May 20, 2025 • 23 mins
Florida Teacher
In this episode, Danielle Goodman from Florida joins Mirav to talk about the state of teaching. Florida is a difficult place to be a teacher: factors like low earnings and the cultural climate make a challenging job even harder. In spite of the challenges, countless educators choose to stay and make a difference in the lives of our nation's next generation. Tune in to learn more about teaching as a career and the nuanced story of America's teachers today.
Topics
00:36 Introduction
02:14 Necessary certifications and education
03:44 It's a full time job
04:19 Earnings for a teacher in Florida
06:55 Florida's teaching climate
08:19 Is it possible to be an agent of change as a teacher?
10:40 With all the challenges, why stay a teacher?
14:19 More on earnings
15:02 Biggest challenges
20:36 Ending on a high note: a story of success
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Music credit: Kate Pierson & Monica Nation
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
after covid, it was very.
You know, we were very mentalhealth, mental health well we're
not even allowed to talk aboutmental health anymore in florida
.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
There's no more hi and welcome back to how much can
I make.
I'm a curious journalist with apassion for exploring what
people do for a living.
This time I wanted to dig intowhat it's really like to be a
teacher in Florida.
Because all the new rules andregulations and all the stuff
(00:32):
we're hearing about in the newsI thought it would be
interesting.
So I contacted Danielle Goodmanshe's a Florida teacher of many
years to try and find out whatthe job is really like and is it
worth the paycheck.
So let's dive right in,danielle.
Thanks a lot for doing it.
First of all, my pleasure.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
I'm happy to be here.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
My first question is did you always want to be a
teacher?
Speaker 1 (00:56):
So I knew you were going to ask me that that's what
most people ask me, and theanswer is no.
I did not always want to be ateacher.
Teaching is actually a secondcareer for me.
I didn't start teaching until Iwas about 39.
Oh, so yeah, it was so how didit come?
about I was getting divorced andit was sink or swim time.
(01:18):
So my actual degree was inliberal arts and you know what
can you do with a liberal artsdegree?
So I spent a lot of time whenmy children were little in their
school volunteering PTA readingto the class, and I realized
this is something I did want todo, you know, at turning 40
(01:38):
years old.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Why?
Because you had small childrenand you're so important.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
I had small children and I just loved it.
I realized that I connectedwith the children.
So, no, when I was in collegeoriginally I didn't think about
education or teaching.
It was not even anywhere nearanything I wanted to do.
So being in the school system,having small children, immersing
myself in education, reallyshined a light on that aha
(02:05):
moment.
This actually is something Iwant to do.
However, I was 40, not 20.
So I found out what I had to do, because in public school, you
need the proper certification.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
This is what I want to know what kind of
certification do you need?
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Well, it's different now than it was 20 years ago.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
What is it now?
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Now it's a lot less rigorous because we have a
teaching shortage.
So, as it used to be, you hadto have a four-year degree, you
had certain certification testsyou had to take, you had
something called a generalknowledge test that you had to
pass, and it was much morerigorous where now they're
hiring students straight out ofhigh school to substitute and
(02:50):
quick, like a fast track towardsbecoming a teacher.
That's a problem, don't youthink it's a huge problem?
It's a huge problem.
When I was doing it.
I had to go back to school toget all this certification.
So here I was, this 40 year oldwoman getting divorced with
three little kids going back tocollege to take classes so I can
(03:10):
get certified and take allthese tests, and it took me
about two years.
I was substituting in themeantime at the private school
that my kids were going to andthen realizing, once I got
divorced, they could no longerattend private school and
shuffled them off to publicschool and started substituting
(03:31):
there and formed a relationshipwith the principal at the school
that my kids went to and hehelped me get all of my
certifications and he gave me ajob.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
Oh, and is it a full time job?
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Like eight to four.
It was a full.
So that was elementary school.
So it was a full time job, 820to 320.
And summer's off.
I started out in fifth grade.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
And you were teaching art history or art or something
.
Okay.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
I started out in fifth grade teaching reading to
fifth graders.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
And once I got the hang of it I realized I wanted
more.
So I know this job has to dowith salary also.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Yeah, we're going to talk about it.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
Yeah, I was going through this with my brother
today, who's visiting fromChicago, you know just thinking
about in preparation for thisand I looked back at the salary
that I was making when I taughtfifth grade and I can't even
believe I lived on that.
It was embarrassing.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
How much was it?
Speaker 1 (04:30):
It was about $32,000 a year.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
A year.
Oh my God, how can they do that?
Speaker 1 (04:37):
That's what my brother said.
This is it's criminal.
So it is criminal, especially,and I'm sure, when you talk to
San Francisco and New York,those teachers definitely in New
York it's much better.
I don't know how it is inCalifornia and San Francisco.
It's bad.
Here it has gone up and thereis a happy ending to my story
(04:58):
that you know.
I make about triple that rightnow, thankfully right so it's
about 15 years later and Idecided I wanted out of
elementary school and I was ableto get a job in a high school.
In a high school when in thelast seven years I've been
working in a high school.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
As a teacher.
You make more money if youteach in high school.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
Yes, that's the trick .
So in high school the days aresplit up by period and by
contract.
If it's a six period day, youteach five periods and you have
one planning period.
