April 15, 2025 • 48 mins
Jordan Wentz, or Jewels of the Trade, shares her expertise on jade, one of the most misunderstood gemstones in the jewelry world, explaining its historical significance and how to identify authentic pieces. She illuminates the differences between Jadeite and Nephrite jade while providing guidance for retailers and consumers on recognizing quality jade and avoiding common pitfalls.
Join the Jewels of the Trade Discord community to learn more about jade, connect with experts, and share your collection. Follow Jordan on Instagram @jewels_of_the_trade or visit her YouTube channel to deepen your understanding of this fascinating gemstone.
More from Jordan & Jewels of the Trade: http://linktr.ee/jewels_of_the_trade
Send feedback or learn more about the podcast: punchmark.com/loupe
Learn about Punchmark's website platform: punchmark.com
Inquire about sponsoring In the Loupe and showcase your business on our next episode: podcast@punchmark.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Welcome to In the Loop all of her expertise and
knowledge with me and starts toexplain the details and
historical significance of jade,as well as what is kind of
trending in today's day and age.
She also tries to explain to methe difference between jadeite
and nephrite, and we talk allabout how you can spot quality
(00:39):
jade and also how retailers caneducate themselves so that
they're not getting ripped offor being misinformed about their
own products.
It's a really cool talk.
I hope you learn more aboutJade and maybe consider carrying
some in your store and alsolook into attending the Jade
conference coming up real soon.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
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Speaker 1 (01:59):
And now back to the show show.
Welcome everybody.
I'm joined by Jordan Wentz andyou have a really interesting
story, jordan.
I don't even know 100% how toexplain that you're with the
Jade Summit.
You've also been a sales rep atMason Kay.
(02:20):
When you introduce yourself,how do you introduce kind of
like what it is that you'redoing?
Speaker 3 (02:24):
That's a great question, michael.
Thanks so much.
It's great to be here.
So I would describe myself asan independent sales rep, which
means I own my own business andbrands contract with me to sell
their product.
My specialty is Jade, so I workclosely with Mason K Jade on
the B2B and B2C sides of theirbusiness.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
Really interesting.
So B2B and B2C.
We've had this conversation inthe past before on other
episodes, but there aredifferent kind of strategies and
I feel like it kind of requiresa different tone.
Do you feel yourself sort ofslipping in and out of the
different kind of conversationstyles when you have to go
between the two?
Speaker 3 (03:02):
Oh, absolutely, and I completely agree.
I would say they're entirelydifferent.
Most of the strategies that Ithink you would use when selling
directly to the consumer aregoing to be different when
you're working with otherprofessionals in the trade.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Yeah, and so you're also a sales rep with Mason Kay.
Can you talk to me a little bitmore about that and explain
that to the audience?
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Yeah, so my job with Mason Kay?
Can you talk to me a little bitmore about that and explain
that to the audience?
Yeah, so my job with Mason Kayis to assist them at trade shows
, to sell their product at trunkshows and liaise with retail
jewelry store accounts to helpthem place their orders, educate
their staff, things like that.
So that's what I do on thewholesale side.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Interesting, and do you find that?
I know that that was primarilyyour position before.
Is that becoming more on theback burner as you started to
kind of put your own business inthe forefront a little bit more
, or is that still taking up amajority of your time?
Speaker 3 (03:57):
Well, to be perfectly honest, Michael, what's kind of
happened is we've seen morelike end consumer demand for
Jade and a lot of jewelry storesmaybe they don't have, you know
, like a clientele for Jade, orthey don't know how to sell Jade
and they get a littleintimidated or afraid to sell it
, and so those customers willusually end up shopping online.
(04:19):
So we're trying to interceptthose customers to keep them
from shopping with untrustworthyoverseas sellers that are going
to offer treated jade, sellingit, as natural things like that.
So a lot of my job has actuallyshifted more to the B2C side.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
Interesting because I watched this video.
I'm trying to remembercompletely.
I wish I would have checkedbeforehand, but it was like jade
bangles and they were showingthe difference between like real
jade and then like a substituteor like a fake jade, and they
were clinking it together and itmakes a completely different
noise.
(04:54):
It's like one is like more highpitched, one is not.
What are, like, the main kindof ways to tell, um, I guess,
fake from real when it comes toJade?
Speaker 3 (05:04):
Wow, you really did your homework.
So let's talk about that first.
We call that the ping test.
So Jade has sonority, which isa property that allows it to
essentially sing.
And in fact, when Mary LouReidinger discovered the
Guatemalan Jade deposits withher husband, jay Reidinger, in
the 1970s, the way that theyfound Jade was by walking around
(05:26):
with a hammer for like I don'tknow eight, nine, 10 months,
something like that, and hittingboulders until they could find
that beautiful ping sound, andthat was how they identified the
jade boulders and made thediscovery.
So even when it's been cutespecially if it's been cut into
something continuous, forinstance a solid jade ring or a
solid jade bangle if it istranslucent, unfractured and
(05:51):
natural, if you strike it with ahard object it'll sing out, and
the higher quality the jade is,the more beautiful the sound.
Yeah, so it's really a tell ofquality.
The problem with that and thisis why we don't recommend using
this method for identificationis that jadeite, jade's most
common simulant, which is dyedgreen quartz, also has sonority.
(06:12):
So when you have a dyed greenquartz bangle that's also highly
translucent and you ping it, itwill sound very similar to a
jade bangle.
So that method is actuallybetter for distinguishing
natural, which is untreatedjadeite jade, from treated
jadeite jade which has beenimpregnated with polymer wax or
resin.
(06:32):
So when you ask the real versusfake question, it's so much
more complicated than thatbecause we have natural but then
we have genuine that's beentreated right.
So you have the real jade, thetreated jade and then the jade
simulants and it all gets veryconfusing from there.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
I understand.
So I always have this question,though, when it comes to these
tricks or the, like you said,impregnated with polymer, I've
wondered so obviously, inuntreated and like this, you
know the natural version is mostlikely going to be the most
beautiful.
It's probably the mosttemperamental, though, Besides
(07:09):
losing you know the fact thatyou can say it's untreated in
its value, are there any reasonswhy you shouldn't be using
polymer or something like thaton your jade?
Is it just because, like Iimagine, it's to protect it?
Is that correct?
Speaker 3 (07:23):
It's not what you think.
A lot of times, gemstones aretreated to increase their
durability.
In the case of jadeite jade,that is not the case at all.
Treated jade is substantiallymore brittle than natural jade.
Which natural jade?
Both natural jade are two ofthe toughest gemstones in the
world.
So then you treat them andyou're literally I mean it's
(07:45):
like a zombie jade, like you'reputting plastic on the inside.
So all of the fractures thatalready existed in that
originally unsellable quality ofjade expand, meaning it's much
more likely to break.
It is not stable in color.
It has five to 10% the value ofits natural jade counterpart If
it doesn't have dye.
If it does have dye on top ofthe polymer impregnation, it has
(08:07):
almost no value whatsoever.
So it's really, reallyimportant for the customer
because jade can be so expensivefor the customer to know that
what they're buying is actuallynatural and not treated.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Really fascinating.
So I guess you've also had abunch of experience on YouTube
with sales and I've watched acouple of your streams before,
and one thing that's fascinatingis I feel like it's not picked
up in popularity the selling,the live selling, and especially
on Facebook.
It was very popular duringCOVID and then it went away
(08:42):
seemingly.
And I'm always like man, I feellike you're on to something
really clever, but you've stuckwith it, especially with YouTube
, and have cultivated anaudience.
Where do you see YouTube kindof fitting in your marketing
kind of armada of techniques?
Speaker 3 (08:58):
Yeah, so interestingly enough, youtube
has over two and a half billionactive monthly users, so it's
actually bigger than Pinterestand it's bigger than TikTok, but
it's not quite as big asFacebook.
Youtube is able to offer, likeshort form and long form content
and everything is searchablebecause Google actually owns
YouTube.
So if you Google somethingabout Jade, for instance, one of
(09:19):
my videos will probably come upin the Google search because
they're on YouTube.
So that means that a video cansit for like six months or a
year or two years, and wheninterest in that topic surges,
the video can blow up, no matterhow much time has passed.
So a customer with cash in handready to buy can find a YouTube
video in a Google search andmake a purchase, irregardless of
(09:39):
the number of views that thevideo has even gotten, because
it's so targeted.
Like, maybe it only has 70views, but you made a $4,000
sale off of one video.
Most of the people that I knowsellers that are really
successful with live selling inthe United States, not China.
China's live selling is kind ofa different ballgame, right.
They don't need a ton of views,they just get very targeted
(10:03):
subscribers who are interestedin buying, and then a lot of you
know, you need a handful 20, 30customers.
Those customers repeat byrepeat by.
They tell their friends thatgrows, it gets bigger and bigger
.
But the idea of live streamingand having, you know, 10,000
views on your live stream, thatdoesn't guarantee success.
That doesn't actually guaranteethat somebody is going to buy.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
It's so fascinating.
I always say that subscribercount and follower count and
view count.
A lot of those are these daysare vanity metrics.
They just kind of make you feelgood and they sort of bring
like an air of clout.
But a lot of the times it doesseem like it's about, yeah,
attracting a couple of thesepower users.
I had to kind of come to gripswith that, with attracting a
couple of these power users.
(10:43):
I had to come to grips withthat with this podcast, for
example.
I used to think the key to thisthing being super successful is
getting tens and hundreds ofthousands of downloads by the
wider audience.
I was like, wait, but if I'minterviewing only retail
jewelers, shouldn't I only wantretail jewelers to be listening?
(11:03):
If that's the targetdemographic and the target model
, then we should behyper-focused on that.
And if we can have as close to100% of our audience be our
target, then the healthier ouraudience is.
Is that kind of how you'reviewing your YouTube platform as
well?
Speaker 3 (11:18):
Literally words taken out of my brain.
Michael, like I think you'respot on.
That's exactly how I see it.
I hope that jewelry sellers cangrow to understand that exact
concept, because if you haveespecially like a niche product,
something that you reallyspecialize in, oh my gosh,
youtube can be such a lucrativeavenue for you, and I've known
(11:38):
people who can sell $50,000worth of product in one YouTube
live sale, but maybe they have20 people watching.
It's about finding the viewer,finding the customer.
It's just not about views andsubscribers Like those numbers
are not as important as theactual dollars going into your
pocket.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
That's so fascinating .
So talk to me about the actualexecution of a of a live stream,
because one of the the thenature of an auction is that you
probably are setting like astarting price and then
hopefully you're going to go upfrom there, and I have done
auctions in the past for my ownartwork and sometimes it goes
(12:19):
really well and you do waybetter than you expected.
