January 15, 2025 • 45 mins
We sat down with Michelle Heston from Fairmont Hotels to talk about a Berkeley, CA, gem – the Claremont Club & Spa. Any hotel that starts out as a castle built on the American Dream is a guaranteed Hotel History destination!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hotel history is created for adult audiences.
(00:03):
Content may not be suitable for all listeners.
Discretion is advised.
You're listening to Hotel History.
We take you with us through the sordid history and scandals
of some of the world's most famous and infamous hotels.
I'm D'Etta.
And I'm Yael.
(00:24):
Let's get started.
Today we're going to be talking about the Claremont Club and Spa,
a Fairmont hotel located in Berkeley, California.
And we are lucky enough to be interviewing Michelle Heston.
Hi. Welcome, Michelle.
Let's get into it and tell us a little bit about yourself,
(00:44):
your title, and what you do.
So my name is Michelle Heston.
I have the great privilege of overseeing public relations
and marketing communications for Fairmont hotels and resorts
in the United States, in the Caribbean, and in Hawaii.
Oh, wow. So you do like all the Fairmonts.
(01:05):
Yeah. That's amazing.
Oh, my God. I thought it was always specifically Claremont.
Oh, no, no, no, no, no.
Oh, you are busy.
Yeah. Okay.
That's so cool.
How long have you been doing this?
Well, I've been with the company over 20 years.
My role has kind of evolved and grown over the years,
(01:26):
but I've been in this particular role for about five years.
Oh, wow. Do you like it? How do you?
I love it. I think I have one of the best jobs.
It's, I always say the hospitality industry
is kind of akin to being a drug addict.
You're either 100% or you're like, this is so not for me.
I'm out. So I'm 100% in.
(01:49):
Oh, my God. Yes, that's so true.
We just read this book about this woman who's the general manager
of the Cecil Hotel in downtown LA.
And that pretty much sums it up.
It's like, you have to be a little crazy.
Yeah.
Like, you have to love the craziness.
It's just, you think about other businesses
(02:10):
and you're open five days a week or six days a week
and from, you know, seven to five or whatever,
but we never, ever close our doors.
And so matter of fact, the few times when we've had to close our doors,
most of us don't even know how to lock our doors.
We don't, it's not something we do.
So it's a very different mindset.
(02:31):
Yeah, absolutely.
You have to be on all the time.
So, well, obviously today we're going to talk about the Claremont Hotel and Spa.
Is it the Claremont Club and Spa?
Right. Right.
The technical full name is the Claremont Club and Spa, a Fairmont Hotel.
Right.
You can just call it the Claremont.
(02:51):
Yeah. That's, everyone's going to know that.
Of course, the Claremont wasn't always on this particular piece of land.
It's so interesting that it actually started out as this kind of quote unquote castle
that was built by the original owner, William B Thornburg, back in the 19th century.
(03:15):
Yeah. During the gold rush.
So this gentleman, you know, struck at the height of the California gold rush,
made all of his money.
He came from Kansas and moved his family out,
but he struck it big in the California gold rush and then decided
that he was going to build his own castle on the hills of California.
That's such an American story.
Isn't it? Right. Right.
(03:37):
For someone, especially the fact that he was an Anglophile seemed to be very,
the whole family loved England and so that they were like American story.
But now we're going to be as English as we possibly can.
Exactly. Right.
Putting a castle on a mountain is pretty English.
Well, I think what also leads to it is because to your point,
the whole family was Anglophiles that his only child, his daughter,
(04:00):
ended up marrying European nobility and moved to Europe when she became a young woman.
And they ended up selling it.
I mean, his wife passed away shortly thereafter and he sold the estate after all that.
Oh, wow. Yeah. I imagine being in a castle all by yourself then is probably not.
Right. You want to spend your time.
(04:22):
So he sold it to John Ballard, right?
Ballard, the Ballard family. Correct.
And they lived there for several generations.
But then something happened.
I said that there was a fire, a wildfire, a wildfire.
It's a very California, California story.
And sadly, in the hills of Oakland, I mean, it's not the first devastating fire
(04:45):
that that area has seen.
And it completely destroyed the estate except for the stables
and a number of the surrounding buildings as well.
And then they kind of had like the people that took over were a group of businessmen,
but they had difficulty finishing it because of so many.
(05:06):
They had a lot of setbacks. It took a lot of setbacks.
So not only did they have the great earthquake, but then they also had the financial collapse.
So they had it took them 10 hard years to reopen, you know, in 1915 was the way it was.
You know, in 1915 was when they finally kind of reopened as the Claremont Hotel.
(05:30):
Wow. I also read that during this period of time, you know, this earthquake happens,
the financial collapse, they're having labor shortages.
But in the middle of all of that, they still went ahead and purchased a few hundred more acres
to add to the property.
So they were definitely optimists and like were not going to stop no matter what.
(05:50):
Optimists with deep pockets.
That's a winning combination.
Everything was so cheap back then.
And one of the investors was the owner of the Borax Company, right?
And that's like Borax, like laundry detergent, right?
Yeah. So he definitely had.
There was some there was some significant wealth there.
Yes. Yeah.
I read a story that he mined the Borax minerals in Joshua, which are some desert,
(06:16):
the Death Valley.
Somewhere in Southern California.
Yeah.
And he took like 20 mules to like carry it.
It's just so interesting.
It's like this is a great idea.
I'm thinking and I don't know this.
So but I'm thinking there wasn't a lot of infrastructure back then, right?
I mean, it's not like you just hop on the freeway and load it into a truck.
(06:39):
Right. Yeah.
This is still the Wild West.
Yeah, literally the Wild West.
Right. Oh, that's amazing.
So they finally are able to open up the resort.
And how did how did the area receive it?
Well, they loved it, right?
I mean, because it was truly kind of an iconic landmark for the East Bay.
(07:02):
And it brought kind of a whole another level of social relevance to the Society of San
Francisco that you were able to bring this world class resort across the bay.
And I was also reading that they had tried to time the opening of this hotel with the
San Francisco World's Fair that was happening at the time.
(07:22):
Which would have been great because, you know, Treasure Island sits between the San
Francisco Peninsula and the East Bay.
So it would have been halfway there.
And you can see it from Treasure Island.
You can actually on a clear day see the Claremont from many different vantage points across
the Bay Area.
Yeah, if you're if you're at the Claremont, you can see all of San Francisco.
Yeah, I was going to say the Claremont must have some amazing views.
(07:45):
Really spectacular views.
So the hotel, you know, is is kind of doing its thing.
But as the 20th century progresses, I love that the story about that the owners originally
wanted the Claremont to be able to have a bar, which it does have now.
But originally, so not only did we where we did, we have the prohibition era.
(08:10):
We all know how that worked out.
But we had this statue on the books that that alcohol couldn't be served within two miles
of a public institution.
And obviously, Cal Berkeley owns quite a bit of land and we fall literally just around
that two mile mark.
So we were not able the owners petitioned for the Claremont to be able to have a bar.
(08:34):
And to try to change some of those statues, they were not successful.
So it's really difficult to own.
And today it would even be impossible a world class resort without a bar.
So that was very difficult.
But Laura has it that two very industrious students at Cal Berkeley went out and measured.
(08:55):
And then they took it the letter of the law that it didn't it had to be two miles by
street, not by as a crow flies.
And that's where that little loophole was able to get us a liquor license.
I really love that the law even stipulated at one point as the crow flies.
(09:16):
How are you measuring this?
Laws and when you know.
So thanks to those Cal, those very smart Cal Berkeley students that we can all drink happily
watch the sunset now at the Claremont.
I read in an article that talks about it.
They said that one, this one female student is the one that measured it
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and that there's a rumor that she got free drinks for life.
That's the same rumor I've heard.
I've had the same thing.
We don't know if that's true.
We don't know.
That's honestly fair.
If it happened again today, I would set her up the same way.
Yeah, I hope for her.
I would even name a cocktail after her, I think.
Oh, that would be so nice.
I think definitely that even though there was prohibition and all of this law going on,
(10:03):
I feel like people were probably still sneaking in.
They had private rooms.
People could have parties.
Especially these kind of landmark iconic hotels.
And I will tell you in San Francisco, so just across the bay at the Fairmont, San Francisco,
when prohibition ended, we opened a bar the next day.
(10:26):
So if you're able to open a bar the day after a law passes,
one would assume that there was probably liquor being served a week before the law became.
And a number of our hotels do have kind of, especially our historic hotels,
have kind of speakeasy rooms that kind of nod to that.
(10:48):
If you had money in those days, maybe like today, there was work arounds.
Yeah, absolutely.
I worked at a brewery and they have a very similar story.
You know, like, oh, prohibition ended.
And then you have like, what's her name?
