August 20, 2024 • 45 mins
In this episode, we sit down with the married RN duo, Helen and Nigel Naylor, whose careers have spanned Australia, New Zealand, the UK, and the Middle East.
Explore the complexities and nuances of providing healthcare in remote areas through Helen's firsthand experiences in Kalbarri. With no on-site doctors, healthcare providers must step up with high autonomy and adaptability.
Hear about the intricacies of healthcare leadership and the pressures of adapting to new environments on short-term contracts.
Helen and Nigel discuss the personal motivations that drive them, such as staying connected with family, and share unique experiences of living in Australia, including encounters with local wildlife and the necessity of a snake policy.
They conclude with heartwarming anecdotes about the supportive, family-like atmosphere among agency nurses and offer invaluable advice for those considering a move to Australia.
This episode of It Takes Heart has CEO of cmr Sam Miklos hosting alongside Head of Talent and Employer Branding, Kate Coomber.
We Care; Music by Waveney Yasso
More about Helen and Nigel's Charity of Choice:
The Western Australian Nurses Memorial Charitable Trust
The Trust awards grants for use by nurses and midwives to advance health care through education, research, practice and management in all health arenas in Western Australia. Visit www.wanursestrust.com.au for more information.
Get to know cmr better!
Follow @ittakesheartpodcast on Instagram, @cmr | Cornerstone Medical Recruitment on Linked In, @cornerstonemedicalrec on TikTok and @CornerstoneMedicalRecruitment on Facebook.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Waveney (00:00):
We care for the land and sea, we care for the energy,
we care for our community.
Sam Miklos (00:14):
We care, Welcome to.
It Takes Heart.
I'm Sam Miklos and I'm KateCoomba.
We hope you enjoy theseincredible stories of healthcare
professionals making adifference in communities across
Australia and beyond Throughour conversations we look to
celebrate the spirit ofcommunity and care.
(00:34):
We acknowledge the traditionalcustodians of the land who have
long practised and sharedancient methods of healing,
providing care and support fortheir communities with wisdom
passed down through generations.
Kate Coomber (00:46):
Join us as we explore what it truly means to
take heart.
Sam Miklos (00:56):
So our guests today are the unforgettable RN couple,
helen and Nigel Naylor.
They have locummed in manycountries around the world,
including the Middle East, theUK, new Zealand and, of course,
australia.
Our team have worked with Helenand Nigel for a good few years
now and they are so loved by ourclients and their communities.
In fact, often they're promotedwhile on contract or asked to
(01:17):
stay on permanently.
They embody the essence ofnursing excellence.
Their optimism, caring nature,adaptability and remarkable
skill set have not only savedlives but have also inspired
those around them to strive forthe best in healthcare delivery.
Our team at Cornerstone loveworking with Helen and Nigel.
They describe them ashardworking, reliable,
(01:39):
enthusiastic and very thoughtful, and always willing to lend a
hand or, apparently, I've heard,offer a place to stay.
We might dive into that alittle bit too.
So welcome, helen and Nigel tothe it Takes Heart podcast.
Hi, so let's get started.
I want to understand where youboth are now, because you're
both in different spaces.
(02:00):
Where are you, helen?
Do you want to start first?
Helen (02:04):
Mrs.
Where are you, Helen?
Do you want to start first?
I'm in Culberry where we bothstarted and then we kept
extending because we give thestaff Christmas off.
So we stayed behind forChristmas and then they asked me
to move up into the Don role.
We both decided before Waxfordthat if I was going to do a
management role it wouldn't begood for Nigel to still be here
(02:28):
Just because of the conflict oranything like that.
Not that we can't work together, but if there was an issue, how
would it?
Sam Miklos (02:37):
roll out.
Yeah, and so then, nigel, whereare you at the moment?
Nigel (02:43):
I returned to New Zealand at the end of no, I've been
home a month.
I'm due to fly out againtomorrow, but came home.
Dad needed surgery, so I'vecome home, done a few jobs on
the property, a few shifts athome as well, yep, just to
obviously keep my skills up inNew Zealand.
It's certainly a differentlevel of nursing.
Again, it blows me away theautonomy we get in Australia.
(03:09):
Yeah, working the way we work,obviously with wax, we use ETS.
Where we work, we don't usuallyhave a doctor on site, and
coming home to work in anestablishment where doctors are
there, it's quite challengingfor me personally because you
almost have to be wait to betold to do something, whereas
obviously when we're in wa um,we're expected to obviously roll
(03:31):
with the situation, get on,make those judgment calls and
then obviously work alongsideets, um.
So yeah, it's quite, quitedifferent, um, but really enjoy
being home.
Sam Miklos (03:40):
It's nice and cold I bet it is yeah, um, and a few
frosts and is it unusual for you, though, being apart, because
typically would you be togetheruh, we normally work together.
Nigel (03:52):
So when, so when, like when I did canada then last year
, uh, I was there a month beforehelen arrived, um, and then
obviously, yeah, we've worked inmost places together, so
obviously, carnarvon, kalbarri,northampton, we've always been
together.
And, like Helen just said, wedecided from the outset, if
Helen took the management role,I would step down and move
(04:13):
somewhere else, because when wewere in New Zealand, I was the
manager of a large ED and Helenwas one of my staff at the time
and it just, even though therewasn't a problem, it just
created the possibility forconflict with other members of
staff.
So we decided from the outset,like Helen said, that I would
move away.
So I'm heading back to Mullowa,so a smaller site, but, yeah,
(04:35):
looking forward to it.
Sam Miklos (04:36):
How far away from each other will you be then?
About two and a half hours.
Kate Coomber (04:40):
Okay, and do you stay?
Sam Miklos (04:42):
would you stay together or is it more of a
weekend catch-up?
Nigel (04:45):
No, we'd catch up on days off, yeah, yeah, and work
through that one.
Kate Coomber (04:49):
Yeah lovely, ooh la la, yeah right, ooh la la.
Nigel (04:54):
Watch out Some fancy dating potential out there in
Dungy Way.
Helen needs me to do herironing.
Helen (05:00):
Oh.
Sam Miklos (05:01):
I love that.
How rude and what do you needfrom Helen Nigel Trouble?
Kate Coomber (05:12):
Do you know what?
I would love to go back andtalk about your earlier career
and maybe where you met.
You know, detecting accents,obviously.
Where's home she ground.
Sam Miklos (05:26):
Oh okay, where did you study?
And that's a wrap, accents,obviously and where did where's
home she?
Nigel (05:30):
grew up.
Oh, okay, so.
So obviously we're both.
We're both from the uk, um,we're both from yorkshire, uh,
so the thing about the uk is youcan live literally 20 meters
away from someone, have adifferent accent yes, um, and
different, totally differentdialect, um.
So Helen is from the next townto where I was from, even though
she's got a rather northernaccent.
So, yeah, we're only maybe 20miles apart.
(05:52):
We met whilst we both served inthe Territorial Army in the UK.
We were at an air show, aWellington air show.
We used to support the air showfrom the field hospital point
of view in case there was amajor incident.
And, yeah, we were drunk and wemet.
Helen (06:12):
They spotted my poo bear tattoo and that was it.
Oh, like all, good love stories.
Sam Miklos (06:18):
We were drunk and the rest is history.
So what?
About your career then fromthat point, were you both
studying, nursing at the time?
Nigel (06:29):
We were both qualified, weren't we?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, we were bothqualified.
I was working, I had beenworking in theatres, in theatre
recovery, and Helen would havebeen an ED nurse at the time.
Fantastic, in differenthospitals.
Sam Miklos (06:42):
So then, you've gone on to… Many, many moons, many
moons.
What happened next?
And Helen?
Nigel (06:43):
would have been an ED nurse at the time in different
hospitals, so yeah, so thenyou've gone on to have Many,
many moons.
Helen (06:47):
Many moons.
What happened?
Sam Miklos (06:48):
next yeah, you've gone on to have this big,
impressive career working aroundthe world Like have you just
chosen places and moved to there?
Kate Coomber (06:59):
How's the opportunity?
Helen (07:00):
come about.
There was a lot going off whenwe first met because I was
actually married to somebodyelse.
Whoa, that's bad, isn't it?
I love that, yeah, but thingshappen and it was never.
We were together for a lot ofyears, me and kevin, and had
three lovely boys together, butwe just grew apart.
(07:21):
I still loved him, but I wasn'tin with him.
And people say what changed?
It was me, not, you know, youjust outgrow the relationship.
I'd been seeing him since I was16.
Yeah, and along come my toy boy, 12 years younger.
Sam Miklos (07:38):
I'm assuming that's Nigel.
No, no, no.
Is there another answer?
Nigel (07:44):
I'm 12 years younger than her first one.
Helen (07:47):
Oh, okay, eight years younger than me, so I'm still a
cougar.
Sam Miklos (07:55):
Love it, love it.
Helen (07:56):
Yeah, and then we followed a friend to New Zealand
, and the reason we picked NewZealand rather than Australia,
that's where she went um, andbecause I don't do spiders, yeah
, I'm shocking.
If a spider's there on apatient, I'm not going you're
out, you're like no, yeah, callthe team.
Sam Miklos (08:16):
So how did you?
How did you end up then in themiddle east?
Nigel (08:21):
so we were, because we were in the territorials.
It was the second iraq war and,um, it was quite a bizarre
situation at the time.
Um, there was, they didbasically a compulsory call up,
so it was the biggest compulsorycall up since world war ii, um,
and at the time the weird thingwas that there was a fireman
strike on at the time at homeand they so they decided to use
(08:42):
the regular soldiers, thefull-time soldiers, to stay at
home and fight the fires,literally, and they sent their
part-time soldiers to war.
Right, so it was a bit of aweird one.
Helen was at sandhurst, becausehelen was a lieutenant um, and
so she was at sandhurst doingher, finalizing her officer
training.
And they, they said basicallybefore she went if you do this,
(09:05):
you'll be going somewhere hotand sandy.
And Helen's like yeah, yeah,I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm going to
listen to what they're tellingyou.
And she's like, yeah, so anyway, helen was in Sandhurst and
this brown envelope arrives onthe doorstep, so I thought I'll
open it, have a look.
And so I start reading it andwe're like okay, okay, starts
again.
And it was my name in the onall the paperwork, but helen's.
(09:25):
So I was like okay.
So I just started a new job ata private hospital in the uk and
I had to say to my boss I'm,I'm off to war, wow she was like
okay, and then helen'spaperwork came, maybe a week
later, but it was just a littlebit.
Like you know, you need toreport to this place at this
time and if you don't basicallyturn up, you'll be arrested.
Sam Miklos (09:44):
It was was just like it was that serious and were?
You going to the same place.
Nigel (09:52):
Yeah, so we initially started in Kuwait, didn't we
together?
