February 24, 2025 • 45 mins
Glen Van Peski shares his philosophy of ultralight backpacking, revealing how taking less can lead to a more fulfilling life. Through personal stories of adventure, gratitude, and survival, he encourages listeners to embrace minimalism and focus on meaningful experiences.
• Overview of Glen Van Peski's philosophy on ultralight backpacking
• Discussion of his iconic 4,200-mile bike journey at 17
• The impact of adventure on personal growth and resilience
• Importance of gratitude amidst life’s challenges
• Details about Glen’s harrowing plane crash experience
• Insights into his marriage and family life
• Glen’s venture into creating ultralight gear with Gossamer Gear
• Future adventure plans and the significance of living opportunistic
To learn about Glen and get his book visit www.glenvanpeski.com.
Want to be a guest on Journey with Jake? Send me a message on PodMatch, here: https://www.podmatch.com/hostdetailpreview/journeywithjake
Visit LandPirate.com to get your gear that has you, the adventurer, in mind. Use the code "Journey with Jake" to get an additional 15% off at check out.
Visit geneticinsights.co and use the code "DISCOVER25" to enjoy a sweet 25% off your first purchase.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Earl Schaefer once said carry as little as possible
, but choose that little withcare.
My guest today, glenn Van Pesky, lives by this philosophy, both
on and off the trail.
As an ultralight backpacker,glenn has learned that the less
you carry, the more you canexperience and accomplish.
But his minimalist approachextends far beyond hiking.
(00:21):
It's a guiding principle forhis life, extends far beyond
hiking.
It's a guiding principle forhis life so much so that he
wrote the book Take Less, doMore.
Surprising Life Lessons inGenerosity, gratitude and
Curiosity from an UltralightBackpacker.
Join me as we hit the trail oflife with Glenn Van Pesky and
discover how traveling light canlead to a more meaningful
(00:41):
journey.
Welcome to Journey with Jake.
This is a podcast aboutadventure and how, through our
adventures, we can overcome thechallenges of life that come our
way.
While I expect you will learnsome things about different
adventures, this show willentertain you.
Each episode will featuredifferent guests or guests as
they share experiences andstories from the different
adventures they have been on.
(01:02):
Not only will you beentertained, but you'll also
hear the failures and trialseach guest faces and what they
have done or are doing toovercome the hardships that come
their way.
My goal is to take each of uson a journey through the
experiences of my guests, withthe hope that you'll be
entertained and inspired toovercome your day-to-day
challenges.
After all, it's not all aboutthe destination as it is about
(01:25):
the destination as it is aboutthe journey.
Welcome back to Journey withJake.
I'm Jake Bushman, your host,and I'm excited to bring you
(01:47):
another fantastic episode.
This time I had the privilegeof chatting with Glenn Van Pesky
.
Glenn is an ultralightbackpacker who loves to hike,
but in our conversation we wentfar beyond the trail and
explored his life journey.
Glenn's story is full ofchallenges, insights and a deep
sense of gratitude for the lifehe's been given.
I can't wait for you to allhear it.
Before we jump into myconversation with Glenn, I just
(02:15):
want to say how fun this monthhas been.
My goal was to release eightepisodes in February to a week,
and after today we've only gotone more to go In March.
I'll return to my regularweekly schedule, though there's
a good chance a bonus episode ortwo will sneak in A few quick
housekeeping items.
Journey with Jake is part of thePodmatch Podcast Network.
You can check out all thefantastic shows in the network
at podmatchcom forward slashnetwork.
(02:37):
I'd love for you to reach outand say hi.
The best way is throughInstagram at
journeywithjakepodcast, or youcan email me at j at journey
with Jakenet.
Also, journey with Jake is onYouTube.
Just search for journey withJake podcast and while you're
there, hit that subscribe buttonand give the episodes a like.
Once again, I'm thrilled I hadthe chance to speak with Glenn
(03:00):
Van Pesky.
If you enjoy this episode, besure to check out episode 69
with Josh Baker, where we talkedabout his adventures on the
Wonderland Trail in Washington.
Now let's get to myconversation with Glenn Van
Pesky.
I have the legend Glenn VanPesky.
All right, we got to start withthat first, because I called
you the legend right off the bat.
(03:20):
Tell me where this legendoriginated from.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Well, in the long distance hiking community
there's a tradition you pick upa trail name and it's typically
assigned to you, and I've had anumber of trail names over the
years.
You know I answer most often toG squared, but a while ago some
people that I hike with a lotstarted calling me the legend
and I, at least in their circle,have not been able to shake
that one.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
I've had a few hikers on and I had some section
hikers who are hiking theAppalachian Trail little
sections at a time each year andthey're a bunch of housewives
and so they kind of gave eachother names you know trail names
.
So I didn't really know thatwas a thing until I talked to
her and then I was reading yourbook and it said oh, the legend.
(04:03):
And I like how you said thatthough it's, you don't assign
that to yourself.
You're not calling yourself alegend, these are people
assigning it to you.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Exactly.
Yeah, that's kind of traditionon trail names is you can I'm
sure you know there's differentversions, but typically you can.
You can refuse to accept atrail name, although sometimes
that's hard if everyone startscalling you by that name.
And there's people like when Ienter people in my contacts, I
put their trail name in, becausesometimes, like, I don't really
(04:29):
know their real name, I justknow them by their trail name.
So if I'm looking for them,it's like what's their real name
?
It's like, oh yeah, it's POD.
You know, it's like princess ofdarkness, so you know she's in
there under that Appreciate youhaving me on that.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
I kind of usually that Appreciate you having me on
that.
I kind of.
Usually I start off a littledifferent.
You usually say hey, welcome,and then you know kind of ask
about who you are.
I wanted to throw that in therebecause I kind of got you know.
When I first started readingyour book I was like, oh, he's
the legend, glenn Van Pesky, soI wanted to start with that.
But, glenn, thanks for havingme on, I appreciate it.
I am a retired civil engineer.
I worked in land development.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
Currently live in Bend Oregon, lived on the East
Coast for a lot, grew up inCalifornia for big periods of
time.
Yeah, along the way Iaccidentally started a
backpacking company, was almostkilled in a plane crash, but
basically I've had kind of anunremarkable life but having a
good time in Bend Oregon and Irecently wrote a book.
That's kind of why I'm doingthe podcast thing.
(05:32):
I was bugged by people for along time to write a book and
finally gave in and wrote it.
So here we are.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
Here we are and I love it.
I'm excited to dive into itmore.
I just started reading it.
The title is Take Less, Do More, With the idea kind of behind
your whole backpacking andtaking things light.
Can you kind of just give mejust a little background on the
book itself?
Sure?
Speaker 2 (05:54):
So I've worked for probably about 50 years.
If you start.
When I graduated high school in1976, I rode my bicycle across
the country 4,200 miles.
Yeah, I know you're shakingyour head.
I shake my head when I thinkabout it.
It's like I mean, what was Ithinking?
I was like 17, hopped on abicycle and no helmet, no cell
phones.
I mean we were using paper maps.
There was no way to researchanything.
(06:15):
This was no internet.
Obviously, start pedaling andtalk to people and I mean it was
an awesome, awesome trip.
And I mean it was an awesome,awesome trip Still to this day,
(06:40):
like the longest continuousadventure I've had, you know,
almost 50 years ago.
So I've been working to lightenmy load.
I mean, on that trip I cut mytoothbrush in half and I joined
the Boy Scouts.
The gear was real heavy and soyou know it's a long story, but
I ended up.
I started sewing gear andreally thinking about how light
my own load my you may know thisfrom other backpackers you've
talked to, but there's a termcalled base pack weight, which
is basically everything you'renot wearing, not counting food
(07:03):
and water, because that varieson the.
You know where you're notwearing, not counting food and
water, because that varies onthe.
You know where you're hikingand how many days you're out,
but all your gear, your pack,your sleeping pad, your sleeping
bag, your tent, cooking gear,extra insulation, everything
like that first aid and my basepack weight is down to generally
around five pounds.
So I've worked at it.
I've done less than that.
(07:24):
I've done under three pounds.
I've worked at it and over theyears I realized that some of
the lessons I learned forreducing my base pack weight had
broader applications to therest of life and that's kind of
the general premise of the book,is what I learned through
backpacking that applies to therest of life.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
I love that concept about it in five pounds, three
pounds, and I'm not a packer, soI don't know, I'm not a
backpacker that sounds reallylight to me.
I mean, I feel like I could puta couple of things in and I'd
be already at that weight ormore.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
Yeah, I mean, if you get your base weight down to 10
pounds, you're doing well.
Most people would be happy withthat.
I mean, I still rememberbreaking 12 pounds on a
particular trip.
So yeah, obviously it getsharder the lower you go.
And you know there's I have.
That includes gear, that's thatI've made myself, gear that's
no longer made and basicallykind of the lightest of
everything you can buy.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
All right, you kind of talked about this 4,200 mile
bike bike ride you did from, Ithink it was, Massachusetts to
California after you graduatedhigh school.
That in itself is an adventure.
Kind of give me the backgroundon that.
How long did it take you?
And it was just you and somebuddies Like what was the
situation behind this?
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Yeah, I decided to do it and then I was kind of
talking among my friends andthree buddies decided to join me
.
The exciting thing is, like,thanks to the marvel of the
internet, I'm in touch withthose guys and we're talking
about doing a 50 yearanniversary trip, going the
other way, the complete the looptrip.
So I'm excited about that.
(08:56):
Still, kind of enrolling thewife in that idea.
Yeah, we're working on that.
Yeah, I have no idea like why Ithought it would be a good idea
.
I was not particularlyadventurous in high school
Growing up.
We did camping, but it was likenational parks, you know,
camping with a campground andyou get the Coleman lantern, the
Coleman stove and doing dayhikes and stuff.
(09:17):
I just I fell in love with thatsmell of being outside, with
the fresh air and the big pinetrees and the sun on the on the
ground and um, yeah, so I don'tknow for me, I thought I was in
the outing club in high schooland we did a trip from western
massachusetts down to the capecape cod and back.
So I'd done, you know, somesmaller kind of bike packing
(09:41):
trips.
I know I don't know whatpossessed me to to bicycle
across the country and what didyour family think?
Speaker 1 (09:47):
were your parents supportive of this?
