August 5, 2025 • 24 mins
OR Nurse
Ever wonder what really goes down behind those mysterious operating room doors? In this episode, longtime OR nurse Patti Columbia Walsh spills the tea on her 40-year career in one of the most high-stress, high-stakes jobs in healthcare. Spoiler alert: it’s not like Grey’s Anatomy.
From anticipating a surgeon’s every move to staying cool during full-blown medical emergencies, Patti takes us inside the fast-paced, no-room-for-error world of the OR and the emotional weight of the job.
If you're curious about a job in nursing, this episode is packed with career insights, real talk and heart. Listen now!
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Music credit: Kate Pierson & Monica Nation
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
We have robotic surgery that we do with, which I
am fascinated by that.
The surgeon can be over hereand the patients here and be
doing the operation from theother side of the room.
It fascinates me.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Yes, we're going to talk about robotic surgeries and
others.
Welcome back to how Much Can IMake?
I'm your host, mara Vo Vozeri.
Today I'm going to chat with myfriend, patty Columbia Walsh,
who's been an operating roomnurse for 40 years.
I really want to know what it'slike to work under high
pressure in such high-stakeenvironment.
(00:36):
I don't think I could do this,can you?
So let's find out what reallygoes on behind those OR doors.
Patty, thanks a lot for doingit.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
Oh, thank you for having me.
I appreciate it.
I appreciate it as well.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
First, let's start with how did you become an
operating room nurse?
Speaker 1 (00:54):
When I was in nursing school I never liked the
bedside with patients because Ibecame attached to the patients
and it was very difficult for meto watch people who were sick
every day.
So I decided that the OR wasfor me, because a patient comes
in, we take care of them and wenever see them again, and that
was more.
(01:14):
It was easier for me to becomea nurse doing that type of
nursing and also I was told whenI was going through a rotation
of the OR in nursing school Iwas told by an OR nurse that you
should do not become an ORnurse.
You're never going to do it andthat also gave me a lot more
inspiration of going intosomething that I was told I
couldn't do.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Why did they think you cannot do it?
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Well, it was my second day in the OR that I
couldn't glove and gown myself,which is something we do, and it
was the second day.
And she just just a typical ORnurse who the older nurses who
eat their young.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
So wait, let's back up for a second.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
How many years did you have to study?
I was in the school for fourand a half years, two for
regular schooling and two and ahalf for nursing school.
You don't go into a specialtyuntil you graduate from school
and you choose what specialtyyou want to be in.
And you always wanted to be anurse, always wanted to.
No, actually I wanted to be aschool teacher.
But Sister Miriam, when I wasin Catholic school, told me I
(02:15):
did well in the sciences.
I should become a nurse ratherthan a teacher, and that's
exactly why I became a nurse.
You have to listen to thosenuns and that's exactly why I
became a nurse.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
You have to listen to those nuns, okay, so what
exactly do you do as a nurse inan operating room?
Speaker 1 (02:30):
So in the OR it's interesting, you know we get the
room ready for any particularcase.
We have, Like I do, spinesurgery and neurosurgery mostly
and the setup for theseparticular procedures is quite a
lot Instrumentation, makingsure the room has everything
that the surgeon wants for theprocedure, and then, once all
that's set, the patient comesinto the room and literally I
(02:53):
probably see the patient forliterally about three or four
minutes and then the anesthesiaputs them to sleep.
I'm a circulator and there's ascrub nurse, so the circulator
is dirty, the scrub person isclean.
What is a circulator?
What do you do?
So whatever the doctor wants orthe scrub tech wants in the
room, anything they need on thefield, I get it and then I give
(03:17):
it to them in a steriletechnique where I have a package
that's not sterile but then Iopen up the package and what's
in the package is sterile.
I have a package that's notsterile, but then I open up the
package and what's in thepackage is sterile and then the
scrub tech takes it from me.
I used to scrub butunfortunately my hands react to
rubber now.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
So I can't scrub, but I actually enjoyed scrubbing
when you scrub, you mean youscrub the patient.
Speaker 1 (03:35):
No, no, no, I'm sorry .
So you have to scrub your handsclean, yes, from the top of
your fingers all the way down toyour elbows.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
And then once you then you go in with a sterile
towel, you dry your hands off,arms off and put on a gown and
gloves and then at that pointyou're sterile.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
I prefer doing that.
So, yes, that's the intro.
You have to know every name ofevery instrument, which is
pretty impressive, because wehave six different services
vascular GYN.
Every one of them has adifferent instrumentation that
they use that you have to havethe knowledge of.
When the surgeon asks you,first of all, he's not supposed
to turn around and ask you foran instrument.
All he does is this Sometimes,if you're very good at what you
(04:12):
do, you know what he wantsbefore he even asks for it, when
you've been doing it for awhile.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
So when he puts out his hand, you're supposed to
know what instrument he needs.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
Yes, you should know, like, if you're, and if you see
that he's cutting a suture, yougive him a scissor.
He doesn't have to ask for it.
You should know that.
So you watch every step of thesurgery.
You have to, as a scrub person,as a scrub nurse or tech, okay,
you have to be in the operation.
You can't be looking around.
(04:41):
You have to be present theentire time.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
And how long did you have to go through training?
Speaker 1 (04:45):
So six months.
I actually had a phenomenaltraining at Westchester County
Medical Center when I became anurse, and for six months you go
through multiple servicesgeneral surgery, urology surgery
, gyn surgery, neurosurgery,vascular surgery and all these
six services.
We were trained each month in adifferent service in order to
(05:07):
learn it.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
So what is a day in your life like at work?
Speaker 1 (05:10):
It's pretty hectic because in the operating room
the surgeon wants you to move asquickly as you possibly can, so
they want to get in the room,they want to make sure
everything in the room is therefor the procedure and they don't
like to wait.
It's important that before I gointo the room that there's a
sheet that tells you everythingthat the doctor wants in the
room, that you have to be surethat you have that in the room
(05:32):
before you're permitted to bringthe patient back.
