December 27, 2024 • 21 mins
Ever thought about transitioning from managing lush fairways to orchestrating thriving real estate ventures? Tony Hudzinski did just that, and he's here to share his story. Join us as Tony, a partner at Wisco Real Estate Services, recounts his journey from a golf course superintendent to a successful real estate investor and broker. Discover how Tony and his wife ventured into house hacking before it became a trendy buzzword and learn about their foray into the multifamily real estate scene. Tony breaks down the art of syndication, enlightening us on the roles of general and limited partners and why having a finger on the pulse of local property management is non-negotiable in the industry.
But that's not all. Tony also opens up about the power of mindset and community in real estate. From running a brokerage that caters to both residential and commercial clients to fostering a thriving community through the Wisco Investor Network, Tony champions the idea of sharing knowledge and nurturing relationships. Hear about the life-changing impact of goal-setting retreats and why maintaining a positive outlook is crucial in navigating this dynamic field. With a strong belief in the potential of multifamily real estate, especially in emerging markets like Madison, Wisconsin, Tony inspires us to blend local expertise with national insights to seize opportunities and triumph over challenges. Get ready to shift your perspective and embrace the limitless potential of real estate investing.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to Heather Ewing, the CRE Rundown.
Today I have a special guestfor you.
It is Tony Pudzinski and he isone of the partners of Wisco
Real Estate Services.
Tony, welcome.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Thanks, heather, happy to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Definitely Great to have someone from the Wisconsin
area on.
Actually it's been a while.
So glad you could join me as weget going.
If you could just share with myaudience a little bit more
about yourself so they can getto know you a little bit more.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Sure, absolutely so.
I am a full-time broker andreal estate investor currently,
but I certainly did not startthere.
I'm a broker and real estateinvestor currently, but I
certainly did not start there.
I grew up loving to play golf,actually, and I couldn't afford
it, and so I got a job at a golfcourse and I did that all
through high school and college,and part of the way through
college I realized I could go toschool to work in a golf course
(00:59):
, and so I actually went toUniversity of Wisconsin here in
Madison and got a degree in turfmanagement, and so my first
career, as I call it, is as agolf course superintendent.
So I did that for about 20years.
And then when I met my wife Iwould say like in 2007,
somewhere in there we both weweren't married yet, but we both
(01:19):
agreed when we bought our firsthouse that it would be an
investment property, it would bea duplex, and so we house
hacked before that was a termand that was our first foray
into real estate investing.
And from there, a couple ofyears later, we bought our first
commercial building, whichhoused a business that we
(01:39):
operated, and eventually soldthat business and really were
enjoying just being landlordsand so we thought let's just buy
some more of these buildingsand be landlords, right.
And then, around 2020, Idecided that I didn't have time
to be a golf coursesuperintendent and you know good
at home with our three childrenand continue investing.
(02:01):
So I left the golf industry andgot my real estate license and
became an agent then and now abroker, and have been investing
ever since and primarily today.
I focus on multifamily, largermultifamily deals and we use
syndication to raise funds tobuy those generally.
(02:21):
So that's kind of a quicksummary of my professional life.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Right, definitely.
Well, the interesting thing toois with the turf experience
right.
That ties in perfectly for landand other deals.
I'm sure there's things thatyou've utilized in that sense
that you carry forward.
But if someone's newer toinvesting, share a little bit
more about syndication, how thatworks and just real high level,
(02:47):
some of the pros and cons.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Sure, absolutely.
I stumbled upon syndication justfrom an investor side realizing
that you know, as a couple mywife and I we were only going to
be able to buy so much propertyby ourselves before we were
going to be overextended, overleveraged.
We're going to run out of moneyfor down payments, Right.
And so I began a search for howto?
How do people accumulate athousand units, 10,000 units of
(03:12):
apartments?
You know, self-storage,whatever it is they're into.
And I found the syndicationconcept, and it's essentially a
person or group of people whoare the general partners or GPs.
They typically are the activereal estate piece.
They go out and find deals,they find financing for them,
they get them under contract andthen they find investors to
(03:32):
come in as limited partners.
So you have the generalpartners who operate it and the
limited partners or LPs who justinvest the money into the deal.
And so we pool our moneytogether with our limited
partners and then we use thosefunds to go and buy the deal.
And so we pool our moneytogether with our limited
partners and then we use thosefunds to go and buy the deals,
and then we do all of theoperations side, all the way
through an eventual sale, and soit's in my mind it's really the
(03:54):
one of the few ways you cantruly passively invest in real
estate.
A lot of people think that realestate investing in general is
passive.
But buy yourself a duplex or arental house on campus and then
call me in six months and tellme how passive that is.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Yeah, they would need to look up what passive means.
