March 3, 2025 • 31 mins
Victor shares his personal story of evolving from a reluctant runner to a marathon coach
Discusses the significance of understanding biomechanics in running
Explores common injuries beginners face and how to prevent them
Offers advice on nutrition and supplements for optimal marathon performance
Highlights the importance of mental fitness during running endeavors
Encourages listeners to seek coaching for better results and experience runner's high
Learn More at: www.Redefine-Fitness.com
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
Hello and welcome to another episode of Health and
Fitness Redefined.
I'm your host, anthony.
Today we have another greatepisode for all of you out today
.
Maybe for those that are notlike me will enjoy this episode,
and those that are like me, Iwould suggest tuning out now,
because if I think about running, I want to throw my face
(00:28):
through a wall, but without allkidding aside without further
ado, let's welcome to the show,victor.
Victor, it's just a pleasure tobe on today.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Thank you, it's my pleasure, it's an honor to be
here.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Yeah, I know I was doing some digging into you all
about marathon running, trainingfor it.
It's definitely not my cup oftea.
I'd much rather sit there andlift weights for three hours
than pretend to run.
If I can drive a car 13 or 26miles, we're good, um,
irregardless.
(01:03):
Tell me a little bit about howyou got into that realm and
we'll go from there.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Yeah, absolutely, and I was the same.
I didn't.
Running wasn't my favoritething.
I was doing a little bit ofboxing before, amateur boxing at
around age 16, 17.
And then, but even then when Iwas training, I loved the
training for boxing but I didnot like the running part
(01:30):
because it would make us run alittle bit.
That was my least favorite part.
Then I got into weightliftingand I liked that part, and every
once in a while I would try alittle bit of cardio, like doing
a couple of miles on thetreadmill.
But it still wasn't my favoritething to do.
And it wasn't until my sisterasked me to join her to train
(01:55):
for a marathon, a full marathon,that I decided, okay, it'll be
nice to have that under my belt,and if she's done it, it can't
be that hard.
But at the same time I wasworking at UPS, so my job was
very physical and as I startedto run, training for that
(02:19):
marathon, I felt more agile.
I guess it seemed to complementthe work that I was doing.
So I started to like therunning and then I experienced
that runner's high and that'swhen I really started to looking
forward to the long runs,because I would get into these
(02:39):
runner's high where I wasfeeling euphoric, I felt great,
I felt like I could run forever,but it was still.
My mind was I was only going todo one marathon and over and
done with.
But right after I got done withmy first marathon, I wanted to
beat that time that I did thefirst one I think it was 342.
(03:02):
And I thought you know what Ican do better next time.
So I registered for the nextyear and it was the LA Marathon
at the time and then I wanted toqualify for the Boston Marathon
and that took me six years oftraining before I qualified.
By then I was pretty addictiveto running and I'm still running
(03:23):
marathons.
Pretty addictive to running andI'm still running marathons.
But once I retired from UPS, Idecided to become a full-time
coach, and that was about threeyears ago.
So I've been doing full-timecoaching since then.
Speaker 1 (03:38):
Awesome man, I knew I never experienced that runner's
high.
Maybe that's why it just neverhappened.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
It just never got me.
Never happened because runner'sdemise is a better way of
putting it.
Every step sucks.
It's pretty amazing.
I mean you still go throughthat like you're high and then
once so every once in a whileyou reach, uh, a wall, what they
call.
We hit the wall, or you startrunning out of energy and then
(04:08):
it comes back and it's up anddown, but you look forward to I
sometimes look forward torunning because I know I can get
there.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
I love that.
So there's two sides to runningmarathons, and I know you're a
coach for it, so we're going toreally dive into this right.
The first side isbiomechanically how how you're
actually moving through a planeof motion, what muscles are
activating, how they'reactivating.
And the second side of that ismental fitness.
It's the willingness to pushforward.
(04:41):
Okay, one more step, one morestep, one more step to say that
to yourself about three and ahalf hours, and then eventually
you'll get to the finish line,depending how slow you're going.
So I think the best place tostart would be biomechanically,
because I think a lot of peopleunderstand the mental side.
They have a understanding.
If I'm going to do this, I wantto finish for myself.
(05:01):
But biomechanically, howsomeone moves, I feel like a lot
of people run wrong.
Yeah, start with.
What are some tips, what aresome things you look for for
somebody who is getting intorunning, wants to run a marathon
and just kind of break down thebiomechanics of it?
Speaker 2 (05:23):
Yeah, so the biomechanics is huge.
So the biomechanics is huge,the understanding because,
you're right, a lot of peopledon't understand they uh,
including myself.
When I first started runningit's like I thought you just go
out and you start running.
And even now I've told themsome of my friends that I do
coaching for running.
Actually it was a friend ofmine that did the boxing and was
(05:44):
like people need coaching forrunning.
He thought you just run andit's like when I started running
I discovered that you can gethurt very easy if you just keep
on running.
Our bodies can only handle somuch.
So it's kind of likeweightlifting, in the same sense
that you know you're using thesame muscles over and over.
(06:06):
They fatigue and they breakdown or you tear muscles.
So it's progressive.
If you're going to do amarathon and you're new at it,
best thing to do is get atraining plan and follow that
training plan slowly,progressively, and dedicate the
(06:26):
time needed for the training andslow you know it's a slow
process, getting a pace that'sright for you when depending on
your fitness level.
But it's a progressive thing.
You're not going to go outevery run and run your hardest.
You're going to have some runsthat are hard running.
(06:49):
You're going to have some runsthat are slow and that's how you
build your endurance and youstart adding.
Most programs will start addingone mile or 10% a week to their
mileage so that you canprogressively build that
endurance.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
So you mentioned common injuries inside of
running.
What are the most commoninjuries you see?
Speaker 2 (07:15):
I think for beginners it's usually the shin splints.
They start to experience shinsplint and usually because they
are running a little bit toofast for the time that they've
done it.
