Chem Thug and the Quest to Educate in an Era of Misinformation

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Well, now I uh, I'm not gonna lie Sometimes I think
about like I think about some ofthe people that, like you know,
are like afraid of what's.
A good example, that recent one, that that recent video that
you made, rob, where you're likethis woman who, like, poured
some water through her shreddedcheese and she was like look at

(00:20):
all this grossness coming out ofthe cheese, and I'm like, at
least I worry about things thatare actually valid to worry
about, like that.
I just feel bad for people likethat sometimes.

Speaker 2 (00:33):
You know that lady that does it.
She also does like a bunch ofrecipe videos and people tack me
in those.
I'm like I'm not going to dothose videos just because of all
the other shit she does.
But like, why doesn't she juststick to that Like she does?
Pretty well with those recipevideos, and then she goes off
and just like, loses her mindabout the, the tiniest thing oh
she's got like a whole thing ofthat.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
I thought I was under the impression that she's like
a one off, like random.

Speaker 4 (00:57):
No, she's really big on Instagram.

Speaker 2 (01:00):
Yeah, she has a P and you listen.
If you ever want to lose braincells, go into the comment
section of her videos.
It's all weak.
I can't believe what.
The FDA should be sued.
The government shouldn't beallowed to do this.
Like it's full, they have drankall the Kool-Aid.
The Kool-Aid is gone.
There's no more to drink.

Speaker 1 (01:23):
Are people this averse to like science?
I guess, yeah.
Like are people thisanti-electual anti-electual in
Canada as well.
Like is it is?
It?
Is it really like a broaderWestern thing?
I always felt like it was justlike a very American thing to be
super, to be like superanti-intellectual and at the
same time, be like, try to belike super intellectual about

(01:45):
your anti-intellectualism.
You know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (01:47):
Like it'll be like no , I'm not going to look at the
facts.
I mean, it's unfortunately veryprevalent in Alberta, mostly
because Alberta is like want tobe Texas.

Speaker 2 (02:01):
That makes sense and there's a lot of it in like
England as well, like there's.
I don't think it's just I thinkAmerica's.
We do everything big, but likeI think it is every other places
as well, just because we'relarger and we're more loud about
it is kind of what you see, butI think it kind of just comes
with the more you have, the moreyou forget about the past, the

(02:24):
things that people dealt withpreviously.
Like you look at vaccines andstuff like that.
People don't remember measles,mums through Bella, like I don't
remember any of that stuff.
So it's just polio.
No one really remembers.
And the people that do rememberpolio are like fuck polio, but
like people today, I don't wantto give my kid polio vaccine.
That's not a thing anymore.
So why should I have to do that?

Speaker 3 (02:43):
And I think it's just because they're so far removed?

Speaker 1 (02:46):
Yeah, exactly, it's like no, because what you don't
understand is that, like yourkid, polio is not a thing
anymore, because we've beengiven kids this vaccine.

Speaker 3 (02:54):
So we kind of need to keep doing that, you know like.

Speaker 4 (02:58):
I know that part.
Yeah, I'm really happy thatthere's the guy on TikTok.
He's like one of the lastpeople with polio in an iron
lung and he's well, oh, yeah,yeah, I'm talking about and it's
great because then people areactually seeing it.
But yeah, it's one of the lastpeople left.

Speaker 2 (03:15):
It's the anti, but it's always been the thing.
Like there was a Russianscientist I forget his name,
it's it's escaped me now butbasically he had this idea that,
like you, had to alter seeds byaltering their environment.
So, if you like, throw seedsfirst and then thought them out,
then they would grow in iceenvironments.

Speaker 1 (03:32):
Obviously knowing literally anything.
Yeah, no, this is a real thing.
Yeah, this this way.
Wait, hold on.
Is this that that that he waslike a Russian scientist that
was like strange scamming, likehe was.
He like knew that he wasbullshit, like he.
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (03:44):
I don't know, did he know he was bullshit?
I'm not, I'm not, I can't speakto them.

Speaker 1 (03:49):
But I don't.
Yeah, I don't know enough, I'msorry.
I think his name I'll remember,like halfway through the
podcast.

Speaker 2 (03:54):
But like basically, but the funny thing was at the
time, like it was Stalin.
Stalin was in power and heloved the idea because it was
like a definitely a communistthing.
Like you change the environmentand change the person.
You change the environment, youchange the seeds.
So they would plant them in iceareas.
They would use dynamite to buryseeds deeper, because you had

(04:14):
to bury them as deep as possible, and also seeds you could plant
as many as you want, becausecertain seeds would just die off
because they know they can'tsurvive with other seeds around.
So they would sacrificethemselves.
All complete nonsense.
Like all of this is nonsense.
But people bought into it, somuch so that Russia ended up
losing a lot of crops and had topretend like they were doing
really well.
So they kept exporting food andpeople kept were dying in

(04:35):
droves because they're like theycouldn't say like hey, this
didn't work out Right, so theyhad to pretend like it worked.
So then you know what happened.
This was the time of Mao Zedongin China, and so China saw like
wow, look at Russia exportingall this food.
Clearly, they have so much.
This is working.
So they got the same scientiststo teach them and they planted
so many seeds in like thenorthernest parts of China,

(04:57):
where it's completely frozenObviously didn't work and again
led to just massive starvation.
And still, to this day, there'speople in like the United
States that believe in this guyand still try and at least do
some of the things that he said.
And if that doesn't teach youthat like no, people won't learn
and we're all idiots, then Ireally don't know what will.
So it's, I can't remember itsname, it's just I got to look it

(05:21):
up later.
Yeah, I mean whole podcast.
I'll send it to you.
You got to listen to it.
It's, it's wild, it'sabsolutely wild.

Speaker 1 (05:30):
I feel like I'm familiar with at least some
aspects of this story, because Ido feel like at some point in
I've read or watched some randomvideo or article about a
Russian agricultural scientistwho, like, was trying to use
this ideology of like.
If you just like, you know, ifyou just subject the season,
appropriate environment, theygrow and they'll be able to grow

(05:51):
in that environment.
That's like the most that I canremember, but like I don't
think I knew about it thisperson then getting hired in
China.

Speaker 2 (05:58):
Yeah, no, they moved to China.
I know, yeah, that was wild.

Speaker 1 (06:03):
Oh, it's like, but that's.
But I mean like that's.
That's just like a con artist,though, though, though right
Like, because sometimes some ofthese people believe fully in
their, in their cool.
I don't know.
Oh yeah, you know for sure, youknow that's a, you know that's
a, you know trofum Lashenko.

Speaker 2 (06:23):
Look up trofum Lashenko.
That's his name.

Speaker 1 (06:25):
I completely, I just but yeah that's, but I'll
definitely, I'll definitely lookthat one up.

Speaker 2 (06:30):
You got to look it.
I'll send you, like, the linkto this podcast.
I listened to it.
If there's a, it's a two-parter.
I'm not going to lie.
It's long because there is somuch absolute crazy shit going
on, but I don't mind that.
I don't mind at all.

Speaker 1 (06:42):
I don't mind that at all.

Speaker 2 (06:43):
I like I watched two other videos on.

Speaker 1 (06:45):
YouTube FD signifies one of my favorite creators,
trofum Lashenko.

Speaker 2 (06:53):
Yeah, but like and he bored, he died in 1976.
So this wasn't that like it was, wasn't that long ago.

Speaker 1 (07:01):
It's like it's one of those things where it's like I
feel like, when I feel like it'sit really just comes down to
access to information, though,like you can be convinced of
something.
If a convincing enough personcomes along and gives you a
convincing case, you know it'slike anybody can get scammed.
That's really the whole reasonwhy knowledge is power, as, as

(07:22):
as is always said, that's atattoo.

Speaker 2 (07:24):
And I generally do there's a tattoo.
There's only one good knowledgeand one evil ignorance.

Speaker 1 (07:29):
Socrates, you know it's like I mean, like you know
there's, there's a thing where,like I feel like if enough
people have enough access toenough information, you kind of
stop running into these issues.
But that doesn't happen,unfortunately that doesn't
happen.
I just, I don't know, I don't,I don't, I don't want to, I
don't want to believe with thatscrew.

Speaker 2 (07:53):
It's such a it's such a balance.
So because in like a communistsociety it's perfect, because
the government kind of controlsthe way things the information
is delivered for the most part.
But also when you get the flipside in America, where there's
so much information, theneveryone has access to whatever
nonsense they want to come upwith.
And we know from like researchthat false information spreads

(08:15):
way faster than accurateinformation.
So it's this tough balance.

Speaker 1 (08:20):
Yeah, if you like, you know, if you just have, like
a straight free flow of justlike, whatever information in
whatever ways is going to go out, then yeah, of course,
especially if there's like,especially if there are
exogenous motives attached tothe dissemination of that
information, right, like, letyou know, it's difficult to have
this conversation withoutacknowledging that, you know,
the dissemination of informationhas often been tied to means,

(08:43):
right, so like, and who hasaccess to the ability to learn
accurate things in a validframework that gives them the
ability to critically think andquestion things appropriately?
You know, it's usually people,who is usually not most people,
and but the thing is, is that,like, I genuinely do believe
that if most, that most peopleare in fact have a perfectly

(09:07):
reasonable intellectual capacity, I do think that the vast
majority of people if, if we hadobviously this is not, you know
, possible, but if we had, like,an infinite set of resources
and an infinite amount of timeyou could make have most people
be reasonable, rational, logical, critical thinkers who are able
to assess valid information andconsume information.

(09:29):
Response.

Speaker 2 (09:29):
Do you think all like misinformation would be like
stamped out in that situation,Like do you think it would
spread at all or would it justbe gone?

Speaker 1 (09:35):
I think it would, just I think it would.
I think it would kind of do thething where it would slowly
fizzle out and there would be alot less of it.
I don't know that you couldever get rid of people.

Speaker 2 (09:44):
Right, that's my question.
You don't think it would Likeanti-social things?

Speaker 1 (09:46):
I don't think you would ever go away, but it
becomes like an oculation kindof like what we were talking
about with vaccines earlier.
Yeah, Like it's easier to foolsomebody who doesn't know things
.
So if, like, if early childhoodeducation were like a universal
thing and like we reallytrained kids, beginning as early
as possible, to just tocritically think just to think
critically, you know what I mean.
Like if we really could instillthat in humans in some way,

(10:08):
because you got to, you got tobe taught to do that.
I get tricked sometimes.
I'm not going to say like I'mnot gullible sometimes yeah
right, you know.
So, like you know, you really dohave to be trained to do that.
But you know I'm not going tosit here and pretend.
Like you know, we're on a greatcourse to be in.
No Right Get me.

Speaker 2 (10:24):
Do you think in our education system we're teaching
people, teaching children, toomuch of just kind of the
memorization like here are thefacts, as opposed to like we
need to teach more of thecritical thinking in order for
them to discern what is realityfrom what is myth?

Speaker 1 (10:39):
I guess You're trying to get me in trouble here.

