April 22, 2025 • 48 mins
Pearls are one of the oldest, most influential gems the world has ever known with a rich history dating back well over 5,000 years. Matt Harris shares his passion for this unique gemstone and explains how fashion trends surrounding the gem have shifted in the last 100 years, where he predicts they will head in future years, and how jewelers can ensure they are buying quality pearls that will sell.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to In the Loop.
What is up everybody?
My name is Michael Burpo.
Thanks again for listening toIn the Loop this week.
I'm joined by Matt Harris andhe is a pearl expert, and we're
talking all about pearls,whether it's about the
cultivation process and thehistorical significance of
(00:21):
pearls.
We're also talking aboutfashion styles and trends that
have come and gone throughoutthe years, as well as why he
hopes that more men startwearing pearls.
It's a really cool conversation.
You can tell how passionate heis about the topic and it
definitely comes through in themicrophone.
I really hope you enjoy andmaybe you consider wearing
pearls today, enjoy, enjoy.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
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Slash go.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
And now back to the show.
What is up everybody?
My name is Michael Burpo.
I'm joined by Matt Harris.
He is our resident expert onpearls.
How are you doing today, matt?
Hey, I'm great.
Thanks, I'm so excited to get achance to speak with you.
(02:01):
This is kind of continuing myeducation in the jewelry
industry.
Lately I've been trying tobring on more experts to educate
me and through me, the audience, on different parts of the
jewelry industry andspecifically how retailers take
advantage of them, mainlybecause I think a lot of us, a
lot of retailers, are super deepinto diamonds and engagement
(02:24):
and things like that, and I loveto find a way to sort of
diversify that and sort of giveother options and educate
everybody along the way.
So, matt, can you talk to mejust a little bit about pearls
and why you're so excited aboutthem?
Speaker 3 (02:39):
Well, yeah, I can.
They really are the mostinteresting, influential and
important gems the world hasever known, and I'm going to say
that above diamonds andsapphires and rubies and you
name it.
The history is incredible andthey're the oldest gem as far as
records of gems being worn asjewelry.
(03:02):
This dates back to over 3000 BC.
So it's just the history isunreal with pearls, Not to
mention.
I just think it's really coolthat it's the only gem that
comes from a living creature.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
Yeah, that is really cool, and so is this.
Did you come at it from a likea retailer, like jeweler
perspective, or was this more oflike from a gemological kind of
perspective?
Speaker 3 (03:27):
You mean, what kind of what got me interested in
pearls?
Yeah, exactly, neither.
Really, it wasn't at all so itcan't.
How about from a retailconsumer perspective?
So when I got married 29 yearsago, we decided to get pearls
for the bridesmaids for gifts,because we thought pearls were
cool, but I didn't know anythingabout them.
My fiance didn't know anythingabout them, and so me, being the
(03:51):
learning geek that I am, I'mthe type of guy that, like, if
I'm going to buy like a car, Ineed to know everything about
that car first, right, or acomputer, you name it right.
I love to shop, and so Ivolunteered to shop for them and
I, just like any other consumer, uh, was just interested in
knowing what I'm getting.
(04:11):
I wanted a good deal.
I didn't know if I was going toget ripped off.
I want to make sure they werereal or treated.
I knew nothing about pearl, so Istarted cruising around stores
and this is before the internet,you guys.
I mean this is when it was likeprodigy and compuser I don't
know if you know what those are,michael, but no, yeah, yeah,
it's, it's the beginnings of theinternet.
(04:31):
Anyways, for the old peoplelistening, you'll get that.
Um, so I was just literallywent to stores and what I
realized is that the people thatwere selling pearls didn't
really know much about them andthat was really interesting to
me and I just got fascinatedwith them because I figured
there's a lot to learn.
And it just stuck with me foryears and years and years and I
(04:53):
actually didn't get really intothe business for another 20,
well, almost 30 years later.
I just they were a hobby.
So I started as a consumer,just out of interest.
They were a hobby, so I startedas a consumer, just out of
interest, wanting to learn.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
Now sort of set this up for me, because I'm
definitely very much an amateur.
I actually bought a set ofpearls when I lived in the city
and I was at a jewelry show andI was like, oh, maybe I'm going
to be, you know, interested inwearing pearls, mainly because,
for example, harry Styles, veryfamously in 2019 at like a Met
(05:26):
Gala, wore a set of pearls.
And I was like, oh, guys canwear pearls.
And it was like sort of changedthe landscape or it felt like
it did away from being classy.
I feel like pearls have alwaysgotten this thing about like, oh
, they're just super, like youwear them with like a black
dress.
Pearls have always gotten thisthing about like, oh, they're
just super, like you wear themwith like a black dress.
And then it was like, oh, maybethey're kind of along the lines
(05:48):
of like forgive the analogy,but kind of like a Cuban link.
You know where it's like, oh,it could go with anything.
It sort of feels like it'ssettled into like somewhere in
between.
Do you feel where do you thinkthat pearls are sitting in the
modern kind of eye and fashiontoday?
Speaker 3 (06:09):
Wow, that is such a good question and if you're a
retailer listening to this, thisis really important Because,
yes, yes, exactly what you.
The way that you envisionpearls at the beginning of that,
historically, historically, isthe way that a lot of people do
still, and that is that pearlsare meant for either like the
(06:30):
power woman, or the wedding, orthe fancy, elegant sort of event
.
So think about pearls right now.
If you guys were to close youreyes, think about pearl, what do
you picture?
Most people that are listeningto this well, we got a lot of
jewelers listening to this, soit may be a little bit different
.
Pearls right now.
If you guys were to close youreyes, think about pearl.
What do you picture?
Most people that are listeningto this well, we got a lot of
jewelers listening this, so,maybe a little bit different.
But most people in generalthink of audrey hepburn or the
(06:53):
queen, or barbara bush, you know, or something like that.
Uh, and that's where pearlshave been for the last hundred
years, and the reason they'vebeen that way is because, well,
you know movies like AudreyHepburn, you know Breakfast at
Tiffany's, et cetera, theybecome kind of the power,
elegant, sort of.
You know, look, and when youthink of pearls, you also
(07:17):
probably thought of round andwhite.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Round and white, which is not the case, I've
learned.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
My mom went to it's not the case, very, very, very
few pearls around maybe about 5%if you talk to, like, the
saltwater farmers and there'smany, many colors of pearls, not
just white.
At first I thought we're goingto do a video, so I brought some
like really cool colors.
So on my desk you guys imagineme holding up all these cool
colors and shapes of differentpearls.
(07:45):
But see, that's the perception.
What happened with harry stylesis two things for you, uh,
number one uh, he tends to wearround white pearls when he wears
them, but he wears pearls likeevery day.
But he's also a man wearingpearls, right.
And so now it's finallyshifting.
People are starting to realize,through a little bit of pearl
(08:06):
education and through seeing,you know, the celebrities, et
cetera, that pearls don't haveto be stuffy, they don't have to
be perfectly elegant, theyabsolutely can be.
They don't even have to bearound, they don't have to be
white and they don't have to beworn by women to be worn by
(08:28):
women.
So, thankfully, a store, now ajeweler and even like just a
fashion boutique, can have pearljewelry that can be everyday
wear for anybody casual pearlsand jeans Fantastic.
Yeah, I wear pearls every day.
Right now I'm wearing a singlepearl Tahitian necklace and then
I've got a pearl bracelet onwith a bunch of Tahitians on a
stretchy cord.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
So when you use the word Tahitian, is that like an
area that they're being sourcedfrom, or is that describing the
type of pearl?
Speaker 3 (08:53):
That is another great question.
It's kind of the term peopleuse for pearls that come from
French Polynesia, I see, andTahiti is in French Polynesia
but French Polynesia the pearl,and Tahiti is in French
Polynesia but the FrenchPolynesia the pearl growing
region is extremely vast, withpearl farms scattered all over
the place, not really even inTahiti or the island of Tahiti,
(09:15):
but in islands, you know, in thearea, but people tend to just
call them Tahitian pearls andwhen you think of Tahitian pearl
, think of the black pearlsthat's another nickname people
have for Tahitians black pearls,although they can be light gray
you know, all sorts of grays,up to deep black, and they can
have overtones that are reallybeautiful purples and greens,
(09:36):
and they're gorgeous.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
And that's what's so cool, is that there is so much
personality to them.
It's in a similar vein as whenyou tell people that, uh, that
diamonds can be different colorsother than you know flawless
white, or you explain to themthat sapphires can be other
colors other than blue.
It just kind of seems like itblows their mind.
Sometimes my mama came backfrom Vietnam and she had a, had
(10:00):
a black or got a black pearlthere and I was like wow, I had
never seen one that was so juststriking and different feeling
than what I've been previouslytrained to see.
Can you talk to me about whatthe factors are that could
increase the value of a pearlversus what you were talking
about with the everyday wear,more standard, kind of run of
(10:21):
the mill.
The everyday wear, you know,more standard, kind of run of
the mill.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
Yeah, and that's the other interesting thing about
pearls nowadays too.
Over the last oh you know it'sbeen a few decades, but the
Chinese have been makingfreshwater pearls, where they
have these mollusks that arereally huge and you can get 20,
30, 40 pearls at one time andyou can grow them quick.
(10:45):
And so, as a result, there'sbeen a massive amount of
freshwater pearls that have comeonto the market and pearls now
can be really affordable.
I have a website, matt HarrisDesigns, and we sell pearls gosh
as low as $30 up to $30,000 ormore.
But there's a whole bunch ofnecklaces that are beautiful,
(11:05):
that are freshwater, that are,you know, $100, $200.
So they're very, veryapproachable.
The value factors I always sayit's like anything, and that is
that the prettier it is, themore expensive it's going to be
right.
So think of that with a car or,you know, a girlfriend or
(11:25):
whatever it happens to be, youknow, and the great thing is
that beauty is in the eye of thebeholder, right?
Same thing with cars andgirlfriends, but in general,
humans tend to like prettythings, and pretty pearls are.
Think of this round.
We tend to like things that areperfectly round, shiny, right.
(11:47):
So those are pearls with likereally nice, nacre, quality,
thick, nacre, that you know it'skind of metallic, like that you
can actually see yourself inlike a mirror, colorful we like
pearls that, maybe even thewhite pearls that have like what
they call orient.
When you move them around itkind of looks like when you blow
a bubble and you see the, thegreens and the pinks kind of
skimming around the the topsurface of the pearl.
(12:08):
So, uh, pearls if it's, and big, we like things big.
