Top Marketing Expert: The Crazy Strategy I Used For Google and Disney! - Bryan Eisenberg - Local Marketing Secrets

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Hey there and welcome back to local marketing secrets.
I'm your host Danny Lebrand and today I'm with Brian Eisenberg.
If you don't know Brian, he's the two time New York's New York
Times bestselling author, the Cocreator of the groundbreaking
persuasion architecture framework and even coined the
term conversion rate optimization.
I'm not even kidding. I I thought you were like a a

(00:20):
major player in conversion rate optimization.
You shared with me privately before the show, you actually
coined the term. You were like one of the first,
really the first person to use the actual term conversion rate
optimization along with other terms like bounce rate, which
you know, Seos like myself and other people regularly use in
the industry, which is just incredible.
Brian is clearly a legend. And then after that, we've got

(00:43):
he's helped major brands like Google, Disney, Dell, HP and
Travelocity generate hundreds ofmillions in additional revenue,
been named a top 10 user experience guru, and has
hundreds of thousands of followers on social media with
over 140,000 followers on LinkedIn alone.
Today we're diving into his persuasion architecture, the

(01:04):
four pillars that let any business be like Amazon, and how
AI and analytics are reshaping customer experience right now.
Now, without further ado, Brian,welcome to the show.
Thank you so much. By the way, funny story with the
conversion rate optimization, that wasn't like we coined the
term, but only because we wantedto rank for something because

(01:26):
people used to search for conversion rate.
Yes, it was currency conversion rate, but we ended up putting
out so much content. We ended up dominating the term
and obviously coined it for the industry.
But when we first started, my brother and I, Jeffrey, we
actually more referred to what we were doing online as digital
salespeople. And you know, people take the
term sales and sale. Yes.

(01:47):
So that didn't work very well early on.
So we learned. No, that, that is just crazy.
So yeah, let's dive into your background a little bit.
You're literally a legend in digital marketing.
It's such a pleasure to have youon the show.
Just talk to me about your background the past 30 years or
so, kind of how you got into it and what, what, what was really
the start of that. Well, you know, I've always been

(02:09):
online essentially my, my whole life.
I mean, I started a bulletin board system, you know, my own
one in 1983 as a very young teen.
And even then I was hacking, youknow, the code to try to get
people to go to different parts of the bulletin board system and
stuff. So long time, obviously Internet
came along, you know, mid 90s, you know, 939495.

(02:30):
We're already starting to play with it with a couple of
businesses that we were in and consulting.
And my brother had just taken meout of social work school.
So he was always a finance guy, I was a social work guy.
But we both had a passion for understanding why people do the
things they do and that kind of bridge the gap because we had no
relationship before that. And we looked at business models

(02:56):
and we were looking at, OK, well, how do we go about, you
know, building a business aroundwhat we want to do?
And, you know, we started the SEO world and, you know, that's
where people were kind of, you know, talking about some kind
of, you know, changes to websiteand website development.
So we played around that space for a while and we just
understood, look, you got to, you know, publish some content,

(03:17):
get well known, start speaking, you know, build out a
methodology, build software. And that is essentially the
trajectory that that we did. We published our first ebook,
The Markers Common Sense Guide to E Metrics 2001.
We made a lot of money on that direction.

(03:40):
Who was the big analytics playerat the time licensed it was
giving it away as physical copies during their roadshow.
So that was real interesting. And then we also published
persuasive Online copywriting atthat time as a physical book for
the first time because all of our friends were telling us,
well, you need to have like a business card that people can

(04:01):
hold. And this was our, I think it was
a $2.50 business card, our firstbook that we, that we self
published. So as we kept publishing, then
we, we started getting invited to speak at conferences.
We were publishing on some of the big online magazines, click
see. And we decided we're going to
write our next book. And that was call to action and

(04:23):
we published it. We did a deal where if you
bought 3 copies, we gave you onefree and we mailed them out to a
bunch of people. But surprisingly we mailed one
to Seth Godin, who didn't have really a relationship with, and
he decided to blog about us and in a post titled Don't Judge a
book by its cover. And he literally called our

(04:45):
cover God awful. Dang, yeah.
But he said, drop everything you're doing and buy this book.
And, and people did. And we became a, you know, New
York Times bestsellers. And that led to our next book,
which was Waiting for Your Cat to Bark.
And yeah. And we got to speak globally.
We, you know, we were, were consulting just all these great

(05:05):
companies. And then we turned our
consultancy and our methodologies and our processes
all into software company. So we took our company, our
agency public. We acquired a software company
and we were embedding all of ourtechniques into the software and
we grew that until the market crashed in 2008 and then been on

(05:28):
our own. And we've been working on some
new fun projects a lot in the home services industries for the
last few years. Yeah, no, so awesome.
And let's let's dive a little bit deeper into like the focus
for conversion rate optimization.
Why did you choose that? You told me a little bit before
the show, but let's really get into it of why conversion rate
optimization and what what were you doing that other people

(05:48):
weren't? So it's, it's interesting.
So it's where I got my original Twitter nickname.
So we were part of an incubator in New York City, you know, in
the very early days of the Internet.
And the owner of the incubator, very bright guy and his
assistant actually claimed us, basically gave us that term, you

(06:12):
know, you guys Grok calm. And that became the name of our
newsletter. And they called me the Grok
because if you're familiar with a strange in a strange land,
Grok means to understand a deep cellular level.
Because we were really looking at these Internet businesses and
saying, look, you know, you haveno clothes.
You could didn't understand how to sell anything.
They were putting up websites, but there was number fundamental
psychology behind how people were buying and that's all we

(06:34):
were analyzing. And yeah, we were doing SEO
stuff too, but we realized we had a bit, we could have a
bigger impact by the psychological triggers that we
were playing around with and theflow and the UX kind of stuff
that we were also doing on websites.
Simple example, one of our firstarticles ever was an article
about shopping carts. Because back then, and we all
take this for granted, you'd hitadd to cart and it would throw

(06:58):
you into the checkout and there was no way to go back.
And and so we wrote said, you know, that's literally like
going into the supermarket, pulling something off the shelf,
putting into your shopping cart and just staring at it and then
wondering what to do next. Like there was no clear
direction. And so that encouraged people to
start coding, you know, return to shopping buttons back early

(07:20):
on, like little stuff like that.And we realized that with with
his advice that we could have a bigger impact because there was
a lot of people talking about traffic, a lot of people talking
about search engine marketing, but almost nobody talking about
how to close the sale and name conversions.
Yeah, awesome. So I think that we're just a few

(07:41):
years too early. Yeah, yeah.
So something we were talking about before the call is that
even though things have majorly changed, which we're going to
get into, get into of like all the AI stuff and how Google is
changing. But what we were talking about
is that things actually, even though they have changed, you
know, maybe the layout or the platform has changed, they're

(08:02):
still the same principles at itscore of, you know, how we're
interacting with humans, how we're marketing.
Can you talk on that of like what are the core principles
here regarding marketing and? I mean, there, there are tons of
them. But I'll, I'll give you one that
again, early on we harped on andyou know, I was at a search
engine conference, you know, this week where the SEO has been

