Navigating the Paranormal: Phill Webster's Journey into the Afterlife

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Have you ever wondered what happens after we bid goodbye to this world? In this episode, I engage in a compelling conversation with Phil Webster, author of Letting Glow. Phil’s spiritual journey began after the loss of his beloved mother during the pandemic, leading him from skepticism to an exploration of mediumship. He generously shares his experiences from grief to personal growth.

As we navigate through Phil's journey, we uncover his remarkable transition. He tells us about his initial encounters with a medium's book and a church service which changed his life forever. Fascinating stories about a late-night FaceTime call, a Blu-ray of Doctor Strange, and a name written in chalk on a café chalkboard all lead to profound spiritual awakenings. His story is not just about connecting with spirit guides but about understanding the balance between our physical world and the spiritual realm.

Phil's exploration isn't limited to mediumship. He also shares insights into his efforts in writing a trilogy, inspired by something greater than himself. He delves into the power of meditation and provides practical tips for those struggling to stay present in the moment. As we wrap up, we discuss the challenges of science when it comes to understanding the paranormal and the fear surrounding the unknown. This conversation is a true testament to Phil’s resilience, spiritual growth, and unwavering belief in the power of the spirit world. Join Phill and me in this mesmerizing journey of loss, hope, and spiritual awakening.

Find Phill at:
🔗 https://www.phillwebster.com
🔗 https://www.instagram.com/phillwebster/

This deck is a labor of love. It's a 44 card oracle deck that's about connecting you to your loved one in spirit. The deck comes with a companion digital guide that gives you an affirmation, a reflection, and an activity for the day.

Check it out at https://stan.store/grief2growth/p/oracle-deck

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I've been studying Near Death Experiences for many years now. I am 100% convinced they are real. In this short, free ebook, I not only explain why I believe NDEs are real, I share some of the universal secrets brought back by people who have had them.

https://www.grief2growth.com/ndelessons

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey everybody, this is Brian, back with another
episode of Grief to Growth, andtoday I've got with me Phil
Webster.
What if?
What if mystical experiencesare real?
What if inspiration, instinctand ingenuity are the same as
intuition, divination andclairvoyance?
Phil's written a book calledLetting Glow, and it's an
adventure and a mediumship, andit takes a deeper look at how we
experience things like time,consciousness and a relationship

(00:22):
to our higher self all thestuff we like to talk about here
on Grief to Growth.
It's profoundly personalaccount of grief during the
global COVID-19 pandemic, and itaims at finding solace and hope
by connecting with ourintuition, and he says it's
simple changes in thinking,meditation, exercises and
shifting our perspectives oneveryday reality can transform
our lives into ones of intensepurpose and deeper connection

(00:45):
with all it is Now.
Phil himself is a writer.
He's an author and a spiritualteacher, and, after living
abroad for 20 years, he returnedto the UK, where he resides now
, and he ventured into acting.
He's since gone on to appear inmovies alongside people like
Sylvester Stallone, ben and DickCumberbatch and L Fanning,
among others.
Phil lost his mother in 2021and realized he'd been

(01:06):
dismissing spiritual calls toaction his entire life, and he
writes about that in his bookagain Letting Glow.
Phil has such trained withIndigenous shamans from North
and South America as well asworld-renowned mediums like
James Van Prague, gordon Smithand Claire Broad.
He's also studied femalespirituality in the Middle Ages
at the University of Barcelonaand is a trained meditation

(01:28):
teacher as well as a personaltrainer.
So with that I want to welcomePhil to Grief, to Growth.

Speaker 2 (01:34):
Hi, brian, thank you very much.
Thanks, yeah, that alwayssounds like such a lot, but most
of those things they just camefrom never knowing what I wanted
to do with my life, so juststacking these things up along
the way.

Speaker 1 (01:45):
That's kind of the way I find life works.
You know, we never know whatpath we're going to take to get
to where we are, and I feel likewe do take the path that's the
right one for us.
So you talk about.
You had some, I guess,spiritual experiences early on
in your life.
What was it that finallytriggered you to awakening?

Speaker 2 (02:02):
I guess for lack of a better word- Well, there were a
couple of things along the waywhich sort of came to light in
hindsight of what happenedaround my mom passing, which is
kind of really the main catalystfor writing the book and which
really sent me down this pathcompletely.
So just yeah, straight off withthat.

(02:22):
We've just been through thepandemic 2020 and we'll know
about that, and my mom lived ina place called the Isle of Wight
, which is an island which issouth of England and it's a good
few hours away from where I'mbased in London and I was
adhering to the governmentguidelines and all that kind of
stuff and I was seeing it whereI was allowed to and, you know,
keeping away when we wasn'tsupposed to.

(02:43):
And I hadn't seen it for acouple of months at this point.
She was supposed to come toLondon for Christmas, but then,
once again, there was a newvariant of COVID or something
and we didn't end up seeing eachother for Christmas.
So over this whole year, she'ssort of grown increasingly
lonely, somewhat depressed.
She was 76 years old and hadvarious age-related health
problems, but we would face timeevery day and on this

(03:06):
particular day it was about twoweeks into 2021.
And I've already spoke to her acouple of times that day and
again we were in a lockdown andthis was quite late at night.
When I had this conversationwith her it was like 9.30.10.
And just to sort of give alittle bit of perspective around
this, we didn't have any familythere on the island, why, she
was very much on her own andit's a very rural place, so I

(03:28):
kind of knew all of theneighbors and people like that.
And again, just to sort ofstress, we were in lockdown.
And then she answered the callthis night and as she sort of
clicked on the screen and I sawher lean into the call, she had
a phone charging on the floor.
There was a man leaning in fromthe other side of the screen
and I was kind of taking herback.

(03:49):
There wasn't supposed to beanyone there and she was always
alone when I called her and Isaw him long enough that I could
describe him.
He had thinning gray hairglasses, looked like he was
maybe late 60s, something likethat.
And as she sort of pulled thephone up he went out of shot.
So I was like, well, who's that?
And she said who's what?
And I was like okay, I was likewell, the guy.

(04:12):
Who's the guy?
I just saw someone.
She's like no, no, no, there'sno one here, and just kind of
dismissed it.
They didn't even sort of takeany notice of me and so they're
talking about her day and againI interrupt her.
I said I said sorry, mom, youknow, but I just saw someone.
Are you telling me that you'reon your own?
And she was like, yeah, there'sno one, been no one here all
day.
And I could always tell whenthere was someone with her

(04:33):
because, like over the years, itused to drive me nuts when I
was a teenager, especially ifsomeone was with her and I tried
to have a phone call.
She'd like turn on all theseairs and graces and it would be
impossible to have aconversation with her.
You know, just be like, okay,come on, just just be yourself.
But she wasn't doing any ofthat and it was a pretty small
house that she lived in.
She wasn't acknowledging anyoneelse and we spoke for about 45

(04:54):
minutes and I thought, well, Imust have been mistaken.
So I just kind of dismissed itas some sort of glitch on the
screen or something.
Obviously that isn't really athing, you know, with both had
iPhones and I just left it and Iwent to bed that night and then
the next morning got a phonecall from a neighbor.
They couldn't get in the houseand my mom had passed away.

(05:16):
She'd had a heart attack.
So, yeah, that I mean.
Obviously the initial grief waswhat it is, and I went through
all of that but at the back ofmy mind I was like, well, what
was all that?
You know, are we talking ghostshere?
Are we talking spirit guides?
And that wasn't something thatI was into into at all or really

(05:37):
interested in.
And then, yeah, as the monthswent on, I kind of gradually
opened up to this idea that thatwas the most logical
explanation to me was that thatwas something that I was
interested in, because that wassomething letting me know that
my mom was about to pass.

