January 13, 2025 • 33 mins
Marketing plans don’t have to be complex. Just consistent.
In this episode, Brandon and Caleb break down the real marketing budgets of three fast-growing companies—one legal, one medical, one home improvement—and reveal the simple strategies behind their multi-million-dollar growth.
If you’ve ever wondered:
- How much should I actually spend on marketing?
- Where should that money go?
- Is branding still worth it in 2025?
This episode gives you clear answers and proven benchmarks you can steal for your own plan.
Simple. Strategic. Scalable.
Hit play and see what a “million-dollar” marketing plan actually looks like.
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LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/frank-and-maven/
Host: Brandon Welch
Co-Host: Caleb Agee
Executive Producer: Carter Breaux
Do you have a marketing problem you'd like us to help solve? Send it to MavenMonday@FrankandMaven.com!
Get a copy of our Best-Selling Book, The Maven Marketer Here:
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Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Caleb Agee (00:00):
I think it's okay to have a marketing plan that is
this simple and it works.
More people should have asimple marketing plan and it
grows the company.
We work really hard at a fewthings and we grow them by
literally millions of dollars.
Brandon Welch (00:15):
Welcome to the Maven Marketing Podcast.
Today is Maven Monday.
I'm your host, Brandon Welch,and I'm joined by Caleb.
Is that a new shirt, AG?
No way Does it look like a newshirt to you.
We were just talking aboutwearing duplicate shirts and I
think I think you could find acouple times we've worn these
shirts yeah, I was.
Caleb Agee (00:35):
Brandon made me take my jacket off, just so you
could see that I wore the shirtagain.
Yeah, I don't know how manytimes I've.
Brandon Welch (00:41):
I think it's a good color on you.
It's good.
It's good.
Yeah, go the Steve Jobs route,right yeah.
Yeah, Find what works and letit keep working New year old
shirt right, yes, yes, this isthe place where we help you
eliminate waste in advertising,grow your business and achieve
the big dream.
Caleb Agee (00:56):
Hey, I wanted to say thank you to.
We just rounded another year,thank you.
That was our first full year ofrecording this podcast.
We're celebrating and it'sawesome.
We're excited about it.
We got a unique compliment thisweek from one of our fans Jason
, I'm looking at you.
He said that we reminded him ofthe duo from Psych the two
(01:18):
characters on the sitcom.
So I'm going to take that as acompliment.
Yeah, I took it as a highcompliment, okay.
I'm going to take that as acompliment.
Yeah, I took it as a highcompliment, okay, because it
means that we are funny andenjoyable, smart and handsome
and handsome.
That's got to be that way, yeah, so come on, son.
Brandon Welch (01:30):
So new year.
Last week we actually droppedan episode that was not recorded
in the new year.
I don't know if you caught that, but I've been out of town,
I've been on the road.
We're back.
This is actually our firstepisode of recording this year
Together.
We thought we ended the yearwith our very best advice on
creating marketing plans.
(01:51):
You can go look at steps one,two and three from the midweek
to December.
Then we gave you kind of arecap and 25 tips for 2025.
We dropped.
Last week we had AlexSwire-Clark, one of the most
brilliant dudes I've ever met,talking about behavioral
psychology and how to alignyourself with your team and how
to get out of the way and letthem grow your company.
(02:13):
Isn't that a novel concept?
Yeah, and this week let's bringit back to this idea of a
marketing plan, because ifyou're in small business or if
you are selling to a smallbusiness right now, chances are
everybody's still kind ofrounding out what this year is
going to look like as far astheir marketing efforts.
If you're wise, you're planningthat right now.
You're not waiting until ithappens to you.
But we thought, hey, we talkeda lot of theory, we gave you the
(02:39):
steps we use and we've usedrepeatedly to grow hundreds of
companies, but we pulled threerandom ones out and we're
calling this episode MarketingPlans that Are Making Millions
and for obvious reasons, we areanonymizing some of this.
But these profiles, we'reliterally giving you the actual
numbers how we built the budget.