Were they like what is he doing?
Kind of bikepacking trips?
I don't know what possessed meto bicycle across the country.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
And what did your family think?
Were your parents supportive ofthis?
Were they like what is he doing?
Yeah, my mom was fine, great,have a good time.
Her thoughts on child raisingwere and she swears she never
said this, but all three of uskids somehow picked this up
talking to my brother and mysister that when you were 18,
you left home, that she hadgiven you all the tools you
needed to make your way in lifeand it was time for you to leave
(10:13):
the nest and figure out whatyour life was going to look like
.
And so I think that was a pieceof it.
I mean I left on that bicycletrip and never came back, you
know.
I mean I stayed on the WestCoast, so that was kind of me
leaving the nest.
So that was a piece of it.
And you know, when I think aboutthe planning or lack of
planning, I mean this was whenyou could go into a gas station
and get free paper maps and sowe got a map of the country and
(10:36):
we knew where we were and wejust kind of took a blue
highlighter and did a lineacross the country and that was
like the extent of our planning,and then we would get to a new
state.
We'd stop at a gas station,pick up the map for that state
and kind of look at our blueline map and look at the state
highways and stuff and figureout, well, this is pretty close
and you know, make our wayacross that state.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
So Did you ever have any moments, you know, as a 17,
18 year old biking across thecountry where you were like what
am I doing?
Why am I doing this?
Speaker 2 (11:07):
You know, I don't remember that and it's funny how
selective your memory is.
I didn't keep any notes.
I don't know what I wasthinking.
I probably the paper and penwould be heavy or something, I
don't know.
But one of the guys had a, youknow, had the wherewithal to, as
he puts it.
I had the feeling this wasgoing to be like a pretty big
thing in my life and might liketo have some record of it.
(11:28):
So we have his record,including meticulous accounting
of where we spent money, whichwas just fascinating.
Look at what things cost 50years ago.
Yeah, I don't, I don't know,but it was great.
I don't remember any thoughts ofreading through his journal.
There was a lot more rain thanI remember.
Like I don't remember, and Iride in a bike all day in the
(11:51):
rain is miserable Somehow.
I don't, I don't remember it,but reading his, reading his
journals, like, yeah, rain today, it's like Ooh man, I don't
remember that.
It was just, it was just theadventure and you know I
remember the people we met alongthe way.
No, it was.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
It's the adventure of it all, and that's a question I
like to ask.
Sometimes I wait till the endof the podcast, but I want to
ask that now, because youdecided to do this For you now
and, thinking back to all theadventures you've been on,
you've done a lot of things.
You've done a lot of hiking andthings like that biking and all
sorts of stuff but what doesadventure mean to you?
Speaker 2 (12:33):
place.
I like my wilderness lesscurated.
Being out there with less gearis part of that.
But putting yourself in asituation where you don't
control all the variables and Imean we never control all the
variables but you plan as bestyou can based on your research
and your experience.
But ultimately, anytime you'rein the wilderness, things happen
and you have to solve thoseproblems with your skills and
the gear that you have, and Ilike that.
I think maybe that's just theengineer part of me, but I think
(12:55):
it makes us doing hard thingsis important for us as humans.
I don't know if you've read thecomfort crisis by.
We've done too good a job ashumans of making our life
comfortable and it's killing us,you know.
And it's important for us to dohard things to push ourselves,
(13:19):
to push ourselves really hard.
Occasionally he talks aboutplanning a trip or challenge
where you only have like a 50%chance of success.
You know not that you're goingto die if you fall into the
wrong 50%, but you know tryingto do like a rim to rim monthly
basis for something over threedays where you just get a chance
(13:53):
.
There's something magic aboutthree days being unplugged as
your brain stops thinking aboutall the emails that are piling
up and the things on your to-dolist, because you can't do any
of them.
You don't have cell coverageand you're just out there
letting your mind wander andjust being, and that's something
we don't do enough of in ourmodern world no, you're
(14:13):
absolutely right.
Speaker 1 (14:14):
I remember years ago going on a cruise and it didn't
have internet access, and sothat was great.
My phone didn't work nothing,and now you go on cruises and
they have internet access.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
So it's like dang it, you know.
Yeah, we're losing out any.
Everywhere we turn, we'relosing out on these yeah, these,
yeah, you're still stillplugged in and so, and so that's
one of the magic of wilderness,is it's.
You know, if you go back it'sstill which is rare when I go
that usually you don't have cellphone coverage at the trailhead
, you know, and it might get ithere and there on a peak, but
other than that you're unpluggedFor you, Glenn?
Speaker 1 (14:47):
do you have any particular trails that you just
really love, that you enjoy?
I mean, I know there's somefamous ones, I know there's.
You know the Pacific CrestTrail, there's Connell Vide, you
got Appalachian.
Is there any for you that youjust absolutely love?
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Well, I love being outside in general and I'm not
too picky.
You know, if I have to choose,the mountains kind of near or
above treeline is really wheremy heart sings.
Mountains kind of near or abovetree line is really where my
heart sings, but really anywherein the West.
I have this theory.
There's kind of like you'rekind of born a Westerner and
Easterner and the place you'reactually born isn't necessarily
(15:22):
who you are.
You know it's like, but justsomething about the West and the
wide open spaces.
You know, driving acrossWyoming and Montana and the big
mountains just makes my heartsing.
And I think people in the Westare just different in these and
I've spent a lot of time in bothplaces and not that one's
better.
But you know, it's just thewide open spaces and the big sky
(15:43):
makes my heart sing All right,a couple other things that I
read about you, that you've andyou've talked about one.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
You talked about walking away from a plane crash.
That's pretty incredible.
Yeah, kind of give me thesituation.
What happened with this planecrash?
Speaker 2 (15:58):
Yeah, I guess that's.
That's one thing that maybe nota lot of people have
experienced.
When I was building my careerand in business, I was always
working on personal development.
You know, reading books, well,listening to cassette tapes.
Back in the day, I got involvedin like a kind of leadership
personal development course.
You know some lectures, and agroup of us went to a week-long
(16:21):
seminar up in NorthernCalifornia and one of the guys
had just gotten his pilot'slicense and I had my pilot's
license.
I had I don't know under ahundred hours.
He had a few more than that andso he said well, let's rent a
plane and fly up there, becausethere was actually a airfield on
this conference site.
So we thought that'd be great.
You know we're young bucks andfeeling like we're flying in our
(16:44):
own plane.
This is going to be awesome.
So we were coming back fromthat seminar and we stopped in
San Francisco and got a cab to,you know, the piers there, had a
nice dinner and just feelinglike this is great, you know,
we're living the life here.
And then we got back in theplane and it is getting dark as
we fly down the coast to OrangeCounty was our destination.
(17:08):
That's where we'd flown out ofA couple of us had driven up
from San Diego and it's gettingdark, and the pilot.
There are two gas tanks, one ineach wing on the plane and you
know, I noticed when one tankwent dry and he switched to the
other one because I had mypilot's license.
I was kind of aware of thosethings and we're flying along
(17:29):
and I saw him switch back.
You know cause we he'd run outof gas in the second tank and
the minute I saw him switchingback to the tank that I already
knew was empty.
That was my clue.
It's like this is not going toend power almost made it to a
nearby airport, meadowlark thathad been.
(17:54):
It was a small private landingstrip, been there for years and
they'd built up homes around itso they were shutting the lights
off at night so it didn'tdisturb the people that lived
adjacent to it.
Now, and we couldn't find thetransponder code to click on the
lights, but he still got withinspitting distance almost of the
fence, missed some houses goingin and went in through some
(18:17):
trees that took off the wings,so we landed very hard on the
ground right side up and blewthe doors off and I went
unconscious.
But then was the first one tocome to and when I called out I
got no answer.
So you know my first thoughtwas, wow, I could be the sole
survivor to come to.
And when I called out I got noanswer.
So you know my first thoughtwas wow, I could be the sole
survivor of this crash.
And I got out of the tent orout of the plane, which was easy
(18:41):
because there were no doorsanymore.
And I was looking at Bill, who'dbeen sitting in the co-pilot
seat in front of me, and I wasstill thinking I should get
people away from the plane,worried about fire, not thinking
that well, with no fuel,probably not.
You know, your brain's not, ormy brain, wasn't, working at
full capacity in that situationand I remember I was I could
(19:03):
barely stand, my legs were likejelly from shock and I thought,
well, how am I?
I can like barely hold myselfup.
How am I going to get Bill outof the plane?
But I, you know, got him out ofthe plane, laid him down on the
grass and by that time thefirst responders were there, you
know fire truck and ambulanceand stuff, yeah.
So my wife got a call from thehospital saying you need to
(19:24):
drive to the hospital up inOrange County and bring someone
with you.
There's been a crash and shesaid is my husband alive, says I
can't tell you.
So she had to get a neighbordrive up.
We had young kids.
She had to get someone to watchthe kids and drive up there,
not knowing, like stewing thewhole drive up, like am I a
(19:45):
widow and just don't know it yet.
So yeah, that was a hard time.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
And so you survived.
Obviously Was it just you andBill, or was there somebody else
with you?
Speaker 2 (19:53):
No, there were five of us.
The pilot, who had just beenmarried six months, did not
survive the crash.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Even though his piloting ensured that the rest
of us survived.
Yeah, and so, you know, one ofthe things as a result of that
is, you know, I never leave mywife without telling her I love
her, because I don't assume thatI'm coming back.
I mean, I, you know, I plan onthat For sure.
But after that crash, you know,I realized that that's not a
(20:23):
guarantee.
You know, I was hoping that thepilot and his young wife, you
know, had left on good terms.
I mean, so, yeah, kind ofchanged the way I look at things
.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
No, for sure, and I'm guessing your wife was probably
panicked, you know, not knowingwhat's going on.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
Well, yeah, and that was the.
You know that was the start ofwe had a very hard time, you
know.
The plane crashed, the economytank, my business went under.
I worked for a year without asalary.
Our second son was bornseverely disabled.
She was pregnant with him whenI was in the plane crash.
He was born severely disabled.
So, yeah, that was the start ofa rough time.
(21:00):
Wow, A rough stretch.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Yeah, let's let's.
20 year, 20 year rough stretch.
Let's stick on the topic ofyour family for a little bit,
because I know your wife,francie is that her name?