Well, helen, the night Iarrived, there was a sandstorm
and Helen was in the camp at thesandstorm.
Yeah, helen's tent blew awayand all the clothes.
Kate Coomber (10:03):
Oh my gosh.
Sam Miklos (10:05):
And what year is this?
No ironing there, helen, we'dalways be friends with everybody
.
Helen (10:09):
So the pioneers looked after us because we'd been doing
their sandbagging.
So we got to play a game offooty with them.
So they moved the trucks aroundto try and protect us but you
couldn't see a thing and you hadto put your respirator on and
everybody all dance.
So it was like, and I spent thenight in the Clydesdale tent
(10:31):
because our tent wasn't thereanymore.
Sam Miklos (10:34):
But yeah, it's interesting stories and I'm
surprised they actually sent meBecause what was the role, what
was the role you were doingthere?
Helen (10:43):
In the war zone.
It was actually I.
I was in the ED at the mainfield hospital, which was
200-bedded field hospital.
Yeah, wow.
Sam Miklos (10:52):
And what about your role, Nigel, there?
Nigel (10:55):
I was attached to a medical supply regiment because
in the territorials I didn'tjoin as a nurse, I joined to get
away from nursing, so I joinedas a driver, so I was a heavy
goods driver, yep, uh.
And then they sent me when theysent me out, they touched me to
the med supply regiment.
So we used to cover the threeservices and the prisoners of
war, um, so we'd make sure allthe med supplies were available
(11:18):
for them.
Uh, down to like having a bloodbank, um, you know, so we could
do a major blood drive if weneeded to.
Out there, how long were youout?
How long were you?
Um, I think in total I wasabout six months, so didn't seem
.
But we were there before thewar, when the war, the day the
war started, and even though theactual fighting only lasted
(11:39):
maybe a couple of weeks,obviously the ongoing effects
are still being seen today.
Sam Miklos (11:43):
Yeah so yeah, helen, being in a, you know, a 200 bed
ed facility there, how was thatlike, would you say on
reflection, that was rewarding,was it stressful, was it scary?
Helen (11:54):
yeah, yeah everybody asks that question was it scary?
It's a different what you'dthink I'd be scared of.
We weren't.
It was pitch black on the night.
So I could tell you storiesabout a nurse who actually went
to the toilet, got lost andended up in the trenches.
Oh my gosh, which she wastraumatised, so we had to talk
(12:16):
her down a bit.
We actually built the fieldhospital from scratch, so it was
putting all the tent work upand stuff and people were coming
down with diarrhea and vomitingbecause the water was just
they'd sent out natural springwater but left it in the desert
condition so it was like 50degrees and it was cooking all
(12:37):
the bugs.
So people were getting sicknessand diarrhea, yeah, and it's
actually in the British Army toget dehydration.
Oh, wow, yeah, well, but whatdo you do when they're causing
it.
Sam Miklos (12:48):
This is it.
I was just going to sayabsolutely so how did you get to
Australia?
Helen (12:56):
So I'm going to do what Nigel says.
How did we get into nursing Allright by a plane?
Fair point.
Sam Miklos (13:04):
Fair point.
That was Kate's question.
Was it a good plane?
Long last one.
Helen (13:15):
Better than the one we went to Bali on oh there you go.
We did a few years where I hadissues with my health.
I had an accident with my legand it had led to other issues
and I've actually got apacemaker that doesn't cause any
problems now and I just went.
(13:35):
If I don't do it now, I'llnever do it, and it's always
been one of my dreams notNigel's to actually do Australia
.
But do they really outbackremote stuff and make a
difference?
And I guess.
Kate Coomber (13:49):
Maybe could you share what you feel that
difference is in comparison to.
You know you've talked aboutthe work that you're doing in
New Zealand and in a busyhospital where there's a big
team around you, versus whenyou're very remote.
I think maybe some peoplelistening might not understand
what remote means and just howremote it is Like.
(14:10):
I'd love to hear from yourperspective paint a picture of
what that is and the impact.
Then you can have.
Nigel (14:17):
So New Zealand, everything.
So the rule of thumb in NewZealand is there's only two
degrees of separation betweeneverybody.
Everybody knows someone whoknows somebody, and that was
proven when we came to Australiaand we're looking at people who
are like we know them, and likethere was a girl in Carnarvon
where Helen goes.
I know her from somewhere andit turns out that she was one of
Helen's students when she was alecturer, a nursing lecturer,
(14:41):
and then our previous Don atCalbury.
We're like again nursinglecturer, and then our previous
don at carberry.
We're like, again, we know himand again he was one of our
students as well, you know.
So it's, it's very small.
We bought a car in x-mas andthe lady we bought the car of,
her partner knew a lady we workwith from new zealand.
It's just everything's just sosmall and using.
So a lot of people know people.
So like the saying is, if youkick one person, half a town
(15:03):
limp, um, whereas in australiathe, the sheer size of australia
is, is phenomenal and I don'tthink people can grasp it.
It's like when they say, oh,it's just down the road, in
australia it could be a thousandk's.
It's like, okay, that's notjust down the road.
But you do 100k's in australiaand you see nothing.
You do 100k's in new zealandand you've gone through maybe a
(15:24):
dozen towns.
Yes, you know, it's like it'sjust, yeah, the vast scope of
australia, it blows my mind.
And being able to offer healthcare in those places where
resources are limited, so evenplaces like cowberry.
You know it's, yeah, it's onlytwo hours from gerrardton, but
it's still two hours.
If you need acute care, youknow there's no physical doctor
(15:45):
on the site, so you are thebarrier between life and death
there's no other way to put itfor some people.
Whereas in New Zealand you knowthere aren't many sites, if any
, that there aren't doctors andyou are relatively close to most
things.
So for, like, where we live,here're 20 k's away from our
(16:06):
nearest town, um, but the major,major regional hospital would
be, for us would be an hour anda half away, yeah, um, or we can
go to rota, which is maybeanother 40 minutes.
But again, the the healthsystem in new zealand now it's
only one system calledwhereifata Ora, where we had 20
DHBs previously.
Um, you, they were quite strictabout um boundaries, like, oh
(16:29):
well, you live here, you belongto that one and it's getting a
little bit more flexible now.
So, yeah, having just the sheersize of Australia yeah, is is
the thing that people are goingto be.
If they've never been, they'rejust going to be blown away by
and I guess one of thosehospitals.
Kate Coomber (16:44):
If we look at calvary, you know how many beds
are in that hospital.
What does it look like?
Helen (16:51):
it's actually quite.
I'm going to pinch this onenight, all scenes I'm.
We've got four bedded likelittle ward thing if somebody
needs to stay overnight and thenwe've got a palliative bed.
And what's nice is you get theprivilege to meet the community,
the people there, so everybodyknows everybody.
(17:13):
So when you go to the shop webumped into a lady who I call my
kiwi sister from another mister.
She's coming for a patient andI was just like catching up and
we're oh hi, how are you doing?
Meaning, how was she doing?
Yeah, and she went all on abouther injury that she'd been in,
and I thought, no, that's notwhat I want to talk about.
(17:35):
You know, and I always say topeople, because you can build up
a good rapport with somebodywhen you're working with them,
when they see us out in thecommunity, you can just smile
and they can either acknowledgeyou or ignore you, because
people will wonder how you'vemet yeah, yeah and then it's
that confidentiality yeah butwhen you're working in smaller
(17:55):
ones and like when we go likenight of limbalua, it's trying
to make a difference with thecommunity.
So it's not just about nursingnursing in the workplace, it's
about what can we do for thatcommunity.
So we'd even looked at maybedoing some volunteer working for
saint john's, if was there away we could do that yeah,
(18:16):
fantastic as we move along,because nigel actually does
search and rescue in new zealand.
Right, he does it to go up inthe helicopters.
I'll tell you that.
But yeah, there's ulteriormotives.
But, yeah, it's just, we likeeducation.
So one of the things we lookedat was maybe he doesn't have
thought about this.
(18:36):
This is my next one.
Sam Miklos (18:39):
I love that you're about to drop this Nigel's like
all right strap in.
Kate Coomber (18:42):
Nigel, let's plan this out.
Helen (18:44):
Doing our ACLS instructor's course.
Right, doing our ACLSinstructor's course?
Because if we're the back ofthe hand and the nurses are
struggling to get to the courses, we can provide that in our
normal hours at no extra pay tokeep people upskilled, because
we've got these different layersthat we can bring to our
workplace.
Sam Miklos (19:04):
It's stuff like that that's so special too.
That's the sort of stuff thatwe really look to share those
stories, because I think there'sso many layers to what you can
do when you go into thesecommunities.
Like you said, it's not justnursing and the health facility.
It's all the volunteering andthe work that you can do.
And then it's also what otherskills do you have that you can
upskill and leave a legacy inthat community as well?
Kate Coomber (19:25):
And if you can be doing that there locally and
people aren't having to travel,then you're improving the
patient outcomes there.
Of course you are, yeah, youknow there's, I imagine, a gap
between the outcomes, sometimesin very, very remote areas
versus what's accessible in ametro area, and it sounds like
all of those initiatives thatyou're talking about get on
(19:46):
board Nigel, because it's bookedby the sounds of it.
Well, now you know that's ahuge impact to that community.
Nigel (19:54):
The thing is, as you say, you can't just walk into a
community and start dictatingthe way things need to be.
You know you're doing thiswrong.
You need to do this becauseyou've got to learn how the
community and it's the same herein New Zealand you have to
learn how the community and it'sthe same here in New Zealand.
You have to learn about thecommunity before you can be part
of that community.
Sam Miklos (20:10):
How do you do that?
How do you do that respectfully, particularly when you're
coming in and out on contract?
Nigel (20:16):
For us personally.
I mean, we've been in NewZealand now.
This is 21 years now and evennow it's still hard to
understand the ins and outs ofthe indigenous side of things.
Luckily New Zealand, most ofthe Maori Iwi, they do things
(20:37):
similarly, whereas in Australiabecause I said in Canada one day
when we were there I said whydon't we have like a cultural
education system where you canlearn about the culture and
start to engage and try to bemore proactive with the, with
the population?
And the lady I spoke said shewas the um, she was the
aboriginal liaison officer withthe police and she said it's
(21:00):
just physically impossiblebecause you've got so many um,
so many groups to deal with, somany mods, that you can't.
You could do something for onegroup here and then 20 metres
away their customs are totallydifferent.
Kate Coomber (21:15):
It's not one size fits all.
It's interesting because wetalk about it in our teams a lot
of how do we upskill andprepare people more?
But that's a really interestingpoint.
Nigel (21:27):
Yes, I think just having a broad knowledge, having some
knowledge, is better than noknowledge, but it's about having
the right knowledge, if thatmakes sense I think sometimes,
on a less serious note, it'sjust be genuine, yeah and talk
to people, so I use a lot of funand humor when I'm working.
