Welcome to 'Leadership Mastery with Otis McGregor: Transforming Decision-Making and Mindsets for Success', a must-listen podcast for aspiring and established leaders alike. Join us as we delve into the mind of Otis McGregor, a renowned leadership coach and expert, who shares his invaluable insights on overcoming negative mindsets and enhancing decision-making skills in the dynamic world of leadership.
In This Episode, You'll Discover:
- Effective Leadership Strategies: Learn how to navigate the complexities of leadership roles and make impactful decisions.
- Mindset Transformation Techniques: Otis McGregor reveals practical methods to shift from a negative to a positive mindset, crucial for leadership success.
- Insights on Personal Growth: Explore the interplay between personal development and professional leadership abilities.
- Real-World Leadership Challenges: Hear McGregor's experiences and anecdotes that highlight common leadership hurdles and how to overcome them.
By blending McGregor's expert advice with real-world examples, this episode is a treasure trove of knowledge for anyone looking to enhance their leadership skills and mindset. Tune in to transform your approach to leadership and decision-making, and don't forget to subscribe for more insightful episodes!"
Links
- Website - https://successchampionnetworking.com/
- YouTube Video - https://www.youtube.com/c/GrowthMode
- Blog - https://successchampionnetworking.com/blog/
- Facebook Group https://www.facebook.com/groups/SuccessChampion
Mentioned in this episode:
Success Champions Networking
If you want to grow and scale your business you need to be getting into great conversations with other business owners that can help you take your business to the next level. Joining an online business peer group like Success Champions provides access to a select pool of successful business people from around the world, each having a well-established network who trust them, who want to introduce you to people that can help you build the business of your dreams. So once you get to know your fellow members and they’ve gotten to know you along with your services and ethics, the conversations you get into will multiply!
Success Champion Networking
Success Champion Networking isn't for the beginning networker. Success Champion Networking is for business people that understand building successful relationships is a two-way street requiring commitment from both people involved. Stop wasting time networking with people that don't understand how to leverage their network to generate quality referrals for you. If you are ready to network with business people that are tired of doing all the heavy lifting and want to build real partnerships that generate high-revenue referrals visit one of our Chapters today. https://successchampionnetworking.com/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Otis McGregor (00:00):
sometimes you got to roll up the sleeves and dive back in.
Right.
I always talk about, Hey, if there's ahole that needs to be dug, guess what?
I got to grab a shovel to get that hole dug.
But what you got to understand as the leader is how do I.
Keep myself from being stuck in that hole, keep myself frombeing the guy that's still digging down, because you know
(00:21):
what, as the leader, you have to be looking for what otherholes need to be dug, what other buildings need to be built
You've got to get around people thatare doing the shit you want to be doing.
On the level and volume of what you want to be doing.
Go in and be the damn student.
(00:43):
I could learn every person in this room.
Think about how you talk about your business.
Yes, passion sells.
You can't carry on a real conversation outside the passion.
You're gonna lose.
So the whole point of all of thisis one, show up as you, fuckin loud.
(01:06):
Two, get yourself in frickin roomsthat scare the shit out of you.
It's really about looking at those thingsthat you know will move the business forward.
and doing them anyways.
me to always show up as m Welcome to growth mode.
Donnie Boivin (01:34):
otis, I've been working on myself for a number of years, and I'm, I promise you, I know you know this, but building
a business is the best way to meet the dude in the mirror.
There's nothing else that'll show you whatyou're made of better than building a business.
My question, starting out the gate, is as I continue to evolveinto a leadership role, being the CEO of my company, how
(01:55):
do I figure out or how do I introspectively look at myselfand dive further into who I am and my leadership style?
Otis McGregor (02:02):
Well, first off, the fundamentals are you have to lead yourself, right?
So leading yourself, one of my key principles thatI like to use, not really a principle, but it's a
technique, is for understanding self awareness andmindfulness and how you show up and that's energy levels.
And I'll give you, I'll give you the quick down anddirty kind of the, not even the reader's digest.
(02:24):
We're going to do the reader's digest ofthe reader's digest of these energy levels.
So there's seven levels of energy.
We take these seven levels, we put them into two categories.
Positive and negative.
Positive, anabolic, expansive, exciting.
Let's do it again.
More, more, more, right?
I can't wait.
Negative, catabolic, sucking the oxygen out of the room.
(02:44):
I like to describe it to my militaryguys, and you'll appreciate this.
It feels like You're wearing a workout vest, aballistic vest, 100 pound rucksack in an EOD blast suit.
That's what negative energy feels like.
It is physically and mentally draining.
And the key to this whole thing is, I'm not going to gointo all seven levels, unless you want to dive into those.
(03:10):
But the key to this is understanding that inthe end and the beginning, you get to choose.
It's all about the choice you make.
Nothing's going to make you happy.
Nothing's going to make you.
Pissed off unless you decide it.
I can, I can walk up, head over to your office, takeme a couple of hours to get there, head over to your
(03:30):
office, smack you in the face, and you get to choose.
Thank you very much, Otis.
I appreciate that.
Or mute mother and punch me back.
It's a choice.
It's all a choice.
Once you start deciding that I'm choosing to bepissed off in this moment, I'm choosing to be happy.
Guess what?
You get back in control.
(03:51):
That's self awareness and mindfulness.
It is huge, it's a huge self power to understand.
And here's, here's why it's important.
When we are pissed off, all we see is red.
We have, we have blinders on and the survival blinders come on.
Survival blinders put us into a fight or flight mode, right?
(04:12):
Yep.
And we don't see solutions.
When we're positive, think about thattime that you're walking down the street.
Maybe downtown Roanoke, right?
And you're walking around Weatherford orwhatever like that, and you're in downtown,
and you're like, Oh, check that out over there.
What's that over there?
Oh man, let's go over there.
Or my favorite, being a Texas boy myself, I'm driving down theroad, that farm road, back, back country road, and I see that
(04:40):
old F 100, step side, sitting in front of the farmer's house.
And I'm like, man.
I should stop making an offer and buythat because I could build that thing up.
And that'd be a fricking really cool ass pickup truck to drive.
That's positive energy because I'm seeing opportunity.
If I was pissed off, I'd probably drive by that and go,look at that piece of crap sitting in that guy's yard.
(05:01):
What a junk.
What a piece.
But if I'm positive, if I've chosen to be positive in themoment, I see that pickup truck, the exact same pickup truck.
I'm like, damn, that's cool.
I want, I want to, I can really have some fun with that.
That's where we can start to make changes in our life.
That positive energy.
We see opportunity.
We create opportunities for ourselveswhen we're in a positive state of mind.
(05:24):
All
Donnie Boivin (05:24):
right.
This is going to be fun.
So I'm not a woo woo guy at all.
All right.
So, uh, uh, I, I believe there's a real thing oftoxic positivity, um, and motherfuckers telling
themselves that they got to be positive all the time.
I want to punch everybody in the face.
Um, so.
Where's the line then?
Because, look, building a business is fucking hard.
I don't give a shit who says otherwise, right?
(05:47):
Um, there's just a lot of moving parts, a lotof decisions that have to be made, a lot of fast
decisions that often have to be made in business.
So, emotions do play a part because you're regulating yourself.
You're keeping the fate of other people in yourhands, you know, you're trying to make the right
calls and move forward, you know, trying to be Mr.
Positivity all the time is fuckingpointless because oftentimes, rage.
(06:15):
Yeah.
Right.
I mean, sometimes rage has been one of my greatest toolsto find the breakthrough I need because I got so pissed
off over something that I'm like, Ooh, we can fix that.
Right.
So, so walk me through it because I always hear thispositivity crap and, and I don't always wrap my head
around it because I know the power of both emotions.
Otis McGregor (06:35):
Well, first off, it all comes down to being authentic.
True.
If you're, if you're bullshitting yourself.
You're not being authentic.
If your point walking around, you know, you, when youfirst started talking about that, you reminded me of air
assault school Fort Campbell when I was 20 something.
And, you know, you had to say air assaultevery time your left foot hit the ground.
(06:57):
And it was just a silly stuff.
And we started saying false motivation is the key to graduation.
And that was the lesson I learned many, many years ago.
And I still think of that even eventoday, because I can't BS myself.
I gotta be authentic with myself and I authentically choose.
(07:18):
Yeah, it's okay.
By the way, I wasn't saying it's wrong to be pissed off.
I was saying it's a choice to be pissed off.
And if you want to be pissed off, thenbe pissed off and fucking take action.
Because that's the thing that happens, right?
You mentioned it.
Man, I got pissed off and I got this done.
Yeah, because you got pissed off and you'relike, damn, I'm Fucking tired of this shit
(07:40):
and we're going to blow through it, right?
That's okay.
You made a decision to do that and youtook action to put fire in your belly.
You say, let's fix this right now.
Stop everything.
This is fucking bullshit.
Let's take action.
Boom.
And you attacked it.
That's negative energy.
Yes, what you don't realize that happens, youknow, the, the, I always look at this as pros and
(08:05):
cons, not, not positive and negative pros and cons.
So the pro to that is you took action, boom, blowing it through.
The con to that is maybe there was a better choice over here.
Maybe there was a better choice over here.
But that's okay, right?
In the moment, you said, Nope, this is fucked up.
We gotta fix this right now.
We're taking action and moving forward.
(08:26):
Alright, you know, that's okay.
The secret to this, going back to what I wastalking about earlier, that mindfulness and
self awareness, is that it's a conscious choice.
Realizing that, you know what, I'm fuckingpissed off, I'm gonna be pissed off, goddammit.
And we're gonna take action right now.
I'm in control.
(08:47):
I'm deciding.
I don't want to be pissed off.
Nothing wrong with that.
There's pros and cons to it, but there's nothing wrong with it.
It's a choice.
That
Donnie Boivin (08:56):
can be really hard.
You know, I had Chris Dadeon on and hesaid something that blew my fucking mind.
I never heard anybody say this before, but hesaid, your mind doesn't want you to be present
because it's the only time it's not in control.
When you're thinking in the future, right?
You're projecting and telling yourself stories.
When you're thinking in the past, you're fabricatingthings you thought happened or remembering things.
(09:18):
Your mind can control those two things,but it can't control the right now.
Mm hmm.
Right?
And I, I promise you, I, I do mybest to go right here, right now.
Right here, right now.
And I don't know what to do with it.
If I'm completely honest, right?
I'm like, okay, I'm going for a walk.
Am I fucking looking at the rocks?
(09:39):
Am I looking at the grass?
I mean, what do I do if I'm right here, right now?
I mean, my wife may be in the room.
What do I do?
Do I just focus on her?
Otis McGregor (09:50):
Do I just focus on my wife when she's in the room?
By the way, Ms.
Suzanne, yes, yes, I do.
Yes,
Donnie Boivin (09:59):
I do.
I love you, Elizabeth.
Right.
But, but how do you, I mean, because really, I mean,In that moment that you're supposed to be right
here, taking ownership control of all your things.
I mean, that's either stupid, fastthinking or I'm missing a step.
Otis McGregor (10:20):
Here's the way I like to look at it.
And you hit on some of this alreadyis, is the past cannot be changed.
The past, your, your choice on the past and the memoriesof the past is it's your schoolhouse or your prison.
Okay.
That's number one.
Number two, future is unknown and is uncontrollable.
We cannot control the future.
(10:40):
All we have is the present moment.
The thing about the present moment is thepresent moment creates the future that we want.
And when we think about the actions that we'retaking in this moment, I'm setting up my future.
In the moment, and I can intentionally do that byeven right now where we're talking, I'm thinking, oh,
(11:01):
I want to lead us this way by saying this or that.
Right?
But I'm doing that in the present moment to move to his future.
Can I guarantee that's the subject?
We're going to go the rabbit.
We're going to chase in that hole.
I don't know, but by saying certain things,I might lead us that way, or I may not.
As long as I'm thinking about what I'm doing, the actionsI'm taking in this very moment, because the moment we
(11:26):
have right now, as your friend said, is all you got.
Yeah.
And I create the future I want bythe actions I take in this moment.
Donnie Boivin (11:38):
So then take into account as a leader, as a dude, right?