Not Marilyn Monroe.
Jean Harlow, Harlow in the streets of L.A. cracking open a beer.
(11:12):
Where did she get that?
Right.
Where did all this beer come from?
Well, you know, it's funny, the same thing in Sonoma.
They were they were allowed to continue to produce wine
for religious services.
So there was a whole lot of drinking going on in those religious services
because there was a whole lot of wine.
So it makes so much sense.
I believe you mean the blood of Christ.
(11:33):
So I love that word transubstantiation for the win.
During this time, I think the hotel started to get a little more
organized, I think the hotel starts to change hands a little bit.
(11:55):
And lots of investment into the property and really kind of this focus
on really elevating it to the kind of the best of the best or best in class
in the greater San Francisco Bay Area.
So, you know, new buildings, new decor.
Frank Lloyd Wright himself built a chapel so we could continue to attract
kind of those very high end society weddings from across the Bay Area.
(12:17):
The pictures we have in our historic hallway, which I love, and they take you
back to these women in these beautiful dresses kind of reclining on these,
I guess I'd say deck chairs overlooking the Bay and kids running around
and beautiful, just a beautiful scene, right?
Where you come and have afternoon tea and you would have a cocktail
(12:37):
and watch the sunset.
And it was truly ladies who lunch kind of taken to a whole other level.
That sounds amazing.
I really want to see this place.
It's really spectacular.
You know, I love old historic buildings and hotels, but it has a spirit
and it has a soul, that hotel.
And it's so endeared into the community.
(13:00):
You know, people of Berkeley, Oakland, because actually the hotel,
the city lines of Berkeley and Oakland go down the middle of the hotel.
So one part of the hotel, you're in Berkeley and one side you're in Oakland.
It's endeared into them and the residents and other areas,
they literally treat that hotel as if it's an extension of their own living rooms.
(13:21):
That's so nice.
And I'm sure that they have, you know, regulars that come in all the time.
Yeah, that's great.
I feel like that's what hotels are.
That's a reputation.
Kind of you have to get along with the area around.
I think it's a really important.
And I think that kind of goes in and out of fashion or people are paying more attention.
(13:43):
But I think in my career, the hotels that are able to really
help identify and elevate the destination are the ones that are the most successful,
where the employees are not just workers there.
They're true ambassadors of that destination.
And I think that's really important.
Yeah, I agree.
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Yeah.
And you can tell the difference when you go into a hotel that has like those values.
Yes, for sure.
Yes, immediately, there's a difference in the air.
And there's pride, right?
You can't have somebody fake that if you're really proud of the hotel and what it's doing
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and your volunteer efforts and your philanthropic support.
It's just tactile, almost.
Yeah, I think that's one reason we love historic hotels so much,
because they have this grand past usually that everyone is very proud
to be now part of the legacy.
And so I think it really helps to cement all of those aspects together.
(14:51):
Yeah, it's interesting you say that because I wonder if someone ever did a story like what
the psychological impact is of these old grand hotels, because you don't really get that with
other businesses or places.
I mean, maybe a museum in some cases, but you don't get it with really a restaurant
or retail outlet.
It's different.
People, I think because you can literally immerse yourself in a hotel and you can sleep there.
(15:16):
There's rites of passage.
There's life events.
All these things happen that tie it into people.
Yes.
Yeah, we really understand that and appreciate that.
And I think that's what draws us to historic hotels and why we created this podcast, because
when we start looking in the history of these hotels, we're like, wow, they had an influence
(15:38):
on every aspect of life.
People don't realize from politics, from food, from just society in general culture.
It really is like that.
It really is.
And to this day, we did an event just a few weeks ago.
We partnered with Visit Oakland, which is the destination management company for the
city of Oakland.
And we did a high fashion high tea.
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And we brought in local Oakland specific fashion designers and we did a high tea for the community.
So really embracing kind of that.
And some of it was very, very haute couture fashion, beautiful.
And some of it was a little more street fashion trendy.
So really embracing who we are and who we were and kind of trying to marry those two
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aspects of the history.
That's great.
I love hearing that.
Collaboration is the key.
Exactly.
And seeing what resonates, right?
We want to bring in the community into the hotel and what resonates.
So for this particular audience is bringing in some really interesting fashion designers
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that share our zip code.
So yeah, one of our questions for you is how the Claremont sort of celebrates and preserves
its history while staying modern.
And that sounds like that's exactly what you're doing.
And I think that some of the partnerships that we have, I know our executive chef,
Joseph Perry at that hotel is really in the forefront of really being collaborative with
(17:10):
guest chefs and bringing in, he's done a whole series, heritage dinners, really embracing
black cuisine and bringing in black chefs.
He's brought in the McBride sisters who are amazing female winemakers and a black-owned
business and how they're incorporating kind of their spirit and their nuance into their wines.
(17:35):
So really embracing what used to be called kind of minority leaders in these fields and
bringing them to the forefront.
I love that.
That's amazing.
Yeah, just making the community bigger and bigger.
That's great.
We were one of the first hotels and we're currently in a hiatus, but we did cannabis
dinners.
When cannabis became legal, we brought in a cannabis partner and we did a cannabis pairing
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dinner.
Now we had the liquor rules came back in again and we couldn't do it under our roof.
So we had to build a tent and we had to do some other things, but we were able to do
it legally.
Yeah, that is cutting edge right there.
I have not heard of other hotels doing that.
Not luxury hotels, probably.
No.
No.
No, that is very Berkeley.
Yeah, it is very Berkeley.
(18:19):
And I think that's important.
It may not work in other markets, but it's very much the essence of our destination.
Yes, and that's so important to, you know, you are making it a destination for that
particular locale and to be able to say, this is Berkeley, this is who we are, experience
(18:40):
who we are while you're here.
And I think that's what really good hotels do today.
If you, we call them brass and glass, you can go to some of our larger competitors in
any major city, whether it's Chicago or Houston or New York or Boston, and it looks and feels
like the same hotel, regardless of the destination.
We try really hard at Fairmont is to embrace the destination.
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Yes, of course we have corporate protocols and templates and what have you, but we need
to be true to the destination first and be ambassadors for the destination.
And then move forward.
So I think that that's the driving force is who are we and what is our purpose in this
community and how do we elevate that?
That's good because I feel like the hotels that are the most interesting are the ones
(19:28):
that are unique and don't try to blend in with every other hotel.
Cause it didn't used to be that way.
Right?
Like you wanted to stay at a luxury hotel and you wanted the comforter to be the same,
the towels to be the same, the menu to be the same.
You wanted like cookie cutter.
And I think today people are looking for experiences.
People are trying to create something that's new and different or resonates particularly
(19:50):
with them.
And you can't do that in a cookie cutter experience.
I mean, I definitely agree.
I thought if I'm going to a new hotel, I don't want it to be like this other hotel.
I mean, I want it to be clean.
That's that's never changed.
Right.
I hear you.
And those are some of those protocols are really important, right?
But, but I think that we want our concierge to not just say everybody that asks you where
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they should go to dinner.
You give them these five restaurants.
No, we want you to talk to them.
What's your favorite food?
Where do you interest in?
Are you interested in trying something completely off the wall international?
Are you trying to do something that really speaks to the destination and finding out
what that resonates and then creating that experience for them?
(20:34):
Yeah, this is good hospitality.
That is good.
It's the best.
Yeah, just listening right there.
So one of the aspects that makes this such a great destination hotel is the spa.
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So when did the spa first become incorporated into it?
Well, you know, it's funny, like we always had pools and we were always kind of health
conscious, but that was a very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very,
very relatively new addition to the resort and then bringing in kind of really good wellness
providers experiences that we're that our guests were looking for at that time.
(21:17):
So a spa has always been an important part has,
as has the pools, the tennis courts, kind of that whole life resort wellness.
I feel like many hotels actually don't have spas which I know
So it's, it's like kind of a difficult thing for some hotels.
Like they're like, Oh, should we add a spot?
(21:38):
Should we not?
But what's so interesting about this place is that because they bought so much land,
yeah, they had a lot of space to expand.
And I'm like, they were on it.
They knew, well, you yeah, land is obviously a premium.
And, you know, spas are expensive to operate and to run.
So if you did a cost analysis, it makes more sense financially to just build more guest
(22:03):
rooms or suites, but it's an amenity that a really, a certain demographic is going to
insist upon.
So it's again, understanding that clientele when we, the spa did open in the eighties,
it was to the tune of about $6 million, which was an ignored amount of money in those days
to create a spa.
(22:23):
I'm terrible.
I'm terrible at doing the conversions between decades.
But yeah, but 6 million in the eighties was definitely a lot of money.
Right.
That's a lot.
