in trouble outside of
California.
And you know what?
Like you said, you started tofor someone else or like that
first time, but what was thatfirst experience like traveling
(12:19):
that kind of made you be like, Iwant to keep doing this.
Frank (12:23):
I really think it's just something about getting out of
the U.
S.
And seeing a whole nother way ofliving and in history that you
just don't see here America isvery young compared to a lot of
other places in the world,especially when you visit a
place like Rome and how far backthe history goes there.
(12:48):
And yeah, it's just a verydifferent perspective and I
find, especially within Europeancountries the energies of a lot
of the places I've been it'squite different places,
especially like Amsterdam, it'sjust so much, It's just so free.
There's so much freedom there ina different way that you
(13:08):
experience in the US.
And I think that's one of themain things that I enjoy is that
open mindedness that you get ina lot of other places that you
don't really get as much here inthe US where it's really less
about labels.
I feel like in the U.
S.
So much emphasis is put onlabels and, how you identify and
(13:30):
things like that.
And traveling abroad in a lot ofplaces no one really cares about
labels so much.
It's just being who you are.
That's really, the vibes that Iget, which I really enjoy.
And being someone who has alwaysworn their queerness on their
(13:52):
sleeve I'm very hyper aware whenI travel because it's one thing
when you're wearing the thing inthe club, wearing the sexy
outfit or, things of that, butwhat does that look like when
you leave the club?
It.
3, 4 o'clock in the morning, andyou're going back to your hotel.
Those are things that I'm alwaysvery hyper aware of when I
travel and looking for, in termsof safety and being comfortable.
Steve (14:17):
Where have you been most comfortable with that?
Frank (14:20):
Oh, I would say one of my favorite places in sobriety has
been Puerto Vallarta.
I've been there twice now, and Iabsolutely love the energy there
in the city.
And it's very much a place whereI feel comfortable walking about
(14:40):
in almost anything.
Very little of anything, if youwill and it's a very
entertaining place and beingsober.
I have a blast I've traveled inthere with a friend who is not
sober more of a social drinkerand he always comments on how a
lot of times I will stay outmuch later than he will, and
(15:02):
then still be up at 8.
30 in the morning for breakfast.
Steve (15:07):
Yes.
Yep.
That'll happen.
Frank (15:08):
But yeah a lot of times I don't know where I always get my
energy from, but I am all forjust living every single day to
the fullest.
Absolute fullest, which issomething that we've, talked
about before.
And when I was coming back tothe States from Australia in the
spring I had a layover inHonolulu and it was about an
(15:31):
eight hour layover.
I wore my swimsuit underneath myclothes and we landed, I think
at five 30 in the morning,checked my bags into the evening
flight.
And then took a cab to thebeach, and I spent Almost the
entire eight hours, just roamingthe island.
(15:52):
And again, just soaking up everysingle minute.
A good friend of mine who livedin Hawaii briefly had gave me
the tip that the airport,especially when you're traveling
within the U S tends to be veryeasy to get through.
And I have TSA pre check and shetold me to get to the airport
about 20, 25 minutes.
(16:14):
Before my flight.
And she was like, you won't havea problem.
And initially I was nervous.
I was like, you know what?
We're going to go with it.
And I did, and sure enough, Imade it to the gate with
probably eight or so minutesspare.
Steve (16:28):
Yeah, I would trust and do that, but my parents would
just be rolling over.
They're alive, so they wouldjust be rolling over their house
down 20 minutes south from me,but they would be mortified
because they were very muchtrained me.
If you go anywhere, evendomestically, because we never
traveled internationally, evendomestically, they're like,
they're the type of guy, they'refour or five hours in advance.
Frank (16:45):
Oh, yeah.
Yes.
Yeah, but, and also, I think,too talking about traveling
within the U.
S.
I feel like that is greatexperience to just getting
comfortable with moving aboutand, getting in airplanes
especially thinking aboutplanning larger trips.
To out of the country travelingabout the U.
(17:07):
S.
can be great practice for muchlarger trips in terms of flying.
And two, next time you're inVegas, I recommend checking out
the Neon Museum.
Steve (17:19):
Yes, I was there when I went, and I do remember that
because it was early enough inthe day.
So that was fun.
Yes.
When we went there there waslike a Tim Burton thing going on
there where it was likeshowcasing all of his work.
And it was, Oh,
Frank (17:31):
nice.