But the nature of the beast isthat sometimes an item flops and
it sells for either base priceor sometimes even lower than
that.
When you're dealing withsomething that can have a high
cost, such as Jade, are yousetting a floor that, even if it
never goes up from there, thatyou'll what you put in, or is it
(12:45):
just the nature of the beast?
Sometimes you take a bath on acouple of the products and then
some of them go much higher thanwhat you anticipated.
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Well, personally, I don't do any auction style live
selling yet on my channel, but Ido want to talk about this.
So, michael, are you familiarwith Whatnot?
Speaker 1 (13:01):
Whatnot?
I don't think so.
Speaker 3 (13:02):
Whatnot is like if Twitch and eBay made a baby.
So it's a platform for liveselling that I think is taking
off.
I think it's going to getreally huge.
Basically, sellers will stream,sometimes for hours, sometimes
every day, and it's all auctionbased.
So they're auctioning off theirgoods to smartphone users who
log in through an app and theybuy by swiping the screen.
So it's very quick decisions,it's very competitive and this
(13:24):
is, I hope.
I hope people hear this andrealize like live selling is so
much bigger than we realized.
Like it's so much bigger thanjust like the Instagram sellers
or the TikTok sellers, whichreally TikTok is a huge, huge
economy for live selling.
But there is more to it,especially deep into YouTube and
on platforms like whatnot.
So I personally believe YouTubeis actually heading kind of in
(13:45):
a direction more like whatnot,but it's just not quite there.
Youtube to me, it offers a salesavenue, and that's not
necessarily the primary focus ofmy channel, because the focus
of my channel is education andcommunity, but the reality is, I
mean, people are going to wantto buy right, they want to
support content creators andthey want to buy from someone
that they trust.
(14:05):
So, since I don't carry my owninventory.
Yet I sell using affiliatemarketing and Mason K has, you
know, the retail side to theirbusiness that I mentioned.
So they're my main affiliateand I feature their products on
my Tuesday night live stream.
So I sell products through theaffiliate links in the video
description.
But YouTube right now has afunction where it can sync up
with Shopify.
So other sellers who might beinterested in live selling, if
(14:28):
they have a Shopify site alreadyand they have a YouTube account
that meets certain criteria,they can sync their items that
are already on their websiteonto YouTube so that they are
clickable and like purchasablewhile someone is watching a
video.
And to me, like I think that isis probably safer than like the
auction style that you weretalking about.
(14:50):
But I do think in a way it'slimiting Cause, like you
mentioned, with the auctionstyle you can make so much more
off of our product sale becauseyou're actually taking it to the
market and asking them likewhat is this really worth?
What are you actually willingto pay for this?
You know, and I think YouTubewill go that way and we'll see
more sellers doing that.
It's just there's high riskright now for that sort of thing
(15:13):
, um, but in the next six monthsor a year.
That can be totally different.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
Yeah, and I think that one thing you've uh kind of
started to allude to is thisidea of like consolidating your
base or like having youraudience in a very tangible
location.
So the live streams, we alreadytalked about it.
You were saying that you know,maybe you have 20 or 25 people
that are logged in, but it stillcan be super lucrative.
(15:39):
And I sometimes think about itlike the traffic to a website.
Sometimes these, I'm likethey're ghosts, they just like
coming in and out and they sortof just float, and sometimes
they click on stuff andsometimes they don't, and it's
just like oh, is this?
Are these even real people?
But then when you see them andyou consolidate them onto more
(15:59):
of like a tangible location,like a live stream, suddenly,
especially if they're typinginto chat or they're interacting
in a way, suddenly it becomes alittle bit more tactile.
But the actual like the apex ofit seems to be through, for
example, like a Discord server.
Can you sort of talk about whatyou've set up with your own
Discord server and what thatkind of adds to your own brand
(16:22):
and business?
Speaker 3 (16:23):
Yeah, definitely let's.
If we could just go back alittle bit to something that you
said about driving people tothe website by using marketing
tactics like YouTube anddifferent types of live selling,
whatnot?
Instagram, tiktok, things likethat.
So what you mentioned is whatwe call conversion rate.
I know you use this term too,so I let's say, I get a thousand
(16:45):
people onto my website, howmany of them actually convert?
Right, when you're building acommunity, which is really the
focus of my YouTube channel,rules of the Trade is more about
building that community andnetworking.
It's a little less about salesand it's more about enhancing
the knowledge of the peopleparticipating in the community.
(17:05):
So I always say a rising tidelifts all boats.
Like we're trying to helppeople be more accurate when
they speak about Jade, when theysell Jade.
You know a lot of retail jewelrystores watch my channel as well
.
Appraisers watch my channel.
It's important that the jewelryindustry understands how
misunderstood Jade really is,cause I think it's probably one
of the most misunderstoodgemstones that actually sells in
(17:28):
the jewelry store, andunderstands what is accurate
about it.
So when you have that educationand that community at the
forefront, some of those metricsdon't matter as much your
conversion rate and things likethat.
Even though and I say this theJewels of the Trade channel gets
about 80,000 views a month, thepast couple of months we've
(17:55):
been getting around 100,000views a month.
That's quite a bit of traffic.
We do drive those customers towebsites where they do buy and
it's very, very successful.
And I will say like, overall,it is lucrative.
I don't want people to thinkcause I, this aspect of
community is, um, you know it's,it's coming from a very caring
place and I do genuinely wantpeople to know more and feel
better about what they'repurchasing and connect with
(18:17):
trustworthy retailers, Even ifit's not a company I represent.
Like I just want people tospend money and buy jewelry and
that that is there.
But also the goal is, at theend of the day, to convert
customers, because that's how wecan afford to have the channel,
so that we can expand theknowledge, you know.
So it's it's sort of a cyclicalthing.
So that kind of brings us tothe discord.
Uh, I started the discordbecause it was sort of just like
(18:40):
a natural evolution for theYouTube channel, because of the
amount of views that I wasgetting and I didn't know what
it was.
So, like Michael, do you useDiscord?
Speaker 1 (18:51):
I go through phases where I use it, but it's not
something that is very ingrainedinto me.
During COVID I was using it alot, but not of late.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
Are you a gamer?
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I am a gamer.
Speaker 3 (19:03):
Yeah, okay.
So I'm not a gamer and that'swhy I didn't know what it was,
and I bet a lot of peoplelistening to this probably don't
know what it is either.
So I started the Discord notknowing what Discord was.
I chose it because I thought itwould be easier to moderate
than Reddit.
It was gonna allow for videocalls, private messaging and a
more personal connection withthe Jot audience.
(19:24):
It was a natural next step forthe YouTube channel because the
channel was really growing.
In the Discord, which is sort oflike a group chat but also a
repository for storing accurateinformation, jot viewers are
encouraged to actually sharephotos from their.
It's like a place where you, aJade customer, you can talk
(19:45):
directly to a Jade researcher ora Jade seller or a Jade
appraiser or a Jade carver andask questions that maybe your
local jewelry store can't answer.
Now, inevitably, we havejewelry store salespeople who
have joined too to learn fromthe group and they're able to
take that information to theircustomers in person at their
store.
So what it's doing is it's sortof creating this halo where
(20:10):
we're increasing the knowledgeof both customers and
professionals.
That inevitably, is going todrive demand, because people are
going to be less intimidatedand they're going to be less
afraid that they're going toaccidentally buy treated jade,
because they're going to be moreconfident, they're going to
know who to shop from.
And it helps sellers becausethe sellers who are in it that
are constantly learning, theycan speak with a confidence and
an accuracy that's going tobring like so much more trust in
(20:34):
their customers towards them.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Do you find that?
So you had mentioned thatReddit was another option.
So it's funny because I had avery similar train of thought
right around 2019.
And we were.
We developed this closedFacebook group for our clients.
We've talked about it in thepast, called the Punchmark
Community, and it has onlyactive Punchmark retailers in
(20:58):
there, and I was 50-50 onwhether or not I wanted to
create a subreddit that wasinvite only, or I was going to
create a Facebook group.
We ended up going with aFacebook group because our
demographic skews older and mostpeople already had a Facebook
account and it would be easierto just pull people from there
as opposed to create an entirelynew platform for them.
(21:21):
But Discord has always beensomething I've found to be so
enticing because of the factthat, first of all, you can do
things centered around topicsand you can also limit speaking
privileges in each topic.
So, for example, you could haveone, for example, about Jade
(21:43):
Education and then only letpeople who are whatever you want
to call it certified to be ableto discuss it in there.
Is that something kind of setup?
Speaker 3 (21:52):
I would say my discord is not that heavily
moderated.
Keep in mind, too, the goal ofthe YouTube channel.
The primary goal of the YouTubechannel is education.
The secondary goal is sales.
The goal of the discord is notsales.
The goal of the discord is onlycommunity, and what I didn't
realize when I started it isthat the discord helps me a lot.
(22:14):
It's a way for me to learn frompeople who know about things
that I don't know, and forpeople to share their
collections and share images andlike things that I wouldn't
normally have access to, likematerial from certain locales or
certain inclusions in in Jade,from certain origins that I
wouldn't normally see.
I can be like hey, does anybodyhave a picture of this?
And and somebody does.
So there's a much greateradvantage, I think, to the, the
(22:39):
blank canvas that is the discord, where the people who join
whatever, whatever knowledge andexpertise they have, they can
bring it to the table and we canall sort of share in that.
So I would say, like I have nothad to mute anybody or like,
keep anybody from saying things,because I think like attracts
like and I think, because of thenature of my channel, it's
(23:02):
drawn in just like a reallyreally good group of people who
aren't going to spreadmisinformation in the discord
Like the people who are in mydiscord.
They know a ton about Jade.
There's about 14 core membersof the discord that control the
culture of it and they're notmoderators like me and my sister
and my husband we moderated.
(23:22):
If somebody's there to spam orif they're being sneaky, we'll
just kick them out Because it'snot Reddit, right, we can just
do that.
But the culture, the tone, thetopics that get discussed,
that's determined by the peoplewho are in it, and the
connections that we've all beenable to make with each other
have been so valuable because ofthat.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
Yeah, and also I think one of the best aspects of
it is that you can control, um,the I guess you you own the
railroads in that instance andthat you can share, uh, for
example, this episode, uh, whenthis one comes out, um, you'll
be able to put it in front ofyour audience, as opposed to
hope that your the algorithmwill share it with them.
(24:05):
And that's one of the parts thatI have kind of been pushed away
from Instagram in the past,because it used to be if you
follow someone, you'll see theirposts right in your feed.