Francie?
Yeah, and you guys have beenmarried what?
40 plus years Over 42 years nowyeah, what's that relationship
been like?
How's it evolved over the years?
Speaker 2 (21:26):
You know, if you look at the divorce rates for things
that happen to couples, likecouples that have endured a
bankruptcy or failure of abusiness, it's like over 90%.
The birth of a disabled childis like 85, 90%.
The death of a child is, youknow, 90%.
And we've survived all those.
So there's really no goodreason we should still be
married, except Francie's prettystubborn I'm sure that's a part
(21:50):
of this.
You know, we got married when Iwas 23, I think 23, 24.
You know, I look at our kids atthat age it's like, oh my gosh,
it's like we knew nothing andso we essentially grew up
together pretty quickly in someareas.
So yeah, it's.
When we moved to Bend sevenyears ago and we decided to
(22:10):
build a house, people would say,oh, building a house, that's a
strain on a marriage.
And Francie would just laugh.
She goes, oh man, with whatwe've been through, it was like
that does not even move theneedle for us.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
It's like yeah, wow, okay.
So bankruptcy, a business thatfailed.
Handicapped child yeah, solet's.
I want to see Brian, grant andDerek.
Those are your three sons,uh-huh.
So Derek was the one physicallyhandicapped, correct?
And he passed away.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
Yeah, he passed away shortly before his 20th birthday
, on Mother's Day oh, wow, OnMother's Day.
So, yeah, well, kind of spinalfluid through his brain.
So his brain didn't develop.
(22:59):
All he had was a brain stem hebasically had.
You know, his skull was filledwith fluid and so he had to.
He couldn't be had to beC-section because his head was
enlarged.
He required countless surgeriesto fix the hydrocephalus and
you know he was severelydisabled.
He was like a newborn.
But now, as his body grew, wefed him.
(23:20):
Initially Francie would feedhim with a bottle.
It would take hours and hoursand he had a very strong gag
reflex, so you could spend twoor three hours feeding him a
bottle and then on the last siphe would throw it all up and
he'd have to start all over.
So huge, huge stress on Francie.
You know about this time.
I mean my business.
I'm working long hours and thenthe business failed and we just
(23:42):
it was, it was a super hardtime and then Grant was born and
so Francie had like twonewborns to take care of.
So, yeah, we eventually goterekplaced and that's a whole long
story.
They took really good care ofhim, was a actually a state
institution up in orange, countyfairview, and they, you know we
would pop in him on, been onhim all hours of the day.
(24:03):
You know they always asked youto like, hey, call and tell us
when you're gonna be here, andfrancie's like we'll just pop in
, you know, because you want tosee what happens when they don't
have notice.
And he was always, you know, ingreat condition, great, taken
great care of.
You know he didn't know, didn'tknow us.
I mean he responded to voiceshe couldn't see because he
didn't have the brain tointerpret that.
(24:24):
He had a feeding tube put in,you know.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
So he could get nourishment.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
But he enjoyed kind of music.
He enjoyed sound and he wasaware of voices.
You could see him trackingCouldn't understand anything,
obviously, and he liked movement.
You could put him in hiswheelchair and like spin him
around.
He'd start just laughinghysterically.
So you know, he never knewenough that he was disabled, he
was just living his life.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
Doing his thing.
Yeah, for you as a father, ahusband, the provider for your
family, and you're struggling,your business failing, what did
you do?
How did you overcome that foryourself?
Because I know for me, as theman of the family, so to speak,
that's a stress and it's toughmentally.
Yeah, how do you overcome that?
Speaker 2 (25:07):
Yeah, it was hard and Derek was hard because, as an
engineer, you know, and a guy ingeneral, we're used to solving
problems.
You know.
Okay, problem, let's figure out.
What are the inputs, what arethe outputs?
You know, how do we, how do weget there, how do we solve this
problem?
And you know, derek, in a way,I mean I couldn't make him
undisabled, I mean I couldn't,that was something I couldn't
(25:28):
fix.
And you know, later on, as theeconomy's tanking and
development's going away, youknow, francie would ask me do I
need to go back to work?
I'm like no, no, no.
We, you know we had somesavings.
And you know, next month do Ineed to go back to work?
No, no.
Finally, she says I'm goingback to work.
So she the kids were a littleolder she started driving up to
(25:53):
UCLA to do a couple of 12 hournursing shifts and then driving
back just to make it throughthat that time.
And then I ended up taking ajob with another company, you
know, after folding my ownengineering company.
So, yeah, I mean, luckily, we,you know, we live cheap, we were
able to get by.
But yeah, that's hard and Ithink your.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Your book kind of reflects some of that.
You know having less, and itcould be material, but it
doesn't have to be, I think,either.
I think it'd be more than thatKind of.
Tell me a little bit about that, because I know a big thing too
that I've read from you just inother aspects is the gratitude
that you have.
And how do you, you know whenyou're struggling, you're going
through all that, how do youfind that gratitude?
You know it could always beworse.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
That's the thing I mean.
Yes, maybe I haven't been ableto take a salary in 10 months,
but we're living in a house, wehave electricity, we are running
water.
You know there's no shortage ofexamples.
If you open your eyes to peoplein other parts of the world
that are living a basicallyStone Age existence, you know,
through no fault of their own,you know war and famine, and so
(26:52):
it's all relative.
I mean, we have such a richlife here, but we, you know,
we're constantly exposed topeople that have so much more.
It's easy to think like, oh well, my life is hard.
It's like, well, take a stepback and really put it in a
global perspective.
And I think that's you know,that's one thing that ultralight
backpacking really helps toreset no-transcript of a cow
(27:41):
trough, because that's all youhave and you need the water.
You know there's nothing likesome time with minimal gear to
really reset your expectations.
It gives you new appreciation,but it also gives you an
understanding that your needs,your basic needs, really aren't
as many as you think they are.
(28:02):
You know, I can go out withfive pounds of gear and I'm safe
, I'm enjoying life, I haveeverything I need and so really.
Anything more than that isextra, it's not necessary, and
it's easy to forget that in theworld we live in you know, it's
like you know you're on a planeride and it's like there's no
internet.
It's like, oh my gosh, this isterrible.
It's like, really, yeah, justjust take a, take a step back
(28:26):
and think about it.
So that's one of the one of thelessons from ultralight
backpacking is.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
it helps reset your gratitude and just gives you a
bigger understanding of howlittle you actually need to be
happy and kind of staying onthat same page of ultralight
backpacking because you, I mean,you've got kind of that
engineer mind.
You're kind of thinking of ways, how do I make this lighter,
how to make things better andmore efficient?
You've come up with a gearcompany, correct, what's the
name of the company?
And then kind of what's yeah,what's it?
What's going on with that Gosh?
Speaker 2 (28:56):
my gear is the name of the company.
I mean it started as GVP gear.
I just used my initials.
And this started my mom also,besides thinking that every kid
should leave home when they were18, also thought that every kid
should know how to cook, bakeand sew when they left home.
She just considered those likebasic life skills.
And so all three of us know howto do all three of those.
(29:18):
And so when our son Brian joinedScouts and we went down to REI
to gear up for the kind of thecapstone backpacking trip was a
week in the high Sierra and sothey loaded us up.
I mean, we had the internalframe.
Packs were the new thing.
So I got this big internalframe pack and, you know
inflatable sleeping pads and bigdown sleeping bags.
(29:39):
We had, you know, an MSR stoveand the old, you know white gas
container and tent andeverything Our packs.
My pack when we left on thattrip with food and water for a
week weighed.
My pack when we left on thattrip with food and water for a
week weighed over 70 pounds,which I was younger then.
It was a good thing.
That would kill me.
Today I can't even believe that.
(29:59):
And about this time Ray Jardinewrote his book the Pacific Crest
Trail Hiker's Handbook, and hetalked about hiking the Pacific
Crest Trail and sewing his owngear and a base weight of around
eight pounds.
So my friend Reed Miller, whowas the scoutmaster of the troop
(30:20):
and also a buddy of minethrough his developer, he read
Ray Jardine's book, the PacificCrest Trail Hiker's Handbook.
Jardine talks about doing thehike through hiking the Pacific
Crest Trail with his wife, jennyand having an eight pound base
pack weight, about doing thehiking through hiking the
Pacific Crest Trail with hiswife, jenny and having an
eight-pound base pack weight.
Reed decides to section hikethe Pacific Crest Trail and so
(30:41):
he's a little older than I am hedecides oh, we're going to go
lightweight, this is going to begreat.
And you know we can help thescouts because a lot of them,
when they boys, when they comeinto scouts, they're young, 13,
14.
You know you can't load them upwith that kind of weight and
expect them to have any kind ofa good experience in the
backcountry.
Since I knew how to sew, youknow, the internal frame pack
(31:02):
that they'd sold me at REIweighed seven and a half pounds
empty.
So I thought that's probably agood place to start.
So I ordered some fabric.
You know, francie stillremembers she gets home from the
store and I've moved the tableand I've got fabric stretched
out on the living room floor andI'm marking it up, measuring
with a yardstick, and marking up.
She says what are you doing?
She says I'm making myself abackpack.
She goes okay, whatever.
(31:22):
So I made myself a pack and then, you know, I'd use that pack on
scout trips and, like you said,I'm an engineer.
I kept thinking like, oh, thisis okay, but it'd be better.
If you know, I did this, thatand the other.
So I made another pack and thenI made a third pack and by the
time I made my fourth pack Ithought this is good.
You know, I think this worksfor the way I backpack right now
(31:43):
and is the best.
I can get People startedcalling it the G4 just because
my name starts with G.
And this was early internet daysand there was kind of an
ultralight backpacking listservactually a PCT listserv Word
kind of got out and so I put theplans such as they were, you
(32:05):
know, I just kind of sketchedthem up and put them on the
internet so people could maketheir own.
And I kept getting calls frompeople saying hey, you know, I
don't know how to sew and Idon't know anyone that knows how
to sew.
Could you make me a pack?
At this point I'm like working70 hours a week on the
engineering and it takes meabout 10 hours to, you know, buy
the fabric, measure everythingout, sew it up.
And so I was like no, there'sno way I'm making you a pack.
But I got enough requests.
(32:26):
I felt bad for these people.