Once you have everything set,that's when you bring the
patient back.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
So you get the list the day before there's a list no
.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
So every morning when we get into work there's a cart
that's filled with theinstrumentation and everything
that you need for that procedure.
So there's central supply whichpicks the cases of this list
that we get every morning.
They pick everything for thecase.
When we get the case we makesure that everything they picked
is in that cart because theydon't get yelled at.
We do so.
(06:01):
We make sure everything that issupposed to be in that cart's
in that cart and then, once werealize that, we go into the
room and we set up the room.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
So you work closely with anesthesiologists, with a
surgeon who else theanesthesiologists we help once
the patient.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
They're starting to put the patient to sleep.
We stand with theanesthesiologists to help hold
the endotracheal tube beforethey place it.
We make sure it's placed beforewe even start prepping the
patient for the surgery and thenI work with the surgeon and
with the scrub tech and anyoneelse who happens to be in the
room that might be needed forthe procedure.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
Do you ever cringe when you see them opening up
somebody?
Speaker 1 (06:39):
I don't cringe when I see surgery.
I do cringe when I see patientsthat have allowed themselves to
have growths on their body fora year and then they come into
the OR and they're massive andyou can't imagine that these
people actually were living withthis.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
That's very difficult for me to watch because I
cannot for the life of meunderstand why anybody would do
that.
I don't know if it's becausethey don't have health insurance
or what the reason is, but Iit's scary sometimes for me,
does it ever?
Speaker 2 (07:10):
happen that in the room you have an emergency
situation?
Yes, what happens then?
Tell me.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
So we do a procedure that's called ALIFT, an anterior
lumbar interbody fusion, whereyou go through the abdomen and
you have a vascular surgeon andspine surgeon.
The vascular surgeon isresponsible for getting access
to the lumbar wherever in thespine that we're operating on,
and because you have a vascularsurgeon opening up to get to the
lumbar area for the spinesurgeon there's a lot of vessels
(07:39):
that are very, very importantthat you don't nick, and I have
been present where surgeons havenicked the vessel and the
patient starts bleedingprofusely.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
What do you do then?
Speaker 1 (07:50):
Literally, there is a button in the operating room
that you have to push whensomething like that happens,
because then everybody who'savailable within the operating
room suite will come running andhelp out With getting blood,
with doing whatever it is that'sneeded to save the patient.
Wow, it's happened to meprobably two times in my career.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
Were you scared.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Oh, petrified.
Petrified because I mean, evenwhen you're petrified and you
look at the surgeon and he'sbeside himself because the
bleeding is unbelievable, itscares you.
Because he's scared he's theone that's responsible for I
mean, all of us in the room areresponsible for saving the
patient, but in reality it'sreally his technique that's
going to save that patient.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
Wow, so you worked with many different surgeons.
Everybody Do you have favorites.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Yes, dr Solari, he's a spine surgeon.
I call him my boyfriend.
No, he's wonderful.
I've worked with him for 11years.
I am always in his room.
If I'm not in his room, he getsupset.
So when I take off today, Iwork.
He works on Mondays, so I'm notthere today and I'm sure he's
asking where's Patty.
But no, him and I work welltogether because I know his
(08:59):
speed and we work very quicklytogether.
What's the average time of anoperation?
So it depends on the operation.
But in the hospital, which isvery difficult for nurses and
techs is that we are required acertain amount of time to get
the next patient in the OR.
So in other words, if a caseends, we have 30 minutes less
(09:19):
than 30 minutes to get the nextpatient in setting up the entire
room and some of these cases wehave 15 instrumentation that we
have to open up in a sterileway in order for the person
that's scrubbed to take it fromus.
And it takes time.
But the cases it depends onwhat the case is Like.
A lift anterior lumbarinterbody fusion takes anywhere
(09:41):
from an hour and a half to twohours.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
How many surgeries can you do a day?
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Depending on the speed of the surgeon, four to
five a day.
So it's go, go, go from thetime.
It's no, no, go from the time.
No, you get 45 minute lunch andthat's all you get.
You move constantly, you're inmovement and it's an eight hour
shift.
It's an eight hour shift.
Yeah, seven and a half hoursand we have a 45 minute lunch.
So they don't pay us for alunch.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
They don't pay you for a lunch.
No, they don't.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
They're not very nurse friendly.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Is your job a union job?
Speaker 1 (10:10):
No, it's not.
So they can literally changewhatever they want.
For if, like we, were gettingpaid four hours for call time,
they took an hour away from us.
If we got called in, we wouldautomatically get paid four
hours.
They took an hour from us.
What do you mean If you're oncall?
So if you're on call, you getpaid $5 an hour on call, every
(10:30):
hour you're on call, and if youget called in, you get time and
a half.
If you're there for two hours,they would pay you for four
hours, but they took an houraway from us.
So now we only get paid if wego in for just three hours.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
Why would you be on call if you are on on on every
day?
Speaker 1 (10:45):
for you have to.
You have to take call.
It's part of your job.
You have to.
You don't have a choice, sothat's after work hour the call.
Usually I take it on theweekends because I'm not monday
through friday.
I prefer not to work rightafter my shift is over.
If they want me to stay, Iprefer not to do that.
So I take call.
You take the call yourself.
You choose to take what you wantas long as it's available and I
(11:06):
usually take it on a saturday,sunday, so you have to negotiate
your own salary.
When I went in, when I firstwent to work there, I told him I
wanted to get the salary I wasgetting in New York, because
Jersey does not pay nurses theway they do in New York.
And they gave it to me.
What's the average salary of anurse?
When I started nursing, I wasgetting paid for the first job I
ever had $11.50 an hour, whatthat's, I know.
(11:29):
I couldn't even live on it.
It was ridiculous.
And now I do do.
Well, now Do I think I shouldbe making more?
Absolutely.
But the newer nurses coming in,brand new nurses are making
$73,000 a year as a brand newnurse, with all the benefits and
everything with all thebenefits.
