April 9, 2025 • 32 mins
What if the secret to better skin is timing, not more products? In this episode of Listen to Your Skin, Dr. Jen reveals how syncing your routine with your skin’s natural rhythm can transform your results.
Learn why vitamin C belongs in the morning, retinoids at night, and why even oily skin needs moisturizer. She also breaks down common myths, the power of product delivery systems, and how less really can be more.
Plus, get the inside scoop on Moon and Skin’s multitasking moisturizer that does it all.
Ready to simplify your routine and get real results? Tune in now!
• ABOUT THE GUEST •
Meet Melissa June, survivor, speaker, and founder of Live Anyway, a nonprofit dedicated to helping women reclaim their power after life-altering challenges. With unfiltered honesty and an unstoppable spirit, she creates transformative spaces through storytelling, retreats, and deep conversations.
Melissa’s mission is simple: to inspire women to heal, rise, and rewrite their stories on their own terms.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Listen to your Skin by Moon and Skin, the
podcast where science meetsnature to celebrate the story of
your skin.
Your skin is a living canvas,ever-evolving, deeply personal
and uniquely yours.
Each week, we'll dive into thescience of healthy skin, share
empowering stories and uncovertransformative self-care rituals
.
We're here to help you embraceevery phase of your journey with
(00:22):
confidence and care.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
How often do I really need to wash my face?
Speaker 1 (00:26):
So I really think that everyone needs to wash
their face twice a day becauseat night obviously we want to
get off our makeup and we wantto get off the toxins and the
dirt and the debris from the day.
But a lot of people don't thinkthey need to clean in the
morning also.
But we do need to cleanse witha gentle cleanser in the morning
because our skin is our biggestdetox organ.
(00:48):
So at night when we're sleeping, we're basically extruding
toxins and we're extruding dirtand debris out of our pores.
So we want to get that off soour daily skincare can penetrate
.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
How about vitamin C?
I hear a lot about people youknow saying that I need to have
vitamin C.
Is that true?
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely so.
Vitamin C is just a core thingthat pretty much everyone needs
in their skincare regimen andyou want to make sure you're
applying it to work with yourcircadian clock, so during the
daytime, as soon as our eyes andour skin sees the light, we are
in a protective mode.
So our body basically isprotecting us from any
(01:30):
environmental toxins orallergens, and vitamin C will
help with some of the freeradicals that we're exposed to
that get through our sunscreen,even to prevent DNA breakdown,
and it helps support the healthystructure of our collagen in
the skin.
So I want people to be applyingvitamin C every morning and you
(01:50):
apply it face, neck, chest andthe back of your hands.
I usually have people sweep theback of their hands with it
after cleansing first step inthe morning and then let it dry
completely, then apply yourmoisturizer, then your sunscreen
.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
So I've bought vitamin C before and then let it
dry completely, then apply yourmoisturizer, then your
sunscreen.
So I've bought vitamin C beforeand then, after like a little
bit, it turned like brown.
Is that normal, or can Iprevent that?
Speaker 1 (02:11):
Yeah, that's such a good point.
I hear that so often, so I'm soglad you brought that up,
because typically all vitamin Csare not created equal.
So the active form of vitamin Cis L-ascorbic acid.
So the active form of vitamin Cis L-ascorbic acid and the way
it works it's very unstablebecause it basically protects
(02:32):
you from the free radicals.
So L-ascorbic acid is veryunstable.
It is broken down by light, byheat and by oxygen.
So the longer it sits on yourcounter, the more it's likely to
turn from the clear color whenit's active to the brown color
and become inactive.
So scientists have created otherforms of vitamin C that are
(02:53):
more active.
There's THD ascorbate andthere's sodium ascorbyl
phosphate.
I preferentially like thesodium ascorbyl phosphate form
of vitamin C because it convertsto L-ascorbic acid in the body,
making it effective by helpingprotect you from the free
radical damage, and it also isgreat for anyone who's
(03:14):
predisposed to getting acne fromvitamin C, which I hear about a
lot, or sensitive skin.
So I love looking for a sodiumascorbyl phosphate form of
vitamin C.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
How about retin-A or retinol?
What is the difference betweenthe two and when might I use
that?
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Yeah, so retinoids as opposed to vitamin C.
You want to use those at night.
So, as I mentioned with vitaminC, when we wake up in the
morning and our eyes seesunlight and our skin also has
photoreceptors which aresensitive to light, we turn into
a protective mode.
And the opposite is true atnight.
So at night, when we don't haveany light which is why it's
(03:55):
important to sleep in a darkroom the melatonin rises and
we're in a regenerative phase.
So there's such a thing asbeauty sleep.
So, as our body is renewing andregenerating, our liver ticks up
and our skin cells want torenew and regenerate, and
vitamin A products, whetherthey're in the form of retinol
or retinoic acid, tretinoin,which retinol converts into in
(04:20):
the skin, they help with thatrenewal process.
So tretinoin is a prescriptionthat can be prescribed and it's
the active form of vitamin A inthe skin.
It's also tends to be a littlebit harsh on the skin and cause
a little bit of peeling andredness.
So I like people to start lowand go slow and start with a
(04:42):
retinol and gradually increaseto every night, and if they
could tolerate every night andthey're still wanting more
effects, then they can go to aprescription strength.
But honestly I find that ifsomeone is able to tolerate
retinol every single night asyour first step after cleansing,
before a moisturizer, they endup getting really good results
(05:02):
in improvement of fine lines,wrinkles, pigmentation,
reduction of the clogged poresand acne after about three to
six months.
So that's what I have people do.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Wow, I was just going to ask you about the timing.
So how long does it take toreally start to see results?
Speaker 1 (05:20):
Yeah.
So when we're talking aboutincreasing collagen in the skin,
we need to give it three months, because we're sending signals
to rev up the fibroblasts, whichare the cells that produce
collagen in the dermis, and ittakes about three months
optimally six months to seeresults.
So there are studies showingthat if you use a lower-strength
retinol compared to ahigher-strength retinol, you get
(05:43):
to the same endpoint at sixmonths.
You just get there a little bitquicker to a higher strength
retinol.
You get to the same endpoint atsix months.
You just get there a little bitquicker with a higher strength.
But unfortunately a lot ofpeople have irritation.
So that's where we want to lookat the formula.
What is the formulation?
And there's some really cooltechnology.
There's liposomal technologythat we now have, where the
retinol is encapsulated by aphospholipid so it can penetrate
(06:05):
through the epidermis, into thedeep layers of the epidermis
and even the dermis to stimulatethe fibroblasts without causing
all of that peeling and rednessand roughness that nobody likes
, Because we recommend retinoidsall the time.
But what happens is people giveup after a couple weeks because
they're red and they're raw.
So it always goes back to theformulations.
Things are not created equal.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Back to the vitamin C a little bit.
You know back when I boughtvitamin C before I broke out
really bad.
Is that normal?
Speaker 1 (06:33):
Yeah, it's not normal , but really, what is normal,
right?
No one's normal.
We're all our own person.
So, just because your bestfriend tolerates it and you
don't, you need to listen toyour skin, right?
So we all need to listen and beattuned to our skin, and what
works for your best friend mightnot work for you, just like
what works for you might notwork for me, and vice versa.
(06:54):
So, for anyone who hassensitivities or anyone who is
prone to getting acne, I wantthem to look at the formulation
of their vitamin C and look forthe form of vitamin C in being
sodium ascorbyl phosphate.