You know, it was unfortunatetheir moms hadn't taught them
how to sew before they left home.
And so I was talking to QuestOutfitters, the sisters in
Florida that I ordered fabricfrom, and they said well,
there's this cut and sew shop onyour coast up in Seattle, you
know, maybe they could make afew packs for you.
So they gave me the contactinfo.
I got ahold of Monty up inSeattle and he says, oh yeah,
(32:49):
our minimum order is a hundred.
And I'm like, well, I don't, Ineed about 25 packs and everyone
who's bugging me will have oneand I can go back to the
engineering and that'll be that.
And so we went back and forthand finally settled on 50.
I thought, eh, they'll be in mygarage for the next five years,
but you know I'll eventuallyget rid of them Sent him up a
(33:13):
pack and, you know, went backand forth until he could make
the pack that I had designed andour son Brian put up like a
rudimentary website where peoplecould, you know, fill out an
order for him and it would sendme an email with their details.
The initial G4s were offered inone size and four different
colors, which I have no idea why.
I thought, like color was moreimportant.
Maybe I thought, well, it'seasy to change the colors, just
different fabrics.
Like I only have the pattern inone size that fits me and I'm
(33:36):
six four.
So I, you know, I have no ideathose early customers probably
didn't fit any of them.
I don't.
I have no idea.
And so I go.
You know, I'm busy working on myengineering and suddenly one
day I get a email and it's myfirst order.
It's like man, what do I do?
So I grabbed a pad of yellow.
(33:56):
I had a pad of yellow linedpaper on my desk.
I grabbed it and wrote down theorder, you know, and that's I
still have.
These are these, are thoseyellow line that's.
That's the piece of paper Igrabbed to start writing down
orders.
You know, I wrote down, wrotedown the order, wrote down each
line had like the person's name,and then I put a check mark
(34:17):
when their check arrived becausewe didn't have any.
You know, payment system set up.
This was early days and youdon't.
You know you don't put systemsin place if you think you're
just going to sell 25 packs.
It's like you don't worry abouta fancy company name, you just
call it your initials and pieceof paper and people mail their
checks.
It's like, yeah, this will befine.
You know this will be over in acouple of months here and it
(34:38):
wasn't.
You know I had 86 orders beforeI got my first shipment and
then we had to order more fabricand then it just went on from
there.
Gossamer and what's it calledagain?
Gossamer gear, gossamer gear.
Speaker 1 (34:49):
Gossamer gear.
Speaker 2 (34:50):
And it was always a side gig.
I mean, I've never taken asalary from the company.
Um cause I just never.
I don't know, it might've beenfun, I didn't want to.
Speaker 1 (35:03):
I didn't figure it was fair to my family.
You know I didn't want togamble my mortgage and my kid's
college education on it.
Involved still.
Is that kind of how it works?
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Yeah.
Yeah, it got to a point where Iwas going to close it down
because I was working 67 hours aweek doing the engineering and
then another 30 hours a weekdoing the gear business and I
was making, you know, good moneydoing the engineering and no
money on the gear business.
So if one was going to go, it'spretty obvious which one it had
(35:32):
to be.
So about this time I had joinedthe board of the Pacific Crest
Trail Association to kind ofgive back.
And at one of the meetings wewere talking about new board
members and Henry Shires of TarpTent brought up what about John
Mackey?
He does a lot of hiking.
And I said who's John Mackey?
And he said co-founder of WholeFoods Market.
And John is a very big hiker,among other things.
(35:54):
And anyway, so we set up ameeting to meet him in Boulder
and pitch him on becoming aboard member.
And by this time I had a littlebit of a reputation for having
a light pack and so John's asuper gear guy.
So he was interested in talkingto me.
That was kind of the reason heagreed to meet.
And so we met, had a nicedinner with the executive
director, liz Bergeron, and Ipitched John.
(36:16):
You know, a couple of weekslater I get back and I come to
the decision that I had to closedown the gear company and Liz
calls me up and says hey, youknow, you were the bait.
You need to close the deal,follow up with Mackie and get
him to join the board.
So I called up John and askedhim if he wanted to join the
board and he said no.
You know, he's a verysuccessful guy, obviously, and
one of the reasons he does thatis saying no to things that
(36:39):
don't have his name on them.
I was just hiking with him theother day and he said I forget
how it came up, but he says Iasked myself is this something I
need to do?
Like, am I the one that has todo this?
And if the answer is no, it'slike well, let someone else do
it, because there's stuff thatonly I can do and that's the
stuff that I need to be doing.
So, anyway, he said no and Isaid oh, by the way, I'm going
(36:59):
to close down the gear company.
So you know, if you're going toorder anything, do it in the
next week or two.
And he said I'm leaving on ahike.
Don't do anything until I getback.
And so he calls me, you know,day or two later and says okay,
I got a proposal for you.
I will buy 75% of the company.
I think it's important that youmaintain ownership and that
you're involved, but you can beas involved or uninvolved as you
(37:21):
want.
I'll hire someone to run it,I'll put money into you know,
rent an office and pay salaries,and that's how we ended up to
the Gossamer Gear today.
You know, otherwise it wouldhave been a footnote in history,
yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:35):
Yeah, well, and you would have just shut it down and
that would have been it.
Yeah, that would have been it.
I mean, yeah, selling thecompany.
Hey, get something out of it.
And you're still going to beinvolved with it.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
Yeah, I mean I didn't see any downside, you know.
I mean he paid me $100,000 for75%, which didn't change my
lifestyle, but really the thingsI've gotten out of Gosmer Gear
haven't been monetary One.
The relationship with JohnMackey and the hikes I've gone
on with him and his friends andjust being around that much
wisdom and experience on aregular basis is huge.
And then with the gear companyI get to travel to fun places.
You know we were in Japan tospeak at an event and meet with
(38:16):
dealers and I'm going to theNetherlands in the spring to
speak at event there.
So yeah, the people, the peopleand the places are the fun part
.
Speaker 1 (38:25):
And I'm going to ask about that because, as we're
kind of wrapping up here, yeah,what do you think the?
What does the future hold foryou?
What more adventures do youwant to do as well?
Speaker 2 (38:33):
You know I've been thinking about that.
A buddy of mine just got abrain tumor and he's super
healthy, a big hiker, and he'sdoing some things to prolong his
time left, but you know,basically he's got call it a
couple of years.
It's really made me think kindof back to the plane crash, you
know.
It was like your future isn'tguaranteed.
(38:54):
It's like, yeah, what would beon my list, you know, if I knew
things were coming to an end?
You know, if I had a couple ofyears, like which, which of the
items would I want to do more of?
Which things would I stop doing?
There's a never ending list ofthings For 2025, 2025.
(39:14):
I thought, well, I'm an engineer, I'm gonna plan, put together a
big, big list of likepossibilities.
We couldn't do them all, youknow.
And there's check marks.
You know, is this like a glennand francy thing?
Or just a glenn thing andfrancy's less of a planner?
She just prefers to kind of letthings unfold.
So you know, we've gotten a fewthings like with check marks
like, yes, we.
We've gotten a few things likewith check marks like yes, we're
definitely doing this.
A couple of things like, okay,this isn't going to fit into
(39:35):
this year.
You know we'd like to do NewZealand sometime.
You know, rent a camper van andbum around there for a couple
of weeks, and we're talkingabout taking our sprinter van on
the Dempster Highway in Alaska.
That's not on the not list yet,so that may happen.
Yeah, I mean, we love Europeand Italy.
There's backpacking events.
Yeah, we like a mix, we likeoverseas travel.
(39:58):
We just actually, at the timeof this list that I first made
this list, I don't know, wejoined a local kind of club and
they're doing a wine cruise.
That sounds, sounds fun.
You know that wasn't on thelist.
So now we're doing that.
Some friends of ours, your booklike hiking on the camino for a
week in spain and it's like Idon't know, it's probably not
(40:18):
the way I'd hike it and probablynot the section I'd hike, but
they're good friends and it'llbe a blast, you know.
So, okay, well, let's do that.
So we're kind of veryopportunistic.
You know, things come up whenyou have fun friends.
It's like fun opportunitiescome up and my pack is always
packed.
I could be, you know, probablyout the door in a couple hours
if I wanted to for a trip, andthere's trips.
(40:40):
I try and do that too.
I usually get permits for twoto three trips a year and just
send it out to a group of peoplethat I have to see who can make
it.
So I try and create those tripsand not just take advantage of
other people's trip creation.
Speaker 1 (40:53):
This has been fascinating.
I really appreciate who you are, tell everybody where they can
find the book and what's thebest way to get your book.
Speaker 2 (41:01):
Probably best bet.
I mean, the book is anywhereyou buy books.
Your local book seller canorder for you if they don't
already have it, Amazon, all theonline places, of course.
You can find out somethingabout the book and about me at
glennvanpeskycom.
I have lots of tips and tricksthere, backpacking and otherwise
eccentric other materials andvideos.
(41:21):
Yeah, you can sign up for mynewsletter.
I only do it every couple ofweeks and I'm thinking I may
make it less frequent than that,because maybe that's something
I don't enjoy doing as much assome other things.
Speaker 1 (41:32):
So my final question for you, then, is someone who
likes to backpack.
You've only got one opportunity, you got like a week left and
you've only got one place tobackpack.
Where are you going and why?
Speaker 2 (41:44):
For me, I'd be in the mountains, you know, somewhere
up above tree line, some trails,some cross country route,
finding probably somewhere inthe West.
I don't know, it would depend,Could be Europe, but I don't
know.
I like the here where you cancamp anywhere.
It's less curated, you can justbe out there.
Speaker 1 (42:02):
Glenn, thank you so much for coming on Journey with
Jake.
Jake, thanks for having me.
It's been a great journey.
Thank you so much to my guest,glenn Van Pesky, for sharing his
life journey with us.
I really appreciate thereminder to take less and do
more.
I have a copy of Glenn's bookTake Less, do More, and it's
full of fantastic stories andlife lessons.
I highly recommend grabbing acopy.
(42:24):
Just head over toglennvanpeskycom.
You can also follow Glenn onInstagram at g van pesky.
Thanks again, glenn, for beingpart of journey with Jake and,
of course, a special thanks toall of you, the listeners.
If you're enjoying the show, itwould mean a lot If you could
leave a rating and review onApple podcasts or Spotify.