(08:24):
who, who was in front of the room was sharing some of the
research he had on. I think he's got access to over
20,000 Google search consoles, you know, $43 million, like all
kinds of crazy money he spent onall this research.
And one of the things he found out, which is one of the things
we told people early on is stop wasting a long time for people

(08:45):
to download your website. Like it's got to be quick.
If it's not quick, they're goingto leave.
And of course, you know, people always push that limit.
You know, as you know, when I first started, it was dial up.
Actually when I first started was 300 board, bulletin board,
right with the modem, you know, then, then you had dial up and
you know, we told people that said you have to keep it under 8

(09:06):
seconds. Well, where does that 8 seconds
come from? Well, it's the same thing in
advertising. If you don't catch someone's
attention in the 1st 8 seconds, they're gone.
So we were like, we just saw it when you know, we did usability
test and we can see it 8 secondssite didn't load, they were
gone. And today high speed people
still think they can bloat the page.
And what he's also finding is that if you want the AIS to be
effective and Google to rank you, if that site takes too long

(09:29):
to load, it's too much of A coston them.
They're not going to rank you asmuch.
They're not going to index you as much.
Yeah, definitely no that that's.Human behavior.
Yeah, no, that's, that's something any site can do it,
especially because people are used to social media.
They're used to everything fast,immediate, quick.
You know one, one Click to buy on Amazon.
Everyone's used to that immediate gratification, right?

(09:52):
Exactly. And so, you know, I see people
who love to bury things on a page, you know, big videos and,
and, and, you know, hero images for the amount of space it takes
up on screen and the amount of time that it takes someone to
kind of go through, you've already started eroding that
relationship. Yeah, so talk to me a little bit

(10:12):
about a landing page. You know, you actually you rank
on Google, someone clicks on thepage like specifically because
we know the the top of the page is definitely the most
important. What should we have at the top
of the page? Number one, it's you just kind
of have really clear impact statement about how you benefit
them and the value you bring. Like it's here's the problem

(10:36):
with all communication today, OK, it's so easy to produce
content, right? When we first started, there was
nothing, I mean, I was hand coding articles on grok.com
because there was no WordPress. There was no like you had to do
it. The hard coded HTML.
There was no way I built my first ESP.
We, I used to watch the spool ofemails going out because you

(10:59):
couldn't just sign up for MailChimp.
You know, back in the day, right, didn't exist.
Now we have AI that just spits out content, right?
Whether it's videos and you know, and, and you know, images
and text. There's so much and it's so much
noise. And it's one of the reasons I
wrote my latest book is we're sooverwhelmed with this noise that
the only thing that cuts throughit is ultimate clarity.

(11:21):
It's got to be razor sharp. I kind of have a, a rhino in the
back there as well. And it's like, you know, it has
to make one point and really clear.
And we're finding that the same thing with every landing page.
It's got to make one point. Now you can have multiple, you
can link to multiple pages. That's fine, but the page itself
has to be thematic to one thing.Make it clear, make it relevant

(11:42):
to the person who's coming to you.
And people come for different reasons.
So you've got to understand that.
And then you have to talk with impact today because if you talk
in what just corporate jargon and and just language that they
don't care about, they're gone. So the copywriting is incredibly
important. You and.

(12:02):
Yeah, well, and. That I mean.
Great imagery is too, but I'm not sure you're seeing it too,
right? You remember seeing the early
thumbnails that were being generated by AI.
Now everybody's kind of doing the same.
They're not as effective anymore.
Yeah. No, definitely.

(12:22):
There still needs to be that, that expert layer because you
can I, I feel like AI just as a whole, at least in terms of
copywriting and generating images, which will eventually be
videos. It, it is videos now, but I feel
like there's, there's still someroom to improve there.
But it seems like it's kind of democratized the landscape or
now that the bar has been raised.
So correct, now you, you can't, you can't really be a beginner

(12:44):
anymore because if you're a beginner, then you might as well
get replaced by AI. But now it's it's the experts
time to take over because now everyone's using the AI tools.
You need the experts to do better than AI tools.
Well, it's even more than that, right?
And I love that you mentioned that it raised the bar because I
said, you know, the quality of content that the, the poorest
level of content is better with AI than everyone else than it

(13:08):
was previously. So that's great.
But here's the problem. If you understand how these
models work, OK, they're trainedon all these bodies of work.
And it's a predictive engine about what word go needs to go
next. Great marketing is not
predictable. So if this large body of context

(13:31):
is just going to keep giving youpredictable words, you're
setting yourself up for failure to begin with.
You have interesting how to be remarkable, huh?
OK, so. I want to be here that way.
Yeah, no. I.
Know that kind of blew my mind. No, that was good.
Something else I want to jump into kind of adjacent.

(13:53):
I was, I was talking about this a little bit before, but about
like the whole Amazon model. Amazon has completely
transformed the market and you literally published a book
called Be Like Amazon. So can you talk a little bit
about that of like your 4 pillars and how any company,
like even a home service companycan be like Amazon?
Yeah, it even goes further than the book.
So it started off as an early article and I had a friend of

(14:16):
mine interview at Amazon and their Human Services department
sent her an e-mail like welcoming her and all that and,
you know, talking about all their values and stuff like
that. And they linked to my article on
the four pillars. Dang, I was like, OK, if Amazon
is looking to it, I'm obviously explaining it with better

(14:38):
clarity than they do. So I knew, OK, this is great.
You know, obviously I nailed it.But then Jeffrey and I with Roy
Williams, the Wizard of ads, we had this question said, OK, can
we find, you know, small, you know, mom and pop businesses
that essentially leverage the same principles, right, that

(15:00):
Amazon does? And are they successful with
them? OK.
And we can go into the four pillars, which is, you know,
obviously #1 being customer centric, really understanding
what your customer needs and focused on them.
And we'll have to talk a little bit more about what Jeff Bezos
meant by customer centric because most people think they
aren't, but they actually aren't, but he is.

(15:20):
You have to have a culture of innovation.
So if you're always thinking about your customers, you're
always thinking about how to stay ahead of them, right?
And how to do things better, then you need a culture of
agility. You've got to get stuff done
right. If you can't act and do, you
know, great work and have great standard operating procedures
and duplicate your stuff and scale, you're just not going to
grow. And then ultimately you have to

(15:41):
look at what you're doing, saying, OK, did it work?
Did it not work? Cuz you're going to get a lot of
failure. But then you got to learn how to
tweak it and it's just a continuous cycle.
And so one of my favorite examples of this is Ken Goodrich
from Gettle. If you, if you've ever heard of
Ken, right, he built $100 million HPC company.
You know, when you understand a little bit about his background

(16:02):
with, you know, holding the, theflashlight for his dad, you
know, his dad influenced a lot of his beliefs.
And I'm going to, we're going tohave to talk about the word
beliefs a little bit more later,but it influenced his beliefs.
And one of the things that Ken believed about air conditioners
was that every screw that a technician touched needed to be

(16:23):
super tight because if there's extra vibrations in the system,
it would cause damage the systemin the long term.
OK, great. Do you might understand that?
I might understand that because we've been in home services for
a while. But how does a typical customer
understand whether the technician touched the screws or
not? So what it can do?