I know it's a long word, it'sSAP, but you're going to want to
avoid the forms that sayL-ascorbic acid and look for
(07:16):
sodium ascorbyl phosphatebecause that's going to be less
inflammatory, less likely tocause acne.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
So I'm perimenopausal , so my skin is obviously
changing and I feel like myhormones are changing.
Do you have any recommendationsfor how you know I would work
with all of these things in my,in my system?
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Yeah, for sure For sure, you know, and the word
perimenopause is a word weweren't using many years ago.
It's, and it's kind ofeverywhere now.
And perimenopause is reallyhard to define.
It's just the time of your life, which can be 10 to 15 years,
from 35 to 50, or even 40 to 55,until you reach menopause.
Menopause has a bizarredefinition it's basically going
(07:57):
a full year without having aperiod, but in the meantime,
during those years, our hormonesare up and down and up and down
and fluctuating more than theynormally would be during a
normal menstrual cycle.
So it's really important tolisten to your skin and know
when you're more predisposed toacne, when you're more oily, and
modify things Absolutely.
(08:17):
Everyone needs a vitamin C andeveryone needs a retinol.
So vitamin C in the morning,retinol at night.
If you tend to be more dry andmore prone to irritation, I
would make sure you have moremoisturizer on your skin,
particularly at night, and I'msuch a minimalist I want to look
for moisturizers that havemultiple functions.
(08:39):
So why do I really need an eyecream and then face moisturizer,
then a neck moisturizer, when Ican find one moisturizer that
works for all of the areas?
Take the leftover on my handsand sweep the back of my hands
every night.
So all of those areas are beingcorrected, equally aging
gracefully together, right?
So that's what I look for.
And then if someone isirritated with retinol, like
(09:03):
just say, before you wereperimenopausal, you were
tolerating your retinol everysingle night with no problem,
and now you're noticing that youmight have a little bit more of
a barrier, dysfunction anddisruption and more irritation.
I don't want you to give up onit.
Maybe go every other night ordo the sandwich technique, where
(09:24):
you apply moisturizer, let itsoak in, quench your skin, apply
your retinol as you always have.
It will go where it needs to goon the receptors, let it dry
and then put another layer ofmoisturizer on, and I find that
that can really benefit a lot ofpeople rather than just giving
up on it Can.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
I use the same moisturizer in the morning that
I do at night.
People rather than just givingup on it, can I?
Speaker 1 (09:45):
use the same moisturizer in the morning that
I do at night?
Yeah, it depends on your skintype.
So ideally you can.
So I tend to be pretty oily, soI don't use a moisturizer in
the morning.
I use sunscreen in the morningafter my vitamin C, and then, if
I'm dealing with pigmentation,I'll put a pigment corrector on
after vitamin C, beforesunscreen.
We always layer thinnest tothickest, so when you're
applying products, you applyyour thinnest serum and then you
(10:10):
go thicker as you apply, withyour sunscreen being the last
step before your makeup.
And most people I find in thewinter absolutely need to have a
moisturizer twice a day becausewe're reaching homeostasis with
our environment all of the time.
So the air is drier and we'regoing to be drier because we are
one with we are one with ourenvironment, right.
(10:32):
So I do recommend a moisturizer, the same one, twice a day.
If you tend to be more dry,I'll have you boost your
moisturizer at night.
Either go for a thickermoisturizer or have that be the
only time of day you use yourmoisturizer.
Or take some mineral water fromLa Roche-Posay makes a nice
(10:53):
mineral water spray and thesehave prebiotics and probiotics
in them and spray your face andthen take a liberal amount of
moisturizer and apply it and itsoaks in and pushes the moisture
in your skin and that's a wayto boost it, rather than putting
something oily that could breakyou out at night.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
Do I use the same cleanser in the morning and at
night?
I do.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
Yeah, I do the same cleanser morning and at night.
Like as I mentioned, I'm aminimalist, so I think why have
so many products when you canhave one product do a lot of
things?
So I'll use the samemoisturizer and recommend that
for most of my patients the sameone in the morning and night.
If they do wear a lot of makeup, then I'll have them do a
double cleanse with an oil-basedcleanser first and then their
(11:41):
more medical grade,results-driven moisturizer that
might have some activebotanicals in there.
Then I'll have them use thatafterwards.
Or I'll have them use micellarwater first and then use their
cleanser afterwards and thecleansers I recommend.
I like to be on the skin for twofull minutes, so I'll have them
apply it and massage theirlymphatics and rub the cleanser
(12:05):
in and let it penetrate andnourish the skin for a full two
minutes.
And we really want to use agood cleanser that removes
makeup, removes impurities,removes dirt anything that's
extruded from the pores at nightor during the day and oils, but
does not strip the skin.
So we don't want a cleanserwhere your skin feels tight or
raw or red or burning.
(12:26):
It should never feel that wayafterwards.
It's too strong.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
I have also younger daughters.
How old should you be when youstart adopting vitamin C and
retinol?
Speaker 1 (12:37):
Yeah, that's a great question.
I think 2024 was a year ofoveruse of products and 2025 is
going to be more minimalism, andit's for a good reason.
You know there's just we don'tneed to live in excess for any
reasons, and we really saw thatwith the teens.
We saw them doing so many stepsand I think it actually
(12:57):
disrupts the skin barrier, itdisrupts the skin microbiome and
it's not a good idea.
So when you're in your teens, agood cleanser, a good
moisturizer and a good sunscreenis really all that is
recommended.
As someone goes into their 20s,that's when I start having them
use a vitamin C as an amazingpreventative measure.
Absolutely 30s, 40s, 50s, andthen retinol same thing.
(13:21):
Mid-20s is a great time, butteenagers not so much.
It's a little bit of a waste ofyour money.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
And how about if you start breaking out?
Is there a solution for that?
Speaker 1 (13:30):
Yeah.
So you know retinol andtretinoin we use for acne, so it
works for acne because it helpsturn over the skin cells.
So as we get older our skingets lazy, our stem cells get
tired and they don't turn overas quickly.
So a lot of times people thinkthey have dry skin, but what it
is is the skin is just notrefreshing and turning over as
(13:52):
quickly.
So there's a couple ways, acouple things we can do with
that.
We can add exfoliants to helpexfoliate off the top dead skin
cell layer and when youexfoliate the skin it sends
signals down to the stem cellsto say, hey, rev, rev up, make
some more fresh skin.
So we're kind of sending thosesignals that aren't happening.
(14:13):
We can also use stem cells andI love products that have
vitamin C with stem cells inthem, because that will help
send those signals to rev upfresh stem cells while also
protecting the skin from freeradicals.
So less products containingmore technology is always what
we're looking for.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
You can put stem cells in your products From
plants.
Yes, Wow.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
How does that work?
Yeah, it works by signaling thehuman skin, and we used to
think that plants didn't signalhuman stem cells, and they
actually do.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
Wow, that's incredible.
Do you treat body acne the sameway as you would treat face
acne?
Yeah, that's a great question.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
So I always look for the cause.
So what is the cause of thebody acne?
And is it folliculitisirritation of the hair follicle
or is it actually acne Typicallyon the body?
What I usually see is friction,occlusion.
So just say someone's anathlete and they're wearing
non-breathable clothing andthere's a lot of friction to a
(15:15):
particular area.
