June 22, 2023 • 23 mins
In this episode, Vance and Zoe discuss some powerful stories of children's generosity, and how churches can make the concept of giving and generosity simple enough for even the littlest minds to comprehend.
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Episode Transcript
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Unknown (00:00):
childlike generosity.
(00:00):
It'spowerful when you give, not only
(00:01):
are you releasing what you have,you're also releasing the
control of what is done withwhat you have. Right. Wow. And
when you're a kid you don'tthink about that. A pastor term
tech leader and a millennialchurchgoer, explore the
intersection of technology,culture and faith, equipping you
with innovative strategies tosupport you as you live out your
(00:22):
calling leader churches withconfidence to step into the
future together. This is thegive it up podcast. Okay, Vance.
So I feel like the church talksoften about childlike faith.
Yeah, it's beautiful. But Iactually want to talk about an
offshoot of childlike faith,which is childlike generosity,
remix. Remix. Yes. And Iactually have to start by
(00:45):
sharing my first story ofgenerosity in my life. Because
it really, I think, set the tonefor how I am as an adult,
because I was seven years old.
And I had just gone to this newchurch with my family, and I was
in the kids ministry. And up onthe screen, they played this
(01:06):
video. Now, granted, this is preTOMS Shoes, okay? They play this
video of kids in Haiti withoutshoes, right? It was like this
really moving to three minutevideo, like, look at the bare
feet, look at them running. ButI remember like being gripped at
seven years old, like looking,looking at my own shoes being
like, How is this possible,right? I've never seen another
(01:28):
human being without shoes,right? At this point in my life.
So I went home that day, becausethey ended the video by saying,
guess what, next week as a kidsministry, we're going to have an
opportunity to raise money tobuy kids in Haiti shoes. Wow.
And I was like, yeah, it's gone.
Because I'm like, counting allthe shoes I have. And I was
like, this is a problem I need.
(01:51):
Right? So go home, becauseyou're a sneakerhead at that
time. I mean, it was almostprophetic at that point that I
would one day be a sneaker. Butyes, yeah. So I tell my parents,
I'm like, I'm so excited. We'regonna give to this next week.
And I'm like, Oh, that'sawesome. So I go upstairs, and I
go to my piggy bank, which wasone of those jumbo Crayola
(02:11):
crayons. Yeah. Do you know whatthese look like? Yeah, of
course, they're like, literallyfour feet tall, which is as tall
as me. It's seven. And I poppedthe cap off of it. And I looked
down the barrel. And I'm like,Yeah, that's gonna be perfect.
Put it back on. Fast forward aweek. That Sunday morning, I
shoot wide awake, okay, becauseI'm so excited because I know
what today is. And so I lug mycrayon filled with coins down
(02:37):
the stairs, and try and go outto the car and my mom stops me.
She's like, Oh, my gosh, so whatare you do it? I was like, Mom,
I'm giving. I'm bringing mypiggy bank with me to give for
these kids in Haiti. And she'slike, well, we don't need to
bring the whole crayon. Right.
We could put it in a bag. Yeah.
Which I was like, I guess thatis less extra. So we fill up
this like gallon ziplock bag,and it is probably 20 pounds of
(03:01):
coins. I mean, this thing waslike, busting at the seams. So
now I walk into church, like Ijust robbed a bank of only its
coins. And I drop it on theseat, like slide and under my
chair, and I'm so pumped forthis giving. And then the moment
finally comes. And I see I leteverybody else go first. Not to
cause a scene, of course, is mythinking. So these kids are
(03:24):
dropping in like 50 cents. $1like no doubt, surely what their
parents gave thema tie button to get rain.
I weighed two then I like carrymy 20 pound bag up. And so
stupidly, instead of justputting it in there. I opened
the bag. Yes, dollar. Coins areshooting everywhere. They're
(03:47):
like bouncing off of the bucket.
I love it. It's likeoverflowing, no pun intended
one. And the pastor stops theservice. Yes, it goes, Wait a
second here. What's going onhere? He's like, looking right
at me. And He hands the mic tome. And I was like, I'm giving
for the shoes. And he was like,How much is this? And I was
(04:07):
like, It's all that I have. AndI found out later it was
probably $70 worth of coins thatI gave to that. And it literally
was all that I have. Wow.
Talking about this today. If Iwas so compelled by a vision and
a mission that I drained my bankaccount. Yeah. It would not be
(04:30):
all that I have. Yeah. Becauseof how wealth is diversified and
non cash assets. Yeah, yeah. Butit's this concept of kids
feeling the security to know Ican give everything because my
daddy has got me. Yeah, that'sokay. No, and I think about
stories you tell tell about thestory of the kids whenever you
(04:53):
guys were raising for the Vivecampus.