Speaker 2 (10:43):
I mean, I don't know the answer to this.
Like I, it's, it's a different,like that.
And also like what, how tocensor things is I'm fascinated
with, because I think it.
We do need some censorship, buthow much and where and who does
it Like?
I don't know the answer tothese questions and I find them

(11:03):
just interesting.

Speaker 1 (11:05):
I mean, yeah, I'm not going to say I'm pretending
like I have like a perfectsolution to that Question is a
question that needs to beanswered because, you know, not
all information is needed at allpoints in time in one's life
and sometimes you don't wantpeople seeing certain things.
You know like trigger warnings,for perfect example.
You know like that's, you knowas a prime example of like when
you want to.
You know, but I think that'sstill kind of, and again, I
understand that this is kind ofI think the word I'm looking for

(11:28):
here is quixotic.
You know this idea that, likeyou know, if, if we were in a
perfect world.
Quote unquote or even just aworld, like I said, where more
people had more access to morelike, and this, I guess, is
where I guess this is kind ofwhat gets to your question,
right Like what is valid andcorrect information outside of
things that can be empiricallytested, you know, like, where do

(11:50):
we, where do we draw that line?

Speaker 2 (11:52):
I suppose, right Like there there is that before the
things that are we have testedand we do understand.
How much of that do we thencensor from people on the other
side, questioning, questioningthat that's kind of my question.
Like vaccines is always a greatexample.
There's always you know howmuch of that do we say, okay, no

(12:12):
, we really can't let thisspread, because people will
believe it and that is verydangerous.
But also then they're going tosay you're censoring us and
we're you know like that's,that's government intervention,
yada, yada, yada.
And I get that Like Iunderstand from their point of
view.
But fuck me, can I fuck someshit?

Speaker 1 (12:30):
I mean, you know if something I suppose that there
are, at least you know, I guess.
I guess there's, there's two,there's two paths to talking
about this, you know, with aconcrete example.
And then there's the like,nebulous information.
Like, you know it's like, butat least in that specific
example I mean look, we havelaws about spreading harmful

(12:51):
medical misinformation, rightLike we have laws against that,
and there are material harmsthat come to people when this
type of misinformation getsspread.
So I, I, you know I don't knowabout a perfect framework, but
you know if there's a materialharm, that that comes from the
proliferation of an idea.
You know I mean as somebody whohas suffered material harm for

(13:15):
the proliferation of certainideas.
But I hear what you're saying,I absolutely hear what you're
saying.
Like where's the line?
Like at what point, who gets todecide?

Speaker 2 (13:26):
And it's like, what frustrates me is you have, like
the, the I forget his name, butthe person who released the
study on vaccines and autism.
Yes, he was just.
Yes, he got his license takenaway.
Yes, he had some things.
You know, you know thathappened to him, but he's still
like, he still makes money offhis ideas.
He still, like, tries to spreadhis ideas.
He like people still pay himfor shit.

(13:48):
Like, so, even if you arecompletely like, the whole
system says, nope, we're takingall, all of your licensing and
everything away, you can stilltake your information anywhere,
make money off it, profit, andyou know well and so and yeah,
so this is where I go back tolike.

Speaker 1 (14:04):
this is where I go back to like.
In reality, you're right, andthat's just kind of like a
tragic result of where we existin my like perfect ideal world,
where people have access toenough information, most people
think critically you just can'tmake money off of that.
Like, if, like, and that'sthat's where I'm like, if there
is, if, if, if I'm not saying itis we're not there now, and I

(14:27):
mean, really it just kind ofsucks.
It makes me sad and that's abig part of why I decided to.
You know why me and my wifekind of did I've been doing the
Kim Dark thing, because thereneeds to be more voices of
reason out there, I think.
But you know, if you reallyasked me like, you know how I
feel deep down and you know whenI'm like, falling asleep at
night and I wish upon a star forthe way I wish the world to be.

(14:49):
I just wish more people werebetter at thinking critically so
that they couldn't be preyedupon in this way, because at the
end, you know, and I don't andI don't blame any given
individual for not knowingsomething right we all learn
things at certain points in ourlives and we didn't know it
beforehand, and that's just howthings work.
Like, being ignorant isn't acrime, no, being intentionally

(15:11):
ignorant, however, I don't know.
I personally feel so tiredabout people who were like nah,
I don't want to learn, I'm likewhy, not Because that's my
definition of stupid.

Speaker 2 (15:23):
It's like you have ignorant, which is like I just
didn't know, like I don't knowabout the mating rituals of
pandas, like whatever, like I'mignorant about that.

Speaker 4 (15:31):
But why?

Speaker 2 (15:31):
pandas.
Come on, red pandas.
I know, go back to the redpandas, the running gag, but
like being stupid is like here'sthe information I go.
No, I don't, I won't, I won'tlearn that.
I'm just going to stick withwhat I believe instead.
Yeah, my definition.

Speaker 4 (15:46):
Well, we've, we've already done half the podcast.
Do we have any if we didn'tintroduce the podcast yet?

Speaker 2 (15:53):
We just kind of ran into it.
Hey, welcome to the podcast inmoderation.
You're listening to Rob Liamand our special guest Chem Thug.
How you doing.
What up y'all?
Just coming in Okay, listen.
So yeah, let's go back tointroducing.
So I am super excited for thisepisode because of all our

(16:14):
guests so far.
You know.
Wait, rob, do you have?
Do other people that have beena guest on the show?
Do they listen to the podcastafter this?
Definitely not, no.

Speaker 4 (16:21):
They, they, they, they.
You know, just in case they do,I'm not going to say what I was
going to say Chem Thug, we'resuper excited to have you.

Speaker 1 (16:27):
I'm excited to be here.
I appreciate your advice.

Speaker 2 (16:30):
It's cool so yeah, why don't you give us a little
bit of what you do on kind oflike TikTok and your social
medias?
And, you know, give us yourdeal if you will.

Speaker 1 (16:39):
Sure sure.
So I am currently a PhDcandidate in a synthetic organic
chemistry research program andin my spare time, I guess, I
make videos on TikTok andYouTube and I guess also
Instagram and, I suppose,wherever else.
I eventually put them aboutchemistry, mostly just kind of

(16:59):
like debunking things, or tryingto debunking things that are
patently false, or trying toexplain things that are
mystifying or confusing or likewhy did this happen, you know,
like, so, like one of the firstvideos we did with where the uh,
why you can't mix bleach withvinegar, or any acid for that
matter, because of the wholereaction that generates chlorine

(17:20):
gas, which is, you know,technically something you might
figure out after like an O-chemone course, right, or a Jinkum
even.
But you know, sometimes youneed to be told not to mix
bleach with things.

Speaker 4 (17:32):
That's what I did.
Sometimes you need to be toldnot to eat borax.

Speaker 2 (17:37):
We'll get into the borax thing in a second.
What?

Speaker 4 (17:39):
got you interested, though.

Speaker 2 (17:40):
I'm curious what got you interested, though, in doing
that?
Did you just see a lot of thisstuff popping up on your social
media or whatever?
Like, what made you interestedin being like, hey, actually
don't do that, I'm trying togive a short answer here.

Speaker 1 (17:55):
I like teaching, I like explaining things.
I always have, even since I wasa little kid.
So I don't consume a whole lotof TikTok.
I do consume a fair amount ofYouTube, but my wife consumes a
lot of TikTok and she would showme things and she would ask me
questions and I would be like,oh well, see, this is what's
happening there and this is whatthat's about.

(18:16):
And then there was one daywhere she was like hey, do you
want to make a video explainingthis thing that you just
explained to me?
And I was like sure why not?
Yeah, that's good.
And then it did really like waybetter than either of us ever
could have possibly expected itwould do.
And then the next one we didlike Legit went viral, which was
the chlorine.
The chlorine and, excuse me,the chlorine gas from bleach and

(18:38):
vinegar.
And so we did a couple morevideos, and I think the first
four videos were all about likebleach and what not to do with
it.

Speaker 2 (18:47):
You get pigeonholed into something and I guess you
have pigeonholed into bleach.

Speaker 1 (18:51):
Yeah, for those first few videos I was like man, I'm
just like here, like somebodyhas sent me a question asking me
like, yeah, you know, I cleanedthis pan I had with bleach and
this other stuff and here's somepictures of what it looks like
now and it got on those crazycolors and you know.

Speaker 3 (19:05):
I was like man.

Speaker 1 (19:06):
That sounds like a really interesting Redox
reaction series and I kind ofstarted trying to look into it a
little bit, but I didn't haveenough information to like
really figure it out.
At the end of the day I waslike I don't really know, I can
give a guess.

Speaker 2 (19:19):
But that's a sign of a person who actually knows his
business.
They can say like oh, I don'tknow, it's probably something to
do with this or that, but like,at the end of the day, that's
something, that's somethingright there.

Speaker 1 (19:30):
Yeah, I feel like.
I feel like one of the mainthings you learn in any kind of
like in any higher education.
At some point you learn that,like you don't know a lot of
things.
There's a lot of things youjust don't know, and that's fine
, that's OK, it's totally fine.
It's totally fine, but yeah youknow, I just kind of continued
on after that.

(19:51):
Like you know, my wife wouldsuggest videos or I would come
up with things that I thoughtwould be interesting, and you
know we would go for it.

Speaker 2 (19:57):
Nice, so we do have to.
So yes, Valaz, Rob alluded tothe one thing that kind of blew
up that you know we were allfascinated with.
We all did videos.
I did a video.
It got taken down.
Tick Tock got real mad at mefor doing a satire piece on
borax, and I know your video gotlike taken down for a little
bit and then you had to get itreinstituted.
It was like a whole thing, butyeah give people a little

(20:20):
background on the whole boraxthing, if you could.

Speaker 1 (20:23):
Oh man, I guess I should have.
Probably I should have seenthis coming Right At some point.
At some point my wife hadapproached me with this one and
she was like yo, people aredrinking borax or tick tock,
basically.

Speaker 3 (20:38):
You were like no way.

Speaker 1 (20:40):
Why.
And she was like, oh well, youknow, they say it does all these
things.
And I was like, no, it doesn't,what.
So I was like, all right, well,maybe I'm wrong.
You know, like I said, like Iwas saying before, like I try to
get people benefited to doubt.
I don't know everything, I'mnot a medical expert and I mean
like maybe there's some I don'tknow, so I look into it and I
actually for a lot of the videos.

(21:01):
Up to that point I didn't haveto do a lot of like literature,
searching to like understand,because a lot of it was stuff
that I still kind of just know.
And then I would like look upstuff in literature after and be
like, yep, I was right, butthis one I was like, no, I'm
going to go do some digging.
I'm going to do some diggingand literally everything I found
was like this is toxic, this ispoison, Don't drink this, Don't
eat this.

(21:22):
I found like maybe like tworandom papers that were like
boron is a necessarymicronutrient that's present
enough in other things that youreally shouldn't supplement it
because you need to access boronas a problem.
But that's boron, not borax.
Borax is like your body doesn'tgive people borax?

Speaker 2 (21:41):
Can you give people like, just like?
People are probably like whatthe fuck?