There's so many actions that could be taken.
So we throw a lot of theories at theworld saying, okay, these are the beliefs.
I think I should be doing to move forward.
You do said things.
(11:59):
And then you're putting benchmarks against thosegoing, okay, was that the right move or not?
And then you're constantly weighing prosand cons of moving decisions forward.
And I make very, very fast decisions.
So much so that Jerry Mack, my coach, looked atme and said, I'm going to tell you something,
you're not allowed to do a fucking thing with it.
Like, don't start, right?
Which I'd never had a coach tell me not to start.
(12:19):
It was kind of interesting.
Um, so, so, In all of that, where, where am I?
Making the right decisions, making the right moves,if it's in the moment, and you're trying not to base
it off the past, but you have to, because right?
History tells us a lot of things, um, but you're alsotrying to project a future where you're trying to get to.
Otis McGregor (12:43):
So, first off, everything you've done, seen, felt, experienced.
And had happened around you in the environment that you've hadhas created the person you are in this very moment right now.
True.
So that's, that's understanding number one.
Understanding number two is thevalues that you have in your life.
(13:06):
Are the values that drive your decisions and understandingwhat those values are and being aware of those values,
even in a reactionary sense, those values still driveyour decision back to the negative energy, right?
When we put the blinders on, becausewe have to go, we have to fix this.
We have to unfuck this go right now.
(13:27):
My values are still there.
My values, even though I'm not, I'm not doing the analysis.
I'm not sitting back doing a course of action analysisand comparing options and all that sort of stuff.
I'm taking immediate action withwhat I perceive as the best solution.
And that, that is the basis of who you are.
(13:51):
Now you can change that.
You can change that, but it's not going to happen like this.
By changing your values, changing your perspective as we go alongand we make those decisions and go, Oh shit, that was wrong.
All right, so now I've already got that logged in my head in thereactionary sense, because if I'm about, if I'm in the kitchen
and the stove's on, and I'm slipping and falling, and I, my handis going to the stove to grab, I've already learned that lesson.
(14:17):
I'm still in reactionary mode, right, because I'm about to fall.
I know that I'm going to pull that hand back sothat it doesn't go into the hot stove, right?
Yep.
We're doing that.
We, we, we log those things in ourmind as we live and as we go forward.
That's the analysis that we can put ourselves into in learningback to the school, schoolhouse or prison of our past, right?
(14:42):
Yeah, I learned a long time ago, learning my hand on the stove.
That's, that's part of my schoolhouse.
That's not a prison, right?
So now I know I'm around that hot stove.
I'm gonna be careful, even if I'm slippingand falling over that pot or whatever.
Is going, I'm going to, whoa, don't do that.
Donnie Boivin (15:01):
All right.
Well, then that leads me right into one of my biggest struggles,which is I am the here an idea, take immediate action.
Let's go.
So I'm constantly with the team.
Go on.
Okay.
This is what the next thing we're going to do.
Okay.
This is the next thing we're going to do.
And then I'll come back off in time andgo, okay, yeah, we're not doing that one.
(15:22):
That was just me jumping a gun too fast.
Right?
Um, let's go do this thing.
How do I stop that or lack of a better word or slowit down enough that I'm not having the team building
crap out and doing things, um, unintentionally.
How
Otis McGregor (15:39):
painful is the mistake?
Donnie Boivin (15:41):
It's never really painful because there's not that much heavy lifting.
There you go.
Otis McGregor (15:45):
Then.
Right.
And you're not going to change unless you decide, right?
You can make the choice to change,or you can let pain drive the change.
And I hear
Donnie Boivin (15:53):
that all the time.
People are like, okay, you can make the choice tosay, well, fuck, you know, okay, I choose to change.
What's your
Otis McGregor (15:59):
learning cycle?
What do you mean?
So when you do that, and you say,yep, that was the right solution.
Back to what we were talking about in the green room.
What are the indicators going back?
What's the root cause analysis?
Do you ever go back and look at what were the indicatorsthat I might have missed or assumed one way or the other?
Donnie Boivin (16:20):
Yeah, I can't, I can't honestly say that I go back and self analyze afterwards a whole lot.
I'm, I'm more of alright, we fuckedthat up, let's just keep running.
Otis McGregor (16:30):
Okay.
That's a technique.
Donnie Boivin (16:33):
Fair.
Is it the right technique?
Or is it a technique?
Otis McGregor (16:37):
Hey, there's only one person that decides that.
Just like there's only one person that decideswhether or not you're successful, and that's you.
Well,
Donnie Boivin (16:43):
come on.
We all want the silver bullet, right?
And we know that there's no silver bullet in the same sentence.
Otis McGregor (16:49):
Yeah.
I mean, that goes back to the being authentic, man.
Don't bullshit
Donnie Boivin (16:52):
yourself.
100%.
Should I go back and start reevaluating,you know, why I took that course of action?
Because I had, I had a, an epiphany with another guestand that's why I love doing this style of podcast.
And during our conversation, I realized that truly knowingyourself is, and you've said this for the most part,
(17:13):
it's understanding why you're having the emotions you'rehaving, what caused those emotions to come into play.
And so I've done a better job of analyzing why I'mdoing certain things, but not always great at it.
Um, What I'm thinking through now is some of these decisionswere financial decisions based on a short term gain versus
(17:38):
a long term, you know play and Depending on what's going oninside of a business life, whatever, you know, that can be often
Otis McGregor (17:46):
type thing.
We all want the microwave solution.
Fuck
Donnie Boivin (17:49):
yes, right?
Um, so how do we recognize that it's in a, a, aquick emotional decision or choice we're making
versus it's a practical business decision?
Otis McGregor (18:05):
Ask yourself how much time you have, because I'm going to share with you.
I've got a couple of things that are running around in my head.
And the first one that's popping into my head,uh, I call it the trust triad of leadership.
So trust triad of leadership.
Number one, trust yourself, trust yourself, trustthe decisions that you make in the moment that you
(18:26):
make them with the information you have in the timethat you have to make that decision to be the best
that you can be, trust that decision that you made.
Number two, trust your team, trust your team to dothe job you hired them and are paying them to do.
Otherwise.
Why are you paying him?
Why are you paying that guy to build you a website?
(18:48):
If you're calling him up every 15 minutes and supervisinghim, got him on Zoom, share screen, all those sort of
things to build you a website, why are you paying him?
And oh, by the way, while you're doing his job, you'remicromanaging him or her in that position who's doing your job?
Trust your team.
Trust that, trust your team to dothe job you're paying them to do.
And when those two pieces of thetriad are in place, the the final leg.
(19:12):
Your team trusts you comes into play.
And when your team trusts you, then theybelieve that every decision that you make has
the best interests of the organization in mind.
It's not about you making more money, getting a higherIPO, uh, getting a promotion, getting a bigger bonus.
They believe that every decision that you make as aleader has the best interest of the organization in mind.
(19:38):
Trust yourself, trust your team, and your team trusts you.
That's the trust triad.
So with that in mind, keeping that in mind, youhave to start looking at how do I get better?
If I make, if I take action, if I'm anaction guy, because I'm the same way.
You know, I'm, I'm, I'm learning to take some pauses,you know, I'm trying, I'm trying somebody, somebody
(20:00):
sends me an email and I was like, damn, you canget me a hundred million in, in just six months.
, man, dang, I gotta dive into this.
I gotta talk to the, that, that's,that's exactly what I, yeah, yeah.
Right.
I mean, take action.
Boom, boom, boom, boom.
Because that's, you know, in some cases, in some points in life.
You got to live that way, but you got toask yourself, do I have a moment to pause?
(20:26):
Do I have a moment to reflect?
I'm going to share with you one otherthing I want you to think about.
And this, these 2 coincide the trust triad, but it'sthe 5 steps to building a team of continuous improvement
with a culture of success and as part of, I've takenBruce Tuckman's, uh, Form Norm Storm and I've expanded
(20:48):
it to how to make a great team in these five steps.
So for me, everybody comes togetherkind of the name tag sort of thing.
Where's your desk?
What do you do?
Where are you from?
I don't know.
What's your name?
Oh, okay.
Gotcha.
Norman.
Okay.
Oh, so that's what you do, man.
You're pretty good at that.
I'm starting to understand what you do.
I understand how I fit in.
I'm understanding the mission, whywe're all brought together, right?
(21:10):
Because there has to be a reason that we're together as a team.
So now we're all understanding our mission, how wefeed into it, what my part is, how I add value to it.
Storming.
Storming is, man, we are running at full speed.
I know what you're going to do before you do it.
I know how you're going to react.
I know how you're going to show up no matter the situation.
It's also called flow.
(21:31):
Great book, Stealing Fire Behind Me, uh, talks aboutflow, and that is where we all want to operate.
But you can't because you can't stay in that state becausethe environment and world and people change constantly
So once we've achieved floor once we've achieved thatstorming stage guess what we got to do We got a pause.
We got a step back and say what did we do?
(21:54):
Right?
We gotta assess We got a look at it andsay well Maybe we could do this better.
What do we do?
What can we build on, build on success?
What can we fix?
What are we missing?
Are we missing the capability?
Do we need more people?
Do we need less people?
Got too many people doing it.
That's when a good team starts to become a great team.
(22:16):
But this final step.
Is where greatness really happens.
And that is adapting.
I'm going to take what we've assessed, what we'veidentified, and I'm going to implement that.
I'm going to make those changes in our organization.
Like, Oh, Hey guys, if you hear me ready to go.
(22:36):
And by the way, I had a, had another entrepreneur onour, on our show a while back who had the same problem.
And then he basically told them to stop.
Whenever I throw out good ideas, just don't start it for a day.
That's what he literally told the team to do.
Wait 24 hours and I'll come back andsee that it's not the right thing.
That is the assessment stage.
(22:57):
And when we assess, now we've changed our process, ourtechnique, our procedures, our personnel, our capability,
or maybe even the mission of that organization.
And we go right back to forming.
So we go forming.
Norming, storming, assessing, and adapting.
(23:18):
And when you do that, when you take those moments, those last twomoments, that's the difference between, yeah, we're doing okay.
And man, we're fucking kicking ass.
Holy shit.
We're blowing it out of the water.
That's the differentiator in having a good team to agreat team, to a highly successful, highly performing.
(23:40):
Organization that just fucking blows it out of the water
Donnie Boivin (23:44):
now.
I like that.
I think my, my favorite portion in that was telling the teamto sit on it for 24 hours to see if it's a good technique.
I tell you what,
Otis McGregor (23:54):
I want to write that one down and implement it tomorrow.
I
Donnie Boivin (23:58):
think you're right.
I think I think my, my, my team would be appreciative of it.
You know, um, so, you know, I wasn't born in aleadership role, you know, type I, I somehow typically
find myself self selecting into a leadership position.
Um, I don't know that I've always been picked as theleader in the room, but I always found myself there.
Otis McGregor (24:23):
Um, sorry, I'm laughing because sometimes you're the guy that's still standing when everybody took a step back.
Yeah, that's true.
That's
Donnie Boivin (24:30):
true.
Right.
Yep.
Yep.
So the, the, the, the trick for me is I've never had tolead people hardly yet throughout my life, not in a, a.
Direct report type of way.
You know, I've always been a sales guy.
I've always, you know, I've led some sales teams that did a lotof sales training, but this is really my first stunt and role
(24:56):
of being a true leader in a leadership role, CEO of a company.
And, you know, there's a lot of thingsI have no idea what the hell I'm doing.
Just kind of figuring it out as I go along.
Um, that's been my MO for life is just, let's bang my headagainst the wall until something works, you know, so it's a
Otis McGregor (25:14):
technique.
You it's a technique.
Donnie Boivin (25:17):
Um, well for, for, for what am I 46?
I will promise you for 45 years of my life, I was uncoachable.
For some reason, had a chip on my shoulder, wasn'tgonna take advice from people, felt like I fucking knew
everything, um, and it took me having to take some good licksbefore I'm like, alright, there's gotta be a better way.
(25:39):
I still don't take advice very well.
Um, you know, uh, I don't know if it'smy upbringing or whatever else, but.
Uh, somebody telling me what to do.