However, if the school'soverpopulated, you can ask to
have no planning period and thenyou get paid for that period.
(05:37):
So you're making about an extrasix to $7,000 a year.
Then you could become a clubsponsor, you can become a coach,
you can add on all of thesedifferent supplements to your
paycheck.
And that's only possible in highschool, not in only in high
school, not in elementary school, because in elementary school
you have your with your classthe whole day.
(05:59):
You're teaching one subjectwith that class the whole day,
so there are ways to supplementyour salary.
Now I also tutor.
So once I got to high school Istarted tutoring SAT tutoring,
college essays, my college, whencollege applications are
ramping up, you know I'm busy,busy, busy helping students
(06:19):
write college essays and, iftheir parents can afford to have
them, a college essay tutor, ansat tutor, it's really really
good money.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
it's very helpful and to supplement your income so
the teaching job you're tutoringyou're doing after school hours
, privately school privateschool yes, after school hours
what's the going rate for atutor in In high school?
Speaker 1 (06:44):
Yeah, For SAT tutoring, and it could be
anywhere from $75 to $100 anhour.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
This is really nice.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
Yes.
So that is helpful tosupplement your salary because,
as you heard, our salaries inMiami and all of Florida are not
great in education.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
They're terrible.
I think they're lowest.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
I think we're third lowest, which is insane because
the cost of living in Miami hasskyrocketed.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
Exactly.
That's why you have a lot ofturnover of teachers.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
No, A huge amount of turnover and a lot of the
younger teachers still live withtheir parents and you mentioned
before the size of classes.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
I read that the sizes in Florida are really large.
They're huge.
What do you have?
40 kids in a class 37, 40.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
In the electives they could have 45 to 50 children in
high school.
It's insane and they get awaywith it.
There's loopholes.
There's things that they can doto get away with this's insane
and they get away with it.
There's loopholes.
There's things that they can doto get away with this class
size.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
And do you believe that it hurts the education
Children are?
Speaker 1 (07:51):
dumber, 100%.
I was just reading that.
Our report card, the nation'sreport card, is terrible.
Yes, children are.
It is definitely the dumbingdown of society and we see it.
We see it in the data, we seeit in their, the way they dress,
the way they look.
They just look like they're sodon't care about anything, and
(08:13):
certainly not their education.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
Wow, that's very sad If a vigilante teacher would
want to get in and change things.
Do you have any kind ofcreativity of what you can teach
with all the book banning andcurriculum restrictions?
Speaker 1 (08:28):
So I'll just talk about myself being the advanced
placement literature teacher.
So I taught English literaturefor the last five years and then
I was able to teach advancedplacement art history, which are
these are college level courses, so the curriculum is
completely separate from theMiami Dade County Public School
curriculum.
(08:48):
So I could get away withteaching stories like Willa
Cather's Paul's Case or theYellow Wallpaper, willa Cather's
Paul's Case or the YellowWallpaper.
One of our novels was AThousand Splendid Suns.
No way a regular classroomteacher could teach that right
now.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
What they'll actually come in and arrest them.
What?
Speaker 1 (09:07):
Yes, parents could come in and complain.
I mean, we have the we passedin a couple years ago.
I wrote down the exact yearbecause I knew you were going to
ask me about it in 2022,.
A couple of years ago, I wrotedown the exact year because I
knew you were going to ask meabout it In 2022,.
The don't say gay bill here inFlorida.
You know there's no more.
Your pronoun is your pronounthat you were born with.
You can get in serious troubleas a teacher.
You know a student says hey,miss Goodman, can you call me
(09:31):
this instead of this?
And I say I'm sorry, but in thegrade book this is your name
and this is what I have to callyou in order to protect myself
and my job.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
It is very scary, and especially not as much in high
school but in the elementaryschool and the middle schools,
because the children are youngerand the parents are very you
know the helicopter parents.
It's scary for those teachers.
We have a little bit moreleeway.
But I will tell you, we areseeing a lot more kids not
wanting to put up going toadministration.
(10:03):
Oh, my teacher said this.
My teacher said that they'rejust immature.
They've really.
It really is the dumbing downof America.
It's sad.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Wow.
And what about the teacherunion?
Don't you get organized?
Don't you try to make a change?
I mean, you are teachers afterall.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
Yes, Florida is.
Our union is not that strongbecause we have.
They just actually tried totake away our union.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Right, they weakened it lately.
Speaker 1 (10:32):
They weakened our union and it's sad.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
This is what I'm asking you.
With all the problems inflorida, with all that you have
to teach what you have to teachand call somebody whatever they
tell you, and all of that, whydo people still stay teachers?
Speaker 1 (10:48):
that's a good question why do teachers still
stay teachers?
Well, I'll tell you for myself.
Yes, I'm out the classroom butI deal with children every day,
all day long.
I am the student activitiesdirector now.
It is the connections that wemake, especially in high school,
with these children.
So they're not all as I'mpainting them to be.
(11:10):
There's still that top 20, 25percent that they push
themselves.
They're in it to win it, thatthey pushed themselves, they're
in it to win it.
They are smart and creative andthey just, you know, understand
, they get it.
They're putting their phonesdown, they're reading the novels
, they're doing the work,they're going the extra mile.