(02:59):
We're going to go mostly budgetand marketing mix, because
that's a big question right now.
We could get super theoreticaland go into the messaging and
share campaigns which we do fromtime to time.
Yeah, but we're going to giveyou three clients that are
definitely growing by doubledigits and have been growing by
double digits, and all of thesewould have been in the category
of making millions of dollars onreturn from that marketing
(03:20):
investment.
Caleb Agee (03:21):
Isn't that?
Brandon Welch (03:21):
exciting.
That is exciting.
It's really exciting from thatmarketing investment Isn't that
exciting.
That is exciting, it's reallyexciting.
Yeah, so kind of a shortepisode, but just so you can
hear it and go huh, where am Iat from that?
Right, we're going to jump in.
We have a legal client, we havea medical client and we have a
home improvement client.
Those are the three areas thatare kind of in home run
territory for Frank and Mavenjust over the years.
(03:42):
For whatever reason, that's whatwe settled into.
These principles and thisbalance should apply to anybody
who is in a service or expertservice industry.
You would nuance a little bitfor retail as far as percentages
but, the balance and the mixbetween medias is probably the
same if you're serving a localmarket.
Caleb Agee (04:00):
Yeah, and then there would also be nuance for
hospitality and food service aswell.
I think a little bit of a tradethere, yep.
And then there would also benuance for, like, hospitality
and food service as well.
I think a little bit of a tradethere, yep.
Brandon Welch (04:08):
We'll talk about that as we go along, but let's
just say you are a brick andmortar or serving a community or
a region or a lot of these areactually multi-regional clients,
but the principle applies downto the city and town that you
would be working in.
So, you want to talk about thelegal client.
Caleb Agee (04:29):
Yeah, so this attorney group, it's multiple
attorneys obviously here.
They have been working togetherfor about 10 years, obviously
growing the company.
When we started working withthem, um, they had one office,
one office yeah.
(04:49):
And they've.
They've really growntremendously over that time and
now they have nine in it's kindof a regional across it, across
the entire area In the South isharea.
Brandon Welch (05:00):
Yep, yeah and um, they've doubled the size of
their business in just underthree years and I will say that
the three years we worked withthem before that, they doubled
their business in that, yeah.
But just so you know, I'm justgoing to give some random
revenues of these guys 2.1million four years ago, 3
(05:24):
million three years ago, 3.8million what would that be two
years ago?
And then, this last year wasjust under 4 million and there
were some external factors.
We're going to talk a lot aboutexternal factors right now, or
throughout some of these,because what you'll see, yes,
(05:46):
you want to set annual growthgoals, yes, you want to be
mindful of cash flow and whatyou're able to invest in a
marketing plan, but what you'llsee is it's not necessarily what
you did now or even in the lastyear.
You will see, with all of theseplans, that even when there's a
hiccup on a six or 12-monthbasis because, frankly, like in
(06:08):
the last couple of years, it'sbeen weird- for some categories,
life happens.
Caleb Agee (06:11):
There's been some headwinds.
Brandon Welch (06:12):
Things happen At some point.
You always slingshot past thatand if we were to data plot the
five-year trend, it would bedoing a more aggressive, steep
climb.
Caleb Agee (06:22):
Yeah, is that fair?
Yeah, I think it's fair.
Brandon Welch (06:25):
But you could easily say in four years they've
doubled their business.
Well, you could say in threeyears they've doubled their
business actually.
So how did we do that, caleb?
Caleb Agee (06:34):
Yeah.
So we're going to give you justthe quick numbers, the overview
of their marketing plan.
We always think in three typesof customers.
Today customers are buying whatyou're selling today.
Tomorrow customers are peoplewho are not buying.
I'm giving you a quick recapPeople who are not buying today
but will eventually.
And then yesterday customersare people who have bought from
(06:55):
you in the past and you want toget them to come back for repeat
purchases or referrals.
Brandon Welch (07:00):
Or bring their friends and family.
Yep.
So, nate the camera guy, who isthe bigger group of people?
