February 14, 2021 • 34 mins
Keith and Roxann continue to give the 411 of how they met, and dive into how Keith’s trauma made him uncomfortable with Roxann’s advances.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Welcome to living a triggered life podcast with keith and Roxanne presented by the trigger project.
Find out more information about the trigger project.
Go to www 0.1 dot com.
We're gonna pick up pretty much um where we left off and we were talking about the last two episodes we've been talking about how we met and that is the foundation of our relationship but there's just a lot of background in terms of where Roxanne was,
(00:32):
when we met,
where I was,
when we met etcetera etcetera etcetera etcetera etcetera.
Right Roxanne that's a lot of yes it is and sometimes I'm extra like today many times.
Okay good,
so let's pick up where we left off starting new um you could start so when I met you I was in junior year college,
(00:53):
wait a minute,
you're going back,
you're going back to the beginning,
we left off,
you followed me halfway across the,
across the state and a half from providence to follow me up to the University of massachusetts Amherst which is really far if people don't people you don't understand that this whole area,
(01:13):
it's at least almost 2.5 hours,
maybe three,
probably three hours knew that I was going to be at this party which is a huge party jeans and t shirt party,
big shout out to said to U mass Malcolm x picnic and knew I was going to be there and said hey I want to see you because we've been talking on the phone for for for six months,
I want to see you and so I'm going to come to this party.
(01:36):
Yeah,
I remember that but I wanna be able to share what frame of mind I was in to do something like that.
That was so crazy.
Okay,
that's cool.
But we left off when we had our first kiss and you got goose bumps and I think you re enacted that for yourself in the moment as I was telling you,
love that part of the story.
(01:57):
It's a beautiful thing.
It's a beautiful thing when you can remember the first time you kissed somebody and they melted in your arms and you melted into their arms,
right?
And you get that,
get that little like,
got like a chill and I could like,
I never I never kissed nobody like that and had them do that,
You know what I'm saying?
They usually just fall right down when I would kiss them,
You know what I mean?
Are you talking about your other women and they were falling down?
(02:21):
You sure wasn't any other reason why they were falling down other than you kissing them?
Um That was,
I mean some people,
some people have said that um I have really soft lips so or some people say,
my man jones used to say honey dips,
excuse me,
it's like glaze so I'm being completely silly um because I was really shy,
so so what do you trying to tell me where you want me to start did start where I wanted to start and then you interrupted and you just got on this path and talking about melting and honey dips and blah,
(02:54):
blah blah.
I just wanted to be able to say?
Like what frame of mind would drive me to get in a car with my friend and drive for what felt like it was 10 hours,
it wasn't that long but we were tired and it felt like it was that long and how excited I was to go and spend time with you and wait a minute.
(03:15):
Did you have an idea that I was coming up there?
Did we plan that out?
Well you said that you were going to try but you didn't tell me for sure,
you know what I mean?
And then you were like look all right.
So I was really excited telling my friend abby about him and what I wanted to do and she was down and she was down for it.
(03:38):
Well she had to because she had a car and drive and I didn't have a license,
I don't have a car and just talking about the frame of mind I was in,
I was in a relationship where I really was making some really bad choices and it was causing a lot of pain and anguish and I was coming with my own pain already.
So I went to college with a lot of pain and suffering and then I get into this relationship with this dude and that caused pain and suffering,
(04:06):
but what kind of,
what kind of pain did you carry in carry into what into college?
Oh my God,
I don't know if that's something you want to get into right now or we were going to talk about it eventually.
But yeah,
I think that my frame of mind right now is talking about just carrying from when we met and that moment of our first kiss,
(04:27):
and I think a different time because talking about what pain and suffering I carried into going to college is going to sort of really change the tone.
Whereas the tone about when we met is like,
it's like,
wow,
I found him,
you know,
I like that,
I like that space.
(04:50):
So that was part of the reason why I needed to be out of that relationship.
And so one of the things that is very clear in my mind and still remains clear in my mind is I did not know anything about sexual health or sexual development,
nothing zero,
what I knew was my trauma.
(05:10):
And so I walk into college and I walk into a social situation that I have no idea of,
I'm 17 years old and I'm out of state for the first time in my life by myself and I don't know anybody.
And so those first relationships,
you know,
they become family,
they become everything.
(05:31):
And so I'm in this bad relationship and I can't get out of it because this is my family,
because I was coming from a broken sort of family,
but I had the wherewithal to know I need to get out of this relationship,
it's just going to be really bad,
it's going to end bad for me in my life and then I meet you,
(05:51):
so going out and driving that way and continuing to walk into that light that you know,
so this is how I describe that.
So this dude,
I opened the door,
he's standing there with his little kufi and his three quarter trench,
he was wearing a three quarter trench trench at that time,
nobody,
I'm wearing a three quarter trench right now,
(06:12):
Still nobody,
this dude has so much style and flair and personality,
but when I opened the door when I first met him,
I swear it was like a light shining,
like the sun,
you sure I don't have no theme music,
no chef,
(06:32):
you didn't,
It was that time,
it was like the era of great hip hop and R and B and soul,
but anyway,
it was like a light y'all,
it's hard to explain it,
but it was sort of that moment of and I recognize it now,
I didn't recognize it.
Then I just was drawn to him and drawn to that light because I've never in my life met a man like this before,
(06:59):
I just had to breathe that through,
but I was drawn to the light and I went for it,
but now as I have been in this relationship for a while,
I realized that that light was God showing me a way out of the darkness that I had been living in,
I didn't know that back then and so I went with it,
so getting in that car and driving up to U Mass Amherst and not knowing one solitary person,
(07:23):
it was like 5000 people at this party and like he said,
I didn't know how to dance,
it's so embarrassing to say that out loud and knowing that people are going to be listening to this so embarrassing but anyway um and he's laughing at me but besides all of that,
(07:44):
it was that light that was guiding me to drive all the way to U Mass Amherst and not worry about anything because what I needed keith to know was that I was in I'm gonna say it one more time,
I needed keith to know that I was all in because this was my moment and that through our ups and downs and everything that's happened in our lives and our relationship that has always been the foundation.
(08:11):
Amen showing you stepped on that dance floor,
you damn jerk when you look pretty as couldn't dance.
Yeah,
that was another moment when you were trying to tell me that you were all in right hey,
you know what?
You know what when you make you know when you make yourself vulnerable,
(08:33):
look I respect,
I have my respect because I mean at that point,
like I wanted to be a background dancer,
you know what I'm saying?
Like that was me,
you know what I mean?
Like I was doing all the dances and then just like flipping them.
I've always been that way,
but I was,
I mean seriously?
And at that time music was sold,
the music was so dope,
you know,
and the DJ was banging.
(08:54):
I wanted to dance,
continue to dance all night and I was just dancing circles around.
