July 2, 2024 • 35 mins
Are generational labels really useful in the workplace, or are they just stereotypes that hold us back? In this episode of "Real Talk on Talent," we boldly assert that generational differences are often overrated. Our discussion questions the traditional narratives around Gen Z, Millennials, and Baby Boomers, suggesting that age and life stages play a bigger role in workplace behavior and preferences.
With stories and examples, we argue that while social events do shape generational experiences, the core values in the workplace—like fair compensation and meaningful work—are universally shared. Tune in for actionable strategies to attract and retain a diverse pool of talent, ensuring your organization remains inclusive and forward-thinking.
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Links & Mentions:
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➡︎ Hot Topic: Gen Alpha in the Workplace
➡︎ Pew Research
➡︎ McKinsey & Company Analysis
➡︎ Survey Says Gen Z Workforce Is Toxic
➡︎ Why I Want AI to Do My Dishes and Laundry (So I Can Focus on Art and Writing)
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Welcome to Real Talk on Talent, a human resources
podcast where we talk abouttalent acquisition, recruiting
and all things hiring.
Welcome back, hey.
Pleasure to be here.
We have a couple changes Ithink that we need to address.
Okay, let's hear about them.
Speaker 3 (00:26):
Yep, oh casty cast.
Technically I should still bewearing it, but I'm just over it
and it doesn't fit under a lotof my clothes.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
I do feel like we need to clarify.
Your doctor told you you cantake off the brace.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
So yes, yes, yes, yes .
Speaker 2 (00:39):
You're not just going rogue?
No, I'm not going rogue.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
Like I can take it off during certain times.
Perhaps I lean on the takeoff alittle bit more than I should,
but five weeks in I'm healinglike a champ.
Of course you are.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
You're being good as new in no time.
Even better.
Congratulations, I'm glad thatyou are feeling good and it's
healing well.
Yeah, yeah yeah, and our secondexciting change is we're in a
new office.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Oh yay, yes, we are New background, kind of maybe
New chair, it's a similar setup,but we have a new human office.
Speaker 2 (01:11):
Yeah, we do, and I love it.
It is awesome.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Yeah, it's awesome.
So human had been at thebeaches in Jacksonville for gosh
20-something years and we kindof outgrew that space, so we
wound up taking over justdifferent buildings and so we
had a very fragmentedinconsistent Like a human campus
of just different locations.
Yeah, which we?
Speaker 2 (01:32):
loved, we did love.
Location was great, but nowit's like I can walk down the
hall to go talk to anyone.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
Yeah, it's so nice.
Yeah, so we've kind of we'vegrown up.
Yeah, yeah, we're in our bigboy.
So come visit our office.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Yeah, it's really awesome.
Speaker 3 (01:44):
Yeah, yeah, for sure, definitely Highly recommend Yay
.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Cool, okay, any other exciting things going on?
Uh, you know no.
That'll probably come out Justpodcasting.
The most exciting thing wecould do D generational
differences.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
We are talking about generation differences we are,
but I think we have someopinions about generational
differences in the workforce.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
But that's what we're going to talk about.
That's what we're going to talkabout.
So we have gone through all thefive pillars, so we've come
back around to people, correct,so this is our people topic and
we wanted to talk aboutgenerational differences in the
workforce.
But, as you and I hadconversations leading up to this
, we literally looked at eachother and said it's kind of BS,
(02:31):
yeah, which is a bold statement.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
This whole episode is going to be a hot take.
A hot take, hot topic, let's goAll right.
Okay, so I'm going to set thestage a little bit.
If you're good with that, let'sdo it.
So.
Stage a little bit.
If you're good with that, let'sdo it.
So, when people talk aboutgenerational differences in the
workforce, it's a very validtopic and it's something that's
been around for a long time.
But I would like for you toplease explain why you and I
(02:55):
both looked at each other andsaid we don't want to talk about
.
Oh, what is Gen Z doing in theworkforce today?
Or, you know, this is what babyboomers are all about Like.
Can you please give a justsynopsis of what we're going to
talk about today?
Speaker 3 (03:09):
Yeah, so I think prior to this, prior to this
particular podcast, we both dida fair amount of research.
Obviously, these areconversations that we're having
a lot, our partners are askingit about.
You know how do we do it?
So we've done a good amount ofresearch and I think when we
looked at the research and whenwe really thought about what it
(03:30):
was saying, what we realized wasis these generational
differences are really kind ofbased on stereotypes that don't
necessarily provide a lot ofvalue and insight if you are
trying to make decisions aroundhow to attract and retain
different generations and agreed, and I'm cut you off.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
But I have to add in here is that the reason that I
feel so strongly about this it'snot just from the research, but
I'm a millennial.
I'm smack dab in millennial agerange, depending on what years
you put on that and early in mycareer I became a leader in the
business and I cannot tell youhow many times it was that of
(04:14):
the era of millennial bashing.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
Oh, yes, yes, yes, I remember.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
And so I had so many times where I would sit across
the table from another leader ora client contact and they would
be just beating up millennialsleft right.
You know they don't want towork, they just want to feel
good, like that kind of thing.
And I'd say, well, I'm amillennial.
And their response was oh, butyou're not like all the yeah, of
course I'm like yes I am, I'm,I'm a hundred percent a
millennial and so my for mywhole career I've been, I.
(04:40):
I feel very strongly that thislike hitting of generations
against each other is silly, andI am just going to say I'm very
pro-Gensy.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
Yeah, so here's my thought on it.
So it's not about generationaldifferences, it's about
differences in age, and whereyou are in your age doesn't
dictate but it really influenceswhat you're looking for in work
(05:12):
, in life, and work is a hugepart of life, and that's not to
discount the impact of majorsocial events on generations.
That is definitely somethingthat impacts generations as a
whole.
But when you think about whatmost people want in employment
(05:35):
and in work life, it's kind ofthe same three things regardless
of generation.
Speaker 2 (05:36):
So I do want to get into that, but I want to you
kind of separated age andgeneration and like experiences.
I think the two are likecompletely intertwined.
Okay, so Pew has an article andwe'll link the article where
they talked about whenresearchers are looking at
generational differences,because our statement on saying
(05:57):
the generational discussion iskind of silly is not to say that
all the generations are thesame.
That's not what we're saying.
Obviously, based on age andexperiences, there are going to
be stereotypes based on how oldyou are or like you know.
But the Pew article talkedabout the researching elements
that go into generationalunderstanding and see if I can
(06:19):
remember them.
That's the life cycle effect,which is what you're talking
about.
So, how old are you?
What are your needs?
What are your perspectives?
One of the examples is theyounger you are, the less likely
you are to vote, and that wastrue for boomers when they were
young and that was true formillennials when they were young
.
Gen Z is like throwing a littlebit for a loop.
So again, pro Gen Z.
(06:40):
So there's a life cycle effectTo your point.
How old are you?
But, um, so there's a lifecycle effect to your point.
How old are you what's going on.
The second one is called aperiod effect, and when you have
these events in life thatimpact society as a whole, so
that could be the greatdepression, it could be wars,
could be 9-11 it could be thegreat depression.
(07:00):
Covid, covid, yes, it's one,yeah, and it has this impact
that changes your perspectives,your needs, your expectations.
And then the last one's calledthe cohort effect, and it's when
you have these period eventsthat have an increased impact on
a certain generation.
So that could be either like ifyou have the Vietnam or, better
(07:26):
yet, you have 9-11.
That happened 23 years ago.
So anyone who's younger, let'ssay younger than 33, it doesn't
have the same impact on them asolder generations, and so there
are.
Or the other side is, you havethese big period impacts that,
where you are in your life, havea bigger impact on you.
(07:47):
Okay, makes sense.
So, like 2008 recession, I wastrying to find my first job.
That's going to have a lotbigger impact on people my age
than if you're older,established or retired, and
didn't really have that big ofan impact on you.
