May 12, 2025 • 29 mins
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Safe infant sleep guidelines have reduced SIDS deaths by 50-80% over the last three decades, yet funding for this critical public health campaign is now at risk of being cut.
• Explained difference between SIDS (sudden infant death syndrome) and SUID (sudden unexpected infant death)
• Described the "triple risk model" that leads to SIDS: vulnerable infant + critical developmental period + external stressor
• Detailed the history of the Back to Sleep campaign which began in 1994
• Outlined key safe sleep recommendations: babies on backs, firm flat surface, no loose bedding or soft objects
• Discussed why co-sleeping increases SIDS risk despite cultural preferences
• Clarified that products like Dockatot are not designed for safe sleep
• Highlighted that Black and Indigenous communities experience higher SIDS rates
• Examined how funding cuts could impact access to life-saving health information
• Connected these changes to a broader pattern of removing evidence-based health information from government resources
Check out our website, email us at yourcheckuppod@gmail.com with questions or feedback, and most importantly, stay healthy until next time.
Production and Content: Edward Delesky, MD & Nicole Aruffo, RN
Artwork: Olivia Pawlowski
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Ed Delesky, MD (00:05):
Hi, welcome to your checkup.
We are the patient educationpodcast, where we bring
conversations from the doctor'soffice to your ears.
On this podcast, we try tobring medicine closer to its
patients.
I'm Ed Delesky, a familymedicine doctor in the
Philadelphia area.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (00:19):
And I'm Nicole Aruffo.
I'm a nurse.
Ed Delesky, MD (00:21):
And we are so excited you were able to join us
here again today.
It's been a great weekend sofar, very exciting.
I got to have some oysters lastnight.
You didn't get to join me inthat venture.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (00:38):
Sounds like I wasn't missing a lot.
Ed Delesky, MD (00:40):
No, I would say that if I'm going to like a
lukewarm, like reference I don'tknow it's a, I don't know.
Should I say the name of theplace or should I spare them?
I don't know I don't think weneed to slander anyone great,
but they were, um, they wereokay and they were very
expensive for being just okay.
I think about the oyster tripto Doc's that we took, where we
(01:05):
like those were great and Icouldn't get enough.
And they were huge.
These like large oysters thatthey labeled large.
Our intern, if you couldn'thear him, is very interested in
this conversation too.
You know they were OK.
I not too much to say aboutthem.
Ordered a crab dip, got a crabtoast instead.
(01:25):
Yeah, the dinner was a littlelukewarm.
You didn't come with us.
I went with Karthik and Mike.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (01:32):
The boys chat came over.
Ed Delesky, MD (01:33):
Yes, yes, they did, and they love their dirty
martini, I'll tell you my God.
And for the first time,hand-stuffed blue cheesed olives
um, with your help and you know, ziploc bags can become well.
It worked out really well, Ithink.
Uh, I don't know, what did youthink of those?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (01:55):
I thought they were delicious thank you I
think everyone else did too.
So did ollie so did ollie.
Ed Delesky, MD (02:02):
But um, just so that're clear, we don't let him
drink.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (02:06):
Oh, no, no, Not for little boys.
Ed Delesky, MD (02:08):
Definitely not.
Do you have any highlights fromthis week?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (02:14):
From the week ?
Honestly no.
Ed Delesky, MD (02:17):
Well, it's a much more calm week because I
didn't have like a whole icecream meltdown like I did last
week.
But there is a new ice creamplace that opened up down the
street that I'm interested intrying at some point yeah, maybe
we can go, like this week,because you're on vacation for
two weeks.
I am, so you know going to youI know, lucky me.
Getting ice cream would be fun.
And then we started runningtogether, which I love.
(02:37):
I think it's so fun, I feel sogreat about it and we do our
little.
Peloton runs outside.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (02:44):
Yeah, they have been fun until I can't walk
the next day, but it's okay.
Ed Delesky, MD (02:48):
Yeah, it turns out you probably have something
wrong with your feet.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (02:52):
Well, my feet keep going numb every time I
run, and they like have for thelast couple years, and I really
just like thought that I justhadn't found the right running
shoe for me.
So I went through a lot ofdifferent brands and now I'm
coming to realize it's probablylike I'm the problem.
Yeah, I think it's my feet, notmy shoes.
Ed Delesky, MD (03:14):
Totally.
Yeah, I think something else isgoing on there.
Especially when we came to theend you were like oh, like you
know, it was a hard run that wedid.
It was long Like a 60 minuterun is not a small thing and
then at the end you're like man,I just had to be careful there
for a while.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (03:34):
I just didn't want to step weird, so I can't
feel my feet.
Ed Delesky, MD (03:35):
Yeah, I was gonna like step weird or like do
something like I definitely getthat in the cold, but I think
that's a totally different thingthan what you're experiencing
whenever you go and do this, andyou're so nonchalantly said it
too.
You were just like, oh yeah, bythe way, like my feet get
really numb whenever we do theseintervals and then it's better
when I stop walk and when Istart walking, like jesus christ
(03:55):
, get in there.
We had um and all theexcitement of the the boys chat.
We did like a test run of the,the podcast set up for them
while we were.
You know, we had a recordedversion of american history
trivia that will never see thepublic's eye and or ears, and
mike got really excited with theum.
(04:16):
Well, to go back to hispodcasting days, right, because
he had the toothpick pod andthey would go and review
toothpicks Wait are you for real?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (04:26):
That's what it was?
Yeah, no, it was called thetoothpick pod Like a toothpick.
Ed Delesky, MD (04:30):
A toothpick review, yeah, and they would go
to different restaurants andthey would look at like they
would get the toothpicks andthen they would talk about other
stuff.
They had different segments.
They did it when they were incollege.
They had a whole setup.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (04:43):
How many episodes did they do?
Ed Delesky, MD (04:45):
I'm not entirely sure.
I certainly hope that he'slistening in his basement right
now and he's going to send insome fan mail Doing basement
things, doing basement things,all right.
So what are we going to talkabout today?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (04:56):
Nick, today we're talking about safe sleep,
and I don't want to hear an eyeroll from anyone.
Why?
Ed Delesky, MD (05:03):
would we hear an eye roll from anyone?
Why would we hear an eye rollfrom anyone about this?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (05:07):
It's a little controversial, I think.
Oh, for some reason.
Ed Delesky, MD (05:12):
Well, that's a weird thing.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (05:13):
Yeah.
Ed Delesky, MD (05:14):
To be controversial about, especially
given that it was so effective,yeah, at preventing what it was
supposed to prevent.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (05:22):
Yeah, well, you know.
Ed Delesky, MD (05:27):
Yeah Well, you know.