I couldn't believe I was like,
she can't dance,
wow,
but she's out here,
she's out here with me and you know,
I still try to make an attempt to dance with her,
you know what I mean?
You know like Will smith,
(09:14):
will smith is dancing on Fresh Prince.
Some people don't know something younger folks,
you can look it up and he just starts dancing like that was me.
I was used to dance with people who could dance the same exact way.
So you know,
I just had to slow it down.
But let me,
let me say for the,
let me say this though,
Roxanne did allow me to teach her how to dance and she can dance so we can go out and get it in.
(09:39):
You know,
she has her own style.
I mind,
we can dance together and things like that.
I can go off and try to spin on my head if I want to,
whatever she knows exactly what to do.
She's okay with that.
That's love right there.
That's love.
So now,
you know,
like a little bit about what got me in that car to drive that distance,
(10:00):
to do all of that I did,
and then That moment in the backseat of I think it was my friend,
it was my friend's car.
In that moment,
you see how we talked about,
we talked about it,
like,
it was yesterday,
it was legitimately 20 plus years ago,
we're talking about,
like,
yesterday,
like,
like that that should just happen.
(10:21):
Yeah,
that's that's kind of how that's kind of how it is and it didn't just happen.
Mhm.
But we know I mean,
but it's it's,
you know,
it's monumental.
It's it's things to remember,
like,
I mean,
I could I could sit and write about it and,
and I vividly have the memory of everything that's happened and how we met and all the rest of that stuff,
you know,
I can make a movie out if I want to write a play about it,
(10:43):
you know,
I could talked about on the podcast,
it's a beautiful thing when I recognize how much of darkness I lived in based on the trauma I experienced and I'm talking about complex trauma and then to have to be able to talk the way I'm talking because of a relationship or being in relation to someone else and offering to be vulnerable and being vulnerable and being okay with it And the end result is the outcome is having a blessed relationship with this other person,
(11:18):
this man or as I like to always refer to him,
this black beautiful man.
I'm always like,
why are you talking about me like that?
Because you don't hear nobody talking about black men like that.
That's why.
And I want people to understand that there's a beauty in who you are and that beauty I see.
Yeah,
but I'm caramel.
(11:39):
I'm just saying specifically fine doesn't work for me but find no,
that's okay.
It's just always,
I'm always surprised you like my beautiful black husband.
I'm like girl you ain't got that with me like that.
You can just say that what I want.
You should know this by now.
Oh God,
that's true.
That's true.
When she was in just a side note,
(12:00):
firecracker,
when I first met her,
I know you attained firecracker swear right out of mouth like boom.
You know,
say,
hey,
what's up?
I just,
I just do it in a different way now.
Okay,
yeah,
quiet away.
She was loud new york new york accent you say,
(12:20):
hey,
what's up?
Hey,
what's up rocks?
What's up?
All right?
You're getting off checking dude.
So that's what was happening and then we got to that moment and after that moment I wanted him to come back with me.
I don't even know where I was going,
where was that going?
You're going back to providence.
Yeah,
I wanted him to come back and he wouldn't,
(12:41):
you want to say why you wouldn't come?
I was uncomfortable with that move.
Why?
Because you thought I was going to take advantage of you?
Yes,
you're right.
After that kiss.
I was like uh it was going to go down,
I was like uh and I was like,
I mean perfect,
I mean a couple of things,
right,
couple of things.
I,
you know,
I had come back from Amherst,
(13:02):
I wasn't in school that semester and things like that and I was getting myself together and I still have,
I was still living in my father's house and I always had respect for him,
you know what I mean?
Beijing,
so I had respect for my father and so you know,
for me to kind of like disappear and end up being in providence or whatever.
I was like that's not a good move,
you know?
But there was another thing as well is that I just wasn't comfortable,
(13:23):
right?
It seemed like,
oh maybe she just wants to have a one night stand or whatever and I just wasn't,
I just wasn't comfortable with that,
you know what I mean?
It just wasn't,
you know like,
oh maybe she's just gonna be a notch on the belt or something like that and that just turned me off in a basic set,
the thought of that,
not her turning me off,
but you know,
I felt like that I wasn't necessarily ready for that,
(13:46):
it wasn't something that I that I can handle.
You know,
I also was abused by a female and a male and the male and the female was actually aggressive and I think there's certain times when females have been just naturally aggressive.
Nothing overtly wrong with that.
But I think at times it's it's made me go in another direction.
(14:06):
What do you mean by another direction?
Say more about that run?
No,
I just think that just close up a little bit,
get shy,
not necessarily lose confidence or anything like that,
but just go the other way after that experience,
you were very closed off,
you would be open and then closed,
(14:28):
open and then closed for a while.
I just didn't know what was going to happen.
I just didn't feel,
I just didn't feel safe.
I was completely vulnerable in a lot of situations.
I was vulnerable in that situation as well.
And I felt,
I mean,
I felt this great connection with you for sure.
But I just in my mind,
I just didn't want to feel like I was going to have relations with you and then nothing would happen from it.
(14:54):
You know,
I think,
I think also I had in my mind,
you know,
I always talk about my grandmother and and things like that.
Both my grandmothers were wonderful,
wonderful women,
but my dad's mom mrs Maskell.
You know,
they say things,
you know when you when you raise Beijing,
you're trained.
And so those things sometimes I stick with you.
My grandson ain't gonna be no jiggle o.
Mhm.
(15:14):
Mike keith,
keith,
keith,
keith keith.
He ain't gonna be out there with them women.
You better be careful boy,
you ain't gonna be able to arrest these men.
And I think I was just really confused about that and I just didn't want to be that type of that type of person.
I think that also goes back to my abuser and and things like that as well in terms of how I looked at that person and that masculinity,
(15:43):
that toxic masculinity.
And I was confused.
I was confused about it.
Who taught you about sex.
Who helped you develop your sexual identity?
It was forced.
What does that mean?
It was forced by circumstance.
No one ever really had the birds and the bees kind of talk with me.
It was like,
it was just a whole bunch of magazines and dirty movies that were just kind of around,
I remember them in your house.
(16:06):
That's kind of like that's kind of like how it was,
you know,
you go you go different people's houses and things were just left out and was like,
I wonder why this is left,
What's this?
Oh my God,
You know,
scratch and sniff like,
you know,
but I think that's that's pretty much how I that's pretty much how I kind of learned about it.
(16:27):
I mean my mom was always the interesting thing is about,
my mom was,
my mom was about respect and she was always about you know,
making sure that I understood that I just didn't didn't just take take my penis out anywhere and stuff like that.
I mean sometimes you know when you're little and they take you somewhere,
they're just some kids just peeing out in front everybody know my mom was,
(16:51):
my mom would take me behind somewhere and make sure that you know,
I was private about it and stuff and she always talked to me about it,
she was like,
look don't be just pulling that thing out anywhere and just thinking,
you know,
you need to be respectful with that you need to be respectful with women and how you deal with them.