Yeah, I mean, when we werelooking to raise $8 million in
45 days. Is we appealed to a fewbillionaires and we raise zero
from them, which was kind ofcrazy. Yeah. That's another
podcast and another story foranother day. But it was so crazy
because kids in our church, likelittle girls, starting lemonade
(05:17):
stands were raising 1000s ofdollars and more generous than
some adults in some households.
I love that childlikegenerosity. I mean, it's
powerful. It's really, reallypowerful. That story is
powerful. And I was even justgetting in the fields a little
bit to think that you had thatchildlike generosity, that
childlike faith, to emptyeverything and even be able to
(05:39):
share that testimony in front ofthe whole church, I'm sure that
inspired so many people, and Ieven just think about the words
of Jesus, right? Like, if youwant to inherit the kingdom of
God, you have to have childlikefaith, right. And if you even
hinder anything like that, he'sactually like, it would be
better for you to put somethingon your neck so heavy that you
(06:00):
would float to the bottom of theocean, which is like, right, I
don't know, people think thatJesus was a pacifist, but like,
he was pretty savage sometimes.
And so I just, I get so impactedby that. I mean, we've seen it
in our community. And every timethat I reflected, I meditate on
this teaching. Every time Iinteract with it actually
(06:24):
happening in real life, I getmoved. I get compelled. Why we
lost that. That's,that's how, yes, maybe there's
more bills. Yes, there's moreresponsibility for you. But it's
almost like the moment that youfeel the responsibility is on
you. Yeah, you lose that.
Yeah. There is an element towhere when you are of that age,
(06:46):
have that mindset on adulteratedby the world. You are in this
phase of life where nothing tolose, relatively speaking. Yeah.
Right. And so when you step intomore responsibility, when you
step into more assets, when youstep into dependence, you have
(07:07):
like actual people that dependon you. Yeah. Yeah, you do, you
do have to reckon with the factthat now you have something to
lose. And so I think that's partof it. Yeah. I do also think
that across developing fromchild like, NIS, to adolescence
(07:27):
to adulthood, there is thisprogression of jadedness for
sure. Yeah, that's you go on.
Yeah. I don't know. What what'syour experience?
Yeah. I mean, I would say that,when you realize that the weight
of things getting done now restson you, and not somebody else.
(07:48):
It it really pulls that out offrame. But that's the thing is
like, I always try and challengemyself of like, wait, no, it
doesn't. No, God, God is in allthings. Yes. Not just like some
things. If I invite Him intoevery part of my life, then he's
in all things and, but it'sreally hard to kind of keep
grasping that. And quitehonestly, I think we make it too
(08:12):
complex, right? Like if a sevenyear old, can be compelled to
give everything they have. Itwas that simple. And it's not
like I stand alone in that, likeyou're talking about these
girls, and their lemonade standslike, there was something that
children understand aboutgiving. That is not only so
inherent, it's so simple. Yeah.
And I think of, you know, likecompanies like Apple who make
(08:33):
things simple. Oh, I like that.
I have a my best friend's son istwo years old, and knows how to
FaceTime me. Wow, that'sterrifying, actually. But the
fact that they can understandgreen red call hang up. That's
(08:54):
pretty crazy. Yeah. How how canthe church how can tech
companies, how can we create amovement to make generosity and
the complex thought of givingsimple once again?
Yeah, I mean, some of it isactually in the technology,
right? It's creating userinterfaces. It's creating user
experiences that remove thebarriers. Yeah. Especially if we
(09:18):
want to capitalize on the factthat people interact with their
phones, people interact withmarketplaces and products
already today. Yeah. In acertain way, we shouldn't resist
against that we should try toleverage that we should try to
leverage all the innovation andtechnology that had been
invested billions and billionsof dollars invested by tech
companies like Apple to trainsociety in a certain way to be
(09:41):
able to get things done on theirphone, whether it's work or
personal, or purchasing thingsonline. And so as easy as it is
to now consume on the internetto consume on an online platform
to consume through an app. Itshould be that easy to be able
to give it In overflow areinnovating every day, right
(10:02):
eventually, and actually notinto the far distant future,
you're going to be able to givein so many wet Apple Pay Venmo
you know, all these things thatyou're already using in your day
to day? Why isn't that presentin some of our giving apps and
some of our applications thatwe're inviting people to use to
(10:24):
be able to be generous towardsour organization? I think the
spiritual dynamic is what yousaid, though, how do we continue
to remind people and refreshpeople, and the fact that it's
as simple as that childlikefaith, you once had, that
childlike faith, if you did comefrom a good family, and you had
trust in your parents, you had agood father, right. And even if
(10:45):
you did it, to remind yourselfthat the reason you're a
believer from the first placewas because of this revelation
that you do have a heavenlyFather, a father that has your
name reserved at his table, andhave a you literally have a
reservation at the nicestrestaurant. It's called the
(11:08):
heaven, like at the most bougie.