No, I'm fascinated to hear that it's not cost effective because I always assumed spas
are great for those who aren't staying at the hotel that like a lot of people would.
(22:43):
It's an attraction that people are like, Oh, I'm going to go to this spa.
Like I love spas.
Well, and I think that's a relatively new and not it's not across the board, but for
a long time, spa amenities in a hotel were only available to hotel guests.
Like if you ask your grandparents, they will tell you that the only way you could get into
(23:03):
a dining room or to a spa and for many resorts was to be a guest.
And that changed, but that's in your lifetime.
So if you ask someone that's a bit older, they'll say that the only way that you could
go there was to be a guest or be a member in our.
Yeah.
Okay.
I did not know that you guys are so spoiled.
(23:26):
We are spoiled.
So during this period of the 20th century and even up until today, are there any major
celebrities or historical figures that spent time at the resort?
Well, I think it's always fun.
We don't usually share that unless the celebrity or dignitary shares that and a lot of
(23:50):
that's public.
But I do think what's really cool is that like in the 90s, Mrs.
Doubtfire with Robin Williams and Sally Field and Pierce Brosnan was shot.
And those kind of classic scenes were recognizable to anybody in the Bay Area.
And it's always been a place for C-suite level corporate executives, diplomats,
(24:16):
foreign embassy to stay in the East Bay.
So we're very, very fortunate that we have that kind of and some of the entertaining,
the entertainers that have performed Louis Armstrong and what have you over the course
of the years.
That's always such a nice accolade to be able to share.
Yes.
(24:36):
He's around.
He really played every.
Yeah, he was happy to play everywhere.
I come from a music background, so I'm interested to know what which musicians played where.
I didn't know that Mrs.
Doubtfire, the pool deck scene was at the Claremont until I started doing the research.
(24:56):
And I was like, oh, of course, I can like see it so clearly in my mind.
It was I need to rewatch it.
Yeah, it really was apparent.
I mean, I wasn't there at that point and Fairmont wasn't on board, but they recently did.
They had like a Robin Williams look like where it was dressing up as Mrs.
Doubtfire and we had them in the hotel.
That was kind of fun.
That's so cute.
Yeah.
Wow.
(25:17):
I love that.
I love when they embrace.
Yeah, so it was fun.
So then in around the millennium, you guys had a Millennium Grand makeover.
Yes.
Which I love the branding on that.
And so is that just even more improvement?
And so is that just even more improvements to the hotel and the spa and just think in
(25:42):
a hotel that regular improvements are necessary, right?
There's a lot of wear and tear.
And so a good rule of thumb is seven to 10 years.
There's going to be some kind of there's always going to be maintenance work going on,
but usually a significant improvement about every timeline.
And then there's obviously in the longer stretch of time is when you do major improvements.
(26:02):
So maybe it's a new ballroom, new decor, reformatting the lobby.
So that's gone through a couple of different iterations, even just in my time when Fairmont
came on is they renovated that whole lobby and opened it back up and showcase the views
and what have you.
So.
And then in 2002, that's when the Claremont is designated a city landmark by the city
(26:28):
of Oakland.
Correct.
Which is?
On the California Register of Historical Resources.
And then we also became a member of Historic Hotels as well.
So and that's really those are great organizations with like minded businesses that we can
promote and market and help tell our story.
(26:48):
This becoming a city landmark impacts the ability of the hotel to change things up at
all.
It does, and it depends on if it's city, if it's county, if it's national.
So there's some of those designations we didn't formally apply for because it does change
what you can and can't do.
And that's always an ownership decision usually at that point.
(27:11):
Yeah, we definitely we've been reading a lot about that as well.
A lot of rules and regulations.
Yes, especially in California.
I don't know where you ladies are located, but.
LA.
Oh, you're in LA.
So, you know, California's got its own set of rules above and beyond, kind of even national.
Yeah.
Yes.
(27:31):
We we got to meet the historic hotel.
Who did we meet?
We met we've met the VP of Marketing and I can't remember Catherine's title, but she
was also.
Catherine or she handles like marketing PR.
Yes.
Yes.
(27:51):
We we were so lucky we got to meet her.
We went to DC and we stayed at the Mayflower Hotel and we interviewed her and we're going
to it's going to come out.
We're doing a really great like video.
And.
Oh, good.
She's great.
She's a great resource.
Yeah, she's great.
And she gave us this like book of all the historical hotels.
Yeah.
(28:14):
Yeah, it's our new Bible.
Yeah, they do a nice job the way they lay everything out with the history and what have
you in timelines.
Yeah.
Yes, it was so nice.
I use.
Yeah, we use their website as a resource quite a bit.
Yeah.
So are there any other historical anecdotes that we might have missed?
I just I think the history of it in itself.
It's a really robust club offering with private members that we have now and really staying
(28:40):
true to the history of the destination and the hotel, but really providing world class
options and experiences for the guests and those club members.
So really challenging ourselves, whether it's from a culinary standpoint, a cultural
standpoint, service levels, how do we stay relevant and how do we help lead that charge
(29:01):
at all times?
And I think that that's what that team has done.
I think I want to shout out to the culinary program is second to none.
The concierge team there is exceptional and just the wealth of knowledge that they have
not only about the hotel, but about the destination, about creating itineraries, about again,
(29:22):
really creating bespoke itineraries for those guests.
That's amazing because they people that's who they go to.
They do.
And they're the epicenter of knowledge in a hotel.
So I heard I really encourage people spend some time before you go to a destination,
know enough to that you can ask the right questions and then elicit that support.
If you're staying at a hotel, that's an amenity.
(29:44):
That's an amenity that you should tap into.
So whether it's a coveted reservation, whether it's should we do X or Y, you know, should
Mike, would my kids like Fairyland or the zoo more, they know how to ask the right questions
to help direct you for the kind of experience that you or your family is looking for.
That's so important.
(30:05):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I think a lot of travelers don't tap into that resource and it's it's the best thing
you can do.
Yeah, I agree.
I like to become friends with whoever's working at the.
You're smart.
That's a really smart thing to do.
At least tell them, you know, here's my family.
I have three kids and they're this ages and one of them really likes just skate parks
(30:26):
and one just wants to have pizza, you know, let them know.
So you kind of build in those little things that'll be interesting to all the parties.
Yeah.
And if they don't know, then they'll learn and they'll just get.
They'll find out.
They will have the resources to find out.
Yeah.
Yeah, we we heard somebody in D.C.
use the term concierge mafia, which I loved that they all all from all the hotels, they
(30:54):
know each other and they talk and they do know and they reach out, which I also think
is also cool.
There's organizations like look, Claydoor, which is a very sophisticated group of concierge
that have to be admitted and tested in.
And that's one of their kind of adages is that they are each other's support.
And it's not proprietary to me or my hotel.
(31:16):
This is what we are going to provide for guests to this destination.
I didn't know that they had such a group.
Oh, yeah, it's very prestigious.
And you spell it like L.E.S.
Play C.L.E.F.S.
Door D apostrophe or look, Claydoor.
And the history of it is fascinating.
(31:37):
It was a European society first and then came and actually the first concierge in the United
States was Tom Wolf at the Fairmont, San Francisco.
So we've kind of have a propensity towards that level of service in this area as well.
I think we just found another podcast episode.
That's fascinating.
(32:03):
So are there any events that that the spots or the club itself holds or do they do holiday?
Well, there's always something going on.
So whether it's a guest chef in our restaurant, so whether it's programming,
at the club for members, you know, during the holidays, we do a beautiful tree lighting
(32:24):
and we bring in some philanthropic partners like Make-A-Wish, which is one of my very
favorite organizations nationally and now internationally.
We bring in families, we host wishes throughout our hotels all the time.
So really making it something that resonates.
So whether it's a cookie decorating activity or something in our kitchen, we do a lot of
(32:46):
that, but we do a lot of itineraries for guests.
So we do a lot of itineraries for guests.
So whether it's a wedding activity or something at our kids club is really tuning into what's
going on, creating itineraries for guests is really making sure there's always something
exciting happening at the hotel.
(33:07):
You know, it was Halloween.
We did and we just do them seasonally.
We did haunted history tours and really leaning into that.
We've leaned into that.
Our concierges were telling us repeatedly that people are always asking us questions,
is this hotel haunted and what have you.
I mean, it's an old white wood hotel.
You don't find many old white wood hotels in the state of California.
(33:30):
So it's a little creaky and whatever.
It's interesting.
And so we do have that.
We've never had any terrible things happen.
So if guests always ask, I'm scared, don't be scared.
These are all very happy ghosts.
If that's something that you believe in.
But those tours were sold out.
I mean, we launched them in the beginning of October and they were sold out.
(33:52):
People love ghosts.
Yes.
They love ghost stories.
