April 29, 2025 • 51 mins
Today we have Lloyd Rooney sharing his journey - from leaving the traditional schooling system at 12 due to dyslexia, learning how he learned best, to bartending in the UK and now owner-operating multiple restaurants in New Zealand, employing over 135 people.
Lloyed is a co-founder of The Jetson Group, a collection of distinctive restaurants in New Zealand:
The Quay, No. 8, Loco, and The Cove Cafe.
I had the chance to meet Lloyd and Mike during a recent stop at The Cove Cafe and I was struck, not only by their approach to hospitality but also their business philosophies - ones that blend creativity, strategy, and a deep respect for community and locally sourced ingredients.
In this episode, we dive into the behind-the-scenes decisions that have fueled their restaurant success, with a focus in this episode on The Cove Cafe in Waipu, New Zealand - which is highly seasonal. At that one location, his staff swells from 16 year-round to 45 employees for the summer months.
Lloyd opens up about the realities of scaling in the hospitality industry, how dyslexia shaped his entrepreneurial style, and why trusting your team is essential to sustainable growth.
Check out Lloyd’s restaurants and learn more through the links in the episode description above.
Subscribe on Apple Podcast , Spotify or YouTube.
Let’s connect!
Subscribe to my newsletter: Time To Live: Thriving in Business and Beyond
Website: https://www.annemcginty.com/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/annemcginty
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/annemcgintyhost
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Welcome to how I Built my Small Business.
I'm Anne McGinty, your host,and today we have Lloyd Rooney
sharing his journey from leavingthe traditional schooling
system at 12 due to dyslexia,learning how he learned best, to
bartending in the UK and nowowner operating multiple
(00:30):
restaurants in New Zealandemploying over 135 people.
Lloyd is the co-founder of theJetson Group, a collection of
distinctive restaurants in NewZealand.
The Key sp spelled Q-U-A-YNumber 8, loco and the Cove Cafe
.
I had the chance to meet Lloydand Mike during a recent stop at
(00:53):
the Cove Cafe, and I was strucknot only by their approach to
hospitality, but also theirbusiness philosophies, ones that
blend creativity, strategy anda deep respect for community and
locally sourced ingredients.
We dive into thebehind-the-scenes decisions that
have fueled their restaurantsuccess, with a focus in this
(01:17):
episode on the Cove Cafe inWaipu, which is highly seasonal.
At that one location, his staffswells from 16 year round to 45
employees for the summer months.
Lloyd shares the challenges ofgrowing in the hospitality
industry and how his uniquebackground has influenced his
(01:38):
approach.
You can find a link through tothe Cove Cafe and the Jetson
Group in the episode'sdescription.
A link through to the Cove Cafeand the Jetson Group in the
episode's description.
A quick favor before we getstarted and this means the world
to me If you enjoy this episode, or have enjoyed any episode,
(01:58):
could you do me a quick favor?
Share it with just one personin your life who might love it
too?
If each of you did that, we'dinstantly double our
listenership overnight, allowingus to continue bringing you
more incredible guests andcontinue producing content that
inspires and empowers you.
Just one episode to one person.
(02:19):
I massively appreciate it.
Lloyd, it's great to see you.
Thanks for coming on the show.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Thanks for having me.
I'm looking forward to this.
It's my first podcast, so let'sgo for it.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
Well, so I had the opportunity to chat with your
partner, mike, when we were atthe Cove Cafe the other week,
and I was pretty impressed bywhat I learned of your story.
So I'm really looking forwardto hearing more, and I was
wondering if, looking back, youcould tell us what some of the
key experiences were that shapedyour path to where you are
(02:54):
today.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
So I think for human beings we are the sum of all our
parts.
I suppose in many ways my wholelife has shaped where I am
today.
Growing up in a very poorfamily, I was young as a six.
I had a black sister, a dotbefore I was born, a Muslim
sister-in-law, a Thaisister-in-law.
So a very large, multiculturalfamily.
(03:17):
Very poor, large, multiculturalfamily, and I was dyslexic.
As the youngest of the six kids, nobody else in the family was
apart from me.
I ended up growing into somebodythat I never thought I would
have done when I was a child,but mum took me out of school
(03:39):
when I was 12 and I was taughtat home and that had a massive
impact on me because I learnedto learn for myself and I think
that was a massive gift.
That mum gave me was theability to learn for myself, and
it shaped everything I did fromthen on.
So I went to university becauseI learned to learn for myself.
(04:00):
I did my law conversion course,called a CPE, because I learned
to learn for myself, and then Idid my law finals and I learned
to learn for myself.
I did my law conversion course,called a CPE, because I learned
to learn for myself, and then Idid my law finals and I learned
to learn for myself.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Okay, but so you studied law.
How does that translate intobecoming a restaurateur?
Speaker 2 (04:18):
You know what I actually love studying law but I
hated being a lawyer.
It was something that it justdidn't sit with me at all.
You know, being a lawyer andgoing to sing a law firm every
day just wasn't my gig and Iknew it and it wasn't what I was
born to do and I knew it Everytime I got on the tube to go to
(04:38):
work and I saw my reflection inthe glass of the tube.
I didn't recognize myself,reflection in the glass of the
tube.
I didn't recognize myself.
But saying that having thatlegal background has been a
tremendous help to me everysingle day with running a
business, because I'm abledefinitely to problem solve and
solve issues before they becomea big issue and before I need to
(05:00):
spend money on lawyers fees.
So I'm already kind of thinkingfive steps ahead when I'm
working every day.
So having that legal backgroundhas been a tremendous help.
Speaker 1 (05:10):
How did you then get your foot in the door with
hospitality?
Speaker 2 (05:14):
So when I was in my law finals or my CPE course, I
got a job working as a waiter ina restaurant called Capital
Ancsi in Camden Town and then Iwent on to manage a pub called
the Engineer in Primrose Hill.
It was owned by LaurenceLeVay's daughter, tamza LeVay,
and Abigail Osborne, and it wasmy kind of real taste of running
(05:38):
a restaurant.
And one thing Abby and Tamtaught me which I think is
really important is theybasically left the restaurant
for myself and Claire, the othermanager, to run as if it was
ours and we I think weemotionally bought into it.
We loved it and they had theknowledge that we were running
it for them in the best capacitythat we could do.
(06:00):
So that was my first sort ofstep into hospitality was the
Engineer One of London's firstgastropubs and probably the most
successful gastropub in Londonat the time.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
They gave you a lot of autonomy to just figure
things out Huge.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
Huge, a massive amount of autonomy, and it's
something which I've taken fromme with my restaurants, in that
I have given the staff who workfor me the same autonomy and I
think it's probably the biggestingredient to my success.
I know it's the biggestingredient to their success
because they couldn't run theengineer, abby got married and
(06:34):
had children and Tamsin also gotmarried and so they weren't in
a position to run a hospitalityvenue which was 11 in the
morning to 11 at night, to run ahospitality venue which was 11
in the morning to 11 at night.
And them empowering us gave usthe ability to really, really,
really, really get our teethinto it.
And I've taken the same essencefrom them and I've given it to
(06:55):
my staff and I think that'swhat's definitely empowered me
to open.
At one point I had sevenrestaurants and I couldn't have
done that if I didn't have staffthat I empowered to run it for
me.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
And when you were given that position and autonomy
, what key lessons do you thinkthat you learned beyond how
important it was for you andyour team to have that autonomy
Like what did you learn aboutthe actual management or the
running of a successful businessthat translated over when you
(07:24):
eventually branched off on yourown?
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Yeah, I think that for me, when I empower the staff
, before I empower them, I needto know that they can take that
power, that they can take theautonomy and they can run with
it.
I think that's a big gift is toknow who has the ability to
take on that role and beautonomous and those that don't.
(07:49):
And I also think it's reallyimportant with empowering people
is that you give them a reallystrong framework to work within.
So they have this autonomy, butthey have a really good
framework around them and agreat team that supports them
and helps them deliver what weneed to deliver.
I think the framework is reallyimportant with autonomy.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
What do you mean when you say framework?
Is this like a training thatthey go through?
Speaker 2 (08:14):
No, I think when I say framework is that they have
a really clear understanding ofwhat their role is, what we need
to achieve and how we achieve.
It is what I mean by framework,and I think you know you
basically kind of give them anoutline, a sketch of what the
restaurant is and what we needto do to get from A to B to
deliver the product that we needto deliver.
(08:35):
And of course, you know, at theend of the day we can only
deliver that product if we'vegot the team around you.
So you give them a really goodframework, a really good sketch
of what it is that we need to do, and then you give them the
team around them and the toolsto achieve it.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
How did you learn how to hire the right team?
Is this just like trial anderror, like where did you get
most of this learning from?
Speaker 2 (08:58):
I think it's definitely experience when I had
my own restaurant in Londoncalled the Duke of York.
So when I left the engineeringI set my own restaurant called
Duke of York in St John's Wood.
I had a business partner,brendan, and Brendan always said
to me he can tell when someonewalks through the door whether
or not they're going to be agood fit.
And I think, you know, it'spart about their presence, it's
(09:19):
part about their energy, it'spart about how they interact
with you when they first enterthe room, and I think that's a
massive part because, of course,the most important thing for me
is when I'm looking for a staffmember is that they can
interact with the customers in away that I am happy and I feel
(09:39):
confident about.
So, yeah, I think the, you know, interaction between you and
the potential staff member isthe biggest key to begin with,
and I think everything justgrows legs from there on.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Yeah, communication, and then also hospitality.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
Yes, I always say a restaurant manager has to be the
best waiter, the best maitre d', the best barista and the best
bartender, because you need tobe able to walk into the
restaurant and just pick upevery single piece and run with
it.
So I always say it's reallyimportant with managers that
they can do every single part ofwhat that puzzle and what that
(10:16):
piece is, but also they have tohave that communication skills,
that light in their eyes.
You know, when you walk in andyou have just this person on the
front door that has this energyand this light.
That's what you need.
You need them to be able to doall the parts and have this
energy and light about them thatjust makes them a joy to be
(10:38):
able to interact with.
When I look at the staff, I canwalk into my restaurant and see
who are the ones that I can justsee are actually resonating and
those that aren't.
You know, and of course noteverybody is a magic star, but
you try and get as many peopleof those stars as you can.
I go into the, into myrestaurant the key in Fongaree
the other day and there's thisFrench waiter there and he just
(10:59):
has this energy about thisamazing light, this engagement
with people, that's incredible.
And I just look at that andthink yeah, that's what you're
looking for.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Okay, so take us from the UK to you, arriving in New
Zealand.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
Okay.
So that was a massive path.
So I had a restaurant in the UK, in London, called Duke of York
in St John's Wood, but I alsohad an interior design store as
well.
So I was an interior designer.
I fall into most things in mylife.
I fell into restaurants, youknow.
I trained to be a lawyer butfell into restaurants, which was
a side hustle to earn money tobe a lawyer with, and I kind of
(11:37):
fell into being an interiordesigner as well.
I had this interior design shopin Islington called Revel Lloyd
and I won in Chelsea the samename and I started just
basically buying furniture andselling it.
And then I just fell intointeriors and someone one day
said to me oh, can you design myhouse?
And I was like sure I candesign your house.
(11:58):
So I ended up being an interiordesigner and I had some really
lovely clients.