That's why I've got to be very selective with peopleI talk to about business and how I get coached because
if you point me in a direction, my God, I'm going.
Um, and so I've got to trust the person to give methe direction that that's the right damn move to make.
(26:02):
So, um, I'm very, very, very cautious in that, in that realm.
Otis McGregor (26:06):
I'll make that
Donnie Boivin (26:06):
mistake.
How many stupid shit have you built in your company?
Cause somebody said, Hey, you should do this.
And then you turn around and go, what the hell was I thinking?
Um, you know, so as I continue to develop,um, as a, the CEO of the company, how do I.
(26:28):
Recently, this is a better question recently, I, you know,had an incident where I got too close to 1 of the staff and we
became buddies and there's nothing wrong with becoming buddies.
But, um.
The buddy wasn't holding up his end of the bargain, right?
And so now that person is no longer with the company.
(26:51):
So how do I navigate that?
Let's be friends.
Let's hang out.
Let's shoot the shit.
Let's well, let's get the damn work done.
Otis McGregor (27:03):
There's no, there's no line now.
I'll tell you, I learned this the hard way also.
So, I had an NCO teach me this.
I think it was, I want to say it was when I wasa squad leader, a LURSU squad leader when I was,
when I was in the Texas Army National Guard.
Donnie Boivin (27:22):
I'm sorry, the Army?
I didn't catch that.
The,
Otis McGregor (27:25):
the Texas Army National Guard.
I mean, the Lone Star Division.
That's what we were.
Pull up the patch somewhere.
It's behind.
There it is.
You got
Donnie Boivin (27:34):
a little, some shit back there.
You don't need to clean up.
Otis McGregor (27:39):
I was a LURSU, uh, Long Range Reconnaissance Surveillance guy, part of the division unit.
And, uh, one of my NCOs told me this when I became a squadleader and, Looking back on it, it was really bad advice.
It was, he said, don't get personal with any of your soldiersbecause you're going to have to send them to die and that will
(28:01):
influence your decision to not, to send them on a mission.
And, and, and I carried that with me into my first,first assignment as a lieutenant, uh, platoon leader.
Uh, and, It was really awkward, and I would, whenguys would start talking about family and this,
that, and the other, I'd kind of separate myselfout of the conversation and all that sort of stuff.
(28:24):
And what I realized when I became a Green Beret,because the culture is so much different in an
operational detachment alpha and ODA, those 12men, uh, I had to know what their life was like.
I had to know what kind of family they had,and I had to know what was going on at home,
(28:45):
because it affects their performance every day.
Because there is no work, life, and life.
It is all life.
Integrated.
I 100 percent agree.
So, back to your question about Can I befriendly with a partner, a subordinate?
(29:06):
Yeah, but you also have to, you have to put your big boy pantson when the time comes and say, Hey, fellas, which I did many
times as a green beret in charge of guys out doing operationsand the fuck off start stuff would start and be like, That's it.
Stop.
(29:26):
And we went right back to, you know what?
I mean, it almost felt like, you know, mom and dad sort of thing.
We had a couple of incidents one time where, where my teamsergeant and I had to play mom and dad and ground, you
know, ground a couple of guys for some shit they got into.
Right.
Um, but the point of this is, isyou have to understand your team.
(29:50):
You have to know what's making themtick back to that storming stage.
And understanding who they are, why they are,why they're there, what are they doing there?
What's their purpose?
How does that align with your vision of the organization?
Do they see themselves with your vision?
We can come back to that in a minute, too.
Because I think that's a really key pieceto that CEO position for you, but it's.
(30:13):
It's okay to put your arm around themand say, dude, man, that fricking sucks.
Your dog died.
God, man, I remember my dog, man.
I hate that, man.
We went through some really tough.
Do you need to take some time off?
Mission First reminds me of one of my key leadership tenets.
Mission First people always.
If I'm not taking care of my people,I got to know who my people are.
(30:36):
They aren't just that guy that's there foreight hours a day, Monday through Friday.
There's a whole lot more of life going on.
Remember when we talked about your past, everythingyou've done, seen, been, experienced, and felt, and
tasted up until this very moment is who you are.
That's part of them, and knowing that their dog died,or they're going through a divorce, or their kid's
(30:57):
sick, or, or maybe some bills got mixed up, or whatever.
That affects their performance.
And you got to be able to see that and know that.
And then as their leader, if they are not performingtwo expectations, you got to ask yourself, number
one, did I tell them what I expect of them?
(31:22):
Number two, did I provide them all the resourcesand training they needed to be successful?
And if I answer positive on both of those, being truly authentic.
To myself and not BS in myself, then the third question comes in,are they incapable of performing this job that I've put them in?
(31:45):
Then, then it's time to say, all right, you need to gobecause I've, I've told you what, what you need to do.
I've given you all the resources and all the trainingand you've confirmed and we've walked back through it.
You know, the, the old, uh, 90 dayimprovement plan and all those sort of things.
(32:06):
We've done all that and you're still not performing.
Then I tell you what, that you arenot a good fit for our organization.
I am going to help you find a betterorganization for you to fit into.
That's leadership.
It's tough, but that's the conversation you got to have.
No fun having it, you know, because it's not all happy go lucky.
(32:27):
You know, yeah, rainbows, man, I'm giving you a bonus.
I love to do that.
Remember, you know, giving you a, writing that bonus check.
There's nothing better than that as a leader in business, right?
Giving somebody a promotion.
Giving them an award, recognizing them infront of everybody, that's, that's great.
But you know what?
A real leader still has to do the hard stuff, and that is,
(32:51):
you ain't doing, you ain't the right fit, and I'm sorry.
We're gonna, we're gonna do this right.
I'm not firing you today.
I'm gonna give you two weeks.
And we're going to, I'm going to set you up with a recruiter, aheadhunter who's a friend of mine, and I'm going to give you a
business coach or transition coach or whatever you want to callit to help you figure out what it is you should be doing because.
(33:15):
I believe in you as a human being,and you're not a piece of shit.
Now, there are some times when those people are a piece of shit.
Right.
Stealing from you, and you just gotta comeaway right away and not do anything for them?
Okay.
But generally speaking, our team,we want to take care of that person.
They're a human being, right?
A
Donnie Boivin (33:35):
hundred percent.
So we've gotten to know each other pretty damnwell, Otis, I feel like I can, I can, I can flip
the script a little bit on you at the moment.
And you're going to be like, hell yeah, let's run.
So I'm going to give you carte blancheto fucking straight up coach me.
However, you would typically coach somebody freaking come at me.
(33:59):
However, you would traditionally approach coaching a client.
No holds barred.
I'll put it on the table.
Otis McGregor (34:05):
All right.
So, uh, way I always start my calls off or whatare three wins since the last time we talked?
Uh, three wins.
Cause we always want to build on and celebrate success.
Give me three wins.
Donnie Boivin (34:14):
Yep.
For sure.
Uh, one, we brought Julie into company when we hadto let a person go and she is stepping up, uh, and
getting ramped up and give me somewhat peace of mind.
Uh, I'm heading out this weekend to go to a Renaissance festival.
It's one of my favorite things in the world to do.
So this is just a chance to get thefuck away with the wife and friends.
(34:35):
Um, the third one, I think we're finallyat the tipping point, um, of the company.
You know, it really feels like, um, we.
We got one more piece of the puzzle we got to figure out, man.
We figured that piece out and we are heading off to some really,really nice places, but so, uh, those are probably the three
Otis McGregor (34:54):
biggest.
Awesome.
Awesome.
Those are awesome, man.
I'm excited for you.
And I'm, I'm envisioning you eating that big ass turkey leg.
This
Donnie Boivin (35:02):
is what it
Otis McGregor (35:04):
is.
And that's what everybody associates withassociates with the Renaissance fair.
All right.
What's a block or an obstacle?
Something that in your head is said to you.
Nah, here's a, there's a great example.
I don't want to call that guybecause, you know, he's really busy.
When I want to talk to him about,isn't that important or, you know,
Donnie Boivin (35:25):
mind really easy.
So, um, because of the recent scenario inside thecompany, I'm having to do a lot of additional work,
um, and a bunch of stuff that I didn't learn before.
Um, you know, I put trust and an employee.
Gave them ownership over it and I never checked it, right?
Which is 100 percent my bad.
(35:46):
Right?
So, um, now I think I'm finally starting to get tothat place where I don't want to give it up again.
And it's, it's, you know.
Because I'm worried, will I understandit enough to be able to make the move?
So now I'm completely overwhelming myself with allthe things that I'm doing and get myself back to the
(36:10):
point where there's just not enough hours in the day.
Otis McGregor (36:14):
Yeah.
Uh, I usually ask, well, what would you like to focus on today?
But I think that's what you want to focus on today.
And here's what I, here's what I take is Ihave another client doing the exact same thing.
They're about, they're about, uh, probably about60 days ahead of you, interestingly enough.
All right.
And exact, he's the CEO, exact same situation.
(36:38):
And yes, sometimes you got to rollup the sleeves and dive back in.
Right.
I always talk about, Hey, if there's ahole that needs to be dug, guess what?
I got to grab a shovel to get that hole dug.
But what you got to understand as the leader is how do I.
Keep myself from being stuck in that hole, keep myselffrom being the guy that's still digging down, because you
(37:00):
know what, as the leader, you have to be looking for whatother holes need to be dug, what other buildings need to be
built, and if you're head down in the business, working inthe business, remember that old saying, working in, not on?
You've got to have, as soon as you diveinto that crisis mode, 100%, got to do it.
Crisis mode.
But as soon as you step into crisis mode, you got to bethinking about how do I extract myself, extract myself out?
(37:24):
So what's your plan to extract yourself out?
Of being in the business, doing the day to day operations is notdoing what a CEO should do, which is what upper out up and out.
Sorry,
Donnie Boivin (37:38):
upper out.
Um, yeah, the, the interesting place for, for me is.
There's a financial gap that has to be reachedto be able to extract myself from some of this.
So, um, and there's some things that have to be done.
So there's, there's a slight roadmap, not a, not a great one.
(38:01):
Um, the slight roadmap is we're going tobe rebuilding the entire backend company.
You know, everything stays functioning running forward.
So, but I'll be in the mess of it untilthat gets rebuilt and put together.
We don't know yet.
That's part of the struggle.
Um, because of, we don't understandhow long the build is going to take.
(38:25):
Um, because we literally had to start from scratch.
Otis McGregor (38:29):
All right.
What I, what I would throw at you tothink about is, well, what's the outcome?
What's the outcome look like?
What are the, what are the key?
Go ahead.
Go ahead.
Tell me.
Donnie Boivin (38:40):
Yeah, no.
So, so where I need to get to is I need to have 2 fulltime staff sitting on that program monitoring that program.
I needed a full time staff sitting on, uh,our internal, um, membership program as well.
Okay.
Um, and I need to figure out how to get more crap off my plateso I can go be the face of the damn company where I need to be.
(39:07):
Um, but there's a revenue gap tobackfill all those, those positions.
Mm hmm.
Otis McGregor (39:13):
So that's not an outcome.
Those are all action steps.
Oh, you're right.
You're right.
What is the outcome you want to achieve?
Donnie Boivin (39:23):
Say it a different
Otis McGregor (39:24):
way.
Um.
What's the vision?
When you get back to, when you get to this, this point.
Donnie Boivin (39:32):
Fair, fair.
So I want to have the chapters going all across North America.
Stay focused there so that I'm flying inand doing in person events and the likes.
That's what we're trying to get to because one thing thatwe found is the groups do amazingly well on their own.
But when I come into a territory, it really lights up.
Otis McGregor (39:55):
That's typical because you are the power and the personality of the organization.
Right?
Yep.
So you, you've come really close, but I want to take a step back.
And what I challenge you to do is one of my favorite toolsto help guys see where to go is create the ideal day.
(40:21):
Now, that's not something we can do right thisminute because it takes some time, but I'm
going to explain to you what the ideal day is.
And oh, by the way, It's not an arbitrary ideal day.
We're recording this on the 25th of October, 2028.
And I want you to write down on your pieceof paper, ideal day, 25 October, 2028.