Like, you know, I heard like, Ithink the streets are gold, and
luminescent. And you know, allthat type of stuff like, like,
this is like nothing that we'veever experienced. And God has
reserved that, but not onlyreserved it for a time, and a
place, and a season and adestination. But even Jesus
(11:29):
prayed on earth, as it is inheaven. Yeah, that that the
richness and the abundance andthe provision and the protection
that exists in heaven that weread about exists on earth, as
well, that that we have thatbridge because of Jesus. And if
(11:51):
we can just remind ourselves andrefresh ourselves in the
simplicity of that fact that,amen, okay. He's not just a
father, but he's a good father.
Yeah, he's a father that wantsto bless me he, I'm not a beggar
anymore. There's a story in theNew Testament, about a blind
(12:11):
beggar at the bottom pretty muchof the planet in Jericho, right?
Because at that time, I actuallyeven today, it's below sea
level. Right? So it's like ablind beggar at the bottom of
the planet. Well, he's cryingout for Jesus, Jesus, Son of
David, would you have mercy onme? Right? He couldn't see.
(12:33):
Yeah, he couldn't see. But ButBut he, he cries out to Jesus
and the Son, Son of DavidWright, the Son of Man, it's a
language used for the Messiah.
It's language used for Jesus inthis story, the son of man stops
in his tracks. And then all of asudden, the blind beggar makes
(12:57):
his way towards Jesus. And, youknow, ultimately, if you know
this story, he gets healed,right? He takes off his cloak,
he runs to Jesus he, he getshealed. What's so interesting
about this story is that, youknow, Jericho, if you're
familiar with this town. It'salso the place hundreds of years
(13:21):
earlier, where Joshua or Joshuaactually circled this town,
because it was fortified, andGod had promised this town to
them. And similar to the blindbeggar shouted, right, and we
know, in the Old Testament, thewalls fall down on the way to
(13:47):
their promise. But even withinthe story of Joshua, there was
another moment where they'rebattling and they're winning.
And Joshua prays to God, God,would you would you actually
have this stuff son stand still,because we really want to
(14:07):
solidify this victory in thefirst time ever recorded in
history. The son stands still.
Yeah. What's so crazy aboutthat, that that was literally in
the same place that this blindbeggar shouts to Jesus, who is
(14:29):
the son Joshua, which is inHebrew, Yeshua, which is another
name for Jesus. He yells, andthe physical son stands still so
they could solidify the victory.
Wow. Hundreds of years later inthe same place. In Jericho, a
(14:49):
blind beggar shouts yells infaith, and the sun Not, not the
ash. Namakkal son, but the Sonof Man, the Son of God stands
still, I don't know what's moreof a miracle. If the Sun
standing still like literallylike the sun in them when the
(15:10):
sun is standing still, or theson of man, the Son of God
stopping in his tracks, becausehe cares about a blind beggar,
it's powerful. There's nothingthat you can do for God to love
you more, there's nothing thatyou can do for God to love you
less the same way he can makethe sun and the stars stand
(15:33):
still, the same way that he cansend Jesus to this planet. Yeah,
and get stopped in his tracksfor a blind beggar is the same
way he can provide for yourfinances. It's that simple,
totally. You have a good father,that spans generations that
spans circumstances that spanshistory. And science that spans
(15:56):
difficulties and trials, thatspans across all of these
things. And when he went on thatcrossed the Bible informs us is
that he didn't go there just foran event. He went there to
abolish your sin, past, present,and future, so that when He
(16:19):
abolished that sin, you couldnow be a son, you can now be a
daughter. It all is that simple.
If you actually grab that, andcontinue to remind yourself and
refresh yourselves in that. Andyou know, that man, my father,
he's a good father. He hasprovision, yeah, he has
(16:40):
protection, then you canactually live out not just when
you're five, or 10, or 12. Butmaybe when you're 3555. I hope
when I'm 75. I can havechildlike generosity, I can have
child like, faith,same. And I think one of the big
concepts around it that I wasjust thinking about, as you were
(17:04):
talking is releasing control.
Because when you give, not onlyare you releasing what you have,
you're also releasing thecontrol of what is done with
what you have. Right? Wow. Andwhen you're a kid, you don't
think about that. You don'tcare, you're just like, I just
(17:24):
see an issue, I want to meet theneed. Like I remember, like one
of the first times I saw ahomeless person, like when kids
see homeless people for thefirst time, they aren't afraid
of them. They're like, Oh, man,someone needs help. It's usually
the parents that pull them intighter, because they're not
sure right of the situation.