Okay, so I love that.
So what are those three things?
Again, it was the life cycleeffect.
Okay, it's like what you'retalking about Age, we'll say,
we'll simplify it, Yep.
Age, okay, yep.
And then you have the periodimpact Okay, which is these big
(08:09):
events that change agenerational perspective, okay,
or just society, mm-hmm.
And the cohort impact, wherethese big events impact a
certain generation more, forwhatever reason Makes sense.
Speaker 3 (08:22):
Got it.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Very interesting.
So I actually and I went on awhole thing, but I think that's
an interesting.
I want to tie it back to workon that one specifically because
this is a talent podcast yes,yes.
So I want to ask you, as amanager of multiple generations,
when you think about like ageover generation, if that makes
(08:45):
sense.
Absolutely does, yes.
How does that impact yourapproach to managing employees
or connecting with employees?
How does that influence you asa manager?
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Yeah, yeah, great question.
So first, I think there's somany articles out there that
talk about you need to leaddifferent generations
differently.
I'm not buying it.
Different generationsdifferently I'm not buying it,
you're not.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
I'm not buying, it Okay, why?
Speaker 3 (09:07):
So I think you can lead everybody the same way by
being an empathetic leader.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Okay, okay, I was ready to be like.
No, dina, we're going to getinto this.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
But, yes, to me, the commonality between all of the
generations is that there's nocommonality.
I can have two people who arethe same age and they need to be
led differently.
So, to me, leading acrossmulti-generations is no
different than leading a diverseteam.
It'd be foolish and naive tothink that leadership is a one
(09:43):
size fits all approach.
So, to me, it's about beingempathetic and proactive with
your team and asking them how doyou like to be led,
understanding what works forthem, what doesn't work for them
, really developing a goodrelationship so you know how to
best grow and develop youremployees.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Yeah, that's really interesting, I agree.
I think there's more nuance,especially if I think about like
a new leader, because I thinkyou 100% you have to go in with
empathy, you have to go in withone-to-one, custom leadership
style.
I 100% agree with that.
I do think that the more youcan understand potential
(10:25):
influences you may notunderstand, the easier it is to
be empathetic.
Okay, yes, I would agree withthat, and that's true not just
for generational but likecultural backgrounds or
differences that way.
And so I do think it's importantand I think this is one big
disconnect between, let's justsay, the boomer and the Gen Z
generation is you could havesomeone who is a baby boomer,
(10:47):
who is completely but the needsof a Gen Zer.
They don't understand becausethey're forgetting the cohort
effect of that generation or thelife cycle that they're in, and
so they have a hard time beingempathetic because they can't
(11:09):
put themselves in those shoes orsay this is why you have this
perspective, this view.
That to me is not important,and so I do think that it
probably roots down to empathy.
But I think that there is amore active level of
understanding and appreciationfor how people show up
differently, based on the thingsthat impact them, because you
(11:29):
can easily be like oh, I'mreally caring, just tell me what
you want.
But sometimes you have to be alittle more proactive in saying
like I don't really get it butlike I'm here for you, yeah, so
I think, empathetic andauthenticity and transparency.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
So if I were to say those are three things that are
universal across generations,across age, and so how can you
be authentic in your leadership,how can you ask your team to be
their authentic versions ofthemselves?
And I think this gets you knowthat's a great way to lead
people.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
I completely agree.
What would you tell to Gen Zers?
Okay, because we constantlytalk about like boomers looking
down like the hierarchy oftraditional businesses and being
frustrated at Gen Zers.
What would you tell Gen Z thatwe need from them as leaders?
Speaker 3 (12:21):
Yeah, oh, great question, great question.
So I think the answer is timeOkay.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
And I'm going to say it in two different ways.
So, I think when you areyounger, you tend to be perhaps
less patient and you want thingsto come along quickly.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
Especially if you're in an Amazon overnight delivery
era.
Oh yes, this is a great example.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
You know what?
There we go.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Like the expectation, it's like I clicked Right now.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
Yeah, right now, exactly.
So I think, when we tie thisback to the workplace, where do
we see this come up?
Employee, so I think, when wetie this back to the workplace,
where do we see this come up?
You know employee, their desirefor growth and development and
promotions.
I think that I think if youlooked at how quickly a Gen Zer
expects to be promoted versushow quickly, let's say, a baby
(13:08):
boomer, you know Gen X wouldexpect to be promoted, you're
going to see a truncatedtimeline there.
Same thing with the amount oftime somebody's willing to stay
within a position, and so Ithink the answer is time and
patience, and that is not aneasy thing for people to accept,
but I think that is the realityof the world, and what we saw
(13:30):
in some of the research we weredoing was one of the biggest
dissatisfiers of youngergenerations is really this lack
of accelerated growth anddevelopment, and you have to
wonder will there be a pointwhere do they recognize that
this type of accelerated growthisn't the norm, or do we as
employers need to figure out howdo we accelerate growth for
(13:53):
these people?
Speaker 2 (13:53):
I think it's well.
I think that as employers, weneed to figure out ways to
provide accelerated growth.
But going back to, why might ayounger individual have that
perspective?
I think there are probably twothings that I find interesting
about that.
One is thinking about there area lot more options for personal
(14:14):
expansion, and what I mean issorry.
In today's digital world, youcan be an entrepreneur more
easily, you can have side gigsmore easily, so you don't have
to wait for things to happen.
It's like go, just do it, and Ithink something like 40, more
(14:36):
than 40% of Gen Zers have a sidehustle.
But the other thing is, um, thegrass is not always greener,
and we learn that.
The older you get in yourcareer, the more you learn that.
And if you haven't had thatexperience of, oh well, I want
that next step, so I'm going toleave this company.
Um, that's an age thing too,where it's like you've
experienced that, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (14:57):
So I think experience is something that the younger
generation doesn't have, andthey will get it.
And I'm going to be verycynical right now, which isn't a
Dina thing.
Normally I'm not a cynicalperson, and I would say this is
true of every generation.
When they are young, when youare in your formative years, so
(15:18):
to speak.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
That might be a bit of a no, it's true, it is, but I
believe, I believe that Ichanged more between 19 and 25
than I did between 25 and 35.
Yeah, yeah, like continue, Iwould agree with that.
Speaker 3 (15:30):
Like continue, I would agree with that I think
that when you are in these years, you haven't experienced life
yet, and so what you want andwhat you're looking for is the
biggest, boldest, best possiblesolution, best everything.
(15:53):
But then life happens, and lifeisn't always what you think
it's going to be, and that'swhen your expectations start to
change.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
Well, and I think this is a perfect example of how
old you are yeah, it 100% doesand it's not just.
I don't think it's a cynicalthing to say, oh, your
expectations change.
Expectations change when youare 19 years old.
You have a million paths infront of you.
(16:18):
Where do you go to school hasan impact.
Do you go to school?
What kind of trade do you want?
Like?
What relationships are you in?
You could literally pick up andmove anywhere in the world
because you have noresponsibilities, no connections
.
You have all of this, and everytime you make a decision, your
path changes and you get fewer,fewer forks in the road, and so,
(16:40):
the older you get, you stillcan make any of those decisions,
but every step you've made hasadjusted to a point where it's
more difficult, and you'vealready made a ton of those
critical decisions in your life,and so I think that's another
great example of it's not thatthe older you get, the more
you're like.
You just need a little dose ofreality.
(17:01):
I think it's that we've madeall these decisions and
sometimes we forget that youhave individuals who are at the
beginning of their career.
I just had someone on my teamwho's been in white collar work
all the way up until 30s decideto go into the trades and go be
in manual labor, and that isvery unusual.
(17:22):
Yeah, I mean which by?
Speaker 3 (17:23):
the way she's going to crush it.
I'm super pumped for her, yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
Good for her Yep.