Speaker 1 (05:50):
Hmm, so do you have any idea who it was to this day?

Speaker 2 (05:54):
Well, that's the thing, you know.
He didn't.
He didn't look like a familymember.
I mean, I lost touch with mydad when I was 18.
At a stretch it could have beenhim, you know, at the age he
might have been.
If he's, if he was still around, I've no idea.
I'm assuming he's not.
He was quite a heavy drinkerand he had one lung.
He still smoked.
And then there was COVID.

(06:15):
So I mean, if he I shouldn'tlike sort of not, not, not to
make light of it but if he madeit through that, then you know
that I wouldn't have thought so.
I mean, I ended up writing mybook that I sort of thought that
it was possibly him, but I justdon't know.
You know, and and, like I say,I didn't really sort of get any
comfort out of it.
It was just like, okay, thathappened.

(06:36):
And I would tell people aboutit and, depending on which side
of the fence people were, youknow, people would be saying
what it was grief, and I'd belike, well, it wasn't grief,
because it was before the fact,you know, and then, and then I
would meet people that say, well, yeah, that was, that was
clearly your spirit guide, oryour mom's spirit guide and
somebody letting you know thatthey were.
They were there for you know.
So, yeah, I ended up going thatroute.

Speaker 1 (06:58):
Okay, and so I, first of all, I'm going to say I'm
really sorry about your mother.
I know that had to be atremendous yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
So, and before this you were anactor.
You've done several things, soI know you've been an actor and
you're a trainer, so what wereyou doing at the time?

Speaker 2 (07:16):
So at the time, I had come back to the UK in 2017,
after living abroad for 20 yearsor so and when I came back,
I've sailed in London with mypartner and I thought, if I was
really honest with myself, whatwould I love to do?
And I'd always been obsessedwith movies and I thought, well,
the logical way to get intothat would be perhaps acting.
I don't have any experience infilm directing or editing or

(07:38):
anything like that in my 40s, soI went to drama school and very
quickly got a few small partsbut I use the word like actor
very loosely when I refer tomyself about it.
You know, I literally walk onsail line and walk off again.
And that's me done, you know.
But it was good.
You know, we paid the bills fora few years and I must admit,
my attention has really goneaway from it now since writing

(08:00):
the book and kind of the paththat I'm taking now.
I feel that there are a lot ofegos on film sets, which is kind
of to be expected, and I feellike that's not really the
environment that I'm leaningtowards these days, you know.

Speaker 1 (08:16):
So, yeah, sorry, so, after your mother passed, tell
me what was your journey likethen, because you eventually
ended up with shamanism and etc.
But what was your journey likeafter your mother passed?

Speaker 2 (08:28):
Yeah, so just talking about the acting thing, I was
scheduled to start immediatelyon one of these big Marvel
superhero movies it was DoctorStrange and the Multiverse of
Madness, it was called and I'vebeen waiting for it for months.
It had been a really quiet yearbecause of COVID and it started
like two days after my mompassed and I thought, well, I'm

(08:49):
just going to do it becauseit'll keep me busy and I need
the money as well.
You know, the expense thatcomes up all around losing
somebody, as I'm sure a lot ofyour listeners know, is just
something else.
So I just kind of got on withit and I barely spoke to anyone
for two months, I think, on set.
You know, I just kind of had myhead down.
It was COVID, so we were allkind of separated anyway and I

(09:13):
just kind of buried my head inbooks that I'd read years before
.
I kind of reread some booksthat I'd read when I was younger
and I would say that they weresort of like a very soft
introduction towardsspirituality.
I was reading things like NeilDonald Walsh and stuff like that
kind of the broader sort ofpicture and not really delving
straight into mediumship oranything.

(09:34):
But they helped, these bookshelped.
And one day on the set, when Ieventually kind of started
talking to people, I spoke tothis young lady and I told her
the story that I just told youand she said, well, you should
ask for a sign, you know.
And I was like I've kind ofthought of this, but I almost
didn't want to.

(09:54):
I was like what if I ask forone and I don't get one, you
know?
So just to sort of ramble on alittle bit, we just moved into a
new apartment during the time Iwas filming this thing and I
had a day off and I was puttingaway a bunch of Blu-rays right,
I've kind of obsolete now, butI've got a stack of them all in
a box and I was putting themvery methodically away in a very

(10:16):
geekly order and I'd got thesefilms, these superhero Marvel
things, and while I was doingthis I was like, oh yeah, okay,
let's do this.
I was like, all right, mum, ifyou're around, give me a sign.
And I sort of carried on tidyingup and as I put these Blu-rays
away, I noticed that one wasmissing, and the one that was
missing was Doctor Strange.

(10:37):
So that was the original movieto the sequel that I was working
on and I thought, well, allright, that's kind of what.
I didn't really attribute it tome, asking for a sign at that
point.
So anyway, I was just kind ofannoyed that it wasn't there.
And then I went about tidyingthe flat and then later in the
day I came across a stack ofbooks and on the top of the
stack of books was this Blu-ray,doctor Strange.

(10:58):
And I was like, well, that'sjust really odd that that should
have been in the box with therest of them.
And then I looked at the book.
Underneath the Blu-ray waspoking out and the author's name
was Maureen, which was my mum'sname, and then the title of the
book.
Underneath that one was pokingout part of it and it said
living.
So I've got Doctor Strange,maureen living.
And I thought, well, I don'tknow, maybe, maybe is that.

(11:21):
You know, depending on which wayyou look at things, I was still
kind of somewhat cynical aboutstuff at the time, but you know
that came up pretty quickly andthings tended to follow on from
that, so I understand you hadsome paranormal experiences, so
tell me about some of those.
Yeah, I mean, I think that thatwas really the biggest one and I

(11:41):
truly, at this point, havesettled on the idea that that
was, you know, a spirit guide ofsome form.
Let me know that my mum wasabout to pass.
If that hadn't happened thatevening, I wouldn't have wrote
this book, I wouldn't be talking.
It just sent me on this wholedifferent trajectory.
So that was what actuallytriggered you to go on the
journey?
Yeah, yeah, definitely.

(12:02):
You know, I just kept goingback to that, well, like who was
that guy, you know?
But yeah, and it kind of mademe reevaluate other things that
happened over the years.
So when I was a kid, I rememberstuff used to happen around the
house things moving, stuff likethat and and you know, as a kid
that was kind of like exciting.
And then as I grew older, Ithought what did those things

(12:23):
really happen?
Or was that just like I wasinto that stuff?
You know, I was like watchingGhostbusters in the 80s or
something, and you know, and andI sort of doubted it all.
And I remember in my teenageyears I came across this term,
astral projection, and read upon it and try to invoke it, and
I had this experience which kindof freaked me out and and again

(12:47):
, as years went by, I thought Idon't know, did that really
happen?
You know, was it just likewishful thinking?
Maybe I was dreaming orsomething like that, although
everything that I read about itafter was kind of confirmed that
that was the experience thatI've had, but I would put all
these things to bed, you know.
And then something in my mid30s very profound, and this kind

(13:10):
of weird talking about this,because I'm talking years apart,
right, you know, like in thefive years in the middle I'm
just living regularly, payingthe bills, not thinking about
any of this kind of stuff.
But in my mid 30s I rememberhaving this very sort of very
profound experience where I kindof I was living a pretty
hedonistic lifestyle.

