June 5, 2025 • 31 mins
Today, we’re talking all things "Rent." Pioneer Productions Company of Morristown will be bringing the larger-than-life rock opera to a more intimate setting.
With music and lyrics by Jonathan Larson, the Tony Award- and Pulitzer Prize-winning musical is quickly approaching its 30-year anniversary. The show first premiered on Broadway 29 years ago in 1996.
Set in New York City’s East Village amid the AIDS crisis of the late 1980s and early 1990s, RENT tells the unforgettable story of a group of struggling artists navigating love, loss, identity, and the cost of living. With a raw, electrifying score and timeless message, RENT celebrates the power of community, chosen family, and living without regret.
Today, Gina is chatting with Director Shanna Levine-Phelps and actors Jade Delos Santos and Connor McDowell about the behind-the-scenes efforts it takes to bring such an iconic show to life.
Thanks for listening!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (00:03):
This is Gina Marie Rodriguez and you're
listening to the Jersey ArtsPodcast.
Today we're talking all things.
Rent.
Pioneer Productions Company ofMorristown will be bringing the
larger-than-life rock opera to amore intimate setting With
music and lyrics by JonathanLarson.
The Tony Award and PulitzerPrize-winning musical is quickly
approaching its 30-yearanniversary.
(00:24):
The show first premiered onBroadway 29 years ago in 1996.
Set in New York City's EastVillage amid the AIDS crisis of
the late 1980s and early 1990s,Rent tells the unforgettable
story of a group of strugglingartists navigating love, loss,
identity and the cost of living.
With a raw, electrifying scoreand timeless message, rent
(00:47):
celebrates the power ofcommunity, chosen family and
living without regret.
Today I'm chatting withdirector Shanna Levine-Phelps
and actors Jade Del os Santosand Connor McDowell about the
behind-the-scenes effort ittakes to bring such an iconic
show to life to bring such aniconic show to life.
Connor McDowell (01:07):
Hi, my name is Connor McDowell and I'm playing
Mark in Rent for PioneerProductions.
Jade Delos Santos (01:11):
Hi, my name is Jade Del os Santos.
I'm playing Joanne in Rent forPioneer Productions.
Shanna Levine-Phelps (01:19):
Hi, I'm Shanna Levine- Phelps and I am
the director of Rent for PioneerProductions.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (01:27):
Shauna, as the director, how are you
approaching this particular rockopera?
Shanna Levine-Phelps (01:32):
That is actually a very good question.
This is the biggest musicalI've ever directed.
It's one of the biggestmusicals Pioneer's ever done.
Probably Hair you know, jadewas actually in that as well
however many years ago was maybeour other big musical, and
(01:53):
though Pioneer's been around fora while, we still kind of learn
as we go.
So, that being said, we make a,a schedule.
I have an amazing um stagemanager who's you know went
through everything, went througheverybody's out dates, figured
out who was going to be wherewhen we went through with the
(02:13):
music director and we broughther in first to go over music
and then, kind of at end, thechoreographer, because Rent is
pretty much all sung and lots ofdancing, and so I was kind of
figuring out where my place isas the director within this.
(02:39):
And Rent is actually, if not myfavorite musical of all time.
It is definitely one of them,and I wanted to kind of come at
it from the angle of characterdevelopment, of who these people
are, who they are to each other, how they fit into this world
(03:00):
and why.
Because for me, and I mean fora lot of people, rent is a huge
spectacle and I actually don'twant to play it like a spec, a
big spectacle.
You know, pioneer likes tobring things in, kind of make it
our own little world and I wanteveryone to be living in that
(03:23):
world.
And really one of the biggestthings we've been talking about
is don't anticipate, becauseeverybody knows Rent, everybody
knows the next line thatsomeone's going to sing.
You know in the big songs ofVivo and Rent, and if you're
actually living in the moment,it's important to not anticipate
what the next person is saying.
(03:44):
Listen to what they say and seehow that makes you feel as your
character and really payattention to who these people
are now, where they came fromand where they want to go, which
is kind of crazy, because 90%of them have a disease that back
(04:07):
in 1996 was a death sentence.
How did that affect them?
It's oh, this is like a hugequestion, but I'm gonna try to
make it.
Basically.
I really my angle is thecharacters and how they're
living in this world and what itmeans to them and how that
(04:30):
relates to everybody else onstage and in the audience.
I think that that's as preciseas I can make it.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (04:39):
I think that was excellently said.
Connor McDowell (04:41):
And.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (04:41):
I do apologize for throwing you under
the bus with the hard questionright at the top, but I think
you I mean I think it's greatthat you jumped right into
shouting at your crew you knowyour team and there's so much
work that goes into a musicalright.
It's not just the actors arefront-facing, but there's so
(05:04):
much work that goes on beforeyou get on your feet.
And I'd love to hear maybe alittle bit more about your
choreographer and your stagemanager, who's wonderful, and
your team.
A little bit about them and howit is for the actors working
with them as well.
Shanna Levine-Phelps (05:21):
So my choreographer her name is Erica
Stubler actors working with themas well.
So my choreographer, her nameis Erica Stubler.
She's amazing.
I've never worked with herbefore.
She's actually never workedwith Pioneer before, but she's
seen a few of our things.
She was friends with a fewpeople and when my original
choreographer had to kind of bowout, you know, we started
(05:42):
talking and she's so easy towork with.
This is actually her first kindof solo choreographer position.
She's, you know, worked in manyother shows and she's kind of
assisted and she's been dancecaptain.
But this was like her bigpremiere as solo choreographer
(06:06):
and she dove into it with.
You know, all of these songsthey have movement, they have
dance, they have all thesethings going on, and so I was
like, basically, I just said gowith it, do what you're going to
do, and we're going to see howthe actors, how it works for
them, how it works for themwhile singing.
We had to scale some thingsback.
We had to change some thingsback.
We had to change some thingsbecause when you get into the
(06:27):
space, not everybody fits.
It's a very large cast on avery small stage.
It's like we're going to uselevels, we have scaffolding, we
have all of these, you know,stairs going up the platform and
it's a lot of things going onand a lot of moving pieces, but
she's very, very easy to workwith for me.
I don't know how it is for theactors.
(06:48):
To be perfectly honest, I'm nota dancer, so you know, I don't
know how hard it is for them towork with Erica, but it's very
easy for me to work with her.