I did Dido's house because shelived in Islington, and I did
some work for Kevin Spacey, whobought a place in Westminster
Bridge Road, and then I met Mikeand he was a farmer in New
Zealand and I ended up crazilyjumping on the plane and
arriving in New Zealand into theheart of the Waikato, onto a
(12:21):
farm, and I'd never set foot ona farm in my life before, you
know, and I'd swapped sellingfurniture to Dido, to swelling
out the pigs, you know I saw.
I swapped Westminster BridgeRoad, where Ken Spacey used to
live, to being in the calves.
It was a massive transition andit wasn't a small bit of land,
it was 10 square kilometers, itwas 2,500 acres.
(12:43):
And there was the three of usthere's me, mike and Kev and my
job was to look after the calvesand rear the calves, and one
year we reared 1,000 calves, soit wasn't a small farm.
And so, yeah, that was mytransition to New Zealand, from
doing interior design to crazilyworking on a farm.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
Oh my gosh, I have just a vision of what that must
have been like for you, but youmade it work.
So how long did this farm Seven?
Speaker 2 (13:09):
years Okay, seven years and I never really loved
it.
It didn't fulfill me in a waythat I wanted to be fulfilled on
a daily basis, but I definitelygot a better understanding of
animals and our place on thisplanet in a bizarre kind of way.
You know, when you'resurrounded by animals every
(13:32):
single day, in a capacity whereyou're caring for them every
single day, moving them, youknow, moving from paddock to
paddock and making sure they'vegot grass and making sure
they've got water, making surethey're healthy, and I
definitely got a deeperunderstanding of how we fit in.
My friend, amber, always saidto me, always said you're like a
diet potato.
He said I can plant youanywhere in your sprout and in
(14:00):
some ways I think I've thrownmyself in something 100% to make
it work.
But then when I was offered theability to do a restaurant
again I jumped at it.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
And how were you offered the opportunity to do a
restaurant again?
Speaker 2 (14:09):
So I mean, I never thought I'd be back in
restaurant when I sold the Dukeof York and I moved away from
restaurants and more intointeriors, I thought that was my
hospo career done.
But a friend of mine, ian, whoowned the local gym in Pukakuri
where I used to go, and I becamevery good friends with him and
his wife Tracy.
They had a part share in arestaurant in Waipu Cove called
(14:30):
the Two Fish Cafe and the chefwho was working there wasn't
enjoying it and I don't thinkparticularly was doing a good
job, and so when they said thatthey were looking at getting out
, I kind of spied opportunityand I jumped at it and I got in
the car and I drove up to WaipuCove and it was a rainy, wet day
.
It was July, our winter, therain was horizontal and I walked
(14:54):
into this building and itcalled to me.
It just resonated with me and Ithought, hmm, I like this, I
like this spot, I likeeverything about it.
I love the bar, I love theoutlook.
It's on the beach.
Who couldn't love the outlook?
You know, you know you're atthe Cove, it's the most
beautiful, beautiful, beautifullocation.
And I looked at what Trent wasdoing in terms of figures and in
(15:16):
terms of number of covers a dayand thought to myself if he's
breaking even on that, I couldturn it around and make money.
And so I did and I jumped at it.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
Can you tell us what it is that you saw when you
looked at the numbers and you'relike I can do better than this
or I can improve here and there.
What did you do?
What changes did you make whenyou took over?
Speaker 2 (15:33):
Well, first of all, he's only open five days a week,
so he was closed on Tuesdaysand Wednesdays and I thought, ok
, I'll change that number one.
Number two there was noconsistency to the opening hours
when he was open.
So if it was a quiet night he'dclose at six o'clock.
It's a no-no.
You never do that.
You have to be consistent withwhat you're giving to a customer
(15:53):
.
They need to know they can comedown and come to the Cove and
you're going to be open when yousay you're going to be open.
And so I gave the restaurantmore consistency, both with
opening times and with itsopening days.
We were open seven days a weekand we're open from nine in the
morning to eight o'clock atnight.
Come winter, come summer, inthe summer we open at eight, an
hour earlier, but I never, ever,close before 8 pm, because even
(16:17):
if it's a rainy, wet night, Iwant people to know that they
can come to the Cove and we'llbe open when we say we're going
to be open.
So I definitely gave it somemore consistency in its opening
hours and more consistency withthe product that we were going
to deliver as well.
So I employed a team of chefs.
I employed a team of chefs.
I employed a front of houseteam.
I knew that would cost me interms of a wage bill, but I knew
(16:38):
that the long-term benefit wasgoing to be a much better
product, much more consistentopening hours and a restaurant
that people knew that they couldgo to if they wanted to go to
it and would always be there.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
And did you have any guidelines as to like how much
you were willing to spend ofyour potential revenue in order
to cover this new team and tostay open the hours that you
wanted to?
Speaker 2 (17:02):
I think with any small business, the biggest cost
to you is going to be wages.
That's the biggest, biggest,biggest cost.
So you always have to be reallymindful of that wage bill.
But you also can't run yourbusiness without wages, without
staff.
So there's always going to bethis dichotomy between giving
(17:24):
your business the ability tofunction and what is the balance
between the functionality andthe cost constraint.
So we kind of opened up with aminimal team but a really strong
team.
And I was there and I was avery good waiter when I was
running the engineer and KevinLancy so I knew that I was two
people and I had a reallyamazing manager in Siobhan and I
(17:47):
had a great head chef in Craigas well who was a chef at the
time.
So you know, I kind of openedup with a really good, strong
team.
It was a small team but it wasa strong team.
But it was also a lot morestaff than the previous owner
had.
I had five floor staff and Ihad three in the kitchen and I
knew that's what I needed tomake it work, so that if it was
(18:09):
quiet I wasn't hemorrhaging cash, but if it was busy we could
all step up and we could makesure that we were able to
deliver the products to thecustomer that came through the
doors.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
How long did it take before you felt Instantly?
Speaker 2 (18:21):
Wow, yeah, I think when you open a new business,
there's always that honeymoonperiod.
It's a new restaurant in townpeople are going to go.
Traditionally, when you open arestaurant and have that
honeymoon period, you're goingto be busy for the first two or
three months whilst people comeand try you out.
The difficult part is makingthat honeymoon period not a
(18:42):
honeymoon period but theconsistent period that's going
to sustain you for the monthsand years to come.
So I opened up in November,which is our spring in New
Zealand, and I knew thatDecember, january and February
were going to be busy because itwas a summer period.
The difficulty for me was howdo I make March through to
(19:02):
November something that's goingto work long term?
But I think what happened waswe did such a great job when we
opened in our honeymoon periodthat we were able to take those
customers that were the localsand the regulars who were really
impressed with the quality offood, the menu, the service and
(19:23):
the general atmosphere and theykept coming back.
So it's important to make surethat honeymoon period isn't just
a honeymoon period but itextends as long as you can
extend it for hopefullyindefinitely.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
You have seasonal fluctuations, as I expect that
most would, so can you give usan idea of what the range is
that you could expect in revenuefrom the slow end to the most
popular day?
Speaker 2 (19:47):
Okay, slow day $2,500 .
Busy day $55,000.
So you go from a two and a halfgrand day to a fifty five
thousand dollar day.
That is the biggest challengefor a business which is as
seasonal as ours.
How do we transform?
How do we, how are we able togo from that to that and
(20:11):
upscaling your business and, Imay add, downscaling the
business.
That's the biggest key to yoursuccess is being able to make
sure that you can make hay wherethe sun shines and really
upscale your business to takeadvantage of those really busy
summer months.
And then how do you thendownscale the business so that
(20:33):
you're not hemorrhaging the cashthat you make in the summer
during your winter period?
So you know, yeah, it's amassive fluctuation and you've
got to get it right to make surethat your business can operate
within those extremes andoperate really, really, really
well.
I mean, the more popular we'vegot and the bigger we've got, I
think in some ways has becomemore of a challenge because we
(20:57):
need to make sure that we reallydeliver, and so what ends up
happening is, during the winterI do have a much stronger team,
because I want to keep thatreally strong core team and I
want to be able to take theminto the summer and then just
bring on all the added help totake us to those $55,000,
$50,000, $60,000 days, all theadded help to take us to those
$55,000, $50,000, $60,000 days.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
Can you give us more clarity on exactly how you
manage this staffing andoperations to handle these big,
drastic ebbs and flows?
What's the size of your teamyear round?
And then, what is it in thepeak?
Speaker 2 (21:27):
Great, great question .
So the size of the team yearround.
So in the winter we still haveprobably 15, 16 full-time
members of staff.
That would be probably eight ornine front of house and about
six or seven in the kitchen,eight in the kitchen.
So we still have a reallystrong core during the winter
(21:48):
and that, I think, is a massivepart to our success.
Because what happens is in thesummer, when you have that short
three month recruitment, whenyou absorb staff into your
restaurant, the biggest key isto get them to assimilate the
culture, get them to understandwhat you want them to deliver
and get them to understand whattheir role is, all within a very
(22:10):
short, short space time.
And so we have a massiverecruitment stage during the
December period.
So getting the staff trained upduring that period without
costing you a huge amount ofmoney to do so is the key to
having a very successful summer.
We can go from 16, for example,during the winter to about 40
(22:32):
during the summer.
We have about 45 members ofstaff during the summer period.
And how do we go from 16 to 40,45?
And we train them up and youassimilate them into the company
.
You get them to understand whatthe culture is, and then
deliver a product, and then,equally, they start dropping off
again between February andMarch.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
And you're specifically talking about the
Cove Cafe, the one restaurantright now.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
I'm talking about the Cove but also the Quay.
The Quay is another restaurantwe have in Whangarei which is
nowhere near as seasonal as theCove because it's based in a
town and it's not based by thebeach.
So we have quite a largepopulation, not large by your
standards but by New Zealandstandards.
We've got 100,000 people wholive in Whangarei.
So that's quite a big town forus in New Zealand and having
(23:16):
100,000 people on your doorstepis great at sustaining your
business during both the winterand the summer.
So the key doesn't nearly asfluctuate as the Cove.
But to give you dollar turnoversin terms of fluctuations, for
us in Whangarei the key, ourquiet day will be $8,000, $9,000
, and our busy day will be$40,000.
So it's not quite the ebbs andflows that the Cove has, but it
(23:39):
still fluctuates, not quite aseasonal.
We still have great winters,you know, but there's still a
seasonality to it.
We have a lot of tourists comethrough during the summer.
So there's definitely aseasonality to the key.
And I've also got number eightin the town, based in Fongray,
and I've got Loco and once againthey have the same seasonality,
not quite like the Cove, butstill you have to be able to
upskill and then drop staff offas you go through from summer to
(24:03):
winter.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
Do you maintain the same margin across all of them?
Speaker 2 (24:08):
Yeah, yeah.
So I don't think the one's morelucrative.
I think that Loco is our SouthAmerican restaurant, but you
know what?
The Cove the Key and numbereight, they're restaurants and
then we serve alcohol.
Loco, it's a bar that servesfood and it's definitely a
psychological switch and this isshowing through revenue.
(24:29):
So, for example, with the Covethe Key and with number eight,
it's about 70-30 split marginwise You've got 70% on food, 30%
on alcohol.