(13:30):
At the time I was running barsand nightclubs in Helsinki and
Finland and I was kind of likevery self absorbed and just not
really thinking about anyoneelse's business but loan.
And I remember waking up thisone morning and something just
kind of and it wasn't like a newthought, but something shifted
with this thought and I juststarted thinking about time
being nonlinear.
You know that all we've got isthis moment of now and that's it

(13:53):
.
You know like everything elseis just kind of a memory or a
thought of what we want to do inthe future, but all we really
have is now, you know, all thetime.
And as I sort of contemplatedthis, something shifted and it
was as though suddenly I wereoutside of myself, like
observing my thoughts, almostlike a depersonalization
experience.
I suppose that is what I'vekind of come to learn since, and

(14:16):
it was terrifying somethingshifted and I can't really
emphasize how terrifying it wasAll of a sudden, sort of reality
just fell away, you know, outof nowhere, and and linear time
just seemed absurd, and my wholeexistence at that point did
also.
So this is going kind of outthere, but I was like, okay,
what the heck's this, you know?

(14:38):
And I went outside and I justtried to walk it off and it just
didn't stop and it's reallyhard to describe it.
And it was at the time I wastrying to tell my work
colleagues and friends andpeople were just kind of glazing
over, being like, okay, sure,you know like I sound completely
nuts, but it was, it was trulyterrifying and it was just like
now, now, now, now, all the timeI couldn't just sort of drift

(15:01):
off, think, well, what am Igoing to eat for dinner later?
Or what did I do last night?
It was just like this hyperawareness that just didn't stop
and people talk about, yeah,like, like you know, people talk
about trying to attain thatright, you know, live, moment
and now.
But this was like that times1000.
And and I truly started doubtingfor my sanity, you know, and it

(15:21):
kept going on.
It went on for weeks, justdidn't let up, and I ended up
going to a doctor who Iexplained all this to as best I
could, and they started usingwords like psychosis, which just
amplified this terror.
You know, I've never thoughtthat that was on the cast for me
, and they gave me a bunch ofmad, slight anti anxiety pills
which didn't touch it at all,sleep and pills which would like

(15:42):
knock me out, and then I'd wakeup and the whole thing would
just start over again.
And I think the best way Icould describe it was like I was
.
It was almost like I washanging on to, like a slippery
bar by my fingertips and justabout keeping a grip on reality.
Essentially, it just felt likeI was.
I don't know what was going onand I went to see another doctor
because I wasn't happy with thepsychosis diagnosis and he said

(16:05):
the same thing and andeventually, after a couple of
months of this, I startedthinking Well, this just isn't.
If this is the way my brainworks, now I'm out of here, you
know, and I don't mean to takethis down a dark path, but I
didn't see any tragedy in that,you know.
I thought this just doesn'twork.
I can't function properly likethis.

(16:25):
And I ended up going to see apsychiatrist and what attracted
me to this guy was that he wasalso a hypnotist.
So I went down and I was like,hey, you know, hypnotize this
away, right, I just just make itstop.
And he explained to me itdidn't.
Didn't work like that.
He said you know, we need ananchor point and it doesn't
really sound like you've got oneand you know, and.
But he said, you know, he saidI believe that what you're

(16:46):
having is is an awakening.
And I was like, well, whatever,I was like just make it stop, I
just want to get back to theherd, I want to get on with work
.
And he said we use them wordslike mystic and talking about
shamanic sickness and all thesethings I've never heard of
before.
I wasn't interested in any ofthat.
I was just like just make itstop.
And he gave me a couple ofmeditations, really powerful but

(17:08):
kind of basic meditations, andand I started practicing these
daily and very gradually I kindof came back to to you know
where I wanted to be and justget an on with life.
So, yeah, so that was along-winded story, but I kind of
again, once I got through itand I got to say I came out of
it a lot humbler.
I feel like my ego was justsmashed to pieces, you know,

(17:30):
when I was kind of doubting formy sanity.
And I did come out of it justthrough these meditations on a
daily basis and and, and it kindof made me stop sweating.
The small stuff which resultedin moving back to the UK,
exploring, acting, all that kindof stuff, but I didn't really
look at it as a mystical eventuntil again, what happened

(17:51):
around my mom passing, and theneverything else sort of kind of
learned about, made me look atthis as though, okay, every few
years something would pop uplike that, you know, and that
was a particularly extreme one,but it seemed like something had
been tapping me on the shoulderlike the whole time.
And I feel that now, you know,after doing various things like
you know, for for work and this,and that I feel like I finally,

(18:12):
you know, found the path that Iwas possibly always supposed to
be on.

Speaker 1 (18:16):
Yeah, well, I thank you for telling that and I think
it's really interesting and forfor people that are younger,
possibly listening, because lifedoesn't make sense as we're
going through it.
I forgot who said it was.
A philosopher said that youknow, it's like life can only be
understood living back orlooking backwards way to live it
, moving forward, and we do.
As we look back, we find theseevents and we put, we put

(18:37):
together the pieces of thepuzzle and we can see how they
make sense.
I also think it's fascinatingyou talking about that.
I've been reading a lot abouttime is not linear, time doesn't
exist.
You know this kind of stuff andtrying to wrap my brain around
it, which we really can't do, Ithink our brains just don't work
that way and you know I couldtotally with the book the Power

(19:00):
of.
Not Everybody wants to live inthe now, or so we think.
So it's interesting that youhad that experience and you know
it's.
Yeah, I didn't not pleasant.

Speaker 2 (19:09):
It wasn't pleasant, it was.
I've never actually read thatbook.
I've heard snippets of himtalking and I'm like, oh yeah,
well, I know all about that, butit was out of nowhere.
It was just like it was such ashock.
It wasn't something I wasexploring or anything and it
came so powerfully and justaltered everything you know.
But again, in hindsight, theway I was going about my life at

(19:32):
the time I wasn't wasn'tterrible, but I wasn't the
greatest you know human being onthe planet and and and.
It really made me take stock ofeverything and and and started
treating people nice.
I started treating myself nicerand it kind of yeah, it
definitely created a big shift.

Speaker 1 (19:50):
Yeah.
So after after the passing ofyour mother, and you're starting
to open up to these spiritualthings and you have the signs,
what made you decide to startstudying mediumship.

Speaker 2 (20:02):
So I just moved around into this new area that I
was mentioning earlier and Iremember walking up and down the
street a lot.
That was just like a couple ofblocks away and I never noticed
this place before and one day Ijust took notice of it.
I probably walked down there 30times at this point and there
was a small spiritualist church.
I don't think you have a lot ofthem.

Speaker 1 (20:23):
We have a few that, not as many as you do in England
.

Speaker 2 (20:27):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, I'd never heard of one before,
you know, and I was like Okay,didn't really never heard the
term spiritualist church.
And I stopped to look at thenotice board outside and they
said they had a demonstration ofmediumship every Sunday and I
thought, well, kind ofinteresting.
You know, and I just veryrecently been starting to look

(20:49):
at that stuff, I've come acrossa book by a medium called Claire
Broad which kind of got methinking about that and just so
many weird little coincidences,right, and just to just go off
the track a little bit, when Istarted reading this book by
Claire, she could have been fromanywhere in the world.
I didn't research her oranything, but her story
immediately took place and theopening chapter, right across

(21:10):
the street from where I wasliving at the time, which I
thought, well, that's so odd.
You know, she could have beenfrom the States, she could have
been Australian or what have you, but no, the whole thing took
place like across the road, Icould see what she was talking
about.
And then a couple of weekslater I stumbled across this
church and you know again inhindsight, but I went along to
this place and I was kind ofstill skeptical somewhat.