I think they just moved into anew space too.
Steve (17:35):
Nice.
We talked about like the prosand like the benefits of the
awesome places you've traveled.
Where has been the hardestplaces to travel either in terms
of being comfortable with yoursexuality or maybe that were
difficult for your sobriety?
Frank (17:47):
I feel like I was very much on my toes when I was in
Estonia.
And I think it's definitely, soI use the sort of there's like a
meter that you can look at thatsort of gauges the queerness of
like certain areas, so you couldlook at that, like before you
travel, especially in likeEuropean countries to gauge like
(18:08):
how friendly a place may be.
So if I remember correctly thegauge was like smaller, but
where I was in Tallinn seemedoverall like pretty queer
friendly.
There are gay bars and things ofthat there, but I feel like.
The language barrier cansometimes be a challenge,
especially with findingmeetings, things of that.
(18:31):
But I feel like in thatparticular place, I was very
much, aware of my surroundings alot of times, just making sure
that while I was being aware ofwhat was happening around me and
not being mindful of not beingabsorbed into my phone which I
feel tends to happen a lot when,if you're traveling and you just
(18:51):
will see people just staringinto their phones I try to avoid
that.
And just being aware, of mysurroundings.
Steve (19:00):
Yeah, and you mentioned that you prefer traveling alone.
How has traveling with peoplebeen different sober than maybe
it was before sobriety?
Frank (19:12):
I have had some really great travel buddies, and I do
sometimes enjoy it.
I feel that if you're travelingwith someone, I think it's
important to understand eachother's travel dynamic.
I think that's really important.
Like I am someone that I can goall day, take a little cat nap
(19:36):
and go out for the evening.
I think it's really pairing upwith someone who matches your
energy in that regard.
I think that's the mostimportant part if you're
traveling with someone justmaking sure that you're on the
same page.
Otherwise, it may be a littlenot quite as enjoyable, perhaps,
(19:56):
if one would rather hang out inthe hotel.
For me, when it comes to hotels,I look for safety, making sure
that the hotel is safe and thebed is comfortable, like those
two are the most importantthings for me otherwise to me,
the hotel is just a place Isleep for a few hours I'm not
looking to usually hang out atthe hotel, but I think things
(20:16):
like that are important ifyou're traveling with someone
because, other people staying ina more kept up hotel might be
important, so I think it's justcovering all those things before
you dive into a trip.
Steve (20:28):
Yeah, makes sense.
And any last minute tips ortricks for sober traveling?
Frank (20:35):
Last minute tips.
I would say just do it.
If you've got the chance to getout and venture I highly
recommend it.
That is very much one of mygoals.
So like when I turned 40, Iturned my life upside down,
became a nomad and have madetraveling my inspiration and
(20:58):
passion for my 40s.
And life is precious.
And I just, continue to saydon't take anything for granted.
Just take the opportunity andgo.
If you've got the chance totravel, do it.
Steve (21:12):
Excellent.
I will try and take your adviceand travel soon.
If someone wanted to follow youon all of your traveling
adventures, how would they dothat?
Frank (21:21):
Sure.
So I am on Instagram and TikTokunder Fashion Queer Historian.
So that is a recent change.
So if you're following me beforeat Man Your Style, I recently
updated the handles to reflectwhere I'm at.
Now professionally.
So at Fashion Queer Historian onboth TikTok and Instagram.
Steve (21:46):
Excellent.
I'll include that over in theshow notes so you all can just
swipe on up and listen.
But thank you as always,Frankie.
It's always a pleasure.
Frank (21:53):
Great to see you again and to be here.
Thank you for having me.
Steve (21:59):
Yes, and thank you listeners for tuning in to
another episode of Gay A.
Make sure you're following soyou can get new episodes every
Thursday and leave a review.
If you love the episode andfound it helpful, it'll make it
easier for other alcoholics andaddicts to find it as well.
And until next time, stay sober.
Hey there, it's Sober Steve, the podcast guy, and
welcome to Gay A, the QueerSober Hero Show.
I am here with 1, 238 DaysSober, and welcoming back friend
and family of the pod, Frankie,welcome back!
Frank (00:20):
Hello! Good to be back.
Thank you for having me again.
Steve (00:24):
Yes, you are, like I mentioned, family at this point
to me, because you've been on awhole bunch, but us alcoholics
also forget, so whether someoneforgot who you were or they're
newer to the show, why don't youintroduce yourself to people?
