August 30, 2024 • 35 mins
Welcome to Season 6 of Innovation Heroes. On this episode, Ed McNamara is joined by SHI Field CTO Dave Gruver to explore the transformative power of Industry 4.0 technologies across various sectors—including healthcare, retail, and manufacturing.
But that's not all––we're setting our sights even higher, looking at how these advancements are propelling us into space. With insights from Intel’s Stacey Shulman, VP of Health, Education, and Consumer Industries, this episode delves into how space innovation is poised to revolutionize the business landscape.
Discover the challenges, opportunities, and future trends of Industry 4.0 and how businesses can prepare to thrive in this new era. Tune in now to learn how SHI is helping businesses solve what's next, both on Earth and beyond.
Listen to the full episode below or wherever you get your podcasts.
Featuring: Dave Gruver, SHI Field CTO and Stacey Shulman, VP Health, Education and Consumer Industries, NEX Group at Intel
SHI's Innovation Heroes is a podcast exploring the people and businesses driving change in our drastically disrupted world.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Stacey Shulman (00:00):
Yeah, I'm, I'm guessing at this point, like anybody, right.
Um, but, but here's what Ibelieve about innovation.
If you know that there's a disruptivetechnology or innovation or macro trend
happening, even if you don't know howit'll impact you, it's best to get
involved early and evolve with it.
Ed McNamara (00:18):
In the world of technology, heroes are everywhere.
They're overcoming disruption, deliveringsustainable outcomes, and fearlessly
forging the future to solve what's next.
Join me, Ed McNamara, as we meet thepeople and businesses driving change
in our constantly disruptive world.
This is Innovation Heroes, apodcast brought to you by SHI.
(00:44):
Hey, innovators.
Welcome back to a brand newseason of Innovation Heroes.
I'm beyond excited to kickoff season six with you.
We've been.
Busy working on 12 amazing hero stories.
And this year we are takingthings to the next level.
We've just moved into our brand newstate of the art podcast studio here at
SHI world headquarters in New Jersey.
If you're listening to the audioversion, this is your reminder
(01:06):
that full video episodes arealso available on our YouTube.
And even though I have a face for radio,as they say, you can head over to youtube.
com and search for SHIcorporation to see us in action.
We're also shaking up the format.
We'll still be speaking to thepeople and businesses behind the most
inspirational innovation stories, butevery now and then I'll ask a colleague
(01:26):
at SHI to join and share their opinionor expertise on the given topic.
Together, we'll dive into the big storiesand share how SHI is helping business
leaders like you solve what's next.
Today, I'm joined by DaveGroover, the field CTO at SHI.
Dave is a powerhouse when it comesto driving technical strategy and
delivering effective solutionsfor SHI's global customers.
(01:48):
Before joining SHI, he spent 25 yearsat AT& T, climbing the ranks to the
title of assistant vice president, andI can't think of a better first co host
to join me on this brand new season.
Dave, welcome to the show.
Dave Gruver (02:01):
Hey, thank you, Ed.
Thanks for having me.
It's good to see you again.
I think we were lasttogether in June at our
Ed McNamara (02:08):
At the End User Computing Summit, that is absolutely correct.
And, uh, hope to see atanother one again soon.
Um, for the purposes of our virtualmeeting today, in today's episode,
we're exploring how Industry 4.
0 is spurring innovations acrossall sectors, from healthcare to
retail, manufacturing, both hereon Earth and even in outer space.
(02:28):
And we'll get to that in a second.
A little later, we're goingto hear from Stacey Shulman.
But for now, let's hear a little bit aboutyou and what you do for SHI's customers.
Dave Gruver (02:36):
Sure.
Um, I've been in this role about a yearand a half in this role of field CTO
focused on the end user compute arena,and I work with our global customers,
our largest customers to identify andexecute to their goals in the end user
compute space, whether it's deploymentsor support transformation, all those areas
that, you know, our global customers areworking to always improve themselves.
(02:59):
We'd like to get in there and helpthem and offer where, you know,
SHI services and capabilities canhelp them improve their business.
Ed McNamara (03:06):
And, and what are they dealing with right now?
I mean, like, what are you seeingin terms of, like, the biggest and
most complex IT organizations thatyou're supporting in the global space?
You know, what, what, what's reallytop of mind for them right now?
Dave Gruver (03:18):
I think, I think it's about, you know, staying current, right?
With everything that's going on with AI.
Especially AI in the endpoint, which isfar less mature than even what's going on
in AI in the cloud, you know, things likechat GPT, but on the endpoint, they're
trying to figure out how to take bestadvantage of these capabilities where
they're going to impact their business.
I think the other thing that playsinto it is technological debt, right?
(03:42):
Especially with thelarge, the larger, older.
Companies that have a lot of legacysoftware and legacy applications that
are really crucial to their business.
How do they move forward andnot abandon those things that
are core to their business?
How do they bring thoseforward economically?
And that's across the board,whether it's finance, pharma.
I mean, you know, communications,entertainment, all the segments
(04:04):
I work with, and you see somecommonalities across the board.
Ed McNamara (04:07):
And, you know, in the concept of industry 4.
0, the fourth industrial revolution,kind of characterized by the
integration of digital technologiesinto manufacturing and industry, you
know, um, like what, what's your take?
Is somebody who.
Who's, you know, who's seasonedthat has kind of seen it all from,
especially from the manufacturer'sside, um, you know, just what's your
take on, on defining industry 4.
(04:28):
0.
And, um, I won't even say that theconstraints, it seems like it's, uh,
you know, we don't even know what the,what, what the constraints might be.
The possibilities seem endless.
Dave Gruver (04:38):
Yeah.
I mean, it's a pretty exciting time, youknow, from a core technology, you look at
sort of AI and edge computing and IOT isbig segments of that, but what it can mean
in terms of manufacturing, in terms of.
More efficiency, betterquality, better repeatability.
Um, also, I think something that getsleft behind sometimes in industry 4.
(04:59):
0 is as you move to these digitalcapabilities, you also expand your access
to the intelligence to run them, right?
The old days of a factory floor, thepeople had to be there to run it.
So you needed people in that area,whether maybe you were in, you know,
the sort of the car industry wereup in the Upper Midwest, or maybe
(05:20):
you're in, you know, um, the garmentindustry or the furniture manufacturing
industry down in the Southeast, right.
Going back, you know, 50 years orso, you had to be on time to do that.
With these digital capabilities,you can access knowledge almost
anywhere in the world and bring itin as part of your manufacturing.
I think that's something thatsometimes gets lost, that capability.
(05:41):
It also has a big impact on thelabor market too, where you might
have been protected regionally.
Right.
You're not competing internationallyfor your job in a lot of cases.
So there's some things going on there.
And I think, you know, there's,I was fortunate before I came
to AT& T and on to SHI, I workedin the manufacturing industry.
I actually built sales for a living forsailboats and I got to see, I actually was
(06:04):
part of a group that really transitionedthe sailmaking industry from a labor
intensive to a capital intensive process.
Where the old way was to sew panelstogether to create a sail, just
like you create a shirt, right?
You sew on the collar,you sew on the sleeves.
That was the old way of doingthat, was labor intensive.
We, where I work, we develop a processto make a sail in one piece, using
(06:26):
large gantries and thread layingmachines, and make this sort of
monocoque structure, and that was sortof that industry's step towards 4.
0.
Manufacturing.
But the other part of that isit really shifted from labor
intensive to capital intensive.
And that changed whocould play in that space.
Right?
(06:46):
So now it's a lot harder.
I think that's going to be aninteresting thing, how this shakes out.
We've seen in sort of the digital worldwhere companies can become cloud based
that can start up very quickly becausethey have access to all these common
resources, I don't know if that's goingto happen in the manufacturing world.
Cause you have to have thatcombination of the manufacturing
capability, but then you need.
(07:07):
Better tooling, whichcan be expensive, right?
And how's that going to play out?
Will that create more consolidation?