Helen (21:44):
It's just and, believe it or not, so does nigel.
Yeah so we get up to all sorts,and I think it's that genuine
thing.
So I'll say to someone look, ifI do something wrong, tell me,
I'll be mortified, and it'sgenuine and it's lovely.
I upset a lady in triage and Ididn't.
It wasn't anything I'd donewrong.
(22:04):
I just said to her she wasspecial to me, she was my first
indigenous lady that I'd everworked with and I says so she'll
follow me wherever I go,because I'll remember her.
And she just burst into tears.
I was like, oh my God, I'vemade her cry.
But we had a laugh and a jokeand I just went.
(22:24):
I'm sorry, I didn't mean tomake you cry and I think she was
just touched because it wasgenuine.
And the other thing that worriedme was we're English and I
thought is this going to be abad thing when we're going to
these communities because of thelost generation and stuff like
that?
And you do feel it, buteverybody's been absolutely
(22:47):
lovely and because there is nofilter, I am what I am.
They actually appreciate that,and so I do do stuff a little
bit outside the norm.
So I've arranged for people toget home with the attendance and
you know, um, one of the ladiessaid you should come out back.
She said they'd love you.
(23:08):
Yeah, because I tell jokes, I'mstraight up.
I try and pitch it at a levelthat people will understand.
Yeah, because what's clear toone person isn't going to be
clear to another absolutely andthen that's why, as a nurse,
you're their advocate they saystop.
If you don't understand whatthey're saying, just ask them to
(23:29):
stop and we'll make them tokeep saying it till you get what
they're actually saying, andthat's what we need to bring it
sounds like you've.
Kate Coomber (23:38):
You've really got to have the right intentions
when you do this line of work itpossibly isn't for everyone,
and if you want a bit ofautonomy in a large hospital
where you don't see the samepeople twice and on different
shifts all the time, you reallyneed to want to immerse yourself
in the community.
I guess for someone wonderingwhether this could be the career
(23:59):
for them, or could they do thisfor a couple of years, or could
they try it, what advice do youhave?
Or really, I guess, littlenuggets.
That's really really criticalfor them to know and understand.
Nigel (24:13):
I always tell people, even from a New Zealand
perspective.
I've spoke to staff while I'vebeen working here and they say,
oh, I really want to.
I say go for it, do it.
What we found coming from theUK to New Zealand initially was
the opportunities here areamazing.
They really really are.
In the UK when we were there itwas like pardon the pun, it was
a bit like dead man's shoes.
(24:34):
You know, you had to wait forsomeone to leave or die before
you could progress through thesystem because it was so tight
that everyone was fighting forthe same thing.
Whereas come to New Zealand,I've done multiple things.
I've been management.
I've done nurse specialistroles.
You know I was a duty managerin a large thousand bed hospital
.
You know I've been able to dothese because I've strove to
(24:57):
push myself and the opportunityto be in there.
It's the same in australia.
If you want to, you can do it.
The only thing stopping you inaustralia is yourself.
Yeah, it really really is.
Um, because you know you go.
I can't do it today becauseit's like no, that's an excuse,
you know, just go for it if you.
If you do it and hate it, youjust say I didn't enjoy that and
I won't go back there again.
(25:18):
Yeah, because you won't knowwhat about training, helen?
Sam Miklos (25:22):
you know you've kind of touched on a little bit
there of cultural awarenesstraining.
You know the als, how do youmanage the training component?
Helen (25:30):
I actually think Karana is a good move going to Karana
and do them sort of courses.
Somebody suggested it to us andwe didn't.
It's one of the managers, youdon't know what you don't know,
but Karana will get you readyfor the different steps and even
if you don't want to goremote-remote, which is where
we're heading, somewhere likeCalbury, it's still a good sound
(25:56):
courses to do, regardless of ifyou're at the older end, like
both me and Nigel are, or theyounger end, just to get you
ready for them placements,because it's lifelong learning,
this nursing, it always has beenyeah um, I do think make sure
you've got your ed experience inthe bigger hospitals, because
(26:16):
you're exposed to more yesbut then you're not down to the
actual assessment skills andstuff and that the more you do
it, the better you and some ofthe people don't realize how
intense the training is.
Now it was funny because when Iapplied at Cornerstone she said
, oh, you haven't got yourdegree.
(26:37):
And I went, I used to.
I said have you looked at my CV?
I've actually taught degreenurses.
I've got more than that degreenurses.
I've got more than that.
I just don't.
So I was going towards mymasters and then things happened
and I just didn't bother tofinish it but I was only two
papers off some past that.
Yeah, I'm the post-grad face,but yeah, it's just lifelong
(27:01):
learning and do their littlestuff.
So, but it's gonna move on to.
One of the other questions is um, you have to when you move into
these different areas.
Different places have differentpolicies and guidelines.
You've got to practice withintheir guidelines so you might be
able to suit you.
(27:21):
You might have pick line access, but is it okay to use it in
wax?
So, like your three yardstraining, then you have to get
it signed off by wax before youcan actually use it and that can
be one of the tricky things.
Everything's a process, isn'tit?
Kate Coomber (27:41):
And what about the challenges that you know it
sounds like you've had?
Well, you've stepped into thisDonrol at the moment.
What comes with that?
Is it really hard decision?
Obviously this one might havebeen even trickier because you
couldn't continue to worktogether.
But typically stepping intothose leadership roles when
you're on a short term contractand it's not a permanent
(28:02):
position what comes with that?
Is there concerns of whathappens next when you leave?
Or is it challenging to step upand sort of get the confidence
of the team?
Or is it challenging to step upand and sort of get the um, the
confidence of the team, or isit?
Is it quite straightforward?
Helen (28:17):
in new zealand when we nidal said he was the manager of
ed.
What he failed to remember isthat they actually made me into
one of the duty managers.
So I managed two hospitals andthat was just nuts.
So the phone calls, thepressures, doing the staffing,
(28:38):
the transfers, the two bighospitals and getting paid less
than what I do on the floor here, yeah, it's just nuts.
Yeah.
So coming into this, it's gotdifferent challenges being a
smaller place, because the small, a smaller workforce can
actually be more tricky andthere's dynamics to play.
(28:59):
But when you've got that, anymanagement's the same sort of
thing.
You've got processes and stuff.
What I found hard with this onewas the different software.
So they said a pink sheet.
Sam Miklos (29:13):
What the hell is a pink sheet?
The hell is a picture.
Helen (29:15):
Yeah, yeah yeah, and it's on microsoft teams, um, and the
processes, and sometimes,because calvary's hasn't had
somebody permanent for a longwhile, it's the staff are sick
of the change.
You know, somebody comes inwith brand new ideas and they've
heard it, seen it, done it.
They're not interested.
(29:36):
Yeah, and I think what helpedwith me is I've actually been on
the floor so they knew me.
Yeah, I wasn't going to changewho I was just because I'm in
this role.
Yeah, but I do have to managethem and you're contracting in
that role.
Sam Miklos (29:50):
Is that right?
Helen (29:50):
yeah, I've got.
They wanted me to take on apermanent fixed-term contract
and Cornerstone was really goodand said you know, if you want
to do it, they don't.
You know we accept, that's thenorm.
But then, looking at the prosand cons, if you ask me what
keeps me going, I live for mygranddaughter in New Zealand, so
(30:15):
I need to be able to go onregular and that's why coniston
ticks all the boxes for me.
Yeah, I can do a contract andthen I can go home for a month
and see elena, yeah.
So she says, mama, you've beenthere too long this time and she
wants to come and see thesnakes and the crocodiles, so
hopefully we'll get her out.
Sam Miklos (30:36):
So I was going to ask you about the reptiles there
, because you said earlier,helen, that the spiders are not
a thing.
I assume they are, and nowyou're out in Kalbarri Like how
are you coping with the, becausea lot of the English are really
freaked out about theAustralian wildlife.
You know how are you coping?
Helen (30:54):
Well, for the first, how many months was it About eight
months, Nigel.
We didn't see a kangaroo.
Nigel (31:00):
Alive kangaroo, alive kangaroo, alive kangaroo, yeah,
yeah, yeah.
Helen (31:06):
But here there's millions of them and they're just
stopping around.
Sam Miklos (31:09):
Yeah, and it was funny.
Helen (31:10):
I was showing my son on because we do a lot of Messenger
.
The kangaroos and he's like mom, don't go any closer because
we've watched the clips onyoutube yeah, yeah, where the
people are with them and they'retrying to drown dogs.
Oh my god, so great.
Look at me I'm going closer butan emu's.
We've seen emu's and we've seena bobtail.
Sam Miklos (31:32):
We've had the kangaroos come up to the
hospital door and go no, sorry,we don't treat kangaroos here we
don't treat you no, not today,not today.
Helen (31:41):
And spiders, we haven't really seen that many.
So I've seen a snake inCarnarvon and did you know?
The policy is you've got tohave four people when you see a
snake, till the snake catchercan get there.
Oh wow, but it was themaintenance guy who come and I
was so silly with him.
I can't believe I gotstarstruck because he come and
(32:03):
he just looks like steve and heeven dressed like him and I was
like, oh my god, it's that guywho died with the fish.
Oh God, I love that there's evena snake.
He just went downhill fromthere we were talking about.
Sam Miklos (32:17):
And that was when I was Keep going, keep going.
Helen (32:20):
That was when I was the after hours manager.
Oh my God.
Sam Miklos (32:28):
The fact that you need a snake policy, like of all
the other things these roomright area nurses have got to
contend with.
It's also a snake policy.
So area nurses have got tocontend with.
It's also a snake policy.
So the I guess the nicknamethat we've heard that you've got
is that a lot of the agencynurses will call you mom and dad
.
Did you know that?
yeah, yeah, yeah, as a parent,like I was like there's so many
things that that brought up forme like why?
Why are they calling you momand dad?
What's, what are you bringing?
(32:48):
That's special?
Nigel (32:49):
I think we just we treat.
We treat people like theyshould be trapped.
So everyone deserves right tobe that an individual, but we
try to look after people as well.
It's like helen says, you know,if it was our kids that were
somewhere foreign and you know,and they're on their own because
a lot of these, uh, a lot ofthese people are traveling on
their own.
So we're quite fortunate becausewe're a couple, whereas if
you're a young single female sosomewhere like Carnarvon, where
(33:13):
the not to put people off, butthe local children can be quite
intimidating at times they'rerunning around, they're slapping
them on the backside and things.
It's quite off-putting foryoung, pretty girls to be
walking around somewhere atnight.
So we just try to look afterpeople.
We invite them to do thingswith us.
(33:33):
If we've got a bit of sparefood, if we're leaving, we
always pass the food on.
We're not paying it forward,yeah, and we just like to look
after people because, again, youknow that's part of what's
lovely we are a family at theend of the day.