At L eight, it's about 70-30split margin-wise You've got 70%
on food, 30% on alcohol.
At Loco, it's the other wayaround.
It's a 70-30 split, but infavor of the bar.
Margins on alcohol tend to bebetter than on food because of
course it's so much morelabor-intensive putting a menu
together and delivering acrossthe pass, as it is to making a
(24:51):
cocktail which is simply puttinga few spirits into a shaker and
shaking it up.
So loco definitely has theability to be more lucrative.
But bars don't tend to have thesame patronage that a
restaurant has, because whatpeople need to eat.
So restaurants tend to havebetter patronage but potentially
(25:13):
a slightly less margin thanbars that have a higher margin
but less patronage.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
Yeah, that does make a lot of sense, and I know over
here we're experiencing a littlebit of a cultural shift as well
, with the younger generationchoosing not to drink as much.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:28):
So would you agree that?
Over here I've talked withother restaurant owners and I
hear a profit margin around the20 to 23% range.
I've heard some people saylower than that.
Very rarely ever heard peoplesay higher than that.
But then people that I know whoown bars say that alcohol has
like a 400% margin.
(25:49):
Would you agree with these?
Speaker 2 (25:51):
No, I don't think alcohol has quite that margin,
not over here.
We have a lot of taxes on ouralcohol so we don't have the
margin anywhere near that sortof margin for alcohol For our
food.
Yeah, I think we work on 30% atthe end of the gate for us is
what we work on.
We try and get our cost ofsales about 68%, 70% for us the
cost of sales and it ends upbeing almost the same for
(26:13):
alcohol over here.
It's about maybe slightlyhigher, but then again your wage
bill should be less becauseyou're just opening a bottle.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
Well, your 30% margin as a restaurant sounds like a
pretty high.
That's pretty good from whatI've heard Across your four
locations, or maybe you want toeven consider all seven that
you've had.
What have you learned, both thegood and the bad, Like what
works and what did you try thatdidn't work.
Speaker 2 (26:41):
So you can pick up the cove and you can move it to
a venue very similar three hoursdown the road and it just
doesn't work.
And I think that's somethingwhich I've learned is that for
some reason, whatever you do,that dinner soquat is missing
and it just doesn't fly.
And there's no reason for it.
(27:02):
You know, we did a restaurantin Mount Monganui.
We spent a lot of money on thefit out the restaurant, millions
on the fit out the restaurant,thinking that it would be a
massive success.
It was a huge venue, empty andthere's no other reason.
A great location tick.
We took the key staff from theCove and the Quay tick.
We had almost the same menu andthe same wine list as the Cove
(27:25):
and the Quay tick, but for somereason it didn't resonate.
And I think that's somethingwhich is universal in
hospitality.
I mean, you know, Jamie Olivercan set up a restaurant in one
town and it flies and in anothertown it flops.
The same with Gordon Ramsay.
There's no other reason of whysometimes it works and sometimes
it doesn't.
You can give it all theingredients, but there's just
(27:47):
that one thing that is missingand you don't know what it is.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
It just doesn't resonate that is interesting, I
wonder.
I wonder if anybody's reallyfigured out the formula behind
it.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
No, I don't think so.
I think with all chains, someof their outlets absolutely go
gangbusters and there'll be somewhich just don't and the others
were supporting it.
You know, it's just sometimesthings work and sometimes they
don't, and I think if we had themagic understanding of why they
didn't work, every singlehospital eventually you did
(28:21):
would be a massive success.
But they're not, that's so true,and you give them all the
ingredients, you give them allthe framework, all the support,
everything to make it work, andsometimes it just doesn't it
just doesn't yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
So, looking back, is there anything that you would
have done differently?
Speaker 2 (28:39):
I would have done differently, I would have pulled
the plug earlier.
It's hard to do sometimes.
I think that's my biggestfailure is I just think this
time next year we'll turn itaround.
What I've learned is thatsometimes when the business
isn't performing and it hasn'tperformed, it's not going to
(29:03):
work and I can throw everythingat it and it's not going to work
.
And I think that is the biggestthing that I've learned is that
I've got to learn to pull theplug, not within four years of
it not working, but within 12months of it not working,
because your first loss is yourbest loss, you know, and don't
let pride get in the way ofmaking the right financial
business decisions.
Speaker 1 (29:20):
Okay, so just focusing on the Cove Cafe,
because we've been talking aboutthat one already and then we
just have some continuity.
What do you think the magic isabout that place?
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Location, location, location.
It is by the beach, so it'skind of, you know, we have a
really relaxed, surfy sort ofvibe to the place, which
everyone loves.
But we just seem to haveconnected with this audience in
a way that I would never haveimagined.
And the same with the Quay inFongare as well, but for
different reasons.
(29:53):
People just love it and itseems to have this energy about
it, this goodwill about it fromeveryone who comes in.
They just think, wow, thisplace is amazing.
The staff are always on point,they're always friendly, it's
always busy.
It just has an energy and avibe about it that just people
(30:14):
love and are attracted to.
So, yeah, I think that a bigpart of the Cove's success is
its connection with its audience, its connection with its locals
, its connection with itstourists, its passers-by, and it
seems to tick the box for somany different groups of people.
I mean, young adults love it.
They love coming in and havinga smoothie and watching the surf
(30:35):
.
Old people love it because theylove the menu and they love the
staff.
Families love it because it'skids-friendly.
You're by a campground that has2,500 people in it, so we have
to be open to everyone who comesin, whoever they're going to be
, our market share is so huge.
It's from the very rich,affluent people from Langs Beach
who have multi-million dollarhouses, to the mums and dads and
(30:56):
kids who are camping at thecampground next door.
So when I set the Cove up, Iwanted to do a menu that
definitely ticked the boxes forall those groups of people, and
we did that, and so the reasonwhy the Cove, I think, is so
popular is it just ticks the boxin so many levels, and the quay
in Fongare is by the marina andit has the same sort of
goodwill and love in the area.
(31:16):
People love the quay and onceagain, with the menu, with the
key, I wanted to be able to besomewhere that people could go
for a date night but could alsocome in and have a muffin and a
coffee.
So it has a menu that ticksmany boxes of many people.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
Well, when you were talking about the Cove I was
wondering oh, is it that it's acaptured audience and that
there's not a whole lot ofcompetition right there?
But then you're saying that theQuay does equally or similarly
as well, and that's in the townbasin.
So that argument would notnecessarily have any proof, I
(31:51):
guess, or evidence.
Speaker 2 (31:52):
You know, I definitely think that you
touched on the point about theCove's location in terms of it
being the only place in town andyeah, it is the only place in
town.
But I never took advantage ofthat.
I never thought to myself youknow what?
It's the only place in town,where else are they going to go?
I never, ever thought.
That was never an ethos behindmy business with the Cove.
It was always how can wedeliver, how can we elevate, how
(32:13):
can we provide the best food,the best service every single
day?
No, no matter what happens andI think that's something which
has been a key to the success isthat we didn't just rest on our
laurels and think to ourselveswell, we're the only place in
town and with the key in Fongore, yeah, you're right, it's a
very different beast, it's a lotmore competition.
But once again, we just get upevery day and say how can we
(32:34):
make it better?
And I think with business,you've got to say to yourself
how do I make it better?
Every single day and we doevery single week or every
single month, when we have amenu change, we think how can we
elevate it this time so that wecan just make it better.
Speaker 1 (32:50):
And how much impact do you think that the design and
the ambiance play into theJetson group's success?
Speaker 2 (32:58):
I mean that's so important.
I keep forgetting about thatno-transcript.
(33:32):
Having that interior thatpeople will walk into and enjoy
and as their comfort and totheir experience with us is so
important Because, you know,going out for dinner for most
people is an experience and noteveryone can afford to go out
for dinner every week.
Some people it's once a month,some people it's once a year for
their birthday, and you need tomake sure that when they come
in that it's a whole experience.
(33:53):
It's the environment, it's thefood, it's the service, it's the
atmosphere, it's the greeting,the goodbye, everything has to
align so that they really doenjoy their experience with us,
because it's an experience.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
What do you say is your ultimate goal, like where
do you see the Jetson Group infive years?
Where would you like it to go?
What are you hoping for?
Speaker 2 (34:16):
Yeah, I think when I first set the Jetson Group up I
never set it up to have.
I think when I first set theJackson Group up, I never set it
up to have many, many, manyrestaurants.
But you know, sometimes fateweaves a little weave and we had
a logo that actually was quitetransferable.
It was four letters in a circleand so if we wanted to expand
with our logo, the expansion wassomething that we could do.
(34:38):
We could simply change the fourletters, which we did.
So the cove is four letters.
The key did so the Cove is fourletters.
The Quay is four letters, locois four letters.
At the Mount we had fire, itwas four letters.
We had the Dune in Mungify fourletters.
I didn't anticipate expanding,but then, when I expanded to the
Quay and I realised that Icould transfer the Cove to the
(34:58):
Quay and I could run tworestaurants successfully
simultaneously and both of themwere hugely successful, I
thought I could take thisthrough the country.
You know, I could take thesefour letters and I could take
this experience that we offerpeople throughout New Zealand
and that's why I set the tworestaurants up in the Mount
Magnawee, fire and Number 8, andI set the Dune up, and then I
set Number 8 up in Fongrae andthen Loco.
(35:18):
But where are we going to be infive years time?
I did have an idea of expansionsouthwards.
At the moment that's come to astop.
I think I've got quitecomfortable with the four and at
the moment they are successfuland they are able to provide
staff with a great wage and agreat job security and job
(35:38):
satisfaction.
It provides me with a greatincome.
So at the moment I can say I'm55.
Now I don't know, do I have theenergy to do more?
At the moment I don't.
That might change in two yearstime.
I might get another rush andthink actually I want to do four
more down the country, but atthe moment I'm just happy with
four.
Speaker 1 (35:56):
And if anybody is listening in and is also a
restaurateur maybe theirrestaurant isn't doing as well
as yours is, or maybe there'ssomebody listening in who wants
to open something what advicewould you give to them?
Speaker 2 (36:08):
Okay.
So the ones that aren't doingso well, it's always a tough
game.
It is a tough game and you'reonly as good as you are before
the next new restaurant opens intown and you know you're always
fighting for that market share.
It's difficult, but you've justgot to remember that every
single day you've got to providethe best that you can provide,
(36:29):
otherwise it's never going towork.
So make sure that you providethe best you can do every single
day.
And for those who want to getinto hospo, it's a full-time job
and you live and breathe it.
And for me, I'm now very lucky.
I've been doing it.
I've had the code for 10 yearsand they run themselves
literally.
I went down yesterday and I wasjust a spare part.
I thought I'll go down fornight service.
(36:50):
I was there half an hour.
I thought I'm in the way, I'lljust go home and that's a lovely
privileged position to be in.
You know, I'm in a position nowwhere I don't have to be there
every single day.
I love to be there and I alwaysgo in every single day just so
that I can cast my eyes acrossand make sure that everything's
tickety boo.
But for those who are startingout.
When you first start out, it'sa 24 hour, seven day a week
(37:12):
venture and if you haven't gotthe energy to do that, don't do
it, because it's going to takeeverything from you to make it
work in the beginning.