So let's slow down if you'reexperiencing shin splints.
And then the other ones is thecalves or ankles a lot of
sprained ankles, and Achilles isanother one.
(07:38):
So calves and Achilles tearsare very common.
Again, it could be due to aweakness in the muscles or just
overuse at one time.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
You know, just not allowing them to build those
muscles or their strengths yeah,I gotta say shin splints is
definitely the first one that'spreventing me from running for
years and just understandingwhat shin splints is.
So I think a brief explanationof that for those that don't
know because I get asked thisquestion all the time what the
hell?
Shin splints?
It's micro fractures inside ofyour shin bone.
(08:12):
So the reason they freaking,hurt so much, is because you're
fracturing the bone inside theshin.
Why is it caused?
Yeah, a couple different waysto cause shin splints, but the
most common is it's how you'rerunning.
When you run heavy is, I guess,the quote they use like the
fancy term where if you everhear someone running on a
(08:32):
treadmill, it's boom, boom, boom.
Yeah, pounding Foot isn'tdorsiflexing.
Dorsiflexing meaning, if thisis my hands, my foot for those
watching video, but otherwisejust flexing upwards.
So I take my toes and try topoint it towards the ceiling.
That muscle that runs over theshin bone is called the anterior
tibialis or your atib.
(08:52):
It controls dorsiflexion andpeople just don't train it.
They work a lot of theantagonist muscle you mentioned,
your calf or your gastrocnemiusis the antagonist to the A-tib.
So if you're overworking, yourmuscle is getting super tight,
right, you can imagine the calfmuscle.
Getting super tight, your toe isgoing to point down.
It makes it even harder to doany sort of dorsiflexion while
(09:18):
you're running and just overuseof that is going to really make
it hard to do so training your.
A-tib is the easy fix.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Yes, and then posture .
You know, when you're running,having the proper posture, the
perfect form and landing withyour forefoot instead of heel
striking and I think that's thenumber one thing that,
especially if they're runninglike a downhill and they're
landing their foot in front ofthem, then exactly what you said
you mentioned, you know you hitthat heel and that shoggle
(09:50):
straight up those shin splints.
It's straight up in a lot ofother areas.
People have back pains.
All kinds of bad stuff happenswhen because you're basically
hitting the brake, when you'regoing down, every time you land,
whereas if you can land in thecenter of gravity, you're going
to minimize that impact.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Yeah, it's kind of what you said.
A lot what we learned in schoolright, heel-toe, heel-toe.
But realistically that's nothow you want to run whatsoever.
So a lot of people try to trainthemselves to run heel-toe and
they realize, oh shit, thishurts a lot.
When you mentioned you want toland with your whole foot flat
and this has been a big pushrecently with, like, barefoot
shoes is teaching people don'tland on your heel, that's going
(10:37):
to send pain straight up throughyour knee and through your shin
bone, will let the impact takeover your whole entire foot and
then you flex your way throughthat.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
So teaching people how to run, because if you run
wrong, the wrong way, over andover again, especially 26.2
miles, you're just gonna destroyyour body absolutely yes and
and like again, uh, landing inthe center of gravity, and
minimize that and also the timethat that foot spends on the
(11:05):
floor will minimize or willprolong the energy, because if
the shorter, you know, if you'retapping the floor, you're not
putting all that weight on thefoot because it's just tapping,
tapping, tapping, tapping, yeah,yeah.
And then using the musclesbecause you were talking about
(11:28):
what muscles you use, and Ithink engaging when you're doing
26.2 miles is learning toengage all your muscles, but
especially the quads, the calvesand the major ones, of course,
but then you're using all ofthem.
You're using your abdominals,even your arms, when you're
(11:50):
swinging.
But if you do it moreconsciously, where you're not
focused on the legs, if the legstarts to hurt, you know, then
just focus.
I do a lot of counting mycadence when I'm running, so
I'll start to count with my arms.
You know my arm swings insteadof the steps that I'm taking and
(12:15):
that, just I feel like it sendsthe energy more towards my arms
instead of all towards my legs.
But it's those little thingsthat over 26 miles is going to
make a huge difference, becauseyou are trying to engage all of
your muscles differently and soit's not one muscle gets over
stress.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Yeah, and you mentioned posture as you're
running, so can you explain alittle bit of how you, how your
posture should look, based uponwalking, jogging, running?
Yes.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
When you're running.
Well, basically, when you'rerunning, you should have a
little bit of a forward lean,but not hunched, because once
people get tired, what they tendto do is to start hunching and
their head starts to go lower.
So this the head's so muchheavier than the rest of the
body, it's in proportion, youknow.
So it does create this pressureon the back when they start to
(13:06):
look down because they'refatigued, and you'll be
surprised of people don'trealize what they start doing
once they get tired, untilsomeone tells them hey, you're
like bent over or you're runningto the side like this, and
they're not aware of it justbecause something started to
ache.
And so, upright, with a littlelean forward and preferably
(13:29):
looking straight at the horizon,because people do tend to start
to look down when they gofatigued and then their head
follows.
Then arm swings also.
If you're running low jog, youdon't have to swing your arm.
The faster you go, the more armswing you want to do,
(13:49):
especially on the uphills.
Then you really want to evenshort run, but you want to
really move those arms to helpyou balance out.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
Yeah, I think pushing arms can help you go if you're
doing more of a sprint type ofthing, Switching in from an
aerobic straight cadence runningto more of an anaerobic sprint
without oxygen, full out, 100feet to the finish line go.
You're showing off to everyoneat the end that didn't watch you
(14:19):
on the 26 miles, they're justwatching the 0.2.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Yeah, and then you have walkers, because a lot of
the older clients I deal withwill practice the walk run
method and I've done marathonswhere I've done better with
taking those walking breaks.
I did a full marathon inColorado where I ran every mile
(14:42):
and I walked at every mile.
I walked about 10 seconds andoverall my time was better than
some of the other ones.
And it's just that time torecover.