Speaker 1 (21:43):
is borax.
I don't know, sorry, yeah, noproblem.
So borax is borax is the that,that laundry additive you've
seen in the 20 mL box, and it'sthis chemical compound.
That's a salt, it's an.
It's a salt of boric acid.
It's a sodium, it's a salt ofsodium and boron, which borate
is boron, with a bunch of oxygenattached to it.

(22:07):
I'm stumbling with the namebecause the way it actually
forms is like a substance isvaguely kind of weird.
It's not just like a one to onething like sodium and chloride,
it's like two sodiums or threesodiums and then like a few
different borons and a bunch ofoxygen atoms.
But the simple version of it islike boron with three oxygens
attached to it and then like twosodiums or something like that,

(22:28):
or three sodiums or somethinglike that, and it's usually just
uses like a laundry booster,like I think it has applications
for like pottery stuff.
There's definitely a bunch ofchemistry you can do with like
boron and borate compounds Iused I literally used one last
week to do something related tomy research is Suzuki coupling,
although it wasn't boric acid,it was like boric acid was

(22:49):
something else attached to it,not important, but I know, but
like you know.
So borax is just the salt ofboric acid, is a sodium salt of
boric acid.
It's like boron, three oxygenatoms and a couple of various

(23:12):
numbers of sodium sodium atoms.
And people will say things likethat, like, oh, this is boron,
sodium and oxygen.
It's like, oh, it's totallyfine.
It's not like it depends on themolecule itself and like how
it's made.
Thus it's chemistry, not howit's made, but the structure of
it and thus it's chemistry.
So yeah, you know, like I said,I did some digging and
everything basically said likeborax, no, absolutely not.
This is like a poison.

(23:33):
Like why would you eat thisboron?
Yeah, necessary micronutrient,get it in your diet.
So at first, like when I firststarted making the video, I was
like all right, well, you know,I'm going to like approach this
with some like grace and youknow, like clearly there's maybe
some necessity of boron and thediet and maybe I should try to
right.
And I started to think about ita little bit more and I saw the
intro that my wife had puttogether, because she put, she

(23:55):
made that.
I saw that was all her.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
If you haven't seen it people listening to this go
watch it.
It's just like a ton of peoplelike just it's so many clips.
It's like 37 of people drinkingborax.

Speaker 1 (24:07):
And then I saw it like.
And then I because at firstalso like I thought that I
didn't realize at first that itwas like the 20 mule brand, like
laundry booster, borax, likethere was a period where I was
like maybe I'll show people howto recrystallize it so that they
can, like you know, use itsafely, or something I was like
no, we're using fire.

(24:27):
No, yeah, you know, I meanthat's literally why the video
opens with like don't eat shitout the laundry box.
People like don't do that.
Like just don't do that, evenif it's good for you.
Like why would you eat it fromthere?
Like what?
No, what's wrong with you?
So you know, I had a bit of avisual reaction to this,
especially after doing actualresearch, so like be sure that I

(24:48):
wasn't like making something up.
At some point somebody told methat there is some random person
who like wrote manuscripts thatare of dubious publication
quality, that purport to havethat borax, that their personal
use of borax helped alleviatetheir what was it?
Arthritis.
But like sounds real.

(25:13):
Yeah, I was gonna say like youknow, like if I can't find, if
that's the only thing I can findand anything else says nah, I'm
going to go with anything else,like I don't know what.
You look, I made it to the ripeold age of 34 without eating
borax once.
So I think I'm on the rightside of history here.

Speaker 2 (25:31):
So basically we need boron.
So these people are saying,okay, drink this, which is boron
and just some other things, andthat's good for you.
That was basically their, theirclaim.

Speaker 4 (25:40):
It's a trace amount of boron that we need.
It's not even that much.

Speaker 1 (25:44):
And it's like I don't know the borons, the thing that
like I mean again, this is notsomething that's like my, my
field of expertise, but I do I'maware that there is a degree to
which your body excretescertain minerals and substances
at different rates, like iron,for example.
You might have some of the iron, some of the iron that's in
your body might have been inyour body for years at this
point, right, like some of theindividual iron atoms.

(26:05):
But like vitamin C, if youdrink vitamin C this morning,
it's gone already, probably,right, you know.
So boron might be one of thosethings that hangs out a lot
anyway, so you don't really needto like worry about consuming
it, you know, but like it isalso just like the thing of like
.
That's not how that works.

Speaker 2 (26:25):
How did they get to the point where they're like,
yes, boron will cure thesethings that I have, like it
doesn't compute.

Speaker 1 (26:33):
It's, it's, it's.
I feel like it goes back tolike the thing I was saying
earlier, where it's like youknow, if you don't have, if you
don't have enough information,if you don't have enough correct
information to combatmisinformation that agrees with
what you think should be correct, then it just becomes that much
easier for you to fall intothat hole.
And then you run into thatissue of people not wanting to

(26:54):
be wrong, like I'm not going tosit here and pretend, like I
feel, bad sometimes when likesomebody's like yo.
Jake yo, yo, yo yo yo.
You were, you were.
You weren't right about that.
That was a I was a incorrectanswer.
You didn't even carry the three.
Yeah, I'm like ah, you're right, I wasn't, you know I get over
it.
It's fine, you know but youknow, and for some people they
get very attached to what theybelieve it carries different

(27:17):
weight.

Speaker 2 (27:18):
If you get like an equation wrong, okay I'll admit
I'm wrong.
But if you get I was drinkingcleaning product wrong, that's
just like a different beast.

Speaker 1 (27:28):
Yeah, you're like nah , I don't want to be, I don't
want to be that wrong Like nah,because like that I look like an
idiot.
You know it's like that peoplemake fun of me on the internet.
You know like, and it's likeyou know I feel bad.
I genuinely do feel bad for alot of the a lot of the people,
for a lot of the people in theworld, for a lot of the people
in those spaces not necessarilythe people who are like,

(27:49):
knowingly putting out falseinformation or knowingly put out
, putting out, knowingly puttingout information that is
somewhat dubious.
You know, like, I like, they'relike.
I think when I was looking intothis, I found some people who
are like I don't know, I heardthis, but I also know this, so I
don't know and I'm like thisisn't that much better, but this
isn't as bad as people, juststraight up being like yo, just

(28:10):
put a sprinkle of 20 mule inyour water bottle in the morning
and you'll never get cancer.
Like I'm like Jesus.
But the thing is it's like ifyou don't understand enough
about how things work in general, then it becomes way easier for
you to think that these likequasi magical solutions are
possible.
You know, or or also right, andI wonder to what degree.

(28:30):
Also like because we live insuch a scientifically and
technologically advanced pointthat there are people who are
like yo, but we can probablyjust do this now, right, like
because we just have thetechnology right.
And I question if at all.
That is a degree to whichpeople.
It just makes it easier forpeople to believe something like
that, whereas, like, oh, youknow, I mean, when you consider

(28:52):
that we exist in the age of someof the, some of the medications
that we have nowadays, like youknow that even just 10 years
ago would have beenrevolutionary.
Well, I guess you know that bydefinition, it doesn't matter
when they happen.
They're revolutionary.

Speaker 3 (29:03):
But I think you get what I mean right.

Speaker 2 (29:05):
Like you know yeah it's just.
It's fascinating to me thewhole boron boric situation is
just it was so yeah, so yeah, wegot heat.

Speaker 1 (29:15):
We got heat for it, right.
Like you know, we put out thisvideo and a lot of it was about
like, as you mentioned, theshocking intro, my wife's intro.
I think a lot of people werelike what?
And I put up a little video, youknow, and I tried to be, I
tried to be reasonable at theend, where I was, like you know,
look, I understand that healthcare is a thing and you know all
of that, but, like yo, don'tyou know, try to find that like

(29:37):
legit information.
You know what I mean and I'lleven say I don't remember who
this person was or what vectorthrough which they contacted me,
but there was one person whocontacted me about that video
and they were like Yo, real talk.
I've used borax to deal withlike an eye infection Because I
genuinely do not have access toother appropriate medication.

(29:58):
I am very much aware of thefact that that's like a last
resort kind of thing.
Wow, thank you for like takinga moment to acknowledge that
like, health care is not likeequitable in this country and
sometimes people have to resortto things like that.
People are desperate, which isheartbreaking.
Like what?

Speaker 2 (30:16):
That is absolutely when you're so down and out that
you go to your cleaning sectionand you just say well,
hopefully this helps with thething I have.
That's a that's a bad spot.

Speaker 4 (30:27):
Hopefully I don't go blind.

Speaker 2 (30:29):
You know, I'm just like yo.
Greatest country in the world,america.

Speaker 1 (30:34):
Tell me about it, right.
So, most of the most of thepeople who reached out were not
like this person.
Most of the people reached outwere all kinds of young adults.
Talk about you getting paid bythe pharmaceutical company which
yo, if there is apharmaceutical company out there
that wants to pay me to tellpeople to not do something that
I'm already going to tell themnot to do Right.
Holla at me,chemicalthuggeryatgmailcom.

Speaker 4 (30:59):
I would happily be paid to tell people not to
consume laundry detergent.

Speaker 3 (31:05):
Why?

Speaker 1 (31:05):
I'm just like yo, this is like I don't like.
Why would you like?

Speaker 2 (31:09):
you know, I'm just like I'm not anyway, so that
happened, but yeah, tiktok tookit down because of that like
intro, they were like theythought you were like promoting
it and it took you a whilesaying, hey, no, we're trying to
educate people, right?

Speaker 1 (31:22):
So yeah, they.
I'm pretty sure part of it wasalso just like a lot of people,
a lot of people, some of thosepeople sending those messages
being like nah, report this formisinformation.
You know, it's fine, I get it,but I do, you know, honestly, it
getting reposted was amonumentally eye-opening moment

(31:42):
for me, I guess, because thatwas probably the moment where I
was like, oh, I'm like actuallya content creator now with like
a following in a community Withsome influence.

Speaker 2 (31:52):
I can get my video back.

Speaker 1 (31:54):
Right and I don't.
I hope to not hope that thatdoesn't come across as like some
weird, you know, megalomaniacalsort of thing, because it very
much was like I'm not, don'tworry, that's what I just heard.

Speaker 3 (32:04):
He'll All right.

Speaker 1 (32:08):
I mean, yeah, of course, obviously, like, there
is the degree to which I just Idid, in a lot of ways, kind of
just end up stumbling into this,but I am, I am like wildly,
wildly humbled by this, Like,especially that moment where I
was like yo, I really asked themto help me get this video back.
And they helped me get thisvideo back.
Like that didn't happen becauseI complained about it.

(32:29):
That happened because I thinkroughly a hundred thousand
people engaged with and watchedthat video that I posted
complaining about it, and theywere like Kim Thug is great, we
love Kim Thug, please put hisstuff back.
And I was like yo, I kind ofcan't stop doing this, I guess.

Speaker 2 (32:42):
Well, at least I got to like, try to like.