(11:34):
And you see that group, and ifI can save 25 percent of them,
or I can help a certain amount,then I'm going to stay and I'm
going to do it.
You know I meant to bring them.
You know today was Valentine'sDay.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
Right.
Speaker 1 (11:42):
The amount of cards that these kids wrote me.
Wow you know I got a rose and Iget, you know, notes and
flowers.
And you know we, as theactivities director, this
morning we rolled out a redcarpet and we played music and
every student that walked in wehanded a little pink heart with
candy.
And you know that fills myheart, because school is not.
(12:03):
It's not only about theeducation, it's about creating a
full person and having thesechildren, who grew up to be
adults, become productivemembers of society in every way.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Do you keep in touch with them after?
Speaker 1 (12:20):
society in every way?
Do you keep in touch with themafter after they 100?
I keep in touch with not all ofthem, but absolutely on they
come home from college, I go tobrunch with them.
You know we're friends onsocial media.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Yes, I keep in touch with them 100 and I see what
they're doing and it fills myheart yeah, I can see that yeah
you have to take the good withthe bad right.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
You have to have the sweet and the salty or else you
don't know how sweet it is.
So that's why I stay inteaching.
I see the younger kids come inand especially in high school,
it's hard for them, you knowit's tough Because now, if
you're not teaching the highlevel courses and you're
teaching the general educationor you're teaching remedial
courses, you are given a script.
(13:02):
You are teaching to a test what?
Oh yeah, you're giving a script.
It's basically like a script ofwhat you're saying, what you're
teaching.
We have guidelines.
There is a textbook.
Yes, you are teaching to a test.
These kids are tested threetimes.
A textbook yes, you areteaching to a test.
These kids are tested threetimes a year and if they don't
pass that test in certain gradelevels, they take it till they
(13:24):
pass or they don't graduate.
These teachers are teaching toa test.
The teachers are graded ontheir data.
Speaker 2 (13:31):
So there's actually no creativity in teaching if you
have to it's terrible.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
It's frustrating for these teachers and that is again
why I was fortunate to teachthese AP level courses where I
had full control of mycurriculum.
No one could say anythingbecause it was not part of the
Miami-Dade County curriculum.
Most of the children I had inmy classes were amazing.
Their parents were supercooperative.
(13:57):
Their parents loved the novelsand the stories and the poetry
that we read.
Oh, I read that when I was inhigh school, you know.
So I was very lucky.
But I see it with the otherteachers and it was, for me at
least, time for a change to kindof progress out of the
classroom and into theadministrative role, not to
mention I make more money.
Yeah, that's what I want to ask, to mention I make more money?
Speaker 2 (14:18):
yeah, that's what I want to ask you.
You make more money, but ifsomebody stays in teaching,
what's the top that they canmake in?
Speaker 1 (14:25):
florida.
Yes, so if you're in highschool and you have all the
extras, probably about 95 to 100000 more talking teachers have
been in for about 30 years 25,25 to 30 years.
Speaker 2 (14:36):
That's not bad, and they get pension and 401k.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
They get.
We have a Florida pension, yes,and we also.
When you retire, you get yourpension, and I know in some
cities like Chicago or SanFrancisco the teachers get to
keep their insurance foreveralso.
But they have to choose betweentheir pension or their social
security, whereas in Florida wedon't get our insurance, but we
get both a pension and oursocial security.
Whereas in Florida we don't getour insurance, but we get both
a pension and our socialsecurity.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Okay, you told us you express the rewards you know
when you see your kids succeed,and all of that, which I can
totally understand.
What's the biggest challenge ofthe job?
The adults, the adults.
What do you mean by the adults?
Speaker 1 (15:12):
Administration.
When the district comes in andyou're not doing that, well, the
new rules that come down thepike every year, everything
changes.
Just when you're getting usedto something the adults want to
throw in, a brand new textbook,or everything changes.
You know there's no more.
You know diversity, equity andinclusion anymore.
(15:35):
So we can't.
You know we have new stories,new textbooks, new.
What do you mean?
New?
Since when New?
Since when?
In the past year or two?
So we used to be after COVID, itwas very, you know, we were
very mental health.
Mental health.
We're not even allowed to talkabout mental health anymore in
Florida.
(15:55):
There's no more.
It's very vanilla, I'm sure,Wonder Bread and mayonnaise, as
I call it.
Oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:03):
Not only you're not making enough money and, by the
way, I heard that some teachershave to spend their own money to
buy supplies for the kids.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
Who do you think bought the candy this morning to
get out?
Miss Goodman.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
Yes, but even for class supplies.
I heard for lesson suppliesthat they have to buy some
things with their own money.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Yes, so we are given money at the beginning of the
year, but you can only spend iton certain things.
So if you're want to buy itemsoutside of this strict supply,
then yes, you have to spend themoney on your own, absolutely,
and we do.
We spend a lot of money outsideof what we're given in the
beginning of the year, whichisn't that much.
(16:44):
It's about $250.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
I think it's really not that much.
You said the challenge is theadult.
I thought that you would saymental health, health and mass
shooting.
You know, every time there's amass shooting they say, oh, it's
mental health.
But now you're telling meyou're not allowed to talk about
mental health.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
So, marav, it's funny that you bring that up because
today, february 14th, is theanniversary, the seven-year
anniversary of the largest massshooting here in Florida,
marjory Stoneman Douglas.
