November 27, 2025 • 33 mins
Ever tried to outrun your brain? Ron Souers did—until speed and stress nearly cost him his job. Our conversation traces that moment of reckoning to a new framework for ADHD: not a defect to hide, but a different wiring to understand, support, and leverage. Ron is a coach, advocate, and host of “Don’t Mind Me, I Just Have ADHD,” and he brings hard-won lessons from the shop floor to the therapist’s chair to practical routines anyone can adopt.
We unpack what ADHD really looks like beyond stereotypes: abundant attention with fragile steering, emotional whiplash that can feel like a storm, and the slower-but-richer processing that often creates depth once information lands. Ron explains how trauma and environment can shape attention systems, why the “try harder” script fails, and how acceptance unlocks better choices at work and home. The forklift story—chemical lines, a near miss, and a mandatory recertification—becomes a case study in urgency, distraction, and the power of stepping back before stepping forward.
Then we get tactical. Mindfulness isn’t a buzzword here; it’s the steering wheel. From taking the “long route” commute as moving meditation to asking “What’s the rush?” before a risky task, Ron shows how small interrupts reduce big errors. He layers in MBSP (mindfulness-based strengths practice) to pair awareness with character strengths like creativity and love of learning, and he dismantles the multitasking myth in favor of deep, single-focus blocks. We also cover sleep, hydration, movement, and faith as anchors that stabilize attention and mood, turning intention into consistent behavior.
If you’re tired of white-knuckling your way through work, this one offers clarity and tools you can use today. Grab Ron’s free training “Mastering the Moment” at youradhguy.com, check out “Don’t Mind Me, I Just Have ADHD” on your favorite podcast app, and tell us: what’s one change you’ll make to protect your focus this week? Subscribe, share with a friend who needs it, and leave a review to help others find the show.
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SPEAKER_01 (00:23):
Well, hello and welcome back to the Healthy
Living Podcast.
I'm your host, Joe Grumbine, andtoday we've got a very special
guest.
His name is Ron Sowers, and he'san ADHD advocate, a podcast
host, and an author dedicated toempowering adults with ADHD to
embrace their differences andunlock their true potential.
(00:45):
And I like to keep intros shortand let the conversation have
plenty of time to talk.
So, Ron, welcome to the show.
It's good to have you here withus.
And you know, it's funny, when Iwas a kid, I was known to be um,
they called me hyperactive, butI'm a lot older than you.
And the truth is, um, I probablyhad what they call ADHD now.
(01:08):
I think everybody's got a littleADHD these days.
Why don't you tell us a littlebit about what that actually
means?
But most importantly, why don'tyou tell us how how did you come
here?
How did you come to this spaceand uh um, you know, tell us a
little bit about your personalstory?
SPEAKER_00 (01:23):
Yeah, thank you.
Uh, I appreciate that, Joe, forum, you know, the space and um,
you know, it's a privilege andan honor.
You know, honestly, you know,how how I came to find out with
ADHD wasn't like, you know, itwas it was it was a lot like
probably most other people'sstories, and just I didn't know.
(01:45):
Um, you know, I would say likeit started because I um was
about to lose my job.
And um, you know, like I Icouldn't slow down, I couldn't I
couldn't stop, like, you know, II didn't feel the need that I
needed that but I had people inmy life, like a lot of people
(02:08):
saying, Man, you need to slowdown, and I just didn't think
that they knew what they weretalking about.
Um, you know, so like anythingin my life, or you know, most
people, in order to to to wantto change, the pain's gotta be
great enough.
And for me, that that you know,losing my job was so scary.
(02:30):
Um, because I was like, youknow, I'm an addict as well.
So I was in a program duringthat time.
So I had people around me, um,you know, that understood how I
was and like understood like theimpact of like losing my job.
So there was like there was alot of you know good loving fear
(02:51):
involved in that.
So what that ended up promptingme to do was go to my uh
physical, I mean my uh primarycare doctor and saying, hey,
look, I I can't slow down, uhafraid I'm gonna lose my job, I
don't know what to do.
Um what do you what do yousuggest?
(03:13):
And she kind of really didn'tdrew a blank, and I was like,
maybe I have ADHD, and she kindof didn't look too convinced,
but I just but she still gave mea list of like psychologists and
therapists, like run down, whichwas you know not the easiest
thing to do because I I don'teven know which one I need
(03:37):
first.
SPEAKER_01 (03:38):
How how old are you at this point?
I'm 44 today, but I mean this atwhen you're going through this
oh when when it was like two,three years ago.
SPEAKER_00 (03:48):
Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_01 (03:49):
So this was pretty recently, yeah, definitely.
SPEAKER_00 (03:52):
So yeah, like I went through that list and I was able
to find the therapist that Iactually uh still talk to today.
And um, you know, like one ofthe first things that he said to
me that really stood out waslike this this can actually be
you turned into a strength,yeah.
Like if you do the work.
And you know, I was like, Idon't know, like I was just so
(04:16):
elated at that time that like Iknew what it was, that there was
help, and I thought, hey, look,if I just do what he says, it's
gonna be cured, right?
SPEAKER_01 (04:27):
Somebody knows about this, it's not just like this
mutant alien virus that nobodyknows what to do with.
SPEAKER_00 (04:34):
Yeah, I'm not all alone, and you know, um, other
people have have gotten betterwith it.
So, you know, I'm just gonnatrust this guy and uh, you know,
do what he says and and justsee, you know, at least try what
he says and you know, try toimplement that in my life.
And one of the biggest thingsthat that made an impact was
(04:55):
like he said, to drive to work,like you're taking the long way.
So I literally went and took thelong way to work.
So I got I went extra early, andum, you know, it it was it was
like a bit of meditation, andthat definitely helped, but it
(05:16):
was like a mountain to like animpossible mountain that I that
I didn't think, you know, therewas a lot of pitfalls where I
just didn't think that I couldslow down, and you know, um, but
uh but I had good people in mylife that that were helping me
along that journey.
SPEAKER_01 (05:33):
So was this something that you've dealt with
all your life, or did you noticethat it became more pronounced
as you got older?
SPEAKER_00 (05:42):
I mean, it it like yeah, looking back, yeah, I
definitely remember.
I remember this one time that Iwas like, I like I love to go
fast in cars that didn't reallygo fast, but you know, I was
like, man, I'm a I'm a speedracer.
