February 14, 2025 • 37 mins
This episode explores the essence of leadership, emphasizing that it's not confined to titles but revolves around influence, trust, and relationship building. The hosts share personal stories, struggles, and key insights into effective leadership while encouraging listeners to seek growth and wisdom in their leadership journeys.
• Understanding the real meaning of leadership
• Difference between managers and true leaders
• Importance of trust in leadership dynamics
• Personal stories illustrate real-world leadership challenges
• The role of self-awareness and humility in effective leadership
• Encouragement and guidance for aspiring leaders
• Biblical principles as a foundation for leadership practices
• The continuous journey of growth in leadership roles
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Let's dig crew.
Thank you for joining thisconversation.
Today is going to be a good one.
Today, we're talking aboutsomething that everyone either
has in their life or somethingthat they will become at some
point in their life.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Yeah, I think, even if someone aspires to step into
a leadership role.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
You took the ding ding ding word you just was
taking so long.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
I'm like why is she talking?
Speaker 1 (00:27):
like this.
I was getting there.
You sound like an AI bot.
An AI bot.
You're the worst.
Okay, what we're talking abouttoday is leadership.
You either have a leader inyour life or someday you're
going to become a leader, and weare really going to talk.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
What about if you are a leader, or you already are a
leader?
You left out a very big pointthe people that are leaders.
This ain't for people that arecurrently leaders.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
We don't take take twos.
This is just going to be it.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
We don't do take twos Yo if you guys are looking
forward to this conversation, besure to hit that like button,
hit that thumbs up here onYouTube.
Shout out to all of our LDCfolks that's been rocking with
us.
You can also hit that littleheart sign, too, as well, if
this channel has been a blessingto you.
If you're joining us on Apple,if you're joining us on Spotify,
(01:12):
don't be shy.
Leave us a little review, writeback, send us a little comment.
We want to know how we're doing.
Our goal is to make sure thatwe're being a blessing to you
guys and that we're able to justempower you guys and just pour
and plant seeds that can changeyour lives.
And so we don't have all theanswers, but we have scenarios,
we have questions, we havethoughts, we have experiences,
(01:32):
and our prayer is that everysingle time you sit in on these
conversations, that you pick upa seed, you pick up a nugget,
something that you could have anencounter with God.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
Are you rewriting our purpose statement right now,
because you said all of that.
Oh and you didn't say why we'rehere we are here to help you
grow a deeper relationship withGod, others and yourself, so
that's why today, we are talkingabout leadership.
So if you're ready, let's dig,let's dig.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
You know leadership is is is interesting too because
, you know, we we always thinkof the word leadership as
someone who's the boss in theroom and someone who's in charge
, but when I look at the wordleader, or the thought or the
concept leader, I think of thosethat are able to influence
those that are around them,those that are able to lead a
(02:21):
cause or lead a movement or beable to turn a room around.
You don't actually necessarilyhave to be the manager.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
You don't have to have the title.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
I think so many people are so obsessed with
titles and they think like, well, make me the leader.
And I'm guilty of that toosometimes.
Sometimes I'm like, well, giveme the title, give me the
position.
But when you really think aboutit, it's like step up to the
plate, bring a change to theroom, influence people, inspire
someone.
And I think there's a bigdifference between managers and
(02:50):
leaders.
Managers tell people to do,leaders inspire people to do.
Speaker 1 (03:01):
That's a really good differentiate.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Right, I saw you turn into a manager one time.
Speaker 1 (03:06):
I sure did, man, and I thought I was like this is it.
I was working at a salon.
They asked me to step up asassistant manager.
Uh, and to be clear, there wasno like regular manager above me
, so it was pretty much themanagement of the salon and I
was very excited for theopportunity.
I had a really goodrelationship with all the girls,
(03:29):
I got along with them, and so Iwas pumped.
I was like I finally get tomove up to management and I
called a meeting.
And boy, when I tell you, I hadto eat the biggest piece of
humble pie Actually, it was theentire pie because the meeting
blew up in my face.
Girls stormed out of themeeting.
(03:50):
That's crazy, bro.
I was sitting there dumbfoundedbecause I thought I had good
relationships with all of themso that meant I could lead them,
and that wasn't true, likethere's so many more layers to
leadership, more than justhaving a good relationship, and
so that was my first taste of itand I was like, yeah, this
(04:12):
sucks.
It's wild too.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
So someone asked us a question.
We're doing an interview acouple of weeks ago and the
question that we were asked waswhat has been the greatest joy
and struggles in leadershiproles while in church or even in
your community and it soundslike you've started to answer
this in this community side.
(04:37):
You working at the salon beinga manager and you thought,
because you're a manager, you'renow the people's leader.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
Yeah, and I thought like the relationships would
swing over, which is also nottrue Once you get lifted to a
higher role.
Expectations raise, demandsraise.
They expect more from me atthat point.
And then I think one of thebiggest experiences that I had
in that moment was I wasmisunderstood.
(05:06):
Like if I had a conversationwith a girl when I was just lead
stylist to another stylist,they would understand where I'm
coming from.
As soon as I got put in thatleadership role and I had the
same conversation, they all of asudden didn't understand me.
I'm like that's not what I saidat all.
Like it was just almostovernight.
Once I got that title, they nolonger gave me the benefit of
(05:29):
the doubt of like, oh no, I know, danny Lee, she didn't mean
that she wouldn't do that, nope.
As soon as I became assistantmanager, it was like she did
this, she did that, and it wasreally hard to understand.
Like that, I had to start fromground zero.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
I had to rebuild that trust.
Yeah, and as we've been steppingmore into leadership roles and
we've been doing some studiestoo, like that book Speed of
Trust that we've read, it was areally good indicator, letting
us know that you, as a leader,you walk into a room with your
heart in the right place, butthe people see you walk into the
(06:05):
room with your behavior.
So true, so your motives mayhave been nice, your motives may
have been pure Right, but allthey see is your actions and
your behavior.
So it makes sense why you saidI felt misunderstood Because
you're like no, my heart's inthe right place.
I do want to make thisorganization a better place.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Like I want to help you.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
I took this role to help you.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
I got to cough.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Oh Lord, Guys, he's been coughing all week.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Guys, there's been a bug going around, there's been
some type of flu going around,and I think I caught it like a
week ago.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
I'm good now.
So, like I, you're right.
I went in with best of motive,best intentions.
I took that title so that Icould make it better for them
and then, all of a sudden, whenI was sitting in that seat, I
became the enemy, I became thebad person.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
I became the one that they were upset with.
Here's my question, for you is.
Going back to the main questionwhat has been one of your
greatest struggles while beingin a leadership role?
Like one of your greateststruggles?
Speaker 1 (07:10):
My greatest struggles , I think, balancing.
So there's something that Iknow God has gifted me with, and
that is to be friends withpeople like to be warm and open.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
Yeah, you are, you're mad friendly.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
I'm like ready to go, like I can be super friendly
and that's just a gift God'sgiven me.
But it also is been a struggleto learn how to harness it and
not allow people to get hurtbecause of it.
So a lot of times I willconnect with someone and I'm
like, oh, this is so fun.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
Or like from the movie Step Brothers I will
connect with someone and I'mlike, oh, this is so fun.
Or like from the movie Step.
Speaker 1 (07:46):
Brothers.
Did we just become best friends?
They think, did we just becomebest friends?
I may not.
I just think, oh my gosh, Iclicked with you.
This is so cool.
I love that, that's great, I'llsee you next week.
And to me it wasn't any deeper,but to them it felt like, did
we just become best friends?
And then when the relationshipchanges or seasons change or my
schedule changes or anythingchanges, those people tend to
(08:09):
get hurt and it's not in myintention, it's not what I want
to happen.
So learning how to like,harness that and deal with
people's hearts without hurtingthem has been a very, very big
struggle, because my intent isto never hurt them.
I love them hard, whether I seethem once a month or whether I
(08:29):
see them once a year, like Ilove hard.
That's just part of what God'sgiven me, but it has been really
hard to maybe communicate moreclearly or, um, to just define
what, what kind of relationshipI'm going to have with that
person and what that might looklike.