But yeah, so with that you know, in case there is someone
that's listening, what type ofinvestment opportunities are you
looking for?
What's a real rough parameterin case that person is looking
to sell?
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Yeah, well, I mean we will tackle anything.
I mean we'll take anything froma house that looks like a good
flip project.
We have our own constructioncrew that works in our
apartments and we'll utilizethem to flip a single family
home.
We're actively doing that rightnow.
But our real bread and butteris, I would say, 16 units and up
, you know and the sky's thelimit Like we will look at deals
(04:53):
that are five or 600 units asfar as apartments go Right, and
so we prefer something with somescale.
We do have our own managementteam.
That's a separate business, butwe manage all of our own
properties and we're able toscale that as needed.
And with the syndication piece,we feel very comfortable looking
at deals that are $2 million upto $200 million, that we can
(05:19):
find the investors and find thefunds to make it happen, and we
feel even more confident that wecan operate those effectively.
So really, you know, focusingaround Dane County, madison area
and we like to say Dane Countyand all the counties that touch
it so really South CentralWisconsin is where we'd like to
stay for as long as we can, sowe run out of property to buy
(05:44):
because we really feel stronglyabout personally managing the
property.
We're not one of thosecompanies that's actively
looking in Tampa or Phoenixbecause that's the hot market of
today and really hoping whoeverwe find to operate those deals
is a good operator.
It's really important to us.
It's one of our core values.
We keep our thumb on this.
We're raising money primarilyfrom our friends and family and
(06:05):
putting our own money into everysingle deal.
So we really want these thingsto perform and we want to be,
holding them to a very highstandard.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Definitely.
I know that makes completesense.
And what would you say are someof the common pitfalls of
investing for newer investors?
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Oh, I think I would start with just not knowing how
to crunch the numbersappropriately, underestimating
expenses and costs and potentialdownfalls that's the one I see
trip people up the most right.
Fortunately, with real estate,you don't tend to lose a lot of
value quickly, right?
So if someone gets into a baddeal, it's usually not going to
go to zero.
It's not like buying a stock ina startup company and then they
(06:49):
just, they just fail.
Right Now your ten thousanddollar investment is completely
gone.
But, yeah, I think,understanding how to operate or
run the numbers properly and soyou don't get yourself in over
your head and underestimatinghow much work is involved, and
so really finding experts andpeople who have been there and
(07:10):
done that to mentor you is thekey I've found.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
Definitely, which segues in perfectly.
So my understanding is you havevarious entities from
construction to, I think,different classes, right?
Can you share a little bit moreabout that?
Speaker 2 (07:26):
Yeah, absolutely.
We have a brokerage, so we doresidential and commercial
brokerage.
We really like to focus on theinvestment side.
So, like that person that wantsto buy their first duplex or
rental house, I love workingwith those buyers and sellers.
But we do regular residentialreal estate as well.
So people want to buy a home.
We do private lending, which is,you know, people who are
(07:47):
flipping houses can come to usfor funds to borrow to do those
projects short term.
On the other side of that isour investors who invest in our
apartment deals.
You know we don't have anapartment deal typically going
on at all times and so theprivate lending allows them to
invest in those loans.
So if a flipper comes to us andsays I need a thousand, a
(08:07):
hundred thousand dollars to flipthis house, we'll go to our
investor pool and say who wouldlike to borrow this person a
hundred thousand dollars?
They get paid a nice return.
We facilitate the whole thing.
We make sure the project isgood, but we also teach people
how to do that, as you alludedto, and we host a monthly meetup
here at our office in DeForest,Wisconsin, just outside of
Madison, and that's a freemeetup.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Give it a plug.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
Yeah, we call it the WIN, the Wisco Investor Network,
and it's invitation only.
So if anyone would like aninvitation, if you're local,
please shoot me an email atpartners at wiscorealestatecom
or tony at wiscolerealestatecomand I can put you on the list.
But we get about 50 to 60people a month who come and we
feed them really good food, youknow, have some drinks.
(08:51):
We have really great networkingafterwards and it's become
really popular and it's fun tosee this group of people grow,
see the same people coming back,bringing friends.
I've been craving a communitylike this for some time, so it's
really neat to be able to giveback.
We like to say that we'reself-proclaimed real estate
nerds and one of the ways wefeel like we can give back to
(09:12):
our community is by just sharingwhat we've learned and what we
know and our connections to, andalso learning from the
attendees.
They all have things to shareas well.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Right.
Well, and I think it's one ofthose too, like everyone, takes
their beatings in real estateright, especially in the early
years.
If you're able to get throughthose, then it's an amazing
arena, but for those that don't,you know, it's a very painful
experience in that sense.