People buying now or people whowill buy in the future?
Fine, yeah, that tomorrowcustomer, that's right.
(07:20):
I'm thinking realtors, I'mthinking car guys, I'm thinking
cosmetic surgery, I'm thinkinganything that is a longer-term
buying purchase.
Let's just say it's more thanthree or four years, right, yeah
, things we don't buy every day.
There is mathematically a very,very, very finite and small
(07:40):
amount of people in the markettoday.
Now, those are worth goingafter and if we can earn them
and influence them and win themover at a profitable pace, great
.
But what you always have toremember with today marketing is
that there's way more peopletrying to get the customer at
the finish line.
Caleb Agee (07:58):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (07:59):
And so that customer, for starters, is more
critical.
They're more price sensitivethe closer they get to the
finish line.
And if they haven't alreadydecided who they're going to do
business with, they're going togo to compare you on either
price or how fast they can getthe solution, or how easy or
what we call convenient theyperceive you to be, versus the
others.
That's right.
(08:19):
So you have to strategically bealigned to compete there.
You have to have some priceconcessions, you have to be
competitive and build yourbusiness from a strategy level
not just from a marketing level,but from a strategy level to be
a viable option.
Because if you say, buy today,buy today, buy today, buy today,
(08:39):
and you're not positioned to bethe best choice for today, then
no matter how much noise youmake, you're kind of throwing it
to the wind.
Caleb Agee (08:44):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (08:46):
So when we are talking about these today,
marketing budgets that we'regoing to tell you like literally
exactly what they're spendingin every category, keep in mind
that these would work a lot, lot, lot less and if we did not
have the long-term payoff andthe long-term momentum of these
(09:09):
companies winning over futurecustomers.
In roofing, if you take theaverage roof gets replaced one
out of every 15 yearsno-transcript.
Caleb Agee (09:25):
Yeah, I don't think it might even be closer.
Is it 15?
Might even be closer to 20 or25.
Brandon Welch (09:30):
Let's just say it's 15.
It's probably closer to 20, butthat's 6% per year.
Okay, that's one divided by 15.
And if I divide that by 12months, there's only one half of
1% of people in the marketliterally right now that care
about roofing that could ever bea Today customer, this month,
this month, in 31 days, in 31days.
So if you're measuring yourmarketing off of a two or three
(09:53):
or four month window, especiallyif it's more of a branding type
or what we would call atomorrow campaign, it's just not
mathematically sound to do thatFast forward 12 months.
There are a lot more people whowould have come around, it's
that 6% right, it's that full 6%.
Now we can do something withthat, right, yeah, so keep that
in mind and keep in mind howlong it takes somebody to buy in
(10:15):
your category.
Like, if I just had a you knowattorney service, how long does
my trade say it's going to bebefore I come back to needing
that again?
That's right.
So this client, partner, clientof ours, tell us what they're
spending, caleb all right.
Caleb Agee (10:32):
So in the today customer acquisition category,
um, they're spending googlesearch ads.
They're.
They're spending fifty seventhousand dollars a year.
Okay, um, that ebbs and flows alittle bit based on, um, you
know, the demand and the amountof available inventory on Google
(10:52):
, but by and large, and that ispurely for this client, purely
Google search ads only NotYouTube, not anything fancy.
Not Performance, max orDiscovery or Display or anything
like that.
Brandon Welch (11:04):
That's literally.
They typed in this attorney'stype service.
Attorney, if you're me orattorney's type service which is
in the category of-.
Caleb Agee (11:10):
Attorney near me, or , yeah, attorney in my town,
whatever, or their very name,right, and so they spent $57,000
on that.
And then on meta ads, which isFacebook and Instagram ads,
mostly lead generation, which iswhy we put it in this today
category.
It actually serves tomorrow alittle bit as well.
But we put it in this todaycategory.
It actually serves tomorrow alittle bit as well, but we do
(11:31):
have to.
We put it in one one of theothers.
So, um, they spent 69,000, sojust under 70,000, um, in today
category.