And we received from thedistrict something to read, and
this year it was a quarter ofthe length of what it is
normally.
(17:21):
In the past my principal got onat 1117 or whatever the time
the shooting started.
I mean the horrific, horriblething.
And when he put the phone downhe looked at me and he said what
did I just read?
This is not what I normallyread.
It was very cut and dry.
It had didn't mention anythingabout mental health, didn't
(17:42):
mention anything about howhorrible all of this is.
It was just in memoriam ofthose who died on February 14,
seven years ago.
Blah, blah, blah.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
It was heartbreaking, it's unbelievable.
Let's take this situation, forexample.
So then, if, as a teacher, yougo back to the classroom, are
you allowed to talk about it andabout, without saying, mental
health, but say the problem inthe head, or whatever?
Speaker 1 (18:07):
Yes, you can talk about it in a sort of roundabout
way without using the wordsthat we're not allowed to use
anymore.
I am really getting into thisis.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
America.
This I can't believe it.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
I know Well, welcome to Florida, as we'd like to say,
with a d-u-h at the end wow itis difficult and you know.
You talked about the massshootings and we have drills.
How often do you have drills?
We have lockdown drills.
I want to say at least twiceevery nine weeks.
I know we have a big fire drillcoming up next week.
(18:42):
We have to keep our doorslocked.
It's just you know, if youconstantly are thinking about
that, you're going to beparalyzed with fear.
You know, we just don't thinkabout it.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
Did you ever go through some?
Speaker 1 (18:53):
weapon trainings, oh no no no, not me.
I'm anti weapons personally.
However, we did have a lockdown.
We did have a scare about ayear and a half ago where they
put our school on lockdown.
It happens all the time.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
When you say lockdown , what does it mean?
The whole school is lockedinside.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
The whole school is locked inside until the police
officers come with their dogsand their guns drawn and check
every single classroom.
So we were in school.
School normally lets out about220.
This maybe happened at about 11.
We were in school till aboutfive o'clock that day.
Thankfully it was a false alarm, but this happens every day
that these schools go onlockdown every day?
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Wow, that is so depressing.
So let me ask you something Canyou point the students to
things online that they canlearn and get more knowledge
than you were allowed to teachthem?
Is it like in secretive, thatyou have to tell them like we
are in?
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Russia A little bit.
I feel like you have to developa trust and communication with
certain students.
You know who you can talk to.
However, maybe they mentionedsomething at home and their
parents come back.
It's kind of scary.
It is kind of like we're inRussia.
But you have to develop arelationship with the students
that you can trust to try andhelp them, to try and point them
(20:13):
in the right direction.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
So I don't want to end on a bad note and a
depressing note, because I'vebeen following Florida politics
and all of that.
That's infuriating, but it'seven more than I thought.
This is really crazy and it'sthe education, it's your next
generation.
How can you do that?
You know, but I don't want toend on a depressing note.
(20:36):
I want to know if you have asuccess story of a student that
comes to mind that you can sharewith us and we will all
understand why people arestaying under this condition and
keep educating the youth oh, Ihave so many success stories of
so many students.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
when I taught fifth grade and I moved to the high
school, it was the theaterpattern high school, so I taught
students in fifth grade, inninth grade, in 10th grade and
in 12th grade.
So some of these students I'vehad for four years running.
So you know, I've seen studentswho were maybe struggling in
elementary school and kind ofcame into their own in high
(21:15):
school.
And I have one student in mindI won't say his name.
He was struggling with his ownsexuality and was able to
finally, you know again, we havea lot of Hispanics and that's
very, there's the machismo, buthe was able to shine and really
come into his own.
He eventually was a water poloteam, national honor society,
(21:41):
all student governmentassociation on a whim applied to
Dartmouth, got in earlydecision.
Oh I mean amazing, and so wehave the students come back
every year to speak to theseniors, our alumni and he came
back this year and he'sgraduating and he's so happy and
he looks so amazing, and that'sthe other thing I get to see
(22:04):
them.
They come back, and there areso many success stories.
And I don't want to end on abad note either, because this is
what I do and this is somethingthat I will be doing for the
next seven or eight years, and,yes, I will wake up at 5 30 in
the morning and, yes, sometimesI don't get home till four
o'clock, but you know, this isour future and it's very
fulfilling.
It is fulfilling and we have to,and we have to have hope, we
(22:27):
have to have hope.
There has to be a shining lightAgain.
I'm not going to save everybody, but I'm going to make my mark
and that's what I want.
I want them to carry the light.
Carry the light with them.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
Excellent.
Do you think that student, bythe way, changed anybody's mind
in the school?
All the machismos?
Did it change anybody's?
Speaker 1 (22:49):
mind, in the, in the school, all the machismos.
Did it change?
Did it make a dent?
Probably, he probably did,because he was, he was able to
speak up for himself and he wasable to rise to the top and
become a leader.
So, yeah, I think it did that'sgreat absolutely that's great.
I mean he showed them he suredid.
Wow, graduating from dartmouthin a couple months and, yeah,
really proud of him.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
That is a great story , yeah well danielle, thank you
so much, that was so interesting, thank you we just hope for
better days for florida, forflorida's youth I agree, we, you
know, shine the light right.