When I was in New York, I workedunder unions all the time and
they were great because they gotus better health insurance,
(11:50):
better vacation time, sick timewhere this is a battle every day
for all of us, they could takewhatever they want away from us.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Wow, do you see a change now that a lot of
hospitals are becomingcorporations or part of a
corporation?
Speaker 1 (12:04):
Well, that's why, exactly so when I was telling
you the way they want to move,move, move.
It's not.
It's not about patient careanymore.
Be honest with you.
It has become a factory.
I mean, there are surgeons thatare doing 14 total joints, like
in 27 minutes it goes, it's,it's ridiculous and we cannot
move fast enough for these men.
(12:25):
We're always being told whyisn't the patient in the room?
Yet?
It's, it's ridiculous, it's,it's not, it's a factory.
Now.
And it breaks my heart becauseit's not about a person, it's
about get them in, get them out,get them in, get them out.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Is that because you're in a big hospital, you
think it's different.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
No, I think what you said.
It's a corporation now and it'sall about making money.
It's not about patient careanymore.
When I walk through the ER,there are people it looks like a
mass unit that are out in thehallways.
I mean I'm talking 50 patientsbecause there's not enough room.
They just keep on taking them.
It's a business, it's acorporation.
It is not about caring for thepatient anymore.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Many times they say oh, you know, the doctor sent me
said I need surgery, I don'treally need, they want the money
.
Do you see cases like this?
When people come in, they openthem up and then, oh, you don't
need to be here.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
I have a.
Well, I have a problem whenthere's a 96 year old man coming
in for a major vascular surgery.
I have a problem with thatbecause, first of all, it's
almost a six hour surgery andthere's no there's no guarantee
it's going to work.
So why put a 96 year old manthrough that if it's not
necessary, six-year-old manthrough that if it's not
(13:33):
necessary?
I've seen it that I don't thinkit's necessary.
But you know, as much as they'dlike us to be patient advocates
, they don't want us to bepatient advocates.
They want us to be quiet, doour job and go home and do you
think the doctors feel it'sreally bad?
Speaker 2 (13:44):
also the surgeons.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Oh, I think, the surgeons.
The only thing the surgeonsfeel bad about or are bothered
by is that we don't move fastenough.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
Really Wow.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
You can actually talk to any nurse that I've ever
worked with.
That would say the exact samething I'm saying, do you see?
Speaker 2 (14:01):
more and more operation moving to automation,
to AI doing some of it.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
We have robotic surgery that we do with, which I
am fascinated by that.
The surgeon can be over hereand the patients here and be
doing the operation from theother side of the room.
It fascinates me.
But we're doing a lot ofrobotic surgery now, with knee
surgery and mostly generalsurgery, GYN surgery.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
So in that case, who gives the instrument?
The robot takes itself.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
So no, so the machine that we use, the robot that we
use, we set up with thedifferent instruments on the
robot arms, so all the arms havethe instrument that's needed
and the surgeon is over to theside controlling it with arms or
, you know, remote controls thatthey could do from the other
side of the room.
It's really fascinating.
This can take a job away from anurse.
(14:49):
This can take a job away from anurse.
Yes, wow, yes, yes, becausebasically, when they put once
the scrub tech has put all thearms on the robot, they're just
waiting for the procedure to bedone, just sitting there waiting
for it to be done.
But, they need somebody to setthat up for them, so they're
still wanted.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
What's the biggest challenge of your job?
Speaker 1 (15:12):
It's working faster.
Really, it's just you justcan't move fast enough.
You can't make.
That's my biggest challenge.
Is the speed that, no matterhow fast you work, it's not fast
enough.
You can't make that.
That's my biggest challenge.
Is the speed that no matter howfast you work, it's not fast
enough.
And every OR nurse knowsexactly what I'm talking about.
That's the challenge.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
You mean to give the instrument faster?
No, no, no.
Speaker 1 (15:30):
To turn over the rooms.
So, in other words, when I sayturn over the rooms, you do an
operation, get that patient outof the room, start cleaning up
for the next case, get the nextone in, get that one in, pass
them out, get the room ready,get the next one in.
It's like so you have to cleanthe room, or do we don't have to
clean the room?
We have a lot of ancillary helpMSTs, medical, surgical staff
(15:50):
that will get the equipment thatwe need for the room and
environmental services willclean the room.
Then we just go into the roomand that's where we do all of
our setup.
You do go out between casesbecause you got to get the dirty
instruments out and you have tomake sure the patient goes to
recovery room and you hand inyour papers and charges to the
front desk.
So you get like 10 minutes outof the room, but then you have
(16:11):
to scrub again, then you have tohurry up and start all over
again.
It's repetitive, basically.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
What would you say that the character trait or the
skills that one needs to have inorder to be a nurse in an
operating room?
Speaker 1 (16:23):
You have to be, have the ability to be yelled at and
you have to be strong with that,because surgeons and I get it
they're under a lot of stress.
You know they're operating onsomebody.
They, you know, trying toeither save that person or, you
know, help them in any way theycan.
And they're under a lot ofstress and I understand that.
(16:46):
So when you don't havesomething there for them or they
hit something that theyshouldn't hit, they start losing
their mind, yelling at you andyou literally have to.
Just it's not you, it's notpersonal, it's just that's the
way it is in the operating roomand you have to be fast and if
you're not fast a mover, thenthe operating room isn't for you
.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
Do you also see kids being?
Speaker 1 (17:05):
operated on.
No, I don't do children thatoften, but when I see them in
the holding area before theyhave surgery, I go over and fist
pump them just to make themsmile.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
Is it emotionally more difficult to work on a kid
than work on?
Speaker 1 (17:18):
a Depends on what the surgery is.
I mean, if it's something thatlike brain tumor or something
that's, you know, catastrophic,yeah, I have a hard time with
that.
With any patient that you comein and you know we do frozen
sections on people who arehaving breast surgery.
Frozen section is you take thespecimen of the cancer that they
found and they send it forfrozen and the frozen section
(17:40):
they'll call you and thepathologist will tell you
exactly what they found.
