LIZETTE CLOETE: Have You Heard of Elopement in Dementia? What Caregivers Should Know.

Elopement usually conjures up visions of secret excursions or maybe even the Elvis Chapel in Las Vegas. But elopement is also used to describe what happens when someone with dementia or cognitive loss leaves a safe area, such as a home or care facility, without supervision or awareness of the potential dangers.  In dementia care facilities, it is a heartbreaking reality that needs urgent attention.

With over 30 years of experience as an occupational-therapist-turned-dementia-coach and 5 years of being a daughter-of-dementia, our guest, Lizette Cloete  OTR/L, CADDCT, CDP, shares her first-hand, personal experience with elopement, how it can lead to accidents, injuries, and even death as a result of hypothermia, malnutrition, and weight loss, and why there is a huge need to protect vulnerable residents living in long term facilities.  Lizette is the owner of “Think Different” Dementia, helping families navigate dementia together, using science-backed strategies, has become a sought-after speaker on dementia-related topics, both nationally and internationally. Her podcast, Christian Dementia Caregiving, is a key resource for connecting and sharing her valuable insights.

In 2023, Lizette was awarded a grant to create an online education and coaching community for family care partners. She is truly a fount of information and support for our caregiving community.  We recount personal stories, including a tragic incident from 1994, highlighting the dire consequences of inadequate staffing and training in these facilities. By sharing these narratives, we stress the critical need for improvements in care and safety measures to protect vulnerable individuals. The broader implications of facility understaffing reveal a pressing need for vigilance and proactive strategies to prevent similar tragedies.

Understanding and managing dementia-related wandering is a complex challenge for caregivers and families. From unpredictable behaviors to ethical dilemmas around monitoring technology, we discuss real-life anecdotes that underscore the relentless nature of wandering. With hopes pinned on proactive engagement and innovative solutions, we aim to inspire meaningful change in caregiving practices, ensuring the safety and well-being of loved ones.

Connect with Lizette: Think Different Dementia
Christian Dementia Caregiving

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Episode Transcript

Angela Fairhurst (00:01):
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Don Priess (01:06):
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Alzheimer's sucks.

(01:29):
It's an equal opportunitydisease that chips away at
everything we hold dear, and todate there's no cure.
So until there is, we continueto fight with the most powerful
tool in our arsenal Love.
This is Love Conquers Alls, areal and really positive podcast
that takes a deep dive intoeverything Alzheimer's the good,

(01:51):
the bad and everything inbetween.
And now here are your hosts,suzy Singer-Carter and me, don
Preece.

Susie Singer Carter (02:04):
Hello, I'm Suzy Singer-Carter.

Don Priess (02:07):
And I'm Don Preece, and this is Love Conquers Alls.
Hello, Susan.

Susie Singer Carter (02:12):
Donald, how are you today?

Don Priess (02:15):
I'm uh, it's, it's well, this is actually a little
later than we normally do a show, which I kind of like.

Susie Singer Carter (02:21):
I like that not getting up in the morning
thing.

Don Priess (02:24):
Yeah it's great.

Lizette Cloete (02:26):
I mean, we could do it at.

Don Priess (02:28):
No, or a midday person either, and night makes
me tired.

Susie Singer Carter (02:34):
So pretty much you're tired all the time
yeah but pretty much.
It's a big problem folks.

Don Priess (02:41):
It is.

Susie Singer Carter (02:42):
Feel me, feel me on this.
I'm going to never watch amovie with John, because this is
what you'll see.

Lizette Cloete (02:51):
It's the dog.
I keep telling you our dog.

Don Priess (02:55):
It's a little Yorkie .

Susie Singer Carter (02:56):
We're roommates, by the way, john and
I are roommates.

Don Priess (03:00):
The dog tucks itself into your hip and literally
sends magical sleep vibes intoyour body.
That you cannot overcome, youcannot overcome them.

Susie Singer Carter (03:10):
So dogs get blamed for everything, don't
they?
We just use them for absolutely, absolutely it's like who broke
this dish?

Don Priess (03:19):
Who?
Yeah, who broke the dish Dogdid it yeah.

Speaker 5 (03:26):
So what's happening?

Susie Singer Carter (03:28):
Well, you know I was.
Newsletters are so timeconsuming.
Can I complain for a second?

Don Priess (03:37):
Do I have a choice?

Susie Singer Carter (03:39):
No, you don't have a choice.
But if anybody out therelistening has any advice on how
to like streamline this, I,maybe I should use ai, but then
I feel like I'm cheating youknow like you are.
I don't know I feel like it'snot my voice because I haven't
really tried it yet for that,but I I always know, I know I
need to do a newsletter becauseI want everyone to be up to date

(04:01):
.
Our guest that we have today isvery good on that.
She's super good on newsletters.
Everybody's better than me onnewsletters.
I'd rather just talk.

Don Priess (04:13):
Except for me.
Yeah, I'm not.
I would be terrible at that.

Susie Singer Carter (04:17):
Yeah, you're worse than me.
No, it's just that to me, I gettoo attached to making them
perfect.
I'm into the production of itall and then I realized three
hours just went by for aone-page thing, right.
And then also the technology isreally clunky.

(04:37):
I'm using MailChimp Sorry,MailChimp, but I mean, but it's
not very intuitive.
Honestly, I can't figure outwhy things don't work the same.
Can you help me?

Don Priess (04:53):
I just uploaded a new it was obviously created by
a monkey.
How good do you think it'sgoing to be?
It's right in the name.
It's in the name.

Susie Singer Carter (05:05):
You're right, I don't know, you should
maybe use male smart guy orsomething.
I don't know.

Don Priess (05:16):
Instead of.

Susie Singer Carter (05:18):
Mail chip.
Okay, that's done.
I'm done with that.
Okay, got it.
Feel better I feel much betternow.
Yeah, good I was feeling reallydumb, like every time I upload
new subscribers from like amailing list that I have or it's
not a mailing list.
I don't buy lists, it's justpeople that I've aggregated and

(05:39):
then I do it and then it's likethat I go oh, there's nothing
there.
It says it says no one'ssubscribed, but I say that
they're subscribed.
So someone please help me withthis.

Don Priess (05:48):
I'm having issues and I shouldn't have to maybe
somebody in tech support islistening right now, who knows?
Yeah, I do, I know, and I'mtired of hearing about it.

Susie Singer Carter (05:55):
So, yeah, let's fix it all right, I put it
out there in the ether let'stalk about the important things.
Now let's talk about our okay,okay, what are those?

Lizette Cloete (06:04):
Well, our guests today, I would love to.

Susie Singer Carter (06:07):
Yeah, we're sort of branching out in our
Alzheimer's conversation and Ilike it.

Don Priess (06:12):
Definitely.

Susie Singer Carter (06:13):
I hope the people listening like it,
because I think it's important.
There's a lot of-.

Don Priess (06:18):
I do too.