Speaker 1 (32:44):
I got to try to like keep this up to some degree,
because yo, these, yo, there's200,000 people out here willing
to go to bat for me.
Yeah, holy shit, this isamazing.
So you know and now?

Speaker 4 (32:57):
Now you're on the best podcast ever Right Now.
I love it.

Speaker 1 (33:02):
Forget getting the video back.
Being on in moderation is theso, but then I think that's when
every single followers andachievement real talk every
single followers achievement,every single follower,
Absolutely.
I'm not trying to say that justto be nice.
I mean that from the core of mybeing like I wouldn't you
wouldn't have invited me here ifit weren't for all those people
.
So real talk, like Absolutely.

Speaker 4 (33:22):
I mean, we wouldn't be here if it was for all those
people.

Speaker 2 (33:24):
Absolutely.
I don't know why people likelisten to me yell about shit,
but they do, so I just go withit, so I thank you.
But then is when I think thesequel kind of happened for you
is was, was colloidal silver,and I just found that and that's
another one that I was justlike I I'm what what?

Speaker 1 (33:42):
You had.

Speaker 2 (33:43):
I thought it was a joke.
I was a hundred percent certainit was a joke and it took a
long time for me to go oh,people are actually doing this,
so you got to give the people alittle bit on what colloidal
silver is like.
That it's just, it's sosomething you have to talk about
something.
It's so something, so something.

Speaker 1 (34:00):
So I mean, yeah, that was another one of the ones
that honestly, that one I wasless surprised by than the Borax
one, just because it is notuntrue that silver has been used
in medicine and continues tofind use in medicine.
Just not that kind Like justnot that one.

Speaker 2 (34:21):
So that's a small detail.
That's a small detail.
Don't worry about it, there'snot one.

Speaker 1 (34:25):
You know, I'm just like yo.
You might as well just buy likea hunk of sterling of like
actual like sterling silver andjust chew on that shit Like
you're doing about as much foryour health.

Speaker 3 (34:37):
Oh OK, Maybe even more.

Speaker 4 (34:40):
Oh OK, Somebody's going to listen to this and
they're going to stop rightthere and just run out and buy
some silver.

Speaker 1 (34:45):
No, I shouldn't have said it.
No, don't do that?

Speaker 2 (34:48):
I mean in the grand scheme of things.
I've heard a lot worse justchewing on a box of silver.
That's all I'm going to say.

Speaker 1 (34:53):
Right, at least sterilize it first.
But yeah, no, so the waycolloidal silver works is like
it's.
So if you imagine, like youhave like a hunk of metal, right
, like, imagine this hunk ofmetal like a bar of a bar of
silver, right Now, make that bara ball of silver, right?
That ball of silver is full ofsilver atoms, right?
And if it's a ball that'sroughly the size of your hand,

(35:15):
there's going to be, you know,millions upon billions, upon
billions of them in there.
So let's shrink that ball downto like half the width of a
human hair.
At this point you start talkingabout a much smaller amount of
atoms, and at this point youstart talking about like
colloidally suspended particlesof silver metal which are
largely which.

(35:35):
I'm not going to sit here andtry to like say how many atoms
are per, because I don'tremember top my head but like
you can get various size,dispersions and distributions,
but it ultimately ends up beinglike little, tiny, like not
quite microscopic, becauseusually there's a haze in the
water so you can kind of see theturbidity of the liquid, and
that is actual, like silvermetal in tiny, tiny particulate

(35:57):
form just floating around.
And bulk silver metal is likeantimicrobial to some degree.
I forget exactly how it works,but like, yeah, I think, like,
if you actually just like ifthey're, if you try to culture
bacteria on like a silversurface, it doesn't work, at
least some, not all, I don'tthink.
But colloidal silver doesn'treally work like that.

(36:19):
It doesn't like, it just kindof accumulates in your body and
doesn't really do anything.
And if it does do anything,it's not like specific.
So a lot of people like tothink that, like, for reasons
that I cannot begin to fathom,but I can only guess at that,

(36:41):
you know the way, the way that,like you know, when you don't
have information, your mindmakes you make up things to
explain it.
You know, like that's justmagic.

Speaker 2 (36:51):
That's how we got the early religions 500 years ago.
I could forgive all of this.
Like, absolutely Like the fourhumors that we had like the, the
miasma theory of disease, werelike just bad smells cause
disease.
I'm like, so the idea that badsmells cause disease, listen,
500 years ago, I'm with it.
I totally understand why peoplesay this thing smells bad, it

(37:13):
goes around people, people getsick, like, and so bad smells
cause disease.
Like, I, I, I, those, those aredots I can connect, but we are
in a time where those dotsshould not no longer be able to
connect.
And people are still connectingthese dots and I just, I'm, I'm
, I'm interested in, baffled byit.

Speaker 1 (37:31):
There's a lot of it that does have to do with the
fact that there are people whoare who actively benefit from
other people buying into this.
So it's not just that like youknow, it's not just that, it's
like they could say it and likethe people who sell colloidal
silver aren't talking about itthe way I talk.

Speaker 2 (37:49):
Sure they don't, but they wouldn't sell very well.

Speaker 1 (37:52):
Exactly, you know, that's I mean, that's really
what it comes down to, whereit's like, you know, and then
you know people need medicalcare.
So you know they turn to thesecrazy alternative things that
have like the vagus sliver ofvague kind of thought of
legitimacy, but they it's like.
It's not like silver as amedicine has never been used
internally.
I don't think like extensivelylike that.

(38:14):
Maybe right before, like earlybefore we had figured out
penicillin, I think some peopledid kind of try to use colloidal
silver as a more spectrum.
Internal Because, like I said,it has antimicrobial properties
like that some but like I'mpretty sure, from what I
remember when I was actuallylooking up stuff for that video,
it was never really wellestablished that it actually had

(38:36):
a significant effect beyond,like you know, basically just
like kind of placebo, you know,like it would maybe work and
maybe wouldn't, and thefortunate thing is that it's
tolerated reasonably well by thebody right, like of the of the
heavy metals, because it is aheavy metal.
Don't let anybody tell youdifferent.
It's a heavy metal.

Speaker 3 (38:58):
It's one of the least bad heavy metals.

Speaker 2 (39:00):
you can consume Couch .
How much does this magicalthing cost?

Speaker 1 (39:07):
Which you know to be fair.
I think that has a lot to dowith how it ends up, you know,
kind of maintaining this spacein the alternative medicine
community, if you will, becausethis is not the first.
Like you know, colloidalsilvers people have been hocking
that stuff for like, like whenI, even when I was recording the
video, like I kind of saw likepeople still try to sell this

(39:28):
stuff, because I remember Iremember there was like kind of
a big wave of it again, likemaybe like 15 years ago or so,
and I was like I feel like it'sbeen around and people have
continued to try to like pushthis quote unquote alternative
medicine, you know it's like.
You know it's like apricot seedsis another one of those things
it's like when people, althoughthat was a little different
because it's you know, cancer Iguess, but like it's, it kind of

(39:51):
all goes from, comes from thesame place.
There's like this vague notionthat it kind of sounds like it
could work.
And then you got a bunch ofpeople because, you know, I'm
pretty sure neither of you havea second colloidal silver.

Speaker 2 (40:04):
Currently no yeah.

Speaker 1 (40:06):
So, like you know, with people with enough
awareness and critical thinkingcapacity to at least, like I
might buy it, I might likebelieve that you're saying
something that's accurate, butI'm not going to like put
credence into it until I doubleverify it.
You know what I mean Like.
But if people feel like you arein a position of authority to

(40:26):
tell them something you know,you know sometimes they just
they just take it and run withit, you know, especially if it
sounds like everything that theywant and more.

Speaker 2 (40:35):
You know, like you're saying that you're kind of
saying like it has this truth toit and I think a lot of it
comes down to the name likecolloidal silver has like a
really good ring to it.
So I've written down some namesand so for the magic thing that
we're coming up with that curesthings, I want you guys to tell
me what you think, OK, becauseobviously, as everybody knows,
the most important thing inthese things is the name.

Speaker 4 (40:56):
Right, Like that's what we're going to hear yeah,
oh, yeah, it's the sciencebehind it.

Speaker 2 (41:00):
Fuck that OK.
So what do you think of FireflyGold?
Because I think like no OK whatabout?
Firefly Dust, and yes, they allbegin with Firefly.
Listen, I think Fireflies arealready sort of otherworldly and
weird.

Speaker 1 (41:17):
So I don't think it's Firefly Dust could work.
Firefly Dust could work.

Speaker 4 (41:20):
It does kind of sound like a drug or something.
Keep going, keep going, keepgoing.

Speaker 2 (41:24):
Because, ok, because we, I think Firefly needs to be
in there because, like it's just, it's already seemed sort of
magical, like if you're justlooking at Fireflies, they look
kind of magical.
We need something that peoplecan jump to the magic without
realizing they're jumping intomagic.

Speaker 1 (41:37):
That's what we need.
How you wait, you got morenames on the list.
I'm deeply curious about this.
Actually, I'm also a creativewriter, so I don't have anything
written on here at all.

Speaker 2 (41:46):
This is a receipt.
I'm just.

Speaker 1 (41:50):
Just random shit.
How about Glowfly Dust?

Speaker 2 (41:56):
I like that more.
Actually, I was all in onFirefly, now I'm in on go
Glowfly, glowfly Dust.
The dust sounds good Like dustis.
Yeah, like it's just it's.
It's small, it can like youknow, I don't know, there's
something about that.

Speaker 4 (42:11):
I like your line of it.

Speaker 2 (42:15):
Like that kind of tells you how you're going to
take it right, like it's just adust, like whatever you can, put
it in water, you could solvethis.

Speaker 1 (42:22):
It's a water drop.

Speaker 2 (42:24):
It's a you know whatever holes you want to drop
it in.

Speaker 3 (42:27):
You can just drop it right in there, it's totally
fine.

Speaker 1 (42:31):
Oh, man, and the best part is, you could like, you
know, you could say, you know,you could just like mix a little
bit of like a radon what do youcall it?
Like a radon paint and somelike sawdust, and it will
definitely glow oh holy shit.

Speaker 2 (42:44):
If it actually like glow, just a little bit even if
it was like under ultravioletlight or something like you
could show people like I'mtaking this, so like oh, what's
that?
And you're like, oh, hold on,let me turn the lights off real
quick, watch this.
And then it lights up andthey're like holy shit, that is
magic, that is actual magic.
Like you said, we don't knowanything anymore, so like all
information is gone.
I think we could really foolquite a few people Now.

Speaker 4 (43:06):
Okay, kemp Thug are you okay coming up with like
real talk?

Speaker 2 (43:09):
We need you to come up with the science-y stuff
behind it, like it doesn't haveto make sense.
It doesn't have to make anysense.

Speaker 1 (43:14):
So wait, hold up, hold up.
Because, like it's funny thatyou had this, that you had this
kind of planned out, because itwas a while ago when I made a
video on hexagonal water and Igot real deep into looking into
like what is the?
I?
Because somebody I made a video, somebody made a comment on
YouTube and they were like, yeah, real easy for you to take down
some scam water, some scam likeyou know water purifier thing.