Then things happened with thealgorithm and it started pushing
similar content or suggestedcontent in front of people and
suddenly you stop seeing thecontent that you had subscribed
(24:26):
to or followed in the firstplace.
And I do find that, for examplewith Discord, that it allows
you to have a very directconnection with your audience
and that's how I used to use itin particular was you could have
a connection with your creatoror your community, instead of
(24:47):
hoping that the algorithm willserve you up to people that
already are engaging with it.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
It's really perfect.
I mean, people can speak withme directly.
They can just message me, theycan tag me in things like
instead of the YouTube channelbeing just me monologuing at
people, it becomes verytwo-sided.
It becomes a conversation, itbecomes a dialogue, and a lot of
that's been driven by the livestreams as well.
So the Tuesday night livestreams that I do that offer
(25:13):
product.
People can go to the website.
They can buy it.
There are affiliate links inthe description.
They're very informationfocused, and so the live streams
have done a lot to cultivatethe community and bring people
into the discord.
Because, think about it, ifyou're a customer and you're
really serious about learning,because you don't want to get
swindled, you don't want toaccidentally buy fake Jade, you
want to know what you're getting, you might, because you have
(25:34):
this motivation, sit and watchan hour long video, an hour long
live stream where you can talkto a Jade expert and ask
questions.
You might actually do that, youmight actually watch that and
gain a lot from that.
And then you're like well, whatdo I do next?
Well, now you hop on over tothe discord and all of these
things factor into the decisionthat you're going to make when
you eventually buy, and I thinkthe real benefit of that is just
(25:59):
intercepting customers so thatthey don't buy a bad product on
accident for too high of a price.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
Educated customers are the best type of customers.
I totally agree.
I think, jordan, we're going totake a quick break and then,
when we come back, I want totalk more about Jade, but
especially about the Jade Summit.
So, everybody, stay with us.
Speaker 4 (26:23):
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(26:45):
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So if you're interested,contact hope at punchmarkcom to
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you'd like continued emailmarketing management again hope
(27:06):
at punchmarkcom.
Have a great day and enjoy therest of the episode.
Speaker 1 (27:18):
All right, everybody Still speaking with Jordan Wentz
.
Jordan, I want to ask a littlebit about this upcoming event
that you're putting on calledthe Jade Summit, and you were
kind of discussing it with me.
It sounds like you're verypassionate about jade in general
.
What is the Jade Summit goingto be?
Speaker 3 (27:34):
So this is the only professional jade conference in
the US.
So for gemologists, appraisersand jewelry sellers who are
looking for continuing education, like what could be better than
going to Monterey, getting anadvanced education on a rare
gemstone and then being able towrite off your trip Like you can
go to the aquarium, you can eatseafood, the whole event is
(27:56):
like in sight of the actualMonterey Bay.
It's right next to the water.
So Mason K Jade is going to bepresenting the first annual
international Jade Summit at theMonterey Bay Festival, which is
an outdoor Jade show that lastsfor three days every summer.
The summit is only one day long, it's indoor and it features
seminars from some of theleading Jade experts in the
(28:16):
world.
So, like Kirk Makepeace, whopioneered the Canadian Jade
industry and put Canada on themap as a major Jade producer,
will be speaking.
Mary Lou Reitinger, whodiscovered the jadeite deposits
of Guatemala with her husband inthe 1970s.
She's going to be speaking.
Lou Blanc, a geophysicist whospecializes in jade formation,
will be there, and Jeff Mason,who's the leading expert in the
(28:37):
US on jadeite jade testing andvaluation.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
That's going to be super cool, and are you putting
it together or what is the?
What is your role in this goingto be?
Speaker 3 (28:47):
So technically, if you want to get fancy, I I'm
called the conference director,which, like you know, basically
I'm going to be emceeing it, um,and then Mason K is actually
sponsoring it.
So my husband and I are goingto actually be like presenting
the conference, but of courseit's with, like the help from
(29:10):
the Jade Events Unlimited boardand the Mason K team.
I mean, there's a lot of peoplethat are really working very
hard to bring this all together.
So, yes, this is its first year.
I'm hoping that it goes reallywell and I can run it every year
, but we'll see.
We'll see.
You know, it just kind ofdepends on how many tickets sell
(29:32):
.
So it's open to anyone.
So Jade customers andcollectors are welcome to come
as well.
It's pretty advanced, though,and the seminars will be
presented with gemologists inmind, so particularly appraisers
and jewelry store sales peopleand Jade carvers, of course.
So we'll see.
I mean it's the first one.
I feel like there's a lot ofinterest, just because Jade is
truly a misunderstood stone andthe biggest complaint I get from
(29:55):
jewelry stores is that theyfeel intimidated by it.
They're kind of afraid to sellit.
So I'm hoping this sort offixes that.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
And remind me when is it going to be taking place.
Speaker 3 (30:05):
Oh yeah, june 14th 2025.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
Very exciting.
So that's going to be coming up.
So if they're interested, whereshould they be going, if they
want to learn more, or mayberegister.
Speaker 3 (30:21):
So if you visit montereybayjadefestivalorg, all
of the information is there andyou can register for your ticket
, which includes breakfast andlunch, and there's plenty of
time allotted for browsing theGeorge Schmeerholtz Jade Carving
Exhibition next door and, ofcourse, the beautiful outdoor
Monterey Bay Jade Festivalinside of Old Fisherman's Wharf
and the Monterey Bay.
Speaker 1 (30:35):
Very cool and I'll have that information in the
show notes below.
But to end this on like a realhigh note Jordan, can you tell
me a little bit about Jade orsome things that I might not
know about it?
I'm obviously definitely anamateur.
Um, I don't own anything Jade.
I would love to one day, butcan you, um, tell me, uh, or the
(30:55):
audience, a little bit aboutJade that could really get them
interested as an entry-levelperson?
Speaker 3 (31:01):
Oh my gosh.
So, michael, have you seen Jadein person?
Speaker 1 (31:04):
I think so.
I believe I've seen it at somejewelry shows, but it doesn't
seem like it's used the way thatother you know fine jewelry
gemstones are used.
It seems like it's a.
Is it considered a stone?
Speaker 3 (31:18):
Yeah.
So what's so confusing, I think, about jade in particular is
that it's an aggregate.
So if you think of like lapislazuli, right, so lapis is
basically it's an aggregate ofmultiple minerals, kind of
smushed together.
Now we call it lapis, butlazurite, which is where like
(31:39):
the lazuli comes from, right,like that's like one mineral and
it mixes with other things.
Jade is the same way.
So there's two gemstones calledjade, there's jadeite jade and
there's nephrite jade andthey're both called jade.
Very confusing.
But in the case of jadeite jade, jadeite is a mineral that's in
jadeite jade.
So yes, in that sense it isdifferent from like ruby and
(32:00):
sapphire and diamond and itlends itself to more variety in
appearance and sometimescharacteristics because it's I
don't want to say it's looselydefined.
It's not loosely defined, it'sjust more varying than a single
crystal gemstone.
So you have confusion becausethere's two gemstones called
jade.
And then, like actuallyidentifying a stone as one of
(32:22):
those two jadeite jade ornephrite jade becomes very, very
difficult because so manysellers accidentally sell quartz
and serpentine and grossulargarnet as jade.
So the word jade itself reallyis a trade term, it's not a
mineral term.
It's been super overused, verymisunderstood and basically we
have sellers like all over justselling whatever as jade because
(32:46):
it's green, and they don't evenrealize that, like jadeite is a
mineral.
The minerals that constitutenephrite jade, which are
actinolite and tremolite, thoseare distinct minerals.
You can't just call anythingjade.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
It's too confusing.
Speaker 3 (33:03):
Words have to have meaning.
So I think that's what mostpeople don't understand about
jade.
Is that just because somebodypresents a gem to you and says
this is jade, that actually thatmeans nothing?
Like the word means nothing.
You need to ask is this jadeitejade or is this nephrite jade?
And I do wonder, michael, whenyou've seen jade at jewelry
(33:28):
shows, do you remember, like howit?
Speaker 1 (33:29):
was presented to you.
Was it as jade or did theyactually distinctly name the
mineral?
I think it was.
What I saw was jade bangles and, like it seemed to be, it was
one continuous piece that's.
It's that iconic green colorand I believe they just called
it a jade bangle, but I don'tquite remember now.
Speaker 3 (33:47):
Could have gone either way.
And it's interesting that youbring up the bangle too because,
like you said earlier, likejade is cut into unique ways
that you don't normally see in,like sapphire and ruby I've
never seen a ruby bangle.
Yeah, and part of that isbecause it's an aggregate, so
you have a larger boulder butonly a small portion of that
boulder is gem quality.
So they're trying to use themost of the rough that they can
(34:13):
in a piece of jade jewelry sobeads or a bangle or a solid
ring or a carving or a disc.
They're basically trying to useas much of that high quality
jade in the boulder as they canto use as much of that high
quality jade in the boulder asthey can.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
So you mentioned carving and it's obviously a
cornerstone of jade culture, ifthat's a thing.
Speaker 3 (34:33):
It is a thing, yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:49):
So I watched your vlog discussing, you know, a
trip to Guatemala and it seemslike there's a ton of jade
carvings but very, you know,very different than what, uh,
typical.
I guess maybe even westernstyle carvings might even show,
like you said, a lot of, a lotof corn carvings, a lot of, uh,
seeming like, nature related.
Um, what is like kind of isthere an origin for why people
are always carving in it?
And like, is that to kind ofmake these aggregate pieces kind
(35:10):
of have some life beyond just,you know, be turned into beads
or whatever?
Speaker 3 (35:15):
So every civilization that's ever had access to jade
revered it and any peoples whocould get their hands on it
valued it above all othermaterials.
In the case of China, theyvalued nephrite jade for like
8,000 years and they carved itinto relics for their religion.
(35:35):
They carved it into tools andweapons, because both jades
nephrite jade and jadeite jadeare two of the toughest, like
the absolute toughest, likegemstones on the planet.
So we think of, like a bronzeage and a stone age,
civilizations like theMesoamerican civilizations
between 1500 BC and 1500 AD andancient China.
(35:56):
They had a jade age.
New Zealand had a jade age,switzerland had a jade age.
So that reverence for the stonecomes from its durability, its
ability to withstand like somuch like just drama, I guess,
(36:18):
and not break.
Speaker 1 (36:20):
So I guess was it useful in, for example, in tools
, Like, because I know that in Ithink it was in Mesoamerica
they used I think it wasobsidian to make you know tools
and daggers and things like that.
