October 21, 2025 • 28 mins
Tired of hiring people who don’t show up—or don’t stick around? In this episode of Masters of Home Service, Marco Radocaj, owner of Balance HVAC, and Rich Camacho, CEO of BlueRecruit, join host Adam Sylvester to share what sets top performers apart. Learn how to spot coachable candidates, rewrite job posts to attract the right people, and build a reliable and high-output team.
New to Jobber? Masters of Home Service listeners can claim an exclusive discount for Jobber at http://bit.ly/4kAzgm0
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Most women will not apply for a jobthat they don't meet 80% of the job
description for. Whereas men we'rein the high forties we're like,
I can probably figure that out wherewomen are like in there. Nope, not for me.
When you think about growing out yourteam, women make up 51% of the workforce.
They're 42% of the new skilled tradeworkers that have entered the workforce
this year.
(00:20):
You do not want to create job descriptionsthat are going to just lock out that
huge group of potential workers.
Welcome to Masters of Home Service,
the best podcast for home service proslike us. I'm your host, Adam Sylvester,
and I want you to crush it in business.
Are you having a hard timehiring top performers?
Are you just settling for C players?
(00:40):
When you really justwant to hire A players,
you kind of fly out the seatof your pan when you're hiring,
just asking this question or thatquestion without any kind of plan.
If you're struggling to hire top talent,then you're probably doing it wrong.
My guests today are rich and Marco Rich,
why don't you start us offand tell us who you are.
Thanks so much forhaving me. Rich Camacho,
co-founder and CEO of Blue Recruit,
(01:01):
we're a platform that helps companieslike Marco find job seekers and then
helping those job seekers connect withquality companies across the skilled
trades through all the US and Canada.Bingo. Well thanks for being here,
I appreiciate it.
Mark, what about you?
Alright, I'm the co-owner of BalancedHVAC out of Vero Beach, Florida.
We're a new company,we're about two years old.
Prior to that I was hiring people forabout five years and we've had really good
(01:23):
success and a lot of those guys that wehired before have come over to the new
company and we just have a lotof loyalty and really great guys.
Good. Well,
I'm glad you're here and I think that alot of our listeners are just wondering,
what am I doing wrong? And so fromyour perspective, Marco, you go first.
What do you see as the most common mistakethat business owners like us make on
(01:44):
a regular basis when they'retrying to hire top talent?
I think it's really hard and it's a reallycommon thing that you hear people say
is that you can't findgood help these days.
And I think that is putting the ownershipand the responsibility on these people
just existing who know exactly how youwant things done and exactly how you want
them done when you want them done.
And there needs to be this process whereyou need to understand there's this
investment in this person.
(02:04):
There are certain qualities that willhelp those people grow in that position,
but it's really something where youneed to find somebody who has these core
qualities and then you can build uponthose and kind of have them grow within
your company.
It's really hard to find good people andnot pay them and give them benefits and
really it starts at that area.
It needs to be something that the employeroffers, something that people want.
(02:26):
And if people don't want to work from you,
people probably don't want tobuy things from you either.
Yeah, so you would say look in the mirrorfirst before you try to post anything
online. Hundred.
Percent.
It can't be something where it's the kindof job description that you would just
scroll through. It has tobe something that pops,
something that really kindof puts yourself in the light where they're getting
an idea of who you are as a company,who your team is as a company,
(02:47):
and then just what the goals are.And there has to be a vision,
there has to be goals. Thegoal isn't to get this job.
The goal is to get this job and grow andexcel and continue just to get better
within whatever that trade would.
Yeah. Rich, what do you think? What'sthe biggest mistake people are making?
Mark, you absolutely nailed it there withtelling the job seeker about yourself,
but one of the big problems that I seeevery single day, and I'm sorry buddy.
(03:11):
HVAC is like the worst at this. No hvac,
y'all are the primadonnasof the skilled trades.
The plumbers are just outthere doing the dirty work.
But one of the biggest problems that Isee with business owners is that every
single, we're all proud of ourcompanies. Every single one of us here,
we're a business owner. Everybody'sproud of what we've built,
what we continue to build. However,
(03:31):
they don't treat the hiringof new workers like a sale.
That's exactly what it's.
That's right.
Think about it. In the housingmarket a couple years ago,
it was a buyer's market, right?I'm sorry, seller's market.
You could basically post a shack,especially down in South Florida,
you could post a shack and they'relike, oh, it's $800,000, one bathroom,
half a room. Like what? And it wasjust people had to do it. Right now,
(03:55):
employment is a job seekers marketAnd employers have to realize
that you not only have toput yourself out there,
you have to sell your opportunities andyou're not selling a job. People aren't,
A lot of small business owners think, oh,
they should just want to work forme because my culture's awesome,
my company's awesome. Nobody knows that.
It might be true and that'sgreat, but nobody knows that.
(04:18):
And people really have tochange their mentality.
Just like when you're out there tryingto upsell a repair into a new unit where
you've got to upsell and explain to thatjob seeker why it is they should come
be part of your team and grow with you.
Yeah. We spend
so much money investing in marketingand advertising and thousands of dollars
(04:38):
every month in getting new leads,
and then we'd spend $10 a month onIndeed, and we think that we're like,
why aren't we gettingnew leads or new hires?
And so we really need to change ourperspective. I like what you said,
we need to look at ourselves first.
Both you guys said that and make surethat we're attracting, we're attractive.
Basically,
what do we have to be in order to begood employers that people want to work
(05:00):
for, and how do wecommunicate that to people?
I think it's like Rich was saying,
is where I think any businessowner in the whole world,
my business is the best and I know allthese reasons and it's all in my head,
and it's this beautiful picture of thisutopia little small business that works
perfectly and it's something thatyou need to be able to write down.
It needs to be tangible, it needs tobe something that somebody can read.
(05:20):
And I know we spent a lot of time whenwe started balance coming up with a
mission statement and someother people that I worked with.
How many AC companieshave a mission statement?
And then when you are interviewingnew people or talking to people who
potentially are going to work for you issomething that's written down that they
can see that it's on our website.
It goes back to our socials.When you come in and talk to me,
I'm going to pitch that same story.
(05:41):
Anybody that you would meet withinthe company that see it every day,
they go through it every dayand they can vouch for that.
It needs to be like everything.If you're not measuring it,
how do you know if you'reachieving it? It's just this.
It can't be a vague goal. And I'mthe best because I'm the best.
We are the best because X, Y,z, and give those specifics.
And then there's thataccountability to it too.
If you have somebody coming in lookingfor employment and you're telling them
(06:04):
you do all these great things,
it would just be such a bummer to notbe able to follow through on that.
You can switch. Yeah. It's likeyou need to be able to, Hey,
I'm going to tell you all these greatthings. I hope I can exceed 'em.
I hope they get better than I pitchedthem to you. And like you were saying,
where right now it's the people that arelooking for the job. It's their market.
It should always betheir market. How is it?