So I like that you are givingit back, and of course, that's
(09:41):
something that's near and dearto my heart too is philanthropy
and sharing what we've learnedand helping people forward.
So I see that as an importantand essential part of business.
But segwaying in what would yousay is the mindset that has
helped you to shift from theearly years to now, or just some
(10:01):
of the different things thatreally stick out to you that
people should be aware of.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
That's a good question.
There's a lot of mindset setthings, I think, having an
abundance mindset, being willingto openly share.
I will share my trade secrets.
If I think I've got some reallycool investment hack, I'm not
afraid to tell anyone that wantsto hear about it.
If I tell 100 people the secrethack, there may be one or two
(10:30):
that actually go through with it, but I don't look at other
investors as competition.
And that's one of the coolthings about our meetups is we
really stress that we wantpeople to be able to speak
freely and have that abundancemindset that there's more than
enough for everyone to go around, and gatekeeping and holding
things tight to the vest wedon't think serves anybody, and
(10:53):
so we're very forthcoming withour information and I really
believe you need to give with noexpectation of receiving right.
That's a big core value ofmyself and our company too, Like
we try to pour into people andI know you know that it'll come
back at some point in the future, but I'm not doing it for that
reason, right?
And so I think, having thatabundance mindset and just not
(11:14):
having, you know, really nottrying to eliminate limiting
beliefs, right?
If you would have told me 10years ago that I would look at a
$200 million apartment deal, Iwould have called you crazy.
You know, when I, when I when Iwas before I was a real estate
professional and I had brokerslooking for me, I would say, all
right, look for duplexesbetween 150 and $300,000.
And to me that was as much as Icould afford and that was all I
(11:37):
was going to look at.
And partially I joined amentoring group to learn how to
do the syndication piece andbeing around people who are, you
know, that have raised abillion dollars, you know to buy
real estate, really showed me,you know, that this is doable,
right, and it really so.
Now the sky's the limit.
(11:57):
Like I said earlier, show me a500 unit apartment complex and
in the past I would have nevereven looked into it, but now
I'll analyze them.
If it makes sense, let's figureout how to make it go right.
And so just taking out thelimiting beliefs and believing
that I mean that abundancemindset will carry you through.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Definitely so.
Which group was that that youyou learned from the mentorship?
Speaker 2 (12:21):
Yeah, that group in particular it's run by actually
have the longest running realestate investment podcast.
It's called the Real EstateGuys Radio Show.
Oh, I've heard of it, it'scalled the Real Estate Guys
Radio.
Show.
Oh, I've heard of it.
Yeah, I've stumbled upon theirpodcast and they were hosting
their annual goal-settingretreat in Las Vegas.
This is back in like 2019.
(12:41):
And I asked my wife if she'dlike to go and she's like I
don't care who it is, let's goto Vegas.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
I just want to get out of.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Wisconsin for a couple of days, and we met some
just amazing people there thatwere involved in their we'll
call it like their inner circlegroup, and it was enough to
where, like wow, these peopleall have that abundance mindset.
They're all so forthcoming withinformation Like.
These are the people that, inour minds at the time, were the
(13:07):
experts that we needed to figureout how to be around, and so we
made a concerted effort totravel to all of their events
and attend all their educationalopportunities, and that's
really what launched took ourinvestment, real estate
investment careers up, you know,10 notches.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
I'm sure definitely.
And what would you say is yourgo-to for mindset when you need
to kind of revamp that right,because some days it's just like
, oh wow, was that painful.
And other days, right, it'slike everything's clicking and
the deals are, you know, comingtogether and penciling and the
numbers are coming in.
What would you say is yourgo-to one or two things for
(13:45):
mindset of staying top?
Speaker 2 (13:49):
tier.
I think the concept for me isis is thinking about how
everything is happening for meand not to me.
So even when you know you spillyour coffee on your pants and
you know bump into another carin the parking lot at the gas
station on the way to work, likeyou can either let those things
trigger you and set a bad toneand put you in a kind of a
(14:10):
negative headspace for the wholeday, or you can you can you can
think of it as all right.
All right I.
This happened for a reason, andI might not realize what it is
right now, but I probably willin the future if I reflect on it
enough.
And you know, maybe, maybe Igot that flat tire because had I
not gotten it, I would havegotten an accident on my way to
my meeting, Right.
And so I try to look ateverything as happening for me
(14:32):
and not to me, and just havingthat mindset really, really
helps shift me away from that.
Woe is me.
Victim mentality to this isjust.
I'm just another step closer towhere I'm supposed to be.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Right, that's terrific.
And what would you say?
You know, as far as the nextfive, 10 years?
What is there anything thatjumps out to you as far as
industry shifts, changes,anything like that?