Yeah, healthcare is a family.
Kate Coomber (33:55):
Did we hear the team talk about a story about a
pub, new year's?
Sam Miklos (33:57):
eve in a pub, is that one we can share, or that's
a?
Helen (33:58):
that's a later it makes us light up.
I wasn't sure if we're beingset up or not.
Nigel (34:03):
This last new year's eve we were.
We were just in the pub and weinvited uh, one of the girls,
rachel, along.
She was next door in theapartments where we were and
it's just come to the pub,there's a band on and we had.
We'd have a good night towardsthe end of the where we were and
we just come to the pub,there's a band on and we had a
good night.
Towards the end of the night wewere on the dance floor dancing
and this guy just comes up andbasically taps on the shoulder
and says is it all right if Iask your daughter if she wants
to come out for a drink?
And we're like she's not ourdaughter.
Helen (34:28):
There's the mum and dad, isn't it?
She's lovely.
Sam Miklos (34:31):
I bet you've got our approval.
Helen (34:33):
Yeah, it was funny because we were all Kiwis,
because we classed ourselves asQuinglish.
Sam Miklos (34:40):
So we're.
Helen (34:40):
Kiwis.
Kate Coomber (34:42):
I haven't heard that before.
Helen (34:44):
Yeah, we're Quinglish and if she was our daughter we'd be
well proud.
But we said to her you know, ifshe didn't want, if she didn't
feel safe, we'd stick around.
If she was okay and she wantedto rendezvous with the bike she
just had to say you know wecould go, but she'd come home
with us, and it's just that sortof thing.
(35:04):
You know, we left Rachel Leepaddleboard for you as well.
We went home and then she leftit at the health centre, just
little things like that, and Ithink it goes a long way, and we
have a cornerstone family, soin canada we had all the
cornerstone yeah, yeah, I'd saygirls, but then there was nigel,
(35:24):
so I was all together, whichwas nice and, but we look after
the agency staff as well.
So just an example I ended uphaving to do a night shift on
Sunday and one of the girls wasfinishing on the Monday, but she
couldn't get a bus intoGeraldton until Tuesday and she
(35:47):
was going to be meeting herfriends.
So I actually drove her toGeraldton, took her to the
hospital and dropped her off atthe accommodation and I says I
don't want anything, I just wantyou to pay it forward.
So if you can help somebody else.
That's what you do.
That's what you do.
It's that.
And Sophie was our first kid,wasn't she?
Nigel (36:07):
She's in Axewath College.
Sam Miklos (36:10):
Do you find it hard to leave these communities?
Like you really, you do createsuch a community around you
where you go.
Is it hard to move on?
I suppose it is yeah.
Nigel (36:23):
I suppose it is to a point because you do.
Even in the bigger places youstill develop relationships with
some of the clients becausethey are horrible phrase
frequent flyers.
They do obviously require moreintense usage of the health
system than others.
So you start to see people.
It's a bit like the analogywhere on the surgical ward the
(36:48):
patient comes in, they have thesurgery, they go home, whereas
on the medical ward you see thesame people time and time and
time and time again.
They either get better or theydon't.
And it's a bit like that.
You do develop thoserelationships or those rapport.
And then it's about that again.
It creates that trust with theclient and their family, because
obviously it's bigger than justthe client.
And again, with some of thepopulations we're dealing with,
(37:10):
it makes it more difficult.
Helen (37:13):
I think it's the same with the staff as well.
The ability of being agencies.
You can go back.
Nigel (37:18):
Yeah, if you're missing somewhere, so it's not a goodbye
forever, it's a revoir for now.
Helen looked at the cornerstonelisting when we first started
and she said if we did theminimum contracts in every place
that's on this list, it'll takeus seven years to work through
them all.
That's fabulous.
Sam Miklos (37:38):
What would what would you say to um, you know
any, any rands or any rns thatare that are listening to this
and thinking, gosh, do I want toget out and travel around
australia, like?
What advice would you give them?
What are the, I guess, what arethe benefits?
But then what are thechallenges that they should know
from the outset?
Nigel (37:55):
First of all, I say do it , just do it, because there's
nothing stopping you apart fromyourself.
It's always a bit difficult, Isuppose, if you've got family.
People are always a bit likeyou know, but you can do it.
I personally would say beprepared to study.
I had mentioned it earlier.
So, like going through the runside of things, it's a lot of
study, you know, if you do theREC and then you've got your MEC
(38:20):
and then you've got yourpharmacotherapeutics course, you
know, and then the immunizationbit.
It's quite a lengthy processand expensive.
Cornerstone are amazing becausethey do help support you
through some of the obviouslyburden, yeah, um, which is,
which is really welcome, um, butagain, it's same.
You know, if you want to put itin, you can put it in and
(38:42):
you'll get the benefits from it.
Yeah, you know, becauseobviously, yeah, it's about your
learning right, it's lifelonglearning.
So we're, whatever we learn,even if we didn't go into the
right area, we can just use itwhere we are.
I can still use it in NewZealand.
Helen (38:56):
Never wasted.
Nigel (38:58):
It's definitely never wasted.
Helen (39:01):
There's hundreds of Nigels and Helens out there.
What you find with agency nurseand the local nurses that are
here day in and day out.
We all support each other.
Yeah, you have little quirks,but that's everywhere.
But it's the fact that youbuild up that network.
So the Facebook just keepsgrowing and growing and growing.
Sam Miklos (39:23):
Yeah, I was going to say Because you keep in touch.
Kate Coomber (39:25):
I think people will be asking how do I get on
contract?
Nigel (39:29):
with Helen and Nigel.
Where are they at the moment?
Where's that mum and dad?
Can I go?
I want to be with mum and dad.
Kate Coomber (39:34):
I'm going on my own.
My first contract hooked me up.
Helen (39:39):
We'd actually be happy to do that, and we do say to some
of the girls as they're goingthat if they want to try
somewhere, just ask us wherewe're going next and let us push
to go.
Because, it is that muchshortfall, yeah, going next and
there was push to go.
Yeah, because he is that muchshortfall, yeah.
And the other thing I'd warnthem maybe is is and especially
being in this role I can see itis sometimes the contract work
(40:02):
will cool off, yeah, and it'sthe end of the tax year, but
then it soon picks back up.
That's when you recharge yourbatteries go and travel we mix
it between somewhere that'sreally busy to somewhere that's
not so busy, so you're keepingyour skills up to date.
Sam Miklos (40:19):
Yeah, yeah, if that makes sense.
That's sometimes that jobsecurity that people get a bit
frightened about, but often wehear that it's not really an
issue, it's a bit of a non-issue.
Kate Coomber (40:27):
There's always something else to move on to and
or it's a great time to justtake a moment recharge travel
see all the great places thatyou, that you nearby and, as you
said in the beginning, likeit's so vast across australia,
there are so many opportunitiesin little towns you may not have
even heard of oh, definitelythere will be somewhere that
that you can find tell us aboutthe wildflowers, nigel
Nigel (40:51):
oh, the non-existent wildflowers.
So obviously west australia'squite famous with wildflower
season, yeah.
So we were driving back aboutthis time last year.
We were driving up through intocowberry in northampton and it
was like I kept saying to him oh, look at all the flowers,
they're so amazing.
And the problem was therewasn't any, because it was a dry
.
It was a dry summer, so there'sno rain it's just like this
(41:12):
standing joke that thewildflowers are out.
Normally we can see it was theother way around, but hopefully
this year there should be quitea good wildflower season, so
Mulloware I'm going is in thecentre of it.
Kate Coomber (41:22):
Yes, let us know there should be quite a bit.
Sam Miklos (41:23):
Let us know we need to take some good photos, nigel
and we can put it out there andlet people know that these
wildflowers do exist.
Kate Coomber (41:30):
Absolutely yeah, Look thank you so much for your
time today.
Sam Miklos (41:35):
I think we've gone completely off script to be
honest, it's been so nice tojust talk to you both and to
share.
Kate Coomber (41:41):
It's normal for us .
Yeah, I can imagine and us so,with this podcast and for your
time today, where CMR areactually donating $500 to a
charity of your choice.
Where is that money going today?
And it's really great to beable to raise some awareness for
that charity.
Nigel (42:00):
So we were.
At first.
Helen wanted to offer it to oneof the health centres we worked
at.
I said I think it has to be aregistered charity.
So we looked at it and I foundone on the system.
It's the Western AustralianNurses Memorial Charity Trust.
So they help with obviouslyhelping midwives and nurses
(42:21):
undertake research and obviouslydevelop the nursing and
midwifery profession further.
So I thought that'd be quitegood.
Sam Miklos (42:28):
That's fantastic.
Can I ask, helen, that if youwere to give it to one of the
facilities you'd worked?
What would that have lookedlike?
Helen (42:37):
It's Northampton, it's the aged care.
It was more or less for theresidents.
Sam Miklos (42:43):
What would you have wanted to give them?
Helen (42:46):
It's just more or less because I spoke to Di the Don
there about it and she was blownaway and I just went just spend
it on the residents.
They go out for trips every nowand again.
They're really struggling toget staff there and it touched
me when we were working there.
They were really I didn't thinkI'd like enjoy working in aged
(43:06):
care, but they were amazing.
Sam Miklos (43:08):
It's like a little family unit and it was just
something for the residentssomething to cheer them up and
yeah, cheer them up and actuallygive back there.
Helen (43:16):
So maybe take them out for a meal or whatever.
They spent a lot of money onthe gardens but they'd run out
and I just went.
Just spend it on whatever youthink for the residents.
Okay, fantastic.
Sam Miklos (43:28):
Yeah, we might have a little chat and see, maybe we
could split a bit of that $500or something because that would
be beautiful.
Thank you both so much we haveso enjoyed speaking to you.
You are just such a wonderfulcouple.
Oh, I think we're losing Helen.
Oh, she's gone all silent.
Nigel (43:48):
Oh, there she is again.
Helen (43:49):
She's come back.
I was like did you do that,nigel?
Nigel put you on mute, helen.
Sam Miklos (43:56):
But we so appreciate the time from both of you and
the stories and I think from acornerstone perspective too.
Thank you for looking after ourcommunity out there on the road
as well.
You know it's lovely to see acommunity um coming together in
a little cornerstone communityout there we haven't pilfered
stuff.
Nigel (44:12):
I I heard you have.
Sam Miklos (44:15):
Keep grabbing those stuff we do our little Christmas
parties around the country inthe area.
So we'll make sure we find outwhere you are at Christmas and
hopefully you've got a littlecommunity around you of
Cornerstone.
Nigel (44:26):
Cool, thank you.
Helen (44:28):
Well, it's like anybody who's actually looking at moving
to australia.
