In this powerful episode of Growing Tall Poppies, Dr. Nat Green is joined once again by Nichole Morrin, clinical psychologist, author, founder of the Invisible Health Network, & The Invisible CEO and creator of the revolutionary COMPASS-5 Model. Together, they unpack Nichi’s harrowing and inspiring journey—from life-threatening illnesses and diagnoses to her 17yo daughter’s shocking heart attack, and the medical dismissal that nearly cost her life.
This episode is a must-listen for anyone navigating life with invisible illnesses, burnout, chronic fatigue, autoimmune conditions, or trauma. Nichi shares how lived experience, medical gaslighting, and systemic failures ignited her mission to transform the healthcare system from within.
💡Key Takeaways:
✅ The link between trauma, invisible illnesses, and nervous system burnout
✅ Medical gaslighting is trauma. Patients deserve to be heard, believed, and treated holistically.
✅ Advocacy fatigue is real—especially for parents and professionals advocating over and over again in broken systems.
✅ Your dreams are still possible, even with a complex health condition. But the strategies must be different.
✅ Burnout is not weakness—it’s often a symptom of deeper, ignored stressors in the nervous system.
✅ Nichi’s COMPASS-5 framework – a trauma-informed, validation-based model that supports both patients and professionals
✅ Healing includes both body and soul: meditation, nervous system work, movement, and creative expression all matter.
✅ Professionals with lived experience have the power to lead the future of trauma-informed, sustainable care.
🔥 Episode Highlights:
🌿 Nichi recounts her daughter’s near-fatal heart attack at 17—initially dismissed as anxiety by paramedics.
🌿 How Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome, POTS, endometriosis, and autoimmune disease shaped Nichi’s life and work.
🌿 The creation of COMPASS-5: a model that changes how invisible and complex conditions are supported systemically for patients and professionals.
🌿 Why most coaching/consulting programs fail those with chronic or fluctuating health—and how The Invisible CEO fills that gap.
This episode offers inspiration and practical advice for anyone looking to thrive after adversity and includes a candid, emotionally raw conversation about burnout, vicarious trauma, and letting go of shame for needing rest due to Invisible Conditions.
🌐 Connect with Nichi:
If this episode resonates with you then I'd love for you to hit SUBSCRIBE so you can keep updated with each new episode as soon as it's released and we'd be most grateful if you would give us a RATING as well. You can also find me on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/drnatgreen/ or on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/DrNatalieGreen
Intro and Outro music: Inspired Ambient by Playsound.
Disclaimer: This podcast is intended for educational purposes only. It is not intended to be deemed or treated as psychological treatment or to replace the need for psychological treatment.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr Nat Green (00:01):
Welcome to the Growing Tall Poppies Podcast.
I'm your host, Dr.
Nat Green, and I'm so excitedto have you join me as we
discuss what it means tonavigate your way through
post-traumatic growth and notjust survive, but to thrive
after trauma.
Through our podcast, we willexplore ways for you to create a
(00:27):
life filled with greaterpurpose, self-awareness, and a
deep inner peace.
Through integrating the manyyears of knowledge and
professional experience, as wellas the wisdom of those who have
experienced trauma firsthand.
We'll combine psychologyaccelerated approaches.
(00:48):
Coaching and personalexperience to assist you, to
learn, to grow and to thrive.
I hope to empower you to createdeeper awareness and
understanding and strongerconnections with yourself and
with others, whilst also pavingthe way for those who have
experienced trauma and adversityto reduce their suffering and
(01:13):
become the very best versions ofthemselves.
In order to thrive.
Thank you so much for joiningme on today's episode.
I'm super excited and verygrateful again today to bring
you our next guest on theGrowing Tall Poppies podcast.
It's my absolute pleasure towelcome back because we had her
(01:38):
as a guest last year on episode20, my beautiful friend and
amazing lady.
Nichole Morrin, who shared herremarkable journey and her
trauma story last year, but shehas experienced so much even
(01:59):
since last year, and she'skindly offered to come and chat
with us again today.
Sharing her personal experienceand blending it with her
professional experience.
So let me welcome back mybeautiful friend Nichi Morrin,
and I'll give you a bit of anintro.
So Nichole is a powerhouse ofinsight, empathy, and
(02:24):
transformation.
She's a clinical psychologist,author, sustainable health
consultant, and founder of.
Her latest huge project andmission, the Invisible Health
Network.
She is also the podcast host ofShine the Spotlight, and the
creator of Compass-5, aninterdisciplinary framework for
(02:47):
complex conditions.
This is a groundbreaking model,revolutionizing the way that we
approach invisible and complexhealth conditions, and she is
the amazing voice behind theinvisible CEO.
This is a movement supportingentrepreneurs, business owners,
and professionals who are livingwith invisible illnesses and
(03:09):
want to lead, live and worksustainably.
Nichi blends science, soul, andpersonal lived experience as an
amazing woman living withconditions like hypermobility,
endometriosis, and an autoimmunecondition after her life being
threatened.
And later her daughter's lifebeing threatened.
(03:31):
And I know she's gonna sharemore about that today.
She has made it her mission tochange the health system from
the inside out.
So welcome, Nichi.
I'm so excited to have youback.
Nichi Morrin (03:43):
Thank you so much, Nat.
It is such a pleasure to betalking with you again.
Dr Nat Green (03:49):
Oh, I know that episode 20 that we did last year
early in the Growing TallPoppies podcast.
We had such amazing feedbackabout you, how beautifully you
shared your story and thewonderful mission that you're
on.
So I'd love if you could startby giving us a bit of a brief
(04:14):
introduction of how life wasback then and where you were at
when you first came on.
Nichi Morrin (04:22):
Okay.
So.
Back then I shared my traumahistory.
I suppose I have always feltlike a bit of an underdog and
there's always seems to besomething happening, something
rare popping up.
It's always those rare thingsthat has seemed to be throughout
(04:45):
the decades and I think.
Briefly, what I shared backthen is my story in regards to
when my life was threatened,over a decade ago.
I'll only briefly go over this,but back then I had all these
(05:05):
nodules in my lungs.
Doctors didn't know what theywere, which is a common sort of
story with me and my family.
And they did hint at maybe it'slung cancer, and my life
flashed before my eyes, and thatwas about six months after
giving birth to my second childand being in the emergency
(05:27):
department with all my organsshutting down, feeling I was
going to die also.
So there were two situationswithin six months apart.
I remember I said back then,'cause I was so scared, I just
would never see my kids grow up.
And I thought if I survive, I'mgoing to enroll in uni because
(05:47):
I'd always wanted to.
But those beliefs of am I smartenough?
Am I good enough?
How can I do that?
I did survive, luckily, and Idid enroll in uni and studied
six years full time whileworking as a hairdresser and
became a clinical psychologist.
And I think back then Ithought, I'm doing this because
(06:14):
one, I want a career.
And I was fascinated bypsychology.
But also I wanted more for myfamily.
I wanted.
More sustainability, morefinancial stability.
I wanted something thatinterested me because my brain's
just super busy and goingconstantly.
Yes.
But over the years, as moretraumas occurred, I ended up
(06:36):
realizing I traded one chair foranother.
So I traded standing behind thehairdressing chair with people
to sitting in front of thetherapy chair with people.
Mm.
So that was a light bulbmoment, and that I only got to
maybe five years ago, when Whenmy health started deteriorating.
(06:59):
And also my husband hadinvisible conditions.
And then my eldest daughter atthe age of about 14 started
becoming unwell.
And then throughout the years,my youngest daughter also
started having those signs ofinvisible conditions around that
same age.
So as my health wasdeteriorating and I had several
(07:22):
surgeries and, and I was lookingfor what is wrong with me is
something that I kept sayinglike, there's something wrong.
I had these big dreams andthese visions of being able to
create something great andtrying to change the way I'm
working with one-on-one therapy.
(07:43):
Which was continuing to burn meout.
It's not that I don't like it,I, I do really love psychology
and enjoy my work, but with myhealth, I needed to change how I
was working.
And then I think even though Iam good at listening to my body.
I still wasn't fully listening,I still was doing the same
(08:08):
things, but expecting things tochange, which is what I teach my
clients, you cannot do.
But I was doing it
Dr Nat Green (08:16):
funny how we've gotta learn those lessons and,
and sometimes we go round andround and round before we
finally learn them, isn't it?
Nichi Morrin (08:23):
Absolutely.
And then a few years ago.
Everything just got worse withthe chronic fatigue and then the
pain, and then I could, in myspine and my hips, I could feel
they were getting worse.
No one knew what was going on.
And as I know with my daughterswho I'm very good at advocating
for, yeah, we needed to gowider.
(08:45):
And that is finding the rightpeople to be able to help the
people that are versed ininvisible conditions and work
with it, have that workingknowledge and know what they're
looking for.
And that's when I actually didget diagnosed this year after.
Decades of not knowing anythingand just thinking, I'm a weird
(09:09):
one.
My rheumatologist said, you'renot a weird one.
You are actually an interestingone and you're a rheumatology
patient.
Like, we can work out what'sgoing on with you.
So in the last 12 months, I hadfound out I had.
Adenomyosis endometriosis, PCOSautoimmune condition axial
(09:33):
spondyloarthritis, and I had mydiagnosis confirmed of
hypermobility spectrum disorder,which Both my daughters have as
well, also known as EhlersDanlos syndrome.
So it's on a sliding scale anda spectrum.
These are areas I focus on inmy clinical practice and I
specialize in.
(09:53):
And now I finally have myanswers and I thought, now I
actually know.
Like that feeling was, it was arelief.
But it also gave me answers ofwhy I haven't been able to
realize my dreams, that thereisn't, it's not just me being a
(10:14):
failure there is somethingthere, and how can I change the
way I live and work to still beable to do those things that I'm
wanting?
After I did get the diagnosesand I had answers, I really
realized how.