And I remember this one time inparticular where I was like
going to like my best friend'shouse, and like there was like
(06:05):
this thin gap, and my sister wasin the in the car beside me, and
I was just like flooring it andgoing, you know, I'm going on
the side of the road to get pastthat, and she was so scared, and
I was like, Man, I don't knowwhy you're scared, because like
I got this, you know, but likelooking back, like that could
have been you know, very thatcould have a second wrong and
(06:28):
boom, it's all over, yeah.
Yeah, so like I live my most ofmy life like that, like you
know, thinking that that wasnormal, thinking that's what I
needed to do.
SPEAKER_01 (06:39):
Okay, and when you're going through school, I
mean, let's go back into highschool or or college or or you
know, just your your school age.
Did you find that you had uhstruggles?
Like for me, I never went tocollege or at least no more in a
couple semesters.
(07:00):
But um when I was in gradeschool and high school, I I was
always fidgeting and and youknow doing stupid crap because I
couldn't keep my mind on thesubject matter unless it was
really interesting.
And if it was, I'd lock in and Icouldn't let it go and I'd be
obsessed with it.
(07:20):
But you know, I was always theone moving around doing stupid
crap and getting you know putoff to the corner because I was
disrupting everybody.
SPEAKER_00 (07:30):
Yeah, yeah.
I definitely had um, you know,times like that.
Like for me, art was wassomething that always was was
something that that drew me toit.
You know, I ended up you knowwinning a a couple of uh awards
for my art and art class.
And um, but like everythingelse, it just like I think I was
(07:53):
interested in science a littlebit, but you know, it really
depended on the teacher, right?
And I really just coastedthrough you know high school and
got, you know, I remember um youknow, hiding out in the bathroom
um between classes and just youknow, because like I just felt
(08:13):
so different, you know.
I didn't really think that Icould make friends and like I
didn't find out till recentlylike that was actually uh a
deeper trauma when I was in likesecond grade um that I had
actually stood up on on in inthe class on a desk and thought
(08:34):
like you know, to try to getfriends, to try to be funny.
And uh my teacher did not likethat, and she ended up putting
me in the front of the class,and I think I got made fun of.
Um, so it was like I just felt,you know, I like my mom told me
that you know, I I I told herlike I just didn't feel like I I
(08:55):
would rather disappear than goback to school, you know.
So I remember seeing a lot oftherapists growing up, but you
know, none of them were able toreally connect the dots, you
know, that it was just likeanxiety, and I didn't really
like listening to them.
I was just going to you knowappease my children.
SPEAKER_01 (09:14):
Right, right.
So now you got this thistherapist that you think has got
the answers.
Um, how how uh tell us a littlebit about how that went.
SPEAKER_00 (09:24):
Yeah, it was it was a process in a you know, and
like in the beginning, you know,I was like, okay, I'm gonna fix
this, I'm gonna do whatever hesays, and we're gonna get past
this, and like I don't so Idon't have to see therapy, you
know, like it was just anotherum box to check off, you know.
So there, you know, and I hadsuccess in there, and you know,
(09:47):
I definitely learned to slowdown, learn the value of like
analyzing my thoughts and likereally questioning, you know.
One one question that I you knowI still ask myself is like, what
is the rush?
SPEAKER_01 (10:01):
You know, like I've left just to hurry.
SPEAKER_00 (10:04):
Yeah, I've left early enough, right?
Like, but I'm I'm speeding downthe road, like I'm gonna get
there on time.
SPEAKER_01 (10:11):
Like hurry up so you can sit there and wait.
SPEAKER_00 (10:14):
Yeah, so you know, that question definitely helps
to like okay, bring me back inthe moment and like really, you
know, analyze what I'm doing.
But it's like so I ended upleaving, um, you know, and
saying, like, hey, you know,I've I think we've this has run
its course, you know, I'm I canapply what you've taught me in
(10:36):
my life.
So what ended up happening waslike I got a um um a different
position in my job that requiredme to to operate a forklift uh
around dangerous chemicals, uhthe raw chemicals and putting
it, it was like a mixing role.
And um, you know, I was you hadto pay attention.
(10:58):
Yeah, I was like, and and thatthat same need to like go fast
took over again because I'mlearning a new position.
I want to make sure that theythey they are right, they made
the right decision.
I want to show them, but like Iended up running into like a
reinforcement pole, almosttaking that out, and like punks
(11:18):
flipping drums and like you nameit, like crushing pallets.
Like it was crazy.
And and like, you know, thefinal thing that really, you
know, uh broke the camel's back,if if you will, was like I was
pulling down, you know, I waslowering the forks and it hit
this little um little beam thatwas like right next to these
(11:42):
chemical lines.
So if it went over a little bitmore, but in my mind, I'm like,
it's just it's just a beam thatlike it shouldn't even be there
because it's not even on theother side.
But honestly, like you know, nowthat I'm looking back, it's like
I'm glad that happened.
Yeah, because but in thatmoment, I was so scared, like I
(12:05):
was so full of stress and fear,like I was gonna lose my job,
and you know, and and you know,like after evaluating that with
you know my sponsor, and likefortunately I had time, like you
have this health and safe time,so I took the rest of the day
off because they theyimmediately were like, you know,
you need to get recertified onon, and there was no one there
(12:28):
to do that.
So like I had to have somebodyelse operate the fork truck for
me, and so I left, and I wasjust like, I did, you know, I
needed to, I needed, I needed tostep off that situation and
evaluating it.
I was like, you know what?
I need I need to go back to myprevious position because like
(12:50):
me and four and heavy machinerydo not mix because like I was
literally going back.
That's when I went back to mytherapist and was like, you
know, we came up with a gameplan for slowing down, and I was
doing good, and you know, andthen that happened.
So it was it was so frustratingbecause it looked like to
(13:11):
everyone else, like I justdidn't care, and I was just but
I got distracted in that moment,so I understood like anything,
it doesn't matter how hard Iwork or how much training I get,
like it it could just be anylittle distraction, and you
know, uh I I could end up itcould it could be worse than
(13:32):
that.
So, you know, during thatprocess, like I I wanted to look
for you know a different job,like a day because I you know I
was like I'm working arounddangerous chemicals, period.
Right, so like that that's notgood with distraction.
SPEAKER_01 (13:47):
So better choices to make when you can't keep your
mind your mind on a on thatsubject there, yeah, yeah,
definitely.
SPEAKER_00 (13:55):
So like I started looking into like how ways to
make like side hustles, and youknow, one of them was like what
the podcast.
Okay, really I've really foundthat I had a passion for talking
about mental health, and then Iwanted to kind of niche it down
to be like ADHD in the workplacebecause it was like you don't
(14:17):
get a lot of that, you know,talked about like what tools you
can use, what how that shows up,and how you can talk about it,
how you can advocate for it.