She says something, if I agree,I'm like, yeah, sure, let's go
with it.
But I always say I reserve theright to change it if I, if it's
not working for me or forwhoever's on stage.
(07:10):
Um and my stage manager, sheactually I've known her for a
very long time.
Um, I've worked with her inshows and I've also worked with
her elsewhere as a stage managerand she's been a stage manager
for pioneer before as well andshe, um actually worked on the
lion king on broadway and thewest end as a stage manager and
(07:33):
she just she knows a lot ofthings.
I actually think it's hard forher to kind of scale it back to
work, you know, in anon-professional way, working
with everybody's's schedules.
This is not their job.
They're not going to, you know,they can't always be there.
They have other things thatthey're coming from, they have
other commitments, they'revolunteering their time.
(07:55):
It's just a lot to kind of getit together.
We have lots of meetings aboutwhat we're going to do next,
so-and-so just called.
They can't make it, we're goingto have to pivot to doing
something else.
It's a lot of that, but thatall kind of goes with the
territory and I'm just really Ifeel very lucky that we get
(08:16):
along and there hasn't been, youknow, much of like we haven't
butt heads with each other.
Know, they seem to let not.
Let me have the final say, Imean as the director, but you
know it's like I'm like oh, howdo you feel about this?
Or like, well, you're thedirector.
Connor McDowell (08:30):
I mean, what do you think it looks like?
Shanna Levine-Phelps (08:32):
and I'm like no, that's great, that
looks great, you know.
So it's.
It's been very copacetic towork with them.
They've.
It's been a lot of fun.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (08:39):
I'm certainly glad to hear that this
would be a miserable process.
If not, I've had a miserabletime working with other
choreographers, so well,congratulations, then, to Erica
on her first solo gig, and shegets a shout out on the Jersey
Arts podcast.
So yeah, there you go.
From the actor's perspective,what is it like working with
Erica?
And because this is a sungthrough show, I can imagine that
(09:02):
there is a lot of movement, asShauna was saying.
Connor McDowell (09:10):
So, from your perspective, how's that going?
So working with Erica has beenreally great for me, because
this is my first show in abouttwo years because I had two knee
surgeries, so Erica has beenreally great with just making me
feel comfortable and safe while, uh, while moving, so, um, like
if my knee starts hurting.
She's not like judgmental oranything.
(09:31):
She's been very uh uh kindthroughout the entire experience
.
She's also a very goodchoreographer.
I didn't know that this was herfirst uh gig as a choreographer
, a solo choreographer.
That that's awesome.
She's great.
I love working with her.
Yeah, yeah, she's awesome.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (09:50):
That's fantastic.
Basically, you're like thePatrick Swayze of this cast.
Connor McDowell (09:56):
I don't know if I would go that far, but thank
you, thank you.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (09:59):
Well, I'm praying that everybody
understood that reference, Jade.
What has your experience been?
Jade Delos Santos (10:06):
Well, specifically with Erica, I mean,
just by like meeting her atfirst, incredibly warm and
energetic, which is like exactlylike what you want from a
choreographer, you know, like Iknow some people like it, you
know, maybe like more chill,maybe like nonchalant, but her
(10:26):
energy is just really likeinfectious and that's that
really helps get all of the likeover 20 year old adults into
gear, because we're all verytired and we're all like working
full-time or part-time, we'retraveling to get there.
So the fact that she not onlyhas this infectious energy but
(10:49):
she also like generally umstarts our like, either like
choreography rehearsals or justrehearsals in general where
we're going to be moving a lot.
She either starts it with, likewe do a warm up to music or she
, you know, has us do thebeginning of La Vie Boheme, the
(11:09):
really important tablechoreography.
She's like all right, let's runit, let's do's do it.
You know she's on top ofgetting us to feel ready and
excited and I think that that isa that's something innate
rather than, you know, a skill.
I think it can be made into askill, but she just has that
(11:31):
down pat well, I guess ouraudience can certainly expect a
killer, killer dance show.
Shanna Levine-Phelps (11:37):
Well, jade and Connor do a tango.
So tango, maureen.
Yes, and it's amazing.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (11:48):
I love that.
I so I will admit, and thisgoes along with a theory that I
have and maybe you guys canweigh in on this theory.
I feel that whichever you seefirst is what you will love most
as an audience member.
So in my case, I saw Rent theMovie before I saw Rent the
(12:08):
Stage Show.
Now, as sacrilegious as itmight sound to say that one
loves Rent the Movie more thanRent the stage show, I wonder
where you all sit in thatparticular boat Stage show movie
.
Everybody's going to say thestage show, I'll go first.
Shanna Levine-Phelps (12:27):
Okay, and this is because I saw the
original Broadway cast onBroadway in 1996, and it changed
my life Like no, and it changedmy life like no joke changed my
life and I am I am always onethat's kind of prone to liking
the stage version more than themovie.
(12:48):
It's just kind of, I think, theway I'm wired.
But, that being, I didn't hatethe movie, because sometimes
when you love the stage show somuch, you hate what they do with
the movie, and I didn't.
And it gave me the feels likethe stage you know performances
(13:09):
give, I think.
But I haven't watched the moviein a very long time, but you
know I did watch it a lot whenit first came out and I, like I
said before, I watched it withmy kids.
You know they loved Angel, they, you know they loved all like
the dancing and because Icouldn't show it to them in
person, I was able to show themthe movie so they could
(13:30):
understand, kind of, where mylove for the show came from.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (13:34):
I do want to add that I also am a person
who typically favors the stageshow, and that's why this theory
stands out to me, because Iguess maybe it's that usually I
see the stage show first, butbecause I didn't, in this case,
I had a very different viewingexperience.
I also did not have thepleasure of seeing the original
Broadway cast, which I thinkmust have been amazing, but some
(13:59):
of them obviously returned forthe movie.
Most of them, Except well,except for Mimi right, it was
Rosaria Dawson was the newcomerthere.
Shanna Levine-Phelps (14:09):
Mm-hmm.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (14:10):
That said let's ask everyone else.
Shanna Levine-Phelps (14:12):
Side note though, I do want to say when I
saw it in 1996 on Broadway, Isaw it with Jade's mom.
I just need you to know thatJade and I go way back.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (14:22):
I love that little tidbit, thank you.
