September 17, 2025 • 19 mins
In this re run of one of our most popular episodes we explore how perfectionism can be dangerous, stopping us in our tracks and preventing us from living fully and joyfully despite its association with excellence.
• Perfectionism is a rising problem fueled by social media and comparison culture
• The "all or nothing" mentality prevents people from taking action or trying new things
• Perfectionism can lead to "analysis paralysis" where overthinking prevents progress
• Perfectionists often miss opportunities waiting for the "perfect moment" that never comes
• Waiting for perfect conditions can negatively impact health, relationships, and life experiences
• Social media creates unrealistic standards that make perfectionism worse
• Embracing imperfection creates space for meaningful memories and connections
• Finding beauty in imperfection mirrors nature, where "weeds" can actually be beautiful flowers
• Flexibility in thinking helps overcome toxic perfectionist tendencies
• Perfectionism affects not just the individual but everyone around them
If you enjoyed this podcast, please share it with family and friends, and let us know in the comments or send us a text through your podcast player.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Why being a perfectionist can actually be
dangerous in so many ways, yeah,and why there can be so many
downsides to it.
Because we're used to thinkingof.
You know, being a perfectionistis, oh yeah, you know,
everything is lovely andeverything is comes out really
nice.
Yes, associating it withexcellence?
(00:22):
Exactly yes.
But today we're going to beactually talking about this
toxic perfectionism and why, youknow, we've got to become aware
of it and why it can actuallystop you in your tracks and stop
you from living your best life.
So tune in to Get Real With theEnglish Sisters.
(00:42):
Please do share this podcastwith your family and friends and
on social media if you enjoy it, and let us know in the
comments if you enjoy it, orsend us a text if you're on your
podcast player, yay.
So let's get down to thispodcast today.
And there's reasons why wedecided to talk about this,
isn't there?
Well, there are reasons why wedecided to talk about this,
(01:03):
isn't there?
Well, there are reasons becausewe suddenly decided that I mean
the lady that comes to help usin the house she cannot clean a
room if everything isn't, ifit's not tidy, exactly Like if
your house is, it's either allor nothing.
Yeah, she'll open a door andshe'll say, oh no, there's,
(01:25):
there are a few things on thefloor.
Thus I could not clean thatroom.
You know, and and and this,this sounds like and she only
comes.
Yeah, it sounds ridiculous,like.
So I know I'm really lucky tohave her coming to help me, so
I'm really ultra grateful thefact that I have her.
She only comes once a week anduh, yeah, but sometimes I think
(01:48):
why?
And then, after speaking to her, I realized that it's kind of
like no, because it's not if, ifthings aren't perfect in her,
in this isn't just with, withthe cleaning aspect, it's
everything in her life.
Everything has to be doneperfectly.
And I'm sure there are a lot ofyou out there that you are
either, like almost I want tosay the word suffering from
(02:11):
perfectionism, because it islike, and it's, it's like a
disease and it's on the rise.
Yeah, this is actually on therise.
Exactly, there are more andmore people that are becoming
perfectionists due to socialmedia, due to comparison.
I think so, and I think I meanit really gets into your mind,
(02:32):
it does your, it does your headin in the end, because you, you
stop, it stops you in yourtracks.
It stops you from doing thingsjust as just as she.
You know she can't clean a roomif there's a few boxes on the
floor or like on the bed orsomething you know you're in the
middle of.
Maybe you know she can't cleana room if there's a few boxes on
the floor or like on the bed orsomething you know you're in
the middle of.
Maybe you know doing yourwardrobe out or something.
Yeah, she'll just go in thereand say, oh no, I can't do this
(02:53):
room, whereas close the door, ifI went in there I would say,
okay, there's a bit, there's alittle bit of room here.
I just, yeah, you know, I justvacuum the carpet a bit, then
I'll go around and do a bit ofthere.
But for her, in her mind, shejust can't.
It's like all or nothing, andI'm sure many of you can
identify with that that.
Maybe you know things havestopped you in the past from
(03:14):
doing things.
I've got my son.
He is a total perfectionist.
He does suffer from anxiety,though, every now and again and,
for example, like the other dayhe was, he decided he said, oh,
I really fancy mashed potatoes.
Oh, but I can't be botheredwith the long process.
And I said what long process,for goodness sake.
(03:35):
Just stick a potato in themicrowave and then get it out,
put some butter on it and mashit up.
You know, that's how I would doit if I wanted it.
You know, like one, it onlytakes like five minutes, or
otherwise.
You can boil them and then justmash them up with you know,
even with a fork.
Yeah, he said oh, mom, you knowI can't do it like that.
And so I thought okay, so, andhe said no, I'm just going to go
(03:57):
out now and grab a hamburger.
So I thought there you go.