So I really started to buildthat and build, you know,
started doing a lot of research,and you know, I found that it
was like pretty difficult tofind the information.
You really had to do somedigging.
(14:37):
Like now it's it's still, but Ifeel like it's all out there,
it's just so scattered, right?
So like you know, it it's notlike synthesized.
SPEAKER_01 (14:48):
There's so much information and in in so many
places that separating goodinformation from bad
information, or like you said,connecting relevant information
together, like a lot of timespeople will you know collect a
dozen different terms for adozen different um uh conditions
(15:13):
and throw them all into the samebatch as though they all belong
together.
And you know, somebody's gottafigure out what what what what
goes where.
So I hear the term ADHD a lot,and frankly, I don't even know
exactly what that means.
Why don't you share with usreally what what is ADHD?
SPEAKER_00 (15:35):
Yeah, ADHD is you know basically the term means uh
attention hyperactive attentiondeficit hyperactivity disorder.
So that name is totallyconfusing on its own because
like I don't lack attention, Idon't have a deficit in
attention, I have an abundancein attention, I just don't know
how to focus it.
(15:55):
Okay, and like hyperactivity waskind of thrown in there because
you know, that fidgeting, thatyou know, not being able to sit
still, racing thoughts, youknow, and like like you can
tell, like I have thathyperactivity, but a lot of it
is combined because there's theinattentive side, you know,
where people are just you know,they seem like they're lazy or
(16:18):
they seem like they're slow orthey seem like they don't care,
you know.
It's it's really their theirbrain is it's so hard for them
to like put things together thatit's like they're just doing
literally the best that theycan.
So when when you have like acombination of those two,
because like I I it when when itcomes to like complex
(16:41):
information, like uh it takes mea long time um to really absorb
it, but when I do, it's it'sit's like set in there, and then
I can see it in a different way.
I compare like the ADHD brain toa high definition printer
because it's gonna take longerto process that information, but
(17:03):
it but the picture is gonna haveso much more quality, so much
more detail, and like that'swhere and another aspect of it
is that emotional dysregulation.
So it's like you could befeeling great one minute, and
then you know, something happensand then you're down in the
dumps, or or you're completelyangry, like your emotions are so
(17:26):
like all over the place, right?
You know, and and a lot of timesyou don't know how to express
that, and that comes out asanger or frustration, you know,
and and that's that's one of thethings that like why I started
like wanting to coach thatbecause I became like a human
guinea pig of like, okay, whatdoes this work?
(17:46):
What does this do?
And you know, like seeing whathas the best benefit in the most
like simple way to do that,because it's like there's all
these great things out therethat you know kind of touch on
the uh surface level of it, butthey don't go really to the
deeper core issue of ADHD.
SPEAKER_01 (18:10):
So the last word of that acronym is disorder, and so
I I look at that as you knowkind of like a um not a disease
necessarily, but uh uh asituation where your brain isn't
(18:32):
working the way a quote normalbrain would work.
And there's all these reasonsfor these things to happen, and
it could be genetic, it could beenvironmental, it could be um
trauma induced.
Um so what is the the genesis ofthis particular type of symptom
(18:53):
syndrome, or is there just oneor is it combinations of things
for different people?
SPEAKER_00 (18:59):
Yeah, I mean, like you said, there's no real normal
brain, like there's everyone haslike something that's the
everyone has strengths andeveryone has weaknesses,
basically.
Um, I think that that disorderjust gives it such a negative
connotation, it really just is adifference.
Like it's it's just your braindeveloped differently, and and
(19:21):
it is trauma-induced.
Um, a lot of it, from myunderstanding, is like when when
you're born before you were evenborn, when you're being created,
like um the trauma that your themother is going through, like
has a direct impact on the waythat your brain develops, you
(19:43):
know, and and like parts of yourbrain get overdeveloped, and
part of your parts of your grainbrain get underdeveloped, it
develops with the same energy,but like different parts.
So even in even that process,and this this is something that
I've learned from Dr.
Gabor Mate, and like he's anincredible source of like
(20:05):
information, and and he reallylike the difference between him
and most people that study it inscience is he adds that
spirituality and emotionalelement to it because you can't
really figure out what theproblem is without looking at
those details as well.
So it's like um, and and eventhe trauma can can happen early
(20:27):
in in childhood from likeneglect, you know, because a lot
of a lot of people don'tunderstand, and and I didn't for
a long time that neglect canactually be a very powerful um
traumatic event.
SPEAKER_01 (20:41):
100%.
I we've had a number of gueststalk about a number of ways that
can play out from uh differenttypes of syndromes to I mean, I
it it it's it's wild how aneglected child can manifest
that trauma uh in so manydifferent ways.
(21:02):
And and I keep seeing it happenover and again.
So you've gone through a numberof different solutions.
Why don't you tell us a littlebit about some of these
solutions and the ones that haveworked best for you?
SPEAKER_00 (21:16):
Yeah, I would say like um, you know, just being
like vulnerable about it, youknow, and acceptance, like a
deep level of acceptance oflike, hey, I have ADHD, that's
not gonna change.
Let's see how I can moveforward.
It's not a problem, it's notsomething that's you know, uh
(21:37):
like makes me less than orbetter than anybody else.
It's just the way I am, justlike I need glasses, right?
Like I don't just say, Well, Ineed glass, I need to fix my
eyes or like do something crazy.
I mean, there's obviously lasersurgery, but like, you know,
honestly, it's it's it's it'slike one of the biggest tools
(22:01):
that I found beyond that ismindfulness, yeah.
You know, and mindfulness is isso powerful because like you
know, with especially withracing thoughts and and being
able to control that, it's likeexercising your brain, right?
(23:07):
It's like literally like beingable to control it.
SPEAKER_01 (23:10):
Exactly what it is, really.
Yeah, it's it's uh it's it'slike mental calisthenics.
(24:06):
You get in there and you yougotta go down all the way and
come up all the way, and andwhen you cut it, it's it you got
a little something from it.
SPEAKER_00 (24:15):
Yeah, definitely.
And and and I so I I've reallyexplored that to a deeper level,
and you know, I found this thingcalled MBSP, which is
mindfulness-based strengthspractice, and you know, it
combines character strengthswith mindfulness to create like
this next level of likeunderstanding of like, you know,
(24:37):
so we all have care differentcharacter strengths, and they
all show up in different ways.