Thank you for sharing.
That is a whole new layer.
Well then, you know what Jade.
You get the question next whatis your relationship to the
movie versus the stage show?
Jade Delos Santos (14:34):
Well, I'm also a person who saw the movie
first.
Um, I think it affected my momin the same way that it affected
shauna when they saw it.
And I was raised in a verythespian household, um, so you
know, we had musicals on all thetime and, um, one of the movies
(14:55):
that my mom would like prettymuch religiously make me watch
was like rent, and I enjoyed it.
Like it wasn't like I was like,oh, I don't want to watch rent,
I loved it.
Um, I never actually saw astaged version of it until I was
like, uh, in my early like Ithink like 21, I'm 21.
(15:15):
I'm yeah like about because mygodfather, um, was in the show
as Roger, I I believe, inHackettstown um, at the
community college, yes, and hewas awesome.
So that was like the first timeI ever saw it staged.
So the songs that weren't in themovie I was like finally able
to see.
And, honestly, for me it kindof feels like the movie and the
(15:45):
show are like two differentattitudes and I think at this
point I think I like the stagemore than the movie, even though
I grew up on it.
Like it's very close though,because you know this was a show
.
That is like kind of almostunfinished because of the
(16:06):
circumstances which it waswritten and put on, you know
like, and I wonder if the moviewas kind of a way to make it a
new draft, essentially like getlike breathe a little bit more
abstract, where I think themovie kind of grounds the, the
(16:40):
story and the characters and thesituation.
So they both have theirstrengths but now that I've been
able to, now that I'mexperiencing one and I've
watched the other for so long, II think I do like the stage
version, if only because of thesong Halloween.
I think the movie really missedout on putting Halloween in it.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (17:00):
Well, I will say that that was one of
the glaring differences, becauseI had seen the movie first.
When I saw the stage show, Ihad no idea that it was a rock
opera, so I had no idea that itwas sung through, that there was
going to be dialogue.
I was very confused and once Iadjusted to that I was like, oh
okay, this is confused.
And once I adjusted to that Iwas like, oh okay, this is
awesome, this is great.
It just it was like I gotsmacked in the face with this is
(17:22):
different.
And then my body had to likecatch up to dancing to new music
.
On to Connor.
What is your take on these two?
Connor McDowell (17:34):
So I actually have a very interesting
experience with Rent.
So I first saw the movie when Iwas 13 years old and I had to
sneak it because I wasn'tallowed to watch it because, yes
, it was rated PG-13, but my momwas still like, no, not right
now, not right now.
So I had to sneak it and I sawit and I was like this is
incredible and I fell in lovewith it and then I started
(17:57):
sharing it with my friends andthen some other friends started
watching it and we all fell inlove with it.
And then eventually I was in aproduction of rent when I was 15
years old as Mark, but we mayor may not have purchased the
rights, but we may or may nothave purchased the rights, so it
(18:18):
was an illegal production ofRent, but it really made me fall
in love with the stage show.
And, from an acting perspective, I really love the fact that
it's fully sung through.
I love the challenge that thatbrings, especially from an
acting perspective, because in alot of shows that are fully
(18:40):
sung through, acting can kind offeel secondary, but I love
trying to to bring that to theforefront.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (18:49):
Uh, in doing in doing the full stage
show wow, and I got a confessionout of you too.
I didn't even have to try.
But that said, since youbrought it up, what is it like
playing Mark?
I mean, what do you do toprepare for such a role,
especially because, like yousaid, it is kind of well, not
(19:12):
kind of, it is a challenge.
So how do you prep?
Connor McDowell (19:14):
So it has been hard, just because he does so
much uh, he's constantly talkingand singing throughout the
entire show, so, uh,memorization is definitely, um,
something that I've found alittle bit more difficult than
usual when it comes to preparingfor a role, just because I want
to make sure everything is, youknow, exactly as written, and
(19:37):
I'm not uh messing with anything.
I'm not messing anything up,but specifically from like an
acting preparation standpoint, Ifigured the easiest way for me
to get closer to Mark was to uhdo some research on, um the
directors that are mentioned inuh La Vie Boheme and throughout
(19:58):
the show, and then watch some ofthe movies that those directors
have made.
So that's kind of what I'vebeen doing uh, recently is uh is
watching some of the uh thefilms.
Like, I've watched, uh, akiraKurosawa.
I watched High and Low recently, which was fantastic.
Um, so, yeah, that's recently,which was fantastic.
So, yeah, that's that's kind ofwhat I've been doing Outside of
(20:19):
you know memorization andprepping.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (20:26):
That is wonderfully thorough and you're
opening your mind to a whole newworld of cinema.
That's excellent.
Connor McDowell (20:28):
Yeah, I love it .
It's, it's incredible.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (20:31):
Jade.
How about you for Joanne?
What's your prep?
Jade Delos Santos (20:34):
Well, when I found out that I got the part, I
really wanted to just kind ofconsume all the Joanne that
existed on the internet.
So I basically just kind oflooked at everyone's
performances.
I kind of figured out what wasthe common thread or the common
(20:56):
threads between them all andthen I thought, ok, how am I
going to be different enoughwithout breaking that thread?
Because Joanne, for when I wasa kid, was like one of my dream
roles.
Because, you know, like I wasborn in 1999, so like back in
(21:19):
like the early 2000s, when themovie came out and when I saw it
there were just there wasn'tHamilton, yet, you know, there
wasn't um things on Broadway.
I remember like being eight andsaying to my mom like god, I
want to play Annie so bad.
And then realizing it's probablynot happening, you know, but
like seeing Joanne exist onscreen and knowing that she
(21:44):
existed on stage was somethingthat like really touched me and
I was like that's something thatI can aim for.
So, honestly, I think my prepstarted like way back back when
I was a child and then I've beenthinking about it and
ruminating on it and I think nowwhen I approach the role, it's
(22:05):
challenging because Joanne issupposed to be kind of the
straight man, that dynamically,without just kind of joining in
on the madness.
So for me it's the way thatI've been relating to it is
through neurodivergence.
(22:28):
I've been relating it to justkind of my own experiences, like
with very chaotic friend groups, and I've just been making the
process of the prep like verypersonal and really adding my
own flair as much as I canbefore it becomes like too too
(22:49):
much and then I pull it back.