Speaker 2 (15:00):
You know being very I'm very bullish on multifamily
real estate right now justbecause I see as a realtor, I
see pricing, I see a lot ofpeople can't afford to buy their
first home anymore.
They would love to own a home,maybe, but they can only afford
an apartment Right, and I don'tsee that changing the
foreseeable future.
There's just such a lack of ofof housing in general and
(15:23):
especially affordable housing,and I know a lot of builders.
I know what it costs to buildthings these days.
Labor costs for them are throughthe roof on top of materials
and I just I see a lot of valueto what we do in buying these
older buildings and then usingour construction crew to go in
and make them nice, make themnot just livable but almost like
a brand new apartment, but fora fraction of a cost of what, in
(15:46):
time, of what it takes to builda brand new facility.
Um, so I I'm very bullish on onmulti-family.
And then you know, on thecommercial side of things like
retail and those sorts of things, restaurants, I think those
things all need to besurrounding that right.
So I don't see a slowdownanytime soon, especially in the
next five years.
(16:06):
I'm doubling down.
We want to buy every apartmentwe can get our hands on in the
next five years.
I'll put it that way.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
Right.
Yeah, I always have to chuckleat the number of calls I get for
mixed use and different rentfigures and this, that and the
other thing for the triple netleases and it's liquid gold you
either have it or you don'twhich all computes into those
mixed use developments andthings of that nature.
So I agree, there's a lot ofaction and it's only going to
(16:35):
increase with the density andthe growth of Dane County, its
projections, and a lot of peopledo want into the market.
Right, Our costs are much lessthan California and the larger
markets, so it's a free for alland quite easy to snap up the
inventory when they've got theright contacts.
So I think it's important toobviously have a local blend
(16:58):
some of the national, regional,but definitely keeping you know
some of those solid localoperators too.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
Yeah, madison is such a wonderful place to live,
right, these people that comeand discover it from the coasts,
um, you know there's a lot ofpeople moving south right.
For the last four years now, alot of people moved to texas and
tennessee and florida andarizona and, um, boy, aside from
a little, a little cold likewe're having, you know, for a
(17:27):
month or two here in the winter,it's really hard to beat.
It is much less expensive.
The quality life, life'samazing.
Another reason I'm bullish onapartments, but just real estate
in general in the Madison areais just so strong because I
teeter between wanting to shoutit from the rooftops and keeping
our little secret and keep, youknow, all the institutional
(17:48):
investors from the coast fromcoming and finding us, but
they'll find us eventually andagain, with that abundance
mentality, I want everyone toknow.
You know all around the worldhow great of a place this
Madison area is and I trulybelieve that.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Definitely so.
This is the hard hittingquestion, right.
So the last one, the big one,is what does living fully mean
to you?
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Yeah, living best for last?
Yeah, that's a great question.
Um, living fully is is it's notnecessarily balanced.
I don't know that.
I believe you can achieve truebalance.
Um, for me, it's keeping mypriorities straight and you know
, my number one priority ismyself and my health and keeping
(18:31):
my my mental, emotional,physical health um in a good
place and whatever it takes todo that, whether it's, you know,
doing hobbies that I love,reading and growing but once I'm
taken care of, I really focus.
(18:52):
I'm very, very much lean towardstaking care of others Like I'm
an acts of service type ofperson.
So I think I think to live afull life, I really need to feel
like I'm very much being ofservice to those around me,
especially my friends and family.
And so I feel like if I can Akeep myself in a good spot and
keep myself strong, I'll be in agood place to be as helpful as
possible to everyone else.
And for sure, money andbusiness and all that stuff is
(19:14):
is cool, but it's it's a distant, you know it's down the list
from those other things.
So relationships, you know I'veenjoyed starting to get to know
you.
I love just meeting new peopleand making connections.
Speaker 1 (19:25):
I really enjoy connecting people, you know if I
can take two people, that Iknow should meet and put them
together.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
That's super satisfying.
So, yeah, living a full life is, I think, taking care of myself
and then taking care of thosearound me, and and everything
else is a bonus, right?
Speaker 1 (19:40):
well, and you know it's one of those two.
It seems like you are living ina very aligned life, which
would make sense why you're ahappy person, good disposition,
and you keep making choices thatkeep you on that path, which is
neat and I think so frequentlya lot of people don't realize
the power that they yield insetting goals and in saying yes
(20:03):
to some things, no to otherthings, that really help them
get on that path.
So I'd say kudos to you, tony.
That's terrific.
I'm excited for you, and I'malso excited to see how your
company continues to grow andexpand, and we'll have to do a
deal together one of these times.
Speaker 2 (20:22):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
I would love that.