Frank (00:36):
Sure! Frankie here, based in New York.
I just celebrated 13 years inSeptember.
A little over 13 years now soberand grateful to be here.
Steve (00:50):
Yeah.
I am grateful to have you backon.
And this week we'll be havingthe focus on travel because of
you being on the show, I followyou and keep up with all of your
adventures and you've been allaround the world.
So tell me like what's been newsince your last guest spot,
which I think has been at thispoint, almost about.
(01:11):
I'm horrible with podcast timingand magic, but it feels like
it's been almost a year.
Frank (01:15):
Yes, I think so.
It was around the end of theyear when we recorded last
talking about beingentrepreneurs.
And you were talking about yourbusiness ventures as well,
venturing out.
And yeah, it's been I feel likeit's been a whirlwind since that
point in a lot of the best ways.
(01:37):
I am still freelancing full timemostly, but I'm also officially
back in school full time.
I actually just hit the sixmonth point on that, which is
wild to think.
And yeah, this year just seemsto be flying by.
Yeah, very much in theentrepreneur spirit and
(01:59):
adventures of traveling.
I had the opportunity to headover to London in April to
present at a conference.
And then from there I traveledfrom London to Wellington, New
Zealand which took about 35hours.
Wow.
It's going to school on theother side of the world is quite
(02:22):
the adventure.
Steve (02:24):
I can only imagine, and I can say that because I have not
traveled much, so yeah, thatthis will certainly be fun to
get into.
So with all of your adventures,and like especially reflecting
back on the past year, whatwould you say is your favorite
part of being sober today?
Frank (02:41):
Favorite part of being sober and getting the chance to
travel so much in the last yearis traveling.
And it's really that being soberallows me to be 100 percent
present I am someone that, like,when I travel, I tend to travel
alone and I like to soak upevery single minute when I am in
(03:04):
a place.
I am someone that can be a nightowl and back at it pretty early
in the morning on the adventure,checking out everything.
Steve (03:16):
Yeah, I definitely love that in sobriety you get to be
both a morning person and anight person and they don't
conflict with each other on aphysical level.
Frank (03:25):
Yes.
And I can fully remembereverything that I did.
Steve (03:29):
Yeah, and also looking at your life today, what would you
say is your favorite part ofbeing a member of the queer
community?
Frank (03:37):
Being a part of the queer community is really great.
For me being a part of it isalso where my research is rooted
in my PhD studies is rooted inqueer studies.
I'm able to shine a light.
Further within the queercommunity on these stories
around doll play and things ofthat I'm focusing on in my
(03:59):
research thesis.
So that makes me very happy tobe not only a part of the queer
community, but also bringing tolight particular stories that
feel very important to be heard.
Steve (04:12):
Yeah I definitely love and admire that about you about
just like how you're vocal aboutthe things you're passionate
about and history is alwayssomething that was never really
fun for me in school.
But I'm learning like I lovequeer history and like
interesting fun history or giveme history as something
interesting but it's just, itwas the school history that
wasn't so That's as much mything, but, I remember watching
(04:34):
like the book of Queer on HBOMax and I was like, Oh, I love
this type of stuff when it'slike fun history.
Frank (04:40):
Yes, exactly.
There's so many facets ofhistory, I too was not a big fan
of what was forced upon if youwill, within schools and such.
There's just so much morefascinating facets of history,
and for me, like my obsession isdolls, but from a queer lens.
(05:02):
Not only looking at the historyof queer dolls, but looking at
how as queer individuals weinteract with dolls and things
of that world.
Steve (05:12):
I love that.
And especially, I know that alot of my listeners are going to
be American.
We can know how Americans viewdolls with gender in America,
but especially with all yourtravels and your studies about
different cultures, there areany cultures where the way that
they treat gender, sexuality,and dolls has surprised you?
Frank (05:29):
I would say I haven't really come across any wild
surprises I would say thatanother thing too that's just
crazy is the fact that I've hadthe opportunity to travel the
world and talk about, queerBarbie and queer doll history to
me is wild in itself.
Like never in a million years,if you told me 15 years ago, I
(05:52):
would be doing this travelingthe world going to conferences
and talking about queer Barbie Iwould have said you were crazy.
It's a really pinch me kind oflife and I don't take any of it
for granted.