Speaker 1 (37:20):
I do know what you're talking about, just from
friends of ours who are in thesame industry.
I wanted to ask you about justhow you've kept your pulse on
the team as it's grown so muchand you've gotten to this point
where you don't need to be there.
How do you make sure that thereisn't any theft, that everyone
(37:42):
is showing up and doing the bestthat they can?
What's the hierarchy with, likehow you handle these operations
?
Speaker 2 (37:50):
That's always a really good question.
Theft, you know what.
At the end of the day, you justhave to trust people, and I
know it's a really hard thing tosay.
You have to trust people, butyou do.
You can't have eyes on earsover everything all of the time.
For me, the way that I operateis first of all, I can go into
(38:10):
the restaurant and I could lookat a situation or see how it's
functioning instantly.
That doesn't take long at all.
I can walk in somewhere andthink that isn't right or
actually that's actually going'sactually going bloody fantastic
.
I'm really happy with that.
I saw the engagement from thestaff to the customers.
That's on point.
I saw the food can wash thepast.
That's on point.
Takes five minutes.
I can walk out.
(38:30):
So keeping your finger on thepulse actually can be really,
really easy.
If it's simply a matter ofmaintaining what you've got In
terms of theft, that's adifferent ballgame.
I do trust the staff implicitly,which I think in some ways is a
good thing and a bad thing.
Good thing is that they knowthat there's complete trust in
them, because they could takestock out the back door and I'll
(38:53):
be none the wiser.
I don't even have cameras insome of my restaurants, you know
.
So it's simply hoping that I'verecruited well, that people are
going to treat me the same waythat I treat them.
But I do look for patterns.
So you know, I might not havecameras, but I look for patterns
in stock.
I look for patterns on the endof the report.
(39:14):
So I get end of the report fromevery restaurant every night
and I read through the end ofthe report and on the end of the
report I see variations betweenwhat we should have taken and
what we actually took.
That's one pattern I can monitor.
The second pattern I monitor iswhat comes in goes out.
I look for stock coming in andstock going out.
If I think to myself, that'sweird.
A lot of stocks have come inrecently but we don't seem to be
(39:35):
that busy.
That's another pattern that Ican look at.
They're very broad.
I grant you very broad patterns, but it's a pattern nonetheless
.
And, to be honest with you, Ikind of wouldn't want to run a
business that was run where itwas so managed that people felt
that they were being watched ornot trusted.
(39:57):
I think you have to be able totrust people, you have to let
them be themselves and you haveto be able to trust people, you
have to let them be themselvesand you have to let them feel
empowered and able to function.
But on the flip side I look forpatterns and that's how I can
try and keep some control on theend part of the business.
Speaker 1 (40:16):
Are you doing anything in particular to keep
your team happy and motivatedfor the success of the
businesses?
Speaker 2 (40:23):
Every day, every day.
I think that's so important.
Every day I will come into arestaurant and I look for
somebody who's not happy and Iask them why Every day?
I want the staff to be happy,every single day, and I do
anything to make that happen,because a happy staff is what
really makes a happy customer.
No one wants to come into arestaurant if the staff are
(40:45):
moping around and miserable.
You know it's crazy.
Every single day I think tomyself how can I make them happy
today?
What can I do to make it better?
I did little things, like I gaveLuke a little bonus the other
day because he'd worked so manyhours over the COVID over that
big summer period of those twoor three weeks, so I gave him a
three grand bonus because I justthought Masafi deserved it.
You know I pay for go down toAuckland and stay at a hotel.
(41:06):
I sent Milena on a woman'sretreat for three days.
Every single day I think aboutwhat I can do for the staff to
make them happy and justsometimes it's just talking to
them, say everything all right,what's gone wrong?
Okay, you know there was a girlwho working number eight,
feeling a bit of tension in herand another manager.
I sat down with her, I had achat with her.
Then I had a chat with him andsaid come on, guys, you know,
(41:26):
you've got to be able to worktogether and you've got to be
able to understand what it meansto make your team work.
And I always say for managersour job is to put fires out, not
start them.
So that's my biggest, biggest,biggest daily mantra with
managers.
They say, guys, our job is toput fires out, let's not start
them.
So I don't want you arguingwith the team, I want you
supporting the team and I wantyou empowering the team.
(41:46):
So I use managers to make surethe staff are empowered and
supported, and then I obviouslymake sure that managers feel
empowered and supported by me.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
That sounds like you're a great leader.
Speaker 2 (41:57):
Yeah, I am a good leader.
I'm sorry but I am.
It's definitely something whichI know is the reason for a big
part of the success is I'mreally good at my job and that
is making sure that we keep thatship stable and the ship has to
be stable at all times andthat's about, you know, maybe
some constantly putting in thesedifferent ways of making things
(42:19):
work, but just making sure thatthe staff are happy and that
they're content that they've gotsupport, they feel that they've
got leadership.
I step in when I need to stepin and I step out when I feel I
can step out.
So, yeah, I am very good at myjob.
That's definitely been a reasonwhy we're able to be in the
position we're in, where we'vegot four restaurants functioning
really, really well and I canstep back and support now from
(42:42):
the wings.
Speaker 1 (42:43):
So is this just part of your personality or is there
an experience that made you wantto be this type of a leader?
Did you read a book or take acourse?
Speaker 2 (42:52):
No, no book, no course.
I think in life everyexperience that you have will
shape you.
Abintam gave me the autonomy torun the engineer and I took
that with me so that when I cameto run my own restaurants I
gave the staff the same autonomy.
So that was something I learnedfrom my experience in terms of
managing staff.
I've got great empathy forpeople.
(43:14):
I remember when I did CampAmerica, which is where you go
and work a summer camp in theStates, and I did that when I
was 18, 19 years old andsuddenly I'd gone from being the
youngest of the family who'sbeing bullied, yet sport at the
same time.
I don't know how that works,but apparently it works Bullied
and sport at the same time Toworking in a summer camp and
looking after children.
And I worked for the SalvationArmy a summer camp in West
(43:36):
Virginia called Camp TomahawkGreat, great, great summer camp,
amazing job.
So much summer camp we did inAmerica, amazing job.
So they'd go around Baltimoreand DC this is where the
catchment was and pick up allthese kids off the street and
bring them to a camp.
And I learned empathy from thatexperience.
I learned to put somebody whowasn't a brother or a friend or
(44:00):
somebody I had any connectionwith above myself and which I
did.
You know we used to be given anallowance to spend at a tuck
shop and we had poor kids andI'd always give them my
allowance.
It meant more to them than itmeant to me and I think I
learned the empathy from that.
So, in terms of doing a course,I always think it's really
difficult.
I'm going to put myself out ona limb here.
It's like interior design.
You can't learn interior design.
(44:22):
I think it's something whichyou have to just develop an eye
for over a period of time isexperience about what mediums go
with mediums, you know, and Ithink it's the same with people
management.
I don't think you can learnpeople management.
I think it's something whichyou have to A have a really good
aptitude for B.
A have a really good aptitudefor B have some great
experiences which help youunderstand how to get the best
(44:43):
out of people.
And.
C just putting all of yourparts of yourself into
understanding what makes peopletick and get the best out of
people.
Empathy is something which isan important trait that we take
with us and hopefully learn anduse every day.
Speaker 1 (45:07):
It's very true and something we want to teach to
our kids.
So I just have one finalquestion, and this is a question
that I ask everybody.
It is unrelated to business,it's more of wisdom.
If you could sit down withyourself when you were in your
early twenties and have aconversation, what life wisdom
would you give yourself?
Speaker 2 (45:23):
First thing is don't worry, everything will be okay.
I think that's the mostimportant thing I'd say to
myself, because when you're 20,you're just always worried about
what the future is going tohold.
Where will I be, what will I do, what roof will I have on my
head?
So I think the most importantthing I say to myself, to a 20
year old, is don't worry,everything will be okay.
The second thing is trust yourgut, because it will play well
(45:47):
for you, far more than it won'tTrust your gut.
The next thing I say to myselfis and I love people.
I always have.
I love people.
I think people are amazing.
They make me laugh every singleday and, yeah, you can
sometimes you get somebody whotests that love for people, but
(46:10):
99.9% of the time I think peopleare amazing.
And I'll say to myself you knowwhat?
You're right, lloyd, people areamazing.
Remember that.
Speaker 1 (46:19):
That is awesome, Lloyd.
Thank you so much for coming onand sharing your story with us.
I feel like I learned so muchjust by listening to your
journey, which has been a prettydiverse from you know UK, as a
lawyer, interior design to therestaurant management, to now
running your own thing to thefarm.
(46:39):
I mean, it is just so rich withexperience.
Speaker 2 (46:43):
And.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
I so appreciate you taking the time to share it with
us.
Speaker 2 (46:46):
Believe me, that was the abbreviated version, so it
was very succinct.
You know, 20 or 30 years intoan hour.
There's so many more things Iwould like to discuss, but you
have to choose points, I suppose, which are the most poignant,
and I think I've done it today.
Speaker 1 (47:05):
Today's key takeaways Dyslexia and learning
differences.
Don't define your ceiling.
You can absolutely learn how tolearn.
It just might not look liketraditional schooling.
Find the way you learn best andbuild from there.
If you hand the reins to theright manager, while supporting
(47:26):
them and empowering them, theyemotionally buy in.
In other words, they'll treatit like it's theirs.
That pride shows up in theday-to-day.
Empowerment isn't hands-off,it's a well-framed freedom.
So before you delegate, makesure they can handle it.
Not everyone's wired forleadership.
(47:49):
Give them a clear framework.
What's the goal, what's therole and how do we get from A to
B?
Surround them with a supportiveteam and tools to succeed.
First impressions matter.
You can often tell if someone'sa fit the moment they walk in.
Watch their energy, how theycarry themselves and how they
(48:11):
connect with people right away.
A great manager should be ableto wear multiple hats.
They should be the best waiter,the best bartender, the best
barista, someone who lifts theroom and keeps things moving
smoothly, and that spark intheir eyes that matters
Communication presence and thatbit of light.
(48:34):
That's hospitality at its best.
Staff smart by balancing wageswith function.
Quiet times shouldn't bleedcash, but busy times need
coverage.
Honeymoon periods don't lastunless you make them.
You've got two to three monthsof customer grace.
(48:54):
Extend it by nailing foodservice consistency, menu and
vibe every single day.
Three things are key whenhiring or training Make sure
they get the culture.
Make sure they know what youwant from them and make sure
they understand their role.
Know what kind of a place yourun.
(49:16):
Are you a bar that serves foodor a restaurant that serves
drinks?
That changes everything fromyour margins to your staff
structure and overall approach.
Some locations just don't workand that's okay.
You can copy everything teamconcept, hours and it still
(49:36):
might flop.
Be willing to walk away.
Don't let pride get in the wayof making smart financial
decisions.
The space matters and yourinteriors should make customers
feel good.
It's not just about what's onthe plate.
It's the full experience, thefood service atmosphere, the way
(49:57):
they're greeted and the waythey're sent off.
As an employer, show up withyour best efforts every day.
Every day is a chance to raisethe bar.
Hospitality isn't a side hustle.
If you're opening a restaurant,know it'll take everything from
you at the start.
(50:17):
Be ready.
Trust your team, but buildsystems.