I say to them do the internet,do the internet's going, do
cornerstone or agency, becausethen you can see where you
actually want to settle down.
Yeah, before you make the bigleap, yeah, so very true, this
(44:51):
is it.
Sam Miklos (44:52):
We definitely are, and we talk a lot about the
community, like you're part ofour community, you know, and
that's that's so special for us,and hearing these stories will
no doubt inspire other othergreat candidates to get out
there and jump on the bandwagonand do what you're doing so.
Thank you so very much for yourtime today and for your time
always for the team.
Nigel (45:11):
Thank you.
Sam Miklos (45:14):
Thanks for listening .
Don't forget to share, rate andreview.
This allows us to reach morepeople and share more incredible
stories.
Click the follow or subscribebutton to ensure you never miss
(45:47):
an episode.
Thank you.
We care for the land and sea, we care for the energy,
we care for our community.
Sam Miklos (00:14):
We care, Welcome to.
It Takes Heart.
I'm Sam Miklos and I'm KateCoomba.
We hope you enjoy theseincredible stories of healthcare
professionals making adifference in communities across
Australia and beyond Throughour conversations we look to
celebrate the spirit ofcommunity and care.
(00:34):
We acknowledge the traditionalcustodians of the land who have
long practised and sharedancient methods of healing,
providing care and support fortheir communities with wisdom
passed down through generations.
Kate Coomber (00:46):
Join us as we explore what it truly means to
take heart.
Sam Miklos (00:56):
So our guests today are the unforgettable RN couple,
helen and Nigel Naylor.
They have locummed in manycountries around the world,
including the Middle East, theUK, new Zealand and, of course,
australia.
Our team have worked with Helenand Nigel for a good few years
now and they are so loved by ourclients and their communities.
In fact, often they're promotedwhile on contract or asked to
(01:17):
stay on permanently.
They embody the essence ofnursing excellence.
Their optimism, caring nature,adaptability and remarkable
skill set have not only savedlives but have also inspired
those around them to strive forthe best in healthcare delivery.
Our team at Cornerstone loveworking with Helen and Nigel.
They describe them ashardworking, reliable,
(01:39):
enthusiastic and very thoughtful, and always willing to lend a
hand or, apparently, I've heard,offer a place to stay.
We might dive into that alittle bit too.
So welcome, helen and Nigel tothe it Takes Heart podcast.
Hi, so let's get started.
I want to understand where youboth are now, because you're
both in different spaces.
(02:00):
Where are you, helen?
Do you want to start first?
Helen (02:04):
Mrs.
Where are you, Helen?
Do you want to start first?
I'm in Culberry where we bothstarted and then we kept
extending because we give thestaff Christmas off.
So we stayed behind forChristmas and then they asked me
to move up into the Don role.
We both decided before Waxfordthat if I was going to do a
management role it wouldn't begood for Nigel to still be here
(02:28):
Just because of the conflict oranything like that.
Not that we can't work together, but if there was an issue, how
would it?
Sam Miklos (02:37):
roll out.
Yeah, and so then, nigel, whereare you at the moment?
Nigel (02:43):
I returned to New Zealand at the end of no, I've been
home a month.
I'm due to fly out againtomorrow, but came home.
Dad needed surgery, so I'vecome home, done a few jobs on
the property, a few shifts athome as well, yep, just to
obviously keep my skills up inNew Zealand.
It's certainly a differentlevel of nursing.
Again, it blows me away theautonomy we get in Australia.
(03:09):
Yeah, working the way we work,obviously with wax, we use ETS.
Where we work, we don't usuallyhave a doctor on site, and
coming home to work in anestablishment where doctors are
there, it's quite challengingfor me personally because you
almost have to be wait to betold to do something, whereas
obviously when we're in wa um,we're expected to obviously roll
(03:31):
with the situation, get on,make those judgment calls and
then obviously work alongsideets, um.
So yeah, it's quite, quitedifferent, um, but really enjoy
being home.
Sam Miklos (03:40):
It's nice and cold I bet it is yeah, um, and a few
frosts and is it unusual for you, though, being apart, because
typically would you be togetheruh, we normally work together.
Nigel (03:52):
So when, so when, like when I did canada then last year
, uh, I was there a month beforehelen arrived, um, and then
obviously, yeah, we've worked inmost places together, so
obviously, carnarvon, kalbarri,northampton, we've always been
together.
And, like Helen just said, wedecided from the outset, if
Helen took the management role,I would step down and move
(04:13):
somewhere else, because when wewere in New Zealand, I was the
manager of a large ED and Helenwas one of my staff at the time
and it just, even though therewasn't a problem, it just
created the possibility forconflict with other members of
staff.
So we decided from the outset,like Helen said, that I would
move away.
So I'm heading back to Mullowa,so a smaller site, but, yeah,
(04:35):
looking forward to it.
Sam Miklos (04:36):
How far away from each other will you be then?
About two and a half hours.
Kate Coomber (04:40):
Okay, and do you stay?
Sam Miklos (04:42):
would you stay together or is it more of a
weekend catch-up?
Nigel (04:45):
No, we'd catch up on days off, yeah, yeah, and work
through that one.
Kate Coomber (04:49):
Yeah lovely, ooh la la, yeah right, ooh la la.
Nigel (04:54):
Watch out Some fancy dating potential out there in
Dungy Way.
Helen needs me to do herironing.
Helen (05:00):
Oh.
Sam Miklos (05:01):
I love that.
How rude and what do you needfrom Helen Nigel Trouble?
Kate Coomber (05:12):
Do you know what?
I would love to go back andtalk about your earlier career
and maybe where you met.
You know, detecting accents,obviously.
Where's home she ground.
Sam Miklos (05:26):
Oh okay, where did you study?
And that's a wrap, accents,obviously and where did where's
home she?
Nigel (05:30):
grew up.
Oh, okay, so.
So obviously we're both.
We're both from the uk, um,we're both from yorkshire, uh,
so the thing about the uk is youcan live literally 20 meters
away from someone, have adifferent accent yes, um, and
different, totally differentdialect, um.
So Helen is from the next townto where I was from, even though
she's got a rather northernaccent.
So, yeah, we're only maybe 20miles apart.
(05:52):
We met whilst we both served inthe Territorial Army in the UK.
We were at an air show, aWellington air show.
We used to support the air showfrom the field hospital point
of view in case there was amajor incident.
And, yeah, we were drunk and wemet.
Helen (06:12):
They spotted my poo bear tattoo and that was it.
Oh, like all, good love stories.
Sam Miklos (06:18):
We were drunk and the rest is history.
So what?
About your career then fromthat point, were you both
studying, nursing at the time?
Nigel (06:29):
We were both qualified, weren't we?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, we were bothqualified.
I was working, I had beenworking in theatres, in theatre
recovery, and Helen would havebeen an ED nurse at the time.
Fantastic, in differenthospitals.
Sam Miklos (06:42):
So then, you've gone on to… Many, many moons, many
moons.
What happened next?
And Helen?
Nigel (06:43):
would have been an ED nurse at the time in different
hospitals, so yeah, so thenyou've gone on to have Many,
many moons.
Helen (06:47):
Many moons.
What happened?
Sam Miklos (06:48):
next yeah, you've gone on to have this big,
impressive career working aroundthe world Like have you just
chosen places and moved to there?
Kate Coomber (06:59):
How's the opportunity?
Helen (07:00):
come about.
There was a lot going off whenwe first met because I was
actually married to somebodyelse.
Whoa, that's bad, isn't it?
I love that, yeah, but thingshappen and it was never.
We were together for a lot ofyears, me and kevin, and had
three lovely boys together, butwe just grew apart.
(07:21):
I still loved him, but I wasn'tin with him.
And people say what changed?
It was me, not, you know, youjust outgrow the relationship.
I'd been seeing him since I was16.
Yeah, and along come my toy boy, 12 years younger.
Sam Miklos (07:38):
I'm assuming that's Nigel.
No, no, no.
Is there another answer?
Nigel (07:44):
I'm 12 years younger than her first one.
Helen (07:47):
Oh, okay, eight years younger than me, so I'm still a
cougar.
Sam Miklos (07:55):
Love it, love it.
Helen (07:56):
Yeah, and then we followed a friend to New Zealand
, and the reason we picked NewZealand rather than Australia,
that's where she went um, andbecause I don't do spiders, yeah
, I'm shocking.
If a spider's there on apatient, I'm not going you're
out, you're like no, yeah, callthe team.
Sam Miklos (08:16):
So how did you?
How did you end up then in themiddle east?
Nigel (08:21):
so we were, because we were in the territorials.
It was the second iraq war and,um, it was quite a bizarre
situation at the time.
Um, there was, they didbasically a compulsory call up,
so it was the biggest compulsorycall up since world war ii, um,
and at the time the weird thingwas that there was a fireman
strike on at the time at homeand they so they decided to use
(08:42):
the regular soldiers, thefull-time soldiers, to stay at
home and fight the fires,literally, and they sent their
part-time soldiers to war.
Right, so it was a bit of aweird one.
Helen was at sandhurst, becausehelen was a lieutenant um, and
so she was at sandhurst doingher, finalizing her officer
training.
And they, they said basicallybefore she went if you do this,
(09:05):
you'll be going somewhere hotand sandy.
And Helen's like yeah, yeah,I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm going to
listen to what they're tellingyou.
And she's like, yeah, so anyway, helen was in Sandhurst and
this brown envelope arrives onthe doorstep, so I thought I'll
open it, have a look.
And so I start reading it andwe're like okay, okay, starts
again.
And it was my name in the onall the paperwork, but helen's.
(09:25):
So I was like okay.
So I just started a new job ata private hospital in the uk and
I had to say to my boss I'm,I'm off to war, wow she was like
okay, and then helen'spaperwork came, maybe a week
later, but it was just a littlebit.
Like you know, you need toreport to this place at this
time and if you don't basicallyturn up, you'll be arrested.
Sam Miklos (09:44):
It was was just like it was that serious and were?
You going to the same place.
Nigel (09:52):
Yeah, so we initially started in Kuwait, didn't we
together?
Well, helen, the night Iarrived, there was a sandstorm
and Helen was in the camp at thesandstorm.
Yeah, helen's tent blew awayand all the clothes.
Kate Coomber (10:03):
Oh my gosh.
Sam Miklos (10:05):
And what year is this?
No ironing there, helen, we'dalways be friends with everybody
.
Helen (10:09):
So the pioneers looked after us because we'd been doing
their sandbagging.
So we got to play a game offooty with them.
So they moved the trucks aroundto try and protect us but you
couldn't see a thing and you hadto put your respirator on and
everybody all dance.
So it was like, and I spent thenight in the Clydesdale tent
(10:31):
because our tent wasn't thereanymore.
Sam Miklos (10:34):
But yeah, it's interesting stories and I'm
surprised they actually sent meBecause what was the role, what
was the role you were doingthere?