And when you walk, you know why, say again, do you know why?
I think just the, the recoverytime is what I've and it gets
the time to your muscles torecover from that.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
so you're in colorado , you said right.
So it's high altitude.
Oh, yes, yeah.
So that high altitude actuallypromotes not working.
Instead of crib cycle, which isthe energy cycle you're using
from running long distances, youwant to switch, which is what I
mentioned before, to more of ananaerobic cycle, something
that's shorter, so not using theoxygen to promote, promote
(15:28):
constant energy, and it's thealtitude that really prevented
you from staying in the steadystate cardio and pushing you
more into an anaerobic side ofit, which is it's funny.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
you say that it's just so true, like when you
think about like oh shit, yeahyes, yes, and but in people who
start training withincorporating some runs into
their walks seem to injurethemselves a little bit less
than people that don't practicethat.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
Yeah, I can definitely see that.
I guess another common ailment,injury it's all in the same
relative, but a meniscus issues.
So at the end of part ofpeople's knees you're always
like, oh yeah, it's at manyhertz.
Um, different things can cause.
But I think over what's theproper way to put this stepping
(16:20):
too far or reaching too far withyour foot, as opposed to not
like you don't want to go 100,reaching as far as you can.
So why don't you explain alittle bit as far as pace is
what everyone calls itgenerically, so what should be a
generic like how do you knowwhere to pace at and what does
your stride length look likeinside that?
Speaker 2 (16:43):
well.
The pace is the speed thatyou're running at, which is
going to be different foreverybody, and it's your fitness
level, but something that youcan start to measure what you
can handle in the track.
And there's some formulas thatreally work really well.
For example, there's somethingcalled the Yasso 800.
(17:05):
So that's 800 meters on thetrack and somebody discovered
that whatever you do, 800 intime, you can do a marathon in
that time.
So, for example, if you can dothe um eight hundreds in four
minutes, you could probably do amarathon in four hours.
(17:27):
So four and four minutes andhours.
So then you can start, but youhave to be able to do it like
eight to 10 times in a row witha little bit of a break.
So if you can do each timesticking to those four minutes
eight times in a row, thenyou're probably going to be able
(17:47):
to run a four-hour marathon.
However, you can use that thento start pacing yourself for
that speed.
Then the stride is how far areyou going to stride?
For most especially men, wehave too long of a stride, so
(18:09):
we're landing our feet in frontof us instead of on the at the
center of gravity.
The most efficient that's foundout is between six revolutions
per minute.
So if you double that, 160, 170to 185, something like that.
(18:34):
So having that keeping thathigh, high revolutions per
minute for most people is goingto give them a perfect stride.
And that's why I count mycadence, because I was taking
too long of a stride, landing myfoot in front.
And then when I started to,okay, can I increase it little
(18:54):
by little.
So it's not a drastic changeand it messes up my form.
So, just um, I was doing, forexample, I would count with one
foot and I was doing about 75.
So I started to increase okay,can I do 80?
And then the next time I wouldgo for a run, can I do one more
stripe per minute and one moreuntil I was doing about 192.
(19:17):
And that's when I was doingreally much better times at the
end of a marathon withoutspending more energy.
And I know I forgot you hadreferred that to injury, or, yes
, to injury to the knees.
I think that was the same.
So, yeah, the shorter try.
I think it's going to make itmore land in your center of
(19:37):
gravity, so that all thepressures coming from everywhere
you know well distributedrather than onto the knee.
And and then there's so manyvariables there where just the
slight little bit of weightvariation puts that pressure on
the knee in different ways thatit's hard to see in the naked
eye, but it's happening over andover and over.
(20:00):
Then there's also thestrengthening of the muscles
that contribute the most to theknee, like your quads and your
hamstrings.
Everything that you strengthenis going to help prevent knee
injury.
(20:20):
The stronger you have your core, the stronger you have those
legs, the less likely you are to.
On top of perfect form.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
Yeah.
And then as far as traininggoes, let's say you're working
on your quads, your hamstrings,your abdominis.
Yeah, the thorough speculationright now is sitting in more of
a muscular endurance fromtraining for like a marathon or
training for running.
So meaning high reps, lowweight, is going to be way more
(20:54):
ideal.
Sticking inside differentenergy cycles, working more of
your slow twitch muscles and notreally diving into the what we
call just lack of a better wordpower lifting.
For those that don't know, likethe quick, that fast twitch
muscles, what do you, what doyou see?
As far as programming goes forsomebody, what should it, what
(21:14):
should it look like inside of agym and on the track for when
they do start running?
Speaker 2 (21:21):
I'm gonna lean towards maybe seasonal like if
you're going to lean towardsmaybe seasonal Like if you're
going to be wanting to develop ahabit of running different
marathons, maybe you're not justwanting to do one then having
the season where you work moreon the strength Like, for
example, if you're not going tobe running a lot in the winter
(21:41):
then that's a good time to hitthe gym and start working on
those muscles, those calves, thequads.
Some dynamic stretches, youknow, like lunges with weights,
are perfect for that as well.
And then cross-training.
(22:03):
One of the reasons why a lot ofmarathoners turn into
triathletes is because they do alot of cross training, because
that is going to strengthen, butyou still have to do some
weights a little bit, but a lotof, uh, a lot of improvements
can be made by incorporating thebiking and swimming.
(22:25):
And that's when I started doingit and I noticed a huge
improvement, because I picked upthe book that's titled Run Less
, run Faster, and in that bookit was giving you only like
three to four workouts ofrunning a week and then the rest
cross cross training withswimming and biking, preferable
(22:48):
with some weights, and once Iwas doing that as well, I might
as well do a triathlon, sinceI'm already swimming and biking,
I got into triathlons.
I signed up for an Ironman and,coincidentally, when I was
training for the Ironman is whenI qualified for the Boston
(23:09):
Marathon Because I noticed I wasgetting so much faster.
It's like, oh, I'm going to trynow, because I noticed how fast
I was getting when I wastraining for the triathlon.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
That's awesome.