Those reviews help othersdiscover the podcast and I'd be
(42:47):
so grateful for your support.
We're down to the final days ofFebruary and coming up this
Thursday.
I've got Stephen James Ferrison the show.
Stephen has a fascinatingbackground as a parachutist in
the Royal military and we talkabout his incredible three-day
bike excursion across Iceland.
It's a conversation full ofadventure, great stories and
(43:09):
some inspiring life lessons, sobe sure to check it out.
Just remember, it's not alwaysabout the destination as it is
about the journey.
Take care everybody.
Earl Schaefer once said carry as little as possible
, but choose that little withcare.
My guest today, glenn Van Pesky, lives by this philosophy, both
on and off the trail.
As an ultralight backpacker,glenn has learned that the less
you carry, the more you canexperience and accomplish.
But his minimalist approachextends far beyond hiking.
(00:21):
It's a guiding principle forhis life, extends far beyond
hiking.
It's a guiding principle forhis life so much so that he
wrote the book Take Less, doMore.
Surprising Life Lessons inGenerosity, gratitude and
Curiosity from an UltralightBackpacker.
Join me as we hit the trail oflife with Glenn Van Pesky and
discover how traveling light canlead to a more meaningful
(00:41):
journey.
Welcome to Journey with Jake.
This is a podcast aboutadventure and how, through our
adventures, we can overcome thechallenges of life that come our
way.
While I expect you will learnsome things about different
adventures, this show willentertain you.
Each episode will featuredifferent guests or guests as
they share experiences andstories from the different
adventures they have been on.
(01:02):
Not only will you beentertained, but you'll also
hear the failures and trialseach guest faces and what they
have done or are doing toovercome the hardships that come
their way.
My goal is to take each of uson a journey through the
experiences of my guests, withthe hope that you'll be
entertained and inspired toovercome your day-to-day
challenges.
After all, it's not all aboutthe destination as it is about
(01:25):
the destination as it is aboutthe journey.
Welcome back to Journey withJake.
I'm Jake Bushman, your host,and I'm excited to bring you
(01:47):
another fantastic episode.
This time I had the privilegeof chatting with Glenn Van Pesky
.
Glenn is an ultralightbackpacker who loves to hike,
but in our conversation we wentfar beyond the trail and
explored his life journey.
Glenn's story is full ofchallenges, insights and a deep
sense of gratitude for the lifehe's been given.
I can't wait for you to allhear it.
Before we jump into myconversation with Glenn, I just
(02:15):
want to say how fun this monthhas been.
My goal was to release eightepisodes in February to a week,
and after today we've only gotone more to go In March.
I'll return to my regularweekly schedule, though there's
a good chance a bonus episode ortwo will sneak in A few quick
housekeeping items.
Journey with Jake is part of thePodmatch Podcast Network.
You can check out all thefantastic shows in the network
at podmatchcom forward slashnetwork.
(02:37):
I'd love for you to reach outand say hi.
The best way is throughInstagram at
journeywithjakepodcast, or youcan email me at j at journey
with Jakenet.
Also, journey with Jake is onYouTube.
Just search for journey withJake podcast and while you're
there, hit that subscribe buttonand give the episodes a like.
Once again, I'm thrilled I hadthe chance to speak with Glenn
(03:00):
Van Pesky.
If you enjoy this episode, besure to check out episode 69
with Josh Baker, where we talkedabout his adventures on the
Wonderland Trail in Washington.
Now let's get to myconversation with Glenn Van
Pesky.
I have the legend Glenn VanPesky.
All right, we got to start withthat first, because I called
you the legend right off the bat.
(03:20):
Tell me where this legendoriginated from.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Well, in the long distance hiking community
there's a tradition you pick upa trail name and it's typically
assigned to you, and I've had anumber of trail names over the
years.
You know I answer most often toG squared, but a while ago some
people that I hike with a lotstarted calling me the legend
and I, at least in their circle,have not been able to shake
that one.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
I've had a few hikers on and I had some section
hikers who are hiking theAppalachian Trail little
sections at a time each year andthey're a bunch of housewives
and so they kind of gave eachother names you know trail names
.
So I didn't really know thatwas a thing until I talked to
her and then I was reading yourbook and it said oh, the legend.
(04:03):
And I like how you said thatthough it's, you don't assign
that to yourself.
You're not calling yourself alegend, these are people
assigning it to you.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Exactly.
Yeah, that's kind of traditionon trail names is you can I'm
sure you know there's differentversions, but typically you can.
You can refuse to accept atrail name, although sometimes
that's hard if everyone startscalling you by that name.
And there's people like when Ienter people in my contacts, I
put their trail name in, becausesometimes, like, I don't really
(04:29):
know their real name, I justknow them by their trail name.
So if I'm looking for them,it's like what's their real name
?
It's like, oh yeah, it's POD.
You know, it's like princess ofdarkness, so you know she's in
there under that Appreciate youhaving me on that.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
I kind of usually that Appreciate you having me on
that.
I kind of.
Usually I start off a littledifferent.
You usually say hey, welcome,and then you know kind of ask
about who you are.
I wanted to throw that in therebecause I kind of got you know.
When I first started readingyour book I was like, oh, he's
the legend, glenn Van Pesky, soI wanted to start with that.
But, glenn, thanks for havingme on, I appreciate it.
I am a retired civil engineer.
I worked in land development.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
Currently live in Bend Oregon, lived on the East
Coast for a lot, grew up inCalifornia for big periods of
time.
Yeah, along the way Iaccidentally started a
backpacking company, was almostkilled in a plane crash, but
basically I've had kind of anunremarkable life but having a
good time in Bend Oregon and Irecently wrote a book.
That's kind of why I'm doingthe podcast thing.
(05:32):
I was bugged by people for along time to write a book and
finally gave in and wrote it.
So here we are.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
Here we are and I love it.
I'm excited to dive into itmore.
I just started reading it.
The title is Take Less, Do More, With the idea kind of behind
your whole backpacking andtaking things light.
Can you kind of just give mejust a little background on the
book itself?
Sure?
Speaker 2 (05:54):
So I've worked for probably about 50 years.
If you start.
When I graduated high school in1976, I rode my bicycle across
the country 4,200 miles.
Yeah, I know you're shakingyour head.
I shake my head when I thinkabout it.
It's like I mean, what was Ithinking?
I was like 17, hopped on abicycle and no helmet, no cell
phones.
I mean we were using paper maps.
There was no way to researchanything.
(06:15):
This was no internet.
Obviously, start pedaling andtalk to people and I mean it was
an awesome, awesome trip.
And I mean it was an awesome,awesome trip Still to this day,
(06:40):
like the longest continuousadventure I've had, you know,
almost 50 years ago.
So I've been working to lightenmy load.
I mean, on that trip I cut mytoothbrush in half and I joined
the Boy Scouts.
The gear was real heavy and soyou know it's a long story, but
I ended up.
I started sewing gear andreally thinking about how light
my own load my you may know thisfrom other backpackers you've
talked to, but there's a termcalled base pack weight, which
is basically everything you'renot wearing, not counting food
(07:03):
and water, because that varieson the.
You know where you're notwearing, not counting food and
water, because that varies onthe.
You know where you're hikingand how many days you're out,
but all your gear, your pack,your sleeping pad, your sleeping
bag, your tent, cooking gear,extra insulation, everything
like that first aid and my basepack weight is down to generally
around five pounds.
So I've worked at it.
I've done less than that.
(07:24):
I've done under three pounds.
I've worked at it and over theyears I realized that some of
the lessons I learned forreducing my base pack weight had
broader applications to therest of life and that's kind of
the general premise of the book,is what I learned through
backpacking that applies to therest of life.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
I love that concept about it in five pounds, three
pounds, and I'm not a packer, soI don't know, I'm not a
backpacker that sounds reallylight to me.
I mean, I feel like I could puta couple of things in and I'd
be already at that weight ormore.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
Yeah, I mean, if you get your base weight down to 10
pounds, you're doing well.
Most people would be happy withthat.
I mean, I still rememberbreaking 12 pounds on a
particular trip.
So yeah, obviously it getsharder the lower you go.
And you know there's I have.
That includes gear, that's thatI've made myself, gear that's
no longer made and basicallykind of the lightest of
everything you can buy.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
All right, you kind of talked about this 4,200 mile
bike bike ride you did from, Ithink it was, Massachusetts to
California after you graduatedhigh school.
That in itself is an adventure.
Kind of give me the backgroundon that.
How long did it take you?
And it was just you and somebuddies Like what was the
situation behind this?
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Yeah, I decided to do it and then I was kind of
talking among my friends andthree buddies decided to join me
.
The exciting thing is, like,thanks to the marvel of the
internet, I'm in touch withthose guys and we're talking
about doing a 50 yearanniversary trip, going the
other way, the complete the looptrip.
So I'm excited about that.
(08:56):
Still, kind of enrolling thewife in that idea.
Yeah, we're working on that.
Yeah, I have no idea like why Ithought it would be a good idea
.
I was not particularlyadventurous in high school
Growing up.
We did camping, but it was likenational parks, you know,
camping with a campground andyou get the Coleman lantern, the
Coleman stove and doing dayhikes and stuff.
(09:17):
I just I fell in love with thatsmell of being outside, with
the fresh air and the big pinetrees and the sun on the on the
ground and um, yeah, so I don'tknow for me, I thought I was in
the outing club in high schooland we did a trip from western
massachusetts down to the capecape cod and back.
So I'd done, you know, somesmaller kind of bike packing
(09:41):
trips.
I know I don't know whatpossessed me to to bicycle
across the country and what didyour family think?
Speaker 1 (09:47):
were your parents supportive of this?
Were they like what is he doing?
Kind of bikepacking trips?
I don't know what possessed meto bicycle across the country.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
And what did your family think?
Were your parents supportive ofthis?
Were they like what is he doing?
Yeah, my mom was fine, great,have a good time.
Her thoughts on child raisingwere and she swears she never
said this, but all three of uskids somehow picked this up
talking to my brother and mysister that when you were 18,
you left home, that she hadgiven you all the tools you
needed to make your way in lifeand it was time for you to leave
(10:13):
the nest and figure out whatyour life was going to look like
.
And so I think that was a pieceof it.