You know,
she was clear,
I mean she was clear about that,
(17:11):
she was really clear and I'm happy that she was clear about that you got to make sure to wash,
you gotta be clean.
You know,
all those things and that always stuck with me,
you know,
don't know,
don't when you leave the house,
make sure your presentable were some clean underwear.
So just in case if you have you have,
you know,
God forbid that you get in the ambulance that that that your underwear will be clean and the people will know that you're taken care of why why do things always have to go back to how she gonna look right?
(17:42):
But that's that's exactly that was her parenting.
But that's but that's how it is.
That it was important.
You know,
that's how it was.
When I asked you that question about how you learned these things,
because I only learned my sexual identity through my trauma.
Well,
I mean,
you know what?
Thank you so much for asking.
I don't mean to cut you off.
You know,
I did.
But that also was part of how I learned some of that at some of that.
(18:05):
You also had some very healthy training and development from your mom,
which is what you were just talking about.
And I don't remember having any of that.
Yeah,
that's deep.
I mean,
and I think that,
I mean there was so much the magazines and all the rest of the stuff that was out there in terms,
of you know the 20 that were in the bathroom and The other 500,
(18:28):
that was um Good Lord.
Um that was out there.
That really was,
I mean,
that really in some ways I felt like and it's now talking about it now that I see that it wasn't,
it wasn't completely overshadowed by the things that my mom told me.
What does that mean?
It wasn't completely overshadowed because it was so,
I mean,
it was it was so intense with how old were you when you first started singing that stuff?
(18:53):
Oh my God,
I mean,
that really makes a difference if depends on age,
because you're not supposed to,
we're not supposed to see things like that at a certain age,
It really sort of pushes our brain to try and process something.
We have no understanding.
I I don't remember ever not seeing it,
to be honest,
whether it was just,
(19:13):
you know what I mean,
Whether it was a juggs juggs magazine or whatever,
I don't I don't remember ever not seeing it,
you know,
for for a certain age,
it's really inappropriate because you don't have any way of processing that at a certain age.
And so right,
well,
no,
I had no,
I had no way to to process that.
I didn't know what the combat zone was.
I didn't know,
(19:33):
I didn't know some of the some of the combat zone,
because this is some of the some of the language that I would hear,
and I didn't know anything.
I didn't know what it was.
You know,
you shouldn't have known what it was.
And that was an area that was an area of town where there were,
there are ladies of the night and strip clubs and and things like that,
um that some family members has come up from other states and some of them and yeah,
(19:55):
and some used to frequent and and things like that,
But yeah,
I didn't,
I mean,
but I'm asking you these questions because I want to make sure that the audience understands that there's a context here of very what seemed like innocent experiences that play a role in how we identify and how we see the world and how we have expectations of partners or sometimes expectations that are not healthy.
(20:24):
Sometimes expectations that might seem a little healthy.
Why or why not?
But these are the foundation pieces of the whole name of this podcast which is living a triggered life.
Like we're talking about the details of different triggered moments in our life as well as the details that created a foundation for how we continue to live triggered life except now it's in partnership.
(20:49):
Right.
Right.
And I think that's why I'm asking and that's why we're talking about this and that's why it's so important because people grow up with these circumstances and they just glare over it.
They act like they didn't have any impact or it's not going to have an impact on their life.
And it is and it always does and we got to recognize it.
(21:09):
Right.
Right.
I I think it's I think it's hard,
I think it's hard,
I think it's hard to to acknowledge,
I know it was for me to acknowledge what has happened and and things like that and you know what exactly what does it really mean and how is it and how does it manifest itself through relationships now whoever I choose to have them with and that is you know that's that's deep.
(21:33):
So should we move on from after that?
And now we know why I mean well I'll just say now we know why you wouldn't go home with me.
So I'll just say that I didn't understand why he basically rejected my advances and then he was key for sort of open but closed at the same time.
(21:55):
It was very confusing for me because I didn't know what was going on.
I didn't know what was happening.
I had never had a man not respond to me and that was new for me.
So I was like well I guess I'm going to have to continue to be assertive because I don't really know if he likes me.
(22:15):
Yeah well he wasn't really making it known back then.
I didn't feel that way.
I was very insecure about it because I didn't know this would be a great moment.
We had people calling in and ask how many people would have been running to providence.
I don't think you understand that context there.
Mm I don't know why you're looking at me like that.
(22:37):
So anyway so that's how I felt.
I was very confused about the whole situation and had this strategy in this plan to make sure that this man knew I was serious business.
So what you do because I stayed in I stayed in,
I stayed in Amherst for the for another day and a half or so.
Oh well we drove back home to providence and I stayed in touch with you and we continue to talk.
(23:00):
The beginning of our relationship was really about talking.
No I missed some.
What did I miss?
You know I got bad memory.
Yeah.
You missed.
So you went back to providence But where did you end up the next day?
I don't remember.
Oh back here back in massachusetts I showed up looking for you.
Didn't.
I got on the bus had some idea of where he lived but didn't really know where he lived but was on the bus.
(23:26):
This is what you're talking about.
Yeah.
So I needed to make sure that he understood what was happening here.
So I got in the next day I got on the bus,
I came to massachusetts.
Let's put this together.
So she drove three,
they drove three hours in the middle of the night party ended at two or three,
drove back to province.
Those three hours.
(23:46):
I was sleeping in a dorm with my boys and then she got on a bus and went to massachusetts from province which is about an hour to get to my house about an hour and a half.
So I didn't really know where he lived and I only kissed her and I got on a bus in Cambridge and found my way to his neighborhood.
(24:08):
And I met this young man on the bus.
Well there weren't a lot of black people around that neighborhood.
So I didn't see any.
I thought I don't know why you looking at me?
This is my story.
Yeah but I'm sorry.
I got there was there was no black families in that.
Not on the bus.
On the bus.
Yeah,
that's what I'm talking about,
(24:29):
how he begin all up on me like he can't just wait a second,
y'all see that.
Anyway so I got on a bus there were not a lot of black people on the bus on the way to that neighborhood.
And I just see one brown brother on the bus and I said I wonder if he knows keith.
(24:50):
So I said how difficult is that?
I saw one dude boy black dude said you know this black dude named Keith.
So I said I'm sorry to bother you.
Do you know this guy named keith,
keith Maskell?
That's his name,
do you know him?
He lives around here.
And the brother just looked at me big smile on his face,
(25:13):
dancing eyes like he said yeah I know keith.
I said can you tell me where he lives?
Can you take me to his house?
I think I told him that I was with him the night before,
I might have told him something like that and that I had come to see him and I wanted to see him and this brother just looked at me like he didn't know what was going on.
(25:34):
It was to him.
He was like is this chick crazy like I don't know who she is,
what's going on?
And he said well you'll have to come with me to my house.