But yeah, definitely prep workhas been studying, thinking
about like how much I thinkabout Joanne, like for my whole
life, and then, you know, reallytrying to execute it in a
really respectful and fresh way.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (23:05):
I am honestly so fascinated by
hearing an actor talk abouttheir process, so this is really
exciting for me and I love thatthis show for each of you has
been in your life so long, likewe said it's been.
We're just under 30 years forthe anniversary of the Broadway
show, so prepping, prepping forthis show, since you're eight,
(23:29):
sounds wonderful for me, and Iknow that we're not being quite
literal, right, you weren't aneight year old saying, ah yes,
one day, one day, I willunderstand what it is to break
up with a woman and then have toshare her with her ex boyfriend
.
But on that note, what is itlike working with one another?
And do you craft?
Do you cross craft?
(23:50):
Talk to one another about whatit was like having dated Maureen
and I am speaking to ouraudiences that you know, know
the plot of Rent, and I hopethat you do so, connor, what has
your takeaway been from workingwith Jade on this?
Connor McDowell (24:08):
What I found most helpful is Jade and I have
become actually quite closefriends throughout this process
so we just find ourselveslaughing and having fun together
a lot of the time throughoutrehearsals.
So bringing a lot of thatenergy, especially to Tango
Maureen and just being verycomfortable with each other, I
(24:30):
feel like, has brought an energyto the song that just makes it
a lot, of, a lot of fun to do,especially with with Jade.
I've really enjoyed workingwith Jade.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (24:41):
I'm very glad to hear that I I want to
know from each of you what is itthat you're excited to share
with audiences?
What?
What is your favorite partabout putting on a show and
waiting to hear that reaction?
Shanna Levine-Phelps (24:57):
That is a very good question, I think what
I'm most excited about.
First of all, I'm very, very,very excited about this cast.
I just cannot.
I know that you're alwaysdirectors, always like, oh, this
is my dream cast, they're soperfect, they're so this,
they're so this, they're so that, and.
(25:18):
But I have been wanting eitherto be in the show.
First I wanted to be Mimi, thenI wanted to be Maureen and now
I am more drawn towards Joanne.
It's just a thing as you age,it's what happens.
But these humans in this showthey're just lovely people.
(25:40):
It's lovely to be with them allthe time.
Yes, we're tired.
Yes, sometimes it gets a littlefrustrating, you know.
Yes, people talk when otherpeople are on stage and blah,
blah, blah.
But in general, I havethoroughly, thoroughly enjoyed
the people.
(26:03):
I've enjoyed these actors andI've enjoyed being able to share
my thoughts on Rent and them,all of them, connor and Jade and
I mean especially Connor andJade they've really taken it to
heart.
They're very grounded on stage,which is just a beautiful thing
(26:24):
.
It's one of my favorite thingswhen actors can really live on
stage in the world that theycreate and be really truthful.
But all of these people, theythey're here because they want
to be here there.
They took these parts becausethey want to portray them.
They've taken, you know, mythoughts on the, on rent, as
(26:45):
kind of like its own universe,its own place in time.
And yes, it's a period piecebecause, you know, I, I grew up,
you know, when I was little.
That's when the AIDS epidemic,you know, came about.
I was, I was born in the 70s,so you know, like that, I really
(27:05):
grew up with that.
So being able to kind of sharewhat it was like in real time
for me and and then, you know,broaden that and have all all of
these actors take where theyare in their lives and what
these things mean to them, andand put it together is just so
(27:26):
beautiful.
Um, they're just so.
I don't, I, I'm gonna, I'm good, I'm gushing, but they're
beautiful.
The whole cast, all thesepeople, and I just want
everybody to see them.
I want everybody to see howthey have created Rent and that
it's important and it'simportant to them and it's
important to us, and I just wanteverybody to see it because
(27:49):
they're amazing.
Jade Delos Santos (27:50):
So a big thing for me I'm a voice teacher
as well as a beginner pianoteacher and a big thing for me
is that when I see my studentsand they're like I want to sing
this song from Waitress, I wantto sing this song from Lion King
or Ragtime Parade, whatever Isee, there's like so much like
(28:13):
excitement and like hope intheir eyes because these are
roles that they want to likeembody and they really want to
like perform one day.
And I think that a lot of myolder students are going to be
coming to the show, um, or sothey say, but hopefully they do.
(28:34):
And I think what I want to givethem as like myself and also as
a cast, is I want to give themthat like hope of that.
Like you know, we do not looklike what you know.
Professionalism always lookslike and, um, what exists in the
(28:57):
, in the, in the mainstream, youknow, on on broadway, on
broadway west end, wherever um.
And I want to give them thatsense of hope that they, they
can do it, they can be on thatstage, they can be in these
kinds of roles, um, that's andthat's for everybody, not just
the kids I I teach, but for anyadult who gave up on their
(29:21):
theatrical dreams, or anyonelike that.
That's what I want to givepeople in any performance, but
with this cast most especially.
Connor McDowell (29:31):
That was a really beautiful answer answer
um, so, uh, I feel like we'vecreated a very uh intimate
production of rent.
A lot of productions that yousee are very, they can feel very
distant, you know, because, uh,you know you're just watching
on a flat stage, but we have a,we have a thrust, we have a
(29:51):
catwalk in our, on our set, andit it really it feels like it
brings in the audience in a waythat you usually don't see for a
show like this, and I I reallylove that and I hope that people
come to the show and theyreally do feel that sense of
that, that sense of intimacy,because I feel like
interpersonal intimacy issomething that we are really
(30:13):
lacking, uh, societally right,which is, you know, I hope that
this kind of helps foster asense of community.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (30:22):
You can check out Pioneer's production
of Rent at the stage atFellowship Hall in Morristown,
running Fridays through Sundays,beginning June 13th through the
22nd.
For tickets and moreinformation, be sure to visit
PioneerProductionsCompany.
org.
If you liked this episode, besure to review, subscribe and
tell your friends.
A transcript of this podcast,links relevant to the story and
(30:45):
more about the arts in NewJersey can be found at
JerseyArts.
com.
The Jersey Arts Podcast ispresented by Art Pride New
Jersey, advancing a state ofcreativity since 1986.
The show was co-founded by, andcurrently supported by funds
from, the New Jersey StateCouncil on the Arts.