Whereas God is telling all ofus, like, Let's go meet the
needs like, right, give thecontrol to me, I'll handle the
(17:45):
rest. And I think that's, it'sreally gripping when you think
about how often we actually needto practice giving up control.
And I love that because youknow, a lot of people will hear
that and be like, Oh, well, oh,it's because of drugs are hazy.
Oh, you know, what they actuallydo? And you know, at the end of
(18:07):
the day, especially if you're afather or a mother, you're a
parent. Who cares about yourpolitics in that moment? Right,
right. If you have a chance tomodel to your son to your
daughter, that doesn't knowanything about anything, why not
model generosity, right? Why notjust taken up? What's $1 to you?
Totally right, what's a coupleof bucks in that situation?
(18:29):
Because it's so much more thanyour politics is about the
purpose, and what you're tryingto develop in the next
generation.
Absolutely. And even if somebodyelse isn't impacted by it,
you're going to be impacted.
There you go. See by beinggenerous, like I remember my
brother, when we were on amission trip to Los Angeles
years ago, we saw a homelessperson on Hollywood Boulevard.
(18:50):
And my brother was adamantbecause we weren't on the
mission trip. We were notallowed to give out physical
cash to them. So he's like,Alright, I want to buy this guy
a meal. McDonald's was rightnext door, came up to the guy.
He's like, I'm gonna buy youdinner. McDonald's. What do you
want? He said, I don't wantanything. Yeah, I want money.
Yeah, sure. So he's like,Alright, I'm gonna just buy him.
Whatever. Yeah, give it to him.
(19:13):
puts it down. The man literallygets up, walks into the
trashcan, throws an O and putshis sign back up. Okay. And we
were all like, so shaken up bythis. Like, how does he just
like, how disrespectful mybrother's like, I don't care.
Yeah. It wasn't like, that's noton me. Right? Like God told me
to be generous. I'm not payingattention to what the guy told
(19:34):
me to do. I'm doing what Godtold me to do. Good. And I'm
like, man, God is telling us.
Yeah, to trust Him. God istelling us to give up control.
God is telling us to honor withthe tide. Yeah. Are we going to
choose that obedience?
Yeah, it's so good. And youknow, if you're leading a church
if you're a senior churchleader, a pastor executive
(19:55):
pastor, I think some of For thetimes that are leading people,
we make things so complex whenit's actually so simple, not
easy, right? Not easy, right?
But the word of God is not meantto be confusing. There is
complexity. I mean, the word ofGod is something that you could
(20:17):
be studying your whole life. Butthere are certain specific and
simple truths that might not beeasy, but should be taught with
as much clarity. And in clarity,there is so much energy, you
know, when people get arevelation about something, when
when God starts, you know,scaling, the Bible talks about
(20:41):
scales on your eyes when thosestart falling, and you know,
somebody gets the simplerevelation of grace or, or the
simple revelation of generosity,if they just start applying it.
And that's the thing, right? Wecan't just preach at people, we
got to make it practical. Yeah.
(21:01):
And that's actually what setspeople free. Totally. Right.
Faith without works is literallyJames says dead. And so we can't
just preach faith, we need toshow faith, we need to make it
so practicable. So applicable,what we say at our church is we
want Sundays to preach to yourMondays, we want this to be
(21:22):
something that you leave aSunday service that you can
apply straight in your home, youcan apply straight with your
family and buy straight withyour finances. And I think
that's something that we need togo back to a lot of times people
think that pastoring is a fancypulpit and a fancy preach, and
you got your alliterated points,and you know, things are flowing
(21:44):
and things are rhyming andthings are, you know, and and
but at the end of the day, ifthey didn't do it, you didn't
build anything. Yeah, if youdidn't influence an action,
right, if you didn't influencean application, the community
literally didn't grow. Yeah, youjust had a good stand up comedy
(22:05):
routine. And there's nothingwrong and humor and there's
nothing wrong and making surethat words flows so that they
can be caught and that they canbe carried and they can be
remembered. I'm all for that. Itry to pride myself and working
on my craft to be in order. Butat the end of the day, what are
we building? Yeah, we want tobuild childlike dependence on
(22:27):
God. Yeah. Not creating childdish, Christian, but creating
people with childlike faith, toremember that, hey, they have a
good father, they have somebodythat can supply all of their
needs, and sometimes thatchildlike faith is the most
mature thing that you can do.
Thanksso much for listening to the
(22:49):
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(23:33):
much. We'll see you next time.
childlike generosity.
