September 15, 2025 • 26 mins
Welcome to the God is Good Podcast! Host Carol O’Brien speaks with Karen, an inspiring storyteller on a mission to unite Christians and reignite faith. In “Take My Hand,” Karen shares her personal journey from her Salvation Army roots, through moments of wandering and rediscovery, to embracing Catholicism and becoming a passionate advocate for Christian unity.
Episode Highlights
- Meet Karen: Karen, a convert to Catholicism, reflects on how her Salvation Army upbringing first introduced her to the joy of faith and community, and how her experiences shaped her commitment to helping others find Jesus.
- Childhood & Salvationist Roots: From a Lutheran baptism to a transformative encounter at a Salvation Army vacation Bible school, Karen tells of her early faith foundation and the impact of feeling truly seen and loved by God.
- Adolescent Challenges: Karen candidly discusses her college years, when she drifted from her faith, wrestled with shame, and eventually learned to accept God’s forgiveness and grace—discovering anew the power of self-forgiveness.
- Family Transformation: Through her faith journey, Karen’s rekindled relationship with God inspires her family—including her father and even her extended family—to return to church and rediscover their own faith.
- Spiritual Transitions: Karen and her husband’s search for a faith community leads them through Methodist and Catholic experiences, culminating in their joyful welcome into the Catholic Church during the 2022 Easter Vigil.
- Living a Faith-Filled Life: Today, Karen teaches at a Catholic high school, writes for CatholicMom.com and Living Faith Kids, and hosts her own podcast, “Stand. Kneel. Now What?” helping others stay on fire for Christ and encouraging young people to remain rooted in faith.
- Psalm 73—A Guiding Light: Karen’s favorite psalm reminds her (and listeners) that God is always present, even when life feels unfair or overwhelming—He holds our hands and guides us through every trial.
Memorable Quotes
- “I realized that I could either carry God’s love for me, or I could carry my shame for the rest of my life. But I couldn’t carry them both at the same time.” – Karen
- “If we put our division aside, we could come together and just be this beautiful Christian family…sometimes cousins at the dining table that sometimes get along and sometimes fight.” – Karen
- "Look at all these other beautiful things that are all pointing to Jesus." – Carol
- “You can’t light fires if you are not lighting your fire too.” – Karen
- “God is the rock of my heart, my portion forever.” – Psalm 73
Karen's Links
- Podcast: : https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/stand-kneel-now-what/id1700467911
- Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/stand_kneel_now_what/
- Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/people/Stand-Kneel-Now-What-Podcast/100094002187472/
- Catholic Mom website: https://www.catholicmom.com/
Our goal with this episode is to move at least one heart toward God -- is it yours? Let us know! And if you'd like to get involved by becoming a storyteller or donating to the movement, please visit:
Web: godisgoodpodcast.com
Social: www.facebook.com/groups/godisgoodpodcast/
Some of our episodes mention the ACTS Retreat, which is an evangelization retreat from ACTS Missions in San Antonio, TX: www.actsmissions.org.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Carol (00:09):
Welcome to the God Is Good podcast, where we share
stories of everyday people whohave reignited their faith in
Jesus and experienced remarkablelife transformations.
My name is Carol O'Brien.
I'm your host for this podcast,and it would mean the world to
me if you would share ourpodcast with others who might
really benefit from hearing ourepisodes.
(00:32):
As for me, my feet had almoststumbled.
My steps had nearly slippedbecause I was envious of the
arrogant when I saw theprosperity of the wicked.
Yet I am always with you.
You take hold of my right hand,though my flesh and my heart
fail, God is the rock of myheart, my portion forever.
(00:54):
Psalm 73 verses two throughthree and 23 through 26.
I am delighted to introduce ournewest storyteller, Karen, to
the God Is Good Podcast.
Karen is passionate aboutsharing her faith and bringing
people together.
As a convert to Catholicism.
She is grateful for hersalvationist roots, which first
(01:16):
brought her the joy of Jesus.
Karen's mission is to inspireothers and help unite
Christians, especially bybuilding a bridge between
Catholics and Protestantsthrough her podcast.
So please sit back and relax.
Grab a cup of coffee and join mein hearing Karen's story of
transformation.
(01:37):
Welcome Karen to the GoddessGood Podcast.
Karen (01:40):
Thanks for having me.
Carol (01:42):
We're excited to talk to you and as I start every
podcast, I want to know aboutyour childhood and how you grew
up.
Can you tell us about your faithfoundation as a child?
Karen (01:52):
Yeah, for sure.
This is one of my favoritestories.
I was baptized as a Lutheran butwe never went to church growing
up.
My family consisted of my momwho had been married and
divorced before she had met mydad.
And from her first marriage, shehad my sister who is nine years
(02:13):
older than I am.
So there's a huge age gapbetween my sister and I.
My dad grew up Lutheran, butdidn't really stay with the
church later on in life, butknew I needed to be baptized.
So I was baptized.
And then in second grade I metmy best friend and we're still
best friends 30 years later.
(02:33):
I actually made fun of her onthe playground.
She had just moved in to wherewe lived at the time, and she
was wearing the world's ugliestoutfit I've ever seen.
It was a yellow polo shirt and abrown pleated skirt, and then
(02:53):
white socks.
And I went up to her and I said,you know what?
Your outfit is really ugly.
And she said this is for a groupthat my church does, and we're
going to have vacation Bibleschool as soon as school's over.
Do you want to come?
And I said, yeah.
I went home that night and toldmy dad and my mom that I had met
(03:14):
my now best friend, and said,can I go to vacation Bible
school with her?
Parents were like let's check itout.
So that ended up being theSalvation Army.
And my parents were okay withit.
They're Trinitarian; It'sbasically an offshoot of the
Methodist Church.
And so I went, into vacationBible school but I didn't really
(03:37):
know anything.
Our leader for the second gradegroup-- the joy that radiated
off of his face and in his lifeand his wife's.