Yeah, we'll pay that house too.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
We're shooting to the moon, we're on a fast pace and
it's really exciting and I lookforward to working with you at
any opportunity.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
Definitely, so.
Share with our audience where'sthe best place for them to
contact, and then I'll alsoinclude it at the end of the
video.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
Yeah, linkedin is probably the best best place to
find me.
It's just Tony Hudzinski,t-o-n-y-h-u-d-z-i-n-s-k-i, feel
free to add.
Feel free to add me there.
Yeah, I'd love to connect.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Excellent, Tony.
Thanks so much.
It was great talking with you.
Yeahasure talking to you also.
All right, bye-bye, bye-bye.
Welcome to Heather Ewing, the CRE Rundown.
Today I have a special guestfor you.
It is Tony Pudzinski and he isone of the partners of Wisco
Real Estate Services.
Tony, welcome.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Thanks, heather, happy to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Definitely Great to have someone from the Wisconsin
area on.
Actually it's been a while.
So glad you could join me as weget going.
If you could just share with myaudience a little bit more
about yourself so they can getto know you a little bit more.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Sure, absolutely so.
I am a full-time broker andreal estate investor currently,
but I certainly did not startthere.
I'm a broker and real estateinvestor currently, but I
certainly did not start there.
I grew up loving to play golf,actually, and I couldn't afford
it, and so I got a job at a golfcourse and I did that all
through high school and college,and part of the way through
college I realized I could go toschool to work in a golf course
(00:59):
, and so I actually went toUniversity of Wisconsin here in
Madison and got a degree in turfmanagement, and so my first
career, as I call it, is as agolf course superintendent.
So I did that for about 20years.
And then when I met my wife Iwould say like in 2007,
somewhere in there we both weweren't married yet, but we both
(01:19):
agreed when we bought our firsthouse that it would be an
investment property, it would bea duplex, and so we house
hacked before that was a termand that was our first foray
into real estate investing.
And from there, a couple ofyears later, we bought our first
commercial building, whichhoused a business that we
(01:39):
operated, and eventually soldthat business and really were
enjoying just being landlordsand so we thought let's just buy
some more of these buildingsand be landlords, right.
And then, around 2020, Idecided that I didn't have time
to be a golf coursesuperintendent and you know good
at home with our three childrenand continue investing.
(02:01):
So I left the golf industry andgot my real estate license and
became an agent then and now abroker, and have been investing
ever since and primarily today.
I focus on multifamily, largermultifamily deals and we use
syndication to raise funds tobuy those generally.
(02:21):
So that's kind of a quicksummary of my professional life.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Right, definitely.
Well, the interesting thing toois with the turf experience
right.
That ties in perfectly for landand other deals.
I'm sure there's things thatyou've utilized in that sense
that you carry forward.
But if someone's newer toinvesting, share a little bit
more about syndication, how thatworks and just real high level,
(02:47):
some of the pros and cons.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Sure, absolutely.
I stumbled upon syndication justfrom an investor side realizing
that you know, as a couple mywife and I we were only going to
be able to buy so much propertyby ourselves before we were
going to be overextended, overleveraged.
We're going to run out of moneyfor down payments, Right.
And so I began a search for howto?
How do people accumulate athousand units, 10,000 units of
(03:12):
apartments?
You know, self-storage,whatever it is they're into.
And I found the syndicationconcept, and it's essentially a
person or group of people whoare the general partners or GPs.
They typically are the activereal estate piece.
They go out and find deals,they find financing for them,
they get them under contract andthen they find investors to
(03:32):
come in as limited partners.
So you have the generalpartners who operate it and the
limited partners or LPs who justinvest the money into the deal.
And so we pool our moneytogether with our limited
partners and then we use thosefunds to go and buy the deal.
And so we pool our moneytogether with our limited
partners and then we use thosefunds to go and buy the deals,
and then we do all of theoperations side, all the way
through an eventual sale, and soit's in my mind it's really the
(03:54):
one of the few ways you cantruly passively invest in real
estate.
A lot of people think that realestate investing in general is
passive.
But buy yourself a duplex or arental house on campus and then
call me in six months and tellme how passive that is.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Yeah, they would need to look up what passive means.
But yeah, so with that you know, in case there is someone
that's listening, what type ofinvestment opportunities are you
looking for?
What's a real rough parameterin case that person is looking
to sell?
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Yeah, well, I mean we will tackle anything.
I mean we'll take anything froma house that looks like a good
flip project.
We have our own constructioncrew that works in our
apartments and we'll utilizethem to flip a single family
home.
We're actively doing that rightnow.
But our real bread and butteris, I would say, 16 units and up
, you know and the sky's thelimit Like we will look at deals
(04:53):
that are five or 600 units asfar as apartments go Right, and
so we prefer something with somescale.