That's been one of my strugglesfor sure.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
It makes sense, and I'm wondering if you're more
intentional of communicatingwith somebody at the beginning
and the start of therelationship, letting them know
your strengths and yoursuperpowers, that, hey, god has
given me an ability to practicehospitality and compassion with
people, so you're going to feel,we're going to feel an instant
(09:09):
connection.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Yeah, Like like we'll feel close right away.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Yeah, but but it's tough too, cause you can't be
like someone like me, just belike, be careful, cause we're
not best friends.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Bro Cause I've said that before.
I'm like hey, I know.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
I'm like yo.
I know you feel like we'reclose, but we're not friends.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Oh my gosh, and that person wanted it so badly.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
I was working with somebody many years ago and he'd
ask me he's like hey bro, likeare we best friends?
And I'm like no bro we're notlike we became friends.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
You didn't say best?
Speaker 2 (09:45):
I don't.
I feel like best friends is forwomen and children.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
Okay, that's actually valid.
It's very much a girl thing.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Like I have really good close friends.
I got one or two like closefriends, but I don't ever think
I said yeah, so my best friend,could you imagine me saying yeah
, so this?
Speaker 1 (10:01):
is my best friend.
Never, never, I could neverimagine you using that verbiage.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
Yo, and I feel like some people are going to give me
some heat right now.
It's like oh my gosh, I can'tbelieve.
Pierre just said that bestfriends are for children and for
women.
I'm just like bro, if you're agrown man, you have best friends
.
That's completely fine.
I just have really closefriends and I have good friends
right.
But people tend to just findyou connect with you and in
their mind they already put youin a box, in a place where you
(10:28):
are in their heart.
And you don't even realize it.
And it's tough being theirleader too at the same time.
Totally, because as a leader,you constantly have to keep
growing, like a team will nevergrow if the leader doesn't grow
grow if the leader doesn't grow.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
And they, and these, these people that have connected
to me in that point, they tendto and I've seen it from a lot
of them get very territorial ofme.
Like they don't want to shareme with no one else.
So, once they've connected withme, they don't want me to move
up and they don't want me tomove to a different, like
friendship connection literallya different, different
conversation.
They don't want me to move to adifferent, like friendship
connection, literally adifferent conversation.
They don't want me to move tothe other conversation.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
They want me to stay right there with them, hold
their hand and be very close tothem only, and it's like it gets
unhealthy, Like you can't but Iwill say and this is where I'm
challenging you because I feellike it's shame on you for
knowing this about your skillset, your superpower, your strength
and going into a relationshiprealizing like, oh my gosh, this
(11:28):
person is obsessed with me andyou got to figure out a point
where you're like catching itright now, letting them know
Again, not being as harsh andaggressive as I would be, like,
hey, let me just put a pin inthis right now.
We're not best friends.
Speaker 1 (11:42):
Right, I'm not saying that Right.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
But letting them know like I'm in your life for this
season and right now I'm walkingdirectly next to you, but
there's going to be season whereGod is going to assign me to do
it with other people.
And I need you to understandthat I'm not leaving you, I'm
not moving off from you.
Like you're growing to yourperson, I'm growing into my
person, and so we have tounderstand like we grow with the
growth.
This is where the seasons are,and I feel like just to
(12:10):
challenge you, like I think yougot to figure out that way to
communicate to someone, forexample, for me.
I'm a visionary, so when I'm ina room with people, I
automatically start sharing withthem what I see for them and
things that I feel like they cando or they should be doing.
Where I'm like man, I see you,man, hearing your words, man, I
feel like you're.
(12:30):
Yo, this is your ability, thisis your skillset, this is your.
So now, sometimes people andI've, and it's happened People
sometimes treat me like sometype of genie in a bottle, right
, what do you see for me?
Yeah, like hey.
I've had people like hey, whatdo you see for me?
They have, hey, what I'm like,what I don't know, I don't know.
I see for you.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
I ain't your God, but they want you to tell them
exactly what it is, so that theycan just do that.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
So I recently had some people walk out and walk
out of my life, and I think someof it was because of that,
because I communicated to themso much of what I saw for them,
what I saw for me, what I sawfor us, where we're going, all
those types of things, and whenit didn't turn out the way they
imagined it or the way Imight've described it, or none
of it worked out the way wedreamed of it.
(13:17):
So it's almost like I let themdown and I'm realizing I need to
do a better job at whenever I'msharing with someone and I'm
using my skill set to castvisions or thoughts or dreams or
ideas to give disclaimers oflike, hey, I'm just sharing you
what I see, but I'm not your God, I'm not the Holy spirit, I
can't make this happen for you.
You got to put in your own workand I'm also a human, I'm a man
(13:40):
.
My perception, my perspectivemight be off today.
That's true.
Like I'm saying, it could justbe something like yo, how, as a
leader, we have to work so hardto catch ourselves, to not allow
people to box us in or trap us,or to see things happening
right in front of us all at thesame exact time and not to catch
(14:01):
it and jump in front of it.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Yeah, you know what I'm saying.
Yeah.
So what is that?
What you would describe as yourbiggest challenge in leadership
?
Nope, what's your biggestchallenge?
I ain't got none, Pierre.
You said I ain't got one, whichI will say disclaimer guys.
Pierre's been in the leadershipgame a lot longer than me.
That salon job was my firsttaste of leadership and then
(14:26):
I've been in church leadershipafter that.
But you've been in a leadershipsince you were like yeah,
teenager 14.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
Yeah, my biggest struggle as a leader is seeing
something for someone and tryingto force them to see it for
themselves.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
That's your biggest.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
That's the biggest one, seeing someone that has so
much potential and they'remaking decisions going down
certain pathways that I'm likeman yo, if you could only see
what.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
I see in you.
You do that with me, or likeyou've had to learn to not do
that even with me.
Speaker 2 (15:02):
But the struggle is like fighting for them to see it
, yeah, and that I feel likewhat happens sometimes is they
feel remorse, they feel bad thatI've worked so hard to get them
to see it.
Sometimes they force themselvesto see and ultimately they
never saw it for themselves,yeah, which causes both of us to
be frustrated with each other.
I would say the second greateststruggle that I have as a
(15:26):
manager or as a leader, as apastor, as a director is, um,
believing people, like when theyshow me that, like their real
selves.
So if they're incapable, ifthey're flaky, if they're always
lagging, if they're alwaysdouble booking, if they're not
punctual and they keep doing ittime after time after time and
(15:49):
they showed me, even whenthey're explicitly saying this
is who I am, yeah, it's me notgiving up on them, which I think
it's a strength and it's aweakness at the same time,
because ultimately it forces meto start holding their weight
for them and it makes us holdthe whole team back.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
And that's been a struggle for me as a leader,
cause I'm like yo.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
This person has proved time after time after
time that they're not reliable,or time after time after time
that they're inconsistent.
Why will I not just let them go?
I had this one guy that was onmy team one time that I had to
sit down twice and eventually Ihad to actually release him from
my team Like, hey, man, you'reoff.
And it's because I sawsomething for him more than he
(16:31):
saw for himself and I workedreally hard for him to see it,
and once in a while he'd be ableto hold it together, keep it
together and it it together andit'd flare up.
But it started trickling allthroughout the team.
This behavior, his behavior,there are certain things that he
was doing that was goingagainst our culture and it was
affecting the rest of the team.
Speaker 1 (16:51):
And.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
I tried to have these conversations with him, I'd
find out he would still gobehind my back and still act up.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
It's still, and I'd find out, he would still go
behind my back and still act up.
It's still, and I address itHours talking to him, hours,
days.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
And I would just always constantly sit him down
once, walk him through it youneed to pray, bro, you need to
see God 30 days on the bench,come back.
He would hold off for a fewmore months.
We'd go through it all overagain.
Eventually, I finally had tosit him down and I realized like
he's been doing something thathe's shown to me from the first
day.
I mean, I'm talking about a twoto three year process and I've
(17:21):
always saw this, and so that'ssomething that like I for me, as
a leader, I really need tocontinue to manage, cause if I
don't, the rest of my team wouldconstantly be frustrated with
me for not seeing something theyalready saw.
If my team sees it before me.
I'm doing something wrong.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
That's good.
What are some things that youdo as a leader that helps you
see things before they come tobe a problem point?
Like you just said, if my teamsees things before I do, I'm
failing as a leader.
So what are some things thatyou do as a leader that helps
you, like, visually see orspiritually even see those
(18:02):
things before they become aproblem?