Was he going to meet you play basketball with you?
Right?
Oh that's right.
He said you'll have to come with me to my house,
I have to do something and then I'll take you and show you where he lives.
(25:58):
So this dude took me to his house,
met his mama.
I was like hi how you doing?
Little did I know who he was and keeps life and he did eventually take me to his house when I got to keith's house,
his father answered the door but keith wasn't home.
That was interesting.
I had a rose for keith and he let me didn't he let me put it in your on your bed?
(26:23):
I think he did because that's how I knew your room was a mess,
hot ass mess,
just *** everywhere and clothes and he was like trying to ask me questions and smiling and whatnot.
And I think he called you didn't he?
Yeah he told you,
what did he tell you?
He was like you,
(26:44):
I was like yes dad,
what's up?
What's up?
What's going on?
He's like hey um someone's here to see you and I was like someone's in my house because we had invasions where no one came to the house,
especially if they were young people,
they never came over to visit or anything like that.
They always go to the backyard.
They never came upstairs.
And I've never been in my room unless it was like supervised or whatever.
(27:04):
And I was like,
who the heck is in my house?
He goes,
some girl named Roxanne.
I was like,
Oh no,
oh my God,
my dad and my dad was just,
I'm sorry,
but this is just straight,
I'm just keeping it straight 100.
My dad was a boob guy.
And so I was like,
oh my God.
(27:25):
And so he put her on the phone and I was the first thing I asked,
I was like,
oh my God,
did he stare at your boobs?
She said,
he said hi to my boobs.
He didn't say hi to me.
He said hi to my boobs and I was horrified.
I was horrified and said,
oh my God.
But she was like,
(27:45):
she was like,
I left something on your bed,
left something on your bed for you.
And I was like,
what?
But I thought it was really sweet.
I was like,
wow,
this girl just drove across the earth to be to see me at this party.
And then she ended up at my house like what the heck is going on?
Like wow,
this is special.
Didn't I tell you that I met your friend steve how I got to your house.
(28:08):
Right,
Right,
Right.
Yeah.
Big shoutout to steve steve still like,
you know,
one of our best friends and things like that.
But it's like I was like,
you asked some random dude and just happened to be steve,
steve took it to his house.
We gotta bring steve on the show and have him talk about that experience.
Well,
you know what,
we'll bring steve on,
what we'll do is we'll bring steve on and ask him how he's experienced our relationship just knowing just knowing our past and things like that.
(28:37):
That would be really interesting.
Yeah,
he's been he's been with us since the,
since the beginning.
So it's interesting to see how how other people um you know,
view us,
you know the way we interact and and how we interact,
here's how we interact all the time.
You know,
we can I think we're a little tame compared to where we can be like Yeah,
(28:59):
well,
I mean,
I'm not my usual self.
So that's the story,
Another story for another day.
Um wow,
that's crazy.
That's crazy.
So yeah,
she left the rose.
She left the rose on my bed but I didn't really know what it was,
but I was horrified because she met my father and I was horrified because I was like,
(29:19):
there's no way she went into my room because it was it was a hot mess.
No question.
No question.
And it's not like I had a thing about it,
is it's not like I didn't have or I hadn't had experiences with women that were really nice to me or aggressive to me or should really show me a lot of love because I,
(29:41):
because I did for sure,
I just don't think that I was ready for it,
that I could really appreciate it um at the time,
which is sometimes kinda kinda sad as well because I really would have loved to just been able to experience um that and possibly have,
(30:02):
you know,
a real kind of a meaning meaningful relationship with a couple of folks um in high school for sure.
And um but I guess that's just how things things happened.
I did get experienced some of it,
but not as much as not as much as as I would have liked just because,
you know,
I went the other way,
what do you mean?
You went the other way?
(30:23):
Well,
some folks were,
you know,
really were wonderfully aggressive and lovingly aggressive with me,
you know what I mean?
And I was like,
oh my God,
like just beautiful moments,
but I didn't really know,
you know,
when I was kind of in sort of a relationship and kind of sort of in something and I didn't know how to deal with it.
(30:44):
So you're talking,
you're talking about trust,
right,
feeling like you can trust because that's what it sounds like,
I don't know,
I don't know what to call it,
to be honest with you.
I don't know if I didn't trust myself.
I don't know if I didn't trust them.
I just didn't feel well.
You know what?
I didn't feel safe,
right?
So what you're saying,
trust yeah,
(31:05):
I just didn't trust didn't trust the situation.
You know?
I think of course being triggered,
being triggered in the situation and then trying to being able to like to try to like enjoy it and and things like that.
Like it was just too it was just too complex even though I really you know with one of the situations I really really had some strong feelings you're talking about a girl that you're with in high school.
(31:30):
Yeah,
really strong feelings.
But I just it just didn't it just didn't work out in the way that I wanted it to and I mean the really the beautiful thing about it is that I had to go back and and talk to her about it you know because she really put herself out there to show this love for me.
When did you have to go back and talk about it?
(31:50):
You're talking about back back then?
No,
like the last three years.
Four years.
Really?
Yeah.
Why did you have to?
Well I felt like I felt because she always was hurt by because she felt like I didn't really that I didn't like love her back or that that that she felt rejected when she was being 100% vulnerable and she really wanted me and she wanted me to be her first and and you know,
(32:15):
this she had such a special place for me.
We had such a great connection and I,
and I felt like I owed it to her.
How did you reconnect with her?
Um it was social media.
I just called her,
I think I had a thing with social media or something like that and whatever and I called and I said,
look,
I need to talk to you.
Well actually,
when I was I was in therapy,
I started therapy and started really talking about stuff and I was like,
(32:37):
you know what,
I definitely can look back at some of the relationships that I had and you know,
like I didn't handle things always the best way,
you know?
And so I felt like I wanted to go back and have conversations,
I want to go back because I didn't tell,
I didn't tell them what happened to me and you saying them you're talking about this particular individual.
Yes.
(32:57):
Well,
I didn't tell,
I didn't tell the young women that I that I was I was kind of with,
I didn't really talk about what happened to me.
I didn't talk about the abuse and things like that.
That's not an uncommon thing.
I mean I've been your wife for a while and I was with you for a while.
You didn't even tell me.
Really,
I mean I knew about the female perpetrator but there was a lot that you didn't tell me.
(33:20):
Yeah I was just you know this whole you know the whole thing about being silenced you know with don't tell people your business and and things and I just didn't I didn't talk about it but I needed to talk about it and I felt like I owed it to them to talk to them about it but one specific person I really felt felt like I really owed it to her to talk about it you know I think that's really important and maybe we leave that for next time and talk about that because that is a really important relational thing that you did right right and then we'll bring it back and we'll continue the story but thank you for listening to living a triggered left podcast with keith and Roxanne presented by the trigger project.
(33:59):
To find out more information about the triggered project.