(06:25):
There's no way that any of this wouldever work if it's just one person running
the show by themselves. You needto have this people on the street,
especially the technicians, thoseare the people the customers see,
and I could think I'm the greatestair conditioning guy of all time,
but I'm not in the houses. It'sthe technicians in the field.
And those need to be people that havea reason to be excited about going to
work. And it has to be more than justthe job itself. It has to be the culture.
(06:49):
Yeah.
What do you guys think in termsof compensation and benefits?
Are there certain benefits that tradespeople are looking for that really matter
them more than maybe somebody else?Anything that comes to mind on that?
Yeah.
One thing that's really crazy is mostpeople think of what's the number one
thing when someone's looking for anew job that they're looking for?
(07:09):
Most business owners when askedthat question will say, oh,
they're looking for bettercompensation. Ever since COVID,
we've been running a study for years now,
but ever since COVID compensation isactually the number three most desired
single attribute when it comes to a job.
The number one thing that trade workersare most looking for is flexibility in
their schedule. And people look atthat. What do you mean flexibility?
(07:32):
You're not going to workfrom home. It's not like, oh,
come in whenever you feel like it.
But what's interesting about whatpeople look for for flexibility,
one of my favorite stories years ago,
there was a mobile automotive shop ofMaryland that was hiring a technician.
They found 'em on our platform.They interviewed connected,
they loved each other. The onestipulation the technician had was, Hey,
(07:54):
every Thursday afternoonis my son's lacrosse game.
I will not miss my son's lacrosse game.So that business owner said, okay, hey,
no worries. We'll go ahead. You canleave at lunchtime on Thursdays,
come in an hour earlier, Mondaythrough Wednesday, stay an hour later,
make up that time. No big deal.They went ahead, hired him.
He actually still works there.
That business owner created suchincredible loyalty with that because next
(08:16):
season he might switch to Wednesdaygames and they'll readjust the schedule.
But it's that flexibility that peopleare really looking towards because at the
end of the day, yes, we workbecause we need compensation,
but we need to have that compensationto support our friends, our family,
our loved ones. And thenat the end of the day,
that's actually the single mostimportant thing. By the way,
health benefits are number two,do not wait 30, 60, 90 days,
(08:39):
health benefits day one.
So what do you guys think we shoulddo if we can't afford all that stuff?
We're brand new company, can'tafford PTO, can't afford vacation,
can't afford health,all that kind of thing.
Because I know there's a lot oflisteners right now who are thinking,
I just can't afford all that. That'sthousands and thousands of dollars a year.
What else can they do to attract? Theycan be flexible. What else can they do?
(09:00):
I was going to piggyback off what hesaid is that exactly that flexibility is
such an important thing. And Ithink in any, especially HPAC,
but anything where you have an on-callor there's seasonal type things where
it's really hot in Florida right now,we're going to have some overtime.
But when you see the guys that aremaking a lot of money within the trade,
and again,
that's the perceived thing that isimportant is how much money annually do I
(09:22):
bring home? But if you're working 60hours a week, overtime is not a benefit.
Overtime, there's somethingthat's not managed correctly,
whether you need to hire anotherperson or be more organized internally,
but overtime is not a benefit. So ifyou are compromising your free time,
if you're working 60 hoursa week, 52 weeks a year,
how important is work? I feel like thatflexibility, it doesn't cost anything.
(09:46):
Flexibility costs, it'sabout organization,
communication and really just having somecompassion for the person that you're
working with and realizing this isn't atechnician, this is guy, this is Carlos,
this is Miguel. These arepeople that I work with.
They do things outside of airconditioning just like I do,
and they need to be understandingwith that. And that's free.
You can do that for free.
(10:06):
Yeah, I think the listener needs tojust understand that they need to
try to give as much as they can,
whether that's just a little bit offlexibility or a lot of flexibility or a
little bit of benefitsand a lot of benefits,
they need to figure out what their limitis and then give that to their people.
What can we do that's uniqueand special for our people?
And then highlight that whateverthat is in the job interview.
(10:27):
And any more thoughts on that?
One real quick thing before that issome people might not want to hear this,
but it's just reality. If youcan't afford certain benefits,
if you can't afford thePTOs, the health benefits,
I think what's more importantat that point, reexamine,
are you ready to start a business?Are you ready to even think about growing
(10:48):
your business? I tellpeople this all the time,
whether it's to hire anothertechnician, hire a salesperson, hire.
We see it all the time with HRcoordinators, with recruiters.
You're not actually ready to takethat step and jumping into that step,
we all know well crushthat business real quick,
and that's a fastest way to get yourbusiness shut down. So if you're worried,
(11:08):
I don't know if I can afford that,
you're probably not readyand just keep chugging along.
I see it with texts all thetime like, Hey, you know what?
I know how to do all this stuff. Whydon't I just start my own business? Well,
do you know what kind ofreserve you're going to need?
Don't plan on a paycheck for the next12 months. Are you ready for that?
Yeah. The first year of a businessis a nightmare. It's horrifying.
And I knew it was goingto be horrifying going in.
(11:28):
It was scarier than I thought,
but this was the decision that wemade as all of our employees. Day one,
we're going to have full healthcoverage and we would pay for all of it.
And yeah, it was very stressful.We didn't have any money,
but as this thing continuesto work, those guys,
they see the investment,they see that they matter,
and I think that there's this attitude,
especially with something likeair conditioning in Florida,
(11:51):
there's a lot of AC guys and theattitude is that these technicians
are replaceable, anybody's replaceable,
and if that attitudecontinues into your culture,
you don't have a culture and it's.
Post bad culture.
So it's something where you needto have, whether it's your 401k,
whether it is your health benefits,whether it's your continued education,
(12:11):
whatever your benefits thatare important to you are,
they need to be something that North Star,
something that you're notgoing to compromise on.
It's something that's going to happenno matter what. And like you said,
you need to plan for it. And if youcan't do it, you can't plan for it,
you probably shouldn't.So well said with that.
And I think you mentioned a whole bunchof different benefits that are out
(12:32):
there. The benefits for each individualemployee don't have to be the same.
We have had employees that want401k matching. We've had other ones,
especially the younger ones that don'tquite understand that 401k matching is
the greatest free money you'llever get in your life. I'm like,
are you sure you don't want this?I'm just going to give you money.
And they're like, no, no, no. I'lltake more paycheck. I was like,
(12:54):
you don't understand the benefits ofthis, but hey, they're individuals.
They can make up their own choices.
Your plans don't have tobe the same for everybody.
We have a lot of employeesthat they're married,
their spouse has a phenomenal medicalplan and their spouse can cover them,
the dependents of children.
And so really just talk to theseindividuals during the interview,
(13:15):
during the initial onboarding and figureout what's important to you and then go
ahead and customize thatbenefit package for them.
This is a great conversation.
I do want to pause for a minuteto talk about jobber top talent,
want great tools, they wantto have good HVAC tools,
and that's softwareincluded. So how does Jobber,
as one of your tools in your tool belt,
how does that help you stand apart fromthe rest in the eyes of your candidates
(13:38):
and your employees?