That's an example of, you know,his perfectionism is actually
getting in the way of his health, because if it's not perfect
the mashed potatoes, theninstead of eating a healthy
potato, he's gone out to get ahamburger, which is just fast
food.
So I thought that's theclassical example of lots of
(04:17):
things that happened to him inhis life that I can see.
You know he's.
He's just bought a house now.
So I thought, well, let's get,you know, start painting, let
you know, so you can move in andenjoy it.
Yes, but we need to get aprofessional painter's opinion,
we need to do the primer on thewall.
We need to do this.
No, everything was like it'slike stopping.
(04:41):
Yeah, it's like it like stopsyou from you know, just from
getting from rolling up yoursleeves and getting on with it
because you're thinking in yourhead that you're not good enough
to do that, because you haven'tgot the experience or the tools
or the you know, they know howto do it, whereas if you just
say, okay, I'm just going to domy best, and that you know, like
I remember who cares.
(05:01):
Yeah, I remember when we firstcame to Italy, when people used
to have painters come in andthen all this DIY came into it
yes, it wasn't, it came into it.
Nobody would actually do ityourself here in Italy.
No, we came from the UK and youknow the English kind of
mindset where people would dotheir own homes up and just sort
(05:22):
of figure a way you know itwouldn't be perfect, but no, not
here.
They had to kind of shine alight.
They had.
They would get a torch andactually shine it on the wall to
see if there was any like kinksor nooks or crannies or any
imperfections in the paint jobthey'd done.
Yeah, so that was, but obviouslythat was a professional painter
that would come in and do it,yeah, but and then do you really
(05:43):
need a professional painterthough, have you?
If you've got loads of money tosplash out and you've got the,
then you know the financialresources.
Yes, of course, you can get aninterior decorator, you can get
a painter.
You can get.
You know, you can get all ofthis stuff, but most of us in
the real world we we don't haveall that extra cash lying around
(06:05):
, and, and it is hard work.
When you actually do do thepainting, but, oh, what a
satisfaction you get afterwardswhen you manage to do it
yourself.
There is that sense of prideand your self-worth grows.
When you do things yourself,you know you immediately have
this massive boost inself-esteem.
(06:27):
So it's good for you also to totry and do these things, and I
think, like, like recently, myhusband's done out the bathroom
and the upstairs bathroom, andmy son is shocked why, why, dad?
Why?
Why are you doing this?
You know you don't need to dothis now, at this stage in your
life.
You can get someone to do itfor you.
(06:48):
Why are you killing yourselfdoing it?
And he actually got sore kneefrom it.
It was hard work, he's lovedthe process and he's thoroughly
enjoyed it, and I've enjoyed thefact that I haven't got workers
in my house every day that hedid it, he did it and he's just
nice and quiet and discreet andI, oh yeah, he's brilliant.
He's brilliant when he does hisjob.
(07:08):
So I haven't got people in here.
He is a perfectionist, but Ithink he's learned how to, how
to sort of master hisperfectionist to his advantage
there.
Yes, because he is anotherexample of a perfectionist.
It's never stopped him, it'snot.
He's not a toxic perfectionist,no, no, he'll get on with it.
He'll get on with it and tryand learn new things.
(07:29):
He'll write notes down andthings, but then while he's
doing it, he'll want it to bemore and more so he wants to
learn how to do it properly.
Yes, yes, he does, but he doesaccept as well that there might
be you know, there might bethings that aren't exactly 100
(07:49):
perfect.
He allows flexibility.
It's like in business, isn'tthere?
Because he also listens to mewhere I say that's fine, just
get on with it exactly.
Yeah, maybe if he was on hisown he might, you know, go down
that rabbit hole a bit more oftoxic perfection.
I think if you've got twoperfectionists in a couple, in a
friendship, that's when thingscan be a little bit tricky,
(08:10):
because you know well, they dosay opposites attract.
So perhaps a lot of the timesthere there is one perfectionist
and then you end up withsomebody else that's not like
that and you actually quiteenjoy that feeling of sort of
somebody that's more flexiblearound you.
Yeah, I think that's probablyquite a good combination,
because you're like edge eachother on, won't you?
(08:30):
The perfectionist will make youdo things a bit better and more
perfection, yes, it'll actuallyimprove, inspire you, yeah,
yeah, but it's, it's when itstops you from doing things, or
it like it's, it's like all on,the all or nothing mentality,
which is like harmful, I think,and toxic.
Well, it's like in business,isn't it the?
There there is a saying calledanalysis, paralysis.
(08:51):
So if you analyze something toomuch, you will never do
anything.
And it's actually feared inbusiness because they say, if
you analyze something too much,you will never do anything.
And it's actually feared inbusiness because they say, if
you, if you're going to start upan idea and you start it and
then you have it, you could, youhave to wait for everything to
be perfect, you will never getit done.