Brandon Welch (11:39):
Yeah, um, I'll, I'll speak a little bit to that
particular account.
Um, we have a lot of those thatmet a budget um towards calling
them to action, to likeseminars or like downloadable
things that they can, you know,get a little bit of information.
The client gives a little bitof value and then they they lean
into the next step.
But some of that is is also inthe category of like tomorrow
(12:03):
advertising, because it's justvideo views and kind of pushing
the brand in general becauseit's just video views and kind
of pushing the brand in general.
Caleb Agee (12:10):
So yeah, so that is their today.
Their today budget all in was126,000 for the year this is in
2024.
And then their tomorrowcustomer budget.
They spent 144,000 on broadcasttelevision.
They spent 14,000 on a localmagazine advertising and then
68,000 on seven differentbillboards.
(12:32):
Um, remember, they're regional.
So, they're billboards in um,in around their town and the
towns they serve.
And then, uh, they spentbetween.
They spent about 18 to 20 grandon um video production for
those TV ads and all the thingsthere.
Brandon Welch (12:50):
Yep, it's a great campaign.
Love seeing them.
And then the yesterdaymarketing category, which is
almost always the cheapest butvery often the most impactful.
Caleb Agee (13:02):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (13:03):
Four grand total on Christmas cards graphics
mailers.
Caleb Agee (13:08):
Just random thank yous and feel goods.
Brandon Welch (13:13):
Sometimes this client does appreciation events.
I didn't see one in theirbudget last year.
Caleb Agee (13:17):
No, I don't think so .
Brandon Welch (13:18):
We should make them do another one.
And then, if you count all inemail marketing just to their
past customers, with thecreative services and the
software and all that, it's fivegrand.
Caleb Agee (13:28):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (13:28):
Okay, their entire budget is $369,170.
Or sorry, $770.
Yeah, and that was the breakout.
35% of that went to todaycustomers, the other basically
went to tomorrow customers.
There's maybe half a percentthat went to yesterday customers
, that's right, you know.
Half a percent that went toyesterday customers, that's
(13:48):
right.
Caleb Agee (13:48):
So and then if you put that, you know they were
right at about 4 million.
Put that 369,000, that's justjust under 10% 10% cost of
marketing Yep All in.
Brandon Welch (14:00):
That is a real plan.
Caleb Agee (14:01):
That is the real results $4 million company spent
$369,000 and that's how theybroke it down.
Brandon Welch (14:08):
Yes, and I might add, they're very happy.
Yes, they are.
They are living good lives, allthe partners there.
So, yeah, take that for what itis.
Yeah, so keep in mind we'regoing to talk at the end about
that 30 to 40% in today versus60 to 70 in tomorrow.
Okay, Yep.
Next is a medical officeMedical office.
Yep, next is a medical officeMedical office.
(14:28):
So these guys treat some reallyspecific conditions in the,
we'll just say, like thearthritis space and some other
chronic related diseases right,yeah.
Specialist doctors okay.
Yeah, we've worked with them fora long time, so we have a ton
of insight into this client andwe've worked with them for a
(14:49):
long time, so we have a ton ofinsight into this client.
Their category is somewhat Iwon't say gloomy, but it's
somewhat cold to the touch, justbecause it's not like it's kind
of for really specific thingsand it's for people who are kind
of in really bad areas, rightyeah.
Caleb Agee (15:10):
It's hard to find patients that make sense for
them, because of the specificservice that they offer Yep.
Brandon Welch (15:14):
So I'm just going to talk about the last three
years 40% growth in the lastthree years.
But if you look at last yearversus this year, it was
literally a 97% increase.
Almost doubled the size oftheir business.
Okay, that's crazy.
We've been building that rampfor a long time.
Caleb Agee (15:28):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (15:28):
And some things just kind of came to light and
they were able to start offeringsome services.
This year that slingshot it.
But they've had that 20 to 40%growth for every year for as
long as we've worked with them.
And that's remarkable becausethey're in a pretty medium sized
market.