Helen (10:43):
In the war zone.
It was actually I.
I was in the ED at the mainfield hospital, which was
200-bedded field hospital.
Yeah, wow.
Sam Miklos (10:52):
And what about your role, Nigel, there?
Nigel (10:55):
I was attached to a medical supply regiment because
in the territorials I didn'tjoin as a nurse, I joined to get
away from nursing, so I joinedas a driver, so I was a heavy
goods driver, yep, uh.
And then they sent me when theysent me out, they touched me to
the med supply regiment.
So we used to cover the threeservices and the prisoners of
war, um, so we'd make sure allthe med supplies were available
(11:18):
for them.
Uh, down to like having a bloodbank, um, you know, so we could
do a major blood drive if weneeded to.
Out there, how long were youout?
How long were you?
Um, I think in total I wasabout six months, so didn't seem
.
But we were there before thewar, when the war, the day the
war started, and even though theactual fighting only lasted
(11:39):
maybe a couple of weeks,obviously the ongoing effects
are still being seen today.
Sam Miklos (11:43):
Yeah so yeah, helen, being in a, you know, a 200 bed
ed facility there, how was thatlike, would you say on
reflection, that was rewarding,was it stressful, was it scary?
Helen (11:54):
yeah, yeah everybody asks that question was it scary?
It's a different what you'dthink I'd be scared of.
We weren't.
It was pitch black on the night.
So I could tell you storiesabout a nurse who actually went
to the toilet, got lost andended up in the trenches.
Oh my gosh, which she wastraumatised, so we had to talk
(12:16):
her down a bit.
We actually built the fieldhospital from scratch, so it was
putting all the tent work upand stuff and people were coming
down with diarrhea and vomitingbecause the water was just
they'd sent out natural springwater but left it in the desert
condition so it was like 50degrees and it was cooking all
(12:37):
the bugs.
So people were getting sicknessand diarrhea, yeah, and it's
actually in the British Army toget dehydration.
Oh, wow, yeah, well, but whatdo you do when they're causing
it.
Sam Miklos (12:48):
This is it.
I was just going to sayabsolutely so how did you get to
Australia?
Helen (12:56):
So I'm going to do what Nigel says.
How did we get into nursing Allright by a plane?
Fair point.
Sam Miklos (13:04):
Fair point.
That was Kate's question.
Was it a good plane?
Long last one.
Helen (13:15):
Better than the one we went to Bali on oh there you go.
We did a few years where I hadissues with my health.
I had an accident with my legand it had led to other issues
and I've actually got apacemaker that doesn't cause any
problems now and I just went.
(13:35):
If I don't do it now, I'llnever do it, and it's always
been one of my dreams notNigel's to actually do Australia
.
But do they really outbackremote stuff and make a
difference?
And I guess.
Kate Coomber (13:49):
Maybe could you share what you feel that
difference is in comparison to.
You know you've talked aboutthe work that you're doing in
New Zealand and in a busyhospital where there's a big
team around you, versus whenyou're very remote.
I think maybe some peoplelistening might not understand
what remote means and just howremote it is Like.
(14:10):
I'd love to hear from yourperspective paint a picture of
what that is and the impact.
Then you can have.
Nigel (14:17):
So New Zealand, everything.
So the rule of thumb in NewZealand is there's only two
degrees of separation betweeneverybody.
Everybody knows someone whoknows somebody, and that was
proven when we came to Australiaand we're looking at people who
are like we know them, and likethere was a girl in Carnarvon
where Helen goes.
I know her from somewhere andit turns out that she was one of
Helen's students when she was alecturer, a nursing lecturer,
(14:41):
and then our previous Don atCalbury.
We're like again nursinglecturer, and then our previous
don at carberry.
We're like, again, we know himand again he was one of our
students as well, you know.
So it's, it's very small.
We bought a car in x-mas andthe lady we bought the car of,
her partner knew a lady we workwith from new zealand.
It's just everything's just sosmall and using.
So a lot of people know people.
So like the saying is, if youkick one person, half a town
(15:03):
limp, um, whereas in australiathe, the sheer size of australia
is, is phenomenal and I don'tthink people can grasp it.
It's like when they say, oh,it's just down the road, in
australia it could be a thousandk's.
It's like, okay, that's notjust down the road.
But you do 100k's in australiaand you see nothing.
You do 100k's in new zealandand you've gone through maybe a
(15:24):
dozen towns.
Yes, you know, it's like it'sjust, yeah, the vast scope of
australia, it blows my mind.
And being able to offer healthcare in those places where
resources are limited, so evenplaces like cowberry.
You know it's, yeah, it's onlytwo hours from gerrardton, but
it's still two hours.
If you need acute care, youknow there's no physical doctor
(15:45):
on the site, so you are thebarrier between life and death
there's no other way to put itfor some people.
Whereas in New Zealand you knowthere aren't many sites, if any
, that there aren't doctors andyou are relatively close to most
things.
So for, like, where we live,here're 20 k's away from our
(16:06):
nearest town, um, but the major,major regional hospital would
be, for us would be an hour anda half away, yeah, um, or we can
go to rota, which is maybeanother 40 minutes.
But again, the the healthsystem in new zealand now it's
only one system calledwhereifata Ora, where we had 20
DHBs previously.
Um, you, they were quite strictabout um boundaries, like, oh
(16:29):
well, you live here, you belongto that one and it's getting a
little bit more flexible now.
So, yeah, having just the sheersize of Australia yeah, is is
the thing that people are goingto be.
If they've never been, they'rejust going to be blown away by
and I guess one of thosehospitals.
Kate Coomber (16:44):
If we look at calvary, you know how many beds
are in that hospital.
What does it look like?
Helen (16:51):
it's actually quite.
I'm going to pinch this onenight, all scenes I'm.
We've got four bedded likelittle ward thing if somebody
needs to stay overnight and thenwe've got a palliative bed.
And what's nice is you get theprivilege to meet the community,
the people there, so everybodyknows everybody.
(17:13):
So when you go to the shop webumped into a lady who I call my
kiwi sister from another mister.
She's coming for a patient andI was just like catching up and
we're oh hi, how are you doing?
Meaning, how was she doing?
Yeah, and she went all on abouther injury that she'd been in,
and I thought, no, that's notwhat I want to talk about.
(17:35):
You know, and I always say topeople, because you can build up
a good rapport with somebodywhen you're working with them,
when they see us out in thecommunity, you can just smile
and they can either acknowledgeyou or ignore you, because
people will wonder how you'vemet yeah, yeah and then it's
that confidentiality yeah butwhen you're working in smaller
(17:55):
ones and like when we go likenight of limbalua, it's trying
to make a difference with thecommunity.
So it's not just about nursingnursing in the workplace, it's
about what can we do for thatcommunity.
So we'd even looked at maybedoing some volunteer working for
saint john's, if was there away we could do that yeah,
(18:16):
fantastic as we move along,because nigel actually does
search and rescue in new zealand.
Right, he does it to go up inthe helicopters.
I'll tell you that.
But yeah, there's ulteriormotives.
But, yeah, it's just, we likeeducation.
So one of the things we lookedat was maybe he doesn't have
thought about this.
(18:36):
This is my next one.
Sam Miklos (18:39):
I love that you're about to drop this Nigel's like
all right strap in.
Kate Coomber (18:42):
Nigel, let's plan this out.
Helen (18:44):
Doing our ACLS instructor's course.
Right, doing our ACLSinstructor's course?
Because if we're the back ofthe hand and the nurses are
struggling to get to the courses, we can provide that in our
normal hours at no extra pay tokeep people upskilled, because
we've got these different layersthat we can bring to our
workplace.
Sam Miklos (19:04):
It's stuff like that that's so special too.
That's the sort of stuff thatwe really look to share those
stories, because I think there'sso many layers to what you can
do when you go into thesecommunities.
Like you said, it's not justnursing and the health facility.
It's all the volunteering andthe work that you can do.
And then it's also what otherskills do you have that you can
upskill and leave a legacy inthat community as well?
Kate Coomber (19:25):
And if you can be doing that there locally and
people aren't having to travel,then you're improving the
patient outcomes there.
Of course you are, yeah, youknow there's, I imagine, a gap
between the outcomes, sometimesin very, very remote areas
versus what's accessible in ametro area, and it sounds like
all of those initiatives thatyou're talking about get on
(19:46):
board Nigel, because it's bookedby the sounds of it.
Well, now you know that's ahuge impact to that community.
Nigel (19:54):
The thing is, as you say, you can't just walk into a
community and start dictatingthe way things need to be.
You know you're doing thiswrong.
You need to do this becauseyou've got to learn how the
community and it's the same herein New Zealand you have to
learn how the community and it'sthe same here in New Zealand.
You have to learn about thecommunity before you can be part
of that community.
Sam Miklos (20:10):
How do you do that?
How do you do that respectfully, particularly when you're
coming in and out on contract?
Nigel (20:16):
For us personally.
I mean, we've been in NewZealand now.
This is 21 years now and evennow it's still hard to
understand the ins and outs ofthe indigenous side of things.
Luckily New Zealand, most ofthe Maori Iwi, they do things
(20:37):
similarly, whereas in Australiabecause I said in Canada one day
when we were there I said whydon't we have like a cultural
education system where you canlearn about the culture and
start to engage and try to bemore proactive with the, with
the population?
And the lady I spoke said shewas the um, she was the
aboriginal liaison officer withthe police and she said it's
(21:00):
just physically impossiblebecause you've got so many um,
so many groups to deal with, somany mods, that you can't.
You could do something for onegroup here and then 20 metres
away their customs are totallydifferent.
Kate Coomber (21:15):
It's not one size fits all.
It's interesting because wetalk about it in our teams a lot
of how do we upskill andprepare people more?
But that's a really interestingpoint.
Nigel (21:27):
Yes, I think just having a broad knowledge, having some
knowledge, is better than noknowledge, but it's about having
the right knowledge, if thatmakes sense I think sometimes,
on a less serious note, it'sjust be genuine, yeah and talk
to people, so I use a lot of funand humor when I'm working.
Helen (21:44):
It's just and, believe it or not, so does nigel.
Yeah so we get up to all sorts,and I think it's that genuine
thing.
So I'll say to someone look, ifI do something wrong, tell me,
I'll be mortified, and it'sgenuine and it's lovely.
I upset a lady in triage and Ididn't.
It wasn't anything I'd donewrong.
(22:04):
I just said to her she wasspecial to me, she was my first
indigenous lady that I'd everworked with and I says so she'll
follow me wherever I go,because I'll remember her.
And she just burst into tears.
I was like, oh my God, I'vemade her cry.
But we had a laugh and a jokeand I just went.
(22:24):
I'm sorry, I didn't mean tomake you cry and I think she was
just touched because it wasgenuine.