I find that a lot of timesespecially within Barbie history
there tends to be a very Onesided view of this doll's
(06:14):
history.
Feedback I get from conferencesis that a lot of people are
surprised to hear about thisangle from Queer Lens and it's
such a it's such a vastbackground, not just in terms of
queer doll history, but alsowithin my studies I'm focusing
on looking at the interactionsthat queer individuals had with
(06:36):
dolls as a kid.
So many of us had to play withdolls in secret due to a lot of
toxic masculine ideals that wereshoved upon many of us and this
notion that playing with dollswill make you gay the funny
thing is for myself and some ofthe interviewees that I've had
it's Don't play with dollsbecause that will make you gay,
but here, play with this GI Joe,that will make you gay, and it's
(06:59):
muscled and usually in a uniformwhich opens a whole nother can
of worms.
Steve (07:06):
Yeah, I definitely can relate to that because I see on
the internet about like how likethe 80s are wild with like
cartoons but you'll see justlike leather daddies on like He
Man and like some of the subtexton some of that and that was
like the straight masculinestuff but God forbid you played
with Barbies.
Frank (07:22):
So it is interesting.
Yeah so it's such a fascinatingtwist.
But yeah, it's really been awild ride having these
opportunities to present myresearch and now getting the
chance to study full time inWellington, New Zealand and the
adventures that I had over thelast year.
(07:44):
So I got to go down to NewZealand for six weeks to begin
the program and so I traveledfrom London, and there was
London to Shanghai, and thenShanghai to Auckland, New
Zealand.
And then, while I was overthere, so I seem to have this
knack for finding doll museumsin the weirdest places.
(08:06):
And so I travelled over toMelbourne, Australia when I was
down under.
And there is a doll museum inthe middle of nowhere.
It's right outside ish ofMelbourne.
And it's just a random one roomdoll museum that's curated by
one individual, seems like maybea passion project.
(08:28):
And it's, yeah, and it's just inthe middle of nowhere.
And and then recently I took atrip to Montreal for the weekend
and I came across this on Googleand it was listed as a permanent
Barbie museum.
So I was like, Oh, that soundsfascinating.
And so I went to Montreal tocheck that out for the most
(08:49):
part.
And once I realized, like, whereit was, it means any word of
museum is, really, it's it'sliterally in a kind of like a
mall, but it's like anentertainment mall.
And there's like various I don'tknow, it looks like there might
have been like a casinosomewhere in there, and there
(09:09):
were other like kid orientedgames, and then there was this
room on the third level that waslike this Barbie exhibition.
And it was just literally a roomof dolls surrounded around the
room like encases.
There was actually, there was noemployees or any of that and it
(09:30):
was just like little placards ofwhat, the doll was.
So yeah that's been interestingon my travels, these sort of
like random doll museums in themiddle of nowhere.
Steve (09:42):
I love that.
And being that you're travelingnow, has that been something
that, is new in sobriety aswell, or what was your
relationship like with travelingaround when you were growing up?
Frank (09:54):
Traveling, I would say I really did not do a lot of with
something that I was not reallyexposed to, or having a family
that had the money to be able totravel growing up generally so I
grew up in New Orleans.
And for the most part any placethat we went was via a car.
So it was like going to Biloxior going to Memphis.
(10:17):
I had relatives that lived inMemphis as a kid.
So it was generally like in thatscope in which we stayed.
And it really wasn't into mythirties and into writing when I
really started traveling and itwas actually my ex husband that
I can thank for planting thattravel bug in me because the
(10:40):
first time that I traveledabroad was accompanying my ex on
a trip to Paris.
And it really started there.
And I was on that first trip.
I've just been hungry to do moreand I've had great opportunities
to travel.
And this year I got to feel alot of Europe that I haven't had
(11:03):
the chance to presented at aconference in Talon in Estonia
in July.
And so I flew into Helsinki.
And I spent about a day and ahalf in Helsinki, and then took
a ferry over to Tallinn and thenafter the conference, I flew
into Prague, and from Prague, Itrained all the way to London.
(11:27):
So I took the train from Pragueto Berlin to Cologne to
Amsterdam to Antwerp, and thenAntwerp to London over the
course of 19 days.
Steve (11:36):
Wow.
Yeah, that's a lot.
I know that it's one of thosethings where my husband and I
even before we got married weresaying, Oh, we'll get our
passports.