I'll see acne in those areaslike the back or the butt.
But in your back, knee right,and the other reason I see acne
on the back when it's notsomeone who just has regular
teenage acne is from hairconditioner.
I'll see certain types of hairproducts cause acne around the
hairline and around the lowerback I mean the upper back when
(15:35):
they are rinsing their hair.
So you have to ask people whattheir lifestyle is like.
Are they going to hot yoga andsweating and then wearing their
clothes for an hour afterwards,or are they going home and
showering off?
Because if we sweat a lot andwe rub and then we occlude or we
block our sweat glands, we'regoing to get acne in those areas
(15:56):
.
So before I just start throwingmedicine at someone, I want to
find out what are theirbehaviors that might be
contributing to forming the acne.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
It's a little overwhelming thinking about all
the different ingredients andthe products.
How do I really know that I'mgetting a good vitamin C?
Speaker 1 (16:11):
Yeah, I know, I know, and over the years I've seen so
many people bring in bucketsand bags of stuff to me and they
weren't being effective at alland they wasted so much money.
So this is how I break it downWith vitamin C, what you want to
look for is you want to lookfor a formulation that contains
sodium, ascorbyl phosphate,especially if you're prone to
acne or sensitive skin.
(16:32):
You want, if you can find,something that has plant stem
cells.
You're going to get a twofer.
So you're going to have oneproduct in one step that
stimulates stem cells and alsohelps protect you from free
radical damage, and then find aproduct that has some hydrating
capabilities, like hyaluronicacid in it, especially
plant-derived botanicalhyaluronic acid is a very
(16:52):
elegant formulation.
And then what also makes thevitamin C stable and more potent
is when it has ferulic acid andvitamin E added to it.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
So those are the things you want to look for With
all of the ingredients it's alittle hard to keep track of.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
How do I know that I'm getting the right retinol
Right?
Yeah, so I would always startwith a retinol as opposed to a
tretinoin or a prescriptionstrength vitamin A product.
And with retinol there's somegreat technology out there, so I
like people to look for aretinol that's a liposomal
retinol, so basically theretinol, the active molecule, is
encapsulated in phospholipidsso it's able to penetrate
(17:32):
through the epidermis and get tothe deeper layers of the
epidermis to rev up the stemcells and also into the
fibroblasts to stimulatecollagen from forming without
causing irritation to the toplayer of the skin.
The other thing with retinol isI find that people the top
layer of the skin.
The other thing with retinol isI find that people apply too
much to the skin.
So a small amount the size of apea or a pearl, dot the
(17:54):
forehead, each cheek, the chinand the chest and blend it in,
avoiding the creases around theeyes, the nose, the corners of
the mouth and the crease in theneck, and doing that three times
a week After two weeks ifyou're not having irritation or
peeling or redness, which youreally shouldn't see from
liposomal retinol, because it'sencapsulated and it's slowly
(18:16):
delivered over time and it'ssuper stable.
Just start slow, start low, goslow and after two weeks go to
four times a week, another weekfive times a week until you're
able to tolerate it every night.
We're in this for the long gameand you really see the best
results with retinol at sixmonths.
So you want to stick with it.
So liposomal retinol is the onethat I want.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
Yep Liposomal is a special technology where the
retinol is encapsulated and itgets delivered to where it needs
to be in the skin, and it'ssuper stable.
So you know what you're getting.
You're getting it where itneeds to go.
So, for the first time ever, Ifound a moisturizer that has an
exfoliator in it.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
What is that about?
Yeah, that's such a greatquestion.
So this is, I think, brillianttechnology, because a lot of
times people are so dry andthey're putting moisturizer,
moisturizer, moisturizer ontheir.
It's just not penetratingbecause as we get older, the top
layer of our skin just likekind of sticks around and that's
what makes us look dull and dry.
So by having very low levels ofalpha hydroxy, beta hydroxy
(19:21):
acid, like glycolic acid,salicylic acid, it will loosen
up those corneocytes, the toplayer of the skin that's dead,
so that you can actually getinfusion of the moisturizer, of
the hyaluronic acid, of all ofthe hydrating properties of a
product, as well as anybotanical extracts like centella
(19:42):
asiatica or mushroom extractthat can be lightening and
brightening things like that.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
I was going to bring it back to the oily skin part,
because you said this is goodfor oily skin too, right?
So I have oily skin and I don'talways use like a moisturizer.
Is this something that I canuse also as a moisturizer that
won't make me extra?
Speaker 1 (20:02):
oily.
Yeah, that's one of the biggestmyths is people who have oily
skin think they don't needmoisturizer and, at the very
least, okay.
Just say you run a little highcortisol during the day, like I
do, and you tend to get a littlebit greasy.
You may not necessarily need amoisturizer during the day, but
at night, everyone, everyone,everyone needs a moisturizer
because we lose a lot of waterat night or we have increased
(20:23):
trans epidermal water loss lossand we lose a lot of moisture
from our skin at night and yourskin can ironically compensate
by making more oil if you don'thydrate at night.
So absolutely you want to lookfor a moisturizer containing
hyaluronic acid that'slightweight and non-comedogenic
if you have oily skin, somethingthat's light and hydrating,
(20:43):
without being necessarily creamor oil-based did you say that
there's mushrooms in thismoisturizer?
So I love nature.
I think all the best secrets inthe world are from nature and
as she lets us discover them.
Slowly, over time we will findthe properties and reishi
mushroom extract can belightening and even out uneven
(21:05):
skin tone.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
Where does the name moon and skin come from?
Speaker 1 (21:17):
Yeah, so moon and skin is basically encouraging
all of us to work with theharmony and cycles of nature
around us and within our body.
So we have a circadian cycle.
Morning and night, our bodiesin different metabolic processes
, so when we hit the light inthe morning we have our
circadian clock turn on andwe're in a different mode than
at night when we're renewing.
And then, as women, we have ourinfradian cycle, which is our
(21:38):
monthly cycle, where ourhormones evolve and they change
every single day.
Unlike a man, that's 24 hoursand we want to work with that
cycle as well.
And then we have the seasons andwith every season our body is
reaching homeostasis with thoseseasons.
So we also want to learn towork with the rhythms of the
seasons.
(21:58):
And then we have the seasons ofour life.
So the seasons of our life,because what we need when we're
teen is different from our 30sand 50s.
So the skincare line willevolve with the seasons of our
life, because what we need whenwe're teen is different from our
30s and 50s.
So the skincare line willevolve with the seasons of our
life and the seasons of where welive.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
So I can use the same moisturizer in the morning and
at night.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Yes, you can, and you can also use it around your
eyes and your neck, your chest,and I always, always, always,
with every product, I recommendsweeping the back of your hands.
We forget this and we want thisto all age together, right, so?
Speaker 2 (22:28):
yeah, and this is a moisturizer that I, at 40, can
use and my daughter at 20.
Yes, you, can wow.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Yeah, I mean, let's be honest.
Sometimes at 40 you need moreof a booster.
So at 20 she may only need itat night and you may need it
twice a day.
And then, if you want to boostit more, you can spray your face
with some prebiotic, probioticmineral water like La
Roche-Posay or Vichy, and thentake a little bit more than she
would and soak it in at night.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
Would she use retinol as well at 20?
Speaker 1 (22:57):
years old, it really depends.
So I'm a minimalist, I don'tlike to put a lot on people's
faces.