I think the biggest thing is that yousay when you're bringing in these top
techs,
these are people who are working at areally high level within their trade.
And again, what we do is in the attic,so nobody sees that for the most part.
But how we use jobber to kind of get ridof that and so that everybody can see
the craftsmanship and the careis every job a one-off job,
we'll have a visit review form and thena multiple day job will have it daily
(14:01):
review form. Those forms are going tolet you know, here's what we did today.
Is it working? Yes or no? Here'swhat needs to happen next,
and here's any additionalnotes that we might have,
but we want to give youthis good information.
But the secret sauce isalong with that review form,
is that we're posting a link from companycam that's going to show you the work
that we actually did inside of your attictoday. So it's not this just ambiguous
(14:23):
duck that's in your attic and youhave no idea what it looks like.
We can show you the progress, wecan show you the craftsmanship.
And then those guys get to create theirown content with these tools that the
customers appreciate. And when thecustomers get to see those things,
and it's not just Miguel in theattic making a bunch of noise. It is,
you see what he did at the end of the day,
and I've been doing this for 15 yearsand I still can't believe what these guys
(14:45):
are building and the spaces that they'rebuilding and then getting the results
that they're having.
So if you're not giving these guys thetools to kind of flex their work that
they're doing every day at thishigh level that you expect,
what are we doing it for?
We want the customers to be ableto see that and having that type of
transparency and be able to show themhow good of a job we're doing in their
attic.That adds value and that adds money,
(15:07):
and you can charge more for this betterproduct because people can actually see
it. And it's not just ACcompany one, AC company two,
they both did the same thing.Didn't we did a better job?
And here's a picture of everyday of us progressing through it.
Here's the results at the end.
And then those guys are veryproud of the work that they did,
and they should be rightfully so.
And it's nice to be able to show thosethings to the customers that add value to
(15:29):
your top tax and then justadd value to your customer,
to your company as a whole.
Yeah, I totally agree.
And I also think that Jobber just makesit simple to give our team instructions.
All the notes are in there,all the photos are in there,
and it tells them where to goand how to call the client.
They need everything is all in oneplace so that he feels confident
(15:50):
going to the client's house.
They have all the informationthey need all in one place.
It really makes it easy to get thejob done. If you're not using jobber,
you need to less chaos and more orderand jobber will help you do all that.
Go to jobber.com/podcast deal,
get exclusive discount andstart using jobber today.
Let's move on to the jobdescription, the job posting.
(16:11):
Do you guys have any secretsfor our listeners to how to make a job posting more
compelling and more effective?
I feel like it's really important toestablish yourself and be very genuine
throughout the entire process.I am an old football player,
an old track athlete, so I'mlike a meathead to the T.
So the job descriptionthat I'm posting is really
(16:31):
a team oriented type of thing,
but that is also in line with kindof how we've branded our culture.
A lot of what we do is we want to makesure that we have problem solvers,
not problem pushers. We wantpeople that when things get hard,
we're not running away from things.
We're not blaming other people becauseit's always really easy to find 50 things
that cause something to not work,
but we need to find the people who aregoing to find them one or two things that
(16:53):
will help this problem work,people that are patient,
and it's really just about findingpeople that you don't mind spending time
with.I think as the employer,
it's my job to make sure thatyou have the tools that you need,
the training that you need,
and that you're comfortableperforming your day-to-day tasks.
Emphasize communication.
We need to make sure that you don't mindcoming in and learning job or learning
company camp, learning the things thatwe use to communicate with customers.
(17:16):
I think that's something that's reallyoverlooked, especially in our trade,
is that we don't have this reallygreat communication and rapport with
customers.
There's a lot of handwritten scratchnotes on three poppy pieces of paper,
but we want to change that,
so we need to make sure that we'reclear about that at the beginning.
We have different expectations onthe job with your communication with
customers,
and when really just comes down to beingokay with working with other people and
(17:39):
hot addicts that it's notalways the best situation,
but you need to find a way to make it thebest of the situation and not let that
kind of tempo dictate your culture andfind the people who want to come to work
and have a reason to work too.I think that's really important.
So full disclosure,for the last six years,
I've led an effort to get ridof job posts. So on our platform
(18:01):
we have zero job posting,zero job descriptions.
I think that specifically for the trades,
it is a semi outdated systemof trying to find folks.
However, with that said,if you're using them,
if you're putting out there a couplethings that you definitely should do,
put the actual, if it's anhourly rate, put the hourly rate.
(18:23):
If it's a range, put a real range. Nothingdrives me more crazy. I'm like, oh,
this role is 30 to $150,000. Wow,
one sounds fantastic. The other onesounds horrendous. Where do I fall in?
Put the compensation outthere. At the end of the day,
all you're doing is saving time. Whybring people in that are well outside,
well above, well below? Whateverit is that you're offering,
(18:44):
you're saving everybody time.
Another thing is avoid putting inthis endless list of these are the
things we're looking for.Focus on the absolute go.
No goss of the job,residential HVAC, construction.
You have to have a clean criminal record.
Our insurance will not allow someoneto enter a home that doesn't have one.
So if it's an absoluterequirement, put it on there.
(19:05):
If you're looking forCDL drivers, guess what?
You have to have a clean drivingrecord, things like that.
If it's not a hard requirement, that'swhat the interview process is for.
So allow those individuals to get intothe process and don't just shut the door
on them by putting in whatmost of the time is arbitrary
requirements that aregoing to lock people out.
And one of the big things is you'reactually going to push out more women from
(19:30):
applying to your jobs becauseit's this crazy statistic.
Most women will not apply for a jobthat they don't meet 80% of the job
description for, whereas men we'rein the high forties, so we're like,
interesting. I can probably figure thatout where women are like in there. Nope,
not for me. But when you thinkabout growing out your team,
women make up 51% of the workforce.
They're 42% of the new skilled tradeworkers that have entered the workforce
(19:51):
this year. You do not want to createjob descriptions that are going to just
lock out that huge groupof potential workers.
I think that I use a job postingto really clarify what the job is.
I want people to know exactlywhat they're signing up for.
I want them to know generally speaking,
what the job is like andwhether it's a good company,
(20:12):
because a lot of times it's not the guyor the girl who is looking for the job,
it's the girlfriend or the boyfriendor the mom who's like, Hey,
get out of the house. Go geta job. And they see the ad,
and so it helps them like,oh, this company's legit.
So we had to communicate that stuff tothem clearly and not just bark orders at
them like, yeah, you better be goodor else we're going to fire you.
And I think it's really important.I do scan indeed all the time.
(20:35):
I do want to make sure that I am currentwith everything that we're doing and
that we are at theupper end of everything,
because that's just really important.But I think that, like you said,
the job descriptions, those,especially in what I've read,
gets so long and ridiculous.
And if you're applying for a jobwhere you have this endless possible
task to accomplish in a day,I mean, that's somebody's job.