And if it's cancer and they're32 years old and it's metastatic
, it breaks your heart.
You're in that room and you're.
You feel it.
You feel it in your heart.
And although I told you that Idon't like to be on the floors
because I don't get attached topatients in the OR, it's not as
you don't get attached topatients In the OR, it's not as
you don't get as attached, butit does affect you.
(18:02):
When you hear bad news about apatient's life, you know, oh,
when somebody dies on theoperating room, that, or if they
have metastatic cancer orsomething like that, it's hard
to hear.
You know your heart sinks, youknow.
Did it happen to you thatsomebody died in the operation
Years ago?
It was just County MedicalCenter, a young girl 18, was in
(18:24):
a motor vehicle accident and shegot hit in the side.
Beautiful girl, I'll neverforget it, she was gorgeous.
I was fairly new in theoperating room and they were
giving all blood products to tryand save her and unfortunately
she died and it was devastatingto me.
And the room was filled withpeople.
And then you know people arelaughing.
You know we're wrapping theyoung girl's body and they're
(18:45):
laughing and I just stopped fora minute.
I go, you guys, this woman'sdead.
How do you do this?
How can you laugh?
Where's humor in this?
And you know what they said.
If you're going to let thisaffect you every time, when this
happens, you're never going tomake it in the OR.
When this happens, you're nevergoing to make it in the OR.
This is how we survive, wow, andthat's exactly what they said
and they were right.
And when they told me that,that is exactly what I learned,
because I lost a lot AtWestchester County Medical
(19:06):
Center, it was the number onetrauma center.
We were losing patients all thetime Through motor vehicle
accidents, ATV accidents, justmultiple things, and it was hard
.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
So how do you come out of this?
At the end of the day, you comehome and you have all these
images in your mind.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
You just say a prayer for them and that's it.
I mean, you just learn to livewith it.
You know it does bother me.
I can remember names ofpatients that I took care of,
that died in the OR, that brokemy heart.
But you know, as sad as it maysound, it's a job, you know,
unfortunately.
But it does affect me.
I'm not going to lie and say itdoesn't affect me, but I can't
(19:44):
let it affect me all the timebecause I'd never go to work.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
Any case that sticks out in your mind more than
others.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
A little boy at Westchester County Medical
Center.
There was a terrible busaccident and he had a skull
fracture and the brain wascoming through the skull and he
was only um seven years old andhe he died.
And another young man, he wascrushed by a fire truck, in
between a fire truck and a car.
He was 19.
We did like six surgeries onhim and he lost from his pelvis
(20:11):
down.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
Oh, my god his fit.
Speaker 1 (20:13):
He kept on getting gangrene from the um, from the
accident, from.
Gain green is when the tissuestarts dying.
Ooh, and we removed both of itfrom his hip, his legs, from his
hip down and we actually did apenectomy.
If you can imagine what is that.
They removed his Penis, Hispenis, yeah, and that crushed
(20:34):
his soul and he ended up dyingas well because the gain green
just kept on going up.
He was 19.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
Up dying as well because the gangrene just kept
on going up.
He was 19.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Marshall was his name and that was.
I'll tell you that was about 30years ago and I've never
forgotten the kid.
That was another difficult.
He died because we saw him allthe time.
Every time we saw him we weredoing a procedure on him.
So that's not something that wenormally do see them so often,
but him, because he had multiplebecause of the gangrene.
We actually had to keep onremoving the gangrene from his
(21:02):
body.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Wow, that's a terrible story.
Do you ever run into ex-patientor family member out on the
street or anywhere?
Speaker 1 (21:11):
There are patients that I'll be out somewhere and
they said, oh, you took care ofme in the OR and I'd be like how
do you even recognize me?
Because we can't even recognizeeach other with the hat on and
the mask and everything else.
He said something about you.
I just recognize you and hesaid thank you and that made me
feel wonderful, but not all thetime, because they don't
remember the OR.
They remember the holding area,the OR you get medication that
(21:31):
cause amnesia before you go into relax, you make you feel less
anxious, so they don't rememberanything.
And then they go to therecovery room.
So the OR never, like holdingarea, will get gifts and cards.
Recovery room will get giftsand cards, not the OR, because
nobody remembers us and maybethat's a good thing.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
I don't know, that is funny, yeah.
So what advice would you givesomebody that want to break into
nursing and become an operatingroom nurse?
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Of all the nursing, I think the operating room is the
best.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
Really why.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
I really do because for multiple reasons, I think
it's a real specialty.
You really get to know thehuman body from head to toe and
literally see it.
You know all the nurses aretogether, we work together, we
work well together, and I thinkthat's a little different on the
floor, maybe because we couldbe in rooms next to each other
and we could just help eachother out.
(22:23):
I love the OR.
I would never leave and I'venever wanted to be in management
.
I never wanted to not be in theOR.
So I enjoy being present.
You like the adrenaline rush,absolutely Love it.
I love running around.
I might complain that we haveto move.
I like, like that, but noteverybody, not a lot of people
like that, but I understand thatthey pretty much run us into
(22:44):
the ground.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
So what is the biggest reward of your job?
Speaker 1 (22:47):
Seeing people who are in the holding area before they
go into the operating room andthey're crying because they have
breast cancer, any type ofcancer.
They're scared and just holdingtheir hand and making them
laugh is that's the mostrewarding thing for me.
I love to see them smile, laugh.
I just want to take thatanxiety away from them and I get
(23:08):
how they're feeling.
I mean, I've been there withbreast cancer so I know they're
frightened.
I understand that, and just tohave them smile or just makes
makes me happy, makes you happy,makes them feel better, and
they're really very appreciativetoo when they feel that you
understand them.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
All right, then.
On that note, thank you so muchfor doing it.
Thank you, marav I appreciateit, it's interesting to speak to
somebody that actually lives itand not just on TV.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
Yes, and the surgeons aren't as good looking as they
are on TV.
Just saying Closing statement.