So if somebody struggles withacne or blackheads in their 20s,
we always use retinoids.
In the 20s we use it in theform of Retin-A or Tretinoin as
a prescription strength whichcan be really harsh and
stripping on the skin.
So retinol absolutely recommend.
(23:19):
I don't recommend it duringpregnancy or breastfeeding
because it does affect cellturnover, so theoretically it
can affect cell turnover in ababy, so it's not recommended
during those times.
But it's a very safe productthat's been around since the
seventies and it's proven tohelp with fine lines and
wrinkles, acne plug, pores,lifting off pigmentation.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
So, dr J, you helped create this formulation of
moisturizer.
I did.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Yeah.
So I really wanted tointentionally create a
moisturizer that was good forall skin types, and one of the
things that I think is oftenoverlooked with a moisturizer is
it might be a good qualitymoisturizer, yet it's not
penetrating through the skin.
So we needed to add a littlebit of salicylic acid and
glycolic acid at a very lowlevel nothing that's going to
(24:03):
feel like a chemical peel orpeel your skin at a low level to
loosen up the dead skin cells.
So once the dead skin cells areloosened up and they're no
longer insulating your skin fromactually having penetration of
the moisturizer, this hydratingmoisturizer that's not
comedogenic, not acne-forming,can penetrate, so it's a really
cool product.
(24:23):
It has a lot of antioxidantslike centella asiatica,
dandelion root, schisandra,green tea in it, and it also has
a reishi mushroom extractthat's really good for evening
out skin tone.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
So tell me how did this partnership happen and what
brought you to this point.
Speaker 1 (24:43):
Yeah, so I'm at a point in my life where I only
work with excellent people thathave good intentions on making
the world a better place, andI've helped create dozens of
skincare lines before, and thatwasn't always the case.
A lot of times, people justwanted to make money, because
the skincare industry is areally big industry it's a
(25:03):
multi-billion dollar industryand I want to only align with
people who want to educatepeople to become empowered to
take care of their health, andthat's where I found my current
people my family.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
There's so many unique things about this
moisturizer you know for, like,we talked about it having
exfoliators in it and how can itlike?
How can one moisturizer be madefor multiple people and why is
that important?
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Yeah, it's really important because you you don't
want to have a ton of things onyour counter, you know, and you
want to minimize things.
Also, I wanted something thatpeople can.
You have the same moisturizeras your daughter.
She might use it once a day,only at night, while you'll need
(25:56):
to use it twice a day becauseyou have more mature skin or you
need to use more, or someonewho has combination skin.
They can avoid application tothe center of their face and use
it on the periphery of theirface and their neck.
So it has a lot of properties.
That has so many antioxidantsthat are just even more
beneficial than only themoisturizing and the hydration
(26:17):
abilities.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
So you talked about moon and skin being special
partners that really likecarried your same values.
What does make moon and skinspecial?
Speaker 1 (26:25):
Yeah for me, I could speak for myself.
For me, it's the intentionalitybehind everything.
So I often ask myself,especially seeing tens of
(26:51):
thousands of people's peopleover the years, when they come
in and they share with mesomething that they're
vulnerable about educating andempowering people so that they
not only understand the skincare and why it's important to
nourish your skin from theoutside in, but also how to take
control over your own life, sothat you have the power to make
(27:13):
the decisions that will bringyou in a healthier direction for
yourself and your family, everysingle day.
So it's an educational platformthat also offers beautiful
skincare from nature, workingwith the harmony and rhythm of
nature.
Speaker 2 (27:30):
I love it so much.
How good does it feel to seelike the product in real life,
actually like in my hand,sitting with you right now?
Speaker 1 (27:39):
It's really exciting, because I do not have the
creative capacity to create thepackaging and all the bottling,
and I'm really impressed withall of it.
While I can recommendformulations and active
ingredients that arescience-backed, I really do need
a team of chemists to puttogether these formulations in a
(28:00):
way that's cosmetically elegant, because while the ingredients
are active and there's sciencebehind them, if they're not
formulated well, they're notgoing to feel good on your skin.
So I want to make sure there'sno pilling and everything layers
well together and people wantto use it and it's cosmetically
elegant.
Speaker 2 (28:15):
You talked about the importance of having chemists
working with chemists andthere's no pilling and
everything layers well togetherand people want to use it and
it's cosmetically elegant.
You talked about the importanceof having chemists working with
chemists and, you know, workingwith the natural earth on
products, and there seems to bethis dichotomy between working
with natural products andworking with, you know, created
products or like manufacturedproducts, and I love the fact
that this sort of seems to blendthe best of all the worlds
(28:37):
right.
So can you tell me about thatprocess and how did you bring
that to life?
Speaker 1 (28:41):
Yeah.
So I mean people will say, oh,you can eat this product.
Well, that's ridiculous,because if you can eat something
, it's going to have a shelflife of two or three or four
days, so it's just not feasible.
You do have to addpreservatives.
We have great options for cleanpreservatives.
We have great options forcombining things together.
I am not an expert onchemically putting these
(29:05):
together, but I'm certainlylearning by working with some
brilliant scientists on whatthey do to put things together,
and every once in a while, I'llkeep wanting to add other
antioxidants and other thingsI'm excited about.
Like.
Centella Asiatica is also knownas Go-To-Cola.
It's in all of our products andit's really going to be the
hottest ingredient in 2025because there's some science
(29:25):
behind it showing that it helpsincrease the collagen and the
thickness of the dermis which welose over time.
So, starting in our mid-20s, welose about 1% of our collagen
every year and then aroundmenopause it dramatically drops
and within five years aftermenopause, we lose 30% of our
collagen.
So anything we could do toreplenish that is huge and
(29:47):
that's coming from nature.
There's also studies showingcentella asiatica helping for
stretch marks and replenishingthe elastic tissue.
So there's so many beautifulthings about products that can
be derived from nature.
Now, we don't want to stripnature, we want to work with
nature, and this is what I'm allabout.
But going back to the cosmeticchemist, you know I'll keep
(30:08):
saying how about we add this andthis and this, and it gets to a
point where they say that'senough, we can't add anymore, so
any more.
So you know, it's, it's aconstant, it's a constant
collaboration.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
Well, you guys have done a beautiful job, because I
am just seeing a lot of newamazing things in here, like the
stem cell, the vitamin C, theretin-A or retinol, and the
exfoliating in the moisturizer.
It's just.
It seems like it's all thethings.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Yeah, and the thing that I really want people to
understand is, just because alabel says it has something, it
doesn't mean it's going toactively get to where it needs
to go in the skin.
So you want to make sure thetechnology is right and that's
why, with the vitamin C, we havesodium ascorbyl phosphate,
which is a stable form ofvitamin C, and with the retinol,
it's a liposomal retinol, soit's encapsulated, it's very
stable and it's slow delivery,so it's delivered over time to
(31:04):
cause less irritation and itpenetrates better in the skin.
So the technology matters.
It's like when you get anenergy drink, it might say it
contains an ingredient and it'sthe smallest amount.
It's not going to make adifference on your in your body.
The same holds true with skincare is you want to look at the
technology behind it, becausethat's what really matters.
Is it going to get to where itneeds to be in the skin?
Is it going to do what it needsto do in the skin?
Speaker 2 (31:26):
So tell me what's next for Moon and Skin.
When can people get their handson this?