So if pearls are big, perfectlyround, very lustrous, thick,
nacre, great nacre, quality,blemish, free and a beautiful
color, you just found yourself avery expensive pearl.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
That's a really interesting kind of perspective
on it.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
Does that make sense?
Speaker 1 (12:28):
It's similar in that way as diamonds, because
theoretically I've heard ofpeople going to like these
diamond mines and like they'reable to find, albeit very low
quality, diamonds that are apoint of a carat, but in the end
it is a diamond, but like whatmakes like a really expensive
one.
It's like, oh man, you couldhave one.
(12:48):
That's, you know, not even acarrot and it's worth, you know,
more than my house, that kindof thing yeah, and think of
pearls like uh, clarity, right,so a uh i1 pearl is going to be
a pearl.
Speaker 3 (12:59):
that's got a fair amount of you know pits on it.
Uh, that's visible to the eyeand when you look at it you can
kind of see it's got these fairamount of you know pits on it
that's visible to the eye andwhen you look at it you can kind
of see it's got these blemishesand pits, et cetera.
You know where it's, like youknow VVS is going to be.
You're going to sit in thereand like move it around in your
hand and look at it and you justcan't really see anything wrong
with this thing.
You know, maybe you get itunder magnification and you'll
(13:21):
find a little blemishing.
So that's an interestinganalogy that I just came up with
now that you mentioned it.
But it kind of makes sense foryou, for you diamond guys, think
of it that way, yeah.
And do people buy the I1diamonds?
Yeah, and do people buyblemished pearls?
Absolutely.
And you know, I sold a SouthSea golden yellow pearl necklace
recently Sea Golden Yellow EarlNecklace recently and it was, I
(13:45):
think, like $7,000.
Now if you looked at it from adistance, like if you and I were
standing, you know, three, four, five feet away from each other
, you'd look at me wearing theseand you say, well, there's
really beautiful, big roundSouth Sea golden pearls.
But if you got close you'dnotice that they all had a
moderate amount of blemishes tothem.
And now that strand would havebeen $30,000 if it would have
(14:09):
been clean is what they call it.
But with little blemishes youcan save money.
So, similar to diamonds, whenpeople are buying you got to
think price point, budget, youknow.
And what's important to peopleIs it the size.
Some girls or guys people likea big diamond, some people want
the clarity, some people wantthe color.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
Yeah, and so I guess that's a really good point.
So, for retailers that arelistening, I'm always interested
in kind of you know, valueshopping and what is it that you
can kind of skimp on if to getmore than what might be in your
budget initially.
And, for example, my friendstalk to me about jewelry because
they know I work in jewelry andthey're always asking about
(14:49):
diamonds and they're alwayssaying, oh, what can you do to
get like a better diamond thanwhat you can afford?
Well, I always tell them youcould either get a lab grown
diamond or you could get thingsthat are more flawed or have
inclusions in them.
If they kind of fall in acertain range, then they're only
ever going to be seen if youwere to put them under a loop.
(15:11):
Is that true for pearls?
And what is it that you couldkind of corner cut a little bit
to get a better set of pearlsthan maybe your budget would
allow for?
For?
Speaker 3 (15:24):
well, I'm kind of lucky personally, because you
know how we talked aboutbeautiful things being expensive
.
I I literally have sweatshirtsand shirts that say this on the
back I had a mate and it's biglettering.
It says I like them big andbaroque.
So baroque pearls aren't.
Is it so?
Broke meaning not, um, you know, round and symmetrical.
(15:44):
Uh.
So Baroque is something that Ilove and I personally would
rather wear a Baroque-shapednecklace than a round pearl
necklace, and it costs a lotless money, so shape could be
one of those things.
Sometimes pearls, especially ifthey're strung in a strand, the
only way you can really tell ifthey're round is you put them on
(16:05):
like a flat surface and rollthem, and if they kind of wibble
, wobble a little bit, thenthey're not round, they're near
round, and quite often pearlswill look round.
Although they're not Now nearround, pearls are going to be
less expensive than the sametype being round.
So that's another way that Ithink that you can kind of save
a little money as well is to buysome that aren't perfectly
round, because it's so hard tonotice sometimes by looking at
(16:27):
them or any of those.
It just depends what you'reinto.
I really don't mind a fewblemishes.
You know, I personally don'tprefer to look at like pitted
pearls.
I would rather skimp on theshape or the size or you know
the, but it just depends.
Yeah, everybody's got their owntaste.
But there are ways that you cankind of save a little bit of
money and there are.
(16:47):
The purest as there are arewith diamonds, that or any
gemstone that.
Just they've got to have theunheated salon sapphire, you
know.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
Uh, with perfect cut proportions and I've always been
of the opinion that who whocares about like some of those,
uh, you know, very shopspecialty like you know, um,
what makes it extra, extraexpensive?
I've never been really intothat.
Where it's like, oh, it'sunheated, I'm like, well, if
it's beautiful when it's heated,I'd rather, you know, I guess
(17:20):
it doesn't really matter to me,as long as it still looks
beautiful on their hand or, youknow, on their body, and I guess
that's one of those things it'slike.
You know, if there are some ofthese like ways that they can
make things look maybe morebeautiful and make it maybe more
attainable or affordable forcertain people, I'm very much of
(17:47):
the opinion that I think it'sbetter for people to be able to
have those things if theywouldn't normally.
Is that something that you haveto educate jewelers on, on ways
to kind of talk about pearls ina way that makes it more
attainable or understandable fora shopper?
Speaker 3 (18:00):
Yes, I ran a retail jewelry store for about four
years.
I left there about two twoyears ago and to focus solely on
this now, on pearls and but mebeing a pearl lover, we carried
a lot of pearls and I would tellpeople on the jewelry groups
(18:21):
online etc.
Uh, you get in theconversations with jewelers all
the time, the trade shows andwhatnot and your cocktail hour
and you talk pearls and they'relike, oh, we never sell pearls,
like nobody's buying pearls,it's so hard to sell pearls.
And I tell them I literallywould sell pearls every day, and
multiples some days.
And people say, how is thateven possible?
And it's really your educationand your mindset as a jeweler
(18:44):
and your selection.
So I'm going to generalize.
I'm sure this isn't the casewith everybody, of course, but
most stores, when it comes totheir pearl selection jewelry
stores, they're going to havethat case and it's going to be
some perfectly round smallokoyas like a necklace or two.
It's going to be some roundstuds, studs.
(19:06):
It may be, if you're lucky,like a Tahitian round, you know,
a pendant or a strand andthat's kind of it.
There really isn't much else.
And so if you want people to,this goes to your point that
you're just talking about.
It's something for everybodyand every price point and not
necessarily going for theperfect.
(19:27):
You know stone that if it'sheated, whatever.
Same with pearls.
If I can, let somebody have theexperience of buying a hundred
dollar pearl freshwater necklaceand they're going out there and
they're wearing it all the timeand somebody sees them and they
like, wow, that's cool.
Oh yeah, it's freshwater pearls, you can go get them for $100.
(19:49):
It goes, it perpetuates, andthen people start being
comfortable with wearing pearlfashion.
They start wearing it in casualenvironments and then the whole
world of pearl fashion kind ofcomes up along with this.
Because a lot of those peopleare now more familiar with
pearls, more comfortable buyingpearls and guess what?
They're going to start buyinghigher-end pearls.
(20:09):
With pearls we're comfortablebuying pearls and guess what?
They're going to start buyinghigher end pearls.
So in my store we would have onthe countertop not even
underneath this display of pearlearrings and then we maybe have
maybe 10 or 15 differentdesigns that range from $35 to
$65 freshwater pearls.
We'd sell those all day longand you know what?
A lot of those people will comeback later and buy a pearl
(20:30):
necklace or eventually, a SouthSea strand for $8,000 or
whatever.
So I think getting them in thehands of many people as possible
is great, and you don't have tosell just high end when it
comes to pearls.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Ah, I really love that approach.
In my opinion, I am very muchanti-gatekeeping when it comes
to especially the jewelry, butjust fashion in general.
I am very much anti-gatekeepingwhen it comes to, uh, to
especially the jewelry, but justfashion in general.
I feel like you.
I I hate rules when it comes to, uh, just any type of art, but
especially when it comes tofashion, I, I just am like any
example that you show me.
I will do my best to find you acounter example on why you
(21:05):
could do that, you know.
Speaker 3 (21:07):
I agree with you, except that I saw on Facebook
yesterday or Instagram, a videoof a fashion show, and it's
where they dress people up inmusical instruments.
So they had this one ladystanding like in a drum and
another one was like her headwas poking out the top of a
cello, and I can't go that far.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
You know what, if that's where we draw the line, I
think we're going to do it.
Speaker 3 (21:30):
That's where I draw the line.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
I think we're gonna draw the line yeah, all right,
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Have a great day and enjoy therest of the episode.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
And we're back, matt, you were talking about that.
The more common kind ofversions are, you know, pearl
strand necklace and maybebracelets that for all intents
and purposes are just a smallernecklace, you guess you could
say, or maybe a solitairependant and maybe some studs.
Are there any other kind oftrends that you're kind of
(23:01):
starting to pay attention tothat might be not falling into
those main categories that youthink are exciting and maybe
should be watched out for?
Speaker 3 (23:09):
Yes, and I'm glad you mentioned because I didn't talk
about it too much but a store.
Right now, I think what's hotin the pearl world pearl strands
are always going to be thereand everybody should have a
pearl strand I think men too.
We'll talk about that in aminute.
But as far as pearl jewelry,it's a lot easier to get people
into pearl jewelry, I think ifyou are carrying kind of modern
(23:31):
designs where you've got metaluh and something small, so like
a, a gold chain with a singlepearl pendant or drilled right
through the pearl with somegrommets and and something like
that.
Or we have a chain that has aone pearl and then another one
kind of drops down and it'sadjustable so you can kind of
(23:53):
make it go up and down yourchest.
Oh cool, so little things likethat that are just have like a
dainty pearl, a pendant or yeah,studs are always going to be
popular, but I think mixingmetals with gold and making them
more fashionable.
We have station necklaces thatare very popular, where we just
have silver stationed withinexpensive pearls and we make
(24:14):
them like 36 inches long so youcan double them up if you want.
Those are a lot of fun too,because you're seeing the girls
go out and wear those you knowlike with the jeans.
So I'd say that's a trend thatI would stick to if I was a
store and wanted to increasepearl sales and, of course,
always have a few strands.