All right, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
Barav.
Okay, that's a wrap for today.
If you have a comment orquestion or would like us to
cover a certain job, please letus know.
Visit our website athowmuchcanimakeinfo.
We would love to hear from you.
And, on your way out, don'tforget to subscribe and share
this episode with anyone who iscurious about their next job.
(24:07):
See you next time.
We have robotic surgery that we do with, which I
am fascinated by that.
The surgeon can be over hereand the patients here and be
doing the operation from theother side of the room.
It fascinates me.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Yes, we're going to talk about robotic surgeries and
others.
Welcome back to how Much Can IMake?
I'm your host, mara Vo Vozeri.
Today I'm going to chat with myfriend, patty Columbia Walsh,
who's been an operating roomnurse for 40 years.
I really want to know what it'slike to work under high
pressure in such high-stakeenvironment.
(00:36):
I don't think I could do this,can you?
So let's find out what reallygoes on behind those OR doors.
Patty, thanks a lot for doingit.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
Oh, thank you for having me.
I appreciate it.
I appreciate it as well.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
First, let's start with how did you become an
operating room nurse?
Speaker 1 (00:54):
When I was in nursing school I never liked the
bedside with patients because Ibecame attached to the patients
and it was very difficult for meto watch people who were sick
every day.
So I decided that the OR wasfor me, because a patient comes
in, we take care of them and wenever see them again, and that
was more.
(01:14):
It was easier for me to becomea nurse doing that type of
nursing and also I was told whenI was going through a rotation
of the OR in nursing school Iwas told by an OR nurse that you
should do not become an ORnurse.
You're never going to do it andthat also gave me a lot more
inspiration of going intosomething that I was told I
couldn't do.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Why did they think you cannot do it?
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Well, it was my second day in the OR that I
couldn't glove and gown myself,which is something we do, and it
was the second day.
And she just just a typical ORnurse who the older nurses who
eat their young.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
So wait, let's back up for a second.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
How many years did you have to study?
I was in the school for fourand a half years, two for
regular schooling and two and ahalf for nursing school.
You don't go into a specialtyuntil you graduate from school
and you choose what specialtyyou want to be in.
And you always wanted to be anurse, always wanted to.
No, actually I wanted to be aschool teacher.
But Sister Miriam, when I wasin Catholic school, told me I
(02:15):
did well in the sciences.
I should become a nurse ratherthan a teacher, and that's
exactly why I became a nurse.
You have to listen to thosenuns and that's exactly why I
became a nurse.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
You have to listen to those nuns, okay, so what
exactly do you do as a nurse inan operating room?
Speaker 1 (02:30):
So in the OR it's interesting, you know we get the
room ready for any particularcase.
We have, Like I do, spinesurgery and neurosurgery mostly
and the setup for theseparticular procedures is quite a
lot Instrumentation, makingsure the room has everything
that the surgeon wants for theprocedure, and then, once all
that's set, the patient comesinto the room and literally I
(02:53):
probably see the patient forliterally about three or four
minutes and then the anesthesiaputs them to sleep.
I'm a circulator and there's ascrub nurse, so the circulator
is dirty, the scrub person isclean.
What is a circulator?
What do you do?
So whatever the doctor wants orthe scrub tech wants in the
room, anything they need on thefield, I get it and then I give
(03:17):
it to them in a steriletechnique where I have a package
that's not sterile but then Iopen up the package and what's
in the package is sterile.
I have a package that's notsterile, but then I open up the
package and what's in thepackage is sterile and then the
scrub tech takes it from me.
I used to scrub butunfortunately my hands react to
rubber now.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
So I can't scrub, but I actually enjoyed scrubbing
when you scrub, you mean youscrub the patient.
Speaker 1 (03:35):
No, no, no, I'm sorry .
So you have to scrub your handsclean, yes, from the top of
your fingers all the way down toyour elbows.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
And then once you then you go in with a sterile
towel, you dry your hands off,arms off and put on a gown and
gloves and then at that pointyou're sterile.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
I prefer doing that.
So, yes, that's the intro.
You have to know every name ofevery instrument, which is
pretty impressive, because wehave six different services
vascular GYN.
Every one of them has adifferent instrumentation that
they use that you have to havethe knowledge of.
When the surgeon asks you,first of all, he's not supposed
to turn around and ask you foran instrument.
All he does is this Sometimes,if you're very good at what you
(04:12):
do, you know what he wantsbefore he even asks for it, when
you've been doing it for awhile.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
So when he puts out his hand, you're supposed to
know what instrument he needs.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
Yes, you should know, like, if you're, and if you see
that he's cutting a suture, yougive him a scissor.
He doesn't have to ask for it.
You should know that.
So you watch every step of thesurgery.
You have to, as a scrub person,as a scrub nurse or tech, okay,
you have to be in the operation.
You can't be looking around.
(04:41):
You have to be present theentire time.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
And how long did you have to go through training?
Speaker 1 (04:45):
So six months.
I actually had a phenomenaltraining at Westchester County
Medical Center when I became anurse, and for six months you go
through multiple servicesgeneral surgery, urology surgery
, gyn surgery, neurosurgery,vascular surgery and all these
six services.
We were trained each month in adifferent service in order to
(05:07):
learn it.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
So what is a day in your life like at work?
Speaker 1 (05:10):
It's pretty hectic because in the operating room
the surgeon wants you to move asquickly as you possibly can, so
they want to get in the room,they want to make sure
everything in the room is therefor the procedure and they don't
like to wait.
It's important that before I gointo the room that there's a
sheet that tells you everythingthat the doctor wants in the
room, that you have to be surethat you have that in the room
(05:32):
before you're permitted to bringthe patient back.
Once you have everything set,that's when you bring the
patient back.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
So you get the list the day before there's a list no
.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
So every morning when we get into work there's a cart
that's filled with theinstrumentation and everything
that you need for that procedure.
So there's central supply whichpicks the cases of this list
that we get every morning.
They pick everything for thecase.