Yeah Well, I guess one thingyou're going to serve as our
expert here today, because thisis one of the foundations of
your career.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (05:33):
Yeah, the foundation of my career has been
educating parents on safe sleepfor their infants, so they
don't die.
Ed Delesky, MD (05:40):
Right, and so to prevent that, they created this
program.
But the reason that we'retalking about it here today is
because we were seeing in thenews.
We were seeing in the news thatthere are reports of funding
being cut for this campaign.
The safe to sleep is a campaign.
We're going to talk about allof that, but it seems like this
current administration islooking to reduce the funding
(06:03):
for the safe sleep, or safe tosleep campaign, outreach and
materials, and that's why we'regoing to talk about it here
today.
So why don't we dive in and getat the core thing, because this
is such an important topic?
The campaign and intervention,I guess, is really what it is.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (06:23):
Yeah, I mean, if you've been to a
pediatrician in the last 30years, you've gotten this spiel.
But I mean it's not for nothing.
So Totally.
Ed Delesky, MD (06:31):
All of this is born out of a certain idea of
preventing SIDS or, I guess,s-u-i-d.
Can you tell us a little bitabout what those actually are?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (06:41):
Yes, so SIDS, which, if you for some reason
have never heard of it before,it's sudden infant death
syndrome, which is unexplaineddeath in infants under one year
old, and this typically happensduring their sleep.
Suid is essentially the samething, but a little different.
(07:02):
It stands for sudden,unexpected infant death, which
includes, um, it's kind of anumbrella, so it includes SIDS,
and then accidental suffocationand unknown, unknown causes.
Ed Delesky, MD (07:16):
And when I was looking at this cause, this is a
part of our practice.
It's like this type of thingSIDS occurs when three things
overlap and it takes avulnerable infant, a critical
period in development meaningthat, like in their development,
they can't like move their fate, move their arm to protect
their airway or they can't rollover at a certain point and an
external stressor for thisspecific talk.
(07:37):
That external stressor is anunsleep, unsafe sleep position,
and when all of those thingshappen together it brews an
opportunity for really horriblethings to happen.
So can you tell us a little bitmore about the history of what
started off as back to sleep?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (07:56):
Yeah, so it started off as back to sleep.
So in 1992, the americanacademy of pediatrics started
recommending back or sidesleeping, typically really back
sleeping, for infants.
And then in 1994 was when thewhole back to sleep campaign
started.
Um, it was like a nationallaunch to encourage babies
(08:18):
sleeping on their back only anda couple other things that we'll
talk about to reduce the riskof SIDS.
This has reduced the risk ofyour baby dying right it has and
it's been effective um, it'sbeen effective.
So it's been um a 50 percentreduction in SIDS deaths.
Um, I want to say at least a50% reduction.
(08:41):
I've seen other sources sayquoted higher higher almost to
like 80% in the U?
S since it began, so reallyjust in the last 30 years, it's
had a huge impact and this canbe controversial because one of
the kind of like pillars of it,I guess, is having your baby
sleep like by themselves withnothing, so essentially not
(09:03):
co-sleeping, which a lot ofpeople like to do.
Um, I personally will never bedoing that If we have kids some
people do.
It does increase your risk ofyour baby dying and that's just
how it is.
Ed Delesky, MD (09:17):
Um, I couldn't help but think we're at an if
now.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (09:21):
Well, you know, you never know, you're
right.
You're right If we can't.
Ed Delesky, MD (09:24):
You're right, you're right, no.
So it sounds like theco-sleeping is the big thing.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (09:30):
Co-sleeping is a big thing.
Ed Delesky, MD (09:31):
And then so there's like a generational
feature.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (09:34):
Yeah, you know, like it's, I guess like
our parents' generation orgrandparents' generation I guess
you probably haven't heard it alot because you didn't actually
like work in peds a lot butlike people saying like, oh well
, like you know, like I put youin a crib with a million stuffed
(09:56):
animals or wrapped you up in ablanket when you were a newborn
and had no neck control, or like, oh, like I slept with a
blanket and I was fine.
But yeah, like I mean I don'thave an actual, solid number of
how many babies have died fromSIDS in the last 30 years or you
know before all of thathappened, but a lot of babies
(10:16):
did, and now at least 50% lessbabies are not dying because of
this Exactly.
Ed Delesky, MD (10:24):
And it's a simple intervention that we're
going to dive into a little bitmore on the specific detailed
recommendations, but it reallydoes sound like the co-sleeping
is the big culprit.
Having those loose objects nearyour baby is the culprit.
And one thing when we'recounseling people like you know,
(10:45):
when, like new mom comes in andthe inadvertent like someone
who's breastfeeding, theinadvertent like sleepiness that
can happen when like say that,like you're feeding your baby
and then you fall asleep andthen that's a really vulnerable
time.
It.
It sounds like so, like not allof this is intentional or
outright like defiance towardsthe American.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (11:06):
Yeah, like this doesn't happen because of,
of, like nefarious action of aparent.
It's just kind of the day today thing.
You know, your, your baby, hasno neck control.
If they aren't breathing andtheir body needs them to take a
breath, they can't move to dothat.
Ed Delesky, MD (11:27):
Exactly, and that's that like developmental
thing.
So I you know, thankfully thisis pretty rare.
Um, we don't have a like areadily available quote, but
SIDS is pretty rare and it tooka decent amount of time to
evaluate this and actually causethere are.
People are looking at this allthe time saying like how can we
reduce the risk of SIDS?
Because literally no one wantsthat to happen.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (11:49):
And like it shouldn't happen, like your
normal healthy baby, shouldn't?
Just you shouldn't go check onthem in the morning and they're
dead, because, like, that's whatit is.
Ed Delesky, MD (11:58):
And so when they came out with this and they
were able to find something totake that risk and lower it, it
was huge and it remains huge.
And so they had this wholecampaign to push the agenda
forward and tell everyone aboutit and be like you should be
executing these things at home,like this is how your baby
should be sleeping and likewe've talked about here, it's
(12:20):
not like it's not out ofmalintent that anyone's having
their baby like sleep in a weirdway.
It's just stuff that happens,unfortunately, when those three
things come together that wetalked about, that triple risk
model, the highlights from therecommendations from the
(12:40):
American Academy of Pediatrics,and maybe add in your own flair
of, like your counseling stylethat you would give someone when
you met them, Sure.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (12:50):
So we're always placing the infant on
their backs to go to sleep,especially when they're like at
that really young age where theycan't roll over.
They're staying on their backon a firm, flat, non-inclined
sleep surface okay, that's.