(00:00):
It'spowerful when you give, not only
(00:01):
are you releasing what you have,you're also releasing the
control of what is done withwhat you have. Right. Wow. And
when you're a kid you don'tthink about that. A pastor term
tech leader and a millennialchurchgoer, explore the
intersection of technology,culture and faith, equipping you
with innovative strategies tosupport you as you live out your
(00:22):
calling leader churches withconfidence to step into the
future together. This is thegive it up podcast. Okay, Vance.
So I feel like the church talksoften about childlike faith.
Yeah, it's beautiful. But Iactually want to talk about an
offshoot of childlike faith,which is childlike generosity,
remix. Remix. Yes. And Iactually have to start by
(00:45):
sharing my first story ofgenerosity in my life. Because
it really, I think, set the tonefor how I am as an adult,
because I was seven years old.
And I had just gone to this newchurch with my family, and I was
in the kids ministry. And up onthe screen, they played this
(01:06):
video. Now, granted, this is preTOMS Shoes, okay? They play this
video of kids in Haiti withoutshoes, right? It was like this
really moving to three minutevideo, like, look at the bare
feet, look at them running. ButI remember like being gripped at
seven years old, like looking,looking at my own shoes being
like, How is this possible,right? I've never seen another
(01:28):
human being without shoes,right? At this point in my life.
So I went home that day, becausethey ended the video by saying,
guess what, next week as a kidsministry, we're going to have an
opportunity to raise money tobuy kids in Haiti shoes. Wow.
And I was like, yeah, it's gone.
Because I'm like, counting allthe shoes I have. And I was
like, this is a problem I need.
(01:51):
Right? So go home, becauseyou're a sneakerhead at that
time. I mean, it was almostprophetic at that point that I
would one day be a sneaker. Butyes, yeah. So I tell my parents,
I'm like, I'm so excited. We'regonna give to this next week.
And I'm like, Oh, that'sawesome. So I go upstairs, and I
go to my piggy bank, which wasone of those jumbo Crayola
(02:11):
crayons. Yeah. Do you know whatthese look like? Yeah, of
course, they're like, literallyfour feet tall, which is as tall
as me. It's seven. And I poppedthe cap off of it. And I looked
down the barrel. And I'm like,Yeah, that's gonna be perfect.
Put it back on. Fast forward aweek. That Sunday morning, I
shoot wide awake, okay, becauseI'm so excited because I know
what today is. And so I lug mycrayon filled with coins down
(02:37):
the stairs, and try and go outto the car and my mom stops me.
She's like, Oh, my gosh, so whatare you do it? I was like, Mom,
I'm giving. I'm bringing mypiggy bank with me to give for
these kids in Haiti. And she'slike, well, we don't need to
bring the whole crayon. Right.
We could put it in a bag. Yeah.
Which I was like, I guess thatis less extra. So we fill up
this like gallon ziplock bag,and it is probably 20 pounds of
(03:01):
coins. I mean, this thing waslike, busting at the seams. So
now I walk into church, like Ijust robbed a bank of only its
coins. And I drop it on theseat, like slide and under my
chair, and I'm so pumped forthis giving. And then the moment
finally comes. And I see I leteverybody else go first. Not to
cause a scene, of course, is mythinking. So these kids are
(03:24):
dropping in like 50 cents. $1like no doubt, surely what their
parents gave thema tie button to get rain.
I weighed two then I like carrymy 20 pound bag up. And so
stupidly, instead of justputting it in there. I opened
the bag. Yes, dollar. Coins areshooting everywhere. They're
(03:47):
like bouncing off of the bucket.
I love it. It's likeoverflowing, no pun intended
one. And the pastor stops theservice. Yes, it goes, Wait a
second here. What's going onhere? He's like, looking right
at me. And He hands the mic tome. And I was like, I'm giving
for the shoes. And he was like,How much is this? And I was
(04:07):
like, It's all that I have. AndI found out later it was
probably $70 worth of coins thatI gave to that. And it literally
was all that I have. Wow.
Talking about this today. If Iwas so compelled by a vision and
a mission that I drained my bankaccount. Yeah. It would not be
(04:30):
all that I have. Yeah. Becauseof how wealth is diversified and
non cash assets. Yeah, yeah. Butit's this concept of kids
feeling the security to know Ican give everything because my
daddy has got me. Yeah, that'sokay. No, and I think about
stories you tell tell about thestory of the kids whenever you
(04:53):
guys were raising for the Vivecampus.
Yeah, I mean, when we werelooking to raise $8 million in
45 days. Is we appealed to a fewbillionaires and we raise zero
from them, which was kind ofcrazy. Yeah. That's another
podcast and another story foranother day. But it was so crazy
because kids in our church, likelittle girls, starting lemonade
(05:17):
stands were raising 1000s ofdollars and more generous than
some adults in some households.