The six months before gettingthose answers, my light had
(10:36):
dimmed those big dreams that I'dhad for creating a network for
invisible health and traininghealth professionals, or, I had
all these ideas and working withpeople more intimately that
have invisible conditions.
I had doubted myself so much.
(10:57):
I think I had.
Let those beliefs take over ofhow can I do this?
My body's letting me down.
Maybe I should just go get ajob give up my ideas.
And then after I did getanswers, I think I started to
pull myself out of that.
(11:18):
And I thought, well, maybe Ican do this.
I just need to sort of.
Think differently.
I needed clarity in my goalsand what I actually wanted to
achieve and how I could do itsustainably.
So I was sort of sitting inthat space, just working on
things slowly, but didn't have aclear direction yet.
(11:38):
And then I had somethingmassive happen.
And that was my 17-year-olddaughter called me one night in
the middle of the night.
And so we have a very longhouse, so we often will just
call each other, someone phonesat night.
She's like, Mum I feel likethere's a, a house sitting on my
(12:03):
chest.
Um, hopefully I don't cry whileI'm telling this story.
Dr Nat Green (12:08):
It's a very challenging story, so it's
totally okay if you're crying.
Nichi Morrin (12:12):
She said, I feel like my chest is being torn
apart from the inside out.
It's hard to breathe.
I'm in 10, outta 10 pain.
I feel like I'm dying.
And I, I think I was.
I think it was like I waspartly zoned out, like for that
and the next week ahead.
(12:33):
Because I, I remained prettycalm throughout it all and I
dunno how but we called theambulance.
It took probably 50 minutes forthe ambulance to finally come
and she was told.
This is anxiety.
Have some Panadol.
I'm sure you'll be fine.
Your heart is textbook perfect,and this does not go down well.
(13:01):
So one.
Invisible conditions is myarea.
That's what I focus on foryears.
Exactly.
And I hear over and over, thestories of being dismissed,
things not being recognized.
Oh, it's just anxiety and boydoes it grind my gears.
Dr Nat Green (13:17):
Oh, absolutely.
Nichi Morrin (13:19):
And when she's there, in 10 outta 10 pain.
Feeling like your chest hasbeen torn apart, feeling like
there's a house sitting on yourchest, the pressure, pain
radiating through your body.
This is not anxiety.
No.
I've got nothing againstparamedics.
They're brilliant and we needthem, but this was a very
dismissive circumstance.
(13:41):
Twice she told them she hasEhler's Danlos syndrome, which
is a red flag because Exactly.
You have more fragility in yourconnective tissues.
and the hearts included inthat.
Mm-hmm.
They said to her, how do youspell that?
And she said, I feel like I'mdying.
I can't think right now.
(14:01):
Like Google it.
Mm.
So because they couldn't spellit, they left it out of her
reports and handover to thehospital.
Dr Nat Green (14:08):
That's frightening, isn't it?
Oh really?
Nichi Morrin (14:11):
It's very frightening.
And then.
They said, oh, your heart'stextbook perfect.
And were talking to her aboutfood and Red Rooster and that
sort of thing, and, and theywere, the paramedics were told
this is not normal for her.
So she has POTS, so posturalorthostatic Tachycardia
syndrome.
Mm-hmm.
(14:31):
With that, her heart's rarelyunder 100 beats a minute, and
it's more when she's standingafter the heart attack.
It was sitting around that 75.
So yes, it might look textbookperfect to them, but they were
told this is not her normalclinical picture.
So she wasn't looked in at as awhole and in the context of
(14:53):
what was normal for her, so theyweren't gonna take her to the
hospital.
They said, do you really wannago?
Like, we're going past anywayif you want us to take you.
And it's like she's going tothe hospital.
So she was taken to thehospital.
We followed her there and theywere quite dismissive also, so
(15:16):
they're like, oh, I'm sure it'scostochondritis.
So like inflammation in theribs?
Yeah.
Um, we'll do a blood test.
So if you have hypermobility orEhlers Danlos your veins.
They can be hypermobile too.
Yes, and I said to them, shehas hypermobile veins after
digging for 45 minutes in herarm causing further distress.
(15:38):
I said to them, can you pleasestop, put a heat pack on the
other arm, raise the veins andtry there with a, little
butterfly needle?
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Then they got a blood test.
So we waited a couple hours andI, I just kept, I.
Just wanting to know what wasgoing on.
I think every five minutes Iwas looking out the door.
Hmm.
And we, no one had come andseen us and told us what was
(16:00):
going on.
So I asked and said, are herblood test results back.
And the doctor said, oh yeah,they are.
And I said, well, what arethey?
And she goes oh no, it's fine.
You know, we, oh wait.
Um, actually I don't even knowif these are her blood tests
because we did seven at once.
Dr Nat Green (16:19):
Oh my goodness.
Nichi Morrin (16:21):
So she went back for to her desk for a minute and
come back and said, oh no,they're right.
We should really do a lungx-ray, but I'm sure it's fine.
Just go home and come back ifyou get worse.
So it was 5:00 AM by now.
We were exhausted.
We went home and had somesleep.
And then during the next dayshe said, I just feel crap.
(16:43):
She was quite short of breath.
Just not feeling good.
Mm-hmm.
So I booked her in with our GPfor the next morning and the
doctor from the ED called, sothis is 24 hours later, that
doctor from the ED called me,said, oh, I've actually just
read her results.
Her troponin's elevated.
So these results would've beenthere for 24 hours and you
(17:07):
better get in for more tests.
And I said, well, I'm on my wayto the gp, send everything
there.
So we went to the GP and thegps like, it's not normal for a
17-year-old to have elevatedtroponin and she's not doing
this.
She said, go have an urgentblood test and urgent X-ray
straight away.
So we did that and an hourlater we got the call her
troponin's 10 times higher, getto the ED and we're gonna
(17:30):
transfer you through to the nextregional center immediately.
Mm-hmm.
So we did that and I don'tthink the doctors could really
believe what was going onbecause they're like, they
didn't really have an idea whatwas going on, but they're like
you don't look like you've hadanything happen.
(17:50):
You're quite calm.
And I said, she has been livingwith.
Conditions ever since, um,having vaccine injury Mm.
A few years ago.
So I said, this isn't a, a newthing to not be feeling the
greatest.
She's quite resilient.
So by the time we gottransferred through to
(18:12):
Toowoomba, they didn't reallyknow what was going on.
So they just kept monitoringand the treponin kept going up
and up and up.
Mm.
It was two and a half daysbefore we had a cardiologist
even put eyes on us.
Dr Nat Green (18:23):
Two and a half days.
Nichi Morrin (18:25):
Two and a half days.
When he finally come, he wasbrilliant, but he transferred us
to a private hospital and wewere told if you were older, you
wouldn't have survived thislong.
So she was monitored.
She, her treponin was startingto come down by this because it
was three days later.
Mm.
He had an idea what type ofheart attack it was.
(18:47):
So we had tests and then, uh,surgical procedure, and it was
found, it was SCAD, sospontaneous coronary artery
dissection.
So that caused the heartattack.
This is a rare type of heartattack.
Again.
Rarely another,
Dr Nat Green (19:03):
another rare condition for your family.
Nichi Morrin (19:06):
Oh.
And it most often occurs infemales.
So 70% of the time it's femaleswith no known triggers, um,
which is scary.
And, and thank goodness shesurvived.
She's still dealing withfatigue now.
Yeah.
But.
She was very strong andresilient, but when I was
(19:31):
sitting in that hospital withher, so we stayed in hospital
for a week after I was sittingthere and I thought, oh my God,
like my fire was back.
My light was full, and Ithought.
I have the skills, I have theknowledge, I have the lived
experience.
I cannot let fears orself-doubt, or my invisible
(19:55):
conditions stop me from beingthis beacon of hope for other
people.
Hmm.
And it makes me wanna cry whenI think about it.
But the amount of crap we havebeen through,
Dr Nat Green (20:08):
yeah.
Nichi Morrin (20:08):
There's a reason for that.
And I fully believeeverything's for a reason.
And.
Since all this has happened,I've been in talks with the
Queensland Ambulance Serviceabout clinical education across
the board.
I have been so up to my neck inresearch just researching as if
I'm writing a PhD on the gapsin this health system and how I
(20:32):
can fill it.
And.
From that I have come up withthe COMPASS-5 model.
So this is a interdisciplinaryframework for managing and
working with complex invisiblehealth conditions.
And this, I think where itfills a gap is not only does it
(20:58):
provide support for.
Having better outcomes forpeople that live with these
conditions.
Mm-hmm.
But it also provides supportfor the health providers because
since COVID, the number ofcomplex presentations has
(21:18):
increased dramatically.
Burnout.
And I am gonna talk about theword burnout because I see
colleagues.
Dissing the word burnout and
Dr Nat Green (21:31):
same
Nichi Morrin (21:32):
as someone who's been through it.
Mm-hmm.
And it is, so it's occurringthat much everywhere in the
population right now.
Dr Nat Green (21:42):
Yeah.
Definitely.
Nichi Morrin (21:44):
It needs talking about, and when you can talk
about it, you're beingauthentic.
But my model, the COMPASS-5.
Also supports thesustainability of the providers.
So this training model doesboth, and I think that's where
it fills a gap.
Dr Nat Green (22:05):
Wow.
You have just given so muchgold in that conversation.
Firstly, I, and I know we'vealready talked about this, but
this is the first time ourlisteners are hearing it.
I want to thank you.
From the bottom of my heart forsharing that story.
So honestly, so openly, sovulnerably.
(22:26):
And I know your beautiful girland I've met her and she's
amazing.
And I know she'll be sograteful that she has a Mum who
is like a dog with a bone andadvocates and, and gets it.
And will keep going and keepgoing because as you said, it
saved her life.
Yeah.
And you know, we don't knowwhat we don't know.
(22:48):
Of course, and ambosparamedics, hospital staff don't
always know about conditions,but you've highlighted the
absolute importance and need forthem to listen, to listen to a
patient, a patient's parentadvocate, if this is not a
(23:14):
normal presentation for thatpatient.