Go to www dot triggered one dot com and remember you're no longer surviving,
Welcome to living a triggered life podcast with keith and Roxanne presented by the trigger project.
Find out more information about the trigger project.
Go to www 0.1 dot com.
We're gonna pick up pretty much um where we left off and we were talking about the last two episodes we've been talking about how we met and that is the foundation of our relationship but there's just a lot of background in terms of where Roxanne was,
(00:32):
when we met,
where I was,
when we met etcetera etcetera etcetera etcetera etcetera.
Right Roxanne that's a lot of yes it is and sometimes I'm extra like today many times.
Okay good,
so let's pick up where we left off starting new um you could start so when I met you I was in junior year college,
(00:53):
wait a minute,
you're going back,
you're going back to the beginning,
we left off,
you followed me halfway across the,
across the state and a half from providence to follow me up to the University of massachusetts Amherst which is really far if people don't people you don't understand that this whole area,
(01:13):
it's at least almost 2.5 hours,
maybe three,
probably three hours knew that I was going to be at this party which is a huge party jeans and t shirt party,
big shout out to said to U mass Malcolm x picnic and knew I was going to be there and said hey I want to see you because we've been talking on the phone for for for six months,
I want to see you and so I'm going to come to this party.
(01:36):
Yeah,
I remember that but I wanna be able to share what frame of mind I was in to do something like that.
That was so crazy.
Okay,
that's cool.
But we left off when we had our first kiss and you got goose bumps and I think you re enacted that for yourself in the moment as I was telling you,
love that part of the story.
(01:57):
It's a beautiful thing.
It's a beautiful thing when you can remember the first time you kissed somebody and they melted in your arms and you melted into their arms,
right?
And you get that,
get that little like,
got like a chill and I could like,
I never I never kissed nobody like that and had them do that,
You know what I'm saying?
They usually just fall right down when I would kiss them,
You know what I mean?
Are you talking about your other women and they were falling down?
(02:21):
You sure wasn't any other reason why they were falling down other than you kissing them?
Um That was,
I mean some people,
some people have said that um I have really soft lips so or some people say,
my man jones used to say honey dips,
excuse me,
it's like glaze so I'm being completely silly um because I was really shy,
so so what do you trying to tell me where you want me to start did start where I wanted to start and then you interrupted and you just got on this path and talking about melting and honey dips and blah,
(02:54):
blah blah.
I just wanted to be able to say?
Like what frame of mind would drive me to get in a car with my friend and drive for what felt like it was 10 hours,
it wasn't that long but we were tired and it felt like it was that long and how excited I was to go and spend time with you and wait a minute.
(03:15):
Did you have an idea that I was coming up there?
Did we plan that out?
Well you said that you were going to try but you didn't tell me for sure,
you know what I mean?
And then you were like look all right.
So I was really excited telling my friend abby about him and what I wanted to do and she was down and she was down for it.
(03:38):
Well she had to because she had a car and drive and I didn't have a license,
I don't have a car and just talking about the frame of mind I was in,
I was in a relationship where I really was making some really bad choices and it was causing a lot of pain and anguish and I was coming with my own pain already.
So I went to college with a lot of pain and suffering and then I get into this relationship with this dude and that caused pain and suffering,
(04:06):
but what kind of,
what kind of pain did you carry in carry into what into college?
Oh my God,
I don't know if that's something you want to get into right now or we were going to talk about it eventually.
But yeah,
I think that my frame of mind right now is talking about just carrying from when we met and that moment of our first kiss,
(04:27):
and I think a different time because talking about what pain and suffering I carried into going to college is going to sort of really change the tone.
Whereas the tone about when we met is like,
it's like,
wow,
I found him,
you know,
I like that,
I like that space.
(04:50):
So that was part of the reason why I needed to be out of that relationship.
And so one of the things that is very clear in my mind and still remains clear in my mind is I did not know anything about sexual health or sexual development,
nothing zero,
what I knew was my trauma.
(05:10):
And so I walk into college and I walk into a social situation that I have no idea of,
I'm 17 years old and I'm out of state for the first time in my life by myself and I don't know anybody.
And so those first relationships,
you know,
they become family,
they become everything.
(05:31):
And so I'm in this bad relationship and I can't get out of it because this is my family,
because I was coming from a broken sort of family,
but I had the wherewithal to know I need to get out of this relationship,
it's just going to be really bad,
it's going to end bad for me in my life and then I meet you,
(05:51):
so going out and driving that way and continuing to walk into that light that you know,
so this is how I describe that.
So this dude,
I opened the door,
he's standing there with his little kufi and his three quarter trench,
he was wearing a three quarter trench trench at that time,
nobody,
I'm wearing a three quarter trench right now,
(06:12):
Still nobody,
this dude has so much style and flair and personality,
but when I opened the door when I first met him,
I swear it was like a light shining,
like the sun,
you sure I don't have no theme music,
no chef,
(06:32):
you didn't,
It was that time,
it was like the era of great hip hop and R and B and soul,
but anyway,
it was like a light y'all,
it's hard to explain it,
but it was sort of that moment of and I recognize it now,
I didn't recognize it.
Then I just was drawn to him and drawn to that light because I've never in my life met a man like this before,
(06:59):
I just had to breathe that through,
but I was drawn to the light and I went for it,
but now as I have been in this relationship for a while,
I realized that that light was God showing me a way out of the darkness that I had been living in,
I didn't know that back then and so I went with it,
so getting in that car and driving up to U Mass Amherst and not knowing one solitary person,
(07:23):
it was like 5000 people at this party and like he said,
I didn't know how to dance,
it's so embarrassing to say that out loud and knowing that people are going to be listening to this so embarrassing but anyway um and he's laughing at me but besides all of that,
(07:44):
it was that light that was guiding me to drive all the way to U Mass Amherst and not worry about anything because what I needed keith to know was that I was in I'm gonna say it one more time,
I needed keith to know that I was all in because this was my moment and that through our ups and downs and everything that's happened in our lives and our relationship that has always been the foundation.
(08:11):
Amen showing you stepped on that dance floor,
you damn jerk when you look pretty as couldn't dance.
Yeah,
that was another moment when you were trying to tell me that you were all in right hey,
you know what?
You know what when you make you know when you make yourself vulnerable,
(08:33):
look I respect,
I have my respect because I mean at that point,
like I wanted to be a background dancer,
you know what I'm saying?
Like that was me,
you know what I mean?
Like I was doing all the dances and then just like flipping them.
I've always been that way,
but I was,
I mean seriously?
And at that time music was sold,
the music was so dope,
you know,
and the DJ was banging.
(08:54):
I wanted to dance,
continue to dance all night and I was just dancing circles around.
I couldn't believe I was like,
she can't dance,
wow,
but she's out here,
she's out here with me and you know,
I still try to make an attempt to dance with her,
you know what I mean?