Susie Singer Carter (06:19):
Podcasts now.
When we started there wasn'tFour years ago there was not a
lot.
There are a lot now.
So you have a lot of choices,but I think you should just
stick with me and don and ournext guest other than that
that's it.
I support all my except for yeah, unless our next guest has a
podcast, then I think we shouldbring everyone should bring

(06:43):
their own, you know flavor,otherwise there's just a lot of
the same.
But then again that's okay too.
I'm totally contradictingmyself because, yeah, maybe you
like the way someone else saysit better.
You like a more serious person.
I'd rather bring it to you in amore fun way, a little lighter
way, because it's such a heavybreezy, if you will.

(07:05):
Breezy, you are breezy, Anyway.
So without further ado, go DonDo your job.

Don Priess (07:14):
I'll do that.
Lizette Kluta is a veteranoccupational therapist, pastor's
wife and daughter of twoparents with cognitive loss.
With over 30 years ofexperience as an occupational
therapist turned dementia coach,and five years of being a
daughter of dementia, she hasbecome a sought-after speaker on
dementia-related topics, bothnationally and internationally.

(07:35):
Her podcast, Christian DementiaCaregiving, is a key resource
for connecting and sharing hervaluable insights.
In 2023, Lizette was awarded agrant to create an online
education and coaching communityfor family care partners.
She is truly a fount ofinformation and support for our
caregiving community and we aredelighted to have her with us

(07:58):
today.
So, without further ado, let'ssay hello to Lizette Kluta.
Hello Lizette.

Speaker 5 (08:04):
Thank you so much.
You did such a good job on thename.
I'm always proud of people whenthey attempt it and then they
crush it.
It's wonderful.

Don Priess (08:14):
I feel yes.

Susie Singer Carter (08:16):
Yes my day is made.
My day is made.
I love this woman.
She's from South Africa, see,south Africa.
There's my only thing I can doand shame, shame, right.
And we got to talk.
I got to talk on Lizette'spodcast and we had such a great

(08:38):
conversation and she brought upthis topic that we're going to
talk about today, which iseloping, which is not getting
married in Vegas.
This is a whole other topic,right, and I said that's such a
great conversation because mymother eloped and many people
I've talked to have eloped, andI wanted Lizette to talk about

(09:00):
this because she has put a lotof attention and focus onto this
matter that we I think most ofus have dealt with that with
somebody with dementia orAlzheimer's, and I think so.
Thank you for coming on to havethis conversation.

Speaker 5 (09:18):
You're welcome.
Do you remember the story Itold you that precipitated the
conversation about elopement?

Susie Singer Carter (09:25):
I want you to remind me and my readers here
I'm a reader, you guys aren'treading.

Speaker 5 (09:33):
It works that way, right?
Yeah, so when we were, when wewere conversing I believe it was
, I don't believe it was when wewere recording but when we were
talking I mentioned one of myvery, very first jobs when my
husband and I moved to theUnited States in 1993.
This would have been January of1994.

(09:56):
I had a terrible, terribleexperience going to work one day
, and so you've got to thinkabout it.
This is 1994.
It's pre-cell phone Life was,you know, very vastly different.
I was young and dumb.
I was 23 years old as a brandspanking new occupational

(10:18):
therapist, working at a skillednursing facility in Fort Wayne.
Working at a skilled nursingfacility in Fort Wayne, indiana,
in January.
My husband and I had one carwhich meant he drove me to work
in the morning.
I'd go to work at 7 am and hewould pick me up after work in
the afternoon at 3.30.
And so I want people to picturein their mind you know it's

(10:41):
cold, it's winter, it's anursing facility, you know you
can drive in the United Statesby a nursing facility or a
funeral home.
And no, it's a nursing facilityor a funeral home.
They kind of all look similar.
And he pulled up the car and Igot out and the very first thing
I saw was a wheelchair outsidethe building.

(11:02):
But, like I I said, I was youngand dumb At that point.
To me, a wheelchair just meant awheelchair.
Now, 30 years later, awheelchair means where's the
person in the wheelchair?
There's a wheelchair.
But at that time it was very,very ignorant and naive and I
didn't think, oh, there's awheelchair outside.
I just thought there's awheelchair outside.

(11:24):
I just thought there's awheelchair outside, it needs to
go in.
And I distinctly remember goingup to the wheelchair and
breaking it out of the ice Right.
So it's January in Fort Wayne,indiana and starting to go in,
and my husband pulled the car,reversed the car out and the
beams of the car alighted on theperson who had been in the

(11:48):
wheelchair, and so my immediateresponse was to run inside as
quickly as I could get the staff, you know, come back outside,
because this is a person who isoutside and it's January and
it's cold.
But I'll never forget what shelooked like, because she was

(12:08):
obviously an older female personwho had gotten out of a nursing
home in the middle of the nightand she died outside that
nursing home and it is calledelopement.
Right in a facility, the personelopes from the facility.
The other word that people knowmore commonly here is now we

(12:32):
talk about people wanderingright.
They wander away.
It's the same concept but theformal word for it is elopement.
They've eloped.
They didn't have permission toleave the building, but the
reality of the matter is thatthat never should have happened.
Like in a facility.
It never should have happened.
She was at the far end of thefacility and had to go through

(12:56):
several double doors before sheeven got out of the building.
They're supposed to check onresidents overnight.
You know there should be noreason why it was 7 o'clock in
the morning.
They hadn't even startedlooking for her before I got to
work.
Now, fast forward, you know, 31years later, I would not have

(13:17):
run in.
I would have gone in and called911, and called 911 and I would
have started steps to have itbe really looked at what
occurred.
But you know, hindsight's 20-20.
As we get older we learn moreand we know better what to do.
But I will never, ever, everforget that patient, and that

(13:44):
was, you know, she was livingthere and she had dementia, and
it's something I don't think wetalk about enough in the health
care space, or even inAlzheimer's care, that a person
can elope from home and we don'tthink about that.

Susie Singer Carter (13:59):
No, it's first of all what a horrible
experience.
No, it's first of all what ahorrible experience, obviously
for the woman and you as a young, you know person.
And her family, her family, allof that, and you know.

(14:21):
Again I'm going to go back tothe reason why we're doing no
Country for Old People, ourdocumentary, because those
things, like you you said,should never happen.
And if these facilities weren'tunderstaffed and were better,
it had people that were bettertrained because they were
staffed properly and therefore,of course, paid properly and
therefore they were moreinvested in their job, they
would those things would.
Those would be the exception tothe rule, but they're not,

(14:44):
because it happens all the time.
I mean, my mother was foundthree miles away from the
facility that where she was inmemory care and it's supposed to
be locked.
And then there's, you know, andthen people that we've
interviewed even for thedocumentary, this lovely family,
the stewart's.
Their mother was found deadoutside.

(15:05):
Nobody knew why she was in amemory care lockdown situation,
there was no way to get out, andyet they know that she died
from falling out of somewhere.
Because there was no, there wasno way for her to get down
without anyone seeing her, so noone was watching.
And the trauma that is put onthis family, and again, this

(15:30):
family is just one of millionsof things.
You know where things havehappened, where they shouldn't
have happened.
You know it's horrible, I mean,it's horrifying, and these
memories don't leave you.
They stay forever.

Speaker 5 (15:46):
No, they stay forever and they change you forever.
I absolutely agree they changeyou forever.
It changed me as a human, butit also changed me as a
therapist.