(21:32):
I remember I'd said all of mysocial media stuff to private no
, I'd nonsensical completely,because it's not like anyone
knew that I was, you know, goingto show up there or knew my
story or anything.
And then I watched this ladywork, a lady called Janet
Neville and she started working,working away, away around the
congregation, I suppose youcould call it of maybe 15 people

(21:54):
or something, and she startedtelling people about you know
how I describe in a house inScotland and she claimed that
she'd never heard of this placein Scotland and this lady was
sitting confirming it like yeah,yeah, that's my, that's my
husband's family you describe intheir house.
And then she went on somebodyelse and somebody else and she
was getting like 90%affirmations that people

(22:15):
completely understood what shewas talking about.
And by the time she got to me Iwas like I was like, okay, wow,
this is amazing.
You know that she's tellingpeople these things.
And she got to me and shestarted talking about a young
man and I was like, okay, well,no idea who this guy is.
You know, I was there hoping tohear from my mom, right, if
this was going to be a realthing.
And she started talking aboutthis guy.

(22:36):
And then she started talking ashim, which was kind of
interesting.
I didn't know that was coming,you know.
She started sort of referringto me as as though she was him
speaking directly to me and um,and started talking about me
being a medium, or a voice forspirit, as she called it.
And again, this wasn'tsomething that was really on the
mind at the time.
I just only to start to sort oflooking into this stuff and I

(22:59):
thought, well, that'sinteresting itself.
They're just saying thatbecause it just took an interest
in it.
But she started saying, yeah,you know, one day you'll be up
here and give people messages.
And I was like, okay, cool, butstill don't know who this guy
is.
And then the penny dropped and Irealized that it was somebody
that had passed when we were.
I was probably 18, he was 20.
Tragically, he got in with thewrong crowd and overdosed, and

(23:24):
then everything that she'd said,you know, found a place.
I was like, damn, she's talkingabout him, you know.
And then, just right at the endof it, she said, oh, I've got a
lady here, like an elderly ladythat's recently passed, and I
kind of choked up, you know.
And she described the situationaround my mum passing and her

(23:47):
accent changed.
Again, this was like a gamechanger for me, because this
lady the medium, she had a verysort of strong London cockney
accent and then it kind of justwent to this Northern English
accent, my mum's accent, and shejust kind of the language she
used although it was a verybrief message, it was my mum
speaking to me, you know, and itwas life changing.

(24:09):
I say, you know, this hadn'tbeen something that I've ever
looked into before, and then Ijust went along this night and
it just, yeah, essentiallychanged my life, I would say I'm
excited to announce I have agreat new resource.

Speaker 1 (24:21):
It's called Gems Four Steps to Move from Grief to Joy
, and what it is.
It's four things that I'vefound that I do on a daily basis
to help me to navigate my grief, and I'm offering it to you
free of charge.
It's a free download.
Just go to my website,wwwgrieftogrowthcom.
Slash gems G, e, m, s and grabit there for free.

(24:44):
I hope you enjoy it.
Wow, yeah, yeah.
So that was your firstexperience with mediumship.
And then, yeah, make you decideto start like I think I can do
this story.
I want to do this.

Speaker 2 (24:56):
Well, it's an interesting thing, you know,
because, like, did I start doingit because she said I was going
to do it, or or because shesuggested it, or was it on the
cards already, and I kind ofcame to the conclusion that
again, there've been all thesethings along the way, there was
a couple more that we might getto.
But, yeah, I was like, oh right, this seems to be, this seems
to be my thing, I don't know.

(25:17):
I thought everything kind ofmade sense after that.
You know, I've always kind of Iwould always want to have
deeper conversations with people, or you know, why is this or
what?
What are we doing here?
And, and typically, peoplewouldn't really be interested,
and I always used to find itkind of frustrating, you know,
and I feel like, well, what moreimportant question is there,
you know?

(25:37):
But I get it.
You know, we've got stuff toget on with and I've got a lot
of friends that are sort ofskeptical of this stuff and I
respect that and I'm not tryingto, you know, enforce my beliefs
on them.
But yeah, it seems to be.
It makes sense to me now.

Speaker 1 (25:52):
So how did you get started in terms of studying?
Because you studied with somepretty amazing people.

Speaker 2 (25:59):
Yeah, so I'd finished .
I finished this book by themedium, claire Broad, and very
quickly afterwards I came acrossthis place called the College
of Psychic Studies in London,and I did again.
I was like didn't know therewas a place such as you know the
Good.

Speaker 1 (26:14):
Exist.

Speaker 2 (26:15):
Yeah, I was like, what is this?
Like the X-Men school orsomething you know, and Claire
was the author, she was doing aclass there, pretty much like
weeks after I'd finished thebook.
And again I was like, well,that's a weird coincidence, I'll
go along.
And I told Claire pretty muchall these stories that I told
you when we had a break.

(26:36):
And she was the first personthat at that point was like oh,
yeah, yeah, yeah, that makesperfect sense.
You know, that's your spirit,guys trying to get in touch with
you, that's this, that's that.
And the first person thatdidn't really sort of dismiss
this whole thing as justrambling nonsense, you know.
And she asked to keep in touch.
So, yeah, I very quickly becamelike fast friends with her and

(26:57):
took a lot of her workshops andclasses.
And then, you know, in sort ofdowntime, anything else that
popped up, like Gordon Smith orJames Van Prouder, I would sort
of jump on a Zoom class withthem or something like that.
And yeah, just try to sort ofkeep practicing, you know.
And then soon after that I metanother lady that did a kind of

(27:17):
like a fortnightly circle, likea development developing
mediumship circle, which I stillgo to.
So, yeah, just kind of beenpracticing and so far so good.
I'm definitely not callingmyself a medium at this stage, I
think, you know, just inrespect to the people that have
done it before me.
They've told me they've done itseven, eight years before he

(27:38):
even actually gave a reading,you know, but at least in
practice I've pretty much had ahundred percent success rate.
So yeah, it's crazy.

Speaker 1 (27:48):
Yeah, mediumship is different in the UK than it is
here.
I mean, here people, they'lltake a weekend workshop and
they'll go out and start callingthemselves a medium, and in
England it seems like you guysare a lot more serious about
developing.
And you know, have you?
You know, have you heard ofNikki Allen?

Speaker 2 (28:08):
I'm not sure it might sound familiar.

Speaker 1 (28:11):
She's a medium in England and she's written a
couple of books.
In one of her books she talksabout, you know, going to the
spiritualist churches andthey're like you've been
practicing long enough so theywouldn't even let her on the
platform.

Speaker 2 (28:22):
So that's something I'm very conscious of because
you know, I've wrote this bookand I wrote another book
straight afterwards that they'llbe out next year, and I kind of
feel like somewhat like alittle bit of a Maverick step in
saying, hey, I'm a medium in ayear, you know, and this is how
to do it, and I've kind of like,wrote what's worked for me and
in theory, the reader could, youknow, follow these steps and

(28:43):
progress as well.
And I'm also conscious of notupsetting this very traditional,
you know, long, long history ofspiritualism in this country.
Like you say.
You know that I don't want tosort of be frowned upon for
suggesting that anyone can goout and do this.
Yeah, I don't know.

(29:03):
You know, I remember seeing agirl one night step into the
church.
She said she'd been doing itfor a couple of months and she
just gave, you know,confirmation after confirmation
of people everyone's hand wouldhave gone up and all agreeing
with what she was saying.
It was.
You know, she seemed as good asthe ones I've seen doing it for
years.
So I don't know, maybe there'sjust kind of a traditionalist

(29:24):
hierarchy, I'm not sure.

Speaker 1 (29:26):
Yeah, well, I think it's kind of like and I've been
talking to millions for severalyears now, seven or eight years,
and you know, and so what I'vecome to the conclusion it's kind
of like people that have skillsof playing music.
There's some people that areprodigies, you know, and they
can pick up a guitar and teachthemselves a play, and there's
someone like me that could studyfor years and never be any good

(29:46):
at all, and there's everythingin between, right.
So there's nothing that saysthat you have to be a medium for
10 years before you can be good, but it's probably an exception
rather than the rule.