(20:56):
That's a really important thing thatyou're spending a ton of time away from
your family. Things you want todo. It needs to be very specific,
so you're not selling them oneverything Who can do everything.
You're going to come in here andget really good at these tasks,
then we'll get really good atthese tasks. We'll keep moving up.
But if you're very vague and you justhave this concept of what this kind of
role is, that's tough for both sides,for the employer and the employee.
(21:18):
We've looked in the mirror to make surethat we're a quality company that is
worth attracting people. Thenwe've got a good job description,
and now we're actually doinginterviews and we're actually having,
we're kneecap to kneecapwith these interviewees.
What are the qualities that you'relooking for that makes someone a top
performer or a player versus a Cplayer? What are those qualities?
The first guy that weinterviewed for balance,
(21:38):
he's the one that kind of brought thisto me where he just said it out loud.
He's like, I love airconditioning. And to be that,
it was kind of weird because you don'tjust say that. I'm like, well, I do too.
But I would never just saythat to somebody, dude.
But then it opens up that conversation.
It's something that I think is reallyimportant that you understand what they
love about it,
and then you can kind of tailor everythingto making sure that they're getting
(21:59):
their wins, because noteverybody's wins the same.
Everybody has different ways that theyenjoy their job or the challenges that
they like,
and then you can put 'em in positionsto actually succeed and then they feel
good about it. I think it's just reallya big win trade off for both sides.
Marco, you just had me thinkingabout Anchorman with I love Lamp.
That's how your interview was forme. It's obviously time management.
(22:21):
There's all kinds of importantthings. Thinking like an owner,
I'm sure we all see in the reels of the,oh, when I give a technician a Sharpie,
they just forget it, throw itout when it's their Sharpie,
how good a care they take over it.For me, the single biggest attribute,
which is something that reallyhas to be developed by owners,
I have a military background, and whatI always love about military veterans,
(22:41):
by the way,
vets make up about 11% of the skilledtrades is something called implied tasks.
I'm sure there's tons of times wherey'all will tell your employees, Hey,
we got to go do X project.Well, yes, the project is this,
but there's that list of unstatedthings that have to happen,
and it's the ability for anindividual to look at, Hey,
(23:04):
the refrigerant needs to be refilled.Well, yes,
the refrigerant needs to berefilled, but before you do that,
you got to start checking pressures,making sure it's the right refrigerant.
Good luck trying to findrefrigerant right now.
But it's all those impliedtasks that I think are,
it's not a natural thingthat most people have,
and it's really on the owner to startbuilding that attribute into your
(23:25):
workers. Once you do that, now you havetechs out there that are able to upsell,
they're able to find thoseother issues in the projects,
and probably the single best place wherethey're going to come to you already is
from the military that is hammeredin so hard amongst that community.
This is just really funny that youbrought that up at the military thing,
this that I knew he was a vetand he was in charge of hiring,
(23:48):
and he would keep a roll of papertowels with the last roll on it,
just the last sheet with a stackof fresh rolls right next to it.
And he would ask thatguy for a paper towel,
pull the last sheet offthe paper towel roll,
and then see if he would refillit. And it's just like, Hey,
that's the kind of guy, okay, next step,
two day process that we'rethinking about tomorrow,
not just today type of thing.
(24:08):
And I just think that was just anothermilitary guy. Those guys get it,
for sure.
Implied tests rather than havinga guy whose hands are wet,
refilling the paper towel nowruining all the paper towels.
Here's the whole stack ofpaper towels. Refill it, man.
So I think that was agreat idea by him. So.
I like Patrick Leon's ideal teamplayer, humble, hungry, and smart.
You want to make sure that peopledon't have big ego when they walk in.
(24:29):
They don't take themselves too seriously.They're easy to get along with, right?
That's a humble, hungry means that theywant to work, they want to make money,
they want to progress, theywant to advance in their career,
and they're willing to do morethan what you've asked 'em to do.
They're willing to work late sometimes,maybe work weekends and just, Hey,
I'm here to do whatever you needfrom me. I'm willing to do it.
And then smart is less iq, but more eq,
(24:50):
being able to read the room when a clientsays they're happy, but they're not.
You can tell John over here alwayscomes in mad in the mornings,
which isn't okay, but it's good to know.It's important to just have that feel.
And so humble, hungry and smartis the way that we really,
that's our frameworkfor hiring new people.
We want to look for those threequalities in our candidates.
(25:12):
And the way we say it is ripe, fruitis dead, green fruit is growing,
and that you want people who, no matterhow long you've been in the trade,
there's always more. There's alwaysmore. You're never at the end of this.
This is like honestly,if you get down into it,
it's like the nuts and bolts is physics.
So you're never at the end of this thing.
And if you're ever in this positionwhere you think, I know everything,
I need to know you're done,it will continue to grow.
(25:35):
Things will continue to change,
and you'll stay here thinking that Iknow enough, I'm good. And that's, again,
I think it really all just goesback to what is your culture?
Do you prioritize that?
Is that important every day withwhat you're doing at your company?
Yeah.
One of my favorite things that we do inthe whole interview process to make sure
that people are on time, peopleis the more meetings you have,
(25:58):
the more times they have to be ontime. And so we have a phone review.
They have to be on time for,we have an in-person review,
they have to be on time for, and thenwe'll do at least two ride-alongs,
sometimes three. And if theylive far away, we'll do three.
And sometimes that third one, they'll be20 minutes late. And then, Nope, sorry,
it's the honeymoon period.If you're not good now,
you'll be late every singletime. You have to be on time now.
(26:19):
And so that's one little hackthat we found that really helps.
But if they're 15 minutesearly every single time,
potentially five times in a row,
that's a really good sign that they'renot going to drag you along and be late
half the time.But yeah, this is great. Thanks, guys.
I'm going to break it down to three actualitems that people can do right now in
starting today to helptheir hiring process.
Number one is this whole conceptof look in the mirror. First,
(26:41):
you want to make sure that you arean attractive business with a real
opportunity. People areattracted to growing businesses,
business that they have vision and aplace that they can come in and thrive.
And you want to make sure that you havethat you're actually selling a great
opportunity.
Number two is you want to make surethat the person you're interviewing has
passion or a willingness to learn,
just a good vibe that they're goingto come in and bring energy to the
(27:06):
organization and not justlike another lackluster,
I'm just here for a paycheckkind of thing. And number three,
make sure that they're going to beon time by having lots of interviews,
phone screen, phone interview,in-person, interview, ride alongs,
all those are ways to make sure theperson's not late. And if they are late,
then it's a no really, if they'relate, no. If it's not a hell yes,
(27:26):
it's a hell no.
Absolutely.
Right.
Amen.
Well, you guys are crushing it. Keepdoing it. Keep serving your people.
How do you think people findout more about you, Marco?
They can go to ourwebsite, balance, HV c.com.
It has links to all of our socialdifferent interviews. Check it out.
For us. Go ahead and go to bluerecruit.com, and of course,
all the different socials.
B go. Thanks for being here,guys. I really appreciate.
(27:47):
It. Thank you.