I do want to talk aboutsimilarities, though.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
You and I had a great discussion around this.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
Do you want to kick us off on this?
Speaker 3 (17:40):
Yes, want to talk about similarities, though.
You and I had a greatdiscussion around this.
Do you want to kick us off onthis?
Yes, okay, yeah, so what wefound was there's really three
similarities across generationsdifferent ages, life cycle.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
What you mean is saying we often look and say Gen
Z wants this from work, whereas, like, gen X wants that from
work.
Correct, but a recent survey byMcKenzie, thank you, basically
said that's not true.
Speaker 3 (17:57):
That's not true?
Okay so, and we're going tolook at it from kind of the
highest level.
So what it said was here's whatpeople want in work.
People want fair compensation,people want career growth and
development and people wantmeaningful work.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
I think the difference is there were a
couple others that kind ofpopped in and out Correct, but
overarchingly that is what drewpeople to take a job, stay in a
job or quit a job Correct,Regardless of age.
Speaker 3 (18:26):
Yes, yes, the only call out there was Gen Z didn't
value compensation as much asother people.
My theory on that is they're intheir mid-teens and early 20s.
They probably don't have toworry about comp that much yet.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Well, and I also think that when you say, oh,
these three items are whateveryone cares about, the way
that shows up is different,based off of those generational
influences that we talked aboutearlier.
So you still care about compand, to your point, gen Z may
have a different need for comp,or they're not in a place where
(19:03):
they're, like millennials, arestarting to think about their
kids, like starting aboutcollege funds and stuff like
that.
It's a different kind ofperspective on it, but everyone
still cares about compensationand that's a critical component
to their decision making process, correct?
Speaker 3 (19:18):
Yeah, yeah.
So when we think about thosethree things, we think about
fair compensation, we thinkabout career growth and
development, and then we thinkabout meaningful work.
The way those show up and aredefined to each generation is
going to be different, and as anemployer, it is our job to
figure out how do we communicatethese benefits most effectively
(19:40):
with these differentgenerations in different
lifecycle phases, so to speak,and I think that's where
organizations can step up.
I think the communication isnot a one size fits all approach
, and I see this in internalcommunications and also from a
(20:00):
TA perspective.
It really is important that youlook at creating different
value propositions for differentpeople.
Thank you for making a the EVPLove that.
Yes, yes, yes, you know thereare people.
The nuances of what people wantare different, so you can't
(20:23):
just go with this one size fitsall approach, and so it's not
only your message, it's how areyou communicating, what's your
cadence?
Speaker 2 (20:30):
All those things, I agree.
And I think one and that canfeel super overwhelming to say
like, oh, everyone needs theirconfigured approach to that.
And I don't think that, that Idon't think that companies need
to feel like they have to say,okay, employee A, what is it
that you need?
Let's build this for you,whatever.
(20:50):
But I do think that choose yourown adventure of saying like,
okay, we offer healthcarebenefits, this is what it looks
like.
You can decide how that's setup.
This is, and I'm going to helpprovide the insight you need to
get the correct like healthcareand benefits, et cetera.
If this doesn't work for you,we understand, like we're going
(21:11):
to do everything we can to getthat, but if you want something
new or different, we're going tosupport you in whatever that.
Whatever it is you need to dofor yourself, and it's not just
healthcare and benefits.
But I agree with you completelyI'm just adding the layer of.
I think I'm not advocating andI won't speak for you, but I
don't think you are either thatcompanies have to custom fit
(21:32):
everything to every individualemployee.
That's an unfair expectation, Iwould agree, yes, but to the
point of saying how do youcommunicate?
These are your options, this ishow you step into them, how you
benefit from them and how thisties into the larger employment
experience that goes into that.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
Exactly.
I think it is not customizedsolutions, it's customized
communications, and it's notnecessarily communications
customized down to everyindividual, but it's making sure
that your communicationstrategy is going to be
effective for all audiences, andso I think that's the big
takeaway.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
I also think that it's really important to have
two-way communication and wejust went through this oh, 100%.
We just went through a big, bigproject here at Human to really
kind of dig into and havereally specific two-way
communication.
So we literally said we want tohear everybody's perspective
and then we're going to makesure our comms plan is
appropriately responding andthat we as Human have the right
(22:30):
programs in place for our people.
That was a really powerfulexercise, and not just as a good
business practice.
But going into this actuallyhadn't made.
This connection underscores myperspective that when people
talk about Gen Zers like when weliterally sat down and listened
to everybody, regardless of age, job title, location, et cetera
(22:51):
everyone needed the same thing.
Kind of coming back to thatconversation, everyone had the
same thing.
It may show up in differentways, and so it's a really
powerful exercise to say, okay,what is the human variation of
that within the business?
Speaker 3 (23:07):
Yeah, Well, it's so funny.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
We could really roll with this.
We really could, we reallycould.
So let's do this.
Okay, what's the one takeaway?
You think a TA leader?
Speaker 3 (23:16):
because we talked about the business at large.
What's the one?
Speaker 2 (23:19):
thing a TA leader should take away from this.
Speaker 3 (23:21):
So I would say, trying to bring in talent,
really look at how you'repositioning yourself as an
employer and figure out if thatresonates with across
generations.
You know, figure out first ofall who's your ideal candidate,
is your messaging appropriatefor them?
And then look at itholistically and figure out are
(23:43):
you being inclusive in yourmessaging?
Is this going to appeal to allgenerations, to everyone?
Speaker 2 (23:48):
So yeah, that's my takeaway.
I like that one yeah.
Speaker 3 (23:52):
I like that one.
Yeah, what about you?
Speaker 2 (23:53):
yeah, that's, that's my takeaway.
I like that one.
Yeah, I like that one.
Yeah, what about you?
I asked the question.
I don't even have an answer forit.
I think my one takeaway would beto pay attention to stereotypes
, but to realize, becausestereotypes exist for a reason,
but to also not fall intogeneralizing stereotypes,
(24:15):
because I think that when youlook at a stereotype, um, you
can learn truth from that,because, again, stereotypes pop
out of consistencies and thenthey're characterized largely Um
and and I say that specificallyto a TA leader because it's so
(24:35):
easy Like, oh yeah, you had theyoung person come in for an
interview or like, listen tothat, but also realize, like,
hey, this is someone who'sstarting their career and people
may not have understood you inthe same way and they're just
looking for that support.
Or vice versa, if you have anolder like candidate, like,
don't assume that they don'tlike know how to use technology,
and that's a really unfairstereotype.
(24:55):
But we do that all the time and, as a TA leader, I think it's
important to say we're all juston these different like places
in our journey and how can welook at the ways that we can
really benefit together in arelationship, like an employment
relationship.
Yeah, that was a weak answer.
I didn't love that one, but thefeeling is there.
Speaker 3 (25:24):
Listen, I'm into it, I'm going to give you 7.5 stars.
Thank you Out of 10?
Out of five.
Hillary, 150%, 150%.
Thanks.
Dina Makes me feel better.
Yeah, you know what the otherthing I will say before we close
out this particular session is.
I was thinking about kind ofthe business case for working
with different generations and Ireally do think that we know
that diversity leads to betterresults.
So diversity of thought andwhen we think of younger
(25:47):
generations, older generations,older generations tend to have a
lot of institutional knowledge,which is incredibly impactful.
Younger generations come to uswith fresh ideas, fresh
perspectives.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
And energy.
Older I get in my career, themore I'm like I don't really
want to try anything new.
And then there's that energy oflike yeah, let's break the mold
.
I'm like you're right, let's gofor it.
Speaker 3 (26:09):
Exactly so.
I think that businesses wouldbe super short-sighted not to
try to maximize on that positivecollision between institutional
knowledge and energy and freshideas.
Speaker 2 (26:22):
I actually and this was years ago, I read this
article so I could not tell youwhat company it was.