Okay, take care bye-bye, thankyou.
Thank you bye-bye.
Thank you, mara.
Thank you Bye-bye.
Okay, that's a wrap for today.
(23:31):
If you have a comment orquestion or would like us to
cover a certain job, please letus know.
Visit our website athowmuchcanimakeinfo.
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See you next time.
after covid, it was very.
You know, we were very mentalhealth, mental health well we're
not even allowed to talk aboutmental health anymore in florida
.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
There's no more hi and welcome back to how much can
I make.
I'm a curious journalist with apassion for exploring what
people do for a living.
This time I wanted to dig intowhat it's really like to be a
teacher in Florida.
Because all the new rules andregulations and all the stuff
(00:32):
we're hearing about in the newsI thought it would be
interesting.
So I contacted Danielle Goodmanshe's a Florida teacher of many
years to try and find out whatthe job is really like and is it
worth the paycheck.
So let's dive right in,danielle.
Thanks a lot for doing it.
First of all, my pleasure.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
I'm happy to be here.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
My first question is did you always want to be a
teacher?
Speaker 1 (00:56):
So I knew you were going to ask me that that's what
most people ask me, and theanswer is no.
I did not always want to be ateacher.
Teaching is actually a secondcareer for me.
I didn't start teaching until Iwas about 39.
Oh, so yeah, it was so how didit come?
about I was getting divorced andit was sink or swim time.
(01:18):
So my actual degree was inliberal arts and you know what
can you do with a liberal artsdegree?
So I spent a lot of time whenmy children were little in their
school volunteering PTA readingto the class, and I realized
this is something I did want todo, you know, at turning 40
(01:38):
years old.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Why?
Because you had small childrenand you're so important.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
I had small children and I just loved it.
I realized that I connectedwith the children.
So, no, when I was in collegeoriginally I didn't think about
education or teaching.
It was not even anywhere nearanything I wanted to do.
So being in the school system,having small children, immersing
myself in education, reallyshined a light on that aha
(02:05):
moment.
This actually is something Iwant to do.
However, I was 40, not 20.
So I found out what I had to do, because in public school, you
need the proper certification.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
This is what I want to know what kind of
certification do you need?
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Well, it's different now than it was 20 years ago.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
What is it now?
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Now it's a lot less rigorous because we have a
teaching shortage.
So, as it used to be, you hadto have a four-year degree, you
had certain certification testsyou had to take, you had
something called a generalknowledge test that you had to
pass, and it was much morerigorous where now they're
hiring students straight out ofhigh school to substitute and
(02:50):
quick, like a fast track towardsbecoming a teacher.
That's a problem, don't youthink it's a huge problem?
It's a huge problem.
When I was doing it.
I had to go back to school toget all this certification.
So here I was, this 40 year oldwoman getting divorced with
three little kids going back tocollege to take classes so I can
(03:10):
get certified and take allthese tests, and it took me
about two years.
I was substituting in themeantime at the private school
that my kids were going to andthen realizing, once I got
divorced, they could no longerattend private school and
shuffled them off to publicschool and started substituting
(03:31):
there and formed a relationshipwith the principal at the school
that my kids went to and hehelped me get all of my
certifications and he gave me ajob.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
Oh, and is it a full time job?
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Like eight to four.
It was a full.
So that was elementary school.
So it was a full time job, 820to 320.
And summer's off.
I started out in fifth grade.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
And you were teaching art history or art or something
.
Okay.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
I started out in fifth grade teaching reading to
fifth graders.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
And once I got the hang of it I realized I wanted
more.
So I know this job has to dowith salary also.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Yeah, we're going to talk about it.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
Yeah, I was going through this with my brother
today, who's visiting fromChicago, you know just thinking
about in preparation for thisand I looked back at the salary
that I was making when I taughtfifth grade and I can't even
believe I lived on that.
It was embarrassing.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
How much was it?
Speaker 1 (04:30):
It was about $32,000 a year.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
A year.
Oh my God, how can they do that?
Speaker 1 (04:37):
That's what my brother said.
This is it's criminal.
So it is criminal, especially,and I'm sure, when you talk to
San Francisco and New York,those teachers definitely in New
York it's much better.
I don't know how it is inCalifornia and San Francisco.
It's bad.
Here it has gone up and thereis a happy ending to my story
(04:58):
that you know.
I make about triple that rightnow, thankfully right so it's
about 15 years later and Idecided I wanted out of
elementary school and I was ableto get a job in a high school.
In a high school when in thelast seven years I've been
working in a high school.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
As a teacher.
You make more money if youteach in high school.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
Yes, that's the trick .
So in high school the days aresplit up by period and by
contract.
If it's a six period day, youteach five periods and you have
one planning period.
However, if the school'soverpopulated, you can ask to
have no planning period and thenyou get paid for that period.
(05:37):
So you're making about an extrasix to $7,000 a year.
Then you could become a clubsponsor, you can become a coach,
you can add on all of thesedifferent supplements to your
paycheck.
And that's only possible in highschool, not in only in high
school, not in elementary school, because in elementary school
you have your with your classthe whole day.
(05:59):
You're teaching one subjectwith that class the whole day,
so there are ways to supplementyour salary.