(43:34):
But maybe you should address DrDr Gerald Pollock's like
several reams of publishedresearch on easy water and
hexagonal water in the exclusionzone and I was like what,
there's like a what?
So I looked into it.
Yeah, you know, that's what youdo right, yeah.

Speaker 2 (43:49):
You know you look into it and sure enough.

Speaker 1 (43:51):
this is dude Gerald Pollock, who's like out here
talking about some.
Oh well, you know, we let me becareful here, cause he's like
actually got his PhD and he'slike actually like a very, you
know, published and I think he'sdone plenty of things that are
actually valid.
But this I understand he gets alot of.
He gets a lot of flack for thislike easy water idea.
There he did some experimentsand he showed that like if you

(44:14):
have water and it like thatwater self arranges basically,
which we kind of know right, andbut he's like extending this
logic to like all kinds of wildthings, and this idea of
hexagonal water is one of them,where, like water, when treated
appropriately I forget exactlywhat you have to do to it, but
like the water molecules, theH2O molecules, will arrange
themselves in the hexagons andstay in that shape, and this has

(44:37):
like wild properties and itlike leads to like water having
memory and all kinds of wildthings.
And so I was like you know, ifpeople buy that, you know what
they'll buy Tesseractal water.
I don't drink.

Speaker 4 (44:48):
I don't drink hexagonal water, I drink
tesseractal water.

Speaker 1 (44:51):
And the way tesseractal water works is that,
you know, hydration isdifficult, right?
Like a lot of people struggleto drink water.
Yeah, and it's true, like waterdoesn't, it's always tastes
that great, right?
So how great would it be if youcould like drink water for now,
and also the times when youhadn't drank water in the last
like you know, day or so, that'swhere tesseractal water comes

(45:12):
in.
It's hydration in the fourthdimension.

Speaker 3 (45:16):
So basically, you know, you take.

Speaker 1 (45:18):
you take hexagonal water, right, and then you add
to a small amount of magnetizedpowder, iron, and then you take
this powder you mix it up andthen what you have to do you
have to put it on a rectifyingdevice.
Now, fortunately, a rectifyingdevice can actually just be a
VCR.
No, no bullshit.

(45:38):
Because the magnet, because themagnets in the VCR will be able
to force the magnetized powderto induce the tesseractal form
of the water in the vessel.
So all you have to do is takeyour you know your hexagonal
water that's been doped with themagnetic powder, put it on the
rectifying device and hit rewind, and for every hour that you

(45:59):
rewind it, you will hydrate aprevious day's worth of yourself
.

Speaker 2 (46:03):
People are going to be going in droves to the dump
to find their local VCRs thathave been thrown away.
I can't believe I just threwout the answer to all my
hydration problems.
I must go get my VCR back.

Speaker 4 (46:17):
That was just brilliant.
That was brilliant.
And there's so many like.
I'm just thinking about logosnow.

Speaker 2 (46:26):
Like we need to get a logo on this, like rewind water
, like, like, oh, there's somany.

Speaker 1 (46:32):
I think that's better .
Actually, I think that's better.
I think that's better.
Rewind water, rewind water.

Speaker 2 (46:36):
Like the first to market tesseractal water.

Speaker 1 (46:38):
Yeah, there we go.

Speaker 2 (46:43):
You put little like a little VC like I don't.
Oh, there's so many like littlethings you could do.
It would be so good Peoplewould buy that shit up.
They really would.
Yeah, you know it's, it's.
It's wild to me.

Speaker 1 (46:52):
I'm not going to pretend Like I don't enjoy and
find it hilarious to like comeup with these things, but at the
same time that I cannot helpbut be just a little bit sad
knowing that there is somebodyout there who would fall for
that shit.
Oh, it's not somebody.

Speaker 2 (47:05):
Somebody's people.
Okay, rewind water.
Get your extra dimension orrewind water.
The dimensions have changed.
There's oh, there's so manygood that it would be great.
It would be so good.
I'm all in, we take, we takeglow, fly dust and rewind water

(47:26):
and we become fuckingmillionaires.
That's what I do there's glow,fly dust, oh man.

Speaker 3 (47:29):
I might sit on that I might.

Speaker 1 (47:31):
I might sit and think on that one.
I might write you off.
So I'm like, just because Ilike that name glow, fly, dust
and nothing else I'm going touse that in, like my D&D
campaign world.
That's.
That's going to be a new thing.
Nice, I might be in thecampaign world I got to figure
out what.
But I like the name.
I like it too much, oh man.

Speaker 4 (47:46):
But yeah, man, I love it.

Speaker 1 (47:48):
It's, yeah, it's.
It's always kind of crazy to me, like I, you know, as much as I
feel bad about it, like, and Ido what I can to like try and
like put some information outhere, just be one additional
voice of reason out here.
You know, I'm just like I'maware that you can't save every
starfish, as they say, but I wasat the very end of the day.

(48:09):
At the very least I try to.
I try to get people like Mostpeople except for people who
have entire platforms dedicatedto just promoting erroneous
ideologies or they're straightup just out there to make money
off of this them.
I'm like, nah, y'all can gokick rocks or open to shoes,
like real talk.
But to the people who aregenuinely just kind of like

(48:32):
don't know things, and for noreal fault of their own, because
America's public educationsystem sucks and you gotta pay
for college and books areexpensive and they're written in
languages that people don'talways understand, because
jargon is a real thing you knowwhat I mean.
Like I can't be that mad atpeople for like not knowing
things.
I can't be a little frustratedat people for not looking them
up.
So I always hope that at theend of any of my videos

(48:55):
colloidal, silver, borax, any ofthem that people are like maybe
I should just look things up,you know if you're one of those
people, if it's one of thosepeople, if the person watching
it is like is one of thosepeople that was considering it
or had used it or at some pointit was like not really aware of
it.
It's like I hope that my videosat the very least give people
the sensation that, like yo, Icould just look something up,

(49:15):
like I could just kind of likelook into this actually on my
own and like at least just havea more informed opinion, because
, at the very least, like, whenpeople get fall down, these like
information silos, theinformation rabbit holes, like
it, if there's, if there's afoothold that was made earlier
on, even if they were just likebriefly introduced to the idea

(49:37):
that, like yo, wait, hold up,there are some people who
disagree with this and they havelegitimate disagreements.
I feel like that at the veryleast can help get people to
stop being like that.
You know what I mean, becausethese people vote oh.

Speaker 2 (49:50):
I think if you have stopped one person from taking
colloidal silver and holes ordrinking cleaning products, I
think you have done a very goodjob.
I mean, I'll call that avictory.
I'll call that a win any day ofthe week, yeah.

Speaker 1 (50:04):
No, I know Real talk.
I mean, every time I get acomment that's like I wish you
were my teacher, or thank you somuch for the information, I'm
like that's why I do this.
That is the main reason why Ikeep doing this, because trying
to get this PhD is is sucking alot of the life out of me.

Speaker 2 (50:21):
I don't have a life time to do that's why you need
glow, fly dust and rewind water.
They'll help get you throughwhat this is, bro Well, I think
you got to at least tell peoplewhere all your social media
things were to find you at theend.
So people remember, so they cango look up how to not take

(50:42):
borax.

Speaker 1 (50:44):
Right.
So fortunately all of mysocials have the same handle at
Kim Thug C, H E M T H U G.
That is Kim truly humbled underGod.

Speaker 3 (50:55):
I still can't do that with a straight face.

Speaker 1 (51:00):
That was most ridiculous to cut out of her.
But yeah, at Kim Thug I am onYouTube trying to grow the
platform there Definitelyappreciate any subscribers over
there.
I am still on tic tac and alsoon Instagram.
I mean, if you reallyappreciate, if you watch my
stuff and you appreciate what Ido, I definitely appreciate a
coffee and yeah, you know Idefinitely you can.

(51:24):
You can try and DM me.
I cannot promise that I will beable to answer any, any
particular question somebodysends me, but you know I do make
an effort and I do mine thatfor content.
So you know, like there was thatvideo on chemical structures
that somebody asked for and Iactually had a lot of fun with
that one because I've wanted toexplain chemical structures and
nomenclature to people for along time because I feel like

(51:44):
it's very easy to actuallyunderstand.
And then once you know it, it'slike yo wait, like I know a
thing now.
Like I love knowledge that likeis actionable.
We're like you teach somebodysomething and they can go and
like do something.
It's like, yeah, you might haveto like intentionally go like
crack a chemistry textbook tofind some molecules to look at.
But you can do it now, right,like you couldn't do that before

(52:06):
you know something.

Speaker 4 (52:09):
But yeah, I know what channel I'm going to be
phishing while I edit this.

Speaker 2 (52:14):
Well, I just went on to YouTube and and subscribe to
Ken Thug on yeah, on YouTube.
So you go do that.
It takes you a second, it helpsus, helps out and you can maybe
learn something.
Learn some stuff aboutchemistry, which he actually
makes it fun, because I'm goingto tell you, I've taken
chemistry multiple times and Iusually do not have fun.

Speaker 4 (52:31):
I won't lie to you I don't have fun.
So that was a pretty greatepisode for our 25th episode,
hey right.

Speaker 1 (52:40):
I'm glad y'all think so.
I feel like it was pretty fun.

Speaker 2 (52:43):
I thought it was pretty cool.
I love talking about.
I love talking about like justfake cures and stuff, like it's
terrible and people get taken inby it, but I find it
fascinating.
So I enjoyed all the, all theapricot seeds and shit.

Speaker 4 (52:57):
On that note, it's time to announce the winners for
our 25th episode giveaway andto make the draw.
We have a special guest, brianLittlefield, co-owner of
Jocofuel Brian.

Speaker 3 (53:10):
Rob, what's going on?
Thanks for having me on.

Speaker 4 (53:13):
Well, thank you for sponsoring this giveaway.

Speaker 3 (53:16):
Yeah, absolutely.
We're happy to do that.
We love your show and we'rehappy to support your listeners.

Speaker 4 (53:23):
That's like we are just so happy that you were able
to do this and we.
We've loved the idea of beingable to get back to our
listeners and it's great thatyou were able to step in and
help us do that.

Speaker 2 (53:38):
And you should do it because we can.

Speaker 4 (53:41):
Okay, so let's draw us a grand prize winner here.

Speaker 3 (53:45):
Let's do it.

Speaker 2 (53:48):
Exciting Winning the big prizes.

Speaker 3 (53:51):
So our grand prize winner is Jason Kumar.

Speaker 4 (53:55):
Congrats from Harold and.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
Kumar go to White Castle.

Speaker 4 (53:57):
And so we've also got that was grand prize.
You know I'll give the list outon Patreon itself.
We also have a couple ofsmaller winners going on here.

Speaker 3 (54:09):
Everyone's a winner baby, skyler, bryan, oh, as long
as it's not Skyler from.

Speaker 2 (54:15):
Breaking Bad.
I don't like Skyler, I don'tlike that character.