I think it was in the like oh,millennials are the worst era
where a CEO of a majorcorporation actually took some
of his entry-level employees andthey were like an advisor to
the CEO, so he would meet withthem regularly to better
(26:42):
understand the differences thathis younger employees like,
their different perspectives,the needs, the insights, but
also what it's like to be anentry-level employee in the
organization.
I thought that was really areally interesting approach to
understanding how differentpeople show up in the workforce
and how you can take advantageof that excitement and insight.
Yeah, love that.
Speaker 3 (27:02):
Yeah, cool idea huh, yeah, great idea.
Speaker 2 (27:04):
Yeah, uh-huh, very cool, cool.
Do we have a correction section?
I don't think we do?
Speaker 3 (27:08):
I don't think we do.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Nope, we were flawless last show Flawless,
flawless, dina, thanks to you,you keep us rolling, oh, rolling
, listen, here we go, here we go.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Um, okay, whitney, hot takes on hot topics, hot
takes, hot topics, hot dina well, hillary, I want to mention, uh
, something you brought upearlier, which is that
generations are kind of affectedby events in which happened,
during their lifetime, majorevents.
(27:38):
That being said, we have GenAlpha to look out for.
They are kind of known as theCOVID kids.
They were born between 2010 and2024.
And my question to you both iswhat is your prediction on how
Gen Alpha will be?
Speaker 2 (27:58):
in the workplace.
I also love that you asked thetwo people with no children to
answer the Gen Alpha question.
That's a great, great question.
Speaker 3 (28:07):
So so, gen Alpha, I'm going to tell you this when you
join the workforce for thefirst time, everybody's going to
say that you are the downfallof the workforce.
They're going to say that forevery generation.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
And that's been going on for as long as human beings
have existed.
It really has.
Speaker 3 (28:23):
It really has.
So don't take it personally.
They're going to say that untilthe next generation comes along
, Then they'll blame the nextone.
Then they'll blame the next one.
Oh gosh, I need to think aboutthis.
Oh gosh, I need to.
I need to think about this.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
So it is going to be really interesting because I
have a couple of nieces andnephews who are Gen Alpha and
when I think about theinfluences that are going to
impact them, we've gone frommillennials, who were the first
digital, like natives, and thenyou have Gen Z, who has just
been saturated in this digitalworld to a point where there is
kind of this whiplash back toanalog.
(29:02):
Do you know, a lot of Gen Zersare getting dumb phones and
disposable cameras and stuff.
Speaker 3 (29:07):
So, FYI, I want a dumb phone and I have said this
for a while Get a Cricut, one ofof those giant yeah listen, but
again we're seeing the whiplash, but simultaneously we're
seeing AI pop up into everywhereand you know.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
So it'll be interesting to see with
Generation Alpha, when they comein, if the digital conversation
isn't even really somethingthat gets discussed in the same
way, because, if you it's soassumed, yeah, it in the same
way, because if you it's soassumed because, yeah, it's like
that idea of the influence ofdigital is aging out of the
workforce.
Speaker 3 (29:42):
Because at when?
Yes, gen alpha baseline haschanged correct.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Like gen x is going to be the old generation.
When alpha is joining theworkforce, millennials will be
on their way out and for for us,we are digital natives like
yeah, like we know what it waslike before Google I am older
than Google by FYI but like it'sso ingrained in our world so I
almost wonder if the generationalpha, when they come in, it'll
(30:08):
almost be like there's a newthing to consider, whether it's
going like the skill we talkabout, skills based.
Well, is that going to be whatthey're focusing on as they come
in, or, like I feel like it'sgoing to be a completely
different dialogue.
So Generation Alpha is notnecessarily going to be coming
in with this completelydifferent skill set, but like
(30:29):
the world will be different, soGen Alpha will fit into it in a
way that we're not reallythinking about right now.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
Yeah, so this is super interesting and I'm
probably going to say a wholebunch of things that are just
going to be really weird.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
We're making stuff up as we go.
Let's just go, we are.
Why is it hot?
Speaker 3 (30:44):
today.
Okay, so super interesting.
So first, I think everybody'swork is going to change
dramatically.
I believe that AI is going todramatically change the type of
work that people do, and so whatwe hear about a lot of younger
generations is that perhapsthey're lacking in social skills
.
I feel like this generation,gen Alpha, is going to make a
(31:09):
rebound and they are going to beso socially advanced.
Can I say?
Speaker 2 (31:15):
something, please.
I think the idea of peoplebeing socially awkward is
because they're social in a waythat we were not as kids.
Oh my God, you're right, sothis goes back to like
generational.
Yes, generational difference,yes, yes, yes, the experiences,
because if, growing up up, theonly way to hang out with my
(31:36):
friends, if I went and knockedon the door, yeah, and we went
running around outside until,like, it got too dark to play,
yeah, um, okay, so now, but likethere's you know I get what
you're saying.
Speaker 3 (31:48):
You could still do that today?
Speaker 2 (31:49):
yeah, but we have provided this digital world that
is so much more complex and somuch more like you engage in a
completely different way.
Yeah, it is very important tohave face-to-face time.
It is very important to notlose those structures that we
reminisce about, but I thinkthat this goes back to the more
(32:10):
we age out, boomers.
Yeah, yeah, you're right, we'regonna be like.
Yeah, I used to bond with mysiblings and I, to this day,
play nintendo Mario.
Speaker 3 (32:17):
Kart, the original one.
Up down, up down, left right, a, b start.
That's the code.
Speaker 2 (32:22):
Not on a Nintendo 64.
No.
Speaker 3 (32:24):
Oh, that's old school .
Speaker 2 (32:25):
Nintendo.
Yeah, yeah, that's like that'slike OG hey guys.
Xy, gen X here.
But my point is saying some ofthe greatest bonding experiences
that we had as kids and asadults was through video games.
Speaker 3 (32:37):
Yeah, so do you think that?
Okay, that's interesting.
So do you think that?
What do you think the workplaceis going to look like?
Is there?
I mean, what are your thoughtson?
Speaker 2 (32:48):
this.
I think it's too early in theAI conversation to see how much
we let that dominate yeah.
Speaker 3 (32:55):
It's kind of scary and kind of amazing at the same
time.
It's.
I agree.
This is a whole other.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
We can't get down that one, because we're really
rolling with this one.
I think that when Gen Alphacomes in, we will have made some
of those decisions and I justwant to make a plug, like a
nerdy plug.
Every time the AI conversationcomes in, I think about Dune,
like the book, and if you'veread Dune, like, you know that
(33:24):
essentially they rejected allthe technology and that's how.
So I just want to make a plugfor that, because I think about
it all the time and if you know,you know.
But my hope is that we use AIto take care of the busy work so
that we can use our time to dothe creative, fun things, like.
I saw a quote that says I wantso.
I was thinking that I saw aquote that said I want AI to do
(33:47):
my laundry and my dishes so Ican do art.
I don't want AI to do art, so Ihave to do the laundry and
dishes.
Speaker 3 (33:53):
I was thinking it, I didn't want to say it, but I was
like I wonder if Gen Alpha isreally going to lean into the
art, which would be amazing.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
And the trades, because that's the other thing.
There's a massive need fortrade-skilled work.
It's going to continue to bethat, and if we get AI to a
point where it can do all of thejust baseline stuff, my hope is
, then we get to do the thingsthat bring about a new type of
renaissance.
Yeah, oh, I love this Hillary.
Yeah, that is my hope.
(34:21):
Gen alpha will be the rebirthof art and trades and books.
Boom.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
And I think we'll see that happen.
They're predicted to be thelargest generation to date, with
over 2 billion of them by 2025.
Wow, seriously.
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Even with the decrease in like fertility rates
.
Wow, interesting.
Yeah, you know what I'm pro-genalpha.
Speaker 3 (34:46):
Let's do it Like I said pro-gen Z, pro-gen alpha
I'm into it Awesome.