And thank you for listening.
I hope that you heard something todaythat will make your whole hiring process
more effective and more compelling toget more top performers. I'm your host,
Adam Sylvester. You canfind me@adamsylvester.com.
Your team and your clients andyour family deserve your very best.
So go give it to 'em.
Most women will not apply for a jobthat they don't meet 80% of the job
description for. Whereas men we'rein the high forties we're like,
I can probably figure that out wherewomen are like in there. Nope, not for me.
When you think about growing out yourteam, women make up 51% of the workforce.
They're 42% of the new skilled tradeworkers that have entered the workforce
this year.
(00:20):
You do not want to create job descriptionsthat are going to just lock out that
huge group of potential workers.
Welcome to Masters of Home Service,
the best podcast for home service proslike us. I'm your host, Adam Sylvester,
and I want you to crush it in business.
Are you having a hard timehiring top performers?
Are you just settling for C players?
(00:40):
When you really justwant to hire A players,
you kind of fly out the seatof your pan when you're hiring,
just asking this question or thatquestion without any kind of plan.
If you're struggling to hire top talent,then you're probably doing it wrong.
My guests today are rich and Marco Rich,
why don't you start us offand tell us who you are.
Thanks so much forhaving me. Rich Camacho,
co-founder and CEO of Blue Recruit,
(01:01):
we're a platform that helps companieslike Marco find job seekers and then
helping those job seekers connect withquality companies across the skilled
trades through all the US and Canada.Bingo. Well thanks for being here,
I appreiciate it.
Mark, what about you?
Alright, I'm the co-owner of BalancedHVAC out of Vero Beach, Florida.
We're a new company,we're about two years old.
Prior to that I was hiring people forabout five years and we've had really good
(01:23):
success and a lot of those guys that wehired before have come over to the new
company and we just have a lotof loyalty and really great guys.
Good. Well,
I'm glad you're here and I think that alot of our listeners are just wondering,
what am I doing wrong? And so fromyour perspective, Marco, you go first.
What do you see as the most common mistakethat business owners like us make on
(01:44):
a regular basis when they'retrying to hire top talent?
I think it's really hard and it's a reallycommon thing that you hear people say
is that you can't findgood help these days.
And I think that is putting the ownershipand the responsibility on these people
just existing who know exactly how youwant things done and exactly how you want
them done when you want them done.
And there needs to be this process whereyou need to understand there's this
investment in this person.
(02:04):
There are certain qualities that willhelp those people grow in that position,
but it's really something where youneed to find somebody who has these core
qualities and then you can build uponthose and kind of have them grow within
your company.
It's really hard to find good people andnot pay them and give them benefits and
really it starts at that area.
It needs to be something that the employeroffers, something that people want.
(02:26):
And if people don't want to work from you,
people probably don't want tobuy things from you either.
Yeah, so you would say look in the mirrorfirst before you try to post anything
online. Hundred.
Percent.
It can't be something where it's the kindof job description that you would just
scroll through. It has tobe something that pops,
something that really kindof puts yourself in the light where they're getting
an idea of who you are as a company,who your team is as a company,
(02:47):
and then just what the goals are.And there has to be a vision,
there has to be goals. Thegoal isn't to get this job.
The goal is to get this job and grow andexcel and continue just to get better
within whatever that trade would.
Yeah. Rich, what do you think? What'sthe biggest mistake people are making?
Mark, you absolutely nailed it there withtelling the job seeker about yourself,
but one of the big problems that I seeevery single day, and I'm sorry buddy.
(03:11):
HVAC is like the worst at this. No hvac,
y'all are the primadonnasof the skilled trades.
The plumbers are just outthere doing the dirty work.
But one of the biggest problems that Isee with business owners is that every
single, we're all proud of ourcompanies. Every single one of us here,
we're a business owner. Everybody'sproud of what we've built,
what we continue to build. However,
(03:31):
they don't treat the hiringof new workers like a sale.
That's exactly what it's.
That's right.
Think about it. In the housingmarket a couple years ago,
it was a buyer's market, right?I'm sorry, seller's market.
You could basically post a shack,especially down in South Florida,
you could post a shack and they'relike, oh, it's $800,000, one bathroom,
half a room. Like what? And it wasjust people had to do it. Right now,
(03:55):
employment is a job seekers marketAnd employers have to realize
that you not only have toput yourself out there,
you have to sell your opportunities andyou're not selling a job. People aren't,
A lot of small business owners think, oh,
they should just want to work forme because my culture's awesome,
my company's awesome. Nobody knows that.
It might be true and that'sgreat, but nobody knows that.
(04:18):
And people really have tochange their mentality.
Just like when you're out there tryingto upsell a repair into a new unit where
you've got to upsell and explain to thatjob seeker why it is they should come
be part of your team and grow with you.
Yeah. We spend
so much money investing in marketingand advertising and thousands of dollars
(04:38):
every month in getting new leads,
and then we'd spend $10 a month onIndeed, and we think that we're like,
why aren't we gettingnew leads or new hires?
And so we really need to change ourperspective. I like what you said,
we need to look at ourselves first.
Both you guys said that and make surethat we're attracting, we're attractive.
Basically,
what do we have to be in order to begood employers that people want to work
(05:00):
for, and how do wecommunicate that to people?
I think it's like Rich was saying,
is where I think any businessowner in the whole world,
my business is the best and I know allthese reasons and it's all in my head,
and it's this beautiful picture of thisutopia little small business that works
perfectly and it's something thatyou need to be able to write down.
It needs to be tangible, it needs tobe something that somebody can read.
(05:20):
And I know we spent a lot of time whenwe started balance coming up with a
mission statement and someother people that I worked with.
How many AC companieshave a mission statement?
And then when you are interviewingnew people or talking to people who
potentially are going to work for you issomething that's written down that they
can see that it's on our website.
It goes back to our socials.When you come in and talk to me,
I'm going to pitch that same story.
(05:41):
Anybody that you would meet withinthe company that see it every day,
they go through it every dayand they can vouch for that.
It needs to be like everything.If you're not measuring it,
how do you know if you'reachieving it? It's just this.
It can't be a vague goal. And I'mthe best because I'm the best.
We are the best because X, Y,z, and give those specifics.
And then there's thataccountability to it too.
If you have somebody coming in lookingfor employment and you're telling them
(06:04):
you do all these great things,
it would just be such a bummer to notbe able to follow through on that.
You can switch. Yeah. It's likeyou need to be able to, Hey,
I'm going to tell you all these greatthings. I hope I can exceed 'em.
I hope they get better than I pitchedthem to you. And like you were saying,
where right now it's the people that arelooking for the job. It's their market.
It should always betheir market. How is it?
(06:25):
There's no way that any of this wouldever work if it's just one person running
the show by themselves. You needto have this people on the street,
especially the technicians, thoseare the people the customers see,
and I could think I'm the greatestair conditioning guy of all time,
but I'm not in the houses. It'sthe technicians in the field.
And those need to be people that havea reason to be excited about going to
work. And it has to be more than justthe job itself. It has to be the culture.