Speaker 3 (54:19):
And Dustin Spencer Congratulations, dustin,
congratulations.
So our additional winners areLisa Just Gamore, bang.
Gabe Sassman, bang Eddie Gomezand Megan.

Speaker 4 (54:33):
Maverick Bang.

Speaker 3 (54:34):
All that.

Speaker 4 (54:36):
Congratulations to all of you.

Speaker 3 (54:40):
And thank you so much for listening to the podcast.

Speaker 4 (54:42):
you guys For real.
And, of course, a huge shoutout to Joggle Fuel.
Thank you so much forsponsoring this.

Speaker 3 (54:49):
Thanks Bryan, absolutely, we're happy to do so
and we really hope everyoneloves the product.

Speaker 4 (54:54):
I hope so too.

Speaker 2 (54:55):
And try the banana shake Some of them look pretty
good but I swear if any of youget the banana smoothie.

Speaker 4 (55:01):
You're dead to me.

Speaker 2 (55:03):
What it tastes so much like bananas.

Speaker 1 (55:07):
It's a popular one.

Speaker 3 (55:08):
It's a popular one, Although the new sweet cream
coffee is it's sold out.
We're taking bets on when it'sgoing to sell out again.

Speaker 4 (55:17):
So that one sounds good.

Speaker 3 (55:18):
Yeah, it's like a Joggle calls it like a tiramisu
in a in a bottle, and it has 95milligrams of caffeine in every
one, so it's like protein and alittle bit of energy.

Speaker 2 (55:31):
So I'm still on banana in a bottle that one
sounds really good.

Speaker 4 (55:34):
I might get that for myself when it ever gets back.
I'm just going to like sitthere refreshing the page.

Speaker 3 (55:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah .

Speaker 4 (55:45):
I'm going to go order some Thank you again for for
all of this.

Speaker 3 (55:51):
I'm going to go order some before that goes out of
stock or whatever All right.

Speaker 4 (55:55):
And another shout out to Scientific Snitch for
throwing in five tubs ofpre-workout.

Speaker 2 (56:02):
Pre-workout.

Speaker 4 (56:03):
Yeah, pre-workout, fancy schmancy.
White chocolate, strawberry,white chocolate, raspberry I
can't remember White chocolatesomething apparently tastes like
cereal.

Speaker 2 (56:16):
Well, yeah, but wait until chem thugs pre-workout.
It's bore on free.
It's got glow.
Fly in it, though.
Wait till you hit the gym andeveryone starts staring at you
Make sure you use your rewindwater when you mix it up.

Speaker 1 (56:34):
I thought about that one earlier.
Yeah, you know, like I would, Iwould have to look up what a
pre-workout is.
Like I uh, I won't pretend Ibenefit from a certain amount of
genetic lottery.
Uh, you know what I mean.
Like I did, I used to work alot when I was younger and I did
a lot of manual physical labor,like in college I was a booboo,
but now I'm a gym.

(56:54):
I don't really work out.

Speaker 2 (56:56):
You could sell a pre-workout so well.
You could sell a pre-workout, Ipromise you like it's all you
know.
Just use your chemistrybackground and be like.
This is scientificallyformulated to be the ultimate.

Speaker 4 (57:09):
You're really good at making up the names and stuff.

Speaker 2 (57:12):
So you have great names.
You could use a bunch of fancywords, it doesn't matter.
If they make sense, peoplewould buy into it.

Speaker 1 (57:21):
No, you know there's a degree to which you know the
fancier the words you use, themore people are like oh no, you
clearly know what you're talkingabout.
So if you could like, string abunch of them together, like,
without mispronouncing any.

Speaker 2 (57:31):
of them like and they're like, oh sure, and say
it confidently All right, just,you're good, you got it.
It's a little bit of a Breccaeffect.

Speaker 4 (57:39):
Oh, bonus points if you turn it into a song and
dance.

Speaker 2 (57:44):
Get a little jingle going.
That's a whole other thing.

Speaker 1 (57:49):
But you know, that was that was.
That was actually kind of fun.
I even go for it.

Speaker 4 (57:56):
He's on his way to the Arnold's.

Speaker 2 (57:58):
Yeah, that's going to be going on this weekend.
I'm probably not going to gobecause I work, but it's right
next door to me, so there's that.
What is that?

Speaker 1 (58:08):
I don't know the Arnold.

Speaker 2 (58:08):
Classic, so you know.

Speaker 4 (58:09):
Arnold Schwarzenegger Arnold's bodybuilding stuff.

Speaker 1 (58:13):
Oh, like you know, I know Arnold.
I thought he like, I thoughtafter he was the gubernator he
just like chilled.

Speaker 2 (58:21):
He has a whole event every year.
Yeah, he made his own event.

Speaker 1 (58:26):
It's a whole bodybuilding thing and they got
other events.
This is how you know I don'twork out.

Speaker 2 (58:33):
Don't tell people this part.
Come to the Arnold Classic withyour pre-workout,
scientifically formulated to getyou the best pump imaginable
Right Insert fancy words hereKim Thug Brain.
Oh my God, yeah, not, I have it, it's huh it's.

Speaker 1 (58:48):
it makes me sad but at the same time I never feel
bad laughing at like you knowI'm not going to be like.
I think I feel bad laughing at,like the absurd things that
people end up believingsometimes about, like what

(59:09):
doesn't doesn't work for health.
Like I don't know if you heardabout this radon mines thing,
but apparently there are peoplewho are like going into
abandoned mines that are full ofradon gas for the radiation
that their people you fuckingread Wow, you're fuckin with me
Apparently this is a thing.
Like which you know people did.
People didn't do that in likethe 20s and like I I mean the
1920s and like the 1880s when wefirst kind of discovered this

(59:32):
stuff.

Speaker 2 (59:33):
You mean the 2020s, because apparently they're still
doing it, that's the wild thing.

Speaker 1 (59:38):
It's like yo, we figured this out already.
Why are we going back?
We already had the answer.

Speaker 2 (59:44):
The answer was no.
I think that's a good point,though, like we always do go
back to things when enough,specifically when enough time
has passed that we forget thatthey didn't work, and enough
people have lost that knowledgethat that knowledge is no longer
like a common knowledge thingyou know.

Speaker 1 (01:00:06):
So it's like yeah, you know, like ah.
And it really doesn't help thatthere is a non-negligible
extent to which large scalepharmaceutical production does
not always entirely gear itselfspecifically to treatment and

(01:00:29):
amelioration Right.

Speaker 2 (01:00:31):
Like there are some companies.

Speaker 1 (01:00:32):
They are still trying to make money.

Speaker 3 (01:00:34):
So sometimes there's a profit.

Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
Yeah, you know what I mean and it's like all right,
well, I get it.
They go and sometimes do someshit that like maybe make you
feel some type of way, but thatdoesn't necessarily mean that
like insulin isn't bad for you.
Like what through, like whatyou know.

Speaker 3 (01:00:52):
No, it's not bad.

Speaker 2 (01:00:53):
It's the worst.
If you go on social media, itis the worst thing.

Speaker 1 (01:00:57):
I'm just like you, know you know yeah.
But yeah, I was like, yeah, butyeah, there's a lot of the fun
in this chapter.
It's just like.
How to just like.

Speaker 2 (01:01:07):
That's the thing.
But with pharmaceuticalcompanies, like, people are
understandably frustrated, andwhen you get frustrated you turn
elsewhere, and when you haveenough time has gone by where
you forget these things don'twork.
You're going to try, we'regoing to do bloodletting soon.

Speaker 1 (01:01:20):
It's going to come back, I guarantee you we're
going to start doing it again Idon't know when people are
already doing it.
I guarantee you people arealready doing it.
I guarantee you you got to getone of the best.
I'm frustrated too, if I didn'tlive in a social life medicine
country, it's like yeah it'slike it's frustrating Other
thing.
It's like yo, like how is itjust like?

(01:01:42):
It's like can we talk about whypeople got to do this in the
first place?
Like I like I'm all for laughsand jokes, ha ha, yeah, you know
yuck it up and all of that, but, like I don't, you know you got
to have this conversation.
You can't have thisconversation in good faith,
meaningfully, without at leastacknowledging that, like yo,
it's not 100% people's faultthat they end up in these
situations.

(01:02:02):
But we already said that.
I just wanted to say it againbecause, like, because that's
real, that's the part that makesme upset.
I don't really get mad atpeople for, like, turning
alternative medicines,especially things like you know,
when people are in desperatesituations, I'm like I get mad
at you.
When you have terminal cancer,you have children you know yeah
like, yeah, like, like I said,like I said in the April God
season, it was like, look, Idon't have cancer, I don't think

(01:02:24):
, I don't think I've lostanybody in my life from cancer,
so I can't really super speak toit.
But, as I said in the end, ifyou don't have cancer, stay the
fuck away from these shits.
Like don't eat them.
Like why, if you like, if you,yo, look, if you, if you, if you
, if you, if you at thatprecipice, if you on that nice
edge I don't know anything aboutthat.
You got to do what you got todo.
Please consult somebody elsewho's more knowledgeable.

(01:02:44):
But, like it's everybody elseout here and I'm like, yo, what
are you doing?
What are you doing?
Like, why?
But you know, I, I can't be madat them without also being mad
at the conditions that created.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:03:02):
When there's yeah, when it's someone who has, like,
terminal cancer or some kind ofterminal diagnosis, how can you
get frustrated with them forlooking for answers Like?

Speaker 3 (01:03:14):
you know the doctor say hey, we can't help you.

Speaker 2 (01:03:16):
There's nothing we can do, so you're gonna turn to
him.

Speaker 1 (01:03:20):
Yeah, at that point, look, you gonna do what you
gonna do.
But what I hate is Kent Huffinand people like Kent Huffin,
like people like that clown,like he's one of those people,
oh you don't know the ReverendDr Huffin?
Oh Hovey, I forget how you sayhis name, but you wanna talk

(01:03:42):
about a clown?
Nah, I'll talk shit about himall day.
Fuck that dude, I cannot standhim he is.
You wanna talk about amisinformation panel?
Ah, and what makes me thesaddest about it is that he
wraps it all up in somereligious spirituality, which
I'm like, oh God.
I'm just like.
Can you not please?

Speaker 3 (01:04:02):
Like ah, I'm just like ah.

Speaker 4 (01:04:07):
The entire like living water thing that's
completely targeted at religiouspeople because it's living
water was a religious thing inthe Bible.

Speaker 1 (01:04:19):
And it's wow, because it's like and you know that's
where it's like at the end ofthe day.
It's like a lot of this stuffperpetuates itself because there
are people who can survive andmake a living for themselves off
of its perpetuation.
So like there are, you knowthere are means and motives for
the perpetuation of thisinformation.
It's not like it just gets outthere on its own and like it's.

(01:04:40):
It's artificially selected forby people who benefit from its
propagation, versus accurateinformation, which is hard to
artificially select for, becauseeven a lot of times,
unfortunately, the accurateinformation is you can't do
anything or like you need to dothis other specific thing where
it's very complicated and it'sinvolved.
It's not just a simple thing,you know, and it's harder to

(01:05:02):
package and sell accurateinformation than it is to
package and sell a delusion, youknow, yeah, so like, oh, yeah,
yo, liam, are you stuck readingabout it?