Speaker 2 (34:50):
Yeah, this is great Great.
Thank you, dina.
Thank you Whitney.
Oh, thank you, whitney, thankyou, hillary.
Speaker 3 (34:55):
Yeah, this was great.
This was really great.
I enjoyed this conversation.
Speaker 2 (34:58):
So next time, next time, wait, people process
Process Back to process.
All right, yeah, join us nexttime Till we meet again.
Thanks Dina, thanks Hillary,bye.
Welcome to Real Talk on Talent, a human resources
podcast where we talk abouttalent acquisition, recruiting
and all things hiring.
Welcome back, hey.
Pleasure to be here.
We have a couple changes Ithink that we need to address.
Okay, let's hear about them.
Speaker 3 (00:26):
Yep, oh casty cast.
Technically I should still bewearing it, but I'm just over it
and it doesn't fit under a lotof my clothes.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
I do feel like we need to clarify.
Your doctor told you you cantake off the brace.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
So yes, yes, yes, yes .
Speaker 2 (00:39):
You're not just going rogue?
No, I'm not going rogue.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
Like I can take it off during certain times.
Perhaps I lean on the takeoff alittle bit more than I should,
but five weeks in I'm healinglike a champ.
Of course you are.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
You're being good as new in no time.
Even better.
Congratulations, I'm glad thatyou are feeling good and it's
healing well.
Yeah, yeah yeah, and our secondexciting change is we're in a
new office.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Oh yay, yes, we are New background, kind of maybe
New chair, it's a similar setup,but we have a new human office.
Speaker 2 (01:11):
Yeah, we do, and I love it.
It is awesome.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Yeah, it's awesome.
So human had been at thebeaches in Jacksonville for gosh
20-something years and we kindof outgrew that space, so we
wound up taking over justdifferent buildings and so we
had a very fragmentedinconsistent Like a human campus
of just different locations.
Yeah, which we?
Speaker 2 (01:32):
loved, we did love.
Location was great, but nowit's like I can walk down the
hall to go talk to anyone.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
Yeah, it's so nice.
Yeah, so we've kind of we'vegrown up.
Yeah, yeah, we're in our bigboy.
So come visit our office.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Yeah, it's really awesome.
Speaker 3 (01:44):
Yeah, yeah, for sure, definitely Highly recommend Yay
.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Cool, okay, any other exciting things going on?
Uh, you know no.
That'll probably come out Justpodcasting.
The most exciting thing wecould do D generational
differences.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
We are talking about generation differences we are,
but I think we have someopinions about generational
differences in the workforce.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
But that's what we're going to talk about.
That's what we're going to talkabout.
So we have gone through all thefive pillars, so we've come
back around to people, correct,so this is our people topic and
we wanted to talk aboutgenerational differences in the
workforce.
But, as you and I hadconversations leading up to this
, we literally looked at eachother and said it's kind of BS,
(02:31):
yeah, which is a bold statement.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
This whole episode is going to be a hot take.
A hot take, hot topic, let's goAll right.
Okay, so I'm going to set thestage a little bit.
If you're good with that, let'sdo it.
So.
Stage a little bit.
If you're good with that, let'sdo it.
So, when people talk aboutgenerational differences in the
workforce, it's a very validtopic and it's something that's
been around for a long time.
But I would like for you toplease explain why you and I
(02:55):
both looked at each other andsaid we don't want to talk about
.
Oh, what is Gen Z doing in theworkforce today?
Or, you know, this is what babyboomers are all about Like.
Can you please give a justsynopsis of what we're going to
talk about today?
Speaker 3 (03:09):
Yeah, so I think prior to this, prior to this
particular podcast, we both dida fair amount of research.
Obviously, these areconversations that we're having
a lot, our partners are askingit about.
You know how do we do it?
So we've done a good amount ofresearch and I think when we
looked at the research and whenwe really thought about what it
(03:30):
was saying, what we realized wasis these generational
differences are really kind ofbased on stereotypes that don't
necessarily provide a lot ofvalue and insight if you are
trying to make decisions aroundhow to attract and retain
different generations and agreed, and I'm cut you off.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
But I have to add in here is that the reason that I
feel so strongly about this it'snot just from the research, but
I'm a millennial.
I'm smack dab in millennial agerange, depending on what years
you put on that and early in mycareer I became a leader in the
business and I cannot tell youhow many times it was that of
(04:14):
the era of millennial bashing.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
Oh, yes, yes, yes, I remember.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
And so I had so many times where I would sit across
the table from another leader ora client contact and they would
be just beating up millennialsleft right.
You know they don't want towork, they just want to feel
good, like that kind of thing.
And I'd say, well, I'm amillennial.
And their response was oh, butyou're not like all the yeah, of
course I'm like yes I am, I'm,I'm a hundred percent a
millennial and so my for mywhole career I've been, I.
(04:40):
I feel very strongly that thislike hitting of generations
against each other is silly, andI am just going to say I'm very
pro-Gensy.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
Yeah, so here's my thought on it.
So it's not about generationaldifferences, it's about
differences in age, and whereyou are in your age doesn't
dictate but it really influenceswhat you're looking for in work
(05:12):
, in life, and work is a hugepart of life, and that's not to
discount the impact of majorsocial events on generations.
That is definitely somethingthat impacts generations as a
whole.
But when you think about whatmost people want in employment
(05:35):
and in work life, it's kind ofthe same three things regardless
of generation.
Speaker 2 (05:36):
So I do want to get into that, but I want to you
kind of separated age andgeneration and like experiences.
I think the two are likecompletely intertwined.
Okay, so Pew has an article andwe'll link the article where
they talked about whenresearchers are looking at
generational differences,because our statement on saying
(05:57):
the generational discussion iskind of silly is not to say that
all the generations are thesame.
That's not what we're saying.
Obviously, based on age andexperiences, there are going to
be stereotypes based on how oldyou are or like you know.
But the Pew article talkedabout the researching elements
that go into generationalunderstanding and see if I can
(06:19):
remember them.
That's the life cycle effect,which is what you're talking
about.
So, how old are you?
What are your needs?
What are your perspectives?
One of the examples is theyounger you are, the less likely
you are to vote, and that wastrue for boomers when they were
young and that was true formillennials when they were young
.
Gen Z is like throwing a littlebit for a loop.
So again, pro Gen Z.
(06:40):
So there's a life cycle effectTo your point.
How old are you?
But, um, so there's a lifecycle effect to your point.
How old are you what's going on.
The second one is called aperiod effect, and when you have
these events in life thatimpact society as a whole, so
that could be the greatdepression, it could be wars,
could be 9-11 it could be thegreat depression.
(07:00):
Covid, covid, yes, it's one,yeah, and it has this impact
that changes your perspectives,your needs, your expectations.
And then the last one's calledthe cohort effect, and it's when
you have these period eventsthat have an increased impact on
a certain generation.
So that could be either like ifyou have the Vietnam or, better
(07:26):
yet, you have 9-11.
That happened 23 years ago.
So anyone who's younger, let'ssay younger than 33, it doesn't
have the same impact on them asolder generations, and so there
are.
Or the other side is, you havethese big period impacts that,
where you are in your life, havea bigger impact on you.
(07:47):
Okay, makes sense.
So, like 2008 recession, I wastrying to find my first job.
That's going to have a lotbigger impact on people my age
than if you're older,established or retired, and
didn't really have that big ofan impact on you.
Okay, so I love that.
So what are those three things?
Again, it was the life cycleeffect.
Okay, it's like what you'retalking about Age, we'll say,
we'll simplify it, Yep.
Age, okay, yep.
And then you have the periodimpact Okay, which is these big
(08:09):
events that change agenerational perspective, okay,
or just society, mm-hmm.
And the cohort impact, wherethese big events impact a
certain generation more, forwhatever reason Makes sense.