(06:49):
Yeah.
What do you guys think in termsof compensation and benefits?
Are there certain benefits that tradespeople are looking for that really matter
them more than maybe somebody else?Anything that comes to mind on that?
Yeah.
One thing that's really crazy is mostpeople think of what's the number one
thing when someone's looking for anew job that they're looking for?
(07:09):
Most business owners when askedthat question will say, oh,
they're looking for bettercompensation. Ever since COVID,
we've been running a study for years now,
but ever since COVID compensation isactually the number three most desired
single attribute when it comes to a job.
The number one thing that trade workersare most looking for is flexibility in
their schedule. And people look atthat. What do you mean flexibility?
(07:32):
You're not going to workfrom home. It's not like, oh,
come in whenever you feel like it.
But what's interesting about whatpeople look for for flexibility,
one of my favorite stories years ago,
there was a mobile automotive shop ofMaryland that was hiring a technician.
They found 'em on our platform.They interviewed connected,
they loved each other. The onestipulation the technician had was, Hey,
(07:54):
every Thursday afternoonis my son's lacrosse game.
I will not miss my son's lacrosse game.So that business owner said, okay, hey,
no worries. We'll go ahead. You canleave at lunchtime on Thursdays,
come in an hour earlier, Mondaythrough Wednesday, stay an hour later,
make up that time. No big deal.They went ahead, hired him.
He actually still works there.
That business owner created suchincredible loyalty with that because next
(08:16):
season he might switch to Wednesdaygames and they'll readjust the schedule.
But it's that flexibility that peopleare really looking towards because at the
end of the day, yes, we workbecause we need compensation,
but we need to have that compensationto support our friends, our family,
our loved ones. And thenat the end of the day,
that's actually the single mostimportant thing. By the way,
health benefits are number two,do not wait 30, 60, 90 days,
(08:39):
health benefits day one.
So what do you guys think we shoulddo if we can't afford all that stuff?
We're brand new company, can'tafford PTO, can't afford vacation,
can't afford health,all that kind of thing.
Because I know there's a lot oflisteners right now who are thinking,
I just can't afford all that. That'sthousands and thousands of dollars a year.
What else can they do to attract? Theycan be flexible. What else can they do?
(09:00):
I was going to piggyback off what hesaid is that exactly that flexibility is
such an important thing. And Ithink in any, especially HPAC,
but anything where you have an on-callor there's seasonal type things where
it's really hot in Florida right now,we're going to have some overtime.
But when you see the guys that aremaking a lot of money within the trade,
and again,
that's the perceived thing that isimportant is how much money annually do I
(09:22):
bring home? But if you're working 60hours a week, overtime is not a benefit.
Overtime, there's somethingthat's not managed correctly,
whether you need to hire anotherperson or be more organized internally,
but overtime is not a benefit. So ifyou are compromising your free time,
if you're working 60 hoursa week, 52 weeks a year,
how important is work? I feel like thatflexibility, it doesn't cost anything.
(09:46):
Flexibility costs, it'sabout organization,
communication and really just having somecompassion for the person that you're
working with and realizing this isn't atechnician, this is guy, this is Carlos,
this is Miguel. These arepeople that I work with.
They do things outside of airconditioning just like I do,
and they need to be understandingwith that. And that's free.
You can do that for free.
(10:06):
Yeah, I think the listener needs tojust understand that they need to
try to give as much as they can,
whether that's just a little bit offlexibility or a lot of flexibility or a
little bit of benefitsand a lot of benefits,
they need to figure out what their limitis and then give that to their people.
What can we do that's uniqueand special for our people?
And then highlight that whateverthat is in the job interview.
(10:27):
And any more thoughts on that?
One real quick thing before that issome people might not want to hear this,
but it's just reality. If youcan't afford certain benefits,
if you can't afford thePTOs, the health benefits,
I think what's more importantat that point, reexamine,
are you ready to start a business?Are you ready to even think about growing
(10:48):
your business? I tellpeople this all the time,
whether it's to hire anothertechnician, hire a salesperson, hire.
We see it all the time with HRcoordinators, with recruiters.
You're not actually ready to takethat step and jumping into that step,
we all know well crushthat business real quick,
and that's a fastest way to get yourbusiness shut down. So if you're worried,
(11:08):
I don't know if I can afford that,
you're probably not readyand just keep chugging along.
I see it with texts all thetime like, Hey, you know what?
I know how to do all this stuff. Whydon't I just start my own business? Well,
do you know what kind ofreserve you're going to need?
Don't plan on a paycheck for the next12 months. Are you ready for that?
Yeah. The first year of a businessis a nightmare. It's horrifying.
And I knew it was goingto be horrifying going in.
(11:28):
It was scarier than I thought,
but this was the decision that wemade as all of our employees. Day one,
we're going to have full healthcoverage and we would pay for all of it.
And yeah, it was very stressful.We didn't have any money,
but as this thing continuesto work, those guys,
they see the investment,they see that they matter,
and I think that there's this attitude,
especially with something likeair conditioning in Florida,
(11:51):
there's a lot of AC guys and theattitude is that these technicians
are replaceable, anybody's replaceable,
and if that attitudecontinues into your culture,
you don't have a culture and it's.
Post bad culture.
So it's something where you needto have, whether it's your 401k,
whether it is your health benefits,whether it's your continued education,
(12:11):
whatever your benefits thatare important to you are,
they need to be something that North Star,
something that you're notgoing to compromise on.
It's something that's going to happenno matter what. And like you said,
you need to plan for it. And if youcan't do it, you can't plan for it,
you probably shouldn't.So well said with that.
And I think you mentioned a whole bunchof different benefits that are out
(12:32):
there. The benefits for each individualemployee don't have to be the same.
We have had employees that want401k matching. We've had other ones,
especially the younger ones that don'tquite understand that 401k matching is
the greatest free money you'llever get in your life. I'm like,
are you sure you don't want this?I'm just going to give you money.
And they're like, no, no, no. I'lltake more paycheck. I was like,
(12:54):
you don't understand the benefits ofthis, but hey, they're individuals.
They can make up their own choices.
Your plans don't have tobe the same for everybody.
We have a lot of employeesthat they're married,
their spouse has a phenomenal medicalplan and their spouse can cover them,
the dependents of children.
And so really just talk to theseindividuals during the interview,
(13:15):
during the initial onboarding and figureout what's important to you and then go
ahead and customize thatbenefit package for them.
This is a great conversation.
I do want to pause for a minuteto talk about jobber top talent,
want great tools, they wantto have good HVAC tools,
and that's softwareincluded. So how does Jobber,
as one of your tools in your tool belt,
how does that help you stand apart fromthe rest in the eyes of your candidates
(13:38):
and your employees?
I think the biggest thing is that yousay when you're bringing in these top
techs,
these are people who are working at areally high level within their trade.
And again, what we do is in the attic,so nobody sees that for the most part.