Like they just had somethingthat I knew as a second grader
that I wanted.
And so I kept going to churchwith them.
Later on in life I left and wenta different path.
But I will always acknowledge myroots in the Salvation Army and
(04:00):
just love that's where I metJesus for myself.
Carol (04:04):
It sounds like it was so joyful.
I can just see it on your facethat it was a really wonderful
experience.
What was so great about it andwhat was so different?
Karen (04:12):
I had finally experienced Jesus.
And it's funny that you say,that was so joyful because
that's my best friend's name isJoy.
And so I just knew that's whereI needed to be.
And eventually my family startedcoming to church with me again.
So it reignited my dad's passionfor Christ.
I don't think he ever lost faithin Jesus himself.
(04:34):
I just think he becamedisenfranchised with church in
general.
And so my family started comingto church with me.
My grandparents finally came tochurch with me.
My nephew, who has DownSyndrome, started going to
church too, all at the SalvationArmy.
So I really credit the SalvationArmy for not only igniting my
(04:56):
fire, but igniting the fire inmy family too, and wanting to
experience Jesus on a deeperlevel.
Carol (05:02):
It sounds like you were already an evangelist in the
second grade.
Karen (05:07):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Carol (05:08):
So talk about the period of time where you might have
strayed a little bit away fromthat joy.
Karen (05:16):
Yes.
A lot of people don't know thatthe Salvation Army is even a
church.
When I tell people that's whereI grew up, a lot of them think I
worshiped in a thrift store,which is not true at all.
We have church buildings.
But what's funny but not funny.
So I had gone off to college andbefore I had left for college, I
had taken what is basically acatechist class.
(05:38):
So in the Salvation Army, thereare no sacraments.
So there's no baptism.
There's no communion, and thenthere's no confirmation.
At age 11, they do a programcalled Junior Soldiers where
they allow you to declare yourintentions for Christ.
And with that you sign a littlething that says that you won't
smoke, you won't drink, youwon't have premarital sex, you
(06:01):
won't do all of this stuff.
And it's just like tenets offaith that you promised to
uphold.
And so that's what we do at age11.
And then when you become 18, youcan become a senior soldier.
And I had taken the classes,even though I had already
decided that I didn't want tobecome a senior soldier because
one of the tenets of theSalvation Army is that you don't
(06:22):
drink.
And I knew I was going off tocollege and I knew I was
probably going to drink.
And I didn't want to sign apiece of paper and make a
promise to God that I wasn'tgoing to keep.
And so even though I had gonethrough the classes, I had just
decided that it wasn't for me.
I had decided I wasn't going tobecome a senior soldier and I
(06:44):
was also doing what kids incollege do.
I was straying away from myfaith.
And so in college I was talkingthe talk, but I was not walking
the walk.
And I would tell people I was aChristian, but I was living a
very different life and somepeople were surprised.
They were like, you still callyourself a Christian and this is
(07:05):
how you're living your weekends?
And I was like, yeah, of course,aren't you?
I was trying to live life formyself and I was living for my
own happiness and I didn'treally care.
And it took me quite a long timeto get over that as a Christian
in general.
I lived in a lot of shame for along time.
(07:25):
And, I was looking at my eldestin the hospital and, I realized
that I could either carry God'slove for me or I could carry my
shame for the rest of my life.
But I couldn't carry them at thesame time.
And I had to put one down, and Ichose my shame to put down.
And then imparts the next partof my life...
Carol (07:45):
Before we get there I just heard a stat from Bishop
Baron that a high percentage ofyoung adults leave their faith
by the age of 22.
Wow.
So
I think that's an interesting thing that you said
that you had left at that time.
It's very common.
So before we get into that nextpart of your life, you had your
(08:06):
child and you said you were inthe hospital.
What was it about thatexperience that made you reflect
back on, okay, what am I goingto do with my life at this
point?
Karen (08:17):
Yeah, so my first child was an emergency C-section and a
very scary one.
So it was the night before I hadgone in because I thought I was
in labor.
My child was in the rightposition, ready to go, and they
said, it's not going to be thatlong.
And then at some point in 12hours she had flipped and she
(08:40):
was now not only breach, butthey call it Sunnyside up.
I like to tell people her heartwas facing my heart, which is
the complete wrong way for achild to be born.
But I was in very active labor.
By the time that they caughtthis, I was at, nine centimeters
dilated.
I was ready to go and everythinghappened very quickly.
And of course I went into labor,at two o'clock in the morning.
(09:02):
So they're trying to get myblood work back to see if I can
even have anesthesia, all thisstuff.
And it was terrifying.
And I've watched enough doctorshows to know that if a doctor
sprints out of a room, it's notokay.
And the doctor sprinted outtathe room and said, get her
prepped for surgery now.
And so it was one of thosethings that like, just...
(09:24):
I don't want to say it was anear death experience because my
daughter and I are fine.
We were fine then too.
We were in very capable hands.
But having that experience of itjust being really scary and the
fact that I could have lost her,I could have lost myself.
Childbirth in general is alwaysa scary thing to go through, but
when you have this emergencyhappen, and I was like, how can
(09:44):
I look at myself with suchdisdain and hatred?
And hate myself when I knowthat's not how God looks at me.
Like I had recognized that Godhad forgiven me at that point,
but I hadn't forgiven myself.
And so I just knew that Icouldn't pass that on to my
(10:05):
daughter.
I couldn't pass that on to anyother subsequent kids that I
had, like I, I needed them toknow how much they were loved by
God, not just me as a mom, but Ineeded them to know that they
were also wanted and loved andcared for and brought into this
world for a purpose.
But I had to know that myselftoo.
Carol (10:24):
I think that sometimes we are easy to forgive other people
but then it's so hard to forgiveourselves.
We understand it in our heads.
But we don't understand it inour hearts.
So it's remarkable that a badsituation got you to the point
where you realized God hadreally forgiven you.
Okay.
So we're moving into this nextpart of your life.