Speaker 2 (18:04):
Yeah, I like to ask my team members throughout the
week, like I do post checks, andI'll ask them you know, what
was a highlight from this pastweek?
Or I'll ask is did anythingstick out to you this week, or
did you notice anything thisweek that goes against our
culture or that goes againstwhat we're working towards?
(18:25):
Because, at the end of the day,as a leader, as a coach, our
captain, right A manager, Iwon't be able to see everything
that's happening on the field.
I won't be able to seeeverything that's happening on
the court, especially when I'min the game.
So it's my job to find peopleon my team that I trust their
judgment, but also prefacing itof like, hey, I'm not asking you
to just tell me your feelingsand things that you like.
(18:46):
I need you to tell me what'sworking, what's not working.
Right, we were talking aboutthat a couple weeks ago, like
when we met with our.
We met with, like, the youthleaders a couple of weeks ago.
And we told them I'm like, ifyou guys see something that's
not working, share it with us,not saying, just share stuff
with me that you just don't likepreferences.
Speaker 1 (19:05):
I feel like it's not your personality point.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
Yeah, I'm not asking for there is space for that.
Like there, there are timeswhen we're birthing something
like, and I'm asking, like, like, what do you guys want to see
Right?
Like like, what'd you thinkabout this?
Like, did you like it Right?
But ultimately, the feedbackthat I always want to hear is
what's working and what's notworking, and so for me, that
allows me to keep a pulse on ateam.
I don't always get it right,I'm still working on it, but
(19:39):
it's some buffers and for me,like, one of the greatest joys
as a leader is when my teamactually see something before me
and they address it exactly theway that I would address it,
and I'm like yo I have no notes.
Like you, killed this.
You made such a great decision.
It allows me to keep risingabove.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
Yeah, that is super helpful.
Yeah, I think another thing thatI struggle with in leadership
is just it's what you call theline and the lamb like being
soft and understanding, but thenalso like calling them and
(20:20):
challenging them to raise tothat moment and be like, okay,
but can you push through?
Like cause, I'm always more ofan empath, I always want to be a
caring leader that like caresabout what's going on in their
home If someone's sick orsomething happens.
Like finding that balance ofbeing understanding, being
caring, but also like saying,hey, like this is your
(20:42):
commitment, do you think thatyou can stick to your word?
Can you make your word umdependable?
Or does this kind of change howI can depend on you going in
the future?
Like finding that balance is itand I think that's the
nurturing side of me, that's themothering side of me, where I
just want to be caring and kindand it's okay, don't worry,
(21:03):
we'll figure it out.
It's okay, cause that isimportant.
But so is like, hey, does thischange how I count on you going
forward from this, because thismakes me feel like I can't count
on you as much, and so justkind of like finding that
balance of being soft and strongat the same time is a challenge
for me.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
Yeah, it's interesting too, because I feel
like it's the same way when itcomes to parenting.
It's so easy for us to just tryto be our kids' friends, and we
just want to be nice and wantto let them have their way.
We don't want them to be mad atus, we just want them.
But we're actually letting themdown when we're not teaching
them accountability.
It's very true.
We're actually letting themdown if we're not leading them
(21:47):
how to manage their emotions.
We're letting them down whenwe're not teaching them how to
teach people how to treat them.
Our son, right now, he he's I.
I mean some might say he'sgetting bullied at school, but I
don't think he's gettingbullied at school.
I think he's meeting.
He's finally meeting his matchRight At school, cause he's
(22:08):
slick, he's tough, he always gotsomething smart to say he's
arrogant.
He's arrogant.
He's cocky talks trash.
He likes to tease his friends,and now he got some friends in
school that that matched themand they're overriding him and
they're doing it stronger thanhe is and he's starting to go
ahead and that little turtleneckis jumping down and he's scared
and I'm like.
(22:30):
I'm like, oh yo, so we're notgoing to change schools for
reasons like that, we're notgoing to do anything like that,
but we're going to teach you howto teach these kids how to
treat you, and so this is howyou respond back to it and then
also teaching them like you reapwhat you sow.
I know, for me as a leader, oneof the biggest struggles I
(22:50):
guess this is another bigstruggle because I mentioned two
earlier but a big struggle forme as a leader is leading
someone that's literally like me.
The hardest person to earlier,but a big struggle for me as a
leader is leading someone that'sliterally like me.
The hardest person to lead isalways going to be yourself,
that's very true.
Because it's the only person youcan make excuses for.
It's the only person thatyou'll cover up for.
Speaker 1 (23:12):
It's the only person that you'll like bend over
backwards because you know wherethey're at.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Yeah, you know their motives.
It's yourself.
It's the hardest person to lead.
It's yourself no-transcriptyeah.
Think about that.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
I just was realizing that you're saying both leading
yourself and leading someonelike you.
You're saying both options.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
I'm saying both right .
I'm saying both leadingyourself right, talking yourself
out of not hitting snooze, butyou just define it.
You just define it at the sameexact time, or you're defending
that person.
You're defending yourself, likewell, well, why are you talking
in third person?
Like yeah, he had to sleep?
You're talking about yourself.
(24:01):
Yeah, he was tired he had along day.
Yesterday we had a long daytalking about yourself right now
.
That's trash bro and then, allof a sudden, you start leading
someone else that's like you andyou're looking right in the
mirror.
Why are you yawning right?
Speaker 1 (24:13):
now, guys, I tried to hide it and he called me out.
Also, he left the AC on.
I'm freezing.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
I did not leave the AC on.
That's the fan.
Speaker 1 (24:20):
By the time we're done, it's going to be 54
degrees in this house.
Speaker 2 (24:23):
Relax man.
We can't have them watching mesweating right here.
All right, I guess second fall,let me say this early Third of
all fourth of all he's juststarting over.
Yo, if you guys are liking theseconversations, this
conversation specifically, like,tell us what are some things
that you guys are dealing withor struggling with as leaders,
(24:44):
what are some tips and pointersthat you guys may even have for
us as you hear some of the stuffthat we're talking about,
things that we encounter.
You know highs and lows.
One question that I want us toanswer right now is and I'm
going to ask you this, babe,what is one of the greatest joys
that you get in being a leader,Greatest joys?
Speaker 1 (25:06):
Greatest joys of being a leader.
So I served as children'sdirector for a year and a half
and some of the greatest joysduring that season was watching
I mean the fruits of serving inthat department, like in general
watching children learn how toworship at church, growing in
(25:29):
the relationship with Jesus.
Like there were moments where Iwas leading worship for kids
and I had 30 kids like singingso loud, hands raised like truly
, truly worshiping, and thosewere some like incredible
moments of wow, god, thank youfor using me in this moment.
Other greatest joys would bewalking with young women and
(25:54):
seeing them jump over hurdlesthat would keep them paralyzed
before.
So there are times I've talkedwith girls and worked through
things when they're mental itwas the mental game so often it
would just absolutely jeopardizethem and freeze them and they
couldn't make moves.
And when I saw them breakthrough some of those thought
(26:15):
processes that the enemy wasusing to tell them they weren't
worth it, to tell them theyweren't good enough, and and for
all it took for me was to speaktruth to them and to encourage
them to make the word of Godlouder than what the enemy says
to us, um, and watching it likebreak off of them and it didn't
bother them anymore.
Like that is.
The greatest joy for me is tojust see them sore and like
(26:39):
really break through thosechallenges, and it's so humbling
to to be like wow, god, thankyou for using me, uh, in that
person's life, thank you forgiving me the opportunity to
speak into them.
Like that's a humbling moment,it's huge.
And so those have been some oflike the greatest joys of like,
yeah, girl, you got this.
Like you don't, you don't needme to be in your cheerleading
(27:00):
corner anymore.
There are moments where youneeded me to be a cheerleader in
your squad and I would cheeryou on, but once you get, once
you get over that hurdle, likewatching them just kind of soars
, it's so rewarding I'm just,it's overwhelming.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
Yeah, yeah, do you what about?
Speaker 1 (27:14):
for you.
What Like your greatest joys?
Speaker 2 (27:18):
My greatest joy is sitting right here next to you.
Ooh, that was a good one, yeah,happy Valentine's day.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
Happy Valentine's day .
It's early, I know I'm joking.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Um, that was your gift, was a shout out on let's
Dig the podcast.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
No'm playing.