(24:34):
But I'm most excited about menin pearls and I am the biggest
proponent of that, and if you goto my Instagram channel or my
YouTube, we're talking about itall day long.
So you mentioned Harry Styles.
You can always count on him.
I did a story the other day onaj mclean from the backstreet
boys.
He's always wearing pearls.
(24:54):
Now too.
Uh, asap rocky, um, the davebautista.
You know the really big dudefrom guardians of the galaxy.
yeah, formerly wrestler yeahyeah, he wore like a triple
strand Mikimoto Akoya necklaceto Toronto Film Festival
(25:15):
recently, for example.
It goes on and on.
I can tell you a lot of guyswearing pearls.
Rod Stewart, every performance.
Now he's wearing pearls.
He's I suppose I haven't seenhim, but all my friends are
telling me he's rocking it atlike 77 or something Very cool.
It goes on and on and on.
Men in pearls and boy I tell youI'm in some of these jeweler
(25:35):
groups and some of you that aregoing to listen to it I'll bet
you're in some of the groupsthat I'm in online and all you
got to do is mention men inpearls and there's 500 comments
and people are talking about howhorrible it is and dumb and
this and that and men shouldnever wear pearls.
The other side of it is likeabsolutely, pearls are hot on
guys and I mean I literally wearone every day and I have for
(25:56):
years.
But something about that thateverybody should know.
And if you're a retailer andthis comes up, it'll be kind of
fun to tell your customers aboutthis that pearls have only
become almost strictly feminineover the last hundred years.
So, and it was because theystarted culturing pearls, making
pearls, around 1900.
And you guys all know Mikimoto.
(26:17):
He's kind of considered thegrandfather of culture pearls,
although some people technicallydid it before him.
He really figured out a way tomake a lot of culture pearls and
so you had these small whiteround pearls coming out in the
1910s, 20s and 30s and then youhad the you know, the Audrey
Hepburns.
Like I was saying, coco Chanelstarted making the faux pearl
(26:39):
necklaces and that became a bigthing in the right after
Prohibition.
So they quickly becamefeminized.
Before 1900, yes, a lot offemales would wear pearls.
You look at any art museum andgo to the Queens they're wearing
pearls.
But guess what?
Go check out the pictures ofthe kings they're wearing pearls
too.
Type in Google Henry VIII lateron and find a picture of him
(27:02):
not wearing pearls.
Right, king Charles, I wore apearl in his ear that he got for
a present when he was 15 yearsold.
Literally wore it every dayuntil his beheading King Charles
II.
King Charles III probablydoesn't know it, but in the
Imperial Crown actually has fourpearls that date back to the
1400s, back at Pope Clement'stime, and men and pearls were a
(27:26):
thing.
Julius Caesar used to have aparty trick where he would like
hold a pearl and tell you howmuch it weighed.
That was kind of his braggingthing.
I'll give you one more exampleHis greatest general, general
Pompey.
He was known as Pompey theGreat or the Teenage Butcher,
because this guy was so ruthlessthat when he would conquer
(27:47):
different peoples, he would likeliterally have them cut up.
When he would conquer differentpeoples, he would like
literally have them cut up.
So he single-handedly turnedRome into an empire by
conquering seven what theycalled continents at the time.
They were kind of like regions.
Anyways, when he conquered thelast one, he, to celebrate, had
himself made like a replica ofhimself out of pearls and he
(28:09):
paraded it around town for twodays and everybody was talking
about what a massive display ofwealth this guy and coolness.
You know that's portrayed.
He was like badass, right, andthis was like one of the most
ruthless men in the world.
Oh, one more.
If you guys have heard of theMaharaja, they were in India.
(28:34):
So the country was split upunder English rule with these
regions and you have kind oflike a king of each region.
They're called Maharaja.
But if you type up Maharajayou're going to see that they
all wore pearls too and just alot of them.
So men and pearls is a thing italways has been.
It just kind of got off track alittle bit.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
It's a really interesting series of examples,
mainly because they are just alittle bit more historical as
opposed to modern.
And you're the ones that you hadstarted off this episode
talking about with Audrey, withAudrey Hepburn, and you know the
queen and the.
All the examples of modern dayare these, you know, very
(29:17):
striking or famous women.
I wonder if, to me, harryStyles at least for me and my
friends and like the people Ispeak with friends and like the
people that I speak with he'sthe most recent like
recognizable ambassador for forpearls on men, and I wonder if
that will continue, whether youknow how hard would it be to
(29:40):
kind of make that be yourcalling card?
I guess it would, you know.
It remains to be seen if, ifHarry Styles keeps on doing that
and more people follow suit.
But I would love it if, yeah,if more examples, not just
people that are have their feetfirmly planted in fashion the
way that I believe Harry Styleskind of does, but if more people
(30:03):
from various levels ofcelebrity, like Dave Bautista
does and A$AP Rocky those areall super cool examples of like
people that aren't necessarilyfashion first, but more examples
of using jewelry to kind ofamplify your image and message a
little bit more.
Speaker 3 (30:22):
Yeah, and you know it makes me think of here's an
example of just a normal guy andpearls.
I was going to sell my pickuptruck recently and my assistant
whose name is Pearl, weirdlyenough has a friend that does
mobile detailing.
So she mentioned this to himbecause I needed to clean it up
(30:43):
right before I put it out forsale and he suggested he says,
well, what if I trade Matt adetail job for a strand of
pearls?
So, sure enough, this is like a$200-something detail job and I
custom made him a white strandof pearls and then we have these
literally frost pearls, sothey're pearl-shaped as crosses
(31:05):
and I put one in the middle withsome like a few gold balls
around it beads.
It was so awesome, this thing,uh, and he and this guy's just a
tough dude and and he's outthere rocking this thing, uh,
and it's awesome that's a reallycool example.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
So, yeah, what's what's interesting is you were
talking about different types ofpearls and then we were talking
about ways you can get a.
You know around that, forexample.
But you also mentioned culturedversus uncultured pearls.
My grandma, like she alwayswore uncultured.
I think it was like a triplestrand of uncultured pearls, you
(31:41):
know, like the ones they kindof always.
I always thought that theylooked like rice or like beans
and they were kind of likestrangely shaped, and my mom
always told me it was becausethey were more affordable.
Is that?
Do you think that that has gonethrough like it's the waves of
vogue and might be due to comeback?
Or is that something?
(32:02):
It's been passed up because youknow, farming, culture, pearls
is so much more, you know,attainable and easy to do these
days.
Speaker 3 (32:10):
Well, I'm trying to answer that without getting into
a two-hour segment on it.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
Let it rip.
Come on, matt, we got time.
Speaker 3 (32:18):
No, I don't want to scare people away.
So we can dig into this stuffon different episodes and
YouTube and stuff, but ingeneral, first let me say this
that, because everybody shouldknow this and there's confusion,
because when people will comeinto my store and I'm sure they
come into your store too, ifyou're listening to this as a
retailer and they have the termsconfused, so they'll say are
(32:43):
those pearls real or do you havenatural pearls?
And when they say do you havenatural pearls, what they are
meaning is they're not fake,they're not plastic, they're not
glass, right?
So here's a quick 101 on theterminology.
So in the pearl world there iscultured pearls and there's
natural pearls, and so that's it.
(33:03):
Cultured, natural, naturalpearls are pearls that think of,
like the old romantic, you knowdiving deep, you know, yeah,
you know picking up some randomoyster and bringing it up and
you opening it up and it's apearl.
It's a pearl, and that's theway all pearls were before 1900.
It's just all those kings andqueens.
(33:24):
They'd have to go throughthousands, sometimes 10,000
oysters just to get one pearl.
So they're very rare and that'sthe way they've always been
through history, until Mikimotoand some other guys came around.
They figured out how to culturethem.
So a culture pearl is a pearlthat's made with, with humans,
help.
A natural pearl is a pearlthat's made just as a result of
(33:47):
nature, so human intervention orhelp and complete natural.
So um, culture pearls then area human inserting a bead or a
piece of what they call mantletissue, or inserting the
irritant into the mollusk andthat, that irritant I say that
(34:08):
because muscle mollusks don'treally have a central nervous
system like do they?
We do so they don't feel pain,but anyways, this irritant, the
mother of pearl, the nacre, isbuilt around this and creates a
pearl.
So in nature it usually happensas a result of a parasite that
kind of moves its way into the,into the mollusk, and then
(34:28):
plants itself and that parasitebecomes like the irritant and
again with humans, we'reliterally inserting something in
there.
So those are your two termsnatural pearl, cultured pearl.
Now, the pearls that you'retalking about, I don't see those
small kind of Rice Krispiepearls coming back.
There's a few different things.
(34:49):
One of them is there is a placecalled lake biwa, japan.
That would make a lot of thoseuh back and they got really
heavily polluted.
I believe must have been likethe 60s or 70s, if I recall.
I don't recall because I wastoo young, but you know, recall
reading about uh, and they madea lot of those kind of rice
crispy pearls.
And then the chinese startedcoming up with with cultured
(35:14):
freshwater pools.
Now they weren't putting beadslike they do in the round pearls
into the mollusk, they wereputting a little piece of tissue
that would kind of jump startthe nacre creation process.
And these, back at thebeginning, when they started
these decades ago, they werealways tiny and kind of crappy
and not really shiny or lustrous.
(35:34):
And they produce a whole bunchof them.
They'd have individual farmerseven like converting their rice
patties into a pond in theirbackyard and creating these.
And so the Chinese freshwaterpearls were very small, kind of
weird shaped, not very lustrous,and ultra cheap.
Now even the Chinese havechanged, where now, generally
(35:55):
speaking, they're going toconcentrate more on higher
quality, less better quality.
They're even nucleating themwith beads and you're getting
big pearls and round pearls andpearls that are actually of much
higher quality than they usedto be.
Speaker 1 (36:09):
So I've got drawers full of like those old pearls,
uh, but no, you don't really seethem on the market anymore yeah
, it's always really interestingbecause so you say like, oh,
they were originally found, orlike pearls were originally, you
got to dive in, you got to gothrough all of these, uh, these
mollusks and just to get one,and that inherently makes the
(36:31):
rarity, makes the value.
Uh, there there's a like,almost like a correlation
between them.
However, they figured out a wayto kind of I don't want to say
man make, but sort of um, these,these pearls and man, in saying
that out loud, it sure sounds alot like lab-grown diamonds, it
(36:54):
sure does.