And like uh for me, my you know,one of them's you know, one of
the top ones is creativity andlove of learning.
So when those two like reallylike come together, when I'm
loving learning and then andthen create like my brain lights
(24:58):
up, you know.
So like it's and it's beingmindful of those things.
Um am I using too muchcreativity or am I am I you know
and coming up with too manyideas?
And like maybe I need to addsome prudence in there and be
like, look, I can only focusreally well on one thing, even
though I think I can multitask,but in my experience
(25:20):
multitasking conundrum, right?
SPEAKER_01 (25:22):
Everybody thinks I'm multitasking, I'm better.
Worst thing you can do.
SPEAKER_00 (25:27):
Yeah, it actually doesn't exist, it doesn't work,
you know, because like it's it'sthat trend, it actually slows
you down, slows down yourprogress.
It's like when and and you lookat focus and like understanding
focus, like what your mindfocuses on is like what you're
gonna produce in your life.
So you look at light, and likelight, if you put it under a
(25:51):
magnifying glass, it's well, youjust look at light and it's it's
harmless, it lights up the room.
But if you put it under amagnifying glass, you can burn
stuff.
You good if you even focus iteven stronger, you can cut
through steel like a laser, likea laser beam, yeah.
So that's the same way your mindworks.
If you are completely focused onone thing and non-stop and
(26:14):
without any distractions, whichis difficult for somebody with
ADHD, sure, but like that's whatI do.
Like I coach them like every forme, every person with ADHD is
like somebody, you know, a manwith ADHD is is buried treasure.
SPEAKER_01 (26:33):
Right, right.
Well, I can say definitely thisconversation.
I wouldn't suspect that youdealt with ADHD.
So you've definitely um, youknow, you you have a a focus
through the conversation, youryour tempo has been laid back,
paced, and everything about it.
Like I've had guests that arepretty manic, you know, and I I
(26:56):
get excited, I get manicsometimes and just like speed up
and just get into it, you know.
But you really um had a goodgood level demeanor through
this.
Why don't you tell us a littlebit about your podcast and how
the people that you're helpingand and how that's all working?
SPEAKER_00 (27:12):
Yeah, I appreciate that and you know that
observation and and and uh youknow that means a lot.
Yeah um so with my podcast, it'scalled Don't Mind Me.
I just have ADHD.
You know, I I have you knowsingle episodes where I where I
talk about certain um topicsthat are particularly interested
(27:33):
in me and that that have had animpact and and I believe will
help other people.
Like I did this ADHD and traumaseries.
So it was like this whole arc ofyou know how how it happens when
you're born, like what happened,like growing up as a child, what
what how your parents areinvolved, how the environment is
involved, how how that can leadto addiction.
(27:56):
Like it's it really goes deepinto you know, like exploring
like all these thingscontributed to who you are
today.
It wasn't just one thing, so wecan't just address those one
thing and and coming up withsolutions in those things, and
and and not in a way that'slike, oh, these are all bad, and
(28:16):
like this is the problem.
No, it's like there's goodthings in them, but
understanding them helps you tomake an educated decision moving
forward.
SPEAKER_01 (28:28):
Everything cuts both ways.
People don't realize that thereis no good or bad.
I mean, it I mean, there is goodand bad, but most everything has
a little bit of both in it.
And it depends on what you'redoing with it and what you're
putting it with, and you know,there's so many, so many
variables.
I think that's that's good.
The the solutions in health aregenerally unique to each
(28:52):
individual and the complex setof circumstances that are
involved.
SPEAKER_00 (28:58):
Yeah, definitely.
And and and mental health is soimportant to the whole dynamic
of it, like understanding howyour brain works and like what's
what's what's a good amount ofsleep, what what what I need to
do to be able to focus, like theproper amount of water, like
that's so important to, youknow, and if your mental
(29:19):
health's not good, you're notgonna care about exercise and
you're not gonna care about therest of the paradigm.
Right.
You know, so like and and and Ibelieve that like you know, in
my life, like when when you'remore God-centered and you put
God in in first in your life,like everything else falls into
place because you understand whyyou're here, you understand God
(29:42):
doesn't make mistakes, and if hemade you, he made you out of
love.
SPEAKER_01 (29:46):
You bet 100%.
That's a that's a that's a awise observation.
Listen, Ron, uh this happens tome almost every time we run out
of time before we run out ofconversation.
I I want to invite you to umwrap your thought up into a
central point to bring to thelisteners, but I also want to
(30:08):
invite you to come back tocontinue this discussion at a
future time because I feel likewe really just scratched the
surface of of this.
And uh I have a number of gueststhat come back over and again
and and get deeper intoconversation, and I definitely
want to extend that offer to youas well.
But for our listeners, um, isthere is there a central thought
(30:30):
that you'd like to share?
SPEAKER_00 (30:32):
Yeah, it's just just uh you're worth it.
Like you're worth like like Isaid, God created you, you have
a gift, and you know it's it'sit's you alone, you're one of a
kind, and you're worth gettingto know better.
SPEAKER_01 (30:49):
100%.
That's a that's a powerful andbeautiful thought, and it's it's
important.
I think if each of us were totake that uh alone and really
spend time with it and realizeit, and then you start forgiving
yourself for the stupid thingsthat you beat yourself up for
and you start opening up doorsinstead of shutting them and and
creating opportunity instead ofwalking away from things.
(31:12):
So definitely I I wouldencourage everybody to take that
one and spend some time with it.
It's definitely uh important.
Why don't you tell us a littlebit about um how to find your
podcast and how to get a hold ofyou if somebody's dealing with
uh ADHD themselves and they theythey want to maybe find some
(31:33):
answers?
SPEAKER_00 (31:34):
Yeah, definitely.
If you want to like step into myworld, definitely um don't mind
me.
I just have ADHD, is my podcast.
There it's on Apple, Spotify,um, you know, your favorite
platform to listen on.
Um, I'm also offering your guesta video that I just made, and
(31:56):
that's like uh free training.
It's called uh mastering themoment.
And um literally it talks aboutlike you know how how to make
eye contact, how to do thedifferent things to really show
up and like make a powerfulfirst impression.
You can find that at youradhguy.com.
(32:18):
And uh there's there's severalother great resources there,
including you know, ways to getget in contact with me and like
potentially um work with me.
SPEAKER_01 (32:29):
Fantastic.
Well, Ron, I I this has been agreat conversation.
Apparently, you and I have a lotin common.
Uh and you know, it's funny, I Inever considered my what they
called back in the 70shyperactivity um a deficit.