Ed Delesky, MD (13:06):
That's a lot of words there.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (13:07):
Firm yeah, firm, flat, no incline.
They actually make um, I don'tknow what the material of it is,
but they make like cribmattresses kind of specific, to
like help reduce this risk.
The um materials kind of likeum spongy, no, I guess, and like
(13:30):
airy um, and they actually willdo tests like just because I've
like seen people online andthey'll like put their face like
in the mattress and like youcan still breathe oh, so that's
kind of like in an effort tohelp reduce this.
Ed Delesky, MD (13:44):
I don't know what the material is but if you
like, look it up, you'll comeacross it online Room sharing
without bed sharing.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (13:51):
So this goes back to our co-sleeping.
Also, I want to point out therethat the Dockatot or anything
of that like similar structureis not meant for safe sleep.
It is not meant for you tosleep next to your baby while
they're asleep.
Ed Delesky, MD (14:10):
Explain what the Dockatot is a little bit.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (14:12):
The Dockatot is.
I mean, it's a great thing tohave for your baby when you're
supervising them or like whenyou're sitting next to them on
the couch.
It's kind of like a little ovalpillow.
It honestly kind of looks likea dog bed a little bit, with
like four sides and then thelittle indent where the baby
goes um.
I guess it has three sidesreally, but whatever, anyhow,
(14:35):
it's kind of yeah, that's likethe best way you can describe it
as like a little dog bed oh,okay for a baby so that they can
, like, um, sit, like it doeskind of have sides, but you
really are supposed to be likesupervising them and it like
says that all over the box andthat's again still not something
that you can reliably have thebaby sleep between the two of
(14:58):
you or next to you and justlike's going to be fine.
Ed Delesky, MD (15:00):
That's not what it's made for right, especially,
like you know, getting at the.
So co-sleeping has it's a.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (15:08):
It's a messy term because I think it leaves
opportunity formisinterpretation people think
like a docket or somethingsimilar to that is kind of like
the solution for safeco-sleeping and it is not okay
your baby is still at risk forsids, which means they are still
at risk for dying right.
Ed Delesky, MD (15:26):
Well, even like I can imagine someone like
flailing their arm overunexpectedly in like the middle
of the night, like if they'reright next to someone, so like
their baby that is um.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (15:38):
The next biggest highlight I would say
this is pretty high up there isto avoid, um, like loose bedding
, any soft objects, any blankets, really anything in the bed
should not be in the bed withthem, except the baby yeah.
Ed Delesky, MD (15:53):
So you said um loose bedding and like how do
you incorporate any sort ofblanket?
Are they just kind of like outthere in the the wind?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (16:02):
yeah, I mean you can put like a sleep sack on
them or something they're likeconnected to, kind of okay, I
guess I'll say or like a swaddleyeah, but no, um, or sometimes
people have those like cribliner things.
They kind of it's like I don'tknow how to describe it.
You know what I'm talking about.
Hey, it's really for more forlike a decoration sort of thing.
(16:25):
Um, that goes around like theoutside, on like the crib rails,
just none of that.
Crib mattress, crib sheet, baby, okay.
Ed Delesky, MD (16:35):
That's all you need.
That's all you need, and thereare a couple other things.
Um, cause I'm interested inhearing like a little bit more
about, like common pain pointsin conversation that you've had.
But a couple other things,because I'm interested in
hearing a little bit more aboutcommon pain points in
conversation that you've had buta couple other things from the
American Academy of Pediatricsthat have showed to reduce their
risk of SIDS as well, includingavoiding exposure to smoke,
drugs and alcohol, avoidingoverheating, and prenatal care
(16:58):
is incredibly important as well,and surprisingly I say this
sarcastically, like surprisinglywe know that vaccines are
incredibly safe and effectiveand should be.
We completely endorse the useof routine vaccination schedule
from the CDC, and that alsokeeps your child safe and
healthy.
But what are sort of pitfallsor misunderstandings that you've
(17:20):
experienced when describingthis to people?
Like, have you confrontedsomeone who feels really
strongly about this at somepoint?
Or maybe had a piece with, likeeducating someone when you're
you were on the floors doingthis?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (17:33):
well.
So like the hospital like tookit very seriously because, like
it has happened, where someonehas like brought a baby over to
like the couch for the parentsin the middle of the night and
like the baby has died, likethat has happened so like I mean
we did like this whole thing,um as part of the safe to sleep
(17:54):
campaign.
Um, I think a lot of pediatrichospitals probably do this.
There's like videos that loadinto the parents' TV, like for
them to watch education, that,like the nurses do handout like,
print out handouts on discharge, like that's all kind of part
of that um.
But we have had a lot ofparents who would like, for
(18:17):
whatever reason or another,would insist on like sleeping in
the hospital crib with the baby, or bringing the baby over to
the like parents couch or bed,um, and we like had them like
sign this whole thing.
It was like a discussion withthe doctor too, like this whole
thing, because I mean, peoplejust do this and it's like
happened in the hospital andthen a baby dies right.
Ed Delesky, MD (18:39):
actually now I have um some of the data from
the cdc.
The fast facts section of theirwebsite is that they have in
2022, they measured 700 suddenunexpected infant deaths and
1,529 of them were from SIDS,and that's some of the most
up-to-date data that we have.
(19:00):
They do calculate this stuffover the course of time but,
getting back to your point, italmost sounds like there were a
ton of materials and none ofthis stuff is free, like it
takes money to produce thosevideos and create those
deliverables and in no smallpart, some of that money or all
of it came from this programthat is now being threatened or,
(19:22):
if it's not already shut down,actively being shut down, which
is a huge public health riskyeah, I'm wondering, like at
what point that that educationgets taken down from the
Internet getting rid of thissentiment?
this not even a sentiment.
This like life-saving campaignand life-saving intervention.
(19:55):
Is there a movement because ofpeople's cultural beliefs about
like how their family, like howyour family, should behave at
night when you're sleeping, likeyeah, that's a big thing too,
but I mean the numbers are thereand you can't really argue with
that.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (20:15):
It's also one of those things like it is a
lot more rare now because ofthis.
Ed Delesky, MD (20:21):
Right.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (20:22):
So then, people, I feel like it's just
kind of one of those thingswhere it's like, oh, this is so
rare, like this isn't going tohappen to me or my baby.
And, like you, always thinkthat it won't.
Ed Delesky, MD (20:33):
Right and like we're talking about big numbers
here, like we quoted like 3 000,but like it's when you really
get on that individual level andit's you and your daily life,
and like that is devastating.
You quoted the 50 reduction insids and this campaign
altogether actually created thiswidespread change in behavior
(20:55):
where now fewer parents areplacing their babies on their
stomachs and they're placingthem on their backs.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (21:01):
And this is all like very simple stuff.