Speaker 1 (31:29):
Yeah, so we're hoping by end of March, working with
perfectionists here, so we'regetting it in the hands as soon
as possible.
Everything has to be right.
I love it.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Thank you for joining us on Listen to your Skin by
Moon and Skin.
It's an honor to be part ofyour skincare journey and if you
love this episode, make sure tosubscribe.
Leave us a glowing review andshare it with someone who's
passionate about their skincarejourney, and please connect with
us on social to ask yourquestions, which will drive
future educational episodes.
Welcome to Listen to your Skin by Moon and Skin, the
podcast where science meetsnature to celebrate the story of
your skin.
Your skin is a living canvas,ever-evolving, deeply personal
and uniquely yours.
Each week, we'll dive into thescience of healthy skin, share
empowering stories and uncovertransformative self-care rituals
.
We're here to help you embraceevery phase of your journey with
(00:22):
confidence and care.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
How often do I really need to wash my face?
Speaker 1 (00:26):
So I really think that everyone needs to wash
their face twice a day becauseat night obviously we want to
get off our makeup and we wantto get off the toxins and the
dirt and the debris from the day.
But a lot of people don't thinkthey need to clean in the
morning also.
But we do need to cleanse witha gentle cleanser in the morning
because our skin is our biggestdetox organ.
(00:48):
So at night when we're sleeping, we're basically extruding
toxins and we're extruding dirtand debris out of our pores.
So we want to get that off soour daily skincare can penetrate
.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
How about vitamin C?
I hear a lot about people youknow saying that I need to have
vitamin C.
Is that true?
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely so.
Vitamin C is just a core thingthat pretty much everyone needs
in their skincare regimen andyou want to make sure you're
applying it to work with yourcircadian clock, so during the
daytime, as soon as our eyes andour skin sees the light, we are
in a protective mode.
So our body basically isprotecting us from any
(01:30):
environmental toxins orallergens, and vitamin C will
help with some of the freeradicals that we're exposed to
that get through our sunscreen,even to prevent DNA breakdown,
and it helps support the healthystructure of our collagen in
the skin.
So I want people to be applyingvitamin C every morning and you
(01:50):
apply it face, neck, chest andthe back of your hands.
I usually have people sweep theback of their hands with it
after cleansing first step inthe morning and then let it dry
completely, then apply yourmoisturizer, then your sunscreen
.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
So I've bought vitamin C before and then let it
dry completely, then apply yourmoisturizer, then your
sunscreen.
So I've bought vitamin C beforeand then, after like a little
bit, it turned like brown.
Is that normal, or can Iprevent that?
Speaker 1 (02:11):
Yeah, that's such a good point.
I hear that so often, so I'm soglad you brought that up,
because typically all vitamin Csare not created equal.
So the active form of vitamin Cis L-ascorbic acid.
So the active form of vitamin Cis L-ascorbic acid and the way
it works it's very unstablebecause it basically protects
(02:32):
you from the free radicals.
So L-ascorbic acid is veryunstable.
It is broken down by light, byheat and by oxygen.
So the longer it sits on yourcounter, the more it's likely to
turn from the clear color whenit's active to the brown color
and become inactive.
So scientists have created otherforms of vitamin C that are
(02:53):
more active.
There's THD ascorbate andthere's sodium ascorbyl
phosphate.
I preferentially like thesodium ascorbyl phosphate form
of vitamin C because it convertsto L-ascorbic acid in the body,
making it effective by helpingprotect you from the free
radical damage, and it also isgreat for anyone who's
(03:14):
predisposed to getting acne fromvitamin C, which I hear about a
lot, or sensitive skin.
So I love looking for a sodiumascorbyl phosphate form of
vitamin C.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
How about retin-A or retinol?
What is the difference betweenthe two and when might I use
that?
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Yeah, so retinoids as opposed to vitamin C.
You want to use those at night.
So, as I mentioned with vitaminC, when we wake up in the
morning and our eyes seesunlight and our skin also has
photoreceptors which aresensitive to light, we turn into
a protective mode.
And the opposite is true atnight.
So at night, when we don't haveany light which is why it's
(03:55):
important to sleep in a darkroom the melatonin rises and
we're in a regenerative phase.
So there's such a thing asbeauty sleep.
So, as our body is renewing andregenerating, our liver ticks up
and our skin cells want torenew and regenerate, and
vitamin A products, whetherthey're in the form of retinol
or retinoic acid, tretinoin,which retinol converts into in
(04:20):
the skin, they help with thatrenewal process.
So tretinoin is a prescriptionthat can be prescribed and it's
the active form of vitamin A inthe skin.
It's also tends to be a littlebit harsh on the skin and cause
a little bit of peeling andredness.
So I like people to start lowand go slow and start with a
(04:42):
retinol and gradually increaseto every night, and if they
could tolerate every night andthey're still wanting more
effects, then they can go to aprescription strength.
But honestly I find that ifsomeone is able to tolerate
retinol every single night asyour first step after cleansing,
before a moisturizer, they endup getting really good results
(05:02):
in improvement of fine lines,wrinkles, pigmentation,
reduction of the clogged poresand acne after about three to
six months.
So that's what I have people do.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Wow, I was just going to ask you about the timing.
So how long does it take toreally start to see results?
Speaker 1 (05:20):
Yeah.
So when we're talking aboutincreasing collagen in the skin,
we need to give it three months, because we're sending signals
to rev up the fibroblasts, whichare the cells that produce
collagen in the dermis, and ittakes about three months
optimally six months to seeresults.
So there are studies showingthat if you use a lower-strength
retinol compared to ahigher-strength retinol, you get
(05:43):
to the same endpoint at sixmonths.
You just get there a little bitquicker to a higher strength
retinol.
You get to the same endpoint atsix months.
You just get there a little bitquicker with a higher strength.
But unfortunately a lot ofpeople have irritation.
So that's where we want to lookat the formula.
What is the formulation?
And there's some really cooltechnology.
There's liposomal technologythat we now have, where the
retinol is encapsulated by aphospholipid so it can penetrate
(06:05):
through the epidermis, into thedeep layers of the epidermis
and even the dermis to stimulatethe fibroblasts without causing
all of that peeling and rednessand roughness that nobody likes
, Because we recommend retinoidsall the time.
But what happens is people giveup after a couple weeks because
they're red and they're raw.
So it always goes back to theformulations.
Things are not created equal.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Back to the vitamin C a little bit.
You know back when I boughtvitamin C before I broke out
really bad.
Is that normal?
Speaker 1 (06:33):
Yeah, it's not normal , but really, what is normal,
right?
No one's normal.
We're all our own person.
So, just because your bestfriend tolerates it and you
don't, you need to listen toyour skin, right?
So we all need to listen and beattuned to our skin, and what
works for your best friend mightnot work for you, just like
what works for you might notwork for me, and vice versa.
(06:54):
So, for anyone who hassensitivities or anyone who is
prone to getting acne, I wantthem to look at the formulation
of their vitamin C and look forthe form of vitamin C in being
sodium ascorbyl phosphate.
I know it's a long word, it'sSAP, but you're going to want to
avoid the forms that sayL-ascorbic acid and look for
(07:16):
sodium ascorbyl phosphatebecause that's going to be less
inflammatory, less likely tocause acne.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
So I'm perimenopausal , so my skin is obviously
changing and I feel like myhormones are changing.
Do you have any recommendationsfor how you know I would work
with all of these things in my,in my system?