Yeah, and it paralyzes you,literally the fear of not
(09:12):
getting everything perfect, nothaving exactly the right budget,
exactly the right personnel,this and that you won't do it.
No, you will be paralysed, itwill stop you, it will stop you
in life.
It will create a lot of anxietyas well, because you'll feel
frustrated because you're notfulfilling the thing that you
(09:32):
wanted to do, exactly.
I mean, you've got to sort ofbecome aware of this, I think.
Yeah, I think it's likeeverything.
If you become aware of whatyou're doing with your own mind,
with your own mind and your ownthoughts, and you know when
you're going down that spiral ofperfectionism, yeah, you can
stop yourself and say, hey, well, maybe you know a little bit
(09:52):
more flexibility, or maybe, ifyou know there's a few things
wrong with it, that's finebecause overall it's a good
thing.
Exactly, overall it's a goodthing.
Yeah, I mean, when we werebabies, we didn't learn how to
walk.
You know, immediately we didn'tdo it perfectly.
We started crawling and then wedidn't know how to eat properly
and we made a terrible messwith our food, spitting it out
(10:15):
and goodness me, in our pants.
Yeah, we, we weren't perfect,and so we're not perfect now as
adults either.
We have to allow thatflexibility and the be elastic
enough in our own minds to saywho cares?
You know, it's good, it's agood job and I'm proud of you.
Know, become proud of yourselffor doing it and for taking
(10:37):
those first steps.
I think you've got to justallow for more flexibility to
enter.
Yeah, and I think that alsocomes when it comes down for
with your health and yourfitness.
A perfectionist will never startworking out because they won't
have the right equipment or theywon't have the amount of time
necessary to do it.
I haven't got an hour today.
(10:58):
Well, you could just do maybe10 minutes.
And you just follow a YouTubevideo.
He says really, I would need apersonal trainer.
I go well, you haven't got themoney for a personal trainer, so
why don't you just watch avideo and start doing it
yourself?
No, there, you go, no, thereyou go.
No, there you go, no, no.
And then you know he is pairedwith another perfectionist.
So it's drama.
(11:19):
Yeah, so you were.
There's drama there because itstops you from doing.
You need a professional inorder not to do an exercise that
might hurt you.
Yes, that is true, but you canalso just start.
You can start with an exercisethat's safe, exactly With
weights.
Start, you can start with anexercise that's safe, exactly
(11:39):
with weights if you're doingweight training weights that are
safe for you and just get onwith it and just roll your
sleeve up and just start andjust do it and you'll be
healthier for it.
Exactly.
I mean, when we first came toItaly, I mean, and they still
say that now, so many peopleactually know how to speak
English, but they won't.
They are literally paralyzed bythe fear of looking foolish.
(11:59):
And and they, you know they'renot.
It's ridiculous, isn't it?
You think, oh, but you didn't.
You know, sometimes you can.
Actually, you studied Englishfor like 10 years at school and
you still don't want to speak it.
They won't speak it becauseit's part of their culture.
They say they can't speakEnglish.
They say, oh, no, it's part oftheir culture.
They say, oh, no, it's reallyreally bad.
Oh, no, no, and I know it canbe embarrassing, it's like me if
(12:21):
I try and speak french Ihaven't spoken french for years
I'm gonna make, I'm gonna messup, yeah, but does that actually
stop me?
No, if I find a french personand and I see that they need
help.
I will speak to them in french.
Well, I will too.
So I mean, that's because we'renot.
We'll do our best.
We'll do our best to try and,you know, whatever we can.
That brings me back to when, um,therefore when, when, like when
(12:45):
, I remember you telling me whydon't you have a baby now?
Exactly because I would beliving with my, with my partner,
who's my husband now at thetime for ages.
We met when we were 19 and we'dbe living together.
You were so together.
I wasn't working at the time,so it was like the perfect
opportunity.
And you said why don't you havea baby?
When you were trying to getpregnant, you said you try as
well and I go, but I can't havea baby.
(13:06):
And you said, why not?
You haven't tried?
Well, you know there's, therearen't any problems or anything.
I said, no, but I can't haveone because I haven't, we
haven't got a house yet.
We have to buy a house first.
And you said why?
Yeah, because we were living inrented accommodation.
In those days it was more commonfor you to to be able to
purchase a house.
Nowadays, hardly anyone canpurchase one.
It's so, you know, expensive.
(13:27):
But then in those days youcould if you'd saved up.
So I said we're saving for youknow, for a down payment.
And you said I why you shouldjust go, just go for it, you
don't need to, you, you live ina nice place, you've got enough
room to live, you know, to havea baby room for the cot.
Yeah, you had like another room.
Yeah, I haven't even had anextra room.
So I said there's room for acot, so just do it.
(13:49):
And we did it and it, and weactually bought our house four
years later.
Uh, or no, six years later.
Six years later, we had twochildren and we bought a house.
