November 2, 2023 • 53 mins
Donnie Boivin sits down with Mickie Kennedy, the founder of eReleases, to delve deep into the transformative power of press releases for businesses. They discuss how a well-crafted press release can not only shape a company's image but also act as a pivotal tool in attracting and retaining customers. Mickie shares invaluable insights on leveraging media coverage, the importance of consistency in press release campaigns, and the art of building trust with potential customers through a history of media mentions. The duo also touches upon the challenges of measuring the ROI of press releases and the significance of engaging with local media. As a bonus, Mickie offers a sneak peek into eReleases' free masterclass, a resource designed to guide businesses in crafting impactful press releases. Whether you're a startup looking to make a mark or an established business aiming to boost sales, this episode is packed with strategies and tips to harness the potential of press releases effectively. Dive in to discover how you can grow your business and increase sales with the power of the written word!
https://www.ereleases.com
Links
- Website - https://successchampionnetworking.com/
- YouTube Video - https://www.youtube.com/c/GrowthMode
- Blog - https://successchampionnetworking.com/blog/
- Facebook Group https://www.facebook.com/groups/SuccessChampion
Mentioned in this episode:
Success Champions Networking
If you want to grow and scale your business you need to be getting into great conversations with other business owners that can help you take your business to the next level. Joining an online business peer group like Success Champions provides access to a select pool of successful business people from around the world, each having a well-established network who trust them, who want to introduce you to people that can help you build the business of your dreams. So once you get to know your fellow members and they’ve gotten to know you along with your services and ethics, the conversations you get into will multiply!
Success Champion Networking
Success Champion Networking isn't for the beginning networker. Success Champion Networking is for business people that understand building successful relationships is a two-way street requiring commitment from both people involved. Stop wasting time networking with people that don't understand how to leverage their network to generate quality referrals for you. If you are ready to network with business people that are tired of doing all the heavy lifting and want to build real partnerships that generate high-revenue referrals visit one of our Chapters today. https://successchampionnetworking.com/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Mickie Kennedy (00:00):
if everybody in your industry is joining the conversation with something that's trending in your industry,
(00:05):
saying the same thing, be the person who says the exact opposite
Donnie Boivin (00:10):
You've got to get around people that are doing the shit you want to be doing.
On the level and volume of what you want to be doing.
Go in and be the damn student.
I could learn every person in this room.
Think about how you talk about your business.
(00:31):
Yes, passion sells.
But you can't carry on a real conversation outside the passion.
You're gonna lose.
You're gonna lose.
So the whole point of all of this,is one, show up as you, fucking loud.
Two, get yourself in frickin roomsthat scare the shit out of you.
(00:53):
It's really about looking at those things that you knowwill move the business forward, and doing them anyways.
Thank you for allowing me to always show upas me, and thank you for showing up as you.
All right, Mickey, uh, running a smallbusiness, having clients all over North America.
(01:18):
You know, the biggest thing that we've beenfocusing on is word of mouth marketing, right?
That's been the number one thing that's grown our business.
Everybody knows it's powerful as hell, but we were seriouslycontemplating getting into the PR game and looking at getting
some publicity and some awareness around what we're doing.
Um, if I'm a small business owner, Youknow, where do I start when it comes to PR?
(01:40):
Is it focusing on my unique selling proposition or isit just writing something and hoping it gets picked
Mickie Kennedy (01:46):
up?
Right.
So with PR, you're looking to do a PR campaign.
So you have six to eight press releases,six to eight opportunities to, uh.
Engage with the media and have at least one ofthem work, uh, the types of releases, uh, yeah,
you can focus on your unique selling proposition.
What it is that you do that's different than everybody else.
(02:08):
Uh, what makes you the kick ass business that you areagainst all the other businesses out there in your space?
Um, You know, it could be sharing your story, uh, you know, thepeople that appear on shark tank often open with how, you know,
their, their journey to build this business or that product.
And the reason for that is people relate to that.
(02:29):
So, you know, don't discount the human interest elementof storytelling and journalists do like storytelling.
And so make sure that anything that you areannouncing has the elements of the story.
Um.
You know, a lot of people do a product launch, apress release, and they just say, here's our product.
Here's a list of features.
Here's a buy button.
(02:50):
And that really is missing the storytelling, uh, elements.
So to beef that up, I would suggest that you add a usecase study, someone who used this product or service,
what their experience was, you know, what, what.
What was solved with this product, as well as get aquote from them about, you know, their experience.
And that gives the journalists a lot more elements to builda story and be able to create the types of articles that
(03:14):
they like to create and, uh, you know, you, you don't always,uh, write a press release thinking that mind, but you really
should, you know, almost reverse engineer, what is a journalistlooking for and how can I put those elements in, in a press
release so that they'll want to share that with their audience.
So what I mean,
Donnie Boivin (03:34):
what are they looking for?
When I think about journalists, right?
I think about news and right.
I hate the news.
I hate everything about the news.
Right.
And, and, you know, it's unfortunate that you do at some pointand company got to get exposure by being on those platforms.
So you're right between the murder, the death, the rape and the.
(03:54):
You know, freaking riots and then you pop in, right?
You know, um, so, so that's always a struggle.
So, I mean, what the hell are they actuallylooking for that would make it got, you know, cool.
I've got a cool story of being a blue collar kid that, youknow, turn around and build my companies to the level they are.
I mean, I've got that story, but so do a hundredthousand other people have that same story.
(04:18):
What are they looking for?
What story am I going to pull that grabs
Mickie Kennedy (04:21):
them?
I think that, uh, you're just looking for somethingthat's uniquely your story and sort of defines
you as, as different in the, in the space.
Um, you know, if, if it is that you're providing a servicelike many other, Are are providing the similar service.
What is it that's different about you?
You know, what is unique?
(04:42):
Sometimes if you feel like I don't really have anythingthat I'm newsworthy, you know, going on in my business,
you can sort of just manufacture the news become the news.
And a lot of people.
Really tell me what do you mean by manufacture?
Do a survey or study within your industry and send that out withyour thoughts as to why the survey had the results that it did?
(05:04):
Um, I'd like to do a survey of 16 questions.
The press release will probably focuson 2 or 3 of the biggest aha moments.
What were the biggest surprises?
Um, you want to ask questions that arereally relevant and timely right now.
So what's going on in your industry that's different thanit was three years ago, or, you know, even six months ago,
um, you know, are you having, you know, staffing issues?
(05:26):
Uh, you know, maybe having everybody'shaving staffing issues right now, right?
You know, the culture is changing andpeople are wanting to work differently.
They want to work from home.
They don't want necessarily.
To invest in a culture in the office.
And so it makes it very challenging,but you can ask questions about that.
Um, you can also ask questions if you, you know, notice thatyou're tightening the belt when it comes to marketing in
(05:47):
the next couple of quarters, ask, you know, are you spendingmore or less than the next quarter or two on your marketing
budget, those are all really good indicators that can sortof show things that are happening within your industry.
And.
You know, you, you then take the two or three questionsout of that 16 question survey and, uh, you know, pick
(06:08):
the ones that were the, you know, the ones you feel likeyou're gonna get the most mileage out of, or the journalists
are going to find the most interesting and put them in apress release and talk about them, have a quote by you.
You know, analyzing why you felt the results turned out that way.
You're now the expert and you'repositioning yourself as an expert.
And I know that that can be challenging a lot.
(06:29):
Cause a lot of small businesses feel like I'm notimportant enough to send out a press release or matter.
Donnie Boivin (06:35):
I'm more curious.
I mean, cause I, I, I agree with you.
There's a lot of people are going to struggle with.
Being seen as the expert, you know, they're in their head.
They're like, I'm just a small business owner type thing, but I'mmore fascinated right now at the, at the thought of, excuse me,
I'm going to put a survey together, um, that asked my customers,you know, what's their marketing spend going to be coming up?
(06:58):
Are they holding back or what are theydoing about hiring or things like that?
How does me commenting on that?
Put me in a position of authority that they'dwant to either interview me or run that, that
Mickie Kennedy (07:11):
article.
I think that, um, it's the, the journalist isasking the question, are these questions ones that
my audience would want to know the answers to?
And so it's a, it's about asking the right questions andit really doesn't matter necessarily who's sending it out.
It's were really cool questions asked.
(07:32):
And did you get some, you know.
Really interesting responses and provide some analysisas to why you feel they, they responded that way.
Um, I, I've had this work with a local auto repairshop in Pennsylvania, who sent out a survey, uh,
to other independent repair shops across the U Sand they just did not believe that it would work.
(07:54):
And they got picked up in over 10,uh, automotive trade publications.
What were they asking though?
Okay, so with them, I always recommend that in the 16questions you ask, um, I recommend using like survey monkey.
We have four pages, four questions per page.
So someone stops halfway.
You've still got half the responses andyou've asked the most important questions.
(08:15):
So you've got their responses on the last page.
Spends a little time asking, uh, leftfield questions, weird questions.
And the one that we asked and the one that the press releaseended up being about was what's the strangest thing a customer
left in their car while being repaired and it was open field.
So there was no statistical relevance to any of the responses.
(08:37):
And we just put a roundup of what wefelt like were the 50 most interesting.
Uh, responses on the website, and we also put thequestions and answers for all of the survey on that page.
It was a resource page that we had built for it.
And then in the press release, we mentioned, Ithink, the top 20 or top 25 of those responses.
(08:58):
And that was what went viral, you know,the automotive industry really loved it.
Um, you know, this auto repair shop feltlike, you know, who are we to be doing this?
And I'm just like, you're the person whojust put it together and, and sent it out.
And as a result, they got links back to them.
They got mentioned in all of these places.
And
Donnie Boivin (09:17):
that's the ROI is, is the backlinks, the, the things is that.
Is it an SEO play then?
Mickie Kennedy (09:26):
Is it for them?
It was because they had a domain nametied to the yellow pages that went dark.
And so they had a new domain name and an SEO person said,you know, if you can get authority links, especially
within your industry, That would go really far.
And it did.
I mean, within 90 days, they were ranking topone result in their area for auto repairs.
(09:49):
And, you know, one of the pushbacks we get from peopledoing a survey is I don't know who to send it to.
I don't have an audience big enough.
Um, like maybe it's not your customer base, butmaybe it's, you know, other people, competitors
in your industry that you're trying to reach.
And in their case, all they did was, uh.
Partner with a small, I think it was an independentrepair shop association, and there's lots of independent
(10:11):
and small trade associations that have members.
Generally, I like to have people have membersof say, you know, 500 to 1000 or more members.
It's a really good, you know, sample pool.
Um, you really are looking to try to get 150 or more responses.
Um, but I've seen people work withless statistically relevant and 150.
(10:32):
I mean, it's enough for journalists to be interested in a story.
Um, it seems, it seems to be, um,less than that, you know, it's, it's.
It's a little bit more like you're curatingor shaping the results as a result of that.
So, um, it, it can work.
And I, you know, and what I recommend whenyou reach out to a smaller independent trade
(10:53):
association and say, hey, I'm doing the survey.
Here's the link.
I'd love it.
If you can send this out to your members,I'll mention you in the press release.
I'll be issuing over the wire.