Speaker 3 (08:22):
Got it.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Very interesting.
So I actually and I went on awhole thing, but I think that's
an interesting.
I want to tie it back to workon that one specifically because
this is a talent podcast yes,yes.
So I want to ask you, as amanager of multiple generations,
when you think about like ageover generation, if that makes
(08:45):
sense.
Absolutely does, yes.
How does that impact yourapproach to managing employees
or connecting with employees?
How does that influence you asa manager?
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Yeah, yeah, great question.
So first, I think there's somany articles out there that
talk about you need to leaddifferent generations
differently.
I'm not buying it.
Different generationsdifferently I'm not buying it,
you're not.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
I'm not buying, it Okay, why?
Speaker 3 (09:07):
So I think you can lead everybody the same way by
being an empathetic leader.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Okay, okay, I was ready to be like.
No, dina, we're going to getinto this.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
But, yes, to me, the commonality between all of the
generations is that there's nocommonality.
I can have two people who arethe same age and they need to be
led differently.
So, to me, leading acrossmulti-generations is no
different than leading a diverseteam.
It'd be foolish and naive tothink that leadership is a one
(09:43):
size fits all approach.
So, to me, it's about beingempathetic and proactive with
your team and asking them how doyou like to be led,
understanding what works forthem, what doesn't work for them
, really developing a goodrelationship so you know how to
best grow and develop youremployees.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Yeah, that's really interesting, I agree.
I think there's more nuance,especially if I think about like
a new leader, because I thinkyou 100% you have to go in with
empathy, you have to go in withone-to-one, custom leadership
style.
I 100% agree with that.
I do think that the more youcan understand potential
(10:25):
influences you may notunderstand, the easier it is to
be empathetic.
Okay, yes, I would agree withthat, and that's true not just
for generational but likecultural backgrounds or
differences that way.
And so I do think it's importantand I think this is one big
disconnect between, let's justsay, the boomer and the Gen Z
generation is you could havesomeone who is a baby boomer,
(10:47):
who is completely but the needsof a Gen Zer.
They don't understand becausethey're forgetting the cohort
effect of that generation or thelife cycle that they're in, and
so they have a hard time beingempathetic because they can't
(11:09):
put themselves in those shoes orsay this is why you have this
perspective, this view.
That to me is not important,and so I do think that it
probably roots down to empathy.
But I think that there is amore active level of
understanding and appreciationfor how people show up
differently, based on the thingsthat impact them, because you
(11:29):
can easily be like oh, I'mreally caring, just tell me what
you want.
But sometimes you have to be alittle more proactive in saying
like I don't really get it butlike I'm here for you, yeah, so
I think, empathetic andauthenticity and transparency.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
So if I were to say those are three things that are
universal across generations,across age, and so how can you
be authentic in your leadership,how can you ask your team to be
their authentic versions ofthemselves?
And I think this gets you knowthat's a great way to lead
people.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
I completely agree.
What would you tell to Gen Zers?
Okay, because we constantlytalk about like boomers looking
down like the hierarchy oftraditional businesses and being
frustrated at Gen Zers.
What would you tell Gen Z thatwe need from them as leaders?
Speaker 3 (12:21):
Yeah, oh, great question, great question.
So I think the answer is timeOkay.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
And I'm going to say it in two different ways.
So, I think when you areyounger, you tend to be perhaps
less patient and you want thingsto come along quickly.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
Especially if you're in an Amazon overnight delivery
era.
Oh yes, this is a great example.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
You know what?
There we go.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Like the expectation, it's like I clicked Right now.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
Yeah, right now, exactly.
So I think, when we tie thisback to the workplace, where do
we see this come up?
Employee, so I think, when wetie this back to the workplace,
where do we see this come up?
You know employee, their desirefor growth and development and
promotions.
I think that I think if youlooked at how quickly a Gen Zer
expects to be promoted versushow quickly, let's say, a baby
(13:08):
boomer, you know Gen X wouldexpect to be promoted, you're
going to see a truncatedtimeline there.
Same thing with the amount oftime somebody's willing to stay
within a position, and so Ithink the answer is time and
patience, and that is not aneasy thing for people to accept,
but I think that is the realityof the world, and what we saw
(13:30):
in some of the research we weredoing was one of the biggest
dissatisfiers of youngergenerations is really this lack
of accelerated growth anddevelopment, and you have to
wonder will there be a pointwhere do they recognize that
this type of accelerated growthisn't the norm, or do we as
employers need to figure out howdo we accelerate growth for
(13:53):
these people?
Speaker 2 (13:53):
I think it's well.
I think that as employers, weneed to figure out ways to
provide accelerated growth.
But going back to, why might ayounger individual have that
perspective?
I think there are probably twothings that I find interesting
about that.
One is thinking about there area lot more options for personal
(14:14):
expansion, and what I mean issorry.
In today's digital world, youcan be an entrepreneur more
easily, you can have side gigsmore easily, so you don't have
to wait for things to happen.
It's like go, just do it, and Ithink something like 40, more
(14:36):
than 40% of Gen Zers have a sidehustle.
But the other thing is, um, thegrass is not always greener,
and we learn that.
The older you get in yourcareer, the more you learn that.
And if you haven't had thatexperience of, oh well, I want
that next step, so I'm going toleave this company.
Um, that's an age thing too,where it's like you've
experienced that, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (14:57):
So I think experience is something that the younger
generation doesn't have, andthey will get it.
And I'm going to be verycynical right now, which isn't a
Dina thing.
Normally I'm not a cynicalperson, and I would say this is
true of every generation.
When they are young, when youare in your formative years, so
(15:18):
to speak.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
That might be a bit of a no, it's true, it is, but I
believe, I believe that Ichanged more between 19 and 25
than I did between 25 and 35.
Yeah, yeah, like continue, Iwould agree with that.
Speaker 3 (15:30):
Like continue, I would agree with that I think
that when you are in these years, you haven't experienced life
yet, and so what you want andwhat you're looking for is the
biggest, boldest, best possiblesolution, best everything.
(15:53):
But then life happens, and lifeisn't always what you think
it's going to be, and that'swhen your expectations start to
change.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
Well, and I think this is a perfect example of how
old you are yeah, it 100% doesand it's not just.
I don't think it's a cynicalthing to say, oh, your
expectations change.
Expectations change when youare 19 years old.
You have a million paths infront of you.
(16:18):
Where do you go to school hasan impact.
Do you go to school?
What kind of trade do you want?
Like?
What relationships are you in?
You could literally pick up andmove anywhere in the world
because you have noresponsibilities, no connections
.
You have all of this, and everytime you make a decision, your
path changes and you get fewer,fewer forks in the road, and so,
(16:40):
the older you get, you stillcan make any of those decisions,
but every step you've made hasadjusted to a point where it's
more difficult, and you'vealready made a ton of those
critical decisions in your life,and so I think that's another
great example of it's not thatthe older you get, the more
you're like.
You just need a little dose ofreality.
(17:01):
I think it's that we've madeall these decisions and
sometimes we forget that youhave individuals who are at the
beginning of their career.
I just had someone on my teamwho's been in white collar work
all the way up until 30s decideto go into the trades and go be
in manual labor, and that isvery unusual.
(17:22):
Yeah, I mean which by?
Speaker 3 (17:23):
the way she's going to crush it.
I'm super pumped for her, yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
Good for her Yep.
I do want to talk aboutsimilarities, though.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
You and I had a great discussion around this.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
Do you want to kick us off on this?
Speaker 3 (17:40):
Yes, want to talk about similarities, though.
You and I had a greatdiscussion around this.
Do you want to kick us off onthis?
Yes, okay, yeah, so what wefound was there's really three
similarities across generationsdifferent ages, life cycle.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
What you mean is saying we often look and say Gen
Z wants this from work, whereas, like, gen X wants that from
work.