I really, I don't know, but it's going tobe an interesting thing to play through.
Ed McNamara (07:17):
I love that you mentioned your experience in sale making, and
I'm really happy that we got to itbecause when I think back to like
the, you know, technology innovation,you know, the shows, innovation
heroes, Stacey Shulman, you know,talks about manufacturing in space.
I mean, how cool is it to you thatas somebody who, you know, is in the,
you know, multi millennium, you know,uh, age of, of, of sail making that,
(07:41):
that, you know, transportation isstill leading the way in terms of where
we might be driving innovation next.
Dave Gruver (07:46):
Yeah, it's pretty exciting.
I think, you know, for me, when I look atsort of the, I think they call it space 4.
0, I think it's got its ownterm now, is that right?
And yeah, I think it's interestingto see what we're doing there.
And it's interesting to see where it canactually touch our lives individually.
Right.
Um, again, I have to go back to sailing.
Um, when we started sailing acrossthe ocean and races when I was
(08:08):
in my twenties, which is with thegray hair, that was a while ago.
Um, you know, it was, it was navigateby the stars using a sextant.
If you're lucky, you sideband radio,you might, when we got a little,
got a little older, we had weatherfaxes, you had this limited data.
Now you have Starlink, and whatan amazing, you know, think
about Starlink, I don't know ifit really falls into space 4.
(08:31):
0, but I think it kind of does becauseof the communication that it allows from
and to really increases the capability.
And that communication is goingto support more data transfer to
space, right, as they improve that.
So that's one thing that I see going on.
The other thing that I thinkis, that I understand is a big
part of, you know, Space 4.
0 is where additivemanufacturing comes in.
(08:53):
And it's been really interestingto see how that goes on.
Behind me, I've got my, you know,I've been a 3D printer hobbyist for a
long time, but to see this same typeof technology scaled up, printing
metals, printing rocket boosters, youknow, um, thrusters and things like
that, and the ability to create inspace, and just that concept overall.
Of additive manufacturing where I'mnot starting with a block of aluminum
(09:18):
or titanium and milling away allthe parts with a lot of waste and
I have to carry all this weight.
Think about that in space.
I can start with a filament of somethingand create without any waste and what
that means in terms of the capabilityand also for additive manufacturing
what you can do in space where gravityIs it a factor as a whole another
(09:40):
leap in capability to create thingsto be used back on Earth or to create
things to be taken forward in space?
I think it's pretty excitingto see what's going on.
And it'll be interesting, youknow, you and I are of similar age.
Um, our, our, our space, I think wewere, when I started, it was space 2.
0 or 3.
0 with the, with the Apollo program.
(10:01):
And, you know, the thing wegot out of that was Tang.
I think we're going to do a little betterthis time with what's going on in Space 4.
0.
Ed McNamara (10:09):
So the buzz around Industry 4.
0 has been impossible to ignore,um, its promise of revolutionizing
industries through advanced technologieslike AI, IoT, and robotics, but
there's an exciting new dimensionto this revolution, uh, space.
To kick off our sixth season, we'veinvited back the wonderful Stacey Shulman,
(10:29):
Vice President of Health, Education,and Consumer Industries at Intel.
With a deep understanding of integratingcutting edge tech into business
strategies, Stacey will shed lighton how space innovation is poised
to redefine the business landscape.
Now, this interview was recordedjust before we finished up the
new studio, but it's packed withinsights you won't want to miss.
(10:50):
Let's dive into that now, and thenDave and I will be back to tackle
the exciting future of Industry 4.
0.
Innovation Heroes is proudly producedby SHI, a leading global IT solutions
provider dedicated to making life simplerfor business and IT professionals.
For over 30 years, we've bridgedthe gap between digital strategy
and execution, delivering cuttingedge technology and services to
(11:13):
thousands of customers worldwide.
Whether you're navigatingthe cloud or the cloud.
Strengthening cybersecurity ortransforming your workplace.
SHI is here to help.
To learn more, visit shi.
com slash solve what's next.
That's shi.
com slash solve what's next.
To embrace the future with stressfree scalable solutions that
(11:33):
you and your people will love.
Stacey, welcome back to Innovation Heroes.
Stacey Shulman (11:41):
Thank you.
It's always fun to be here.
Ed McNamara (11:43):
It's always fun to have you.
You, you're going to kick off our seasononce again, and we really appreciate it.
So this is your sixth visit to our show.
Uh, we love having a kickoff theseason because the conversation
could literally go anywhere.
So you're one of the few guests wherewe say, what do you want to talk about?
And over the last few seasons, you'vecovered a wide range of topics from.
Healthcare to hotels and all things AI.
(12:05):
But for this episode, you specificallyrequested that we talk about space.
So I'm in why space and why now?
Stacey Shulman (12:13):
You know, I, this is one that caught me off guard a little bit.
Um, and so I thought that, youknow, we should, um, help others
not be caught off guard by it.
And so it kind of startedearly in the year.
I was, um.
Uh, at an event, and I happen tobe with a man named Cam Ghaffarian.
Cam is the, the person whofounded a lot of space companies.
(12:35):
Um, I would say very unlike someof the other space people that,
that we've seen in the press.
Um, he's highly understated.
And, um, so, um, earlier this year, uh,the U S for the first time in 50 years,
re landed, uh, a craft on the moon.
That was cam's company that did that.
(12:56):
And I was with him the day after thatall happened and got a chance to spend
some really quality time with them onwhat's, what's really going on in the
space, you know, area, it's not somethingI'd really been paying attention to.
And he, he was, um, What was shockingwas how far ahead these technologies are.
Right.
And, um, and, and how far ahead the,the, the next international space
(13:22):
station is, how far ahead we are inlooking at consumer space travel.
And then I started looking at, okay, letme just go look at this, at this industry.
And so maybe a couple offacts on, on the industry.
Um, Kinsey did a study on this,on this space, and they believe
that the space industry by 2035.
(13:45):
We'll be $1.8 trillion industry.
Wow.
And that with an upsidepotential up to 2.31 trillion.
And so when you look at kind ofwhat it is in 2023 or what it was in
2023, it was a $630 billion industrythat most of us were unaware of.
Right.
That's bigger.
(14:05):
Just putting that perspective,that's bigger than the silicon
industry and about, um, half thesize of the payments industry.
And so when we start kind of looking atthose numbers, then I've kind of looked
at, well, let's break down those numbers.
So that number breaks down into,I would say half and half, half
of it is the things, you know,supporting, um, the space industry, the
(14:27):
infrastructure, that's the satellitelaunches, satellites, that industry.
Which is what most people thinkis the space industry, right?
But the other half is theusage of those technologies.
So think about GPS and what GPS did.
To all of our technical enablement.
Um, that was all space technology.
(14:47):
And so if we think about that and youlook at stuff like GPS and what can
happen when you start developing inspace, we know that it's something that
happens kind of overnight, practically.
It feels overnight to us becausewe wake up to it one, one day,
um, where the entire industry hasbeen growing for, for a long time.
(15:08):
And so I've been kind of on thisjourney of looking at, well, what are.
The industries impacted by thetechnologies that might come out of
the space industry and what do weneed to think about is, is all the
different industries for me that allthe industries that touch people.
Ed McNamara (15:26):
Absolutely.
Um, the space industry is expectedto shape numerous industries in the
next five or 10 years from spacetourism to manufacturing in space.
Can you give us an overview ofhow these advancements will impact
various sectors and spur innovation?
Yeah, I'm guessing atthis point, like anybody.
Right.
Um, but, but here's what Ibelieve about innovation.
(15:48):
If you know that there's a disruptivetechnology or innovation or macro trend
happening, even if you don't know howit'll impact you, it's best to get
involved early and evolve with it.
Um, and you know, start buildinghypotheses and start looking.
So I will say my hypotheses on theseareas, um, and, and things that
(16:10):
I've been exploring personally.
You know, one, you, youtalked about manufacturing.