That's definitely a hard gig todo.
God, swimming yet again.
You'll never catch me doingthat Biking I would do.
Swimming only has to do withlike I'm jumping into a body of
water.
I can't see the bottom.
A shark's going to come and eatme.
It has nothing to do with anycapacity beyond that.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
Okay, yeah, there's a lot of panic around swimming,
not just sharks, but even coldwater.
I experienced cold water panicthat I didn't know I had it.
It's like I was swimming inopen water, I was doing okay and
everything, but one day went tothis triathlon in Walla Walla,
washington.
It's a reservoir, but the waterwas super cold.
(24:03):
I got there and like, okay,just relax, relax.
And every time my face would goin the water.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
It would be the same thing, I couldn't catch my
breath.
Speaker 2 (24:14):
I couldn't catch my breath.
And then I researched it andit's like oh, I guess it's
pretty common, you got to get inthe cold.
For people who suffer from that, you just get in the cold water
.
And even on race day day, whatI've done in the past is if I'm
in a hotel before race day and Iknow the water is going to be
cold and they don't let us getin the water, then I fill up the
(24:34):
tub with super cold water andget in there in the morning and
just start to learn to relax,relax oh man, my worst nightmare
.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
I want to talk about the other side of it.
Obviously I'm not going to getinto the mental side.
We've done a bunch of episodeson that.
But as far as leading up to andday before for nutrition and
supplements, anything that youfind particularly works with
what kind of foods you're eating, or any kind of supplements
that you notice a lot ofmarathon runners to take for
(25:10):
those interested, yeah, some ofthe newest things that I've seen
that people are working reallywell, that are a little bit
different.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Of course we use different kinds of gels and all
kinds of other stuff, but themore natural, less preservative
stuff I tend to like betterPotatoes for carbs, for example.
You can take them.
I usually just boil them in themorning and take them with me
(25:37):
about an hour before the race.
They work really well.
Chia seed for hydration.
You can mix it with yourfavorite juice a little bit, or
just with water with some kindof sweetener.
Chia seed has a little bit ofcarb, has carbs, and it also
(25:59):
provides some nutrients and youcan use it on your runs
nutrients, and you can use it onyour runs.
The other one is beads.
Beads and bead juice seem toreally work for endurance
workouts and for endurance races.
Speaker 1 (26:16):
I'm a great fan of that Full chuck full of vitamins
.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Yeah, and something about the nitrogen.
I guess they're high innitrogen and that really helps.
My sister loves that.
She's always she does a.
She has an air fryer so sheputs them sliced and eats them.
Speaker 1 (26:38):
You know why she does it that way, right?
No, why she's trying to beatthe competition.
Speaker 2 (26:44):
I get it.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
God dad jokes it's a good one.
Yeah, I've also heard a lot ofpeople dive into.
I saw no vitamin B complexes.
It's like your B12.
A lot of people do tend to take, or your B6 and then magnesium
post-race.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Yes, and if you can get some tests where they can
detect if you're low on some ofthose, that's a big plus.
You know where you cansupplement.
But yeah, b12, you know, likethey have.
I remember taking thosefive-hour energies.
I don't do that anymore becausethey get my heart rate a little
too high but they do make adifference and I don't know if
(27:28):
it's the caffeine or the, but Isuspect it's also the B12.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Probably both.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
Yeah, the combination .
Speaker 1 (27:36):
Caffeine is one hell of a drug man?
Speaker 2 (27:39):
Yes, and you have to be very, very careful because it
is a diuretic.
So when you are, when you'rerunning for long distances and
you take a little bit ofcaffeine, you first you have to
be careful that you're notpushing yourself too hard, too
fast, and the other one thatyou're hydrating very well
because you don't want to shityourself halfway through the
(28:00):
race.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Yeah, really, I've seen it.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
Yes, yes, that and and dehydrated and cramping,
cramping like crazy, and that'llruin.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
That will ruin your race and then what about those
that, uh, eat a ton of carbs thenight before?
Truth to that, false to that.
That's always been a thinggrowing up Carb load the night
before a race.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
I say, unless you've done it a ton of times and it's
worked for you, then do it.
But if you've tried it duringtraining because you should do
what you do in training andyou're not going to load- much
more than you did.
when you're training, I tend Iused to load up and then my best
(28:46):
bet is to stick to what I've,the portions and everything, to
what I've been training with.
Yeah, I don't.
I don't see this huge benefitof people who just go over
second plate of pasta is goingto actually make you overfilled
and be heavy on race day.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
I would say it's probably worse because you're
going to throw off your sleepcycle, which is probably the
most important thing for youjust to be rested.
And because you're so freakingbloated, you're just going to
sit there and go oh, I can'tsleep.
Or if you do sleep, you're notin deep REM sleep, repairing
your muscles and getting readyto go before race day.
So yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
I think you're right.
I think that the one athleteshave done the best are the ones
that stick to a kind of regulardiet, that you don't change too
much.
A little slight changes becauseyou are going to push yourself
a little harder, but not a wholelot.
Don't do anything toodrastically different.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
Totally agree.
Anyway, victor, we do want tostart wrapping the show up, so
I'm going to ask you two finalquestions at the end.
First one is if we were tosummarize this episode in one or
two sentences, what would beyour take home message?
Speaker 2 (30:01):
Get a training plan, follow the plan.
Get a training plan, follow theplan.
Watch your posture.
Get a coach if you can, becauseit's going to help you
definitely run a better race andexperience that runner's high.
It's amazing Once you do,you're never going to want to
(30:23):
not run again.
Speaker 1 (30:24):
Love it.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
And the second question how can people find you
, get ahold of you and learnmore about your program.
They can go to eym coaching.
I have a training plan thatthey can download for free and
get them started.
And also, if they want to get ahold of me, they can just leave
a message there or book a callwith me love it.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Thank you for coming on, victor.
Thank you for guys listening tothis week's episode of how the
fitness redefined.