You know like Will smith,
(09:14):
will smith is dancing on Fresh Prince.
Some people don't know something younger folks,
you can look it up and he just starts dancing like that was me.
I was used to dance with people who could dance the same exact way.
So you know,
I just had to slow it down.
But let me,
let me say for the,
let me say this though,
Roxanne did allow me to teach her how to dance and she can dance so we can go out and get it in.
(09:39):
You know,
she has her own style.
I mind,
we can dance together and things like that.
I can go off and try to spin on my head if I want to,
whatever she knows exactly what to do.
She's okay with that.
That's love right there.
That's love.
So now,
you know,
like a little bit about what got me in that car to drive that distance,
(10:00):
to do all of that I did,
and then That moment in the backseat of I think it was my friend,
it was my friend's car.
In that moment,
you see how we talked about,
we talked about it,
like,
it was yesterday,
it was legitimately 20 plus years ago,
we're talking about,
like,
yesterday,
like,
like that that should just happen.
(10:21):
Yeah,
that's that's kind of how that's kind of how it is and it didn't just happen.
Mhm.
But we know I mean,
but it's it's,
you know,
it's monumental.
It's it's things to remember,
like,
I mean,
I could I could sit and write about it and,
and I vividly have the memory of everything that's happened and how we met and all the rest of that stuff,
you know,
I can make a movie out if I want to write a play about it,
(10:43):
you know,
I could talked about on the podcast,
it's a beautiful thing when I recognize how much of darkness I lived in based on the trauma I experienced and I'm talking about complex trauma and then to have to be able to talk the way I'm talking because of a relationship or being in relation to someone else and offering to be vulnerable and being vulnerable and being okay with it And the end result is the outcome is having a blessed relationship with this other person,
(11:18):
this man or as I like to always refer to him,
this black beautiful man.
I'm always like,
why are you talking about me like that?
Because you don't hear nobody talking about black men like that.
That's why.
And I want people to understand that there's a beauty in who you are and that beauty I see.
Yeah,
but I'm caramel.
(11:39):
I'm just saying specifically fine doesn't work for me but find no,
that's okay.
It's just always,
I'm always surprised you like my beautiful black husband.
I'm like girl you ain't got that with me like that.
You can just say that what I want.
You should know this by now.
Oh God,
that's true.
That's true.
When she was in just a side note,
(12:00):
firecracker,
when I first met her,
I know you attained firecracker swear right out of mouth like boom.
You know,
say,
hey,
what's up?
I just,
I just do it in a different way now.
Okay,
yeah,
quiet away.
She was loud new york new york accent you say,
(12:20):
hey,
what's up?
Hey,
what's up rocks?
What's up?
All right?
You're getting off checking dude.
So that's what was happening and then we got to that moment and after that moment I wanted him to come back with me.
I don't even know where I was going,
where was that going?
You're going back to providence.
Yeah,
I wanted him to come back and he wouldn't,
(12:41):
you want to say why you wouldn't come?
I was uncomfortable with that move.
Why?
Because you thought I was going to take advantage of you?
Yes,
you're right.
After that kiss.
I was like uh it was going to go down,
I was like uh and I was like,
I mean perfect,
I mean a couple of things,
right,
couple of things.
I,
you know,
I had come back from Amherst,
(13:02):
I wasn't in school that semester and things like that and I was getting myself together and I still have,
I was still living in my father's house and I always had respect for him,
you know what I mean?
Beijing,
so I had respect for my father and so you know,
for me to kind of like disappear and end up being in providence or whatever.
I was like that's not a good move,
you know?
But there was another thing as well is that I just wasn't comfortable,
(13:23):
right?
It seemed like,
oh maybe she just wants to have a one night stand or whatever and I just wasn't,
I just wasn't comfortable with that,
you know what I mean?
It just wasn't,
you know like,
oh maybe she's just gonna be a notch on the belt or something like that and that just turned me off in a basic set,
the thought of that,
not her turning me off,
but you know,
I felt like that I wasn't necessarily ready for that,
(13:46):
it wasn't something that I that I can handle.
You know,
I also was abused by a female and a male and the male and the female was actually aggressive and I think there's certain times when females have been just naturally aggressive.
Nothing overtly wrong with that.
But I think at times it's it's made me go in another direction.
(14:06):
What do you mean by another direction?
Say more about that run?
No,
I just think that just close up a little bit,
get shy,
not necessarily lose confidence or anything like that,
but just go the other way after that experience,
you were very closed off,
you would be open and then closed,
(14:28):
open and then closed for a while.
I just didn't know what was going to happen.
I just didn't feel,
I just didn't feel safe.
I was completely vulnerable in a lot of situations.
I was vulnerable in that situation as well.
And I felt,
I mean,
I felt this great connection with you for sure.
But I just in my mind,
I just didn't want to feel like I was going to have relations with you and then nothing would happen from it.
(14:54):
You know,
I think,
I think also I had in my mind,
you know,
I always talk about my grandmother and and things like that.
Both my grandmothers were wonderful,
wonderful women,
but my dad's mom mrs Maskell.
You know,
they say things,
you know when you when you raise Beijing,
you're trained.
And so those things sometimes I stick with you.
My grandson ain't gonna be no jiggle o.
Mhm.
(15:14):
Mike keith,
keith,
keith,
keith keith.
He ain't gonna be out there with them women.
You better be careful boy,
you ain't gonna be able to arrest these men.
And I think I was just really confused about that and I just didn't want to be that type of that type of person.
I think that also goes back to my abuser and and things like that as well in terms of how I looked at that person and that masculinity,
(15:43):
that toxic masculinity.
And I was confused.
I was confused about it.
Who taught you about sex.
Who helped you develop your sexual identity?
It was forced.
What does that mean?
It was forced by circumstance.
No one ever really had the birds and the bees kind of talk with me.
It was like,
it was just a whole bunch of magazines and dirty movies that were just kind of around,
I remember them in your house.
(16:06):
That's kind of like that's kind of like how it was,
you know,
you go you go different people's houses and things were just left out and was like,
I wonder why this is left,
What's this?
Oh my God,
You know,
scratch and sniff like,
you know,
but I think that's that's pretty much how I that's pretty much how I kind of learned about it.
(16:27):
I mean my mom was always the interesting thing is about,
my mom was,
my mom was about respect and she was always about you know,
making sure that I understood that I just didn't didn't just take take my penis out anywhere and stuff like that.
I mean sometimes you know when you're little and they take you somewhere,
they're just some kids just peeing out in front everybody know my mom was,
(16:51):
my mom would take me behind somewhere and make sure that you know,
I was private about it and stuff and she always talked to me about it,
she was like,
look don't be just pulling that thing out anywhere and just thinking,
you know,
you need to be respectful with that you need to be respectful with women and how you deal with them.