(16:43):
He replaced every single screw in every single truck and every
single air conditioner into a bright red shiny screw.
What color are most air conditioner screws?
Just Gray. Black.
Yeah, you know, Chrome color, like that's it.
Yeah. Now, as a consumer, right,

(17:04):
Because it only matters if it matters to the consumer.
I can go look at the work that you're doing and I could see,
oh, look at all those bright redscrews.
I know you touched every single one of those.
Dang, that's good. Right.
And so not only did it impact the customers, because now they
know that his values and he's showing it, it's totally
customer centric. It's easy for them because now

(17:26):
when they're looking at what they touched and didn't touch,
they only have to look for what's not shiny and red, right?
And then they can just keep optimizing from there.
And that's the beauty of something so simple.
You don't have the big crazy experiments.
What is you think a red screw cost?
But it does things his company so much OK, like in pest

(17:48):
control. Could you imagine, you know, if
if you, you know, if you had something that was, you know,
lit up where you sprayed everywhere instead of the
invisible spray, people might know and this Oh yeah, that's
going to go away in an hour. But you can see where we
sprayed. It's all bioluminescence or
something like that. Again, it's it's that same kind
of, you know, visual impact to the customer that I've really

(18:09):
taken care of them. And that's what you get when you
buy from Amazon. You feel like they've taken good
care of you because everything about they, what they do and
they built their brand on is about the customer values,
right? We value selection, we value
price, we value availability andwe value get getting good
service when we need it. And that's the term that's

(18:31):
coming to my head. The term that's coming to my
head is going above and beyond that.
You know, most companies, OK, weset expectations, we match them.
But with Amazon and with these other companies like Gettle,
it's always doing more. So if you know, hey, we're going
to do the service, but we're also going to do this, you know,
maybe we give you a goodie bag or we give you, you know, dog
treats, just a little bit something extra that ends up

(18:52):
meaning much more to the customer.
Yeah, it's what I said earlier, right?
If you're going to be predictable, you can't be
remarkable, right? Do the boring stuff and boring
stuff is what AI will replace atsome point, right?
If you think about the manual stuff, but the stuff that's the
human touch, the stuff that really connects to people's
hearts, double down on that. Escalate on that because that's

(19:15):
what's going to make you grow toa whole nother level.
I've got I've got a fun story. I don't, he may or may not be
happy that I share it, but maybemaybe my friend, Doctor Matt
Delgado, who's a local chiropractor here who've been
helping for the last number of years and we've worked on
building all kinds of special moments into his business

(19:38):
because there are lots of chiropractors now he's a
different kind of chiropractor. He's neuro based and all that,
but it's still the experience right from when they walk into
the office, how the office looksto how quick they're seen to
little moments that just triggerthings.
So he will go ahead and give them a gift at some point.

(19:58):
I don't give all the details. I don't give away all the
secrets. But another one we just did is
we created a break the scripts moment where again, depending on
certain circumstances and where the client may be at, he's
actually created like fake prescription pads that will tell

(20:19):
you, hey, you know, this is goodfor one time out type of thing.
Go, go, go give it to your significant other and go chill
out. OK, I don't want to give all the
details of how he's doing that, but again, it's like those are
human to human moments. But, and again, when it's
delivered, how it's delivered, that's the stuff that you can't
scale. But when you implement it,

(20:41):
that's what makes you remarkableas a business.
So yeah, Life, Spring, Cairo. And then same thing when you go
to the website, the language he uses, he is punchy.
It's clarity and impact over andover and over again because you
can't be boring today. Yeah.
Well. The businesses, yeah.
Now I'm glad that you mentioned today because, you know, all

(21:02):
these like this, this has been working, you know, really
throughout the history of business.
But talk more about how this is particularly so prevalent with
all the AI stuff, with all the noise, with all the businesses,
Like why is this so important now?
I mean, there is a study severalyears ago I'm trying to think
about what is it, but maybe a decade ago where, you know, the

(21:24):
average person was in touch by like 5000 ads a day or something
like that. Now it must be like 20 or
30,000, yeah. Can you imagine?
How much content, all the videospeople scroll through on TikTok
and Instagram, like they're justso much noise.
And, you know, and then from ourbusiness perspective, right,
we're overwhelmed with the number of hours we're working

(21:45):
with traffic, with, you know, new AIS that are coming out
every day with, you know, new tools with 16 different
dashboards, our brains. And he sees it as a nervous
based chiropractor. We're fried, we're fried.
Our brains are fried, we're overwhelmed.
And, you know, it's the reason Iwrote, I think I swallow an

(22:07):
elephant because when we left our agency and I was doing this
with all these companies, I didn't realize how overwhelmed I
was because I wasn't taking themmyself.
And I ballooned up to 277 lbs. OK.
I legitimately thought I swallowed an elephant.
You know, there are pictures of me online, You know, a whole
bunch of friends afterwards, youknow, they saw me lose 100 lbs

(22:29):
in about 10 months. And again, that had a real big
impact on people because people said, hey, I need to take care
of, you know, my health. And now, you know, I had to let
just literally about a year ago,I had my health kind of sneak up
on me. I ballooned up a little bit
more, not quite to that level, but my blood sugar was three

(22:49):
times the normal level. And I wasn't paying attention
because I was too busy. I was still walking.
I just checked the average nine 9400 steps a day.
OK, so minimum was 7500, but I was averaging around 10,000
steps a day. I was eating plant based, trying
to get as much work as I could with our startup, with my wife's
home care agency. So you know, my kids, my family,

(23:11):
my dog, like every, everything was just life was lifing.
You know, my brother had a couple of illnesses.
So you know, that was causing stress.
And I realized that my blood sugar had climbed up to 376,
which is over three times to normal level.
And at that moment, I realized, you know, that cut through,
like, you don't want that. It's kind of like, you know,

(23:33):
when you're driving and the sirens go on behind you and
you're like, yeah, boat. Yeah.
That kind of moment. Like, you have to do something.
Don't wait for those moments to get through to people in
business and everything, right? So you have to find ways to
pound your way through there with, like I said, clarity and
impact. Within four months, I got my

(23:54):
blood sugar leveled. All of a sudden I had no more
brain fog, no fatigue, blurry vision's gone, no more aches and
pains. A bunion I had disappeared.
My whole life changed non-stop energy and I wrote the first
draft of I think I Swallowed an Elephant in 10 days.
Wow, that's crazy. Yeah, no, so I was mentioning

(24:15):
I'm about halfway through your book.
Absolutely love it. And you're talking about this
concept the whole time. And I just like to dive a little
bit deeper and maybe actually the, I guess the after effect.
So, you know, you gain 100 lbs or really this could apply to
any life scenario. You know, the business is
failing, you know, breakup or whatever you want to mention.
Slogging through life, yeah. Yeah, talk.
Talk to us about the transition of someone who's in a tough