Once we get married, because weknew the name change was going
to happen, but we've beenmarried for eight years now and
we haven't even gotten ourpassports yet.
So like we've traveled like inthe States, some places, like
we've done, we've gone to Vegas,which like, I think will be more
fun to try again, sober.
(11:57):
Cause that was right before mysobriety.
But like I, and now in sobriety,I've gotten to even go out to
California, which was like myfirst time on the West coast.
So I'm seeing more of America inmy sobriety than I've ever
really seen before, but I stillhave in trouble outside of
California.
And you know what?
Like you said, you started tofor someone else or like that
first time, but what was thatfirst experience like traveling
(12:19):
that kind of made you be like, Iwant to keep doing this.
Frank (12:23):
I really think it's just something about getting out of
the U.
S.
And seeing a whole nother way ofliving and in history that you
just don't see here America isvery young compared to a lot of
other places in the world,especially when you visit a
place like Rome and how far backthe history goes there.
(12:48):
And yeah, it's just a verydifferent perspective and I
find, especially within Europeancountries the energies of a lot
of the places I've been it'squite different places,
especially like Amsterdam, it'sjust so much, It's just so free.
There's so much freedom there ina different way that you
(13:08):
experience in the US.
And I think that's one of themain things that I enjoy is that
open mindedness that you get ina lot of other places that you
don't really get as much here inthe US where it's really less
about labels.
I feel like in the U.
S.
So much emphasis is put onlabels and, how you identify and
(13:30):
things like that.
And traveling abroad in a lot ofplaces no one really cares about
labels so much.
It's just being who you are.
That's really, the vibes that Iget, which I really enjoy.
And being someone who has alwaysworn their queerness on their
(13:52):
sleeve I'm very hyper aware whenI travel because it's one thing
when you're wearing the thing inthe club, wearing the sexy
outfit or, things of that, butwhat does that look like when
you leave the club?
It.
3, 4 o'clock in the morning, andyou're going back to your hotel.
Those are things that I'm alwaysvery hyper aware of when I
travel and looking for, in termsof safety and being comfortable.
Steve (14:17):
Where have you been most comfortable with that?
Frank (14:20):
Oh, I would say one of my favorite places in sobriety has
been Puerto Vallarta.
I've been there twice now, and Iabsolutely love the energy there
in the city.
And it's very much a place whereI feel comfortable walking about
(14:40):
in almost anything.
Very little of anything, if youwill and it's a very
entertaining place and beingsober.
I have a blast I've traveled inthere with a friend who is not
sober more of a social drinkerand he always comments on how a
lot of times I will stay outmuch later than he will, and
(15:02):
then still be up at 8.
30 in the morning for breakfast.
Steve (15:07):
Yes.
Yep.
That'll happen.
Frank (15:08):
But yeah a lot of times I don't know where I always get my
energy from, but I am all forjust living every single day to
the fullest.
Absolute fullest, which issomething that we've, talked
about before.
And when I was coming back tothe States from Australia in the
spring I had a layover inHonolulu and it was about an
(15:31):
eight hour layover.
I wore my swimsuit underneath myclothes and we landed, I think
at five 30 in the morning,checked my bags into the evening
flight.
And then took a cab to thebeach, and I spent Almost the
entire eight hours, just roamingthe island.
(15:52):
And again, just soaking up everysingle minute.
A good friend of mine who livedin Hawaii briefly had gave me
the tip that the airport,especially when you're traveling
within the U S tends to be veryeasy to get through.
And I have TSA pre check and shetold me to get to the airport
about 20, 25 minutes.
(16:14):
Before my flight.
And she was like, you won't havea problem.
And initially I was nervous.
I was like, you know what?
We're going to go with it.
And I did, and sure enough, Imade it to the gate with
probably eight or so minutesspare.
Steve (16:28):
Yeah, I would trust and do that, but my parents would
just be rolling over.
They're alive, so they wouldjust be rolling over their house
down 20 minutes south from me,but they would be mortified
because they were very muchtrained me.
If you go anywhere, evendomestically, because we never
traveled internationally, evendomestically, they're like,
they're the type of guy, they'refour or five hours in advance.
Frank (16:45):
Oh, yeah.
Yes.
Yeah, but, and also, I think,too talking about traveling
within the U.
S.
I feel like that is greatexperience to just getting
comfortable with moving aboutand, getting in airplanes
especially thinking aboutplanning larger trips.