Most of the small independent trade associationssee this as a huge win win and they'll often do it.
I've had a couple push back andsay, could we co brand the survey?
And I don't feel a big loss of anything by doing that.
(11:13):
It just gives more legitimacy to you.
Um, but you know, they're, they're really great partners.
The large trade associations aren'tinterested in working with people like this.
They like to control everything and they'regoing to be harder to try to navigate.
Trying to get something like this, a surveydone, but it's something that anyone can do.
And if you feel like you're just not newsworthy or don't matterto the media, it's one of the ways in which you can sort of, you
(11:38):
know, I, I've created this, the survey, I've got these numbers.
I own this data.
It's mine.
And if you, you know, uh, want to share it with your members oryour audience as a journalist, uh, you know, here, here I am.
And here's some quotes by me.
And, you know, that's another really greatway to stand out is have amazing quotes.
(11:58):
Uh, so many people write quotes for the media as an afterthought,and what they don't realize is that a journalist can build
an entire story around an amazing quote, and you want to saysomething that can't be easily paraphrased or generalized.
Uh, you want it to say something that they're going tohave to include you because I've had people, uh, do.
(12:20):
Press releases, they have a quote in it, and thenthe story runs and the company's not even mentioned
in the, in the actual article that they inspired.
And it's not because that journalist was trying tocut them out of the story, but they mentioned them
in there usually through a quote and the managingeditor saw it and said, this is a weak quote.
Why bother having it in here, cross them out andnot even realize that they inspired the story with
(12:44):
their press release and now they're not even in it.
So that that's 1 of the things that can happen.
So having an amazing quote, working with data, and sometimesit doesn't have to be your data through a survey or study.
If you're just put data together, that's publicly availablein an interesting way, it can really sort of go far as
to elevating the newsworthiness of your press release.
(13:05):
So if you have a product launch.
You know, maybe talk about a certain percentage of people in yourindustry are facing the same challenge or a similar challenge.
And, you know, those kinds of numbers can really makeit, you know, more of a stronghold for journalists
to cling to when they're writing an article.
Man,
Donnie Boivin (13:23):
there's a lot of things to unpack in there.
Um, the first one, so as I'm thinking through, I've gotall these ideas around press releases we should attempt to
do, you know, but I'm thinking, God, what's in the survey?
What questions am I asking?
You know, then I'm, I'm, I'm going to, well,how do I know it's this powerful damn quote?
Uh, what's the mechanics behind that?
(13:44):
So what, let's start with, you know, what questions arewe asking in the survey, uh, itself is it, so just to
help you a little bit, I run B2B business to businessnetworking groups, um, all throughout North America.
So we bring, you know, service based business ownerstogether and teach them to collaborate and open doors
(14:06):
through introductions to the right rooms, the rightpeople, the right opportunities, that type of thing.
So I've got a collective community.
Uh, of size, what, what survey would I put asurvey out to them when I put a survey out to my
customers or when I put a survey out somewhere else?
I know there's a lot of questionskind of sure in there, but sure.
Mickie Kennedy (14:29):
I find that the surveys that attracts journalists the most.
Are the ones that are where you'retalking to people within your industry.
Um, and you know, that, that may be colleagues orpartners, or it could be competitors in the marketplace.
Generally those do the best with like tradepublications and sometimes with newspapers.
(14:51):
But you know, you can also have a survey of yourcustomers and clients and what they're facing.
And that could be interesting as well.
I find that if you're a local based business and your market islocal, getting a survey of your clients can be really good for
local media, you know, local newspapers, uh, you know, mayberadio TV, uh, as well as like, you know, if you're looking at
(15:13):
to have a business magazine or newspaper in your market as well.
Yeah.
And then what
Donnie Boivin (15:19):
questions are we asking?
I mean, is it, is it, um, Because you're not goingto, you can't make it all about your business.
Nobody's ever going to pick that up.
Right.
So am I asking them industry?
Am I asking them projections?
What am I trying
Mickie Kennedy (15:37):
to uncover?
You want to just ask questions that would interest peoplein your industry that would want to know the answer.
So, uh, you know, sometimes surveys can be very specific.
Uh, you know, one that.
What types of surveys I'm seeing that are very common, that arethematic or like AI, you know, are you using AI in your industry?
(15:58):
Uh, you know, do you feel AI is, uh, just put chat GPT next to
Donnie Boivin (16:01):
anything and it's going to run.
I
Mickie Kennedy (16:03):
mean, and you know, what people are people's thoughts about that are, uh, you know, uh, the
writers are going to have one perspective, you know,people who write for a living, the feeling that AI.
Potentially is, uh, uh, you know, going to replace themor potentially could, and then you're going to have other
people who feel like this is a tool and can assist us, um,you know, getting a feel in your industry about people's
(16:28):
perceptions about things like that could be really useful.
Um, so, but, you know, other thematicthings could be sometimes environmental.
Um, you know, if you're in an industry that's rapidly changingbecause of environmental concerns, um, like the automotive
industry is facing a lot of changes and shifts and things alongthose lines, um, you can sort of put together some, uh, questions
(16:49):
that are around that and you want to pick sort of like hotbutton items, you know, not the ones that are like, uh, you know.
Does moving to AI scare you or something like that?
But, you know, have you, you know,what are the challenges around it?
You know, what are the things that, uh,you found hard or easy to implement?
Um, I think that also asking questions that areaffecting, uh, Uh, you know, the entire nation, uh,
(17:15):
which could be like, you know, if you're heading in andin a recession or out of a recession, asking questions
that are specific to your economic health, your, as acompany, and you know, that can, uh, sort of, you know.
Get a perspective.
What's going on there?
Uh, you know, asking about, you know, spending,hiring, any of those things are really good for it.
(17:37):
It's just a matter of, you know, what if you were at aconference or a trade show that was happening today, what are
the kinds of questions you would love to just talk to someoneat the water cooler about, you know, Hey, have you noticed
that, uh, the, uh, Payables is now taking 80 to 90 days.
And it used to be, you know, net 30,you were always getting paid on time.
And so I was like, yeah, we have noticed that, you know,potentially that could be a question that you could ask.
(18:01):
So, uh, you know, talk to, uh, colleagues, uh, talk topeople within your own company, uh, talk to, uh, you know,
people in other markets and just get a feel for what arethe types of things that they would want to ask you and, you
know, what's going on with you and, you know, they could be.
You know, marketing, AI, it could, there'slots of different approaches and it's just a
(18:24):
matter of brainstorming what, what, what would.
Really be 16 interesting questions to ask and, youknow, sort of bury at the end of that questionnaire.
What are some, you know, left field questions, you know, how many
Donnie Boivin (18:37):
left field questions should I have?
Because I got to get another question to chase
Mickie Kennedy (18:40):
that.
But I'm just curious.
Sure.
I like 2 to 4, uh, you know, uh, on that lastpage, take 2 to 4 and just, just go wild.
And you can even, you know, haveit so that they're not responding.
Yes or no, or true or false or, uh, multiple choice.
But.
Yeah.
You can actually give them, uh, uh, an area to, to, to writesomething like we did with the, uh, local auto repair shop.
(19:03):
Um, but it does take a little bit more, you know,turning through the results because everybody's
response is going to be different that way.
Donnie Boivin (19:12):
So like a common interest for a lot of our prospects, LinkedIn right now, because of, uh, All the cool
things going on over there, just as a pure idea, would itmake sense for us to go potentially survey 150, 200 LinkedIn
(19:34):
experts, coaches, and the likes, or would it make more sense?
To go in a survey, you know, B to B business people inservice based businesses who are on LinkedIn and how
actively they're using it or something along those lines,which would make more sense to try and put a survey
Mickie Kennedy (19:53):
to.
I think that either one of them potentiallycould be a good survey audience.
Um, it's, I think it has to go with intent and goals.
Um, you know, is engaging with 150 individualswho are on LinkedIn, uh, going to be helpful?
Uh, to your business, getting their, their, their viewpoints,or is it going to be more strategic if you get it from
(20:18):
people who are considered linkedin experts, uh, potentially,I think the linkedin experts might be potentially more
valuable because I think that a lot of people will probably.
Want to know the answer of that populationover just the general population.
But I've seen it work really well for different audiences.
(20:39):
I do think that the benefit of, uh, you know,reaching out to LinkedIn experts in that space
is that you're kind of networking with experts.
It does give you a huge opportunity to get to know them.
They get to know you.
Uh, it's great branding.
Uh, if they go through the survey.
You know, on SurveyMonkey, there's a, you know, whenyou're done, you click submit, uh, send them to your
(21:06):
homepage or a page on your website, thanking them.
And all of a sudden, now you, you've got them on your website.
You, you know, uh, probably cookie them for remarketing.
It's just, it's just a really valuable introduction and agreat way to get them to know a little bit more about you.
Yeah.
Donnie Boivin (21:20):
And I love that because for me, networking is all about not necessarily trying to get to your end user client.
It's about getting to the people who already are workingwith your clients and getting great with them and those
linkedin experts are all working with our ideal client.
So, um, that that that would be afun exercise to try and put together.
What's a good quote, right?
(21:41):
So I'm talking to these newspapers and you're like, you gotto put together this like amazing quote that could almost
tell a story or a journalist could write a story about it.
How do you pick up a good quote?
Like that, because in my head, I'm like, Oh, I'll just gochat GPT and go, what's a good quote to give to a journalist?
You know, like 500 million other people are trying to
Mickie Kennedy (21:59):
do right now.
Sure.
I think that a really great quote is one that stands out.
Uh, it's one that if a journalist was toparaphrase that, uh, would there be a loss?
And the loss could be the certainty with which it was spoken.
Um, the precision, the power of how it was spoken.
(22:19):
It could also be the.
The, the art of the writing itself, like,was it just a beautifully said sentence?
There's a lot of different things that could go into it.
A lot to put into
Donnie Boivin (22:30):
one, one quote.
I mean, you know, uh, I need to go hire like areally expensive copywriter to come up with one
Mickie Kennedy (22:37):
sentence for me.
Right.
But a lot of quotes are just written as like.
Passive verb, uh, we feel this is a really great assetto the company launching this product and, you know,
put some active verbs in there, you know, give me an
Donnie Boivin (22:51):
example of what a good quotes, what it would sound like just so I can wrap my head around it,
Mickie Kennedy (22:56):
right?
Let's see, because I'm, you know, as I'm,
Donnie Boivin (22:59):
you know, going through, I mean, I have quotes that.
People have repeated that.
I've said, um, but I don't not done from a journalistic nature.
Mickie Kennedy (23:11):
Sure.
Let's see, I think that, like, having a quotewhere, uh, 1 person says something along the lines
of, um, you know, I, I, I feel like this product.
Uh, you know, addresses the need in the marketplace.
And, uh, I feel like it can be areally great asset to any business.
(23:33):
That's like a safe generic quote, but if you said something alongthe lines of, you know, this, this, this product, uh, addresses.
The biggest need in our marketplace, which is a lack of that.
And it's like, wow, that's very succinct.
And it immediately has something that's very identifiablewhere you've identified what, what, what it does.