Does jade hold an edge?
Is that kind of part of it?
Or was it more for like,because it was so hard?
(36:40):
I guess I don't reallyunderstand.
Speaker 3 (36:42):
So there's hardness and there's toughness.
So hardness is resistance toscratching and toughness is
resistance to breaking.
Jade is both so because of itshardness it can be basically
carved to be very, very thin andhave a sharp edge.
Because of its toughness it'snot going to break easily.
So it was actually an idealstone before metal for
(37:04):
particularly weapons, forhunting, for tools, for kitchen
utensils.
And then, of course, there wasthe ceremonial sort of use of it
because of its beautiful coloras well.
So, for instance, jadeite jadewas actually used in Mesoamerica
, and when the Spanish found itwith the Aztecs, the Aztecs
(37:26):
called it a word that I cannotpronounce properly it's like
Chalchuhudl, and that referredto the plumage of the Quetzal
bird, which today is like thenational bird of Guatemala, it's
probably like the highest, youknow, valued bird in
Mesoamerican history, and theyequated jade with that very,
(37:52):
very special bird that had somuch meaning to their culture.
The opposite of that, or notopposite, but I guess the
inverse of that is that in China, when they first saw jadeite
jade coming out of Burma in the1700s, they called it feichui.
Feichui refers to the plumageof the kingfisher bird, another
really beautiful icon in nature,and so you can just kind of see
(38:13):
how people, the way they viewedthe stone, the way they thought
of its beauty and considered itso different from other gems.
China long believed that allgemstones want to be jade.
China long believed that allgemstones want to be jade.
Speaker 1 (38:28):
Jade is like the ultimate stone.
Wow, that's so fascinating.
I guess that there's a utilityto it, but it's also very
beautiful.
I guess that does put it inkind of a unique position.
Speaker 3 (38:40):
Well, that's why it's able to be worn in bangles too.
Right, if, let's say you couldget a diamond big enough lab
grown, I guess you got.
You could, right, like youcould get a lab grown diamond
big enough.
If you cut a diamond into abangle like it would shatter,
like you wouldn't be able towear it for more than a day.
People wear jade bangles theirentire life in china.
(39:01):
They put them on teenage girlsbefore their hand is done
growing and then then, whentheir wrist gets bigger, they
can't take them off.
They wear them for their wholelife.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
Wow, that is wild.
What a really interesting stone, and one I hope I see more of.
It does seem like for a reallylong time, I mean, at least in
the Western culture.
For a lot of the places thatI've attended, the shows I've
attended, it's all about, yeah,diamonds and around gold, but
(39:31):
this is, you know, the fact thatthis is naturally, unnaturally
occurring as well, and reallybeautiful.
What a really interesting kindof aspect to it.
Speaker 3 (39:38):
Well, and I have one thing to add to that, michael,
before we move on.
I'm sorry, think of it this waytoo.
The price of gold just hit$3,000 an ounce.
When I left the jewelry storethat I worked for in 2020, gold
was $1,200 an ounce.
Jade bangles, beads, solidbands, et cetera are impervious
to the rising cost of gold andoffer the customer an
opportunity to buy fine heirloom, quality jewelry that's in
(40:02):
their budget and at a morestable price.
So for anyone wondering why itseems like they're hearing about
Jade more, I think that's partof it.
I think the demand for Jade isgrowing and I think just the
stability of its pricing and thefact that it's so attainable,
even in good qualities, is amajor part of that.
Speaker 1 (40:21):
Hmm, interesting because there is a volume that
it's able to meet the demand.
That's.
I wonder if that'll be able tokeep up because as it gets more
and more popular I'm sure thatthere will be more and more
demand.
So that'll be fascinating andhopefully that works out.
For you know the Jade Summit aswell and I guess Jordan, that
kind of.
To wrap this up, it sounds likeyou are positioning yourself in
(40:45):
like a really unique spot inthe jewelry industry.
I guess I was going to ask likekind of where do you see this
going as a, you know, eventdirector for the Jade Summit but
also helping with, you know,sales and marketing for Mason
Kay?
Where do you kind of seeyourself going in the jewelry
industry?
Speaker 3 (41:04):
So I am so proud of the jade industry Like I, I
can't even believe that I get tobe a part of it.
The jade industry in particular, which is kind of more of a
sect off to the side of thejewelry industry, it's a
community of sellers who arereally good to their customers.
They're good to each other andhonestly I want to see the jade
industry do well Like I wantjade to just blow up.
(41:26):
In the United States Imentioned earlier.
A rising tide lifts all boats.
Most jade sellers would agreethat it helps us all a lot more
to promote the jade industry asa whole than to just promote one
or two sellers.
We want to connect customerswith the stone and as an
industry I think we wantcustomers to have a good
experience with it and treasuretheir jade and pass it down and
really appreciate it.
(41:47):
So anything that I do in mycareer, especially right now, I
think it's because I believe inthe jade economy in the U?
S, which is small now but it'sinevitably going to get bigger
and frankly I want to be a partof it when it does.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
Wow, what a really uh , a wholesome way to kind of uh
view it, especially with youknow, the fact that it's not
rare is something I do find kindof attractive about it, like
the fact that my birthstones aregarnets is garnet and as a
result I kind of feel reallylucky because garnet is not
(42:22):
super expensive, because it isrelatively not common I guess
it's relatively common and withjade, the fact that there are
mines that are still producingcopious amounts of jade that are
beautiful and it does all seemto be beautiful, that's kind of
like one of those parts ofjewelry I do feel like a lot of
(42:43):
the times jewelry is thecornerstone is rarity and innate
value because of rarity andthere is a finite amount of gold
.
And then there's everyone'salways discussing lab run versus
natural diamonds because of,you know, rarity and the fact
that it did come from the earth.
(43:03):
But the fact that jade is notnecessarily rare is, I don't
know.
I find that very enticing andkind of like an endearing aspect
of it.
Speaker 3 (43:13):
Well, think of it this way too, because there are
two jades.
So I think that makes it feellike there's more of it than
there is.
But it's because we're talkingabout two gemstones.
Nephrite jade is geologicallymore abundant, but jadeite jade
geologically is very rare.
So if you consider that there'sprobably 50 diamond mines in
the us or, sorry, in the worldmy bad in the world there are
(43:34):
two active jadeite jade minesthat are producing any notable
quality in any notable quantityof jadeite jade.
So there are fewer jadeproducing mines that are
offering gem quality jade and infact gem quality jadeite jade I
mean some of the imperialqualities can fetch millions
easily.
Barbara Hutton's necklace soldfor, I don't know, 26 or 27
(43:57):
million and it was just not just, but I mean it was jade beads
and of course gorgeous, but mygosh over $20 million.
Of course gorgeous, but my goshover $20 million.
So one of the things that makesJade special, and especially in
its I want to say lowerqualities, qualities that aren't
necessarily gem quality maybeyou wouldn't put it in your
engagement rate it's stilldurable enough and it's still
(44:21):
attractive enough to be art.
Jade really is an art form.
So you have really threeindustries within jade, you have
antiques right pre, you know,pre-ccp era, I guess, um pre
hold on, sorry editor, you'regonna have to edit this out
while I think of the word.
(44:41):
No, you're good, uh, 1911 worldwar two.
Speaker 1 (44:49):
Uh, world war one rebellion.
Speaker 3 (44:50):
Yeah, uh, never mind, hold on, I'll think of another
word.
So you have.
You have the jade antiques andantiquities.
So you have pieces that arenephrite jade carvings that come
from like the Ming dynasty orthe Qing dynasty or, even more
rarely, you know, the Handynasty, like these dynasty
jades that were not jewelry, itwas just carvings.
(45:14):
You have modern jade carving,which is an art form, like what
they're celebrating in Guatemalaat the Congress of Jade Carvers
that they have in Antigua everyyear, and then you have jewelry
as a separate category.
So jade, unlike ruby andsapphire, spans multiple
industries essentially and has alot more to offer than just a
(45:40):
gemstone for jewelry.
Speaker 1 (45:41):
Very fascinating, Jordan.
You've convinced me I need toget myself a jade dangle.
I need one.
Speaker 3 (45:47):
It sounds very cool, you do.
Speaker 2 (45:49):
Sounds like an awesome, awesome time.
Speaker 1 (45:51):
Jordan.
If people want to learn evenmore, where can they find you on
the internet, if they want tofollow your accounts.
Speaker 3 (45:58):
Yeah, so if you are in the trade, you can follow me
on Instagram.
It's Jewels of the Trade andthat's where I connect with
retailers and wholesalers andcarvers and that's just a good
way to kind of like actuallytalk to me.
If you are interested inlearning more about Jade, I do
recommend my YouTube channel,which is also called Jewels of
the Trade.
And if you're wanting to getlike nitty gritty, down and
(46:22):
dirty with the details, like youwant to really understand Jade,
join down and dirty with thedetails, Like you want to really
understand Jade, join mydiscord Honestly, like the link
is in pretty much all of theYouTube video descriptions join,
learn, watch, contribute, sharephotos of your collection.
Because what we're trying to dowith the jewels of the trade
overall platform is just expandcustomer and seller Jade
knowledge.
We want to eradicate all ofthis misinformation that's
(46:46):
poisoning people in jewelrystores and forcing people to buy
crap jade online for too highof prices.
We want to get rid of all thatand we want this safe oasis
where people can actually findgood information and know that
there's a reliable place to buyjade.
We don't want people to beafraid to buy jade.
We want people to feelconfident and if you're a
(47:07):
retailer who's wanting to sellJade, I can help actually like
train your staff and we can do atrunk show or we can
collaborate in a way that willbenefit you and your customers.
Speaker 1 (47:19):
Very cool.
Thank you so much, jordan.
I really appreciate you comingon.
What a really interesting topic.
I think it's something I'mgoing to have to look into even
more, but I appreciate your time.
Thanks everybody.
Go give her a follow and we'llbe back next week, tuesday, with
another episode.
Cheers everybody, bye.
All right, everybody.
(47:45):
That's the end of the show.
Thanks so much for listening.
My guest this week was JordanWentz, and she's with Jewels of
the Trade, and I highlyrecommend checking out her
YouTube channel and all of herlinks in the show notes below.
It's super interesting.
This episode was brought to youby Punchmark and produced and
hosted by me, michael Burpo.
This episode was edited by PaulSuarez with music by Ross
(48:07):
Cockrum.
Don't forget to rate thepodcast on Spotify and Apple
Podcasts and leave us feedbackon punchmarkcom slash loop.
That's L-O-U-P-E.