But for some reason peopledon't seem to draw that line in
that, you know, if I was to goand find a pearl just by
shucking a ton of oysters andthen I find one, and it would be
like, wow, that's really cool.
But it's not like it's more rare, uh, or valuable, just because
(37:16):
I pulled it out of an oystermyself by happenstance.
Um, it's kind of almost likealong the lines of like, I don't
know, like, uh, having havinggone and found my, found my own,
uh, gemstone, you know, out innature myself, and then, like,
went and cut it myself.
It's such a.
(37:36):
It's interesting that sometimesthose rules apply to other
gemstones as opposed to, youknow, with pearls.
I find that very confusing.
I find that very confusing.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
I'd have to kind of have to dive into that and kind
of wrestle with that in my brainto make that, you know,
completely rationalized I guess.
Yeah, well, there's somedifferences there.
You can go to Sunstone Butte,you know, mine Sunstone's in
Oregon or whatnot, or there'sprobably a place where you can
go get Peridot or something, Idon't know.
There's a mine, where you can goand you, you, you know, take
your chisel or whatever and getstuff and bring it to a cutter
uh, there's really no place togo to die for oysters, uh, and
(38:20):
get pearls, except for bahrain.
In bahrain, uh they're, they'refascinating, but they actually
have a whole revitalizedindustry of natural pearl
farming.
And I say natural pearlsbecause they really they kind of
farm, but they really arenatural pearls and they are very
great stewards of the, theenvironment, the water, the.
(38:44):
You know how many oysters arepulled and you can get a permit
to pull up, I think, a maximumof 50 oysters, if I, if, if I
remember right, and I want to goout there and do that one of
these days.
That sounds cool, but therereally is no other.
You can't go anywhere andnobody is going and picking up
an oyster and getting a pearlthese days.
Speaker 1 (39:04):
Yeah, it's really, uh , it's just interesting.
I I know I am probably comparingthings um that't have a
correlation, but for some reasonthe fact that they are it's
still like identical is very,very cool and something that is
fascinating, especially whenthere are these different values
attributed to the differentcolors and the quality and
(39:27):
things like that, just likethere is with gemstones the
different colors and the qualityand things like that, just like
there is with gemstones.
Now I guess I kind of want topivot that into talking about
the, you know, for retailers.
So right now it does feel likethe focus is away from pearls
and you're making some greatpoints about why retailers
should be getting into this.
If a retailer might beinterested in expanding their
(39:49):
display or trying to get part of, you know, expanding their line
of pearl offerings, what wouldbe the best way that they should
go about doing that?
Is it a matter of findingconnections or making their own
pearl jewelry, or are therebrands that you would highly
recommend people at leastinvestigate to see if they might
(40:10):
be interested in carrying theirdesigns?
Speaker 3 (40:12):
Yeah, I mean, I don't recommend jewelers get into
making pearl jewelry becausethat's like the last thing you
have time to do is to try tocreate pearl jewelry.
By the way, and stringing is anart.
I'll tell you that.
That's what I've heard.
I've heard it's a real art.
I'm training two stringers andwe just had our stringing night
last night and one girl kind ofgraduated and she's so excited,
but it took her a lot of time toget to the point of getting the
(40:34):
quality where I like it to be.
And, believe it or not, there'sdifferent stringing techniques,
there's different quality.
There's different qualitymaterials.
So, yeah, buy collections.
You can buy my collectionmattharrisdesignscom and we sell
retail online, but I alsowholesale designs with packaging
and presentation and the storyto everybody.
(40:56):
And then I also have to say andI'm a member, a board member,
of the Culture Pearl Associationof America and we have a great,
great group of wholesalers thatyou can come to and all of
those people are the real dealand you can trust everything
there is about all of these guysand we have a list online.
(41:19):
So if you go to the CPA orCultural Parole Association
website, I think we actuallyjust changing the URL, but
Google it, you can find a listof vendors, and these people
have been around for a long time.
We have some that are thirdgeneration pearl vendors that
are great and they're at all thetrade shows JCK and Nissan, et
(41:40):
cetera.
So that'd be a great place tostart is the Culture Pearl
Association.
Speaker 1 (41:46):
Awesome and, matt, I'll make sure I have that
information in the show notes.
That's definitely I'd love for,uh love to check it, check it
all out and make sure that, um,our retailers are looking into
it as well.
But, matt, maybe just to kindof put us on uh, end us on a on
a some interesting notes, canyou give me maybe one or two
interesting facts that you havein that catalog of yours, uh,
about pearls, um, to that kindof really summarize how special
(42:11):
and unique they are as agemstone?
Speaker 3 (42:13):
Well, kind of like something that just would be
interesting to tell a customerthat they don't know.
Yeah, sure, yeah.
Well, you know we opened theshow with this.
Pearls are the only gem thatcomes from a living creature,
and that's pretty cool.
By the way, did you know?
Even pearls are a gem.
A lot of people don't know thatthey're technically a gem.
The GIA designated them as suchI think it was gosh 1968 or
(42:39):
something like that.
So that's interesting in itselfand they're one of the oldest
things gems that has been wornas jewelry, and we talked about
the history and whatnot.
But if I had had a one-liner,when people come into my store,
I remember I'd tell them thatthey're the only gem that comes
(42:59):
from a living creature.
It starts the conversation.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
That's a really interesting.
It's such a fascinatingeverything about them.
They feel almost like they'realive.
I sometimes feel like it's likethey have a little bit more to
them than, um, you know some ofthe other ones, and not that I
don't have a lot of appreciationfor, for other things, but the
fact that they literally arelike, seemingly birthed by, by
(43:23):
nature is just such a specialand kind of unique quality about
them that, uh, definitely agood hook.
Speaker 3 (43:28):
I appreciate that and you know, as a farmer, you can
do whatever you want, but youjust don't know how the pearl's
going to come out.
Yeah, you, we do.
We simply don't have thecontrol now to romanticize them.
Uh guys, don't get me wrong, Ilove diamonds and sapphires and
all this stuff.
I've got a lot of them, uh.
But you know, you get a rockout of the ground and you cut it
(43:51):
up into a.
You know a way that,technically, that everybody
knows now is excellent, cut this, you know, has a play of light
that's perfect and cool.
But a pearl farmer, right,you've got these little guys in
the water for a few years andyou do what you can.
You try to like make sure thatthe water for a few years and
you do what you can.
You try to like make sure thatthe water is in, you know, good
(44:12):
shape.
Um, you try to.
You have to take them out andclean them.
Uh, you, you still don't knoweven if the bead is going to
take.
Um, I've opened up oysters infrench polynesia and taken five,
six, seven of them before Ieven got a pearl, and these all
had a bead put in them.
So you don't even know ifthey're going to have a pearl,
and if you do, I've opened up 50oysters without getting a
(44:36):
perfectly round pearl, so youjust don't know what's going to
come out, and there's somethingreally cool about that that you
know.
No matter what we do as humans,nature plays a huge part in
pearls, and I just think wearingthem.
I think of that when I wearthem, and every one is really,
really unique.
So when you get that singlepearl, you're the only one that
has it.
You could say that everydiamond is unique too.
(44:58):
You know there's some that areclose to each other, but there's
something about pearls and thatuniqueness that I love as well.
Speaker 1 (45:05):
Matt, I really appreciate your time.
What a really cool conversation.
I definitely learned your time.
What a really cool conversation.
I definitely learned a lot.
I was going to say what?
Speaker 3 (45:11):
did you learn about Pearl?
What sticks out in your mindabout Pearls that you learned
today?
Speaker 1 (45:15):
Give me like one or two things, I think what stands
out to me is first of all thatthey are historically worn, I
guess.
For me, the image that I thinkof is, yeah, a perfect white
strand and typically worn by afamous, rich woman, and the fact
(45:36):
that that's not always been thecase and that it's only in
recent years that that has beenthe main figure is kind of an
interesting one to me,especially worn by kings.
But the other one is the factthat the range of colors is so
kind of pronounced and can be,you know, I guess, is not
(45:57):
something that can be majorlycontrolled.
I think that's kind of exciting.
Nowadays, you're right,especially with lab grown
diamonds, I feel like they canpretty much pick exactly what it
is that they want.
But the fact that there isstill some randomness and some
kind of seemingly luck is justlike a really endearing quality
to me.
Speaker 3 (46:18):
You said it better than I did.
That's great.
I got one more thing to say.
It's a teaser maybe.
Sure, the girl in the pearlearring the movie Vermeer
Vermeer.
I'm'm gonna tell you right nowthat's not a pearl no way,
really, yeah and so I'm doing ayoutube about this.
Uh, we're gonna film it sometimein the next few days and uh, so
(46:41):
all the things that we talkedabout kind of will lead to you
understanding what I'm talkingabout, uh, when you see that.
But it just wouldn't make sensebecause that pearl and there's
a lot of technical reasons why Idon't think that's a pearl in
terms of the painting itself andeverything but culturally a
pearl.
If it was a pearl that size, Ithink it's just a shiny piece of
(47:03):
tin or something.
But a pearl that beautiful,that size, would have absolutely
been found its way to whateverqueen in Europe at that time.
There's no way in the worldthat would be owned by.
It wasn't really even a personthat he painted anyways, but
even Vermeer or anybody like itor anybody like the subject.
(47:25):
It would be just so over thetop because it would be one of
the most valuable things in isto have a pearl like that based
off the sheer size of it or theshot size and size and shape.
And then you could say, well,I'll save it for the video.
If you guys want to go, look atyoutube.
Speaker 1 (47:40):
Yeah and matt, I'll have every uh, all your links in
the show notes below.
Everybody, go check them out,uh, if you want to learn more
about, if you're interested incarrying more designs.
He also has his own line ofpearl jewelry and I really
appreciate your time.
Thank you so much, matt, forjoining me and everybody.
We'll be back next week,tuesday, with another episode.
(48:01):
Cheers, everybody, bye.
Cheers, all right, everybody.
That's the end of the show.
Thanks so much for listening.
My guest this week was MattHarris and he's a Pearl expert.
Definitely go check out hisinformation in the show notes
below.
This episode was brought to youby Punchmark and produced and
(48:24):
hosted by me, michael Burpo.
This episode was edited by PaulSuarez with music by Ross
Cockrum.
Don't forget to rate thepodcast on Spotify and Apple
Podcasts and leave us feedbackon punchmarkcom slash loop.
That's L-O-U-P-E.
We'll be back next week,tuesday, with another episode.
Thanks, bye, thank you.
Welcome to In the Loop.
What is up everybody?
My name is Michael Burpo.