Ed Delesky, MD (21:03):
Yeah.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (21:03):
So I feel like if you were a parent, right
, this isn't like a heavy liftto do, and if it's like if I was
a new parent, I nothing aboutthis and I was being told by my
baby's pediatrician.
You know like, do x, y and z tokeep your kid the safest at
night or while they're sleeping.
Reduce their risk of suddenlydying for seemingly no reason.
(21:25):
It's a very simple thing to doand you know why not just do it
why not?
Ed Delesky, MD (21:32):
why not just do it?
And you know why not just do it, why not?
Why not just do it?
Yeah, I can't help but thinkabout um.
I've definitely walked in earlymorning, like 5 am, to the
hospital, like rounding on a newmom and like she's exhausted
because she just delivered andlike was in a really hard labor
and like she's breastfeeding herbaby and and the baby's laying
(21:52):
in the bed and she had noddedoff to sleep while she was
breastfeeding.
So this isn't a very scarything, but I really do want to
hone in that even people withthe best intentions and this
isn't to say that breastfeedingis bad, breastfeeding is good.
If you want to do it, go aheadand do it, and you should
probably.
But even people with the bestintentions, the biggest heart,
(22:16):
that like that's such avulnerable time and it's like
it's so innocent.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (22:20):
Just put them on a pulse ox so at least if
they were suffocating I couldwatch them on the monitor.
I guess that's harder on like alabor and delivery floor.
Ed Delesky, MD (22:30):
Totally Like a normal nursery or like wherever
the like recovery room is orwhatever happens.
Right, but like no one's inthere with them to watch them,
and like they're in a hospitalwhich is supposed to be like an
incredibly safe place.
But then this is also like,yeah, like you nudge them like
awake, and like there's a lot oflike you have to be very gentle
when you talk about that tooand like course correcting about
(22:54):
, hey, this is something thatyou have to be mindful of and
think about, especially maybeeven if it's a new parent and
they've never had to think aboutanything like this and in a
moment, your entire world haschanged.
Now you're responsible for thissmall living being.
So there's a lot, there's a lotof stuff here.
So there's a lot, there's a lotof stuff here, and I think this
(23:29):
campaign was and still is, forthe moment, extremely powerful
and not free.
This podcast is free, sohopefully it gets out there to
anyone who needs to listen, toput their baby back to sleep.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (23:36):
What other thoughts are you having?
How do you feel about theprogram getting cut?
No, I think that it'sunfortunate that something that
has been so proven to be soeffective maybe won't be there
anymore, or as much, and italmost sounded like earlier.
Ed Delesky, MD (23:50):
You were kind of implying that like when you
said, like, even like, how theCDC websites were taken down for
a period of time and they'rebeing, like, picked off at
various times.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (23:59):
Well, and there are certain like other
things that I think are beinglike limited from what I've seen
, which I won't go intospecifics.
I don't want to like misspeakon anything, but yeah.
Ed Delesky, MD (24:11):
Yeah, I guess when I was reading about this,
seeing this come up in the news,and I I think it's a damn shame
that this is happening this wayand just sitting here now
talking to you, I didn't evenconsider like the underlying
hidden agenda of like this,looking at this technique,
(24:32):
technique as a like getting ridof it and scrubbing the idea
yeah, because I feel like, oncethey like do that, then which
you can like cut this part.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (24:42):
but I feel like, um I haven't like actually
verified this, but there wassome I forget exactly what it
was something about like birthcontrol, like information,
information, something like offthe CDC website, and then I was
seeing like um, um, I think itwas like yeah, it was like HIV.
Ed Delesky, MD (25:00):
Yes and STIs.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (25:01):
And, like I've seen, this is this
information about this portionhas like strictly come from Tik
TOK, but I've seen like Tik TOKsof gay men going to the
pharmacy to like get their prepand then the pharmacist like
giving them like printed outinformation or and like stopping
and like taking time with themto be like, hey, this is going
(25:22):
to be like removed from the likeif this gets removed from the
internet soon.
Like dah, dah, dah, dah, dahdah.
Ed Delesky, MD (25:26):
Oh, yeah, yep, and this, maybe this is like the
opportunity for like a wholehealth misinformation, and like
how our information is travelingthese days, episode after this,
because that has absolutelybeen happening.
The treatment guidelines weretaken down, like even at work,
(25:49):
like people are like oh, Iwonder what's being taken down
today.
Or like things that doctors useevery day are to help make
decisions about treatment forpatients.
Like was removed, I believe itwas brought back up, but this
stuff changes day to day and so,like, by the time you listen to
this, who knows?
Yeah, but will this be thatagain?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (26:05):
And I like maybe, and like maybe it's, I
don't know like, oh, sids ratesare so low, we don't need to,
you know, know, go as hard onthis campaign.
But maybe I'll try to give thebenefit of the doubt and think
that that's why but, there arealso, like so many other, like
the marketing isn't as heavy incertain populations exactly and
(26:28):
SIDS rates are higher in likemore like black and indigenous
communities right so it's likenot hasn't fully reached
everywhere exactly they are,like, disproportionately
affected in that way, and soit's worth it.
Ed Delesky, MD (26:43):
It's worthwhile to keep pushing this and to keep
telling people, and I mean withthe way that, like, so much
information is free, right, likeyou go online, like we, you
consume any number of things inthe course of a day online, and
it's it is kind of crazy tothink that there's so much money
that it takes to producesomething like this, but it
makes sense.
Like marketing isn't free,right, campaigns like this
(27:06):
aren't free, but they'reworthwhile because they this
specific one is so simple, it'ssuch a light lift and it saves
lives and has saved lives, and Ithink maybe it'll be a
generational thing or maybeit'll just take another
administration where, like, thissentiment will keep going.
(27:27):
This is like style, thiscampaign, like we'll live on,
and like pediatricians practices, but if it goes away and then,
decades from now, people forget,it makes you wonder, yeah, so
thank you for coming back toanother episode of your checkup.
Hopefully you were able tolearn something for yourself, a
(27:47):
loved one or an infant neighborgoing to sleep.
Please check out our website.
If you found this helpful atall, send it to a new parent, or
if you have someone in yourfamily who's a new parent, or
send it just to a friend, aloved one or a neighbor and
check out our other episodes.
You can visit our website,email us at yourcheckuppod at
(28:08):
gmailcom and send us some fanmail.
We look at it all the time.
We love when we get messagesand we'll talk about them on the
show If it's anything like aquestion or something like that.
So thank you for coming backand we look forward to having
you back next week and, mostimportantly, stay healthy, my
friends, until next time.