This episode was hosted, editedand produced by me, Gina Marie
Rodriguez.
(31:05):
Executive producers are JimAtkinson and Isaac Serna-Diaz,
and my thanks, of course, toShanna Levine Phelps, Jade Delos
Santos and Connor McDowell forspeaking with me today.
I'm Gina Marie Rodriguez forthe Jersey Arts Podcast.
Thanks for listening.
This is Gina Marie Rodriguez and you're
listening to the Jersey ArtsPodcast.
Today we're talking all things.
Rent.
Pioneer Productions Company ofMorristown will be bringing the
larger-than-life rock opera to amore intimate setting With
music and lyrics by JonathanLarson.
The Tony Award and PulitzerPrize-winning musical is quickly
approaching its 30-yearanniversary.
(00:24):
The show first premiered onBroadway 29 years ago in 1996.
Set in New York City's EastVillage amid the AIDS crisis of
the late 1980s and early 1990s,Rent tells the unforgettable
story of a group of strugglingartists navigating love, loss,
identity and the cost of living.
With a raw, electrifying scoreand timeless message, rent
(00:47):
celebrates the power ofcommunity, chosen family and
living without regret.
Today I'm chatting withdirector Shanna Levine-Phelps
and actors Jade Del os Santosand Connor McDowell about the
behind-the-scenes effort ittakes to bring such an iconic
show to life to bring such aniconic show to life.
Connor McDowell (01:07):
Hi, my name is Connor McDowell and I'm playing
Mark in Rent for PioneerProductions.
Jade Delos Santos (01:11):
Hi, my name is Jade Del os Santos.
I'm playing Joanne in Rent forPioneer Productions.
Shanna Levine-Phelps (01:19):
Hi, I'm Shanna Levine- Phelps and I am
the director of Rent for PioneerProductions.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (01:27):
Shauna, as the director, how are you
approaching this particular rockopera?
Shanna Levine-Phelps (01:32):
That is actually a very good question.
This is the biggest musicalI've ever directed.
It's one of the biggestmusicals Pioneer's ever done.
Probably Hair you know, jadewas actually in that as well
however many years ago was maybeour other big musical, and
(01:53):
though Pioneer's been around fora while, we still kind of learn
as we go.
So, that being said, we make a,a schedule.
I have an amazing um stagemanager who's you know went
through everything, went througheverybody's out dates, figured
out who was going to be wherewhen we went through with the
(02:13):
music director and we broughther in first to go over music
and then, kind of at end, thechoreographer, because Rent is
pretty much all sung and lots ofdancing, and so I was kind of
figuring out where my place isas the director within this.
(02:39):
And Rent is actually, if not myfavorite musical of all time.
It is definitely one of them,and I wanted to kind of come at
it from the angle of characterdevelopment, of who these people
are, who they are to each other, how they fit into this world
(03:00):
and why.
Because for me, and I mean fora lot of people, rent is a huge
spectacle and I actually don'twant to play it like a spec, a
big spectacle.
You know, pioneer likes tobring things in, kind of make it
our own little world and I wanteveryone to be living in that
(03:23):
world.
And really one of the biggestthings we've been talking about
is don't anticipate, becauseeverybody knows Rent, everybody
knows the next line thatsomeone's going to sing.
You know in the big songs ofVivo and Rent, and if you're
actually living in the moment,it's important to not anticipate
what the next person is saying.
(03:44):
Listen to what they say and seehow that makes you feel as your
character and really payattention to who these people
are now, where they came fromand where they want to go, which
is kind of crazy, because 90%of them have a disease that back
(04:07):
in 1996 was a death sentence.
How did that affect them?
It's oh, this is like a hugequestion, but I'm gonna try to
make it.
Basically.
I really my angle is thecharacters and how they're
living in this world and what itmeans to them and how that
(04:30):
relates to everybody else onstage and in the audience.
I think that that's as preciseas I can make it.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (04:39):
I think that was excellently said.
Connor McDowell (04:41):
And.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (04:41):
I do apologize for throwing you under
the bus with the hard questionright at the top, but I think
you I mean I think it's greatthat you jumped right into
shouting at your crew you knowyour team and there's so much
work that goes into a musicalright.
It's not just the actors arefront-facing, but there's so
(05:04):
much work that goes on beforeyou get on your feet.
And I'd love to hear maybe alittle bit more about your
choreographer and your stagemanager, who's wonderful, and
your team.
A little bit about them and howit is for the actors working
with them as well.
Shanna Levine-Phelps (05:21):
So my choreographer her name is Erica
Stubler actors working with themas well.
So my choreographer, her nameis Erica Stubler.
She's amazing.
I've never worked with herbefore.
She's actually never workedwith Pioneer before, but she's
seen a few of our things.
She was friends with a fewpeople and when my original
choreographer had to kind of bowout, you know, we started
(05:42):
talking and she's so easy towork with.
This is actually her first kindof solo choreographer position.
She's, you know, worked in manyother shows and she's kind of
assisted and she's been dancecaptain.
But this was like her bigpremiere as solo choreographer
(06:06):
and she dove into it with.
You know, all of these songsthey have movement, they have
dance, they have all thesethings going on, and so I was
like, basically, I just said gowith it, do what you're going to
do, and we're going to see howthe actors, how it works for
them, how it works for themwhile singing.
We had to scale some thingsback.
We had to change some thingsback.
We had to change some thingsbecause when you get into the
(06:27):
space, not everybody fits.
It's a very large cast on avery small stage.
It's like we're going to uselevels, we have scaffolding, we
have all of these, you know,stairs going up the platform and
it's a lot of things going onand a lot of moving pieces, but
she's very, very easy to workwith for me.
I don't know how it is for theactors.
(06:48):
To be perfectly honest, I'm nota dancer, so you know, I don't
know how hard it is for them towork with Erica, but it's very
easy for me to work with her.
She says something, if I agree,I'm like, yeah, sure, let's go
with it.
But I always say I reserve theright to change it if I, if it's
not working for me or forwhoever's on stage.
(07:10):
Um and my stage manager, sheactually I've known her for a
very long time.
Um, I've worked with her inshows and I've also worked with
her elsewhere as a stage managerand she's been a stage manager
for pioneer before as well andshe, um actually worked on the
lion king on broadway and thewest end as a stage manager and
(07:33):
she just she knows a lot ofthings.