I mean I left on that bicycletrip and never came back, you
know.
I mean I stayed on the WestCoast, so that was kind of me
leaving the nest.
So that was a piece of it.
And you know, when I think aboutthe planning or lack of
planning, I mean this was whenyou could go into a gas station
and get free paper maps and sowe got a map of the country and
(10:36):
we knew where we were and wejust kind of took a blue
highlighter and did a lineacross the country and that was
like the extent of our planning,and then we would get to a new
state.
We'd stop at a gas station,pick up the map for that state
and kind of look at our blueline map and look at the state
highways and stuff and figureout, well, this is pretty close
and you know, make our wayacross that state.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
So Did you ever have any moments, you know, as a 17,
18 year old biking across thecountry where you were like what
am I doing?
Why am I doing this?
Speaker 2 (11:07):
You know, I don't remember that and it's funny how
selective your memory is.
I didn't keep any notes.
I don't know what I wasthinking.
I probably the paper and penwould be heavy or something, I
don't know.
But one of the guys had a, youknow, had the wherewithal to, as
he puts it.
I had the feeling this wasgoing to be like a pretty big
thing in my life and might liketo have some record of it.
(11:28):
So we have his record,including meticulous accounting
of where we spent money, whichwas just fascinating.
Look at what things cost 50years ago.
Yeah, I don't, I don't know,but it was great.
I don't remember any thoughts ofreading through his journal.
There was a lot more rain thanI remember.
Like I don't remember, and Iride in a bike all day in the
(11:51):
rain is miserable Somehow.
I don't, I don't remember it,but reading his, reading his
journals, like, yeah, rain today, it's like Ooh man, I don't
remember that.
It was just, it was just theadventure and you know I
remember the people we met alongthe way.
No, it was.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
It's the adventure of it all, and that's a question I
like to ask.
Sometimes I wait till the endof the podcast, but I want to
ask that now, because youdecided to do this For you now
and, thinking back to all theadventures you've been on,
you've done a lot of things.
You've done a lot of hiking andthings like that biking and all
sorts of stuff but what doesadventure mean to you?
Speaker 2 (12:33):
place.
I like my wilderness lesscurated.
Being out there with less gearis part of that.
But putting yourself in asituation where you don't
control all the variables and Imean we never control all the
variables but you plan as bestyou can based on your research
and your experience.
But ultimately, anytime you'rein the wilderness, things happen
and you have to solve thoseproblems with your skills and
the gear that you have, and Ilike that.
I think maybe that's just theengineer part of me, but I think
(12:55):
it makes us doing hard thingsis important for us as humans.
I don't know if you've read thecomfort crisis by.
We've done too good a job ashumans of making our life
comfortable and it's killing us,you know.
And it's important for us to dohard things to push ourselves,
(13:19):
to push ourselves really hard.
Occasionally he talks aboutplanning a trip or challenge
where you only have like a 50%chance of success.
You know not that you're goingto die if you fall into the
wrong 50%, but you know tryingto do like a rim to rim monthly
basis for something over threedays where you just get a chance
(13:53):
.
There's something magic aboutthree days being unplugged as
your brain stops thinking aboutall the emails that are piling
up and the things on your to-dolist, because you can't do any
of them.
You don't have cell coverageand you're just out there
letting your mind wander andjust being, and that's something
we don't do enough of in ourmodern world no, you're
(14:13):
absolutely right.
Speaker 1 (14:14):
I remember years ago going on a cruise and it didn't
have internet access, and sothat was great.
My phone didn't work nothing,and now you go on cruises and
they have internet access.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
So it's like dang it, you know.
Yeah, we're losing out any.
Everywhere we turn, we'relosing out on these yeah, these,
yeah, you're still stillplugged in and so, and so that's
one of the magic of wilderness,is it's.
You know, if you go back it'sstill which is rare when I go
that usually you don't have cellphone coverage at the trailhead
, you know, and it might get ithere and there on a peak, but
other than that you're unpluggedFor you, Glenn?
Speaker 1 (14:47):
do you have any particular trails that you just
really love, that you enjoy?
I mean, I know there's somefamous ones, I know there's.
You know the Pacific CrestTrail, there's Connell Vide, you
got Appalachian.
Is there any for you that youjust absolutely love?
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Well, I love being outside in general and I'm not
too picky.
You know, if I have to choose,the mountains kind of near or
above treeline is really wheremy heart sings.
Mountains kind of near or abovetree line is really where my
heart sings, but really anywherein the West.
I have this theory.
There's kind of like you'rekind of born a Westerner and
Easterner and the place you'reactually born isn't necessarily
(15:22):
who you are.
You know it's like, but justsomething about the West and the
wide open spaces.
You know, driving acrossWyoming and Montana and the big
mountains just makes my heartsing.
And I think people in the Westare just different in these and
I've spent a lot of time in bothplaces and not that one's
better.
But you know, it's just thewide open spaces and the big sky
(15:43):
makes my heart sing All right,a couple other things that I
read about you, that you've andyou've talked about one.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
You talked about walking away from a plane crash.
That's pretty incredible.
Yeah, kind of give me thesituation.
What happened with this planecrash?
Speaker 2 (15:58):
Yeah, I guess that's.
That's one thing that maybe nota lot of people have
experienced.
When I was building my careerand in business, I was always
working on personal development.
You know, reading books, well,listening to cassette tapes.
Back in the day, I got involvedin like a kind of leadership
personal development course.
You know some lectures, and agroup of us went to a week-long
(16:21):
seminar up in NorthernCalifornia and one of the guys
had just gotten his pilot'slicense and I had my pilot's
license.
I had I don't know under ahundred hours.
He had a few more than that andso he said well, let's rent a
plane and fly up there, becausethere was actually a airfield on
this conference site.
So we thought that'd be great.
You know we're young bucks andfeeling like we're flying in our
(16:44):
own plane.
This is going to be awesome.
So we were coming back fromthat seminar and we stopped in
San Francisco and got a cab to,you know, the piers there, had a
nice dinner and just feelinglike this is great, you know,
we're living the life here.
And then we got back in theplane and it is getting dark as
we fly down the coast to OrangeCounty was our destination.
(17:08):
That's where we'd flown out ofA couple of us had driven up
from San Diego and it's gettingdark, and the pilot.
There are two gas tanks, one ineach wing on the plane and you
know, I noticed when one tankwent dry and he switched to the
other one because I had mypilot's license.
I was kind of aware of thosethings and we're flying along
(17:29):
and I saw him switch back.
You know cause we he'd run outof gas in the second tank and
the minute I saw him switchingback to the tank that I already
knew was empty.
That was my clue.
It's like this is not going toend power almost made it to a
nearby airport, meadowlark thathad been.
(17:54):
It was a small private landingstrip, been there for years and
they'd built up homes around itso they were shutting the lights
off at night so it didn'tdisturb the people that lived
adjacent to it.
Now, and we couldn't find thetransponder code to click on the
lights, but he still got withinspitting distance almost of the
fence, missed some houses goingin and went in through some
(18:17):
trees that took off the wings,so we landed very hard on the
ground right side up and blewthe doors off and I went
unconscious.
But then was the first one tocome to and when I called out I
got no answer.
So you know my first thoughtwas, wow, I could be the sole
survivor to come to.
And when I called out I got noanswer.
So you know my first thoughtwas wow, I could be the sole
survivor of this crash.
And I got out of the tent orout of the plane, which was easy
(18:41):
because there were no doorsanymore.
And I was looking at Bill, who'dbeen sitting in the co-pilot
seat in front of me, and I wasstill thinking I should get
people away from the plane,worried about fire, not thinking
that well, with no fuel,probably not.
You know, your brain's not, ormy brain, wasn't, working at
full capacity in that situationand I remember I was I could
(19:03):
barely stand, my legs were likejelly from shock and I thought,
well, how am I?
I can like barely hold myselfup.
How am I going to get Bill outof the plane?
But I, you know, got him out ofthe plane, laid him down on the
grass and by that time thefirst responders were there, you
know fire truck and ambulanceand stuff, yeah.
So my wife got a call from thehospital saying you need to
(19:24):
drive to the hospital up inOrange County and bring someone
with you.
There's been a crash and shesaid is my husband alive, says I
can't tell you.
So she had to get a neighbordrive up.
We had young kids.
She had to get someone to watchthe kids and drive up there,
not knowing, like stewing thewhole drive up, like am I a
(19:45):
widow and just don't know it yet.
So yeah, that was a hard time.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
And so you survived.
Obviously Was it just you andBill, or was there somebody else
with you?
Speaker 2 (19:53):
No, there were five of us.
The pilot, who had just beenmarried six months, did not
survive the crash.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Even though his piloting ensured that the rest
of us survived.
Yeah, and so, you know, one ofthe things as a result of that
is, you know, I never leave mywife without telling her I love
her, because I don't assume thatI'm coming back.
I mean, I, you know, I plan onthat For sure.
But after that crash, you know,I realized that that's not a
(20:23):
guarantee.
You know, I was hoping that thepilot and his young wife, you
know, had left on good terms.
I mean, so, yeah, kind ofchanged the way I look at things
.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
No, for sure, and I'm guessing your wife was probably
panicked, you know, not knowingwhat's going on.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
Well, yeah, and that was the.
You know that was the start ofwe had a very hard time, you
know.
The plane crashed, the economytank, my business went under.
I worked for a year without asalary.
Our second son was bornseverely disabled.
She was pregnant with him whenI was in the plane crash.
He was born severely disabled.
So, yeah, that was the start ofa rough time.
(21:00):
Wow, A rough stretch.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Yeah, let's let's.
20 year, 20 year rough stretch.
Let's stick on the topic ofyour family for a little bit,
because I know your wife,francie is that her name?
Francie?
Yeah, and you guys have beenmarried what?
40 plus years Over 42 years nowyeah, what's that relationship
been like?
How's it evolved over the years?
Speaker 2 (21:26):
You know, if you look at the divorce rates for things
that happen to couples, likecouples that have endured a
bankruptcy or failure of abusiness, it's like over 90%.
The birth of a disabled childis like 85, 90%.
The death of a child is, youknow, 90%.
And we've survived all those.
So there's really no goodreason we should still be
married, except Francie's prettystubborn I'm sure that's a part
(21:50):
of this.