Please don't forget, share,share the show, subscribe.
It's the only way we do grow.
We don't write ads or anythingelse.
Don't forget, fitness ismedicine.
Until next time, thank you,outro Music.
Hello and welcome to another episode of Health and
Fitness Redefined.
I'm your host, anthony.
Today we have another greatepisode for all of you out today
.
Maybe for those that are notlike me will enjoy this episode,
and those that are like me, Iwould suggest tuning out now,
because if I think about running, I want to throw my face
(00:28):
through a wall, but without allkidding aside without further
ado, let's welcome to the show,victor.
Victor, it's just a pleasure tobe on today.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Thank you, it's my pleasure, it's an honor to be
here.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Yeah, I know I was doing some digging into you all
about marathon running, trainingfor it.
It's definitely not my cup oftea.
I'd much rather sit there andlift weights for three hours
than pretend to run.
If I can drive a car 13 or 26miles, we're good, um,
irregardless.
(01:03):
Tell me a little bit about howyou got into that realm and
we'll go from there.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Yeah, absolutely, and I was the same.
I didn't.
Running wasn't my favoritething.
I was doing a little bit ofboxing before, amateur boxing at
around age 16, 17.
And then, but even then when Iwas training, I loved the
training for boxing but I didnot like the running part
(01:30):
because it would make us run alittle bit.
That was my least favorite part.
Then I got into weightliftingand I liked that part, and every
once in a while I would try alittle bit of cardio, like doing
a couple of miles on thetreadmill.
But it still wasn't my favoritething to do.
And it wasn't until my sisterasked me to join her to train
(01:55):
for a marathon, a full marathon,that I decided, okay, it'll be
nice to have that under my belt,and if she's done it, it can't
be that hard.
But at the same time I wasworking at UPS, so my job was
very physical and as I startedto run, training for that
(02:19):
marathon, I felt more agile.
I guess it seemed to complementthe work that I was doing.
So I started to like therunning and then I experienced
that runner's high and that'swhen I really started to looking
forward to the long runs,because I would get into these
(02:39):
runner's high where I wasfeeling euphoric, I felt great,
I felt like I could run forever,but it was still.
My mind was I was only going todo one marathon and over and
done with.
But right after I got done withmy first marathon, I wanted to
beat that time that I did thefirst one I think it was 342.
(03:02):
And I thought you know what Ican do better next time.
So I registered for the nextyear and it was the LA Marathon
at the time and then I wanted toqualify for the Boston Marathon
and that took me six years oftraining before I qualified.
By then I was pretty addictiveto running and I'm still running
(03:23):
marathons.
Pretty addictive to running andI'm still running marathons.
But once I retired from UPS, Idecided to become a full-time
coach, and that was about threeyears ago.
So I've been doing full-timecoaching since then.
Speaker 1 (03:38):
Awesome man, I knew I never experienced that runner's
high.
Maybe that's why it just neverhappened.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
It just never got me.
Never happened because runner'sdemise is a better way of
putting it.
Every step sucks.
It's pretty amazing.
I mean you still go throughthat like you're high and then
once so every once in a whileyou reach, uh, a wall, what they
call.
We hit the wall, or you startrunning out of energy and then
(04:08):
it comes back and it's up anddown, but you look forward to I
sometimes look forward torunning because I know I can get
there.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
I love that.
So there's two sides to runningmarathons, and I know you're a
coach for it, so we're going toreally dive into this right.
The first side isbiomechanically how how you're
actually moving through a planeof motion, what muscles are
activating, how they'reactivating.
And the second side of that ismental fitness.
It's the willingness to pushforward.
(04:41):
Okay, one more step, one morestep, one more step to say that
to yourself about three and ahalf hours, and then eventually
you'll get to the finish line,depending how slow you're going.
So I think the best place tostart would be biomechanically,
because I think a lot of peopleunderstand the mental side.
They have a understanding.
If I'm going to do this, I wantto finish for myself.
(05:01):
But biomechanically, howsomeone moves, I feel like a lot
of people run wrong.
Yeah, start with.
What are some tips, what aresome things you look for for
somebody who is getting intorunning, wants to run a marathon
and just kind of break down thebiomechanics of it?
Speaker 2 (05:23):
Yeah, so the biomechanics is huge.
So the biomechanics is huge,the understanding because,
you're right, a lot of peopledon't understand they uh,
including myself.
When I first started runningit's like I thought you just go
out and you start running.
And even now I've told themsome of my friends that I do
coaching for running.
Actually it was a friend ofmine that did the boxing and was
(05:44):
like people need coaching forrunning.
He thought you just run andit's like when I started running
I discovered that you can gethurt very easy if you just keep
on running.
Our bodies can only handle somuch.
So it's kind of likeweightlifting, in the same sense
that you know you're using thesame muscles over and over.
(06:06):
They fatigue and they breakdown or you tear muscles.
So it's progressive.
If you're going to do amarathon and you're new at it,
best thing to do is get atraining plan and follow that
training plan slowly,progressively, and dedicate the
(06:26):
time needed for the training andslow you know it's a slow
process, getting a pace that'sright for you when depending on
your fitness level.
But it's a progressive thing.
You're not going to go outevery run and run your hardest.
You're going to have some runsthat are hard running.
(06:49):
You're going to have some runsthat are slow and that's how you
build your endurance and youstart adding.
Most programs will start addingone mile or 10% a week to their
mileage so that you canprogressively build that
endurance.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
So you mentioned common injuries inside of
running.
What are the most commoninjuries you see?
Speaker 2 (07:15):
I think for beginners it's usually the shin splints.
They start to experience shinsplint and usually because they
are running a little bit toofast for the time that they've
done it.
So let's slow down if you'reexperiencing shin splints.
And then the other ones is thecalves or ankles a lot of
sprained ankles, and Achilles isanother one.
(07:38):
So calves and Achilles tearsare very common.