And the other thing that worriedme was we're English and I
thought is this going to be abad thing when we're going to
these communities because of thelost generation and stuff like
that?
And you do feel it, buteverybody's been absolutely
(22:47):
lovely and because there is nofilter, I am what I am.
They actually appreciate that,and so I do do stuff a little
bit outside the norm.
So I've arranged for people toget home with the attendance and
you know, um, one of the ladiessaid you should come out back.
She said they'd love you.
(23:08):
Yeah, because I tell jokes, I'mstraight up.
I try and pitch it at a levelthat people will understand.
Yeah, because what's clear toone person isn't going to be
clear to another absolutely andthen that's why, as a nurse,
you're their advocate they saystop.
If you don't understand whatthey're saying, just ask them to
(23:29):
stop and we'll make them tokeep saying it till you get what
they're actually saying, andthat's what we need to bring it
sounds like you've.
Kate Coomber (23:38):
You've really got to have the right intentions
when you do this line of work itpossibly isn't for everyone,
and if you want a bit ofautonomy in a large hospital
where you don't see the samepeople twice and on different
shifts all the time, you reallyneed to want to immerse yourself
in the community.
I guess for someone wonderingwhether this could be the career
(23:59):
for them, or could they do thisfor a couple of years, or could
they try it, what advice do youhave?
Or really, I guess, littlenuggets.
That's really really criticalfor them to know and understand.
Nigel (24:13):
I always tell people, even from a New Zealand
perspective.
I've spoke to staff while I'vebeen working here and they say,
oh, I really want to.
I say go for it, do it.
What we found coming from theUK to New Zealand initially was
the opportunities here areamazing.
They really really are.
In the UK when we were there itwas like pardon the pun, it was
a bit like dead man's shoes.
(24:34):
You know, you had to wait forsomeone to leave or die before
you could progress through thesystem because it was so tight
that everyone was fighting forthe same thing.
Whereas come to New Zealand,I've done multiple things.
I've been management.
I've done nurse specialistroles.
You know I was a duty managerin a large thousand bed hospital
.
You know I've been able to dothese because I've strove to
(24:57):
push myself and the opportunityto be in there.
It's the same in australia.
If you want to, you can do it.
The only thing stopping you inaustralia is yourself.
Yeah, it really really is.
Um, because you know you go.
I can't do it today becauseit's like no, that's an excuse,
you know, just go for it if you.
If you do it and hate it, youjust say I didn't enjoy that and
I won't go back there again.
(25:18):
Yeah, because you won't knowwhat about training, helen?
Sam Miklos (25:22):
you know you've kind of touched on a little bit
there of cultural awarenesstraining.
You know the als, how do youmanage the training component?
Helen (25:30):
I actually think Karana is a good move going to Karana
and do them sort of courses.
Somebody suggested it to us andwe didn't.
It's one of the managers, youdon't know what you don't know,
but Karana will get you readyfor the different steps and even
if you don't want to goremote-remote, which is where
we're heading, somewhere likeCalbury, it's still a good sound
(25:56):
courses to do, regardless of ifyou're at the older end, like
both me and Nigel are, or theyounger end, just to get you
ready for them placements,because it's lifelong learning,
this nursing, it always has beenyeah um, I do think make sure
you've got your ed experience inthe bigger hospitals, because
(26:16):
you're exposed to more yesbut then you're not down to the
actual assessment skills andstuff and that the more you do
it, the better you and some ofthe people don't realize how
intense the training is.
Now it was funny because when Iapplied at Cornerstone she said
, oh, you haven't got yourdegree.
(26:37):
And I went, I used to.
I said have you looked at my CV?
I've actually taught degreenurses.
I've got more than that degreenurses.
I've got more than that.
I just don't.
So I was going towards mymasters and then things happened
and I just didn't bother tofinish it but I was only two
papers off some past that.
Yeah, I'm the post-grad face,but yeah, it's just lifelong
(27:01):
learning and do their littlestuff.
So, but it's gonna move on to.
One of the other questions is um, you have to when you move into
these different areas.
Different places have differentpolicies and guidelines.
You've got to practice withintheir guidelines so you might be
able to suit you.
(27:21):
You might have pick line access, but is it okay to use it in
wax?
So, like your three yardstraining, then you have to get
it signed off by wax before youcan actually use it and that can
be one of the tricky things.
Everything's a process, isn'tit?
Kate Coomber (27:41):
And what about the challenges that you know it
sounds like you've had?
Well, you've stepped into thisDonrol at the moment.
What comes with that?
Is it really hard decision?
Obviously this one might havebeen even trickier because you
couldn't continue to worktogether.
But typically stepping intothose leadership roles when
you're on a short term contractand it's not a permanent
(28:02):
position what comes with that?
Is there concerns of whathappens next when you leave?
Or is it challenging to step upand sort of get the confidence
of the team?
Or is it challenging to step upand and sort of get the um, the
confidence of the team, or isit?
Is it quite straightforward?
Helen (28:17):
in new zealand when we nidal said he was the manager of
ed.
What he failed to remember isthat they actually made me into
one of the duty managers.
So I managed two hospitals andthat was just nuts.
So the phone calls, thepressures, doing the staffing,
(28:38):
the transfers, the two bighospitals and getting paid less
than what I do on the floor here, yeah, it's just nuts.
Yeah.
So coming into this, it's gotdifferent challenges being a
smaller place, because the small, a smaller workforce can
actually be more tricky andthere's dynamics to play.
(28:59):
But when you've got that, anymanagement's the same sort of
thing.
You've got processes and stuff.
What I found hard with this onewas the different software.
So they said a pink sheet.
Sam Miklos (29:13):
What the hell is a pink sheet?
The hell is a picture.
Helen (29:15):
Yeah, yeah yeah, and it's on microsoft teams, um, and the
processes, and sometimes,because calvary's hasn't had
somebody permanent for a longwhile, it's the staff are sick
of the change.
You know, somebody comes inwith brand new ideas and they've
heard it, seen it, done it.
They're not interested.
(29:36):
Yeah, and I think what helpedwith me is I've actually been on
the floor so they knew me.
Yeah, I wasn't going to changewho I was just because I'm in
this role.
Yeah, but I do have to managethem and you're contracting in
that role.
Sam Miklos (29:50):
Is that right?
Helen (29:50):
yeah, I've got.
They wanted me to take on apermanent fixed-term contract
and Cornerstone was really goodand said you know, if you want
to do it, they don't.
You know we accept, that's thenorm.
But then, looking at the prosand cons, if you ask me what
keeps me going, I live for mygranddaughter in New Zealand, so
(30:15):
I need to be able to go onregular and that's why coniston
ticks all the boxes for me.
Yeah, I can do a contract andthen I can go home for a month
and see elena, yeah.
So she says, mama, you've beenthere too long this time and she
wants to come and see thesnakes and the crocodiles, so
hopefully we'll get her out.
Sam Miklos (30:36):
So I was going to ask you about the reptiles there
, because you said earlier,helen, that the spiders are not
a thing.
I assume they are, and nowyou're out in Kalbarri Like how
are you coping with the, becausea lot of the English are really
freaked out about theAustralian wildlife.
You know how are you coping?
Helen (30:54):
Well, for the first, how many months was it About eight
months, Nigel.
We didn't see a kangaroo.
Nigel (31:00):
Alive kangaroo, alive kangaroo, alive kangaroo, yeah,
yeah, yeah.
Helen (31:06):
But here there's millions of them and they're just
stopping around.
Sam Miklos (31:09):
Yeah, and it was funny.
Helen (31:10):
I was showing my son on because we do a lot of Messenger
.
The kangaroos and he's like mom, don't go any closer because
we've watched the clips onyoutube yeah, yeah, where the
people are with them and they'retrying to drown dogs.
Oh my god, so great.
Look at me I'm going closer butan emu's.
We've seen emu's and we've seena bobtail.
Sam Miklos (31:32):
We've had the kangaroos come up to the
hospital door and go no, sorry,we don't treat kangaroos here we
don't treat you no, not today,not today.
Helen (31:41):
And spiders, we haven't really seen that many.
So I've seen a snake inCarnarvon and did you know?
The policy is you've got tohave four people when you see a
snake, till the snake catchercan get there.
Oh wow, but it was themaintenance guy who come and I
was so silly with him.
I can't believe I gotstarstruck because he come and
(32:03):
he just looks like steve and heeven dressed like him and I was
like, oh my god, it's that guywho died with the fish.
Oh God, I love that there's evena snake.
He just went downhill fromthere we were talking about.
Sam Miklos (32:17):
And that was when I was Keep going, keep going.
Helen (32:20):
That was when I was the after hours manager.
Oh my God.
Sam Miklos (32:28):
The fact that you need a snake policy, like of all
the other things these roomright area nurses have got to
contend with.
It's also a snake policy.
So area nurses have got tocontend with.
It's also a snake policy.
So the I guess the nicknamethat we've heard that you've got
is that a lot of the agencynurses will call you mom and dad
.
Did you know that?
yeah, yeah, yeah, as a parent,like I was like there's so many
things that that brought up forme like why?
Why are they calling you momand dad?
What's, what are you bringing?
(32:48):
That's special?
Nigel (32:49):
I think we just we treat.
We treat people like theyshould be trapped.
So everyone deserves right tobe that an individual, but we
try to look after people as well.
It's like helen says, you know,if it was our kids that were
somewhere foreign and you know,and they're on their own because
a lot of these, uh, a lot ofthese people are traveling on
their own.
So we're quite fortunate becausewe're a couple, whereas if
you're a young single female sosomewhere like Carnarvon, where
(33:13):
the not to put people off, butthe local children can be quite
intimidating at times they'rerunning around, they're slapping
them on the backside and things.
It's quite off-putting foryoung, pretty girls to be
walking around somewhere atnight.
So we just try to look afterpeople.
We invite them to do thingswith us.
(33:33):
If we've got a bit of sparefood, if we're leaving, we
always pass the food on.
We're not paying it forward,yeah, and we just like to look
after people because, again, youknow that's part of what's
lovely we are a family at theend of the day.
Yeah, healthcare is a family.
Kate Coomber (33:55):
Did we hear the team talk about a story about a
pub, new year's?
Sam Miklos (33:57):
eve in a pub, is that one we can share, or that's
a?
Helen (33:58):
that's a later it makes us light up.
I wasn't sure if we're beingset up or not.
Nigel (34:03):
This last new year's eve we were.
We were just in the pub and weinvited uh, one of the girls,
rachel, along.
She was next door in theapartments where we were and
it's just come to the pub,there's a band on and we had.
We'd have a good night towardsthe end of the where we were and
we just come to the pub,there's a band on and we had a
good night.