Six years later, you enteredthe house with the two children.
We rented our forever home thatwe bought and then we did out,
all by ourselves as well,because we just did it, we just
(14:10):
you, just do it.
And and how many lifeexperiences and how much, how
much you know goodness is thatbrought.
Yes, and it enabled the factthat you did have them.
At least mum and dad enjoyedthem, because then they passed
away.
Yes, they did, they got to seethem and you got all that
satisfaction with actuallymemories, you know, of having
our parents see your children?
Well, they would have.
(14:30):
Yeah, they wouldn't have seenmuch, they weren't in very good
health conditions Exactly by thetime.
You actually moved much harder,yeah.
So so you actually got mum toactually enjoy your first
daughter.
A lot, you know, and and youhave all those memories which
you may not have had.
So sometimes you know, waitingfor the perfect moment might not
be the perfect moment.
(14:51):
You know, in real life it mightbe just the perfect moment that
you think is the perfect momentbecause you've got this thing
in your head.
You know this idea, programming, whatever, of what or the
comparing it to other people.
You know, I think nowadays morethan ever, it's so much because
of social media.
It always has been, it has been.
Before it was like the nextdoor neighbor, what the group
(15:14):
was, but now it's like beingtenfold, a hundredfold
heightened.
I know, because everything isso curated on social media that
you believe, we all believe, weall get fooled that life is
really like that.
When it's just one moment, one,we know it's not real, but we're
kind of like there's a part ofour brain, there's a part of our
brain that wants it to be realBecause it looks so beautiful.
(15:37):
So then we compare ourselves toit and you know, as we were
chatting before when we werehaving a cup of tea, if we had
been like that, I mean, when wedo this podcast, we video the
podcast as well, whereas so manyof our colleagues say, oh no, I
can't video it, no-transcript,you know, just go for it.
(16:06):
We just go for it.
If we hadn't, we wouldn't havestarted a podcast.
No, never no, so you wouldn'tbe listening to us now.
No, we would just say, no, weneed a team, you need someone to
edit it, you need someone tocurate it, you need, you know,
something to talk about.
Yeah, I mean, we just basicallytook chat about what we were
(16:27):
chatting about one minute beforein the kitchen.
Yeah, and then our ownexperiences and you know, as as
as therapists as well, thatobviously comes in, but just
general, a lot of stuff thatjust happens to us and and our
families, so there's no need tohave it so curated, so perfect.
I think the imperfection iswhat is what's attractive as
(16:50):
well, because when something isso perfect, you think, yeah,
well, but where's the soul in it?
Yeah, where's the soul you've?
I, when we look at our houses,we know we painted that room and
we might think, oh yeah, I knowthat, you know.
I mean, like when we were doingour bathroom out and we've got
our little son who went it wastwo who did a little.
(17:10):
Yeah, he came in to help hisdaddy and he did a little
scratch on the tile and you'vegot that memory, we've got that
still there.
We kept it where he scratchedthe tile because he wanted to.
Yeah, adorable, exactly.
But that's part of the historyof the feelings, of the emotions
in the end.
So, yeah, I think you know thismyth about everything having to
(17:34):
be perfect and curated is is, isnot.
It's not true, it's not.
Nature is not like that either,is it?
If we look at nature, I mean,you look at a field, there'd be
millions of weeds in it, exactly, and then there'll be the odd
beautiful flower.
What sometimes the weeds are?
The beautiful flowers.
You know if it just depends howyou're looking at it, because
the dandelions and everythingelse is considered a weed.
(17:57):
Look at the beauty in it, thedaisies, you know, in my garden
now.
They're weeds, but they'rebeautiful.
They're beautiful white flowers, perfect in their imperfections
, exactly.
Yes, I think that's it.
I think we have to look atthings a little bit differently
and allow more flexibility toenter our minds and take a deep
breath and just say, look, thisis all part of the journey.
(18:19):
If it's going to be a goodthing in the end, if it's not
going to be toxic for us, ifit's going to be toxic for us
and stop us doing what we reallywant to be doing right now,
just for us, and stop us doingwhat we really want to be doing
right now, just let go.
Is it worth it?
No, it's not.
It's never worth it.
It's actually.
You know, it can actually bevery dangerous for your health
and for everything else.
Yeah, and for the people aroundyou as well.
(18:40):
Yeah, because it can be a greatdampener on, you know, your
social life, on the peoplearound you, if they know that.
You know like, oh dear, thatperson's going to get upset if
they invite us to dinner andthen the dinner doesn't come out
well, for example.
Yeah, we know they're going tobe grumpy in the kitchen.
You know there's no point,there's.
(19:01):
No, you might as well just havea big laugh about it.
And you know, just put it inyour memory cupboard.
Exactly, it's part of memories,isn't it?
Yeah, it's part of life,exactly.