When we get the case we makesure that everything they picked
is in that cart because theydon't get yelled at.
We do so.
(06:01):
We make sure everything that issupposed to be in that cart's
in that cart and then, once werealize that, we go into the
room and we set up the room.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
So you work closely with anesthesiologists, with a
surgeon who else theanesthesiologists we help once
the patient.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
They're starting to put the patient to sleep.
We stand with theanesthesiologists to help hold
the endotracheal tube beforethey place it.
We make sure it's placed beforewe even start prepping the
patient for the surgery and thenI work with the surgeon and
with the scrub tech and anyoneelse who happens to be in the
room that might be needed forthe procedure.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
Do you ever cringe when you see them opening up
somebody?
Speaker 1 (06:39):
I don't cringe when I see surgery.
I do cringe when I see patientsthat have allowed themselves to
have growths on their body fora year and then they come into
the OR and they're massive andyou can't imagine that these
people actually were living withthis.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
That's very difficult for me to watch because I
cannot for the life of meunderstand why anybody would do
that.
I don't know if it's becausethey don't have health insurance
or what the reason is, but Iit's scary sometimes for me,
does it ever?
Speaker 2 (07:10):
happen that in the room you have an emergency
situation?
Yes, what happens then?
Tell me.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
So we do a procedure that's called ALIFT, an anterior
lumbar interbody fusion, whereyou go through the abdomen and
you have a vascular surgeon andspine surgeon.
The vascular surgeon isresponsible for getting access
to the lumbar wherever in thespine that we're operating on,
and because you have a vascularsurgeon opening up to get to the
lumbar area for the spinesurgeon there's a lot of vessels
(07:39):
that are very, very importantthat you don't nick, and I have
been present where surgeons havenicked the vessel and the
patient starts bleedingprofusely.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
What do you do then?
Speaker 1 (07:50):
Literally, there is a button in the operating room
that you have to push whensomething like that happens,
because then everybody who'savailable within the operating
room suite will come running andhelp out With getting blood,
with doing whatever it is that'sneeded to save the patient.
Wow, it's happened to meprobably two times in my career.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
Were you scared.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Oh, petrified.
Petrified because I mean, evenwhen you're petrified and you
look at the surgeon and he'sbeside himself because the
bleeding is unbelievable, itscares you.
Because he's scared he's theone that's responsible for I
mean, all of us in the room areresponsible for saving the
patient, but in reality it'sreally his technique that's
going to save that patient.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
Wow, so you worked with many different surgeons.
Everybody Do you have favorites.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Yes, dr Solari, he's a spine surgeon.
I call him my boyfriend.
No, he's wonderful.
I've worked with him for 11years.
I am always in his room.
If I'm not in his room, he getsupset.
So when I take off today, Iwork.
He works on Mondays, so I'm notthere today and I'm sure he's
asking where's Patty.
But no, him and I work welltogether because I know his
(08:59):
speed and we work very quicklytogether.
What's the average time of anoperation?
So it depends on the operation.
But in the hospital, which isvery difficult for nurses and
techs is that we are required acertain amount of time to get
the next patient in the OR.
So in other words, if a caseends, we have 30 minutes less
(09:19):
than 30 minutes to get the nextpatient in setting up the entire
room and some of these cases wehave 15 instrumentation that we
have to open up in a sterileway in order for the person
that's scrubbed to take it fromus.
And it takes time.
But the cases it depends onwhat the case is Like.
A lift anterior lumbarinterbody fusion takes anywhere
(09:41):
from an hour and a half to twohours.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
How many surgeries can you do a day?
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Depending on the speed of the surgeon, four to
five a day.
So it's go, go, go from thetime.
It's no, no, go from the time.
No, you get 45 minute lunch andthat's all you get.
You move constantly, you're inmovement and it's an eight hour
shift.
It's an eight hour shift.
Yeah, seven and a half hoursand we have a 45 minute lunch.
So they don't pay us for alunch.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
They don't pay you for a lunch.
No, they don't.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
They're not very nurse friendly.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Is your job a union job?
Speaker 1 (10:10):
No, it's not.
So they can literally changewhatever they want.
For if, like we, were gettingpaid four hours for call time,
they took an hour away from us.
If we got called in, we wouldautomatically get paid four
hours.
They took an hour from us.
What do you mean If you're oncall?
So if you're on call, you getpaid $5 an hour on call, every
(10:30):
hour you're on call, and if youget called in, you get time and
a half.
If you're there for two hours,they would pay you for four
hours, but they took an houraway from us.
So now we only get paid if wego in for just three hours.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
Why would you be on call if you are on on on every
day?
Speaker 1 (10:45):
for you have to.
You have to take call.
It's part of your job.
You have to.
You don't have a choice, sothat's after work hour the call.
Usually I take it on theweekends because I'm not monday
through friday.
I prefer not to work rightafter my shift is over.
If they want me to stay, Iprefer not to do that.
So I take call.
You take the call yourself.
You choose to take what you wantas long as it's available and I
(11:06):
usually take it on a saturday,sunday, so you have to negotiate
your own salary.
When I went in, when I firstwent to work there, I told him I
wanted to get the salary I wasgetting in New York, because
Jersey does not pay nurses theway they do in New York.
And they gave it to me.
What's the average salary of anurse?
When I started nursing, I wasgetting paid for the first job I
ever had $11.50 an hour, whatthat's, I know.
(11:29):
I couldn't even live on it.
It was ridiculous.
And now I do do.
Well, now Do I think I shouldbe making more?
Absolutely.
But the newer nurses coming in,brand new nurses are making
$73,000 a year as a brand newnurse, with all the benefits and
everything with all thebenefits.
When I was in New York, I workedunder unions all the time and
they were great because they gotus better health insurance,
(11:50):
better vacation time, sick timewhere this is a battle every day
for all of us, they could takewhatever they want away from us.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Wow, do you see a change now that a lot of
hospitals are becomingcorporations or part of a
corporation?
Speaker 1 (12:04):
Well, that's why, exactly so when I was telling
you the way they want to move,move, move.