We do have our own managementteam.
That's a separate business, butwe manage all of our own
properties and we're able toscale that as needed.
And with the syndication piece,we feel very comfortable looking
at deals that are $2 million upto $200 million, that we can
(05:19):
find the investors and find thefunds to make it happen, and we
feel even more confident that wecan operate those effectively.
So really, you know, focusingaround Dane County, madison area
and we like to say Dane Countyand all the counties that touch
it so really South CentralWisconsin is where we'd like to
stay for as long as we can, sowe run out of property to buy
(05:44):
because we really feel stronglyabout personally managing the
property.
We're not one of thosecompanies that's actively
looking in Tampa or Phoenixbecause that's the hot market of
today and really hoping whoeverwe find to operate those deals
is a good operator.
It's really important to us.
It's one of our core values.
We keep our thumb on this.
We're raising money primarilyfrom our friends and family and
(06:05):
putting our own money into everysingle deal.
So we really want these thingsto perform and we want to be,
holding them to a very highstandard.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Definitely.
I know that makes completesense.
And what would you say are someof the common pitfalls of
investing for newer investors?
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Oh, I think I would start with just not knowing how
to crunch the numbersappropriately, underestimating
expenses and costs and potentialdownfalls that's the one I see
trip people up the most right.
Fortunately, with real estate,you don't tend to lose a lot of
value quickly, right?
So if someone gets into a baddeal, it's usually not going to
go to zero.
It's not like buying a stock ina startup company and then they
(06:49):
just, they just fail.
Right Now your ten thousanddollar investment is completely
gone.
But, yeah, I think,understanding how to operate or
run the numbers properly and soyou don't get yourself in over
your head and underestimatinghow much work is involved, and
so really finding experts andpeople who have been there and
(07:10):
done that to mentor you is thekey I've found.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
Definitely, which segues in perfectly.
So my understanding is you havevarious entities from
construction to, I think,different classes, right?
Can you share a little bit moreabout that?
Speaker 2 (07:26):
Yeah, absolutely.
We have a brokerage, so we doresidential and commercial
brokerage.
We really like to focus on theinvestment side.
So, like that person that wantsto buy their first duplex or
rental house, I love workingwith those buyers and sellers.
But we do regular residentialreal estate as well.
So people want to buy a home.
We do private lending, which is,you know, people who are
(07:47):
flipping houses can come to usfor funds to borrow to do those
projects short term.
On the other side of that isour investors who invest in our
apartment deals.
You know we don't have anapartment deal typically going
on at all times and so theprivate lending allows them to
invest in those loans.
So if a flipper comes to us andsays I need a thousand, a
(08:07):
hundred thousand dollars to flipthis house, we'll go to our
investor pool and say who wouldlike to borrow this person a
hundred thousand dollars?
They get paid a nice return.
We facilitate the whole thing.
We make sure the project isgood, but we also teach people
how to do that, as you alludedto, and we host a monthly meetup
here at our office in DeForest,Wisconsin, just outside of
Madison, and that's a freemeetup.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Give it a plug.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
Yeah, we call it the WIN, the Wisco Investor Network,
and it's invitation only.
So if anyone would like aninvitation, if you're local,
please shoot me an email atpartners at wiscorealestatecom
or tony at wiscolerealestatecomand I can put you on the list.
But we get about 50 to 60people a month who come and we
feed them really good food, youknow, have some drinks.
(08:51):
We have really great networkingafterwards and it's become
really popular and it's fun tosee this group of people grow,
see the same people coming back,bringing friends.
I've been craving a communitylike this for some time, so it's
really neat to be able to giveback.
We like to say that we'reself-proclaimed real estate
nerds and one of the ways wefeel like we can give back to
(09:12):
our community is by just sharingwhat we've learned and what we
know and our connections to, andalso learning from the
attendees.
They all have things to shareas well.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Right.
Well, and I think it's one ofthose too, like everyone, takes
their beatings in real estateright, especially in the early
years.
If you're able to get throughthose, then it's an amazing
arena, but for those that don't,you know, it's a very painful
experience in that sense.
So I like that you are givingit back, and of course, that's
(09:41):
something that's near and dearto my heart too is philanthropy
and sharing what we've learnedand helping people forward.
So I see that as an importantand essential part of business.
But segwaying in what would yousay is the mindset that has
helped you to shift from theearly years to now, or just some
(10:01):
of the different things thatreally stick out to you that
people should be aware of.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
That's a good question.
There's a lot of mindset setthings, I think, having an
abundance mindset, being willingto openly share.
I will share my trade secrets.
If I think I've got some reallycool investment hack, I'm not
afraid to tell anyone that wantsto hear about it.