I was like, well, I don't know.
I just you give me something I'minterested in and I'll I'll lock
(32:52):
in.
Other than that, you know,you're not that interesting.
And uh I I don't think I everlet it get get to me because I
kept going, you know.
I always found a way to to findsomething else.
Although, you know, I'm sure Icomplicated a lot of other
people's lives along the way.
But um I absolutely want to uhuh extend that invitation to
(33:16):
you.
I'd love to have you come back,and there's just so much more to
talk about, but I want to thankyou for joining us today.
SPEAKER_00 (33:23):
Yeah, tough way.
And and uh, you know, uh I'mhumbled and honored that you'd
you'd have me back and and andI'd love to.
SPEAKER_01 (33:31):
Wonderful.
Well, this has been anotherepisode of the Healthy Living
Podcast.
I'm your host, Joe Grumbine, andI'd like to thank all of our
listeners that make this showpossible, and we will see you
next time.
Well, hello and welcome back to the Healthy
Living Podcast.
I'm your host, Joe Grumbine, andtoday we've got a very special
guest.
His name is Ron Sowers, and he'san ADHD advocate, a podcast
host, and an author dedicated toempowering adults with ADHD to
embrace their differences andunlock their true potential.
(00:45):
And I like to keep intros shortand let the conversation have
plenty of time to talk.
So, Ron, welcome to the show.
It's good to have you here withus.
And you know, it's funny, when Iwas a kid, I was known to be um,
they called me hyperactive, butI'm a lot older than you.
And the truth is, um, I probablyhad what they call ADHD now.
(01:08):
I think everybody's got a littleADHD these days.
Why don't you tell us a littlebit about what that actually
means?
But most importantly, why don'tyou tell us how how did you come
here?
How did you come to this spaceand uh um, you know, tell us a
little bit about your personalstory?
SPEAKER_00 (01:23):
Yeah, thank you.
Uh, I appreciate that, Joe, forum, you know, the space and um,
you know, it's a privilege andan honor.
You know, honestly, you know,how how I came to find out with
ADHD wasn't like, you know, itwas it was it was a lot like
probably most other people'sstories, and just I didn't know.
(01:45):
Um, you know, I would say likeit started because I um was
about to lose my job.
And um, you know, like I Icouldn't slow down, I couldn't I
couldn't stop, like, you know, II didn't feel the need that I
needed that but I had people inmy life, like a lot of people
(02:08):
saying, Man, you need to slowdown, and I just didn't think
that they knew what they weretalking about.
Um, you know, so like anythingin my life, or you know, most
people, in order to to to wantto change, the pain's gotta be
great enough.
And for me, that that you know,losing my job was so scary.
(02:30):
Um, because I was like, youknow, I'm an addict as well.
So I was in a program duringthat time.
So I had people around me, um,you know, that understood how I
was and like understood like theimpact of like losing my job.
So there was like there was alot of you know good loving fear
(02:51):
involved in that.
So what that ended up promptingme to do was go to my uh
physical, I mean my uh primarycare doctor and saying, hey,
look, I I can't slow down, uhafraid I'm gonna lose my job, I
don't know what to do.
Um what do you what do yousuggest?
(03:13):
And she kind of really didn'tdrew a blank, and I was like,
maybe I have ADHD, and she kindof didn't look too convinced,
but I just but she still gave mea list of like psychologists and
therapists, like run down, whichwas you know not the easiest
thing to do because I I don'teven know which one I need
(03:37):
first.
SPEAKER_01 (03:38):
How how old are you at this point?
I'm 44 today, but I mean this atwhen you're going through this
oh when when it was like two,three years ago.
SPEAKER_00 (03:48):
Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_01 (03:49):
So this was pretty recently, yeah, definitely.
SPEAKER_00 (03:52):
So yeah, like I went through that list and I was able
to find the therapist that Iactually uh still talk to today.
And um, you know, like one ofthe first things that he said to
me that really stood out waslike this this can actually be
you turned into a strength,yeah.
Like if you do the work.
And you know, I was like, Idon't know, like I was just so
(04:16):
elated at that time that like Iknew what it was, that there was
help, and I thought, hey, look,if I just do what he says, it's
gonna be cured, right?
SPEAKER_01 (04:27):
Somebody knows about this, it's not just like this
mutant alien virus that nobodyknows what to do with.
SPEAKER_00 (04:34):
Yeah, I'm not all alone, and you know, um, other
people have have gotten betterwith it.
So, you know, I'm just gonnatrust this guy and uh, you know,
do what he says and and justsee, you know, at least try what
he says and you know, try toimplement that in my life.
And one of the biggest thingsthat that made an impact was
(04:55):
like he said, to drive to work,like you're taking the long way.
So I literally went and took thelong way to work.
So I got I went extra early, andum, you know, it it was it was
like a bit of meditation, andthat definitely helped, but it
(05:16):
was like a mountain to like animpossible mountain that I that
I didn't think, you know, therewas a lot of pitfalls where I
just didn't think that I couldslow down, and you know, um, but
uh but I had good people in mylife that that were helping me
along that journey.
SPEAKER_01 (05:33):
So was this something that you've dealt with
all your life, or did you noticethat it became more pronounced
as you got older?
SPEAKER_00 (05:42):
I mean, it it like yeah, looking back, yeah, I
definitely remember.
I remember this one time that Iwas like, I like I love to go
fast in cars that didn't reallygo fast, but you know, I was
like, man, I'm a I'm a speedracer.
And I remember this one time inparticular where I was like
going to like my best friend'shouse, and like there was like
(06:05):
this thin gap, and my sister wasin the in the car beside me, and
I was just like flooring it andgoing, you know, I'm going on
the side of the road to get pastthat, and she was so scared, and
I was like, Man, I don't knowwhy you're scared, because like
I got this, you know, but likelooking back, like that could
have been you know, very thatcould have a second wrong and
(06:28):
boom, it's all over, yeah.
Yeah, so like I live my most ofmy life like that, like you
know, thinking that that wasnormal, thinking that's what I
needed to do.
SPEAKER_01 (06:39):
Okay, and when you're going through school, I
mean, let's go back into highschool or or college or or you
know, just your your school age.
Did you find that you had uhstruggles?
Like for me, I never went tocollege or at least no more in a
couple semesters.
(07:00):
But um when I was in gradeschool and high school, I I was
always fidgeting and and youknow doing stupid crap because I
couldn't keep my mind on thesubject matter unless it was
really interesting.
And if it was, I'd lock in and Icouldn't let it go and I'd be
obsessed with it.