To out of the country travelingabout the U.
(17:07):
S.
can be great practice for muchlarger trips in terms of flying.
And two, next time you're inVegas, I recommend checking out
the Neon Museum.
Steve (17:19):
Yes, I was there when I went, and I do remember that
because it was early enough inthe day.
So that was fun.
Yes.
When we went there there waslike a Tim Burton thing going on
there where it was likeshowcasing all of his work.
And it was, Oh,
Frank (17:31):
nice.
I think they just moved into anew space too.
Steve (17:35):
Nice.
We talked about like the prosand like the benefits of the
awesome places you've traveled.
Where has been the hardestplaces to travel either in terms
of being comfortable with yoursexuality or maybe that were
difficult for your sobriety?
Frank (17:47):
I feel like I was very much on my toes when I was in
Estonia.
And I think it's definitely, soI use the sort of there's like a
meter that you can look at thatsort of gauges the queerness of
like certain areas, so you couldlook at that, like before you
travel, especially in likeEuropean countries to gauge like
(18:08):
how friendly a place may be.
So if I remember correctly thegauge was like smaller, but
where I was in Tallinn seemedoverall like pretty queer
friendly.
There are gay bars and things ofthat there, but I feel like.
The language barrier cansometimes be a challenge,
especially with findingmeetings, things of that.
(18:31):
But I feel like in thatparticular place, I was very
much, aware of my surroundings alot of times, just making sure
that while I was being aware ofwhat was happening around me and
not being mindful of not beingabsorbed into my phone which I
feel tends to happen a lot when,if you're traveling and you just
(18:51):
will see people just staringinto their phones I try to avoid
that.
And just being aware, of mysurroundings.
Steve (19:00):
Yeah, and you mentioned that you prefer traveling alone.
How has traveling with peoplebeen different sober than maybe
it was before sobriety?
Frank (19:12):
I have had some really great travel buddies, and I do
sometimes enjoy it.
I feel that if you're travelingwith someone, I think it's
important to understand eachother's travel dynamic.
I think that's really important.
Like I am someone that I can goall day, take a little cat nap
(19:36):
and go out for the evening.
I think it's really pairing upwith someone who matches your
energy in that regard.
I think that's the mostimportant part if you're
traveling with someone justmaking sure that you're on the
same page.
Otherwise, it may be a littlenot quite as enjoyable, perhaps,
(19:56):
if one would rather hang out inthe hotel.
For me, when it comes to hotels,I look for safety, making sure
that the hotel is safe and thebed is comfortable, like those
two are the most importantthings for me otherwise to me,
the hotel is just a place Isleep for a few hours I'm not
looking to usually hang out atthe hotel, but I think things
(20:16):
like that are important ifyou're traveling with someone
because, other people staying ina more kept up hotel might be
important, so I think it's justcovering all those things before
you dive into a trip.
Steve (20:28):
Yeah, makes sense.
And any last minute tips ortricks for sober traveling?
Frank (20:35):
Last minute tips.
I would say just do it.
If you've got the chance to getout and venture I highly
recommend it.
That is very much one of mygoals.
So like when I turned 40, Iturned my life upside down,
became a nomad and have madetraveling my inspiration and
(20:58):
passion for my 40s.
And life is precious.
And I just, continue to saydon't take anything for granted.
Just take the opportunity andgo.
If you've got the chance totravel, do it.
Steve (21:12):
Excellent.
I will try and take your adviceand travel soon.
If someone wanted to follow youon all of your traveling
adventures, how would they dothat?
Frank (21:21):
Sure.
So I am on Instagram and TikTokunder Fashion Queer Historian.
So that is a recent change.
So if you're following me beforeat Man Your Style, I recently
updated the handles to reflectwhere I'm at.
Now professionally.
So at Fashion Queer Historian onboth TikTok and Instagram.
Steve (21:46):
Excellent.
I'll include that over in theshow notes so you all can just
swipe on up and listen.
But thank you as always,Frankie.
It's always a pleasure.
Frank (21:53):
Great to see you again and to be here.
Thank you for having me.
Steve (21:59):
Yes, and thank you listeners for tuning in to
another episode of Gay A.
Make sure you're following soyou can get new episodes every
Thursday and leave a review.
If you love the episode andfound it helpful, it'll make it
easier for other alcoholics andaddicts to find it as well.
And until next time, stay sober.
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