And we always say hotels need to embrace that side of themselves.
We didn't for many, many, many years.
It was kind of a back end.
It's just not something we're going to talk about or promote.
And then we just said, why not?
People are into it.
Let's just try it.
And we had a general manager at the time that was very keen.
(34:14):
I said, let's do it.
And that was a really successful activation now that this was year three.
And I'm quite sure we'll continue to do that.
That's great.
Yeah.
I love hearing that.
And I love that you said that ghosts honked where they're happy.
And I totally agree with this because when we talk about hotels, we talk a lot about ghosts.
(34:38):
And when we spoke about the Cecil Hotel,
we said we didn't really read a lot about ghosts there or these haunted experiences.
And it's because I don't think they wanted to stay there.
Yeah.
They weren't happy there.
They weren't happy there.
Right.
So it's just a really interesting phenomenon.
It's kind of what you bring to the experience, I think, as well.
(34:58):
Yeah.
Do you have any ghost stories to share about the Claremont or what you've heard?
You know, I've just heard that.
And they say that there is people have claimed to see an older woman dressed in kind of period
costume wandering the halls.
And people would say that they think that it was Mrs. Thornburg.
(35:20):
Oh.
Haunting in her beautiful white castle.
She never wanted to leave.
OK.
That's like a nice ghost story.
I like that.
That's creepy.
No, I don't think it's creepy.
Yeah.
No.
And our Coltier's team does a really good job on these tours of kind of bringing in
someone in a period costume to kind of show that kind of ethereal, someone walking down
(35:43):
the hall so people can see that.
And then it's an opportunity for that team to talk about the history in a really interesting
way.
Right.
So, oh, that's Mrs. Thornburg.
And here's who the Thornburgs were and how they made their money and why they built a
house like this.
Yeah.
It's a great segue into that.
Yeah.
And people are going to listen because they're like, oh, a ghost is involved.
(36:05):
Right.
Right.
Exactly.
I did read something about that.
Some people said that they heard a party going on or like noise happening in a room.
Yeah.
We get that.
That is something that I've read as well.
And keep in mind now that the society parties were always held at the Claremont.
(36:28):
So if you think about that, this is where society came.
So whether it was a quinceanería or whether it was a confirmation or a wedding or engagement,
this is where everybody came.
There wasn't 12 hotels of the stature.
This was it.
So this is where the who came to enjoy.
(36:51):
I love to think that there's a group of society ghosts still just having a great time.
Right.
Like, who are these people wearing leggings in my hotel?
That's a good ghost to have a good party.
Like, what's going on?
And then there was another ghost story.
I read that there's a little girl that hangs out at the edge of some beds and tickles people's feet.
(37:16):
I've read that one too, and I have not experienced it, but I have heard that.
So but we do get the child playing.
So, you know, we get that a lot, but I was told recently that and I learned this on a history tour that I joined that for many years, you know, there were these laundry shoots that would go from the higher floors down to laundry.
(37:37):
So that because it wasn't elevators and, you know, to carry all that down and that kids in the neighborhood knew how to how how to sneak into the hotel and use the laundry shoots as slides.
That's hilarious.
Oh, my God.
And so that was always a thing in the olden days is that they were trying to keep the local kids out of the hallways to to play in the laundry shoots.
(38:01):
I feel like I do that if I was back in the day.
Yeah, that sounds like so much fun.
My mom would threaten my life to not ever go do that.
She would already know.
We show in this in the haunted history tour where some of these little doors are there closed up now, but this was the little door that led to the laundry shoot that would go down to the laundry.
(38:22):
Wow.
I love that that they still preserved at least a little bit.
A little bit, right?
So it's a little talking point to show, you know, how the hotel was built.
I hope there were always piles of laundry for them to land on.
Yeah, exactly.
Right.
Exactly.
You got to go down, got to surf down with a pillowcase.
Yeah, exactly.
And I'm already thinking how I would do it.
(38:44):
Right.
You're such a troublemaker.
Yeah.
So what is your favorite area of the hotel?
Well, I have to tell you that the views are really second to none.
And people always ask me on my personal social channels, where did you get that sunset shot of the city?
(39:05):
And most of them are from the deck at Limewood, which is our restaurant.
It is truly the best view of San Francisco anywhere.
And because, you know, San Francisco gets a lot of fog, you can see it from afar.
So you get this kind of cool look of fog rolling in the bay, but we're on top of it.
So it's a great vantage.
(39:25):
I think that that's really to have a cocktail, you know, on a sunny day and watch the fog
rolling in through the Golden Gate Bridge into the city is really spectacular.
And they have really good fries.
So a glass of really good wine, California wine and some fries.
I'm good to go.
Yeah.
That's the only meal I need.
(39:48):
It's not the healthiest choice.
I'll have fries and a Pinot Noir, but it's.
We're not going for health.
I know, right.
You'll go to the spa the next day and get all your health back.
I'll play tennis to burn off the calories.
And now we have pickleball there, too.
So you can play pickleball.
That's trendy.
Yeah.
Yeah.
There's all of it.
Yeah.
We gotta go.
(40:09):
That sounds amazing.
Yeah.
So on that, what is your favorite time of year at the hotel?
Well, you know, we're Californians, right?
So somebody in the rest of the country would say it's all the same, but that as Californians,
you know that that's not necessarily the case.
But I do think the holidays are always magical just because of the holidays.
(40:30):
And just the spirit around it around it.
But I got to say, summers in the Oakland Hills are really, really awesome.
We just get it's a different weather pattern.
It's warmer.
It's sunnier.
It feels like a real summer.
We get a lot of San Franciscans coming over to say, I just needed a summer day.
Oh, yeah, that's true.
It's always like a little cold.
(40:51):
It's always cold, a little cold and foggy.
And it's it can be easily 10 to 15 degrees warmer and sunnier where we are.
And you're literally you could take the bar.
It's 10 minutes.
I mean, it's nothing, but it's you know, we don't get the same weather.
Yeah.
Oh, then they really did choose an ideal place.
Really were smart.
Like, really smart.
(41:11):
I feel like California in general has that.
But even in L.A., the beach, downtown.
I lived in West L.A. for a long time.
Right.
And then my best friend lived in Santa Monica.
So yes.
What?
Oh, it's gray and cold.
Not here.
And I'm mid-Wolter.
Right.
Yeah, like I'm sweating.
What are you doing?
(41:33):
Only in California.
Right.
All these little microclimates.
So I think that I think the summer would have to be my ultimate favorite.
Finally, a different answer.
Honestly, almost everyone says Christmas because hotels really do Christmas very well.
But yeah, but it's nice to hear that there's something special about summer
because I hate summer because I'm from a very, very hot place.
(41:57):
So.
Are you from Texas?
Yes.
See, I knew it.
OK.
Well, I summer is OK, but I love I love fall.
I'm like and L.A. has such a delayed summer.
So we're the same way.
Like I if you ask me elsewhere in the country, I would say fall, too.
But I mean, fall is you got to really look for it.
(42:20):
Not so well in L.A. You really got to look for it.
You see it a little bit more here, but.
It's I'm from New York.
I'm from New York.
Oh, yeah.
It's right.
We fall is like BCs and everything so pretty.
And yeah, L.A. doesn't have that.
Yeah.
It's so yeah.
So now I definitely need to experience an Oakland summer.
So I want to I want to feel I'm I know that I might like summer
(42:42):
if I just found the right place.
It's not we get we have we have hot here.
So in some places.
Yes.
Yeah.
But then you go on the board at bar and then it's and then you better bring your sweater.
Yeah. Yeah.
So I have one last question.
But do you have any other questions?
(43:03):
No, I'm good.
OK. Other than the Claremont, what is what else is your favorite Fairmont hotel?
I have a lot of favorites.
I'm really blessed with a multitude of amazing hotels.
But you mentioned the Plaza in New York.
Of course, that's a sister hotel, the Savoy in London.
We're opening a brand new hotel in a matter of days in Long Beach, the Breakers.
(43:27):
Really?
So we've got a lot of really these iconic, beautiful hotels that are through our ownership
and through our design teams have painstakingly restored and kept as these testaments to luxury
and travel and lifestyle.
And I think those are all really amazing projects that our whole company is very proud of,
(43:49):
as are the communities.
Wow. Yeah.
Everyone that you mentioned, we will.
We've done it.
Episodes on the subway.
Yeah.
On the Plaza.
And now we have to check out the Long Beach one.
Check it out.
Long Beach Breakers were opening literally in a matter of days.
But it's really spectacular right on the waterfront in downtown historic Long Beach.
And what they've done to that beautiful building is is spectacular.
(44:12):
That sounds amazing.
Oh, my God.
Well, thank you so much.
Your answers are awesome.
And you really make us want to go and visit.