Speaker 2 (29:57):
Yeah, yeah, that makes sense, that makes sense.
Yeah, yeah, I'm just, like Isay, just very cautious about
stepping on any sort oftraditionalist toes, because
there are people around thatthat I've met that really
started with people from ahundred, you know, that were
around 100 years ago.
You know they kind of met themat the tail end of their lives,
learned from these people thatwere the pioneers of this stuff

(30:20):
and then, like two generationsaway, you know, it's kind of
really close to thattraditionalist element.
So, yeah, I'm kind of alwaystrying to be respectful for it,
you know.

Speaker 1 (30:30):
Yeah, I think that's great.
I think it's great that youtake it seriously.
But also I would encourage youto be confident in your
abilities, because I've again,I've known lots of mediums.
Some are just natural born.
I was talking to one just theother day.
She's just always been, she'salways seen spirit and has
always been with her.
And then I know people who havedeveloped, you know, in their

(30:52):
30s or 40s or even 50s, and ittook them, you know, years to
develop after that.
So it's everything in between.

Speaker 2 (31:00):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, no.
Well, I mean just sort of tobring it sort of full circle, I
mean it's very much helped mewith dealing with the loss of my
mom.
It's been well.
Yeah, it was January 2021.
So you know, we're approachingsomewhat the three year mark and
I feel like it it's somewhataccelerated the healing process

(31:21):
for me.
I'm not sure, of course, we allgo through this at our own pace.
The first year was unbelievablyhard.
You know I wasn't prepared forhow hard it was and you know a
lot of people lost people aroundthat period of time and a
friend of mine had lost both ofhis parents, a few friends

(31:43):
actually, and you know a coupleof them are like well, you know,
it's cool, I'm moving on, youknow, six months later, and I'm
like I can't even comprehendthat.
You know that I wanted to hurt,I wanted to feel all of it.
That being said, learning aboutthis stuff was a very sort of
mixed bag of emotions, and rightin the book too, because, as
much as I was pouring my griefinto it and it definitely helped

(32:05):
to sort of write about it I waslearning about these amazing
things.
You know they were happeningalmost weekly as I explored
mediumship.
So yeah, it was kind of a verybittersweet journey, you know,
but it definitely helped,definitely helped.

Speaker 1 (32:19):
So have you been?
Have you been a contact, yourspirit guide since since then?
Are you, are you makingconnection with them?

Speaker 2 (32:26):
Yeah, I'm still learning to meet them.
It's kind of funny to have likea few years ago I would have
dismissed this whole thing, youknow I would have probably been
intrigued but I wouldn't havetaken it that seriously.
But to talk about it now yeah,you know I've met a couple of
them.
I feel like I'm still on my wayto sort of get into no more.
Definitely the last couple ofmonths since the books come out

(32:50):
and talking about promoting itand sort of thinking about all
that stuff, it's kind of made mypractice suffer somewhat.
I haven't been meditating asmuch as I should and all these
kind of things, and I can seeit's kind of gone to the wayside
a little bit.
But I plan to get back to itvery soon and I think that's

(33:10):
fine.
I think that you know we'realso we've also got stuff to get
on with.
We need to pay the rent and youknow we've got practical
obligations and we are having aphysical experience.
So I think that it all happensin its own time.
But yeah, I initially, thefirst year or two of the yeah,
up until recently, I felt verymuch connected and, yeah, it's

(33:34):
been interesting.
It's been interesting and justbeing able to sort of
differentiate between mythoughts and what I believe is
coming from them.
Yeah, thank you.

Speaker 1 (33:45):
Well, I know you've said you've been.
You feel like you've beenguided to write a trilogy, to
write three books.
I assume that's coming fromyour guides, or where is that
coming from?

Speaker 2 (33:54):
Yeah, definitely so.
The second book, which goes wayout.
There is kind of less about meand more about the bigger
picture.
I've pretty much, to an extent,told you my whole story as
things that have happened tomyself.
So I don't want to just write abunch of books saying, I mean,

(34:15):
I've read books like this wheremediums are talking about, you
know, confirmations that theygive to people or readings that
they give for people, and it'skind of a list of that.
I don't want to do that, youknow, I don't want to just be
like and then this person saidthat, and then they said that,
and then they agreed that.
And while those things did helpme initially, I feel like

(34:36):
there's a bigger thing going onhere that we should look into.
And I feel that the second bookI feel that half of it wasn't
from me, you know.
I'd look back at it and I'dthink, okay, that's way smarter
than me.
I'm not.
I wouldn't have come up withthat.
You know, when I read it now, Icouldn't, sort of, off the top
of my head, talk about some ofthe things that are wrote in

(34:58):
there.
I truly believe that it hascome from something higher than
me, yeah, so I've left it atthat.
I haven't made a start on thethird book yet and I'm just
trusting that it'll come tofruition when it does, you know.

Speaker 1 (35:16):
Okay, so in your first book, the book that's out
now, there's I know this talkabout like meditation and
exercises and things that peoplecan do, so it's more than just
your story, right?
So tell me about what the otherparts of the book are.

Speaker 2 (35:27):
Yeah, definitely.
I just started writing aboutwhat really worked for me in
terms of meditation and that wasreally a game changer from back
before my mom passing oranything like that.
I was kind of looking at it as amore sort of practical mental
health practice that I learnedabout, but then as a subtle
exploring for mediumship.
It seems that meditation istruly the doorway to open, open

(35:51):
us up to that, and one of thethings I like to sort of talk
about is that, and that thereare probably a way, smarter
terms to use them, the way I'mgoing to describe it, but as
though we've got like a backseatdriver.
You know which is ourconsciousness, which is
observing our thoughts, right?
So you know we sort of we reactto our thoughts and respond to

(36:12):
them and everything comes fromthought, essentially, right.
You know and I really sort ofran with that idea in the book
that when we can sort of take astep back and don't get attached
to the emotions that are sortof we're constantly being
bombarded with this, and thatyou know, for example, one thing
I always say is kind of youstep outside and you're on your

(36:33):
way to do something, you seesomebody in a red t-shirt and
you know that kind of triggerssome memory of somebody at
school that bored you in a redt-shirt or something like that,
and you got that going on whileyou're trying to do what you're
trying to do and it's justnonstop right.
And I feel that meditation isreally beneficial to being able
to step back from all that andjust taking a moment to yourself
and then recognizing that we'renot our thoughts.

(36:54):
You know, we're somethingthat's internal, external to
that.
I'm not sure about that yet,but yeah, there's a huge benefit
in it and I believe that, again, learning about mediumship,
when you can sort of separatethat, then when something else
comes in, then you recognize itas something else.
You know, okay, that's not partof that whole you know, passing

(37:15):
train of thoughts over there,this is something that's coming
from somewhere else and stillyou're the one at the back
that's taken all thisinformation in.
So, yeah, I find it fascinatingand, yeah, the meditation seems
to be really that seems to besomething that people are really
have responded well to with thebook?

Speaker 1 (37:33):
Yeah, I think it's really interesting.
I have a big proponent ofmeditation and a lot of people
push back against it becausethey say, well, I can't do it,
they don't understand it.
So do you give some practicaltips for people that are
struggling with that?

Speaker 2 (37:47):
Yeah, definitely.
I did one the other day.
Actually, really, verygradually, I've been going to
these sort of spiritualfestivals and stuff like that
that are a thing here, and I didone the other day.
A lot of people showed up Iwould have been happy with one
and I think about 60 peopleshowed up, but I kind of there
was a lot going on around us.