I've been looking at some stuff, oh I see it's on your mind.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
I'm excited.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
I have all I've been thinking about is our son's
birthday is that weekend, soyeah, no, it's good, like, like
you take cash, right, I do cashup.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
Um, um, no, I mean, it's, it's, it's been like
really cool.
I think, um, this is not just ajoy, but I really want to just
encourage us and people that areeven listening right now, um,
to really obsess over thepurpose of why you're a leader.
Um, a leader is not a task.
(28:07):
A leader is not a title, right?
A leader is an assignment.
You have an opportunity to leadpeople through the mission.
My job as a leader, for me, whenI step into the room, it's not
just to get things done.
We will get things done.
We will check things off thelist, like we will accomplish
(28:29):
the things that we came to dothat day, but ultimately, like
my goal is to help people findtheir purpose in God.
My goal is to help someonefulfill a mission, not just a
checklist off of positions,because I think the tasks, the
things that we do, that we'llnever find fulfillment in that
(28:49):
unless we know why we are doingit.
You know, I've watched you inthe last year step into
leadership roles.
There are times where youdidn't even know what you were
doing or why you were there, andeven today we had a
conversation at breakfast.
I'm like your purpose is not tojust fulfill a policy or
procedure or protocols, right,as people are literally looking
(29:09):
to you to walk alongside them,and it's not even necessarily to
even have answers.
Speaker 1 (29:14):
Yeah, Because I don't always have them.
Speaker 2 (29:16):
It's not to have answers, but it's to walk with
them with a sound mind.
It's to point them to theanswer.
And that's one of the greatestcallings of being a leader.
It's challenging because, likeI said earlier, the hardest
person to lead is always goingto be yourself.
Like everybody gets better whenthe leader gets better.
You know what I mean, and sothat's a hard challenge to take
on personally, because there'ssome days you don't want to get
(29:37):
better, or there's some days youdon't want to put in the work
to get better.
You do want to get better, butit's the work.
It's like all right, you'regoing to have to rebook.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
You're going to have to be disciplined.
Speaker 2 (29:45):
You're going to have to get on the podcast.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
You're going to have to be the first one to say I'm
sorry.
You're going to have to be thefirst one to accept
responsibility.
Everything rises and falls onleadership.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
Yeah, and it's not necessarily even just saying the
word sorry is what you said,it's just owning the failure.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
Accepting the responsibility.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
Accepting it, being responsible and owning the
mistakes.
So if something didn't work outright, if something didn't go
right, as a leader it's one ofthe hardest things to do, cause
you put everything in it to makeit go right.
Speaker 1 (30:38):
And it could still go wrong.
And you have to say like, andit's.
It's the humility thing too, oflike, because once you get, if
you're in a role and pride isall you're feeling, like, the
Lord will humble you Like.
Pride comes before a fall.
That's Bible.
So, knowing that, as you'resitting in a role of leadership,
as long as you stay in humilityand say hey, that was my bad.
(31:02):
I truly tried my best, but Ican see how it didn't come how I
wanted it to.
This wasn't the outcome I waslooking for or that wasn't what
I wanted you to hear.
I'm sorry that that's what youheard in my words.
That wasn't my intention.
Like all those things, um it itjust it makes you an incredible
leader.
I remember one time talking to aparent from our church and I
(31:24):
was talking about um, there wasa conflict and I said did you,
did you apologize to thatteenager.
I said did you, did youapologize to that teenager?
And the mom was very upset atthe, at the very idea of
apologizing.
But I remember what it did tous in our relationship with our
(31:44):
son.
When we started to apologizeand say I'm sorry, I got really
upset and I shouldn't have donethat, or I'm sorry that that
happened.
Um, I did that wrong and Icould have done better.
Even yesterday I took him tothe dentist.
I he's super afraid of thedentist and I downplayed the
appointment.
I thought it was going to be avery simple appointment and
ended up being painful.
And after the appointment,after we're in the car and no
(32:07):
one is around, I looked at himand I was like hey, I want you
to know that is not what Ithought was going to happen
today.
I did not lie to you.
I told you what I thought wasgoing to happen and I'm sorry
that that hurt today at theappointment.
Are you okay?
Like I want him to trust me, Iwant him to think I didn't want
him to think that I was justdownplaying it the whole time.
And so all those things asleaders of like the humility,
(32:30):
the humbleness, like it has tobe the main character that you
carry, and and knowing withinthe same hand, humility and like
what God's placed inside of you, what he's called you to do,
those things go to and to.
You will be an incredibleleader.
Yeah, man.
Speaker 2 (32:47):
Yeah, that's it.
That's all, folks.
That's all we got for you guystoday.
Man, we've been having theseconversations in our home every
single day.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
It's all the time y'all.
I wish y'all would know.
Like he literally said, todaywas our breakfast and I was like
this was part of our breakfastconversation.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Yeah, we just talked about the responsibilities that
we carry as a leader and areasthat we need to grow in, areas
that we need to step it up inholding each other accountable,
checking each other.
Even now, there are things thatwe're listening to, things that
we're watching podcasts, justlike this conversations.
I would encourage everyone thatstrives to be a better leader
(33:23):
because we're all leadingsomebody.
Even if you're not leadingothers, you're still leading
yourself and everyone who hasthe desire to be a better leader
, like, make the consciousdecisions to seek God and God's
wisdom and his guidance.
Start getting into the properbooks, start finding the right
podcast, start finding the rightpeople, but, more importantly,
(33:44):
like, stop lying to yourself,you know, go easy on yourself.
At the same time, we talk aboutthis right Having relationships
with ourselves.
Leading ourselves is one of themost challenging things that
you could do.
But when you have God in yourlife, when you have the Holy
Spirit leading you, holy Spiritopens up your heart so that you
can see the truth, you can seethe depth, and then that allows
you to even find cleansing inyour soul.
(34:05):
Throughout those situations andfor me as a leader, that helps
me when I'm able to sit down andrealize today I made a comment
at the house that I said man,like you know, like I need to
start doing this, this.
I said I said a comment and Isaid you know what I take that
back.
I am starting.
Remember I said that, liketoday, like I need to start
stepping into that, I need tostart stepping into that
(34:25):
situation.
That's what I said.
And I said you know what, Itake that back, I'm stepping
into that situation.
When we say I need to start,it's giving us, like, time to
milk it.
It's given us we're stalling,we're making excuses for like
why we haven't done it yet, andwe we start telling ourselves,
like we're going to do it, Ihaven't started yet.
Now tell yourself you're goingto start it and find someone to
hold you accountable.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
So that's all I really got to say All right, I'm
going to end with these twoscriptures that I had.
One is man, we're like bothlike clearing our throats.
Sorry guys, it's a great day ofrecording.
Let's take the podcast.
Speaker 2 (34:58):
Right, let's record.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
Okay, these two scriptures I want to leave you
with.
The first one is James 1.5.
If you need wisdom, ask ourgenerous God and he will give it
to you.
He will not rebuke you forasking.
And so if you're in aleadership role, or maybe you're
even under a leader that'sreally challenging you and maybe
(35:20):
frustrating you, like askingthe Lord for wisdom of how to
approach the situation, askingthe Lord for wisdom of how do
you lead better?
Um, they literally says he willgive it to you.
So that's James one five, and Iwant to just encourage that.
And then, lastly, I want to endwith this one it's a Galatians
six nine.
So let's not get tired of doingwhat is good at just the right
(35:42):
time.
We'll reap a harvest ofblessing If we don't give up.
Leadership is hard.
Leadership literally pulls outthe strengths and weaknesses of
yourself and the gifts thatGod's given you, and it makes
you see yourself in a differentway.
And we have to keep going.
We have to keep doing the hardwork, the discipline of what
Pierre said, of listening topodcasts, reading the right
(36:03):
books, finding the right mentors, doing the hard work to be a
leader that can bring peoplecloser to God and point them to
him, I will not be a leader.
I pray that I'll never be aleader that pushes people from
God, but that I'm only a leaderthat leads people closer to a
walk with Jesus, and so I justwant to encourage you all with
(36:23):
that scripture Don't grow wearyin well-doing.
Do the good work.
You will reap a harvest, andmost of the time, that harvest
will be when you get in heavenand there are crowns in your or
jewels in your crown, and thatyou led people to be closer to
Jesus.