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Yeah, for sure For sure, you know, and the word
perimenopause is a word weweren't using many years ago.
It's, and it's kind ofeverywhere now.
And perimenopause is reallyhard to define.
It's just the time of your life, which can be 10 to 15 years,
from 35 to 50, or even 40 to 55,until you reach menopause.
Menopause has a bizarredefinition it's basically going
(07:57):
a full year without having aperiod, but in the meantime,
during those years, our hormonesare up and down and up and down
and fluctuating more than theynormally would be during a
normal menstrual cycle.
So it's really important tolisten to your skin and know
when you're more predisposed toacne, when you're more oily, and
modify things Absolutely.
(08:17):
Everyone needs a vitamin C andeveryone needs a retinol.
So vitamin C in the morning,retinol at night.
If you tend to be more dry andmore prone to irritation, I
would make sure you have moremoisturizer on your skin,
particularly at night, and I'msuch a minimalist I want to look
for moisturizers that havemultiple functions.
(08:39):
So why do I really need an eyecream and then face moisturizer,
then a neck moisturizer, when Ican find one moisturizer that
works for all of the areas?
Take the leftover on my handsand sweep the back of my hands
every night.
So all of those areas are beingcorrected, equally aging
gracefully together, right?
So that's what I look for.
And then if someone isirritated with retinol, like
(09:03):
just say, before you wereperimenopausal, you were
tolerating your retinol everysingle night with no problem,
and now you're noticing that youmight have a little bit more of
a barrier, dysfunction anddisruption and more irritation.
I don't want you to give up onit.
Maybe go every other night ordo the sandwich technique, where
(09:24):
you apply moisturizer, let itsoak in, quench your skin, apply
your retinol as you always have.
It will go where it needs to goon the receptors, let it dry
and then put another layer ofmoisturizer on, and I find that
that can really benefit a lot ofpeople rather than just giving
up on it Can.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
I use the same moisturizer in the morning that
I do at night.
People rather than just givingup on it, can I?
Speaker 1 (09:45):
use the same moisturizer in the morning that
I do at night?
Yeah, it depends on your skintype.
So ideally you can.
So I tend to be pretty oily, soI don't use a moisturizer in
the morning.
I use sunscreen in the morningafter my vitamin C, and then, if
I'm dealing with pigmentation,I'll put a pigment corrector on
after vitamin C, beforesunscreen.
We always layer thinnest tothickest, so when you're
applying products, you applyyour thinnest serum and then you
(10:10):
go thicker as you apply, withyour sunscreen being the last
step before your makeup.
And most people I find in thewinter absolutely need to have a
moisturizer twice a day becausewe're reaching homeostasis with
our environment all of the time.
So the air is drier and we'regoing to be drier because we are
one with we are one with ourenvironment, right.
(10:32):
So I do recommend a moisturizer, the same one, twice a day.
If you tend to be more dry,I'll have you boost your
moisturizer at night.
Either go for a thickermoisturizer or have that be the
only time of day you use yourmoisturizer.
Or take some mineral water fromLa Roche-Posay makes a nice
(10:53):
mineral water spray and thesehave prebiotics and probiotics
in them and spray your face andthen take a liberal amount of
moisturizer and apply it and itsoaks in and pushes the moisture
in your skin and that's a wayto boost it, rather than putting
something oily that could breakyou out at night.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
Do I use the same cleanser in the morning and at
night?
I do.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
Yeah, I do the same cleanser morning and at night.
Like as I mentioned, I'm aminimalist, so I think why have
so many products when you canhave one product do a lot of
things?
So I'll use the samemoisturizer and recommend that
for most of my patients the sameone in the morning and night.
If they do wear a lot of makeup, then I'll have them do a
double cleanse with an oil-basedcleanser first and then their
(11:41):
more medical grade,results-driven moisturizer that
might have some activebotanicals in there.
Then I'll have them use thatafterwards.
Or I'll have them use micellarwater first and then use their
cleanser afterwards and thecleansers I recommend.
I like to be on the skin for twofull minutes, so I'll have them
apply it and massage theirlymphatics and rub the cleanser
(12:05):
in and let it penetrate andnourish the skin for a full two
minutes.
And we really want to use agood cleanser that removes
makeup, removes impurities,removes dirt anything that's
extruded from the pores at nightor during the day and oils, but
does not strip the skin.
So we don't want a cleanserwhere your skin feels tight or
raw or red or burning.
(12:26):
It should never feel that wayafterwards.
It's too strong.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
I have also younger daughters.
How old should you be when youstart adopting vitamin C and
retinol?
Speaker 1 (12:37):
Yeah, that's a great question.
I think 2024 was a year ofoveruse of products and 2025 is
going to be more minimalism, andit's for a good reason.
You know there's just we don'tneed to live in excess for any
reasons, and we really saw thatwith the teens.
We saw them doing so many stepsand I think it actually
(12:57):
disrupts the skin barrier, itdisrupts the skin microbiome and
it's not a good idea.
So when you're in your teens, agood cleanser, a good
moisturizer and a good sunscreenis really all that is
recommended.
As someone goes into their 20s,that's when I start having them
use a vitamin C as an amazingpreventative measure.
Absolutely 30s, 40s, 50s, andthen retinol same thing.
(13:21):
Mid-20s is a great time, butteenagers not so much.
It's a little bit of a waste ofyour money.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
And how about if you start breaking out?
Is there a solution for that?
Speaker 1 (13:30):
Yeah.
So you know retinol andtretinoin we use for acne, so it
works for acne because it helpsturn over the skin cells.
So as we get older our skingets lazy, our stem cells get
tired and they don't turn overas quickly.
So a lot of times people thinkthey have dry skin, but what it
is is the skin is just notrefreshing and turning over as
(13:52):
quickly.
So there's a couple ways, acouple things we can do with
that.
We can add exfoliants to helpexfoliate off the top dead skin
cell layer and when youexfoliate the skin it sends
signals down to the stem cellsto say, hey, rev, rev up, make
some more fresh skin.
So we're kind of sending thosesignals that aren't happening.
(14:13):
We can also use stem cells andI love products that have
vitamin C with stem cells inthem, because that will help
send those signals to rev upfresh stem cells while also
protecting the skin from freeradicals.
So less products containingmore technology is always what
we're looking for.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
You can put stem cells in your products From
plants.
Yes, Wow.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
How does that work?
Yeah, it works by signaling thehuman skin, and we used to
think that plants didn't signalhuman stem cells, and they
actually do.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
Wow, that's incredible.
Do you treat body acne the sameway as you would treat face
acne?
Yeah, that's a great question.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
So I always look for the cause.
So what is the cause of thebody acne?
And is it folliculitisirritation of the hair follicle
or is it actually acne Typicallyon the body?
What I usually see is friction,occlusion.
So just say someone's anathlete and they're wearing
non-breathable clothing andthere's a lot of friction to a
(15:15):
particular area.
I'll see acne in those areaslike the back or the butt.
But in your back, knee right,and the other reason I see acne
on the back when it's notsomeone who just has regular
teenage acne is from hairconditioner.
I'll see certain types of hairproducts cause acne around the
hairline and around the lowerback I mean the upper back when
(15:35):
they are rinsing their hair.
So you have to ask people whattheir lifestyle is like.
Are they going to hot yoga andsweating and then wearing their
clothes for an hour afterwards,or are they going home and
showering off?