(10:45):
Tell us about that.
Karen (10:46):
So when my husband and I had gotten married about three
years before we had our firstkid, we knew that the Salvation
Army was not going to be thechurch for us simply because,
the area that we're in, theSalvation Army doesn't have a
lot of young couples or a lot ofcouples with families.
And I was looking for that.
(11:07):
I wanted that kind of supportsystem.
So we ended up joining aMethodist church that wasn't too
far from us.
We would go at five o'clock atnight and we would have our
service and then we would do adinner afterwards.
And it's just so beautifulgetting to break bread with the
community that you worship withtoo.
(11:28):
And so we did that and then wehad our kids and we had them
baptized.
And the church that we were apart of became more of a mega
church, which just turned us offaltogether.
And the funny thing is, so wewere going to the Methodist
church, but for preschool wewere sending my daughter to the
Catholic church that was closerto us because they were the only
(11:51):
school in the area that taughtSpanish even to the little bitty
kids.
So we were sending them to theCatholic school so that they
could learn Spanish.
And the, the fact that they weregetting religion was just a
bonus for me.
So around COVID, we had decidedthat we weren't going to go to
the Methodist church anymore,that it just wasn't suiting our
needs as a couple or as afamily.
(12:12):
And we took a break.
And then COVID hit and all thechurches everywhere shut down.
So we couldn't even church shoplike we wanted.
Fast forward in that next summerafter COVID and I came
downstairs and I looked at myhusband and I said, you know I
need a church community.
I'm really feeling called to getback involved in a church.
(12:34):
And I said, we're sending ourkids to Catholic school what do
you think about checking out theCatholic Church?
And he said do they drink coffeeand eat bacon'cause that's all I
care about?
And I said, you know what, I'mpretty sure I have had both in
front of my Catholic familymembers, so yeah.
And so that August, my mom tookthe kids for a little bit and we
(12:55):
went to our first Mass, just myhusband and I.
And unbeknownst to each other,before we'd even walked in, we
both silently prayed if this iswhere God wanted us, to make it
abundantly clear, and he did.
I was ready to join that day.
Like I was like, where do wesign up?
What do I have to do?
What class do I take?
My husband was a bit morereserved, and so it took us
(13:18):
until about the end of Octoberof 2021 before we officially
signed up for OCIA.
But we joined the CatholicChurch Easter Vigil of 2022, and
we will both tell you that it isthe best decision we have made
for ourselves, for our family.
I just, I couldn't be happierwith that decision.
And the fact that I get to takeCommunion and receive the
(13:42):
Eucharist is one of the greatestjoys that I have in life now.
Carol (13:46):
That's wonderful.
There's so many things that Iwanted to tell you about.
The coffee thing is hystericalbecause my husband didn't grow
up with any religion and he wasshopping around.
He went to the Mormons and heloved the Tabernacle choir and
he loved it all.
And then they told him hecouldn't have coffee and he was
(14:06):
like, what?
Yeah.
What religion or whatdenomination did your husband
grow up?
Karen (14:14):
So he was baptized Methodist and then also didn't
go to church a whole lot.
And he liked the Methodistchurch that we were a part of,
but then when it became more ofa mega church and really not
genuine in what we hadoriginally joined, he was like,
I'm done.
And so it was one of thosethings.
(14:34):
It was sad to see that he hadthis not great experience when
he was a teenager at a Baptistchurch and then now we're at
this Methodist church and he'snot having a great experience.
And he's a quiet guy, like I'mthe extrovert in the
relationship and he's more of anintrovert.
And he loved when we went, itwas RCIA when we went through
it, but now it's OCIA.
(14:55):
Anyway, he like participated andto see him really connect with
the people there and we talkabout saints stalking us.
He was a hundred percent stalkedby St.
Joseph.
And it was so amazing and hewould talk about St.
Joseph as this guy that he wasjust best friends with.
(15:15):
And I was like, this is trulywhere we're meant to be.
Carol (15:19):
I'm a cradle Catholic, so it's interesting.
Are the Methodists very close tothe Trinitarian, to the Baptist?
You seem very open to thoseexperiences.
Was it a hard transition or wasit easy transition at least on
the side of the Protestantdenominations?
Karen (15:36):
So the Salvation Army is Trinitarian.
However, once again, they don'thave any sacraments.
You can get married there, butit's not considered a sacrament.
If you get divorced, you don'thave to get an annulment.
But I really think the SalvationArmy is related to the Catholic
Church in different ways.
I've written an article about iton CatholicMom.com because I'm a
(15:57):
contributor author there, and sowhen we joined the Methodist
Church, it wasn't very hard forme because that's how I grew up.
But in the Methodist Church,they take communion.
It's once a month.
And my students now, I teach ata Catholic high school now and
they think this is so funny.
Communion was like whateverbread you had laying around.
But as far as like my husband, Ithink, because they only went,
(16:20):
they were like the Santa ClausEaster Bunny.
They only went on Christmas orEaster or when things were going
right in their family.
So I don't think he had such afirm foundation in his Baptist
faith that it made a differencewhere he went, after that.
Carol (16:37):
So did you face any questions or any backlash with
either family or friends forbecoming Catholic?
Karen (16:44):
Not so much with my family.
I was a little concerned becausemy dad is very Lutheran and I
thought I was going to break hisheart.
But in fact my dad, I would saynow is Catholic curious.
But not from my family becausemy dad's sister converted to
Catholicism when she married herhusband, and my cousins are
(17:05):
Catholic.
I would say some of my friendshave a difficult time with it
when I express the Sinlessnessof Mary or that I'm going to go
pray a rosary or I'm going toAdoration.
It's not that they aredisrespectful in it, they just
don't understand.
And so that is what really droveme to make my own podcast.
(17:27):
I wanted to make it this bridgebetween misconceptions that
people have of the Catholicfaith and Protestantism because
both are beautiful in differentways.
And I think if we put ourdivision aside, like we could
come together and just be thisbeautiful Christian family.