We know that in suborbital space, gravityfree environment, you know, a great vacuum
type environment, um, you can do more, youcan build pure crystals, you can, um, that
the types of, um, chemicals and materialsthat can be combined are different.
(16:33):
Um, you can combine things thataren't combinable here on Earth.
You know, within our,our gravity environment.
So, you know, when you look atmanufacturing, I think there's, we're
going to see new materials come out ofthings that are manufactured in space.
Um, and we're going to seebetter materials coming out of
like crystals that are, that areused in, in compute and whatnot.
(16:54):
Um, I think even Silicon manufacturing.
We're going to see, um, a better way ofdoing silicon manufacturing in space.
So there there's that, there'sthat manufacturing angle.
Then there's the other anglethat, um, around, um, bio biotech.
And the other surprise that kind ofcaught me off guard is when I was on my
listening tour in the beginning of thisyear, I met with a lot of biotechnology
(17:19):
companies and life sciences companies.
And was surprised to hear that a lotof them are already manufacturing
Um, in space, in suborbitalspace, um, I was unaware of that.
Like, I thought it was a novelty,you know, a couple people might
be doing it here and there.
Um, and no, there, there's a lot morethan what I thought happening already.
(17:43):
And so when we start looking at, youknow, the, the field of medicine, I think
we're going to see some, Some things comeout of space and, um, manufacturing and
the life sciences space and biopharmaspace that, that are revolutionary.
And so that, that's another area, um,AI, like we, we like to talk about AI
(18:03):
a lot, um, if we look at, um, the usageof that data, so, you know, even things
like we, we've got, I don't remember howmany, I think it's 50, 000 satellites now.
orbiting the earth and all the data fromthose satellites, you know, it needs to
(18:23):
be looked at and it needs to, and we canuse that data for things like, um, you
know, early warning systems for globalcatastrophes for weather, we can use
that for fire, you know, fire detection,um, these satellites can detect.
You know, within minuteswhen a fire breaks out pretty
much anywhere in the world.
(18:44):
And so those are the types of thingsthat we haven't started really
seeing scale yet, but we're seeing.
Um, proof points that it,that it's going to scale.
And so those are just a few examples.
And I think, you know, the one thingthat I had in my head, I'm like, where is
all of this taking place when you starttalking about like manufacturing in space?
(19:05):
And, you know, I hadn'trealized that there were, 2, 848
satellite launches in 2023 alone.
So you say there's 50, 000 out there.
And then I saw there's almost 2,900 satellite launches just in 2023.
I'm like, boy, there is way moreup there than I had any idea about.
And we're adding to it at a,it's gotta be a record rate.
Stacey Shulman (19:26):
So it's, it's kind of, it's kind of shocking
how fast it's happening and we're,we're just on the front end of it.
Right.
You know, we're seeing the front end ofthat, of getting the infrastructure there.
What happens once thatinfrastructure's there?
The people who invested inthat need to monetize it.
And I think that's where we'regoing to start seeing a lot
of these, um, innovations.
How can businesses leverage the uniqueconditions of space to innovate and
(19:50):
improve their manufacturing processes?
Well, this is the question I think that,that we need to explore is, um, you know,
what we, again, what we know is that,Manufacturing materials, manufacturing
in space, you can do a lot more.
The other, um, angle I would takeon it is that, and a lot of times
in manufacturing, you need eitherextreme heat or extreme cold and the
(20:15):
amount of energy it takes to do thathere on planet, right, is, is insane.
It's crazy amounts of energy to, togo extremes and a lot of materials
manufacturing, you need those extremes.
Well, when you get into space,it's actually, you don't need it.
Energy at all to do that.
You need to put it in the shadeor you need to put it in the sun.
(20:36):
I mean, that's pretty much it.
And you, you have your extremes.
So it's a matter of like movingit from one location to another,
you know, is it shaded or not?
And, um, you, you have theextremes that you need.
So the, I don't think we've scratchedthe surface yet on what manufacturing
and space can do for us, but, um,Again, it's, it's going to get there
(20:58):
quick and, and that's, you know,kind of evidenced by that hockey
stick that we were talking about.
So I anticipate the manufacturingwill be the same kind of hockey
stick, you know, will it be, well,that hockey stick start in 3 years,
5 years or 10 years is a debate.
My bet is that it's closerto the five year mark when we
(21:19):
start seeing that hockey stick.
Um, and, and that's why I'm kindof looking at, you know, if it's
in five year mark, um, a lot of usneed to start thinking about it now.
Ed McNamara (21:31):
Sticking with the moon, um, the efforts to establish
moon bases and eventually occupiedMars, Totally getting momentum.
Um, what are some of the implications ofthese initiatives for businesses on earth?
Like how to, how to, how can companiesget involved or how can they benefit from
these projects, you know, moving forward?
Stacey Shulman (21:49):
Yeah, that's actually one of the areas that's
kind of personally exciting for me.
Um, Um, you know, I kind of lookat the work that I do that benefits
humanity and the work that I dothat, you know, drives a PNL.
Um, so on the work that I do that benefitshumanity side of things, um, this is where
I'm excited is that, you know, if, if,if NASA wants to set up a permanent base
(22:11):
camp on the moon, which is their plan.
Um, and they're going to getastronauts back on the moon by 2030.
Um, and, um, you know,lots going on there.
Well, what you need to do is youneed to have, um, sustainability.
So when we talk about sustainabilitygoals, we're going to see it
in its extreme on the moon.
Um, if you don't have easy accessto water on the moon and how much
(22:33):
water can you fly over from earth?
And so we need to be able to, you know,we know there's ice crystals on the moon.
Um, and, but is that,is it drinkable water?
Likely not.
Um, there's probably a lot ofprecious metals in that water, so
those precious metals need to beextracted out and it needs to be done
in an energy efficient way, whichwe don't have that capability today.
(22:58):
And so the good news is that whengovernment starts trying to solve
those problems, they put investmentinto those things that ultimately
will come back to earth and and.
Improve our lives here.
If we can extract lithium, cobalt andprecious metals from water and make it
drinkable Not only do we get to reusethose precious metals for things that we
need and we don't have to mine them Butwe also can Increase our water supply
(23:24):
And so those types of technologies, Ithink are In our quest for putting a,
uh, you know, something on the moon isgoing to be beneficial for everyone.
And that doesn't even get into verticalmanufacturing or vertical farming and
agriculture in sustainable agriculture,all of these things we're going to need.
Yeah, at eight pounds a gallon, themore you can use of, of anything that's
(23:47):
on the moon already that you don'thave to fly there is would, would be,
would be huge from a water perspective.
Ed McNamara (23:52):
That's a, that's really interesting.
Yeah.
From a construction perspective,you can't fly concrete over.
Great point.
Or metal for that matter.
I mean, you're going to need tomanufacture a 3D print, um, habitats on
the moon using, um, concrete that's made.
Yeah.
Um, and then of course, the other thingis, uh, training from lunar material.
(24:13):
So space programs innovate and planover a much longer time, uh, than, than
what most companies are accustomed to.
It's not really a, it's not,it's not quarter quarter.
That's for sure.
So how could companies align theirquarterly reports and short term
goals with the long term visionrequired to achieve like, let's say
a 30 year goal, which is somebody'scareer versus the next quarterly
Stacey Shulman (24:42):
The benefits, you know, again, I'll, I'll kind of come back
to GPS, um, technologies like that,that, that will, that we will see more
of that come out of, of this effort.
Um, it's not 30 years for that.
So I think that one company shouldlook at kind of that, that roadmap,
you know, you've got your short,medium, longterm roadmap, like any.
(25:03):
I'd say innovation teamshould be doing it.
You've got to make money today tofund your aspirations for tomorrow.
Um, but you should know whatthat roadmap looks like.
And so looking at what doI, what do I need today?
What what's one, what'sthe path to get there?
How do I back into what I need today?
And how does that helpme make money right now?
(25:25):
And so when I look at that, I think,you know, the, the shorter term
horizon are, um, the technologies,the assistive technologies that
are going to come out of space.