So let us know if you enjoy thispodcast.
You know, please do leave acomment if you're watching us on
youtube, or send us a text ifyou're listening wherever you
get your podcasts on apple,podcast, spotify, wherever you
(19:22):
you are and let us know if youfeel that you kind of have
become more perfectionist overtime and if you think the social
media is influencing you aswell.
Exactly, or if you've gotanyone around you that's like
that.
Yeah, let us know.
See you next week.
Lots of love and smiles fromthe english sisters.
Bye.
Why being a perfectionist can actually be
dangerous in so many ways, yeah,and why there can be so many
downsides to it.
Because we're used to thinkingof.
You know, being a perfectionistis, oh yeah, you know,
everything is lovely andeverything is comes out really
nice.
Yes, associating it withexcellence?
(00:22):
Exactly yes.
But today we're going to beactually talking about this
toxic perfectionism and why, youknow, we've got to become aware
of it and why it can actuallystop you in your tracks and stop
you from living your best life.
So tune in to Get Real With theEnglish Sisters.
(00:42):
Please do share this podcastwith your family and friends and
on social media if you enjoy it, and let us know in the
comments if you enjoy it, orsend us a text if you're on your
podcast player, yay.
So let's get down to thispodcast today.
And there's reasons why wedecided to talk about this,
isn't there?
Well, there are reasons why wedecided to talk about this,
(01:03):
isn't there?
Well, there are reasons becausewe suddenly decided that I mean
the lady that comes to help usin the house she cannot clean a
room if everything isn't, ifit's not tidy, exactly Like if
your house is, it's either allor nothing.
Yeah, she'll open a door andshe'll say, oh no, there's,
(01:25):
there are a few things on thefloor.
Thus I could not clean thatroom.
You know, and and and this,this sounds like and she only
comes.
Yeah, it sounds ridiculous,like.
So I know I'm really lucky tohave her coming to help me, so
I'm really ultra grateful thefact that I have her.
She only comes once a week anduh, yeah, but sometimes I think
(01:48):
why?
And then, after speaking to her, I realized that it's kind of
like no, because it's not if, ifthings aren't perfect in her,
in this isn't just with, withthe cleaning aspect, it's
everything in her life.
Everything has to be doneperfectly.
And I'm sure there are a lot ofyou out there that you are
either, like almost I want tosay the word suffering from
(02:11):
perfectionism, because it islike, and it's, it's like a
disease and it's on the rise.
Yeah, this is actually on therise.
Exactly, there are more andmore people that are becoming
perfectionists due to socialmedia, due to comparison.
I think so, and I think I meanit really gets into your mind,
(02:32):
it does your, it does your headin in the end, because you, you
stop, it stops you in yourtracks.
It stops you from doing thingsjust as just as she.
You know she can't clean a roomif there's a few boxes on the
floor or like on the bed orsomething you know you're in the
middle of.
Maybe you know she can't cleana room if there's a few boxes on
the floor or like on the bed orsomething you know you're in
the middle of.
Maybe you know doing yourwardrobe out or something.
Yeah, she'll just go in thereand say, oh no, I can't do this
(02:53):
room, whereas close the door, ifI went in there I would say,
okay, there's a bit, there's alittle bit of room here.
I just, yeah, you know, I justvacuum the carpet a bit, then
I'll go around and do a bit ofthere.
But for her, in her mind, shejust can't.
It's like all or nothing, andI'm sure many of you can
identify with that that.
Maybe you know things havestopped you in the past from
(03:14):
doing things.
I've got my son.
He is a total perfectionist.
He does suffer from anxiety,though, every now and again and,
for example, like the other dayhe was, he decided he said, oh,
I really fancy mashed potatoes.
Oh, but I can't be botheredwith the long process.
And I said what long process,for goodness sake.
(03:35):
Just stick a potato in themicrowave and then get it out,
put some butter on it and mashit up.
You know, that's how I would doit if I wanted it.
You know, like one, it onlytakes like five minutes, or
otherwise.
You can boil them and then justmash them up with you know,
even with a fork.
Yeah, he said oh, mom, you knowI can't do it like that.
And so I thought okay, so, andhe said no, I'm just going to go
(03:57):
out now and grab a hamburger.
So I thought there you go.
That's an example of, you know,his perfectionism is actually
getting in the way of his health, because if it's not perfect
the mashed potatoes, theninstead of eating a healthy
potato, he's gone out to get ahamburger, which is just fast
food.
So I thought that's theclassical example of lots of
(04:17):
things that happened to him inhis life that I can see.
You know he's.
He's just bought a house now.
So I thought, well, let's get,you know, start painting, let
you know, so you can move in andenjoy it.
Yes, but we need to get aprofessional painter's opinion,
we need to do the primer on thewall.
We need to do this.
No, everything was like it'slike stopping.