(23:57):
And it almost
Donnie Boivin (23:57):
tells a story versus trying to convince or anything.
It's coming maybe from a more of a place of authority.
Mickie Kennedy (24:04):
Right.
Absolutely.
Okay.
Donnie Boivin (24:07):
All right.
It's fascinating.
I, I never thought about doing, uh, youknow, press releases in this regard.
When I think about a press release, I'mlike, Hey, we got an event coming up or we're
doing a book launch, you know, type of thing.
I, this almost feels like you're gaming thesystem a little bit and I'm, I'm good with that.
You know, um, uh, I, I like finding those little tinyloopholes sometimes or, you know, ways that you can.
(24:30):
Get around what some of the big houses and things are doing.
How much do does like case studiesplay into doing these releases?
Is it important that we have case studies go with it?
Is that just like backup reference material?
What do we do with case
Mickie Kennedy (24:45):
studies in general?
I think the case studies can be very valuable because.
They, they really can fill out that needfor a journalist who's looking for a story.
So whatever you're announcing or sending out, having a usecase or a case study can really go a long ways towards sort
of fleshing out the story within what you're announcing.
(25:08):
And I found that they can be really valuable.
Um, you know, the, you look at the product launchrelease that just says, here's our product, here's a
bullets of all of our features and here's a buy button.
It's, it's really hard for journalists to, you know,draft a compelling story there, but if you include
a case study, uh, of what someone's results were.
(25:30):
Uh, ideally getting a quote from them as well can can reallygo a long ways towards, uh, you know, fulfilling the needs
of a journalist, uh, who's who's trying to get it out there.
At the end of the day, a journalist is agatekeeper and they're trying to decide if this.
Bit of news that you have is worth sharing with their audience.
And I think that, you know, fulfilling some of those needs,uh, for, you know, an audience like human interest element,
(25:56):
uh, having another person who has a challenge and cameto your product, found your product to be very valuable.
This was the results that they had.
And here's a quote that sort of just sort of, uh, hones into.
Why your product was a perfect solutionfor them can really go a long ways.
Yeah.
(26:16):
I,
Donnie Boivin (26:18):
I just think trying to get something that a reporter is going to run, it's got to be
a somewhat of an ordeal because you know, theirass is on the line every time they run an article.
So, so if they put out something thatit flops, you know, that's their job.
Um, So there has to be some absolute,you know, strategy behind it.
Um, we don't have a whole lot of case studies.
(26:40):
We've got lots of cool testimonials, but on the case study sideof things, I can't say that we've ever gone down that route.
Um, case study in your mind is that a static setof questions you ask a client or somebody who's
used your product or services, um, and then you.
Come back and put that all together, or is itthey're, they're more finessed to it than that.
Mickie Kennedy (27:06):
I find that that can be very valuable having a set of questions that lead people through a Q
and a, to get some responses, to build out a case study.
But one of the ways that I go about it is I'll takean interesting, uh, client who had great results and I
will, you know, address it as here was the challenge.
(27:26):
This is, this was, you know, I talked to him and ask,you know, what was the challenge going into this?
And a lot of people are just like, I don't know.
And I was like, well, would you say that you werefacing, you know, how, how to market in a different way?
And we're looking at PR for that and like,yeah, you know, so you sort of get that.
And I, I sort of build a story like, you know, here was, herewas this client, uh, this was the challenge that they had.
(27:51):
Um, you know.
This was, uh, we sent it out.
This was the results and then I'll be like,Hey, you know, I often see the results.
So I was like, Hey, I noticed that you got inthe wall street journal and the New York times.
They're like, yeah, that was really great.
And then they just talk and they usually talk excitedly.
Um, they talk about what that meant for them.
(28:11):
Usually it's more customers or they got a really great leadfor a big sell or something really powerful happened from it.
And then just putting that out there as, you know, theelements of this, of the, of the case study of like, this
was, uh, what they saw, um, maybe when you got them to talk,you, you got together, uh, a potential quote that you can ask
(28:32):
them if it would be okay if you use this and, uh, Sometimesyou can massage that a little bit and say, you know, uh,
this was sort of paraphrase what you were talking about.
Are you okay with that?
And we're like, Oh yeah, yeah, that's great.
And so I think all of those go a long way.
I think that, uh, you know, if, if you can build out a way of.
(28:55):
You know, talking to your client, uh, after, you know, they've,they've worked with you for a little bit with some ready made
questions can, can go a long way, but, you know, sometimesjust talking with someone sort of debriefing after, uh, you
know, they've spent a considerable amount of money with you.
And you, you, you've seen, you know, that there's beensome results of what you've seen, uh, could potentially
(29:16):
be a good time to, to, you know, sit in with themand get their thoughts on the entire experience.
So
Donnie Boivin (29:25):
let me think through, you know, I've got a client that in six months and doing one of our
masterminds, you know, she tripled her business and, youknow, so there's a phenomenal result on the back end.
Like, how do I take her through, be able to capturethat information so that I get a killer, you
know, case study, but on the, on the back end ofthat, what value does that have for a journalist?
(29:50):
I'm just basically saying, youknow, we kick ass with our clients.
Right.
Yeah.
Why would a journalist pick that up?
Mickie Kennedy (29:57):
So I think that having a track record and sharing people's experiences and, uh, and, and,
you know, the, the, the path that they've gone through,uh, be it inspirational or vulnerable, um, is, is.
The, the, the ingredients that a journalist is looking for,um, you know, I think that as a service based business who just
(30:22):
has a good case study that in and of itself isn't going to beenough, I think, to get you over the hump of, of getting an
article, but I think that, you know, maybe it's focusing on.
Um, you know, a relaunch of your service or maybe a specific,uh, approach that you're taking with your service that's
(30:44):
novel or new, that there's a milestone that's happening alongwith that case study, uh, can, can work really well for you.
And sometimes it could be, you know, something asbenign as an anniversary, you know, we're celebrating
10 years in business and looking back, uh, at thegrowth methods that we've used, uh, to help our clients.
Uh, We've noticed that, you know, in our last six clients,uh, they all saw this result and one in particular actually
(31:13):
saw a tripling, uh, of their business as a result of this, andthen have a quote by her, you know, saying, wow, you know, you
know, tripling my business as, as, as it was, was something Ididn't think that was possible in such a short period of time
or something along those lines, and all of a sudden you cansort of see the story sort of potentially coming together.
Donnie Boivin (31:36):
Yeah, no, that's the anniversary one got me well, because we just wrapped up year four, the
badass business summit will hit year five next year.
So that's a, that's a cool twist and play on it.
You know, does this work for like local radioand the things, or is this strictly focused in
on, on press releases and articles and likes?
Mickie Kennedy (31:59):
So the thing is radio and TV.
Does pick up press releases.
They do look for stories on the wire.
And so potentially I, it can lead to that.
Um, you know, I've had clients who've got picked upon local TV or radio, uh, as well as like national
news, like good morning America and even late night TV.
(32:21):
Uh, that's, that's one in the lottery right there.
I mean, we had one client, celebraducks, which makes celebrity ducks.
Uh, they also make historical ones like Shakespeare.
In a rubber ducky form and all kinds of, you know,uh, celebrities and things along those lines.
And, uh, they, they got, uh, picked up on the late night TV show.
(32:42):
Uh, they got to come out and share some oftheir wacky creations and things like that.
That is a huge.
Milestone to have that happen because that's the equivalent
Donnie Boivin (32:52):
of a YouTube video going, you know, a hundred million views
Mickie Kennedy (32:55):
type of thing, you know, exactly.
And I, I, I deal with clients who getmedia pickup and it's, it's great.
They get a few sales from it.
And then I also get some that they get, uh, one article.
And then they get, you know, a 25million sell, uh, from that 1 article.
And so it's all over the place, what a success is.
(33:16):
Um, you know, but generally what we're looking foris getting these articles written by journalists
and, uh, potentially, you know, you know, getting.
New customers through that, but also using these linksthat you've created on these websites, uh, to put your
customers, expose them to it as well as your leads.
(33:38):
So, uh, generally, one of the things that my clientsnotice is that, um, when they get links from an
article that they got picked up in, they're like.
It looks like a third of the people that visit our websitebought, is that possible to have a conversion rate of 30, 40%?
And I'm like, it is, you know, not everybody whoread the article clicked through to visit you, but
(34:00):
the ones that did, you know, they read this article.
You know, it's, it works as an impliedendorsement, almost like a referral.
When a journalist writes about you, um, it's not like a, seeingan ad, you, you read an article, you get this warm feeling
about this company and you just want to do business with them.
You don't open a new browser and say, can I get it 15percent cheaper on Amazon or something similar to it?
(34:23):
It really is.
It creates this, this, this.
Feeling that works really well.
And if you could, you can then take that link tothat article and share it with your customers.
Customers are always going to be shopping around.
They may not shop every year, but some of them do.
And maybe this is the year that a couple were consideringreshopping, uh, who they're working with just to make
(34:44):
sure they're working with the best company, causeit's been a few years they've worked with you and.
They see that article and they're just like,I don't even have to do that this year.
This is definitely the right company that we want to, youknow, uh, to be associated with the same thing with leads.
There's always people that are on the fenceand you're going to lose some of them.
You didn't, you didn't convert them.
Uh, but getting that link in front of themand having them read that article can be.
(35:08):
Potentially just what they needed to pushthem to your side and win them as a customer.
And so, you know, all of these opportunities, share them withyour social media, uh, preserve them, put them on your website,
you know, build a, a new, a new section on your website.
We pull this great content, which canreally attract the search engines as well.
And, uh, it, it really does send a strongsignal to people that you're, you know, you
(35:33):
care about your reputation, you're out there.
You know, making a name for yourself, you're owning a littlebit of yourself in the media, uh, by, by, by getting out there.
And, you know, I, I, I always share that therewas a website my daughter sent me to and wanted
me to buy her something for her birthday.
And as soon as I saw it, I did not feelcomfortable giving them my credit card.
(35:55):
And so I.
Went around their website and found that they had a pressroom and it had like eight years worth of press releases.
So I'm like, well, there's definitely not a scam becauseno one's going to go through and create a history of
eight years worth of announcements to send something out.
So I felt a little more comfortableand I, you know, I'm in PR, so maybe.
That isn't the same feeling that everybody feels,but I do think that people look for indicators
(36:20):
of, is this someone that I want to work with?
And someone who is taking the time to, um, Announcemilestones to the media and preserving them on their
website is a really good, strong indicator that this is abusiness that cares about who they are and their identity.
Yeah, for sure.
Donnie Boivin (36:40):
Um, and I, I can't help but think this is like a long play though, because you don't know
what's going to hit is, is, should you test this?
I mean, the, do you put out one storyand be like, cool, a hit and then.
Attack on question.
How do you determine ROI from, from doing
Mickie Kennedy (37:00):
a press release?
Right.
So ROI is a little challenging because unlike with marketing,you don't really get to use tracking URLs or they're certainly
not going to be respected by journalists, uh, you know, sothat makes it a little difficult, but I think that, um, you
know, looking at your results and when you have successes.
(37:20):
What they mean to you is, is a really good indicator.