Susie Singer Carter (16:00):
In a good way or as a therapist.

Speaker 5 (16:03):
In a very good way.
I'm way more assertive withpeople related to safety than I
might have been if I didn't havethat experience.
Right, I'm a lot more direct.
I'm pretty direct.
South Africans are direct.

Susie Singer Carter (16:22):
Yes, you are, yes, you are.

Speaker 5 (16:25):
Right.
So that's just a fact, factthat's never going to change.
However, in the same vein, youknow I will tell people things
that they don't like to, thatthey don't want to hear, because
it's truly a safety concern forthe person, safety concern for
the person I'll never forget.
Recently, within the last fewyears, I was still working in

(16:47):
home health and I had awonderful couple that had been
married for they weren't evensuper old.
She was 14 when they gotmarried and there was a
backstory as to why she was asyoung as she was, but they'd
been married like 65 years.
They were in their late 70s,you know early 80s, and um

(17:10):
brother-in-law I don't know ifyou have this much in california
, but where I live in thecountry, uh, people have um mom
and you know somebody livesthere, and then there's a
sibling or grandkids and it'slike this mushroom of a whole
community of families that areall on the same property or
within sitting distance of oneanother.

(17:32):
And she had severe Alzheimer'sand he would allow her to walk
to the brother's house, whichwas right next door, and I told
them immediately the very firsttime I met them.
I'm like that's not a safesituation for her and he's like
no, she's been doing it forever.
I'm like you.

(17:53):
It's not a safe situationbecause she's not the person she
used to be and she can getturned around.
She can.
She can decide in her mind thatshe's going somewhere else and
take off and you're never goingto find her again.
Or you know, it's summer inSouth Carolina, she falls in a

(18:14):
ditch and and she's laying outthere and get heat stroke and
all these other things.
But but people, people who aretaking care of somebody with
dementia at home, do notnecessarily think that they're
going to walk away from home,but the statistics actually show
that 80% of all people livingwith dementia will wander from

(18:38):
home at least once.
At least once, and aren't they?

Don Priess (18:42):
usually trying to find their home.
Aren't they trying to walk, ordo they know where?
Like, where are they going?
Are they trying to find wherethey were, or we don't know that
?

Speaker 5 (18:54):
I don't think there's really a way to know.
I think, if I think there canbe so many different reasons, a
person can get something intheir head and they may decide
it's five o'clock, it's dusk,it's time to go home from work.
They may, in their mind, bethinking they're at work and
it's time to leave and to gohome, or they may truly start

(19:14):
out thinking I'm going to mybrother-in-law's house across
the yard and take off andhalfway there forget what they
were doing, turn around and getturned around and go off in a
different direction.
I think it's very difficult totruly know or understand what
they are thinking, but thereality of the matter is just
because somebody hasn't done itdoesn't mean that they're not

(19:38):
going to do it.
Recently I had a blessing.
I had an opportunity to be asupport person on a
dementia-supported cruise andthere was a gentleman who was on
that cruise who never wanderedaway from home, but on the

(19:59):
cruise he wandered away threetimes.
Three times on a cruise Once inthe hotel in Fort Lauderdale,
which was pretty darn scary.
Once, once when we were on thecruise itself, and once the last
day.
And you know, we were we.

(20:19):
We had strategies, we hadthings that we were implementing
to keep him safe.
But the reality is, you know,it happens, and it happens more
frequently than what we thinkand nobody's really talking
about it all that much becausewe don't you know how many.

(20:40):
How can you research?
Oh, mom walked away from herhome and we found her two blocks
away and brought her home.
Nobody's tracking that data forpeople at home.
We are only aware of the badconsequences of somebody not
being found.
But how many people are doingit that are being found, but we

(21:03):
just really don't know.

Susie Singer Carter (21:05):
Right, I mean, I think that there is
technology that I've talked topeople in the industry, in our
industry and community that arecreating or have already certain
kinds of tracking devices thatyou can even like your Apple
Watch.
You know there's ways to beable to find where people are.
But, that said, I was trying tolook it up while you were

(21:25):
talking.
I can't think of his name rightnow, is it Carl Mooney Kyle?

Don Priess (21:34):
No, no, no, Kyle Mooney's an actor.
That's what I thought.
I can't think of his name.

Susie Singer Carter (21:38):
But there was a documentary based on this
man's wife that she was abrilliant area like a heiress
engineer and he also is anengineer and she had Alzheimer's
and they were at the modernMuseum here in Los Angeles and
she had early onset Alzheimer'sand they he.

(22:02):
She was still living at home.
She went to the restroom and hewas waiting outside for his
wife and she was in there for awhile so he thought he'd just
dash into the bathroom and useit.
He came back out and she wasn'tcoming out, wasn't coming out,
she was gone and they didn'tfind her until a year later and
and it wasn't good news- itwasn't good news.

Lizette Cloete (22:26):
No.

Susie Singer Carter (22:27):
And so since then they had come up with
tracking bracelets.
I know that in Los Angeles andhe's been, you know, very, very
active in the Alzheimer's LosAngeles community and you know
it's things like that that bringon change anyway.
But you know, and here's a verybrilliant man and you know

(22:50):
you'd think like he was veryconscientious, but it took a
second for her to be gone andgone that fast, because there
was even like, if you watch thedocumentary and I'll put it in
the show notes, guys, because Ican't think of the name of it
it's like where's linda?
Or have you seen linda,something like that.
But um, they had, like you know, cameras that that are there on

(23:11):
the streets, but only what, andthey could see her going down
the street and and there arethere's.
There's a certain thing thathappens with alzheimer's, where
one of the um experts was sayingthat when they're walking and
they're lost, they'll continueto go a certain way.
It's like left or left.
Do you know anything about that?

Speaker 5 (23:33):
I just know that they'll continue to go.
They literally will not stop,they will not ask for help, they
will just keep walking untilthey collapse or yep, until they
stop or fall into a ditch,whatever you know.
And you bring up the trackingdevices that I'm going to use

(23:53):
the gentleman on the cruise asan example because I was racking
my brain Like when thishappened.
I'm like the first time.
He didn't have on shoes.
He was in his pajamas and justtook out.
He wears glasses, didn't puthis glasses on.
They make trackers for glasses.
They make trackers for shoes.
They make trackers for belts.

(24:14):
Right, um, they make air tagtrackers.
That trackers are.
You can find trackers foralmost anything.
The second time, um, he left.
He never wears a belt, he takesthem off.
He takes off bracelets, hetakes off watches, he takes off
everything.
Yeah, and so I I literally wasracking my brain because there

(24:37):
was nothing that we could attachto him that he wasn't right
you'd almost have to do a chip,you'd almost almost have to do a
chip like they do with children.
Exactly, and I hate that.
That was my thought, because Idon't want anybody to chip me.
I know Right, there's aconversation.

(24:59):
There's a separate conversationabout chipping a person but, at
the same time, chip our animalsyeah, to know where they are,
right, right and to be able tofind them again it's.

Don Priess (25:11):
It's not a horrible thing, it's not.
It's really not a terriblething, it's I don't think.

Speaker 5 (25:16):
I don't think it is, but for a person who, who
literally, will not keepsomething on their body, how do
you agree?