Speaker 2 (01:05:13):
So he's a he's a creationist, so he's a pastor
creationist.
But like the first thing thatyou look up is just like the
Huffin theory is entirelyrejected in the scientific
community.
It's like a big, bold firstresult.

Speaker 1 (01:05:32):
Oh man, he's not even the worst Like he.
He at some point or anotherhe's mentioned apricot seeds.
He was just the first person tocome to mind.
He is very much one of thosepeople that, like he spreads oh,
I think he's also likeadvocated for colloidal silver
being useful and like usuallythey get.

Speaker 2 (01:05:45):
They could hop all on board.
Why?

Speaker 1 (01:05:47):
not, You're not going to be like, oh no that other
one doesn't work.

Speaker 2 (01:05:50):
It's just this weird one.
No, all of them work.
Yeah, it's just by my shit.

Speaker 1 (01:05:59):
Excuse me, oh man, like yeah, it's, it's, it is.
It is kind of like afascinating and mind boggling
sort of thing to just like watchthis, watch, see to, like see
this happen.
You know, I mean like seepeople get taken in by
misinformation and watch themlike, and then watch people like
reject the accurate information.

Speaker 2 (01:06:20):
To go back to the vaccine example, you know I mean
like that's, that's probablylike one of the like most
pernicious things, one of my oneof my videos on Dr Sebi kind of
found the Sebi community and Iapparently I am like the most
racist person ever because DrSebi is saving lie, he died but
like he was, he cured AIDS andstuff and he's like and I get so

(01:06:43):
many comments every day Likeit's not meant for you, whitey,
it's only black, people aren'tsupposed to eat meat, and and
they're supposed to avoidpineapple.
I'm like what are you talking?
You're saying I'm the racistfirst.
I don't what is happening.
What is going on in the world.

Speaker 4 (01:06:58):
I'm just yeah, same thing happened to me when I did
a Sebi video.

Speaker 2 (01:07:05):
I never thought I would get in trouble for saying
black people can eat pineapple,but here we are in 2024.
Here we are.
This is I'm here now and I'vegotten in trouble for saying
black people can eat pineapple.
And I'm racist because of it Ithink, for me it was black

(01:07:26):
people are allowed to eat whiterice.
White rice, yeah, that's.
Oh, no, no, no you can't dothat.

Speaker 1 (01:07:31):
You're going to dilute the blackness.

Speaker 2 (01:07:32):
You're going to you know the removal.

Speaker 1 (01:07:36):
Look, I look I might get in some trouble for this one
.
Whatever, I I really don'tappreciate when any marginalized
community like leans on theirmarginalization as a reason why
they should be left to like dosomething that is materially
harmful yeah, and I mean eitherto themselves or others like I
don't.
I don't agree with that ideathat, like you know, if, if what

(01:07:59):
you're like I agree with thenotion that you know, if you do
not exist as a member of thiscommunity, then you should
approach it with a certainamount of grace and space and
understanding and blah, blah,blah, yada, yada yada.
This is all real and very true.
However, I don't think thatthat means that you can't go and
be like yo wait, this dude iswrong.
It's totally safe for y'all toeat pineapple, especially if you

(01:08:19):
consider that the fundamentalpremise that's being purported
here is that there does exist abiological difference between
right black people yes, nonblack people and that is, you
know, racist.

Speaker 2 (01:08:36):
I'm not a human and they're saying no white people,
black people are different andtherefore black people have to
avoid these foods.
I was just like what?

Speaker 1 (01:08:47):
I'm like because of the history of imperialism and
colonialism, especially in theWest and particularly in the US.
It is actually true that blackpeople do have certain like
genetic predispositions tocertain types of medical
maladies and they shouldabsolutely work with a PCP who
is familiar with this fact thatthey want to have, like, some of
the best health health outcomesthey can.
That is not the same as sayingthat you can't eat pineapple

(01:09:09):
because you black.

Speaker 2 (01:09:10):
Then they make the jump to.
You have to change your entirediet.

Speaker 1 (01:09:17):
That's you know, that you know, and that's that's the
thing in my head where it'slike, at a certain point there
are people who are just like Ican make money making content.
So I need to figure out whatcontent I can make.
That's going to be like quickand easy engaging for people,
because that's also another partof it.
Right, like you wouldn't havepeople out here scamming people
if people you know had theirbasic needs met you know what I

(01:09:39):
mean.
Like you know, you know, ifpeople didn't have, like you
know, like in a world, in aworld where we legitimately have
, have the technology and thecapacity to produce enough food,
enough nutritious whole foodfor everybody to have a little
bit more than they actually needMaybe not the best selection of
anything all the time, but agood choice of a wide variety of

(01:10:02):
nutritious food.
We have that capacity.
We don't have theinfrastructure for it and we
clearly don't have thecollective will to implement the
infrastructure for it.
But we could, we could try, wecould go for it.

Speaker 2 (01:10:13):
Isn't it also frustrating,though, that people fight
against GMOs too?
Like you, we start doing this,and they're like no GMOs, and
you're like but.

Speaker 1 (01:10:22):
Yo, corn is a GMO Corn, actual plant corn.
That shit doesn't occur innature like that.
Niggas make that shit fromgrass like what?
20,000 years ago that shitwasn't.
That shit didn't just show upin the forest like that.

Speaker 2 (01:10:36):
What is it?
Tio Sinte or whatever, like theancestor of corn.
If you look at it it's just gotlike a.

Speaker 1 (01:10:40):
Just enough for like a, for like an eight, burst up
that to come through and pickoff little pieces and like, if
you ever went, if you ever beento like excuse me, I was going
to say a Chinese food spot Ifyou've ever been to a Chinese
takeout restaurant, like one ofthose kind of like you know city
Chinese takeout restaurants soyou get those heads, one of
those like those stir-forndishes.

(01:11:01):
They got those like little babycorns in there.
That's what like corn, likestarted.

Speaker 2 (01:11:06):
I think it was worse.
I think it was worse than thatLike little tiny pieces on that
tiny corn that you could eat,and the rest was you couldn't
eat it.
And so, yeah, we made it better.
We made it better.

Speaker 1 (01:11:19):
Watermelons.

Speaker 2 (01:11:20):
You modified its genetics.
Oh yeah, that's another onehave you seen like paintings of
watermelons from like the 1700s.
They don't look likewatermelons even today, and that
was a few hundred years ago.
Food is way better.

Speaker 1 (01:11:31):
It's, it's, it's like .
Brussels sprouts are anotherperfect example.
Crucifers.
I absolutely yeah, I absolutelylike.
Here's the thing.
It's like look, I'm not goingto sit here and pretend, like
you know, like being acritically thinking, rational
human being means beingskeptical of things.
It means taking a moment toquestion stuff.
But if you're going to questionthings, you should actually

(01:11:54):
then question them.
Go find, go ask the questionand find the information you
need.
Don't just make a judgment callbased on how you feel about it,
because, yo, I feel bad about awhole bunch of things but I'm
still like, yeah, but you know,I mean I still like.
That's the way it is.
That's actually the reality ofthings.
I feel bad about the fact thatI'm a material being sometimes

(01:12:14):
and I need to sleep and I needto eat, cause sometimes I just
want to keep doing what I'mdoing, but I need to sleep and I
need to eat, so I go and do it.
It's like.
You know, like, like I shutterto think of whatever.
We're going to get to a pointwhere people are going to start
questioning whether or not youcan put out fire with water.

Speaker 2 (01:12:30):
Like there's like there's certain fundamental
things that I'm just saying.

Speaker 1 (01:12:34):
That's when they say to find fire with fire.

Speaker 2 (01:12:36):
It's like, can we do?

Speaker 1 (01:12:37):
that, but like, not the way people think, I guess I
don't know, but like you knowit's like.
But yeah, to get back to theGMO thing, it's like I
understand people being likewhoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.
This sounds kind of differentand this sounds kind of wonky
and it's like no, we justfigured out how to vastly
accelerate the process of doingsomething we've been doing for
thousands of years, likestraightening down.

(01:12:58):
The only difference is that wefigured out how to do this by
shooting a laser or something.
I forget exactly how they do it, but it's like.
It's like some kind of likeimpact specific thing, like at
least it used to be one of theways where they would like
switch out the gene is likestraight up, just like firing
pieces of genome at the DNA andso something stuck, I think, or
something like that.
I'm probably wrong about that.
Please fact check that, butlike it's still faster than like

(01:13:20):
all right, well, this, thisplant got a little bigger than
the other one, so we're notwe're going to kill that one and
we go on, we're going to gowith this one.

Speaker 2 (01:13:27):
And then next year we'll see my great great
grandson will enjoy the profitsof me deciding to pick this
plant.

Speaker 1 (01:13:34):
You know, and it's like and and and like.
I feel like there is very mucha degree to which people have
like a sense, like people havelike an I don't want to go too
much into like the wishy-washymysticism of it, but like I feel
like there's absolutely degreeto which people recognize that
the profit motive that drivesmost of our societal
organization is fundamentallyfucking with our access to

(01:13:58):
quality meet, like quality goodsand services.
You know, like there comes apoint where you can do something
to make money only up until apoint, because inevitably you
reach a point where doing it theway that it like really would
need to be done for the sake ofit being done becomes not
profitable.
So you kind of have to make achoice Are you going to make

(01:14:20):
money doing this or are you justtrying to do this and do it
well?
And I feel like just, it's just.
I mean, why wouldn't you justchoose to make money if the
profit motive is what you knowkind of drives our current
social organization?

Speaker 4 (01:14:35):
So like In Canada we currentlyhave a bill for a basic
universal income going throughparliament and I'm really hoping
it goes through.

Speaker 1 (01:14:47):
I mean, yo, it's a step in the right direction.
It's absolutely a step in theright direction because, yeah, I
mean like, consider, like, how,like, the gains we've had in
productivity technology over thelast 20 years roughly lets one
person do the job of threepeople 20 years ago and nowadays
you have people doing the jobof two people with all this

(01:15:09):
productivity technology, it'slike why, why, why, for what?
Why, like, actually, whyBecause people, because profit
became the point at some point,at some point.
That's why people start doingstuff and that's that.
That.
That in, I think, in a lot ofinstances.
I'm not going to go and say allright, because that's a little

(01:15:31):
while.
There are definitely companiesand organizations out there that
are able to sustain themselveswhile still turning a quality
product and not resorting todubious practices.

Speaker 2 (01:15:40):
But those are never going to be the companies that
really make it.

Speaker 1 (01:15:43):
That's my point, that's my point.
Eventually those companies getbought.

Speaker 2 (01:15:48):
Yeah, you know, or they just stay very small At the
best case scenario, that'sthat's exactly.

Speaker 1 (01:15:54):
That's the best case scenario you could hope for,
because I can't tell you howmany times I've been out here
looking for a brand that I like,loved, and then all of a sudden
I'm like where'd it go?
What happened when?
What I gone?
I'm in this.