Instead right now we're likecousins at the dining table that
(17:49):
sometimes get along andsometimes fight.
Carol (17:52):
So you went through RCIA.
My husband went through it aswell, and I just saw how on fire
he became for Jesus.
He was like a sponge.
He just loved every bit aboutit.
And from day one has been onfire for Jesus.
Was it the same for you?
Or when would you say youtransformed from lukewarm to on
(18:14):
fire for Jesus?
Karen (18:16):
I was on fire like after that first Mass in August.
I have never experienced thescripture the way the Catholic
Church does it before.
In my Protestant faith, a lot offocus was on the New Testament
and not a lot was on the OldTestament.
And I never realized thatthey're mirrors.
No one had ever taken the timeto explain the beauty that comes
(18:40):
from looking at the Bible as awhole.
It was almost all like I knew alot about the gospel, but I knew
nothing that came before that.
And so realizing that everythingin the Bible has a purpose and
every scripture and every verseis for a reason, and that these
big"T" traditions are therebecause that's what was passed
on.
(19:00):
And it just, everything justclicked, like that light bulb
moment that you have.
And I was on fire as a preteenand a teenager for Christ, but
not in the way that I am now.
Like now, it's like I, I waseven telling my religious
education students at my parishthis morning.
I was like, this is every partof me.
Like I wake up and I can't stoptalking about Jesus.
(19:23):
And I go to bed and I wake upand I think about Jesus.
I was like, this is every day ofmy life.
Before it was like, I went tochurch on Sunday.
I went to youth group onWednesday night, and I tried to
live my life for God as much asI could, but now I know the end
goal is I want to be a saint andI want to take as many people
(19:45):
with me as I can, and I gottafigure out a way to do it.
And before it was just like, Iwant to be a good person for
God.
And now it's like I want to be agood person for God and I want
you to be a good person for God.
And I want to light your fireand your fire.
And your fire.
And your fire.
And how do we get there andwhat's next?
Carol (20:03):
Yeah, it was amazing transformation for me as well.
When you start to realizeeverything's pointing towards
Jesus.
The Old Testament points towardsJesus.
The Old Testament is hidden andrevealed in the New Testament
and the New Testament points toJesus.
And the relationship with Mary,.
Yeah., our traditions, oursacraments our liturgy,
(20:24):
everything is centered on Jesus.
And look at all these otherbeautiful things that are all
pointing to Jesus.
And if you just have one, thinkof all the things that you might
be missing.
So you became on fire for Jesus.
What are you doing with thaton-fired-ness now?
Karen (20:41):
Yeah, so even before I became Catholic, I found
CatholicMom.com.
It was when I was in the RCIAprocess that I found them
because even though my mom isphenomenal she's not Catholic,
and so I now had two childrenunder my charge where I was now
a Catholic mom and I neededsomething to help me figure out
(21:03):
how to be a Catholic mom.
So I was listening to theCatholic Mom cast and I was
reading their blog every day andthey were looking for writers.
And I had sent the editor anemail that said, Hey, I am not
even Catholic but I do write onthe side and could I even still
apply?
And she was like, of course,apply.
(21:26):
And so I heard back from themlate January of 2022.
It was such a God thing.
I wasn't going to apply, but myhusband was like, no, I think
you need to, because your voiceis so important.
Because even as I was goingthrough the process of becoming
Catholic-- yes, there areamazing voices of converts into
(21:50):
the Catholic faith like ScottHahn, who is phenomenal.
But even as I was reading whathe went through and it was
beautiful, I was like, but thisdoesn't match what I'm going
through.
And I just knew I couldn't bethe only woman going through
this process that needed anotherwoman to help lead the way.
So I got the contributing authorposition for Catholic Mom, and
(22:15):
it's not paid, but I love everyminute of it.
I also write for Living FaithKids, and that is wonderful.
We do gospel reflections fortheir little missile that they
have for kids, and that's reallyfun.
And then, yeah, I also have myown podcast.
It's called"Stand.
Kneel.
Now what?" And like I said, itwas this birthing process of I
(22:36):
was doing some articles forCatholic Mom and I had made a
joke that I was going to write abook one day called"Stand.
Kneel.
Now What?" And someone was like,oh, that would make a great
podcast.
So that's where that started.
And I also teach at a Catholichigh school.
I was a public school teacherfor 16 years.
I taught in a public school andit just became harder and harder
(22:59):
for me to not talk about Jesus.
And I decided it was time.
And part of the reason I wantedto become a Catholic school
educator is because I realizedthat losing my way in college
was something that I hope nohigh school student thinks is
necessary.
And I wanted to light fires forJesus at the high school level
(23:24):
so that when they got to collegethey would know Jesus even more
than I did.
Carol (23:30):
Your perspective is really remarkable, and it sounds
like God is using you in somereally amazing ways.
So let's talk about Psalm 73.
So it's a long psalm.
It talks about how great God is.
It talks about being envious ofseeing the wicked prosper.
(23:53):
Yes.
It talks about God's sanctuaryand all kinds of good things.
Why is that your favorite Psalm?
Karen (23:59):
When I was in high school I was getting made fun of for
being a Christian and for beinga salvationist.
People just, once again, theythought I went to church at a
thrift store.
I wasn't unpopular, but I wasn'tpart of the popular crowd.
They were going out and theywere partying and I wasn't
(24:19):
getting invited.
I was having this hard time ofbeing a Christian in high school
is basically what it boils downto.
And I was really upset with Godone night, and I just remember
being like angry and going, whyam I putting in all this time
living my life for Christ,making sure that I'm not going
(24:41):
out and having sex and I'm notsmoking and I'm not drinking,
and I'm not doing this and I'mnot doing, and what are you
doing for me, God?
I just remember breaking down inmy bedroom and going what do you
have for me?
What's the purpose of this?
And it was probably the HolySpirit, telling me to open my
Bible.
And I opened it to Psalm 73.