Now I also tutor.
So once I got to high school Istarted tutoring SAT tutoring,
college essays, my college, whencollege applications are
ramping up, you know I'm busy,busy, busy helping students
(06:19):
write college essays and, iftheir parents can afford to have
them, a college essay tutor, ansat tutor, it's really really
good money.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
it's very helpful and to supplement your income so
the teaching job you're tutoringyou're doing after school hours
, privately school privateschool yes, after school hours
what's the going rate for atutor in In high school?
Speaker 1 (06:44):
Yeah, For SAT tutoring, and it could be
anywhere from $75 to $100 anhour.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
This is really nice.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
Yes.
So that is helpful tosupplement your salary because,
as you heard, our salaries inMiami and all of Florida are not
great in education.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
They're terrible.
I think they're lowest.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
I think we're third lowest, which is insane because
the cost of living in Miami hasskyrocketed.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
Exactly.
That's why you have a lot ofturnover of teachers.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
No, A huge amount of turnover and a lot of the
younger teachers still live withtheir parents and you mentioned
before the size of classes.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
I read that the sizes in Florida are really large.
They're huge.
What do you have?
40 kids in a class 37, 40.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
In the electives they could have 45 to 50 children in
high school.
It's insane and they get awaywith it.
There's loopholes.
There's things that they can doto get away with this's insane
and they get away with it.
There's loopholes.
There's things that they can doto get away with this class
size.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
And do you believe that it hurts the education
Children are?
Speaker 1 (07:51):
dumber, 100%.
I was just reading that.
Our report card, the nation'sreport card, is terrible.
Yes, children are.
It is definitely the dumbingdown of society and we see it.
We see it in the data, we seeit in their, the way they dress,
the way they look.
They just look like they're sodon't care about anything, and
(08:13):
certainly not their education.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
Wow, that's very sad If a vigilante teacher would
want to get in and change things.
Do you have any kind ofcreativity of what you can teach
with all the book banning andcurriculum restrictions?
Speaker 1 (08:28):
So I'll just talk about myself being the advanced
placement literature teacher.
So I taught English literaturefor the last five years and then
I was able to teach advancedplacement art history, which are
these are college level courses, so the curriculum is
completely separate from theMiami Dade County Public School
curriculum.
(08:48):
So I could get away withteaching stories like Willa
Cather's Paul's Case or theYellow Wallpaper, willa Cather's
Paul's Case or the YellowWallpaper.
One of our novels was AThousand Splendid Suns.
No way a regular classroomteacher could teach that right
now.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
What they'll actually come in and arrest them.
What?
Speaker 1 (09:07):
Yes, parents could come in and complain.
I mean, we have the we passedin a couple years ago.
I wrote down the exact yearbecause I knew you were going to
ask me about it in 2022,.
A couple of years ago, I wrotedown the exact year because I
knew you were going to ask meabout it In 2022,.
The don't say gay bill here inFlorida.
You know there's no more.
Your pronoun is your pronounthat you were born with.
You can get in serious troubleas a teacher.
You know a student says hey,miss Goodman, can you call me
(09:31):
this instead of this?
And I say I'm sorry, but in thegrade book this is your name
and this is what I have to callyou in order to protect myself
and my job.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
It is very scary, and especially not as much in high
school but in the elementaryschool and the middle schools,
because the children are youngerand the parents are very you
know the helicopter parents.
It's scary for those teachers.
We have a little bit moreleeway.
But I will tell you, we areseeing a lot more kids not
wanting to put up going toadministration.
(10:03):
Oh, my teacher said this.
My teacher said that they'rejust immature.
They've really.
It really is the dumbing downof America.
It's sad.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Wow.
And what about the teacherunion?
Don't you get organized?
Don't you try to make a change?
I mean, you are teachers afterall.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
Yes, Florida is.
Our union is not that strongbecause we have.
They just actually tried totake away our union.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Right, they weakened it lately.
Speaker 1 (10:32):
They weakened our union and it's sad.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
This is what I'm asking you.
With all the problems inflorida, with all that you have
to teach what you have to teachand call somebody whatever they
tell you, and all of that, whydo people still stay teachers?
Speaker 1 (10:48):
that's a good question why do teachers still
stay teachers?
Well, I'll tell you for myself.
Yes, I'm out the classroom butI deal with children every day,
all day long.
I am the student activitiesdirector now.
It is the connections that wemake, especially in high school,
with these children.
So they're not all as I'mpainting them to be.
(11:10):
There's still that top 20, 25percent that they push
themselves.
They're in it to win it, thatthey pushed themselves, they're
in it to win it.
They are smart and creative andthey just, you know, understand
, they get it.
They're putting their phonesdown, they're reading the novels
, they're doing the work,they're going the extra mile.
(11:34):
And you see that group, and ifI can save 25 percent of them,
or I can help a certain amount,then I'm going to stay and I'm
going to do it.
You know I meant to bring them.
You know today was Valentine'sDay.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
Right.
Speaker 1 (11:42):
The amount of cards that these kids wrote me.
Wow you know I got a rose and Iget, you know, notes and
flowers.
And you know we, as theactivities director, this
morning we rolled out a redcarpet and we played music and
every student that walked in wehanded a little pink heart with
candy.
And you know that fills myheart, because school is not.