(07:20):
But you know, I was always theone moving around doing stupid
crap and getting you know putoff to the corner because I was
disrupting everybody.
SPEAKER_00 (07:30):
Yeah, yeah.
I definitely had um, you know,times like that.
Like for me, art was wassomething that always was was
something that that drew me toit.
You know, I ended up you knowwinning a a couple of uh awards
for my art and art class.
And um, but like everythingelse, it just like I think I was
(07:53):
interested in science a littlebit, but you know, it really
depended on the teacher, right?
And I really just coastedthrough you know high school and
got, you know, I remember um youknow, hiding out in the bathroom
um between classes and just youknow, because like I just felt
(08:13):
so different, you know.
I didn't really think that Icould make friends and like I
didn't find out till recentlylike that was actually uh a
deeper trauma when I was in likesecond grade um that I had
actually stood up on on in inthe class on a desk and thought
(08:34):
like you know, to try to getfriends, to try to be funny.
And uh my teacher did not likethat, and she ended up putting
me in the front of the class,and I think I got made fun of.
Um, so it was like I just felt,you know, I like my mom told me
that you know, I I I told herlike I just didn't feel like I I
(08:55):
would rather disappear than goback to school, you know.
So I remember seeing a lot oftherapists growing up, but you
know, none of them were able toreally connect the dots, you
know, that it was just likeanxiety, and I didn't really
like listening to them.
I was just going to you knowappease my children.
SPEAKER_01 (09:14):
Right, right.
So now you got this thistherapist that you think has got
the answers.
Um, how how uh tell us a littlebit about how that went.
SPEAKER_00 (09:24):
Yeah, it was it was a process in a you know, and
like in the beginning, you know,I was like, okay, I'm gonna fix
this, I'm gonna do whatever hesays, and we're gonna get past
this, and like I don't so Idon't have to see therapy, you
know, like it was just anotherum box to check off, you know.
So there, you know, and I hadsuccess in there, and you know,
(09:47):
I definitely learned to slowdown, learn the value of like
analyzing my thoughts and likereally questioning, you know.
One one question that I you knowI still ask myself is like, what
is the rush?
SPEAKER_01 (10:01):
You know, like I've left just to hurry.
SPEAKER_00 (10:04):
Yeah, I've left early enough, right?
Like, but I'm I'm speeding downthe road, like I'm gonna get
there on time.
SPEAKER_01 (10:11):
Like hurry up so you can sit there and wait.
SPEAKER_00 (10:14):
Yeah, so you know, that question definitely helps
to like okay, bring me back inthe moment and like really, you
know, analyze what I'm doing.
But it's like so I ended upleaving, um, you know, and
saying, like, hey, you know,I've I think we've this has run
its course, you know, I'm I canapply what you've taught me in
(10:36):
my life.
So what ended up happening waslike I got a um um a different
position in my job that requiredme to to operate a forklift uh
around dangerous chemicals, uhthe raw chemicals and putting
it, it was like a mixing role.
And um, you know, I was you hadto pay attention.
(10:58):
Yeah, I was like, and and thatthat same need to like go fast
took over again because I'mlearning a new position.
I want to make sure that theythey they are right, they made
the right decision.
I want to show them, but like Iended up running into like a
reinforcement pole, almosttaking that out, and like punks
(11:18):
flipping drums and like you nameit, like crushing pallets.
Like it was crazy.
And and like, you know, thefinal thing that really, you
know, uh broke the camel's back,if if you will, was like I was
pulling down, you know, I waslowering the forks and it hit
this little um little beam thatwas like right next to these
(11:42):
chemical lines.
So if it went over a little bitmore, but in my mind, I'm like,
it's just it's just a beam thatlike it shouldn't even be there
because it's not even on theother side.
But honestly, like you know, nowthat I'm looking back, it's like
I'm glad that happened.
Yeah, because but in thatmoment, I was so scared, like I
(12:05):
was so full of stress and fear,like I was gonna lose my job,
and you know, and and you know,like after evaluating that with
you know my sponsor, and likefortunately I had time, like you
have this health and safe time,so I took the rest of the day
off because they theyimmediately were like, you know,
you need to get recertified onon, and there was no one there
(12:28):
to do that.
So like I had to have somebodyelse operate the fork truck for
me, and so I left, and I wasjust like, I did, you know, I
needed to, I needed, I needed tostep off that situation and
evaluating it.
I was like, you know what?
I need I need to go back to myprevious position because like
(12:50):
me and four and heavy machinerydo not mix because like I was
literally going back.
That's when I went back to mytherapist and was like, you
know, we came up with a gameplan for slowing down, and I was
doing good, and you know, andthen that happened.
So it was it was so frustratingbecause it looked like to
(13:11):
everyone else, like I justdidn't care, and I was just but
I got distracted in that moment,so I understood like anything,
it doesn't matter how hard Iwork or how much training I get,
like it it could just be anylittle distraction, and you
know, uh I I could end up itcould it could be worse than
(13:32):
that.
So, you know, during thatprocess, like I I wanted to look
for you know a different job,like a day because I you know I
was like I'm working arounddangerous chemicals, period.
Right, so like that that's notgood with distraction.
SPEAKER_01 (13:47):
So better choices to make when you can't keep your
mind your mind on a on thatsubject there, yeah, yeah,
definitely.
SPEAKER_00 (13:55):
So like I started looking into like how ways to
make like side hustles, and youknow, one of them was like what
the podcast.
Okay, really I've really foundthat I had a passion for talking
about mental health, and then Iwanted to kind of niche it down
to be like ADHD in the workplacebecause it was like you don't
(14:17):
get a lot of that, you know,talked about like what tools you
can use, what how that shows up,and how you can talk about it,
how you can advocate for it.
So I really started to buildthat and build, you know,
started doing a lot of research,and you know, I found that it
was like pretty difficult tofind the information.
You really had to do somedigging.
(14:37):
Like now it's it's still, but Ifeel like it's all out there,
it's just so scattered, right?
So like you know, it it's notlike synthesized.
SPEAKER_01 (14:48):
There's so much information and in in so many
places that separating goodinformation from bad
information, or like you said,connecting relevant information
together, like a lot of timespeople will you know collect a
dozen different terms for adozen different um uh conditions
(15:13):
and throw them all into the samebatch as though they all belong
together.
And you know, somebody's gottafigure out what what what what
goes where.
So I hear the term ADHD a lot,and frankly, I don't even know
exactly what that means.
Why don't you share with usreally what what is ADHD?