Listen to what you are beingtold and ask more questions, so
Absolutely.
Yeah.
For you to be saying that andbeing dismissed as anxiety and
having to keep pushing and besent home and go back.
(23:34):
Had you not known and continuedto advocate, I'd hate to even
think where you'd be
Nichi Morrin (23:43):
as everything was happening.
'Cause we spent time in threehospitals, two different
emergency departments.
I was documenting every singlelittle thing that was happening,
any change in her patterns.
So I was up to dateknowledgeable to be able to
advocate for that.
And I actually experiencedadvocacy fatigue also.
(24:07):
Mm.
Because.
I had to advocate so muchthroughout it.
Once we did get to the privatehospital, they were very great.
They were really good, but Istill did have to advocate
several times throughout thisbecause they're all like, gee,
you're a complex one.
Oh, you're a rare one.
Oh, you are the youngest we'veever seen in our cardiac ward.
(24:31):
But these things happen and.
It shouldn't take people losingtheir lives or not being
listened to for change to occur.
And I know with scad, so I'vedone a lot of research into
scads since
Dr Nat Green (24:46):
I can imagine you have.
Nichi Morrin (24:48):
Um, I'm like a big researcher where I hyper fixate
on what I'm researching.
But a lot of people lose theirlives because this is ignored.
Exactly.
And it is not picked up or it'sleft a long time.
Mm-hmm.
I think where my clinicalcompass so the COMPASS-5 program
fills the gap is also becausewe have the bio-psychosocial
(25:13):
clinical Reasoning Framework,where helps us look more
holistically and at a wholeperson point of view.
It's trauma informed becausepeople with invisible
conditions, they have a historyof medical trauma, gaslighting,
they are fearful of going tohealth professionals.
(25:33):
Mm-hmm.
So trauma is huge in this it'svalidation based communication.
It's built on because we needto validate the client's lived
experience.
Yes, health professionals haveall this knowledge, but they
might spend a 30 to 60 minute,um, lesson Yeah.
On these conditions.
(25:54):
Where this persons might havelived with it for 20 years.
They're the expert in theirexperience, and we need to
listen to them.
Yes.
And that validation basedcommunication reduces the
likelihood of dismissal.
Increases patient engagementand trust and it reduces the
health provider's risk of beingreported because that's one of
(26:15):
the biggest AHPRA complaints Isthe dismissal, the medical
trauma and gaslighting, thethings being ignored?
Yes.
So this helps reduce theprovider risk.
It's interdisciplinarycollaboration, which is so
important because we need thatcross-professional understanding
and shared care.
(26:36):
For holistic outcomes, wecannot silo the professionals
off when we look at multi-systemcomplex conditions.
And clinician sustainabilityand wellbeing.
So the training actually hastools for them to maintain their
own emotional health,wellbeing, reflective practice,
(27:00):
peer support, and boundarysetting.
So it encompasses all of that.
Dr Nat Green (27:05):
Mm-hmm.
And amazing.
Nichi Morrin (27:08):
And that's where I'm in the stage of development
and then getting it out there.
Dr Nat Green (27:13):
I, as you know, I'm one of your biggest fans,
Nichi.
I just love the work you'redoing.
But as you know, and, and as alot of my listeners know, I also
have.
Those invisible healthconditions with thanks to you
understanding what Ehlers Danlosis.
Oh, is this what I've had allmy life and why I've had all
(27:35):
these issues?
So getting that understandingis huge.
But as you said, there areactually health professionals
with a lot of these invisibleconditions and with fried
nervous systems because.
As you said for yours wascompletely fried.
(27:57):
Mine's been completely fried.
It's that whole pushing throughand pushing through mm-hmm.
And continuing to burnourselves out because we wanna
make a difference and we wannahelp people, but we also have
our own underlying autoimmunehealth conditions that we often
ignore.
So I think this is purebrilliance.
(28:20):
This Invisible Health Networkand this COMPASS-5 model can
change the entire way thatprofessionals and patients are
treated and impacted.
Absolutely blown away by whatyou're developing and so
excited.
And I think this needs to beshared with everyone in the
(28:41):
world.
To be honest,
Nichi Morrin (28:43):
it's my goal to revolutionize healthcare.
To make these changes.
And as part of the InvisibleHealth Network, it's got the
COMPASS-5 model for the healthproviders, and then it's got the
invisible CEO, so it's got thetwo streams and the invisible
CEO stream is specifically for.
(29:05):
Professionals, business ownersand entrepreneurs who are
wanting those more sustainableways to work because we should
not have to choose betweenhealth and our purpose and your
typical coaching and consultingprograms out there, I have not
(29:25):
found one that is built on.
the nervous system based modelfor people, or they are
entrepreneurs and bigvisionaries who live with
invisible health conditions.
Mm-hmm.
Because the strategies aredifferent for us, the
accountability does not worklike it does for typical people
(29:48):
that are out there who areprofessionals, entrepreneurs, or
business owners.
And from my own livedexperience, having that support
network to help you with.
Sustain your motivation,continue those dreams.
Having that group of peoplethat all get it to help you on
(30:09):
your journey is so important.
Not only for your own mentalhealth, but for your purpose and
at like that soul level.
And I think recently I did goto a retreat with you and a
bunch of other Professionals andentrepreneurs and being able to
(30:30):
have that in a way that alsosupports you when you have those
in invisible conditions is one,I don't know anywhere else
where it's being done, and two,it is priceless.
Dr Nat Green (30:45):
Definitely.
And I mean, there's again, somuch gold in what you are
sharing because with invisiblehealth conditions and
sustainability, you'll have dayswhere you have to step back and
you're not able to even getoutta bed.
And having a safe space, likewhat you are developing means
(31:09):
that's okay.
And so when you can only work acouple of days one week, but
five days the next week.
Being able to do that and havethat happen and be okay is a
hugely different way of lookingat things.
Nichi Morrin (31:25):
Oh, absolutely.
Because as a big dreamingentrepreneur or business owner
with invisible conditions, wecan often get stuck with the
unpredictability of our healthor our.
Body not being able to supportat a time what we are wishing
for.
Mm.
Then there's emotionaldysregulation, or our nervous
(31:47):
systems might be amped up andthere might be times where we're
more.
Sensitive to things and need tosort of wind back.
And then there's inconsistencywith getting our work done and
boom, bust cycles and burnout,like the big word burnout that
some people have an aversion to.
Mm-hmm.
Um, fear of visibility.
(32:09):
And then there's guilt and orshame around having these
ambitions also.
So there's, there's so muchgoing on that we need a
different operating system andsupport system.
For that sustainable success.
Dr Nat Green (32:24):
Yeah.
And hearing you speak aboutburnout like that, and you know
where I stand on that, thatburnout is not spoken about or
often in some professions wornas a badge of honor, and you
just keep pushing through.
Mm-hmm.
We know we need to acknowledgethat burnout is real.
(32:45):
Yes, but you'll also know thatfrom my perspective when we talk
about burnout, I don't believeit's just burnout.
I think as you've said, it's avery holistic picture, and
underneath that is our nervoussystem.
I.
Has been holding yes space forother people for so long, trying
to hold our own space whenwe've got all this other stuff
(33:08):
going on and that often has thisunderlying layer of vicarious
trauma.
Yes.
Where we've got this traumathat we've carried often
unknowingly.
But it's also got those layersof being gaslit, being
dismissed, having our wholeintegrity threatened, as well as
(33:29):
that fear of being seen asimpaired in inverted commas that
as a health professional orprofessional entrepreneur, am I
a fraud?
Am I an imposter?
Is there something wrong?
And should I not be doing this?
'cause I can't show up everyday like everyone else.
Nichi Morrin (33:49):
Yes, exactly.
And I, I think burnout is aterm often used where if we
imagine we have a tree, burnoutis the branches and the leaves
where it's a word sort of knownfor the, the things that we are
feeling or we might be doing.
But the trunk of that tree andthat root system go far deeper
(34:11):
and those roots.
are all those vicarioustraumas, all those things we've
experienced or the things we'veingested on a nervous system
level we don't even realize.
So I think a lot of peopleburnout's like the common word,
but it's so far deeper with alot more going on than people
(34:33):
either want to recognize or areactually conscious of.
Dr Nat Green (34:39):
Absolutely.
I do think the way you've justdescribed that is.
Fantastic, because really it'sthe base of the tree, the
foundation, but these roots,they spread far and wide and
they're unseen.
Just like the invisibleconditions.
They're under the ground.
We know they're there, but wedon't really understand or know
(35:01):
which path they follow until westart digging and dig them up.
Or snap the root off
Nichi Morrin (35:08):
Yeah, exactly.
That's right.
Dr Nat Green (35:11):
Yeah, very powerful.
And can we just go back for aminute?
So, I mean, I know the outcomewith your beautiful daughter.
So did you wanna share whereshe's at now?
Like so she definitely had aheart attack?
Yes.
Only because you kept pushingthat people were able to
actually see that.
(35:31):
And where is she now?
Nichi Morrin (35:34):
So she's just turned 18.
Woohoo.
Very, really exciting.
I can't believe it.
She's already 18.
Mm.
Um, she's had to step back fromher job just to try and get
herself well.
Mm-hmm.
But that's okay because yourhealth's a priority.
Yeah.
And fatigue.
(35:54):
She's experiencing a lot offatigue, but the medication
she's on to protect the heartafter a heart attack can also
lead to fatigue.
So hopefully when we go back inabout a month's time, we can
change that.
And her fatigue might ease alittle.
Mm-hmm.
But at the moment, she's happy.
(36:16):
She still can't believe thatshe had a heart attack.
But her resilience justinspires me and how strong she
is.
And she was all for me reachingout to the Queensland Ambulance
Service mm-hmm.
And having these discussionsand investigations occurring for
clinical education across theboard, and she's very happy.