Well, that's my job.
So I get a gold star for today.
Hotel history is created for adult audiences.
(00:03):
Content may not be suitable for all listeners.
Discretion is advised.
You're listening to Hotel History.
We take you with us through the sordid history and scandals
of some of the world's most famous and infamous hotels.
I'm D'Etta.
And I'm Yael.
(00:24):
Let's get started.
Today we're going to be talking about the Claremont Club and Spa,
a Fairmont hotel located in Berkeley, California.
And we are lucky enough to be interviewing Michelle Heston.
Hi. Welcome, Michelle.
Let's get into it and tell us a little bit about yourself,
(00:44):
your title, and what you do.
So my name is Michelle Heston.
I have the great privilege of overseeing public relations
and marketing communications for Fairmont hotels and resorts
in the United States, in the Caribbean, and in Hawaii.
Oh, wow. So you do like all the Fairmonts.
(01:05):
Yeah. That's amazing.
Oh, my God. I thought it was always specifically Claremont.
Oh, no, no, no, no, no.
Oh, you are busy.
Yeah. Okay.
That's so cool.
How long have you been doing this?
Well, I've been with the company over 20 years.
My role has kind of evolved and grown over the years,
(01:26):
but I've been in this particular role for about five years.
Oh, wow. Do you like it? How do you?
I love it. I think I have one of the best jobs.
It's, I always say the hospitality industry
is kind of akin to being a drug addict.
You're either 100% or you're like, this is so not for me.
I'm out. So I'm 100% in.
(01:49):
Oh, my God. Yes, that's so true.
We just read this book about this woman who's the general manager
of the Cecil Hotel in downtown LA.
And that pretty much sums it up.
It's like, you have to be a little crazy.
Yeah.
Like, you have to love the craziness.
It's just, you think about other businesses
(02:10):
and you're open five days a week or six days a week
and from, you know, seven to five or whatever,
but we never, ever close our doors.
And so matter of fact, the few times when we've had to close our doors,
most of us don't even know how to lock our doors.
We don't, it's not something we do.
So it's a very different mindset.
(02:31):
Yeah, absolutely.
You have to be on all the time.
So, well, obviously today we're going to talk about the Claremont Hotel and Spa.
Is it the Claremont Club and Spa?
Right. Right.
The technical full name is the Claremont Club and Spa, a Fairmont Hotel.
Right.
You can just call it the Claremont.
(02:51):
Yeah. That's, everyone's going to know that.
Of course, the Claremont wasn't always on this particular piece of land.
It's so interesting that it actually started out as this kind of quote unquote castle
that was built by the original owner, William B Thornburg, back in the 19th century.
(03:15):
Yeah. During the gold rush.
So this gentleman, you know, struck at the height of the California gold rush,
made all of his money.
He came from Kansas and moved his family out,
but he struck it big in the California gold rush and then decided
that he was going to build his own castle on the hills of California.
That's such an American story.
Isn't it? Right. Right.
(03:37):
For someone, especially the fact that he was an Anglophile seemed to be very,
the whole family loved England and so that they were like American story.
But now we're going to be as English as we possibly can.
Exactly. Right.
Putting a castle on a mountain is pretty English.
Well, I think what also leads to it is because to your point,
the whole family was Anglophiles that his only child, his daughter,
(04:00):
ended up marrying European nobility and moved to Europe when she became a young woman.
And they ended up selling it.
I mean, his wife passed away shortly thereafter and he sold the estate after all that.
Oh, wow. Yeah. I imagine being in a castle all by yourself then is probably not.
Right. You want to spend your time.
(04:22):
So he sold it to John Ballard, right?
Ballard, the Ballard family. Correct.
And they lived there for several generations.
But then something happened.
I said that there was a fire, a wildfire, a wildfire.
It's a very California, California story.
And sadly, in the hills of Oakland, I mean, it's not the first devastating fire
(04:45):
that that area has seen.
And it completely destroyed the estate except for the stables
and a number of the surrounding buildings as well.
And then they kind of had like the people that took over were a group of businessmen,
but they had difficulty finishing it because of so many.
(05:06):
They had a lot of setbacks. It took a lot of setbacks.
So not only did they have the great earthquake, but then they also had the financial collapse.
So they had it took them 10 hard years to reopen, you know, in 1915 was the way it was.
You know, in 1915 was when they finally kind of reopened as the Claremont Hotel.
(05:30):
Wow. I also read that during this period of time, you know, this earthquake happens,
the financial collapse, they're having labor shortages.
But in the middle of all of that, they still went ahead and purchased a few hundred more acres
to add to the property.
So they were definitely optimists and like were not going to stop no matter what.
(05:50):
Optimists with deep pockets.
That's a winning combination.
Everything was so cheap back then.
And one of the investors was the owner of the Borax Company, right?
And that's like Borax, like laundry detergent, right?
Yeah. So he definitely had.
There was some there was some significant wealth there.
Yes. Yeah.
I read a story that he mined the Borax minerals in Joshua, which are some desert,
(06:16):
the Death Valley.
Somewhere in Southern California.
Yeah.
And he took like 20 mules to like carry it.
It's just so interesting.
It's like this is a great idea.
I'm thinking and I don't know this.
So but I'm thinking there wasn't a lot of infrastructure back then, right?
I mean, it's not like you just hop on the freeway and load it into a truck.
(06:39):
Right. Yeah.
This is still the Wild West.
Yeah, literally the Wild West.
Right. Oh, that's amazing.
So they finally are able to open up the resort.
And how did how did the area receive it?
Well, they loved it, right?
I mean, because it was truly kind of an iconic landmark for the East Bay.
(07:02):
And it brought kind of a whole another level of social relevance to the Society of San
Francisco that you were able to bring this world class resort across the bay.
And I was also reading that they had tried to time the opening of this hotel with the
San Francisco World's Fair that was happening at the time.
(07:22):
Which would have been great because, you know, Treasure Island sits between the San
Francisco Peninsula and the East Bay.
So it would have been halfway there.
And you can see it from Treasure Island.
You can actually on a clear day see the Claremont from many different vantage points across
the Bay Area.
Yeah, if you're if you're at the Claremont, you can see all of San Francisco.
Yeah, I was going to say the Claremont must have some amazing views.
(07:45):
Really spectacular views.
So the hotel, you know, is is kind of doing its thing.
But as the 20th century progresses, I love that the story about that the owners originally
wanted the Claremont to be able to have a bar, which it does have now.
But originally, so not only did we where we did, we have the prohibition era.
(08:10):
We all know how that worked out.
But we had this statue on the books that that alcohol couldn't be served within two miles
of a public institution.
And obviously, Cal Berkeley owns quite a bit of land and we fall literally just around
that two mile mark.
So we were not able the owners petitioned for the Claremont to be able to have a bar.
(08:34):
And to try to change some of those statues, they were not successful.
So it's really difficult to own.
And today it would even be impossible a world class resort without a bar.
So that was very difficult.
But Laura has it that two very industrious students at Cal Berkeley went out and measured.
(08:55):
And then they took it the letter of the law that it didn't it had to be two miles by
street, not by as a crow flies.
And that's where that little loophole was able to get us a liquor license.
I really love that the law even stipulated at one point as the crow flies.
(09:16):
How are you measuring this?
Laws and when you know.
So thanks to those Cal, those very smart Cal Berkeley students that we can all drink happily
watch the sunset now at the Claremont.
I read in an article that talks about it.
They said that one, this one female student is the one that measured it
(09:37):
and that there's a rumor that she got free drinks for life.
That's the same rumor I've heard.
I've had the same thing.
We don't know if that's true.
We don't know.
That's honestly fair.
If it happened again today, I would set her up the same way.
Yeah, I hope for her.
I would even name a cocktail after her, I think.
Oh, that would be so nice.
I think definitely that even though there was prohibition and all of this law going on,
(10:03):
I feel like people were probably still sneaking in.
They had private rooms.
People could have parties.
Especially these kind of landmark iconic hotels.
And I will tell you in San Francisco, so just across the bay at the Fairmont, San Francisco,
when prohibition ended, we opened a bar the next day.
(10:26):
So if you're able to open a bar the day after a law passes,
one would assume that there was probably liquor being served a week before the law became.
And a number of our hotels do have kind of, especially our historic hotels,
have kind of speakeasy rooms that kind of nod to that.
(10:48):
If you had money in those days, maybe like today, there was work arounds.
Yeah, absolutely.
I worked at a brewery and they have a very similar story.
You know, like, oh, prohibition ended.
And then you have like, what's her name?
Not Marilyn Monroe.
Jean Harlow, Harlow in the streets of L.A. cracking open a beer.
(11:12):
Where did she get that?
Right.
Where did all this beer come from?