They're not in like some bigfishbowl where they got tons of
(15:56):
people with these ailments andthey have to work really hard to
even be able to serve one, butthey're going to do a little
over 4 million.
So we're taking some of our Iwould say our medium size like
small businesses definitely notin startup phase, but also not
these last two are not like our10, 20, $30 million clients,
because I think that's morerelevant and definitely, if it
works at a smaller level, youcan expand it when you get
bigger right, that's right yeah.
So the plan for them?
We spend a lot on Facebook, orMeta.
(16:19):
So Facebook and Instagram 60grand 60 grand a year, five
grand a month.
I'm going to say half of thatis like hardcore lead generation
and the other half would besome like brand type stuff.
Yes, we are at a phase inAmerican media where you can use
Facebook as I'm not going tosay a replacement for TV, but it
(16:43):
does sort of the same thing ifyou do it the right way.
Caleb Agee (16:46):
Yes.
Brandon Welch (16:47):
If you have a long-term approach to Facebook,
or I'm going to say Facebook andMeta and Instagram.
Caleb Agee (16:52):
Yeah, all the same.
Brandon Welch (16:53):
Yeah, all the same, and the same is kind of
true with YouTube TV ads it usedto be.
There was no reason to go useany media besides TV or radio or
billboards or something to tryto become locally famous.
There's enough of agenerational shift that it can
kind of make sense now.
So, they're spending 60 grandon meta ads and on tomorrow
(17:17):
media.
Caleb Agee (17:18):
Yeah, they're.
They're spending 80 onbroadcast television $80,000.
And then they've got, you know,five to 10 grand in production.
They got to keep the ads freshevery year.
So we consider that part of thetomorrow customer cost.
Brandon Welch (17:32):
Yep.
And then their yesterdaymarketing was just basically
their email marketing software.
Four grand Yep, whoop-dee-doo,but, dude, I bet if we looked it
was probably a million dollarsof their sales that came from.
From talking to past people, so, overall, about 175,000,
174,453 to be exact, was theirmarketing budget, because we
mine the dollars and centsaround here.
Caleb Agee (17:51):
That's right.
Brandon Welch (17:51):
Frank and Maven, don't we?
Caleb Agee (17:52):
That's right.
Brandon Welch (17:53):
So if you do the math there, they have right at
33% in the today category, orlike meta ads, and the other
70-ish percent, 65-70%, is goingto tomorrow marketing.
Pretty remarkable, right?
That's pretty great.
And they're another one likedoubled the size of their
business in the last few years,right, mm-hmm.
(18:14):
Anything to add to that?
Caleb Agee (18:16):
Yeah, no, I think it's okay to have a marketing
plan that is this simple.
Brandon Welch (18:19):
And it works.
More people should have asimple marketing plan and it
grows the company.
Caleb Agee (18:23):
It really does we work really hard at a few things
and we work really hard at afew things and we grow them by
literally millions of dollars.
Brandon Welch (18:29):
Yes, what?
So keep that in your backpocket, Like we think of modern
day marketing it's got to be.
It's got to have the shinyobjects in it.
You will win far faster bydoing the James Clear method,
which is just a little bitbetter every day.
That compounding interest, thatsteamroller, that snowball that
builds up and just says I'm notbig right now, but if I do a
(18:51):
little bit of winning overpeople every single day, fast
forward two years, I'm going todouble in size.
Wow, okay, let's see we have ahome improvement.
Well this client is in theroofing category, a little bit
older of a company.
We've been working with themfor a while.
Caleb Agee (19:15):
I will tell you.
Brandon Welch (19:16):
most of the growth we're about to talk about
has happened in the last fiveyears.
Caleb Agee (19:18):
They're approaching 20 years in business, but they
got really aggressive andconsistent in their marketing
Halfway through that Halfwaythrough.
Brandon Welch (19:27):
Yeah, maybe like two-thirds of the way through.
So, um, we think they've takenover the most like market share
in their space.
I think they're.
Caleb Agee (19:41):
They're at least neck and neck with the with the
legacy business.