It's not.
It's not about patient careanymore.
Be honest with you.
It has become a factory.
I mean, there are surgeons thatare doing 14 total joints, like
in 27 minutes it goes, it's,it's ridiculous and we cannot
move fast enough for these men.
(12:25):
We're always being told whyisn't the patient in the room?
Yet?
It's, it's ridiculous, it's,it's not, it's a factory.
Now.
And it breaks my heart becauseit's not about a person, it's
about get them in, get them out,get them in, get them out.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Is that because you're in a big hospital, you
think it's different.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
No, I think what you said.
It's a corporation now and it'sall about making money.
It's not about patient careanymore.
When I walk through the ER,there are people it looks like a
mass unit that are out in thehallways.
I mean I'm talking 50 patientsbecause there's not enough room.
They just keep on taking them.
It's a business, it's acorporation.
It is not about caring for thepatient anymore.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Many times they say oh, you know, the doctor sent me
said I need surgery, I don'treally need, they want the money
.
Do you see cases like this?
When people come in, they openthem up and then, oh, you don't
need to be here.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
I have a.
Well, I have a problem whenthere's a 96 year old man coming
in for a major vascular surgery.
I have a problem with thatbecause, first of all, it's
almost a six hour surgery andthere's no there's no guarantee
it's going to work.
So why put a 96 year old manthrough that if it's not
necessary, six-year-old manthrough that if it's not
(13:33):
necessary?
I've seen it that I don't thinkit's necessary.
But you know, as much as they'dlike us to be patient advocates
, they don't want us to bepatient advocates.
They want us to be quiet, doour job and go home and do you
think the doctors feel it'sreally bad?
Speaker 2 (13:44):
also the surgeons.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Oh, I think, the surgeons.
The only thing the surgeonsfeel bad about or are bothered
by is that we don't move fastenough.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
Really Wow.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
You can actually talk to any nurse that I've ever
worked with.
That would say the exact samething I'm saying, do you see?
Speaker 2 (14:01):
more and more operation moving to automation,
to AI doing some of it.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
We have robotic surgery that we do with, which I
am fascinated by that.
The surgeon can be over hereand the patients here and be
doing the operation from theother side of the room.
It fascinates me.
But we're doing a lot ofrobotic surgery now, with knee
surgery and mostly generalsurgery, GYN surgery.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
So in that case, who gives the instrument?
The robot takes itself.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
So no, so the machine that we use, the robot that we
use, we set up with thedifferent instruments on the
robot arms, so all the arms havethe instrument that's needed
and the surgeon is over to theside controlling it with arms or
, you know, remote controls thatthey could do from the other
side of the room.
It's really fascinating.
This can take a job away from anurse.
(14:49):
This can take a job away from anurse.
Yes, wow, yes, yes, becausebasically, when they put once
the scrub tech has put all thearms on the robot, they're just
waiting for the procedure to bedone, just sitting there waiting
for it to be done.
But, they need somebody to setthat up for them, so they're
still wanted.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
What's the biggest challenge of your job?
Speaker 1 (15:12):
It's working faster.
Really, it's just you justcan't move fast enough.
You can't make.
That's my biggest challenge.
Is the speed that, no matterhow fast you work, it's not fast
enough.
You can't make that.
That's my biggest challenge.
Is the speed that no matter howfast you work, it's not fast
enough.
And every OR nurse knowsexactly what I'm talking about.
That's the challenge.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
You mean to give the instrument faster?
No, no, no.
Speaker 1 (15:30):
To turn over the rooms.
So, in other words, when I sayturn over the rooms, you do an
operation, get that patient outof the room, start cleaning up
for the next case, get the nextone in, get that one in, pass
them out, get the room ready,get the next one in.
It's like so you have to cleanthe room, or do we don't have to
clean the room?
We have a lot of ancillary helpMSTs, medical, surgical staff
(15:50):
that will get the equipment thatwe need for the room and
environmental services willclean the room.
Then we just go into the roomand that's where we do all of
our setup.
You do go out between casesbecause you got to get the dirty
instruments out and you have tomake sure the patient goes to
recovery room and you hand inyour papers and charges to the
front desk.
So you get like 10 minutes outof the room, but then you have
(16:11):
to scrub again, then you have tohurry up and start all over
again.
It's repetitive, basically.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
What would you say that the character trait or the
skills that one needs to have inorder to be a nurse in an
operating room?
Speaker 1 (16:23):
You have to be, have the ability to be yelled at and
you have to be strong with that,because surgeons and I get it
they're under a lot of stress.
You know they're operating onsomebody.
They, you know, trying toeither save that person or, you
know, help them in any way theycan.
And they're under a lot ofstress and I understand that.
(16:46):
So when you don't havesomething there for them or they
hit something that theyshouldn't hit, they start losing
their mind, yelling at you andyou literally have to.
Just it's not you, it's notpersonal, it's just that's the
way it is in the operating roomand you have to be fast and if
you're not fast a mover, thenthe operating room isn't for you
.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
Do you also see kids being?
Speaker 1 (17:05):
operated on.
No, I don't do children thatoften, but when I see them in
the holding area before theyhave surgery, I go over and fist
pump them just to make themsmile.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
Is it emotionally more difficult to work on a kid
than work on?
Speaker 1 (17:18):
a Depends on what the surgery is.
I mean, if it's something thatlike brain tumor or something
that's, you know, catastrophic,yeah, I have a hard time with
that.
With any patient that you comein and you know we do frozen
sections on people who arehaving breast surgery.
Frozen section is you take thespecimen of the cancer that they
found and they send it forfrozen and the frozen section
(17:40):
they'll call you and thepathologist will tell you
exactly what they found.
And if it's cancer and they're32 years old and it's metastatic
, it breaks your heart.
You're in that room and you're.
You feel it.
You feel it in your heart.
And although I told you that Idon't like to be on the floors
because I don't get attached topatients in the OR, it's not as
you don't get attached topatients In the OR, it's not as
you don't get as attached, butit does affect you.