Because if we sweat a lot andwe rub and then we occlude or we
block our sweat glands, we'regoing to get acne in those areas
(15:56):
.
So before I just start throwingmedicine at someone, I want to
find out what are theirbehaviors that might be
contributing to forming the acne.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
It's a little overwhelming thinking about all
the different ingredients andthe products.
How do I really know that I'mgetting a good vitamin C?
Speaker 1 (16:11):
Yeah, I know, I know, and over the years I've seen so
many people bring in bucketsand bags of stuff to me and they
weren't being effective at alland they wasted so much money.
So this is how I break it downWith vitamin C, what you want to
look for is you want to lookfor a formulation that contains
sodium, ascorbyl phosphate,especially if you're prone to
acne or sensitive skin.
(16:32):
You want, if you can find,something that has plant stem
cells.
You're going to get a twofer.
So you're going to have oneproduct in one step that
stimulates stem cells and alsohelps protect you from free
radical damage, and then find aproduct that has some hydrating
capabilities, like hyaluronicacid in it, especially
plant-derived botanicalhyaluronic acid is a very
(16:52):
elegant formulation.
And then what also makes thevitamin C stable and more potent
is when it has ferulic acid andvitamin E added to it.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
So those are the things you want to look for With
all of the ingredients it's alittle hard to keep track of.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
How do I know that I'm getting the right retinol
Right?
Yeah, so I would always startwith a retinol as opposed to a
tretinoin or a prescriptionstrength vitamin A product.
And with retinol there's somegreat technology out there, so I
like people to look for aretinol that's a liposomal
retinol, so basically theretinol, the active molecule, is
encapsulated in phospholipidsso it's able to penetrate
(17:32):
through the epidermis and get tothe deeper layers of the
epidermis to rev up the stemcells and also into the
fibroblasts to stimulatecollagen from forming without
causing irritation to the toplayer of the skin.
The other thing with retinol isI find that people the top
layer of the skin.
The other thing with retinol isI find that people apply too
much to the skin.
So a small amount the size of apea or a pearl, dot the
(17:54):
forehead, each cheek, the chinand the chest and blend it in,
avoiding the creases around theeyes, the nose, the corners of
the mouth and the crease in theneck, and doing that three times
a week After two weeks ifyou're not having irritation or
peeling or redness, which youreally shouldn't see from
liposomal retinol, because it'sencapsulated and it's slowly
(18:16):
delivered over time and it'ssuper stable.
Just start slow, start low, goslow and after two weeks go to
four times a week, another weekfive times a week until you're
able to tolerate it every night.
We're in this for the long gameand you really see the best
results with retinol at sixmonths.
So you want to stick with it.
So liposomal retinol is the onethat I want.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
Yep Liposomal is a special technology where the
retinol is encapsulated and itgets delivered to where it needs
to be in the skin, and it'ssuper stable.
So you know what you're getting.
You're getting it where itneeds to go.
So, for the first time ever, Ifound a moisturizer that has an
exfoliator in it.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
What is that about?
Yeah, that's such a greatquestion.
So this is, I think, brillianttechnology, because a lot of
times people are so dry andthey're putting moisturizer,
moisturizer, moisturizer ontheir.
It's just not penetratingbecause as we get older, the top
layer of our skin just likekind of sticks around and that's
what makes us look dull and dry.
So by having very low levels ofalpha hydroxy, beta hydroxy
(19:21):
acid, like glycolic acid,salicylic acid, it will loosen
up those corneocytes, the toplayer of the skin that's dead,
so that you can actually getinfusion of the moisturizer, of
the hyaluronic acid, of all ofthe hydrating properties of a
product, as well as anybotanical extracts like centella
(19:42):
asiatica or mushroom extractthat can be lightening and
brightening things like that.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
I was going to bring it back to the oily skin part,
because you said this is goodfor oily skin too, right?
So I have oily skin and I don'talways use like a moisturizer.
Is this something that I canuse also as a moisturizer that
won't make me extra?
Speaker 1 (20:02):
oily.
Yeah, that's one of the biggestmyths is people who have oily
skin think they don't needmoisturizer and, at the very
least, okay.
Just say you run a little highcortisol during the day, like I
do, and you tend to get a littlebit greasy.
You may not necessarily need amoisturizer during the day, but
at night, everyone, everyone,everyone needs a moisturizer
because we lose a lot of waterat night or we have increased
(20:23):
trans epidermal water loss lossand we lose a lot of moisture
from our skin at night and yourskin can ironically compensate
by making more oil if you don'thydrate at night.
So absolutely you want to lookfor a moisturizer containing
hyaluronic acid that'slightweight and non-comedogenic
if you have oily skin, somethingthat's light and hydrating,
(20:43):
without being necessarily creamor oil-based did you say that
there's mushrooms in thismoisturizer?
So I love nature.
I think all the best secrets inthe world are from nature and
as she lets us discover them.
Slowly, over time we will findthe properties and reishi
mushroom extract can belightening and even out uneven
(21:05):
skin tone.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
Where does the name moon and skin come from?
Speaker 1 (21:17):
Yeah, so moon and skin is basically encouraging
all of us to work with theharmony and cycles of nature
around us and within our body.
So we have a circadian cycle.
Morning and night, our bodiesin different metabolic processes
, so when we hit the light inthe morning we have our
circadian clock turn on andwe're in a different mode than
at night when we're renewing.
And then, as women, we have ourinfradian cycle, which is our
(21:38):
monthly cycle, where ourhormones evolve and they change
every single day.
Unlike a man, that's 24 hoursand we want to work with that
cycle as well.
And then we have the seasons andwith every season our body is
reaching homeostasis with thoseseasons.
So we also want to learn towork with the rhythms of the
seasons.
(21:58):
And then we have the seasons ofour life.
So the seasons of our life,because what we need when we're
teen is different from our 30sand 50s.
So the skincare line willevolve with the seasons of our
life, because what we need whenwe're teen is different from our
30s and 50s.
So the skincare line willevolve with the seasons of our
life and the seasons of where welive.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
So I can use the same moisturizer in the morning and
at night.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Yes, you can, and you can also use it around your
eyes and your neck, your chest,and I always, always, always,
with every product, I recommendsweeping the back of your hands.
We forget this and we want thisto all age together, right, so?
Speaker 2 (22:28):
yeah, and this is a moisturizer that I, at 40, can
use and my daughter at 20.
Yes, you, can wow.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Yeah, I mean, let's be honest.
Sometimes at 40 you need moreof a booster.
So at 20 she may only need itat night and you may need it
twice a day.
And then, if you want to boostit more, you can spray your face
with some prebiotic, probioticmineral water like La
Roche-Posay or Vichy, and thentake a little bit more than she
would and soak it in at night.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
Would she use retinol as well at 20?
Speaker 1 (22:57):
years old, it really depends.
So I'm a minimalist, I don'tlike to put a lot on people's
faces.
So if somebody struggles withacne or blackheads in their 20s,
we always use retinoids.
In the 20s we use it in theform of Retin-A or Tretinoin as
a prescription strength whichcan be really harsh and
stripping on the skin.
So retinol absolutely recommend.
(23:19):
I don't recommend it duringpregnancy or breastfeeding
because it does affect cellturnover, so theoretically it
can affect cell turnover in ababy, so it's not recommended
during those times.