(36:40):
That I am trying to make changein this space, not only for
what she's experienced, for whatI've experienced for what my
younger daughter's experiencedbut, and also my nephew.
So my, nephew has a rare braintumor that was founded at 18
months.
Uh, he's 13 now.
(37:01):
And.
The amount of times he's almostdied, the amount of times.
He's had stuff ignored.
We had to call Ryan's rule atone stage.
Mm.
He nearly died several timesand we ended up with a formal
apology from the hospital forhim being ignored at one stage
at Brisbane Hospital.
So Braxton's fight his page onFacebook.
(37:22):
He's got thousands of followersfollowing his journey, um, from
a foundation I started for himyears ago.
So the rare and, the invisiblehas been something my family's
lived with for 12, actually over12 years.
Mm-hmm.
Uh, we've lived it.
We have breathed it and.
(37:43):
I think my family is very proudof what I'm trying to do.
Mm.
And they're so supportive of itbecause we need change to
happen for everyone out therewith invisible conditions that
takes years to find out answers.
(38:04):
Only yesterday I had someonesay to me, and it brought tears
to my eyes, they said.
My mum passed a year ago, butif only my mum had found you
before she passed, I think wewould've got answers for what
she had lived with her wholelife.
Oh.
Um, and that was just like, ohmy God, I just, the goosebumps
(38:33):
that one need to get my stuffout there and happening.
And also for the professionals,the other people.
Like myself who work in thespaces, but wanna protect their
wellbeing also.
Dr Nat Green (38:49):
Yes.
And really who better to leadsuch a powerful movement than
you?
Like you've lived it, you'vebreathed it, and unfortunately
had.
the Experiences you've hadrecently on top of all your own
experiences, had your daughtergo through that as well and like
(39:10):
you said, these experiences,I'm a firm believer in that as
well happen for a reason.
Yeah.
'cause it's through asprofessionals, our lived
experience and the impact ofthat.
If we don't experience that.
With our education andknowledge and drive, then we
(39:31):
can't lead the way and make thedifference.
So yeah, absolutely.
I'm with you on that, thatthese things happen and it's
about how you then turn thataround Yeah.
And pay it forward.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
And make the difference in theworld that you were born to do.
Nichi Morrin (39:52):
And and how you said about things happen for a
reason.
It just so happened that afterher heart attack, I was just
drawn back into the universityspace and I'm doing some
teaching one day a week at auniversity now.
And on that first day I metanother colleague there and I
(40:14):
just told her a five minutebrief overview of.
My story and what I'm doing andshe's like, oh my God, I was
meant to meet you and your stuffhas to be out there.
And I think even since then,just being back in that space
and I just love being amongstthe research and all that sort
of stuff, and I've been heavilyin the research since just
(40:37):
building this, but I feel likenow I'm on my path.
I have the clarity and havingthat sort of.
Group of entrepreneurs andprofessionals around me all
doing similar things has reallyhelped with my clarity and that
motivation.
But these lived experiences aremy huge drivers.
Dr Nat Green (40:59):
Mm.
Yeah.
So lived experience, supportfrom community.
Yes.
They're really importantthings.
Yeah.
What do you think you'd shareOne thing with our listeners
that would help them as theynavigate, you know, post-trauma
(41:19):
or life with invisibleconditions, and I know so many
of my listeners have both asthey move from the trauma
through to post-traumaticgrowth.
What would be one thing or manythings that you could share
that would help them?
Nichi Morrin (41:37):
I feel throughout all the trauma myself and my
family have been through overthe last 15 years, 15, 20 years.
I think there were times whereI would just think every, 'cause
(41:59):
every single time I hadsomething good happening.
To be followed by somethingknocking me down again.
So I'd start to think, I can'tdo anything good.
I can't have happiness, I can'thave any, my dreams happen
because there was alwayssomething around the corner
gonna knock me down.
So I was sort of scared to behappy or scared to follow my
(42:26):
dreams and I thought, how can I.
Feel happy or do these thingsif others in my family are
suffering and all these thingsare going on.
So there were several timeswhere that scared me.
And I think one strength ofmine is I do always look at what
(42:48):
can I learn from theseexperiences?
And I look at it with thatglass half full of.
What lessons can I learn fromthis?
Because this is something I canmove forward to help me with
the things I'm trying to do.
Yeah.
Or help me get through.
So reframing that mindset tolook at instead of what life's
(43:10):
happening or what life's doingto me and what have I done to
bring on all this bad luck It'smore what can I learn from this
experience.
To help me and help others moveforward.
And I know when, it did getreally hard when my health
really deteriorated a couple ofyears ago, not only like I did
(43:35):
struggle more with mm-hmmthinking positive and that's
where I actually had tomassively practice what I
preach.
But I had to go beyond just.
Reframing in a cognitive levelmm-hmm.
To step into my body at a soullevel.
Yes.
So, to process that trauma, Ihad to stop and do meditation,
(43:59):
um, do my tapping, do mystretches and my movements.
So all those little half donestress and trauma cycles sitting
on my nervous system, like halfdone washing machine, lung.
Mm-hmm.
I had to process them throughmovement and soul-based
exercises.
So what I actually did, likewhat I would've loved to do is
(44:21):
take three months off anddisappear off on an island.
But I couldn't afford to dothat.
Dr Nat Green (44:26):
That'd be nice, wouldn't it?
Nichi Morrin (44:28):
So I would, every morning I would measure where my
body's at.
Could I give myself some metime that morning and about four
or five mornings a week I wouldwhere I would.
Depending on my energy andwhere I was at, could I do 10
minutes?
Could I do 30 minutes?
And I would decide what my bodywanted that day.
(44:51):
What, what did it need?
So there wasn't rigid goals.
There wasn't, I had to go andwork out at a gym because I
can't do gyms.
Mm-hmm.
Um, but whether it was a 10minute.
Gentle on exercise by listeningto a podcast.
I was nurturing my creativeside at the same time.
Or was it 15 minutes ofrestorative yoga just on the
(45:14):
mat, or was it doing stretching,just gentle stretching.
For 10 minutes and then 10minutes of listening to a
podcast just to nurture my busybrain.
So I did that and meditationtoo.
I found that really helpful,especially for a busy ADHD
(45:37):
entrepreneurial brain.
I found short periods ofmeditation was helpful.
Mm-hmm.
So all this stuff Iincorporated into my.
I'm not gonna say daily.
'cause some days I couldn't doit.
So weekly practices.
Mm-hmm.
And I was proud of myself forwhat I could do.
And then walking.
(45:58):
So this year I've incorporatedtrying to go for some walks in
the afternoon just to get outand been mindful of my
environment.
So those body-based things Ihave found so important for.
Getting through trauma andregulating that nervous system.
Dr Nat Green (46:16):
Absolutely.
So really the key lessons andlearnings for you have been to
allow yourself to feel toconnect in with your body Yeah.
And to really tune into it andlisten.
Yeah.
Not think what it might be andbe in your head, but to connect.
(46:37):
And that's that three brainstuff that Yes, we talked about
before, that I do that head, theheart and the gut and really,
yes, allowing them to integrateand feel, because when we're
going through trauma and inorder to cope with our invisible
health conditions, we oftenshut down part of that, one of
those brains because it's toopainful.
Nichi Morrin (46:57):
Oh, absolutely.
And that's one thing I see withpeople with invisible
conditions.
It is the gut brain.
It is the heart.
It is the entire lot that Iwork with in this space because
this condition's a multisystem.
They are not just one or theothers.
You have to work at this level.
And one other thing for peoplewith post-traumatic growth is
(47:19):
reaching out to someone if youare not okay.
That was something I alwaysfelt hard to do because I felt
like a burden.
I know a couple of times Ireached out to you and I
thought.
Oh, but I don't wanna burdenher or, or anything 'cause she's
busy.
But when you actually reach outand you just share the light
for me, I get pulled into line abit, a little, and I'm able to
(47:43):
step back and pull myself backin instead of being all anxious
and worried.
Dr Nat Green (47:49):
So allowing yourself to be held Yes.
But also having.
The courage to ask for helpbecause we, I know myself as
well.
It's really hard to ask forhelp, you know, for whatever
other internal chatter goes on.
I don't wanna be seen as weak.
I don't wanna be a burden.
(48:09):
You know, we all have thoseconversations, but the reality
is we can't carry the load alonebecause that continues to
impact our nervous system andweighs down.
Nichi Morrin (48:21):
Mm-hmm.
Absolutely.
Dr Nat Green (48:23):
Yeah.
So tell me, Nichi, as we moveto wrapping up this
conversation, where can ourlisteners find out more about
you and find you online and findout all about the exciting new
things you're bringing to life?
Nichi Morrin (48:35):
So on Facebook, they can find me at the
Invisible Health Network or theinvisible CEO and on Instagram,
they can find me at theinvisible CEO my website.
www.invisiblehealthnetwork.comin the process of being built.
(48:57):
So that'll be mm-hmm.
Finished hopefully within thenext month.
Excellent.
Um, and then my COMPASS-5training and my invisible CEO
support will be launched.
Dr Nat Green (49:09):
How exciting.
Nichi Morrin (49:10):
It's all in motion.
Dr Nat Green (49:11):
You have done so much and all that really in less
than a year since we lasttalked.
You continue to, you know,inspire me and I love the work
that you're doing, but again,I'm so sorry that you and your
family have had to go throughwhat you've been through to get
you on this track.
(49:33):
Yeah,
Nichi Morrin (49:34):
thank you.
I think we're a resilientbunch, but we've had to learn to
be.
Dr Nat Green (49:39):
Absolutely.
And really, who better to pavethe way for us to change
systems, make a difference, andgive hope to people with
invisible conditions.
And whether that's trauma orsignificant health conditions,
they're all invisible.
Nichi Morrin (49:58):
Yes, exactly.
Thank you.
Dr Nat Green (50:01):
So thank you, Nichi.
Nichi Morrin (50:02):
Thank you so much, Nat.