Again, it could be due to aweakness in the muscles or just
overuse at one time.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
You know, just not allowing them to build those
muscles or their strengths yeah,I gotta say shin splints is
definitely the first one that'spreventing me from running for
years and just understandingwhat shin splints is.
So I think a brief explanationof that for those that don't
know because I get asked thisquestion all the time what the
hell?
Shin splints?
It's micro fractures inside ofyour shin bone.
(08:12):
So the reason they freaking,hurt so much, is because you're
fracturing the bone inside theshin.
Why is it caused?
Yeah, a couple different waysto cause shin splints, but the
most common is it's how you'rerunning.
When you run heavy is, I guess,the quote they use like the
fancy term where if you everhear someone running on a
(08:32):
treadmill, it's boom, boom, boom.
Yeah, pounding Foot isn'tdorsiflexing.
Dorsiflexing meaning, if thisis my hands, my foot for those
watching video, but otherwisejust flexing upwards.
So I take my toes and try topoint it towards the ceiling.
That muscle that runs over theshin bone is called the anterior
tibialis or your atib.
(08:52):
It controls dorsiflexion andpeople just don't train it.
They work a lot of theantagonist muscle you mentioned,
your calf or your gastrocnemiusis the antagonist to the A-tib.
So if you're overworking, yourmuscle is getting super tight,
right, you can imagine the calfmuscle.
Getting super tight, your toe isgoing to point down.
It makes it even harder to doany sort of dorsiflexion while
(09:18):
you're running and just overuseof that is going to really make
it hard to do so training your.
A-tib is the easy fix.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Yes, and then posture .
You know, when you're running,having the proper posture, the
perfect form and landing withyour forefoot instead of heel
striking and I think that's thenumber one thing that,
especially if they're runninglike a downhill and they're
landing their foot in front ofthem, then exactly what you said
you mentioned, you know you hitthat heel and that shoggle
(09:50):
straight up those shin splints.
It's straight up in a lot ofother areas.
People have back pains.
All kinds of bad stuff happenswhen because you're basically
hitting the brake, when you'regoing down, every time you land,
whereas if you can land in thecenter of gravity, you're going
to minimize that impact.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Yeah, it's kind of what you said.
A lot what we learned in schoolright, heel-toe, heel-toe.
But realistically that's nothow you want to run whatsoever.
So a lot of people try to trainthemselves to run heel-toe and
they realize, oh shit, thishurts a lot.
When you mentioned you want toland with your whole foot flat
and this has been a big pushrecently with, like, barefoot
shoes is teaching people don'tland on your heel, that's going
(10:37):
to send pain straight up throughyour knee and through your shin
bone, will let the impact takeover your whole entire foot and
then you flex your way throughthat.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
So teaching people how to run, because if you run
wrong, the wrong way, over andover again, especially 26.2
miles, you're just gonna destroyyour body absolutely yes and
and like again, uh, landing inthe center of gravity, and
minimize that and also the timethat that foot spends on the
(11:05):
floor will minimize or willprolong the energy, because if
the shorter, you know, if you'retapping the floor, you're not
putting all that weight on thefoot because it's just tapping,
tapping, tapping, tapping, yeah,yeah.
And then using the musclesbecause you were talking about
(11:28):
what muscles you use, and Ithink engaging when you're doing
26.2 miles is learning toengage all your muscles, but
especially the quads, the calvesand the major ones, of course,
but then you're using all ofthem.
You're using your abdominals,even your arms, when you're
(11:50):
swinging.
But if you do it moreconsciously, where you're not
focused on the legs, if the legstarts to hurt, you know, then
just focus.
I do a lot of counting mycadence when I'm running, so
I'll start to count with my arms.
You know my arm swings insteadof the steps that I'm taking and
(12:15):
that, just I feel like it sendsthe energy more towards my arms
instead of all towards my legs.
But it's those little thingsthat over 26 miles is going to
make a huge difference, becauseyou are trying to engage all of
your muscles differently and soit's not one muscle gets over
stress.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Yeah, and you mentioned posture as you're
running, so can you explain alittle bit of how you, how your
posture should look, based uponwalking, jogging, running?
Yes.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
When you're running.
Well, basically, when you'rerunning, you should have a
little bit of a forward lean,but not hunched, because once
people get tired, what they tendto do is to start hunching and
their head starts to go lower.
So this the head's so muchheavier than the rest of the
body, it's in proportion, youknow.
So it does create this pressureon the back when they start to
(13:06):
look down because they'refatigued, and you'll be
surprised of people don'trealize what they start doing
once they get tired, untilsomeone tells them hey, you're
like bent over or you're runningto the side like this, and
they're not aware of it justbecause something started to
ache.
And so, upright, with a littlelean forward and preferably
(13:29):
looking straight at the horizon,because people do tend to start
to look down when they gofatigued and then their head
follows.
Then arm swings also.
If you're running low jog, youdon't have to swing your arm.
The faster you go, the more armswing you want to do,
(13:49):
especially on the uphills.
Then you really want to evenshort run, but you want to
really move those arms to helpyou balance out.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
Yeah, I think pushing arms can help you go if you're
doing more of a sprint type ofthing, Switching in from an
aerobic straight cadence runningto more of an anaerobic sprint
without oxygen, full out, 100feet to the finish line go.
You're showing off to everyoneat the end that didn't watch you
(14:19):
on the 26 miles, they're justwatching the 0.2.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Yeah, and then you have walkers, because a lot of
the older clients I deal withwill practice the walk run
method and I've done marathonswhere I've done better with
taking those walking breaks.
I did a full marathon inColorado where I ran every mile
(14:42):
and I walked at every mile.
I walked about 10 seconds andoverall my time was better than
some of the other ones.
And it's just that time torecover.
And when you walk, you know why, say again, do you know why?
I think just the, the recoverytime is what I've and it gets
the time to your muscles torecover from that.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
so you're in colorado , you said right.
So it's high altitude.
Oh, yes, yeah.