Um, the data, um, you know, you lookat the insurance companies, what
they could do with that kind of data.
Um, building companies, what they cando, uh, manufacturing companies and the
(25:46):
medical industry, what can it do with thedata and the experiments and what types of
experiments should they be thinking aboutin space today that all they can, you can
start on now, that's not a 30 year plan.
Um, and then looking at, well,doing a little, you know, I'd say.
Uh, thought experiment on what typesof technologies do we think could be
(26:08):
more beneficial for us as a business?
And what do we think could happen if, youknow, we start building on the moon, if
we start, you know, um, uh, setting uptravel to the international space station?
We're going to have multipleinternational space stations.
We're going to have privateinternational space stations.
What does that look like?
And what, what happens inindustry when that starts?
(26:32):
And that's five, that's not 20 years out.
That's five years out.
Ed McNamara (26:36):
You kind of said a couple of short term already, but you know, five
years, 10 years, you know, what excitingdevelopments are happening right now
that, you know, business leaders can keepan eye on, you know, from, from where
you're sitting, what's your prediction?
Stacey Shulman (26:48):
Well, I think that when we start looking at, you know, again,
manufacturing and biotech, those areareas if they're not looking at space
right now, They're going to be caughtoff guard because it's moving faster
than it's moving around them already.
And their competitors are probably lookingat it, um, um, based on the companies
(27:09):
I've talked to, um, supply chain, um, youknow, anybody who runs a sophisticated
supply chain, start thinking about what itlooks like when, when you can fly goods.
Um, from one part of the world to theother side of the world and under an hour.
Um, what does that doto your supply chain?
Because that's coming withinthe next five years as well.
(27:32):
And so when you, when you thinkabout kind of supply chain, um, uh,
abilities, like if you can get anythingmanufactured anywhere, you know, in
the world, outside of the world, um,and you can have it landed where you
need to land it, um, within hours.
Where do you manufacture?
(27:52):
Um, and those are the types of thingsthat I think, um, you know, I, I think
are going to start, like, really kindof, you know, Disrupting, um, in a
good way, the ways we do things today.
And so, um, and then, youknow, water technology, um,
energy, uh, energy harvesting.
(28:14):
I think all of those categories iswhere we're going to see, um, Huge
improvements and some of that is mixedwith hope, you know, my optimism, of
course, this comes true But this iskind of the indicators that I'm seeing
Ed McNamara (28:29):
That is fascinating.
I I will finally make it to Australiaif we can get we get that flight
down to an hour I will dumb.
I'm there like it's the only it'sthe only thing that stopped me so far
Stacey Shulman (28:40):
But really close.
It's not like 15 years out.
We're talking within, you knowbefore we hit 2030 2030 So within
the next six years, that'll be.
available.
Ed McNamara (28:51):
I love it.
Um, Stacey, thank you somuch for being with us again.
Uh, for listeners interested inlearning more about you or, or
who would like to reach out to youdirectly, what's the, what's the
best place for them to find you?
Yeah, the best places either onLinkedIn or, um, just email me directly.
Stacey Shulman (29:09):
It's stacey.
shulman at intel.
com.
Ed McNamara (29:12):
Awesome.
Stacey.
Thanks again.
Stacey Shulman (29:14):
Thank you.
Ed McNamara (29:18):
So Dave, Stacey shared some big numbers about the future
business potential of space innovation,you know, but businesses aren't used
to thinking long term like that, youknow, and how do you get a business to
go long term big picture thinking Um,when they have, you know, shareholders
who are interested in the next quarterand have some very specific number
(29:41):
performance based short term goals.
You know, how do you, how do you getto that, to that, you know, pie in
the sky, uh, literally ship in thesky, um, kind of way of thinking while
still, you know, hitting all of thoseshort term quarterly goals along the
way that public companies need to.
Dave Gruver (29:58):
Yeah, it's, I think it's a big challenge, right?
When you think about those types oflong term cycles and the fact that
it takes quite a while for thoseinvestments to really drive the return.
Now, the returns are so compelling, right?
That's why you want to do it.
You want to get thereand get those returns.
And so, you know, I think it comes,a lot of it comes down to leadership
and communication in that case, right?
(30:20):
Can you articulate the valueof this endeavor to your
shareholders or your investors?
And keep them engaged alongthe way of getting there.
Can you show the milestones of progressthat will say, yes, we are moving forward.
And also, you know, the level oftransparency you've got to have
about, yeah, we stubbed our toe,but we're still moving forward.
(30:41):
And.
It also, again, you know, it takes, ittakes, I think it takes a, uh, uh, quite a
mindset to have that level of imaginationand commitment and surrounding yourself
with people like that to pull that off.
It's, it's fascinating to think about.
And, you know, the question is,could this create a world where
private companies have a leg up,you know, and then you go back, I
(31:04):
was thinking too, about like Amazon.
How many years did Amazon losemoney before they became the
true behemoth they are now?
And, you know, they had the rightleadership that kept people on board.
They were delivering the serviceand they just kept iterating and
improving to get to where they are now.
I guess that's, you know, oneway to think about it as well.
There's there are companies outthere before this case that have
(31:25):
gone through that, but it's a it'sI don't know how steep a hill it is.
It's a hill into space.
That's pretty steep, butit's a long hill, isn't it?
Ed McNamara (31:33):
And you'd better have a charismatic leader at the top because
that, uh, you know, that, that Amazonwas funded by that rising stock price.
Like what, what happens if that,if that doesn't keep going?
Dave Gruver (31:43):
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah.
It's, it's a really fascinating challengefrom just a financial perspective
to achieve those types of goals.
Ed McNamara (31:50):
In terms of the practical steps businesses can take to prepare
for, I mean, for, for what's next, USHIis always, you know, our goal is we
keep it general because we don't know.
It's, it's solve what's next.
Um, how do, how do businesses just makesure that they're prepared to keep their
minds open to this kind of innovation?
Dave Gruver (32:08):
I think number one, and you kind of said it, open
minded, I think you've got to hireand nurture a mindset of curiosity.
You've got to have thatin your workforce, right?
You can't be holding on to what I have.
You got to be lookingfor what I can do, right?
What can we take forward?
So that to me is justunderpins everything.
If you don't have a curious culture withinyour business, you're potentially going
(32:32):
to miss and to look at, to look to otherareas, you know, If you're in telecom
or you're in pharma or you're in bankingor whatever, or manufacturing, look to
other industries, what are they doing?
Can you pull that over?
But I think those arereally important things.
I think, you know, for us with ourcompany, I think that's one of the things
(32:53):
I love about SHI is that curiosity.
As you may know, we've been working a loton building our AI lab out in Somerset.
Both, you know, using on prem cloudresources, we've extended that to
have endpoint AI as part of that.
We're ready to helpcustomers on that journey.
And how are those tools going to helpthem move their business forward?
(33:14):
Um, you know, it's, it'san interesting thing.
I think the other part of it is, as youlook at that is to know, it's sort of
a paraphrase of an old beer ad, right?
With great automationcomes great responsibility.
Um, and making sure youthink carefully through.
The ramifications as you moreautomate your business, whether it's
a manufacturing process, or it's just,it might even be an internal workflow.
(33:36):
If you don't have the right.
Architecture and understandingof it as well, right?
As you, you know, I P enable more ofyour business, put it on the Internet.
Do you have the right securitycontrols the right defenses there?
Have you thought throughthe what if scenarios?
If this goes wrong, how do we control it?
(33:57):
Stop it.
Reset it.
All those things.
So there's a lot of factors in thisworld we're living in with, you
know, a big part of industry 4.
0 is that level of automation.
Do you have the right sphere ofcontrols around it and understanding
to implement it successfullyand, you know, continuously.
Ed McNamara (34:16):
So we've journeyed through the exciting possibilities that space
innovation brings to the business world,uncovering how these advancements can
drive efficiency, open a whole universeof possibilities and opportunities,
and redefine corporate strategies.