(24:38):
place, which a lot of people are.
How do you make that transition?You have to change the story.
That's the first, that's the first thing.
You know, When I made the decision to lose the £100, it
was because my kids were young. My middle one had just like
finished T-ball, you know, earlyyears of Little League and had

(25:00):
another one, you know, young onewho was getting ready to start
moving. And I was like, how am I going
to keep up with my kids? And that became my motivating
factor to really get in the bestshape probably since I was a
teenager. So it was, it was great, right?
And you know, the, the good newsis I can still catch my son's,
you know, 80 plus mile per hour fastball today, much easier now

(25:21):
that I don't have the blood sugar issues.
But that story worked until it stopped working.
And like I said, I started creeping up back into the two
40s and the blood sugar went up.I stopped paying attention to
it. And I realized by the way, for
months I knew the story wasn't working.
And I was trying to say, well, what I need a new story.
I didn't know what to do And when I just went for the annual

(25:43):
blood test and got shocked because I like, I couldn't
imagine with my habits that I'd had blood sugar so bad, blood
pressure through the roof. Like I, it just didn't make
sense to me. And it woke me up and I made
decision right there. And I told the nurse
practitioner, I said I need 3 weeks to just change things.

(26:03):
And I came back in three weeks and she, I cut my blood sugar in
half. Then she gave me continuous
glucose monitor and I still wearone of every so often.
This is one of the weeks I'm wearing it.
And once I had the data to what was going on inside my body, I
was then really able to optimizeeverything.
And now my blood sugar hovers in, you know, the 80s, nineties,

(26:25):
like real, real comfortable levels.
I don't get above any outside ofthe norm numbers.
And the story was very simply, Ididn't want to end up, you know,
like my brother, he's got reallysick in the last few years.
I didn't want to live a lifetimeof medication.
I owned a home care agency. I see what goes on with seniors.

(26:46):
I see the dementia. I, I could, I can't live that
life. And so I was like, I need to
empower myself. I know I can be disciplined and
put the priorities into the actions I needed to take.
And so I had a look at all my beliefs, which is the first
thing I tell everybody to do, right?
And that belief that walking 10,000 steps a day and eating

(27:09):
plant based and minimally processed food is enough to keep
me healthy. It wasn't right, so it limited
me. Yeah, no, that, it's, that is so
powerful and that's something I noticed with pest control owners
as well. I have some new partners that
were, you know, taking equity and pest control companies and
such. And one of my partners who he's

(27:31):
worked with like over 500 pest control companies.
He's one of the most well known guys in the space.
And he said really the main problem with at least these
smaller owners is beliefs that they are stuck in the technician
mentality that they are not ready to become the owner.
They have basically just given themselves a glorified job.
So that ties into beliefs too, right?
Of like how? How can they switch that?

(27:52):
100% so I I feel blessed. I've had some amazing mentors in
my life. OK, some of them turned out to
be not the most honorable people, but they they did share
some smart things. And one of the early ones, this
is when we first started our agency.
Way before that, we had a mentorthat said very clearly he wanted

(28:12):
to be temporarily motivated to be permanently lazy.
Let me sing that again, temporarily motivated to be
permanently lazy. And he said, you've got to learn
to get other people's efforts. You need to create scale.
So of course, you know, we've read Michael Gerber.

(28:32):
Michael Gerber, you know, was actually a former client of ours
too. By the way, funny story with the
EMF and everything I did in the early days of conversion, I
documented my thinking, my processes.
So that call to action was a whole bunch of things like
here's what you look at. When we wrote Always Be testing,

(28:53):
it was all the things that we would use to basically train our
analysts on how to plan tests for website owners, because I
didn't want to keep doing it forever.
Yeah, right. So I understood the value of
scale and standard operating procedures and yeah.
And just having, you know, you know, just all of these ways to

(29:14):
pass on knowledge, things like the conversion Trinity, which we
can, we can talk about a simple technique anybody can do to
improve their conversion rates and not waste time with stupid
tests. Talk to me about that.
What is the conversion Trinity? The Conversion Trinity looks at
three things. OK, relevance.
And relevance is relative because it's relative to the
perspective of the person who's coming on your website at that

(29:36):
person, that one person who's coming.
And there are different kinds ofcustomers and we can talk a
little bit more about that. It's value, right?
How do you express that value tothem?
And then it's action, which is how do you develop the
confidence in them to want to take that next action?
And so you can apply this one looking at any ad, you can apply

(29:57):
this one looking at any landing page and any website.
Every page should answer those two questions.
Who is this relevant for? Is it relevant for the customer
I'm trying to talk to today? How am I expressing that value
to them? Is it, you know, clear and
impactful? And lastly, have I closed all
the loops so they're comfortableand have confidence to take
action? If you don't do those three

(30:19):
things, everything's lost. Can you, can you give me an
example of that, of maybe how you've done that for a company
or even just a makeup example? Oh, I mean we used to have it
with. I showed an example on my
webinar yesterday with one of mystudents who had 111% increase
in conversion for one of their people fit deck.

(30:39):
They used to have a playing carddeck where you you know, you
flip the cards and with an in anapp and it give you your
workout, right? So it randomized the exercise.
Great little concept, but they weren't converting that well.
And so we did a few things. He started adding all the logos
for all the different phones that it worked for.
He changed the headline so that it really spoke more to what
they were doing, you know, clarified the benefits a lot

(31:02):
better. I mean, I can, we can throw in a
screenshot so that people can see it.
But yeah, I do it all over the place.
I mean, I did an example yesterday where I did a search
for organic dog food, right? Because I was on a SEO charity
where they're raised raising funds for sheltered dogs and

(31:23):
cats in Ukraine. OK, So I figured organic dog
food's a great example. And I did a search on Google,
found a sponsored ad and you start asking yourself, OK, how
is this relevant to the guy who's are very methodical about
taking care of his dog, right? Maybe maybe he's an accountant
or a cyber security guy or something.
He's just super, super, you know, methodical about

(31:44):
everything he purchases. So when you tell him organic,
like he wants to know to like the spices were used or organic.
OK, Yeah. And you go ahead and you look at
the ads and you look at the landing page and it's like
they're leaving them high and dry.
Because here's the crazy thing, Danny, that I think, I think
almost everybody misses in 19. No, in 2001, I believe it was

(32:07):
shop.org published the first ever benchmark conversion rates
on the website. It was 1.8%.
You know what a good conversion rate?
Direct marketing was? 2%.
You know what the average conversion rate is today?
2%. Still today.
Still today. Now think about it.
Is technology better? Yeah.

(32:28):
Graphics better. The way we access the Internet.
It's faster, people are smarter,we've got tons of books, tons of
content about a marketing, and the conversion rate's still
hovering around 2 to 3% for mostcompanies.
And here's the crazy part. OK, in direct marketing, I send
you something in the mail, hopefully you open it up, right?