Correct, but a recent survey byMcKenzie, thank you, basically
said that's not true.
Speaker 3 (17:57):
That's not true?
Okay so, and we're going tolook at it from kind of the
highest level.
So what it said was here's whatpeople want in work.
People want fair compensation,people want career growth and
development and people wantmeaningful work.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
I think the difference is there were a
couple others that kind ofpopped in and out Correct, but
overarchingly that is what drewpeople to take a job, stay in a
job or quit a job Correct,Regardless of age.
Speaker 3 (18:26):
Yes, yes, the only call out there was Gen Z didn't
value compensation as much asother people.
My theory on that is they're intheir mid-teens and early 20s.
They probably don't have toworry about comp that much yet.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Well, and I also think that when you say, oh,
these three items are whateveryone cares about, the way
that shows up is different,based off of those generational
influences that we talked aboutearlier.
So you still care about compand, to your point, gen Z may
have a different need for comp,or they're not in a place where
(19:03):
they're, like millennials, arestarting to think about their
kids, like starting aboutcollege funds and stuff like
that.
It's a different kind ofperspective on it, but everyone
still cares about compensationand that's a critical component
to their decision making process, correct?
Speaker 3 (19:18):
Yeah, yeah.
So when we think about thosethree things, we think about
fair compensation, we thinkabout career growth and
development, and then we thinkabout meaningful work.
The way those show up and aredefined to each generation is
going to be different, and as anemployer, it is our job to
figure out how do we communicatethese benefits most effectively
(19:40):
with these differentgenerations in different
lifecycle phases, so to speak,and I think that's where
organizations can step up.
I think the communication isnot a one size fits all approach
, and I see this in internalcommunications and also from a
(20:00):
TA perspective.
It really is important that youlook at creating different
value propositions for differentpeople.
Thank you for making a the EVPLove that.
Yes, yes, yes, you know thereare people.
The nuances of what people wantare different, so you can't
(20:23):
just go with this one size fitsall approach, and so it's not
only your message, it's how areyou communicating, what's your
cadence?
Speaker 2 (20:30):
All those things, I agree.
And I think one and that canfeel super overwhelming to say
like, oh, everyone needs theirconfigured approach to that.
And I don't think that, that Idon't think that companies need
to feel like they have to say,okay, employee A, what is it
that you need?
Let's build this for you,whatever.
(20:50):
But I do think that choose yourown adventure of saying like,
okay, we offer healthcarebenefits, this is what it looks
like.
You can decide how that's setup.
This is, and I'm going to helpprovide the insight you need to
get the correct like healthcareand benefits, et cetera.
If this doesn't work for you,we understand, like we're going
(21:11):
to do everything we can to getthat, but if you want something
new or different, we're going tosupport you in whatever that.
Whatever it is you need to dofor yourself, and it's not just
healthcare and benefits.
But I agree with you completelyI'm just adding the layer of.
I think I'm not advocating andI won't speak for you, but I
don't think you are either thatcompanies have to custom fit
(21:32):
everything to every individualemployee.
That's an unfair expectation, Iwould agree, yes, but to the
point of saying how do youcommunicate?
These are your options, this ishow you step into them, how you
benefit from them and how thisties into the larger employment
experience that goes into that.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
Exactly.
I think it is not customizedsolutions, it's customized
communications, and it's notnecessarily communications
customized down to everyindividual, but it's making sure
that your communicationstrategy is going to be
effective for all audiences, andso I think that's the big
takeaway.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
I also think that it's really important to have
two-way communication and wejust went through this oh, 100%.
We just went through a big, bigproject here at Human to really
kind of dig into and havereally specific two-way
communication.
So we literally said we want tohear everybody's perspective
and then we're going to makesure our comms plan is
appropriately responding andthat we as Human have the right
(22:30):
programs in place for our people.
That was a really powerfulexercise, and not just as a good
business practice.
But going into this actuallyhadn't made.
This connection underscores myperspective that when people
talk about Gen Zers like when weliterally sat down and listened
to everybody, regardless of age, job title, location, et cetera
(22:51):
everyone needed the same thing.
Kind of coming back to thatconversation, everyone had the
same thing.
It may show up in differentways, and so it's a really
powerful exercise to say, okay,what is the human variation of
that within the business?
Speaker 3 (23:07):
Yeah, Well, it's so funny.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
We could really roll with this.
We really could, we reallycould.
So let's do this.
Okay, what's the one takeaway?
You think a TA leader?
Speaker 3 (23:16):
because we talked about the business at large.
What's the one?
Speaker 2 (23:19):
thing a TA leader should take away from this.
Speaker 3 (23:21):
So I would say, trying to bring in talent,
really look at how you'repositioning yourself as an
employer and figure out if thatresonates with across
generations.
You know, figure out first ofall who's your ideal candidate,
is your messaging appropriatefor them?
And then look at itholistically and figure out are
(23:43):
you being inclusive in yourmessaging?
Is this going to appeal to allgenerations, to everyone?
Speaker 2 (23:48):
So yeah, that's my takeaway.
I like that one yeah.
Speaker 3 (23:52):
I like that one.
Yeah, what about you?
Speaker 2 (23:53):
yeah, that's, that's my takeaway.
I like that one.
Yeah, I like that one.
Yeah, what about you?
I asked the question.
I don't even have an answer forit.
I think my one takeaway would beto pay attention to stereotypes
, but to realize, becausestereotypes exist for a reason,
but to also not fall intogeneralizing stereotypes,
(24:15):
because I think that when youlook at a stereotype, um, you
can learn truth from that,because, again, stereotypes pop
out of consistencies and thenthey're characterized largely Um
and and I say that specificallyto a TA leader because it's so
(24:35):
easy Like, oh yeah, you had theyoung person come in for an
interview or like, listen tothat, but also realize, like,
hey, this is someone who'sstarting their career and people
may not have understood you inthe same way and they're just
looking for that support.
Or vice versa, if you have anolder like candidate, like,
don't assume that they don'tlike know how to use technology,
and that's a really unfairstereotype.
(24:55):
But we do that all the time and, as a TA leader, I think it's
important to say we're all juston these different like places
in our journey and how can welook at the ways that we can
really benefit together in arelationship, like an employment
relationship.
Yeah, that was a weak answer.
I didn't love that one, but thefeeling is there.
Speaker 3 (25:24):
Listen, I'm into it, I'm going to give you 7.5 stars.
Thank you Out of 10?
Out of five.
Hillary, 150%, 150%.
Thanks.
Dina Makes me feel better.
Yeah, you know what the otherthing I will say before we close
out this particular session is.
I was thinking about kind ofthe business case for working
with different generations and Ireally do think that we know
that diversity leads to betterresults.
So diversity of thought andwhen we think of younger
(25:47):
generations, older generations,older generations tend to have a
lot of institutional knowledge,which is incredibly impactful.
Younger generations come to uswith fresh ideas, fresh
perspectives.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
And energy.
Older I get in my career, themore I'm like I don't really
want to try anything new.
And then there's that energy oflike yeah, let's break the mold
.
I'm like you're right, let's gofor it.
Speaker 3 (26:09):
Exactly so.
I think that businesses wouldbe super short-sighted not to
try to maximize on that positivecollision between institutional
knowledge and energy and freshideas.
Speaker 2 (26:22):
I actually and this was years ago, I read this
article so I could not tell youwhat company it was.
I think it was in the like oh,millennials are the worst era
where a CEO of a majorcorporation actually took some
of his entry-level employees andthey were like an advisor to
the CEO, so he would meet withthem regularly to better
(26:42):
understand the differences thathis younger employees like,
their different perspectives,the needs, the insights, but
also what it's like to be anentry-level employee in the
organization.
I thought that was really areally interesting approach to
understanding how differentpeople show up in the workforce
and how you can take advantageof that excitement and insight.
Yeah, love that.