Brandon Welch (19:43):
Which that other business in their town has been
there for 60 years.
Caleb Agee (19:47):
That's crazy, and and they're they're overtaking
them right.
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (19:51):
So here's the numbers.
Now, keep in mind, roofing hasa lot of external factors, okay,
and I'm going to give you likeit has to do a lot with the
weather.
So if you have a good weatheryear, that's actually bad for
roofing, right, and that's whatknocks a lot of roofers out,
like the guys that come induring a storm and build this
(20:12):
big company and buy big trucksand build big overhead and then
next year there's not a storm.
A lot of them go out ofbusiness.
But let's see, four years ago,$13 million, well, $12.8 million
.
Let's see the next year, nostorm year.
Okay, they still did 9 million.
Now, that's really remarkable.
They did that by everydayservice and if you know anything
(20:34):
about the roofing business,that's pretty dang remarkable
okay.
Year after that they did have astorm, but it was, I will say I
remember.
This year it was an equallysized storm as the year before,
where they did 12.8, but thistime they did 16.2 million.
Caleb Agee (20:48):
Yeah.
They got a lot more of thestorm business Scraped through 4
million.
Yes, in the same circumstances.
Brandon Welch (20:55):
Yes, yeah, and this last year, the storm.
There was a storm, but itwasn't like this big event.
It was like more of kind ofsome small storms added up Just
under 18 million $17.7 millionin revenue.
Caleb Agee (21:10):
Still about 10% growth.
Brandon Welch (21:12):
Yeah, and that's crazy.
It's crazy, talk right.
Caleb Agee (21:19):
Your 20th year in business doing 10% growth.
That's great.
Yeah, people enjoy that.
Oh yeah, it rounds off a lotusually.
Brandon Welch (21:27):
So what do we do to make that happen?
Caleb Agee (21:29):
okay.
So this plan has a few moreitems in it than the last last
couple.
Obviously they're scratching at18 million um today.
Customers, though same twothings google search ads and um
at 140 000 total annual budgeton google search um meta ads 25
(21:50):
000, so that's Facebook andInstagram ads Um, a little bit
of lead generation and a mix umbetween that and maybe some
tomorrow branding.
Customer awareness right, yes,in the tomorrow category they
spent 143,000 on broadcasttelevision.
They also spent 10,000 on anews app sponsorship for that
(22:11):
same station, so it's $153,000to the local TV station.
We added YouTube last year tothe tune of $24,000 as well, and
billboards for $12,000.
So-, um, that's kind of roundsout there everything.
(22:32):
And then roofing is such a um,it's such a longterm product
there.
Yesterday marketing um isreally just referrals it.
You know very, very rarely.
They're just now wrapping intheir age of business to where
they can do a roof for somebodywho they've done in their first
year of business.
Brandon Welch (22:51):
It's funny enough they they actually told me this
year they actually did finallyre-roof one of their original
roofs.
Caleb Agee (22:58):
Oh, that's crazy.
Brandon Welch (22:59):
I think that happened this year.
It was really crazy.
Caleb Agee (23:01):
Short of a storm.
Nobody's changing their roofagain for 20 years.
Nope, not just because right.
Brandon Welch (23:09):
And then yesterday marketing.
They actually don't spendanything on that.
They do phone calls and theyjust work their past customers
and they're really, you know,they get involved in the
community, they help, you know,the kids' baseball teams and
things like that.
So that could be somewhatyesterday marketing, but they're
not actually emailing or doinganything regularly on that.
Caleb Agee (23:27):
All-in marketing budget ended up being $394,591.
Brandon Welch (23:34):
Isn't that wild 2%, that's 2.2%, wasn't it?
Caleb Agee (23:40):
2.2% of top line revenue.
Check the notes, brandon.
I did check the notes.
Brandon Welch (23:45):
You're like it's a 2.2% of top line revenue in
that company.
I mean, these people have anamazing business, amazing family
, they are changing lives, theyare the good guys they are, they
have built a legacy, they havesomething, if you know.