(40:43):
I think I said that I messed up.
Today is 2023.
Uh, I want you to think the morning of October 25th,2028, you wake up in the morning and already you're
feeling like, damn, my back feels pretty good today.
Why is my back feel good?
And you go throughout the day andeverything just kind of happens.
(41:05):
You got to drive into town.
And as you're driving into town, youkeep hitting all the green lights.
It's like, man, this is freaking pretty good.
You know what?
They give you an extra, extra squirt of whipped creamon your fancy latte as you go by the Starbucks or the
local, hopefully the local coffee place and get it.
Right.
Right.
Just, just these little things justkind of happen throughout the day.
(41:27):
And, and at the end of the day, when you put your headdown on your pillow next to your wife, you think to
yourself, holy shit, this was a Fucking great day.
Not a perfect day.
I didn't say perfect.
I said ideal.
Because what we're going to do is we're going to set this up.
We're going to create the feeling, the taste,the vision for what this day looks like.
(41:53):
And the devil is in the details.
If you set your alarm at 5 30 and you wake up at 5 29.
That's part of it.
Do I wake up before my alarm or do I wake up to my alarm?
When I get up out of bed, do I take a piss?
Do I brush my teeth?
Do I go outside and have a cigarette?
What's the first thing that I do?
(42:14):
If I go to the gym, I go for a run.
What's the drive like?
Driving to the gym.
What's the workout like if I'm working out in my basement?
What's the run like?
Am I running on a golf course, a trail,uh, in the woods, out in the prairie?
All these sort of things.
We're creating this picture.
In our mind, and this picture in our mind is thesecret to the success of the ideal day because it is.
(42:40):
We're, we're creating this image, andI call this the red truck syndrome.
Red truck syndrome is, I never saw a red pickup truckuntil the day I decided I wanted to buy a red F 150.
And when I decided I wanted to buy a red F 150, guess what?
I saw it at every freaking intersection.
A red pickup truck.
I go to Walmart, there's three of them in the parking lot.
(43:01):
I go across the street to the Home Depot,there's four more in the Home Depot parking lot.
And I'm like, where the hell did they all come from?
Was there a run on red pickup trucks last night?
No.
It was not important information last nightuntil the moment I decided this is what I want.
And when I decide this is what I want, thefilters in my mind change and start to look
(43:22):
to fulfill what I need, what I say I want.
This is survival instinct.
I'm a hunter.
And you know what?
I can see things that most peoplecan't see because when I'm out hunting.
My mind is attuned to that elk, that deer, that antelope.
I can see the shape.
I can see the patterns and pick it out because my mind, I'vetold my mind that vision, that image is important to me.
(43:46):
The same thing happens with the ideal day.
That's why the details are so important becausewe're creating this image in our mind to pursue.
And that image becomes your vision and your vision whenwe have a vision, because we're going to take the details.
We're, we're reverse engineering this, right?
What does everybody always say?
Create this vision and then we dribble it down.
(44:07):
That's too hard.
That's all this, this wazoo stuff, right?
I mean, how many years have I been doing strategy?
That's.
We'll start off with strategy.
I'm telling you, start off with what you want a dayin your life to look like ideally in five years, and
you're going to take that and that becomes your vision.
(44:28):
And when we have a vision, then wecan set our goals, our objectives.
Our tasks, our action steps.
What the hell are you doing this afternoon tomove you one step closer to that ideal day?
And, oh, by the way, like we said earlier, it's all life.
So there ought to be something in therethat's generating revenue for you.
(44:50):
Or maybe, maybe that ideal day for you is a day fishing, aday hunting, a day on the ski slopes, a day on the beach.
If that's the ideal day for you, unrestricted,realistic, ideal day, remember those two words,
unrestricted and realistic, how do you get there?
(45:14):
How do you get to that point in life whereyou can take a full day off and surf?
where you can take a full day off and hunt.
How do you get there?
What are the things that you need to do?
What do you need to do with your business?
What do you need to do with your life?
Where do you need to live?
Who do you need to be?
All these things start to come out of thatideal day, and it's a powerful tool to use.
(45:38):
And guess what?
Now that I know what my day looks like.
Which revolves around my business.
I can create a vision for my business.
And when I create a vision, a five year vision for my business,then I could put together a five year plan for my business.
And you said you're a salesman.
Guess what?
Guess what part of leadership is a key element ofleadership is selling your vision to your team.
(46:03):
If your team does not see themselves.
In your five year vision, they'renot going to be there in five years.
They're not going to perform likethey want to be there in five years.
If they don't see who they are, if their vision, their personalindividual vision does not align with the vision that you set for
(46:23):
your team, your business, you're doing a couple of things wrong.
You've got the wrong person and you're not explaining to them.
You're not telling them how you see them fitting in.
And there may be, there may be a division there.
That's okay.
Right.
That may be that that's time for, you know, in 18 months,they need to step away because they're not going to be
(46:47):
here in five years because they don't see themselves infive years, whatever that reason may be, they may retire.
May want to stay on with kids.
May want to change careers.
That's okay.
But this is what you do as a leader.
You set that vision, especially a CEO, particularly aCEO, you set the vision for your organization and you
sell it to your team and your team has to have that buyin and when they get that buy in and they see themselves
(47:12):
in that, look out man, you're going to hit storming.
You're going to be hitting storming more and more.
Donnie Boivin (47:20):
I think we're, so what I haven't done is, is done the ideal day.
I've got the company vision and I havethe, the, the team's buy in there.
Um, we know what it's going to taketo get to the level we want to.
Um, we don't have a hundred percent the path of that's okay.
That's what we're figuring out now.
(47:40):
Um, We feel like we're at the tip and point to get there.
So, so when I started the company, um, I really set out tochange how the world networks, especially in a B2B game, because
beyond we've all been some really shitty networking where yougot people trying to sell you their lotions and potions crap.
So that was
Otis McGregor (48:01):
that one this weekend,
Donnie Boivin (48:03):
right?
Um, so, so that was the first vision is let's get there.
That which then created a secondary vision of how do wehelp as many people get to freedom through building a
business and that means they can be a selling for somebody.
That means it can be running a business.
Didn't matter.
How can help them buy them freedom?
So, we know to get them there, we've got to teachthem a different level of networking, right?
(48:27):
And we're getting that done.
Right.
And we're coming up with new models and new frameworksand the people, I mean, we're getting stories already of
like Nicole Bernardo, we've tripled her company in sixmonths because she's doing things just a different way.
You know, and we're getting these a lotof cool stories and things like that.
So I've got the, the company vision done.
(48:49):
What I haven't done to what you were justwalking through is design the ideal day.
I've got it.
I've got a generalized idea of whatthat ideal day would look like.
You know, I know I want to woke up, wake up on afreaking and, you know, wildlife retreat ranch.
It's ours with nothing that can eat us.
Uh, you know.
(49:10):
Um, I want the animals, but I don't wantto have to take care of the animals.
That's somebody else's role and responsibility.
Right.
You know, uh, but we know that we wantto create a big, huge, huge sanctuary.
And the only way I can do that is to serve as manypeople as I possibly can in this aspect of networking.
Right.
So got that revenue side dialed in.
I need to work further and more on creating out that ideal day.
(49:35):
And one
Otis McGregor (49:35):
more thing at you, come on, understand yours.
Start to understand the concept.
When you're, it sounds like you'regetting there, start playing with it.
Then teach this to your wife.
Have her go to her other end, go to the other end of the house.
Create her ideal day.
And y'all come back together wherever you do your familymeetings at the kitchen table or whatever over a glass
(49:56):
of whiskey, glass of wine, glass of milk, don't matter.
And compare.
That's,
Donnie Boivin (50:03):
that's teamwork.
I know.
I, we, I know we're both aligned on the animal park.
What's on that animal park is where we're, we are misaligned.
She wants to do an old dog retreat.
Um, and I don't wanna watch that many old dogs die, so
. Otis McGregor: Ooh, that would be
tough.
That's when we not alive.
Damn.
That would be tough.
I'm like, can we just go get all the crazyother critters and just take care of them?
(50:25):
Uh, that, that's, that's the place that I wanna be.
So, um, but that'll be fun.
Dude, thanks for this.
That's, that's a fun project and a funexercise that I'll spend some time with.
Otis McGregor (50:37):
Yeah, have fun with it, man.
I mean, I, I, it's one of my favorite things toteach people because it is, it's so powerful.
It's so simple, but so powerful inhelping guide who you want to be.
I mean, it define, helps you define your success.
Donnie Boivin (50:52):
Well, and you know, I hate the concept of what I'm so annoyed with the phrase.
I can't even think of what it is right now.
Um, like you visualize yourself as successful and you be manifest
Otis McGregor (51:07):
yourself.
Donnie Boivin (51:08):
I fucking hate that shit.
Otis McGregor (51:12):
My son asked me that one time.
Hey dad, do you manifest killing a deer?
Oh yeah, yeah.
I'm, I'm, I'm manifesting.
I'm, I'm, I'm sitting here in the woods, squatting, manifestingreally hard for that buck, that big buck to walk up.
I
Donnie Boivin (51:24):
can remember in my twenties, I was into the self help game really big.
And I was all into this, you know, you can manifest your destiny.
And my buddy, who's about six foot six, you know,400 pounds walks up to me and goes, look, I can
manifest all I want that I'm going to be a jockey.
It ain't ever going to fucking happen.
Otis McGregor (51:45):
And that's why, that's why I said in the ideal day when you plan it, unrestricted, realistic.
Yeah,
Donnie Boivin (51:52):
yeah, yeah.
No, I like, I mean, even thinking about the ranch, becauseI don't think about that enough as we want to do that.
Right.
It puts a different energy into the thoughtprocess because it's something we really want to
Otis McGregor (52:03):
do.
I mean, I did that a couple ofyears ago when we bought our ranch.
Uh, I said, I started to visualize the type of, uh, area Iwanted and the parameters and, and all of a sudden things just
started to jump off the page, you know, looking on Zillow inparticular, and they would just, it would like leap off the page.
(52:24):
It's like, bam, that's it.
That's awesome.
I mean, that was, that's what it took was I wanted to.
I wanted to understand where I wanted to be with thatland and what I wanted to do, what it, what it felt like.
I mean, people would ask me, well, whatare you, what are you going to do with it?
I said, well, the hell I want to do.
Right.
Right.
And if I want to ride around and I'll sharethis publicly, I'm going to do it for you.
(52:48):
If I want to ride around in my four wheeler, naked, witha bottle of whiskey in one hand and my AR 15 in another,
shooting and running, that's what I'm going to do on my lane.
So be it.
Because if it's mine, I do what the hell I want to.
Absolutely.
Right?
Absolutely.
I hate to that you have that visualization right now.
I'm sorry.
I want to kind
Donnie Boivin (53:07):
of burn my eyes out at the moment, but
well, well, Otis, this was a blast, my friend.
I appreciate you coming on here and, andhanging out with me for a little while.
How do people find you?
How do they get in touch with you?
How do we blow up the Otis and Cam show, which isby the way, is a cool show with you and your boy.
Otis McGregor (53:27):
Thank you.
Thank you.
Yeah.
It's a, it's a, we have a lot of fun.
So I'll start with that one first.
The, the Cam and Otis show.
You can follow us on YouTube.
Just, just go to YouTube, the Cam and Otis show, hit subscribe.
Uh, we post two shows a week.
We've got some great guests.
Someday Donnie will be on our show when we can.
I
Donnie Boivin (53:44):
will apologize that I missed two damn interview appointments with these guys.
I don't know how the hell I did it, but I've done it.
So
Otis McGregor (53:55):
we'll get you out there, man.
And, and I'll, I'll just always remind you.
I'm sure that's number one, number two.
Uh, sign up via my website, our website, tribe purpose.com.
Sign up for my Monday Moments newsletter.
That is a great, it is, it is my passion project.
Every week I publish this newsletter withthe lessons I learned from the previous week.
(54:20):
So this week to help you kick off yourweek on Monday morning, Monday moments.
Right.
And so you got a lesson learned, you got a stoicquote, you got some business ideas in there.