I actually think it's hard forher to kind of scale it back to
work, you know, in anon-professional way, working
with everybody's's schedules.
This is not their job.
They're not going to, you know,they can't always be there.
They have other things thatthey're coming from, they have
other commitments, they'revolunteering their time.
(07:55):
It's just a lot to kind of getit together.
We have lots of meetings aboutwhat we're going to do next,
so-and-so just called.
They can't make it, we're goingto have to pivot to doing
something else.
It's a lot of that, but thatall kind of goes with the
territory and I'm just really Ifeel very lucky that we get
(08:16):
along and there hasn't been, youknow, much of like we haven't
butt heads with each other.
Know, they seem to let not.
Let me have the final say, Imean as the director, but you
know it's like I'm like oh, howdo you feel about this?
Or like, well, you're thedirector.
Connor McDowell (08:30):
I mean, what do you think it looks like?
Shanna Levine-Phelps (08:32):
and I'm like no, that's great, that
looks great, you know.
So it's.
It's been very copacetic towork with them.
They've.
It's been a lot of fun.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (08:39):
I'm certainly glad to hear that this
would be a miserable process.
If not, I've had a miserabletime working with other
choreographers, so well,congratulations, then, to Erica
on her first solo gig, and shegets a shout out on the Jersey
Arts podcast.
So yeah, there you go.
From the actor's perspective,what is it like working with
Erica?
And because this is a sungthrough show, I can imagine that
(09:02):
there is a lot of movement, asShauna was saying.
Connor McDowell (09:10):
So, from your perspective, how's that going?
So working with Erica has beenreally great for me, because
this is my first show in abouttwo years because I had two knee
surgeries, so Erica has beenreally great with just making me
feel comfortable and safe while, uh, while moving, so, um, like
if my knee starts hurting.
She's not like judgmental oranything.
(09:31):
She's been very uh uh kindthroughout the entire experience
.
She's also a very goodchoreographer.
I didn't know that this was herfirst uh gig as a choreographer
, a solo choreographer.
That that's awesome.
She's great.
I love working with her.
Yeah, yeah, she's awesome.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (09:50):
That's fantastic.
Basically, you're like thePatrick Swayze of this cast.
Connor McDowell (09:56):
I don't know if I would go that far, but thank
you, thank you.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (09:59):
Well, I'm praying that everybody
understood that reference, Jade.
What has your experience been?
Jade Delos Santos (10:06):
Well, specifically with Erica, I mean,
just by like meeting her atfirst, incredibly warm and
energetic, which is like exactlylike what you want from a
choreographer, you know, like Iknow some people like it, you
know, maybe like more chill,maybe like nonchalant, but her
(10:26):
energy is just really likeinfectious and that's that
really helps get all of the likeover 20 year old adults into
gear, because we're all verytired and we're all like working
full-time or part-time, we'retraveling to get there.
So the fact that she not onlyhas this infectious energy but
(10:49):
she also like generally umstarts our like, either like
choreography rehearsals or justrehearsals in general where
we're going to be moving a lot.
She either starts it with, likewe do a warm up to music or she
, you know, has us do thebeginning of La Vie Boheme, the
(11:09):
really important tablechoreography.
She's like all right, let's runit, let's do's do it.
You know she's on top ofgetting us to feel ready and
excited and I think that that isa that's something innate
rather than, you know, a skill.
I think it can be made into askill, but she just has that
(11:31):
down pat well, I guess ouraudience can certainly expect a
killer, killer dance show.
Shanna Levine-Phelps (11:37):
Well, jade and Connor do a tango.
So tango, maureen.
Yes, and it's amazing.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (11:48):
I love that.
I so I will admit, and thisgoes along with a theory that I
have and maybe you guys canweigh in on this theory.
I feel that whichever you seefirst is what you will love most
as an audience member.
So in my case, I saw Rent theMovie before I saw Rent the
(12:08):
Stage Show.
Now, as sacrilegious as itmight sound to say that one
loves Rent the Movie more thanRent the stage show, I wonder
where you all sit in thatparticular boat Stage show movie
.
Everybody's going to say thestage show, I'll go first.
Shanna Levine-Phelps (12:27):
Okay, and this is because I saw the
original Broadway cast onBroadway in 1996, and it changed
my life Like no, and it changedmy life like no joke changed my
life and I am I am always onethat's kind of prone to liking
the stage version more than themovie.
(12:48):
It's just kind of, I think, theway I'm wired.
But, that being, I didn't hatethe movie, because sometimes
when you love the stage show somuch, you hate what they do with
the movie, and I didn't.
And it gave me the feels likethe stage you know performances
(13:09):
give, I think.
But I haven't watched the moviein a very long time, but you
know I did watch it a lot whenit first came out and I, like I
said before, I watched it withmy kids.
You know they loved Angel, they, you know they loved all like
the dancing and because Icouldn't show it to them in
person, I was able to show themthe movie so they could
(13:30):
understand, kind of, where mylove for the show came from.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (13:34):
I do want to add that I also am a person
who typically favors the stageshow, and that's why this theory
stands out to me, because Iguess maybe it's that usually I
see the stage show first, butbecause I didn't, in this case,
I had a very different viewingexperience.
I also did not have thepleasure of seeing the original
Broadway cast, which I thinkmust have been amazing, but some
(13:59):
of them obviously returned forthe movie.
Most of them, Except well,except for Mimi right, it was
Rosaria Dawson was the newcomerthere.
Shanna Levine-Phelps (14:09):
Mm-hmm.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (14:10):
That said let's ask everyone else.
Shanna Levine-Phelps (14:12):
Side note though, I do want to say when I
saw it in 1996 on Broadway, Isaw it with Jade's mom.
I just need you to know thatJade and I go way back.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (14:22):
I love that little tidbit, thank you.
Thank you for sharing.
That is a whole new layer.
Well then, you know what Jade.
You get the question next whatis your relationship to the
movie versus the stage show?
Jade Delos Santos (14:34):
Well, I'm also a person who saw the movie
first.
Um, I think it affected my momin the same way that it affected
shauna when they saw it.
And I was raised in a verythespian household, um, so you
know, we had musicals on all thetime and, um, one of the movies
(14:55):
that my mom would like prettymuch religiously make me watch
was like rent, and I enjoyed it.