It's all about seeing the wickedprosper.
(25:03):
But God's there for you and Hesees that your hand is going to
slip.
He's going to grab it.
And He has plans that are somuch better for you than you
could even imagine.
Carol (25:17):
I love it.
Okay, is there anything elsethat you want to say?
Karen (25:21):
Just keep running the race.
There are days that sometimes Iwake up and go, you know what,
this is, it's hard, man.
It's hard to live a Christianlife day after day.
But it is so worth it.
It is so worth it.
And don't forget to keep yourfire lit for Christ because you
can't light fires if you are notlighting your fire too.
Carol (25:44):
This was wonderful.
Thank you so much, Karen.
We so appreciate you being onthe Goddess Good podcast.
I'm sure your story is going tomove at least one heart towards
Jesus.
Karen (25:54):
Thank you for letting me come on.
It was a pleasure.
Carol (25:57):
And to you, our listeners, thank you for joining
us today.
If these stories speak to yourheart and you want to become
part of this movement, we'd loveto hear from you.
Maybe you have a story to tell,but you're not sure if it's
right for the podcast.
That's okay.
Reach out anyway and we'll walkthrough it together.
And if sharing your story isn'tyour thing, you can still make a
difference by liking, followingand sharing this very episode.
(26:21):
We're so grateful for those whosupport us financially as well.
Your generosity helps us movehearts on their journey toward
holiness by sharing stories thatglorify God.
We can't wait to share more withyou in the next episode.
Until then, friends, rememberGod is good.
Welcome to the God Is Good podcast, where we share
stories of everyday people whohave reignited their faith in
Jesus and experienced remarkablelife transformations.
My name is Carol O'Brien.
I'm your host for this podcast,and it would mean the world to
me if you would share ourpodcast with others who might
really benefit from hearing ourepisodes.
(00:32):
As for me, my feet had almoststumbled.
My steps had nearly slippedbecause I was envious of the
arrogant when I saw theprosperity of the wicked.
Yet I am always with you.
You take hold of my right hand,though my flesh and my heart
fail, God is the rock of myheart, my portion forever.
(00:54):
Psalm 73 verses two throughthree and 23 through 26.
I am delighted to introduce ournewest storyteller, Karen, to
the God Is Good Podcast.
Karen is passionate aboutsharing her faith and bringing
people together.
As a convert to Catholicism.
She is grateful for hersalvationist roots, which first
(01:16):
brought her the joy of Jesus.
Karen's mission is to inspireothers and help unite
Christians, especially bybuilding a bridge between
Catholics and Protestantsthrough her podcast.
So please sit back and relax.
Grab a cup of coffee and join mein hearing Karen's story of
transformation.
(01:37):
Welcome Karen to the GoddessGood Podcast.
Karen (01:40):
Thanks for having me.
Carol (01:42):
We're excited to talk to you and as I start every
podcast, I want to know aboutyour childhood and how you grew
up.
Can you tell us about your faithfoundation as a child?
Karen (01:52):
Yeah, for sure.
This is one of my favoritestories.
I was baptized as a Lutheran butwe never went to church growing
up.
My family consisted of my momwho had been married and
divorced before she had met mydad.
And from her first marriage, shehad my sister who is nine years
(02:13):
older than I am.
So there's a huge age gapbetween my sister and I.
My dad grew up Lutheran, butdidn't really stay with the
church later on in life, butknew I needed to be baptized.
So I was baptized.
And then in second grade I metmy best friend and we're still
best friends 30 years later.
(02:33):
I actually made fun of her onthe playground.
She had just moved in to wherewe lived at the time, and she
was wearing the world's ugliestoutfit I've ever seen.
It was a yellow polo shirt and abrown pleated skirt, and then
(02:53):
white socks.
And I went up to her and I said,you know what?
Your outfit is really ugly.
And she said this is for a groupthat my church does, and we're
going to have vacation Bibleschool as soon as school's over.
Do you want to come?
And I said, yeah.
I went home that night and toldmy dad and my mom that I had met
(03:14):
my now best friend, and said,can I go to vacation Bible
school with her?
Parents were like let's check itout.
So that ended up being theSalvation Army.
And my parents were okay withit.
They're Trinitarian; It'sbasically an offshoot of the
Methodist Church.
And so I went, into vacationBible school but I didn't really
(03:37):
know anything.
Our leader for the second gradegroup-- the joy that radiated
off of his face and in his lifeand his wife's.
Like they just had somethingthat I knew as a second grader
that I wanted.
And so I kept going to churchwith them.
Later on in life I left and wenta different path.
But I will always acknowledge myroots in the Salvation Army and
(04:00):
just love that's where I metJesus for myself.
Carol (04:04):
It sounds like it was so joyful.
I can just see it on your facethat it was a really wonderful
experience.
What was so great about it andwhat was so different?
Karen (04:12):
I had finally experienced Jesus.
And it's funny that you say,that was so joyful because
that's my best friend's name isJoy.
And so I just knew that's whereI needed to be.
And eventually my family startedcoming to church with me again.
So it reignited my dad's passionfor Christ.
I don't think he ever lost faithin Jesus himself.
(04:34):
I just think he becamedisenfranchised with church in
general.
And so my family started comingto church with me.
My grandparents finally came tochurch with me.
My nephew, who has DownSyndrome, started going to
church too, all at the SalvationArmy.
So I really credit the SalvationArmy for not only igniting my
(04:56):
fire, but igniting the fire inmy family too, and wanting to
experience Jesus on a deeperlevel.
Carol (05:02):
It sounds like you were already an evangelist in the
second grade.
Karen (05:07):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Carol (05:08):
So talk about the period of time where you might have
strayed a little bit away fromthat joy.
Karen (05:16):
Yes.
A lot of people don't know thatthe Salvation Army is even a
church.
When I tell people that's whereI grew up, a lot of them think I
worshiped in a thrift store,which is not true at all.
We have church buildings.