You never know, there might be something that youwant to latch on to and build your business on.
And it's just, it's, it's something I just reallyenjoy sharing because I'm sharing what I've learned.
(54:45):
With others so that they can have more success because I'm,I'm a firm believer and you'll love this, Donnie is, is the
fact that if I'm not sharing what I've learned with others, sothey can have more success, I'm being a selfish son of a bitch.
So that's what Monday moments doesfor me each and every week, man.
I I've been doing it for four years now.
Every Monday, that gets published, no matter whether I'mhunting, fishing, sitting on the beach, or maybe riding my ATV.
(55:13):
There
Donnie Boivin (55:13):
you go.
I like it.
I like it.
Well, folks, if you guys stuck aroundwith us this long, do me a favor.
Take a screenshot of Otis and Can Otis and Donny sitting here.
Jesus, I can't talk.
If you've been sitting around this long, take a screenshotof me and Otis sitting here, wherever you're listening to us.
Put that out on social media.
Tag us in there.
I promise you I will swing in and come say hello if I see it.
(55:35):
Take a screenshot.
Otherwise, I love you.
I mean it.
See you.
Bye.
sometimes you got to roll up the sleeves and dive back in.
Right.
I always talk about, Hey, if there's ahole that needs to be dug, guess what?
I got to grab a shovel to get that hole dug.
But what you got to understand as the leader is how do I.
Keep myself from being stuck in that hole, keep myself frombeing the guy that's still digging down, because you know
(00:21):
what, as the leader, you have to be looking for what otherholes need to be dug, what other buildings need to be built
You've got to get around people thatare doing the shit you want to be doing.
On the level and volume of what you want to be doing.
Go in and be the damn student.
(00:43):
I could learn every person in this room.
Think about how you talk about your business.
Yes, passion sells.
You can't carry on a real conversation outside the passion.
You're gonna lose.
So the whole point of all of thisis one, show up as you, fuckin loud.
(01:06):
Two, get yourself in frickin roomsthat scare the shit out of you.
It's really about looking at those thingsthat you know will move the business forward.
and doing them anyways.
me to always show up as m Welcome to growth mode.
Donnie Boivin (01:34):
otis, I've been working on myself for a number of years, and I'm, I promise you, I know you know this, but building
a business is the best way to meet the dude in the mirror.
There's nothing else that'll show you whatyou're made of better than building a business.
My question, starting out the gate, is as I continue to evolveinto a leadership role, being the CEO of my company, how
(01:55):
do I figure out or how do I introspectively look at myselfand dive further into who I am and my leadership style?
Otis McGregor (02:02):
Well, first off, the fundamentals are you have to lead yourself, right?
So leading yourself, one of my key principles thatI like to use, not really a principle, but it's a
technique, is for understanding self awareness andmindfulness and how you show up and that's energy levels.
And I'll give you, I'll give you the quick down anddirty kind of the, not even the reader's digest.
(02:24):
We're going to do the reader's digest ofthe reader's digest of these energy levels.
So there's seven levels of energy.
We take these seven levels, we put them into two categories.
Positive and negative.
Positive, anabolic, expansive, exciting.
Let's do it again.
More, more, more, right?
I can't wait.
Negative, catabolic, sucking the oxygen out of the room.
(02:44):
I like to describe it to my militaryguys, and you'll appreciate this.
It feels like You're wearing a workout vest, aballistic vest, 100 pound rucksack in an EOD blast suit.
That's what negative energy feels like.
It is physically and mentally draining.
And the key to this whole thing is, I'm not going to gointo all seven levels, unless you want to dive into those.
(03:10):
But the key to this is understanding that inthe end and the beginning, you get to choose.
It's all about the choice you make.
Nothing's going to make you happy.
Nothing's going to make you.
Pissed off unless you decide it.
I can, I can walk up, head over to your office, takeme a couple of hours to get there, head over to your
(03:30):
office, smack you in the face, and you get to choose.
Thank you very much, Otis.
I appreciate that.
Or mute mother and punch me back.
It's a choice.
It's all a choice.
Once you start deciding that I'm choosing to bepissed off in this moment, I'm choosing to be happy.
Guess what?
You get back in control.
(03:51):
That's self awareness and mindfulness.
It is huge, it's a huge self power to understand.
And here's, here's why it's important.
When we are pissed off, all we see is red.
We have, we have blinders on and the survival blinders come on.
Survival blinders put us into a fight or flight mode, right?
(04:12):
Yep.
And we don't see solutions.
When we're positive, think about thattime that you're walking down the street.
Maybe downtown Roanoke, right?
And you're walking around Weatherford orwhatever like that, and you're in downtown,
and you're like, Oh, check that out over there.
What's that over there?
Oh man, let's go over there.
Or my favorite, being a Texas boy myself, I'm driving down theroad, that farm road, back, back country road, and I see that
(04:40):
old F 100, step side, sitting in front of the farmer's house.
And I'm like, man.
I should stop making an offer and buythat because I could build that thing up.
And that'd be a fricking really cool ass pickup truck to drive.
That's positive energy because I'm seeing opportunity.
If I was pissed off, I'd probably drive by that and go,look at that piece of crap sitting in that guy's yard.
(05:01):
What a junk.
What a piece.
But if I'm positive, if I've chosen to be positive in themoment, I see that pickup truck, the exact same pickup truck.
I'm like, damn, that's cool.
I want, I want to, I can really have some fun with that.
That's where we can start to make changes in our life.
That positive energy.
We see opportunity.
We create opportunities for ourselveswhen we're in a positive state of mind.
(05:24):
All
Donnie Boivin (05:24):
right.
This is going to be fun.
So I'm not a woo woo guy at all.
All right.
So, uh, uh, I, I believe there's a real thing oftoxic positivity, um, and motherfuckers telling
themselves that they got to be positive all the time.
I want to punch everybody in the face.
Um, so.
Where's the line then?
Because, look, building a business is fucking hard.
I don't give a shit who says otherwise, right?
(05:47):
Um, there's just a lot of moving parts, a lotof decisions that have to be made, a lot of fast
decisions that often have to be made in business.
So, emotions do play a part because you're regulating yourself.
You're keeping the fate of other people in yourhands, you know, you're trying to make the right
calls and move forward, you know, trying to be Mr.
Positivity all the time is fuckingpointless because oftentimes, rage.
(06:15):
Yeah.
Right.
I mean, sometimes rage has been one of my greatest toolsto find the breakthrough I need because I got so pissed
off over something that I'm like, Ooh, we can fix that.
Right.
So, so walk me through it because I always hear thispositivity crap and, and I don't always wrap my head
around it because I know the power of both emotions.
Otis McGregor (06:35):
Well, first off, it all comes down to being authentic.
True.
If you're, if you're bullshitting yourself.
You're not being authentic.
If your point walking around, you know, you, when youfirst started talking about that, you reminded me of air
assault school Fort Campbell when I was 20 something.
And, you know, you had to say air assaultevery time your left foot hit the ground.
(06:57):
And it was just a silly stuff.
And we started saying false motivation is the key to graduation.
And that was the lesson I learned many, many years ago.
And I still think of that even eventoday, because I can't BS myself.
I gotta be authentic with myself and I authentically choose.
(07:18):
Yeah, it's okay.
By the way, I wasn't saying it's wrong to be pissed off.
I was saying it's a choice to be pissed off.
And if you want to be pissed off, thenbe pissed off and fucking take action.
Because that's the thing that happens, right?
You mentioned it.
Man, I got pissed off and I got this done.
Yeah, because you got pissed off and you'relike, damn, I'm Fucking tired of this shit
(07:40):
and we're going to blow through it, right?
That's okay.
You made a decision to do that and youtook action to put fire in your belly.
You say, let's fix this right now.
Stop everything.
This is fucking bullshit.
Let's take action.
Boom.
And you attacked it.
That's negative energy.
Yes, what you don't realize that happens, youknow, the, the, I always look at this as pros and
(08:05):
cons, not, not positive and negative pros and cons.
So the pro to that is you took action, boom, blowing it through.
The con to that is maybe there was a better choice over here.
Maybe there was a better choice over here.
But that's okay, right?
In the moment, you said, Nope, this is fucked up.
We gotta fix this right now.
We're taking action and moving forward.
(08:26):
Alright, you know, that's okay.
The secret to this, going back to what I wastalking about earlier, that mindfulness and
self awareness, is that it's a conscious choice.
Realizing that, you know what, I'm fuckingpissed off, I'm gonna be pissed off, goddammit.
And we're gonna take action right now.
I'm in control.
(08:47):
I'm deciding.
I don't want to be pissed off.
Nothing wrong with that.
There's pros and cons to it, but there's nothing wrong with it.
It's a choice.
That
Donnie Boivin (08:56):
can be really hard.
You know, I had Chris Dadeon on and hesaid something that blew my fucking mind.
I never heard anybody say this before, but hesaid, your mind doesn't want you to be present
because it's the only time it's not in control.
When you're thinking in the future, right?
You're projecting and telling yourself stories.
When you're thinking in the past, you're fabricatingthings you thought happened or remembering things.
(09:18):
Your mind can control those two things,but it can't control the right now.
Mm hmm.
Right?
And I, I promise you, I, I do mybest to go right here, right now.
Right here, right now.
And I don't know what to do with it.
If I'm completely honest, right?
I'm like, okay, I'm going for a walk.
Am I fucking looking at the rocks?
(09:39):
Am I looking at the grass?
I mean, what do I do if I'm right here, right now?
I mean, my wife may be in the room.
What do I do?
Do I just focus on her?
Otis McGregor (09:50):
Do I just focus on my wife when she's in the room?
By the way, Ms.
Suzanne, yes, yes, I do.
Yes,
Donnie Boivin (09:59):
I do.
I love you, Elizabeth.
Right.
But, but how do you, I mean, because really, I mean,In that moment that you're supposed to be right
here, taking ownership control of all your things.
I mean, that's either stupid, fastthinking or I'm missing a step.
Otis McGregor (10:20):
Here's the way I like to look at it.
And you hit on some of this alreadyis, is the past cannot be changed.
The past, your, your choice on the past and the memoriesof the past is it's your schoolhouse or your prison.
Okay.
That's number one.
Number two, future is unknown and is uncontrollable.
We cannot control the future.
(10:40):
All we have is the present moment.
The thing about the present moment is thepresent moment creates the future that we want.
And when we think about the actions that we'retaking in this moment, I'm setting up my future.
In the moment, and I can intentionally do that byeven right now where we're talking, I'm thinking, oh,
(11:01):
I want to lead us this way by saying this or that.
Right?
But I'm doing that in the present moment to move to his future.
Can I guarantee that's the subject?
We're going to go the rabbit.
We're going to chase in that hole.
I don't know, but by saying certain things,I might lead us that way, or I may not.
As long as I'm thinking about what I'm doing, the actionsI'm taking in this very moment, because the moment we
(11:26):
have right now, as your friend said, is all you got.
Yeah.
And I create the future I want bythe actions I take in this moment.
Donnie Boivin (11:38):
So then take into account as a leader, as a dude, right?
There's so many actions that could be taken.
So we throw a lot of theories at theworld saying, okay, these are the beliefs.
I think I should be doing to move forward.
You do said things.
(11:59):
And then you're putting benchmarks against thosegoing, okay, was that the right move or not?
And then you're constantly weighing prosand cons of moving decisions forward.
And I make very, very fast decisions.
So much so that Jerry Mack, my coach, looked atme and said, I'm going to tell you something,
you're not allowed to do a fucking thing with it.
Like, don't start, right?
Which I'd never had a coach tell me not to start.
(12:19):
It was kind of interesting.
Um, so, so, In all of that, where, where am I?
Making the right decisions, making the right moves,if it's in the moment, and you're trying not to base
it off the past, but you have to, because right?
History tells us a lot of things, um, but you're alsotrying to project a future where you're trying to get to.
Otis McGregor (12:43):
So, first off, everything you've done, seen, felt, experienced.
And had happened around you in the environment that you've hadhas created the person you are in this very moment right now.
True.
So that's, that's understanding number one.
Understanding number two is thevalues that you have in your life.