As we move forward, it's crucial forbusiness leaders to stay informed
and proactive about integratingthese cutting edge technologies.
(34:38):
A big thank you to Stacey Shulman forsharing her invaluable insights and
expertise, and to this episode's cohost Dave Groover for joining me in
this Odyssey Exploring Industry 4.
0.
Remember, the future of your businessmight just be found in the stars.
Until next time, keep innovating,stay ahead of the curve.
I'm Ed McNamara, and I'llsee you again in two weeks.
Yeah, I'm, I'm guessing at this point, like anybody, right.
Um, but, but here's what Ibelieve about innovation.
If you know that there's a disruptivetechnology or innovation or macro trend
happening, even if you don't know howit'll impact you, it's best to get
involved early and evolve with it.
Ed McNamara (00:18):
In the world of technology, heroes are everywhere.
They're overcoming disruption, deliveringsustainable outcomes, and fearlessly
forging the future to solve what's next.
Join me, Ed McNamara, as we meet thepeople and businesses driving change
in our constantly disruptive world.
This is Innovation Heroes, apodcast brought to you by SHI.
(00:44):
Hey, innovators.
Welcome back to a brand newseason of Innovation Heroes.
I'm beyond excited to kickoff season six with you.
We've been.
Busy working on 12 amazing hero stories.
And this year we are takingthings to the next level.
We've just moved into our brand newstate of the art podcast studio here at
SHI world headquarters in New Jersey.
If you're listening to the audioversion, this is your reminder
(01:06):
that full video episodes arealso available on our YouTube.
And even though I have a face for radio,as they say, you can head over to youtube.
com and search for SHIcorporation to see us in action.
We're also shaking up the format.
We'll still be speaking to thepeople and businesses behind the most
inspirational innovation stories, butevery now and then I'll ask a colleague
(01:26):
at SHI to join and share their opinionor expertise on the given topic.
Together, we'll dive into the big storiesand share how SHI is helping business
leaders like you solve what's next.
Today, I'm joined by DaveGroover, the field CTO at SHI.
Dave is a powerhouse when it comesto driving technical strategy and
delivering effective solutionsfor SHI's global customers.
(01:48):
Before joining SHI, he spent 25 yearsat AT& T, climbing the ranks to the
title of assistant vice president, andI can't think of a better first co host
to join me on this brand new season.
Dave, welcome to the show.
Dave Gruver (02:01):
Hey, thank you, Ed.
Thanks for having me.
It's good to see you again.
I think we were lasttogether in June at our
Ed McNamara (02:08):
At the End User Computing Summit, that is absolutely correct.
And, uh, hope to see atanother one again soon.
Um, for the purposes of our virtualmeeting today, in today's episode,
we're exploring how Industry 4.
0 is spurring innovations acrossall sectors, from healthcare to
retail, manufacturing, both hereon Earth and even in outer space.
(02:28):
And we'll get to that in a second.
A little later, we're goingto hear from Stacey Shulman.
But for now, let's hear a little bit aboutyou and what you do for SHI's customers.
Dave Gruver (02:36):
Sure.
Um, I've been in this role about a yearand a half in this role of field CTO
focused on the end user compute arena,and I work with our global customers,
our largest customers to identify andexecute to their goals in the end user
compute space, whether it's deploymentsor support transformation, all those areas
that, you know, our global customers areworking to always improve themselves.
(02:59):
We'd like to get in there and helpthem and offer where, you know,
SHI services and capabilities canhelp them improve their business.
Ed McNamara (03:06):
And, and what are they dealing with right now?
I mean, like, what are you seeingin terms of, like, the biggest and
most complex IT organizations thatyou're supporting in the global space?
You know, what, what, what's reallytop of mind for them right now?
Dave Gruver (03:18):
I think, I think it's about, you know, staying current, right?
With everything that's going on with AI.
Especially AI in the endpoint, which isfar less mature than even what's going on
in AI in the cloud, you know, things likechat GPT, but on the endpoint, they're
trying to figure out how to take bestadvantage of these capabilities where
they're going to impact their business.
I think the other thing that playsinto it is technological debt, right?
(03:42):
Especially with thelarge, the larger, older.
Companies that have a lot of legacysoftware and legacy applications that
are really crucial to their business.
How do they move forward andnot abandon those things that
are core to their business?
How do they bring thoseforward economically?
And that's across the board,whether it's finance, pharma.
I mean, you know, communications,entertainment, all the segments
(04:04):
I work with, and you see somecommonalities across the board.
Ed McNamara (04:07):
And, you know, in the concept of industry 4.
0, the fourth industrial revolution,kind of characterized by the
integration of digital technologiesinto manufacturing and industry, you
know, um, like what, what's your take?
Is somebody who.
Who's, you know, who's seasonedthat has kind of seen it all from,
especially from the manufacturer'sside, um, you know, just what's your
take on, on defining industry 4.
(04:28):
0.
And, um, I won't even say that theconstraints, it seems like it's, uh,
you know, we don't even know what the,what, what the constraints might be.
The possibilities seem endless.
Dave Gruver (04:38):
Yeah.
I mean, it's a pretty exciting time, youknow, from a core technology, you look at
sort of AI and edge computing and IOT isbig segments of that, but what it can mean
in terms of manufacturing, in terms of.
More efficiency, betterquality, better repeatability.
Um, also, I think something that getsleft behind sometimes in industry 4.
(04:59):
0 is as you move to these digitalcapabilities, you also expand your access
to the intelligence to run them, right?
The old days of a factory floor, thepeople had to be there to run it.
So you needed people in that area,whether maybe you were in, you know,
the sort of the car industry wereup in the Upper Midwest, or maybe
(05:20):
you're in, you know, um, the garmentindustry or the furniture manufacturing
industry down in the Southeast, right.
Going back, you know, 50 years orso, you had to be on time to do that.
With these digital capabilities,you can access knowledge almost
anywhere in the world and bring itin as part of your manufacturing.
I think that's something thatsometimes gets lost, that capability.
(05:41):
It also has a big impact on thelabor market too, where you might
have been protected regionally.
Right.
You're not competing internationallyfor your job in a lot of cases.
So there's some things going on there.
And I think, you know, there's,I was fortunate before I came
to AT& T and on to SHI, I workedin the manufacturing industry.
I actually built sales for a living forsailboats and I got to see, I actually was
(06:04):
part of a group that really transitionedthe sailmaking industry from a labor
intensive to a capital intensive process.
Where the old way was to sew panelstogether to create a sail, just
like you create a shirt, right?
You sew on the collar,you sew on the sleeves.
That was the old way of doingthat, was labor intensive.
We, where I work, we develop a processto make a sail in one piece, using
(06:26):
large gantries and thread layingmachines, and make this sort of
monocoque structure, and that was sortof that industry's step towards 4.
0.
Manufacturing.
But the other part of that isit really shifted from labor
intensive to capital intensive.
And that changed whocould play in that space.
Right?
(06:46):
So now it's a lot harder.
I think that's going to be aninteresting thing, how this shakes out.
We've seen in sort of the digital worldwhere companies can become cloud based
that can start up very quickly becausethey have access to all these common
resources, I don't know if that's goingto happen in the manufacturing world.
Cause you have to have thatcombination of the manufacturing
capability, but then you need.
(07:07):
Better tooling, whichcan be expensive, right?
And how's that going to play out?
Will that create more consolidation?
I really, I don't know, but it's going tobe an interesting thing to play through.
Ed McNamara (07:17):
I love that you mentioned your experience in sale making, and
I'm really happy that we got to itbecause when I think back to like
the, you know, technology innovation,you know, the shows, innovation
heroes, Stacey Shulman, you know,talks about manufacturing in space.
I mean, how cool is it to you thatas somebody who, you know, is in the,
you know, multi millennium, you know,uh, age of, of, of sail making that,
(07:41):
that, you know, transportation isstill leading the way in terms of where
we might be driving innovation next.