You know,
she was clear,
I mean she was clear about that,
(17:11):
she was really clear and I'm happy that she was clear about that you got to make sure to wash,
you gotta be clean.
You know,
all those things and that always stuck with me,
you know,
don't know,
don't when you leave the house,
make sure your presentable were some clean underwear.
So just in case if you have you have,
you know,
God forbid that you get in the ambulance that that that your underwear will be clean and the people will know that you're taken care of why why do things always have to go back to how she gonna look right?
(17:42):
But that's that's exactly that was her parenting.
But that's but that's how it is.
That it was important.
You know,
that's how it was.
When I asked you that question about how you learned these things,
because I only learned my sexual identity through my trauma.
Well,
I mean,
you know what?
Thank you so much for asking.
I don't mean to cut you off.
You know,
I did.
But that also was part of how I learned some of that at some of that.
(18:05):
You also had some very healthy training and development from your mom,
which is what you were just talking about.
And I don't remember having any of that.
Yeah,
that's deep.
I mean,
and I think that,
I mean there was so much the magazines and all the rest of the stuff that was out there in terms,
of you know the 20 that were in the bathroom and The other 500,
(18:28):
that was um Good Lord.
Um that was out there.
That really was,
I mean,
that really in some ways I felt like and it's now talking about it now that I see that it wasn't,
it wasn't completely overshadowed by the things that my mom told me.
What does that mean?
It wasn't completely overshadowed because it was so,
I mean,
it was it was so intense with how old were you when you first started singing that stuff?
(18:53):
Oh my God,
I mean,
that really makes a difference if depends on age,
because you're not supposed to,
we're not supposed to see things like that at a certain age,
It really sort of pushes our brain to try and process something.
We have no understanding.
I I don't remember ever not seeing it,
to be honest,
whether it was just,
(19:13):
you know what I mean,
Whether it was a juggs juggs magazine or whatever,
I don't I don't remember ever not seeing it,
you know,
for for a certain age,
it's really inappropriate because you don't have any way of processing that at a certain age.
And so right,
well,
no,
I had no,
I had no way to to process that.
I didn't know what the combat zone was.
I didn't know,
(19:33):
I didn't know some of the some of the combat zone,
because this is some of the some of the language that I would hear,
and I didn't know anything.
I didn't know what it was.
You know,
you shouldn't have known what it was.
And that was an area that was an area of town where there were,
there are ladies of the night and strip clubs and and things like that,
um that some family members has come up from other states and some of them and yeah,
(19:55):
and some used to frequent and and things like that,
But yeah,
I didn't,
I mean,
but I'm asking you these questions because I want to make sure that the audience understands that there's a context here of very what seemed like innocent experiences that play a role in how we identify and how we see the world and how we have expectations of partners or sometimes expectations that are not healthy.
(20:24):
Sometimes expectations that might seem a little healthy.
Why or why not?
But these are the foundation pieces of the whole name of this podcast which is living a triggered life.
Like we're talking about the details of different triggered moments in our life as well as the details that created a foundation for how we continue to live triggered life except now it's in partnership.
(20:49):
Right.
Right.
And I think that's why I'm asking and that's why we're talking about this and that's why it's so important because people grow up with these circumstances and they just glare over it.
They act like they didn't have any impact or it's not going to have an impact on their life.
And it is and it always does and we got to recognize it.
(21:09):
Right.
Right.
I I think it's I think it's hard,
I think it's hard,
I think it's hard to to acknowledge,
I know it was for me to acknowledge what has happened and and things like that and you know what exactly what does it really mean and how is it and how does it manifest itself through relationships now whoever I choose to have them with and that is you know that's that's deep.
(21:33):
So should we move on from after that?
And now we know why I mean well I'll just say now we know why you wouldn't go home with me.
So I'll just say that I didn't understand why he basically rejected my advances and then he was key for sort of open but closed at the same time.
(21:55):
It was very confusing for me because I didn't know what was going on.
I didn't know what was happening.
I had never had a man not respond to me and that was new for me.
So I was like well I guess I'm going to have to continue to be assertive because I don't really know if he likes me.
(22:15):
Yeah well he wasn't really making it known back then.
I didn't feel that way.
I was very insecure about it because I didn't know this would be a great moment.
We had people calling in and ask how many people would have been running to providence.
I don't think you understand that context there.
Mm I don't know why you're looking at me like that.
(22:37):
So anyway so that's how I felt.
I was very confused about the whole situation and had this strategy in this plan to make sure that this man knew I was serious business.
So what you do because I stayed in I stayed in,
I stayed in Amherst for the for another day and a half or so.
Oh well we drove back home to providence and I stayed in touch with you and we continue to talk.
(23:00):
The beginning of our relationship was really about talking.
No I missed some.
What did I miss?
You know I got bad memory.
Yeah.
You missed.
So you went back to providence But where did you end up the next day?
I don't remember.
Oh back here back in massachusetts I showed up looking for you.
Didn't.
I got on the bus had some idea of where he lived but didn't really know where he lived but was on the bus.
(23:26):
This is what you're talking about.
Yeah.
So I needed to make sure that he understood what was happening here.
So I got in the next day I got on the bus,
I came to massachusetts.
Let's put this together.
So she drove three,
they drove three hours in the middle of the night party ended at two or three,
drove back to province.
Those three hours.
(23:46):
I was sleeping in a dorm with my boys and then she got on a bus and went to massachusetts from province which is about an hour to get to my house about an hour and a half.
So I didn't really know where he lived and I only kissed her and I got on a bus in Cambridge and found my way to his neighborhood.
(24:08):
And I met this young man on the bus.
Well there weren't a lot of black people around that neighborhood.
So I didn't see any.
I thought I don't know why you looking at me?
This is my story.
Yeah but I'm sorry.
I got there was there was no black families in that.
Not on the bus.
On the bus.
Yeah,
that's what I'm talking about,
(24:29):
how he begin all up on me like he can't just wait a second,
y'all see that.
Anyway so I got on a bus there were not a lot of black people on the bus on the way to that neighborhood.
And I just see one brown brother on the bus and I said I wonder if he knows keith.
(24:50):
So I said how difficult is that?
I saw one dude boy black dude said you know this black dude named Keith.
So I said I'm sorry to bother you.
Do you know this guy named keith,
keith Maskell?
That's his name,
do you know him?
He lives around here.
And the brother just looked at me big smile on his face,
(25:13):
dancing eyes like he said yeah I know keith.
I said can you tell me where he lives?
Can you take me to his house?
I think I told him that I was with him the night before,
I might have told him something like that and that I had come to see him and I wanted to see him and this brother just looked at me like he didn't know what was going on.
(25:34):
It was to him.
He was like is this chick crazy like I don't know who she is,
what's going on?
And he said well you'll have to come with me to my house.
Was he going to meet you play basketball with you?
Right?
Oh that's right.