If a second generation wants totake it over, they can.
But there's a lot of peoplethat would buy that business for
(24:07):
a very, very, very hefty sum,where you know the owners, if
they ever wanted to, would neverhave to work again or worry
about money.
Caleb Agee (24:17):
Much of anything.
Yeah, much of anything right.
Brandon Welch (24:19):
Yeah.
So what did you see there?
You saw very simple plans.
You saw a lot of broadcast inlocal markets.
That is still the mostefficient, the cheapest way, the
most efficient way to reachlarge groups of people.
Caleb Agee (24:37):
That's right.
Brandon Welch (24:38):
And to have your brand name become known, liked
and trusted.
We are mixing it more with, ifwe're looking at like sub-30s,
like the millennial audience,the old millennials and the you
know, and even some of theyounger millennials, who you
call an old.
Yeah, exactly, Really tough toreach them in broadcasts, like
(24:59):
consistently.
But that's the only caveat.
But guess what?
Mom and dad, grandma andgrandpa still have money and
they're still spending it,especially on medical legal.
Medical, yeah, and homeimprovement, home improvement,
yeah, Because they're probablyin the house they're going to
stay at until you wheel them offto the you know they definitely
need doctors.
The assisted living place ormove to Florida, or whatever.
Legal assistance Yep so greatcategories to be in, but the
(25:20):
principle would remain the same.
You want 40-ish percent of yourbudget, probably tops 40%, tops
on like just hardcore.
Are you ready to buy it?
Are you buying today?
But that will work so much, somuch, so much better if you have
already been there for months,years and, in these guys' case,
some of them decades, of beingthe known, liked and trusted
(25:42):
company.
That's right, and a very, verybig key for all three of these
things is they're creative asdadgum memorable.
Yes, we make people laugh, cryor get angry at their ads.
Caleb Agee (25:51):
Just copying this plan won't make it work for you.
That's the danger, why wehesitate talking about these
things.
Yes, because people could belike oh well, if I just spend
this 2% of top line revenue onmy $18 million company, I'll
have it all solved.
No, nope, that is not the case.
Brandon Welch (26:09):
You are always more effective the more
memorable you are.
That's right.
Like saliency, relevancy,persuasion in your ads, that
lifts all boats.
That is the ultimate leverageon any ad campaign.
And all three of these things,all three of these guys have it
undeniably Like you could walkinto a grocery store and
somebody, you could mention thename of these companies and
(26:31):
somebody would tell you whattheir ad said.
Caleb Agee (26:34):
Or if they're in the ad, people would stop them and
be like are you, they get?
Brandon Welch (26:38):
requests for autographs right at restaurants
and stuff like that.
So that can be you too.
This is not an episode aboutcreative, but we have lots and
lots of episodes about how towrite and build memorable
campaigns.
That's right, but other thanthat it's not complicated.
We'd pick one or two things andwithin these broadcast
(26:58):
schedules just so you know, it'sbeen the same programs for a
lot of years.
Caleb Agee (27:02):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (27:02):
Been the same audiences for a lot of years.
We just stay there and we gohey, if there's a, if there are
50,000 people that watch thisprogram every day, we need 6% of
them a year Yep, and then weknow how many we could hopefully
convince to be our customers,right?
Caleb Agee (27:16):
Yeah, before we talk about that roofer example from
the beginning, right yeah.
Brandon Welch (27:19):
And these guys probably won't ever serve a
total of 50,000 people, right,they might serve 1,000 a year,
right?
Yeah, if they're lucky, right.
So keep that in mind.
It's slow and steady, wins therace.
It's win them over.
Be there, be there, be there.
One day they will think of youfirst and, as Roy says, feel the
best about you.
Roy H Williams, what's theother takeaways?
Caleb Agee (27:41):
Yeah, I think we're harping on it, but invest in
tomorrow.
A lot of businesses market likethey're going out of business
next month, and I think that'sthe key to actually going out of
business next month is is justbeing hand to mouth.