Dave Gruver (07:46):
Yeah, it's pretty exciting.
I think, you know, for me, when I look atsort of the, I think they call it space 4.
0, I think it's got its ownterm now, is that right?
And yeah, I think it's interestingto see what we're doing there.
And it's interesting to see where it canactually touch our lives individually.
Right.
Um, again, I have to go back to sailing.
Um, when we started sailing acrossthe ocean and races when I was
(08:08):
in my twenties, which is with thegray hair, that was a while ago.
Um, you know, it was, it was navigateby the stars using a sextant.
If you're lucky, you sideband radio,you might, when we got a little,
got a little older, we had weatherfaxes, you had this limited data.
Now you have Starlink, and whatan amazing, you know, think
about Starlink, I don't know ifit really falls into space 4.
(08:31):
0, but I think it kind of does becauseof the communication that it allows from
and to really increases the capability.
And that communication is goingto support more data transfer to
space, right, as they improve that.
So that's one thing that I see going on.
The other thing that I thinkis, that I understand is a big
part of, you know, Space 4.
0 is where additivemanufacturing comes in.
(08:53):
And it's been really interestingto see how that goes on.
Behind me, I've got my, you know,I've been a 3D printer hobbyist for a
long time, but to see this same typeof technology scaled up, printing
metals, printing rocket boosters, youknow, um, thrusters and things like
that, and the ability to create inspace, and just that concept overall.
Of additive manufacturing where I'mnot starting with a block of aluminum
(09:18):
or titanium and milling away allthe parts with a lot of waste and
I have to carry all this weight.
Think about that in space.
I can start with a filament of somethingand create without any waste and what
that means in terms of the capabilityand also for additive manufacturing
what you can do in space where gravityIs it a factor as a whole another
(09:40):
leap in capability to create thingsto be used back on Earth or to create
things to be taken forward in space?
I think it's pretty excitingto see what's going on.
And it'll be interesting, youknow, you and I are of similar age.
Um, our, our, our space, I think wewere, when I started, it was space 2.
0 or 3.
0 with the, with the Apollo program.
(10:01):
And, you know, the thing wegot out of that was Tang.
I think we're going to do a little betterthis time with what's going on in Space 4.
0.
Ed McNamara (10:09):
So the buzz around Industry 4.
0 has been impossible to ignore,um, its promise of revolutionizing
industries through advanced technologieslike AI, IoT, and robotics, but
there's an exciting new dimensionto this revolution, uh, space.
To kick off our sixth season, we'veinvited back the wonderful Stacey Shulman,
(10:29):
Vice President of Health, Education,and Consumer Industries at Intel.
With a deep understanding of integratingcutting edge tech into business
strategies, Stacey will shed lighton how space innovation is poised
to redefine the business landscape.
Now, this interview was recordedjust before we finished up the
new studio, but it's packed withinsights you won't want to miss.
(10:50):
Let's dive into that now, and thenDave and I will be back to tackle
the exciting future of Industry 4.
0.
Innovation Heroes is proudly producedby SHI, a leading global IT solutions
provider dedicated to making life simplerfor business and IT professionals.
For over 30 years, we've bridgedthe gap between digital strategy
and execution, delivering cuttingedge technology and services to
(11:13):
thousands of customers worldwide.
Whether you're navigatingthe cloud or the cloud.
Strengthening cybersecurity ortransforming your workplace.
SHI is here to help.
To learn more, visit shi.
com slash solve what's next.
That's shi.
com slash solve what's next.
To embrace the future with stressfree scalable solutions that
(11:33):
you and your people will love.
Stacey, welcome back to Innovation Heroes.
Stacey Shulman (11:41):
Thank you.
It's always fun to be here.
Ed McNamara (11:43):
It's always fun to have you.
You, you're going to kick off our seasononce again, and we really appreciate it.
So this is your sixth visit to our show.
Uh, we love having a kickoff theseason because the conversation
could literally go anywhere.
So you're one of the few guests wherewe say, what do you want to talk about?
And over the last few seasons, you'vecovered a wide range of topics from.
Healthcare to hotels and all things AI.
(12:05):
But for this episode, you specificallyrequested that we talk about space.
So I'm in why space and why now?
Stacey Shulman (12:13):
You know, I, this is one that caught me off guard a little bit.
Um, and so I thought that, youknow, we should, um, help others
not be caught off guard by it.
And so it kind of startedearly in the year.
I was, um.
Uh, at an event, and I happen tobe with a man named Cam Ghaffarian.
Cam is the, the person whofounded a lot of space companies.
(12:35):
Um, I would say very unlike someof the other space people that,
that we've seen in the press.
Um, he's highly understated.
And, um, so, um, earlier this year, uh,the U S for the first time in 50 years,
re landed, uh, a craft on the moon.
That was cam's company that did that.
(12:56):
And I was with him the day after thatall happened and got a chance to spend
some really quality time with them onwhat's, what's really going on in the
space, you know, area, it's not somethingI'd really been paying attention to.
And he, he was, um, What was shockingwas how far ahead these technologies are.
Right.
And, um, and, and how far ahead the,the, the next international space
(13:22):
station is, how far ahead we are inlooking at consumer space travel.
And then I started looking at, okay, letme just go look at this, at this industry.
And so maybe a couple offacts on, on the industry.
Um, Kinsey did a study on this,on this space, and they believe
that the space industry by 2035.
(13:45):
We'll be $1.8 trillion industry.
Wow.
And that with an upsidepotential up to 2.31 trillion.
And so when you look at kind ofwhat it is in 2023 or what it was in
2023, it was a $630 billion industrythat most of us were unaware of.
Right.
That's bigger.
(14:05):
Just putting that perspective,that's bigger than the silicon
industry and about, um, half thesize of the payments industry.
And so when we start kind of looking atthose numbers, then I've kind of looked
at, well, let's break down those numbers.
So that number breaks down into,I would say half and half, half
of it is the things, you know,supporting, um, the space industry, the
(14:27):
infrastructure, that's the satellitelaunches, satellites, that industry.
Which is what most people thinkis the space industry, right?
But the other half is theusage of those technologies.
So think about GPS and what GPS did.
To all of our technical enablement.
Um, that was all space technology.
(14:47):
And so if we think about that and youlook at stuff like GPS and what can
happen when you start developing inspace, we know that it's something that
happens kind of overnight, practically.
It feels overnight to us becausewe wake up to it one, one day,
um, where the entire industry hasbeen growing for, for a long time.
(15:08):
And so I've been kind of on thisjourney of looking at, well, what are.
The industries impacted by thetechnologies that might come out of
the space industry and what do weneed to think about is, is all the
different industries for me that allthe industries that touch people.
Ed McNamara (15:26):
Absolutely.
Um, the space industry is expectedto shape numerous industries in the
next five or 10 years from spacetourism to manufacturing in space.
Can you give us an overview ofhow these advancements will impact
various sectors and spur innovation?
Yeah, I'm guessing atthis point, like anybody.
Right.
Um, but, but here's what Ibelieve about innovation.
(15:48):
If you know that there's a disruptivetechnology or innovation or macro trend
happening, even if you don't know howit'll impact you, it's best to get
involved early and evolve with it.
Um, and you know, start buildinghypotheses and start looking.
So I will say my hypotheses on theseareas, um, and, and things that
(16:10):
I've been exploring personally.
You know, one, you, youtalked about manufacturing.
We know that in suborbital space, gravityfree environment, you know, a great vacuum
type environment, um, you can do more, youcan build pure crystals, you can, um, that
the types of, um, chemicals and materialsthat can be combined are different.
(16:33):
Um, you can combine things thataren't combinable here on Earth.
You know, within our,our gravity environment.
So, you know, when you look atmanufacturing, I think there's, we're
going to see new materials come out ofthings that are manufactured in space.
Um, and we're going to seebetter materials coming out of
like crystals that are, that areused in, in compute and whatnot.
(16:54):
Um, I think even Silicon manufacturing.