Thanks.
We'll be back next week,tuesday, with another episode.
Cheers, bye, thank you.
Welcome to In the Loop all of her expertise and
knowledge with me and starts toexplain the details and
historical significance of jade,as well as what is kind of
trending in today's day and age.
She also tries to explain to methe difference between jadeite
and nephrite, and we talk allabout how you can spot quality
(00:39):
jade and also how retailers caneducate themselves so that
they're not getting ripped offor being misinformed about their
own products.
It's a really cool talk.
I hope you learn more aboutJade and maybe consider carrying
some in your store and alsolook into attending the Jade
conference coming up real soon.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Thanks and enjoy this episode is brought to you by
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platform and digital growthagency.
Our mission reaches way beyondtechnology.
With decades of experience andlong-lasting industry
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We consider our clients ourfriends, as many of them have
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Speaker 1 (01:59):
And now back to the show show.
Welcome everybody.
I'm joined by Jordan Wentz andyou have a really interesting
story, jordan.
I don't even know 100% how toexplain that you're with the
Jade Summit.
You've also been a sales rep atMason Kay.
(02:20):
When you introduce yourself,how do you introduce kind of
like what it is that you'redoing?
Speaker 3 (02:24):
That's a great question, michael.
Thanks so much.
It's great to be here.
So I would describe myself asan independent sales rep, which
means I own my own business andbrands contract with me to sell
their product.
My specialty is Jade, so I workclosely with Mason K Jade on
the B2B and B2C sides of theirbusiness.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
Really interesting.
So B2B and B2C.
We've had this conversation inthe past before on other
episodes, but there aredifferent kind of strategies and
I feel like it kind of requiresa different tone.
Do you feel yourself sort ofslipping in and out of the
different kind of conversationstyles when you have to go
between the two?
Speaker 3 (03:02):
Oh, absolutely, and I completely agree.
I would say they're entirelydifferent.
Most of the strategies that Ithink you would use when selling
directly to the consumer aregoing to be different when
you're working with otherprofessionals in the trade.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Yeah, and so you're also a sales rep with Mason Kay.
Can you talk to me a little bitmore about that and explain
that to the audience?
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Yeah, so my job with Mason Kay?
Can you talk to me a little bitmore about that and explain
that to the audience?
Yeah, so my job with Mason Kayis to assist them at trade shows
, to sell their product at trunkshows and liaise with retail
jewelry store accounts to helpthem place their orders, educate
their staff, things like that.
So that's what I do on thewholesale side.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Interesting, and do you find that?
I know that that was primarilyyour position before.
Is that becoming more on theback burner as you started to
kind of put your own business inthe forefront a little bit more
, or is that still taking up amajority of your time?
Speaker 3 (03:57):
Well, to be perfectly honest, Michael, what's kind of
happened is we've seen morelike end consumer demand for
Jade and a lot of jewelry storesmaybe they don't have, you know
, like a clientele for Jade, orthey don't know how to sell Jade
and they get a littleintimidated or afraid to sell it
, and so those customers willusually end up shopping online.
(04:19):
So we're trying to interceptthose customers to keep them
from shopping with untrustworthyoverseas sellers that are going
to offer treated jade, sellingit, as natural things like that.
So a lot of my job has actuallyshifted more to the B2C side.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
Interesting because I watched this video.
I'm trying to remembercompletely.
I wish I would have checkedbeforehand, but it was like jade
bangles and they were showingthe difference between like real
jade and then like a substituteor like a fake jade, and they
were clinking it together and itmakes a completely different
noise.
(04:54):
It's like one is like more highpitched, one is not.
What are, like, the main kindof ways to tell, um, I guess,
fake from real when it comes toJade?
Speaker 3 (05:04):
Wow, you really did your homework.
So let's talk about that first.
We call that the ping test.
So Jade has sonority, which isa property that allows it to
essentially sing.
And in fact, when Mary LouReidinger discovered the
Guatemalan Jade deposits withher husband, jay Reidinger, in
the 1970s, the way that theyfound Jade was by walking around
(05:26):
with a hammer for like I don'tknow eight, nine, 10 months,
something like that, and hittingboulders until they could find
that beautiful ping sound, andthat was how they identified the
jade boulders and made thediscovery.
So even when it's been cutespecially if it's been cut into
something continuous, forinstance a solid jade ring or a
solid jade bangle if it istranslucent, unfractured and
(05:51):
natural, if you strike it with ahard object it'll sing out, and
the higher quality the jade is,the more beautiful the sound.
Yeah, so it's really a tell ofquality.
The problem with that and thisis why we don't recommend using
this method for identificationis that jadeite, jade's most
common simulant, which is dyedgreen quartz, also has sonority.
(06:12):
So when you have a dyed greenquartz bangle that's also highly
translucent and you ping it, itwill sound very similar to a
jade bangle.
So that method is actuallybetter for distinguishing
natural, which is untreatedjadeite jade, from treated
jadeite jade which has beenimpregnated with polymer wax or
resin.
(06:32):
So when you ask the real versusfake question, it's so much
more complicated than thatbecause we have natural but then
we have genuine that's beentreated right.
So you have the real jade, thetreated jade and then the jade
simulants and it all gets veryconfusing from there.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
I understand.
So I always have this question,though, when it comes to these
tricks or the, like you said,impregnated with polymer, I've
wondered so obviously, inuntreated and like this, you
know the natural version is mostlikely going to be the most
beautiful.
It's probably the mosttemperamental, though, Besides
(07:09):
losing you know the fact thatyou can say it's untreated in
its value, are there any reasonswhy you shouldn't be using
polymer or something like thaton your jade?
Is it just because, like Iimagine, it's to protect it?
Is that correct?
Speaker 3 (07:23):
It's not what you think.
A lot of times, gemstones aretreated to increase their
durability.
In the case of jadeite jade,that is not the case at all.
Treated jade is substantiallymore brittle than natural jade.
Which natural jade?
Both natural jade are two ofthe toughest gemstones in the
world.
So then you treat them andyou're literally I mean it's
(07:45):
like a zombie jade, like you'reputting plastic on the inside.
So all of the fractures thatalready existed in that
originally unsellable quality ofjade expand, meaning it's much
more likely to break.
It is not stable in color.
It has five to 10% the value ofits natural jade counterpart If
it doesn't have dye.
If it does have dye on top ofthe polymer impregnation, it has
(08:07):
almost no value whatsoever.
So it's really, reallyimportant for the customer
because jade can be so expensivefor the customer to know that
what they're buying is actuallynatural and not treated.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Really fascinating.
So I guess you've also had abunch of experience on YouTube
with sales and I've watched acouple of your streams before,
and one thing that's fascinatingis I feel like it's not picked
up in popularity the selling,the live selling, and especially
on Facebook.
It was very popular duringCOVID and then it went away
(08:42):
seemingly.
And I'm always like man, I feellike you're on to something
really clever, but you've stuckwith it, especially with YouTube
, and have cultivated anaudience.
Where do you see YouTube kindof fitting in your marketing
kind of armada of techniques?
Speaker 3 (08:58):
Yeah, so interestingly enough, youtube
has over two and a half billionactive monthly users, so it's
actually bigger than Pinterestand it's bigger than TikTok, but
it's not quite as big asFacebook.
Youtube is able to offer, likeshort form and long form content
and everything is searchablebecause Google actually owns
YouTube.
So if you Google somethingabout Jade, for instance, one of
(09:19):
my videos will probably come upin the Google search because
they're on YouTube.
So that means that a video cansit for like six months or a
year or two years, and wheninterest in that topic surges,
the video can blow up, no matterhow much time has passed.
So a customer with cash in handready to buy can find a YouTube
video in a Google search andmake a purchase, irregardless of
(09:39):
the number of views that thevideo has even gotten, because
it's so targeted.
Like, maybe it only has 70views, but you made a $4,000
sale off of one video.
Most of the people that I knowsellers that are really
successful with live selling inthe United States, not China.
China's live selling is kind ofa different ballgame, right.
They don't need a ton of views,they just get very targeted
(10:03):
subscribers who are interestedin buying, and then a lot of you
know, you need a handful 20, 30customers.
Those customers repeat byrepeat by.
They tell their friends thatgrows, it gets bigger and bigger
.
But the idea of live streamingand having, you know, 10,000
views on your live stream, thatdoesn't guarantee success.
That doesn't actually guaranteethat somebody is going to buy.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
It's so fascinating.
I always say that subscribercount and follower count and
view count.
A lot of those are these daysare vanity metrics.
They just kind of make you feelgood and they sort of bring
like an air of clout.
But a lot of the times it doesseem like it's about, yeah,
attracting a couple of thesepower users.
I had to kind of come to gripswith that, with attracting a
couple of these power users.
(10:43):
I had to come to grips withthat with this podcast, for
example.
I used to think the key to thisthing being super successful is
getting tens and hundreds ofthousands of downloads by the
wider audience.
I was like, wait, but if I'minterviewing only retail
jewelers, shouldn't I only wantretail jewelers to be listening?
(11:03):
If that's the targetdemographic and the target model
, then we should behyper-focused on that.
And if we can have as close to100% of our audience be our
target, then the healthier ouraudience is.
Is that kind of how you'reviewing your YouTube platform as
well?
Speaker 3 (11:18):
Literally words taken out of my brain.
Michael, like I think you'respot on.
That's exactly how I see it.
I hope that jewelry sellers cangrow to understand that exact
concept, because if you haveespecially like a niche product,
something that you reallyspecialize in, oh my gosh,
youtube can be such a lucrativeavenue for you, and I've known
(11:38):
people who can sell $50,000worth of product in one YouTube
live sale, but maybe they have20 people watching.
It's about finding the viewer,finding the customer.
It's just not about views andsubscribers Like those numbers
are not as important as theactual dollars going into your
pocket.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
That's so fascinating .
So talk to me about the actualexecution of a of a live stream,
because one of the the thenature of an auction is that you
probably are setting like astarting price and then
hopefully you're going to go upfrom there, and I have done
auctions in the past for my ownartwork and sometimes it goes
(12:19):
really well and you do waybetter than you expected.
But the nature of the beast isthat sometimes an item flops and
it sells for either base priceor sometimes even lower than
that.
When you're dealing withsomething that can have a high
cost, such as Jade, are yousetting a floor that, even if it
never goes up from there, thatyou'll what you put in, or is it
(12:45):
just the nature of the beast?
Sometimes you take a bath on acouple of the products and then
some of them go much higher thanwhat you anticipated.
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Well, personally, I don't do any auction style live
selling yet on my channel, but Ido want to talk about this.