(12:03):
It's not only about theeducation, it's about creating a
full person and having thesechildren, who grew up to be
adults, become productivemembers of society in every way.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Do you keep in touch with them after?
Speaker 1 (12:20):
society in every way?
Do you keep in touch with themafter after they 100?
I keep in touch with not all ofthem, but absolutely on they
come home from college, I go tobrunch with them.
You know we're friends onsocial media.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Yes, I keep in touch with them 100 and I see what
they're doing and it fills myheart yeah, I can see that yeah
you have to take the good withthe bad right.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
You have to have the sweet and the salty or else you
don't know how sweet it is.
So that's why I stay inteaching.
I see the younger kids come inand especially in high school,
it's hard for them, you knowit's tough Because now, if
you're not teaching the highlevel courses and you're
teaching the general educationor you're teaching remedial
courses, you are given a script.
(13:02):
You are teaching to a test what?
Oh yeah, you're giving a script.
It's basically like a script ofwhat you're saying, what you're
teaching.
We have guidelines.
There is a textbook.
Yes, you are teaching to a test.
These kids are tested threetimes.
A textbook yes, you areteaching to a test.
These kids are tested threetimes a year and if they don't
pass that test in certain gradelevels, they take it till they
(13:24):
pass or they don't graduate.
These teachers are teaching toa test.
The teachers are graded ontheir data.
Speaker 2 (13:31):
So there's actually no creativity in teaching if you
have to it's terrible.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
It's frustrating for these teachers and that is again
why I was fortunate to teachthese AP level courses where I
had full control of mycurriculum.
No one could say anythingbecause it was not part of the
Miami-Dade County curriculum.
Most of the children I had inmy classes were amazing.
Their parents were supercooperative.
(13:57):
Their parents loved the novelsand the stories and the poetry
that we read.
Oh, I read that when I was inhigh school, you know.
So I was very lucky.
But I see it with the otherteachers and it was, for me at
least, time for a change to kindof progress out of the
classroom and into theadministrative role, not to
mention I make more money.
Yeah, that's what I want to ask, to mention I make more money?
Speaker 2 (14:18):
yeah, that's what I want to ask you.
You make more money, but ifsomebody stays in teaching,
what's the top that they canmake in?
Speaker 1 (14:25):
florida.
Yes, so if you're in highschool and you have all the
extras, probably about 95 to 100000 more talking teachers have
been in for about 30 years 25,25 to 30 years.
Speaker 2 (14:36):
That's not bad, and they get pension and 401k.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
They get.
We have a Florida pension, yes,and we also.
When you retire, you get yourpension, and I know in some
cities like Chicago or SanFrancisco the teachers get to
keep their insurance foreveralso.
But they have to choose betweentheir pension or their social
security, whereas in Florida wedon't get our insurance, but we
get both a pension and oursocial security.
Whereas in Florida we don't getour insurance, but we get both
a pension and our socialsecurity.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Okay, you told us you express the rewards you know
when you see your kids succeed,and all of that, which I can
totally understand.
What's the biggest challenge ofthe job?
The adults, the adults.
What do you mean by the adults?
Speaker 1 (15:12):
Administration.
When the district comes in andyou're not doing that, well, the
new rules that come down thepike every year, everything
changes.
Just when you're getting usedto something the adults want to
throw in, a brand new textbook,or everything changes.
You know there's no more.
You know diversity, equity andinclusion anymore.
(15:35):
So we can't.
You know we have new stories,new textbooks, new.
What do you mean?
New?
Since when New?
Since when?
In the past year or two?
So we used to be after COVID, itwas very, you know, we were
very mental health.
Mental health.
We're not even allowed to talkabout mental health anymore in
Florida.
(15:55):
There's no more.
It's very vanilla, I'm sure,Wonder Bread and mayonnaise, as
I call it.
Oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:03):
Not only you're not making enough money and, by the
way, I heard that some teachershave to spend their own money to
buy supplies for the kids.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
Who do you think bought the candy this morning to
get out?
Miss Goodman.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
Yes, but even for class supplies.
I heard for lesson suppliesthat they have to buy some
things with their own money.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Yes, so we are given money at the beginning of the
year, but you can only spend iton certain things.
So if you're want to buy itemsoutside of this strict supply,
then yes, you have to spend themoney on your own, absolutely,
and we do.
We spend a lot of money outsideof what we're given in the
beginning of the year, whichisn't that much.
(16:44):
It's about $250.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
I think it's really not that much.
You said the challenge is theadult.
I thought that you would saymental health, health and mass
shooting.
You know, every time there's amass shooting they say, oh, it's
mental health.
But now you're telling meyou're not allowed to talk about
mental health.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
So, marav, it's funny that you bring that up because
today, february 14th, is theanniversary, the seven-year
anniversary of the largest massshooting here in Florida,
marjory Stoneman Douglas.
And we received from thedistrict something to read, and
this year it was a quarter ofthe length of what it is
normally.
(17:21):
In the past my principal got onat 1117 or whatever the time
the shooting started.
I mean the horrific, horriblething.
And when he put the phone downhe looked at me and he said what
did I just read?
This is not what I normallyread.
It was very cut and dry.
It had didn't mention anythingabout mental health, didn't
(17:42):
mention anything about howhorrible all of this is.