We're going to see, um, a better way ofdoing silicon manufacturing in space.
So there there's that, there'sthat manufacturing angle.
Then there's the other anglethat, um, around, um, bio biotech.
And the other surprise that kind ofcaught me off guard is when I was on my
listening tour in the beginning of thisyear, I met with a lot of biotechnology
(17:19):
companies and life sciences companies.
And was surprised to hear that a lotof them are already manufacturing
Um, in space, in suborbitalspace, um, I was unaware of that.
Like, I thought it was a novelty,you know, a couple people might
be doing it here and there.
Um, and no, there, there's a lot morethan what I thought happening already.
(17:43):
And so when we start looking at, youknow, the, the field of medicine, I think
we're going to see some, Some things comeout of space and, um, manufacturing and
the life sciences space and biopharmaspace that, that are revolutionary.
And so that, that's another area, um,AI, like we, we like to talk about AI
(18:03):
a lot, um, if we look at, um, the usageof that data, so, you know, even things
like we, we've got, I don't remember howmany, I think it's 50, 000 satellites now.
orbiting the earth and all the data fromthose satellites, you know, it needs to
(18:23):
be looked at and it needs to, and we canuse that data for things like, um, you
know, early warning systems for globalcatastrophes for weather, we can use
that for fire, you know, fire detection,um, these satellites can detect.
You know, within minuteswhen a fire breaks out pretty
much anywhere in the world.
(18:44):
And so those are the types of thingsthat we haven't started really
seeing scale yet, but we're seeing.
Um, proof points that it,that it's going to scale.
And so those are just a few examples.
And I think, you know, the one thingthat I had in my head, I'm like, where is
all of this taking place when you starttalking about like manufacturing in space?
(19:05):
And, you know, I hadn'trealized that there were, 2, 848
satellite launches in 2023 alone.
So you say there's 50, 000 out there.
And then I saw there's almost 2,900 satellite launches just in 2023.
I'm like, boy, there is way moreup there than I had any idea about.
And we're adding to it at a,it's gotta be a record rate.
Stacey Shulman (19:26):
So it's, it's kind of, it's kind of shocking
how fast it's happening and we're,we're just on the front end of it.
Right.
You know, we're seeing the front end ofthat, of getting the infrastructure there.
What happens once thatinfrastructure's there?
The people who invested inthat need to monetize it.
And I think that's where we'regoing to start seeing a lot
of these, um, innovations.
How can businesses leverage the uniqueconditions of space to innovate and
(19:50):
improve their manufacturing processes?
Well, this is the question I think that,that we need to explore is, um, you know,
what we, again, what we know is that,Manufacturing materials, manufacturing
in space, you can do a lot more.
The other, um, angle I would takeon it is that, and a lot of times
in manufacturing, you need eitherextreme heat or extreme cold and the
(20:15):
amount of energy it takes to do thathere on planet, right, is, is insane.
It's crazy amounts of energy to, togo extremes and a lot of materials
manufacturing, you need those extremes.
Well, when you get into space,it's actually, you don't need it.
Energy at all to do that.
You need to put it in the shadeor you need to put it in the sun.
(20:36):
I mean, that's pretty much it.
And you, you have your extremes.
So it's a matter of like movingit from one location to another,
you know, is it shaded or not?
And, um, you, you have theextremes that you need.
So the, I don't think we've scratchedthe surface yet on what manufacturing
and space can do for us, but, um,Again, it's, it's going to get there
(20:58):
quick and, and that's, you know,kind of evidenced by that hockey
stick that we were talking about.
So I anticipate the manufacturingwill be the same kind of hockey
stick, you know, will it be, well,that hockey stick start in 3 years,
5 years or 10 years is a debate.
My bet is that it's closerto the five year mark when we
(21:19):
start seeing that hockey stick.
Um, and, and that's why I'm kindof looking at, you know, if it's
in five year mark, um, a lot of usneed to start thinking about it now.
Ed McNamara (21:31):
Sticking with the moon, um, the efforts to establish
moon bases and eventually occupiedMars, Totally getting momentum.
Um, what are some of the implications ofthese initiatives for businesses on earth?
Like how to, how to, how can companiesget involved or how can they benefit from
these projects, you know, moving forward?
Stacey Shulman (21:49):
Yeah, that's actually one of the areas that's
kind of personally exciting for me.
Um, Um, you know, I kind of lookat the work that I do that benefits
humanity and the work that I dothat, you know, drives a PNL.
Um, so on the work that I do that benefitshumanity side of things, um, this is where
I'm excited is that, you know, if, if,if NASA wants to set up a permanent base
(22:11):
camp on the moon, which is their plan.
Um, and they're going to getastronauts back on the moon by 2030.
Um, and, um, you know,lots going on there.
Well, what you need to do is youneed to have, um, sustainability.
So when we talk about sustainabilitygoals, we're going to see it
in its extreme on the moon.
Um, if you don't have easy accessto water on the moon and how much
(22:33):
water can you fly over from earth?
And so we need to be able to, you know,we know there's ice crystals on the moon.
Um, and, but is that,is it drinkable water?
Likely not.
Um, there's probably a lot ofprecious metals in that water, so
those precious metals need to beextracted out and it needs to be done
in an energy efficient way, whichwe don't have that capability today.
(22:58):
And so the good news is that whengovernment starts trying to solve
those problems, they put investmentinto those things that ultimately
will come back to earth and and.
Improve our lives here.
If we can extract lithium, cobalt andprecious metals from water and make it
drinkable Not only do we get to reusethose precious metals for things that we
need and we don't have to mine them Butwe also can Increase our water supply
(23:24):
And so those types of technologies, Ithink are In our quest for putting a,
uh, you know, something on the moon isgoing to be beneficial for everyone.
And that doesn't even get into verticalmanufacturing or vertical farming and
agriculture in sustainable agriculture,all of these things we're going to need.
Yeah, at eight pounds a gallon, themore you can use of, of anything that's
(23:47):
on the moon already that you don'thave to fly there is would, would be,
would be huge from a water perspective.
Ed McNamara (23:52):
That's a, that's really interesting.
Yeah.
From a construction perspective,you can't fly concrete over.
Great point.
Or metal for that matter.
I mean, you're going to need tomanufacture a 3D print, um, habitats on
the moon using, um, concrete that's made.
Yeah.
Um, and then of course, the other thingis, uh, training from lunar material.
(24:13):
So space programs innovate and planover a much longer time, uh, than, than
what most companies are accustomed to.
It's not really a, it's not,it's not quarter quarter.
That's for sure.
So how could companies align theirquarterly reports and short term
goals with the long term visionrequired to achieve like, let's say
a 30 year goal, which is somebody'scareer versus the next quarterly
Stacey Shulman (24:42):
The benefits, you know, again, I'll, I'll kind of come back
to GPS, um, technologies like that,that, that will, that we will see more
of that come out of, of this effort.
Um, it's not 30 years for that.
So I think that one company shouldlook at kind of that, that roadmap,
you know, you've got your short,medium, longterm roadmap, like any.
(25:03):
I'd say innovation teamshould be doing it.
You've got to make money today tofund your aspirations for tomorrow.
Um, but you should know whatthat roadmap looks like.
And so looking at what doI, what do I need today?
What what's one, what'sthe path to get there?
How do I back into what I need today?
And how does that helpme make money right now?
(25:25):
And so when I look at that, I think,you know, the, the shorter term
horizon are, um, the technologies,the assistive technologies that
are going to come out of space.
Um, the data, um, you know, you lookat the insurance companies, what
they could do with that kind of data.
Um, building companies, what they cando, uh, manufacturing companies and the
(25:46):
medical industry, what can it do with thedata and the experiments and what types of
experiments should they be thinking aboutin space today that all they can, you can
start on now, that's not a 30 year plan.
Um, and then looking at, well,doing a little, you know, I'd say.
Uh, thought experiment on what typesof technologies do we think could be
(26:08):
more beneficial for us as a business?