Susie Singer Carter (25:25):
my mother wouldn't, my mother you know, I
was thinking like if I couldtake one of her bracelets that
she knew that she loved herjewelry, if I could take
something that she was familiarwith and and have something put
into that thing that was she wasfamiliar with, because
otherwise, otherwise for sure,she would have said what is this
stuff?
Get this off of me, you know.
Yeah, I don't want this stuff,this isn't mine, this isn't me.

Don Priess (25:50):
Yeah, she would not have liked that at all.
God forbid somebody could takea bracelet from her.
I mean, once you're out in theworld you don't know that.
That's that danger.
So, by the way, it's Kirk Moody.

Susie Singer Carter (26:03):
Moody, not Moody.
Yeah, it's Kirk.

Don Priess (26:06):
Moody.

Susie Singer Carter (26:08):
Did you see his movie, so we Can't Catch.
People in Suspense.

Don Priess (26:13):
I'll look it up.
I think it's called, you know.
Look it up.

Susie Singer Carter (26:16):
So I was going to mention another
anecdote, terrible anecdote.
When I was first starting thedocumentary and I went to one of
my colleagues who's a directorand I knew that her mom had
passed away already but had beenat the same facility my mom was
at before my mom and I said,you know, wondered if you hey.

(26:37):
I asked her did she want to bea part of this project?
And she was super busy at thetime and actually didn't really
have the heart to do it.
You know something which isquite common Most people, once
it's over, they don't want tolook back, because it's
sometimes when it's really hardyou don't want to look back.
So but she did share the storywith me and this didn't happen

(27:00):
at a nursing home.
It happened at a very, veryhigh-end assisted living in Los
Angeles and every Sunday her momhad Alzheimer's, every Sunday.
So she lived like, notindependently, but she had her
own little place within, youknow, like a little tiny, like
her own apartment, and it wasthe beginning of her diagnosis.

(27:24):
So every Sunday they had astanding date to have dinner
with the family.
They would go and pick her upand this one week she would hear
from her mom, like every day,but she didn't hear from her for
the last Friday and Saturdayand she was a little but she was
working, my friend was workingas a director, so she was like
with her long hours.

(27:45):
So she didn't think, well,mom's probably got busy, maybe
she's doing some social whatever.
And Sunday came around and theywent to pick her up and when
they got to her door there wasall these newspapers piled up at
the front of the door a coupledays' worth of newspapers.
And when she went in, her momwas lying naked on the ground in

(28:06):
her own excrement.
And, um, she wasn't dead, shedidn't die, but it was clear
that she had been late.
She couldn't get back up, thatshe had been laying there for at
least over 24 hours.
Nobody checked on her.
She didn't come to dinner.
Nobody checked on her.
And, and you know, and I said toher, what did you do?

(28:29):
She said well, we weredevastated.
We went talk to theadministration.
She said but, susie, there wasno place else to take her.
This was the best place andthat's what's so scary, you know
, and that you know.
So I say that as a cautionarytale because it's it's not
exactly eloping, but the pointis that people aren't watching

(28:51):
your loved one, so you, and whenyou assume they are, you can't
do that because you just can't,unfortunately.
So you need to check in.
If you're not, if you can't bethere every day and of course of
course not you can't At leastcheck in.
And if you can't get a hold ofthem, have somebody go over to

(29:12):
their room and assure you thatthey're okay, because those are
devastating consequences, ifthere can be.

Speaker 5 (29:23):
Oh, absolutely For sure, but I'm very grateful Don
and I were talking before westarted the podcast about.
You know how far things are alot further along than that
experience I had 31 years ago.
Then in 31 years from now,things are going to be a lot

(29:46):
further along than what they arenow.
But we do live in an age wherewhere technology, I really
believe, can solve a lot of thedistant supervision type of
situations related tospecifically in a facility or in
somebody's home, related toensuring some eyes on or some

(30:16):
other remote monitoringtechniques to be able to see,
number one, that somebody is athome.
Number two, that behavior isnormal.
Number three, that they haven'twalked out of the building.
And so I'm extremely gratefulfor that opportunity and for
those opportunities to comeabout now, because it does

(30:40):
absolutely radically change yourability as a caregiver to have
extra eyes on a person withoutbeing there but we face a
challenge also as far as cameraslike, especially if it's a
facility, because somefacilities will say, oh no,
you're not putting the camera inthis, they don't want cameras I
think she's talking about othertechnology you're talking about

(31:02):
at home, at home, yeah, butno, no, I'm talking about
technology that is notcamera-based.

Susie Singer Carter (31:10):
Right, you know.
What it brings to mind, Camila,is that we're watching this
series called Sunny, which is inthe future, and it's what's her
name, Don.

Don Priess (31:23):
Rashida Jones, rashida Jones, rashida Jones.

Susie Singer Carter (31:26):
And it's where you know everybody has
these robots that are theirassistants, basically, and
that's what I think of when yousay that to me, because it's
like a human companion.

Speaker 5 (31:41):
Well, these are a little different though this
technology.
They use motion sensors andhumidity, want to make sure that
they're opening the fridgeright, and so it's connected to

(32:12):
your cell phone.
But in a facility-based placeyou can put those sensors on
beds to know if somebody's inthe bed or on the door, to know
whether the door has been openedor closed.
Then you can track staff comingin.
There are ways to track peoplewithout cameras and there are
ways to track people withoutcameras, and so that's exciting
technology from a facility-basedcare, because, yes, I agree,
dawn, facilities do not want youto have cameras in there,

(32:35):
because they don't want you tosee what's happening to now use
other type of technology thatcan help track behavior but not
actually show the person.
So you know, inside theapartment the example that you

(33:00):
were using related to yourfriend who's mom in the assisted
living facility they now makelamps for like a you know a lamp
, just a regular lamp that havevelocity monitors in that can
see whether somebody's fallen inthe room.
Oh, wow, that's so there isknowledge there's technology
coming out that I you trulybelieve can help be an invisible

(33:26):
caregiver to people withdementia at home, keep them at
home a little bit longer.
Afford family members of peoplewho, by necessity or whatever
reason, do need to be in afacility, because you know, some
people really are difficult ifyou're alone to manage because

(33:49):
of behavior.
But there are other ways thatwe can help monitor and
supervise without being there,by using technology.

Don Priess (33:57):
But those could also be used in facilities, meaning
if that lamp was in everyone'sroom, then the staff knows if
something happened.
It's a simple way that if theyare understaffed and they don't
have the time for someone tocome in and check in on them,
that at least there's some sortof notification something has
happened and that could helpeven until we solve our staffing

(34:20):
issues, which is what we'retrying to do all of our staffing
issues, which is what we'retrying to do.

Speaker 5 (34:26):
And even if the facility doesn't want to provide
a lamp like that, you know afamily member, a family
caregiver, could certainly get alamp, put it in the room, have
the notification come to themand be, all you know, bad.
Out of hell if somethinghappens and contact the facility
.