(32:51):
You get a postcard, you call up 2% and you're golden.
OK, online I searched for you, Ityped in your name, I saw
something on your social media and I decided to click through
to your website. Tell me why in God's name it
should only be 2% conversion? That is horrible.

(33:14):
That is so bad. Why should it be 10%?
What happened to the other 90% of people?
OK, maybe 50% have ticks in their fingers and they clicked
it by accident. I I don't know.
So 50% gone. What are other excuses for not
coming to your website? Why spend time going to your

(33:37):
website and not buy? That should be the first
question every business owner should be asking themselves.
Yeah, no, that, that is the low hanging fruit.
I talked about this. I, I did 15 hours of recording
with my new partners for this new agency.
And that's a big thing that we were talking about and I was
kind of even realizing it because, you know, you kind of
learn as you teach and we were talking a lot about conversion

(33:58):
rate optimization. I was like, this is the low
hanging fruit. You already have the traffic.
Someone's coming in from Facebook, they're coming in from
Google, wherever they're coming in, they're already on the page.
Like this is your. Job to piss, not to piss them
off like. Yeah, yeah.
So so you talked about page speed.
What other like key components are there then?
I mean, relevance is, is obviously the key.

(34:21):
You know, obviously you talk a lot about SEO as well.
Back in the very early days, I explained search, search engine
marketing, SCO, all of that was all about 5 Rs and those five Rs
will never change. And it's funny, I had a good
friend of mine, Dwayne Forrester, write an article a

(34:42):
few weeks ago about this, about AI in search and looking all
this. And I said, OK, well, it's the
same, it's the same five hours. First, is it relevant, right?
Is it relevant to the searcher? OK.
The only thing that the engines want to do is put you in front
of relevant content for whateverquery you're interested in.
The only thing the algorithms onsocial media want to do is put

(35:03):
things on that they believe yourinterests matched relevance.
They don't want to do anything else.
In fact, you know, years ago I had Ping Jen, the head of the
Quality Score team for Microsoft, bring us in because
he saw me speak about landing page relevance and he wanted me
to explain it to his team because I was explaining in more
human terms, not geek talk. The second one is reputation,

(35:27):
OK. And reputation is, is is twofold
reputation, not only is reviews,obviously at the local level,
it's a really important thing, but also obviously citations,
but more so, you know, can you get media talking about you?
Can you get your partner's talking about you?
So that tells a lot about your reputation plus the behavior
that the sites know about you aswell.

(35:49):
Because obviously Google has analytics everywhere.
They have the browsers, they have Chrome, they have Android,
they know what's going on your website.
They have Gmail, they know when people purchase, didn't
purchase, when they get confirmation receipts.
They know the reputation real well.
And I'll tell you how we found out that that's a whole other

(36:09):
fun story offline. Remarkable.
OK, again, if you want to stand out and you want to grow today,
you just have to produce above and beyond.
It's not five stars. How how would you get everybody
or give you a six star review? OK, because people expect the
five stars today. OK, you really have to go above

(36:29):
that. Then there's readability, OK.
And for the search engine, for the for the AIS, for the LLMS,
how are they consuming your content?
We talked about that earlier. You know, when we first wrote
Persuasive Online copper in 2001, we talked about the
importance of, you know, writingpages with headlines and sub
headlines and interlinking with,you know, keywords in the links.

(36:51):
And the way you write a link is with an impaired verb with
implied value. Like we talked about all this
stuff and guess what, the searchengines like today's those
little short blurbs, FAQ type stuff that's real short.
And so that's a headline with a sub headline and explaining it
in one clear point, like doesn'tchange.
And then the last one is reach. How big of an audience are you

(37:14):
speaking to? OK, my friend Ray Bard, who's
one of the most successful business publisher everywhere.
You know, whenever he'd look at content, he'd look it on a 2 by
2 map and he think about like anocean, right?
So you're reaching mass world, like, you know, pretty girls who
are influencers tend to be kind of more ocean like, right?

(37:37):
Bayous wells and then puddles, right, that are very shallow
and, you know, not very wide. So you kind of have to choose
what market you're playing in, right?
It's very different to compete in the heart of Boston or New
York City than it is in Cedar Park.
You know, Austin, you know, Texas, you know, it's a suburb,

(38:00):
but it's going to be a differentmarket, right?
You're, you're not quite, you know, the, the ocean size of
Austin. You're, you're going to be a
little more, you know, you know,narrower and deeper because it's
a suburb. You could talk specifically that
suburb. It's kind of like what we've
done with my home care agency. You know, we're based in Round
Rock, TX. And so we've worked real hard to

(38:20):
become the best of Round Rock because that gives my reputation
a boost in Round Rock. It's not difficult.
Yeah, yeah. So really, you want to be the
biggest fish, whether that's thebiggest fish in the pond or the
ocean or the lake or whatever you want to call it.
So if you don't have much authority, if you're not a big

(38:43):
figure, which, by the way, this is exactly what I've done with
my agency, you know. Yeah, I'm a young guy.
I have been been in digital marketing for too long,
especially compared to Someone Like You or Dennis or whoever
else. But the way that I can compete
is by niching down on something like pest control and then being
known for just not even pest control marketing, but one skill
within pest control marketing. Right.
And, and not only that, but being remarkable and getting the

(39:03):
results about it. So your clients are talking
about it as well. Other people you're bringing on
are talking about it as well. And so you're building a
reputation and you're building areputation with the
relationships that you have because all the algorithms out
there start understanding the nature of the relationships.
And when you have me on your podcast, when you have Dennis on
your peasant, oh, he said, oh, he hangs around with these
people who have authority in these topics.

(39:25):
He must have some authority. You are who you hang around.
Yeah, no, that's, that's what I'm doing here.
I mean, it's it's for people, but it's also for the search
engines. Maybe that's something we could
even get into that. I feel like as I was starting to
get into SEO, I'm optimizing forthe search engines and trying to
show up in Google. And now eventually it's Chacha,
BT and all these other places. But I've realized, and I think

(39:47):
you'd probably agree, that the search engines are want to show
exactly what the people want to see right there.
There's a clear correspondence that they're basically the same
thing that Google wants to show people that are authoritative
and trustworthy and have a lot of information about themselves
out there. And that's the same thing that
people want, right? So it's it's really funny.

(40:09):
I'll bring up the story of how we found out how reputation
matters so much. And it was more about offline
data sources than it was online sources.
I did a presentation called The Mad Men of Search that if you
look for it on SlideShare, the slides are somehow whited out.

(40:32):
Not by me anyway. We were working with a client
who sold educational toys. OK, And they were well
optimized, like from a conversion point of view, from
an SEO point of view, really well optimized.
But they couldn't beat out, I think it was Hasbro or one of

(40:55):
the big toy companies. Oh, Fisher Price.
Fisher Price, that's what it was.
And Fisher Price, you go to their website and they had like
the big flash thing going on. It was, it was awful.
Like it was not optimized. They didn't have many backlinks.
They didn't. But this is back in the days
when you still had Toys-R-Us andyou still had all this and

(41:16):
people were buying their products more than everybody
else. And I'm like, they've got to be
using other sources of data because there's credit card
data, There's all kinds of otherdata that if I were trying to
understand how to duplicate what's in the real world online,
I would have tapped into, whether I admit it or not.