Like it wasn't like I was like,oh, I don't want to watch rent,
I loved it.
Um, I never actually saw astaged version of it until I was
like, uh, in my early like Ithink like 21, I'm 21.
(15:15):
I'm yeah like about because mygodfather, um, was in the show
as Roger, I I believe, inHackettstown um, at the
community college, yes, and hewas awesome.
So that was like the first timeI ever saw it staged.
So the songs that weren't in themovie I was like finally able
to see.
And, honestly, for me it kindof feels like the movie and the
(15:45):
show are like two differentattitudes and I think at this
point I think I like the stagemore than the movie, even though
I grew up on it.
Like it's very close though,because you know this was a show
.
That is like kind of almostunfinished because of the
(16:06):
circumstances which it waswritten and put on, you know
like, and I wonder if the moviewas kind of a way to make it a
new draft, essentially like getlike breathe a little bit more
abstract, where I think themovie kind of grounds the, the
(16:40):
story and the characters and thesituation.
So they both have theirstrengths but now that I've been
able to, now that I'mexperiencing one and I've
watched the other for so long, II think I do like the stage
version, if only because of thesong Halloween.
I think the movie really missedout on putting Halloween in it.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (17:00):
Well, I will say that that was one of
the glaring differences, becauseI had seen the movie first.
When I saw the stage show, Ihad no idea that it was a rock
opera, so I had no idea that itwas sung through, that there was
going to be dialogue.
I was very confused and once Iadjusted to that I was like, oh
okay, this is confused.
And once I adjusted to that Iwas like, oh okay, this is
awesome, this is great.
It just it was like I gotsmacked in the face with this is
(17:22):
different.
And then my body had to likecatch up to dancing to new music
.
On to Connor.
What is your take on these two?
Connor McDowell (17:34):
So I actually have a very interesting
experience with Rent.
So I first saw the movie when Iwas 13 years old and I had to
sneak it because I wasn'tallowed to watch it because, yes
, it was rated PG-13, but my momwas still like, no, not right
now, not right now.
So I had to sneak it and I sawit and I was like this is
incredible and I fell in lovewith it and then I started
(17:57):
sharing it with my friends andthen some other friends started
watching it and we all fell inlove with it.
And then eventually I was in aproduction of rent when I was 15
years old as Mark, but we mayor may not have purchased the
rights, but we may or may nothave purchased the rights, so it
(18:18):
was an illegal production ofRent, but it really made me fall
in love with the stage show.
And, from an acting perspective, I really love the fact that
it's fully sung through.
I love the challenge that thatbrings, especially from an
acting perspective, because in alot of shows that are fully
(18:40):
sung through, acting can kind offeel secondary, but I love
trying to to bring that to theforefront.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (18:49):
Uh, in doing in doing the full stage
show wow, and I got a confessionout of you too.
I didn't even have to try.
But that said, since youbrought it up, what is it like
playing Mark?
I mean, what do you do toprepare for such a role,
especially because, like yousaid, it is kind of well, not
(19:12):
kind of, it is a challenge.
So how do you prep?
Connor McDowell (19:14):
So it has been hard, just because he does so
much uh, he's constantly talkingand singing throughout the
entire show, so, uh,memorization is definitely, um,
something that I've found alittle bit more difficult than
usual when it comes to preparingfor a role, just because I want
to make sure everything is, youknow, exactly as written, and
(19:37):
I'm not uh messing with anything.
I'm not messing anything up,but specifically from like an
acting preparation standpoint, Ifigured the easiest way for me
to get closer to Mark was to uhdo some research on, um the
directors that are mentioned inuh La Vie Boheme and throughout
(19:58):
the show, and then watch some ofthe movies that those directors
have made.
So that's kind of what I'vebeen doing uh, recently is uh is
watching some of the uh thefilms.
Like, I've watched, uh, akiraKurosawa.
I watched High and Low recently, which was fantastic.
Um, so, yeah, that's recently,which was fantastic.
So, yeah, that's that's kind ofwhat I've been doing Outside of
(20:19):
you know memorization andprepping.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (20:26):
That is wonderfully thorough and you're
opening your mind to a whole newworld of cinema.
That's excellent.
Connor McDowell (20:28):
Yeah, I love it .
It's, it's incredible.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (20:31):
Jade.
How about you for Joanne?
What's your prep?
Jade Delos Santos (20:34):
Well, when I found out that I got the part, I
really wanted to just kind ofconsume all the Joanne that
existed on the internet.
So I basically just kind oflooked at everyone's
performances.
I kind of figured out what wasthe common thread or the common
(20:56):
threads between them all andthen I thought, ok, how am I
going to be different enoughwithout breaking that thread?
Because Joanne, for when I wasa kid, was like one of my dream
roles.
Because, you know, like I wasborn in 1999, so like back in
(21:19):
like the early 2000s, when themovie came out and when I saw it
there were just there wasn'tHamilton, yet, you know, there
wasn't um things on Broadway.
I remember like being eight andsaying to my mom like god, I
want to play Annie so bad.
And then realizing it's probablynot happening, you know, but
like seeing Joanne exist onscreen and knowing that she
(21:44):
existed on stage was somethingthat like really touched me and
I was like that's something thatI can aim for.
So, honestly, I think my prepstarted like way back back when
I was a child and then I've beenthinking about it and
ruminating on it and I think nowwhen I approach the role, it's
(22:05):
challenging because Joanne issupposed to be kind of the
straight man, that dynamically,without just kind of joining in
on the madness.
So for me it's the way thatI've been relating to it is
through neurodivergence.
(22:28):
I've been relating it to justkind of my own experiences, like
with very chaotic friend groups, and I've just been making the
process of the prep like verypersonal and really adding my
own flair as much as I canbefore it becomes like too too
(22:49):
much and then I pull it back.
But yeah, definitely prep workhas been studying, thinking
about like how much I thinkabout Joanne, like for my whole
life, and then, you know, reallytrying to execute it in a
really respectful and fresh way.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (23:05):
I am honestly so fascinated by
hearing an actor talk abouttheir process, so this is really
exciting for me and I love thatthis show for each of you has
been in your life so long, likewe said it's been.