If I tell 100 people the secrethack, there may be one or two
(10:30):
that actually go through with it, but I don't look at other
investors as competition.
And that's one of the coolthings about our meetups is we
really stress that we wantpeople to be able to speak
freely and have that abundancemindset that there's more than
enough for everyone to go around, and gatekeeping and holding
things tight to the vest wedon't think serves anybody, and
(10:53):
so we're very forthcoming withour information and I really
believe you need to give with noexpectation of receiving right.
That's a big core value ofmyself and our company too, Like
we try to pour into people andI know you know that it'll come
back at some point in the future, but I'm not doing it for that
reason, right?
And so I think, having thatabundance mindset and just not
(11:14):
having, you know, really nottrying to eliminate limiting
beliefs, right?
If you would have told me 10years ago that I would look at a
$200 million apartment deal, Iwould have called you crazy.
You know, when I, when I when Iwas before I was a real estate
professional and I had brokerslooking for me, I would say, all
right, look for duplexesbetween 150 and $300,000.
And to me that was as much as Icould afford and that was all I
(11:37):
was going to look at.
And partially I joined amentoring group to learn how to
do the syndication piece andbeing around people who are, you
know, that have raised abillion dollars, you know to buy
real estate, really showed me,you know, that this is doable,
right, and it really so.
Now the sky's the limit.
(11:57):
Like I said earlier, show me a500 unit apartment complex and
in the past I would have nevereven looked into it, but now
I'll analyze them.
If it makes sense, let's figureout how to make it go right.
And so just taking out thelimiting beliefs and believing
that I mean that abundancemindset will carry you through.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Definitely so.
Which group was that that youyou learned from the mentorship?
Speaker 2 (12:21):
Yeah, that group in particular it's run by actually
have the longest running realestate investment podcast.
It's called the Real EstateGuys Radio Show.
Oh, I've heard of it, it'scalled the Real Estate Guys
Radio.
Show.
Oh, I've heard of it.
Yeah, I've stumbled upon theirpodcast and they were hosting
their annual goal-settingretreat in Las Vegas.
This is back in like 2019.
(12:41):
And I asked my wife if she'dlike to go and she's like I
don't care who it is, let's goto Vegas.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
I just want to get out of.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Wisconsin for a couple of days, and we met some
just amazing people there thatwere involved in their we'll
call it like their inner circlegroup, and it was enough to
where, like wow, these peopleall have that abundance mindset.
They're all so forthcoming withinformation Like.
These are the people that, inour minds at the time, were the
(13:07):
experts that we needed to figureout how to be around, and so we
made a concerted effort totravel to all of their events
and attend all their educationalopportunities, and that's
really what launched took ourinvestment, real estate
investment careers up, you know,10 notches.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
I'm sure definitely.
And what would you say is yourgo-to for mindset when you need
to kind of revamp that right,because some days it's just like
, oh wow, was that painful.
And other days, right, it'slike everything's clicking and
the deals are, you know, comingtogether and penciling and the
numbers are coming in.
What would you say is yourgo-to one or two things for
(13:45):
mindset of staying top?
Speaker 2 (13:49):
tier.
I think the concept for me isis is thinking about how
everything is happening for meand not to me.
So even when you know you spillyour coffee on your pants and
you know bump into another carin the parking lot at the gas
station on the way to work, likeyou can either let those things
trigger you and set a bad toneand put you in a kind of a
(14:10):
negative headspace for the wholeday, or you can you can you can
think of it as all right.
All right I.
This happened for a reason, andI might not realize what it is
right now, but I probably willin the future if I reflect on it
enough.
And you know, maybe, maybe Igot that flat tire because had I
not gotten it, I would havegotten an accident on my way to
my meeting, Right.
And so I try to look ateverything as happening for me
(14:32):
and not to me, and just havingthat mindset really, really
helps shift me away from that.
Woe is me.
Victim mentality to this isjust.
I'm just another step closer towhere I'm supposed to be.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Right, that's terrific.
And what would you say?
You know, as far as the nextfive, 10 years?
What is there anything thatjumps out to you as far as
industry shifts, changes,anything like that?
Speaker 2 (15:00):
You know being very I'm very bullish on multifamily
real estate right now justbecause I see as a realtor, I
see pricing, I see a lot ofpeople can't afford to buy their
first home anymore.
They would love to own a home,maybe, but they can only afford
an apartment Right, and I don'tsee that changing the
foreseeable future.
There's just such a lack of ofof housing in general and
(15:23):
especially affordable housing,and I know a lot of builders.
I know what it costs to buildthings these days.