Thanks again for listening toIn the Loop this week.
I'm joined by Matt Harris andhe is a pearl expert, and we're
talking all about pearls,whether it's about the
cultivation process and thehistorical significance of
(00:21):
pearls.
We're also talking aboutfashion styles and trends that
have come and gone throughoutthe years, as well as why he
hopes that more men startwearing pearls.
It's a really cool conversation.
You can tell how passionate heis about the topic and it
definitely comes through in themicrophone.
I really hope you enjoy andmaybe you consider wearing
pearls today, enjoy, enjoy.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
This episode is brought to you by Punchmark, the
jewelry industry's favoritewebsite platform and digital
growth agency.
Our mission reaches way beyondtechnology.
With decades of experience andlong-lasting industry
relationships, punchmark enablesjewelry businesses to flourish
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We consider our clients ourfriends, as many of them have
(01:07):
been friends way before becomingclients.
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Schedule a guided demo today atpunchmarkcom.
Slash go.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
And now back to the show.
What is up everybody?
My name is Michael Burpo.
I'm joined by Matt Harris.
He is our resident expert onpearls.
How are you doing today, matt?
Hey, I'm great.
Thanks, I'm so excited to get achance to speak with you.
(02:01):
This is kind of continuing myeducation in the jewelry
industry.
Lately I've been trying tobring on more experts to educate
me and through me, the audience, on different parts of the
jewelry industry andspecifically how retailers take
advantage of them, mainlybecause I think a lot of us, a
lot of retailers, are super deepinto diamonds and engagement
(02:24):
and things like that, and I loveto find a way to sort of
diversify that and sort of giveother options and educate
everybody along the way.
So, matt, can you talk to mejust a little bit about pearls
and why you're so excited aboutthem?
Speaker 3 (02:39):
Well, yeah, I can.
They really are the mostinteresting, influential and
important gems the world hasever known, and I'm going to say
that above diamonds andsapphires and rubies and you
name it.
The history is incredible andthey're the oldest gem as far as
records of gems being worn asjewelry.
(03:02):
This dates back to over 3000 BC.
So it's just the history isunreal with pearls, Not to
mention.
I just think it's really coolthat it's the only gem that
comes from a living creature.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
Yeah, that is really cool, and so is this.
Did you come at it from a likea retailer, like jeweler
perspective, or was this more oflike from a gemological kind of
perspective?
Speaker 3 (03:27):
You mean, what kind of what got me interested in
pearls?
Yeah, exactly, neither.
Really, it wasn't at all so itcan't.
How about from a retailconsumer perspective?
So when I got married 29 yearsago, we decided to get pearls
for the bridesmaids for gifts,because we thought pearls were
cool, but I didn't know anythingabout them.
My fiance didn't know anythingabout them, and so me, being the
(03:51):
learning geek that I am, I'mthe type of guy that, like, if
I'm going to buy like a car, Ineed to know everything about
that car first, right, or acomputer, you name it right.
I love to shop, and so Ivolunteered to shop for them and
I, just like any other consumer, uh, was just interested in
knowing what I'm getting.
(04:11):
I wanted a good deal.
I didn't know if I was going toget ripped off.
I want to make sure they werereal or treated.
I knew nothing about pearl, so Istarted cruising around stores
and this is before the internet,you guys.
I mean this is when it was likeprodigy and compuser I don't
know if you know what those are,michael, but no, yeah, yeah,
it's, it's the beginnings of theinternet.
(04:31):
Anyways, for the old peoplelistening, you'll get that.
Um, so I was just literallywent to stores and what I
realized is that the people thatwere selling pearls didn't
really know much about them andthat was really interesting to
me and I just got fascinatedwith them because I figured
there's a lot to learn.
And it just stuck with me foryears and years and years and I
(04:53):
actually didn't get really intothe business for another 20,
well, almost 30 years later.
I just they were a hobby.
So I started as a consumer,just out of interest.
They were a hobby, so I startedas a consumer, just out of
interest, wanting to learn.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
Now sort of set this up for me, because I'm
definitely very much an amateur.
I actually bought a set ofpearls when I lived in the city
and I was at a jewelry show andI was like, oh, maybe I'm going
to be, you know, interested inwearing pearls, mainly because,
for example, harry Styles, veryfamously in 2019 at like a Met
(05:26):
Gala, wore a set of pearls.
And I was like, oh, guys canwear pearls.
And it was like sort of changedthe landscape or it felt like
it did away from being classy.
I feel like pearls have alwaysgotten this thing about like, oh
, they're just super, like youwear them with like a black
dress.
Pearls have always gotten thisthing about like, oh, they're
just super, like you wear themwith like a black dress.
And then it was like, oh, maybethey're kind of along the lines
(05:48):
of like forgive the analogy,but kind of like a Cuban link.
You know where it's like, oh,it could go with anything.
It sort of feels like it'ssettled into like somewhere in
between.
Do you feel where do you thinkthat pearls are sitting in the
modern kind of eye and fashiontoday?
Speaker 3 (06:09):
Wow, that is such a good question and if you're a
retailer listening to this, thisis really important Because,
yes, yes, exactly what you.
The way that you envisionpearls at the beginning of that,
historically, historically, isthe way that a lot of people do
still, and that is that pearlsare meant for either like the
(06:30):
power woman, or the wedding, orthe fancy, elegant sort of event
.
So think about pearls right now.
If you guys were to close youreyes, think about pearl, what do
you picture?
Most people that are listeningto this well, we got a lot of
jewelers listening to this, soit may be a little bit different
.
Pearls right now.
If you guys were to close youreyes, think about pearl.
What do you picture?
Most people that are listeningto this well, we got a lot of
jewelers listening this, so,maybe a little bit different.
But most people in generalthink of audrey hepburn or the
(06:53):
queen, or barbara bush, you know, or something like that.
Uh, and that's where pearlshave been for the last hundred
years, and the reason they'vebeen that way is because, well,
you know movies like AudreyHepburn, you know Breakfast at
Tiffany's, et cetera, theybecome kind of the power,
elegant, sort of.
You know, look, and when youthink of pearls, you also
(07:17):
probably thought of round andwhite.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Round and white, which is not the case, I've
learned.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
My mom went to it's not the case, very, very, very
few pearls around maybe about 5%if you talk to, like, the
saltwater farmers and there'smany, many colors of pearls, not
just white.
At first I thought we're goingto do a video, so I brought some
like really cool colors.
So on my desk you guys imagineme holding up all these cool
colors and shapes of differentpearls.
(07:45):
But see, that's the perception.
What happened with harry stylesis two things for you, uh,
number one uh, he tends to wearround white pearls when he wears
them, but he wears pearls likeevery day.
But he's also a man wearingpearls, right.
And so now it's finallyshifting.
People are starting to realize,through a little bit of pearl
(08:06):
education and through seeing,you know, the celebrities, et
cetera, that pearls don't haveto be stuffy, they don't have to
be perfectly elegant, theyabsolutely can be.
They don't even have to bearound, they don't have to be
white and they don't have to beworn by women to be worn by
(08:28):
women.
So, thankfully, a store, now ajeweler and even like just a
fashion boutique, can have pearljewelry that can be everyday
wear for anybody casual pearlsand jeans Fantastic.
Yeah, I wear pearls every day.
Right now I'm wearing a singlepearl Tahitian necklace and then
I've got a pearl bracelet onwith a bunch of Tahitians on a
stretchy cord.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
So when you use the word Tahitian, is that like an
area that they're being sourcedfrom, or is that describing the
type of pearl?
Speaker 3 (08:53):
That is another great question.
It's kind of the term peopleuse for pearls that come from
French Polynesia, I see, andTahiti is in French Polynesia
but French Polynesia the pearl,and Tahiti is in French
Polynesia but the FrenchPolynesia the pearl growing
region is extremely vast, withpearl farms scattered all over
the place, not really even inTahiti or the island of Tahiti,
(09:15):
but in islands, you know, in thearea, but people tend to just
call them Tahitian pearls andwhen you think of Tahitian pearl
, think of the black pearlsthat's another nickname people
have for Tahitians black pearls,although they can be light gray
you know, all sorts of grays,up to deep black, and they can
have overtones that are reallybeautiful purples and greens,
(09:36):
and they're gorgeous.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
And that's what's so cool, is that there is so much
personality to them.
It's in a similar vein as whenyou tell people that, uh, that
diamonds can be different colorsother than you know flawless
white, or you explain to themthat sapphires can be other
colors other than blue.
It just kind of seems like itblows their mind.
Sometimes my mama came backfrom Vietnam and she had a, had
(10:00):
a black or got a black pearlthere and I was like wow, I had
never seen one that was so juststriking and different feeling
than what I've been previouslytrained to see.
Can you talk to me about whatthe factors are that could
increase the value of a pearlversus what you were talking
about with the everyday wear,more standard, kind of run of
(10:21):
the mill.
The everyday wear, you know,more standard, kind of run of
the mill.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
Yeah, and that's the other interesting thing about
pearls nowadays too.
Over the last oh you know it'sbeen a few decades, but the
Chinese have been makingfreshwater pearls, where they
have these mollusks that arereally huge and you can get 20,
30, 40 pearls at one time andyou can grow them quick.
(10:45):
And so, as a result, there'sbeen a massive amount of
freshwater pearls that have comeonto the market and pearls now
can be really affordable.
I have a website, matt HarrisDesigns, and we sell pearls gosh
as low as $30 up to $30,000 ormore.
But there's a whole bunch ofnecklaces that are beautiful,
(11:05):
that are freshwater, that are,you know, $100, $200.
So they're very, veryapproachable.
The value factors I always sayit's like anything, and that is
that the prettier it is, themore expensive it's going to be
right.
So think of that with a car or,you know, a girlfriend or
(11:25):
whatever it happens to be, youknow, and the great thing is
that beauty is in the eye of thebeholder, right?
Same thing with cars andgirlfriends, but in general,
humans tend to like prettythings, and pretty pearls are.
Think of this round.
We tend to like things that areperfectly round, shiny, right.
(11:47):
So those are pearls with likereally nice, nacre, quality,
thick, nacre, that you know it'skind of metallic, like that you
can actually see yourself inlike a mirror, colorful we like
pearls that, maybe even thewhite pearls that have like what
they call orient.
When you move them around itkind of looks like when you blow
a bubble and you see the, thegreens and the pinks kind of
skimming around the the topsurface of the pearl.
(12:08):
So, uh, pearls if it's, and big, we like things big.