(38:08):
It was a big sort of festival.
There was Jumps playingsomewhere and people doing this
and that.
And I think that you know wehave this sort of illusion that
we have to, you know, be sittingin silence and not get
distracted and kind of I thinkit's fine to get distracted as
long as you just bring yourselfback.
So, with that meditation thatwe did that day, I was like,

(38:28):
okay, well, let's use thesesounds, you know, to sort of
ground us to this moment,because I think that's also key,
you know, just being present inthe moment Nothing as
terrifying as I talked aboutearlier but just being conscious
that we're right here right now, focusing on the breath, always
come back to the breath and youknow, if you do hear a dog
barking in the distance, justuse it.
You know, be like, okay, that'sme right now.

(38:49):
That's keeping me right here,while I, you know, sort of go
through this and you knowdistractions are going to come
up, it's inevitable.
But just yeah, always come backto the breath, always come back
to the present moment.

Speaker 1 (39:02):
Yeah, I think that's great that you do that and
describe for people and it'skind of I was kind of smiling
there when you talked aboutcoming back to the present
moment, thinking about yourterrifying experience of being
able to get out of the presentmoment.
But there's that balance interms of being human.
You know, I just said I'mstruggling right now with this
concept of because I'm readingall these books telling me that

(39:23):
time is an illusion and there'sreally no past and there's
really no future, and it's aconcept that I struggle with.
But you've had the flip side ofthat experience.

Speaker 2 (39:34):
Yeah, I mean, it was so terrifying.
But then I've had things sincearound mediumship, like, for
example, I shouldn't really tellall the tales that are in the
book, but for example, I wasstruggling with this whole
mediumship at one point and Iwas begging for you know, I'd
had signs but I wanted more.
And I was at my mom's house.

(39:55):
You know, she'd been gone a fewmonths and I still sort of kept
hold of the house just to sortof be there and be around her
things and grieve.
And I remember going to thebeach one night and I was like,
okay, well, you know, if this isthe thing, if you, whoever you
is wants me to do this, thengive me.
I need more, you know.

(40:15):
And this was like a pretty crazyexperience, I have to say.
And I settled in this spot onthe beach and I was crying.
I was very much missing my mom.
I probably had a bit to drinkthat night and I started kind of
just like yelling.
I was like proper freak outmoment.
I was like, all right, you know, just give me something if this
is what you want me to do.
You know and I'm talking spiritguides here and I've been sat

(40:38):
there for a while and I was kindof given up and I turned to my
left and there was a.
There was a cafe right next tome and there was a chalkboard on
the cafe and this is I stilldon't really get this like and
on the cafe chalkboard was myname.
I said Phil wrote in chalk andall around it is said hi hi, hi,
hi, hi, hi, hi hi, as in likethe greeting, and I was like,

(41:03):
okay, there we go again.
You know, I'm asking for a signand there's my name and a bunch
of like sort of greetingsaround it and I've gone there
before.
The fact right, so I've gonethere before.
I was kind of asking for thesign and stuff like that.
So the whole thing you knowabout time being nonlinear and
maybe on the other side thatthat's probably the case, that

(41:25):
the kind of I'm assuming that'srecognized my plate taking me to
the place that was going togive me the you know, the
comfort that I'm on the righttrack.

Speaker 1 (41:35):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's great.
So can you explain to me,because I know that I was
reading your notes and one ofthe things you said that really
intrigued me, that you said theinspiration, instinct and
ingenuity are the same asintuition, divination and
clairvoyance.
So what do you mean by that?

Speaker 2 (41:51):
Yeah, absolutely, I think you know and this is
something I say a lot, but Ireally I believe it's true.
You know, people talk abouthaving a gut feeling, or we say
we can't put our finger onsomething, or we talk about
walking into a room and cuttingthe air with a knife where
someone's had an argument, andyou know we pick up on these
things and we all agree thatthis is a real thing.
You know, no matter if you'reskeptical of any spiritual stuff

(42:12):
or not, but then, yeah, if youstart using was like Clair
Sentience or Clair audience oranything like that, or a sixth
sense, then people typicallyjust dismiss you or look at you
like you're nuts.
But I think it's simply aquestion of semantics, right,
we're talking about the samething, we're talking about the
same moments of knowing that weget, but we're just using

(42:34):
different language.
You know it's the same stuff,right, and I've felt that again,
since learning about meditation, learning about mediumship,
I've really become more in tunewith intuition and my honest,
you know, sort of authentic self.
Yeah, I think we all have them,it's just we just use different
times for them.

Speaker 1 (42:55):
Yeah, I think that's a really good point.
We do shy away from certainterms and we've all had the
experience.
You know, for example, youthink about somebody in the
phone rings and it's them, andyou know, we just we chalk that
up to coincidence and things.
I mean, we've all hadexperiences like that.

Speaker 2 (43:14):
Yeah, that's it.
And you know even some of themore sort of profound, I would
say sort of mystical spiritualexperiences.
They somehow I feel that theydon't quite sit in your memory
of the same way as everydaypractical stuff, you know.
So when something does happen,like like me sitting on the
beach and there's my name ropeon the cafe, or or I've had a
couple of other things, one withmy partner who she's very much

(43:38):
on the fence about this stuff,she kind of it's kind of good,
she keeps me grounded somewhatbut, she's very sort of leaning
more towards agnostic.
I suppose.
We had an experience togetherthat was very overwhelming and
profound, and and she was like,okay, what, what is this?

(43:58):
You know what?
There was something physically,since they like going on
something with us, sure, and andI said, well, this is what I'm
talking about, this is exactlywhat I've been talking about all
these months, and I know sheexperienced it, and I said,
after this is done, I saidyou're not going to remember
this the same way, because it'snot like something that comes in
through the usual sensors, it'snot something that you can

(44:19):
touch or taste or or or.
I mean these things happen aswell.
But this particular thing thatwas happened to us, it was more
like a knowing or a very oddsensation that was that was
happening between us, andafterwards she kind of was like,
yeah, well, something happened,but I don't know, you know, I
thought that that thing wasgoing to change everything for

(44:40):
her, but it didn't.
You know she's still like, well, yeah, something happened, but
it doesn't mean that I believein life after death at this
point.
But you know, but yeah, I justto go sort of back again to the
point I feel that these thingsdon't really sit in our memory,
the same way as you know what wejust did this afternoon.

Speaker 1 (45:00):
You know Well, you just described something there
that I think is very importantthat we, that we kind of dig
into a little bit, because youtalked even about some of the
experiences you had earlier.
We have an experience, it'svery visceral, it's very real to
us, we, but then over time ourbrain talks us out of it.
Did that really happen?

(45:22):
Did that really happen the wayI felt it happened?
And especially when it's asubjective experience, when it's
only us, just just one personseeing it, two people see it, we
give it more weight.
I think that's reallyinteresting about about our
culture too.
It's like if I see something, Idescribe it to you, then people
are like and maybe it happened,but if two people describe it,

(45:43):
then we give it more weight.
But we I think we all talk ortend to talk ourselves out of
things like that.

Speaker 2 (45:49):
Yeah, absolutely.
You know, I'd still do itmyself and I still I've heard of
mediums, you know, that havebeen practicing for years,
saying that they still questionit.
Even though they they get thisinformation like on a regular
basis, they're still like Idon't know, is this real?
You know, it's kind of weird.
You know, like I and for myself, like I know that these things
that I'm given to people, noidea where it comes from.