Well, you know, it's funny, the same thing in Sonoma.
They were they were allowed to continue to produce wine
for religious services.
So there was a whole lot of drinking going on in those religious services
because there was a whole lot of wine.
So it makes so much sense.
I believe you mean the blood of Christ.
(11:33):
So I love that word transubstantiation for the win.
During this time, I think the hotel started to get a little more
organized, I think the hotel starts to change hands a little bit.
(11:55):
And lots of investment into the property and really kind of this focus
on really elevating it to the kind of the best of the best or best in class
in the greater San Francisco Bay Area.
So, you know, new buildings, new decor.
Frank Lloyd Wright himself built a chapel so we could continue to attract
kind of those very high end society weddings from across the Bay Area.
(12:17):
The pictures we have in our historic hallway, which I love, and they take you
back to these women in these beautiful dresses kind of reclining on these,
I guess I'd say deck chairs overlooking the Bay and kids running around
and beautiful, just a beautiful scene, right?
Where you come and have afternoon tea and you would have a cocktail
(12:37):
and watch the sunset.
And it was truly ladies who lunch kind of taken to a whole other level.
That sounds amazing.
I really want to see this place.
It's really spectacular.
You know, I love old historic buildings and hotels, but it has a spirit
and it has a soul, that hotel.
And it's so endeared into the community.
(13:00):
You know, people of Berkeley, Oakland, because actually the hotel,
the city lines of Berkeley and Oakland go down the middle of the hotel.
So one part of the hotel, you're in Berkeley and one side you're in Oakland.
It's endeared into them and the residents and other areas,
they literally treat that hotel as if it's an extension of their own living rooms.
(13:21):
That's so nice.
And I'm sure that they have, you know, regulars that come in all the time.
Yeah, that's great.
I feel like that's what hotels are.
That's a reputation.
Kind of you have to get along with the area around.
I think it's a really important.
And I think that kind of goes in and out of fashion or people are paying more attention.
(13:43):
But I think in my career, the hotels that are able to really
help identify and elevate the destination are the ones that are the most successful,
where the employees are not just workers there.
They're true ambassadors of that destination.
And I think that's really important.
Yeah, I agree.
(14:04):
Yeah.
And you can tell the difference when you go into a hotel that has like those values.
Yes, for sure.
Yes, immediately, there's a difference in the air.
And there's pride, right?
You can't have somebody fake that if you're really proud of the hotel and what it's doing
(14:25):
and your volunteer efforts and your philanthropic support.
It's just tactile, almost.
Yeah, I think that's one reason we love historic hotels so much,
because they have this grand past usually that everyone is very proud
to be now part of the legacy.
And so I think it really helps to cement all of those aspects together.
(14:51):
Yeah, it's interesting you say that because I wonder if someone ever did a story like what
the psychological impact is of these old grand hotels, because you don't really get that with
other businesses or places.
I mean, maybe a museum in some cases, but you don't get it with really a restaurant
or retail outlet.
It's different.
People, I think because you can literally immerse yourself in a hotel and you can sleep there.
(15:16):
There's rites of passage.
There's life events.
All these things happen that tie it into people.
Yes.
Yeah, we really understand that and appreciate that.
And I think that's what draws us to historic hotels and why we created this podcast, because
when we start looking in the history of these hotels, we're like, wow, they had an influence
(15:38):
on every aspect of life.
People don't realize from politics, from food, from just society in general culture.
It really is like that.
It really is.
And to this day, we did an event just a few weeks ago.
We partnered with Visit Oakland, which is the destination management company for the
city of Oakland.
And we did a high fashion high tea.
(15:59):
And we brought in local Oakland specific fashion designers and we did a high tea for the community.
So really embracing kind of that.
And some of it was very, very haute couture fashion, beautiful.
And some of it was a little more street fashion trendy.
So really embracing who we are and who we were and kind of trying to marry those two
(16:23):
aspects of the history.
That's great.
I love hearing that.
Collaboration is the key.
Exactly.
And seeing what resonates, right?
We want to bring in the community into the hotel and what resonates.
So for this particular audience is bringing in some really interesting fashion designers
(16:44):
that share our zip code.
So yeah, one of our questions for you is how the Claremont sort of celebrates and preserves
its history while staying modern.
And that sounds like that's exactly what you're doing.
And I think that some of the partnerships that we have, I know our executive chef,
Joseph Perry at that hotel is really in the forefront of really being collaborative with
(17:10):
guest chefs and bringing in, he's done a whole series, heritage dinners, really embracing
black cuisine and bringing in black chefs.
He's brought in the McBride sisters who are amazing female winemakers and a black-owned
business and how they're incorporating kind of their spirit and their nuance into their wines.
(17:35):
So really embracing what used to be called kind of minority leaders in these fields and
bringing them to the forefront.
I love that.
That's amazing.
Yeah, just making the community bigger and bigger.
That's great.
We were one of the first hotels and we're currently in a hiatus, but we did cannabis
dinners.
When cannabis became legal, we brought in a cannabis partner and we did a cannabis pairing
(17:58):
dinner.
Now we had the liquor rules came back in again and we couldn't do it under our roof.
So we had to build a tent and we had to do some other things, but we were able to do
it legally.
Yeah, that is cutting edge right there.
I have not heard of other hotels doing that.
Not luxury hotels, probably.
No.
No.
No, that is very Berkeley.
Yeah, it is very Berkeley.
(18:19):
And I think that's important.
It may not work in other markets, but it's very much the essence of our destination.
Yes, and that's so important to, you know, you are making it a destination for that
particular locale and to be able to say, this is Berkeley, this is who we are, experience
(18:40):
who we are while you're here.
And I think that's what really good hotels do today.
If you, we call them brass and glass, you can go to some of our larger competitors in
any major city, whether it's Chicago or Houston or New York or Boston, and it looks and feels
like the same hotel, regardless of the destination.
We try really hard at Fairmont is to embrace the destination.
(19:03):
Yes, of course we have corporate protocols and templates and what have you, but we need
to be true to the destination first and be ambassadors for the destination.
And then move forward.
So I think that that's the driving force is who are we and what is our purpose in this
community and how do we elevate that?
That's good because I feel like the hotels that are the most interesting are the ones
(19:28):
that are unique and don't try to blend in with every other hotel.
Cause it didn't used to be that way.
Right?
Like you wanted to stay at a luxury hotel and you wanted the comforter to be the same,
the towels to be the same, the menu to be the same.
You wanted like cookie cutter.
And I think today people are looking for experiences.
People are trying to create something that's new and different or resonates particularly
(19:50):
with them.
And you can't do that in a cookie cutter experience.
I mean, I definitely agree.
I thought if I'm going to a new hotel, I don't want it to be like this other hotel.
I mean, I want it to be clean.
That's that's never changed.
Right.
I hear you.
And those are some of those protocols are really important, right?
But, but I think that we want our concierge to not just say everybody that asks you where
(20:13):
they should go to dinner.
You give them these five restaurants.
No, we want you to talk to them.
What's your favorite food?
Where do you interest in?
Are you interested in trying something completely off the wall international?
Are you trying to do something that really speaks to the destination and finding out
what that resonates and then creating that experience for them?
(20:34):
Yeah, this is good hospitality.
That is good.
It's the best.
Yeah, just listening right there.
So one of the aspects that makes this such a great destination hotel is the spa.
(20:55):
So when did the spa first become incorporated into it?
Well, you know, it's funny, like we always had pools and we were always kind of health
conscious, but that was a very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very,
very relatively new addition to the resort and then bringing in kind of really good wellness
providers experiences that we're that our guests were looking for at that time.
(21:17):
So a spa has always been an important part has,
as has the pools, the tennis courts, kind of that whole life resort wellness.
I feel like many hotels actually don't have spas which I know
So it's, it's like kind of a difficult thing for some hotels.
Like they're like, Oh, should we add a spot?
(21:38):
Should we not?
But what's so interesting about this place is that because they bought so much land,
yeah, they had a lot of space to expand.
And I'm like, they were on it.
They knew, well, you yeah, land is obviously a premium.
And, you know, spas are expensive to operate and to run.
So if you did a cost analysis, it makes more sense financially to just build more guest
(22:03):
rooms or suites, but it's an amenity that a really, a certain demographic is going to
insist upon.
So it's again, understanding that clientele when we, the spa did open in the eighties,
it was to the tune of about $6 million, which was an ignored amount of money in those days
to create a spa.
(22:23):
I'm terrible.
I'm terrible at doing the conversions between decades.
But yeah, but 6 million in the eighties was definitely a lot of money.
Right.
That's a lot.
No, I'm fascinated to hear that it's not cost effective because I always assumed spas
are great for those who aren't staying at the hotel that like a lot of people would.