So if pearls are big, perfectlyround, very lustrous, thick,
nacre, great nacre, quality,blemish, free and a beautiful
color, you just found yourself avery expensive pearl.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
That's a really interesting kind of perspective
on it.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
Does that make sense?
Speaker 1 (12:28):
It's similar in that way as diamonds, because
theoretically I've heard ofpeople going to like these
diamond mines and like they'reable to find, albeit very low
quality, diamonds that are apoint of a carat, but in the end
it is a diamond, but like whatmakes like a really expensive
one.
It's like, oh man, you couldhave one.
(12:48):
That's, you know, not even acarrot and it's worth, you know,
more than my house, that kindof thing yeah, and think of
pearls like uh, clarity, right,so a uh i1 pearl is going to be
a pearl.
Speaker 3 (12:59):
that's got a fair amount of you know pits on it.
Uh, that's visible to the eyeand when you look at it you can
kind of see it's got these fairamount of you know pits on it
that's visible to the eye andwhen you look at it you can kind
of see it's got these blemishesand pits, et cetera.
You know where it's, like youknow VVS is going to be.
You're going to sit in thereand like move it around in your
hand and look at it and you justcan't really see anything wrong
with this thing.
You know, maybe you get itunder magnification and you'll
(13:21):
find a little blemishing.
So that's an interestinganalogy that I just came up with
now that you mentioned it.
But it kind of makes sense foryou, for you diamond guys, think
of it that way, yeah.
And do people buy the I1diamonds?
Yeah, and do people buyblemished pearls?
Absolutely.
And you know, I sold a SouthSea golden yellow pearl necklace
recently Sea Golden Yellow EarlNecklace recently and it was, I
(13:45):
think, like $7,000.
Now if you looked at it from adistance, like if you and I were
standing, you know, three, four, five feet away from each other
, you'd look at me wearing theseand you say, well, there's
really beautiful, big roundSouth Sea golden pearls.
But if you got close you'dnotice that they all had a
moderate amount of blemishes tothem.
And now that strand would havebeen $30,000 if it would have
(14:09):
been clean is what they call it.
But with little blemishes youcan save money.
So, similar to diamonds, whenpeople are buying you got to
think price point, budget, youknow.
And what's important to peopleIs it the size.
Some girls or guys people likea big diamond, some people want
the clarity, some people wantthe color.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
Yeah, and so I guess that's a really good point.
So, for retailers that arelistening, I'm always interested
in kind of you know, valueshopping and what is it that you
can kind of skimp on if to getmore than what might be in your
budget initially.
And, for example, my friendstalk to me about jewelry because
they know I work in jewelry andthey're always asking about
(14:49):
diamonds and they're alwayssaying, oh, what can you do to
get like a better diamond thanwhat you can afford?
Well, I always tell them youcould either get a lab grown
diamond or you could get thingsthat are more flawed or have
inclusions in them.
If they kind of fall in acertain range, then they're only
ever going to be seen if youwere to put them under a loop.
(15:11):
Is that true for pearls?
And what is it that you couldkind of corner cut a little bit
to get a better set of pearlsthan maybe your budget would
allow for?
For?
Speaker 3 (15:24):
well, I'm kind of lucky personally, because you
know how we talked aboutbeautiful things being expensive
.
I I literally have sweatshirtsand shirts that say this on the
back I had a mate and it's biglettering.
It says I like them big andbaroque.
So baroque pearls aren't.
Is it so?
Broke meaning not, um, you know, round and symmetrical.
(15:44):
Uh.
So Baroque is something that Ilove and I personally would
rather wear a Baroque-shapednecklace than a round pearl
necklace, and it costs a lotless money, so shape could be
one of those things.
Sometimes pearls, especially ifthey're strung in a strand, the
only way you can really tell ifthey're round is you put them on
(16:05):
like a flat surface and rollthem, and if they kind of wibble
, wobble a little bit, thenthey're not round, they're near
round, and quite often pearlswill look round.
Although they're not Now nearround, pearls are going to be
less expensive than the sametype being round.
So that's another way that Ithink that you can kind of save
a little money as well is to buysome that aren't perfectly
round, because it's so hard tonotice sometimes by looking at
(16:27):
them or any of those.
It just depends what you'reinto.
I really don't mind a fewblemishes.
You know, I personally don'tprefer to look at like pitted
pearls.
I would rather skimp on theshape or the size or you know
the, but it just depends.
Yeah, everybody's got their owntaste.
But there are ways that you cankind of save a little bit of
money and there are.
(16:47):
The purest as there are arewith diamonds, that or any
gemstone that.
Just they've got to have theunheated salon sapphire, you
know.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
Uh, with perfect cut proportions and I've always been
of the opinion that who whocares about like some of those,
uh, you know, very shopspecialty like you know, um,
what makes it extra, extraexpensive?
I've never been really intothat.
Where it's like, oh, it'sunheated, I'm like, well, if
it's beautiful when it's heated,I'd rather, you know, I guess
(17:20):
it doesn't really matter to me,as long as it still looks
beautiful on their hand or, youknow, on their body, and I guess
that's one of those things it'slike.
You know, if there are some ofthese like ways that they can
make things look maybe morebeautiful and make it maybe more
attainable or affordable forcertain people, I'm very much of
(17:47):
the opinion that I think it'sbetter for people to be able to
have those things if theywouldn't normally.
Is that something that you haveto educate jewelers on, on ways
to kind of talk about pearls ina way that makes it more
attainable or understandable fora shopper?
Speaker 3 (18:00):
Yes, I ran a retail jewelry store for about four
years.
I left there about two twoyears ago and to focus solely on
this now, on pearls and but mebeing a pearl lover, we carried
a lot of pearls and I would tellpeople on the jewelry groups
(18:21):
online etc.
Uh, you get in theconversations with jewelers all
the time, the trade shows andwhatnot and your cocktail hour
and you talk pearls and they'relike, oh, we never sell pearls,
like nobody's buying pearls,it's so hard to sell pearls.
And I tell them I literallywould sell pearls every day, and
multiples some days.
And people say, how is thateven possible?
And it's really your educationand your mindset as a jeweler
(18:44):
and your selection.
So I'm going to generalize.
I'm sure this isn't the casewith everybody, of course, but
most stores, when it comes totheir pearl selection jewelry
stores, they're going to havethat case and it's going to be
some perfectly round smallokoyas like a necklace or two.
It's going to be some roundstuds, studs.
(19:06):
It may be, if you're lucky,like a Tahitian round, you know,
a pendant or a strand andthat's kind of it.
There really isn't much else.
And so if you want people to,this goes to your point that
you're just talking about.
It's something for everybodyand every price point and not
necessarily going for theperfect.
(19:27):
You know stone that if it'sheated, whatever.
Same with pearls.
If I can, let somebody have theexperience of buying a hundred
dollar pearl freshwater necklaceand they're going out there and
they're wearing it all the timeand somebody sees them and they
like, wow, that's cool.
Oh yeah, it's freshwater pearls, you can go get them for $100.
(19:49):
It goes, it perpetuates, andthen people start being
comfortable with wearing pearlfashion.
They start wearing it in casualenvironments and then the whole
world of pearl fashion kind ofcomes up along with this.
Because a lot of those peopleare now more familiar with
pearls, more comfortable buyingpearls and guess what?
They're going to start buyinghigher-end pearls.
(20:09):
With pearls we're comfortablebuying pearls and guess what?
They're going to start buyinghigher end pearls.
So in my store we would have onthe countertop not even
underneath this display of pearlearrings and then we maybe have
maybe 10 or 15 differentdesigns that range from $35 to
$65 freshwater pearls.
We'd sell those all day longand you know what?
A lot of those people will comeback later and buy a pearl
(20:30):
necklace or eventually, a SouthSea strand for $8,000 or
whatever.
So I think getting them in thehands of many people as possible
is great, and you don't have tosell just high end when it
comes to pearls.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Ah, I really love that approach.
In my opinion, I am very muchanti-gatekeeping when it comes
to especially the jewelry, butjust fashion in general.
I am very much anti-gatekeepingwhen it comes to, uh, to
especially the jewelry, but justfashion in general.
I feel like you.
I I hate rules when it comes to, uh, just any type of art, but
especially when it comes tofashion, I, I just am like any
example that you show me.
I will do my best to find you acounter example on why you
(21:05):
could do that, you know.
Speaker 3 (21:07):
I agree with you, except that I saw on Facebook
yesterday or Instagram, a videoof a fashion show, and it's
where they dress people up inmusical instruments.
So they had this one ladystanding like in a drum and
another one was like her headwas poking out the top of a
cello, and I can't go that far.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
You know what, if that's where we draw the line, I
think we're going to do it.
Speaker 3 (21:30):
That's where I draw the line.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
I think we're gonna draw the line yeah, all right,
everybody, we're gonna take aquick break and hear a word from
our sponsor mother's day iscoming up.
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Have a great day and enjoy therest of the episode.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
And we're back, matt, you were talking about that.
The more common kind ofversions are, you know, pearl
strand necklace and maybebracelets that for all intents
and purposes are just a smallernecklace, you guess you could
say, or maybe a solitairependant and maybe some studs.
Are there any other kind oftrends that you're kind of
(23:01):
starting to pay attention tothat might be not falling into
those main categories that youthink are exciting and maybe
should be watched out for?
Speaker 3 (23:09):
Yes, and I'm glad you mentioned because I didn't talk
about it too much but a store.
Right now, I think what's hotin the pearl world pearl strands
are always going to be thereand everybody should have a
pearl strand I think men too.
We'll talk about that in aminute.
But as far as pearl jewelry,it's a lot easier to get people
into pearl jewelry, I think ifyou are carrying kind of modern
(23:31):
designs where you've got metaluh and something small, so like
a, a gold chain with a singlepearl pendant or drilled right
through the pearl with somegrommets and and something like
that.
Or we have a chain that has aone pearl and then another one
kind of drops down and it'sadjustable so you can kind of
(23:53):
make it go up and down yourchest.
Oh cool, so little things likethat that are just have like a
dainty pearl, a pendant or yeah,studs are always going to be
popular, but I think mixingmetals with gold and making them
more fashionable.
We have station necklaces thatare very popular, where we just
have silver stationed withinexpensive pearls and we make
(24:14):
them like 36 inches long so youcan double them up if you want.
Those are a lot of fun too,because you're seeing the girls
go out and wear those you knowlike with the jeans.
So I'd say that's a trend thatI would stick to if I was a
store and wanted to increasepearl sales and, of course,
always have a few strands.