Don Priess (34:42):
Yeah, if someone will answer the phone when you
call or call 9-1-1 yeah, no,exactly, exactly, because my mom
, my mom's my mom's an assistedliving and she has both from the
facility.
They have a you know where shecan call them.
Of course, if you're notconscious you can't do that, but
she also has a pendant that ifthey'll know if something

(35:05):
happens, it's it's to an outsideyou know service and they'll
know if she's fallen orsomething.
So you know, yeah, there isthat technology, but then you're
still relying on them wearingit and that's that's the
challenge and sometimes theywon't wear it right, like my
mother right yep, yep.
So, by the way, where is nancy?

(35:26):
Where is nancy?
Is the documentary?

Susie Singer Carter (35:28):
that's called.
Where is?

Don Priess (35:29):
nancy yeah and it does definitely cover this, this
topic, and she, you know sheeloped from a public place,
right?

Speaker 5 (35:38):
so uh which back to my my cruise example.
Right after the cruise, maybe acouple months after the cruise
and I need to go look this up, Ikeep meaning to go look this up
there was a husband and a wifecombination.
Now on the cruise that I went,we were one staff member to
three people and not threepeople with dementia three

(36:01):
people.
So there were people withdementia and their family
members.
We were almost one-on-one withthe people living with dementia
three people.
So there were people withdementia and their family
members.
We were almost one-on-one withthe people living with dementia.
So we had like nine or tenstaff members and there were
nine or ten people with dementiaon the cruise.
We were a group of over 31people but we were almost able
to be one-on-one with the peopleliving with dementia.

(36:23):
But this was a husband and awife combination who had gone on
a cruise by themselves inMexico and did you guys hear
this story?
It's been within the lastcouple of months, um, and they
came off of the the ship andwhen they got through the port

(36:43):
on the like on the dock orwherever both of them went into
the restroom and he was newly,newly, newly diagnosed with
frontotemporal dementia and whenshe came out.
He had come out before her andtook off in mexico and they, at
the time that I stopped lookingit up, it had been several days

(37:06):
and they hadn't found it.
So you know, and she had atracking device.
She did have some sort of atracking device, but it was
attached to her cell phone andhad to be within a certain
radius of her phone.
So the moment you left thatradius's gone.
Yeah, you know, but we, youknow, we've been talking about

(37:27):
some high-tech stuff.
Here's a low-tech strategy forfamilies at home.
Okay, um, a police officertaught us, take a dry washcloth
not a wet one, a dry washclothand rub it on the person's neck
um, get scent.
You know, get some of the oilson the body, put it in a plastic

(37:49):
bag and put it in the freezer.
And if the person does walkaway from home, we have the
ability, using tracking dogs, totake that person's because then
it's just their scent and,specifically from home, be able
to try to track them wow, that'sa great tip that's, that's yeah

(38:13):
I meanbecause, even, even for, even
for the gentleman whose wife hadwandered away from a situation
like that, if, if they had a wayof having her scent yes, even
if he had to go home and get itthey, they might have had an
opportunity using tracking dogsto see if they could pick her

(38:33):
scent again.
But of course we because wedon't necessarily keep, you know
, dirty clothes, things in thehouse we don't necessarily have
that, but it is another way ofbeing able to locate somebody if
there is the opportunity to usecanine dogs, but then it has to
be an isolated scent.

Susie Singer Carter (38:59):
Wow, that's an amazing tip.
I wouldn't have thought of that.
I mean, I wouldn't have knownthat they would do that.
It's amazing.

Don Priess (39:06):
We'll be right back.

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Susie Singer Carter (40:06):
You know I was talking to one of our other
doctors who was yet weinterviewed for no country for
old people, um al power, who isa geriatrician, but he speaks
all around the world on and he'sreally focused on dementia and
you know, and he talks about thelocked door, you know, in in

(40:29):
facilities and how you know theyin, in, in.
Of course he's a big fan of thegreen greenhouse model, which
is, you know, in facilities andhow you know they, and of course
he's a big fan of the greengreenhouse model, which is, you
know, very much, you know,person-centered.
It's very different than thefacilities that are in use now.
There are very few greenhousemodels out there because the
government doesn't, you know,subsidize it.
But you know, in their trialsthey found that the facilities

(40:55):
that they didn't lock doors,less people wanted to leave.
And there is something aboutthe dignity of a lock, you know,
or the indignity of a lockeddoor that makes people want to
get out because they feelincarcerated.

(41:16):
And I know my mother did.
My mother was, you know, untilI got her into a facility.
That was the whole facility wasmemory care, so there was not
one specific area.
She was and I took her out ofthe other place.
She was so unhappy because shehadn't hurt.
She kept forgetting, like, whywas it locked, and why is she

(41:38):
trapped in here and why and it?
And they really, really madeher want to get out, and and I,
you know, and I think thatthat's something that you know,
that's just the philosophy andthings that, in the future, that
we need to think about when wethink about people with.
Don't you agree?

Speaker 5 (41:56):
Oh, absolutely.
I remember here in SouthCarolina once I went to an
assisted living facility memorycare assisted living facility
and when I came into thebuilding the locked unit I just
stood there a minute and I'mlike you all have a lot of
people try to get out andthey're like, yeah, I'm like I
totally get it.

(42:17):
You know the way it wasstructured.
They had like a big exit signand the door was locked and it
was very institutional and itwas one of those push bars that
you just exactly know what to dowhen you get up to it.
Even if there's nothing youknow, if you're really not even
thinking, well, you just have topush it and it doesn't open and

(42:39):
then it makes an alarm and theyhad people constantly trying to
leave the facility.
That I do think that technologylike these remote sensors and
things that I have explained toyou can be used in a locked unit

(43:02):
and even greater, in acommunity, because there are
ways of setting them up thatthey have barriers, like a
boundary, and the person canhave a geotag Right a boundary,
and the person can have a geotagand then if they get beyond
that boundary, you know that youneed to be able to locate them.

(43:25):
So there are.
I think I 100% agree with youthat over time locked units are
going to be less.
But at home, you know, there isa true, real concern at home
for somebody walking away fromhome.
They make slider locks for thetop of the door that you can.
You know a person with dementiawon't look up or down, they'll
just look kind of right in frontof them so they'll see the door
handle.
But you can put a slider lockon the top that you can open and

(43:49):
close manually from both insideand outside, so the door isn't
locked per se.
You know they can turn thehandle, they just cannot open
the door.
You can put, you know, magneticmonitors on the door just so
you can hear the door opening.
So you, you have an earlywarning system.

(44:09):
But I recently had a.
I have a person that I workwith in in my coaching community
and his wife is an exit seeker.
She tries to walk out of thehouse all the time and one of
the strategies that we used intheir house was to and this is
what is also used, sometimessuccessfully, just depending on

(44:32):
the facility is is making thedoor not look like a door and
the way we did this in theirhouse was I suggested to him to
look and see if he could find ashower curtain that looked like
a bookshelf because a bookshelfis something that's normal in

(44:53):
our house.
We're not bringing something inthat doesn't look like the
house and he put the bookshelfup over the door.
Um, he had.
He'd already put deadbolts onso that he would have to use a
key, like an actual key, to openthe door, but she would always
go to the door and was literallyfrustrated.