(04:41):
Yeah, it's like it like stopsyou from you know, just from
getting from rolling up yoursleeves and getting on with it
because you're thinking in yourhead that you're not good enough
to do that, because you haven'tgot the experience or the tools
or the you know, they know howto do it, whereas if you just
say, okay, I'm just going to domy best, and that you know, like
I remember who cares.
(05:01):
Yeah, I remember when we firstcame to Italy, when people used
to have painters come in andthen all this DIY came into it
yes, it wasn't, it came into it.
Nobody would actually do ityourself here in Italy.
No, we came from the UK and youknow the English kind of
mindset where people would dotheir own homes up and just sort
(05:22):
of figure a way you know itwouldn't be perfect, but no, not
here.
They had to kind of shine alight.
They had.
They would get a torch andactually shine it on the wall to
see if there was any like kinksor nooks or crannies or any
imperfections in the paint jobthey'd done.
Yeah, so that was, but obviouslythat was a professional painter
that would come in and do it,yeah, but and then do you really
(05:43):
need a professional painterthough, have you?
If you've got loads of money tosplash out and you've got the,
then you know the financialresources.
Yes, of course, you can get aninterior decorator, you can get
a painter.
You can get.
You know, you can get all ofthis stuff, but most of us in
the real world we we don't haveall that extra cash lying around
(06:05):
, and, and it is hard work.
When you actually do do thepainting, but, oh, what a
satisfaction you get afterwardswhen you manage to do it
yourself.
There is that sense of prideand your self-worth grows.
When you do things yourself,you know you immediately have
this massive boost inself-esteem.
(06:27):
So it's good for you also to totry and do these things, and I
think, like, like recently, myhusband's done out the bathroom
and the upstairs bathroom, andmy son is shocked why, why, dad?
Why?
Why are you doing this?
You know you don't need to dothis now, at this stage in your
life.
You can get someone to do itfor you.
(06:48):
Why are you killing yourselfdoing it?
And he actually got sore kneefrom it.
It was hard work, he's lovedthe process and he's thoroughly
enjoyed it, and I've enjoyed thefact that I haven't got workers
in my house every day that hedid it, he did it and he's just
nice and quiet and discreet andI, oh yeah, he's brilliant.
He's brilliant when he does hisjob.
(07:08):
So I haven't got people in here.
He is a perfectionist, but Ithink he's learned how to, how
to sort of master hisperfectionist to his advantage
there.
Yes, because he is anotherexample of a perfectionist.
It's never stopped him, it'snot.
He's not a toxic perfectionist,no, no, he'll get on with it.
He'll get on with it and tryand learn new things.
(07:29):
He'll write notes down andthings, but then while he's
doing it, he'll want it to bemore and more so he wants to
learn how to do it properly.
Yes, yes, he does, but he doesaccept as well that there might
be you know, there might bethings that aren't exactly 100
(07:49):
perfect.
He allows flexibility.
It's like in business, isn'tthere?
Because he also listens to mewhere I say that's fine, just
get on with it exactly.
Yeah, maybe if he was on hisown he might, you know, go down
that rabbit hole a bit more oftoxic perfection.
I think if you've got twoperfectionists in a couple, in a
friendship, that's when thingscan be a little bit tricky,
(08:10):
because you know well, they dosay opposites attract.
So perhaps a lot of the timesthere there is one perfectionist
and then you end up withsomebody else that's not like
that and you actually quiteenjoy that feeling of sort of
somebody that's more flexiblearound you.
Yeah, I think that's probablyquite a good combination,
because you're like edge eachother on, won't you?
(08:30):
The perfectionist will make youdo things a bit better and more
perfection, yes, it'll actuallyimprove, inspire you, yeah,
yeah, but it's, it's when itstops you from doing things, or
it like it's, it's like all on,the all or nothing mentality,
which is like harmful, I think,and toxic.
Well, it's like in business,isn't it the?
There there is a saying calledanalysis, paralysis.
(08:51):
So if you analyze something toomuch, you will never do
anything.
And it's actually feared inbusiness because they say, if
you analyze something too much,you will never do anything.
And it's actually feared inbusiness because they say, if
you, if you're going to start upan idea and you start it and
then you have it, you could, youhave to wait for everything to
be perfect, you will never getit done.
Yeah, and it paralyzes you,literally the fear of not
(09:12):
getting everything perfect, nothaving exactly the right budget,
exactly the right personnel,this and that you won't do it.
No, you will be paralysed, itwill stop you, it will stop you
in life.
It will create a lot of anxietyas well, because you'll feel
frustrated because you're notfulfilling the thing that you
(09:32):
wanted to do, exactly.
I mean, you've got to sort ofbecome aware of this, I think.
Yeah, I think it's likeeverything.