You don't want staff feelingwatched all the time, but you do
need to track your numbers,notice patterns and stay in
control without hovering.
Happy staff, make happycustomers, watch body language.
(50:37):
If something's off, ask, showyou care.
Culture starts behind thescenes.
Managers should put fires out,not start them.
Employees need to feelsupported by their managers and
your managers need to feelsupported by you.
Empathy is a skill you canbuild, but you have to
(51:02):
experience it, practice it anduse it daily, in and out of work
.
And lastly, don't worry.
Everything is going to be okay.
Trust your gut.
Most people are amazing.
Stay open, stay grounded andjust keep showing up.
That's it for today.
I release episodes once a week,so come back and check it out.
(51:25):
Have a great day.
Welcome to how I Built my Small Business.
I'm Anne McGinty, your host,and today we have Lloyd Rooney
sharing his journey from leavingthe traditional schooling
system at 12 due to dyslexia,learning how he learned best, to
bartending in the UK and nowowner operating multiple
(00:30):
restaurants in New Zealandemploying over 135 people.
Lloyd is the co-founder of theJetson Group, a collection of
distinctive restaurants in NewZealand.
The Key sp spelled Q-U-A-YNumber 8, loco and the Cove Cafe
.
I had the chance to meet Lloydand Mike during a recent stop at
(00:53):
the Cove Cafe, and I was strucknot only by their approach to
hospitality, but also theirbusiness philosophies, ones that
blend creativity, strategy anda deep respect for community and
locally sourced ingredients.
We dive into thebehind-the-scenes decisions that
have fueled their restaurantsuccess, with a focus in this
(01:17):
episode on the Cove Cafe inWaipu, which is highly seasonal.
At that one location, his staffswells from 16 year round to 45
employees for the summer months.
Lloyd shares the challenges ofgrowing in the hospitality
industry and how his uniquebackground has influenced his
(01:38):
approach.
You can find a link through tothe Cove Cafe and the Jetson
Group in the episode'sdescription.
A link through to the Cove Cafeand the Jetson Group in the
episode's description.
A quick favor before we getstarted and this means the world
to me If you enjoy this episode, or have enjoyed any episode,
(01:58):
could you do me a quick favor?
Share it with just one personin your life who might love it
too?
If each of you did that, we'dinstantly double our
listenership overnight, allowingus to continue bringing you
more incredible guests andcontinue producing content that
inspires and empowers you.
Just one episode to one person.
(02:19):
I massively appreciate it.
Lloyd, it's great to see you.
Thanks for coming on the show.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Thanks for having me.
I'm looking forward to this.
It's my first podcast, so let'sgo for it.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
Well, so I had the opportunity to chat with your
partner, mike, when we were atthe Cove Cafe the other week,
and I was pretty impressed bywhat I learned of your story.
So I'm really looking forwardto hearing more, and I was
wondering if, looking back, youcould tell us what some of the
key experiences were that shapedyour path to where you are
(02:54):
today.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
So I think for human beings we are the sum of all our
parts.
I suppose in many ways my wholelife has shaped where I am
today.
Growing up in a very poorfamily, I was young as a six.
I had a black sister, a dotbefore I was born, a Muslim
sister-in-law, a Thaisister-in-law.
So a very large, multiculturalfamily.
(03:17):
Very poor, large, multiculturalfamily, and I was dyslexic.
As the youngest of the six kids, nobody else in the family was
apart from me.
I ended up growing into somebodythat I never thought I would
have done when I was a child,but mum took me out of school
(03:39):
when I was 12 and I was taughtat home and that had a massive
impact on me because I learnedto learn for myself and I think
that was a massive gift.
That mum gave me was theability to learn for myself, and
it shaped everything I did fromthen on.
So I went to university becauseI learned to learn for myself.
(04:00):
I did my law conversion course,called a CPE, because I learned
to learn for myself, and then Idid my law finals and I learned
to learn for myself.
I did my law conversion course,called a CPE, because I learned
to learn for myself, and then Idid my law finals and I learned
to learn for myself.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Okay, but so you studied law.
How does that translate intobecoming a restaurateur?
Speaker 2 (04:18):
You know what I actually love studying law but I
hated being a lawyer.
It was something that it justdidn't sit with me at all.
You know, being a lawyer andgoing to sing a law firm every
day just wasn't my gig and Iknew it and it wasn't what I was
born to do and I knew it Everytime I got on the tube to go to
(04:38):
work and I saw my reflection inthe glass of the tube.
I didn't recognize myself,reflection in the glass of the
tube.
I didn't recognize myself.
But saying that having thatlegal background has been a
tremendous help to me everysingle day with running a
business, because I'm abledefinitely to problem solve and
solve issues before they becomea big issue and before I need to
(05:00):
spend money on lawyers fees.
So I'm already kind of thinkingfive steps ahead when I'm
working every day.
So having that legal backgroundhas been a tremendous help.
Speaker 1 (05:10):
How did you then get your foot in the door with
hospitality?
Speaker 2 (05:14):
So when I was in my law finals or my CPE course, I
got a job working as a waiter ina restaurant called Capital
Ancsi in Camden Town and then Iwent on to manage a pub called
the Engineer in Primrose Hill.
It was owned by LaurenceLeVay's daughter, tamza LeVay,
and Abigail Osborne, and it wasmy kind of real taste of running
(05:38):
a restaurant.
And one thing Abby and Tamtaught me which I think is
really important is theybasically left the restaurant
for myself and Claire, the othermanager, to run as if it was
ours and we I think weemotionally bought into it.
We loved it and they had theknowledge that we were running
it for them in the best capacitythat we could do.
(06:00):
So that was my first sort ofstep into hospitality was the
Engineer One of London's firstgastropubs and probably the most
successful gastropub in Londonat the time.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
They gave you a lot of autonomy to just figure
things out Huge.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
Huge, a massive amount of autonomy, and it's
something which I've taken fromme with my restaurants, in that
I have given the staff who workfor me the same autonomy and I
think it's probably the biggestingredient to my success.
I know it's the biggestingredient to their success
because they couldn't run theengineer, abby got married and
(06:34):
had children and Tamsin also gotmarried and so they weren't in
a position to run a hospitalityvenue which was 11 in the
morning to 11 at night, to run ahospitality venue which was 11
in the morning to 11 at night.
And them empowering us gave usthe ability to really, really,
really, really get our teethinto it.
And I've taken the same essencefrom them and I've given it to
(06:55):
my staff and I think that'swhat's definitely empowered me
to open.
At one point I had sevenrestaurants and I couldn't have
done that if I didn't have staffthat I empowered to run it for
me.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
And when you were given that position and autonomy
, what key lessons do you thinkthat you learned beyond how
important it was for you andyour team to have that autonomy
Like what did you learn aboutthe actual management or the
running of a successful businessthat translated over when you
(07:24):
eventually branched off on yourown?
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Yeah, I think that for me, when I empower the staff
, before I empower them, I needto know that they can take that
power, that they can take theautonomy and they can run with
it.
I think that's a big gift is toknow who has the ability to
take on that role and beautonomous and those that don't.
(07:49):
And I also think it's reallyimportant with empowering people
is that you give them a reallystrong framework to work within.
So they have this autonomy, butthey have a really good
framework around them and agreat team that supports them
and helps them deliver what weneed to deliver.
I think the framework is reallyimportant with autonomy.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
What do you mean when you say framework?
Is this like a training thatthey go through?
Speaker 2 (08:14):
No, I think when I say framework is that they have
a really clear understanding ofwhat their role is, what we need
to achieve and how we achieve.
It is what I mean by framework,and I think you know you
basically kind of give them anoutline, a sketch of what the
restaurant is and what we needto do to get from A to B to
deliver the product that we needto deliver.
(08:35):
And of course, you know, at theend of the day we can only
deliver that product if we'vegot the team around you.
So you give them a really goodframework, a really good sketch
of what it is that we need to do, and then you give them the
team around them and the toolsto achieve it.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
How did you learn how to hire the right team?
Is this just like trial anderror, like where did you get
most of this learning from?
Speaker 2 (08:58):
I think it's definitely experience when I had
my own restaurant in Londoncalled the Duke of York.
So when I left the engineeringI set my own restaurant called
Duke of York in St John's Wood.
I had a business partner,brendan, and Brendan always said
to me he can tell when someonewalks through the door whether
or not they're going to be agood fit.
And I think, you know, it'spart about their presence, it's
(09:19):
part about their energy, it'spart about how they interact
with you when they first enterthe room, and I think that's a
massive part because, of course,the most important thing for me
is when I'm looking for a staffmember is that they can
interact with the customers in away that I am happy and I feel
(09:39):
confident about.
So, yeah, I think the, you know, interaction between you and
the potential staff member isthe biggest key to begin with,
and I think everything justgrows legs from there on.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Yeah, communication, and then also hospitality.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
Yes, I always say a restaurant manager has to be the
best waiter, the best maitre d', the best barista and the best
bartender, because you need tobe able to walk into the
restaurant and just pick upevery single piece and run with
it.
So I always say it's reallyimportant with managers that
they can do every single part ofwhat that puzzle and what that
(10:16):
piece is, but also they have tohave that communication skills,
that light in their eyes.
You know, when you walk in andyou have just this person on the
front door that has this energyand this light.
That's what you need.
You need them to be able to doall the parts and have this
energy and light about them thatjust makes them a joy to be
(10:38):
able to interact with.
When I look at the staff, I canwalk into my restaurant and see
who are the ones that I can justsee are actually resonating and
those that aren't.
You know, and of course noteverybody is a magic star, but
you try and get as many peopleof those stars as you can.
I go into the, into myrestaurant the key in Fongaree
the other day and there's thisFrench waiter there and he just
(10:59):
has this energy about thisamazing light, this engagement
with people, that's incredible.
And I just look at that andthink yeah, that's what you're
looking for.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Okay, so take us from the UK to you, arriving in New
Zealand.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
Okay.
So that was a massive path.
So I had a restaurant in the UK, in London, called Duke of York
in St John's Wood, but I alsohad an interior design store as
well.
So I was an interior designer.
I fall into most things in mylife.
I fell into restaurants, youknow.
I trained to be a lawyer butfell into restaurants, which was
a side hustle to earn money tobe a lawyer with, and I kind of
(11:37):
fell into being an interiordesigner as well.
I had this interior design shopin Islington called Revel Lloyd
and I won in Chelsea the samename and I started just
basically buying furniture andselling it.
And then I just fell intointeriors and someone one day
said to me oh, can you design myhouse?
And I was like sure I candesign your house.
(11:58):
So I ended up being an interiordesigner and I had some really
lovely clients.
I did Dido's house because shelived in Islington, and I did
some work for Kevin Spacey, whobought a place in Westminster
Bridge Road, and then I met Mikeand he was a farmer in New
Zealand and I ended up crazilyjumping on the plane and
arriving in New Zealand into theheart of the Waikato, onto a
(12:21):
farm, and I'd never set foot ona farm in my life before, you
know, and I'd swapped sellingfurniture to Dido, to swelling
out the pigs, you know I saw.
I swapped Westminster BridgeRoad, where Ken Spacey used to
live, to being in the calves.
It was a massive transition andit wasn't a small bit of land,
it was 10 square kilometers, itwas 2,500 acres.