(22:43):
It's an attraction that people are like, Oh, I'm going to go to this spa.
Like I love spas.
Well, and I think that's a relatively new and not it's not across the board, but for
a long time, spa amenities in a hotel were only available to hotel guests.
Like if you ask your grandparents, they will tell you that the only way you could get into
(23:03):
a dining room or to a spa and for many resorts was to be a guest.
And that changed, but that's in your lifetime.
So if you ask someone that's a bit older, they'll say that the only way that you could
go there was to be a guest or be a member in our.
Yeah.
Okay.
I did not know that you guys are so spoiled.
(23:26):
We are spoiled.
So during this period of the 20th century and even up until today, are there any major
celebrities or historical figures that spent time at the resort?
Well, I think it's always fun.
We don't usually share that unless the celebrity or dignitary shares that and a lot of
(23:50):
that's public.
But I do think what's really cool is that like in the 90s, Mrs.
Doubtfire with Robin Williams and Sally Field and Pierce Brosnan was shot.
And those kind of classic scenes were recognizable to anybody in the Bay Area.
And it's always been a place for C-suite level corporate executives, diplomats,
(24:16):
foreign embassy to stay in the East Bay.
So we're very, very fortunate that we have that kind of and some of the entertaining,
the entertainers that have performed Louis Armstrong and what have you over the course
of the years.
That's always such a nice accolade to be able to share.
Yes.
(24:36):
He's around.
He really played every.
Yeah, he was happy to play everywhere.
I come from a music background, so I'm interested to know what which musicians played where.
I didn't know that Mrs.
Doubtfire, the pool deck scene was at the Claremont until I started doing the research.
(24:56):
And I was like, oh, of course, I can like see it so clearly in my mind.
It was I need to rewatch it.
Yeah, it really was apparent.
I mean, I wasn't there at that point and Fairmont wasn't on board, but they recently did.
They had like a Robin Williams look like where it was dressing up as Mrs.
Doubtfire and we had them in the hotel.
That was kind of fun.
That's so cute.
Yeah.
Wow.
(25:17):
I love that.
I love when they embrace.
Yeah, so it was fun.
So then in around the millennium, you guys had a Millennium Grand makeover.
Yes.
Which I love the branding on that.
And so is that just even more improvement?
And so is that just even more improvements to the hotel and the spa and just think in
(25:42):
a hotel that regular improvements are necessary, right?
There's a lot of wear and tear.
And so a good rule of thumb is seven to 10 years.
There's going to be some kind of there's always going to be maintenance work going on,
but usually a significant improvement about every timeline.
And then there's obviously in the longer stretch of time is when you do major improvements.
(26:02):
So maybe it's a new ballroom, new decor, reformatting the lobby.
So that's gone through a couple of different iterations, even just in my time when Fairmont
came on is they renovated that whole lobby and opened it back up and showcase the views
and what have you.
So.
And then in 2002, that's when the Claremont is designated a city landmark by the city
(26:28):
of Oakland.
Correct.
Which is?
On the California Register of Historical Resources.
And then we also became a member of Historic Hotels as well.
So and that's really those are great organizations with like minded businesses that we can
promote and market and help tell our story.
(26:48):
This becoming a city landmark impacts the ability of the hotel to change things up at
all.
It does, and it depends on if it's city, if it's county, if it's national.
So there's some of those designations we didn't formally apply for because it does change
what you can and can't do.
And that's always an ownership decision usually at that point.
(27:11):
Yeah, we definitely we've been reading a lot about that as well.
A lot of rules and regulations.
Yes, especially in California.
I don't know where you ladies are located, but.
LA.
Oh, you're in LA.
So, you know, California's got its own set of rules above and beyond, kind of even national.
Yeah.
Yes.
(27:31):
We we got to meet the historic hotel.
Who did we meet?
We met we've met the VP of Marketing and I can't remember Catherine's title, but she
was also.
Catherine or she handles like marketing PR.
Yes.
Yes.
(27:51):
We we were so lucky we got to meet her.
We went to DC and we stayed at the Mayflower Hotel and we interviewed her and we're going
to it's going to come out.
We're doing a really great like video.
And.
Oh, good.
She's great.
She's a great resource.
Yeah, she's great.
And she gave us this like book of all the historical hotels.
Yeah.
(28:14):
Yeah, it's our new Bible.
Yeah, they do a nice job the way they lay everything out with the history and what have
you in timelines.
Yeah.
Yes, it was so nice.
I use.
Yeah, we use their website as a resource quite a bit.
Yeah.
So are there any other historical anecdotes that we might have missed?
I just I think the history of it in itself.
It's a really robust club offering with private members that we have now and really staying
(28:40):
true to the history of the destination and the hotel, but really providing world class
options and experiences for the guests and those club members.
So really challenging ourselves, whether it's from a culinary standpoint, a cultural
standpoint, service levels, how do we stay relevant and how do we help lead that charge
(29:01):
at all times?
And I think that that's what that team has done.
I think I want to shout out to the culinary program is second to none.
The concierge team there is exceptional and just the wealth of knowledge that they have
not only about the hotel, but about the destination, about creating itineraries, about again,
(29:22):
really creating bespoke itineraries for those guests.
That's amazing because they people that's who they go to.
They do.
And they're the epicenter of knowledge in a hotel.
So I heard I really encourage people spend some time before you go to a destination,
know enough to that you can ask the right questions and then elicit that support.
If you're staying at a hotel, that's an amenity.
(29:44):
That's an amenity that you should tap into.
So whether it's a coveted reservation, whether it's should we do X or Y, you know, should
Mike, would my kids like Fairyland or the zoo more, they know how to ask the right questions
to help direct you for the kind of experience that you or your family is looking for.
That's so important.
(30:05):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I think a lot of travelers don't tap into that resource and it's it's the best thing
you can do.
Yeah, I agree.
I like to become friends with whoever's working at the.
You're smart.
That's a really smart thing to do.
At least tell them, you know, here's my family.
I have three kids and they're this ages and one of them really likes just skate parks
(30:26):
and one just wants to have pizza, you know, let them know.
So you kind of build in those little things that'll be interesting to all the parties.
Yeah.
And if they don't know, then they'll learn and they'll just get.
They'll find out.
They will have the resources to find out.
Yeah.
Yeah, we we heard somebody in D.C.
use the term concierge mafia, which I loved that they all all from all the hotels, they
(30:54):
know each other and they talk and they do know and they reach out, which I also think
is also cool.
There's organizations like look, Claydoor, which is a very sophisticated group of concierge
that have to be admitted and tested in.
And that's one of their kind of adages is that they are each other's support.
And it's not proprietary to me or my hotel.
(31:16):
This is what we are going to provide for guests to this destination.
I didn't know that they had such a group.
Oh, yeah, it's very prestigious.
And you spell it like L.E.S.
Play C.L.E.F.S.
Door D apostrophe or look, Claydoor.
And the history of it is fascinating.
(31:37):
It was a European society first and then came and actually the first concierge in the United
States was Tom Wolf at the Fairmont, San Francisco.
So we've kind of have a propensity towards that level of service in this area as well.
I think we just found another podcast episode.
That's fascinating.
(32:03):
So are there any events that that the spots or the club itself holds or do they do holiday?
Well, there's always something going on.
So whether it's a guest chef in our restaurant, so whether it's programming,
at the club for members, you know, during the holidays, we do a beautiful tree lighting
(32:24):
and we bring in some philanthropic partners like Make-A-Wish, which is one of my very
favorite organizations nationally and now internationally.
We bring in families, we host wishes throughout our hotels all the time.
So really making it something that resonates.
So whether it's a cookie decorating activity or something in our kitchen, we do a lot of
(32:46):
that, but we do a lot of itineraries for guests.
So we do a lot of itineraries for guests.
So whether it's a wedding activity or something at our kids club is really tuning into what's
going on, creating itineraries for guests is really making sure there's always something
exciting happening at the hotel.
(33:07):
You know, it was Halloween.
We did and we just do them seasonally.
We did haunted history tours and really leaning into that.
We've leaned into that.
Our concierges were telling us repeatedly that people are always asking us questions,
is this hotel haunted and what have you.
I mean, it's an old white wood hotel.
You don't find many old white wood hotels in the state of California.
(33:30):
So it's a little creaky and whatever.
It's interesting.
And so we do have that.
We've never had any terrible things happen.
So if guests always ask, I'm scared, don't be scared.
These are all very happy ghosts.
If that's something that you believe in.
But those tours were sold out.
I mean, we launched them in the beginning of October and they were sold out.
(33:52):
People love ghosts.
Yes.
They love ghost stories.
And we always say hotels need to embrace that side of themselves.
We didn't for many, many, many years.