I'm at the Lesky.
I'm Nicole.
(28:29):
Thank you and goodbye Bye.
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This is not medical advice oran attempt to substitute medical
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(28:49):
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In short, I'm not your doctor,I am not your nurse, and make
(29:11):
sure you go get your own checkupwith your own personal doctor.
Hi, welcome to your checkup.
We are the patient educationpodcast, where we bring
conversations from the doctor'soffice to your ears.
On this podcast, we try tobring medicine closer to its
patients.
I'm Ed Delesky, a familymedicine doctor in the
Philadelphia area.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (00:19):
And I'm Nicole Aruffo.
I'm a nurse.
Ed Delesky, MD (00:21):
And we are so excited you were able to join us
here again today.
It's been a great weekend sofar, very exciting.
I got to have some oysters lastnight.
You didn't get to join me inthat venture.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (00:38):
Sounds like I wasn't missing a lot.
Ed Delesky, MD (00:40):
No, I would say that if I'm going to like a
lukewarm, like reference I don'tknow it's a, I don't know.
Should I say the name of theplace or should I spare them?
I don't know I don't think weneed to slander anyone great,
but they were, um, they wereokay and they were very
expensive for being just okay.
I think about the oyster tripto Doc's that we took, where we
(01:05):
like those were great and Icouldn't get enough.
And they were huge.
These like large oysters thatthey labeled large.
Our intern, if you couldn'thear him, is very interested in
this conversation too.
You know they were OK.
I not too much to say aboutthem.
Ordered a crab dip, got a crabtoast instead.
(01:25):
Yeah, the dinner was a littlelukewarm.
You didn't come with us.
I went with Karthik and Mike.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (01:32):
The boys chat came over.
Ed Delesky, MD (01:33):
Yes, yes, they did, and they love their dirty
martini, I'll tell you my God.
And for the first time,hand-stuffed blue cheesed olives
um, with your help and you know, ziploc bags can become well.
It worked out really well, Ithink.
Uh, I don't know, what did youthink of those?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (01:55):
I thought they were delicious thank you I
think everyone else did too.
So did ollie so did ollie.
Ed Delesky, MD (02:02):
But um, just so that're clear, we don't let him
drink.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (02:06):
Oh, no, no, Not for little boys.
Ed Delesky, MD (02:08):
Definitely not.
Do you have any highlights fromthis week?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (02:14):
From the week ?
Honestly no.
Ed Delesky, MD (02:17):
Well, it's a much more calm week because I
didn't have like a whole icecream meltdown like I did last
week.
But there is a new ice creamplace that opened up down the
street that I'm interested intrying at some point yeah, maybe
we can go, like this week,because you're on vacation for
two weeks.
I am, so you know going to youI know, lucky me.
Getting ice cream would be fun.
And then we started runningtogether, which I love.
(02:37):
I think it's so fun, I feel sogreat about it and we do our
little.
Peloton runs outside.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (02:44):
Yeah, they have been fun until I can't walk
the next day, but it's okay.
Ed Delesky, MD (02:48):
Yeah, it turns out you probably have something
wrong with your feet.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (02:52):
Well, my feet keep going numb every time I
run, and they like have for thelast couple years, and I really
just like thought that I justhadn't found the right running
shoe for me.
So I went through a lot ofdifferent brands and now I'm
coming to realize it's probablylike I'm the problem.
Yeah, I think it's my feet, notmy shoes.
Ed Delesky, MD (03:14):
Totally.
Yeah, I think something else isgoing on there.
Especially when we came to theend you were like oh, like you
know, it was a hard run that wedid.
It was long Like a 60 minuterun is not a small thing and
then at the end you're like man,I just had to be careful there
for a while.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (03:34):
I just didn't want to step weird, so I can't
feel my feet.
Ed Delesky, MD (03:35):
Yeah, I was gonna like step weird or like do
something like I definitely getthat in the cold, but I think
that's a totally different thingthan what you're experiencing
whenever you go and do this, andyou're so nonchalantly said it
too.
You were just like, oh yeah, bythe way, like my feet get
really numb whenever we do theseintervals and then it's better
when I stop walk and when Istart walking, like jesus christ
(03:55):
, get in there.
We had um and all theexcitement of the the boys chat.
We did like a test run of the,the podcast set up for them
while we were.
You know, we had a recordedversion of american history
trivia that will never see thepublic's eye and or ears, and
mike got really excited with theum.
(04:16):
Well, to go back to hispodcasting days, right, because
he had the toothpick pod andthey would go and review
toothpicks Wait are you for real?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (04:26):
That's what it was?
Yeah, no, it was called thetoothpick pod Like a toothpick.
Ed Delesky, MD (04:30):
A toothpick review, yeah, and they would go
to different restaurants andthey would look at like they
would get the toothpicks andthen they would talk about other
stuff.
They had different segments.
They did it when they were incollege.
They had a whole setup.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (04:43):
How many episodes did they do?
Ed Delesky, MD (04:45):
I'm not entirely sure.
I certainly hope that he'slistening in his basement right
now and he's going to send insome fan mail Doing basement
things, doing basement things,all right.
So what are we going to talkabout today?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (04:56):
Nick, today we're talking about safe sleep,
and I don't want to hear an eyeroll from anyone.
Why?
Ed Delesky, MD (05:03):
would we hear an eye roll from anyone?
Why would we hear an eye rollfrom anyone about this?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (05:07):
It's a little controversial, I think.
Oh, for some reason.
Ed Delesky, MD (05:12):
Well, that's a weird thing.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (05:13):
Yeah.
Ed Delesky, MD (05:14):
To be controversial about, especially
given that it was so effective,yeah, at preventing what it was
supposed to prevent.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (05:22):
Yeah, well, you know.
Ed Delesky, MD (05:27):
Yeah Well, you know.
Yeah Well, I guess one thingyou're going to serve as our
expert here today, because thisis one of the foundations of
your career.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (05:33):
Yeah, the foundation of my career has been
educating parents on safe sleepfor their infants, so they
don't die.
Ed Delesky, MD (05:40):
Right, and so to prevent that, they created this
program.
But the reason that we'retalking about it here today is
because we were seeing in thenews.
We were seeing in the news thatthere are reports of funding
being cut for this campaign.
The safe to sleep is a campaign.
We're going to talk about allof that, but it seems like this
current administration islooking to reduce the funding
(06:03):
for the safe sleep, or safe tosleep campaign, outreach and
materials, and that's why we'regoing to talk about it here
today.
So why don't we dive in and getat the core thing, because this
is such an important topic?