Towards the end of the night wewere on the dance floor dancing
and this guy just comes up andbasically taps on the shoulder
and says is it all right if Iask your daughter if she wants
to come out for a drink?
And we're like she's not ourdaughter.
Helen (34:28):
There's the mum and dad, isn't it?
She's lovely.
Sam Miklos (34:31):
I bet you've got our approval.
Helen (34:33):
Yeah, it was funny because we were all Kiwis,
because we classed ourselves asQuinglish.
Sam Miklos (34:40):
So we're.
Helen (34:40):
Kiwis.
Kate Coomber (34:42):
I haven't heard that before.
Helen (34:44):
Yeah, we're Quinglish and if she was our daughter we'd be
well proud.
But we said to her you know, ifshe didn't want, if she didn't
feel safe, we'd stick around.
If she was okay and she wantedto rendezvous with the bike she
just had to say you know wecould go, but she'd come home
with us, and it's just that sortof thing.
(35:04):
You know, we left Rachel Leepaddleboard for you as well.
We went home and then she leftit at the health centre, just
little things like that, and Ithink it goes a long way, and we
have a cornerstone family, soin canada we had all the
cornerstone yeah, yeah, I'd saygirls, but then there was nigel,
(35:24):
so I was all together, whichwas nice and, but we look after
the agency staff as well.
So just an example I ended uphaving to do a night shift on
Sunday and one of the girls wasfinishing on the Monday, but she
couldn't get a bus intoGeraldton until Tuesday and she
(35:47):
was going to be meeting herfriends.
So I actually drove her toGeraldton, took her to the
hospital and dropped her off atthe accommodation and I says I
don't want anything, I just wantyou to pay it forward.
So if you can help somebody else.
That's what you do.
That's what you do.
It's that.
And Sophie was our first kid,wasn't she?
Nigel (36:07):
She's in Axewath College.
Sam Miklos (36:10):
Do you find it hard to leave these communities?
Like you really, you do createsuch a community around you
where you go.
Is it hard to move on?
I suppose it is yeah.
Nigel (36:23):
I suppose it is to a point because you do.
Even in the bigger places youstill develop relationships with
some of the clients becausethey are horrible phrase
frequent flyers.
They do obviously require moreintense usage of the health
system than others.
So you start to see people.
It's a bit like the analogywhere on the surgical ward the
(36:48):
patient comes in, they have thesurgery, they go home, whereas
on the medical ward you see thesame people time and time and
time and time again.
They either get better or theydon't.
And it's a bit like that.
You do develop thoserelationships or those rapport.
And then it's about that again.
It creates that trust with theclient and their family, because
obviously it's bigger than justthe client.
And again, with some of thepopulations we're dealing with,
(37:10):
it makes it more difficult.
Helen (37:13):
I think it's the same with the staff as well.
The ability of being agencies.
You can go back.
Nigel (37:18):
Yeah, if you're missing somewhere, so it's not a goodbye
forever, it's a revoir for now.
Helen looked at the cornerstonelisting when we first started
and she said if we did theminimum contracts in every place
that's on this list, it'll takeus seven years to work through
them all.
That's fabulous.
Sam Miklos (37:38):
What would what would you say to um, you know
any, any rands or any rns thatare that are listening to this
and thinking, gosh, do I want toget out and travel around
australia, like?
What advice would you give them?
What are the, I guess, what arethe benefits?
But then what are thechallenges that they should know
from the outset?
Nigel (37:55):
First of all, I say do it , just do it, because there's
nothing stopping you apart fromyourself.
It's always a bit difficult, Isuppose, if you've got family.
People are always a bit likeyou know, but you can do it.
I personally would say beprepared to study.
I had mentioned it earlier.
So, like going through the runside of things, it's a lot of
study, you know, if you do theREC and then you've got your MEC
(38:20):
and then you've got yourpharmacotherapeutics course, you
know, and then the immunizationbit.
It's quite a lengthy processand expensive.
Cornerstone are amazing becausethey do help support you
through some of the obviouslyburden, yeah, um, which is,
which is really welcome, um, butagain, it's same.
You know, if you want to put itin, you can put it in and
(38:42):
you'll get the benefits from it.
Yeah, you know, becauseobviously, yeah, it's about your
learning right, it's lifelonglearning.
So we're, whatever we learn,even if we didn't go into the
right area, we can just use itwhere we are.
I can still use it in NewZealand.
Helen (38:56):
Never wasted.
Nigel (38:58):
It's definitely never wasted.
Helen (39:01):
There's hundreds of Nigels and Helens out there.
What you find with agency nurseand the local nurses that are
here day in and day out.
We all support each other.
Yeah, you have little quirks,but that's everywhere.
But it's the fact that youbuild up that network.
So the Facebook just keepsgrowing and growing and growing.
Sam Miklos (39:23):
Yeah, I was going to say Because you keep in touch.
Kate Coomber (39:25):
I think people will be asking how do I get on
contract?
Nigel (39:29):
with Helen and Nigel.
Where are they at the moment?
Where's that mum and dad?
Can I go?
I want to be with mum and dad.
Kate Coomber (39:34):
I'm going on my own.
My first contract hooked me up.
Helen (39:39):
We'd actually be happy to do that, and we do say to some
of the girls as they're goingthat if they want to try
somewhere, just ask us wherewe're going next and let us push
to go.
Because, it is that muchshortfall, yeah, going next and
there was push to go.
Yeah, because he is that muchshortfall, yeah.
And the other thing I'd warnthem maybe is is and especially
being in this role I can see itis sometimes the contract work
(40:02):
will cool off, yeah, and it'sthe end of the tax year, but
then it soon picks back up.
That's when you recharge yourbatteries go and travel we mix
it between somewhere that'sreally busy to somewhere that's
not so busy, so you're keepingyour skills up to date.
Sam Miklos (40:19):
Yeah, yeah, if that makes sense.
That's sometimes that jobsecurity that people get a bit
frightened about, but often wehear that it's not really an
issue, it's a bit of a non-issue.
Kate Coomber (40:27):
There's always something else to move on to and
or it's a great time to justtake a moment recharge travel
see all the great places thatyou, that you nearby and, as you
said in the beginning, likeit's so vast across australia,
there are so many opportunitiesin little towns you may not have
even heard of oh, definitelythere will be somewhere that
that you can find tell us aboutthe wildflowers, nigel
Nigel (40:51):
oh, the non-existent wildflowers.
So obviously west australia'squite famous with wildflower
season, yeah.
So we were driving back aboutthis time last year.
We were driving up through intocowberry in northampton and it
was like I kept saying to him oh, look at all the flowers,
they're so amazing.
And the problem was therewasn't any, because it was a dry
.
It was a dry summer, so there'sno rain it's just like this
(41:12):
standing joke that thewildflowers are out.
Normally we can see it was theother way around, but hopefully
this year there should be quitea good wildflower season, so
Mulloware I'm going is in thecentre of it.
Kate Coomber (41:22):
Yes, let us know there should be quite a bit.
Sam Miklos (41:23):
Let us know we need to take some good photos, nigel
and we can put it out there andlet people know that these
wildflowers do exist.
Kate Coomber (41:30):
Absolutely yeah, Look thank you so much for your
time today.
Sam Miklos (41:35):
I think we've gone completely off script to be
honest, it's been so nice tojust talk to you both and to
share.
Kate Coomber (41:41):
It's normal for us .
Yeah, I can imagine and us so,with this podcast and for your
time today, where CMR areactually donating $500 to a
charity of your choice.
Where is that money going today?
And it's really great to beable to raise some awareness for
that charity.
Nigel (42:00):
So we were.
At first.
Helen wanted to offer it to oneof the health centres we worked
at.
I said I think it has to be aregistered charity.
So we looked at it and I foundone on the system.
It's the Western AustralianNurses Memorial Charity Trust.
So they help with obviouslyhelping midwives and nurses
(42:21):
undertake research and obviouslydevelop the nursing and
midwifery profession further.
So I thought that'd be quitegood.
Sam Miklos (42:28):
That's fantastic.
Can I ask, helen, that if youwere to give it to one of the
facilities you'd worked?
What would that have lookedlike?
Helen (42:37):
It's Northampton, it's the aged care.
It was more or less for theresidents.
Sam Miklos (42:43):
What would you have wanted to give them?
Helen (42:46):
It's just more or less because I spoke to Di the Don
there about it and she was blownaway and I just went just spend
it on the residents.
They go out for trips every nowand again.
They're really struggling toget staff there and it touched
me when we were working there.
They were really I didn't thinkI'd like enjoy working in aged
(43:06):
care, but they were amazing.
Sam Miklos (43:08):
It's like a little family unit and it was just
something for the residentssomething to cheer them up and
yeah, cheer them up and actuallygive back there.
Helen (43:16):
So maybe take them out for a meal or whatever.
They spent a lot of money onthe gardens but they'd run out
and I just went.
Just spend it on whatever youthink for the residents.
Okay, fantastic.
Sam Miklos (43:28):
Yeah, we might have a little chat and see, maybe we
could split a bit of that $500or something because that would
be beautiful.
Thank you both so much we haveso enjoyed speaking to you.
You are just such a wonderfulcouple.
Oh, I think we're losing Helen.
Oh, she's gone all silent.
Nigel (43:48):
Oh, there she is again.
Helen (43:49):
She's come back.
I was like did you do that,nigel?
Nigel put you on mute, helen.
Sam Miklos (43:56):
But we so appreciate the time from both of you and
the stories and I think from acornerstone perspective too.
Thank you for looking after ourcommunity out there on the road
as well.
You know it's lovely to see acommunity um coming together in
a little cornerstone communityout there we haven't pilfered
stuff.
Nigel (44:12):
I I heard you have.
Sam Miklos (44:15):
Keep grabbing those stuff we do our little Christmas
parties around the country inthe area.
So we'll make sure we find outwhere you are at Christmas and
hopefully you've got a littlecommunity around you of
Cornerstone.
Nigel (44:26):
Cool, thank you.
Helen (44:28):
Well, it's like anybody who's actually looking at moving
to australia.
I say to them do the internet,do the internet's going, do
cornerstone or agency, becausethen you can see where you
actually want to settle down.
Yeah, before you make the bigleap, yeah, so very true, this
(44:51):
is it.
Sam Miklos (44:52):
We definitely are, and we talk a lot about the
community, like you're part ofour community, you know, and
that's that's so special for us,and hearing these stories will
no doubt inspire other othergreat candidates to get out
there and jump on the bandwagonand do what you're doing so.
Thank you so very much for yourtime today and for your time
always for the team.
Nigel (45:11):
Thank you.
Sam Miklos (45:14):
Thanks for listening .
Don't forget to share, rate andreview.
This allows us to reach morepeople and share more incredible
stories.
Click the follow or subscribebutton to ensure you never miss
(45:47):
an episode.
Thank you.
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