If you become aware of whatyou're doing with your own mind,
with your own mind and your ownthoughts, and you know when
you're going down that spiral ofperfectionism, yeah, you can
stop yourself and say, hey, well, maybe you know a little bit
(09:52):
more flexibility, or maybe, ifyou know there's a few things
wrong with it, that's finebecause overall it's a good
thing.
Exactly, overall it's a goodthing.
Yeah, I mean, when we werebabies, we didn't learn how to
walk.
You know, immediately we didn'tdo it perfectly.
We started crawling and then wedidn't know how to eat properly
and we made a terrible messwith our food, spitting it out
(10:15):
and goodness me, in our pants.
Yeah, we, we weren't perfect,and so we're not perfect now as
adults either.
We have to allow thatflexibility and the be elastic
enough in our own minds to saywho cares?
You know, it's good, it's agood job and I'm proud of you.
Know, become proud of yourselffor doing it and for taking
(10:37):
those first steps.
I think you've got to justallow for more flexibility to
enter.
Yeah, and I think that alsocomes when it comes down for
with your health and yourfitness.
A perfectionist will never startworking out because they won't
have the right equipment or theywon't have the amount of time
necessary to do it.
I haven't got an hour today.
(10:58):
Well, you could just do maybe10 minutes.
And you just follow a YouTubevideo.
He says really, I would need apersonal trainer.
I go well, you haven't got themoney for a personal trainer, so
why don't you just watch avideo and start doing it
yourself?
No, there, you go, no, thereyou go.
No, there you go, no, no.
And then you know he is pairedwith another perfectionist.
So it's drama.
(11:19):
Yeah, so you were.
There's drama there because itstops you from doing.
You need a professional inorder not to do an exercise that
might hurt you.
Yes, that is true, but you canalso just start.
You can start with an exercisethat's safe, exactly With
weights.
Start, you can start with anexercise that's safe, exactly
(11:39):
with weights if you're doingweight training weights that are
safe for you and just get onwith it and just roll your
sleeve up and just start andjust do it and you'll be
healthier for it.
Exactly.
I mean, when we first came toItaly, I mean, and they still
say that now, so many peopleactually know how to speak
English, but they won't.
They are literally paralyzed bythe fear of looking foolish.
(11:59):
And and they, you know they'renot.
It's ridiculous, isn't it?
You think, oh, but you didn't.
You know, sometimes you can.
Actually, you studied Englishfor like 10 years at school and
you still don't want to speak it.
They won't speak it becauseit's part of their culture.
They say they can't speakEnglish.
They say, oh, no, it's part oftheir culture.
They say, oh, no, it's reallyreally bad.
Oh, no, no, and I know it canbe embarrassing, it's like me if
(12:21):
I try and speak french Ihaven't spoken french for years
I'm gonna make, I'm gonna messup, yeah, but does that actually
stop me?
No, if I find a french personand and I see that they need
help.
I will speak to them in french.
Well, I will too.
So I mean, that's because we'renot.
We'll do our best.
We'll do our best to try and,you know, whatever we can.
That brings me back to when, um,therefore when, when, like when
(12:45):
, I remember you telling me whydon't you have a baby now?
Exactly because I would beliving with my, with my partner,
who's my husband now at thetime for ages.
We met when we were 19 and we'dbe living together.
You were so together.
I wasn't working at the time,so it was like the perfect
opportunity.
And you said why don't you havea baby?
When you were trying to getpregnant, you said you try as
well and I go, but I can't havea baby.
(13:06):
And you said, why not?
You haven't tried?
Well, you know there's, therearen't any problems or anything.
I said, no, but I can't haveone because I haven't, we
haven't got a house yet.
We have to buy a house first.
And you said why?
Yeah, because we were living inrented accommodation.
In those days it was more commonfor you to to be able to
purchase a house.
Nowadays, hardly anyone canpurchase one.
It's so, you know, expensive.
(13:27):
But then in those days youcould if you'd saved up.
So I said we're saving for youknow, for a down payment.
And you said I why you shouldjust go, just go for it, you
don't need to, you, you live ina nice place, you've got enough
room to live, you know, to havea baby room for the cot.
Yeah, you had like another room.
Yeah, I haven't even had anextra room.
So I said there's room for acot, so just do it.
(13:49):
And we did it and it, and weactually bought our house four
years later.
Uh, or no, six years later.
Six years later, we had twochildren and we bought a house.
Six years later, you enteredthe house with the two children.
We rented our forever home thatwe bought and then we did out,
all by ourselves as well,because we just did it, we just
(14:10):
you, just do it.
And and how many lifeexperiences and how much, how
much you know goodness is thatbrought.
Yes, and it enabled the factthat you did have them.
At least mum and dad enjoyedthem, because then they passed
away.
Yes, they did, they got to seethem and you got all that
satisfaction with actuallymemories, you know, of having
our parents see your children?