The campaign and intervention,I guess, is really what it is.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (06:23):
Yeah, I mean, if you've been to a
pediatrician in the last 30years, you've gotten this spiel.
But I mean it's not for nothing.
So Totally.
Ed Delesky, MD (06:31):
All of this is born out of a certain idea of
preventing SIDS or, I guess,s-u-i-d.
Can you tell us a little bitabout what those actually are?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (06:41):
Yes, so SIDS, which, if you for some reason
have never heard of it before,it's sudden infant death
syndrome, which is unexplaineddeath in infants under one year
old, and this typically happensduring their sleep.
Suid is essentially the samething, but a little different.
(07:02):
It stands for sudden,unexpected infant death, which
includes, um, it's kind of anumbrella, so it includes SIDS,
and then accidental suffocationand unknown, unknown causes.
Ed Delesky, MD (07:16):
And when I was looking at this cause, this is a
part of our practice.
It's like this type of thingSIDS occurs when three things
overlap and it takes avulnerable infant, a critical
period in development meaningthat, like in their development,
they can't like move their fate, move their arm to protect
their airway or they can't rollover at a certain point and an
external stressor for thisspecific talk.
(07:37):
That external stressor is anunsleep, unsafe sleep position,
and when all of those thingshappen together it brews an
opportunity for really horriblethings to happen.
So can you tell us a little bitmore about the history of what
started off as back to sleep?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (07:56):
Yeah, so it started off as back to sleep.
So in 1992, the americanacademy of pediatrics started
recommending back or sidesleeping, typically really back
sleeping, for infants.
And then in 1994 was when thewhole back to sleep campaign
started.
Um, it was like a nationallaunch to encourage babies
(08:18):
sleeping on their back only anda couple other things that we'll
talk about to reduce the riskof SIDS.
This has reduced the risk ofyour baby dying right it has and
it's been effective um, it'sbeen effective.
So it's been um a 50 percentreduction in SIDS deaths.
Um, I want to say at least a50% reduction.
(08:41):
I've seen other sources sayquoted higher higher almost to
like 80% in the U?
S since it began, so reallyjust in the last 30 years, it's
had a huge impact and this canbe controversial because one of
the kind of like pillars of it,I guess, is having your baby
sleep like by themselves withnothing, so essentially not
(09:03):
co-sleeping, which a lot ofpeople like to do.
Um, I personally will never bedoing that If we have kids some
people do.
It does increase your risk ofyour baby dying and that's just
how it is.
Ed Delesky, MD (09:17):
Um, I couldn't help but think we're at an if
now.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (09:21):
Well, you know, you never know, you're
right.
You're right If we can't.
Ed Delesky, MD (09:24):
You're right, you're right, no.
So it sounds like theco-sleeping is the big thing.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (09:30):
Co-sleeping is a big thing.
Ed Delesky, MD (09:31):
And then so there's like a generational
feature.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (09:34):
Yeah, you know, like it's, I guess like
our parents' generation orgrandparents' generation I guess
you probably haven't heard it alot because you didn't actually
like work in peds a lot butlike people saying like, oh well
, like you know, like I put youin a crib with a million stuffed
(09:56):
animals or wrapped you up in ablanket when you were a newborn
and had no neck control, or like, oh, like I slept with a
blanket and I was fine.
But yeah, like I mean I don'thave an actual, solid number of
how many babies have died fromSIDS in the last 30 years or you
know before all of thathappened, but a lot of babies
(10:16):
did, and now at least 50% lessbabies are not dying because of
this Exactly.
Ed Delesky, MD (10:24):
And it's a simple intervention that we're
going to dive into a little bitmore on the specific detailed
recommendations, but it reallydoes sound like the co-sleeping
is the big culprit.
Having those loose objects nearyour baby is the culprit.
And one thing when we'recounseling people like you know,
(10:45):
when, like new mom comes in andthe inadvertent like someone
who's breastfeeding, theinadvertent like sleepiness that
can happen when like say that,like you're feeding your baby
and then you fall asleep andthen that's a really vulnerable
time.
It.
It sounds like so, like not allof this is intentional or
outright like defiance towardsthe American.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (11:06):
Yeah, like this doesn't happen because of,
of, like nefarious action of aparent.
It's just kind of the day today thing.
You know, your, your baby, hasno neck control.
If they aren't breathing andtheir body needs them to take a
breath, they can't move to dothat.
Ed Delesky, MD (11:27):
Exactly, and that's that like developmental
thing.
So I you know, thankfully thisis pretty rare.
Um, we don't have a like areadily available quote, but
SIDS is pretty rare and it tooka decent amount of time to
evaluate this and actually causethere are.
People are looking at this allthe time saying like how can we
reduce the risk of SIDS?
Because literally no one wantsthat to happen.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (11:49):
And like it shouldn't happen, like your
normal healthy baby, shouldn't?
Just you shouldn't go check onthem in the morning and they're
dead, because, like, that's whatit is.
Ed Delesky, MD (11:58):
And so when they came out with this and they
were able to find something totake that risk and lower it, it
was huge and it remains huge.
And so they had this wholecampaign to push the agenda
forward and tell everyone aboutit and be like you should be
executing these things at home,like this is how your baby
should be sleeping and likewe've talked about here, it's
(12:20):
not like it's not out ofmalintent that anyone's having
their baby like sleep in a weirdway.
It's just stuff that happens,unfortunately, when those three
things come together that wetalked about, that triple risk
model, the highlights from therecommendations from the
(12:40):
American Academy of Pediatrics,and maybe add in your own flair
of, like your counseling stylethat you would give someone when
you met them, Sure.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (12:50):
So we're always placing the infant on
their backs to go to sleep,especially when they're like at
that really young age where theycan't roll over.
They're staying on their backon a firm, flat, non-inclined
sleep surface okay, that's.
Ed Delesky, MD (13:06):
That's a lot of words there.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (13:07):
Firm yeah, firm, flat, no incline.
They actually make um, I don'tknow what the material of it is,
but they make like cribmattresses kind of specific, to
like help reduce this risk.
The um materials kind of likeum spongy, no, I guess, and like
(13:30):
airy um, and they actually willdo tests like just because I've
like seen people online andthey'll like put their face like
in the mattress and like youcan still breathe oh, so that's
kind of like in an effort tohelp reduce this.
Ed Delesky, MD (13:44):
I don't know what the material is but if you
like, look it up, you'll comeacross it online Room sharing
without bed sharing.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (13:51):
So this goes back to our co-sleeping.
Also, I want to point out therethat the Dockatot or anything
of that like similar structureis not meant for safe sleep.
It is not meant for you tosleep next to your baby while
they're asleep.