Labor costs for them are throughthe roof on top of materials
and I just I see a lot of valueto what we do in buying these
older buildings and then usingour construction crew to go in
and make them nice, make themnot just livable but almost like
a brand new apartment, but fora fraction of a cost of what, in
(15:46):
time, of what it takes to builda brand new facility.
Um, so I I'm very bullish on onmulti-family.
And then you know, on thecommercial side of things like
retail and those sorts of things, restaurants, I think those
things all need to besurrounding that right.
So I don't see a slowdownanytime soon, especially in the
next five years.
(16:06):
I'm doubling down.
We want to buy every apartmentwe can get our hands on in the
next five years.
I'll put it that way.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
Right.
Yeah, I always have to chuckleat the number of calls I get for
mixed use and different rentfigures and this, that and the
other thing for the triple netleases and it's liquid gold you
either have it or you don'twhich all computes into those
mixed use developments andthings of that nature.
So I agree, there's a lot ofaction and it's only going to
(16:35):
increase with the density andthe growth of Dane County, its
projections, and a lot of peopledo want into the market.
Right, Our costs are much lessthan California and the larger
markets, so it's a free for alland quite easy to snap up the
inventory when they've got theright contacts.
So I think it's important toobviously have a local blend
(16:58):
some of the national, regional,but definitely keeping you know
some of those solid localoperators too.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
Yeah, madison is such a wonderful place to live,
right, these people that comeand discover it from the coasts,
um, you know there's a lot ofpeople moving south right.
For the last four years now, alot of people moved to texas and
tennessee and florida andarizona and, um, boy, aside from
a little, a little cold likewe're having, you know, for a
(17:27):
month or two here in the winter,it's really hard to beat.
It is much less expensive.
The quality life, life'samazing.
Another reason I'm bullish onapartments, but just real estate
in general in the Madison areais just so strong because I
teeter between wanting to shoutit from the rooftops and keeping
our little secret and keep, youknow, all the institutional
(17:48):
investors from the coast fromcoming and finding us, but
they'll find us eventually andagain, with that abundance
mentality, I want everyone toknow.
You know all around the worldhow great of a place this
Madison area is and I trulybelieve that.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Definitely so.
This is the hard hittingquestion, right.
So the last one, the big one,is what does living fully mean
to you?
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Yeah, living best for last?
Yeah, that's a great question.
Um, living fully is is it's notnecessarily balanced.
I don't know that.
I believe you can achieve truebalance.
Um, for me, it's keeping mypriorities straight and you know
, my number one priority ismyself and my health and keeping
(18:31):
my my mental, emotional,physical health um in a good
place and whatever it takes todo that, whether it's, you know,
doing hobbies that I love,reading and growing but once I'm
taken care of, I really focus.
(18:52):
I'm very, very much lean towardstaking care of others Like I'm
an acts of service type ofperson.
So I think I think to live afull life, I really need to feel
like I'm very much being ofservice to those around me,
especially my friends and family.
And so I feel like if I can Akeep myself in a good spot and
keep myself strong, I'll be in agood place to be as helpful as
possible to everyone else.
And for sure, money andbusiness and all that stuff is
(19:14):
is cool, but it's it's a distant, you know it's down the list
from those other things.
So relationships, you know I'veenjoyed starting to get to know
you.
I love just meeting new peopleand making connections.
Speaker 1 (19:25):
I really enjoy connecting people, you know if I
can take two people, that Iknow should meet and put them
together.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
That's super satisfying.
So, yeah, living a full life is, I think, taking care of myself
and then taking care of thosearound me, and and everything
else is a bonus, right?
Speaker 1 (19:40):
well, and you know it's one of those two.
It seems like you are living ina very aligned life, which
would make sense why you're ahappy person, good disposition,
and you keep making choices thatkeep you on that path, which is
neat and I think so frequentlya lot of people don't realize
the power that they yield insetting goals and in saying yes
(20:03):
to some things, no to otherthings, that really help them
get on that path.
So I'd say kudos to you, tony.
That's terrific.
I'm excited for you, and I'malso excited to see how your
company continues to grow andexpand, and we'll have to do a
deal together one of these times.
Speaker 2 (20:22):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
I would love that.
Yeah, we'll pay that house too.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
We're shooting to the moon, we're on a fast pace and
it's really exciting and I lookforward to working with you at
any opportunity.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
Definitely, so.
Share with our audience where'sthe best place for them to
contact, and then I'll alsoinclude it at the end of the
video.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
Yeah, linkedin is probably the best best place to
find me.
It's just Tony Hudzinski,t-o-n-y-h-u-d-z-i-n-s-k-i, feel
free to add.
Feel free to add me there.
Yeah, I'd love to connect.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Excellent, Tony.
Thanks so much.
It was great talking with you.
Yeahasure talking to you also.
All right, bye-bye, bye-bye.
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