(45:15):
Yeah, right, and so by justputting this, this shower
curtain that looked like abookshelf, it stopped that
behavior in that specific spotbecause she would see it and she
would at least have somewhat ofa recognition.
Now, this isn't a door, right,and it looks like a bookshelf,

(45:36):
and she'd turn around and walkaway.
Other things and this is kind offunny because we were talking
about AI earlier AI can reallybe beneficial for certain things
, but totally off base for otherstuff.
And I was playing around withAI the other day and talking
about wandering and wanderingbehaviors and it said you know,

(45:58):
put, put the word stop on thedoor, and I'm like that's the
worst thing you can put on thedoor of a place.
Don't ever put the for anybodylistening if you want somebody
to not walk through a door.
Don't put the word stop on thedoor Right, because what do we
do when we see a stop sign?

Don Priess (46:18):
Right, right, we stop, and then we go, and then
we go Right.

Speaker 5 (46:22):
Right, yeah, don't put stop on the door like wrong
way or employees only or out oforder or something that is
logical.
People with dementia can stillread up to a very late point in

(46:42):
their journey and understandcertain things, specifically
very routine and familiar stufflike a wrong way sign anything,
anything that we would be veryfamiliar with, to clue them or
cue them to not try to gothrough that door.
You know, danger, hazard.

Don Priess (47:04):
Yeah, do you think that?
Is there any possibility ofputting somebody with a room
that now doesn't feel like ithas a door or a way out?
Would that cause any type ofnegative anxiety?

Speaker 5 (47:18):
I think you know I'm kind of with Susie on this one.
You put me in a room where Idon't think I can get out.
I'm going to freak out.

Don Priess (47:24):
Right, that's what I was worrying.
If they were in a room thatsaid, wait, there is no door
here, would that cause?

Speaker 5 (47:30):
it?
Would it create that?
Whether I think it depends onhow far advanced a person's
dementia would be, um whetherthey would actually notice it or
not, because at a certain point, um, I don't think a person
would notice it at the very,very end yeah, I want to say,
like with my mom when she livedwith me that year.

Susie Singer Carter (47:51):
She was very active and she, I say she
was straddling the fence of likeknowing she was losing her
cognitive abilities and fightingit like hell right.
And so I think that at thatstage and before is when it's
the hardest because my mom wouldgo logically, if I look back at

(48:11):
it, she would say what do you?
So how do I get out of here?
Then where's the door?
Where's the door to get out ofhere?
She would be searching for thedoor if it said don't go out
this way.
But I think you're right.
Once my mom got past that stage, because she still could read,
that would have.

Speaker 5 (48:28):
That would have sufficed right, yeah, there's,
there's this window right when,when, when everything is like a
perfect storm, the, you know, atthe beginning stages you can I
don't teach people to reasonwith somebody who has a
diagnosis of dementia, becauseI'm teaching them not that over

(48:52):
time they're not going to beable to reason, but at the
beginning you can still reasonthrough something and they can
understand.
And then the end section whenwe get to that phase it really
doesn't matter.
They're not going to benecessarily like your mom trying
to, you know, leave as much.
But that middle section, when,when the person truly does, or a

(49:16):
lot of people do, have anawareness something's not right.
I'm not the way I always usedto be.
Um, I think that's when, when,when it's the hardest is like
that very, very middle stage.
Um, when people truly, andthey're, and at that very, very
middle stage, when people trulyand at that stage oftentimes
very mobile, still Very mobile,they move really well and cannot

(49:40):
think and reason through thosekinds of challenging situations,
and that's when it'ssignificantly unsafe, because
also at that time safe, becausealso at that time a lot of
families are not recognizingthat the person is, um, at that

(50:00):
point that that that is soimportant that, because they,
they are very good at foolingyou and, like you know, when my
mom lived with me, most peopledidn't even know she had
alzheimer's until it took alittle while for them to go.

Susie Singer Carter (50:11):
is your mom and I'd say, yes, she has
Alzheimer's, because my momcould fake it real good, right.
And so, especially if they'revery social and my mom had her
tricks up her, she had thetricks of her trade, you know
she would start singing to themif she didn't remember their
name.
Of course I remember you.

(50:33):
You are so beautiful to me shewould do those tricks and people
didn't know.
People would think she was justcharming and so it takes time.
So if you're out on the streetand you're roaming and people
wouldn't even think I mean, mymom was such a social butterfly.

Speaker 5 (51:02):
She'd be making friends along the way and they
wouldn't know that she was lost.
Buckets of contention isfamilies who are not willing to
accept the responsibility oftaking the car keys away from
someone.
If you're, if you're scientificpart of your anatomy, your gut

(51:23):
tells you somebody's not.
If you don't want to drive in acar with your mom, your mom
shouldn't be driving.
If you don't want to drive inthe car with your husband, your
husband shouldn't be driving.
If you don't want to drive inthe car with your husband, your
husband shouldn't be driving.
If you don't want to put yourgrandchild in the car or the dog
in the car with your familymember, then they're not safe to
drive, period.
End of discussion.

(51:43):
And families don't want to saythat out loud for a variety of
different reasons, and Iunderstand all of them.
Because I had to take the caraway.
It's not a fun thing.
But how this ties into theelopement is there was a lady
who was driving and she wouldalways only drive to the store.

(52:05):
You know, she's only going tochurch, whatever it is.
Oh, mom's never gonna, she'sonly driving a few blocks,
whatever the excuse is.
Well, she took off, she tookoff and she was found over two
hours away from home.
And the only reason she wasfound two hours away from home

(52:28):
was because she ran out of gasand had enough.
You know, driving is soautomatic.
Saw the you know the gas lighton and everything and pulled
into a gas station and the gasstation attendant recognized
that she was confused and calledthe cops and she was two hours
away from home.

(52:48):
Who's going to find her twohours away from home?

Don Priess (52:53):
And she doesn't know where home is.
You know, no, yeah, I mean Ijust as somebody who, for both
my parents, my brother andsister and I had to take the
keys away, and it was.
We were dreading it and we keptputting it off and putting it,
and I think the tack that wetook, that worked and it
actually was not as bad as itwas.
Just like Mom, mom or dad,please do this for us.

(53:16):
We can't sleep at night, wecan't.
I'm constant Every time, youknow, if you get into a car, we
we're so nervous for, you know,because we're worried that it's
affecting us.
And then the parental part ofthem comes out and says, okay,
I'll do it for you, you know,not for myself because I can

(53:36):
still drive, but I'll do it foryou.
And it really did.
Now, look, I'm sure there'sthat that I may be simplifying
it, but it was a tack that wetook for both of them and it did
.
It was, it helped and it workeddid they did done?

Speaker 5 (53:50):
Did they both have dementia or?

Don Priess (53:52):
just they were ready to stop driving, they were read
, they were well cognitively,they were having issues.
They didn't really.
I mean, my dad's deathcertificate said he had
Alzheimer's.
He did not.
You know his, his mind justslowly, and my mom, who's still
very cognitive.

Susie Singer Carter (54:07):
Your mom doesn't have any.

Don Priess (54:08):
Her memory's going great she does not.
But they were, you know, and itmay be easier when they don't,
as opposed to when they're morecombative and a little more in
denial or don't know there'ssomething going on with them.
But but you know, I I justwanted to throw that out there.
You can give that one a shot oh, absolutely.