Ed Delesky, MD (14:10):
Explain what the Dockatot is a little bit.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (14:12):
The Dockatot is.
I mean, it's a great thing tohave for your baby when you're
supervising them or like whenyou're sitting next to them on
the couch.
It's kind of like a little ovalpillow.
It honestly kind of looks likea dog bed a little bit, with
like four sides and then thelittle indent where the baby
goes um.
I guess it has three sidesreally, but whatever, anyhow,
(14:35):
it's kind of yeah, that's likethe best way you can describe it
as like a little dog bed oh,okay for a baby so that they can
, like, um, sit, like it doeskind of have sides, but you
really are supposed to be likesupervising them and it like
says that all over the box andthat's again still not something
that you can reliably have thebaby sleep between the two of
(14:58):
you or next to you and justlike's going to be fine.
Ed Delesky, MD (15:00):
That's not what it's made for right, especially,
like you know, getting at the.
So co-sleeping has it's a.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (15:08):
It's a messy term because I think it leaves
opportunity formisinterpretation people think
like a docket or somethingsimilar to that is kind of like
the solution for safeco-sleeping and it is not okay
your baby is still at risk forsids, which means they are still
at risk for dying right.
Ed Delesky, MD (15:26):
Well, even like I can imagine someone like
flailing their arm overunexpectedly in like the middle
of the night, like if they'reright next to someone, so like
their baby that is um.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (15:38):
The next biggest highlight I would say
this is pretty high up there isto avoid, um, like loose bedding
, any soft objects, any blankets, really anything in the bed
should not be in the bed withthem, except the baby yeah.
Ed Delesky, MD (15:53):
So you said um loose bedding and like how do
you incorporate any sort ofblanket?
Are they just kind of like outthere in the the wind?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (16:02):
yeah, I mean you can put like a sleep sack on
them or something they're likeconnected to, kind of okay, I
guess I'll say or like a swaddleyeah, but no, um, or sometimes
people have those like cribliner things.
They kind of it's like I don'tknow how to describe it.
You know what I'm talking about.
Hey, it's really for more forlike a decoration sort of thing.
(16:25):
Um, that goes around like theoutside, on like the crib rails,
just none of that.
Crib mattress, crib sheet, baby, okay.
Ed Delesky, MD (16:35):
That's all you need.
That's all you need, and thereare a couple other things.
Um, cause I'm interested inhearing like a little bit more
about, like common pain pointsin conversation that you've had.
But a couple other things,because I'm interested in
hearing a little bit more aboutcommon pain points in
conversation that you've had buta couple other things from the
American Academy of Pediatricsthat have showed to reduce their
risk of SIDS as well, includingavoiding exposure to smoke,
drugs and alcohol, avoidingoverheating, and prenatal care
(16:58):
is incredibly important as well,and surprisingly I say this
sarcastically, like surprisinglywe know that vaccines are
incredibly safe and effectiveand should be.
We completely endorse the useof routine vaccination schedule
from the CDC, and that alsokeeps your child safe and
healthy.
But what are sort of pitfallsor misunderstandings that you've
(17:20):
experienced when describingthis to people?
Like, have you confrontedsomeone who feels really
strongly about this at somepoint?
Or maybe had a piece with, likeeducating someone when you're
you were on the floors doingthis?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (17:33):
well.
So like the hospital like tookit very seriously because, like
it has happened, where someonehas like brought a baby over to
like the couch for the parentsin the middle of the night and
like the baby has died, likethat has happened so like I mean
we did like this whole thing,um as part of the safe to sleep
(17:54):
campaign.
Um, I think a lot of pediatrichospitals probably do this.
There's like videos that loadinto the parents' TV, like for
them to watch education, that,like the nurses do handout like,
print out handouts on discharge, like that's all kind of part
of that um.
But we have had a lot ofparents who would like, for
(18:17):
whatever reason or another,would insist on like sleeping in
the hospital crib with the baby, or bringing the baby over to
the like parents couch or bed,um, and we like had them like
sign this whole thing.
It was like a discussion withthe doctor too, like this whole
thing, because I mean, peoplejust do this and it's like
happened in the hospital andthen a baby dies right.
Ed Delesky, MD (18:39):
actually now I have um some of the data from
the cdc.
The fast facts section of theirwebsite is that they have in
2022, they measured 700 suddenunexpected infant deaths and
1,529 of them were from SIDS,and that's some of the most
up-to-date data that we have.
(19:00):
They do calculate this stuffover the course of time but,
getting back to your point, italmost sounds like there were a
ton of materials and none ofthis stuff is free, like it
takes money to produce thosevideos and create those
deliverables and in no smallpart, some of that money or all
of it came from this programthat is now being threatened or,
(19:22):
if it's not already shut down,actively being shut down, which
is a huge public health riskyeah, I'm wondering, like at
what point that that educationgets taken down from the
Internet getting rid of thissentiment?
this not even a sentiment.
This like life-saving campaignand life-saving intervention.
(19:55):
Is there a movement because ofpeople's cultural beliefs about
like how their family, like howyour family, should behave at
night when you're sleeping, likeyeah, that's a big thing too,
but I mean the numbers are thereand you can't really argue with
that.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (20:15):
It's also one of those things like it is a
lot more rare now because ofthis.
Ed Delesky, MD (20:21):
Right.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (20:22):
So then, people, I feel like it's just
kind of one of those thingswhere it's like, oh, this is so
rare, like this isn't going tohappen to me or my baby.
And, like you, always thinkthat it won't.
Ed Delesky, MD (20:33):
Right and like we're talking about big numbers
here, like we quoted like 3 000,but like it's when you really
get on that individual level andit's you and your daily life,
and like that is devastating.
You quoted the 50 reduction insids and this campaign
altogether actually created thiswidespread change in behavior
(20:55):
where now fewer parents areplacing their babies on their
stomachs and they're placingthem on their backs.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (21:01):
And this is all like very simple stuff.
Ed Delesky, MD (21:03):
Yeah.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (21:03):
So I feel like if you were a parent, right
, this isn't like a heavy liftto do, and if it's like if I was
a new parent, I nothing aboutthis and I was being told by my
baby's pediatrician.
You know like, do x, y and z tokeep your kid the safest at
night or while they're sleeping.
Reduce their risk of suddenlydying for seemingly no reason.
(21:25):
It's a very simple thing to doand you know why not just do it
why not?
Ed Delesky, MD (21:32):
why not just do it?
And you know why not just do it, why not?
Why not just do it?
Yeah, I can't help but thinkabout um.
I've definitely walked in earlymorning, like 5 am, to the
hospital, like rounding on a newmom and like she's exhausted
because she just delivered andlike was in a really hard labor
and like she's breastfeeding herbaby and and the baby's laying
(21:52):
in the bed and she had noddedoff to sleep while she was
breastfeeding.