Speaker 2 (01:16:09):
Because it is the drive of the company to make.
That is, the sole drive is tomake money, and if it's not,
then it's not going to make itin the industry we're currently
in.
It's just, it's not going tohappen.

Speaker 1 (01:16:22):
No, it's not going to be so true.
That's why I was like you know,I was like I was saying earlier
, like I understand I reallyhope I'm using this word
correctly I'm a feel, since I'vewaved, I'm not, I feel like I
should just go Google it, butI'm pretty sure, and this like,
very, very like idealistic,quixotic view of the world, you
know what I mean Like a lot ofwhat we do now to me just

(01:16:43):
doesn't make sense.
But I accept and understand howwe got to where we are and I,
just, I, just I pray to whateverhigher powers there may be that
there is a pathway out of thisshit, because we're not doing
well right now.

Speaker 4 (01:17:01):
No, we're not.

Speaker 1 (01:17:02):
You know, but I feel like this idea of like people,
like this idea of like profit,the profit motive, I feel like a
lot more people are like awareof this idea.
They're like yo, people arejust kind of out here trying to
make money and I feel like a lotmore people are kind of aware
of that and keyed into that andfor that reason in particular,
you got a lot more people outhere being like nah, you can't
trust these companies, you can'ttrust these businesses.

(01:17:24):
And a lot more people buyinginto that Cause they're like
yeah, they just put this in yourfood to make extra money and
they don't have to give you thisand that you know.

Speaker 2 (01:17:31):
So I'm like ah yeah, no, Quixotic, exceedingly
idealistic, unrealistic andimpractical Word.
Okay, it took me a second tospell it.
I didn't know how to spell it.

Speaker 1 (01:17:43):
It's like yeah, I'm pretty sure that's more or less
Like yeah, I'll be quick toadmit it, like I know that what
I'm talking about is a very muchlike a kind of perfect world
scenario.

Speaker 3 (01:17:51):
But I don't think that we couldn't get there.

Speaker 1 (01:17:53):
I just think that we don't, you know, those who have
the ability to steer society inthat direction have a material
benefit in it.
Yeah, they have a materialbenefit for it to not be that so
Right which?

Speaker 2 (01:18:04):
I do, and that's why I get like some of these people,
like I get where you're comingfrom, like where they're talking
about these companies and theshit they do.
I'm like, oh yeah, no, likeNestle and shit, they're
terrible, like they're awful.
Yo, nestle is the worst.
They're an awful company.
I totally agree with you.
What?
But?

Speaker 4 (01:18:17):
if you drink water from.

Speaker 2 (01:18:18):
Nestle, it's not gonna kill you Like you know?

Speaker 1 (01:18:20):
that's what I'm saying.
Yeah, although in a weirdtantrum to like kind of
butterfly effect way, it mightkill some, like indigenous
person in the community whodoesn't have water anymore,
that's what I say, like if youchoose not to drink it, that's
totally cool, like I'm fine withyou choosing to avoid those
products from these companies.
But at the same time, it's likewell, you know what the fuck am

(01:18:41):
I going to do if I need fuckingwater and I live somewhere where
, you know, the groundwater islike I think the state of
Arizona just lets people likedrill like unlimited, well,
unlimited, like as many personalwells as they want, and this
practice has led to likefoundational issues in the soil.
So a lot of the state isactually becoming like not
livable Fact check, please.
Fact check that.
But I'm pretty certain thatI've read about this somewhere

(01:19:03):
from a like very reputablesource that, like this is
becoming an issue.
If it's not Arizona, it's likeNew Mexico or Nevada, one of
those states out there, one ofthem desert states, you know,
but like, oh, like I, you knowwhat are you gonna do?
Like, at a certain point it'slike, what are you gonna do?
You know, it's like it's not,like we do not exist in a world
anymore where people can just,like you know, fuck off to the

(01:19:23):
West and like homestead you knowwhat I mean Like you're not
just about to dip out to thewoods.
You know what I mean, beingmountain man a little bit of a
man, unfortunately.

Speaker 2 (01:19:31):
Oh good old days, right of course.

Speaker 1 (01:19:35):
Good old dysentery.

Speaker 2 (01:19:38):
I miss cholera, good old cholera.

Speaker 4 (01:19:41):
I think Liam would survive about five minutes.

Speaker 2 (01:19:45):
I.
That's because I take myselfout.
I feel like this is not worthliving.
I don't want to live in thisworld.
I'm gone, I'm out.

Speaker 1 (01:19:54):
Oh my God, yeah, not like I.
Just it's just like I won'tpretend like I haven't done,
like I haven't participated inmy fair share of what is it of a
ideal romanticization of, likeyou know, the homesteader life.
But I mean, I'm going camping acouple of times, right, like I
enjoyed it, knowing that it wasgoing to end.

(01:20:15):
It was fun.

Speaker 2 (01:20:19):
Hold on, wait a second, that's a little
different.
It's a little different.

Speaker 4 (01:20:24):
And then there's me.
I've spent like a third of mylife camping.

Speaker 1 (01:20:28):
Nah man it's dope, like don't get me wrong, like I
enjoy it and I definitely hopeto do to camp, to go to spend
more time, actually like campingand like hiking and actually
like being outdoors again.

Speaker 3 (01:20:39):
When you ever come up to.

Speaker 1 (01:20:40):
Alberta.

Speaker 4 (01:20:42):
I will show you the mountains and all the great
camps and spots and everything.

Speaker 1 (01:20:47):
Dude, that might actually.
That's pretty sick, and here'swhere we keep all the
transphobic people.

Speaker 3 (01:20:53):
They're all together we keep them in Calgary, Yo.

Speaker 1 (01:20:58):
I can't.
I just can't with people withthat shit, man, that shit, just
like I ain't.
Look, I got no skin in thatgame.
I ain't got no skin in thatgame whatsoever.
I think like I nah, nah, I likelike no one in my family that
I'm aware of, no one in my likereally close friend circle that
I'm aware of, is like a memberof the trans community

(01:21:21):
specifically, I do notunderstand people who have
issues with trans people.

Speaker 2 (01:21:25):
I don't understand trans.

Speaker 1 (01:21:27):
no, I understand, no, sorry.

Speaker 2 (01:21:28):
I understand transphobia because I understand
that bigotry is a thinggenerally, but like I say, I
don't understand what lets youto understand that bigotry is a
thing.

Speaker 3 (01:21:38):
Cause I'm black in America.
Dawg come on.
Oh wait, right.

Speaker 2 (01:21:41):
I totally forgot.
You're a company.
You're a stuff you deal withevery day.

Speaker 1 (01:21:46):
I'm just like oh yeah , that's right, people just go
and do this.
But I'm just like yo, wait,cause it's like it's one of them
things where I'm like yo, thisis entirely not your business.
Like this is like, like it'sone of those things that's like
you have to be like.
Like.
This is not a perfect analogyand maybe I shouldn't say this,
but I'm gonna go for it anyway,cause I think it illustrates

(01:22:07):
part of what I'm saying, whereI'm like how absurd this is
right.
I can't really hide that I'mblack, right?
Like, if I'm walking down thestreet, you don't really have to
look at me really hard to belike oh, that's a black dude,
right.
But I feel like you have tolike really be trying to like
find trans people.
Like you really gotta be outhere.

Speaker 2 (01:22:26):
Like, oh no, you like you over there, Let me see your
papers.

Speaker 1 (01:22:30):
Yeah, yeah, like I'm like you know, I'm just like and
that's what I mean when it'slike yo, this is like a
ridiculous thing to be worriedabout.

Speaker 2 (01:22:36):
I mean think about it , think back to gay marriage.
Remember when, like I, mean itstill is like gay marriages a
debate, but when they haveproblems with gay people, it was
an attack on traditionalmarriage.
You can't come from a place ofaggressiveness.
You have to be the defender, nomatter what it is.
So even if you are saying gaymarriages is a sin or whatever,

(01:22:58):
you have to come from adefensive place.
So they're attackingtraditional marriage.
That's what they're doing andI'm defending it.
It's always that the religiouspeople are always interesting.

Speaker 4 (01:23:08):
I added that everyone is welcome here, signed to my
videos in the background withall the trans stuff going on in
Alberta and at the like thefirst video I made with that,
somebody commented you shouldtake the flag down and return to
the light.
I'm like I'm pretty sure, yeah,I'm pretty sure, like it states

(01:23:34):
in the Bible somewhere thateveryone is welcome in God's
place or church in Nino.
And so I literally have a signsaying everyone is welcome.
I'm pretty sure I'm followingyour Bible better than you are.

Speaker 2 (01:23:50):
No, you just need to add the verse Josiah 316,.
Whoever the fuck is this?
I don't know, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (01:23:57):
I don't know, I'm just saying.

Speaker 3 (01:23:58):
Josiah 316.

Speaker 1 (01:24:00):
No, because then they're going to tell you you
got the wrong version of theBible.
They're going to tell you youdon't have the King James
version, or you don't have theAgamemnon version or something.
There's like a bunch ofdifferent versions of it.
So, like you know, there's adegree.
Like you know, liam, like kindof to your point earlier, dog,
like you know, there are somepeople that really is no winning
with.
There are some people who areso far down that rabbit hole, so

(01:24:22):
far down that echo chamber andI think to like what is it?
Plato's allegory of the cave?
Is that the one where, like youknow, the dude's like sitting
in a cave, or people are sitting?

Speaker 2 (01:24:31):
in a cave Just staring at the shadows.

Speaker 1 (01:24:32):
Yeah, and all you see is the shadows and it's like
you know, and all of a suddenthey, you know, they get thrust
out into the world.
It's like yo, where the shadowsat Like what, what you mean?

Speaker 2 (01:24:40):
I don't like this.
What's all this green shit,like you know exactly.

Speaker 1 (01:24:46):
You know that's that, that shit is real.
Oh, so it's like huh, huh butyou know, hey look, I think
that's literally a big chunk ofwhy the three of us do the
things that the three of us doon the internet.

Speaker 3 (01:24:59):
Really, yeah, because yo trying to do our tiny little
part out there, our tiny,almost insignificant part, but
we'll reach some people, as manypeople as we can.

Speaker 4 (01:25:11):
And hey, we're making Bobby go crazy, every bucket of
water is full of drops.

Speaker 1 (01:25:14):
Every bucket of water is full of drops.

Speaker 3 (01:25:16):
Oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:25:17):
I saw that she was.
He was roasting this, this,this Bobby dude, recently.
Yeah, I literally just likebinged, like all the videos that
you posted on YouTube, but like, but, gentlemen, I think we had
scheduled this for like an hourand it's been nearly two.
Yeah, I got it Perfect.

Speaker 2 (01:25:37):
Hey, wasn't that a great time.
Listen to the podcast.
You were just I'm assuming youknew or you were just listening
to in moderation.
So if you go ahead and hit thefive star button, is that a
thing?

Speaker 4 (01:25:47):
The light button, that's a thing, the light button
on YouTube, if you're onYouTube hit the like button.

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