It is, it is, it links back to you or is it companymentions, um, you know, are there, uh, conversions that
you can measure that came from an external article?
Those are all really great indicatorsin which you could potentially measure.
Um, you know, sometimes it's extremely obvious, uh, when you goviral with an article, that's just really meaningful in a major.
(37:46):
Publication that it just sends you a lotof traffic and a lot of, uh, customers.
Uh, sometimes it's, it's a little bit more delicate and youjust sort of have to go with a gut feel of like, I think
that worked, but let me test it another month where I knowpredictably how much we do and see if there's a bump there.
Um, I think that.
(38:06):
Testing one press release generally never works because, youknow, when you're, when you're, when you're doing a campaign
of press releases, say six to eight press releases over aperiod, which could be a year, could be a year and a half.
And if you're really proactive, it could be like, uh, youknow, six to eight press releases in six to eight months.
Um, you're, you're, you're looking for.
(38:28):
A few, a few of these opportunities thatyou're testing to see what works it.
As you have media success, you want to see, can I do that again?
Uh, can I make it work for me?
I have one client, uh, clutch.
co that represents lots of little verticals and they do a surveyor study for each of these verticals and they do them annually.
(38:51):
And, uh, they, they ask really engaging questions.
Uh, the meet those.
Uh, industries like to know the responses and theydon't often get 8 to 14 articles for every press
release that they do and you know, that that'ssomething that they can do and just replicate over time.
And it's really just 1 idea.
It's it's the survey or study for other people.
(39:12):
You may have to mix and match and what gets success 1 time.
May not work again.
You just have to test it and see, um, I, I like to lookat, uh, other opportunities that you can do like, uh,
uh, researching your industry for blind spots or gaps.
Um, you know, what are the types of things that yourtrade publications and people in your industry don't
(39:35):
really talk about, you know, maybe when you go to aconference, it is something that you always talk about.
Uh, we did that for our carpet industryas a local carpet company, New Jersey.
We were taking their money month after month.
They were doing a one year campaign of 12 releases and at monthfive, I felt so bad because nothing had happened and we were
(39:56):
brainstorming and I just asked them who their biggest enemywas and they said it was the big box home improvement stores.
And I was just expecting it was like Ed's place across town.
Uh, and so we built a David versus Goliath.
Press release approach where we talked about the challenges ofmarketing against the big box home improvement stores and also
(40:17):
underlying why there's such an inferior solutions for homeowners.
And that got picked up in over, uh, 10floor trade publications, one press release.
And we continued to work that angle.
And over a one year period, we got about 30 some articles.
Um, over 20 were in for trade publications,local newspapers, New Jersey magazine.
(40:42):
Um, and the thing that they did was they put all thoseclippings together in one big book, they called it a brag book.
And every time their salesperson went outto give someone a quote at their home.
They would open that and show, look, we'vebeen picked up by floor cover weekly.
Here we are in New Jersey magazine.
Here we are in the local newspaper.
You're going to get quotes from a lot of people.
We may not come in the cheapest, butwe've been doing this for 30 some years.
(41:06):
And we have a much superior product than say bigbox home improvement stores, which don't even ask.
The people that they hire for installation, have you evereven installed carpet before and we know because we come
in and fix a lot of carpet mistakes from these places,restretching, uh, you know, trying to redo the seam.
So it's less noticeable and when you useus, you're just going to get it right.
(41:30):
And by doing that, they started closing about17 percent more sales by just introducing that
brag book as part of, uh, their experience.
And that's one of the ways in which, youknow, researching your industry or blind spots
can really pull out something that worked.
And then it also shows what they didwith it when they did get media pickup.
And I think that that was just brilliant on theirpart, because I didn't know what they were going
(41:53):
to do with all these trade publication mentions.
Cause I knew their customers aren't readingfloor trade publications, but, but they were huge
indicators, uh, and, uh, basically, uh, respected.
Uh, entities in their industry, that they were ableto pass along that credit, that, that, that, uh,
social proof and credibility so that it went throughto them, uh, to these customers at home who then were
(42:20):
like, yeah, this is the company we want to work with.
Um, other types of press releases that work reallywell, or, you know, being the friendly jerk.
Uh, AKA the contrarian, uh,
uh, is that something you're comfortable with?
You don't want to alienate your customers, but if everybody'ssaying, Hey, we should be making the move for electric
cars and either one person who says, Hey, I don't think so.
(42:40):
I think we should stop before we move forward because the mining.
Uh, of of the minerals for the batteries creates all kinds ofenvironmental hazards, uh, not to mention, we don't know what's
going to happen to these batteries at the end of their life.
Are we creating a bigger problem in landfills?
Not to mention, you know, when these electriccars get in accidents and they catch on
(43:01):
fire, they're almost impossible to put out.
And so maybe we should sit and refine this forthe next few years before we push for it's wide.
Thank you.
Uh, use across the entire country.
That's a way in which you don't sound unreasonable, but you areputting a position out there that really no one else in your
industry may be positing or, or sharing, and so that's a reallygreat way because journalists want to be fair and balanced.
(43:27):
So if they're going to write a lot of articles on electriccars, if you're the only person raising their hand and saying.
I am going to present the con or the negative of this.
You stand the likelihood that you can be plugged intoevery story on this issue because no one else is there
that's willing to say the negative side of things.
Donnie Boivin (43:46):
So we launch, you know, these groups all over and, and like, I literally just had one launch, uh,
this morning, this morning that, uh, one of our chapters.
Does it make sense for us to, every time we launch a chapterin a local area, To do a press release saying we've launched
it and then what would be the kind of plan of attack to, to do
Mickie Kennedy (44:09):
just that?
Right.
I think that for local media, and I think that thosewould be the ones that would be most valuable for you.
I don't think that you would have to even go throughdoing a press release or using a paid service.
Uh, local media is really about connections.
And if you think about it, in every local marketthat you go into, there's probably less than six
(44:30):
people who would potentially write about you.
You know, look at the local paper.
Uh, who is the person who writes or covers your industry?
You can look at the past, uh, reach outto them, ask for their email address.
You can call and ask, they'll give it to you.
They're not trying to hide.
They're members of the community.
And, uh, if you just ask, say, Hey, I've got a, uh, idea.
(44:51):
I'd like to pitch to so and so,uh, can I get their email address?
They'll give it to you.
Just build a small Rolodex of six to 10 people in each market.
Uh, and, uh, as you go into that market, uh, you couldhave something that you've prepared and share that it
could be as little as a few sentences and a great quote,uh, of you talking about entering that marketplace.
(45:13):
And I think that that's a great way to, uh, you know.
Start those little local, uh, chapters that you were, youwere, you were having and then giving that Rolodex to them and
letting them continue to nurture those relationships with themedia, whether they get pickup or not over time, they will,
because what you'll notice is that after a while you might pitchfour or five times a year to these local markets and maybe you
(45:39):
don't get any pickup, but after a while, they're going to beworking on an article and they're looking to plug in someone.
Uh, because that's another thing journalists do.
They like to break it down locally.
So here's how this environmentalissue applies to a local business.
They're going to think of you.
Oh, that might be a great person to plug in here.
And it's one of the reasons you see the samecompanies get recycled in local news often.
(46:01):
It's not because they're paying a lot of people to, to,to get access or they're spending a lot of ad dollars.
Often they're just the ones that are working the networking.
The most and being, being the most proactive,
Donnie Boivin (46:14):
would you, uh, that, so that is actually really smart as hell.
Um, would you recommend doing more ofyour business journals or the local?
So, so like in Fort Worth, Texas, wehave the, the business press, right?
That covers what a lot of our ideal clientele would be in there.
But outside of that, there's the localnewspapers that go to the homes and households.
(46:38):
Uh, would you go after both?
Mickie Kennedy (46:40):
Yes.
Okay.
Yeah.
I, I feel like with local media, it's so easy to potentiallyget pickup that I think it's worth working all of those angles.
Uh, if you're, if you're familiar enough with the marketand you know that there's a TV program or a spotlight that,
uh, maybe the news does occasionally, you may even ask who,who is the producer or booker of those spotlight segments.
(47:05):
And pitch them as well.
Uh, it doesn't have to just be thenewspaper or just the business publication.
You can be creative with it.
And I've also had people do really well with,uh, community weekly papers that are often free.
Uh, sometimes if you're in a local market,people don't think about those, but those can
be really great opportunities for you as well.
(47:26):
Yeah.
In
Donnie Boivin (47:26):
this day and age with, with social media.
Yeah.
And I sold commercial printing for a number of years.
I don't think about the old school stuff of thenewspaper, you know, and, and those types of things.
So that's going to be a fascinating thing to continue to explore.
So dude, we can keep doing this for a while.
I'm going to keep continuing to get a whole bunch offree advice from which I appreciate the hell out of.
Um, uh, what do you think is something that's happening inthe industry that people need to watch out for it or any.
(47:53):
Like scams or anything is they're trying to explore doingPR releases or anything that should be worried about.
Mickie Kennedy (47:58):
Yeah.
There's a lot of places that have newswire intheir name that are not news wires in the U S
there are three news wires of press releases.
Okay.
It's a PR newswire, which is the oldest and largest.
And that's who we work with.
There's business wire.
They're also really big and respectable.
And there's Globe Newswire, which is the newest of them.
Uh, anybody else is not a real newswire,even though they may have wire in their name.
(48:23):
Uh, and a lot of the ones, uh, that are out there thathave wire in their names are just syndication plays.
They're taking your press release andthey're syndicating it on a few websites.
It happens even with PR Newswireand BusinessWire and Globe Newswire.
Uh, but syndication isn't very valuable.
The sections on these websites, like there's a sectionon Yahoo News, all these press releases show up on.
(48:47):
Nobody's looking in that folderwhere all these press releases are.
Very few people see it.
Donnie Boivin (48:53):
I know we did a press release once upon a time and I ended up in like 40 Colorado something one
offs and I went to look at them and you could tell this isjust nothing but a place to like collect press releases.
Mickie Kennedy (49:06):
And that happens with anybody that you use.
But there are people that's all it does.
It never really goes to journalists as well with PR Newswire.
It's available to journalists.
It goes out on feeds directly into newsroomsdirectly on to journalist computers.
So it is available to them where theseother players that are syndication only.
They have no relationships with any journalists.
(49:28):
So the likelihood of journalists evereven sees it is extremely remote.
And you just want to make sure that you're not, youknow, doing that because then you're, you're the
only results you'll ever see is the syndication only.
Donnie Boivin (49:42):
Well, brother, this is awesome.
I really appreciate the insights.
Uh, I actually took some notes that I'm going to begiven to the team and we're going to get to work on it.
So I really enjoy it.
How do people find you?
How do they reach out?
How do they get
Mickie Kennedy (49:54):
in touch with you?
Right.
So the website's e releases.
com.
I do have a free masterclass that goes through allthese strategies of the types of releases that work.
So if you're new to press releases or consideringit's a great place to start, um, it'll give
you an audit of your, your business as to.
What types of releases could be meaningful and work for you.
And it's a e releases.
(50:14):
com slash plan P L a N.
And it's completely free.
It's about an hour long video masterclass.
And I think that's a great place for anybody to start.