It was just in memoriam ofthose who died on February 14,
seven years ago.
Blah, blah, blah.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
It was heartbreaking, it's unbelievable.
Let's take this situation, forexample.
So then, if, as a teacher, yougo back to the classroom, are
you allowed to talk about it andabout, without saying, mental
health, but say the problem inthe head, or whatever?
Speaker 1 (18:07):
Yes, you can talk about it in a sort of roundabout
way without using the wordsthat we're not allowed to use
anymore.
I am really getting into thisis.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
America.
This I can't believe it.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
I know Well, welcome to Florida, as we'd like to say,
with a d-u-h at the end wow itis difficult and you know.
You talked about the massshootings and we have drills.
How often do you have drills?
We have lockdown drills.
I want to say at least twiceevery nine weeks.
I know we have a big fire drillcoming up next week.
(18:42):
We have to keep our doorslocked.
It's just you know, if youconstantly are thinking about
that, you're going to beparalyzed with fear.
You know, we just don't thinkabout it.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
Did you ever go through some?
Speaker 1 (18:53):
weapon trainings, oh no no no, not me.
I'm anti weapons personally.
However, we did have a lockdown.
We did have a scare about ayear and a half ago where they
put our school on lockdown.
It happens all the time.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
When you say lockdown , what does it mean?
The whole school is lockedinside.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
The whole school is locked inside until the police
officers come with their dogsand their guns drawn and check
every single classroom.
So we were in school.
School normally lets out about220.
This maybe happened at about 11.
We were in school till aboutfive o'clock that day.
Thankfully it was a false alarm, but this happens every day
that these schools go onlockdown every day?
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Wow, that is so depressing.
So let me ask you something Canyou point the students to
things online that they canlearn and get more knowledge
than you were allowed to teachthem?
Is it like in secretive, thatyou have to tell them like we
are in?
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Russia A little bit.
I feel like you have to developa trust and communication with
certain students.
You know who you can talk to.
However, maybe they mentionedsomething at home and their
parents come back.
It's kind of scary.
It is kind of like we're inRussia.
But you have to develop arelationship with the students
that you can trust to try andhelp them, to try and point them
(20:13):
in the right direction.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
So I don't want to end on a bad note and a
depressing note, because I'vebeen following Florida politics
and all of that.
That's infuriating, but it'seven more than I thought.
This is really crazy and it'sthe education, it's your next
generation.
How can you do that?
You know, but I don't want toend on a depressing note.
(20:36):
I want to know if you have asuccess story of a student that
comes to mind that you can sharewith us and we will all
understand why people arestaying under this condition and
keep educating the youth oh, Ihave so many success stories of
so many students.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
when I taught fifth grade and I moved to the high
school, it was the theaterpattern high school, so I taught
students in fifth grade, inninth grade, in 10th grade and
in 12th grade.
So some of these students I'vehad for four years running.
So you know, I've seen studentswho were maybe struggling in
elementary school and kind ofcame into their own in high
(21:15):
school.
And I have one student in mindI won't say his name.
He was struggling with his ownsexuality and was able to
finally, you know again, we havea lot of Hispanics and that's
very, there's the machismo, buthe was able to shine and really
come into his own.
He eventually was a water poloteam, national honor society,
(21:41):
all student governmentassociation on a whim applied to
Dartmouth, got in earlydecision.
Oh I mean amazing, and so wehave the students come back
every year to speak to theseniors, our alumni and he came
back this year and he'sgraduating and he's so happy and
he looks so amazing, and that'sthe other thing I get to see
(22:04):
them.
They come back, and there areso many success stories.
And I don't want to end on abad note either, because this is
what I do and this is somethingthat I will be doing for the
next seven or eight years, and,yes, I will wake up at 5 30 in
the morning and, yes, sometimesI don't get home till four
o'clock, but you know, this isour future and it's very
fulfilling.
It is fulfilling and we have to,and we have to have hope, we
(22:27):
have to have hope.
There has to be a shining lightAgain.
I'm not going to save everybody, but I'm going to make my mark
and that's what I want.
I want them to carry the light.
Carry the light with them.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
Excellent.
Do you think that student, bythe way, changed anybody's mind
in the school?
All the machismos?
Did it change anybody's?
Speaker 1 (22:49):
mind, in the, in the school, all the machismos.
Did it change?
Did it make a dent?
Probably, he probably did,because he was, he was able to
speak up for himself and he wasable to rise to the top and
become a leader.
So, yeah, I think it did that'sgreat absolutely that's great.
I mean he showed them he suredid.
Wow, graduating from dartmouthin a couple months and, yeah,
really proud of him.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
That is a great story , yeah well danielle, thank you
so much, that was so interesting, thank you we just hope for
better days for florida, forflorida's youth I agree, we, you
know, shine the light right.
Okay, take care bye-bye, thankyou.
Thank you bye-bye.
Thank you, mara.
Thank you Bye-bye.
Okay, that's a wrap for today.
(23:31):
If you have a comment orquestion or would like us to
cover a certain job, please letus know.
Visit our website athowmuchcanimakeinfo.
We would love to hear from youand, on your way out, don't
forget to subscribe and sharethis episode with anyone who is
curious about their next job.
See you next time.
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