SPEAKER_00 (15:35):
Yeah, ADHD is you know basically the term means uh
attention hyperactive attentiondeficit hyperactivity disorder.
So that name is totallyconfusing on its own because
like I don't lack attention, Idon't have a deficit in
attention, I have an abundancein attention, I just don't know
how to focus it.
(15:55):
Okay, and like hyperactivity waskind of thrown in there because
you know, that fidgeting, thatyou know, not being able to sit
still, racing thoughts, youknow, and like like you can
tell, like I have thathyperactivity, but a lot of it
is combined because there's theinattentive side, you know,
where people are just you know,they seem like they're lazy or
(16:18):
they seem like they're slow orthey seem like they don't care,
you know.
It's it's really their theirbrain is it's so hard for them
to like put things together thatit's like they're just doing
literally the best that theycan.
So when when you have like acombination of those two,
because like I I it when when itcomes to like complex
(16:41):
information, like uh it takes mea long time um to really absorb
it, but when I do, it's it'sit's like set in there, and then
I can see it in a different way.
I compare like the ADHD brain toa high definition printer
because it's gonna take longerto process that information, but
(17:03):
it but the picture is gonna haveso much more quality, so much
more detail, and like that'swhere and another aspect of it
is that emotional dysregulation.
So it's like you could befeeling great one minute, and
then you know, something happensand then you're down in the
dumps, or or you're completelyangry, like your emotions are so
(17:26):
like all over the place, right?
You know, and and a lot of timesyou don't know how to express
that, and that comes out asanger or frustration, you know,
and and that's that's one of thethings that like why I started
like wanting to coach thatbecause I became like a human
guinea pig of like, okay, whatdoes this work?
(17:46):
What does this do?
And you know, like seeing whathas the best benefit in the most
like simple way to do that,because it's like there's all
these great things out therethat you know kind of touch on
the uh surface level of it, butthey don't go really to the
deeper core issue of ADHD.
SPEAKER_01 (18:10):
So the last word of that acronym is disorder, and so
I I look at that as you knowkind of like a um not a disease
necessarily, but uh uh asituation where your brain isn't
(18:32):
working the way a quote normalbrain would work.
And there's all these reasonsfor these things to happen, and
it could be genetic, it could beenvironmental, it could be um
trauma induced.
Um so what is the the genesis ofthis particular type of symptom
(18:53):
syndrome, or is there just oneor is it combinations of things
for different people?
SPEAKER_00 (18:59):
Yeah, I mean, like you said, there's no real normal
brain, like there's everyone haslike something that's the
everyone has strengths andeveryone has weaknesses,
basically.
Um, I think that that disorderjust gives it such a negative
connotation, it really just is adifference.
Like it's it's just your braindeveloped differently, and and
(19:21):
it is trauma-induced.
Um, a lot of it, from myunderstanding, is like when when
you're born before you were evenborn, when you're being created,
like um the trauma that your themother is going through, like
has a direct impact on the waythat your brain develops, you
(19:43):
know, and and like parts of yourbrain get overdeveloped, and
part of your parts of your grainbrain get underdeveloped, it
develops with the same energy,but like different parts.
So even in even that process,and this this is something that
I've learned from Dr.
Gabor Mate, and like he's anincredible source of like
(20:05):
information, and and he reallylike the difference between him
and most people that study it inscience is he adds that
spirituality and emotionalelement to it because you can't
really figure out what theproblem is without looking at
those details as well.
So it's like um, and and eventhe trauma can can happen early
(20:27):
in in childhood from likeneglect, you know, because a lot
of a lot of people don'tunderstand, and and I didn't for
a long time that neglect canactually be a very powerful um
traumatic event.
SPEAKER_01 (20:41):
100%.
I we've had a number of gueststalk about a number of ways that
can play out from uh differenttypes of syndromes to I mean, I
it it it's it's wild how aneglected child can manifest
that trauma uh in so manydifferent ways.
(21:02):
And and I keep seeing it happenover and again.
So you've gone through a numberof different solutions.
Why don't you tell us a littlebit about some of these
solutions and the ones that haveworked best for you?
SPEAKER_00 (21:16):
Yeah, I would say like um, you know, just being
like vulnerable about it, youknow, and acceptance, like a
deep level of acceptance oflike, hey, I have ADHD, that's
not gonna change.
Let's see how I can moveforward.
It's not a problem, it's notsomething that's you know, uh
(21:37):
like makes me less than orbetter than anybody else.
It's just the way I am, justlike I need glasses, right?
Like I don't just say, Well, Ineed glass, I need to fix my
eyes or like do something crazy.
I mean, there's obviously lasersurgery, but like, you know,
honestly, it's it's it's it'slike one of the biggest tools
(22:01):
that I found beyond that ismindfulness, yeah.
You know, and mindfulness is isso powerful because like you
know, with especially withracing thoughts and and being
able to control that, it's likeexercising your brain, right?
(23:07):
It's like literally like beingable to control it.
SPEAKER_01 (23:10):
Exactly what it is, really.
Yeah, it's it's uh it's it'slike mental calisthenics.
(24:06):
You get in there and you yougotta go down all the way and
come up all the way, and andwhen you cut it, it's it you got
a little something from it.
SPEAKER_00 (24:15):
Yeah, definitely.
And and and I so I I've reallyexplored that to a deeper level,
and you know, I found this thingcalled MBSP, which is
mindfulness-based strengthspractice, and you know, it
combines character strengthswith mindfulness to create like
this next level of likeunderstanding of like, you know,
(24:37):
so we all have care differentcharacter strengths, and they
all show up in different ways.
And like uh for me, my you know,one of them's you know, one of
the top ones is creativity andlove of learning.
So when those two like reallylike come together, when I'm
loving learning and then andthen create like my brain lights
(24:58):
up, you know.
So like it's and it's beingmindful of those things.
Um am I using too muchcreativity or am I am I you know
and coming up with too manyideas?
And like maybe I need to addsome prudence in there and be
like, look, I can only focusreally well on one thing, even
though I think I can multitask,but in my experience
(25:20):
multitasking conundrum, right?
SPEAKER_01 (25:22):
Everybody thinks I'm multitasking, I'm better.
Worst thing you can do.
SPEAKER_00 (25:27):
Yeah, it actually doesn't exist, it doesn't work,
you know, because like it's it'sthat trend, it actually slows
you down, slows down yourprogress.
It's like when and and you lookat focus and like understanding
focus, like what your mindfocuses on is like what you're
gonna produce in your life.