Speaker 3 (27:02):
Yeah, cool idea huh, yeah, great idea.
Speaker 2 (27:04):
Yeah, uh-huh, very cool, cool.
Do we have a correction section?
I don't think we do?
Speaker 3 (27:08):
I don't think we do.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Nope, we were flawless last show Flawless,
flawless, dina, thanks to you,you keep us rolling, oh, rolling
, listen, here we go, here we go.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Um, okay, whitney, hot takes on hot topics, hot
takes, hot topics, hot dina well, hillary, I want to mention, uh
, something you brought upearlier, which is that
generations are kind of affectedby events in which happened,
during their lifetime, majorevents.
(27:38):
That being said, we have GenAlpha to look out for.
They are kind of known as theCOVID kids.
They were born between 2010 and2024.
And my question to you both iswhat is your prediction on how
Gen Alpha will be?
Speaker 2 (27:58):
in the workplace.
I also love that you asked thetwo people with no children to
answer the Gen Alpha question.
That's a great, great question.
Speaker 3 (28:07):
So so, gen Alpha, I'm going to tell you this when you
join the workforce for thefirst time, everybody's going to
say that you are the downfallof the workforce.
They're going to say that forevery generation.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
And that's been going on for as long as human beings
have existed.
It really has.
Speaker 3 (28:23):
It really has.
So don't take it personally.
They're going to say that untilthe next generation comes along
, Then they'll blame the nextone.
Then they'll blame the next one.
Oh gosh, I need to think aboutthis.
Oh gosh, I need to.
I need to think about this.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
So it is going to be really interesting because I
have a couple of nieces andnephews who are Gen Alpha and
when I think about theinfluences that are going to
impact them, we've gone frommillennials, who were the first
digital, like natives, and thenyou have Gen Z, who has just
been saturated in this digitalworld to a point where there is
kind of this whiplash back toanalog.
(29:02):
Do you know, a lot of Gen Zersare getting dumb phones and
disposable cameras and stuff.
Speaker 3 (29:07):
So, FYI, I want a dumb phone and I have said this
for a while Get a Cricut, one ofof those giant yeah listen, but
again we're seeing the whiplash, but simultaneously we're
seeing AI pop up into everywhereand you know.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
So it'll be interesting to see with
Generation Alpha, when they comein, if the digital conversation
isn't even really somethingthat gets discussed in the same
way, because, if you it's soassumed, yeah, it in the same
way, because if you it's soassumed because, yeah, it's like
that idea of the influence ofdigital is aging out of the
workforce.
Speaker 3 (29:42):
Because at when?
Yes, gen alpha baseline haschanged correct.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Like gen x is going to be the old generation.
When alpha is joining theworkforce, millennials will be
on their way out and for for us,we are digital natives like
yeah, like we know what it waslike before Google I am older
than Google by FYI but like it'sso ingrained in our world so I
almost wonder if the generationalpha, when they come in, it'll
(30:08):
almost be like there's a newthing to consider, whether it's
going like the skill we talkabout, skills based.
Well, is that going to be whatthey're focusing on as they come
in, or, like I feel like it'sgoing to be a completely
different dialogue.
So Generation Alpha is notnecessarily going to be coming
in with this completelydifferent skill set, but like
(30:29):
the world will be different, soGen Alpha will fit into it in a
way that we're not reallythinking about right now.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
Yeah, so this is super interesting and I'm
probably going to say a wholebunch of things that are just
going to be really weird.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
We're making stuff up as we go.
Let's just go, we are.
Why is it hot?
Speaker 3 (30:44):
today.
Okay, so super interesting.
So first, I think everybody'swork is going to change
dramatically.
I believe that AI is going todramatically change the type of
work that people do, and so whatwe hear about a lot of younger
generations is that perhapsthey're lacking in social skills
.
I feel like this generation,gen Alpha, is going to make a
(31:09):
rebound and they are going to beso socially advanced.
Can I say?
Speaker 2 (31:15):
something, please.
I think the idea of peoplebeing socially awkward is
because they're social in a waythat we were not as kids.
Oh my God, you're right, sothis goes back to like
generational.
Yes, generational difference,yes, yes, yes, the experiences,
because if, growing up up, theonly way to hang out with my
(31:36):
friends, if I went and knockedon the door, yeah, and we went
running around outside until,like, it got too dark to play,
yeah, um, okay, so now, but likethere's you know I get what
you're saying.
Speaker 3 (31:48):
You could still do that today?
Speaker 2 (31:49):
yeah, but we have provided this digital world that
is so much more complex and somuch more like you engage in a
completely different way.
Yeah, it is very important tohave face-to-face time.
It is very important to notlose those structures that we
reminisce about, but I thinkthat this goes back to the more
(32:10):
we age out, boomers.
Yeah, yeah, you're right, we'regonna be like.
Yeah, I used to bond with mysiblings and I, to this day,
play nintendo Mario.
Speaker 3 (32:17):
Kart, the original one.
Up down, up down, left right, a, b start.
That's the code.
Speaker 2 (32:22):
Not on a Nintendo 64.
No.
Speaker 3 (32:24):
Oh, that's old school .
Speaker 2 (32:25):
Nintendo.
Yeah, yeah, that's like that'slike OG hey guys.
Xy, gen X here.
But my point is saying some ofthe greatest bonding experiences
that we had as kids and asadults was through video games.
Speaker 3 (32:37):
Yeah, so do you think that?
Okay, that's interesting.
So do you think that?
What do you think the workplaceis going to look like?
Is there?
I mean, what are your thoughtson?
Speaker 2 (32:48):
this.
I think it's too early in theAI conversation to see how much
we let that dominate yeah.
Speaker 3 (32:55):
It's kind of scary and kind of amazing at the same
time.
It's.
I agree.
This is a whole other.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
We can't get down that one, because we're really
rolling with this one.
I think that when Gen Alphacomes in, we will have made some
of those decisions and I justwant to make a plug, like a
nerdy plug.
Every time the AI conversationcomes in, I think about Dune,
like the book, and if you'veread Dune, like, you know that
(33:24):
essentially they rejected allthe technology and that's how.
So I just want to make a plugfor that, because I think about
it all the time and if you know,you know.
But my hope is that we use AIto take care of the busy work so
that we can use our time to dothe creative, fun things, like.
I saw a quote that says I wantso.
I was thinking that I saw aquote that said I want AI to do
(33:47):
my laundry and my dishes so Ican do art.
I don't want AI to do art, so Ihave to do the laundry and
dishes.
Speaker 3 (33:53):
I was thinking it, I didn't want to say it, but I was
like I wonder if Gen Alpha isreally going to lean into the
art, which would be amazing.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
And the trades, because that's the other thing.
There's a massive need fortrade-skilled work.
It's going to continue to bethat, and if we get AI to a
point where it can do all of thejust baseline stuff, my hope is
, then we get to do the thingsthat bring about a new type of
renaissance.
Yeah, oh, I love this Hillary.
Yeah, that is my hope.
(34:21):
Gen alpha will be the rebirthof art and trades and books.
Boom.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
And I think we'll see that happen.
They're predicted to be thelargest generation to date, with
over 2 billion of them by 2025.
Wow, seriously.
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Even with the decrease in like fertility rates
.
Wow, interesting.
Yeah, you know what I'm pro-genalpha.
Speaker 3 (34:46):
Let's do it Like I said pro-gen Z, pro-gen alpha
I'm into it Awesome.
Speaker 2 (34:50):
Yeah, this is great Great.
Thank you, dina.
Thank you Whitney.
Oh, thank you, whitney, thankyou, hillary.
Speaker 3 (34:55):
Yeah, this was great.
This was really great.
I enjoyed this conversation.
Speaker 2 (34:58):
So next time, next time, wait, people process
Process Back to process.
All right, yeah, join us nexttime Till we meet again.
Thanks Dina, thanks Hillary,bye.
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