So this isn't a very scarything, but I really do want to
hone in that even people withthe best intentions and this
isn't to say that breastfeedingis bad, breastfeeding is good.
If you want to do it, go aheadand do it, and you should
probably.
But even people with the bestintentions, the biggest heart,
(22:16):
that like that's such avulnerable time and it's like
it's so innocent.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (22:20):
Just put them on a pulse ox so at least if
they were suffocating I couldwatch them on the monitor.
I guess that's harder on like alabor and delivery floor.
Ed Delesky, MD (22:30):
Totally Like a normal nursery or like wherever
the like recovery room is orwhatever happens.
Right, but like no one's inthere with them to watch them,
and like they're in a hospitalwhich is supposed to be like an
incredibly safe place.
But then this is also like,yeah, like you nudge them like
awake, and like there's a lot oflike you have to be very gentle
when you talk about that tooand like course correcting about
(22:54):
, hey, this is something thatyou have to be mindful of and
think about, especially maybeeven if it's a new parent and
they've never had to think aboutanything like this and in a
moment, your entire world haschanged.
Now you're responsible for thissmall living being.
So there's a lot, there's a lotof stuff here.
So there's a lot, there's a lotof stuff here, and I think this
(23:29):
campaign was and still is, forthe moment, extremely powerful
and not free.
This podcast is free, sohopefully it gets out there to
anyone who needs to listen, toput their baby back to sleep.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (23:36):
What other thoughts are you having?
How do you feel about theprogram getting cut?
No, I think that it'sunfortunate that something that
has been so proven to be soeffective maybe won't be there
anymore, or as much, and italmost sounded like earlier.
Ed Delesky, MD (23:50):
You were kind of implying that like when you
said, like, even like, how theCDC websites were taken down for
a period of time and they'rebeing, like, picked off at
various times.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (23:59):
Well, and there are certain like other
things that I think are beinglike limited from what I've seen
, which I won't go intospecifics.
I don't want to like misspeakon anything, but yeah.
Ed Delesky, MD (24:11):
Yeah, I guess when I was reading about this,
seeing this come up in the news,and I I think it's a damn shame
that this is happening this wayand just sitting here now
talking to you, I didn't evenconsider like the underlying
hidden agenda of like this,looking at this technique,
(24:32):
technique as a like getting ridof it and scrubbing the idea
yeah, because I feel like, oncethey like do that, then which
you can like cut this part.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (24:42):
but I feel like, um I haven't like actually
verified this, but there wassome I forget exactly what it
was something about like birthcontrol, like information,
information, something like offthe CDC website, and then I was
seeing like um, um, I think itwas like yeah, it was like HIV.
Ed Delesky, MD (25:00):
Yes and STIs.
Nicole Aruffo, RN (25:01):
And, like I've seen, this is this
information about this portionhas like strictly come from Tik
TOK, but I've seen like Tik TOKsof gay men going to the
pharmacy to like get their prepand then the pharmacist like
giving them like printed outinformation or and like stopping
and like taking time with themto be like, hey, this is going
(25:22):
to be like removed from the likeif this gets removed from the
internet soon.
Like dah, dah, dah, dah, dahdah.
Ed Delesky, MD (25:26):
Oh, yeah, yep, and this, maybe this is like the
opportunity for like a wholehealth misinformation, and like
how our information is travelingthese days, episode after this,
because that has absolutelybeen happening.
The treatment guidelines weretaken down, like even at work,
(25:49):
like people are like oh, Iwonder what's being taken down
today.
Or like things that doctors useevery day are to help make
decisions about treatment forpatients.
Like was removed, I believe itwas brought back up, but this
stuff changes day to day and so,like, by the time you listen to
this, who knows?
Yeah, but will this be thatagain?
Nicole Aruffo, RN (26:05):
And I like maybe, and like maybe it's, I
don't know like, oh, sids ratesare so low, we don't need to,
you know, know, go as hard onthis campaign.
But maybe I'll try to give thebenefit of the doubt and think
that that's why but, there arealso, like so many other, like
the marketing isn't as heavy incertain populations exactly and
(26:28):
SIDS rates are higher in likemore like black and indigenous
communities right so it's likenot hasn't fully reached
everywhere exactly they are,like, disproportionately
affected in that way, and soit's worth it.
Ed Delesky, MD (26:43):
It's worthwhile to keep pushing this and to keep
telling people, and I mean withthe way that, like, so much
information is free, right, likeyou go online, like we, you
consume any number of things inthe course of a day online, and
it's it is kind of crazy tothink that there's so much money
that it takes to producesomething like this, but it
makes sense.
Like marketing isn't free,right, campaigns like this
(27:06):
aren't free, but they'reworthwhile because they this
specific one is so simple, it'ssuch a light lift and it saves
lives and has saved lives, and Ithink maybe it'll be a
generational thing or maybeit'll just take another
administration where, like, thissentiment will keep going.
(27:27):
This is like style, thiscampaign, like we'll live on,
and like pediatricians practices, but if it goes away and then,
decades from now, people forget,it makes you wonder, yeah, so
thank you for coming back toanother episode of your checkup.
Hopefully you were able tolearn something for yourself, a
(27:47):
loved one or an infant neighborgoing to sleep.
Please check out our website.
If you found this helpful atall, send it to a new parent, or
if you have someone in yourfamily who's a new parent, or
send it just to a friend, aloved one or a neighbor and
check out our other episodes.
You can visit our website,email us at yourcheckuppod at
(28:08):
gmailcom and send us some fanmail.
We look at it all the time.
We love when we get messagesand we'll talk about them on the
show If it's anything like aquestion or something like that.
So thank you for coming backand we look forward to having
you back next week and, mostimportantly, stay healthy, my
friends, until next time.
I'm at the Lesky.
I'm Nicole.
(28:29):
Thank you and goodbye Bye.
This information may provide abrief overview of diagnosis,
treatment and medications.
It's not exhaustive and is atool to help you understand
potential options about yourhealth.
It doesn't cover all detailsabout conditions, treatments or
medications for a specificperson.
This is not medical advice oran attempt to substitute medical
advice.
(28:49):
You should contact a healthcare provider for personalized
guidance based on your uniquecircumstances.
We explicitly disclaim anyliability relating to the
information given or its use.
This content doesn't endorseany treatments or medications
for a specific patient.
Always talk to your healthcareprovider for complete
information tailored to you.
In short, I'm not your doctor,I am not your nurse, and make
(29:11):
sure you go get your own checkupwith your own personal doctor.
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