(41:41):
And knowing all the sources of data that, for example, Google
had, right, I realized that theyhad to be tapping into other
things because it wasn't what was on page.
Because when people thought about educational toys, it was
Fisher Price. It wasn't, you know,
educationaltoys.com, whatever, whatever their name was back in
the day. And I think when you understand

(42:03):
that, yeah, Google's only job, right?
All the algorithm dollars just to give you what you want, OK,
as fast as possible and where it's going now with AI, right?
You know, search, it's only going to be quicker.
So you have less and less time to do all of these things to
stand out and build a reputationin your area.
So, you know, own that local because that local can be

(42:27):
valuable, and then bridge it from there.
Awesome. So I think you, you've probably
gotten asked this a million times, but I'm almost just going
to ask it for fun and we can playoff.
This is, is SEO finally dead? You know, people have been
saying it forever, but is it dead?
Like a lot of people are saying that now, but they kind of
always been saying it. So let's go back to this

(42:49):
definition of the of the five Rs.
Are there platforms out there that people are accessing or the
search engine are accessing thatmake it really difficult for the
search engine to read all the deeper data they have?
Yes, right. There's some technical
limitations. I've got applications, there's
there's data inside the phone apps that, you know, it doesn't

(43:12):
have access to. I mean, they just announced
Instagram is gonna open up to Google Now, right?
They didn't have all that Instagram data beforehand.
So will there always be a side where there's some technical SEO
that we need to do to work well within the LMS to show up
properly for them or for whatever the future search

(43:33):
exists? Yeah.
You know, TikTok is a search engine algorithm.
Will the keyword research alwaysmatter?
Will, you know, writing and scripting and video and all that
matter? It's going to evolve.
The skills going to change a little bit.
But the core concept of what made search, search is truly the

(43:53):
exact opposite of direct mail, right?
Which is, yes, great marketing that's pulled towards you.
And so we've got to start saying, well, that's really the
direction that we're just going to head into in the future no
matter what. That's never going away.
And do you agree with the concept that it's moving from
like keyword oriented to now kind of like topical authority

(44:17):
and that you have to be overall the authority in a subject
matter or topic? Yeah.
Well, it's, it's also going fromthe, you know, and I remember
when, you know, the average keyword search was one word,
then it went to two words, then it went to three words, you
know, and now we're getting fullsentences and chat.
And now we're, you know, people are, you know, going in voice
and asking queries that way. So that's changing again.

(44:40):
I'm going to bring it to the five Rs.
What's your reputation? Are you remarkable?
That's your authority. Like that's it.
Right. So focus on the five Rs that's.
The time principle, they're never going to go away.
And like I mentioned with Life Spring Cairo, right, we went
ahead and optimized a lot of hiswebsite, his social media, his

(45:02):
office experiences, because theyall play in this.
And I use this example the otherday because he had his the head
basketball coach for UT basketball in their final four
tournament. And they sent them a text
message saying they found the nervous system for the arena.

(45:23):
So could you imagine you're a head coach about to play one of
the biggest tournaments of your life and your messaging your the
chiropractor. I'm like, that's branding
because they think everything nervous base is now him.
They saw that Control Center. Then he that literally the same

(45:45):
day or next day, he's watching avideo with some of these other
athletes and he had asked them some questions.
They were playing some fun videos and they were
articulating the exact same language that we helped craft
what we call our brandable chunks, OK, in those videos.
So everybody likes to talk aboutword of mouth marketing.

(46:07):
Well, word of mouth marketing iswhen I can put our brandable
chunks in your words, your mouth, when you can share the
story of, let's say I think I swallow an elephant.
The way you perceive it is way more valuable than all the other
testimonials because it's got tocome from you.
And it's one of the coolest things I've seen with this book

(46:27):
as opposed to any other book I've ever written, is that
people take from it from where they are in their perspective
and their journey in their life.And so the reviews are way
different that I've seen than than any other book.
But that's the beauty of of planting seeds of language to
these brandable chunks that we call it.
Those show up because those are the things that get stuck in

(46:51):
your head, that when you search for it, the ones who use it most
effectively are the ones who arealways going to stand out.
Can you give an example of that?Of maybe like a local business
who could apply that? Yes, probably.
I have to think about it. I'll give you another small

(47:13):
business we used years ago. We were working with a joystick
company. They did like industrial grade
joystick simulators that pluggedinto your PC.
And back then everything was kind of flimsy plastic and all
of that. And we helped them rewrite their
copy that was very SEO optimized.
We helped them write it to have more impact and we changed the

(47:33):
language to the first headline to built like a friggin tank,
OK. And so we had customers e-mail
stuff that Oh my God, this thingreally is built like a friggin
tank, stuff like that. But a few weeks later there was
a mention in like PC Magazine orsomething like that that
reviewed it and used the exact same phrase.

(47:54):
And so, you know, if a high authority website like PC
Magazine is now using that phrase, other people are looking
joystick like a tank. Who's the only one who's going
to show up? Yeah, that one.
Right. Or here's here's, here's another
example. I was working with a new

(48:16):
entrepreneur. He's been in a number of
businesses, he's been working with founders to help them get
their content out. And he developed a framework
that he called the Organic AI Content Cascade, whatever that
means words are, but it didn't make sense.
And so I'm sitting with him and we're at a coffee shop here

(48:36):
locally. And I'm like, oh, Fernando,
you're what you're really talking about is the viral
genius framework. And he looked at me like, what
do you mean? I'm like, well, every founder,
every business owner has their own zone of genius.
Every home care country. The reason that they start and
want to do their own is because they saw their own genius way of

(49:00):
how to approach the industry. OK.
And what he does is he helps them package that language
through interviews and stuff like that and get that content
out there so it has an opportunity to spread.
So at first he was really cautious with me because he
says, oh, I don't know about that viral part.
Is that over promising? He just posted yesterday
testimony from one of his clients.
They've gone viral several timesand just keep growing.

(49:22):
They went from like 500 views onInstagram to 6000 to people
asking to be on podcast of recognizing him to calling
prospects and they're actually answering the phone instead of
ignoring them now. Only because we changed that one
phrase because organic AI content cascade doesn't stick
viral genius with a logo that wemade that looks like rated PG.

(49:45):
So viral genius on the bottom itsays VG, which also has
psychological layers of very good, right.
It plays on the content part of movie and people never forget
it. And he's been speaking on stages
now and getting a bunch of clients and obviously getting
them viral. I mean, I sit with business
owners all day long trying to help them here locally in the

(50:08):
chamber, come up with some of these Nuggets because it's just,
it's just hard to stand out, right?
If you're a fitness coach, how do you stand out from every
other fitness coach out there, right?
If you're a roofer, how do you stand out?
It's hard. I love that.
So that's it's almost like a a term or several terms that you
can trademark. Basically.