You know, we got married when Iwas 23, I think 23, 24.
You know, I look at our kids atthat age it's like, oh my gosh,
it's like we knew nothing andso we essentially grew up
together pretty quickly in someareas.
So yeah, it's.
When we moved to Bend sevenyears ago and we decided to
(22:10):
build a house, people would say,oh, building a house, that's a
strain on a marriage.
And Francie would just laugh.
She goes, oh man, with whatwe've been through, it was like
that does not even move theneedle for us.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
It's like yeah, wow, okay.
So bankruptcy, a business thatfailed.
Handicapped child yeah, solet's.
I want to see Brian, grant andDerek.
Those are your three sons,uh-huh.
So Derek was the one physicallyhandicapped, correct?
And he passed away.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
Yeah, he passed away shortly before his 20th birthday
, on Mother's Day oh, wow, OnMother's Day.
So, yeah, well, kind of spinalfluid through his brain.
So his brain didn't develop.
(22:59):
All he had was a brain stem hebasically had.
You know, his skull was filledwith fluid and so he had to.
He couldn't be had to beC-section because his head was
enlarged.
He required countless surgeriesto fix the hydrocephalus and
you know he was severelydisabled.
He was like a newborn.
But now, as his body grew, wefed him.
(23:20):
Initially Francie would feedhim with a bottle.
It would take hours and hoursand he had a very strong gag
reflex, so you could spend twoor three hours feeding him a
bottle and then on the last siphe would throw it all up and
he'd have to start all over.
So huge, huge stress on Francie.
You know about this time.
I mean my business.
I'm working long hours and thenthe business failed and we just
(23:42):
it was, it was a super hardtime and then Grant was born and
so Francie had like twonewborns to take care of.
So, yeah, we eventually goterekplaced and that's a whole long
story.
They took really good care ofhim, was a actually a state
institution up in orange, countyfairview, and they, you know we
would pop in him on, been onhim all hours of the day.
(24:03):
You know they always asked youto like, hey, call and tell us
when you're gonna be here, andfrancie's like we'll just pop in
, you know, because you want tosee what happens when they don't
have notice.
And he was always, you know, ingreat condition, great, taken
great care of.
You know he didn't know, didn'tknow us.
I mean he responded to voiceshe couldn't see because he
didn't have the brain tointerpret that.
(24:24):
He had a feeding tube put in,you know.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
So he could get nourishment.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
But he enjoyed kind of music.
He enjoyed sound and he wasaware of voices.
You could see him trackingCouldn't understand anything,
obviously, and he liked movement.
You could put him in hiswheelchair and like spin him
around.
He'd start just laughinghysterically.
So you know, he never knewenough that he was disabled, he
was just living his life.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
Doing his thing.
Yeah, for you as a father, ahusband, the provider for your
family, and you're struggling,your business failing, what did
you do?
How did you overcome that foryourself?
Because I know for me, as theman of the family, so to speak,
that's a stress and it's toughmentally.
Yeah, how do you overcome that?
Speaker 2 (25:07):
Yeah, it was hard and Derek was hard because, as an
engineer, you know, and a guy ingeneral, we're used to solving
problems.
You know.
Okay, problem, let's figure out.
What are the inputs, what arethe outputs?
You know, how do we, how do weget there, how do we solve this
problem?
And you know, derek, in a way,I mean I couldn't make him
undisabled, I mean I couldn't,that was something I couldn't
(25:28):
fix.
And you know, later on, as theeconomy's tanking and
development's going away, youknow, francie would ask me do I
need to go back to work?
I'm like no, no, no.
We, you know we had somesavings.
And you know, next month do Ineed to go back to work?
No, no.
Finally, she says I'm goingback to work.
So she the kids were a littleolder she started driving up to
(25:53):
UCLA to do a couple of 12 hournursing shifts and then driving
back just to make it throughthat that time.
And then I ended up taking ajob with another company, you
know, after folding my ownengineering company.
So, yeah, I mean, luckily, we,you know, we live cheap, we were
able to get by.
But yeah, that's hard and Ithink your.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Your book kind of reflects some of that.
You know having less, and itcould be material, but it
doesn't have to be, I think,either.
I think it'd be more than thatKind of.
Tell me a little bit about that, because I know a big thing too
that I've read from you just inother aspects is the gratitude
that you have.
And how do you, you know whenyou're struggling, you're going
through all that, how do youfind that gratitude?
You know it could always beworse.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
That's the thing I mean.
Yes, maybe I haven't been ableto take a salary in 10 months,
but we're living in a house, wehave electricity, we are running
water.
You know there's no shortage ofexamples.
If you open your eyes to peoplein other parts of the world
that are living a basicallyStone Age existence, you know,
through no fault of their own,you know war and famine, and so
(26:52):
it's all relative.
I mean, we have such a richlife here, but we, you know,
we're constantly exposed topeople that have so much more.
It's easy to think like, oh well, my life is hard.
It's like, well, take a stepback and really put it in a
global perspective.
And I think that's you know,that's one thing that ultralight
backpacking really helps toreset no-transcript of a cow
(27:41):
trough, because that's all youhave and you need the water.
You know there's nothing likesome time with minimal gear to
really reset your expectations.
It gives you new appreciation,but it also gives you an
understanding that your needs,your basic needs, really aren't
as many as you think they are.
(28:02):
You know, I can go out withfive pounds of gear and I'm safe
, I'm enjoying life, I haveeverything I need and so really.
Anything more than that isextra, it's not necessary, and
it's easy to forget that in theworld we live in you know, it's
like you know you're on a planeride and it's like there's no
internet.
It's like, oh my gosh, this isterrible.
It's like, really, yeah, justjust take a, take a step back
(28:26):
and think about it.
So that's one of the one of thelessons from ultralight
backpacking is.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
it helps reset your gratitude and just gives you a
bigger understanding of howlittle you actually need to be
happy and kind of staying onthat same page of ultralight
backpacking because you, I mean,you've got kind of that
engineer mind.
You're kind of thinking of ways, how do I make this lighter,
how to make things better andmore efficient?
You've come up with a gearcompany, correct, what's the
name of the company?
And then kind of what's yeah,what's it?
What's going on with that Gosh?
Speaker 2 (28:56):
my gear is the name of the company.
I mean it started as GVP gear.
I just used my initials.
And this started my mom also,besides thinking that every kid
should leave home when they were18, also thought that every kid
should know how to cook, bakeand sew when they left home.
She just considered those likebasic life skills.
And so all three of us know howto do all three of those.
(29:18):
And so when our son Brian joinedScouts and we went down to REI
to gear up for the kind of thecapstone backpacking trip was a
week in the high Sierra and sothey loaded us up.
I mean, we had the internalframe.
Packs were the new thing.
So I got this big internalframe pack and, you know
inflatable sleeping pads and bigdown sleeping bags.
(29:39):
We had, you know, an MSR stoveand the old, you know white gas
container and tent andeverything Our packs.
My pack when we left on thattrip with food and water for a
week weighed.
My pack when we left on thattrip with food and water for a
week weighed over 70 pounds,which I was younger then.
It was a good thing.
That would kill me.
Today I can't even believe that.
(29:59):
And about this time Ray Jardinewrote his book the Pacific Crest
Trail Hiker's Handbook, and hetalked about hiking the Pacific
Crest Trail and sewing his owngear and a base weight of around
eight pounds.
So my friend Reed Miller, whowas the scoutmaster of the troop
(30:20):
and also a buddy of minethrough his developer, he read
Ray Jardine's book, the PacificCrest Trail Hiker's Handbook.
Jardine talks about doing thehike through hiking the Pacific
Crest Trail with his wife, jennyand having an eight pound base
pack weight, about doing thehiking through hiking the
Pacific Crest Trail with hiswife, jenny and having an
eight-pound base pack weight.
Reed decides to section hikethe Pacific Crest Trail and so
(30:41):
he's a little older than I am hedecides oh, we're going to go
lightweight, this is going to begreat.
And you know we can help thescouts because a lot of them,
when they boys, when they comeinto scouts, they're young, 13,
14.
You know you can't load them upwith that kind of weight and
expect them to have any kind ofa good experience in the
backcountry.
Since I knew how to sew, youknow, the internal frame pack
(31:02):
that they'd sold me at REIweighed seven and a half pounds
empty.
So I thought that's probably agood place to start.
So I ordered some fabric.
You know, francie stillremembers she gets home from the
store and I've moved the tableand I've got fabric stretched
out on the living room floor andI'm marking it up, measuring
with a yardstick, and marking up.
She says what are you doing?
She says I'm making myself abackpack.
She goes okay, whatever.
(31:22):
So I made myself a pack and then, you know, I'd use that pack on
scout trips and, like you said,I'm an engineer.
I kept thinking like, oh, thisis okay, but it'd be better.
If you know, I did this, thatand the other.
So I made another pack and thenI made a third pack and by the
time I made my fourth pack Ithought this is good.
You know, I think this worksfor the way I backpack right now
(31:43):
and is the best.
I can get People startedcalling it the G4 just because
my name starts with G.
And this was early internet daysand there was kind of an
ultralight backpacking listservactually a PCT listserv Word
kind of got out and so I put theplans such as they were, you
(32:05):
know, I just kind of sketchedthem up and put them on the
internet so people could maketheir own.
And I kept getting calls frompeople saying hey, you know, I
don't know how to sew and Idon't know anyone that knows how
to sew.
Could you make me a pack?
At this point I'm like working70 hours a week on the
engineering and it takes meabout 10 hours to, you know, buy
the fabric, measure everythingout, sew it up.
And so I was like no, there'sno way I'm making you a pack.
But I got enough requests.
(32:26):
I felt bad for these people.
You know, it was unfortunatetheir moms hadn't taught them
how to sew before they left home.
And so I was talking to QuestOutfitters, the sisters in
Florida that I ordered fabricfrom, and they said well,
there's this cut and sew shop onyour coast up in Seattle, you
know, maybe they could make afew packs for you.
So they gave me the contactinfo.
I got ahold of Monty up inSeattle and he says, oh yeah,
(32:49):
our minimum order is a hundred.
And I'm like, well, I don't, Ineed about 25 packs and everyone
who's bugging me will have oneand I can go back to the
engineering and that'll be that.