Dr Nat Green (50:04):
I'm really excited to see what you bring to life
and yeah, we'll look forward totalking to you soon.
Nichi Morrin (50:09):
Thank you.
Dr Nat Green (50:10):
Bye.
Thank you for joining me inthis episode of Growing Tall
Poppies.
It is my deepest hope thattoday's episode may have
inspired and empowered you tostep fully into your
post-traumatic growth, so thatyou can have absolute clarity
(50:33):
around who you are, what mattersthe most to you, and to assist
you to release your negativeemotions.
And regulate your nervoussystem so you can fully thrive.
New episodes are publishedevery Tuesday, and I hope you'll
continue to join us as weexplore both the strategies and
(50:54):
the personal qualities requiredto fully live a life of
post-traumatic growth and tothrive.
So if it feels aligned to youand really resonates, then I
invite you to hit subscribe andit would mean the world to us.
If you could share this episodewith others who you feel may
benefit too, you may also findme on Instagram at Growing Tall
(51:19):
Poppies and Facebook, Dr.
Natalie Green.
Remember, every moment is anopportunity to look for the
lessons and to learn andincrease your ability to live
the life you desire and deserve.
So for now, stay connected.
Stay inspired.
(51:40):
Stand tall like the tall poppyyou are, and keep shining your
light brightly in the world.
Bye for.
Welcome to the Growing Tall Poppies Podcast.
I'm your host, Dr.
Nat Green, and I'm so excitedto have you join me as we
discuss what it means tonavigate your way through
post-traumatic growth and notjust survive, but to thrive
after trauma.
Through our podcast, we willexplore ways for you to create a
(00:27):
life filled with greaterpurpose, self-awareness, and a
deep inner peace.
Through integrating the manyyears of knowledge and
professional experience, as wellas the wisdom of those who have
experienced trauma firsthand.
We'll combine psychologyaccelerated approaches.
(00:48):
Coaching and personalexperience to assist you, to
learn, to grow and to thrive.
I hope to empower you to createdeeper awareness and
understanding and strongerconnections with yourself and
with others, whilst also pavingthe way for those who have
experienced trauma and adversityto reduce their suffering and
(01:13):
become the very best versions ofthemselves.
In order to thrive.
Thank you so much for joiningme on today's episode.
I'm super excited and verygrateful again today to bring
you our next guest on theGrowing Tall Poppies podcast.
It's my absolute pleasure towelcome back because we had her
(01:38):
as a guest last year on episode20, my beautiful friend and
amazing lady.
Nichole Morrin, who shared herremarkable journey and her
trauma story last year, but shehas experienced so much even
(01:59):
since last year, and she'skindly offered to come and chat
with us again today.
Sharing her personal experienceand blending it with her
professional experience.
So let me welcome back mybeautiful friend Nichi Morrin,
and I'll give you a bit of anintro.
So Nichole is a powerhouse ofinsight, empathy, and
(02:24):
transformation.
She's a clinical psychologist,author, sustainable health
consultant, and founder of.
Her latest huge project andmission, the Invisible Health
Network.
She is also the podcast host ofShine the Spotlight, and the
creator of Compass-5, aninterdisciplinary framework for
(02:47):
complex conditions.
This is a groundbreaking model,revolutionizing the way that we
approach invisible and complexhealth conditions, and she is
the amazing voice behind theinvisible CEO.
This is a movement supportingentrepreneurs, business owners,
and professionals who are livingwith invisible illnesses and
(03:09):
want to lead, live and worksustainably.
Nichi blends science, soul, andpersonal lived experience as an
amazing woman living withconditions like hypermobility,
endometriosis, and an autoimmunecondition after her life being
threatened.
And later her daughter's lifebeing threatened.
(03:31):
And I know she's gonna sharemore about that today.
She has made it her mission tochange the health system from
the inside out.
So welcome, Nichi.
I'm so excited to have youback.
Nichi Morrin (03:43):
Thank you so much, Nat.
It is such a pleasure to betalking with you again.
Dr Nat Green (03:49):
Oh, I know that episode 20 that we did last year
early in the Growing TallPoppies podcast.
We had such amazing feedbackabout you, how beautifully you
shared your story and thewonderful mission that you're
on.
So I'd love if you could startby giving us a bit of a brief
(04:14):
introduction of how life wasback then and where you were at
when you first came on.
Nichi Morrin (04:22):
Okay.
So.
Back then I shared my traumahistory.
I suppose I have always feltlike a bit of an underdog and
there's always seems to besomething happening, something
rare popping up.
It's always those rare thingsthat has seemed to be throughout
(04:45):
the decades and I think.
Briefly, what I shared backthen is my story in regards to
when my life was threatened,over a decade ago.
I'll only briefly go over this,but back then I had all these
(05:05):
nodules in my lungs.
Doctors didn't know what theywere, which is a common sort of
story with me and my family.
And they did hint at maybe it'slung cancer, and my life
flashed before my eyes, and thatwas about six months after
giving birth to my second childand being in the emergency
(05:27):
department with all my organsshutting down, feeling I was
going to die also.
So there were two situationswithin six months apart.
I remember I said back then,'cause I was so scared, I just
would never see my kids grow up.
And I thought if I survive, I'mgoing to enroll in uni because
(05:47):
I'd always wanted to.
But those beliefs of am I smartenough?
Am I good enough?
How can I do that?
I did survive, luckily, and Idid enroll in uni and studied
six years full time whileworking as a hairdresser and
became a clinical psychologist.
And I think back then Ithought, I'm doing this because
(06:14):
one, I want a career.
And I was fascinated bypsychology.
But also I wanted more for myfamily.
I wanted.
More sustainability, morefinancial stability.
I wanted something thatinterested me because my brain's
just super busy and goingconstantly.
Yes.
But over the years, as moretraumas occurred, I ended up
(06:36):
realizing I traded one chair foranother.
So I traded standing behind thehairdressing chair with people
to sitting in front of thetherapy chair with people.
Mm.
So that was a light bulbmoment, and that I only got to
maybe five years ago, when Whenmy health started deteriorating.
(06:59):
And also my husband hadinvisible conditions.
And then my eldest daughter atthe age of about 14 started
becoming unwell.
And then throughout the years,my youngest daughter also
started having those signs ofinvisible conditions around that
same age.
So as my health wasdeteriorating and I had several
(07:22):
surgeries and, and I was lookingfor what is wrong with me is
something that I kept sayinglike, there's something wrong.
I had these big dreams andthese visions of being able to
create something great andtrying to change the way I'm
working with one-on-one therapy.
(07:43):
Which was continuing to burn meout.
It's not that I don't like it,I, I do really love psychology
and enjoy my work, but with myhealth, I needed to change how I
was working.
And then I think even though Iam good at listening to my body.
I still wasn't fully listening,I still was doing the same
(08:08):
things, but expecting things tochange, which is what I teach my
clients, you cannot do.
But I was doing it
Dr Nat Green (08:16):
funny how we've gotta learn those lessons and,
and sometimes we go round andround and round before we
finally learn them, isn't it?
Nichi Morrin (08:23):
Absolutely.
And then a few years ago.
Everything just got worse withthe chronic fatigue and then the
pain, and then I could, in myspine and my hips, I could feel
they were getting worse.
No one knew what was going on.
And as I know with my daughterswho I'm very good at advocating
for, yeah, we needed to gowider.
(08:45):
And that is finding the rightpeople to be able to help the
people that are versed ininvisible conditions and work
with it, have that workingknowledge and know what they're
looking for.
And that's when I actually didget diagnosed this year after.
Decades of not knowing anythingand just thinking, I'm a weird
(09:09):
one.
My rheumatologist said, you'renot a weird one.
You are actually an interestingone and you're a rheumatology
patient.
Like, we can work out what'sgoing on with you.
So in the last 12 months, I hadfound out I had.
Adenomyosis endometriosis, PCOSautoimmune condition axial
(09:33):
spondyloarthritis, and I had mydiagnosis confirmed of
hypermobility spectrum disorder,which Both my daughters have as
well, also known as EhlersDanlos syndrome.
So it's on a sliding scale anda spectrum.
These are areas I focus on inmy clinical practice and I
specialize in.
(09:53):
And now I finally have myanswers and I thought, now I
actually know.
Like that feeling was, it was arelief.
But it also gave me answers ofwhy I haven't been able to
realize my dreams, that thereisn't, it's not just me being a
(10:14):
failure there is somethingthere, and how can I change the
way I live and work to still beable to do those things that I'm
wanting?
After I did get the diagnosesand I had answers, I really
realized how.
The six months before gettingthose answers, my light had
(10:36):
dimmed those big dreams that I'dhad for creating a network for
invisible health and traininghealth professionals, or, I had
all these ideas and working withpeople more intimately that
have invisible conditions.
I had doubted myself so much.
(10:57):
I think I had.
Let those beliefs take over ofhow can I do this?
My body's letting me down.
Maybe I should just go get ajob give up my ideas.
And then after I did getanswers, I think I started to
pull myself out of that.
(11:18):
And I thought, well, maybe Ican do this.
I just need to sort of.
Think differently.
I needed clarity in my goalsand what I actually wanted to
achieve and how I could do itsustainably.
So I was sort of sitting inthat space, just working on
things slowly, but didn't have aclear direction yet.
(11:38):
And then I had somethingmassive happen.
And that was my 17-year-olddaughter called me one night in
the middle of the night.
And so we have a very longhouse, so we often will just
call each other, someone phonesat night.
She's like, Mum I feel likethere's a, a house sitting on my
(12:03):
chest.
Um, hopefully I don't cry whileI'm telling this story.
Dr Nat Green (12:08):
It's a very challenging story, so it's
totally okay if you're crying.
Nichi Morrin (12:12):
She said, I feel like my chest is being torn
apart from the inside out.
It's hard to breathe.
I'm in 10, outta 10 pain.
I feel like I'm dying.
And I, I think I was.