So I that's it.
I'm done.
That was my two scriptures.
I wouldn't encourage y'all.
We love y'all.
Thank you for joining thisconversation.
(36:44):
Don't forget to subscribe.
Send this to someone you loveand we'll see y.
Let's dig crew.
Thank you for joining thisconversation.
Today is going to be a good one.
Today, we're talking aboutsomething that everyone either
has in their life or somethingthat they will become at some
point in their life.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Yeah, I think, even if someone aspires to step into
a leadership role.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
You took the ding ding ding word you just was
taking so long.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
I'm like why is she talking?
Speaker 1 (00:27):
like this.
I was getting there.
You sound like an AI bot.
An AI bot.
You're the worst.
Okay, what we're talking abouttoday is leadership.
You either have a leader inyour life or someday you're
going to become a leader, and weare really going to talk.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
What about if you are a leader, or you already are a
leader?
You left out a very big pointthe people that are leaders.
This ain't for people that arecurrently leaders.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
We don't take take twos.
This is just going to be it.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
We don't do take twos Yo if you guys are looking
forward to this conversation, besure to hit that like button,
hit that thumbs up here onYouTube.
Shout out to all of our LDCfolks that's been rocking with
us.
You can also hit that littleheart sign, too, as well, if
this channel has been a blessingto you.
If you're joining us on Apple,if you're joining us on Spotify,
(01:12):
don't be shy.
Leave us a little review, writeback, send us a little comment.
We want to know how we're doing.
Our goal is to make sure thatwe're being a blessing to you
guys and that we're able to justempower you guys and just pour
and plant seeds that can changeyour lives.
And so we don't have all theanswers, but we have scenarios,
we have questions, we havethoughts, we have experiences,
(01:32):
and our prayer is that everysingle time you sit in on these
conversations, that you pick upa seed, you pick up a nugget,
something that you could have anencounter with God.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
Are you rewriting our purpose statement right now,
because you said all of that.
Oh and you didn't say why we'rehere we are here to help you
grow a deeper relationship withGod, others and yourself, so
that's why today, we are talkingabout leadership.
So if you're ready, let's dig,let's dig.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
You know leadership is is is interesting too because
, you know, we we always thinkof the word leadership as
someone who's the boss in theroom and someone who's in charge
, but when I look at the wordleader, or the thought or the
concept leader, I think of thosethat are able to influence
those that are around them,those that are able to lead a
(02:21):
cause or lead a movement or beable to turn a room around.
You don't actually necessarilyhave to be the manager.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
You don't have to have the title.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
I think so many people are so obsessed with
titles and they think like, well, make me the leader.
And I'm guilty of that toosometimes.
Sometimes I'm like, well, giveme the title, give me the
position.
But when you really think aboutit, it's like step up to the
plate, bring a change to theroom, influence people, inspire
someone.
And I think there's a bigdifference between managers and
(02:50):
leaders.
Managers tell people to do,leaders inspire people to do.
Speaker 1 (03:01):
That's a really good differentiate.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Right, I saw you turn into a manager one time.
Speaker 1 (03:06):
I sure did, man, and I thought I was like this is it.
I was working at a salon.
They asked me to step up asassistant manager.
Uh, and to be clear, there wasno like regular manager above me
, so it was pretty much themanagement of the salon and I
was very excited for theopportunity.
I had a really goodrelationship with all the girls,
(03:29):
I got along with them, and so Iwas pumped.
I was like I finally get tomove up to management and I
called a meeting.
And boy, when I tell you, I hadto eat the biggest piece of
humble pie Actually, it was theentire pie because the meeting
blew up in my face.
Girls stormed out of themeeting.
(03:50):
That's crazy, bro.
I was sitting there dumbfoundedbecause I thought I had good
relationships with all of themso that meant I could lead them,
and that wasn't true, likethere's so many more layers to
leadership, more than justhaving a good relationship, and
so that was my first taste of itand I was like, yeah, this
(04:12):
sucks.
It's wild too.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
So someone asked us a question.
We're doing an interview acouple of weeks ago and the
question that we were asked waswhat has been the greatest joy
and struggles in leadershiproles while in church or even in
your community and it soundslike you've started to answer
this in this community side.
(04:37):
You working at the salon beinga manager and you thought,
because you're a manager, you'renow the people's leader.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
Yeah, and I thought like the relationships would
swing over, which is also nottrue Once you get lifted to a
higher role.
Expectations raise, demandsraise.
They expect more from me atthat point.
And then I think one of thebiggest experiences that I had
in that moment was I wasmisunderstood.
(05:06):
Like if I had a conversationwith a girl when I was just lead
stylist to another stylist,they would understand where I'm
coming from.
As soon as I got put in thatleadership role and I had the
same conversation, they all of asudden didn't understand me.
I'm like that's not what I saidat all.
Like it was just almostovernight.
Once I got that title, they nolonger gave me the benefit of
(05:29):
the doubt of like, oh no, I know, danny Lee, she didn't mean
that she wouldn't do that, nope.
As soon as I became assistantmanager, it was like she did
this, she did that, and it wasreally hard to understand.
Like that, I had to start fromground zero.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
I had to rebuild that trust.
Yeah, and as we've been steppingmore into leadership roles and
we've been doing some studiestoo, like that book Speed of
Trust that we've read, it was areally good indicator, letting
us know that you, as a leader,you walk into a room with your
heart in the right place, butthe people see you walk into the
(06:05):
room with your behavior.
So true, so your motives mayhave been nice, your motives may
have been pure Right, but allthey see is your actions and
your behavior.
So it makes sense why you saidI felt misunderstood Because
you're like no, my heart's inthe right place.
I do want to make thisorganization a better place.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Like I want to help you.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
I took this role to help you.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
I got to cough.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Oh Lord, Guys, he's been coughing all week.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Guys, there's been a bug going around, there's been
some type of flu going around,and I think I caught it like a
week ago.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
I'm good now.
So, like I, you're right.
I went in with best of motive,best intentions.
I took that title so that Icould make it better for them
and then, all of a sudden, whenI was sitting in that seat, I
became the enemy, I became thebad person.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
I became the one that they were upset with.
Here's my question, for you is.
Going back to the main questionwhat has been one of your
greatest struggles while beingin a leadership role?
Like one of your greateststruggles?
Speaker 1 (07:10):
My greatest struggles , I think, balancing.
So there's something that Iknow God has gifted me with, and
that is to be friends withpeople like to be warm and open.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
Yeah, you are, you're mad friendly.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
I'm like ready to go, like I can be super friendly
and that's just a gift God'sgiven me.
But it also is been a struggleto learn how to harness it and
not allow people to get hurtbecause of it.
So a lot of times I willconnect with someone and I'm
like, oh, this is so fun.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
Or like from the movie Step Brothers I will
connect with someone and I'mlike, oh, this is so fun.
Or like from the movie Step.
Speaker 1 (07:46):
Brothers.
Did we just become best friends?
They think, did we just becomebest friends?
I may not.
I just think, oh my gosh, Iclicked with you.
This is so cool.
I love that, that's great, I'llsee you next week.
And to me it wasn't any deeper,but to them it felt like, did
we just become best friends?
And then when the relationshipchanges or seasons change or my
schedule changes or anythingchanges, those people tend to
(08:09):
get hurt and it's not in myintention, it's not what I want
to happen.
So learning how to like,harness that and deal with
people's hearts without hurtingthem has been a very, very big
struggle, because my intent isto never hurt them.
I love them hard, whether I seethem once a month or whether I
(08:29):
see them once a year, like Ilove hard.
That's just part of what God'sgiven me, but it has been really
hard to maybe communicate moreclearly or, um, to just define
what, what kind of relationshipI'm going to have with that
person and what that might looklike.
That's been one of my strugglesfor sure.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
It makes sense, and I'm wondering if you're more
intentional of communicatingwith somebody at the beginning
and the start of therelationship, letting them know
your strengths and yoursuperpowers, that, hey, god has
given me an ability to practicehospitality and compassion with
people, so you're going to feel,we're going to feel an instant
(09:09):
connection.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Yeah, Like like we'll feel close right away.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Yeah, but but it's tough too, cause you can't be
like someone like me, just belike, be careful, cause we're
not best friends.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Bro Cause I've said that before.