I love that childlikegenerosity. I mean, it's
powerful. It's really, reallypowerful. That story is
powerful. And I was even justgetting in the fields a little
bit to think that you had thatchildlike generosity, that
childlike faith, to emptyeverything and even be able to
(05:39):
share that testimony in front ofthe whole church, I'm sure that
inspired so many people, and Ieven just think about the words
of Jesus, right? Like, if youwant to inherit the kingdom of
God, you have to have childlikefaith, right. And if you even
hinder anything like that, he'sactually like, it would be
better for you to put somethingon your neck so heavy that you
(06:00):
would float to the bottom of theocean, which is like, right, I
don't know, people think thatJesus was a pacifist, but like,
he was pretty savage sometimes.
And so I just, I get so impactedby that. I mean, we've seen it
in our community. And every timethat I reflected, I meditate on
this teaching. Every time Iinteract with it actually
(06:24):
happening in real life, I getmoved. I get compelled. Why we
lost that. That's,that's how, yes, maybe there's
more bills. Yes, there's moreresponsibility for you. But it's
almost like the moment that youfeel the responsibility is on
you. Yeah, you lose that.
Yeah. There is an element towhere when you are of that age,
(06:46):
have that mindset on adulteratedby the world. You are in this
phase of life where nothing tolose, relatively speaking. Yeah.
Right. And so when you step intomore responsibility, when you
step into more assets, when youstep into dependence, you have
(07:07):
like actual people that dependon you. Yeah. Yeah, you do, you
do have to reckon with the factthat now you have something to
lose. And so I think that's partof it. Yeah. I do also think
that across developing fromchild like, NIS, to adolescence
(07:27):
to adulthood, there is thisprogression of jadedness for
sure. Yeah, that's you go on.
Yeah. I don't know. What what'syour experience?
Yeah. I mean, I would say that,when you realize that the weight
of things getting done now restson you, and not somebody else.
(07:48):
It it really pulls that out offrame. But that's the thing is
like, I always try and challengemyself of like, wait, no, it
doesn't. No, God, God is in allthings. Yes. Not just like some
things. If I invite Him intoevery part of my life, then he's
in all things and, but it'sreally hard to kind of keep
grasping that. And quitehonestly, I think we make it too
(08:12):
complex, right? Like if a sevenyear old, can be compelled to
give everything they have. Itwas that simple. And it's not
like I stand alone in that, likeyou're talking about these
girls, and their lemonade standslike, there was something that
children understand aboutgiving. That is not only so
inherent, it's so simple. Yeah.
And I think of, you know, likecompanies like Apple who make
(08:33):
things simple. Oh, I like that.
I have a my best friend's son istwo years old, and knows how to
FaceTime me. Wow, that'sterrifying, actually. But the
fact that they can understandgreen red call hang up. That's
(08:54):
pretty crazy. Yeah. How how canthe church how can tech
companies, how can we create amovement to make generosity and
the complex thought of givingsimple once again?
Yeah, I mean, some of it isactually in the technology,
right? It's creating userinterfaces. It's creating user
experiences that remove thebarriers. Yeah. Especially if we
(09:18):
want to capitalize on the factthat people interact with their
phones, people interact withmarketplaces and products
already today. Yeah. In acertain way, we shouldn't resist
against that we should try toleverage that we should try to
leverage all the innovation andtechnology that had been
invested billions and billionsof dollars invested by tech
companies like Apple to trainsociety in a certain way to be
(09:41):
able to get things done on theirphone, whether it's work or
personal, or purchasing thingsonline. And so as easy as it is
to now consume on the internetto consume on an online platform
to consume through an app. Itshould be that easy to be able
to give it In overflow areinnovating every day, right
(10:02):
eventually, and actually notinto the far distant future,
you're going to be able to givein so many wet Apple Pay Venmo
you know, all these things thatyou're already using in your day
to day? Why isn't that presentin some of our giving apps and
some of our applications thatwe're inviting people to use to
(10:24):
be able to be generous towardsour organization? I think the
spiritual dynamic is what yousaid, though, how do we continue
to remind people and refreshpeople, and the fact that it's
as simple as that childlikefaith, you once had, that
childlike faith, if you did comefrom a good family, and you had
trust in your parents, you had agood father, right. And even if
(10:45):
you did it, to remind yourselfthat the reason you're a
believer from the first placewas because of this revelation
that you do have a heavenlyFather, a father that has your
name reserved at his table, andhave a you literally have a
reservation at the nicestrestaurant. It's called the
(11:08):
heaven, like at the most bougie.