So you look at light, and likelight, if you put it under a
(25:51):
magnifying glass, it's well, youjust look at light and it's it's
harmless, it lights up the room.
But if you put it under amagnifying glass, you can burn
stuff.
You good if you even focus iteven stronger, you can cut
through steel like a laser, likea laser beam, yeah.
So that's the same way your mindworks.
If you are completely focused onone thing and non-stop and
(26:14):
without any distractions, whichis difficult for somebody with
ADHD, sure, but like that's whatI do.
Like I coach them like every forme, every person with ADHD is
like somebody, you know, a manwith ADHD is is buried treasure.
SPEAKER_01 (26:33):
Right, right.
Well, I can say definitely thisconversation.
I wouldn't suspect that youdealt with ADHD.
So you've definitely um, youknow, you you have a a focus
through the conversation, youryour tempo has been laid back,
paced, and everything about it.
Like I've had guests that arepretty manic, you know, and I I
(26:56):
get excited, I get manicsometimes and just like speed up
and just get into it, you know.
But you really um had a goodgood level demeanor through
this.
Why don't you tell us a littlebit about your podcast and how
the people that you're helpingand and how that's all working?
SPEAKER_00 (27:12):
Yeah, I appreciate that and you know that
observation and and and uh youknow that means a lot.
Yeah um so with my podcast, it'scalled Don't Mind Me.
I just have ADHD.
You know, I I have you knowsingle episodes where I where I
talk about certain um topicsthat are particularly interested
(27:33):
in me and that that have had animpact and and I believe will
help other people.
Like I did this ADHD and traumaseries.
So it was like this whole arc ofyou know how how it happens when
you're born, like what happened,like growing up as a child, what
what how your parents areinvolved, how the environment is
involved, how how that can leadto addiction.
(27:56):
Like it's it really goes deepinto you know, like exploring
like all these thingscontributed to who you are
today.
It wasn't just one thing, so wecan't just address those one
thing and and coming up withsolutions in those things, and
and and not in a way that'slike, oh, these are all bad, and
(28:16):
like this is the problem.
No, it's like there's goodthings in them, but
understanding them helps you tomake an educated decision moving
forward.
SPEAKER_01 (28:28):
Everything cuts both ways.
People don't realize that thereis no good or bad.
I mean, it I mean, there is goodand bad, but most everything has
a little bit of both in it.
And it depends on what you'redoing with it and what you're
putting it with, and you know,there's so many, so many
variables.
I think that's that's good.
The the solutions in health aregenerally unique to each
(28:52):
individual and the complex setof circumstances that are
involved.
SPEAKER_00 (28:58):
Yeah, definitely.
And and and mental health is soimportant to the whole dynamic
of it, like understanding howyour brain works and like what's
what's what's a good amount ofsleep, what what what I need to
do to be able to focus, like theproper amount of water, like
that's so important to, youknow, and if your mental
(29:19):
health's not good, you're notgonna care about exercise and
you're not gonna care about therest of the paradigm.
Right.
You know, so like and and and Ibelieve that like you know, in
my life, like when when you'remore God-centered and you put
God in in first in your life,like everything else falls into
place because you understand whyyou're here, you understand God
(29:42):
doesn't make mistakes, and if hemade you, he made you out of
love.
SPEAKER_01 (29:46):
You bet 100%.
That's a that's a that's a awise observation.
Listen, Ron, uh this happens tome almost every time we run out
of time before we run out ofconversation.
I I want to invite you to umwrap your thought up into a
central point to bring to thelisteners, but I also want to
(30:08):
invite you to come back tocontinue this discussion at a
future time because I feel likewe really just scratched the
surface of of this.
And uh I have a number of gueststhat come back over and again
and and get deeper intoconversation, and I definitely
want to extend that offer to youas well.
But for our listeners, um, isthere is there a central thought
(30:30):
that you'd like to share?
SPEAKER_00 (30:32):
Yeah, it's just just uh you're worth it.
Like you're worth like like Isaid, God created you, you have
a gift, and you know it's it'sit's you alone, you're one of a
kind, and you're worth gettingto know better.
SPEAKER_01 (30:49):
100%.
That's a that's a powerful andbeautiful thought, and it's it's
important.
I think if each of us were totake that uh alone and really
spend time with it and realizeit, and then you start forgiving
yourself for the stupid thingsthat you beat yourself up for
and you start opening up doorsinstead of shutting them and and
creating opportunity instead ofwalking away from things.
(31:12):
So definitely I I wouldencourage everybody to take that
one and spend some time with it.
It's definitely uh important.
Why don't you tell us a littlebit about um how to find your
podcast and how to get a hold ofyou if somebody's dealing with
uh ADHD themselves and they theythey want to maybe find some
(31:33):
answers?
SPEAKER_00 (31:34):
Yeah, definitely.
If you want to like step into myworld, definitely um don't mind
me.
I just have ADHD, is my podcast.
There it's on Apple, Spotify,um, you know, your favorite
platform to listen on.
Um, I'm also offering your guesta video that I just made, and
(31:56):
that's like uh free training.
It's called uh mastering themoment.
And um literally it talks aboutlike you know how how to make
eye contact, how to do thedifferent things to really show
up and like make a powerfulfirst impression.
You can find that at youradhguy.com.
(32:18):
And uh there's there's severalother great resources there,
including you know, ways to getget in contact with me and like
potentially um work with me.
SPEAKER_01 (32:29):
Fantastic.
Well, Ron, I I this has been agreat conversation.
Apparently, you and I have a lotin common.
Uh and you know, it's funny, I Inever considered my what they
called back in the 70shyperactivity um a deficit.
I was like, well, I don't know.
I just you give me something I'minterested in and I'll I'll lock
(32:52):
in.
Other than that, you know,you're not that interesting.
And uh I I don't think I everlet it get get to me because I
kept going, you know.
I always found a way to to findsomething else.
Although, you know, I'm sure Icomplicated a lot of other
people's lives along the way.
But um I absolutely want to uhuh extend that invitation to
(33:16):
you.
I'd love to have you come back,and there's just so much more to
talk about, but I want to thankyou for joining us today.
SPEAKER_00 (33:23):
Yeah, tough way.
And and uh, you know, uh I'mhumbled and honored that you'd
you'd have me back and and andI'd love to.
SPEAKER_01 (33:31):
Wonderful.
Well, this has been anotherepisode of the Healthy Living
Podcast.
I'm your host, Joe Grumbine, andI'd like to thank all of our
listeners that make this showpossible, and we will see you
next time.
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