But how we use jobber to kind of get ridof that and so that everybody can see
the craftsmanship and the careis every job a one-off job,
we'll have a visit review form and thena multiple day job will have it daily
(14:01):
review form. Those forms are going tolet you know, here's what we did today.
Is it working? Yes or no? Here'swhat needs to happen next,
and here's any additionalnotes that we might have,
but we want to give youthis good information.
But the secret sauce isalong with that review form,
is that we're posting a link from companycam that's going to show you the work
that we actually did inside of your attictoday. So it's not this just ambiguous
(14:23):
duck that's in your attic and youhave no idea what it looks like.
We can show you the progress, wecan show you the craftsmanship.
And then those guys get to create theirown content with these tools that the
customers appreciate. And when thecustomers get to see those things,
and it's not just Miguel in theattic making a bunch of noise. It is,
you see what he did at the end of the day,
and I've been doing this for 15 yearsand I still can't believe what these guys
(14:45):
are building and the spaces that they'rebuilding and then getting the results
that they're having.
So if you're not giving these guys thetools to kind of flex their work that
they're doing every day at thishigh level that you expect,
what are we doing it for?
We want the customers to be ableto see that and having that type of
transparency and be able to show themhow good of a job we're doing in their
attic.That adds value and that adds money,
(15:07):
and you can charge more for this betterproduct because people can actually see
it. And it's not just ACcompany one, AC company two,
they both did the same thing.Didn't we did a better job?
And here's a picture of everyday of us progressing through it.
Here's the results at the end.
And then those guys are veryproud of the work that they did,
and they should be rightfully so.
And it's nice to be able to show thosethings to the customers that add value to
(15:29):
your top tax and then justadd value to your customer,
to your company as a whole.
Yeah, I totally agree.
And I also think that Jobber just makesit simple to give our team instructions.
All the notes are in there,all the photos are in there,
and it tells them where to goand how to call the client.
They need everything is all in oneplace so that he feels confident
(15:50):
going to the client's house.
They have all the informationthey need all in one place.
It really makes it easy to get thejob done. If you're not using jobber,
you need to less chaos and more orderand jobber will help you do all that.
Go to jobber.com/podcast deal,
get exclusive discount andstart using jobber today.
Let's move on to the jobdescription, the job posting.
(16:11):
Do you guys have any secretsfor our listeners to how to make a job posting more
compelling and more effective?
I feel like it's really important toestablish yourself and be very genuine
throughout the entire process.I am an old football player,
an old track athlete, so I'mlike a meathead to the T.
So the job descriptionthat I'm posting is really
(16:31):
a team oriented type of thing,
but that is also in line with kindof how we've branded our culture.
A lot of what we do is we want to makesure that we have problem solvers,
not problem pushers. We wantpeople that when things get hard,
we're not running away from things.
We're not blaming other people becauseit's always really easy to find 50 things
that cause something to not work,
but we need to find the people who aregoing to find them one or two things that
(16:53):
will help this problem work,people that are patient,
and it's really just about findingpeople that you don't mind spending time
with.I think as the employer,
it's my job to make sure thatyou have the tools that you need,
the training that you need,
and that you're comfortableperforming your day-to-day tasks.
Emphasize communication.
We need to make sure that you don't mindcoming in and learning job or learning
company camp, learning the things thatwe use to communicate with customers.
(17:16):
I think that's something that's reallyoverlooked, especially in our trade,
is that we don't have this reallygreat communication and rapport with
customers.
There's a lot of handwritten scratchnotes on three poppy pieces of paper,
but we want to change that,
so we need to make sure that we'reclear about that at the beginning.
We have different expectations onthe job with your communication with
customers,
and when really just comes down to beingokay with working with other people and
(17:39):
hot addicts that it's notalways the best situation,
but you need to find a way to make it thebest of the situation and not let that
kind of tempo dictate your culture andfind the people who want to come to work
and have a reason to work too.I think that's really important.
So full disclosure,for the last six years,
I've led an effort to get ridof job posts. So on our platform
(18:01):
we have zero job posting,zero job descriptions.
I think that specifically for the trades,
it is a semi outdated systemof trying to find folks.
However, with that said,if you're using them,
if you're putting out there a couplethings that you definitely should do,
put the actual, if it's anhourly rate, put the hourly rate.
(18:23):
If it's a range, put a real range. Nothingdrives me more crazy. I'm like, oh,
this role is 30 to $150,000. Wow,
one sounds fantastic. The other onesounds horrendous. Where do I fall in?
Put the compensation outthere. At the end of the day,
all you're doing is saving time. Whybring people in that are well outside,
well above, well below? Whateverit is that you're offering,
(18:44):
you're saving everybody time.
Another thing is avoid putting inthis endless list of these are the
things we're looking for.Focus on the absolute go.
No goss of the job,residential HVAC, construction.
You have to have a clean criminal record.
Our insurance will not allow someoneto enter a home that doesn't have one.
So if it's an absoluterequirement, put it on there.
(19:05):
If you're looking forCDL drivers, guess what?
You have to have a clean drivingrecord, things like that.
If it's not a hard requirement, that'swhat the interview process is for.
So allow those individuals to get intothe process and don't just shut the door
on them by putting in whatmost of the time is arbitrary
requirements that aregoing to lock people out.
And one of the big things is you'reactually going to push out more women from
(19:30):
applying to your jobs becauseit's this crazy statistic.
Most women will not apply for a jobthat they don't meet 80% of the job
description for, whereas men we'rein the high forties, so we're like,
interesting. I can probably figure thatout where women are like in there. Nope,
not for me. But when you thinkabout growing out your team,
women make up 51% of the workforce.
They're 42% of the new skilled tradeworkers that have entered the workforce
(19:51):
this year. You do not want to createjob descriptions that are going to just
lock out that huge groupof potential workers.
I think that I use a job postingto really clarify what the job is.
I want people to know exactlywhat they're signing up for.
I want them to know generally speaking,
what the job is like andwhether it's a good company,
(20:12):
because a lot of times it's not the guyor the girl who is looking for the job,
it's the girlfriend or the boyfriendor the mom who's like, Hey,
get out of the house. Go geta job. And they see the ad,
and so it helps them like,oh, this company's legit.
So we had to communicate that stuff tothem clearly and not just bark orders at
them like, yeah, you better be goodor else we're going to fire you.
And I think it's really important.I do scan indeed all the time.
(20:35):
I do want to make sure that I am currentwith everything that we're doing and
that we are at theupper end of everything,
because that's just really important.But I think that, like you said,
the job descriptions, those,especially in what I've read,
gets so long and ridiculous.
And if you're applying for a jobwhere you have this endless possible
task to accomplish in a day,I mean, that's somebody's job.
(20:56):
That's a really important thing thatyou're spending a ton of time away from
your family. Things you want todo. It needs to be very specific,
so you're not selling them oneverything Who can do everything.
You're going to come in here andget really good at these tasks,
then we'll get really good atthese tasks. We'll keep moving up.
But if you're very vague and you justhave this concept of what this kind of
role is, that's tough for both sides,for the employer and the employee.