(12:43):
And there was the three of usthere's me, mike and Kev and my
job was to look after the calvesand rear the calves, and one
year we reared 1,000 calves, soit wasn't a small farm.
And so, yeah, that was mytransition to New Zealand, from
doing interior design to crazilyworking on a farm.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
Oh my gosh, I have just a vision of what that must
have been like for you, but youmade it work.
So how long did this farm Seven?
Speaker 2 (13:09):
years Okay, seven years and I never really loved
it.
It didn't fulfill me in a waythat I wanted to be fulfilled on
a daily basis, but I definitelygot a better understanding of
animals and our place on thisplanet in a bizarre kind of way.
You know, when you'resurrounded by animals every
(13:32):
single day, in a capacity whereyou're caring for them every
single day, moving them, youknow, moving from paddock to
paddock and making sure they'vegot grass and making sure
they've got water, making surethey're healthy, and I
definitely got a deeperunderstanding of how we fit in.
My friend, amber, always saidto me, always said you're like a
diet potato.
He said I can plant youanywhere in your sprout and in
(14:00):
some ways I think I've thrownmyself in something 100% to make
it work.
But then when I was offered theability to do a restaurant
again I jumped at it.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
And how were you offered the opportunity to do a
restaurant again?
Speaker 2 (14:09):
So I mean, I never thought I'd be back in
restaurant when I sold the Dukeof York and I moved away from
restaurants and more intointeriors, I thought that was my
hospo career done.
But a friend of mine, ian, whoowned the local gym in Pukakuri
where I used to go, and I becamevery good friends with him and
his wife Tracy.
They had a part share in arestaurant in Waipu Cove called
(14:30):
the Two Fish Cafe and the chefwho was working there wasn't
enjoying it and I don't thinkparticularly was doing a good
job, and so when they said thatthey were looking at getting out
, I kind of spied opportunityand I jumped at it and I got in
the car and I drove up to WaipuCove and it was a rainy, wet day
.
It was July, our winter, therain was horizontal and I walked
(14:54):
into this building and itcalled to me.
It just resonated with me and Ithought, hmm, I like this, I
like this spot, I likeeverything about it.
I love the bar, I love theoutlook.
It's on the beach.
Who couldn't love the outlook?
You know, you know you're atthe Cove, it's the most
beautiful, beautiful, beautifullocation.
And I looked at what Trent wasdoing in terms of figures and in
(15:16):
terms of number of covers a dayand thought to myself if he's
breaking even on that, I couldturn it around and make money.
And so I did and I jumped at it.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
Can you tell us what it is that you saw when you
looked at the numbers and you'relike I can do better than this
or I can improve here and there.
What did you do?
What changes did you make whenyou took over?
Speaker 2 (15:33):
Well, first of all, he's only open five days a week,
so he was closed on Tuesdaysand Wednesdays and I thought, ok
, I'll change that number one.
Number two there was noconsistency to the opening hours
when he was open.
So if it was a quiet night he'dclose at six o'clock.
It's a no-no.
You never do that.
You have to be consistent withwhat you're giving to a customer
(15:53):
.
They need to know they can comedown and come to the Cove and
you're going to be open when yousay you're going to be open.
And so I gave the restaurantmore consistency, both with
opening times and with itsopening days.
We were open seven days a weekand we're open from nine in the
morning to eight o'clock atnight.
Come winter, come summer, inthe summer we open at eight, an
hour earlier, but I never, ever,close before 8 pm, because even
(16:17):
if it's a rainy, wet night, Iwant people to know that they
can come to the Cove and we'llbe open when we say we're going
to be open.
So I definitely gave it somemore consistency in its opening
hours and more consistency withthe product that we were going
to deliver as well.
So I employed a team of chefs.
I employed a team of chefs.
I employed a front of houseteam.
I knew that would cost me interms of a wage bill, but I knew
(16:38):
that the long-term benefit wasgoing to be a much better
product, much more consistentopening hours and a restaurant
that people knew that they couldgo to if they wanted to go to
it and would always be there.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
And did you have any guidelines as to like how much
you were willing to spend ofyour potential revenue in order
to cover this new team and tostay open the hours that you
wanted to?
Speaker 2 (17:02):
I think with any small business, the biggest cost
to you is going to be wages.
That's the biggest, biggest,biggest cost.
So you always have to be reallymindful of that wage bill.
But you also can't run yourbusiness without wages, without
staff.
So there's always going to bethis dichotomy between giving
(17:24):
your business the ability tofunction and what is the balance
between the functionality andthe cost constraint.
So we kind of opened up with aminimal team but a really strong
team.
And I was there and I was avery good waiter when I was
running the engineer and KevinLancy so I knew that I was two
people and I had a reallyamazing manager in Siobhan and I
(17:47):
had a great head chef in Craigas well who was a chef at the
time.
So you know, I kind of openedup with a really good, strong
team.
It was a small team but it wasa strong team.
But it was also a lot morestaff than the previous owner
had.
I had five floor staff and Ihad three in the kitchen and I
knew that's what I needed tomake it work, so that if it was
(18:09):
quiet I wasn't hemorrhaging cash, but if it was busy we could
all step up and we could makesure that we were able to
deliver the products to thecustomer that came through the
doors.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
How long did it take before you felt Instantly?
Speaker 2 (18:21):
Wow, yeah, I think when you open a new business,
there's always that honeymoonperiod.
It's a new restaurant in townpeople are going to go.
Traditionally, when you open arestaurant and have that
honeymoon period, you're goingto be busy for the first two or
three months whilst people comeand try you out.
The difficult part is makingthat honeymoon period not a
(18:42):
honeymoon period but theconsistent period that's going
to sustain you for the monthsand years to come.
So I opened up in November,which is our spring in New
Zealand, and I knew thatDecember, january and February
were going to be busy because itwas a summer period.
The difficulty for me was howdo I make March through to
(19:02):
November something that's goingto work long term?
But I think what happened waswe did such a great job when we
opened in our honeymoon periodthat we were able to take those
customers that were the localsand the regulars who were really
impressed with the quality offood, the menu, the service and
(19:23):
the general atmosphere and theykept coming back.
So it's important to make surethat honeymoon period isn't just
a honeymoon period but itextends as long as you can
extend it for hopefullyindefinitely.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
You have seasonal fluctuations, as I expect that
most would, so can you give usan idea of what the range is
that you could expect in revenuefrom the slow end to the most
popular day?
Speaker 2 (19:47):
Okay, slow day $2,500 .
Busy day $55,000.
So you go from a two and a halfgrand day to a fifty five
thousand dollar day.
That is the biggest challengefor a business which is as
seasonal as ours.
How do we transform?
How do we, how are we able togo from that to that and
(20:11):
upscaling your business and, Imay add, downscaling the
business.
That's the biggest key to yoursuccess is being able to make
sure that you can make hay wherethe sun shines and really
upscale your business to takeadvantage of those really busy
summer months.
And then how do you thendownscale the business so that
(20:33):
you're not hemorrhaging the cashthat you make in the summer
during your winter period?
So you know, yeah, it's amassive fluctuation and you've
got to get it right to make surethat your business can operate
within those extremes andoperate really, really, really
well.
I mean, the more popular we'vegot and the bigger we've got, I
think in some ways has becomemore of a challenge because we
(20:57):
need to make sure that we reallydeliver, and so what ends up
happening is, during the winterI do have a much stronger team,
because I want to keep thatreally strong core team and I
want to be able to take theminto the summer and then just
bring on all the added help totake us to those $55,000,
$50,000, $60,000 days, all theadded help to take us to those
$55,000, $50,000, $60,000 days.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
Can you give us more clarity on exactly how you
manage this staffing andoperations to handle these big,
drastic ebbs and flows?
What's the size of your teamyear round?
And then, what is it in thepeak?
Speaker 2 (21:27):
Great, great question .
So the size of the team yearround.
So in the winter we still haveprobably 15, 16 full-time
members of staff.
That would be probably eight ornine front of house and about
six or seven in the kitchen,eight in the kitchen.
So we still have a reallystrong core during the winter
(21:48):
and that, I think, is a massivepart to our success.
Because what happens is in thesummer, when you have that short
three month recruitment, whenyou absorb staff into your
restaurant, the biggest key isto get them to assimilate the
culture, get them to understandwhat you want them to deliver
and get them to understand whattheir role is, all within a very
(22:10):
short, short space time.
And so we have a massiverecruitment stage during the
December period.
So getting the staff trained upduring that period without
costing you a huge amount ofmoney to do so is the key to
having a very successful summer.
We can go from 16, for example,during the winter to about 40
(22:32):
during the summer.
We have about 45 members ofstaff during the summer period.
And how do we go from 16 to 40,45?
And we train them up and youassimilate them into the company
.
You get them to understand whatthe culture is, and then
deliver a product, and then,equally, they start dropping off
again between February andMarch.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
And you're specifically talking about the
Cove Cafe, the one restaurantright now.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
I'm talking about the Cove but also the Quay.
The Quay is another restaurantwe have in Whangarei which is
nowhere near as seasonal as theCove because it's based in a
town and it's not based by thebeach.
So we have quite a largepopulation, not large by your
standards but by New Zealandstandards.
We've got 100,000 people wholive in Whangarei.
So that's quite a big town forus in New Zealand and having
(23:16):
100,000 people on your doorstepis great at sustaining your
business during both the winterand the summer.
So the key doesn't nearly asfluctuate as the Cove.
But to give you dollar turnoversin terms of fluctuations, for
us in Whangarei the key, ourquiet day will be $8,000, $9,000
, and our busy day will be$40,000.
So it's not quite the ebbs andflows that the Cove has, but it
(23:39):
still fluctuates, not quite aseasonal.
We still have great winters,you know, but there's still a
seasonality to it.
We have a lot of tourists comethrough during the summer.
So there's definitely aseasonality to the key.
And I've also got number eightin the town, based in Fongray,
and I've got Loco and once againthey have the same seasonality,
not quite like the Cove, butstill you have to be able to
upskill and then drop staff offas you go through from summer to
(24:03):
winter.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
Do you maintain the same margin across all of them?
Speaker 2 (24:08):
Yeah, yeah.
So I don't think the one's morelucrative.
I think that Loco is our SouthAmerican restaurant, but you
know what?
The Cove the Key and numbereight, they're restaurants and
then we serve alcohol.
Loco, it's a bar that servesfood and it's definitely a
psychological switch and this isshowing through revenue.
(24:29):
So, for example, with the Covethe Key and with number eight,
it's about 70-30 split marginwise You've got 70% on food, 30%
on alcohol.
At L eight, it's about 70-30split margin-wise You've got 70%
on food, 30% on alcohol.
At Loco, it's the other wayaround.
It's a 70-30 split, but infavor of the bar.
Margins on alcohol tend to bebetter than on food because of
course it's so much morelabor-intensive putting a menu
together and delivering acrossthe pass, as it is to making a
(24:51):
cocktail which is simply puttinga few spirits into a shaker and
shaking it up.
So loco definitely has theability to be more lucrative.
But bars don't tend to have thesame patronage that a
restaurant has, because whatpeople need to eat.