But what's funny but not funny.
So I had gone off to college andbefore I had left for college, I
had taken what is basically acatechist class.
(05:38):
So in the Salvation Army, thereare no sacraments.
So there's no baptism.
There's no communion, and thenthere's no confirmation.
At age 11, they do a programcalled Junior Soldiers where
they allow you to declare yourintentions for Christ.
And with that you sign a littlething that says that you won't
smoke, you won't drink, youwon't have premarital sex, you
(06:01):
won't do all of this stuff.
And it's just like tenets offaith that you promised to
uphold.
And so that's what we do at age11.
And then when you become 18, youcan become a senior soldier.
And I had taken the classes,even though I had already
decided that I didn't want tobecome a senior soldier because
one of the tenets of theSalvation Army is that you don't
(06:22):
drink.
And I knew I was going off tocollege and I knew I was
probably going to drink.
And I didn't want to sign apiece of paper and make a
promise to God that I wasn'tgoing to keep.
And so even though I had gonethrough the classes, I had just
decided that it wasn't for me.
I had decided I wasn't going tobecome a senior soldier and I
(06:44):
was also doing what kids incollege do.
I was straying away from myfaith.
And so in college I was talkingthe talk, but I was not walking
the walk.
And I would tell people I was aChristian, but I was living a
very different life and somepeople were surprised.
They were like, you still callyourself a Christian and this is
(07:05):
how you're living your weekends?
And I was like, yeah, of course,aren't you?
I was trying to live life formyself and I was living for my
own happiness and I didn'treally care.
And it took me quite a long timeto get over that as a Christian
in general.
I lived in a lot of shame for along time.
(07:25):
And, I was looking at my eldestin the hospital and, I realized
that I could either carry God'slove for me or I could carry my
shame for the rest of my life.
But I couldn't carry them at thesame time.
And I had to put one down, and Ichose my shame to put down.
And then imparts the next partof my life...
Carol (07:45):
Before we get there I just heard a stat from Bishop
Baron that a high percentage ofyoung adults leave their faith
by the age of 22.
Wow.
So
I think that's an interesting thing that you said
that you had left at that time.
It's very common.
So before we get into that nextpart of your life, you had your
(08:06):
child and you said you were inthe hospital.
What was it about thatexperience that made you reflect
back on, okay, what am I goingto do with my life at this
point?
Karen (08:17):
Yeah, so my first child was an emergency C-section and a
very scary one.
So it was the night before I hadgone in because I thought I was
in labor.
My child was in the rightposition, ready to go, and they
said, it's not going to be thatlong.
And then at some point in 12hours she had flipped and she
(08:40):
was now not only breach, butthey call it Sunnyside up.
I like to tell people her heartwas facing my heart, which is
the complete wrong way for achild to be born.
But I was in very active labor.
By the time that they caughtthis, I was at, nine centimeters
dilated.
I was ready to go and everythinghappened very quickly.
And of course I went into labor,at two o'clock in the morning.
(09:02):
So they're trying to get myblood work back to see if I can
even have anesthesia, all thisstuff.
And it was terrifying.
And I've watched enough doctorshows to know that if a doctor
sprints out of a room, it's notokay.
And the doctor sprinted outtathe room and said, get her
prepped for surgery now.
And so it was one of thosethings that like, just...
(09:24):
I don't want to say it was anear death experience because my
daughter and I are fine.
We were fine then too.
We were in very capable hands.
But having that experience of itjust being really scary and the
fact that I could have lost her,I could have lost myself.
Childbirth in general is alwaysa scary thing to go through, but
when you have this emergencyhappen, and I was like, how can
(09:44):
I look at myself with suchdisdain and hatred?
And hate myself when I knowthat's not how God looks at me.
Like I had recognized that Godhad forgiven me at that point,
but I hadn't forgiven myself.
And so I just knew that Icouldn't pass that on to my
(10:05):
daughter.
I couldn't pass that on to anyother subsequent kids that I
had, like I, I needed them toknow how much they were loved by
God, not just me as a mom, but Ineeded them to know that they
were also wanted and loved andcared for and brought into this
world for a purpose.
But I had to know that myselftoo.
Carol (10:24):
I think that sometimes we are easy to forgive other people
but then it's so hard to forgiveourselves.
We understand it in our heads.
But we don't understand it inour hearts.
So it's remarkable that a badsituation got you to the point
where you realized God hadreally forgiven you.
Okay.
So we're moving into this nextpart of your life.
(10:45):
Tell us about that.
Karen (10:46):
So when my husband and I had gotten married about three
years before we had our firstkid, we knew that the Salvation
Army was not going to be thechurch for us simply because,
the area that we're in, theSalvation Army doesn't have a
lot of young couples or a lot ofcouples with families.
And I was looking for that.
(11:07):
I wanted that kind of supportsystem.
So we ended up joining aMethodist church that wasn't too
far from us.
We would go at five o'clock atnight and we would have our
service and then we would do adinner afterwards.
And it's just so beautifulgetting to break bread with the
community that you worship withtoo.
(11:28):
And so we did that and then wehad our kids and we had them
baptized.
And the church that we were apart of became more of a mega
church, which just turned us offaltogether.
And the funny thing is, so wewere going to the Methodist
church, but for preschool wewere sending my daughter to the
Catholic church that was closerto us because they were the only
(11:51):
school in the area that taughtSpanish even to the little bitty
kids.
So we were sending them to theCatholic school so that they
could learn Spanish.
And the, the fact that they weregetting religion was just a
bonus for me.
So around COVID, we had decidedthat we weren't going to go to
the Methodist church anymore,that it just wasn't suiting our
needs as a couple or as afamily.
(12:12):
And we took a break.
And then COVID hit and all thechurches everywhere shut down.
So we couldn't even church shoplike we wanted.
Fast forward in that next summerafter COVID and I came
downstairs and I looked at myhusband and I said, you know I
need a church community.
I'm really feeling called to getback involved in a church.