He said you'll have to come with me to my house,
I have to do something and then I'll take you and show you where he lives.
(25:58):
So this dude took me to his house,
met his mama.
I was like hi how you doing?
Little did I know who he was and keeps life and he did eventually take me to his house when I got to keith's house,
his father answered the door but keith wasn't home.
That was interesting.
I had a rose for keith and he let me didn't he let me put it in your on your bed?
(26:23):
I think he did because that's how I knew your room was a mess,
hot ass mess,
just *** everywhere and clothes and he was like trying to ask me questions and smiling and whatnot.
And I think he called you didn't he?
Yeah he told you,
what did he tell you?
He was like you,
(26:44):
I was like yes dad,
what's up?
What's up?
What's going on?
He's like hey um someone's here to see you and I was like someone's in my house because we had invasions where no one came to the house,
especially if they were young people,
they never came over to visit or anything like that.
They always go to the backyard.
They never came upstairs.
And I've never been in my room unless it was like supervised or whatever.
(27:04):
And I was like,
who the heck is in my house?
He goes,
some girl named Roxanne.
I was like,
Oh no,
oh my God,
my dad and my dad was just,
I'm sorry,
but this is just straight,
I'm just keeping it straight 100.
My dad was a boob guy.
And so I was like,
oh my God.
(27:25):
And so he put her on the phone and I was the first thing I asked,
I was like,
oh my God,
did he stare at your boobs?
She said,
he said hi to my boobs.
He didn't say hi to me.
He said hi to my boobs and I was horrified.
I was horrified and said,
oh my God.
But she was like,
(27:45):
she was like,
I left something on your bed,
left something on your bed for you.
And I was like,
what?
But I thought it was really sweet.
I was like,
wow,
this girl just drove across the earth to be to see me at this party.
And then she ended up at my house like what the heck is going on?
Like wow,
this is special.
Didn't I tell you that I met your friend steve how I got to your house.
(28:08):
Right,
Right,
Right.
Yeah.
Big shoutout to steve steve still like,
you know,
one of our best friends and things like that.
But it's like I was like,
you asked some random dude and just happened to be steve,
steve took it to his house.
We gotta bring steve on the show and have him talk about that experience.
Well,
you know what,
we'll bring steve on,
what we'll do is we'll bring steve on and ask him how he's experienced our relationship just knowing just knowing our past and things like that.
(28:37):
That would be really interesting.
Yeah,
he's been he's been with us since the,
since the beginning.
So it's interesting to see how how other people um you know,
view us,
you know the way we interact and and how we interact,
here's how we interact all the time.
You know,
we can I think we're a little tame compared to where we can be like Yeah,
(28:59):
well,
I mean,
I'm not my usual self.
So that's the story,
Another story for another day.
Um wow,
that's crazy.
That's crazy.
So yeah,
she left the rose.
She left the rose on my bed but I didn't really know what it was,
but I was horrified because she met my father and I was horrified because I was like,
(29:19):
there's no way she went into my room because it was it was a hot mess.
No question.
No question.
And it's not like I had a thing about it,
is it's not like I didn't have or I hadn't had experiences with women that were really nice to me or aggressive to me or should really show me a lot of love because I,
(29:41):
because I did for sure,
I just don't think that I was ready for it,
that I could really appreciate it um at the time,
which is sometimes kinda kinda sad as well because I really would have loved to just been able to experience um that and possibly have,
(30:02):
you know,
a real kind of a meaning meaningful relationship with a couple of folks um in high school for sure.
And um but I guess that's just how things things happened.
I did get experienced some of it,
but not as much as not as much as as I would have liked just because,
you know,
I went the other way,
what do you mean?
You went the other way?
(30:23):
Well,
some folks were,
you know,
really were wonderfully aggressive and lovingly aggressive with me,
you know what I mean?
And I was like,
oh my God,
like just beautiful moments,
but I didn't really know,
you know,
when I was kind of in sort of a relationship and kind of sort of in something and I didn't know how to deal with it.
(30:44):
So you're talking,
you're talking about trust,
right,
feeling like you can trust because that's what it sounds like,
I don't know,
I don't know what to call it,
to be honest with you.
I don't know if I didn't trust myself.
I don't know if I didn't trust them.
I just didn't feel well.
You know what?
I didn't feel safe,
right?
So what you're saying,
trust yeah,
(31:05):
I just didn't trust didn't trust the situation.
You know?
I think of course being triggered,
being triggered in the situation and then trying to being able to like to try to like enjoy it and and things like that.
Like it was just too it was just too complex even though I really you know with one of the situations I really really had some strong feelings you're talking about a girl that you're with in high school.
(31:30):
Yeah,
really strong feelings.
But I just it just didn't it just didn't work out in the way that I wanted it to and I mean the really the beautiful thing about it is that I had to go back and and talk to her about it you know because she really put herself out there to show this love for me.
When did you have to go back and talk about it?
(31:50):
You're talking about back back then?
No,
like the last three years.
Four years.
Really?
Yeah.
Why did you have to?
Well I felt like I felt because she always was hurt by because she felt like I didn't really that I didn't like love her back or that that that she felt rejected when she was being 100% vulnerable and she really wanted me and she wanted me to be her first and and you know,
(32:15):
this she had such a special place for me.
We had such a great connection and I,
and I felt like I owed it to her.
How did you reconnect with her?
Um it was social media.
I just called her,
I think I had a thing with social media or something like that and whatever and I called and I said,
look,
I need to talk to you.
Well actually,
when I was I was in therapy,
I started therapy and started really talking about stuff and I was like,
(32:37):
you know what,
I definitely can look back at some of the relationships that I had and you know,
like I didn't handle things always the best way,
you know?
And so I felt like I wanted to go back and have conversations,
I want to go back because I didn't tell,
I didn't tell them what happened to me and you saying them you're talking about this particular individual.
Yes.
(32:57):
Well,
I didn't tell,
I didn't tell the young women that I that I was I was kind of with,
I didn't really talk about what happened to me.
I didn't talk about the abuse and things like that.
That's not an uncommon thing.
I mean I've been your wife for a while and I was with you for a while.
You didn't even tell me.
Really,
I mean I knew about the female perpetrator but there was a lot that you didn't tell me.
(33:20):
Yeah I was just you know this whole you know the whole thing about being silenced you know with don't tell people your business and and things and I just didn't I didn't talk about it but I needed to talk about it and I felt like I owed it to them to talk to them about it but one specific person I really felt felt like I really owed it to her to talk about it you know I think that's really important and maybe we leave that for next time and talk about that because that is a really important relational thing that you did right right and then we'll bring it back and we'll continue the story but thank you for listening to living a triggered left podcast with keith and Roxanne presented by the trigger project.
(33:59):
To find out more information about the triggered project.
Go to www dot triggered one dot com and remember you're no longer surviving,
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