I think it was like I waspartly zoned out, like for that
and the next week ahead.
(12:33):
Because I, I remained prettycalm throughout it all and I
dunno how but we called theambulance.
It took probably 50 minutes forthe ambulance to finally come
and she was told.
This is anxiety.
Have some Panadol.
I'm sure you'll be fine.
Your heart is textbook perfect,and this does not go down well.
(13:01):
So one.
Invisible conditions is myarea.
That's what I focus on foryears.
Exactly.
And I hear over and over, thestories of being dismissed,
things not being recognized.
Oh, it's just anxiety and boydoes it grind my gears.
Dr Nat Green (13:17):
Oh, absolutely.
Nichi Morrin (13:19):
And when she's there, in 10 outta 10 pain.
Feeling like your chest hasbeen torn apart, feeling like
there's a house sitting on yourchest, the pressure, pain
radiating through your body.
This is not anxiety.
No.
I've got nothing againstparamedics.
They're brilliant and we needthem, but this was a very
dismissive circumstance.
(13:41):
Twice she told them she hasEhler's Danlos syndrome, which
is a red flag because Exactly.
You have more fragility in yourconnective tissues.
and the hearts included inthat.
Mm-hmm.
They said to her, how do youspell that?
And she said, I feel like I'mdying.
I can't think right now.
(14:01):
Like Google it.
Mm.
So because they couldn't spellit, they left it out of her
reports and handover to thehospital.
Dr Nat Green (14:08):
That's frightening, isn't it?
Oh really?
Nichi Morrin (14:11):
It's very frightening.
And then.
They said, oh, your heart'stextbook perfect.
And were talking to her aboutfood and Red Rooster and that
sort of thing, and, and theywere, the paramedics were told
this is not normal for her.
So she has POTS, so posturalorthostatic Tachycardia
syndrome.
Mm-hmm.
(14:31):
With that, her heart's rarelyunder 100 beats a minute, and
it's more when she's standingafter the heart attack.
It was sitting around that 75.
So yes, it might look textbookperfect to them, but they were
told this is not her normalclinical picture.
So she wasn't looked in at as awhole and in the context of
(14:53):
what was normal for her, so theyweren't gonna take her to the
hospital.
They said, do you really wannago?
Like, we're going past anywayif you want us to take you.
And it's like she's going tothe hospital.
So she was taken to thehospital.
We followed her there and theywere quite dismissive also, so
(15:16):
they're like, oh, I'm sure it'scostochondritis.
So like inflammation in theribs?
Yeah.
Um, we'll do a blood test.
So if you have hypermobility orEhlers Danlos your veins.
They can be hypermobile too.
Yes, and I said to them, shehas hypermobile veins after
digging for 45 minutes in herarm causing further distress.
(15:38):
I said to them, can you pleasestop, put a heat pack on the
other arm, raise the veins andtry there with a, little
butterfly needle?
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Then they got a blood test.
So we waited a couple hours andI, I just kept, I.
Just wanting to know what wasgoing on.
I think every five minutes Iwas looking out the door.
Hmm.
And we, no one had come andseen us and told us what was
(16:00):
going on.
So I asked and said, are herblood test results back.
And the doctor said, oh yeah,they are.
And I said, well, what arethey?
And she goes oh no, it's fine.
You know, we, oh wait.
Um, actually I don't even knowif these are her blood tests
because we did seven at once.
Dr Nat Green (16:19):
Oh my goodness.
Nichi Morrin (16:21):
So she went back for to her desk for a minute and
come back and said, oh no,they're right.
We should really do a lungx-ray, but I'm sure it's fine.
Just go home and come back ifyou get worse.
So it was 5:00 AM by now.
We were exhausted.
We went home and had somesleep.
And then during the next dayshe said, I just feel crap.
(16:43):
She was quite short of breath.
Just not feeling good.
Mm-hmm.
So I booked her in with our GPfor the next morning and the
doctor from the ED called, sothis is 24 hours later, that
doctor from the ED called me,said, oh, I've actually just
read her results.
Her troponin's elevated.
So these results would've beenthere for 24 hours and you
(17:07):
better get in for more tests.
And I said, well, I'm on my wayto the gp, send everything
there.
So we went to the GP and thegps like, it's not normal for a
17-year-old to have elevatedtroponin and she's not doing
this.
She said, go have an urgentblood test and urgent X-ray
straight away.
So we did that and an hourlater we got the call her
troponin's 10 times higher, getto the ED and we're gonna
(17:30):
transfer you through to the nextregional center immediately.
Mm-hmm.
So we did that and I don'tthink the doctors could really
believe what was going onbecause they're like, they
didn't really have an idea whatwas going on, but they're like
you don't look like you've hadanything happen.
(17:50):
You're quite calm.
And I said, she has been livingwith.
Conditions ever since, um,having vaccine injury Mm.
A few years ago.
So I said, this isn't a, a newthing to not be feeling the
greatest.
She's quite resilient.
So by the time we gottransferred through to
(18:12):
Toowoomba, they didn't reallyknow what was going on.
So they just kept monitoringand the treponin kept going up
and up and up.
Mm.
It was two and a half daysbefore we had a cardiologist
even put eyes on us.
Dr Nat Green (18:23):
Two and a half days.
Nichi Morrin (18:25):
Two and a half days.
When he finally come, he wasbrilliant, but he transferred us
to a private hospital and wewere told if you were older, you
wouldn't have survived thislong.
So she was monitored.
She, her treponin was startingto come down by this because it
was three days later.
Mm.
He had an idea what type ofheart attack it was.
(18:47):
So we had tests and then, uh,surgical procedure, and it was
found, it was SCAD, sospontaneous coronary artery
dissection.
So that caused the heartattack.
This is a rare type of heartattack.
Again.
Rarely another,
Dr Nat Green (19:03):
another rare condition for your family.
Nichi Morrin (19:06):
Oh.
And it most often occurs infemales.
So 70% of the time it's femaleswith no known triggers, um,
which is scary.
And, and thank goodness shesurvived.
She's still dealing withfatigue now.
Yeah.
But.
She was very strong andresilient, but when I was
(19:31):
sitting in that hospital withher, so we stayed in hospital
for a week after I was sittingthere and I thought, oh my God,
like my fire was back.
My light was full, and Ithought.
I have the skills, I have theknowledge, I have the lived
experience.
I cannot let fears orself-doubt, or my invisible
(19:55):
conditions stop me from beingthis beacon of hope for other
people.
Hmm.
And it makes me wanna cry whenI think about it.
But the amount of crap we havebeen through,
Dr Nat Green (20:08):
yeah.
Nichi Morrin (20:08):
There's a reason for that.
And I fully believeeverything's for a reason.
And.
Since all this has happened,I've been in talks with the
Queensland Ambulance Serviceabout clinical education across
the board.
I have been so up to my neck inresearch just researching as if
I'm writing a PhD on the gapsin this health system and how I
(20:32):
can fill it.
And.
From that I have come up withthe COMPASS-5 model.
So this is a interdisciplinaryframework for managing and
working with complex invisiblehealth conditions.
And this, I think where itfills a gap is not only does it
(20:58):
provide support for.
Having better outcomes forpeople that live with these
conditions.
Mm-hmm.
But it also provides supportfor the health providers because
since COVID, the number ofcomplex presentations has
(21:18):
increased dramatically.
Burnout.
And I am gonna talk about theword burnout because I see
colleagues.
Dissing the word burnout and
Dr Nat Green (21:31):
same
Nichi Morrin (21:32):
as someone who's been through it.
Mm-hmm.
And it is, so it's occurringthat much everywhere in the
population right now.
Dr Nat Green (21:42):
Yeah.
Definitely.
Nichi Morrin (21:44):
It needs talking about, and when you can talk
about it, you're beingauthentic.
But my model, the COMPASS-5.
Also supports thesustainability of the providers.
So this training model doesboth, and I think that's where
it fills a gap.
Dr Nat Green (22:05):
Wow.
You have just given so muchgold in that conversation.
Firstly, I, and I know we'vealready talked about this, but
this is the first time ourlisteners are hearing it.
I want to thank you.
From the bottom of my heart forsharing that story.
So honestly, so openly, sovulnerably.
(22:26):
And I know your beautiful girland I've met her and she's
amazing.
And I know she'll be sograteful that she has a Mum who
is like a dog with a bone andadvocates and, and gets it.
And will keep going and keepgoing because as you said, it
saved her life.
Yeah.
And you know, we don't knowwhat we don't know.
(22:48):
Of course, and ambosparamedics, hospital staff don't
always know about conditions,but you've highlighted the
absolute importance and need forthem to listen, to listen to a
patient, a patient's parentadvocate, if this is not a
(23:14):
normal presentation for thatpatient.
Listen to what you are beingtold and ask more questions, so
Absolutely.
Yeah.
For you to be saying that andbeing dismissed as anxiety and
having to keep pushing and besent home and go back.
(23:34):
Had you not known and continuedto advocate, I'd hate to even
think where you'd be
Nichi Morrin (23:43):
as everything was happening.
'Cause we spent time in threehospitals, two different
emergency departments.
I was documenting every singlelittle thing that was happening,
any change in her patterns.
So I was up to dateknowledgeable to be able to
advocate for that.
And I actually experiencedadvocacy fatigue also.
(24:07):
Mm.
Because.
I had to advocate so muchthroughout it.
Once we did get to the privatehospital, they were very great.
They were really good, but Istill did have to advocate
several times throughout thisbecause they're all like, gee,
you're a complex one.
Oh, you're a rare one.
Oh, you are the youngest we'veever seen in our cardiac ward.
(24:31):
But these things happen and.
It shouldn't take people losingtheir lives or not being
listened to for change to occur.
And I know with scad, so I'vedone a lot of research into
scads since
Dr Nat Green (24:46):
I can imagine you have.
Nichi Morrin (24:48):
Um, I'm like a big researcher where I hyper fixate
on what I'm researching.