So, michael, are you familiarwith Whatnot?
Speaker 1 (13:01):
Whatnot?
I don't think so.
Speaker 3 (13:02):
Whatnot is like if Twitch and eBay made a baby.
So it's a platform for liveselling that I think is taking
off.
I think it's going to getreally huge.
Basically, sellers will stream,sometimes for hours, sometimes
every day, and it's all auctionbased.
So they're auctioning off theirgoods to smartphone users who
log in through an app and theybuy by swiping the screen.
So it's very quick decisions,it's very competitive and this
(13:24):
is, I hope.
I hope people hear this andrealize like live selling is so
much bigger than we realized.
Like it's so much bigger thanjust like the Instagram sellers
or the TikTok sellers, whichreally TikTok is a huge, huge
economy for live selling.
But there is more to it,especially deep into YouTube and
on platforms like whatnot.
So I personally believe YouTubeis actually heading kind of in
(13:45):
a direction more like whatnot,but it's just not quite there.
Youtube to me, it offers a salesavenue, and that's not
necessarily the primary focus ofmy channel, because the focus
of my channel is education andcommunity, but the reality is, I
mean, people are going to wantto buy right, they want to
support content creators andthey want to buy from someone
that they trust.
(14:05):
So, since I don't carry my owninventory.
Yet I sell using affiliatemarketing and Mason K has, you
know, the retail side to theirbusiness that I mentioned.
So they're my main affiliateand I feature their products on
my Tuesday night live stream.
So I sell products through theaffiliate links in the video
description.
But YouTube right now has afunction where it can sync up
with Shopify.
So other sellers who might beinterested in live selling, if
(14:28):
they have a Shopify site alreadyand they have a YouTube account
that meets certain criteria,they can sync their items that
are already on their websiteonto YouTube so that they are
clickable and like purchasablewhile someone is watching a
video.
And to me, like I think that isis probably safer than like the
auction style that you weretalking about.
(14:50):
But I do think in a way it'slimiting Cause, like you
mentioned, with the auctionstyle you can make so much more
off of our product sale becauseyou're actually taking it to the
market and asking them likewhat is this really worth?
What are you actually willingto pay for this?
You know, and I think YouTubewill go that way and we'll see
more sellers doing that.
It's just there's high riskright now for that sort of thing
(15:13):
, um, but in the next six monthsor a year.
That can be totally different.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
Yeah, and I think that one thing you've uh kind of
started to allude to is thisidea of like consolidating your
base or like having youraudience in a very tangible
location.
So the live streams, we alreadytalked about it.
You were saying that you know,maybe you have 20 or 25 people
that are logged in, but it stillcan be super lucrative.
(15:39):
And I sometimes think about itlike the traffic to a website.
Sometimes these, I'm likethey're ghosts, they just like
coming in and out and they sortof just float, and sometimes
they click on stuff andsometimes they don't, and it's
just like oh, is this?
Are these even real people?
But then when you see them andyou consolidate them onto more
(15:59):
of like a tangible location,like a live stream, suddenly,
especially if they're typinginto chat or they're interacting
in a way, suddenly it becomes alittle bit more tactile.
But the actual like the apex ofit seems to be through, for
example, like a Discord server.
Can you sort of talk about whatyou've set up with your own
Discord server and what thatkind of adds to your own brand
(16:22):
and business?
Speaker 3 (16:23):
Yeah, definitely let's.
If we could just go back alittle bit to something that you
said about driving people tothe website by using marketing
tactics like YouTube anddifferent types of live selling,
whatnot?
Instagram, tiktok, things likethat.
So what you mentioned is whatwe call conversion rate.
I know you use this term too,so I let's say, I get a thousand
(16:45):
people onto my website, howmany of them actually convert?
Right, when you're building acommunity, which is really the
focus of my YouTube channel,rules of the Trade is more about
building that community andnetworking.
It's a little less about salesand it's more about enhancing
the knowledge of the peopleparticipating in the community.
(17:05):
So I always say a rising tidelifts all boats.
Like we're trying to helppeople be more accurate when
they speak about Jade, when theysell Jade.
You know a lot of retail jewelrystores watch my channel as well
.
Appraisers watch my channel.
It's important that the jewelryindustry understands how
misunderstood Jade really is,cause I think it's probably one
of the most misunderstoodgemstones that actually sells in
(17:28):
the jewelry store, andunderstands what is accurate
about it.
So when you have that educationand that community at the
forefront, some of those metricsdon't matter as much your
conversion rate and things likethat.
Even though and I say this theJewels of the Trade channel gets
about 80,000 views a month, thepast couple of months we've
(17:55):
been getting around 100,000views a month.
That's quite a bit of traffic.
We do drive those customers towebsites where they do buy and
it's very, very successful.
And I will say like, overall,it is lucrative.
I don't want people to thinkcause I, this aspect of
community is, um, you know it's,it's coming from a very caring
place and I do genuinely wantpeople to know more and feel
better about what they'repurchasing and connect with
(18:17):
trustworthy retailers, Even ifit's not a company I represent.
Like I just want people tospend money and buy jewelry and
that that is there.
But also the goal is, at theend of the day, to convert
customers, because that's how wecan afford to have the channel,
so that we can expand theknowledge, you know.
So it's it's sort of a cyclicalthing.
So that kind of brings us tothe discord.
Uh, I started the discordbecause it was sort of just like
(18:40):
a natural evolution for theYouTube channel, because of the
amount of views that I wasgetting and I didn't know what
it was.
So, like Michael, do you useDiscord?
Speaker 1 (18:51):
I go through phases where I use it, but it's not
something that is very ingrainedinto me.
During COVID I was using it alot, but not of late.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
Are you a gamer?
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I am a gamer.
Speaker 3 (19:03):
Yeah, okay.
So I'm not a gamer and that'swhy I didn't know what it was,
and I bet a lot of peoplelistening to this probably don't
know what it is either.
So I started the Discord notknowing what Discord was.
I chose it because I thought itwould be easier to moderate
than Reddit.
It was gonna allow for videocalls, private messaging and a
more personal connection withthe Jot audience.
(19:24):
It was a natural next step forthe YouTube channel because the
channel was really growing.
In the Discord, which is sort oflike a group chat but also a
repository for storing accurateinformation, jot viewers are
encouraged to actually sharephotos from their.
It's like a place where you, aJade customer, you can talk
(19:45):
directly to a Jade researcher ora Jade seller or a Jade
appraiser or a Jade carver andask questions that maybe your
local jewelry store can't answer.
Now, inevitably, we havejewelry store salespeople who
have joined too to learn fromthe group and they're able to
take that information to theircustomers in person at their
store.
So what it's doing is it's sortof creating this halo where
(20:10):
we're increasing the knowledgeof both customers and
professionals.
That inevitably, is going todrive demand, because people are
going to be less intimidatedand they're going to be less
afraid that they're going toaccidentally buy treated jade,
because they're going to be moreconfident, they're going to
know who to shop from.
And it helps sellers becausethe sellers who are in it that
are constantly learning, theycan speak with a confidence and
an accuracy that's going tobring like so much more trust in
(20:34):
their customers towards them.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Do you find that?
So you had mentioned thatReddit was another option.
So it's funny because I had avery similar train of thought
right around 2019.
And we were.
We developed this closedFacebook group for our clients.
We've talked about it in thepast, called the Punchmark
Community, and it has onlyactive Punchmark retailers in
(20:58):
there, and I was 50-50 onwhether or not I wanted to
create a subreddit that wasinvite only, or I was going to
create a Facebook group.
We ended up going with aFacebook group because our
demographic skews older and mostpeople already had a Facebook
account and it would be easierto just pull people from there
as opposed to create an entirelynew platform for them.
(21:21):
But Discord has always beensomething I've found to be so
enticing because of the factthat, first of all, you can do
things centered around topicsand you can also limit speaking
privileges in each topic.
So, for example, you could haveone, for example, about Jade
(21:43):
Education and then only letpeople who are whatever you want
to call it certified to be ableto discuss it in there.
Is that something kind of setup?
Speaker 3 (21:52):
I would say my discord is not that heavily
moderated.
Keep in mind, too, the goal ofthe YouTube channel.
The primary goal of the YouTubechannel is education.
The secondary goal is sales.
The goal of the discord is notsales.
The goal of the discord is onlycommunity, and what I didn't
realize when I started it isthat the discord helps me a lot.
(22:14):
It's a way for me to learn frompeople who know about things
that I don't know, and forpeople to share their
collections and share images andlike things that I wouldn't
normally have access to, likematerial from certain locales or
certain inclusions in in Jade,from certain origins that I
wouldn't normally see.
I can be like hey, does anybodyhave a picture of this?
And and somebody does.
So there's a much greateradvantage, I think, to the, the
(22:39):
blank canvas that is the discord, where the people who join
whatever, whatever knowledge andexpertise they have, they can
bring it to the table and we canall sort of share in that.
So I would say, like I have nothad to mute anybody or like,
keep anybody from saying things,because I think like attracts
like and I think, because of thenature of my channel, it's
(23:02):
drawn in just like a reallyreally good group of people who
aren't going to spreadmisinformation in the discord
Like the people who are in mydiscord.
They know a ton about Jade.
There's about 14 core membersof the discord that control the
culture of it and they're notmoderators like me and my sister
and my husband we moderated.
(23:22):
If somebody's there to spam orif they're being sneaky, we'll
just kick them out Because it'snot Reddit, right, we can just
do that.
But the culture, the tone, thetopics that get discussed,
that's determined by the peoplewho are in it, and the
connections that we've all beenable to make with each other
have been so valuable because ofthat.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
Yeah, and also I think one of the best aspects of
it is that you can control, um,the I guess you you own the
railroads in that instance andthat you can share, uh, for
example, this episode, uh, whenthis one comes out, um, you'll
be able to put it in front ofyour audience, as opposed to
hope that your the algorithmwill share it with them.
(24:05):
And that's one of the parts thatI have kind of been pushed away
from Instagram in the past,because it used to be if you
follow someone, you'll see theirposts right in your feed.
Then things happened with thealgorithm and it started pushing
similar content or suggestedcontent in front of people and
suddenly you stop seeing thecontent that you had subscribed
(24:26):
to or followed in the firstplace.
And I do find that, for examplewith Discord, that it allows
you to have a very directconnection with your audience
and that's how I used to use itin particular was you could have
a connection with your creatoror your community, instead of
(24:47):
hoping that the algorithm willserve you up to people that
already are engaging with it.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
It's really perfect.
I mean, people can speak withme directly.