And what do we think could happen if, youknow, we start building on the moon, if
we start, you know, um, uh, setting uptravel to the international space station?
We're going to have multipleinternational space stations.
We're going to have privateinternational space stations.
What does that look like?
And what, what happens inindustry when that starts?
(26:32):
And that's five, that's not 20 years out.
That's five years out.
Ed McNamara (26:36):
You kind of said a couple of short term already, but you know, five
years, 10 years, you know, what excitingdevelopments are happening right now
that, you know, business leaders can keepan eye on, you know, from, from where
you're sitting, what's your prediction?
Stacey Shulman (26:48):
Well, I think that when we start looking at, you know, again,
manufacturing and biotech, those areareas if they're not looking at space
right now, They're going to be caughtoff guard because it's moving faster
than it's moving around them already.
And their competitors are probably lookingat it, um, um, based on the companies
(27:09):
I've talked to, um, supply chain, um, youknow, anybody who runs a sophisticated
supply chain, start thinking about what itlooks like when, when you can fly goods.
Um, from one part of the world to theother side of the world and under an hour.
Um, what does that doto your supply chain?
Because that's coming withinthe next five years as well.
(27:32):
And so when you, when you thinkabout kind of supply chain, um, uh,
abilities, like if you can get anythingmanufactured anywhere, you know, in
the world, outside of the world, um,and you can have it landed where you
need to land it, um, within hours.
Where do you manufacture?
(27:52):
Um, and those are the types of thingsthat I think, um, you know, I, I think
are going to start, like, really kindof, you know, Disrupting, um, in a
good way, the ways we do things today.
And so, um, and then, youknow, water technology, um,
energy, uh, energy harvesting.
(28:14):
I think all of those categories iswhere we're going to see, um, Huge
improvements and some of that is mixedwith hope, you know, my optimism, of
course, this comes true But this iskind of the indicators that I'm seeing
Ed McNamara (28:29):
That is fascinating.
I I will finally make it to Australiaif we can get we get that flight
down to an hour I will dumb.
I'm there like it's the only it'sthe only thing that stopped me so far
Stacey Shulman (28:40):
But really close.
It's not like 15 years out.
We're talking within, you knowbefore we hit 2030 2030 So within
the next six years, that'll be.
available.
Ed McNamara (28:51):
I love it.
Um, Stacey, thank you somuch for being with us again.
Uh, for listeners interested inlearning more about you or, or
who would like to reach out to youdirectly, what's the, what's the
best place for them to find you?
Yeah, the best places either onLinkedIn or, um, just email me directly.
Stacey Shulman (29:09):
It's stacey.
shulman at intel.
com.
Ed McNamara (29:12):
Awesome.
Stacey.
Thanks again.
Stacey Shulman (29:14):
Thank you.
Ed McNamara (29:18):
So Dave, Stacey shared some big numbers about the future
business potential of space innovation,you know, but businesses aren't used
to thinking long term like that, youknow, and how do you get a business to
go long term big picture thinking Um,when they have, you know, shareholders
who are interested in the next quarterand have some very specific number
(29:41):
performance based short term goals.
You know, how do you, how do you getto that, to that, you know, pie in
the sky, uh, literally ship in thesky, um, kind of way of thinking while
still, you know, hitting all of thoseshort term quarterly goals along the
way that public companies need to.
Dave Gruver (29:58):
Yeah, it's, I think it's a big challenge, right?
When you think about those types oflong term cycles and the fact that
it takes quite a while for thoseinvestments to really drive the return.
Now, the returns are so compelling, right?
That's why you want to do it.
You want to get thereand get those returns.
And so, you know, I think it comes,a lot of it comes down to leadership
and communication in that case, right?
(30:20):
Can you articulate the valueof this endeavor to your
shareholders or your investors?
And keep them engaged alongthe way of getting there.
Can you show the milestones of progressthat will say, yes, we are moving forward.
And also, you know, the level oftransparency you've got to have
about, yeah, we stubbed our toe,but we're still moving forward.
(30:41):
And.
It also, again, you know, it takes, ittakes, I think it takes a, uh, uh, quite a
mindset to have that level of imaginationand commitment and surrounding yourself
with people like that to pull that off.
It's, it's fascinating to think about.
And, you know, the question is,could this create a world where
private companies have a leg up,you know, and then you go back, I
(31:04):
was thinking too, about like Amazon.
How many years did Amazon losemoney before they became the
true behemoth they are now?
And, you know, they had the rightleadership that kept people on board.
They were delivering the serviceand they just kept iterating and
improving to get to where they are now.
I guess that's, you know, oneway to think about it as well.
There's there are companies outthere before this case that have
(31:25):
gone through that, but it's a it'sI don't know how steep a hill it is.
It's a hill into space.
That's pretty steep, butit's a long hill, isn't it?
Ed McNamara (31:33):
And you'd better have a charismatic leader at the top because
that, uh, you know, that, that Amazonwas funded by that rising stock price.
Like what, what happens if that,if that doesn't keep going?
Dave Gruver (31:43):
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah.
It's, it's a really fascinating challengefrom just a financial perspective
to achieve those types of goals.
Ed McNamara (31:50):
In terms of the practical steps businesses can take to prepare
for, I mean, for, for what's next, USHIis always, you know, our goal is we
keep it general because we don't know.
It's, it's solve what's next.
Um, how do, how do businesses just makesure that they're prepared to keep their
minds open to this kind of innovation?
Dave Gruver (32:08):
I think number one, and you kind of said it, open
minded, I think you've got to hireand nurture a mindset of curiosity.
You've got to have thatin your workforce, right?
You can't be holding on to what I have.
You got to be lookingfor what I can do, right?
What can we take forward?
So that to me is justunderpins everything.
If you don't have a curious culture withinyour business, you're potentially going
(32:32):
to miss and to look at, to look to otherareas, you know, If you're in telecom
or you're in pharma or you're in bankingor whatever, or manufacturing, look to
other industries, what are they doing?
Can you pull that over?
But I think those arereally important things.
I think, you know, for us with ourcompany, I think that's one of the things
(32:53):
I love about SHI is that curiosity.
As you may know, we've been working a loton building our AI lab out in Somerset.
Both, you know, using on prem cloudresources, we've extended that to
have endpoint AI as part of that.
We're ready to helpcustomers on that journey.
And how are those tools going to helpthem move their business forward?
(33:14):
Um, you know, it's, it'san interesting thing.
I think the other part of it is, as youlook at that is to know, it's sort of
a paraphrase of an old beer ad, right?
With great automationcomes great responsibility.
Um, and making sure youthink carefully through.
The ramifications as you moreautomate your business, whether it's
a manufacturing process, or it's just,it might even be an internal workflow.
(33:36):
If you don't have the right.
Architecture and understandingof it as well, right?
As you, you know, I P enable more ofyour business, put it on the Internet.
Do you have the right securitycontrols the right defenses there?
Have you thought throughthe what if scenarios?
If this goes wrong, how do we control it?
(33:57):
Stop it.
Reset it.
All those things.
So there's a lot of factors in thisworld we're living in with, you
know, a big part of industry 4.
0 is that level of automation.
Do you have the right sphere ofcontrols around it and understanding
to implement it successfullyand, you know, continuously.
Ed McNamara (34:16):
So we've journeyed through the exciting possibilities that space
innovation brings to the business world,uncovering how these advancements can
drive efficiency, open a whole universeof possibilities and opportunities,
and redefine corporate strategies.
As we move forward, it's crucial forbusiness leaders to stay informed
and proactive about integratingthese cutting edge technologies.
(34:38):
A big thank you to Stacey Shulman forsharing her invaluable insights and
expertise, and to this episode's cohost Dave Groover for joining me in
this Odyssey Exploring Industry 4.
0.
Remember, the future of your businessmight just be found in the stars.
Until next time, keep innovating,stay ahead of the curve.
I'm Ed McNamara, and I'llsee you again in two weeks.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.