Like, you know, I heard like, Ithink the streets are gold, and
luminescent. And you know, allthat type of stuff like, like,
this is like nothing that we'veever experienced. And God has
reserved that, but not onlyreserved it for a time, and a
place, and a season and adestination. But even Jesus
(11:29):
prayed on earth, as it is inheaven. Yeah, that that the
richness and the abundance andthe provision and the protection
that exists in heaven that weread about exists on earth, as
well, that that we have thatbridge because of Jesus. And if
(11:51):
we can just remind ourselves andrefresh ourselves in the
simplicity of that fact that,amen, okay. He's not just a
father, but he's a good father.
Yeah, he's a father that wantsto bless me he, I'm not a beggar
anymore. There's a story in theNew Testament, about a blind
(12:11):
beggar at the bottom pretty muchof the planet in Jericho, right?
Because at that time, I actuallyeven today, it's below sea
level. Right? So it's like ablind beggar at the bottom of
the planet. Well, he's cryingout for Jesus, Jesus, Son of
David, would you have mercy onme? Right? He couldn't see.
(12:33):
Yeah, he couldn't see. But ButBut he, he cries out to Jesus
and the Son, Son of DavidWright, the Son of Man, it's a
language used for the Messiah.
It's language used for Jesus inthis story, the son of man stops
in his tracks. And then all of asudden, the blind beggar makes
(12:57):
his way towards Jesus. And, youknow, ultimately, if you know
this story, he gets healed,right? He takes off his cloak,
he runs to Jesus he, he getshealed. What's so interesting
about this story is that, youknow, Jericho, if you're
familiar with this town. It'salso the place hundreds of years
(13:21):
earlier, where Joshua or Joshuaactually circled this town,
because it was fortified, andGod had promised this town to
them. And similar to the blindbeggar shouted, right, and we
know, in the Old Testament, thewalls fall down on the way to
(13:47):
their promise. But even withinthe story of Joshua, there was
another moment where they'rebattling and they're winning.
And Joshua prays to God, God,would you would you actually
have this stuff son stand still,because we really want to
(14:07):
solidify this victory in thefirst time ever recorded in
history. The son stands still.
Yeah. What's so crazy aboutthat, that that was literally in
the same place that this blindbeggar shouts to Jesus, who is
(14:29):
the son Joshua, which is inHebrew, Yeshua, which is another
name for Jesus. He yells, andthe physical son stands still so
they could solidify the victory.
Wow. Hundreds of years later inthe same place. In Jericho, a
(14:49):
blind beggar shouts yells infaith, and the sun Not, not the
ash. Namakkal son, but the Sonof Man, the Son of God stands
still, I don't know what's moreof a miracle. If the Sun
standing still like literallylike the sun in them when the
(15:10):
sun is standing still, or theson of man, the Son of God
stopping in his tracks, becausehe cares about a blind beggar,
it's powerful. There's nothingthat you can do for God to love
you more, there's nothing thatyou can do for God to love you
less the same way he can makethe sun and the stars stand
(15:33):
still, the same way that he cansend Jesus to this planet. Yeah,
and get stopped in his tracksfor a blind beggar is the same
way he can provide for yourfinances. It's that simple,
totally. You have a good father,that spans generations that
spans circumstances that spanshistory. And science that spans
(15:56):
difficulties and trials, thatspans across all of these
things. And when he went on thatcrossed the Bible informs us is
that he didn't go there just foran event. He went there to
abolish your sin, past, present,and future, so that when He
(16:19):
abolished that sin, you couldnow be a son, you can now be a
daughter. It all is that simple.
If you actually grab that, andcontinue to remind yourself and
refresh yourselves in that. Andyou know, that man, my father,
he's a good father. He hasprovision, yeah, he has
(16:40):
protection, then you canactually live out not just when
you're five, or 10, or 12. Butmaybe when you're 3555. I hope
when I'm 75. I can havechildlike generosity, I can have
child like, faith,same. And I think one of the big
concepts around it that I wasjust thinking about, as you were
(17:04):
talking is releasing control.
Because when you give, not onlyare you releasing what you have,
you're also releasing thecontrol of what is done with
what you have. Right? Wow. Andwhen you're a kid, you don't
think about that. You don'tcare, you're just like, I just
(17:24):
see an issue, I want to meet theneed. Like I remember, like one
of the first times I saw ahomeless person, like when kids
see homeless people for thefirst time, they aren't afraid
of them. They're like, Oh, man,someone needs help. It's usually
the parents that pull them intighter, because they're not
sure right of the situation.
Whereas God is telling all ofus, like, Let's go meet the
needs like, right, give thecontrol to me, I'll handle the
(17:45):
rest. And I think that's, it'sreally gripping when you think
about how often we actually needto practice giving up control.