I'm like hey, I know.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
I'm like yo.
I know you feel like we'reclose, but we're not friends.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Oh my gosh, and that person wanted it so badly.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
I was working with somebody many years ago and he'd
ask me he's like hey bro, likeare we best friends?
And I'm like no bro we're notlike we became friends.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
You didn't say best?
Speaker 2 (09:45):
I don't.
I feel like best friends is forwomen and children.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
Okay, that's actually valid.
It's very much a girl thing.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Like I have really good close friends.
I got one or two like closefriends, but I don't ever think
I said yeah, so my best friend,could you imagine me saying yeah
, so this?
Speaker 1 (10:01):
is my best friend.
Never, never, I could neverimagine you using that verbiage.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
Yo, and I feel like some people are going to give me
some heat right now.
It's like oh my gosh, I can'tbelieve.
Pierre just said that bestfriends are for children and for
women.
I'm just like bro, if you're agrown man, you have best friends
.
That's completely fine.
I just have really closefriends and I have good friends
right.
But people tend to just findyou connect with you and in
their mind they already put youin a box, in a place where you
(10:28):
are in their heart.
And you don't even realize it.
And it's tough being theirleader too at the same time.
Totally, because as a leader,you constantly have to keep
growing, like a team will nevergrow if the leader doesn't grow
grow if the leader doesn't grow.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
And they, and these, these people that have connected
to me in that point, they tendto and I've seen it from a lot
of them get very territorial ofme.
Like they don't want to shareme with no one else.
So, once they've connected withme, they don't want me to move
up and they don't want me tomove to a different, like
friendship connection literallya different, different
conversation.
They don't want me to move to adifferent, like friendship
connection, literally adifferent conversation.
They don't want me to move tothe other conversation.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
They want me to stay right there with them, hold
their hand and be very close tothem only, and it's like it gets
unhealthy, Like you can't but Iwill say and this is where I'm
challenging you because I feellike it's shame on you for
knowing this about your skillset, your superpower, your strength
and going into a relationshiprealizing like, oh my gosh, this
(11:28):
person is obsessed with me andyou got to figure out a point
where you're like catching itright now, letting them know
Again, not being as harsh andaggressive as I would be, like,
hey, let me just put a pin inthis right now.
We're not best friends.
Speaker 1 (11:42):
Right, I'm not saying that Right.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
But letting them know like I'm in your life for this
season and right now I'm walkingdirectly next to you, but
there's going to be season whereGod is going to assign me to do
it with other people.
And I need you to understandthat I'm not leaving you, I'm
not moving off from you.
Like you're growing to yourperson, I'm growing into my
person, and so we have tounderstand like we grow with the
growth.
This is where the seasons are,and I feel like just to
(12:10):
challenge you, like I think yougot to figure out that way to
communicate to someone, forexample, for me.
I'm a visionary, so when I'm ina room with people, I
automatically start sharing withthem what I see for them and
things that I feel like they cando or they should be doing.
Where I'm like man, I see you,man, hearing your words, man, I
feel like you're.
(12:30):
Yo, this is your ability, thisis your skillset, this is your.
So now, sometimes people andI've, and it's happened People
sometimes treat me like sometype of genie in a bottle, right
, what do you see for me?
Yeah, like hey.
I've had people like hey, whatdo you see for me?
They have, hey, what I'm like,what I don't know, I don't know.
I see for you.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
I ain't your God, but they want you to tell them
exactly what it is, so that theycan just do that.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
So I recently had some people walk out and walk
out of my life, and I think someof it was because of that,
because I communicated to themso much of what I saw for them,
what I saw for me, what I sawfor us, where we're going, all
those types of things, and whenit didn't turn out the way they
imagined it or the way Imight've described it, or none
of it worked out the way wedreamed of it.
(13:17):
So it's almost like I let themdown and I'm realizing I need to
do a better job at whenever I'msharing with someone and I'm
using my skill set to castvisions or thoughts or dreams or
ideas to give disclaimers oflike, hey, I'm just sharing you
what I see, but I'm not your God, I'm not the Holy spirit, I
can't make this happen for you.
You got to put in your own workand I'm also a human, I'm a man
(13:40):
.
My perception, my perspectivemight be off today.
That's true.
Like I'm saying, it could justbe something like yo, how, as a
leader, we have to work so hardto catch ourselves, to not allow
people to box us in or trap us,or to see things happening
right in front of us all at thesame exact time and not to catch
(14:01):
it and jump in front of it.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Yeah, you know what I'm saying.
Yeah.
So what is that?
What you would describe as yourbiggest challenge in leadership
?
Nope, what's your biggestchallenge?
I ain't got none, Pierre.
You said I ain't got one, whichI will say disclaimer guys.
Pierre's been in the leadershipgame a lot longer than me.
That salon job was my firsttaste of leadership and then
(14:26):
I've been in church leadershipafter that.
But you've been in a leadershipsince you were like yeah,
teenager 14.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
Yeah, my biggest struggle as a leader is seeing
something for someone and tryingto force them to see it for
themselves.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
That's your biggest.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
That's the biggest one, seeing someone that has so
much potential and they'remaking decisions going down
certain pathways that I'm likeman yo, if you could only see
what.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
I see in you.
You do that with me, or likeyou've had to learn to not do
that even with me.
Speaker 2 (15:02):
But the struggle is like fighting for them to see it
, yeah, and that I feel likewhat happens sometimes is they
feel remorse, they feel bad thatI've worked so hard to get them
to see it.
Sometimes they force themselvesto see and ultimately they
never saw it for themselves,yeah, which causes both of us to
be frustrated with each other.
I would say the second greateststruggle that I have as a
(15:26):
manager or as a leader, as apastor, as a director is, um,
believing people, like when theyshow me that, like their real
selves.
So if they're incapable, ifthey're flaky, if they're always
lagging, if they're alwaysdouble booking, if they're not
punctual and they keep doing ittime after time after time and
(15:49):
they showed me, even whenthey're explicitly saying this
is who I am, yeah, it's me notgiving up on them, which I think
it's a strength and it's aweakness at the same time,
because ultimately it forces meto start holding their weight
for them and it makes us holdthe whole team back.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
And that's been a struggle for me as a leader,
cause I'm like yo.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
This person has proved time after time after
time that they're not reliable,or time after time after time
that they're inconsistent.
Why will I not just let them go?
I had this one guy that was onmy team one time that I had to
sit down twice and eventually Ihad to actually release him from
my team Like, hey, man, you'reoff.
And it's because I sawsomething for him more than he
(16:31):
saw for himself and I workedreally hard for him to see it,
and once in a while he'd be ableto hold it together, keep it
together and it it together andit'd flare up.
But it started trickling allthroughout the team.
This behavior, his behavior,there are certain things that he
was doing that was goingagainst our culture and it was
affecting the rest of the team.
Speaker 1 (16:51):
And.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
I tried to have these conversations with him, I'd
find out he would still gobehind my back and still act up.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
It's still, and I'd find out, he would still go
behind my back and still act up.
It's still, and I address itHours talking to him, hours,
days.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
And I would just always constantly sit him down
once, walk him through it youneed to pray, bro, you need to
see God 30 days on the bench,come back.
He would hold off for a fewmore months.
We'd go through it all overagain.
Eventually, I finally had tosit him down and I realized like
he's been doing something thathe's shown to me from the first
day.
I mean, I'm talking about a twoto three year process and I've
(17:21):
always saw this, and so that'ssomething that like I for me, as
a leader, I really need tocontinue to manage, cause if I
don't, the rest of my team wouldconstantly be frustrated with
me for not seeing something theyalready saw.
If my team sees it before me.
I'm doing something wrong.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
That's good.
What are some things that youdo as a leader that helps you
see things before they come tobe a problem point?
Like you just said, if my teamsees things before I do, I'm
failing as a leader.
So what are some things thatyou do as a leader that helps
you, like, visually see orspiritually even see those
(18:02):
things before they become aproblem?
Speaker 2 (18:04):
Yeah, I like to ask my team members throughout the
week, like I do post checks, andI'll ask them you know, what
was a highlight from this pastweek?
Or I'll ask is did anythingstick out to you this week, or
did you notice anything thisweek that goes against our
culture or that goes againstwhat we're working towards?