(50:29):
That's almost how I'm thinking about it, that this is like you
have come up with the strategy or the framework or the
architecture. And actually this, this plays
perfectly into my next question,which was let's talk about your
persuasion architecture. So that's something that you've
coined or trademarked or whatever you want to call it.
Talk to us about that. And that's, that's one of the,
the many brandable terms that you've come up with.

(50:51):
Yeah, it's actually we have a patent on it from years ago.
It all started with kind of the same things, three simple
questions that we looked at, OK,and we understood.
And this is the whole premise ofwhy the book actually got wrote
and written. I think I saw an elephant

(51:13):
because I realized, how do you mean an elephant?
One bite at a time, right? And it's a micro action, right?
The big action is eating the whole elephant.
But most of us try to think of our website as that big action.
But every click, every time I have to read a paragraph is a

(51:33):
micro decision. Do I keep scrolling or do I
bounce? Do I click or do I go to another
website? OK.
And so we understood the power of every little moment.
And so we said, look, it's all based on three simple questions.
Who do we need to take action, relevance.
What action do they want to take?

(51:56):
Again? How do we build value for what
they want to achieve? And then what can we do to in
order to now I'm blanking out, what can we do to help them take
that action essentially, right. And with what action we want
them taken. So it's planning every single
one of those little clicks that we built tools for and processes

(52:18):
for. And that's what made sites a
rank better because all the interlinking that we used to do,
because if you had a question ona particular phrase and you
didn't answer the first time, weanswered on the next one.
And we would get, you know, conversion lifts of 500 percent,
1000%, like just insane numbers because they were just playing a

(52:39):
different game than everybody else.
And so we took that process and unfortunately, it took months to
plan out for clients. It wasn't, it wasn't a simple
process because it was literallyevery click.
And you had to define like what personas were going to be on
this page and what was mattered to them.
And that would go to the copywriter and they would start,
right? It took forever and then we

(53:00):
eventually when we started working for Google, they loved
the process, but they wanted something was more agile and we
created Buyer Legends, which is our revised version of that,
which you can do in as little as90 minutes, OK.
Talk about that. Yeah.
So it's it's, it's the same process, right?
We're just telling the story of who that customer is, really

(53:24):
getting an understanding of who that persona is.
There's a lot of details on how we do that.
That's in multiple of our books.But then we're planning what
that journey looks like, what that narrative looks like, what
the story is. Because the reality is every
person who comes to you is living in their own story,
right? I called the other day to have a

(53:46):
tune up on my garage door. OK, It's just making a couple of
noises. It's getting summertime here in
Austin. I'm like, I might as well get it
checked out. And they came and they left me
some quotes and it's a friend ofmine's company.
Of course, he said he'll take care of me when I'm ready to
replace my door. But you know, they came with
this quote. It's like, you know, we can't

(54:07):
really do the tune up because itneeds too much at this point.
Like when it dies, I'm going to replace the door.
Like that's, that's where it is not worth spending money on.
But it's that. But they didn't take the time as
much as they could have to understand where I was and why I
was calling. And I told him about it a little

(54:27):
bit, but didn't hear it. And when you don't understand
where the customer story's coming from, you can't move them
forward in any kind of momentum,right?
That's when you start getting ignored.
Yeah, no, I had a Brigham Dickinson on my podcast, I think
a month or two ago. You might be familiar with him.
He, he's one of the top guys whotrained CSRS in the home service

(54:50):
space. And one of the things he says is
a big problem with picking up the phone, replying to leads, is
that someone will say, hey, you know, I need a garage door fix
or my AC is broken or whatever. And they'll go, OK, great,
what's your address? We'll be over there.
And that there's no like, actualdiving into the story,
understanding them, understanding their problems.
Yeah, there's no empathy to start with.

(55:12):
I was at Servicetitan conference, thing was last year,
last or two years ago, and they talked about it, right?
You know, they're monitoring allof these calls and they're
listening to it. And it's like they know by the
number of questions you spend, you know, the likelihood of
conversion, the more questions, the more likely they are to

(55:33):
convert. And everyone wants to get to
book, book, book, book, book. That's why we got 2% conversion
rates. Yeah, no, 100%.
One of the last things I want tocover here was you working with
big companies like Google and Dell and Disney, which is just
crazy. And you know, obviously most
companies will never reach that level, but I just want to like
jump into that world for a second of First off, what's it

(55:55):
even like to work with companiesat that scale?
And you know, what are they doing that others are doing, and
what are they still not doing right?
Well, there's a reason we no longer work with big companies,
because there's lots of frustration in working with
them. They just get much better at
operations. You know, some of them have
truly brilliant people. Google, you know, again, had

(56:18):
some amazingly brilliant people,you know, And then you've got
companies like Universal Orlando, where when Al came to
us, he had tried two other redesigns, couldn't increase the
conversion rate. He was about to get fired if he
didn't get a 10% conversion rate.
And we walk in there and you know, 75 feet of research about

(56:40):
their customers, but not asking all the right questions.
And we just started changing thequestions around, start doing
some research with them and got them not even a full
implementation. And they still got an 80% lift
in conversion rate because we started answering the right
questions and he couldn't get the full thing implemented
because again, the politics of this the that, but he got enough

(57:01):
of it done and got the win. And then he wasn't ready to do
more because he got his win and he was done.
And we've seen this over and over again.
You know, we helped overstock.com with the CEO of
Patrick, Patrick Burden. We worked with him literally
overnight, gave him a solution, made a change it we found out
later on and accounted for a $25million lift in sales from

(57:22):
changing one graphic. And they never, ever did another
change after that. Well, we work with Dell, with my
friend Sam before they left, andhe wanted a report of all the
things that they can do to improve the conversion rate in
the website. And he's like, OK, you know, I
mean, the report was like 65 pages long.
He said, OK, well, what do we do?
First he came back with a spreadsheet.

(57:43):
He helped us learn more about prioritization and big
companies, which is a big thing.And we came up with one test
that gave them 10s of millions of dollars over and over again,
year after year until the beef section finally took it over and
did the same thing. They never did anything else
from that book. So you can have big gains and

(58:04):
big companies and then nothing else happens or somebody changes
position and everything else is just gone.
So interesting. We like working with decision
makers and people who commit whocan just commit to I'm the owner
and you know I can make it happen.
Yeah, definitely. You said you said they were.