And I love that because youknow, a lot of people will hear
that and be like, Oh, well, oh,it's because of drugs are hazy.
Oh, you know, what they actuallydo? And you know, at the end of
(18:07):
the day, especially if you're afather or a mother, you're a
parent. Who cares about yourpolitics in that moment? Right,
right. If you have a chance tomodel to your son to your
daughter, that doesn't knowanything about anything, why not
model generosity, right? Why notjust taken up? What's $1 to you?
Totally right, what's a coupleof bucks in that situation?
(18:29):
Because it's so much more thanyour politics is about the
purpose, and what you're tryingto develop in the next
generation.
Absolutely. And even if somebodyelse isn't impacted by it,
you're going to be impacted.
There you go. See by beinggenerous, like I remember my
brother, when we were on amission trip to Los Angeles
years ago, we saw a homelessperson on Hollywood Boulevard.
(18:50):
And my brother was adamantbecause we weren't on the
mission trip. We were notallowed to give out physical
cash to them. So he's like,Alright, I want to buy this guy
a meal. McDonald's was rightnext door, came up to the guy.
He's like, I'm gonna buy youdinner. McDonald's. What do you
want? He said, I don't wantanything. Yeah, I want money.
Yeah, sure. So he's like,Alright, I'm gonna just buy him.
Whatever. Yeah, give it to him.
(19:13):
puts it down. The man literallygets up, walks into the
trashcan, throws an O and putshis sign back up. Okay. And we
were all like, so shaken up bythis. Like, how does he just
like, how disrespectful mybrother's like, I don't care.
Yeah. It wasn't like, that's noton me. Right? Like God told me
to be generous. I'm not payingattention to what the guy told
(19:34):
me to do. I'm doing what Godtold me to do. Good. And I'm
like, man, God is telling us.
Yeah, to trust Him. God istelling us to give up control.
God is telling us to honor withthe tide. Yeah. Are we going to
choose that obedience?
Yeah, it's so good. And youknow, if you're leading a church
if you're a senior churchleader, a pastor executive
(19:55):
pastor, I think some of For thetimes that are leading people,
we make things so complex whenit's actually so simple, not
easy, right? Not easy, right?
But the word of God is not meantto be confusing. There is
complexity. I mean, the word ofGod is something that you could
(20:17):
be studying your whole life. Butthere are certain specific and
simple truths that might not beeasy, but should be taught with
as much clarity. And in clarity,there is so much energy, you
know, when people get arevelation about something, when
when God starts, you know,scaling, the Bible talks about
(20:41):
scales on your eyes when thosestart falling, and you know,
somebody gets the simplerevelation of grace or, or the
simple revelation of generosity,if they just start applying it.
And that's the thing, right? Wecan't just preach at people, we
got to make it practical. Yeah.
(21:01):
And that's actually what setspeople free. Totally. Right.
Faith without works is literallyJames says dead. And so we can't
just preach faith, we need toshow faith, we need to make it
so practicable. So applicable,what we say at our church is we
want Sundays to preach to yourMondays, we want this to be
(21:22):
something that you leave aSunday service that you can
apply straight in your home, youcan apply straight with your
family and buy straight withyour finances. And I think
that's something that we need togo back to a lot of times people
think that pastoring is a fancypulpit and a fancy preach, and
you got your alliterated points,and you know, things are flowing
(21:44):
and things are rhyming andthings are, you know, and and
but at the end of the day, ifthey didn't do it, you didn't
build anything. Yeah, if youdidn't influence an action,
right, if you didn't influencean application, the community
literally didn't grow. Yeah, youjust had a good stand up comedy
(22:05):
routine. And there's nothingwrong and humor and there's
nothing wrong and making surethat words flows so that they
can be caught and that they canbe carried and they can be
remembered. I'm all for that. Itry to pride myself and working
on my craft to be in order. Butat the end of the day, what are
we building? Yeah, we want tobuild childlike dependence on
(22:27):
God. Yeah. Not creating childdish, Christian, but creating
people with childlike faith, toremember that, hey, they have a
good father, they have somebodythat can supply all of their
needs, and sometimes thatchildlike faith is the most
mature thing that you can do.
Thanksso much for listening to the
(22:49):
give it up podcast if you wantto receive even more insights on
church innovation, culture andgiving. Now you can sign up for
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(23:10):
backslash insider, or just clickthe link in our bio to sign up
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more church leaders. Could youplease subscribe and leave a
review for the show? This tellsthe podcast players what people
are enjoying and want to hearmore of and we are adamant about
providing maximum value to evenmore church leaders. Thanks so
(23:33):
much. We'll see you next time.
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