(21:18):
We've looked in the mirror to make surethat we're a quality company that is
worth attracting people. Thenwe've got a good job description,
and now we're actually doinginterviews and we're actually having,
we're kneecap to kneecapwith these interviewees.
What are the qualities that you'relooking for that makes someone a top
performer or a player versus a Cplayer? What are those qualities?
The first guy that weinterviewed for balance,
(21:38):
he's the one that kind of brought thisto me where he just said it out loud.
He's like, I love airconditioning. And to be that,
it was kind of weird because you don'tjust say that. I'm like, well, I do too.
But I would never just saythat to somebody, dude.
But then it opens up that conversation.
It's something that I think is reallyimportant that you understand what they
love about it,
and then you can kind of tailor everythingto making sure that they're getting
(21:59):
their wins, because noteverybody's wins the same.
Everybody has different ways that theyenjoy their job or the challenges that
they like,
and then you can put 'em in positionsto actually succeed and then they feel
good about it. I think it's just reallya big win trade off for both sides.
Marco, you just had me thinkingabout Anchorman with I love Lamp.
That's how your interview was forme. It's obviously time management.
(22:21):
There's all kinds of importantthings. Thinking like an owner,
I'm sure we all see in the reels of the,oh, when I give a technician a Sharpie,
they just forget it, throw itout when it's their Sharpie,
how good a care they take over it.For me, the single biggest attribute,
which is something that reallyhas to be developed by owners,
I have a military background, and whatI always love about military veterans,
(22:41):
by the way,
vets make up about 11% of the skilledtrades is something called implied tasks.
I'm sure there's tons of times wherey'all will tell your employees, Hey,
we got to go do X project.Well, yes, the project is this,
but there's that list of unstatedthings that have to happen,
and it's the ability for anindividual to look at, Hey,
(23:04):
the refrigerant needs to be refilled.Well, yes,
the refrigerant needs to berefilled, but before you do that,
you got to start checking pressures,making sure it's the right refrigerant.
Good luck trying to findrefrigerant right now.
But it's all those impliedtasks that I think are,
it's not a natural thingthat most people have,
and it's really on the owner to startbuilding that attribute into your
(23:25):
workers. Once you do that, now you havetechs out there that are able to upsell,
they're able to find thoseother issues in the projects,
and probably the single best place wherethey're going to come to you already is
from the military that is hammeredin so hard amongst that community.
This is just really funny that youbrought that up at the military thing,
this that I knew he was a vetand he was in charge of hiring,
(23:48):
and he would keep a roll of papertowels with the last roll on it,
just the last sheet with a stackof fresh rolls right next to it.
And he would ask thatguy for a paper towel,
pull the last sheet offthe paper towel roll,
and then see if he would refillit. And it's just like, Hey,
that's the kind of guy, okay, next step,
two day process that we'rethinking about tomorrow,
not just today type of thing.
(24:08):
And I just think that was just anothermilitary guy. Those guys get it,
for sure.
Implied tests rather than havinga guy whose hands are wet,
refilling the paper towel nowruining all the paper towels.
Here's the whole stack ofpaper towels. Refill it, man.
So I think that was agreat idea by him. So.
I like Patrick Leon's ideal teamplayer, humble, hungry, and smart.
You want to make sure that peopledon't have big ego when they walk in.
(24:29):
They don't take themselves too seriously.They're easy to get along with, right?
That's a humble, hungry means that theywant to work, they want to make money,
they want to progress, theywant to advance in their career,
and they're willing to do morethan what you've asked 'em to do.
They're willing to work late sometimes,maybe work weekends and just, Hey,
I'm here to do whatever you needfrom me. I'm willing to do it.
And then smart is less iq, but more eq,
(24:50):
being able to read the room when a clientsays they're happy, but they're not.
You can tell John over here alwayscomes in mad in the mornings,
which isn't okay, but it's good to know.It's important to just have that feel.
And so humble, hungry and smartis the way that we really,
that's our frameworkfor hiring new people.
We want to look for those threequalities in our candidates.
(25:12):
And the way we say it is ripe, fruitis dead, green fruit is growing,
and that you want people who, no matterhow long you've been in the trade,
there's always more. There's alwaysmore. You're never at the end of this.
This is like honestly,if you get down into it,
it's like the nuts and bolts is physics.
So you're never at the end of this thing.
And if you're ever in this positionwhere you think, I know everything,
I need to know you're done,it will continue to grow.
(25:35):
Things will continue to change,
and you'll stay here thinking that Iknow enough, I'm good. And that's, again,
I think it really all just goesback to what is your culture?
Do you prioritize that?
Is that important every day withwhat you're doing at your company?
Yeah.
One of my favorite things that we do inthe whole interview process to make sure
that people are on time, peopleis the more meetings you have,
(25:58):
the more times they have to be ontime. And so we have a phone review.
They have to be on time for,we have an in-person review,
they have to be on time for, and thenwe'll do at least two ride-alongs,
sometimes three. And if theylive far away, we'll do three.
And sometimes that third one, they'll be20 minutes late. And then, Nope, sorry,
it's the honeymoon period.If you're not good now,
you'll be late every singletime. You have to be on time now.
(26:19):
And so that's one little hackthat we found that really helps.
But if they're 15 minutesearly every single time,
potentially five times in a row,
that's a really good sign that they'renot going to drag you along and be late
half the time.But yeah, this is great. Thanks, guys.
I'm going to break it down to three actualitems that people can do right now in
starting today to helptheir hiring process.
Number one is this whole conceptof look in the mirror. First,
(26:41):
you want to make sure that you arean attractive business with a real
opportunity. People areattracted to growing businesses,
business that they have vision and aplace that they can come in and thrive.
And you want to make sure that you havethat you're actually selling a great
opportunity.
Number two is you want to make surethat the person you're interviewing has
passion or a willingness to learn,
just a good vibe that they're goingto come in and bring energy to the
(27:06):
organization and not justlike another lackluster,
I'm just here for a paycheckkind of thing. And number three,
make sure that they're going to beon time by having lots of interviews,
phone screen, phone interview,in-person, interview, ride alongs,
all those are ways to make sure theperson's not late. And if they are late,
then it's a no really, if they'relate, no. If it's not a hell yes,
(27:26):
it's a hell no.
Absolutely.
Right.
Amen.
Well, you guys are crushing it. Keepdoing it. Keep serving your people.
How do you think people findout more about you, Marco?
They can go to ourwebsite, balance, HV c.com.
It has links to all of our socialdifferent interviews. Check it out.
For us. Go ahead and go to bluerecruit.com, and of course,
all the different socials.
B go. Thanks for being here,guys. I really appreciate.
(27:47):
It. Thank you.
And thank you for listening.
I hope that you heard something todaythat will make your whole hiring process
more effective and more compelling toget more top performers. I'm your host,
Adam Sylvester. You canfind me@adamsylvester.com.
Your team and your clients andyour family deserve your very best.
So go give it to 'em.
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