So restaurants tend to havebetter patronage but potentially
(25:13):
a slightly less margin thanbars that have a higher margin
but less patronage.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
Yeah, that does make a lot of sense, and I know over
here we're experiencing a littlebit of a cultural shift as well
, with the younger generationchoosing not to drink as much.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:28):
So would you agree that?
Over here I've talked withother restaurant owners and I
hear a profit margin around the20 to 23% range.
I've heard some people saylower than that.
Very rarely ever heard peoplesay higher than that.
But then people that I know whoown bars say that alcohol has
like a 400% margin.
(25:49):
Would you agree with these?
Speaker 2 (25:51):
No, I don't think alcohol has quite that margin,
not over here.
We have a lot of taxes on ouralcohol so we don't have the
margin anywhere near that sortof margin for alcohol For our
food.
Yeah, I think we work on 30% atthe end of the gate for us is
what we work on.
We try and get our cost ofsales about 68%, 70% for us the
cost of sales and it ends upbeing almost the same for
(26:13):
alcohol over here.
It's about maybe slightlyhigher, but then again your wage
bill should be less becauseyou're just opening a bottle.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
Well, your 30% margin as a restaurant sounds like a
pretty high.
That's pretty good from whatI've heard Across your four
locations, or maybe you want toeven consider all seven that
you've had.
What have you learned, both thegood and the bad, Like what
works and what did you try thatdidn't work.
Speaker 2 (26:41):
So you can pick up the cove and you can move it to
a venue very similar three hoursdown the road and it just
doesn't work.
And I think that's somethingwhich I've learned is that for
some reason, whatever you do,that dinner soquat is missing
and it just doesn't fly.
And there's no reason for it.
(27:02):
You know, we did a restaurantin Mount Monganui.
We spent a lot of money on thefit out the restaurant, millions
on the fit out the restaurant,thinking that it would be a
massive success.
It was a huge venue, empty andthere's no other reason.
A great location tick.
We took the key staff from theCove and the Quay tick.
We had almost the same menu andthe same wine list as the Cove
(27:25):
and the Quay tick, but for somereason it didn't resonate.
And I think that's somethingwhich is universal in
hospitality.
I mean, you know, Jamie Olivercan set up a restaurant in one
town and it flies and in anothertown it flops.
The same with Gordon Ramsay.
There's no other reason of whysometimes it works and sometimes
it doesn't.
You can give it all theingredients, but there's just
(27:47):
that one thing that is missingand you don't know what it is.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
It just doesn't resonate that is interesting, I
wonder.
I wonder if anybody's reallyfigured out the formula behind
it.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
No, I don't think so.
I think with all chains, someof their outlets absolutely go
gangbusters and there'll be somewhich just don't and the others
were supporting it.
You know, it's just sometimesthings work and sometimes they
don't, and I think if we had themagic understanding of why they
didn't work, every singlehospital eventually you did
(28:21):
would be a massive success.
But they're not, that's so true,and you give them all the
ingredients, you give them allthe framework, all the support,
everything to make it work, andsometimes it just doesn't it
just doesn't yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
So, looking back, is there anything that you would
have done differently?
Speaker 2 (28:39):
I would have done differently, I would have pulled
the plug earlier.
It's hard to do sometimes.
I think that's my biggestfailure is I just think this
time next year we'll turn itaround.
What I've learned is thatsometimes when the business
isn't performing and it hasn'tperformed, it's not going to
(29:03):
work and I can throw everythingat it and it's not going to work
.
And I think that is the biggestthing that I've learned is that
I've got to learn to pull theplug, not within four years of
it not working, but within 12months of it not working,
because your first loss is yourbest loss, you know, and don't
let pride get in the way ofmaking the right financial
business decisions.
Speaker 1 (29:20):
Okay, so just focusing on the Cove Cafe,
because we've been talking aboutthat one already and then we
just have some continuity.
What do you think the magic isabout that place?
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Location, location, location.
It is by the beach, so it'skind of, you know, we have a
really relaxed, surfy sort ofvibe to the place, which
everyone loves.
But we just seem to haveconnected with this audience in
a way that I would never haveimagined.
And the same with the Quay inFongare as well, but for
different reasons.
(29:53):
People just love it and itseems to have this energy about
it, this goodwill about it fromeveryone who comes in.
They just think, wow, thisplace is amazing.
The staff are always on point,they're always friendly, it's
always busy.
It just has an energy and avibe about it that just people
(30:14):
love and are attracted to.
So, yeah, I think that a bigpart of the Cove's success is
its connection with its audience, its connection with its locals
, its connection with itstourists, its passers-by, and it
seems to tick the box for somany different groups of people.
I mean, young adults love it.
They love coming in and havinga smoothie and watching the surf
(30:35):
.
Old people love it because theylove the menu and they love the
staff.
Families love it because it'skids-friendly.
You're by a campground that has2,500 people in it, so we have
to be open to everyone who comesin, whoever they're going to be
, our market share is so huge.
It's from the very rich,affluent people from Langs Beach
who have multi-million dollarhouses, to the mums and dads and
(30:56):
kids who are camping at thecampground next door.
So when I set the Cove up, Iwanted to do a menu that
definitely ticked the boxes forall those groups of people, and
we did that, and so the reasonwhy the Cove, I think, is so
popular is it just ticks the boxin so many levels, and the quay
in Fongare is by the marina andit has the same sort of
goodwill and love in the area.
(31:16):
People love the quay and onceagain, with the menu, with the
key, I wanted to be able to besomewhere that people could go
for a date night but could alsocome in and have a muffin and a
coffee.
So it has a menu that ticksmany boxes of many people.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
Well, when you were talking about the Cove I was
wondering oh, is it that it's acaptured audience and that
there's not a whole lot ofcompetition right there?
But then you're saying that theQuay does equally or similarly
as well, and that's in the townbasin.
So that argument would notnecessarily have any proof, I
(31:51):
guess, or evidence.
Speaker 2 (31:52):
You know, I definitely think that you
touched on the point about theCove's location in terms of it
being the only place in town andyeah, it is the only place in
town.
But I never took advantage ofthat.
I never thought to myself youknow what?
It's the only place in town,where else are they going to go?
I never, ever thought.
That was never an ethos behindmy business with the Cove.
It was always how can wedeliver, how can we elevate, how
(32:13):
can we provide the best food,the best service every single
day?
No, no matter what happens andI think that's something which
has been a key to the success isthat we didn't just rest on our
laurels and think to ourselveswell, we're the only place in
town and with the key in Fongore, yeah, you're right, it's a
very different beast, it's a lotmore competition.
But once again, we just get upevery day and say how can we
(32:34):
make it better?
And I think with business,you've got to say to yourself
how do I make it better?
Every single day and we doevery single week or every
single month, when we have amenu change, we think how can we
elevate it this time so that wecan just make it better.
Speaker 1 (32:50):
And how much impact do you think that the design and
the ambiance play into theJetson group's success?
Speaker 2 (32:58):
I mean that's so important.
I keep forgetting about thatno-transcript.
(33:32):
Having that interior thatpeople will walk into and enjoy
and as their comfort and totheir experience with us is so
important Because, you know,going out for dinner for most
people is an experience and noteveryone can afford to go out
for dinner every week.
Some people it's once a month,some people it's once a year for
their birthday, and you need tomake sure that when they come
in that it's a whole experience.
(33:53):
It's the environment, it's thefood, it's the service, it's the
atmosphere, it's the greeting,the goodbye, everything has to
align so that they really doenjoy their experience with us,
because it's an experience.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
What do you say is your ultimate goal, like where
do you see the Jetson Group infive years?
Where would you like it to go?
What are you hoping for?
Speaker 2 (34:16):
Yeah, I think when I first set the Jetson Group up I
never set it up to have.
I think when I first set theJackson Group up, I never set it
up to have many, many, manyrestaurants.
But you know, sometimes fateweaves a little weave and we had
a logo that actually was quitetransferable.
It was four letters in a circleand so if we wanted to expand
with our logo, the expansion wassomething that we could do.
(34:38):
We could simply change the fourletters, which we did.
So the cove is four letters.
The key did so the Cove is fourletters.
The Quay is four letters, locois four letters.
At the Mount we had fire, itwas four letters.
We had the Dune in Mungify fourletters.
I didn't anticipate expanding,but then, when I expanded to the
Quay and I realised that Icould transfer the Cove to the
(34:58):
Quay and I could run tworestaurants successfully
simultaneously and both of themwere hugely successful, I
thought I could take thisthrough the country.
You know, I could take thesefour letters and I could take
this experience that we offerpeople throughout New Zealand
and that's why I set the tworestaurants up in the Mount
Magnawee, fire and Number 8, andI set the Dune up, and then I
set Number 8 up in Fongrae andthen Loco.
(35:18):
But where are we going to be infive years time?
I did have an idea of expansionsouthwards.
At the moment that's come to astop.
I think I've got quitecomfortable with the four and at
the moment they are successfuland they are able to provide
staff with a great wage and agreat job security and job
(35:38):
satisfaction.
It provides me with a greatincome.
So at the moment I can say I'm55.
Now I don't know, do I have theenergy to do more?
At the moment I don't.
That might change in two yearstime.
I might get another rush andthink actually I want to do four
more down the country, but atthe moment I'm just happy with
four.
Speaker 1 (35:56):
And if anybody is listening in and is also a
restaurateur maybe theirrestaurant isn't doing as well
as yours is, or maybe there'ssomebody listening in who wants
to open something what advicewould you give to them?
Speaker 2 (36:08):
Okay.
So the ones that aren't doingso well, it's always a tough
game.
It is a tough game and you'reonly as good as you are before
the next new restaurant opens intown and you know you're always
fighting for that market share.
It's difficult, but you've justgot to remember that every
single day you've got to providethe best that you can provide,
(36:29):
otherwise it's never going towork.
So make sure that you providethe best you can do every single
day.
And for those who want to getinto hospo, it's a full-time job
and you live and breathe it.
And for me, I'm now very lucky.
I've been doing it.
I've had the code for 10 yearsand they run themselves
literally.
I went down yesterday and I wasjust a spare part.
I thought I'll go down fornight service.
(36:50):
I was there half an hour.
I thought I'm in the way, I'lljust go home and that's a lovely
privileged position to be in.
You know, I'm in a position nowwhere I don't have to be there
every single day.
I love to be there and I alwaysgo in every single day just so
that I can cast my eyes acrossand make sure that everything's
tickety boo.
But for those who are startingout.
When you first start out, it'sa 24 hour, seven day a week
(37:12):
venture and if you haven't gotthe energy to do that, don't do
it, because it's going to takeeverything from you to make it
work in the beginning.
Speaker 1 (37:20):
I do know what you're talking about, just from
friends of ours who are in thesame industry.
I wanted to ask you about justhow you've kept your pulse on
the team as it's grown so muchand you've gotten to this point
where you don't need to be there.
How do you make sure that thereisn't any theft, that everyone
(37:42):
is showing up and doing the bestthat they can?
What's the hierarchy with, likehow you handle these operations
?
Speaker 2 (37:50):
That's always a really good question.
Theft, you know what.
At the end of the day, you justhave to trust people, and I
know it's a really hard thing tosay.
You have to trust people, butyou do.
You can't have eyes on earsover everything all of the time.
For me, the way that I operateis first of all, I can go into
(38:10):
the restaurant and I could lookat a situation or see how it's
functioning instantly.