So that high altitude actuallypromotes not working.
Instead of crib cycle, which isthe energy cycle you're using
from running long distances, youwant to switch, which is what I
mentioned before, to more of ananaerobic cycle, something
that's shorter, so not using theoxygen to promote, promote
(15:28):
constant energy, and it's thealtitude that really prevented
you from staying in the steadystate cardio and pushing you
more into an anaerobic side ofit, which is it's funny.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
you say that it's just so true, like when you
think about like oh shit, yeahyes, yes, and but in people who
start training withincorporating some runs into
their walks seem to injurethemselves a little bit less
than people that don't practicethat.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
Yeah, I can definitely see that.
I guess another common ailment,injury it's all in the same
relative, but a meniscus issues.
So at the end of part ofpeople's knees you're always
like, oh yeah, it's at manyhertz.
Um, different things can cause.
But I think over what's theproper way to put this stepping
(16:20):
too far or reaching too far withyour foot, as opposed to not
like you don't want to go 100,reaching as far as you can.
So why don't you explain alittle bit as far as pace is
what everyone calls itgenerically, so what should be a
generic like how do you knowwhere to pace at and what does
your stride length look likeinside that?
Speaker 2 (16:43):
well.
The pace is the speed thatyou're running at, which is
going to be different foreverybody, and it's your fitness
level, but something that youcan start to measure what you
can handle in the track.
And there's some formulas thatreally work really well.
For example, there's somethingcalled the Yasso 800.
(17:05):
So that's 800 meters on thetrack and somebody discovered
that whatever you do, 800 intime, you can do a marathon in
that time.
So, for example, if you can dothe um eight hundreds in four
minutes, you could probably do amarathon in four hours.
(17:27):
So four and four minutes andhours.
So then you can start, but youhave to be able to do it like
eight to 10 times in a row witha little bit of a break.
So if you can do each timesticking to those four minutes
eight times in a row, thenyou're probably going to be able
(17:47):
to run a four-hour marathon.
However, you can use that thento start pacing yourself for
that speed.
Then the stride is how far areyou going to stride?
For most especially men, wehave too long of a stride, so
(18:09):
we're landing our feet in frontof us instead of on the at the
center of gravity.
The most efficient that's foundout is between six revolutions
per minute.
So if you double that, 160, 170to 185, something like that.
(18:34):
So having that keeping thathigh, high revolutions per
minute for most people is goingto give them a perfect stride.
And that's why I count mycadence, because I was taking
too long of a stride, landing myfoot in front.
And then when I started to,okay, can I increase it little
(18:54):
by little.
So it's not a drastic changeand it messes up my form.
So, just um, I was doing, forexample, I would count with one
foot and I was doing about 75.
So I started to increase okay,can I do 80?
And then the next time I wouldgo for a run, can I do one more
stripe per minute and one moreuntil I was doing about 192.
(19:17):
And that's when I was doingreally much better times at the
end of a marathon withoutspending more energy.
And I know I forgot you hadreferred that to injury, or, yes
, to injury to the knees.
I think that was the same.
So, yeah, the shorter try.
I think it's going to make itmore land in your center of
(19:37):
gravity, so that all thepressures coming from everywhere
you know well distributedrather than onto the knee.
And and then there's so manyvariables there where just the
slight little bit of weightvariation puts that pressure on
the knee in different ways thatit's hard to see in the naked
eye, but it's happening over andover and over.
(20:00):
Then there's also thestrengthening of the muscles
that contribute the most to theknee, like your quads and your
hamstrings.
Everything that you strengthenis going to help prevent knee
injury.
(20:20):
The stronger you have your core, the stronger you have those
legs, the less likely you are to.
On top of perfect form.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
Yeah.
And then as far as traininggoes, let's say you're working
on your quads, your hamstrings,your abdominis.
Yeah, the thorough speculationright now is sitting in more of
a muscular endurance fromtraining for like a marathon or
training for running.
So meaning high reps, lowweight, is going to be way more
(20:54):
ideal.
Sticking inside differentenergy cycles, working more of
your slow twitch muscles and notreally diving into the what we
call just lack of a better wordpower lifting.
For those that don't know, likethe quick, that fast twitch
muscles, what do you, what doyou see?
As far as programming goes forsomebody, what should it, what
(21:14):
should it look like inside of agym and on the track for when
they do start running?
Speaker 2 (21:21):
I'm gonna lean towards maybe seasonal like if
you're going to lean towardsmaybe seasonal Like if you're
going to be wanting to develop ahabit of running different
marathons, maybe you're not justwanting to do one then having
the season where you work moreon the strength Like, for
example, if you're not going tobe running a lot in the winter
(21:41):
then that's a good time to hitthe gym and start working on
those muscles, those calves, thequads.
Some dynamic stretches, youknow, like lunges with weights,
are perfect for that as well.
And then cross-training.
(22:03):
One of the reasons why a lot ofmarathoners turn into
triathletes is because they do alot of cross training, because
that is going to strengthen, butyou still have to do some
weights a little bit, but a lotof, uh, a lot of improvements
can be made by incorporating thebiking and swimming.
(22:25):
And that's when I started doingit and I noticed a huge
improvement, because I picked upthe book that's titled Run Less
, run Faster, and in that bookit was giving you only like
three to four workouts ofrunning a week and then the rest
cross cross training withswimming and biking, preferable
(22:48):
with some weights, and once Iwas doing that as well, I might
as well do a triathlon, sinceI'm already swimming and biking,
I got into triathlons.
I signed up for an Ironman and,coincidentally, when I was
training for the Ironman is whenI qualified for the Boston
(23:09):
Marathon Because I noticed I wasgetting so much faster.
It's like, oh, I'm going to trynow, because I noticed how fast
I was getting when I wastraining for the triathlon.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
That's awesome.
That's definitely a hard gig todo.
God, swimming yet again.
You'll never catch me doingthat Biking I would do.
Swimming only has to do withlike I'm jumping into a body of
water.