But it's a very safe productthat's been around since the
seventies and it's proven tohelp with fine lines and
wrinkles, acne plug, pores,lifting off pigmentation.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
So, dr J, you helped create this formulation of
moisturizer.
I did.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Yeah.
So I really wanted tointentionally create a
moisturizer that was good forall skin types, and one of the
things that I think is oftenoverlooked with a moisturizer is
it might be a good qualitymoisturizer, yet it's not
penetrating through the skin.
So we needed to add a littlebit of salicylic acid and
glycolic acid at a very lowlevel nothing that's going to
(24:03):
feel like a chemical peel orpeel your skin at a low level to
loosen up the dead skin cells.
So once the dead skin cells areloosened up and they're no
longer insulating your skin fromactually having penetration of
the moisturizer, this hydratingmoisturizer that's not
comedogenic, not acne-forming,can penetrate, so it's a really
cool product.
(24:23):
It has a lot of antioxidantslike centella asiatica,
dandelion root, schisandra,green tea in it, and it also has
a reishi mushroom extractthat's really good for evening
out skin tone.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
So tell me how did this partnership happen and what
brought you to this point.
Speaker 1 (24:43):
Yeah, so I'm at a point in my life where I only
work with excellent people thathave good intentions on making
the world a better place, andI've helped create dozens of
skincare lines before, and thatwasn't always the case.
A lot of times, people justwanted to make money, because
the skincare industry is areally big industry it's a
(25:03):
multi-billion dollar industryand I want to only align with
people who want to educatepeople to become empowered to
take care of their health, andthat's where I found my current
people my family.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
There's so many unique things about this
moisturizer you know for, like,we talked about it having
exfoliators in it and how can itlike?
How can one moisturizer be madefor multiple people and why is
that important?
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Yeah, it's really important because you you don't
want to have a ton of things onyour counter, you know, and you
want to minimize things.
Also, I wanted something thatpeople can.
You have the same moisturizeras your daughter.
She might use it once a day,only at night, while you'll need
(25:56):
to use it twice a day becauseyou have more mature skin or you
need to use more, or someonewho has combination skin.
They can avoid application tothe center of their face and use
it on the periphery of theirface and their neck.
So it has a lot of properties.
That has so many antioxidantsthat are just even more
beneficial than only themoisturizing and the hydration
(26:17):
abilities.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
So you talked about moon and skin being special
partners that really likecarried your same values.
What does make moon and skinspecial?
Speaker 1 (26:25):
Yeah for me, I could speak for myself.
For me, it's the intentionalitybehind everything.
So I often ask myself,especially seeing tens of
(26:51):
thousands of people's peopleover the years, when they come
in and they share with mesomething that they're
vulnerable about educating andempowering people so that they
not only understand the skincare and why it's important to
nourish your skin from theoutside in, but also how to take
control over your own life, sothat you have the power to make
(27:13):
the decisions that will bringyou in a healthier direction for
yourself and your family, everysingle day.
So it's an educational platformthat also offers beautiful
skincare from nature, workingwith the harmony and rhythm of
nature.
Speaker 2 (27:30):
I love it so much.
How good does it feel to seelike the product in real life,
actually like in my hand,sitting with you right now?
Speaker 1 (27:39):
It's really exciting, because I do not have the
creative capacity to create thepackaging and all the bottling,
and I'm really impressed withall of it.
While I can recommendformulations and active
ingredients that arescience-backed, I really do need
a team of chemists to puttogether these formulations in a
(28:00):
way that's cosmetically elegant, because while the ingredients
are active and there's sciencebehind them, if they're not
formulated well, they're notgoing to feel good on your skin.
So I want to make sure there'sno pilling and everything layers
well together and people wantto use it and it's cosmetically
elegant.
Speaker 2 (28:15):
You talked about the importance of having chemists
working with chemists andthere's no pilling and
everything layers well togetherand people want to use it and
it's cosmetically elegant.
You talked about the importanceof having chemists working with
chemists and, you know, workingwith the natural earth on
products, and there seems to bethis dichotomy between working
with natural products andworking with, you know, created
products or like manufacturedproducts, and I love the fact
that this sort of seems to blendthe best of all the worlds
(28:37):
right.
So can you tell me about thatprocess and how did you bring
that to life?
Speaker 1 (28:41):
Yeah.
So I mean people will say, oh,you can eat this product.
Well, that's ridiculous,because if you can eat something
, it's going to have a shelflife of two or three or four
days, so it's just not feasible.
You do have to addpreservatives.
We have great options for cleanpreservatives.
We have great options forcombining things together.
I am not an expert onchemically putting these
(29:05):
together, but I'm certainlylearning by working with some
brilliant scientists on whatthey do to put things together,
and every once in a while, I'llkeep wanting to add other
antioxidants and other thingsI'm excited about.
Like.
Centella Asiatica is also knownas Go-To-Cola.
It's in all of our products andit's really going to be the
hottest ingredient in 2025because there's some science
(29:25):
behind it showing that it helpsincrease the collagen and the
thickness of the dermis which welose over time.
So, starting in our mid-20s, welose about 1% of our collagen
every year and then aroundmenopause it dramatically drops
and within five years aftermenopause, we lose 30% of our
collagen.
So anything we could do toreplenish that is huge and
(29:47):
that's coming from nature.
There's also studies showingcentella asiatica helping for
stretch marks and replenishingthe elastic tissue.
So there's so many beautifulthings about products that can
be derived from nature.
Now, we don't want to stripnature, we want to work with
nature, and this is what I'm allabout.
But going back to the cosmeticchemist, you know I'll keep
(30:08):
saying how about we add this andthis and this, and it gets to a
point where they say that'senough, we can't add anymore, so
any more.
So you know, it's, it's aconstant, it's a constant
collaboration.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
Well, you guys have done a beautiful job, because I
am just seeing a lot of newamazing things in here, like the
stem cell, the vitamin C, theretin-A or retinol, and the
exfoliating in the moisturizer.
It's just.
It seems like it's all thethings.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Yeah, and the thing that I really want people to
understand is, just because alabel says it has something, it
doesn't mean it's going toactively get to where it needs
to go in the skin.
So you want to make sure thetechnology is right and that's
why, with the vitamin C, we havesodium ascorbyl phosphate,
which is a stable form ofvitamin C, and with the retinol,
it's a liposomal retinol, soit's encapsulated, it's very
stable and it's slow delivery,so it's delivered over time to
(31:04):
cause less irritation and itpenetrates better in the skin.
So the technology matters.
It's like when you get anenergy drink, it might say it
contains an ingredient and it'sthe smallest amount.
It's not going to make adifference on your in your body.
The same holds true with skincare is you want to look at the
technology behind it, becausethat's what really matters.
Is it going to get to where itneeds to be in the skin?
Is it going to do what it needsto do in the skin?
Speaker 2 (31:26):
So tell me what's next for Moon and Skin.
When can people get their handson this?
Speaker 1 (31:29):
Yeah, so we're hoping by end of March, working with
perfectionists here, so we'regetting it in the hands as soon
as possible.
Everything has to be right.
I love it.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Thank you for joining us on Listen to your Skin by
Moon and Skin.
It's an honor to be part ofyour skincare journey and if you
love this episode, make sure tosubscribe.
Leave us a glowing review andshare it with someone who's
passionate about their skincarejourney, and please connect with
us on social to ask yourquestions, which will drive
future educational episodes.
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