Um, and we also have our social media on our website.
Um, LinkedIn is my direct LinkedIn.
It's a great place to reach me.
And I actually understand it.
I have people in charge of theother social media that's out there.
(50:36):
But, uh, uh, at eReleases, we're all, uh, just editors.
There's no salespeople or commissionsand we work on a a la carte basis.
Uh, it can really help you, uh, you know, get your firstpress release in order and get it out there to the media.
Donnie Boivin (50:51):
That's awesome.
Well, Mickey, thanks for doing this.
Um, guys, if you made it this far, you're still hangingout with us and you got any tips, tricks, any value
out of this, do us a favor, take a screenshot of thiswherever you're listening or watching this and put it
out in your social media channels and tag me and Mickey.
And if we see it, we'll come comment, interact,but it just shows that we're hitting on the content
you guys are enjoying and want to learn more about.
(51:14):
So thanks again, Mickey, for hanging out with me.
And for you guys that are listening and watching.
Love you, man.
See you.
Bye.
if everybody in your industry is joining the conversation with something that's trending in your industry,
(00:05):
saying the same thing, be the person who says the exact opposite
Donnie Boivin (00:10):
You've got to get around people that are doing the shit you want to be doing.
On the level and volume of what you want to be doing.
Go in and be the damn student.
I could learn every person in this room.
Think about how you talk about your business.
(00:31):
Yes, passion sells.
But you can't carry on a real conversation outside the passion.
You're gonna lose.
You're gonna lose.
So the whole point of all of this,is one, show up as you, fucking loud.
Two, get yourself in frickin roomsthat scare the shit out of you.
(00:53):
It's really about looking at those things that you knowwill move the business forward, and doing them anyways.
Thank you for allowing me to always show upas me, and thank you for showing up as you.
All right, Mickey, uh, running a smallbusiness, having clients all over North America.
(01:18):
You know, the biggest thing that we've beenfocusing on is word of mouth marketing, right?
That's been the number one thing that's grown our business.
Everybody knows it's powerful as hell, but we were seriouslycontemplating getting into the PR game and looking at getting
some publicity and some awareness around what we're doing.
Um, if I'm a small business owner, Youknow, where do I start when it comes to PR?
(01:40):
Is it focusing on my unique selling proposition or isit just writing something and hoping it gets picked
Mickie Kennedy (01:46):
up?
Right.
So with PR, you're looking to do a PR campaign.
So you have six to eight press releases,six to eight opportunities to, uh.
Engage with the media and have at least one ofthem work, uh, the types of releases, uh, yeah,
you can focus on your unique selling proposition.
What it is that you do that's different than everybody else.
(02:08):
Uh, what makes you the kick ass business that you areagainst all the other businesses out there in your space?
Um, You know, it could be sharing your story, uh, you know, thepeople that appear on shark tank often open with how, you know,
their, their journey to build this business or that product.
And the reason for that is people relate to that.
(02:29):
So, you know, don't discount the human interest elementof storytelling and journalists do like storytelling.
And so make sure that anything that you areannouncing has the elements of the story.
Um.
You know, a lot of people do a product launch, apress release, and they just say, here's our product.
Here's a list of features.
Here's a buy button.
(02:50):
And that really is missing the storytelling, uh, elements.
So to beef that up, I would suggest that you add a usecase study, someone who used this product or service,
what their experience was, you know, what, what.
What was solved with this product, as well as get aquote from them about, you know, their experience.
And that gives the journalists a lot more elements to builda story and be able to create the types of articles that
(03:14):
they like to create and, uh, you know, you, you don't always,uh, write a press release thinking that mind, but you really
should, you know, almost reverse engineer, what is a journalistlooking for and how can I put those elements in, in a press
release so that they'll want to share that with their audience.
So what I mean,
Donnie Boivin (03:34):
what are they looking for?
When I think about journalists, right?
I think about news and right.
I hate the news.
I hate everything about the news.
Right.
And, and, you know, it's unfortunate that you do at some pointand company got to get exposure by being on those platforms.
So you're right between the murder, the death, the rape and the.
(03:54):
You know, freaking riots and then you pop in, right?
You know, um, so, so that's always a struggle.
So, I mean, what the hell are they actuallylooking for that would make it got, you know, cool.
I've got a cool story of being a blue collar kid that, youknow, turn around and build my companies to the level they are.
I mean, I've got that story, but so do a hundredthousand other people have that same story.
(04:18):
What are they looking for?
What story am I going to pull that grabs
Mickie Kennedy (04:21):
them?
I think that, uh, you're just looking for somethingthat's uniquely your story and sort of defines
you as, as different in the, in the space.
Um, you know, if, if it is that you're providing a servicelike many other, Are are providing the similar service.
What is it that's different about you?
You know, what is unique?
(04:42):
Sometimes if you feel like I don't really have anythingthat I'm newsworthy, you know, going on in my business,
you can sort of just manufacture the news become the news.
And a lot of people.
Really tell me what do you mean by manufacture?
Do a survey or study within your industry and send that out withyour thoughts as to why the survey had the results that it did?
(05:04):
Um, I'd like to do a survey of 16 questions.
The press release will probably focuson 2 or 3 of the biggest aha moments.
What were the biggest surprises?
Um, you want to ask questions that arereally relevant and timely right now.
So what's going on in your industry that's different thanit was three years ago, or, you know, even six months ago,
um, you know, are you having, you know, staffing issues?
(05:26):
Uh, you know, maybe having everybody'shaving staffing issues right now, right?
You know, the culture is changing andpeople are wanting to work differently.
They want to work from home.
They don't want necessarily.
To invest in a culture in the office.
And so it makes it very challenging,but you can ask questions about that.
Um, you can also ask questions if you, you know, notice thatyou're tightening the belt when it comes to marketing in
(05:47):
the next couple of quarters, ask, you know, are you spendingmore or less than the next quarter or two on your marketing
budget, those are all really good indicators that can sortof show things that are happening within your industry.
And.
You know, you, you then take the two or three questionsout of that 16 question survey and, uh, you know, pick
(06:08):
the ones that were the, you know, the ones you feel likeyou're gonna get the most mileage out of, or the journalists
are going to find the most interesting and put them in apress release and talk about them, have a quote by you.
You know, analyzing why you felt the results turned out that way.
You're now the expert and you'repositioning yourself as an expert.
And I know that that can be challenging a lot.
(06:29):
Cause a lot of small businesses feel like I'm notimportant enough to send out a press release or matter.
Donnie Boivin (06:35):
I'm more curious.
I mean, cause I, I, I agree with you.
There's a lot of people are going to struggle with.
Being seen as the expert, you know, they're in their head.
They're like, I'm just a small business owner type thing, but I'mmore fascinated right now at the, at the thought of, excuse me,
I'm going to put a survey together, um, that asked my customers,you know, what's their marketing spend going to be coming up?
(06:58):
Are they holding back or what are theydoing about hiring or things like that?
How does me commenting on that?
Put me in a position of authority that they'dwant to either interview me or run that, that
Mickie Kennedy (07:11):
article.
I think that, um, it's the, the journalist isasking the question, are these questions ones that
my audience would want to know the answers to?
And so it's a, it's about asking the right questions andit really doesn't matter necessarily who's sending it out.
It's were really cool questions asked.
(07:32):
And did you get some, you know.
Really interesting responses and provide some analysisas to why you feel they, they responded that way.
Um, I, I've had this work with a local auto repairshop in Pennsylvania, who sent out a survey, uh,
to other independent repair shops across the U Sand they just did not believe that it would work.
(07:54):
And they got picked up in over 10,uh, automotive trade publications.
What were they asking though?
Okay, so with them, I always recommend that in the 16questions you ask, um, I recommend using like survey monkey.
We have four pages, four questions per page.
So someone stops halfway.
You've still got half the responses andyou've asked the most important questions.
(08:15):
So you've got their responses on the last page.
Spends a little time asking, uh, leftfield questions, weird questions.
And the one that we asked and the one that the press releaseended up being about was what's the strangest thing a customer
left in their car while being repaired and it was open field.
So there was no statistical relevance to any of the responses.
(08:37):
And we just put a roundup of what wefelt like were the 50 most interesting.
Uh, responses on the website, and we also put thequestions and answers for all of the survey on that page.
It was a resource page that we had built for it.
And then in the press release, we mentioned, Ithink, the top 20 or top 25 of those responses.
(08:58):
And that was what went viral, you know,the automotive industry really loved it.
Um, you know, this auto repair shop feltlike, you know, who are we to be doing this?
And I'm just like, you're the person whojust put it together and, and sent it out.
And as a result, they got links back to them.
They got mentioned in all of these places.
And
Donnie Boivin (09:17):
that's the ROI is, is the backlinks, the, the things is that.
Is it an SEO play then?
Mickie Kennedy (09:26):
Is it for them?
It was because they had a domain nametied to the yellow pages that went dark.
And so they had a new domain name and an SEO person said,you know, if you can get authority links, especially
within your industry, That would go really far.
And it did.
I mean, within 90 days, they were ranking topone result in their area for auto repairs.
(09:49):
And, you know, one of the pushbacks we get from peopledoing a survey is I don't know who to send it to.
I don't have an audience big enough.
Um, like maybe it's not your customer base, butmaybe it's, you know, other people, competitors
in your industry that you're trying to reach.
And in their case, all they did was, uh.
Partner with a small, I think it was an independentrepair shop association, and there's lots of independent
(10:11):
and small trade associations that have members.
Generally, I like to have people have membersof say, you know, 500 to 1000 or more members.
It's a really good, you know, sample pool.
Um, you really are looking to try to get 150 or more responses.
Um, but I've seen people work withless statistically relevant and 150.
(10:32):
I mean, it's enough for journalists to be interested in a story.
Um, it seems, it seems to be, um,less than that, you know, it's, it's.
It's a little bit more like you're curatingor shaping the results as a result of that.
So, um, it, it can work.
And I, you know, and what I recommend whenyou reach out to a smaller independent trade
(10:53):
association and say, hey, I'm doing the survey.
Here's the link.
I'd love it.
If you can send this out to your members,I'll mention you in the press release.
I'll be issuing over the wire.
Most of the small independent trade associationssee this as a huge win win and they'll often do it.
I've had a couple push back andsay, could we co brand the survey?
And I don't feel a big loss of anything by doing that.
(11:13):
It just gives more legitimacy to you.
Um, but you know, they're, they're really great partners.
The large trade associations aren'tinterested in working with people like this.
They like to control everything and they'regoing to be harder to try to navigate.
Trying to get something like this, a surveydone, but it's something that anyone can do.
And if you feel like you're just not newsworthy or don't matterto the media, it's one of the ways in which you can sort of, you
(11:38):
know, I, I've created this, the survey, I've got these numbers.
I own this data.
It's mine.
And if you, you know, uh, want to share it with your members oryour audience as a journalist, uh, you know, here, here I am.
And here's some quotes by me.
And, you know, that's another really greatway to stand out is have amazing quotes.
(11:58):
Uh, so many people write quotes for the media as an afterthought,and what they don't realize is that a journalist can build
an entire story around an amazing quote, and you want to saysomething that can't be easily paraphrased or generalized.