Well, they would have.
(14:30):
Yeah, they wouldn't have seenmuch, they weren't in very good
health conditions Exactly by thetime.
You actually moved much harder,yeah.
So so you actually got mum toactually enjoy your first
daughter.
A lot, you know, and and youhave all those memories which
you may not have had.
So sometimes you know, waitingfor the perfect moment might not
be the perfect moment.
(14:51):
You know, in real life it mightbe just the perfect moment that
you think is the perfect momentbecause you've got this thing
in your head.
You know this idea, programming, whatever, of what or the
comparing it to other people.
You know, I think nowadays morethan ever, it's so much because
of social media.
It always has been, it has been.
Before it was like the nextdoor neighbor, what the group
(15:14):
was, but now it's like beingtenfold, a hundredfold
heightened.
I know, because everything isso curated on social media that
you believe, we all believe, weall get fooled that life is
really like that.
When it's just one moment, one,we know it's not real, but we're
kind of like there's a part ofour brain, there's a part of our
brain that wants it to be realBecause it looks so beautiful.
(15:37):
So then we compare ourselves toit and you know, as we were
chatting before when we werehaving a cup of tea, if we had
been like that, I mean, when wedo this podcast, we video the
podcast as well, whereas so manyof our colleagues say, oh no, I
can't video it, no-transcript,you know, just go for it.
(16:06):
We just go for it.
If we hadn't, we wouldn't havestarted a podcast.
No, never no, so you wouldn'tbe listening to us now.
No, we would just say, no, weneed a team, you need someone to
edit it, you need someone tocurate it, you need, you know,
something to talk about.
Yeah, I mean, we just basicallytook chat about what we were
(16:27):
chatting about one minute beforein the kitchen.
Yeah, and then our ownexperiences and you know, as as
as therapists as well, thatobviously comes in, but just
general, a lot of stuff thatjust happens to us and and our
families, so there's no need tohave it so curated, so perfect.
I think the imperfection iswhat is what's attractive as
(16:50):
well, because when something isso perfect, you think, yeah,
well, but where's the soul in it?
Yeah, where's the soul you've?
I, when we look at our houses,we know we painted that room and
we might think, oh yeah, I knowthat, you know.
I mean, like when we were doingour bathroom out and we've got
our little son who went it wastwo who did a little.
(17:10):
Yeah, he came in to help hisdaddy and he did a little
scratch on the tile and you'vegot that memory, we've got that
still there.
We kept it where he scratchedthe tile because he wanted to.
Yeah, adorable, exactly.
But that's part of the historyof the feelings, of the emotions
in the end.
So, yeah, I think you know thismyth about everything having to
(17:34):
be perfect and curated is is, isnot.
It's not true, it's not.
Nature is not like that either,is it?
If we look at nature, I mean,you look at a field, there'd be
millions of weeds in it, exactly, and then there'll be the odd
beautiful flower.
What sometimes the weeds are?
The beautiful flowers.
You know if it just depends howyou're looking at it, because
the dandelions and everythingelse is considered a weed.
(17:57):
Look at the beauty in it, thedaisies, you know, in my garden
now.
They're weeds, but they'rebeautiful.
They're beautiful white flowers, perfect in their imperfections
, exactly.
Yes, I think that's it.
I think we have to look atthings a little bit differently
and allow more flexibility toenter our minds and take a deep
breath and just say, look, thisis all part of the journey.
(18:19):
If it's going to be a goodthing in the end, if it's not
going to be toxic for us, ifit's going to be toxic for us
and stop us doing what we reallywant to be doing right now,
just for us, and stop us doingwhat we really want to be doing
right now, just let go.
Is it worth it?
No, it's not.
It's never worth it.
It's actually.
You know, it can actually bevery dangerous for your health
and for everything else.
Yeah, and for the people aroundyou as well.
(18:40):
Yeah, because it can be a greatdampener on, you know, your
social life, on the peoplearound you, if they know that.
You know like, oh dear, thatperson's going to get upset if
they invite us to dinner andthen the dinner doesn't come out
well, for example.
Yeah, we know they're going tobe grumpy in the kitchen.
You know there's no point,there's.
(19:01):
No, you might as well just havea big laugh about it.
And you know, just put it inyour memory cupboard.
Exactly, it's part of memories,isn't it?
Yeah, it's part of life,exactly.
So let us know if you enjoy thispodcast.
You know, please do leave acomment if you're watching us on
youtube, or send us a text ifyou're listening wherever you
get your podcasts on apple,podcast, spotify, wherever you
(19:22):
you are and let us know if youfeel that you kind of have
become more perfectionist overtime and if you think the social
media is influencing you aswell.
Exactly, or if you've gotanyone around you that's like
that.
Yeah, let us know.
See you next week.
Lots of love and smiles fromthe english sisters.
Bye.
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