They can just message me, theycan tag me in things like
instead of the YouTube channelbeing just me monologuing at
people, it becomes verytwo-sided.
It becomes a conversation, itbecomes a dialogue, and a lot of
that's been driven by the livestreams as well.
So the Tuesday night livestreams that I do that offer
(25:13):
product.
People can go to the website.
They can buy it.
There are affiliate links inthe description.
They're very informationfocused, and so the live streams
have done a lot to cultivatethe community and bring people
into the discord.
Because, think about it, ifyou're a customer and you're
really serious about learning,because you don't want to get
swindled, you don't want toaccidentally buy fake Jade, you
want to know what you're getting, you might, because you have
(25:34):
this motivation, sit and watchan hour long video, an hour long
live stream where you can talkto a Jade expert and ask
questions.
You might actually do that, youmight actually watch that and
gain a lot from that.
And then you're like well, whatdo I do next?
Well, now you hop on over tothe discord and all of these
things factor into the decisionthat you're going to make when
you eventually buy, and I thinkthe real benefit of that is just
(25:59):
intercepting customers so thatthey don't buy a bad product on
accident for too high of a price.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
Educated customers are the best type of customers.
I totally agree.
I think, jordan, we're going totake a quick break and then,
when we come back, I want totalk more about Jade, but
especially about the Jade Summit.
So, everybody, stay with us.
Speaker 4 (26:23):
Mother's Day is coming up.
Are you prepared?
This is Hope Belair, digitalMarketing Manager here at
Punchmark, and I wanted to letyou guys know about our Mother's
Day campaign.
We make it seamless for yourstore to advertise digitally
between a landing page, threebeautiful emails scheduled out
on your behalf, as well associal posts that you get to use
(26:45):
for your organic social media.
We want to make this Mother'sDay the most special Mother's
Day ever for your store and wewould love the opportunity to
take care of that for you.
So if you're interested,contact hope at punchmarkcom to
get the details about ourMother's Day campaign or if
you'd like continued emailmarketing management again hope
(27:06):
at punchmarkcom.
Have a great day and enjoy therest of the episode.
Speaker 1 (27:18):
All right, everybody Still speaking with Jordan Wentz
.
Jordan, I want to ask a littlebit about this upcoming event
that you're putting on calledthe Jade Summit, and you were
kind of discussing it with me.
It sounds like you're verypassionate about jade in general
.
What is the Jade Summit goingto be?
Speaker 3 (27:34):
So this is the only professional jade conference in
the US.
So for gemologists, appraisersand jewelry sellers who are
looking for continuing education, like what could be better than
going to Monterey, getting anadvanced education on a rare
gemstone and then being able towrite off your trip Like you can
go to the aquarium, you can eatseafood, the whole event is
(27:56):
like in sight of the actualMonterey Bay.
It's right next to the water.
So Mason K Jade is going to bepresenting the first annual
international Jade Summit at theMonterey Bay Festival, which is
an outdoor Jade show that lastsfor three days every summer.
The summit is only one day long, it's indoor and it features
seminars from some of theleading Jade experts in the
(28:16):
world.
So, like Kirk Makepeace, whopioneered the Canadian Jade
industry and put Canada on themap as a major Jade producer,
will be speaking.
Mary Lou Reitinger, whodiscovered the jadeite deposits
of Guatemala with her husband inthe 1970s.
She's going to be speaking.
Lou Blanc, a geophysicist whospecializes in jade formation,
will be there, and Jeff Mason,who's the leading expert in the
(28:37):
US on jadeite jade testing andvaluation.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
That's going to be super cool, and are you putting
it together or what is the?
What is your role in this goingto be?
Speaker 3 (28:47):
So technically, if you want to get fancy, I I'm
called the conference director,which, like you know, basically
I'm going to be emceeing it, um,and then Mason K is actually
sponsoring it.
So my husband and I are goingto actually be like presenting
the conference, but of courseit's with, like the help from
(29:10):
the Jade Events Unlimited boardand the Mason K team.
I mean, there's a lot of peoplethat are really working very
hard to bring this all together.
So, yes, this is its first year.
I'm hoping that it goes reallywell and I can run it every year
, but we'll see.
We'll see.
You know, it just kind ofdepends on how many tickets sell
(29:32):
.
So it's open to anyone.
So Jade customers andcollectors are welcome to come
as well.
It's pretty advanced, though,and the seminars will be
presented with gemologists inmind, so particularly appraisers
and jewelry store sales peopleand Jade carvers, of course.
So we'll see.
I mean it's the first one.
I feel like there's a lot ofinterest, just because Jade is
truly a misunderstood stone andthe biggest complaint I get from
(29:55):
jewelry stores is that theyfeel intimidated by it.
They're kind of afraid to sellit.
So I'm hoping this sort offixes that.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
And remind me when is it going to be taking place.
Speaker 3 (30:05):
Oh yeah, june 14th 2025.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
Very exciting.
So that's going to be coming up.
So if they're interested, whereshould they be going, if they
want to learn more, or mayberegister.
Speaker 3 (30:21):
So if you visit montereybayjadefestivalorg, all
of the information is there andyou can register for your ticket
, which includes breakfast andlunch, and there's plenty of
time allotted for browsing theGeorge Schmeerholtz Jade Carving
Exhibition next door and, ofcourse, the beautiful outdoor
Monterey Bay Jade Festivalinside of Old Fisherman's Wharf
and the Monterey Bay.
Speaker 1 (30:35):
Very cool and I'll have that information in the
show notes below.
But to end this on like a realhigh note Jordan, can you tell
me a little bit about Jade orsome things that I might not
know about it?
I'm obviously definitely anamateur.
Um, I don't own anything Jade.
I would love to one day, butcan you, um, tell me, uh, or the
(30:55):
audience, a little bit aboutJade that could really get them
interested as an entry-levelperson?
Speaker 3 (31:01):
Oh my gosh.
So, michael, have you seen Jadein person?
Speaker 1 (31:04):
I think so.
I believe I've seen it at somejewelry shows, but it doesn't
seem like it's used the way thatother you know fine jewelry
gemstones are used.
It seems like it's a.
Is it considered a stone?
Speaker 3 (31:18):
Yeah.
So what's so confusing, I think, about jade in particular is
that it's an aggregate.
So if you think of like lapislazuli, right, so lapis is
basically it's an aggregate ofmultiple minerals, kind of
smushed together.
Now we call it lapis, butlazurite, which is where like
(31:39):
the lazuli comes from, right,like that's like one mineral and
it mixes with other things.
Jade is the same way.
So there's two gemstones calledjade, there's jadeite jade and
there's nephrite jade andthey're both called jade.
Very confusing.
But in the case of jadeite jade, jadeite is a mineral that's in
jadeite jade.
So yes, in that sense it isdifferent from like ruby and
(32:00):
sapphire and diamond and itlends itself to more variety in
appearance and sometimescharacteristics because it's I
don't want to say it's looselydefined.
It's not loosely defined, it'sjust more varying than a single
crystal gemstone.
So you have confusion becausethere's two gemstones called
jade.
And then, like actuallyidentifying a stone as one of
(32:22):
those two jadeite jade ornephrite jade becomes very, very
difficult because so manysellers accidentally sell quartz
and serpentine and grossulargarnet as jade.
So the word jade itself reallyis a trade term, it's not a
mineral term.
It's been super overused, verymisunderstood and basically we
have sellers like all over justselling whatever as jade because
(32:46):
it's green, and they don't evenrealize that, like jadeite is a
mineral.
The minerals that constitutenephrite jade, which are
actinolite and tremolite, thoseare distinct minerals.
You can't just call anythingjade.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
It's too confusing.
Speaker 3 (33:03):
Words have to have meaning.
So I think that's what mostpeople don't understand about
jade.
Is that just because somebodypresents a gem to you and says
this is jade, that actually thatmeans nothing?
Like the word means nothing.
You need to ask is this jadeitejade or is this nephrite jade?
And I do wonder, michael, whenyou've seen jade at jewelry
(33:28):
shows, do you remember, like howit?
Speaker 1 (33:29):
was presented to you.
Was it as jade or did theyactually distinctly name the
mineral?
I think it was.
What I saw was jade bangles and, like it seemed to be, it was
one continuous piece that's.
It's that iconic green colorand I believe they just called
it a jade bangle, but I don'tquite remember now.
Speaker 3 (33:47):
Could have gone either way.
And it's interesting that youbring up the bangle too because,
like you said earlier, likejade is cut into unique ways
that you don't normally see in,like sapphire and ruby I've
never seen a ruby bangle.
Yeah, and part of that isbecause it's an aggregate, so
you have a larger boulder butonly a small portion of that
boulder is gem quality.
So they're trying to use themost of the rough that they can
(34:13):
in a piece of jade jewelry sobeads or a bangle or a solid
ring or a carving or a disc.
They're basically trying to useas much of that high quality
jade in the boulder as they canto use as much of that high
quality jade in the boulder asthey can.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
So you mentioned carving and it's obviously a
cornerstone of jade culture, ifthat's a thing.
Speaker 3 (34:33):
It is a thing, yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:49):
So I watched your vlog discussing, you know, a
trip to Guatemala and it seemslike there's a ton of jade
carvings but very, you know,very different than what, uh,
typical.
I guess maybe even westernstyle carvings might even show,
like you said, a lot of, a lotof corn carvings, a lot of, uh,
seeming like, nature related.
Um, what is like kind of isthere an origin for why people
are always carving in it?
And like, is that to kind ofmake these aggregate pieces kind
(35:10):
of have some life beyond just,you know, be turned into beads
or whatever?
Speaker 3 (35:15):
So every civilization that's ever had access to jade
revered it and any peoples whocould get their hands on it
valued it above all othermaterials.
In the case of China, theyvalued nephrite jade for like
8,000 years and they carved itinto relics for their religion.
(35:35):
They carved it into tools andweapons, because both jades
nephrite jade and jadeite jadeare two of the toughest, like
the absolute toughest, likegemstones on the planet.
So we think of, like a bronzeage and a stone age,
civilizations like theMesoamerican civilizations
between 1500 BC and 1500 AD andancient China.
(35:56):
They had a jade age.
New Zealand had a jade age,switzerland had a jade age.
So that reverence for the stonecomes from its durability, its
ability to withstand like somuch like just drama, I guess,
(36:18):
and not break.
Speaker 1 (36:20):
So I guess was it useful in, for example, in tools
, Like, because I know that in Ithink it was in Mesoamerica
they used I think it wasobsidian to make you know tools
and daggers and things like that.
Does jade hold an edge?
Is that kind of part of it?