(18:25):
Because, at the end of the day,as a leader, as a coach, our
captain, right A manager, Iwon't be able to see everything
that's happening on the field.
I won't be able to seeeverything that's happening on
the court, especially when I'min the game.
So it's my job to find peopleon my team that I trust their
judgment, but also prefacing itof like, hey, I'm not asking you
to just tell me your feelingsand things that you like.
(18:46):
I need you to tell me what'sworking, what's not working.
Right, we were talking aboutthat a couple weeks ago, like
when we met with our.
We met with, like, the youthleaders a couple of weeks ago.
And we told them I'm like, ifyou guys see something that's
not working, share it with us,not saying, just share stuff
with me that you just don't likepreferences.
Speaker 1 (19:05):
I feel like it's not your personality point.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
Yeah, I'm not asking for there is space for that.
Like there, there are timeswhen we're birthing something
like, and I'm asking, like, like, what do you guys want to see
Right?
Like like, what'd you thinkabout this?
Like, did you like it Right?
But ultimately, the feedbackthat I always want to hear is
what's working and what's notworking, and so for me, that
allows me to keep a pulse on ateam.
I don't always get it right,I'm still working on it, but
(19:39):
it's some buffers and for me,like, one of the greatest joys
as a leader is when my teamactually see something before me
and they address it exactly theway that I would address it,
and I'm like yo I have no notes.
Like you, killed this.
You made such a great decision.
It allows me to keep risingabove.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
Yeah, that is super helpful.
Yeah, I think another thing thatI struggle with in leadership
is just it's what you call theline and the lamb like being
soft and understanding, but thenalso like calling them and
(20:20):
challenging them to raise tothat moment and be like, okay,
but can you push through?
Like cause, I'm always more ofan empath, I always want to be a
caring leader that like caresabout what's going on in their
home If someone's sick orsomething happens.
Like finding that balance ofbeing understanding, being
caring, but also like saying,hey, like this is your
(20:42):
commitment, do you think thatyou can stick to your word?
Can you make your word umdependable?
Or does this kind of change howI can depend on you going in
the future?
Like finding that balance is itand I think that's the
nurturing side of me, that's themothering side of me, where I
just want to be caring and kindand it's okay, don't worry,
(21:03):
we'll figure it out.
It's okay, cause that isimportant.
But so is like, hey, does thischange how I count on you going
forward from this, because thismakes me feel like I can't count
on you as much, and so justkind of like finding that
balance of being soft and strongat the same time is a challenge
for me.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
Yeah, it's interesting too, because I feel
like it's the same way when itcomes to parenting.
It's so easy for us to just tryto be our kids' friends, and we
just want to be nice and wantto let them have their way.
We don't want them to be mad atus, we just want them.
But we're actually letting themdown when we're not teaching
them accountability.
It's very true.
We're actually letting themdown if we're not leading them
(21:47):
how to manage their emotions.
We're letting them down whenwe're not teaching them how to
teach people how to treat them.
Our son, right now, he he's I.
I mean some might say he'sgetting bullied at school, but I
don't think he's gettingbullied at school.
I think he's meeting.
He's finally meeting his matchRight At school, cause he's
(22:08):
slick, he's tough, he always gotsomething smart to say he's
arrogant.
He's arrogant.
He's cocky talks trash.
He likes to tease his friends,and now he got some friends in
school that that matched themand they're overriding him and
they're doing it stronger thanhe is and he's starting to go
ahead and that little turtleneckis jumping down and he's scared
and I'm like.
(22:30):
I'm like, oh yo, so we're notgoing to change schools for
reasons like that, we're notgoing to do anything like that,
but we're going to teach you howto teach these kids how to
treat you, and so this is howyou respond back to it and then
also teaching them like you reapwhat you sow.
I know, for me as a leader, oneof the biggest struggles I
(22:50):
guess this is another bigstruggle because I mentioned two
earlier but a big struggle forme as a leader is leading
someone that's literally like me.
The hardest person to earlier,but a big struggle for me as a
leader is leading someone that'sliterally like me.
The hardest person to lead isalways going to be yourself,
that's very true.
Because it's the only person youcan make excuses for.
It's the only person thatyou'll cover up for.
Speaker 1 (23:12):
It's the only person that you'll like bend over
backwards because you know wherethey're at.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Yeah, you know their motives.
It's yourself.
It's the hardest person to lead.
It's yourself no-transcriptyeah.
Think about that.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
I just was realizing that you're saying both leading
yourself and leading someonelike you.
You're saying both options.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
I'm saying both right .
I'm saying both leadingyourself right, talking yourself
out of not hitting snooze, butyou just define it.
You just define it at the sameexact time, or you're defending
that person.
You're defending yourself, likewell, well, why are you talking
in third person?
Like yeah, he had to sleep?
You're talking about yourself.
(24:01):
Yeah, he was tired he had along day.
Yesterday we had a long daytalking about yourself right now
.
That's trash bro and then, allof a sudden, you start leading
someone else that's like you andyou're looking right in the
mirror.
Why are you yawning right?
Speaker 1 (24:13):
now, guys, I tried to hide it and he called me out.
Also, he left the AC on.
I'm freezing.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
I did not leave the AC on.
That's the fan.
Speaker 1 (24:20):
By the time we're done, it's going to be 54
degrees in this house.
Speaker 2 (24:23):
Relax man.
We can't have them watching mesweating right here.
All right, I guess second fall,let me say this early Third of
all fourth of all he's juststarting over.
Yo, if you guys are liking theseconversations, this
conversation specifically, like,tell us what are some things
that you guys are dealing withor struggling with as leaders,
(24:44):
what are some tips and pointersthat you guys may even have for
us as you hear some of the stuffthat we're talking about,
things that we encounter.
You know highs and lows.
One question that I want us toanswer right now is and I'm
going to ask you this, babe,what is one of the greatest joys
that you get in being a leader,Greatest joys?
Speaker 1 (25:06):
Greatest joys of being a leader.
So I served as children'sdirector for a year and a half
and some of the greatest joysduring that season was watching
I mean the fruits of serving inthat department, like in general
watching children learn how toworship at church, growing in
(25:29):
the relationship with Jesus.
Like there were moments where Iwas leading worship for kids
and I had 30 kids like singingso loud, hands raised like truly
, truly worshiping, and thosewere some like incredible
moments of wow, god, thank youfor using me in this moment.
Other greatest joys would bewalking with young women and
(25:54):
seeing them jump over hurdlesthat would keep them paralyzed
before.
So there are times I've talkedwith girls and worked through
things when they're mental itwas the mental game so often it
would just absolutely jeopardizethem and freeze them and they
couldn't make moves.
And when I saw them breakthrough some of those thought
(26:15):
processes that the enemy wasusing to tell them they weren't
worth it, to tell them theyweren't good enough, and and for
all it took for me was to speaktruth to them and to encourage
them to make the word of Godlouder than what the enemy says
to us, um, and watching it likebreak off of them and it didn't
bother them anymore.
Like that is.
The greatest joy for me is tojust see them sore and like
(26:39):
really break through thosechallenges, and it's so humbling
to to be like wow, god, thankyou for using me, uh, in that
person's life, thank you forgiving me the opportunity to
speak into them.
Like that's a humbling moment,it's huge.
And so those have been some oflike the greatest joys of like,
yeah, girl, you got this.
Like you don't, you don't needme to be in your cheerleading
(27:00):
corner anymore.
There are moments where youneeded me to be a cheerleader in
your squad and I would cheeryou on, but once you get, once
you get over that hurdle, likewatching them just kind of soars
, it's so rewarding I'm just,it's overwhelming.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
Yeah, yeah, do you what about?
Speaker 1 (27:14):
for you.
What Like your greatest joys?
Speaker 2 (27:18):
My greatest joy is sitting right here next to you.
Ooh, that was a good one, yeah,happy Valentine's day.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
Happy Valentine's day .
It's early, I know I'm joking.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Um, that was your gift, was a shout out on let's
Dig the podcast.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
No'm playing.
I've been looking at some stuff, oh I see it's on your mind.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
I'm excited.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
I have all I've been thinking about is our son's
birthday is that weekend, soyeah, no, it's good, like, like
you take cash, right, I do cashup.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
Um, um, no, I mean, it's, it's, it's been like
really cool.