But a lot of people lose theirlives because this is ignored.
Exactly.
And it is not picked up or it'sleft a long time.
Mm-hmm.
I think where my clinicalcompass so the COMPASS-5 program
fills the gap is also becausewe have the bio-psychosocial
(25:13):
clinical Reasoning Framework,where helps us look more
holistically and at a wholeperson point of view.
It's trauma informed becausepeople with invisible
conditions, they have a historyof medical trauma, gaslighting,
they are fearful of going tohealth professionals.
(25:33):
Mm-hmm.
So trauma is huge in this it'svalidation based communication.
It's built on because we needto validate the client's lived
experience.
Yes, health professionals haveall this knowledge, but they
might spend a 30 to 60 minute,um, lesson Yeah.
On these conditions.
(25:54):
Where this persons might havelived with it for 20 years.
They're the expert in theirexperience, and we need to
listen to them.
Yes.
And that validation basedcommunication reduces the
likelihood of dismissal.
Increases patient engagementand trust and it reduces the
health provider's risk of beingreported because that's one of
(26:15):
the biggest AHPRA complaints Isthe dismissal, the medical
trauma and gaslighting, thethings being ignored?
Yes.
So this helps reduce theprovider risk.
It's interdisciplinarycollaboration, which is so
important because we need thatcross-professional understanding
and shared care.
(26:36):
For holistic outcomes, wecannot silo the professionals
off when we look at multi-systemcomplex conditions.
And clinician sustainabilityand wellbeing.
So the training actually hastools for them to maintain their
own emotional health,wellbeing, reflective practice,
(27:00):
peer support, and boundarysetting.
So it encompasses all of that.
Dr Nat Green (27:05):
Mm-hmm.
And amazing.
Nichi Morrin (27:08):
And that's where I'm in the stage of development
and then getting it out there.
Dr Nat Green (27:13):
I, as you know, I'm one of your biggest fans,
Nichi.
I just love the work you'redoing.
But as you know, and, and as alot of my listeners know, I also
have.
Those invisible healthconditions with thanks to you
understanding what Ehlers Danlosis.
Oh, is this what I've had allmy life and why I've had all
(27:35):
these issues?
So getting that understandingis huge.
But as you said, there areactually health professionals
with a lot of these invisibleconditions and with fried
nervous systems because.
As you said for yours wascompletely fried.
(27:57):
Mine's been completely fried.
It's that whole pushing throughand pushing through mm-hmm.
And continuing to burnourselves out because we wanna
make a difference and we wannahelp people, but we also have
our own underlying autoimmunehealth conditions that we often
ignore.
So I think this is purebrilliance.
(28:20):
This Invisible Health Networkand this COMPASS-5 model can
change the entire way thatprofessionals and patients are
treated and impacted.
Absolutely blown away by whatyou're developing and so
excited.
And I think this needs to beshared with everyone in the
(28:41):
world.
To be honest,
Nichi Morrin (28:43):
it's my goal to revolutionize healthcare.
To make these changes.
And as part of the InvisibleHealth Network, it's got the
COMPASS-5 model for the healthproviders, and then it's got the
invisible CEO, so it's got thetwo streams and the invisible
CEO stream is specifically for.
(29:05):
Professionals, business ownersand entrepreneurs who are
wanting those more sustainableways to work because we should
not have to choose betweenhealth and our purpose and your
typical coaching and consultingprograms out there, I have not
(29:25):
found one that is built on.
the nervous system based modelfor people, or they are
entrepreneurs and bigvisionaries who live with
invisible health conditions.
Mm-hmm.
Because the strategies aredifferent for us, the
accountability does not worklike it does for typical people
(29:48):
that are out there who areprofessionals, entrepreneurs, or
business owners.
And from my own livedexperience, having that support
network to help you with.
Sustain your motivation,continue those dreams.
Having that group of peoplethat all get it to help you on
(30:09):
your journey is so important.
Not only for your own mentalhealth, but for your purpose and
at like that soul level.
And I think recently I did goto a retreat with you and a
bunch of other Professionals andentrepreneurs and being able to
(30:30):
have that in a way that alsosupports you when you have those
in invisible conditions is one,I don't know anywhere else
where it's being done, and two,it is priceless.
Dr Nat Green (30:45):
Definitely.
And I mean, there's again, somuch gold in what you are
sharing because with invisiblehealth conditions and
sustainability, you'll have dayswhere you have to step back and
you're not able to even getoutta bed.
And having a safe space, likewhat you are developing means
(31:09):
that's okay.
And so when you can only work acouple of days one week, but
five days the next week.
Being able to do that and havethat happen and be okay is a
hugely different way of lookingat things.
Nichi Morrin (31:25):
Oh, absolutely.
Because as a big dreamingentrepreneur or business owner
with invisible conditions, wecan often get stuck with the
unpredictability of our healthor our.
Body not being able to supportat a time what we are wishing
for.
Mm.
Then there's emotionaldysregulation, or our nervous
(31:47):
systems might be amped up andthere might be times where we're
more.
Sensitive to things and need tosort of wind back.
And then there's inconsistencywith getting our work done and
boom, bust cycles and burnout,like the big word burnout that
some people have an aversion to.
Mm-hmm.
Um, fear of visibility.
(32:09):
And then there's guilt and orshame around having these
ambitions also.
So there's, there's so muchgoing on that we need a
different operating system andsupport system.
For that sustainable success.
Dr Nat Green (32:24):
Yeah.
And hearing you speak aboutburnout like that, and you know
where I stand on that, thatburnout is not spoken about or
often in some professions wornas a badge of honor, and you
just keep pushing through.
Mm-hmm.
We know we need to acknowledgethat burnout is real.
(32:45):
Yes, but you'll also know thatfrom my perspective when we talk
about burnout, I don't believeit's just burnout.
I think as you've said, it's avery holistic picture, and
underneath that is our nervoussystem.
I.
Has been holding yes space forother people for so long, trying
to hold our own space whenwe've got all this other stuff
(33:08):
going on and that often has thisunderlying layer of vicarious
trauma.
Yes.
Where we've got this traumathat we've carried often
unknowingly.
But it's also got those layersof being gaslit, being
dismissed, having our wholeintegrity threatened, as well as
(33:29):
that fear of being seen asimpaired in inverted commas that
as a health professional orprofessional entrepreneur, am I
a fraud?
Am I an imposter?
Is there something wrong?
And should I not be doing this?
'cause I can't show up everyday like everyone else.
Nichi Morrin (33:49):
Yes, exactly.
And I, I think burnout is aterm often used where if we
imagine we have a tree, burnoutis the branches and the leaves
where it's a word sort of knownfor the, the things that we are
feeling or we might be doing.
But the trunk of that tree andthat root system go far deeper
(34:11):
and those roots.
are all those vicarioustraumas, all those things we've
experienced or the things we'veingested on a nervous system
level we don't even realize.
So I think a lot of peopleburnout's like the common word,
but it's so far deeper with alot more going on than people
(34:33):
either want to recognize or areactually conscious of.
Dr Nat Green (34:39):
Absolutely.
I do think the way you've justdescribed that is.
Fantastic, because really it'sthe base of the tree, the
foundation, but these roots,they spread far and wide and
they're unseen.
Just like the invisibleconditions.
They're under the ground.
We know they're there, but wedon't really understand or know
(35:01):
which path they follow until westart digging and dig them up.
Or snap the root off
Nichi Morrin (35:08):
Yeah, exactly.
That's right.
Dr Nat Green (35:11):
Yeah, very powerful.
And can we just go back for aminute?
So, I mean, I know the outcomewith your beautiful daughter.
So did you wanna share whereshe's at now?
Like so she definitely had aheart attack?
Yes.
Only because you kept pushingthat people were able to
actually see that.
(35:31):
And where is she now?
Nichi Morrin (35:34):
So she's just turned 18.
Woohoo.
Very, really exciting.
I can't believe it.
She's already 18.
Mm.
Um, she's had to step back fromher job just to try and get
herself well.
Mm-hmm.
But that's okay because yourhealth's a priority.
Yeah.
And fatigue.
(35:54):
She's experiencing a lot offatigue, but the medication
she's on to protect the heartafter a heart attack can also
lead to fatigue.
So hopefully when we go back inabout a month's time, we can
change that.
And her fatigue might ease alittle.
Mm-hmm.
But at the moment, she's happy.
(36:16):
She still can't believe thatshe had a heart attack.
But her resilience justinspires me and how strong she
is.
And she was all for me reachingout to the Queensland Ambulance
Service mm-hmm.
And having these discussionsand investigations occurring for
clinical education across theboard, and she's very happy.
(36:40):
That I am trying to make changein this space, not only for
what she's experienced, for whatI've experienced for what my
younger daughter's experiencedbut, and also my nephew.
So my, nephew has a rare braintumor that was founded at 18
months.
Uh, he's 13 now.
(37:01):
And.
The amount of times he's almostdied, the amount of times.
He's had stuff ignored.
We had to call Ryan's rule atone stage.
Mm.
He nearly died several timesand we ended up with a formal
apology from the hospital forhim being ignored at one stage
at Brisbane Hospital.
So Braxton's fight his page onFacebook.
(37:22):
He's got thousands of followersfollowing his journey, um, from
a foundation I started for himyears ago.
So the rare and, the invisiblehas been something my family's
lived with for 12, actually over12 years.
Mm-hmm.
Uh, we've lived it.
We have breathed it and.
(37:43):
I think my family is very proudof what I'm trying to do.
Mm.
And they're so supportive of itbecause we need change to
happen for everyone out therewith invisible conditions that
takes years to find out answers.
(38:04):
Only yesterday I had someonesay to me, and it brought tears
to my eyes, they said.
My mum passed a year ago, butif only my mum had found you
before she passed, I think wewould've got answers for what
she had lived with her wholelife.
Oh.
Um, and that was just like, ohmy God, I just, the goosebumps
(38:33):
that one need to get my stuffout there and happening.