(24:34):
But I'm most excited about menin pearls and I am the biggest
proponent of that, and if you goto my Instagram channel or my
YouTube, we're talking about itall day long.
So you mentioned Harry Styles.
You can always count on him.
I did a story the other day onaj mclean from the backstreet
boys.
He's always wearing pearls.
(24:54):
Now too.
Uh, asap rocky, um, the davebautista.
You know the really big dudefrom guardians of the galaxy.
yeah, formerly wrestler yeahyeah, he wore like a triple
strand Mikimoto Akoya necklaceto Toronto Film Festival
(25:15):
recently, for example.
It goes on and on.
I can tell you a lot of guyswearing pearls.
Rod Stewart, every performance.
Now he's wearing pearls.
He's I suppose I haven't seenhim, but all my friends are
telling me he's rocking it atlike 77 or something Very cool.
It goes on and on and on.
Men in pearls and boy I tell youI'm in some of these jeweler
(25:35):
groups and some of you that aregoing to listen to it I'll bet
you're in some of the groupsthat I'm in online and all you
got to do is mention men inpearls and there's 500 comments
and people are talking about howhorrible it is and dumb and
this and that and men shouldnever wear pearls.
The other side of it is likeabsolutely, pearls are hot on
guys and I mean I literally wearone every day and I have for
(25:56):
years.
But something about that thateverybody should know.
And if you're a retailer andthis comes up, it'll be kind of
fun to tell your customers aboutthis that pearls have only
become almost strictly feminineover the last hundred years.
So, and it was because theystarted culturing pearls, making
pearls, around 1900.
And you guys all know Mikimoto.
(26:17):
He's kind of considered thegrandfather of culture pearls,
although some people technicallydid it before him.
He really figured out a way tomake a lot of culture pearls and
so you had these small whiteround pearls coming out in the
1910s, 20s and 30s and then youhad the you know, the Audrey
Hepburns.
Like I was saying, coco Chanelstarted making the faux pearl
(26:39):
necklaces and that became a bigthing in the right after
Prohibition.
So they quickly becamefeminized.
Before 1900, yes, a lot offemales would wear pearls.
You look at any art museum andgo to the Queens they're wearing
pearls.
But guess what?
Go check out the pictures ofthe kings they're wearing pearls
too.
Type in Google Henry VIII lateron and find a picture of him
(27:02):
not wearing pearls.
Right, king Charles, I wore apearl in his ear that he got for
a present when he was 15 yearsold.
Literally wore it every dayuntil his beheading King Charles
II.
King Charles III probablydoesn't know it, but in the
Imperial Crown actually has fourpearls that date back to the
1400s, back at Pope Clement'stime, and men and pearls were a
(27:26):
thing.
Julius Caesar used to have aparty trick where he would like
hold a pearl and tell you howmuch it weighed.
That was kind of his braggingthing.
I'll give you one more exampleHis greatest general, general
Pompey.
He was known as Pompey theGreat or the Teenage Butcher,
because this guy was so ruthlessthat when he would conquer
(27:47):
different peoples, he would likeliterally have them cut up.
When he would conquer differentpeoples, he would like
literally have them cut up.
So he single-handedly turnedRome into an empire by
conquering seven what theycalled continents at the time.
They were kind of like regions.
Anyways, when he conquered thelast one, he, to celebrate, had
himself made like a replica ofhimself out of pearls and he
(28:09):
paraded it around town for twodays and everybody was talking
about what a massive display ofwealth this guy and coolness.
You know that's portrayed.
He was like badass, right, andthis was like one of the most
ruthless men in the world.
Oh, one more.
If you guys have heard of theMaharaja, they were in India.
(28:34):
So the country was split upunder English rule with these
regions and you have kind oflike a king of each region.
They're called Maharaja.
But if you type up Maharajayou're going to see that they
all wore pearls too and just alot of them.
So men and pearls is a thing italways has been.
It just kind of got off track alittle bit.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
It's a really interesting series of examples,
mainly because they are just alittle bit more historical as
opposed to modern.
And you're the ones that you hadstarted off this episode
talking about with Audrey, withAudrey Hepburn, and you know the
queen and the.
All the examples of modern dayare these, you know, very
(29:17):
striking or famous women.
I wonder if, to me, harryStyles at least for me and my
friends and like the people Ispeak with friends and like the
people that I speak with he'sthe most recent like
recognizable ambassador for forpearls on men, and I wonder if
that will continue, whether youknow how hard would it be to
(29:40):
kind of make that be yourcalling card?
I guess it would, you know.
It remains to be seen if, ifHarry Styles keeps on doing that
and more people follow suit.
But I would love it if, yeah,if more examples, not just
people that are have their feetfirmly planted in fashion the
way that I believe Harry Styleskind of does, but if more people
(30:03):
from various levels ofcelebrity, like Dave Bautista
does and A$AP Rocky those areall super cool examples of like
people that aren't necessarilyfashion first, but more examples
of using jewelry to kind ofamplify your image and message a
little bit more.
Speaker 3 (30:22):
Yeah, and you know it makes me think of here's an
example of just a normal guy andpearls.
I was going to sell my pickuptruck recently and my assistant
whose name is Pearl, weirdlyenough has a friend that does
mobile detailing.
So she mentioned this to himbecause I needed to clean it up
(30:43):
right before I put it out forsale and he suggested he says,
well, what if I trade Matt adetail job for a strand of
pearls?
So, sure enough, this is like a$200-something detail job and I
custom made him a white strandof pearls and then we have these
literally frost pearls, sothey're pearl-shaped as crosses
(31:05):
and I put one in the middle withsome like a few gold balls
around it beads.
It was so awesome, this thing,uh, and he and this guy's just a
tough dude and and he's outthere rocking this thing, uh,
and it's awesome that's a reallycool example.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
So, yeah, what's what's interesting is you were
talking about different types ofpearls and then we were talking
about ways you can get a.
You know around that, forexample.
But you also mentioned culturedversus uncultured pearls.
My grandma, like she alwayswore uncultured.
I think it was like a triplestrand of uncultured pearls, you
(31:41):
know, like the ones they kindof always.
I always thought that theylooked like rice or like beans
and they were kind of likestrangely shaped, and my mom
always told me it was becausethey were more affordable.
Is that?
Do you think that that has gonethrough like it's the waves of
vogue and might be due to comeback?
Or is that something?
(32:02):
It's been passed up because youknow, farming, culture, pearls
is so much more, you know,attainable and easy to do these
days.
Speaker 3 (32:10):
Well, I'm trying to answer that without getting into
a two-hour segment on it.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
Let it rip.
Come on, matt, we got time.
Speaker 3 (32:18):
No, I don't want to scare people away.
So we can dig into this stuffon different episodes and
YouTube and stuff, but ingeneral, first let me say this
that, because everybody shouldknow this and there's confusion,
because when people will comeinto my store and I'm sure they
come into your store too, ifyou're listening to this as a
retailer and they have the termsconfused, so they'll say are
(32:43):
those pearls real or do you havenatural pearls?
And when they say do you havenatural pearls, what they are
meaning is they're not fake,they're not plastic, they're not
glass, right?
So here's a quick 101 on theterminology.
So in the pearl world there iscultured pearls and there's
natural pearls, and so that's it.
(33:03):
Cultured, natural, naturalpearls are pearls that think of,
like the old romantic, you knowdiving deep, you know, yeah,
you know picking up some randomoyster and bringing it up and
you opening it up and it's apearl.
It's a pearl, and that's theway all pearls were before 1900.
It's just all those kings andqueens.
(33:24):
They'd have to go throughthousands, sometimes 10,000
oysters just to get one pearl.
So they're very rare and that'sthe way they've always been
through history, until Mikimotoand some other guys came around.
They figured out how to culturethem.
So a culture pearl is a pearlthat's made with, with humans,
help.
A natural pearl is a pearlthat's made just as a result of
(33:47):
nature, so human intervention orhelp and complete natural.
So um, culture pearls then area human inserting a bead or a
piece of what they call mantletissue, or inserting the
irritant into the mollusk andthat, that irritant I say that
(34:08):
because muscle mollusks don'treally have a central nervous
system like do they?
We do so they don't feel pain,but anyways, this irritant, the
mother of pearl, the nacre, isbuilt around this and creates a
pearl.
So in nature it usually happensas a result of a parasite that
kind of moves its way into the,into the mollusk, and then
(34:28):
plants itself and that parasitebecomes like the irritant and
again with humans, we'reliterally inserting something in
there.
So those are your two termsnatural pearl, cultured pearl.
Now, the pearls that you'retalking about, I don't see those
small kind of Rice Krispiepearls coming back.
There's a few different things.
(34:49):
One of them is there is a placecalled lake biwa, japan.
That would make a lot of thoseuh back and they got really
heavily polluted.
I believe must have been likethe 60s or 70s, if I recall.
I don't recall because I wastoo young, but you know, recall
reading about uh, and they madea lot of those kind of rice
crispy pearls.
And then the chinese startedcoming up with with cultured
(35:14):
freshwater pools.
Now they weren't putting beadslike they do in the round pearls
into the mollusk, they wereputting a little piece of tissue
that would kind of jump startthe nacre creation process.
And these, back at thebeginning, when they started
these decades ago, they werealways tiny and kind of crappy
and not really shiny or lustrous.
(35:34):
And they produce a whole bunchof them.
They'd have individual farmerseven like converting their rice
patties into a pond in theirbackyard and creating these.
And so the Chinese freshwaterpearls were very small, kind of
weird shaped, not very lustrous,and ultra cheap.
Now even the Chinese havechanged, where now, generally
(35:55):
speaking, they're going toconcentrate more on higher
quality, less better quality.
They're even nucleating themwith beads and you're getting
big pearls and round pearls andpearls that are actually of much
higher quality than they usedto be.
Speaker 1 (36:09):
So I've got drawers full of like those old pearls,
uh, but no, you don't really seethem on the market anymore yeah
, it's always really interestingbecause so you say like, oh,
they were originally found, orlike pearls were originally, you
got to dive in, you got to gothrough all of these, uh, these
mollusks and just to get one,and that inherently makes the
(36:31):
rarity, makes the value.
Uh, there there's a like,almost like a correlation
between them.
However, they figured out a wayto kind of I don't want to say
man make, but sort of um, these,these pearls and man, in saying
that out loud, it sure sounds alot like lab-grown diamonds, it
(36:54):
sure does.