(46:12):
You know, I know in theory howit works, but I don't know the
actual mechanics of it and allyou can sort of do is just trust
that it, that it's a thing.
And I think that's really thekey and that's probably where a
lot of skeptics sort of pointout that that that's what's not
logical about it.
It's like, well, if you startbelieving in this stuff, then
you're going to be looking forit and then you're going to sort

(46:34):
of confirm to yourself becauseyou're actually searching.
You know, you know what I mean.
So it's, I get it.
But yeah, you know, I hadanother experience and sorry, I
won't keep rambling on aboutstories, but for me it was
amazing and I even it was againa paranormal somewhat experience
I saw an orb and I caught it oncamera and I said to my friend

(46:57):
I was like look at this amazingright.
And he was like yeah.
I don't know man.
He was like maybe it's a lightfrom outside, and I'm like, no,
it's not okay, and I'm not inthe habit of lying about these
things.
You know what I mean.
It's like we've known eachother for 30 years, you know.
Like when have I ever come upwith something like this, you
know?
And but still he's like yeah, Idon't know, I don't know, it

(47:19):
just doesn't sit right with him,you know.

Speaker 1 (47:22):
Well, there is and this is.
I've just realized this tomyself.
I'm a very rational person.
I'm a chemical engineer bytraining and I realized this was
just a couple weeks ago.
I'm reading all these books byphysicists and, you know,
philosophers and everything,trying to understand how things
work.
And I think it's fine to try tounderstand how things work.

(47:42):
I think that's part of beinghuman.
But the problem is we tend todismiss things if we don't
understand how they work.
And what I find with thematerialist people say is like,
well, since we don't understandhow mediumship works, therefore
it can't be true.
I don't understand how neardepth experiences happen,
therefore they can't be true.

(48:03):
And I was just really recentlyhearing Neil deGrasse Tyson
talking about, like what you'redescribing?
Something that we can't measure, we can't see, blah, blah, blah
and that's just that's, that'simaginary.
And I'm reading this book.
They're talking about darkmatter and dark energy which
nobody knew existed until 1998.
We still can't, we still don'tknow what they are.
The physicists just tell usthat they it has to be there

(48:25):
because of the way the universeworks, but we don't know what it
is, we can't detect it, wedon't have.
But and that's fine You're likethis is OK.
We'll accept dark matter anddark energy, but we won't accept
the fact that that Phil cantalk to dead people, because we
don't understand how it works.

Speaker 2 (48:39):
Yeah, now, that's it, isn't it it?
I've read and I wish I couldreel them off now, but I've read
of a few converts from fromscience that have really sort of
gone down this path and they'retalking about science almost as
a as a religion.
You know that.
Ok, just, they just won't touchit because because it's.
You know, I'm just going tobutcher this now, but one lady

(49:03):
was talking about, you know,they say well, this study has
been done on that.
She's probably talking about onething that hasn't really been
funded and someone's been likedoesn't make sense.
Ok, it's not a thing, you know.
She's like no one's actuallyreally looked into this and and
a lot of the research I thinkshe was saying showed that.
You know, in terms of peoplesaying they've got clairvoyant
abilities or or, or remoteviewing or all these kind of,

(49:26):
you know, things that sound kindof nuts, that there's a lot,
there's more evidence that isfor it than against it, you know
.
But nobody wants to touch itbecause it just it just calls
everything into question, youknow.
So what can you do?

Speaker 1 (49:38):
Well it's.
I was listening to JulieByshele who's she's done
research on mediums.
She has one runs a thing calledthe Windbridge Institute and
they've actually brought mediumsin and they've done quadruple
blind or quintuple blind studiesand, and there's, they've
eliminated all the things theskeptics say cold reading, hot
reading, you know, bias, allthis, all this.

(50:00):
They've eliminated all thosethings and they've proven that
some mediums can pass, you knowthese tests.
But she said something I hadn'theard before.
I thought this is reallyinteresting.
Some people's brains, when theyhear something new, the front
part of their brain like lightsup and they get really curious
about it and they're like what'sthat?
I want to find out more aboutthat.
Other people, when they hearsomething new, they're amygdala
lights up, their fear receptorslight up and you're like, oh no,

(50:23):
this must be dangerous, we mustrun away from this.
And I just heard this, like aweek ago, and I'm like that's
profound to me, because there'ssome of us that say, ok, well,
this is new, I don't understandit, let me find out more about
it.
And others of us say, well, Idon't understand it.
Therefore it's got to be scary.

Speaker 2 (50:39):
Yeah, that's that's.
I like that as well.
That's interesting.
I got a couple of friends thatI spoke to recently and I feel
that something that possiblyavoiding me because I'm going to
go down this road with them andthey're like I just don't want
to go there, and and one of themsaid, well, that you know,
that's all great, but thatdoesn't help me.
You know, that doesn't serve myday to day life at all.

(50:59):
That's interesting or whatever,but so what, you know, so what?
Like I've still got to go towork, I've still got to do this
and I've still got to do that,and her brain just doesn't go
there.
You know, yeah, so again, andyou know I respect that and a
few years ago, if I'd have comeacross somebody talking like
this, I'd be like I don't know,man, that's a bit.

(51:21):
You know, it sounds quite outthere.

Speaker 1 (51:23):
Yeah, yes, and you know, again, I think that goes
back to that balance thing wecan't, we can't live.
We have to live in this world,we have to live the physical, as
you pointed out, we have to paythe bills, and so those people
are correct.
But death is something that isthe only thing that's universal,
that we're all going to face,personally and for people around

(51:46):
us.
So it's you know when, whensomething happens and this is, I
find this, a lot of people likeyour mother passing or losing a
child, or losing a spouse,that's what kicks us on to that
journey that says, ok, thisstuff is important, but that's
that's what's really important.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (52:05):
Yeah, definitely, and that's it.
You know, I can't imagine.
I've heard your story and Ican't imagine how that must,
must be.
I feel that when we, when welose a parent and I say this
quite a lot as well, but wereally lose like the one true
witness to our lives.
You know the person, andobviously people have different
relationships with the parentslike I'm not saying that this is

(52:27):
across the board, but yeah,that person that's been there
since day one and for me it feltlike stepping into an alternate
universe suddenly.
You know, you just kind ofassumed that they were always
going to be there and and yeah,back to what you said, we kind
of assumed that we was going tobe here is kind of so odd the
way we've got things set uparound death.
And yeah, I think it would, youknow, be a good thing if we

(52:50):
could somewhat normalize it moreand talk about it.

Speaker 1 (52:54):
Yes, it's well, it's scary and we don't want to talk
about it.
And your friends, you know Iit's.
It's really interesting.
My, it's been eight years forme since my daughter passed and
we just had my wife's 60thbirthday party yesterday, two
days ago, and our friends werehere and they know it's like, ok
, this is what I talk about,this is what's right.

(53:14):
And it was funny because afriend of mine called me over
during we're during the birthdayparty.
She said do you want to getphilosophical?
I said yeah, always.
And she started asking me aquestion about what was going on
with this family, if I believedin soul planning and stuff like
that.
And I'm like that to me feltreally good, that she felt
comfortable, you know, havingthat conversation with me.
So I think there are peoplelike you and I that are put here
to.
This is what we're here to do,I think.

Speaker 2 (53:36):
Yeah, I believe so.
And again, in hindsight, I feellike I was always drawn to
these things but I didn't reallyknow where to go.
I would always kind of hit abrick wall, you know it would be
, like, well, that's reallyinteresting, but we just don't
know beyond that.
And I feel that I'm starting tolearn something and it would be
really arrogant to say that Iknow something more than I did

(54:00):
before, I suppose.
But I feel like, yeah, I'm onthe right track, at least.
I guess we're just not designedto know right and, you know,
it'll sort of figure itself outin the end.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
So where do you see yourself going?
I know you just said we don'tknow, because we never know
where we're going to go, but doyou see developing to
professional medium or what doyou see yourself going?