That doesn't take long at all.
I can walk in somewhere andthink that isn't right or
actually that's actually going'sactually going bloody fantastic
.
I'm really happy with that.
I saw the engagement from thestaff to the customers.
That's on point.
I saw the food can wash thepast.
That's on point.
Takes five minutes.
I can walk out.
(38:30):
So keeping your finger on thepulse actually can be really,
really easy.
If it's simply a matter ofmaintaining what you've got In
terms of theft, that's adifferent ballgame.
I do trust the staff implicitly,which I think in some ways is a
good thing and a bad thing.
Good thing is that they knowthat there's complete trust in
them, because they could takestock out the back door and I'll
(38:53):
be none the wiser.
I don't even have cameras insome of my restaurants, you know
.
So it's simply hoping that I'verecruited well, that people are
going to treat me the same waythat I treat them.
But I do look for patterns.
So you know, I might not havecameras, but I look for patterns
in stock.
I look for patterns on the endof the report.
(39:14):
So I get end of the report fromevery restaurant every night
and I read through the end ofthe report and on the end of the
report I see variations betweenwhat we should have taken and
what we actually took.
That's one pattern I can monitor.
The second pattern I monitor iswhat comes in goes out.
I look for stock coming in andstock going out.
If I think to myself, that'sweird.
A lot of stocks have come inrecently but we don't seem to be
(39:35):
that busy.
That's another pattern that Ican look at.
They're very broad.
I grant you very broad patterns, but it's a pattern nonetheless
.
And, to be honest with you, Ikind of wouldn't want to run a
business that was run where itwas so managed that people felt
that they were being watched ornot trusted.
(39:57):
I think you have to be able totrust people, you have to let
them be themselves and you haveto be able to trust people, you
have to let them be themselvesand you have to let them feel
empowered and able to function.
But on the flip side I look forpatterns and that's how I can
try and keep some control on theend part of the business.
Speaker 1 (40:16):
Are you doing anything in particular to keep
your team happy and motivatedfor the success of the
businesses?
Speaker 2 (40:23):
Every day, every day.
I think that's so important.
Every day I will come into arestaurant and I look for
somebody who's not happy and Iask them why Every day?
I want the staff to be happy,every single day, and I do
anything to make that happen,because a happy staff is what
really makes a happy customer.
No one wants to come into arestaurant if the staff are
(40:45):
moping around and miserable.
You know it's crazy.
Every single day I think tomyself how can I make them happy
today?
What can I do to make it better?
I did little things, like I gaveLuke a little bonus the other
day because he'd worked so manyhours over the COVID over that
big summer period of those twoor three weeks, so I gave him a
three grand bonus because I justthought Masafi deserved it.
You know I pay for go down toAuckland and stay at a hotel.
(41:06):
I sent Milena on a woman'sretreat for three days.
Every single day I think aboutwhat I can do for the staff to
make them happy and justsometimes it's just talking to
them, say everything all right,what's gone wrong?
Okay, you know there was a girlwho working number eight,
feeling a bit of tension in herand another manager.
I sat down with her, I had achat with her.
Then I had a chat with him andsaid come on, guys, you know,
(41:26):
you've got to be able to worktogether and you've got to be
able to understand what it meansto make your team work.
And I always say for managersour job is to put fires out, not
start them.
So that's my biggest, biggest,biggest daily mantra with
managers.
They say, guys, our job is toput fires out, let's not start
them.
So I don't want you arguingwith the team, I want you
supporting the team and I wantyou empowering the team.
(41:46):
So I use managers to make surethe staff are empowered and
supported, and then I obviouslymake sure that managers feel
empowered and supported by me.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
That sounds like you're a great leader.
Speaker 2 (41:57):
Yeah, I am a good leader.
I'm sorry but I am.
It's definitely something whichI know is the reason for a big
part of the success is I'mreally good at my job and that
is making sure that we keep thatship stable and the ship has to
be stable at all times andthat's about, you know, maybe
some constantly putting in thesedifferent ways of making things
(42:19):
work, but just making sure thatthe staff are happy and that
they're content that they've gotsupport, they feel that they've
got leadership.
I step in when I need to stepin and I step out when I feel I
can step out.
So, yeah, I am very good at myjob.
That's definitely been a reasonwhy we're able to be in the
position we're in, where we'vegot four restaurants functioning
really, really well and I canstep back and support now from
(42:42):
the wings.
Speaker 1 (42:43):
So is this just part of your personality or is there
an experience that made you wantto be this type of a leader?
Did you read a book or take acourse?
Speaker 2 (42:52):
No, no book, no course.
I think in life everyexperience that you have will
shape you.
Abintam gave me the autonomy torun the engineer and I took
that with me so that when I cameto run my own restaurants I
gave the staff the same autonomy.
So that was something I learnedfrom my experience in terms of
managing staff.
I've got great empathy forpeople.
(43:14):
I remember when I did CampAmerica, which is where you go
and work a summer camp in theStates, and I did that when I
was 18, 19 years old andsuddenly I'd gone from being the
youngest of the family who'sbeing bullied, yet sport at the
same time.
I don't know how that works,but apparently it works Bullied
and sport at the same time Toworking in a summer camp and
looking after children.
And I worked for the SalvationArmy a summer camp in West
(43:36):
Virginia called Camp TomahawkGreat, great, great summer camp,
amazing job.
So much summer camp we did inAmerica, amazing job.
So they'd go around Baltimoreand DC this is where the
catchment was and pick up allthese kids off the street and
bring them to a camp.
And I learned empathy from thatexperience.
I learned to put somebody whowasn't a brother or a friend or
(44:00):
somebody I had any connectionwith above myself and which I
did.
You know we used to be given anallowance to spend at a tuck
shop and we had poor kids andI'd always give them my
allowance.
It meant more to them than itmeant to me and I think I
learned the empathy from that.
So, in terms of doing a course,I always think it's really
difficult.
I'm going to put myself out ona limb here.
It's like interior design.
You can't learn interior design.
(44:22):
I think it's something whichyou have to just develop an eye
for over a period of time isexperience about what mediums go
with mediums, you know, and Ithink it's the same with people
management.
I don't think you can learnpeople management.
I think it's something whichyou have to A have a really good
aptitude for B.
A have a really good aptitudefor B have some great
experiences which help youunderstand how to get the best
(44:43):
out of people.
And.
C just putting all of yourparts of yourself into
understanding what makes peopletick and get the best out of
people.
Empathy is something which isan important trait that we take
with us and hopefully learn anduse every day.
Speaker 1 (45:07):
It's very true and something we want to teach to
our kids.
So I just have one finalquestion, and this is a question
that I ask everybody.
It is unrelated to business,it's more of wisdom.
If you could sit down withyourself when you were in your
early twenties and have aconversation, what life wisdom
would you give yourself?
Speaker 2 (45:23):
First thing is don't worry, everything will be okay.
I think that's the mostimportant thing I'd say to
myself, because when you're 20,you're just always worried about
what the future is going tohold.
Where will I be, what will I do, what roof will I have on my
head?
So I think the most importantthing I say to myself, to a 20
year old, is don't worry,everything will be okay.
The second thing is trust yourgut, because it will play well
(45:47):
for you, far more than it won'tTrust your gut.
The next thing I say to myselfis and I love people.
I always have.
I love people.
I think people are amazing.
They make me laugh every singleday and, yeah, you can
sometimes you get somebody whotests that love for people, but
(46:10):
99.9% of the time I think peopleare amazing.
And I'll say to myself you knowwhat?
You're right, lloyd, people areamazing.
Remember that.
Speaker 1 (46:19):
That is awesome, Lloyd.
Thank you so much for coming onand sharing your story with us.
I feel like I learned so muchjust by listening to your
journey, which has been a prettydiverse from you know UK, as a
lawyer, interior design to therestaurant management, to now
running your own thing to thefarm.
(46:39):
I mean, it is just so rich withexperience.
Speaker 2 (46:43):
And.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
I so appreciate you taking the time to share it with
us.
Speaker 2 (46:46):
Believe me, that was the abbreviated version, so it
was very succinct.
You know, 20 or 30 years intoan hour.
There's so many more things Iwould like to discuss, but you
have to choose points, I suppose, which are the most poignant,
and I think I've done it today.
Speaker 1 (47:05):
Today's key takeaways Dyslexia and learning
differences.
Don't define your ceiling.
You can absolutely learn how tolearn.
It just might not look liketraditional schooling.
Find the way you learn best andbuild from there.
If you hand the reins to theright manager, while supporting
(47:26):
them and empowering them, theyemotionally buy in.
In other words, they'll treatit like it's theirs.
That pride shows up in theday-to-day.
Empowerment isn't hands-off,it's a well-framed freedom.
So before you delegate, makesure they can handle it.
Not everyone's wired forleadership.
(47:49):
Give them a clear framework.
What's the goal, what's therole and how do we get from A to
B?
Surround them with a supportiveteam and tools to succeed.
First impressions matter.
You can often tell if someone'sa fit the moment they walk in.
Watch their energy, how theycarry themselves and how they
(48:11):
connect with people right away.
A great manager should be ableto wear multiple hats.
They should be the best waiter,the best bartender, the best
barista, someone who lifts theroom and keeps things moving
smoothly, and that spark intheir eyes that matters
Communication presence and thatbit of light.
(48:34):
That's hospitality at its best.
Staff smart by balancing wageswith function.
Quiet times shouldn't bleedcash, but busy times need
coverage.
Honeymoon periods don't lastunless you make them.
You've got two to three monthsof customer grace.
(48:54):
Extend it by nailing foodservice consistency, menu and
vibe every single day.
Three things are key whenhiring or training Make sure
they get the culture.
Make sure they know what youwant from them and make sure
they understand their role.
Know what kind of a place yourun.
(49:16):
Are you a bar that serves foodor a restaurant that serves
drinks?
That changes everything fromyour margins to your staff
structure and overall approach.
Some locations just don't workand that's okay.
You can copy everything teamconcept, hours and it still
(49:36):
might flop.
Be willing to walk away.
Don't let pride get in the wayof making smart financial
decisions.
The space matters and yourinteriors should make customers
feel good.
It's not just about what's onthe plate.
It's the full experience, thefood service atmosphere, the way
(49:57):
they're greeted and the waythey're sent off.
As an employer, show up withyour best efforts every day.
Every day is a chance to raisethe bar.
Hospitality isn't a side hustle.
If you're opening a restaurant,know it'll take everything from
you at the start.
(50:17):
Be ready.
Trust your team, but buildsystems.
You don't want staff feelingwatched all the time, but you do
need to track your numbers,notice patterns and stay in
control without hovering.
Happy staff, make happycustomers, watch body language.
(50:37):
If something's off, ask, showyou care.
Culture starts behind thescenes.
Managers should put fires out,not start them.
Employees need to feelsupported by their managers and
your managers need to feelsupported by you.
Empathy is a skill you canbuild, but you have to
(51:02):
experience it, practice it anduse it daily, in and out of work
.
And lastly, don't worry.
Everything is going to be okay.
Trust your gut.
Most people are amazing.
Stay open, stay grounded andjust keep showing up.
That's it for today.
I release episodes once a week,so come back and check it out.
(51:25):
Have a great day.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com