It was kind of a back end.
It's just not something we're going to talk about or promote.
And then we just said, why not?
People are into it.
Let's just try it.
And we had a general manager at the time that was very keen.
(34:14):
I said, let's do it.
And that was a really successful activation now that this was year three.
And I'm quite sure we'll continue to do that.
That's great.
Yeah.
I love hearing that.
And I love that you said that ghosts honked where they're happy.
And I totally agree with this because when we talk about hotels, we talk a lot about ghosts.
(34:38):
And when we spoke about the Cecil Hotel,
we said we didn't really read a lot about ghosts there or these haunted experiences.
And it's because I don't think they wanted to stay there.
Yeah.
They weren't happy there.
They weren't happy there.
Right.
So it's just a really interesting phenomenon.
It's kind of what you bring to the experience, I think, as well.
(34:58):
Yeah.
Do you have any ghost stories to share about the Claremont or what you've heard?
You know, I've just heard that.
And they say that there is people have claimed to see an older woman dressed in kind of period
costume wandering the halls.
And people would say that they think that it was Mrs. Thornburg.
(35:20):
Oh.
Haunting in her beautiful white castle.
She never wanted to leave.
OK.
That's like a nice ghost story.
I like that.
That's creepy.
No, I don't think it's creepy.
Yeah.
No.
And our Coltier's team does a really good job on these tours of kind of bringing in
someone in a period costume to kind of show that kind of ethereal, someone walking down
(35:43):
the hall so people can see that.
And then it's an opportunity for that team to talk about the history in a really interesting
way.
Right.
So, oh, that's Mrs. Thornburg.
And here's who the Thornburgs were and how they made their money and why they built a
house like this.
Yeah.
It's a great segue into that.
Yeah.
And people are going to listen because they're like, oh, a ghost is involved.
(36:05):
Right.
Right.
Exactly.
I did read something about that.
Some people said that they heard a party going on or like noise happening in a room.
Yeah.
We get that.
That is something that I've read as well.
And keep in mind now that the society parties were always held at the Claremont.
(36:28):
So if you think about that, this is where society came.
So whether it was a quinceanería or whether it was a confirmation or a wedding or engagement,
this is where everybody came.
There wasn't 12 hotels of the stature.
This was it.
So this is where the who came to enjoy.
(36:51):
I love to think that there's a group of society ghosts still just having a great time.
Right.
Like, who are these people wearing leggings in my hotel?
That's a good ghost to have a good party.
Like, what's going on?
And then there was another ghost story.
I read that there's a little girl that hangs out at the edge of some beds and tickles people's feet.
(37:16):
I've read that one too, and I have not experienced it, but I have heard that.
So but we do get the child playing.
So, you know, we get that a lot, but I was told recently that and I learned this on a history tour that I joined that for many years, you know, there were these laundry shoots that would go from the higher floors down to laundry.
(37:37):
So that because it wasn't elevators and, you know, to carry all that down and that kids in the neighborhood knew how to how how to sneak into the hotel and use the laundry shoots as slides.
That's hilarious.
Oh, my God.
And so that was always a thing in the olden days is that they were trying to keep the local kids out of the hallways to to play in the laundry shoots.
(38:01):
I feel like I do that if I was back in the day.
Yeah, that sounds like so much fun.
My mom would threaten my life to not ever go do that.
She would already know.
We show in this in the haunted history tour where some of these little doors are there closed up now, but this was the little door that led to the laundry shoot that would go down to the laundry.
(38:22):
Wow.
I love that that they still preserved at least a little bit.
A little bit, right?
So it's a little talking point to show, you know, how the hotel was built.
I hope there were always piles of laundry for them to land on.
Yeah, exactly.
Right.
Exactly.
You got to go down, got to surf down with a pillowcase.
Yeah, exactly.
And I'm already thinking how I would do it.
(38:44):
Right.
You're such a troublemaker.
Yeah.
So what is your favorite area of the hotel?
Well, I have to tell you that the views are really second to none.
And people always ask me on my personal social channels, where did you get that sunset shot of the city?
(39:05):
And most of them are from the deck at Limewood, which is our restaurant.
It is truly the best view of San Francisco anywhere.
And because, you know, San Francisco gets a lot of fog, you can see it from afar.
So you get this kind of cool look of fog rolling in the bay, but we're on top of it.
So it's a great vantage.
(39:25):
I think that that's really to have a cocktail, you know, on a sunny day and watch the fog
rolling in through the Golden Gate Bridge into the city is really spectacular.
And they have really good fries.
So a glass of really good wine, California wine and some fries.
I'm good to go.
Yeah.
That's the only meal I need.
(39:48):
It's not the healthiest choice.
I'll have fries and a Pinot Noir, but it's.
We're not going for health.
I know, right.
You'll go to the spa the next day and get all your health back.
I'll play tennis to burn off the calories.
And now we have pickleball there, too.
So you can play pickleball.
That's trendy.
Yeah.
Yeah.
There's all of it.
Yeah.
We gotta go.
(40:09):
That sounds amazing.
Yeah.
So on that, what is your favorite time of year at the hotel?
Well, you know, we're Californians, right?
So somebody in the rest of the country would say it's all the same, but that as Californians,
you know that that's not necessarily the case.
But I do think the holidays are always magical just because of the holidays.
(40:30):
And just the spirit around it around it.
But I got to say, summers in the Oakland Hills are really, really awesome.
We just get it's a different weather pattern.
It's warmer.
It's sunnier.
It feels like a real summer.
We get a lot of San Franciscans coming over to say, I just needed a summer day.
Oh, yeah, that's true.
It's always like a little cold.
(40:51):
It's always cold, a little cold and foggy.
And it's it can be easily 10 to 15 degrees warmer and sunnier where we are.
And you're literally you could take the bar.
It's 10 minutes.
I mean, it's nothing, but it's you know, we don't get the same weather.
Yeah.
Oh, then they really did choose an ideal place.
Really were smart.
Like, really smart.
(41:11):
I feel like California in general has that.
But even in L.A., the beach, downtown.
I lived in West L.A. for a long time.
Right.
And then my best friend lived in Santa Monica.
So yes.
What?
Oh, it's gray and cold.
Not here.
And I'm mid-Wolter.
Right.
Yeah, like I'm sweating.
What are you doing?
(41:33):
Only in California.
Right.
All these little microclimates.
So I think that I think the summer would have to be my ultimate favorite.
Finally, a different answer.
Honestly, almost everyone says Christmas because hotels really do Christmas very well.
But yeah, but it's nice to hear that there's something special about summer
because I hate summer because I'm from a very, very hot place.
(41:57):
So.
Are you from Texas?
Yes.
See, I knew it.
OK.
Well, I summer is OK, but I love I love fall.
I'm like and L.A. has such a delayed summer.
So we're the same way.
Like I if you ask me elsewhere in the country, I would say fall, too.
But I mean, fall is you got to really look for it.
(42:20):
Not so well in L.A. You really got to look for it.
You see it a little bit more here, but.
It's I'm from New York.
I'm from New York.
Oh, yeah.
It's right.
We fall is like BCs and everything so pretty.
And yeah, L.A. doesn't have that.
Yeah.
It's so yeah.
So now I definitely need to experience an Oakland summer.
So I want to I want to feel I'm I know that I might like summer
(42:42):
if I just found the right place.
It's not we get we have we have hot here.
So in some places.
Yes.
Yeah.
But then you go on the board at bar and then it's and then you better bring your sweater.
Yeah. Yeah.
So I have one last question.
But do you have any other questions?
(43:03):
No, I'm good.
OK. Other than the Claremont, what is what else is your favorite Fairmont hotel?
I have a lot of favorites.
I'm really blessed with a multitude of amazing hotels.
But you mentioned the Plaza in New York.
Of course, that's a sister hotel, the Savoy in London.
We're opening a brand new hotel in a matter of days in Long Beach, the Breakers.
(43:27):
Really?
So we've got a lot of really these iconic, beautiful hotels that are through our ownership
and through our design teams have painstakingly restored and kept as these testaments to luxury
and travel and lifestyle.
And I think those are all really amazing projects that our whole company is very proud of,
(43:49):
as are the communities.
Wow. Yeah.
Everyone that you mentioned, we will.
We've done it.
Episodes on the subway.
Yeah.
On the Plaza.
And now we have to check out the Long Beach one.
Check it out.
Long Beach Breakers were opening literally in a matter of days.
But it's really spectacular right on the waterfront in downtown historic Long Beach.
And what they've done to that beautiful building is is spectacular.
(44:12):
That sounds amazing.
Oh, my God.
Well, thank you so much.
Your answers are awesome.
And you really make us want to go and visit.
Well, that's my job.
So I get a gold star for today.
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