Speaker 2 (54:23):
I'm still on the fence about that.
I find it fascinating.
I've got to be really careful.
Again, I don't want to comeacross as sounding arrogant.
I feel that, you know, I'm verymuch at the start of my journey
with mediumship, like when I'llgive a reading, I'll see
somebody, I'll be able tophysically describe them.
I usually see the circumstancesaround the passing and then
I'll ask for a message and thatwill come to me as a very basic

(54:47):
symbol, you know, like a ship orsomething like that, and so I
feel like it's very rudimentarywhat I'm offering people,
whereas I don't feel that I'mgoing to be able to say anything
.
I feel that I'm at the stagewhere I could actually give
anyone anything hugelybeneficial, you know.
I feel, like I get these threethings and then I'm done, or
perhaps that's me just sort ofsetting myself short, I don't

(55:09):
know, but I'm not suremediumship, working as an actual
medium, is my sort of finaldestination.
I just feel that it's a key tosomething bigger.
Definitely the second book, thethings that I've written that,
like I say, it goes kind of wayout there about time and stuff

(55:30):
like this, some stuff that I'malmost apprehensive about people
reading definitely people thatknow me they're going to think,
okay, he's gone.
But yeah, I feel that there's abigger picture around all this
and one good thing at least wecan say is that it does seem to
be able to be a bit easier totalk about these things than it

(55:51):
was 10 years ago or 15 years ago.
Even skeptical people seem tobe somewhat open to at least
giving up the time of day for alittle while, even if they shut
it down.
I think, yeah, people can havethese conversations a lot more
easier than we're used to.

Speaker 1 (56:09):
Yeah, I think so.
There's a couple of things hereI think science, frankly, is
catching up with philosophersand theologians have told us for
thousands of years.
At this point, you look atquantum physics, quantum
mechanics, quantum theory.
Everybody knows what that is.
Now You're mentioning theMarvel movies and they're

(56:29):
exploring a lot of these themes.
The Doctor Strange movie when Iwent to see that I was like,
wow, this is a deeply spiritualmovie.
I know that's not what theymeant to make, but it is.

Speaker 2 (56:40):
Yeah, I remember I was on a plane and I watched the
animated Spider-Man movie froma couple of years ago.
I was like this is deep.
When I was a kid I was watchingScooby-Doo and they would pull
the mask up somewhere, Right,right, that would be the end.
They're talking about multipledimensions and stuff like that.
Really, if that's how kids arethinking these days, that's

(57:04):
pretty impressive.

Speaker 1 (57:05):
Yeah, and Disney's putting up movies like Soul.
I think what's happening is Ithink people are moving away
from religion and people tend tomix up religion and
spirituality, but people aswe're getting these messages in
a non-religious way, people aremore open to them.

(57:25):
I think people crave this stuff.
We tend to push it down becausesociety tells us that we need
to, so I applaud you for beingbrave enough to put yourself out
there.

Speaker 2 (57:37):
No, thank you.
Yeah, I mean it's been like Isay it's been somewhat of a
healing process for me.
After I'd written the firstbook, I just felt like I'd
learned so much and I felt thatmy story was done to an extent.
And then I'd learned all theseamazing things and I was like,
well, I've got another book hereand really went into that and

(58:01):
the bigger picture.
It still comes down to myopinion somewhat.
So I'm not saying that it's allfor one of a better word gospel
, but it's food for thought, Isuppose.

Speaker 1 (58:12):
Yeah, yeah, well, I think your opinion.
I'm trying to think how torespond to that.
I mean, everything that wewrite, I guess, is pretty much
from our own point of view andwe can share things and hope it
resonates with somebody.
But even again, being ascientific person myself and
realizing that every newscientific theory is laughed at

(58:37):
at first, it's all like that'scrazy, that's insane.
Quantum theory was laughed at.
The first guy that talked aboutmicrobes.
He said I think diseases arecaused by these invisible tiny
things that are floating aroundin the air.
There's no evidence for that,so it's all laughed at at some
point.
So, yeah, your opinion, yourexperiences, and I do read a lot

(59:03):
of talk to a lot of people, andso I see, when I look at the
commonalities between people saythat's where I see the truth,
and there are a lot of peoplesaying the same things that
you're saying now.
They're people that are puttingthat message out.

Speaker 2 (59:16):
That's a.
I think that's a hugelyimportant point as well.
Yeah, like when I've beenlooking into this, it's like,
okay, there are so many of thesestories.
You know people talking aboutnear death experiences and so
many commonalities and all ofthem is.
And how has this just beenignored?
You know, like I don't know howmany thousands of people
talking about you know similarexperiences, especially when

(59:37):
they've passed and come backagain.
They're all the same story,essentially.
You know there's got to besomething to it.

Speaker 1 (59:44):
Right, right, and again people.
This is why people like us seemto keep telling, because people
think, oh, near deathexperiences there's, you know,
every once in a while peoplehave.
It's a lack of oxygen to thebrain, it's a hallucination, and
there are people that have doneresearch.
So whenever someone said to meI'm like you need to read this
book or you need to look at thisresearch, because people have

(01:00:05):
actually controlled, for allthat and it's, I think, the
estimates between five and 10%of the populations had an NDE at
this point, which is literallybillions of people on the planet
that have had this experience.

Speaker 2 (01:00:18):
Right, right, and I, I under shot there with
thousands.

Speaker 1 (01:00:21):
Yeah, yeah, it's millions, and just in the US, I
mean yeah, and if you thinkabout worldwide, it's billions
of people.
So, yeah, keep you know.
We need people like you, needto keep putting this out there
and it makes it acceptable toother people and our friends
might scoff at us, but also, oneday they'll be.

(01:00:42):
They'll be there asking youquestions.
They'll be.
They'll be calling you over andsaying my mom just died and
that's it.
This has been my experience.
Do you think this was real?

Speaker 2 (01:00:51):
No, well, that's the thing, isn't it?
And just to sort of get back tothe grief thing again, you
really don't know until you know.
I thought I anticipated what,what it was going to be like,
you know, and and again losing aparent.
You kind of you know that'sprobably on the cards, but the
experience itself was, wasnothing that could have prepared

(01:01:11):
me.
You know, it's just beenprofound, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:01:17):
It's something we're all going to go through, where,
like I said, we're in the people.
I know it's, it's an unpleasantthought, but it's something
we're all going to go through,might as well.
Be, you know, prepared.
It's my, my way of looking atit.
So so, phil, let people remindpeople of the name of your book
and let people know where theycan get it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:35):
Yeah, it's called letting glow, so really was just
kind of a play on the, on the,on the words there, of sort of
getting through grief and comingout of it a bit brighter.
Yeah, it's available at all theusual bookshops.
If they haven't physically gotit, you can ask for it and it's,
of course, on on Amazon.
Social media wise most activeon Instagram, and I've got a

(01:01:58):
website that I'm probably goingto redo is not the best, but
people have been getting intouch with me through that
PhilWebsacom.

Speaker 1 (01:02:06):
Okay so, and it's filled with two L's.
Yeah, Fill with two L's, yeah,okay so, yeah, and then the
audio too, because sometimespeople are out walking and
listening.
Well, phil, it's been a realpleasure getting to know you.
Thanks for being here, thanksfor doing what you do.

Speaker 2 (01:02:22):
Thanks for very much for having me on.
I've particularly been lookingforward to speaking to you, like
I say after hearing you a fewmonths ago on another podcast.
So, yeah, yeah, pleasurespeaking with you.

Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
All right.
Well, good luck with the book.
We'll talk later.
Thank you, you're welcome you.