And also for the professionals,the other people.
Like myself who work in thespaces, but wanna protect their
wellbeing also.
Dr Nat Green (38:49):
Yes.
And really who better to leadsuch a powerful movement than
you?
Like you've lived it, you'vebreathed it, and unfortunately
had.
the Experiences you've hadrecently on top of all your own
experiences, had your daughtergo through that as well and like
(39:10):
you said, these experiences,I'm a firm believer in that as
well happen for a reason.
Yeah.
'cause it's through asprofessionals, our lived
experience and the impact ofthat.
If we don't experience that.
With our education andknowledge and drive, then we
(39:31):
can't lead the way and make thedifference.
So yeah, absolutely.
I'm with you on that, thatthese things happen and it's
about how you then turn thataround Yeah.
And pay it forward.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
And make the difference in theworld that you were born to do.
Nichi Morrin (39:52):
And and how you said about things happen for a
reason.
It just so happened that afterher heart attack, I was just
drawn back into the universityspace and I'm doing some
teaching one day a week at auniversity now.
And on that first day I metanother colleague there and I
(40:14):
just told her a five minutebrief overview of.
My story and what I'm doing andshe's like, oh my God, I was
meant to meet you and your stuffhas to be out there.
And I think even since then,just being back in that space
and I just love being amongstthe research and all that sort
of stuff, and I've been heavilyin the research since just
(40:37):
building this, but I feel likenow I'm on my path.
I have the clarity and havingthat sort of.
Group of entrepreneurs andprofessionals around me all
doing similar things has reallyhelped with my clarity and that
motivation.
But these lived experiences aremy huge drivers.
Dr Nat Green (40:59):
Mm.
Yeah.
So lived experience, supportfrom community.
Yes.
They're really importantthings.
Yeah.
What do you think you'd shareOne thing with our listeners
that would help them as theynavigate, you know, post-trauma
(41:19):
or life with invisibleconditions, and I know so many
of my listeners have both asthey move from the trauma
through to post-traumaticgrowth.
What would be one thing or manythings that you could share
that would help them?
Nichi Morrin (41:37):
I feel throughout all the trauma myself and my
family have been through overthe last 15 years, 15, 20 years.
I think there were times whereI would just think every, 'cause
(41:59):
every single time I hadsomething good happening.
To be followed by somethingknocking me down again.
So I'd start to think, I can'tdo anything good.
I can't have happiness, I can'thave any, my dreams happen
because there was alwayssomething around the corner
gonna knock me down.
So I was sort of scared to behappy or scared to follow my
(42:26):
dreams and I thought, how can I.
Feel happy or do these thingsif others in my family are
suffering and all these thingsare going on.
So there were several timeswhere that scared me.
And I think one strength ofmine is I do always look at what
(42:48):
can I learn from theseexperiences?
And I look at it with thatglass half full of.
What lessons can I learn fromthis?
Because this is something I canmove forward to help me with
the things I'm trying to do.
Yeah.
Or help me get through.
So reframing that mindset tolook at instead of what life's
(43:10):
happening or what life's doingto me and what have I done to
bring on all this bad luck It'smore what can I learn from this
experience.
To help me and help others moveforward.
And I know when, it did getreally hard when my health
really deteriorated a couple ofyears ago, not only like I did
(43:35):
struggle more with mm-hmmthinking positive and that's
where I actually had tomassively practice what I
preach.
But I had to go beyond just.
Reframing in a cognitive levelmm-hmm.
To step into my body at a soullevel.
Yes.
So, to process that trauma, Ihad to stop and do meditation,
(43:59):
um, do my tapping, do mystretches and my movements.
So all those little half donestress and trauma cycles sitting
on my nervous system, like halfdone washing machine, lung.
Mm-hmm.
I had to process them throughmovement and soul-based
exercises.
So what I actually did, likewhat I would've loved to do is
(44:21):
take three months off anddisappear off on an island.
But I couldn't afford to dothat.
Dr Nat Green (44:26):
That'd be nice, wouldn't it?
Nichi Morrin (44:28):
So I would, every morning I would measure where my
body's at.
Could I give myself some metime that morning and about four
or five mornings a week I wouldwhere I would.
Depending on my energy andwhere I was at, could I do 10
minutes?
Could I do 30 minutes?
And I would decide what my bodywanted that day.
(44:51):
What, what did it need?
So there wasn't rigid goals.
There wasn't, I had to go andwork out at a gym because I
can't do gyms.
Mm-hmm.
Um, but whether it was a 10minute.
Gentle on exercise by listeningto a podcast.
I was nurturing my creativeside at the same time.
Or was it 15 minutes ofrestorative yoga just on the
(45:14):
mat, or was it doing stretching,just gentle stretching.
For 10 minutes and then 10minutes of listening to a
podcast just to nurture my busybrain.
So I did that and meditationtoo.
I found that really helpful,especially for a busy ADHD
(45:37):
entrepreneurial brain.
I found short periods ofmeditation was helpful.
Mm-hmm.
So all this stuff Iincorporated into my.
I'm not gonna say daily.
'cause some days I couldn't doit.
So weekly practices.
Mm-hmm.
And I was proud of myself forwhat I could do.
And then walking.
(45:58):
So this year I've incorporatedtrying to go for some walks in
the afternoon just to get outand been mindful of my
environment.
So those body-based things Ihave found so important for.
Getting through trauma andregulating that nervous system.
Dr Nat Green (46:16):
Absolutely.
So really the key lessons andlearnings for you have been to
allow yourself to feel toconnect in with your body Yeah.
And to really tune into it andlisten.
Yeah.
Not think what it might be andbe in your head, but to connect.
(46:37):
And that's that three brainstuff that Yes, we talked about
before, that I do that head, theheart and the gut and really,
yes, allowing them to integrateand feel, because when we're
going through trauma and inorder to cope with our invisible
health conditions, we oftenshut down part of that, one of
those brains because it's toopainful.
Nichi Morrin (46:57):
Oh, absolutely.
And that's one thing I see withpeople with invisible
conditions.
It is the gut brain.
It is the heart.
It is the entire lot that Iwork with in this space because
this condition's a multisystem.
They are not just one or theothers.
You have to work at this level.
And one other thing for peoplewith post-traumatic growth is
(47:19):
reaching out to someone if youare not okay.
That was something I alwaysfelt hard to do because I felt
like a burden.
I know a couple of times Ireached out to you and I
thought.
Oh, but I don't wanna burdenher or, or anything 'cause she's
busy.
But when you actually reach outand you just share the light
for me, I get pulled into line abit, a little, and I'm able to
(47:43):
step back and pull myself backin instead of being all anxious
and worried.
Dr Nat Green (47:49):
So allowing yourself to be held Yes.
But also having.
The courage to ask for helpbecause we, I know myself as
well.
It's really hard to ask forhelp, you know, for whatever
other internal chatter goes on.
I don't wanna be seen as weak.
I don't wanna be a burden.
(48:09):
You know, we all have thoseconversations, but the reality
is we can't carry the load alonebecause that continues to
impact our nervous system andweighs down.
Nichi Morrin (48:21):
Mm-hmm.
Absolutely.
Dr Nat Green (48:23):
Yeah.
So tell me, Nichi, as we moveto wrapping up this
conversation, where can ourlisteners find out more about
you and find you online and findout all about the exciting new
things you're bringing to life?
Nichi Morrin (48:35):
So on Facebook, they can find me at the
Invisible Health Network or theinvisible CEO and on Instagram,
they can find me at theinvisible CEO my website.
www.invisiblehealthnetwork.comin the process of being built.
(48:57):
So that'll be mm-hmm.
Finished hopefully within thenext month.
Excellent.
Um, and then my COMPASS-5training and my invisible CEO
support will be launched.
Dr Nat Green (49:09):
How exciting.
Nichi Morrin (49:10):
It's all in motion.
Dr Nat Green (49:11):
You have done so much and all that really in less
than a year since we lasttalked.
You continue to, you know,inspire me and I love the work
that you're doing, but again,I'm so sorry that you and your
family have had to go throughwhat you've been through to get
you on this track.
(49:33):
Yeah,
Nichi Morrin (49:34):
thank you.
I think we're a resilientbunch, but we've had to learn to
be.
Dr Nat Green (49:39):
Absolutely.
And really, who better to pavethe way for us to change
systems, make a difference, andgive hope to people with
invisible conditions.
And whether that's trauma orsignificant health conditions,
they're all invisible.
Nichi Morrin (49:58):
Yes, exactly.
Thank you.
Dr Nat Green (50:01):
So thank you, Nichi.
Nichi Morrin (50:02):
Thank you so much, Nat.
Dr Nat Green (50:04):
I'm really excited to see what you bring to life
and yeah, we'll look forward totalking to you soon.
Nichi Morrin (50:09):
Thank you.
Dr Nat Green (50:10):
Bye.
Thank you for joining me inthis episode of Growing Tall
Poppies.
It is my deepest hope thattoday's episode may have
inspired and empowered you tostep fully into your
post-traumatic growth, so thatyou can have absolute clarity
(50:33):
around who you are, what mattersthe most to you, and to assist
you to release your negativeemotions.
And regulate your nervoussystem so you can fully thrive.
New episodes are publishedevery Tuesday, and I hope you'll
continue to join us as weexplore both the strategies and
(50:54):
the personal qualities requiredto fully live a life of
post-traumatic growth and tothrive.
So if it feels aligned to youand really resonates, then I
invite you to hit subscribe andit would mean the world to us.
If you could share this episodewith others who you feel may
benefit too, you may also findme on Instagram at Growing Tall
(51:19):
Poppies and Facebook, Dr.
Natalie Green.
Remember, every moment is anopportunity to look for the
lessons and to learn andincrease your ability to live
the life you desire and deserve.
So for now, stay connected.
Stay inspired.
(51:40):
Stand tall like the tall poppyyou are, and keep shining your
light brightly in the world.
Bye for.
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