(12:34):
And I said, we're sending ourkids to Catholic school what do
you think about checking out theCatholic Church?
And he said do they drink coffeeand eat bacon'cause that's all I
care about?
And I said, you know what, I'mpretty sure I have had both in
front of my Catholic familymembers, so yeah.
And so that August, my mom tookthe kids for a little bit and we
(12:55):
went to our first Mass, just myhusband and I.
And unbeknownst to each other,before we'd even walked in, we
both silently prayed if this iswhere God wanted us, to make it
abundantly clear, and he did.
I was ready to join that day.
Like I was like, where do wesign up?
What do I have to do?
What class do I take?
My husband was a bit morereserved, and so it took us
(13:18):
until about the end of Octoberof 2021 before we officially
signed up for OCIA.
But we joined the CatholicChurch Easter Vigil of 2022, and
we will both tell you that it isthe best decision we have made
for ourselves, for our family.
I just, I couldn't be happierwith that decision.
And the fact that I get to takeCommunion and receive the
(13:42):
Eucharist is one of the greatestjoys that I have in life now.
Carol (13:46):
That's wonderful.
There's so many things that Iwanted to tell you about.
The coffee thing is hystericalbecause my husband didn't grow
up with any religion and he wasshopping around.
He went to the Mormons and heloved the Tabernacle choir and
he loved it all.
And then they told him hecouldn't have coffee and he was
(14:06):
like, what?
Yeah.
What religion or whatdenomination did your husband
grow up?
Karen (14:14):
So he was baptized Methodist and then also didn't
go to church a whole lot.
And he liked the Methodistchurch that we were a part of,
but then when it became more ofa mega church and really not
genuine in what we hadoriginally joined, he was like,
I'm done.
And so it was one of thosethings.
(14:34):
It was sad to see that he hadthis not great experience when
he was a teenager at a Baptistchurch and then now we're at
this Methodist church and he'snot having a great experience.
And he's a quiet guy, like I'mthe extrovert in the
relationship and he's more of anintrovert.
And he loved when we went, itwas RCIA when we went through
it, but now it's OCIA.
(14:55):
Anyway, he like participated andto see him really connect with
the people there and we talkabout saints stalking us.
He was a hundred percent stalkedby St.
Joseph.
And it was so amazing and hewould talk about St.
Joseph as this guy that he wasjust best friends with.
(15:15):
And I was like, this is trulywhere we're meant to be.
Carol (15:19):
I'm a cradle Catholic, so it's interesting.
Are the Methodists very close tothe Trinitarian, to the Baptist?
You seem very open to thoseexperiences.
Was it a hard transition or wasit easy transition at least on
the side of the Protestantdenominations?
Karen (15:36):
So the Salvation Army is Trinitarian.
However, once again, they don'thave any sacraments.
You can get married there, butit's not considered a sacrament.
If you get divorced, you don'thave to get an annulment.
But I really think the SalvationArmy is related to the Catholic
Church in different ways.
I've written an article about iton CatholicMom.com because I'm a
(15:57):
contributor author there, and sowhen we joined the Methodist
Church, it wasn't very hard forme because that's how I grew up.
But in the Methodist Church,they take communion.
It's once a month.
And my students now, I teach ata Catholic high school now and
they think this is so funny.
Communion was like whateverbread you had laying around.
But as far as like my husband, Ithink, because they only went,
(16:20):
they were like the Santa ClausEaster Bunny.
They only went on Christmas orEaster or when things were going
right in their family.
So I don't think he had such afirm foundation in his Baptist
faith that it made a differencewhere he went, after that.
Carol (16:37):
So did you face any questions or any backlash with
either family or friends forbecoming Catholic?
Karen (16:44):
Not so much with my family.
I was a little concerned becausemy dad is very Lutheran and I
thought I was going to break hisheart.
But in fact my dad, I would saynow is Catholic curious.
But not from my family becausemy dad's sister converted to
Catholicism when she married herhusband, and my cousins are
(17:05):
Catholic.
I would say some of my friendshave a difficult time with it
when I express the Sinlessnessof Mary or that I'm going to go
pray a rosary or I'm going toAdoration.
It's not that they aredisrespectful in it, they just
don't understand.
And so that is what really droveme to make my own podcast.
(17:27):
I wanted to make it this bridgebetween misconceptions that
people have of the Catholicfaith and Protestantism because
both are beautiful in differentways.
And I think if we put ourdivision aside, like we could
come together and just be thisbeautiful Christian family.
Instead right now we're likecousins at the dining table that
(17:49):
sometimes get along andsometimes fight.
Carol (17:52):
So you went through RCIA.
My husband went through it aswell, and I just saw how on fire
he became for Jesus.
He was like a sponge.
He just loved every bit aboutit.
And from day one has been onfire for Jesus.
Was it the same for you?
Or when would you say youtransformed from lukewarm to on
(18:14):
fire for Jesus?
Karen (18:16):
I was on fire like after that first Mass in August.
I have never experienced thescripture the way the Catholic
Church does it before.
In my Protestant faith, a lot offocus was on the New Testament
and not a lot was on the OldTestament.
And I never realized thatthey're mirrors.
No one had ever taken the timeto explain the beauty that comes
(18:40):
from looking at the Bible as awhole.
It was almost all like I knew alot about the gospel, but I knew
nothing that came before that.
And so realizing that everythingin the Bible has a purpose and
every scripture and every verseis for a reason, and that these
big"T" traditions are therebecause that's what was passed
on.
(19:00):
And it just, everything justclicked, like that light bulb
moment that you have.
And I was on fire as a preteenand a teenager for Christ, but
not in the way that I am now.
Like now, it's like I, I waseven telling my religious
education students at my parishthis morning.
I was like, this is every partof me.
Like I wake up and I can't stoptalking about Jesus.
(19:23):
And I go to bed and I wake upand I think about Jesus.
I was like, this is every day ofmy life.