Or was it more for like,because it was so hard?
(36:40):
I guess I don't reallyunderstand.
Speaker 3 (36:42):
So there's hardness and there's toughness.
So hardness is resistance toscratching and toughness is
resistance to breaking.
Jade is both so because of itshardness it can be basically
carved to be very, very thin andhave a sharp edge.
Because of its toughness it'snot going to break easily.
So it was actually an idealstone before metal for
(37:04):
particularly weapons, forhunting, for tools, for kitchen
utensils.
And then, of course, there wasthe ceremonial sort of use of it
because of its beautiful coloras well.
So, for instance, jadeite jadewas actually used in Mesoamerica
, and when the Spanish found itwith the Aztecs, the Aztecs
(37:26):
called it a word that I cannotpronounce properly it's like
Chalchuhudl, and that referredto the plumage of the Quetzal
bird, which today is like thenational bird of Guatemala, it's
probably like the highest, youknow, valued bird in
Mesoamerican history, and theyequated jade with that very,
(37:52):
very special bird that had somuch meaning to their culture.
The opposite of that, or notopposite, but I guess the
inverse of that is that in China, when they first saw jadeite
jade coming out of Burma in the1700s, they called it feichui.
Feichui refers to the plumageof the kingfisher bird, another
really beautiful icon in nature,and so you can just kind of see
(38:13):
how people, the way they viewedthe stone, the way they thought
of its beauty and considered itso different from other gems.
China long believed that allgemstones want to be jade.
China long believed that allgemstones want to be jade.
Speaker 1 (38:28):
Jade is like the ultimate stone.
Wow, that's so fascinating.
I guess that there's a utilityto it, but it's also very
beautiful.
I guess that does put it inkind of a unique position.
Speaker 3 (38:40):
Well, that's why it's able to be worn in bangles too.
Right, if, let's say you couldget a diamond big enough lab
grown, I guess you got.
You could, right, like youcould get a lab grown diamond
big enough.
If you cut a diamond into abangle like it would shatter,
like you wouldn't be able towear it for more than a day.
People wear jade bangles theirentire life in china.
(39:01):
They put them on teenage girlsbefore their hand is done
growing and then then, whentheir wrist gets bigger, they
can't take them off.
They wear them for their wholelife.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
Wow, that is wild.
What a really interesting stone, and one I hope I see more of.
It does seem like for a reallylong time, I mean, at least in
the Western culture.
For a lot of the places thatI've attended, the shows I've
attended, it's all about, yeah,diamonds and around gold, but
(39:31):
this is, you know, the fact thatthis is naturally, unnaturally
occurring as well, and reallybeautiful.
What a really interesting kindof aspect to it.
Speaker 3 (39:38):
Well, and I have one thing to add to that, michael,
before we move on.
I'm sorry, think of it this waytoo.
The price of gold just hit$3,000 an ounce.
When I left the jewelry storethat I worked for in 2020, gold
was $1,200 an ounce.
Jade bangles, beads, solidbands, et cetera are impervious
to the rising cost of gold andoffer the customer an
opportunity to buy fine heirloom, quality jewelry that's in
(40:02):
their budget and at a morestable price.
So for anyone wondering why itseems like they're hearing about
Jade more, I think that's partof it.
I think the demand for Jade isgrowing and I think just the
stability of its pricing and thefact that it's so attainable,
even in good qualities, is amajor part of that.
Speaker 1 (40:21):
Hmm, interesting because there is a volume that
it's able to meet the demand.
That's.
I wonder if that'll be able tokeep up because as it gets more
and more popular I'm sure thatthere will be more and more
demand.
So that'll be fascinating andhopefully that works out.
For you know the Jade Summit aswell and I guess Jordan, that
kind of.
To wrap this up, it sounds likeyou are positioning yourself in
(40:45):
like a really unique spot inthe jewelry industry.
I guess I was going to ask likekind of where do you see this
going as a, you know, eventdirector for the Jade Summit but
also helping with, you know,sales and marketing for Mason
Kay?
Where do you kind of seeyourself going in the jewelry
industry?
Speaker 3 (41:04):
So I am so proud of the jade industry Like I, I
can't even believe that I get tobe a part of it.
The jade industry in particular, which is kind of more of a
sect off to the side of thejewelry industry, it's a
community of sellers who arereally good to their customers.
They're good to each other andhonestly I want to see the jade
industry do well Like I wantjade to just blow up.
(41:26):
In the United States Imentioned earlier.
A rising tide lifts all boats.
Most jade sellers would agreethat it helps us all a lot more
to promote the jade industry asa whole than to just promote one
or two sellers.
We want to connect customerswith the stone and as an
industry I think we wantcustomers to have a good
experience with it and treasuretheir jade and pass it down and
really appreciate it.
(41:47):
So anything that I do in mycareer, especially right now, I
think it's because I believe inthe jade economy in the U?
S, which is small now but it'sinevitably going to get bigger
and frankly I want to be a partof it when it does.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
Wow, what a really uh , a wholesome way to kind of uh
view it, especially with youknow, the fact that it's not
rare is something I do find kindof attractive about it, like
the fact that my birthstones aregarnets is garnet and as a
result I kind of feel reallylucky because garnet is not
(42:22):
super expensive, because it isrelatively not common I guess
it's relatively common and withjade, the fact that there are
mines that are still producingcopious amounts of jade that are
beautiful and it does all seemto be beautiful, that's kind of
like one of those parts ofjewelry I do feel like a lot of
(42:43):
the times jewelry is thecornerstone is rarity and innate
value because of rarity andthere is a finite amount of gold
.
And then there's everyone'salways discussing lab run versus
natural diamonds because of,you know, rarity and the fact
that it did come from the earth.
(43:03):
But the fact that jade is notnecessarily rare is, I don't
know.
I find that very enticing andkind of like an endearing aspect
of it.
Speaker 3 (43:13):
Well, think of it this way too, because there are
two jades.
So I think that makes it feellike there's more of it than
there is.
But it's because we're talkingabout two gemstones.
Nephrite jade is geologicallymore abundant, but jadeite jade
geologically is very rare.
So if you consider that there'sprobably 50 diamond mines in
the us or, sorry, in the worldmy bad in the world there are
(43:34):
two active jadeite jade minesthat are producing any notable
quality in any notable quantityof jadeite jade.
So there are fewer jadeproducing mines that are
offering gem quality jade and infact gem quality jadeite jade I
mean some of the imperialqualities can fetch millions
easily.
Barbara Hutton's necklace soldfor, I don't know, 26 or 27
(43:57):
million and it was just not just, but I mean it was jade beads
and of course gorgeous, but mygosh over $20 million.
Of course gorgeous, but my goshover $20 million.
So one of the things that makesJade special, and especially in
its I want to say lowerqualities, qualities that aren't
necessarily gem quality maybeyou wouldn't put it in your
engagement rate it's stilldurable enough and it's still
(44:21):
attractive enough to be art.
Jade really is an art form.
So you have really threeindustries within jade, you have
antiques right pre, you know,pre-ccp era, I guess, um pre
hold on, sorry editor, you'regonna have to edit this out
while I think of the word.
(44:41):
No, you're good, uh, 1911 worldwar two.
Speaker 1 (44:49):
Uh, world war one rebellion.
Speaker 3 (44:50):
Yeah, uh, never mind, hold on, I'll think of another
word.
So you have.
You have the jade antiques andantiquities.
So you have pieces that arenephrite jade carvings that come
from like the Ming dynasty orthe Qing dynasty or, even more
rarely, you know, the Handynasty, like these dynasty
jades that were not jewelry, itwas just carvings.
(45:14):
You have modern jade carving,which is an art form, like what
they're celebrating in Guatemalaat the Congress of Jade Carvers
that they have in Antigua everyyear, and then you have jewelry
as a separate category.
So jade, unlike ruby andsapphire, spans multiple
industries essentially and has alot more to offer than just a
(45:40):
gemstone for jewelry.
Speaker 1 (45:41):
Very fascinating, Jordan.
You've convinced me I need toget myself a jade dangle.
I need one.
Speaker 3 (45:47):
It sounds very cool, you do.
Speaker 2 (45:49):
Sounds like an awesome, awesome time.
Speaker 1 (45:51):
Jordan.
If people want to learn evenmore, where can they find you on
the internet, if they want tofollow your accounts.
Speaker 3 (45:58):
Yeah, so if you are in the trade, you can follow me
on Instagram.
It's Jewels of the Trade andthat's where I connect with
retailers and wholesalers andcarvers and that's just a good
way to kind of like actuallytalk to me.
If you are interested inlearning more about Jade, I do
recommend my YouTube channel,which is also called Jewels of
the Trade.
And if you're wanting to getlike nitty gritty, down and
(46:22):
dirty with the details, like youwant to really understand Jade,
join down and dirty with thedetails, Like you want to really
understand Jade, join mydiscord Honestly, like the link
is in pretty much all of theYouTube video descriptions join,
learn, watch, contribute, sharephotos of your collection.
Because what we're trying to dowith the jewels of the trade
overall platform is just expandcustomer and seller Jade
knowledge.
We want to eradicate all ofthis misinformation that's
(46:46):
poisoning people in jewelrystores and forcing people to buy
crap jade online for too highof prices.
We want to get rid of all thatand we want this safe oasis
where people can actually findgood information and know that
there's a reliable place to buyjade.
We don't want people to beafraid to buy jade.
We want people to feelconfident and if you're a
(47:07):
retailer who's wanting to sellJade, I can help actually like
train your staff and we can do atrunk show or we can
collaborate in a way that willbenefit you and your customers.
Speaker 1 (47:19):
Very cool.
Thank you so much, jordan.
I really appreciate you comingon.
What a really interesting topic.
I think it's something I'mgoing to have to look into even
more, but I appreciate your time.
Thanks everybody.
Go give her a follow and we'llbe back next week, tuesday, with
another episode.
Cheers everybody, bye.
All right, everybody.
(47:45):
That's the end of the show.
Thanks so much for listening.
My guest this week was JordanWentz, and she's with Jewels of
the Trade, and I highlyrecommend checking out her
YouTube channel and all of herlinks in the show notes below.
It's super interesting.
This episode was brought to youby Punchmark and produced and
hosted by me, michael Burpo.
This episode was edited by PaulSuarez with music by Ross
(48:07):
Cockrum.
Don't forget to rate thepodcast on Spotify and Apple
Podcasts and leave us feedbackon punchmarkcom slash loop.
That's L-O-U-P-E.
Thanks.
We'll be back next week,tuesday, with another episode.
Cheers, bye, thank you.
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