Speaker 5 (54:28):
I think everybody should give it a shot.
Um it it's fascinating, though.
I recently um did an episode onmy podcast about dementia and
driving, because it comes up alot.
It's something that can be very, very unsafe.
Who have no cognitiveimpairment, older adults who
have no cognitive impairmentwill self-limit and take the car

(54:54):
keys away from themselvesbecause they recognize I can't
see as well or I can't hear, orI can't turn my head.
They can, they can reasonthrough that.
Somebody with dementia will not.
They do not see the deficits.
That's what makes it sodifficult to take those car keys
away.

Don Priess (55:38):
I try, you know, you try as much as possible to work
towards getting the car keysaway through the physician and
some other people.
We also did have the doctorchime in and say you know, it's
just really hard when they do,yeah.

Susie Singer Carter (55:45):
When they have Alzheimer's or dementia, it
is very difficult because theyforget and they forget and they
forget.
So you know you could tell themall day day long, but my mom
was looking for her car always,always where's my car, where's
my car?
And you know it's.
It's very sad and it's becauseof that is there it is.

(56:08):
It signifies their freedom andit's you know there's a lot
attached to that.
You know, ability to drive itjust does.
It signifies a lot and it'slike I'm saying like when
someone is going throughGroundhog's Day and every day

(56:28):
they wake up and go where's mycar keys, where's my car keys?
Which I put in my film,actually because it was such a
significant part of my mother'stransition.
You know it was like where's mycar keys all the time, where's
my car?
Did you steal my car?
You know that was a big theme,a very big theme, and so it is.
It can be really devastating.

Speaker 5 (56:49):
So it's yeah, yeah but it ties in with the
elopement, because we don'tthink about somebody eloping
with their car, right, right.
I have another example ofsomebody that I was aware of mom
and daughter.
The daughter had taken the caraway from mom, but it was mom's

(57:11):
car.
Daughter had taken the car awayfrom mom, but it was mom's car,
and the daughter and mom wentto the same doctor.
So the primary care physicianwas both of their doctors.
So mom came with the daughterto the doctor's office and her
daughter left her mom in thewaiting area because she was
going in to see the doctor,thinking that mom would be safe

(57:34):
there.
You know, mom forgot why theywere there, forgot that the
daughter was in seeing thedoctor, dug through her purse,
found another set of car keys,walked out, found her car and
drove home and left her daughterat the doctor, you know.
So these, these situations,truly, we cannot make this stuff

(57:57):
up, yeah no, no, what about?

Don Priess (58:01):
yeah, I mean, we know facilities who are
definitely understaffed areusing chemical restraints to
help to stop people from doingthis, which we know is just
horrendous.
It it's the worst, especiallywith people with dementia.
It's just horrible.
And people, might you know, doyou find that?
Or have you heard of doctorsprescribing people who are at

(58:22):
home Like, oh, they'll prescribesomething to kind of chemically
tether them, and if so, if adoctor does that, what should
you tell them?

Speaker 5 (58:33):
I haven't run into that as much at home.
It's definitely more in afacility.
For sure, usually, in myexperience, when we get to that
level of drug medication at home, there are significant

(58:55):
behaviors involved and it's morethan exit seeking, it's
aggression.
You know, it's those thingsthat really make it difficult to
provide care for somebody athome.
Oftentimes it is that anger andthat the person, the care

(59:18):
partner, the caregiver is notfeeling safe or there's a lot of
that physical, like some peoplewith dementia get extremely,
extremely aggressive, and sothat's when I tend to see those
heavy duty medications at home.

(59:40):
I am not a proponent, I'm not aproponent for medication to be
the first line of defense,because I believe that I really
do believe that using looking atwhat's going on with the person
and what's going on in theenvironment and seeing if
they're bored or overstimulatedor what's going on with me, the
care partner because if I'msuper stressed and I come in

(01:00:03):
there, mom's going to be wildand woolly right using using
other techniques first to see ifwe can mitigate or change the
behavior that we're seeing.
But sometimes the only thingthat does help is medication,
but it's not my first line ofdefense, but at home.
Typically the medications thatare prescribed at home are

(01:00:27):
Seroquel, which is a heavy dutyantipsychotic, which oftentimes
you'll find in a facility, butthey tend to be provided at a
much lower dosage than in afacility and I don't remember
ever seeing somebody on halidolat home, which is a chemical
restraint as much as being onhalidol in a facility, and I

(01:00:53):
believe that if I have seen thatthey were transitioning over to
hospice.
So there may be a reason forusing some of those medications
at end of life in order to beable to keep them at home, but I
don't personally have I haven'texperienced as much of that
type of medication and chemicalrestraint at home.

Susie Singer Carter (01:01:12):
You bring up a good point because we have
to wrap up.
I can't believe we've beentalking so long, such a great
conversation.
But you bring up a good pointabout the medication at home,
because my mom was, you know, avictim of Depakote, which is
also, you know, an off-marketdrug to chemically restrain.
An off-market drug tochemically restrain.

(01:01:32):
And all those drugs, when yousee them in a facility, they
bring on sombolence, which isbasically just everybody is
zombies.
When you see zombies, that'swhat you're looking at, because
that's not a natural state ofmind is to be a zombie in a
chair.
And so you know but I didn'tknow that when I first was
getting used, that when I firstwas, you know, getting used to

(01:01:53):
this kind of community, I had noidea that that was what was
going on.
I just thought that was thenature of getting older.
But it's not, it's not.
And so I do think that there's,you know, dosages that you could
do with something.
You know if someone is agitated, that you could do with

(01:02:13):
something.
You know if someone is agitatedand if they're agitated and
you've tried everything, thenmaybe you know there's something
that will.
It's like taking a, you know an, antidepressant, right?
So something that but mild,like, because I don't think you
need to knock, it's either allor nothing.
It feels like you know, in ourindustry, as opposed to you know
like one size fits all andthat's not, that's not, that

(01:02:36):
doesn't make any sense.
You know we're not one sizefits all, so you know either
they're awake or they're out.
But there's a reason that thesedrugs exist and it wasn't for
that.
It wasn't to put people out, itwas to help them get through a
difficult time.
So I think you know what I'mtrying to do is, you know,

(01:03:00):
mitigate the shame, because Ilisten, I don't my mom was a
victim of depakote.
She shouldn't have been on it.
There was no reason for her tobe on depakote, it was just used
because my mom was, anythingbut, you know, aggressive.
You know she wasn't anaggressive person, right and but
you know, until I didn't know,and that really changed the
quality of her life because sheended up being, you know,

(01:03:23):
immobile after that, once Ifound out, she never lost, she
never, she never regained hermobility.
So you know that that that's atragic outcome and she could
have died.
Because they're black labeleddrugs for people with
Alzheimer's.
So, but I also think like youshouldn't feel guilty if you are

(01:03:44):
at home and you need someassistance because somebody's
chemistry is, you know, offbalance because of what's going
on cognitively, certainly youknow you.
You should look into that andfind out what is the minimum you
can use to help and see if ithelps and try different,

(01:04:04):
different kinds of drugs.
You know, maybe, maybe you knowcerco isn't good for your loved
one, maybe at aivan, I don'tknow something, you know I used
to get panic attacks and I wouldget Ativan and you know it
would take it away, like thatand I was back to normal, you
know, and so you never know likewhat works and I'm not, I never
overused it, it was just asafety for me.