(18:02):
When you hear bad news about apatient's life, you know, oh,
when somebody dies on theoperating room, that, or if they
have metastatic cancer orsomething like that, it's hard
to hear.
You know your heart sinks, youknow.
Did it happen to you thatsomebody died in the operation
Years ago?
It was just County MedicalCenter, a young girl 18, was in
(18:24):
a motor vehicle accident and shegot hit in the side.
Beautiful girl, I'll neverforget it, she was gorgeous.
I was fairly new in theoperating room and they were
giving all blood products to tryand save her and unfortunately
she died and it was devastatingto me.
And the room was filled withpeople.
And then you know people arelaughing.
You know we're wrapping theyoung girl's body and they're
(18:45):
laughing and I just stopped fora minute.
I go, you guys, this woman'sdead.
How do you do this?
How can you laugh?
Where's humor in this?
And you know what they said.
If you're going to let thisaffect you every time, when this
happens, you're never going tomake it in the OR.
When this happens, you're nevergoing to make it in the OR.
This is how we survive, wow, andthat's exactly what they said
and they were right.
And when they told me that,that is exactly what I learned,
because I lost a lot AtWestchester County Medical
(19:06):
Center, it was the number onetrauma center.
We were losing patients all thetime Through motor vehicle
accidents, ATV accidents, justmultiple things, and it was hard
.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
So how do you come out of this?
At the end of the day, you comehome and you have all these
images in your mind.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
You just say a prayer for them and that's it.
I mean, you just learn to livewith it.
You know it does bother me.
I can remember names ofpatients that I took care of,
that died in the OR, that brokemy heart.
But you know, as sad as it maysound, it's a job, you know,
unfortunately.
But it does affect me.
I'm not going to lie and say itdoesn't affect me, but I can't
(19:44):
let it affect me all the timebecause I'd never go to work.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
Any case that sticks out in your mind more than
others.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
A little boy at Westchester County Medical
Center.
There was a terrible busaccident and he had a skull
fracture and the brain wascoming through the skull and he
was only um seven years old andhe he died.
And another young man, he wascrushed by a fire truck, in
between a fire truck and a car.
He was 19.
We did like six surgeries onhim and he lost from his pelvis
(20:11):
down.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
Oh, my god his fit.
Speaker 1 (20:13):
He kept on getting gangrene from the um, from the
accident, from.
Gain green is when the tissuestarts dying.
Ooh, and we removed both of itfrom his hip, his legs, from his
hip down and we actually did apenectomy.
If you can imagine what is that.
They removed his Penis, Hispenis, yeah, and that crushed
(20:34):
his soul and he ended up dyingas well because the gain green
just kept on going up.
He was 19.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
Up dying as well because the gangrene just kept
on going up.
He was 19.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Marshall was his name and that was.
I'll tell you that was about 30years ago and I've never
forgotten the kid.
That was another difficult.
He died because we saw him allthe time.
Every time we saw him we weredoing a procedure on him.
So that's not something that wenormally do see them so often,
but him, because he had multiplebecause of the gangrene.
We actually had to keep onremoving the gangrene from his
(21:02):
body.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Wow, that's a terrible story.
Do you ever run into ex-patientor family member out on the
street or anywhere?
Speaker 1 (21:11):
There are patients that I'll be out somewhere and
they said, oh, you took care ofme in the OR and I'd be like how
do you even recognize me?
Because we can't even recognizeeach other with the hat on and
the mask and everything else.
He said something about you.
I just recognize you and hesaid thank you and that made me
feel wonderful, but not all thetime, because they don't
remember the OR.
They remember the holding area,the OR you get medication that
(21:31):
cause amnesia before you go into relax, you make you feel less
anxious, so they don't rememberanything.
And then they go to therecovery room.
So the OR never, like holdingarea, will get gifts and cards.
Recovery room will get giftsand cards, not the OR, because
nobody remembers us and maybethat's a good thing.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
I don't know, that is funny, yeah.
So what advice would you givesomebody that want to break into
nursing and become an operatingroom nurse?
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Of all the nursing, I think the operating room is the
best.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
Really why.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
I really do because for multiple reasons, I think
it's a real specialty.
You really get to know thehuman body from head to toe and
literally see it.
You know all the nurses aretogether, we work together, we
work well together, and I thinkthat's a little different on the
floor, maybe because we couldbe in rooms next to each other
and we could just help eachother out.
(22:23):
I love the OR.
I would never leave and I'venever wanted to be in management
.
I never wanted to not be in theOR.
So I enjoy being present.
You like the adrenaline rush,absolutely Love it.
I love running around.
I might complain that we haveto move.
I like, like that, but noteverybody, not a lot of people
like that, but I understand thatthey pretty much run us into
(22:44):
the ground.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
So what is the biggest reward of your job?
Speaker 1 (22:47):
Seeing people who are in the holding area before they
go into the operating room andthey're crying because they have
breast cancer, any type ofcancer.
They're scared and just holdingtheir hand and making them
laugh is that's the mostrewarding thing for me.
I love to see them smile, laugh.
I just want to take thatanxiety away from them and I get
(23:08):
how they're feeling.
I mean, I've been there withbreast cancer so I know they're
frightened.
I understand that, and just tohave them smile or just makes
makes me happy, makes you happy,makes them feel better, and
they're really very appreciativetoo when they feel that you
understand them.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
All right, then.
On that note, thank you so muchfor doing it.
Thank you, marav I appreciateit, it's interesting to speak to
somebody that actually lives itand not just on TV.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
Yes, and the surgeons aren't as good looking as they
are on TV.
Just saying Closing statement.
All right, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
Barav.
Okay, that's a wrap for today.
If you have a comment orquestion or would like us to
cover a certain job, please letus know.
Visit our website athowmuchcanimakeinfo.
We would love to hear from you.
And, on your way out, don'tforget to subscribe and share
this episode with anyone who iscurious about their next job.
(24:07):
See you next time.
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