(13:06):
Are the values that drive your decisions and understandingwhat those values are and being aware of those values,
even in a reactionary sense, those values still driveyour decision back to the negative energy, right?
When we put the blinders on, becausewe have to go, we have to fix this.
We have to unfuck this go right now.
(13:27):
My values are still there.
My values, even though I'm not, I'm not doing the analysis.
I'm not sitting back doing a course of action analysisand comparing options and all that sort of stuff.
I'm taking immediate action withwhat I perceive as the best solution.
And that, that is the basis of who you are.
(13:51):
Now you can change that.
You can change that, but it's not going to happen like this.
By changing your values, changing your perspective as we go alongand we make those decisions and go, Oh shit, that was wrong.
All right, so now I've already got that logged in my head in thereactionary sense, because if I'm about, if I'm in the kitchen
and the stove's on, and I'm slipping and falling, and I, my handis going to the stove to grab, I've already learned that lesson.
(14:17):
I'm still in reactionary mode, right, because I'm about to fall.
I know that I'm going to pull that hand back sothat it doesn't go into the hot stove, right?
Yep.
We're doing that.
We, we, we log those things in ourmind as we live and as we go forward.
That's the analysis that we can put ourselves into in learningback to the school, schoolhouse or prison of our past, right?
(14:42):
Yeah, I learned a long time ago, learning my hand on the stove.
That's, that's part of my schoolhouse.
That's not a prison, right?
So now I know I'm around that hot stove.
I'm gonna be careful, even if I'm slippingand falling over that pot or whatever.
Is going, I'm going to, whoa, don't do that.
Donnie Boivin (15:01):
All right.
Well, then that leads me right into one of my biggest struggles,which is I am the here an idea, take immediate action.
Let's go.
So I'm constantly with the team.
Go on.
Okay.
This is what the next thing we're going to do.
Okay.
This is the next thing we're going to do.
And then I'll come back off in time andgo, okay, yeah, we're not doing that one.
(15:22):
That was just me jumping a gun too fast.
Right?
Um, let's go do this thing.
How do I stop that or lack of a better word or slowit down enough that I'm not having the team building
crap out and doing things, um, unintentionally.
How
Otis McGregor (15:39):
painful is the mistake?
Donnie Boivin (15:41):
It's never really painful because there's not that much heavy lifting.
There you go.
Otis McGregor (15:45):
Then.
Right.
And you're not going to change unless you decide, right?
You can make the choice to change,or you can let pain drive the change.
And I hear
Donnie Boivin (15:53):
that all the time.
People are like, okay, you can make the choice tosay, well, fuck, you know, okay, I choose to change.
What's your
Otis McGregor (15:59):
learning cycle?
What do you mean?
So when you do that, and you say,yep, that was the right solution.
Back to what we were talking about in the green room.
What are the indicators going back?
What's the root cause analysis?
Do you ever go back and look at what were the indicatorsthat I might have missed or assumed one way or the other?
Donnie Boivin (16:20):
Yeah, I can't, I can't honestly say that I go back and self analyze afterwards a whole lot.
I'm, I'm more of alright, we fuckedthat up, let's just keep running.
Otis McGregor (16:30):
Okay.
That's a technique.
Donnie Boivin (16:33):
Fair.
Is it the right technique?
Or is it a technique?
Otis McGregor (16:37):
Hey, there's only one person that decides that.
Just like there's only one person that decideswhether or not you're successful, and that's you.
Well,
Donnie Boivin (16:43):
come on.
We all want the silver bullet, right?
And we know that there's no silver bullet in the same sentence.
Otis McGregor (16:49):
Yeah.
I mean, that goes back to the being authentic, man.
Don't bullshit
Donnie Boivin (16:52):
yourself.
100%.
Should I go back and start reevaluating,you know, why I took that course of action?
Because I had, I had a, an epiphany with another guestand that's why I love doing this style of podcast.
And during our conversation, I realized that truly knowingyourself is, and you've said this for the most part,
(17:13):
it's understanding why you're having the emotions you'rehaving, what caused those emotions to come into play.
And so I've done a better job of analyzing why I'mdoing certain things, but not always great at it.
Um, What I'm thinking through now is some of these decisionswere financial decisions based on a short term gain versus
(17:38):
a long term, you know play and Depending on what's going oninside of a business life, whatever, you know, that can be often
Otis McGregor (17:46):
type thing.
We all want the microwave solution.
Fuck
Donnie Boivin (17:49):
yes, right?
Um, so how do we recognize that it's in a, a, aquick emotional decision or choice we're making
versus it's a practical business decision?
Otis McGregor (18:05):
Ask yourself how much time you have, because I'm going to share with you.
I've got a couple of things that are running around in my head.
And the first one that's popping into my head,uh, I call it the trust triad of leadership.
So trust triad of leadership.
Number one, trust yourself, trust yourself, trustthe decisions that you make in the moment that you
(18:26):
make them with the information you have in the timethat you have to make that decision to be the best
that you can be, trust that decision that you made.
Number two, trust your team, trust your team to dothe job you hired them and are paying them to do.
Otherwise.
Why are you paying him?
Why are you paying that guy to build you a website?
(18:48):
If you're calling him up every 15 minutes and supervisinghim, got him on Zoom, share screen, all those sort of
things to build you a website, why are you paying him?
And oh, by the way, while you're doing his job, you'remicromanaging him or her in that position who's doing your job?
Trust your team.
Trust that, trust your team to dothe job you're paying them to do.
And when those two pieces of thetriad are in place, the the final leg.
(19:12):
Your team trusts you comes into play.
And when your team trusts you, then theybelieve that every decision that you make has
the best interests of the organization in mind.
It's not about you making more money, getting a higherIPO, uh, getting a promotion, getting a bigger bonus.
They believe that every decision that you make as aleader has the best interest of the organization in mind.
(19:38):
Trust yourself, trust your team, and your team trusts you.
That's the trust triad.
So with that in mind, keeping that in mind, youhave to start looking at how do I get better?
If I make, if I take action, if I'm anaction guy, because I'm the same way.
You know, I'm, I'm, I'm learning to take some pauses,you know, I'm trying, I'm trying somebody, somebody
(20:00):
sends me an email and I was like, damn, you canget me a hundred million in, in just six months.
, man, dang, I gotta dive into this.
I gotta talk to the, that, that's,that's exactly what I, yeah, yeah.
Right.
I mean, take action.
Boom, boom, boom, boom.
Because that's, you know, in some cases, in some points in life.
You got to live that way, but you got toask yourself, do I have a moment to pause?
(20:26):
Do I have a moment to reflect?
I'm going to share with you one otherthing I want you to think about.
And this, these 2 coincide the trust triad, but it'sthe 5 steps to building a team of continuous improvement
with a culture of success and as part of, I've takenBruce Tuckman's, uh, Form Norm Storm and I've expanded
(20:48):
it to how to make a great team in these five steps.
So for me, everybody comes togetherkind of the name tag sort of thing.
Where's your desk?
What do you do?
Where are you from?
I don't know.
What's your name?
Oh, okay.
Gotcha.
Norman.
Okay.
Oh, so that's what you do, man.
You're pretty good at that.
I'm starting to understand what you do.
I understand how I fit in.
I'm understanding the mission, whywe're all brought together, right?
(21:10):
Because there has to be a reason that we're together as a team.
So now we're all understanding our mission, how wefeed into it, what my part is, how I add value to it.
Storming.
Storming is, man, we are running at full speed.
I know what you're going to do before you do it.
I know how you're going to react.
I know how you're going to show up no matter the situation.
It's also called flow.
(21:31):
Great book, Stealing Fire Behind Me, uh, talks aboutflow, and that is where we all want to operate.
But you can't because you can't stay in that state becausethe environment and world and people change constantly
So once we've achieved floor once we've achieved thatstorming stage guess what we got to do We got a pause.
We got a step back and say what did we do?
(21:54):
Right?
We gotta assess We got a look at it andsay well Maybe we could do this better.
What do we do?
What can we build on, build on success?
What can we fix?
What are we missing?
Are we missing the capability?
Do we need more people?
Do we need less people?
Got too many people doing it.
That's when a good team starts to become a great team.
(22:16):
But this final step.
Is where greatness really happens.
And that is adapting.
I'm going to take what we've assessed, what we'veidentified, and I'm going to implement that.
I'm going to make those changes in our organization.
Like, Oh, Hey guys, if you hear me ready to go.
(22:36):
And by the way, I had a, had another entrepreneur onour, on our show a while back who had the same problem.
And then he basically told them to stop.
Whenever I throw out good ideas, just don't start it for a day.
That's what he literally told the team to do.
Wait 24 hours and I'll come back andsee that it's not the right thing.
That is the assessment stage.
(22:57):
And when we assess, now we've changed our process, ourtechnique, our procedures, our personnel, our capability,
or maybe even the mission of that organization.
And we go right back to forming.
So we go forming.
Norming, storming, assessing, and adapting.
(23:18):
And when you do that, when you take those moments, those last twomoments, that's the difference between, yeah, we're doing okay.
And man, we're fucking kicking ass.
Holy shit.
We're blowing it out of the water.
That's the differentiator in having a good team to agreat team, to a highly successful, highly performing.
(23:40):
Organization that just fucking blows it out of the water
Donnie Boivin (23:44):
now.
I like that.
I think my, my favorite portion in that was telling the teamto sit on it for 24 hours to see if it's a good technique.
I tell you what,
Otis McGregor (23:54):
I want to write that one down and implement it tomorrow.
I
Donnie Boivin (23:58):
think you're right.
I think I think my, my, my team would be appreciative of it.
You know, um, so, you know, I wasn't born in aleadership role, you know, type I, I somehow typically
find myself self selecting into a leadership position.
Um, I don't know that I've always been picked as theleader in the room, but I always found myself there.
Otis McGregor (24:23):
Um, sorry, I'm laughing because sometimes you're the guy that's still standing when everybody took a step back.
Yeah, that's true.
That's
Donnie Boivin (24:30):
true.
Right.
Yep.
Yep.
So the, the, the, the trick for me is I've never had tolead people hardly yet throughout my life, not in a, a.
Direct report type of way.
You know, I've always been a sales guy.
I've always, you know, I've led some sales teams that did a lotof sales training, but this is really my first stunt and role
(24:56):
of being a true leader in a leadership role, CEO of a company.
And, you know, there's a lot of thingsI have no idea what the hell I'm doing.
Just kind of figuring it out as I go along.
Um, that's been my MO for life is just, let's bang my headagainst the wall until something works, you know, so it's a
Otis McGregor (25:14):
technique.
You it's a technique.
Donnie Boivin (25:17):
Um, well for, for, for what am I 46?
I will promise you for 45 years of my life, I was uncoachable.
For some reason, had a chip on my shoulder, wasn'tgonna take advice from people, felt like I fucking knew
everything, um, and it took me having to take some good licksbefore I'm like, alright, there's gotta be a better way.
(25:39):
I still don't take advice very well.
Um, you know, uh, I don't know if it'smy upbringing or whatever else, but.
Uh, somebody telling me what to do.
That's why I've got to be very selective with peopleI talk to about business and how I get coached because
if you point me in a direction, my God, I'm going.
Um, and so I've got to trust the person to give methe direction that that's the right damn move to make.
(26:02):
So, um, I'm very, very, very cautious in that, in that realm.
Otis McGregor (26:06):
I'll make that
Donnie Boivin (26:06):
mistake.
How many stupid shit have you built in your company?
Cause somebody said, Hey, you should do this.
And then you turn around and go, what the hell was I thinking?
Um, you know, so as I continue to develop,um, as a, the CEO of the company, how do I.
(26:28):
Recently, this is a better question recently, I, you know,had an incident where I got too close to 1 of the staff and we
became buddies and there's nothing wrong with becoming buddies.
But, um.
The buddy wasn't holding up his end of the bargain, right?
And so now that person is no longer with the company.
(26:51):
So how do I navigate that?
Let's be friends.
Let's hang out.
Let's shoot the shit.
Let's well, let's get the damn work done.
Otis McGregor (27:03):
There's no, there's no line now.
I'll tell you, I learned this the hard way also.