(01:04:25):
It was like if I got a panicattack then it would help, you
know.
So I think that there's justsaying don't feel guilty if you
have to right.

Speaker 5 (01:04:35):
Right?
Yes, I think, a measuredapproach.
Like I said, I'm not aproponent of medication as a
first line of defense.
Let's look for all of the othersolutions first and then, if
there's nothing else that'sworking, then let's start to
explore some of the medication,whereas the industry's standard

(01:04:57):
is oh, let's medicate first.

Susie Singer Carter (01:04:59):
And when they say medicate, they mean
medicate with a capital M.
Yeah, for sure, john.
I know what it makes me thinkof when my mom was at the memory
care the place that it was allmemory care and we'd all go and
visit my mom and there'd be someof the residents who'd come by
and just clopped on in the head.
Remember the woman that justfor some reason she just gave

(01:05:20):
you a smack at the back of yourhead.
Every time it was just like.

Don Priess (01:05:23):
She's just you know.

Susie Singer Carter (01:05:27):
He has that kind of head.
I do.

Don Priess (01:05:28):
It's very hittable.
It's very hittable.

Susie Singer Carter (01:05:31):
It's very hittable.
She wanted his attention orsomething, so every time she'd
go it's actually kind of cute.

Don Priess (01:05:39):
I said will you please put her on medication
right now?

Susie Singer Carter (01:05:42):
Right now, but it was really.
You know, you're right.
That's exactly right.
Lizette is that she wantedDon's attention?
That's what it was, that'sexactly right, lizette is that
she wanted Dawn's attention.

Don Priess (01:05:54):
That's what it was.
That's how she communicated.

Susie Singer Carter (01:05:57):
And that was how she communicated.
I had one gentleman that wasalways yelling at me from across
the room Young lady, young lady, young lady, young lady
Remember Dawn?
And so I finally went over tohim and I was like, because I
was getting used to thecommunity, I wasn't a pro yet,
right.
So I finally went over to himand I said what can I do for you

(01:06:20):
, what can we do?
How are you today?
And he goes I love you.
I go, I love you too.
Tell me about yourself, youknow.
So he needed attention, but youknow so he needed attention.

Speaker 5 (01:06:40):
But if you don't know that, you're going to think,
wow, he's so, he's mean, or he'snasty, or he's you know, he's
so loud.

Don Priess (01:06:42):
right Repetitive behaviors, let's give him some
medication, right Right, he'sannoying, let's calm him down,
so he's not an annoyance.
And usually that again comesback to understaffing and not
enough people to deal with that.
Comes back to understaffing,not enough people to deal with
that.

Speaker 5 (01:06:51):
So now Susie is.
You know, susie has.
He's doing that to Susie, butwhen Susie's not there, he's
saying that to the staff members, right, all day, every day.
Young lady, young lady, younglady, right, and it's driving
them crazy.
And so they will give himmedication instead of attention,
right?

Don Priess (01:07:11):
Instead of just coming over and saying what can
I do for you taking minutes tosay yeah to, to pay attention
and because I think most of usbe the ones that are yelling.
Those are bits like and, and itgoes on and on and on we hear
it down down the hall somebodyyelling and yelling and yelling.
The entire time.
We were there, you know,because nobody went in and said

(01:07:35):
yes.

Susie Singer Carter (01:07:36):
Hi, hello, I love your dress.

Don Priess (01:07:38):
I love your hair.

Susie Singer Carter (01:07:40):
I mean, I learned to do that, right, I
learned to do that.
I love your, I love what you'rewearing today.
Really, yes, I do.
Oh, it's beautiful, you lookbeautiful and they're like oh,
thank you you.
Oh, it's beautiful, you lookbeautiful and they're like, oh,
thank you.
You know who doesn't like to becomplimented, and so I do, you
know.
So I just try to, you know, bea human being.

(01:08:01):
That's all the rational goesand the emotional stays.
Totally Well.
This was so lovely.
Thank you so much for sharing.
It was fun.
Well, you're fun.

(01:08:21):
You're strong but soft at thesame time.
That's what I love about you,because you have a nice heart.
You have a very good heart.
We need more of you in theindustry.

Speaker 5 (01:08:37):
Well, for sure, you know, coming from South Africa,
we definitely can have somebluster, you know, but soft
squishy on the inside.

Don Priess (01:08:49):
Softies at heart.

Susie Singer Carter (01:08:51):
And I knew that about you.
I know that.
I knew that from the second Imet you.
I really like you.
Thank you so much.
We will have all of Lizette'sinformation on the show notes.
Go and listen to her podcast,which is totally different
because it comes from adifferent perspective.
She's in there, she's in thetrenches with a lot more people

(01:09:13):
than I have ever been.
So you know, please, do youknow, tell us what the name of
your podcast is again and wherewe can find it.

Speaker 5 (01:09:23):
So the original name was Dementia Caregiving for
Families and then recently Ichanged it to Christian Dementia
Caregiving.
Okay, mostly because I answermy questions from a Christian
perspective, I blend theevidence-based practices from a

(01:09:44):
biblical lens so people canstill come and listen.
Not all of them are entirely,you know, from a Christian
perspective.
I just started a whole serieson five quick tips for
challenging differentchallenging behaviors, but it is
.
It is good information andreally honestly, one of the

(01:10:08):
biggest things that I've noticedthat makes a successful
caregiver versus an unsuccessfulcaregiver is what we think
about.
It is what we think about ourown journey, what we think about
dementia in particular, and soI really work with people a lot
on how you think about dementia.

(01:10:29):
What do you believe it to be?
Because as long as we continuethis tragedy narrative that it
is all doom and gloom and woe isme then that is the result that
we get, and so I really workwith people very hard on what is
it that you're thinking about,your dementia caregiving journey

(01:10:52):
?
Because what you're thinkingabout it, it will be the result
that you get.

Don Priess (01:10:55):
You manifest it.

Susie Singer Carter (01:10:56):
Right, right, right, Yep, Absolutely.
Well, let's bring it all home,John, because what do we?

Don Priess (01:11:05):
you know Well it just feels like everything in
the long run, you know, it's acombination of faith and science
, and then, in the long run,it's a combination of faith and
science, and then, in the longrun, it's love.
It all has to be based in loveand there is only one reason for
that, and that is because loveis powerful, love is contagious
and love conquers all.
We thank everyone for watching,listening today.

(01:11:28):
If you like what you saw orheard, please share and follow
and do all those good things,and we'll be seeing you next
time.

Susie Singer Carter (01:11:36):
Yes, and check out
NoCountryForOldPeoplecom and seehow you can help us with this
project and with the movementthat we're doing.
We really appreciate it and,yeah, love you.
Talk to you soon.

Don Priess (01:11:50):
See you next time.
Take care, bye-bye.

Susie Singer Carter (01:11:52):
Bye-bye.