But for some reason peopledon't seem to draw that line in
that, you know, if I was to goand find a pearl just by
shucking a ton of oysters andthen I find one, and it would be
like, wow, that's really cool.
But it's not like it's more rare, uh, or valuable, just because
(37:16):
I pulled it out of an oystermyself by happenstance.
Um, it's kind of almost likealong the lines of like, I don't
know, like, uh, having havinggone and found my, found my own,
uh, gemstone, you know, out innature myself, and then, like,
went and cut it myself.
It's such a.
(37:36):
It's interesting that sometimesthose rules apply to other
gemstones as opposed to, youknow, with pearls.
I find that very confusing.
I find that very confusing.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
I'd have to kind of have to dive into that and kind
of wrestle with that in my brainto make that, you know,
completely rationalized I guess.
Yeah, well, there's somedifferences there.
You can go to Sunstone Butte,you know, mine Sunstone's in
Oregon or whatnot, or there'sprobably a place where you can
go get Peridot or something, Idon't know.
There's a mine, where you can goand you, you, you know, take
your chisel or whatever and getstuff and bring it to a cutter
uh, there's really no place togo to die for oysters, uh, and
(38:20):
get pearls, except for bahrain.
In bahrain, uh they're, they'refascinating, but they actually
have a whole revitalizedindustry of natural pearl
farming.
And I say natural pearlsbecause they really they kind of
farm, but they really arenatural pearls and they are very
great stewards of the, theenvironment, the water, the.
(38:44):
You know how many oysters arepulled and you can get a permit
to pull up, I think, a maximumof 50 oysters, if I, if, if I
remember right, and I want to goout there and do that one of
these days.
That sounds cool, but therereally is no other.
You can't go anywhere andnobody is going and picking up
an oyster and getting a pearlthese days.
Speaker 1 (39:04):
Yeah, it's really, uh , it's just interesting.
I I know I am probably comparingthings um that't have a
correlation, but for some reasonthe fact that they are it's
still like identical is very,very cool and something that is
fascinating, especially whenthere are these different values
attributed to the differentcolors and the quality and
(39:27):
things like that, just likethere is with gemstones the
different colors and the qualityand things like that, just like
there is with gemstones.
Now I guess I kind of want topivot that into talking about
the, you know, for retailers.
So right now it does feel likethe focus is away from pearls
and you're making some greatpoints about why retailers
should be getting into this.
If a retailer might beinterested in expanding their
(39:49):
display or trying to get part of, you know, expanding their line
of pearl offerings, what wouldbe the best way that they should
go about doing that?
Is it a matter of findingconnections or making their own
pearl jewelry, or are therebrands that you would highly
recommend people at leastinvestigate to see if they might
(40:10):
be interested in carrying theirdesigns?
Speaker 3 (40:12):
Yeah, I mean, I don't recommend jewelers get into
making pearl jewelry becausethat's like the last thing you
have time to do is to try tocreate pearl jewelry.
By the way, and stringing is anart.
I'll tell you that.
That's what I've heard.
I've heard it's a real art.
I'm training two stringers andwe just had our stringing night
last night and one girl kind ofgraduated and she's so excited,
but it took her a lot of time toget to the point of getting the
(40:34):
quality where I like it to be.
And, believe it or not, there'sdifferent stringing techniques,
there's different quality.
There's different qualitymaterials.
So, yeah, buy collections.
You can buy my collectionmattharrisdesignscom and we sell
retail online, but I alsowholesale designs with packaging
and presentation and the storyto everybody.
(40:56):
And then I also have to say andI'm a member, a board member,
of the Culture Pearl Associationof America and we have a great,
great group of wholesalers thatyou can come to and all of
those people are the real dealand you can trust everything
there is about all of these guysand we have a list online.
(41:19):
So if you go to the CPA orCultural Parole Association
website, I think we actuallyjust changing the URL, but
Google it, you can find a listof vendors, and these people
have been around for a long time.
We have some that are thirdgeneration pearl vendors that
are great and they're at all thetrade shows JCK and Nissan, et
(41:40):
cetera.
So that'd be a great place tostart is the Culture Pearl
Association.
Speaker 1 (41:46):
Awesome and, matt, I'll make sure I have that
information in the show notes.
That's definitely I'd love for,uh love to check it, check it
all out and make sure that, um,our retailers are looking into
it as well.
But, matt, maybe just to kindof put us on uh, end us on a on
a some interesting notes, canyou give me maybe one or two
interesting facts that you havein that catalog of yours, uh,
about pearls, um, to that kindof really summarize how special
(42:11):
and unique they are as agemstone?
Speaker 3 (42:13):
Well, kind of like something that just would be
interesting to tell a customerthat they don't know.
Yeah, sure, yeah.
Well, you know we opened theshow with this.
Pearls are the only gem thatcomes from a living creature,
and that's pretty cool.
By the way, did you know?
Even pearls are a gem.
A lot of people don't know thatthey're technically a gem.
The GIA designated them as suchI think it was gosh 1968 or
(42:39):
something like that.
So that's interesting in itselfand they're one of the oldest
things gems that has been wornas jewelry, and we talked about
the history and whatnot.
But if I had had a one-liner,when people come into my store,
I remember I'd tell them thatthey're the only gem that comes
(42:59):
from a living creature.
It starts the conversation.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
That's a really interesting.
It's such a fascinatingeverything about them.
They feel almost like they'realive.
I sometimes feel like it's likethey have a little bit more to
them than, um, you know some ofthe other ones, and not that I
don't have a lot of appreciationfor, for other things, but the
fact that they literally arelike, seemingly birthed by, by
(43:23):
nature is just such a specialand kind of unique quality about
them that, uh, definitely agood hook.
Speaker 3 (43:28):
I appreciate that and you know, as a farmer, you can
do whatever you want, but youjust don't know how the pearl's
going to come out.
Yeah, you, we do.
We simply don't have thecontrol now to romanticize them.
Uh guys, don't get me wrong, Ilove diamonds and sapphires and
all this stuff.
I've got a lot of them, uh.
But you know, you get a rockout of the ground and you cut it
(43:51):
up into a.
You know a way that,technically, that everybody
knows now is excellent, cut this, you know, has a play of light
that's perfect and cool.
But a pearl farmer, right,you've got these little guys in
the water for a few years andyou do what you can.
You try to like make sure thatthe water for a few years and
you do what you can.
You try to like make sure thatthe water is in, you know, good
(44:12):
shape.
Um, you try to.
You have to take them out andclean them.
Uh, you, you still don't knoweven if the bead is going to
take.
Um, I've opened up oysters infrench polynesia and taken five,
six, seven of them before Ieven got a pearl, and these all
had a bead put in them.
So you don't even know ifthey're going to have a pearl,
and if you do, I've opened up 50oysters without getting a
(44:36):
perfectly round pearl, so youjust don't know what's going to
come out, and there's somethingreally cool about that that you
know.
No matter what we do as humans,nature plays a huge part in
pearls, and I just think wearingthem.
I think of that when I wearthem, and every one is really,
really unique.
So when you get that singlepearl, you're the only one that
has it.
You could say that everydiamond is unique too.
(44:58):
You know there's some that areclose to each other, but there's
something about pearls and thatuniqueness that I love as well.
Speaker 1 (45:05):
Matt, I really appreciate your time.
What a really cool conversation.
I definitely learned your time.
What a really cool conversation.
I definitely learned a lot.
I was going to say what?
Speaker 3 (45:11):
did you learn about Pearl?
What sticks out in your mindabout Pearls that you learned
today?
Speaker 1 (45:15):
Give me like one or two things, I think what stands
out to me is first of all thatthey are historically worn, I
guess.
For me, the image that I thinkof is, yeah, a perfect white
strand and typically worn by afamous, rich woman, and the fact
(45:36):
that that's not always been thecase and that it's only in
recent years that that has beenthe main figure is kind of an
interesting one to me,especially worn by kings.
But the other one is the factthat the range of colors is so
kind of pronounced and can be,you know, I guess, is not
(45:57):
something that can be majorlycontrolled.
I think that's kind of exciting.
Nowadays, you're right,especially with lab grown
diamonds, I feel like they canpretty much pick exactly what it
is that they want.
But the fact that there isstill some randomness and some
kind of seemingly luck is justlike a really endearing quality
to me.
Speaker 3 (46:18):
You said it better than I did.
That's great.
I got one more thing to say.
It's a teaser maybe.
Sure, the girl in the pearlearring the movie Vermeer
Vermeer.
I'm'm gonna tell you right nowthat's not a pearl no way,
really, yeah and so I'm doing ayoutube about this.
Uh, we're gonna film it sometimein the next few days and uh, so
(46:41):
all the things that we talkedabout kind of will lead to you
understanding what I'm talkingabout, uh, when you see that.
But it just wouldn't make sensebecause that pearl and there's
a lot of technical reasons why Idon't think that's a pearl in
terms of the painting itself andeverything but culturally a
pearl.
If it was a pearl that size, Ithink it's just a shiny piece of
(47:03):
tin or something.
But a pearl that beautiful,that size, would have absolutely
been found its way to whateverqueen in Europe at that time.
There's no way in the worldthat would be owned by.
It wasn't really even a personthat he painted anyways, but
even Vermeer or anybody like itor anybody like the subject.
(47:25):
It would be just so over thetop because it would be one of
the most valuable things in isto have a pearl like that based
off the sheer size of it or theshot size and size and shape.
And then you could say, well,I'll save it for the video.
If you guys want to go, look atyoutube.
Speaker 1 (47:40):
Yeah and matt, I'll have every uh, all your links in
the show notes below.
Everybody, go check them out,uh, if you want to learn more
about, if you're interested incarrying more designs.
He also has his own line ofpearl jewelry and I really
appreciate your time.
Thank you so much, matt, forjoining me and everybody.
We'll be back next week,tuesday, with another episode.
(48:01):
Cheers, everybody, bye.
Cheers, all right, everybody.
That's the end of the show.
Thanks so much for listening.
My guest this week was MattHarris and he's a Pearl expert.
Definitely go check out hisinformation in the show notes
below.
This episode was brought to youby Punchmark and produced and
(48:24):
hosted by me, michael Burpo.
This episode was edited by PaulSuarez with music by Ross
Cockrum.
Don't forget to rate thepodcast on Spotify and Apple
Podcasts and leave us feedbackon punchmarkcom slash loop.
That's L-O-U-P-E.
We'll be back next week,tuesday, with another episode.
Thanks, bye, thank you.
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