So, I had an NCO teach me this.
I think it was, I want to say it was when I wasa squad leader, a LURSU squad leader when I was,
when I was in the Texas Army National Guard.
Donnie Boivin (27:22):
I'm sorry, the Army?
I didn't catch that.
The,
Otis McGregor (27:25):
the Texas Army National Guard.
I mean, the Lone Star Division.
That's what we were.
Pull up the patch somewhere.
It's behind.
There it is.
You got
Donnie Boivin (27:34):
a little, some shit back there.
You don't need to clean up.
Otis McGregor (27:39):
I was a LURSU, uh, Long Range Reconnaissance Surveillance guy, part of the division unit.
And, uh, one of my NCOs told me this when I became a squadleader and, Looking back on it, it was really bad advice.
It was, he said, don't get personal with any of your soldiersbecause you're going to have to send them to die and that will
(28:01):
influence your decision to not, to send them on a mission.
And, and, and I carried that with me into my first,first assignment as a lieutenant, uh, platoon leader.
Uh, and, It was really awkward, and I would, whenguys would start talking about family and this,
that, and the other, I'd kind of separate myselfout of the conversation and all that sort of stuff.
(28:24):
And what I realized when I became a Green Beret,because the culture is so much different in an
operational detachment alpha and ODA, those 12men, uh, I had to know what their life was like.
I had to know what kind of family they had,and I had to know what was going on at home,
(28:45):
because it affects their performance every day.
Because there is no work, life, and life.
It is all life.
Integrated.
I 100 percent agree.
So, back to your question about Can I befriendly with a partner, a subordinate?
(29:06):
Yeah, but you also have to, you have to put your big boy pantson when the time comes and say, Hey, fellas, which I did many
times as a green beret in charge of guys out doing operationsand the fuck off start stuff would start and be like, That's it.
Stop.
(29:26):
And we went right back to, you know what?
I mean, it almost felt like, you know, mom and dad sort of thing.
We had a couple of incidents one time where, where my teamsergeant and I had to play mom and dad and ground, you
know, ground a couple of guys for some shit they got into.
Right.
Um, but the point of this is, isyou have to understand your team.
(29:50):
You have to know what's making themtick back to that storming stage.
And understanding who they are, why they are,why they're there, what are they doing there?
What's their purpose?
How does that align with your vision of the organization?
Do they see themselves with your vision?
We can come back to that in a minute, too.
Because I think that's a really key pieceto that CEO position for you, but it's.
(30:13):
It's okay to put your arm around themand say, dude, man, that fricking sucks.
Your dog died.
God, man, I remember my dog, man.
I hate that, man.
We went through some really tough.
Do you need to take some time off?
Mission First reminds me of one of my key leadership tenets.
Mission First people always.
If I'm not taking care of my people,I got to know who my people are.
(30:36):
They aren't just that guy that's there foreight hours a day, Monday through Friday.
There's a whole lot more of life going on.
Remember when we talked about your past, everythingyou've done, seen, been, experienced, and felt, and
tasted up until this very moment is who you are.
That's part of them, and knowing that their dog died,or they're going through a divorce, or their kid's
(30:57):
sick, or, or maybe some bills got mixed up, or whatever.
That affects their performance.
And you got to be able to see that and know that.
And then as their leader, if they are not performingtwo expectations, you got to ask yourself, number
one, did I tell them what I expect of them?
(31:22):
Number two, did I provide them all the resourcesand training they needed to be successful?
And if I answer positive on both of those, being truly authentic.
To myself and not BS in myself, then the third question comes in,are they incapable of performing this job that I've put them in?
(31:45):
Then, then it's time to say, all right, you need to gobecause I've, I've told you what, what you need to do.
I've given you all the resources and all the trainingand you've confirmed and we've walked back through it.
You know, the, the old, uh, 90 dayimprovement plan and all those sort of things.
(32:06):
We've done all that and you're still not performing.
Then I tell you what, that you arenot a good fit for our organization.
I am going to help you find a betterorganization for you to fit into.
That's leadership.
It's tough, but that's the conversation you got to have.
No fun having it, you know, because it's not all happy go lucky.
(32:27):
You know, yeah, rainbows, man, I'm giving you a bonus.
I love to do that.
Remember, you know, giving you a, writing that bonus check.
There's nothing better than that as a leader in business, right?
Giving somebody a promotion.
Giving them an award, recognizing them infront of everybody, that's, that's great.
But you know what?
A real leader still has to do the hard stuff, and that is,
(32:51):
you ain't doing, you ain't the right fit, and I'm sorry.
We're gonna, we're gonna do this right.
I'm not firing you today.
I'm gonna give you two weeks.
And we're going to, I'm going to set you up with a recruiter, aheadhunter who's a friend of mine, and I'm going to give you a
business coach or transition coach or whatever you want to callit to help you figure out what it is you should be doing because.
(33:15):
I believe in you as a human being,and you're not a piece of shit.
Now, there are some times when those people are a piece of shit.
Right.
Stealing from you, and you just gotta comeaway right away and not do anything for them?
Okay.
But generally speaking, our team,we want to take care of that person.
They're a human being, right?
A
Donnie Boivin (33:35):
hundred percent.
So we've gotten to know each other pretty damnwell, Otis, I feel like I can, I can, I can flip
the script a little bit on you at the moment.
And you're going to be like, hell yeah, let's run.
So I'm going to give you carte blancheto fucking straight up coach me.
However, you would typically coach somebody freaking come at me.
(33:59):
However, you would traditionally approach coaching a client.
No holds barred.
I'll put it on the table.
Otis McGregor (34:05):
All right.
So, uh, way I always start my calls off or whatare three wins since the last time we talked?
Uh, three wins.
Cause we always want to build on and celebrate success.
Give me three wins.
Donnie Boivin (34:14):
Yep.
For sure.
Uh, one, we brought Julie into company when we hadto let a person go and she is stepping up, uh, and
getting ramped up and give me somewhat peace of mind.
Uh, I'm heading out this weekend to go to a Renaissance festival.
It's one of my favorite things in the world to do.
So this is just a chance to get thefuck away with the wife and friends.
(34:35):
Um, the third one, I think we're finallyat the tipping point, um, of the company.
You know, it really feels like, um, we.
We got one more piece of the puzzle we got to figure out, man.
We figured that piece out and we are heading off to some really,really nice places, but so, uh, those are probably the three
Otis McGregor (34:54):
biggest.
Awesome.
Awesome.
Those are awesome, man.
I'm excited for you.
And I'm, I'm envisioning you eating that big ass turkey leg.
This
Donnie Boivin (35:02):
is what it
Otis McGregor (35:04):
is.
And that's what everybody associates withassociates with the Renaissance fair.
All right.
What's a block or an obstacle?
Something that in your head is said to you.
Nah, here's a, there's a great example.
I don't want to call that guybecause, you know, he's really busy.
When I want to talk to him about,isn't that important or, you know,
Donnie Boivin (35:25):
mind really easy.
So, um, because of the recent scenario inside thecompany, I'm having to do a lot of additional work,
um, and a bunch of stuff that I didn't learn before.
Um, you know, I put trust and an employee.
Gave them ownership over it and I never checked it, right?
Which is 100 percent my bad.
(35:46):
Right?
So, um, now I think I'm finally starting to get tothat place where I don't want to give it up again.
And it's, it's, you know.
Because I'm worried, will I understandit enough to be able to make the move?
So now I'm completely overwhelming myself with allthe things that I'm doing and get myself back to the
(36:10):
point where there's just not enough hours in the day.
Otis McGregor (36:14):
Yeah.
Uh, I usually ask, well, what would you like to focus on today?
But I think that's what you want to focus on today.
And here's what I, here's what I take is Ihave another client doing the exact same thing.
They're about, they're about, uh, probably about60 days ahead of you, interestingly enough.
All right.
And exact, he's the CEO, exact same situation.
(36:38):
And yes, sometimes you got to rollup the sleeves and dive back in.
Right.
I always talk about, Hey, if there's ahole that needs to be dug, guess what?
I got to grab a shovel to get that hole dug.
But what you got to understand as the leader is how do I.
Keep myself from being stuck in that hole, keep myselffrom being the guy that's still digging down, because you
(37:00):
know what, as the leader, you have to be looking for whatother holes need to be dug, what other buildings need to be
built, and if you're head down in the business, working inthe business, remember that old saying, working in, not on?
You've got to have, as soon as you diveinto that crisis mode, 100%, got to do it.
Crisis mode.
But as soon as you step into crisis mode, you got to bethinking about how do I extract myself, extract myself out?
(37:24):
So what's your plan to extract yourself out?
Of being in the business, doing the day to day operations is notdoing what a CEO should do, which is what upper out up and out.
Sorry,
Donnie Boivin (37:38):
upper out.
Um, yeah, the, the interesting place for, for me is.
There's a financial gap that has to be reachedto be able to extract myself from some of this.
So, um, and there's some things that have to be done.
So there's, there's a slight roadmap, not a, not a great one.
(38:01):
Um, the slight roadmap is we're going tobe rebuilding the entire backend company.
You know, everything stays functioning running forward.
So, but I'll be in the mess of it untilthat gets rebuilt and put together.
We don't know yet.
That's part of the struggle.
Um, because of, we don't understandhow long the build is going to take.
(38:25):
Um, because we literally had to start from scratch.
Otis McGregor (38:29):
All right.
What I, what I would throw at you tothink about is, well, what's the outcome?
What's the outcome look like?
What are the, what are the key?
Go ahead.
Go ahead.
Tell me.
Donnie Boivin (38:40):
Yeah, no.
So, so where I need to get to is I need to have 2 fulltime staff sitting on that program monitoring that program.
I needed a full time staff sitting on, uh,our internal, um, membership program as well.
Okay.
Um, and I need to figure out how to get more crap off my plateso I can go be the face of the damn company where I need to be.
(39:07):
Um, but there's a revenue gap tobackfill all those, those positions.
Mm hmm.
Otis McGregor (39:13):
So that's not an outcome.
Those are all action steps.
Oh, you're right.
You're right.
What is the outcome you want to achieve?
Donnie Boivin (39:23):
Say it a different
Otis McGregor (39:24):
way.
Um.
What's the vision?
When you get back to, when you get to this, this point.
Donnie Boivin (39:32):
Fair, fair.
So I want to have the chapters going all across North America.
Stay focused there so that I'm flying inand doing in person events and the likes.
That's what we're trying to get to because one thing thatwe found is the groups do amazingly well on their own.
But when I come into a territory, it really lights up.
Otis McGregor (39:55):
That's typical because you are the power and the personality of the organization.
Right?
Yep.
So you, you've come really close, but I want to take a step back.
And what I challenge you to do is one of my favorite toolsto help guys see where to go is create the ideal day.
(40:21):
Now, that's not something we can do right thisminute because it takes some time, but I'm
going to explain to you what the ideal day is.
And oh, by the way, It's not an arbitrary ideal day.
We're recording this on the 25th of October, 2028.
And I want you to write down on your pieceof paper, ideal day, 25 October, 2028.
(40:43):
I think I said that I messed up.
Today is 2023.
Uh, I want you to think the morning of October 25th,2028, you wake up in the morning and already you're
feeling like, damn, my back feels pretty good today.
Why is my back feel good?
And you go throughout the day andeverything just kind of happens.
(41:05):
You got to drive into town.
And as you're driving into town, youkeep hitting all the green lights.
It's like, man, this is freaking pretty good.
You know what?
They give you an extra, extra squirt of whipped creamon your fancy latte as you go by the Starbucks or the
local, hopefully the local coffee place and get it.
Right.
Right.
Just, just these little things justkind of happen throughout the day.
(41:27):
And, and at the end of the day, when you put your headdown on your pillow next to your wife, you think to
yourself, holy shit, this was a Fucking great day.
Not a perfect day.
I didn't say perfect.
I said ideal.
Because what we're going to do is we're going to set this up.
We're going to create the feeling, the taste,the vision for what this day looks like.
(41:53):
And the devil is in the details.
If you set your alarm at 5 30 and you wake up at 5 29.
That's part of it.