Uh, you want it to say something that they're going tohave to include you because I've had people, uh, do.
(12:20):
Press releases, they have a quote in it, and thenthe story runs and the company's not even mentioned
in the, in the actual article that they inspired.
And it's not because that journalist was trying tocut them out of the story, but they mentioned them
in there usually through a quote and the managingeditor saw it and said, this is a weak quote.
Why bother having it in here, cross them out andnot even realize that they inspired the story with
(12:44):
their press release and now they're not even in it.
So that that's 1 of the things that can happen.
So having an amazing quote, working with data, and sometimesit doesn't have to be your data through a survey or study.
If you're just put data together, that's publicly availablein an interesting way, it can really sort of go far as
to elevating the newsworthiness of your press release.
(13:05):
So if you have a product launch.
You know, maybe talk about a certain percentage of people in yourindustry are facing the same challenge or a similar challenge.
And, you know, those kinds of numbers can really makeit, you know, more of a stronghold for journalists
to cling to when they're writing an article.
Man,
Donnie Boivin (13:23):
there's a lot of things to unpack in there.
Um, the first one, so as I'm thinking through, I've gotall these ideas around press releases we should attempt to
do, you know, but I'm thinking, God, what's in the survey?
What questions am I asking?
You know, then I'm, I'm, I'm going to, well,how do I know it's this powerful damn quote?
Uh, what's the mechanics behind that?
(13:44):
So what, let's start with, you know, what questions arewe asking in the survey, uh, itself is it, so just to
help you a little bit, I run B2B business to businessnetworking groups, um, all throughout North America.
So we bring, you know, service based business ownerstogether and teach them to collaborate and open doors
(14:06):
through introductions to the right rooms, the rightpeople, the right opportunities, that type of thing.
So I've got a collective community.
Uh, of size, what, what survey would I put asurvey out to them when I put a survey out to my
customers or when I put a survey out somewhere else?
I know there's a lot of questionskind of sure in there, but sure.
Mickie Kennedy (14:29):
I find that the surveys that attracts journalists the most.
Are the ones that are where you'retalking to people within your industry.
Um, and you know, that, that may be colleagues orpartners, or it could be competitors in the marketplace.
Generally those do the best with like tradepublications and sometimes with newspapers.
(14:51):
But you know, you can also have a survey of yourcustomers and clients and what they're facing.
And that could be interesting as well.
I find that if you're a local based business and your market islocal, getting a survey of your clients can be really good for
local media, you know, local newspapers, uh, you know, mayberadio TV, uh, as well as like, you know, if you're looking at
(15:13):
to have a business magazine or newspaper in your market as well.
Yeah.
And then what
Donnie Boivin (15:19):
questions are we asking?
I mean, is it, is it, um, Because you're not goingto, you can't make it all about your business.
Nobody's ever going to pick that up.
Right.
So am I asking them industry?
Am I asking them projections?
What am I trying
Mickie Kennedy (15:37):
to uncover?
You want to just ask questions that would interest peoplein your industry that would want to know the answer.
So, uh, you know, sometimes surveys can be very specific.
Uh, you know, one that.
What types of surveys I'm seeing that are very common, that arethematic or like AI, you know, are you using AI in your industry?
(15:58):
Uh, you know, do you feel AI is, uh, just put chat GPT next to
Donnie Boivin (16:01):
anything and it's going to run.
I
Mickie Kennedy (16:03):
mean, and you know, what people are people's thoughts about that are, uh, you know, uh, the
writers are going to have one perspective, you know,people who write for a living, the feeling that AI.
Potentially is, uh, uh, you know, going to replace themor potentially could, and then you're going to have other
people who feel like this is a tool and can assist us, um,you know, getting a feel in your industry about people's
(16:28):
perceptions about things like that could be really useful.
Um, so, but, you know, other thematicthings could be sometimes environmental.
Um, you know, if you're in an industry that's rapidly changingbecause of environmental concerns, um, like the automotive
industry is facing a lot of changes and shifts and things alongthose lines, um, you can sort of put together some, uh, questions
(16:49):
that are around that and you want to pick sort of like hotbutton items, you know, not the ones that are like, uh, you know.
Does moving to AI scare you or something like that?
But, you know, have you, you know,what are the challenges around it?
You know, what are the things that, uh,you found hard or easy to implement?
Um, I think that also asking questions that areaffecting, uh, Uh, you know, the entire nation, uh,
(17:15):
which could be like, you know, if you're heading in andin a recession or out of a recession, asking questions
that are specific to your economic health, your, as acompany, and you know, that can, uh, sort of, you know.
Get a perspective.
What's going on there?
Uh, you know, asking about, you know, spending,hiring, any of those things are really good for it.
(17:37):
It's just a matter of, you know, what if you were at aconference or a trade show that was happening today, what are
the kinds of questions you would love to just talk to someoneat the water cooler about, you know, Hey, have you noticed
that, uh, the, uh, Payables is now taking 80 to 90 days.
And it used to be, you know, net 30,you were always getting paid on time.
And so I was like, yeah, we have noticed that, you know,potentially that could be a question that you could ask.
(18:01):
So, uh, you know, talk to, uh, colleagues, uh, talk topeople within your own company, uh, talk to, uh, you know,
people in other markets and just get a feel for what arethe types of things that they would want to ask you and, you
know, what's going on with you and, you know, they could be.
You know, marketing, AI, it could, there'slots of different approaches and it's just a
(18:24):
matter of brainstorming what, what, what would.
Really be 16 interesting questions to ask and, youknow, sort of bury at the end of that questionnaire.
What are some, you know, left field questions, you know, how many
Donnie Boivin (18:37):
left field questions should I have?
Because I got to get another question to chase
Mickie Kennedy (18:40):
that.
But I'm just curious.
Sure.
I like 2 to 4, uh, you know, uh, on that lastpage, take 2 to 4 and just, just go wild.
And you can even, you know, haveit so that they're not responding.
Yes or no, or true or false or, uh, multiple choice.
But.
Yeah.
You can actually give them, uh, uh, an area to, to, to writesomething like we did with the, uh, local auto repair shop.
(19:03):
Um, but it does take a little bit more, you know,turning through the results because everybody's
response is going to be different that way.
Donnie Boivin (19:12):
So like a common interest for a lot of our prospects, LinkedIn right now, because of, uh, All the cool
things going on over there, just as a pure idea, would itmake sense for us to go potentially survey 150, 200 LinkedIn
(19:34):
experts, coaches, and the likes, or would it make more sense?
To go in a survey, you know, B to B business people inservice based businesses who are on LinkedIn and how
actively they're using it or something along those lines,which would make more sense to try and put a survey
Mickie Kennedy (19:53):
to.
I think that either one of them potentiallycould be a good survey audience.
Um, it's, I think it has to go with intent and goals.
Um, you know, is engaging with 150 individualswho are on LinkedIn, uh, going to be helpful?
Uh, to your business, getting their, their, their viewpoints,or is it going to be more strategic if you get it from
(20:18):
people who are considered linkedin experts, uh, potentially,I think the linkedin experts might be potentially more
valuable because I think that a lot of people will probably.
Want to know the answer of that populationover just the general population.
But I've seen it work really well for different audiences.
(20:39):
I do think that the benefit of, uh, you know,reaching out to LinkedIn experts in that space
is that you're kind of networking with experts.
It does give you a huge opportunity to get to know them.
They get to know you.
Uh, it's great branding.
Uh, if they go through the survey.
You know, on SurveyMonkey, there's a, you know, whenyou're done, you click submit, uh, send them to your
(21:06):
homepage or a page on your website, thanking them.
And all of a sudden, now you, you've got them on your website.
You, you know, uh, probably cookie them for remarketing.
It's just, it's just a really valuable introduction and agreat way to get them to know a little bit more about you.
Yeah.
Donnie Boivin (21:20):
And I love that because for me, networking is all about not necessarily trying to get to your end user client.
It's about getting to the people who already are workingwith your clients and getting great with them and those
linkedin experts are all working with our ideal client.
So, um, that that that would be afun exercise to try and put together.
What's a good quote, right?
(21:41):
So I'm talking to these newspapers and you're like, you gotto put together this like amazing quote that could almost
tell a story or a journalist could write a story about it.
How do you pick up a good quote?
Like that, because in my head, I'm like, Oh, I'll just gochat GPT and go, what's a good quote to give to a journalist?
You know, like 500 million other people are trying to
Mickie Kennedy (21:59):
do right now.
Sure.
I think that a really great quote is one that stands out.
Uh, it's one that if a journalist was toparaphrase that, uh, would there be a loss?
And the loss could be the certainty with which it was spoken.
Um, the precision, the power of how it was spoken.
(22:19):
It could also be the.
The, the art of the writing itself, like,was it just a beautifully said sentence?
There's a lot of different things that could go into it.
A lot to put into
Donnie Boivin (22:30):
one, one quote.
I mean, you know, uh, I need to go hire like areally expensive copywriter to come up with one
Mickie Kennedy (22:37):
sentence for me.
Right.
But a lot of quotes are just written as like.
Passive verb, uh, we feel this is a really great assetto the company launching this product and, you know,
put some active verbs in there, you know, give me an
Donnie Boivin (22:51):
example of what a good quotes, what it would sound like just so I can wrap my head around it,
Mickie Kennedy (22:56):
right?
Let's see, because I'm, you know, as I'm,
Donnie Boivin (22:59):
you know, going through, I mean, I have quotes that.
People have repeated that.
I've said, um, but I don't not done from a journalistic nature.
Mickie Kennedy (23:11):
Sure.
Let's see, I think that, like, having a quotewhere, uh, 1 person says something along the lines
of, um, you know, I, I, I feel like this product.
Uh, you know, addresses the need in the marketplace.
And, uh, I feel like it can be areally great asset to any business.
(23:33):
That's like a safe generic quote, but if you said something alongthe lines of, you know, this, this, this product, uh, addresses.
The biggest need in our marketplace, which is a lack of that.
And it's like, wow, that's very succinct.
And it immediately has something that's very identifiablewhere you've identified what, what, what it does.
(23:57):
And it almost
Donnie Boivin (23:57):
tells a story versus trying to convince or anything.
It's coming maybe from a more of a place of authority.
Mickie Kennedy (24:04):
Right.
Absolutely.
Okay.
Donnie Boivin (24:07):
All right.
It's fascinating.
I, I never thought about doing, uh, youknow, press releases in this regard.
When I think about a press release, I'mlike, Hey, we got an event coming up or we're
doing a book launch, you know, type of thing.
I, this almost feels like you're gaming thesystem a little bit and I'm, I'm good with that.
You know, um, uh, I, I like finding those little tinyloopholes sometimes or, you know, ways that you can.
(24:30):
Get around what some of the big houses and things are doing.
How much do does like case studiesplay into doing these releases?
Is it important that we have case studies go with it?
Is that just like backup reference material?
What do we do with case
Mickie Kennedy (24:45):
studies in general?
I think the case studies can be very valuable because.
They, they really can fill out that needfor a journalist who's looking for a story.