Before it was like, I went tochurch on Sunday.
I went to youth group onWednesday night, and I tried to
live my life for God as much asI could, but now I know the end
goal is I want to be a saint andI want to take as many people
(19:45):
with me as I can, and I gottafigure out a way to do it.
And before it was just like, Iwant to be a good person for
God.
And now it's like I want to be agood person for God and I want
you to be a good person for God.
And I want to light your fireand your fire.
And your fire.
And your fire.
And how do we get there andwhat's next?
Carol (20:03):
Yeah, it was amazing transformation for me as well.
When you start to realizeeverything's pointing towards
Jesus.
The Old Testament points towardsJesus.
The Old Testament is hidden andrevealed in the New Testament
and the New Testament points toJesus.
And the relationship with Mary,.
Yeah., our traditions, oursacraments our liturgy,
(20:24):
everything is centered on Jesus.
And look at all these otherbeautiful things that are all
pointing to Jesus.
And if you just have one, thinkof all the things that you might
be missing.
So you became on fire for Jesus.
What are you doing with thaton-fired-ness now?
Karen (20:41):
Yeah, so even before I became Catholic, I found
CatholicMom.com.
It was when I was in the RCIAprocess that I found them
because even though my mom isphenomenal she's not Catholic,
and so I now had two childrenunder my charge where I was now
a Catholic mom and I neededsomething to help me figure out
(21:03):
how to be a Catholic mom.
So I was listening to theCatholic Mom cast and I was
reading their blog every day andthey were looking for writers.
And I had sent the editor anemail that said, Hey, I am not
even Catholic but I do write onthe side and could I even still
apply?
And she was like, of course,apply.
(21:26):
And so I heard back from themlate January of 2022.
It was such a God thing.
I wasn't going to apply, but myhusband was like, no, I think
you need to, because your voiceis so important.
Because even as I was goingthrough the process of becoming
Catholic-- yes, there areamazing voices of converts into
(21:50):
the Catholic faith like ScottHahn, who is phenomenal.
But even as I was reading whathe went through and it was
beautiful, I was like, but thisdoesn't match what I'm going
through.
And I just knew I couldn't bethe only woman going through
this process that needed anotherwoman to help lead the way.
So I got the contributing authorposition for Catholic Mom, and
(22:15):
it's not paid, but I love everyminute of it.
I also write for Living FaithKids, and that is wonderful.
We do gospel reflections fortheir little missile that they
have for kids, and that's reallyfun.
And then, yeah, I also have myown podcast.
It's called"Stand.
Kneel.
Now what?" And like I said, itwas this birthing process of I
(22:36):
was doing some articles forCatholic Mom and I had made a
joke that I was going to write abook one day called"Stand.
Kneel.
Now What?" And someone was like,oh, that would make a great
podcast.
So that's where that started.
And I also teach at a Catholichigh school.
I was a public school teacherfor 16 years.
I taught in a public school andit just became harder and harder
(22:59):
for me to not talk about Jesus.
And I decided it was time.
And part of the reason I wantedto become a Catholic school
educator is because I realizedthat losing my way in college
was something that I hope nohigh school student thinks is
necessary.
And I wanted to light fires forJesus at the high school level
(23:24):
so that when they got to collegethey would know Jesus even more
than I did.
Carol (23:30):
Your perspective is really remarkable, and it sounds
like God is using you in somereally amazing ways.
So let's talk about Psalm 73.
So it's a long psalm.
It talks about how great God is.
It talks about being envious ofseeing the wicked prosper.
(23:53):
Yes.
It talks about God's sanctuaryand all kinds of good things.
Why is that your favorite Psalm?
Karen (23:59):
When I was in high school I was getting made fun of for
being a Christian and for beinga salvationist.
People just, once again, theythought I went to church at a
thrift store.
I wasn't unpopular, but I wasn'tpart of the popular crowd.
They were going out and theywere partying and I wasn't
(24:19):
getting invited.
I was having this hard time ofbeing a Christian in high school
is basically what it boils downto.
And I was really upset with Godone night, and I just remember
being like angry and going, whyam I putting in all this time
living my life for Christ,making sure that I'm not going
(24:41):
out and having sex and I'm notsmoking and I'm not drinking,
and I'm not doing this and I'mnot doing, and what are you
doing for me, God?
I just remember breaking down inmy bedroom and going what do you
have for me?
What's the purpose of this?
And it was probably the HolySpirit, telling me to open my
Bible.
And I opened it to Psalm 73.
It's all about seeing the wickedprosper.
(25:03):
But God's there for you and Hesees that your hand is going to
slip.
He's going to grab it.
And He has plans that are somuch better for you than you
could even imagine.
Carol (25:17):
I love it.
Okay, is there anything elsethat you want to say?
Karen (25:21):
Just keep running the race.
There are days that sometimes Iwake up and go, you know what,
this is, it's hard, man.
It's hard to live a Christianlife day after day.
But it is so worth it.
It is so worth it.
And don't forget to keep yourfire lit for Christ because you
can't light fires if you are notlighting your fire too.
Carol (25:44):
This was wonderful.
Thank you so much, Karen.
We so appreciate you being onthe Goddess Good podcast.
I'm sure your story is going tomove at least one heart towards
Jesus.
Karen (25:54):
Thank you for letting me come on.
It was a pleasure.
Carol (25:57):
And to you, our listeners, thank you for joining
us today.
If these stories speak to yourheart and you want to become
part of this movement, we'd loveto hear from you.
Maybe you have a story to tell,but you're not sure if it's
right for the podcast.
That's okay.
Reach out anyway and we'll walkthrough it together.
And if sharing your story isn'tyour thing, you can still make a
difference by liking, followingand sharing this very episode.
(26:21):
We're so grateful for those whosupport us financially as well.
Your generosity helps us movehearts on their journey toward
holiness by sharing stories thatglorify God.
We can't wait to share more withyou in the next episode.
Until then, friends, rememberGod is good.
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