Do I wake up before my alarm or do I wake up to my alarm?
When I get up out of bed, do I take a piss?
Do I brush my teeth?
Do I go outside and have a cigarette?
What's the first thing that I do?
(42:14):
If I go to the gym, I go for a run.
What's the drive like?
Driving to the gym.
What's the workout like if I'm working out in my basement?
What's the run like?
Am I running on a golf course, a trail,uh, in the woods, out in the prairie?
All these sort of things.
We're creating this picture.
In our mind, and this picture in our mind is thesecret to the success of the ideal day because it is.
(42:40):
We're, we're creating this image, andI call this the red truck syndrome.
Red truck syndrome is, I never saw a red pickup truckuntil the day I decided I wanted to buy a red F 150.
And when I decided I wanted to buy a red F 150, guess what?
I saw it at every freaking intersection.
A red pickup truck.
I go to Walmart, there's three of them in the parking lot.
(43:01):
I go across the street to the Home Depot,there's four more in the Home Depot parking lot.
And I'm like, where the hell did they all come from?
Was there a run on red pickup trucks last night?
No.
It was not important information last nightuntil the moment I decided this is what I want.
And when I decide this is what I want, thefilters in my mind change and start to look
(43:22):
to fulfill what I need, what I say I want.
This is survival instinct.
I'm a hunter.
And you know what?
I can see things that most peoplecan't see because when I'm out hunting.
My mind is attuned to that elk, that deer, that antelope.
I can see the shape.
I can see the patterns and pick it out because my mind, I'vetold my mind that vision, that image is important to me.
(43:46):
The same thing happens with the ideal day.
That's why the details are so important becausewe're creating this image in our mind to pursue.
And that image becomes your vision and your vision whenwe have a vision, because we're going to take the details.
We're, we're reverse engineering this, right?
What does everybody always say?
Create this vision and then we dribble it down.
(44:07):
That's too hard.
That's all this, this wazoo stuff, right?
I mean, how many years have I been doing strategy?
That's.
We'll start off with strategy.
I'm telling you, start off with what you want a dayin your life to look like ideally in five years, and
you're going to take that and that becomes your vision.
(44:28):
And when we have a vision, then wecan set our goals, our objectives.
Our tasks, our action steps.
What the hell are you doing this afternoon tomove you one step closer to that ideal day?
And, oh, by the way, like we said earlier, it's all life.
So there ought to be something in therethat's generating revenue for you.
(44:50):
Or maybe, maybe that ideal day for you is a day fishing, aday hunting, a day on the ski slopes, a day on the beach.
If that's the ideal day for you, unrestricted,realistic, ideal day, remember those two words,
unrestricted and realistic, how do you get there?
(45:14):
How do you get to that point in life whereyou can take a full day off and surf?
where you can take a full day off and hunt.
How do you get there?
What are the things that you need to do?
What do you need to do with your business?
What do you need to do with your life?
Where do you need to live?
Who do you need to be?
All these things start to come out of thatideal day, and it's a powerful tool to use.
(45:38):
And guess what?
Now that I know what my day looks like.
Which revolves around my business.
I can create a vision for my business.
And when I create a vision, a five year vision for my business,then I could put together a five year plan for my business.
And you said you're a salesman.
Guess what?
Guess what part of leadership is a key element ofleadership is selling your vision to your team.
(46:03):
If your team does not see themselves.
In your five year vision, they'renot going to be there in five years.
They're not going to perform likethey want to be there in five years.
If they don't see who they are, if their vision, their personalindividual vision does not align with the vision that you set for
(46:23):
your team, your business, you're doing a couple of things wrong.
You've got the wrong person and you're not explaining to them.
You're not telling them how you see them fitting in.
And there may be, there may be a division there.
That's okay.
Right.
That may be that that's time for, you know, in 18 months,they need to step away because they're not going to be
(46:47):
here in five years because they don't see themselves infive years, whatever that reason may be, they may retire.
May want to stay on with kids.
May want to change careers.
That's okay.
But this is what you do as a leader.
You set that vision, especially a CEO, particularly aCEO, you set the vision for your organization and you
sell it to your team and your team has to have that buyin and when they get that buy in and they see themselves
(47:12):
in that, look out man, you're going to hit storming.
You're going to be hitting storming more and more.
Donnie Boivin (47:20):
I think we're, so what I haven't done is, is done the ideal day.
I've got the company vision and I havethe, the, the team's buy in there.
Um, we know what it's going to taketo get to the level we want to.
Um, we don't have a hundred percent the path of that's okay.
That's what we're figuring out now.
(47:40):
Um, We feel like we're at the tip and point to get there.
So, so when I started the company, um, I really set out tochange how the world networks, especially in a B2B game, because
beyond we've all been some really shitty networking where yougot people trying to sell you their lotions and potions crap.
So that was
Otis McGregor (48:01):
that one this weekend,
Donnie Boivin (48:03):
right?
Um, so, so that was the first vision is let's get there.
That which then created a secondary vision of how do wehelp as many people get to freedom through building a
business and that means they can be a selling for somebody.
That means it can be running a business.
Didn't matter.
How can help them buy them freedom?
So, we know to get them there, we've got to teachthem a different level of networking, right?
(48:27):
And we're getting that done.
Right.
And we're coming up with new models and new frameworksand the people, I mean, we're getting stories already of
like Nicole Bernardo, we've tripled her company in sixmonths because she's doing things just a different way.
You know, and we're getting these a lotof cool stories and things like that.
So I've got the, the company vision done.
(48:49):
What I haven't done to what you were justwalking through is design the ideal day.
I've got it.
I've got a generalized idea of whatthat ideal day would look like.
You know, I know I want to woke up, wake up on afreaking and, you know, wildlife retreat ranch.
It's ours with nothing that can eat us.
Uh, you know.
(49:10):
Um, I want the animals, but I don't wantto have to take care of the animals.
That's somebody else's role and responsibility.
Right.
You know, uh, but we know that we wantto create a big, huge, huge sanctuary.
And the only way I can do that is to serve as manypeople as I possibly can in this aspect of networking.
Right.
So got that revenue side dialed in.
I need to work further and more on creating out that ideal day.
(49:35):
And one
Otis McGregor (49:35):
more thing at you, come on, understand yours.
Start to understand the concept.
When you're, it sounds like you'regetting there, start playing with it.
Then teach this to your wife.
Have her go to her other end, go to the other end of the house.
Create her ideal day.
And y'all come back together wherever you do your familymeetings at the kitchen table or whatever over a glass
(49:56):
of whiskey, glass of wine, glass of milk, don't matter.
And compare.
That's,
Donnie Boivin (50:03):
that's teamwork.
I know.
I, we, I know we're both aligned on the animal park.
What's on that animal park is where we're, we are misaligned.
She wants to do an old dog retreat.
Um, and I don't wanna watch that many old dogs die, so
. Otis McGregor: Ooh, that would be
tough.
That's when we not alive.
Damn.
That would be tough.
I'm like, can we just go get all the crazyother critters and just take care of them?
(50:25):
Uh, that, that's, that's the place that I wanna be.
So, um, but that'll be fun.
Dude, thanks for this.
That's, that's a fun project and a funexercise that I'll spend some time with.
Otis McGregor (50:37):
Yeah, have fun with it, man.
I mean, I, I, it's one of my favorite things toteach people because it is, it's so powerful.
It's so simple, but so powerful inhelping guide who you want to be.
I mean, it define, helps you define your success.
Donnie Boivin (50:52):
Well, and you know, I hate the concept of what I'm so annoyed with the phrase.
I can't even think of what it is right now.
Um, like you visualize yourself as successful and you be manifest
Otis McGregor (51:07):
yourself.
Donnie Boivin (51:08):
I fucking hate that shit.
Otis McGregor (51:12):
My son asked me that one time.
Hey dad, do you manifest killing a deer?
Oh yeah, yeah.
I'm, I'm, I'm manifesting.
I'm, I'm, I'm sitting here in the woods, squatting, manifestingreally hard for that buck, that big buck to walk up.
I
Donnie Boivin (51:24):
can remember in my twenties, I was into the self help game really big.
And I was all into this, you know, you can manifest your destiny.
And my buddy, who's about six foot six, you know,400 pounds walks up to me and goes, look, I can
manifest all I want that I'm going to be a jockey.
It ain't ever going to fucking happen.
Otis McGregor (51:45):
And that's why, that's why I said in the ideal day when you plan it, unrestricted, realistic.
Yeah,
Donnie Boivin (51:52):
yeah, yeah.
No, I like, I mean, even thinking about the ranch, becauseI don't think about that enough as we want to do that.
Right.
It puts a different energy into the thoughtprocess because it's something we really want to
Otis McGregor (52:03):
do.
I mean, I did that a couple ofyears ago when we bought our ranch.
Uh, I said, I started to visualize the type of, uh, area Iwanted and the parameters and, and all of a sudden things just
started to jump off the page, you know, looking on Zillow inparticular, and they would just, it would like leap off the page.
(52:24):
It's like, bam, that's it.
That's awesome.
I mean, that was, that's what it took was I wanted to.
I wanted to understand where I wanted to be with thatland and what I wanted to do, what it, what it felt like.
I mean, people would ask me, well, whatare you, what are you going to do with it?
I said, well, the hell I want to do.
Right.
Right.
And if I want to ride around and I'll sharethis publicly, I'm going to do it for you.
(52:48):
If I want to ride around in my four wheeler, naked, witha bottle of whiskey in one hand and my AR 15 in another,
shooting and running, that's what I'm going to do on my lane.
So be it.
Because if it's mine, I do what the hell I want to.
Absolutely.
Right?
Absolutely.
I hate to that you have that visualization right now.
I'm sorry.
I want to kind
Donnie Boivin (53:07):
of burn my eyes out at the moment, but
well, well, Otis, this was a blast, my friend.
I appreciate you coming on here and, andhanging out with me for a little while.
How do people find you?
How do they get in touch with you?
How do we blow up the Otis and Cam show, which isby the way, is a cool show with you and your boy.
Otis McGregor (53:27):
Thank you.
Thank you.
Yeah.
It's a, it's a, we have a lot of fun.
So I'll start with that one first.
The, the Cam and Otis show.
You can follow us on YouTube.
Just, just go to YouTube, the Cam and Otis show, hit subscribe.
Uh, we post two shows a week.
We've got some great guests.
Someday Donnie will be on our show when we can.
I
Donnie Boivin (53:44):
will apologize that I missed two damn interview appointments with these guys.
I don't know how the hell I did it, but I've done it.
So
Otis McGregor (53:55):
we'll get you out there, man.
And, and I'll, I'll just always remind you.
I'm sure that's number one, number two.
Uh, sign up via my website, our website, tribe purpose.com.
Sign up for my Monday Moments newsletter.
That is a great, it is, it is my passion project.
Every week I publish this newsletter withthe lessons I learned from the previous week.
(54:20):
So this week to help you kick off yourweek on Monday morning, Monday moments.
Right.
And so you got a lesson learned, you got a stoicquote, you got some business ideas in there.
You never know, there might be something that youwant to latch on to and build your business on.
And it's just, it's, it's something I just reallyenjoy sharing because I'm sharing what I've learned.
(54:45):
With others so that they can have more success because I'm,I'm a firm believer and you'll love this, Donnie is, is the
fact that if I'm not sharing what I've learned with others, sothey can have more success, I'm being a selfish son of a bitch.
So that's what Monday moments doesfor me each and every week, man.
I I've been doing it for four years now.
Every Monday, that gets published, no matter whether I'mhunting, fishing, sitting on the beach, or maybe riding my ATV.
(55:13):
There
Donnie Boivin (55:13):
you go.
I like it.
I like it.
Well, folks, if you guys stuck aroundwith us this long, do me a favor.
Take a screenshot of Otis and Can Otis and Donny sitting here.
Jesus, I can't talk.
If you've been sitting around this long, take a screenshotof me and Otis sitting here, wherever you're listening to us.
Put that out on social media.
Tag us in there.
I promise you I will swing in and come say hello if I see it.
(55:35):
Take a screenshot.
Otherwise, I love you.
I mean it.
See you.
Bye.
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