So whatever you're announcing or sending out, having a usecase or a case study can really go a long ways towards sort
of fleshing out the story within what you're announcing.
(25:08):
And I found that they can be really valuable.
Um, you know, the, you look at the product launchrelease that just says, here's our product, here's a
bullets of all of our features and here's a buy button.
It's, it's really hard for journalists to, you know,draft a compelling story there, but if you include
a case study, uh, of what someone's results were.
(25:30):
Uh, ideally getting a quote from them as well can can reallygo a long ways towards, uh, you know, fulfilling the needs
of a journalist, uh, who's who's trying to get it out there.
At the end of the day, a journalist is agatekeeper and they're trying to decide if this.
Bit of news that you have is worth sharing with their audience.
And I think that, you know, fulfilling some of those needs,uh, for, you know, an audience like human interest element,
(25:56):
uh, having another person who has a challenge and cameto your product, found your product to be very valuable.
This was the results that they had.
And here's a quote that sort of just sort of, uh, hones into.
Why your product was a perfect solutionfor them can really go a long ways.
Yeah.
(26:16):
I,
Donnie Boivin (26:18):
I just think trying to get something that a reporter is going to run, it's got to be
a somewhat of an ordeal because you know, theirass is on the line every time they run an article.
So, so if they put out something thatit flops, you know, that's their job.
Um, So there has to be some absolute,you know, strategy behind it.
Um, we don't have a whole lot of case studies.
(26:40):
We've got lots of cool testimonials, but on the case study sideof things, I can't say that we've ever gone down that route.
Um, case study in your mind is that a static setof questions you ask a client or somebody who's
used your product or services, um, and then you.
Come back and put that all together, or is itthey're, they're more finessed to it than that.
Mickie Kennedy (27:06):
I find that that can be very valuable having a set of questions that lead people through a Q
and a, to get some responses, to build out a case study.
But one of the ways that I go about it is I'll takean interesting, uh, client who had great results and I
will, you know, address it as here was the challenge.
(27:26):
This is, this was, you know, I talked to him and ask,you know, what was the challenge going into this?
And a lot of people are just like, I don't know.
And I was like, well, would you say that you werefacing, you know, how, how to market in a different way?
And we're looking at PR for that and like,yeah, you know, so you sort of get that.
And I, I sort of build a story like, you know, here was, herewas this client, uh, this was the challenge that they had.
(27:51):
Um, you know.
This was, uh, we sent it out.
This was the results and then I'll be like,Hey, you know, I often see the results.
So I was like, Hey, I noticed that you got inthe wall street journal and the New York times.
They're like, yeah, that was really great.
And then they just talk and they usually talk excitedly.
Um, they talk about what that meant for them.
(28:11):
Usually it's more customers or they got a really great leadfor a big sell or something really powerful happened from it.
And then just putting that out there as, you know, theelements of this, of the, of the case study of like, this
was, uh, what they saw, um, maybe when you got them to talk,you, you got together, uh, a potential quote that you can ask
(28:32):
them if it would be okay if you use this and, uh, Sometimesyou can massage that a little bit and say, you know, uh,
this was sort of paraphrase what you were talking about.
Are you okay with that?
And we're like, Oh yeah, yeah, that's great.
And so I think all of those go a long way.
I think that, uh, you know, if, if you can build out a way of.
(28:55):
You know, talking to your client, uh, after, you know, they've,they've worked with you for a little bit with some ready made
questions can, can go a long way, but, you know, sometimesjust talking with someone sort of debriefing after, uh, you
know, they've spent a considerable amount of money with you.
And you, you, you've seen, you know, that there's beensome results of what you've seen, uh, could potentially
(29:16):
be a good time to, to, you know, sit in with themand get their thoughts on the entire experience.
So
Donnie Boivin (29:25):
let me think through, you know, I've got a client that in six months and doing one of our
masterminds, you know, she tripled her business and, youknow, so there's a phenomenal result on the back end.
Like, how do I take her through, be able to capturethat information so that I get a killer, you
know, case study, but on the, on the back end ofthat, what value does that have for a journalist?
(29:50):
I'm just basically saying, youknow, we kick ass with our clients.
Right.
Yeah.
Why would a journalist pick that up?
Mickie Kennedy (29:57):
So I think that having a track record and sharing people's experiences and, uh, and, and,
you know, the, the, the path that they've gone through,uh, be it inspirational or vulnerable, um, is, is.
The, the, the ingredients that a journalist is looking for,um, you know, I think that as a service based business who just
(30:22):
has a good case study that in and of itself isn't going to beenough, I think, to get you over the hump of, of getting an
article, but I think that, you know, maybe it's focusing on.
Um, you know, a relaunch of your service or maybe a specific,uh, approach that you're taking with your service that's
(30:44):
novel or new, that there's a milestone that's happening alongwith that case study, uh, can, can work really well for you.
And sometimes it could be, you know, something asbenign as an anniversary, you know, we're celebrating
10 years in business and looking back, uh, at thegrowth methods that we've used, uh, to help our clients.
Uh, We've noticed that, you know, in our last six clients,uh, they all saw this result and one in particular actually
(31:13):
saw a tripling, uh, of their business as a result of this, andthen have a quote by her, you know, saying, wow, you know, you
know, tripling my business as, as, as it was, was something Ididn't think that was possible in such a short period of time
or something along those lines, and all of a sudden you cansort of see the story sort of potentially coming together.
Donnie Boivin (31:36):
Yeah, no, that's the anniversary one got me well, because we just wrapped up year four, the
badass business summit will hit year five next year.
So that's a, that's a cool twist and play on it.
You know, does this work for like local radioand the things, or is this strictly focused in
on, on press releases and articles and likes?
Mickie Kennedy (31:59):
So the thing is radio and TV.
Does pick up press releases.
They do look for stories on the wire.
And so potentially I, it can lead to that.
Um, you know, I've had clients who've got picked upon local TV or radio, uh, as well as like national
news, like good morning America and even late night TV.
(32:21):
Uh, that's, that's one in the lottery right there.
I mean, we had one client, celebraducks, which makes celebrity ducks.
Uh, they also make historical ones like Shakespeare.
In a rubber ducky form and all kinds of, you know,uh, celebrities and things along those lines.
And, uh, they, they got, uh, picked up on the late night TV show.
(32:42):
Uh, they got to come out and share some oftheir wacky creations and things like that.
That is a huge.
Milestone to have that happen because that's the equivalent
Donnie Boivin (32:52):
of a YouTube video going, you know, a hundred million views
Mickie Kennedy (32:55):
type of thing, you know, exactly.
And I, I, I deal with clients who getmedia pickup and it's, it's great.
They get a few sales from it.
And then I also get some that they get, uh, one article.
And then they get, you know, a 25million sell, uh, from that 1 article.
And so it's all over the place, what a success is.
(33:16):
Um, you know, but generally what we're looking foris getting these articles written by journalists
and, uh, potentially, you know, you know, getting.
New customers through that, but also using these linksthat you've created on these websites, uh, to put your
customers, expose them to it as well as your leads.
(33:38):
So, uh, generally, one of the things that my clientsnotice is that, um, when they get links from an
article that they got picked up in, they're like.
It looks like a third of the people that visit our websitebought, is that possible to have a conversion rate of 30, 40%?
And I'm like, it is, you know, not everybody whoread the article clicked through to visit you, but
(34:00):
the ones that did, you know, they read this article.
You know, it's, it works as an impliedendorsement, almost like a referral.
When a journalist writes about you, um, it's not like a, seeingan ad, you, you read an article, you get this warm feeling
about this company and you just want to do business with them.
You don't open a new browser and say, can I get it 15percent cheaper on Amazon or something similar to it?
(34:23):
It really is.
It creates this, this, this.
Feeling that works really well.
And if you could, you can then take that link tothat article and share it with your customers.
Customers are always going to be shopping around.
They may not shop every year, but some of them do.
And maybe this is the year that a couple were consideringreshopping, uh, who they're working with just to make
(34:44):
sure they're working with the best company, causeit's been a few years they've worked with you and.
They see that article and they're just like,I don't even have to do that this year.
This is definitely the right company that we want to, youknow, uh, to be associated with the same thing with leads.
There's always people that are on the fenceand you're going to lose some of them.
You didn't, you didn't convert them.
Uh, but getting that link in front of themand having them read that article can be.
(35:08):
Potentially just what they needed to pushthem to your side and win them as a customer.
And so, you know, all of these opportunities, share them withyour social media, uh, preserve them, put them on your website,
you know, build a, a new, a new section on your website.
We pull this great content, which canreally attract the search engines as well.
And, uh, it, it really does send a strongsignal to people that you're, you know, you
(35:33):
care about your reputation, you're out there.
You know, making a name for yourself, you're owning a littlebit of yourself in the media, uh, by, by, by getting out there.
And, you know, I, I, I always share that therewas a website my daughter sent me to and wanted
me to buy her something for her birthday.
And as soon as I saw it, I did not feelcomfortable giving them my credit card.
(35:55):
And so I.
Went around their website and found that they had a pressroom and it had like eight years worth of press releases.
So I'm like, well, there's definitely not a scam becauseno one's going to go through and create a history of
eight years worth of announcements to send something out.
So I felt a little more comfortableand I, you know, I'm in PR, so maybe.
That isn't the same feeling that everybody feels,but I do think that people look for indicators
(36:20):
of, is this someone that I want to work with?
And someone who is taking the time to, um, Announcemilestones to the media and preserving them on their
website is a really good, strong indicator that this is abusiness that cares about who they are and their identity.
Yeah, for sure.
Donnie Boivin (36:40):
Um, and I, I can't help but think this is like a long play though, because you don't know
what's going to hit is, is, should you test this?
I mean, the, do you put out one storyand be like, cool, a hit and then.
Attack on question.
How do you determine ROI from, from doing
Mickie Kennedy (37:00):
a press release?
Right.
So ROI is a little challenging because unlike with marketing,you don't really get to use tracking URLs or they're certainly
not going to be respected by journalists, uh, you know, sothat makes it a little difficult, but I think that, um, you
know, looking at your results and when you have successes.
(37:20):
What they mean to you is, is a really good indicator.
It is, it is, it links back to you or is it companymentions, um, you know, are there, uh, conversions that
you can measure that came from an external article?
Those are all really great indicatorsin which you could potentially measure.
Um, you know, sometimes it's extremely obvious, uh, when you goviral with an article, that's just really meaningful in a major.
(37:46):
Publication that it just sends you a lotof traffic and a lot of, uh, customers.
Uh, sometimes it's, it's a little bit more delicate and youjust sort of have to go with a gut feel of like, I think
that worked, but let me test it another month where I knowpredictably how much we do and see if there's a bump there.
Um, I think that.
(38:06):
Testing one press release generally never works because, youknow, when you're, when you're, when you're doing a campaign
of press releases, say six to eight press releases over aperiod, which could be a year, could be a year and a half.
And if you're really proactive, it could be like, uh, youknow, six to eight press releases in six to eight months.
Um, you're, you're, you're looking for.
(38:28):
A few, a few of these opportunities thatyou're testing to see what works it.
As you have media success, you want to see, can I do that again?
Uh, can I make it work for me?