We're just under 30 years forthe anniversary of the Broadway
show, so prepping, prepping forthis show, since you're eight,
(23:29):
sounds wonderful for me, and Iknow that we're not being quite
literal, right, you weren't aneight year old saying, ah yes,
one day, one day, I willunderstand what it is to break
up with a woman and then have toshare her with her ex boyfriend
.
But on that note, what is itlike working with one another?
And do you craft?
Do you cross craft?
(23:50):
Talk to one another about whatit was like having dated Maureen
and I am speaking to ouraudiences that you know, know
the plot of Rent, and I hopethat you do so, connor, what has
your takeaway been from workingwith Jade on this?
Connor McDowell (24:08):
What I found most helpful is Jade and I have
become actually quite closefriends throughout this process
so we just find ourselveslaughing and having fun together
a lot of the time throughoutrehearsals.
So bringing a lot of thatenergy, especially to Tango
Maureen and just being verycomfortable with each other, I
(24:30):
feel like, has brought an energyto the song that just makes it
a lot, of, a lot of fun to do,especially with with Jade.
I've really enjoyed workingwith Jade.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (24:41):
I'm very glad to hear that I I want to
know from each of you what is itthat you're excited to share
with audiences?
What?
What is your favorite partabout putting on a show and
waiting to hear that reaction?
Shanna Levine-Phelps (24:57):
That is a very good question, I think what
I'm most excited about.
First of all, I'm very, very,very excited about this cast.
I just cannot.
I know that you're alwaysdirectors, always like, oh, this
is my dream cast, they're soperfect, they're so this,
they're so this, they're so that, and.
(25:18):
But I have been wanting eitherto be in the show.
First I wanted to be Mimi, thenI wanted to be Maureen and now
I am more drawn towards Joanne.
It's just a thing as you age,it's what happens.
But these humans in this showthey're just lovely people.
(25:40):
It's lovely to be with them allthe time.
Yes, we're tired.
Yes, sometimes it gets a littlefrustrating, you know.
Yes, people talk when otherpeople are on stage and blah,
blah, blah.
But in general, I havethoroughly, thoroughly enjoyed
the people.
(26:03):
I've enjoyed these actors andI've enjoyed being able to share
my thoughts on Rent and them,all of them, connor and Jade and
I mean especially Connor andJade they've really taken it to
heart.
They're very grounded on stage,which is just a beautiful thing
(26:24):
.
It's one of my favorite thingswhen actors can really live on
stage in the world that theycreate and be really truthful.
But all of these people, theythey're here because they want
to be here there.
They took these parts becausethey want to portray them.
They've taken, you know, mythoughts on the, on rent, as
(26:45):
kind of like its own universe,its own place in time.
And yes, it's a period piecebecause, you know, I, I grew up,
you know, when I was little.
That's when the AIDS epidemic,you know, came about.
I was, I was born in the 70s,so you know, like that, I really
(27:05):
grew up with that.
So being able to kind of sharewhat it was like in real time
for me and and then, you know,broaden that and have all all of
these actors take where theyare in their lives and what
these things mean to them, andand put it together is just so
(27:26):
beautiful.
Um, they're just so.
I don't, I, I'm gonna, I'm good, I'm gushing, but they're
beautiful.
The whole cast, all thesepeople, and I just want
everybody to see them.
I want everybody to see howthey have created Rent and that
it's important and it'simportant to them and it's
important to us, and I just wanteverybody to see it because
(27:49):
they're amazing.
Jade Delos Santos (27:50):
So a big thing for me I'm a voice teacher
as well as a beginner pianoteacher and a big thing for me
is that when I see my studentsand they're like I want to sing
this song from Waitress, I wantto sing this song from Lion King
or Ragtime Parade, whatever Isee, there's like so much like
(28:13):
excitement and like hope intheir eyes because these are
roles that they want to likeembody and they really want to
like perform one day.
And I think that a lot of myolder students are going to be
coming to the show, um, or sothey say, but hopefully they do.
(28:34):
And I think what I want to givethem as like myself and also as
a cast, is I want to give themthat like hope of that.
Like you know, we do not looklike what you know.
Professionalism always lookslike and, um, what exists in the
(28:57):
, in the, in the mainstream, youknow, on on broadway, on
broadway west end, wherever um.
And I want to give them thatsense of hope that they, they
can do it, they can be on thatstage, they can be in these
kinds of roles, um, that's andthat's for everybody, not just
the kids I I teach, but for anyadult who gave up on their
(29:21):
theatrical dreams, or anyonelike that.
That's what I want to givepeople in any performance, but
with this cast most especially.
Connor McDowell (29:31):
That was a really beautiful answer answer
um, so, uh, I feel like we'vecreated a very uh intimate
production of rent.
A lot of productions that yousee are very, they can feel very
distant, you know, because, uh,you know you're just watching
on a flat stage, but we have a,we have a thrust, we have a
(29:51):
catwalk in our, on our set, andit it really it feels like it
brings in the audience in a waythat you usually don't see for a
show like this, and I I reallylove that and I hope that people
come to the show and theyreally do feel that sense of
that, that sense of intimacy,because I feel like
interpersonal intimacy issomething that we are really
(30:13):
lacking, uh, societally right,which is, you know, I hope that
this kind of helps foster asense of community.
Gina Marie Rodriguez (30:22):
You can check out Pioneer's production
of Rent at the stage atFellowship Hall in Morristown,
running Fridays through Sundays,beginning June 13th through the
22nd.
For tickets and moreinformation, be sure to visit
PioneerProductionsCompany.
org.
If you liked this episode, besure to review, subscribe and
tell your friends.
A transcript of this podcast,links relevant to the story and
(30:45):
more about the arts in NewJersey can be found at
JerseyArts.
com.
The Jersey Arts Podcast ispresented by Art Pride New
Jersey, advancing a state ofcreativity since 1986.
The show was co-founded by, andcurrently supported by funds
from, the New Jersey StateCouncil on the Arts.
This episode was hosted, editedand produced by me, Gina Marie
Rodriguez.
(31:05):
Executive producers are JimAtkinson and Isaac Serna-Diaz,
and my thanks, of course, toShanna Levine Phelps, Jade Delos
Santos and Connor McDowell forspeaking with me today.
I'm Gina Marie Rodriguez forthe Jersey Arts Podcast.
Thanks for listening.
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