I think, um, this is not just ajoy, but I really want to just
encourage us and people that areeven listening right now, um,
to really obsess over thepurpose of why you're a leader.
Um, a leader is not a task.
(28:07):
A leader is not a title, right?
A leader is an assignment.
You have an opportunity to leadpeople through the mission.
My job as a leader, for me, whenI step into the room, it's not
just to get things done.
We will get things done.
We will check things off thelist, like we will accomplish
(28:29):
the things that we came to dothat day, but ultimately, like
my goal is to help people findtheir purpose in God.
My goal is to help someonefulfill a mission, not just a
checklist off of positions,because I think the tasks, the
things that we do, that we'llnever find fulfillment in that
(28:49):
unless we know why we are doingit.
You know, I've watched you inthe last year step into
leadership roles.
There are times where youdidn't even know what you were
doing or why you were there, andeven today we had a
conversation at breakfast.
I'm like your purpose is not tojust fulfill a policy or
procedure or protocols, right,as people are literally looking
(29:09):
to you to walk alongside them,and it's not even necessarily to
even have answers.
Speaker 1 (29:14):
Yeah, Because I don't always have them.
Speaker 2 (29:16):
It's not to have answers, but it's to walk with
them with a sound mind.
It's to point them to theanswer.
And that's one of the greatestcallings of being a leader.
It's challenging because, likeI said earlier, the hardest
person to lead is always goingto be yourself.
Like everybody gets better whenthe leader gets better.
You know what I mean, and sothat's a hard challenge to take
on personally, because there'ssome days you don't want to get
(29:37):
better, or there's some days youdon't want to put in the work
to get better.
You do want to get better, butit's the work.
It's like all right, you'regoing to have to rebook.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
You're going to have to be disciplined.
Speaker 2 (29:45):
You're going to have to get on the podcast.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
You're going to have to be the first one to say I'm
sorry.
You're going to have to be thefirst one to accept
responsibility.
Everything rises and falls onleadership.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
Yeah, and it's not necessarily even just saying the
word sorry is what you said,it's just owning the failure.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
Accepting the responsibility.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
Accepting it, being responsible and owning the
mistakes.
So if something didn't work outright, if something didn't go
right, as a leader it's one ofthe hardest things to do, cause
you put everything in it to makeit go right.
Speaker 1 (30:38):
And it could still go wrong.
And you have to say like, andit's.
It's the humility thing too, oflike, because once you get, if
you're in a role and pride isall you're feeling, like, the
Lord will humble you Like.
Pride comes before a fall.
That's Bible.
So, knowing that, as you'resitting in a role of leadership,
as long as you stay in humilityand say hey, that was my bad.
(31:02):
I truly tried my best, but Ican see how it didn't come how I
wanted it to.
This wasn't the outcome I waslooking for or that wasn't what
I wanted you to hear.
I'm sorry that that's what youheard in my words.
That wasn't my intention.
Like all those things, um it itjust it makes you an incredible
leader.
I remember one time talking to aparent from our church and I
(31:24):
was talking about um, there wasa conflict and I said did you,
did you apologize to thatteenager.
I said did you, did youapologize to that teenager?
And the mom was very upset atthe, at the very idea of
apologizing.
But I remember what it did tous in our relationship with our
(31:44):
son.
When we started to apologizeand say I'm sorry, I got really
upset and I shouldn't have donethat, or I'm sorry that that
happened.
Um, I did that wrong and Icould have done better.
Even yesterday I took him tothe dentist.
I he's super afraid of thedentist and I downplayed the
appointment.
I thought it was going to be avery simple appointment and
ended up being painful.
And after the appointment,after we're in the car and no
(32:07):
one is around, I looked at himand I was like hey, I want you
to know that is not what Ithought was going to happen
today.
I did not lie to you.
I told you what I thought wasgoing to happen and I'm sorry
that that hurt today at theappointment.
Are you okay?
Like I want him to trust me, Iwant him to think I didn't want
him to think that I was justdownplaying it the whole time.
And so all those things asleaders of like the humility,
(32:30):
the humbleness, like it has tobe the main character that you
carry, and and knowing withinthe same hand, humility and like
what God's placed inside of you, what he's called you to do,
those things go to and to.
You will be an incredibleleader.
Yeah, man.
Speaker 2 (32:47):
Yeah, that's it.
That's all, folks.
That's all we got for you guystoday.
Man, we've been having theseconversations in our home every
single day.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
It's all the time y'all.
I wish y'all would know.
Like he literally said, todaywas our breakfast and I was like
this was part of our breakfastconversation.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Yeah, we just talked about the responsibilities that
we carry as a leader and areasthat we need to grow in, areas
that we need to step it up inholding each other accountable,
checking each other.
Even now, there are things thatwe're listening to, things that
we're watching podcasts, justlike this conversations.
I would encourage everyone thatstrives to be a better leader
(33:23):
because we're all leadingsomebody.
Even if you're not leadingothers, you're still leading
yourself and everyone who hasthe desire to be a better leader
, like, make the consciousdecisions to seek God and God's
wisdom and his guidance.
Start getting into the properbooks, start finding the right
podcast, start finding the rightpeople, but, more importantly,
(33:44):
like, stop lying to yourself,you know, go easy on yourself.
At the same time, we talk aboutthis right Having relationships
with ourselves.
Leading ourselves is one of themost challenging things that
you could do.
But when you have God in yourlife, when you have the Holy
Spirit leading you, holy Spiritopens up your heart so that you
can see the truth, you can seethe depth, and then that allows
you to even find cleansing inyour soul.
(34:05):
Throughout those situations andfor me as a leader, that helps
me when I'm able to sit down andrealize today I made a comment
at the house that I said man,like you know, like I need to
start doing this, this.
I said I said a comment and Isaid you know what I take that
back.
I am starting.
Remember I said that, liketoday, like I need to start
stepping into that, I need tostart stepping into that
(34:25):
situation.
That's what I said.
And I said you know what, Itake that back, I'm stepping
into that situation.
When we say I need to start,it's giving us, like, time to
milk it.
It's given us we're stalling,we're making excuses for like
why we haven't done it yet, andwe we start telling ourselves,
like we're going to do it, Ihaven't started yet.
Now tell yourself you're goingto start it and find someone to
hold you accountable.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
So that's all I really got to say All right, I'm
going to end with these twoscriptures that I had.
One is man, we're like bothlike clearing our throats.
Sorry guys, it's a great day ofrecording.
Let's take the podcast.
Speaker 2 (34:58):
Right, let's record.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
Okay, these two scriptures I want to leave you
with.
The first one is James 1.5.
If you need wisdom, ask ourgenerous God and he will give it
to you.
He will not rebuke you forasking.
And so if you're in aleadership role, or maybe you're
even under a leader that'sreally challenging you and maybe
(35:20):
frustrating you, like askingthe Lord for wisdom of how to
approach the situation, askingthe Lord for wisdom of how do
you lead better?
Um, they literally says he willgive it to you.
So that's James one five, and Iwant to just encourage that.
And then, lastly, I want to endwith this one it's a Galatians
six nine.
So let's not get tired of doingwhat is good at just the right
(35:42):
time.
We'll reap a harvest ofblessing If we don't give up.
Leadership is hard.
Leadership literally pulls outthe strengths and weaknesses of
yourself and the gifts thatGod's given you, and it makes
you see yourself in a differentway.
And we have to keep going.
We have to keep doing the hardwork, the discipline of what
Pierre said, of listening topodcasts, reading the right
(36:03):
books, finding the right mentors, doing the hard work to be a
leader that can bring peoplecloser to God and point them to
him, I will not be a leader.
I pray that I'll never be aleader that pushes people from
God, but that I'm only a leaderthat leads people closer to a
walk with Jesus, and so I justwant to encourage you all with
(36:23):
that scripture Don't grow wearyin well-doing.
Do the good work.
You will reap a harvest, andmost of the time, that harvest
will be when you get in heavenand there are crowns in your or
jewels in your crown, and thatyou led people to be closer to
Jesus.
So I that's it.
I'm done.
That was my two scriptures.
I wouldn't encourage y'all.
We love y'all.
Thank you for joining thisconversation.
(36:44):
Don't forget to subscribe.
Send this to someone you loveand we'll see y.
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