I have one client, uh, clutch.
co that represents lots of little verticals and they do a surveyor study for each of these verticals and they do them annually.
(38:51):
And, uh, they, they ask really engaging questions.
Uh, the meet those.
Uh, industries like to know the responses and theydon't often get 8 to 14 articles for every press
release that they do and you know, that that'ssomething that they can do and just replicate over time.
And it's really just 1 idea.
It's it's the survey or study for other people.
(39:12):
You may have to mix and match and what gets success 1 time.
May not work again.
You just have to test it and see, um, I, I like to lookat, uh, other opportunities that you can do like, uh,
uh, researching your industry for blind spots or gaps.
Um, you know, what are the types of things that yourtrade publications and people in your industry don't
(39:35):
really talk about, you know, maybe when you go to aconference, it is something that you always talk about.
Uh, we did that for our carpet industryas a local carpet company, New Jersey.
We were taking their money month after month.
They were doing a one year campaign of 12 releases and at monthfive, I felt so bad because nothing had happened and we were
(39:56):
brainstorming and I just asked them who their biggest enemywas and they said it was the big box home improvement stores.
And I was just expecting it was like Ed's place across town.
Uh, and so we built a David versus Goliath.
Press release approach where we talked about the challenges ofmarketing against the big box home improvement stores and also
(40:17):
underlying why there's such an inferior solutions for homeowners.
And that got picked up in over, uh, 10floor trade publications, one press release.
And we continued to work that angle.
And over a one year period, we got about 30 some articles.
Um, over 20 were in for trade publications,local newspapers, New Jersey magazine.
(40:42):
Um, and the thing that they did was they put all thoseclippings together in one big book, they called it a brag book.
And every time their salesperson went outto give someone a quote at their home.
They would open that and show, look, we'vebeen picked up by floor cover weekly.
Here we are in New Jersey magazine.
Here we are in the local newspaper.
You're going to get quotes from a lot of people.
We may not come in the cheapest, butwe've been doing this for 30 some years.
(41:06):
And we have a much superior product than say bigbox home improvement stores, which don't even ask.
The people that they hire for installation, have you evereven installed carpet before and we know because we come
in and fix a lot of carpet mistakes from these places,restretching, uh, you know, trying to redo the seam.
So it's less noticeable and when you useus, you're just going to get it right.
(41:30):
And by doing that, they started closing about17 percent more sales by just introducing that
brag book as part of, uh, their experience.
And that's one of the ways in which, youknow, researching your industry or blind spots
can really pull out something that worked.
And then it also shows what they didwith it when they did get media pickup.
And I think that that was just brilliant on theirpart, because I didn't know what they were going
(41:53):
to do with all these trade publication mentions.
Cause I knew their customers aren't readingfloor trade publications, but, but they were huge
indicators, uh, and, uh, basically, uh, respected.
Uh, entities in their industry, that they were ableto pass along that credit, that, that, that, uh,
social proof and credibility so that it went throughto them, uh, to these customers at home who then were
(42:20):
like, yeah, this is the company we want to work with.
Um, other types of press releases that work reallywell, or, you know, being the friendly jerk.
Uh, AKA the contrarian, uh,
uh, is that something you're comfortable with?
You don't want to alienate your customers, but if everybody'ssaying, Hey, we should be making the move for electric
cars and either one person who says, Hey, I don't think so.
(42:40):
I think we should stop before we move forward because the mining.
Uh, of of the minerals for the batteries creates all kinds ofenvironmental hazards, uh, not to mention, we don't know what's
going to happen to these batteries at the end of their life.
Are we creating a bigger problem in landfills?
Not to mention, you know, when these electriccars get in accidents and they catch on
(43:01):
fire, they're almost impossible to put out.
And so maybe we should sit and refine this forthe next few years before we push for it's wide.
Thank you.
Uh, use across the entire country.
That's a way in which you don't sound unreasonable, but you areputting a position out there that really no one else in your
industry may be positing or, or sharing, and so that's a reallygreat way because journalists want to be fair and balanced.
(43:27):
So if they're going to write a lot of articles on electriccars, if you're the only person raising their hand and saying.
I am going to present the con or the negative of this.
You stand the likelihood that you can be plugged intoevery story on this issue because no one else is there
that's willing to say the negative side of things.
Donnie Boivin (43:46):
So we launch, you know, these groups all over and, and like, I literally just had one launch, uh,
this morning, this morning that, uh, one of our chapters.
Does it make sense for us to, every time we launch a chapterin a local area, To do a press release saying we've launched
it and then what would be the kind of plan of attack to, to do
Mickie Kennedy (44:09):
just that?
Right.
I think that for local media, and I think that thosewould be the ones that would be most valuable for you.
I don't think that you would have to even go throughdoing a press release or using a paid service.
Uh, local media is really about connections.
And if you think about it, in every local marketthat you go into, there's probably less than six
(44:30):
people who would potentially write about you.
You know, look at the local paper.
Uh, who is the person who writes or covers your industry?
You can look at the past, uh, reach outto them, ask for their email address.
You can call and ask, they'll give it to you.
They're not trying to hide.
They're members of the community.
And, uh, if you just ask, say, Hey, I've got a, uh, idea.
(44:51):
I'd like to pitch to so and so,uh, can I get their email address?
They'll give it to you.
Just build a small Rolodex of six to 10 people in each market.
Uh, and, uh, as you go into that market, uh, you couldhave something that you've prepared and share that it
could be as little as a few sentences and a great quote,uh, of you talking about entering that marketplace.
(45:13):
And I think that that's a great way to, uh, you know.
Start those little local, uh, chapters that you were, youwere, you were having and then giving that Rolodex to them and
letting them continue to nurture those relationships with themedia, whether they get pickup or not over time, they will,
because what you'll notice is that after a while you might pitchfour or five times a year to these local markets and maybe you
(45:39):
don't get any pickup, but after a while, they're going to beworking on an article and they're looking to plug in someone.
Uh, because that's another thing journalists do.
They like to break it down locally.
So here's how this environmentalissue applies to a local business.
They're going to think of you.
Oh, that might be a great person to plug in here.
And it's one of the reasons you see the samecompanies get recycled in local news often.
(46:01):
It's not because they're paying a lot of people to, to,to get access or they're spending a lot of ad dollars.
Often they're just the ones that are working the networking.
The most and being, being the most proactive,
Donnie Boivin (46:14):
would you, uh, that, so that is actually really smart as hell.
Um, would you recommend doing more ofyour business journals or the local?
So, so like in Fort Worth, Texas, wehave the, the business press, right?
That covers what a lot of our ideal clientele would be in there.
But outside of that, there's the localnewspapers that go to the homes and households.
(46:38):
Uh, would you go after both?
Mickie Kennedy (46:40):
Yes.
Okay.
Yeah.
I, I feel like with local media, it's so easy to potentiallyget pickup that I think it's worth working all of those angles.
Uh, if you're, if you're familiar enough with the marketand you know that there's a TV program or a spotlight that,
uh, maybe the news does occasionally, you may even ask who,who is the producer or booker of those spotlight segments.
(47:05):
And pitch them as well.
Uh, it doesn't have to just be thenewspaper or just the business publication.
You can be creative with it.
And I've also had people do really well with,uh, community weekly papers that are often free.
Uh, sometimes if you're in a local market,people don't think about those, but those can
be really great opportunities for you as well.
(47:26):
Yeah.
In
Donnie Boivin (47:26):
this day and age with, with social media.
Yeah.
And I sold commercial printing for a number of years.
I don't think about the old school stuff of thenewspaper, you know, and, and those types of things.
So that's going to be a fascinating thing to continue to explore.
So dude, we can keep doing this for a while.
I'm going to keep continuing to get a whole bunch offree advice from which I appreciate the hell out of.
Um, uh, what do you think is something that's happening inthe industry that people need to watch out for it or any.
(47:53):
Like scams or anything is they're trying to explore doingPR releases or anything that should be worried about.
Mickie Kennedy (47:58):
Yeah.
There's a lot of places that have newswire intheir name that are not news wires in the U S
there are three news wires of press releases.
Okay.
It's a PR newswire, which is the oldest and largest.
And that's who we work with.
There's business wire.
They're also really big and respectable.
And there's Globe Newswire, which is the newest of them.
Uh, anybody else is not a real newswire,even though they may have wire in their name.
(48:23):
Uh, and a lot of the ones, uh, that are out there thathave wire in their names are just syndication plays.
They're taking your press release andthey're syndicating it on a few websites.
It happens even with PR Newswireand BusinessWire and Globe Newswire.
Uh, but syndication isn't very valuable.
The sections on these websites, like there's a sectionon Yahoo News, all these press releases show up on.
(48:47):
Nobody's looking in that folderwhere all these press releases are.
Very few people see it.
Donnie Boivin (48:53):
I know we did a press release once upon a time and I ended up in like 40 Colorado something one
offs and I went to look at them and you could tell this isjust nothing but a place to like collect press releases.
Mickie Kennedy (49:06):
And that happens with anybody that you use.
But there are people that's all it does.
It never really goes to journalists as well with PR Newswire.
It's available to journalists.
It goes out on feeds directly into newsroomsdirectly on to journalist computers.
So it is available to them where theseother players that are syndication only.
They have no relationships with any journalists.
(49:28):
So the likelihood of journalists evereven sees it is extremely remote.
And you just want to make sure that you're not, youknow, doing that because then you're, you're the
only results you'll ever see is the syndication only.
Donnie Boivin (49:42):
Well, brother, this is awesome.
I really appreciate the insights.
Uh, I actually took some notes that I'm going to begiven to the team and we're going to get to work on it.
So I really enjoy it.
How do people find you?
How do they reach out?
How do they get
Mickie Kennedy (49:54):
in touch with you?
Right.
So the website's e releases.
com.
I do have a free masterclass that goes through allthese strategies of the types of releases that work.
So if you're new to press releases or consideringit's a great place to start, um, it'll give
you an audit of your, your business as to.
What types of releases could be meaningful and work for you.
And it's a e releases.
(50:14):
com slash plan P L a N.
And it's completely free.
It's about an hour long video masterclass.
And I think that's a great place for anybody to start.
Um, and we also have our social media on our website.
Um, LinkedIn is my direct LinkedIn.
It's a great place to reach me.
And I actually understand it.
I have people in charge of theother social media that's out there.
(50:36):
But, uh, uh, at eReleases, we're all, uh, just editors.
There's no salespeople or commissionsand we work on a a la carte basis.
Uh, it can really help you, uh, you know, get your firstpress release in order and get it out there to the media.
Donnie Boivin (50:51):
That's awesome.
Well, Mickey, thanks for doing this.
Um, guys, if you made it this far, you're still hangingout with us and you got any tips, tricks, any value
out of this, do us a favor, take a screenshot of thiswherever you're listening or watching this and put it
out in your social media channels and tag me and Mickey.
And if we see it, we'll come comment, interact,but it just shows that we're hitting on the content
you guys are enjoying and want to learn more about.
(51:14):
So thanks again, Mickey, for hanging out with me.
And for you guys that are listening and watching.
Love you, man.
See you.
Bye.
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