(58:26):
Right. Yeah.
Can you execute? You said they're not asking the
right questions. What are the right questions?
It depends on the industry. So for example, with Universal,
they were, this is at the time right now they talk a lot about
Harry Potter world and all that.But back then they were really

(58:48):
pitching that, you know, competing against Disney, that
they had like a little Seuss world for the kids and stuff
like that. And one of the things we found
out is when we talked to people as they were coming to the
doors, Doctor Seuss actually turned them off.
Like when the kids were in the rides, I was fine, but it was
turning them off. And to the point where our third
party analyst who was doing the surveys for us, within the first

(59:10):
question, he was able to know whether these people were going
to be completely turned off or not.
It was just so obvious how how blatant of a problem it was.
And so just by helping them understand how complex the sale
was, what things matter to theircustomers, in what order it
mattered to their customers, it changed everything.
Or you know, you know, we workedwith Webex in a day who thought

(59:32):
they had 42 personas, different kinds of groups buying from
them. We boiled it down, it was really
6-6 people who bought kind of the same way.
We're able to simplify the content, simplify the messaging,
increase conversions. People over complicate things a
lot and they suffer from a lot of curses of knowledge.
They think their customers care about their product or their

(59:52):
service as much as they do. The typical pest control owner,
how many hours a day does he think about pest control?
A lot. OK, the typical customer, how
many hours do they want to spendthinking about pest control in a
year? 0.
You've got a problem there. Interesting.

(01:00:14):
OK, yeah, talk to me more about that of like that discrepancy.
And we, we were even discussing this before the call that you
actually think the angle for pest control is like, hey, you
know, we're not even here. We're invisible.
You don't want to worry about bugs.
It's almost embarrassing to havea pest control truck in front of
your house. Talk more about that if like how
that applies to pest control andother home services.

(01:00:34):
I would steal the campaign. Got Milk.
Got Milk was a great ad campaignthat worked in the absence of
milk. Think about that.
So I'm like got bugs. You shouldn't and you shouldn't
have pest control guy breaking the, you know, the time of your
day to come spray everywhere. Like you just don't want bugs.

(01:00:55):
Great. We're going to be invisible.
We're going to come. We're going to spray during the
daytime. We're going to come a few times
during the year. You're never going to notice us,
but you're not going to see bugs.
And if you've got bugs, it's ourfault.
So you, you have to get really clear on the messaging and that
comes from understanding your target market.
I feel like a a pretty big thing.
You've probably seen this, that a lot of people are talking

(01:01:15):
about offers now, like Alex or Mosey at his really famous book,
$100 million offers. Everyone's talking about offers,
but not so much the messaging around it.
So I feel like, I feel like you're really filling that gap
of like, no, we, we still need everything around the offer as
well and how we're portraying that.
You got to start first with building value.
So you know, my brother Jeffrey is now helping Elmer Zubiata who

(01:01:35):
sold Zubi's build a company called zubi.com out in San
Antonio. It's a new home services
companies and they want to take care of like your monthly
maintenance. You know, your, your honey to do
lists. You know, you, you probably
don't have that right now, but you know, if you've got change
the filters in the air conditioner, you've got to check
the smoke detectors, You've got to, you know, change light bulbs

(01:02:00):
and feed up all these other things.
You know, you need to paint thatbathroom that hasn't been
painted a long time. They want to offer all of these
home maintenance things. So what they started doing is
actually putting out checklists of monthly maintenance things,
four people. So either they can do it
themselves or they can pay a lowmonthly fee and have somebody

(01:02:21):
come in and they can enjoy theirSaturday.
That's a good angle. Yeah.
So again, right. It's, but it's bringing value to
the customer first by saying, hey, look, we know you have all
these tasks to do like everyone else.
You know, you've probably got anelephant on your shoulder.
There's my little elephant, right?

(01:02:43):
Big elephant sitting on your shoulder.
You're overwhelmed. You're stressed out.
By the time Saturday comes, you want to get it done, but you
don't have to really the time todo it.
You get caught up with this, themowing, the grass of it.
Let us come once a month, give you the Peace of Mind.
And you know, all of these things will be taken care of for
you. Value upfront.

(01:03:04):
It's a much simpler offer because we're trying to say,
hey, we know you got to do this well.
And you know, yeah, you probablyfeel bad you're not doing it,
and your wife is probably complaining that you haven't
gotten it done easy. We can take care of it for you.
Love that. Just simple but still value
oriented. You have these problems, we're

(01:03:24):
solving the problems. It's just, I feel like that's
kind of what I'm getting from this overall show is like your
service should be fairly simple and the way that you portray
that should be simple like stop,you know, generating tons of
blogs, stop generating tons of content.
Like get really clear on a greatservice and then get really
clear on the messaging of that service.

(01:03:45):
Correct. Correct.
That's exactly it. Yeah, awesome.
To close off here, Brian, I'd like you to just give a final
message to either local marketers or local business
owners. Like what do you want to leave
the people off with? What?
What do they need to know? I think one of the biggest
things, you know, from this point in my life, I would say is

(01:04:10):
if you don't have clarity in your life, you're not going to
have clarity in your messaging, you're not going to have clarity
in your business, you're not going to have clarity in your
relationships. And those things matter and
spend the time on you because there's no sense in you being
burnt out when everyone else around you is also being burnt
out. And we see the amount of chronic

(01:04:33):
disease out there and all these issues, lack of attention that
everybody has. Be the source that is paying
attention, that is delivering attention to people, and people
will be attracted to you. I love that.
So good. Well, this has been an awesome
show, Brian. I've learned so much from you.

(01:04:54):
You know, the, the five Rs, the kind of the four pillars we
have, the the three, you know, aspects of conversion, all of
this so great. You are so amazing.
You've been an awesome podcast guest and it's it's been an
absolute honor to have you on the show.
Thank you so much and I really appreciate it.
And you are doing remarkable things.
You're standing out and I love seeing the content you're

(01:05:16):
putting out there and the impactthat you're making on your
community and in your clients and just just keep delivering.
Thank you, Brian. I really appreciate that.
And where can people find you, learn more about you, your
services, all the stuff you're doing?
You could probably search for meanywhere and you'll find me, you
know, lots and lots of content out there.
But yeah, you know my website, brianeisenberg.com, you know
LinkedIn, you know Facebook. Yeah, I'm just, I'm just about

(01:05:39):
everywhere you can find me. Awesome and you've got 7 books I
believe. What?
What's the first one 11/11/11 OK, I only I only saw seven.
I guess there's even more than that.
That's that's my bad as an interview.
OK, so of year 11 what? What book should people read
first of years? So my several people have
interviewed this who've read allmy books that you know, this is

(01:06:00):
this is our greatest hits in in one volume made really simple
and clear for the first time. Every chapter is 250 to 400
words and there's lots of Nuggets in there.
So I think I swallowed an elephant.
The stories we sell, the successwe build just became available
today as we're speaking on Audible.

(01:06:21):
So you can get that. Be like Amazon is also a
fantastic book. And then if you've got young
kids, you want to, you know, getthem interested in being an
entrepreneur, have them read theRice and Beans Millionaire.
Awesome, love that. OK cool.
So definitely go read. I think I swallowed an elephant.
I'm about halfway through. I love it.
Make sure to go follow him on LinkedIn, Twitter, all other

(01:06:44):
platforms. All those links will be in the
description. And yeah, thank you so much for
coming on, Brian. It's been awesome.
Absolutely, Danny. So thank you so much for having
me. Absolutely.

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Top Marketing Expert: The Crazy Strategy I Used For Google and Disney! - Bryan Eisenberg

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