And so we went back and forthand finally settled on 50.
I thought, eh, they'll be in mygarage for the next five years,
but you know I'll eventuallyget rid of them Sent him up a
(33:13):
pack and, you know, went backand forth until he could make
the pack that I had designed andour son Brian put up like a
rudimentary website where peoplecould, you know, fill out an
order for him and it would sendme an email with their details.
The initial G4s were offered inone size and four different
colors, which I have no idea why.
I thought, like color was moreimportant.
Maybe I thought, well, it'seasy to change the colors, just
different fabrics.
Like I only have the pattern inone size that fits me and I'm
(33:36):
six four.
So I, you know, I have no ideathose early customers probably
didn't fit any of them.
I don't.
I have no idea.
And so I go.
You know, I'm busy working on myengineering and suddenly one
day I get a email and it's myfirst order.
It's like man, what do I do?
So I grabbed a pad of yellow.
(33:56):
I had a pad of yellow linedpaper on my desk.
I grabbed it and wrote down theorder, you know, and that's I
still have.
These are these, are thoseyellow line that's.
That's the piece of paper Igrabbed to start writing down
orders.
You know, I wrote down, wrotedown the order, wrote down each
line had like the person's name,and then I put a check mark
(34:17):
when their check arrived becausewe didn't have any.
You know, payment system set up.
This was early days and youdon't.
You know you don't put systemsin place if you think you're
just going to sell 25 packs.
It's like you don't worry abouta fancy company name, you just
call it your initials and pieceof paper and people mail their
checks.
It's like, yeah, this will befine.
You know this will be over in acouple of months here and it
(34:38):
wasn't.
You know I had 86 orders beforeI got my first shipment and
then we had to order more fabricand then it just went on from
there.
Gossamer and what's it calledagain?
Gossamer gear, gossamer gear.
Speaker 1 (34:49):
Gossamer gear.
Speaker 2 (34:50):
And it was always a side gig.
I mean, I've never taken asalary from the company.
Um cause I just never.
I don't know, it might've beenfun, I didn't want to.
Speaker 1 (35:03):
I didn't figure it was fair to my family.
You know I didn't want togamble my mortgage and my kid's
college education on it.
Involved still.
Is that kind of how it works?
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Yeah.
Yeah, it got to a point where Iwas going to close it down
because I was working 67 hours aweek doing the engineering and
then another 30 hours a weekdoing the gear business and I
was making, you know, good moneydoing the engineering and no
money on the gear business.
So if one was going to go, it'spretty obvious which one it had
(35:32):
to be.
So about this time I had joinedthe board of the Pacific Crest
Trail Association to kind ofgive back.
And at one of the meetings wewere talking about new board
members and Henry Shires of TarpTent brought up what about John
Mackey?
He does a lot of hiking.
And I said who's John Mackey?
And he said co-founder of WholeFoods Market.
And John is a very big hiker,among other things.
(35:54):
And anyway, so we set up ameeting to meet him in Boulder
and pitch him on becoming aboard member.
And by this time I had a littlebit of a reputation for having
a light pack and so John's asuper gear guy.
So he was interested in talkingto me.
That was kind of the reason heagreed to meet.
And so we met, had a nicedinner with the executive
director, liz Bergeron, and Ipitched John.
(36:16):
You know, a couple of weekslater I get back and I come to
the decision that I had to closedown the gear company and Liz
calls me up and says hey, youknow, you were the bait.
You need to close the deal,follow up with Mackie and get
him to join the board.
So I called up John and askedhim if he wanted to join the
board and he said no.
You know, he's a verysuccessful guy, obviously, and
one of the reasons he does thatis saying no to things that
(36:39):
don't have his name on them.
I was just hiking with him theother day and he said I forget
how it came up, but he says Iasked myself is this something I
need to do?
Like, am I the one that has todo this?
And if the answer is no, it'slike well, let someone else do
it, because there's stuff thatonly I can do and that's the
stuff that I need to be doing.
So, anyway, he said no and Isaid oh, by the way, I'm going
(36:59):
to close down the gear company.
So you know, if you're going toorder anything, do it in the
next week or two.
And he said I'm leaving on ahike.
Don't do anything until I getback.
And so he calls me, you know,day or two later and says okay,
I got a proposal for you.
I will buy 75% of the company.
I think it's important that youmaintain ownership and that
you're involved, but you can beas involved or uninvolved as you
(37:21):
want.
I'll hire someone to run it,I'll put money into you know,
rent an office and pay salaries,and that's how we ended up to
the Gossamer Gear today.
You know, otherwise it wouldhave been a footnote in history,
yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:35):
Yeah, well, and you would have just shut it down and
that would have been it.
Yeah, that would have been it.
I mean, yeah, selling thecompany.
Hey, get something out of it.
And you're still going to beinvolved with it.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
Yeah, I mean I didn't see any downside, you know.
I mean he paid me $100,000 for75%, which didn't change my
lifestyle, but really the thingsI've gotten out of Gosmer Gear
haven't been monetary One.
The relationship with JohnMackey and the hikes I've gone
on with him and his friends andjust being around that much
wisdom and experience on aregular basis is huge.
And then with the gear companyI get to travel to fun places.
You know we were in Japan tospeak at an event and meet with
(38:16):
dealers and I'm going to theNetherlands in the spring to
speak at event there.
So yeah, the people, the peopleand the places are the fun part
.
Speaker 1 (38:25):
And I'm going to ask about that because, as we're
kind of wrapping up here, yeah,what do you think the?
What does the future hold foryou?
What more adventures do youwant to do as well?
Speaker 2 (38:33):
You know I've been thinking about that.
A buddy of mine just got abrain tumor and he's super
healthy, a big hiker, and he'sdoing some things to prolong his
time left, but you know,basically he's got call it a
couple of years.
It's really made me think kindof back to the plane crash, you
know.
It was like your future isn'tguaranteed.
(38:54):
It's like, yeah, what would beon my list, you know, if I knew
things were coming to an end?
You know, if I had a couple ofyears, like which, which of the
items would I want to do more of?
Which things would I stop doing?
There's a never ending list ofthings For 2025, 2025.
(39:14):
I thought, well, I'm an engineer, I'm gonna plan, put together a
big, big list of likepossibilities.
We couldn't do them all, youknow.
And there's check marks.
You know, is this like a glennand francy thing?
Or just a glenn thing andfrancy's less of a planner?
She just prefers to kind of letthings unfold.
So you know, we've gotten a fewthings like with check marks
like, yes, we.
We've gotten a few things likewith check marks like yes, we're
definitely doing this.
A couple of things like, okay,this isn't going to fit into
(39:35):
this year.
You know we'd like to do NewZealand sometime.
You know, rent a camper van andbum around there for a couple
of weeks, and we're talkingabout taking our sprinter van on
the Dempster Highway in Alaska.
That's not on the not list yet,so that may happen.
Yeah, I mean, we love Europeand Italy.
There's backpacking events.
Yeah, we like a mix, we likeoverseas travel.
(39:58):
We just actually, at the timeof this list that I first made
this list, I don't know, wejoined a local kind of club and
they're doing a wine cruise.
That sounds, sounds fun.
You know that wasn't on thelist.
So now we're doing that.
Some friends of ours, your booklike hiking on the camino for a
week in spain and it's like Idon't know, it's probably not
(40:18):
the way I'd hike it and probablynot the section I'd hike, but
they're good friends and it'llbe a blast, you know.
So, okay, well, let's do that.
So we're kind of veryopportunistic.
You know, things come up whenyou have fun friends.
It's like fun opportunitiescome up and my pack is always
packed.
I could be, you know, probablyout the door in a couple hours
if I wanted to for a trip, andthere's trips.
(40:40):
I try and do that too.
I usually get permits for twoto three trips a year and just
send it out to a group of peoplethat I have to see who can make
it.
So I try and create those tripsand not just take advantage of
other people's trip creation.
Speaker 1 (40:53):
This has been fascinating.
I really appreciate who you are, tell everybody where they can
find the book and what's thebest way to get your book.
Speaker 2 (41:01):
Probably best bet.
I mean, the book is anywhereyou buy books.
Your local book seller canorder for you if they don't
already have it, Amazon, all theonline places, of course.
You can find out somethingabout the book and about me at
glennvanpeskycom.
I have lots of tips and tricksthere, backpacking and otherwise
eccentric other materials andvideos.
(41:21):
Yeah, you can sign up for mynewsletter.
I only do it every couple ofweeks and I'm thinking I may
make it less frequent than that,because maybe that's something
I don't enjoy doing as much assome other things.
Speaker 1 (41:32):
So my final question for you, then, is someone who
likes to backpack.
You've only got one opportunity, you got like a week left and
you've only got one place tobackpack.
Where are you going and why?
Speaker 2 (41:44):
For me, I'd be in the mountains, you know, somewhere
up above tree line, some trails,some cross country route,
finding probably somewhere inthe West.
I don't know, it would depend,Could be Europe, but I don't
know.
I like the here where you cancamp anywhere.
It's less curated, you can justbe out there.
Speaker 1 (42:02):
Glenn, thank you so much for coming on Journey with
Jake.
Jake, thanks for having me.
It's been a great journey.
Thank you so much to my guest,glenn Van Pesky, for sharing his
life journey with us.
I really appreciate thereminder to take less and do
more.
I have a copy of Glenn's bookTake Less, do More, and it's
full of fantastic stories andlife lessons.
I highly recommend grabbing acopy.
(42:24):
Just head over toglennvanpeskycom.
You can also follow Glenn onInstagram at g van pesky.
Thanks again, glenn, for beingpart of journey with Jake and,
of course, a special thanks toall of you, the listeners.
If you're enjoying the show, itwould mean a lot If you could
leave a rating and review onApple podcasts or Spotify.
Those reviews help othersdiscover the podcast and I'd be
(42:47):
so grateful for your support.
We're down to the final days ofFebruary and coming up this
Thursday.
I've got Stephen James Ferrison the show.
Stephen has a fascinatingbackground as a parachutist in
the Royal military and we talkabout his incredible three-day
bike excursion across Iceland.
It's a conversation full ofadventure, great stories and
(43:09):
some inspiring life lessons, sobe sure to check it out.
Just remember, it's not alwaysabout the destination as it is
about the journey.
Take care everybody.
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