I can't see the bottom.
A shark's going to come and eatme.
It has nothing to do with anycapacity beyond that.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
Okay, yeah, there's a lot of panic around swimming,
not just sharks, but even coldwater.
I experienced cold water panicthat I didn't know I had it.
It's like I was swimming inopen water, I was doing okay and
everything, but one day went tothis triathlon in Walla Walla,
washington.
It's a reservoir, but the waterwas super cold.
(24:03):
I got there and like, okay,just relax, relax.
And every time my face would goin the water.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
It would be the same thing, I couldn't catch my
breath.
Speaker 2 (24:14):
I couldn't catch my breath.
And then I researched it andit's like oh, I guess it's
pretty common, you got to get inthe cold.
For people who suffer from that, you just get in the cold water
.
And even on race day day, whatI've done in the past is if I'm
in a hotel before race day and Iknow the water is going to be
cold and they don't let us getin the water, then I fill up the
(24:34):
tub with super cold water andget in there in the morning and
just start to learn to relax,relax oh man, my worst nightmare
.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
I want to talk about the other side of it.
Obviously I'm not going to getinto the mental side.
We've done a bunch of episodeson that.
But as far as leading up to andday before for nutrition and
supplements, anything that youfind particularly works with
what kind of foods you're eating, or any kind of supplements
that you notice a lot ofmarathon runners to take for
(25:10):
those interested, yeah, some ofthe newest things that I've seen
that people are working reallywell, that are a little bit
different.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Of course we use different kinds of gels and all
kinds of other stuff, but themore natural, less preservative
stuff I tend to like betterPotatoes for carbs, for example.
You can take them.
I usually just boil them in themorning and take them with me
(25:37):
about an hour before the race.
They work really well.
Chia seed for hydration.
You can mix it with yourfavorite juice a little bit, or
just with water with some kindof sweetener.
Chia seed has a little bit ofcarb, has carbs, and it also
(25:59):
provides some nutrients and youcan use it on your runs
nutrients, and you can use it onyour runs.
The other one is beads.
Beads and bead juice seem toreally work for endurance
workouts and for endurance races.
Speaker 1 (26:16):
I'm a great fan of that Full chuck full of vitamins
.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Yeah, and something about the nitrogen.
I guess they're high innitrogen and that really helps.
My sister loves that.
She's always she does a.
She has an air fryer so sheputs them sliced and eats them.
Speaker 1 (26:38):
You know why she does it that way, right?
No, why she's trying to beatthe competition.
Speaker 2 (26:44):
I get it.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
God dad jokes it's a good one.
Yeah, I've also heard a lot ofpeople dive into.
I saw no vitamin B complexes.
It's like your B12.
A lot of people do tend to take, or your B6 and then magnesium
post-race.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Yes, and if you can get some tests where they can
detect if you're low on some ofthose, that's a big plus.
You know where you cansupplement.
But yeah, b12, you know, likethey have.
I remember taking thosefive-hour energies.
I don't do that anymore becausethey get my heart rate a little
too high but they do make adifference and I don't know if
(27:28):
it's the caffeine or the, but Isuspect it's also the B12.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Probably both.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
Yeah, the combination .
Speaker 1 (27:36):
Caffeine is one hell of a drug man?
Speaker 2 (27:39):
Yes, and you have to be very, very careful because it
is a diuretic.
So when you are, when you'rerunning for long distances and
you take a little bit ofcaffeine, you first you have to
be careful that you're notpushing yourself too hard, too
fast, and the other one thatyou're hydrating very well
because you don't want to shityourself halfway through the
(28:00):
race.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Yeah, really, I've seen it.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
Yes, yes, that and and dehydrated and cramping,
cramping like crazy, and that'llruin.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
That will ruin your race and then what about those
that, uh, eat a ton of carbs thenight before?
Truth to that, false to that.
That's always been a thinggrowing up Carb load the night
before a race.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
I say, unless you've done it a ton of times and it's
worked for you, then do it.
But if you've tried it duringtraining because you should do
what you do in training andyou're not going to load- much
more than you did.
when you're training, I tend Iused to load up and then my best
(28:46):
bet is to stick to what I've,the portions and everything, to
what I've been training with.
Yeah, I don't.
I don't see this huge benefitof people who just go over
second plate of pasta is goingto actually make you overfilled
and be heavy on race day.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
I would say it's probably worse because you're
going to throw off your sleepcycle, which is probably the
most important thing for youjust to be rested.
And because you're so freakingbloated, you're just going to
sit there and go oh, I can'tsleep.
Or if you do sleep, you're notin deep REM sleep, repairing
your muscles and getting readyto go before race day.
So yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
I think you're right.
I think that the one athleteshave done the best are the ones
that stick to a kind of regulardiet, that you don't change too
much.
A little slight changes becauseyou are going to push yourself
a little harder, but not a wholelot.
Don't do anything toodrastically different.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
Totally agree.
Anyway, victor, we do want tostart wrapping the show up, so
I'm going to ask you two finalquestions at the end.
First one is if we were tosummarize this episode in one or
two sentences, what would beyour take home message?
Speaker 2 (30:01):
Get a training plan, follow the plan.
Get a training plan, follow theplan.
Watch your posture.
Get a coach if you can, becauseit's going to help you
definitely run a better race andexperience that runner's high.
It's amazing Once you do,you're never going to want to
(30:23):
not run again.
Speaker 1 (30:24):
Love it.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
And the second question how can people find you
, get ahold of you and learnmore about your program.
They can go to eym coaching.
I have a training plan thatthey can download for free and
get them started.
And also, if they want to get ahold of me, they can just leave
a message there or book a callwith me love it.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Thank you for coming on, victor.
Thank you for guys listening tothis week's episode of how the
fitness redefined.
Please don't forget, share,share the show, subscribe.
It's the only way we do grow.
We don't write ads or anythingelse.
Don't forget, fitness ismedicine.
Until next time, thank you,outro Music.
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