Um, the difference maker isbeing consistent and being there
(28:02):
all the time, being willing toinvest and be slow and steady
and and have that pace.
What I also find is businessowner.
We talked to a lot of businessowners that aren't our clients
as well.
Business owners that arestruggling with cashflow, high
expenses, profitability,especially as it pertains to
marketing.
They are usually doing way toomuch today marketing.
(28:25):
They're focused on or they'retrying things and they're
picking it up and putting itdown, and then they're trying
something else, picking up andputting it down, instead of
staying on a course and sayingI'm going to be great here, I
will make a presence, I willmake myself known.
They wait a couple months andsay, ah, didn't work.
And then they throw it out,jump into some other lane and
(28:47):
say now I'm going to be, I'mgoing to try this.
And those are the same businessowners that I hear saying you
know how do I find profitabilityin my marketing?
Yeah, how do I get?
But the ones who have been onthe same track, the same train,
the entire time, are the oneswho are enjoying 2% cost of
marketing.
Brandon Welch (29:06):
Those are the ones we choose to work with.
Yeah, because you know what,when you have a longterm out
outlay, it's just like anyfriendship, any marriage, any
good working relationship, anyrelationship in humanity.
Caleb Agee (29:19):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (29:20):
When you are consistent and you avoid the big
ups and downs.
Caleb Agee (29:23):
you just it's a rule of life.
Brandon Welch (29:26):
It really is.
Caleb Agee (29:26):
Like everybody, it's the beginning of the year Seed
time and harvest.
You're thinking about exerciseand eating well, and all the gym
memberships are selling likehotcakes, but the people who
will actually lose the weightare going to be the ones who
still show up in July and.
October and December and nextyear, when the year rolls around
.
It's not even a thing,consistency.
Brandon Welch (29:44):
Consistency.
Right, yeah, that's right Seedtime and harvest.
So don't be that guy that triesto swing.
Don't be the guy that throws20% at marketing and expects
your business to grow leaps andbounds in a short term.
If you've got the money tospend and you want to do that
consistently, great.
You'll eat a lot of marketshare.
You'll eventually come out ontop.
Caleb Agee (30:07):
But don't do that with a short-term expectation.
Brandon Welch (30:10):
Last thing don't ever forget to do yesterday
marketing.
That's right, all of these guysare doing it in some way, shape
or form, but it's really reallycheap.
It's the cheapest.
It's also a form of consistency, like we're talking about,
right?
Yep, so okay, it doesn't haveto be complicated.
Put 30%-ish in today marketing,70%-ish in tomorrow marketing.
Always do yesterday marketing.
(30:30):
Fill one glass at a time.
That means do one media in eachcategory really well before
you're adding another.
Invest in tomorrow.
Don't advertise like you'regoing out of business next month
.
And when the external factorsslow you down, so long as it's
not a direct cash flow, justhave the courage to see it
through.
You will come out on topbecause your competitors are
(30:51):
going to get scared and they'regoing to stop making noise, but
you're the one that's there,confident, strong, showing up
for your people all along.
That's right.
Caleb Agee (31:01):
And isn't that a?
Brandon Welch (31:01):
beautiful thing.
Hey, we're really excited forthis year.
We have some new things comingyour way.
We have the Maven MarketingAudit If you're sitting here
going, hey, how strong am I inmy marketing plan?
How do I stack up to thismagical Maven method these guys
keep talking about?
We have an easy way for you tofigure that out
(31:22):
Mavenmarketingauditcom.
We had to fix a few glitches onit, but it is now working and
it'll take you about fiveminutes.
You'll get a really clearprintout of how your marketing
is doing for you.
Yeah, and if you want, you canschedule a call with a Frank and
Maven method professional andgo through those and we'll give
you some like solid next stepsas to what you should do in your
(31:44):
marketing.
And then, if you want a littlebit more help from there, we
have a new mastermind productthat is almost ready.
You'll be able to join that.
Stay tuned to these episodes.
We'll be sending some emailsout on that and you can join our
community of marketers and getrub elbows with other small
business owners or marketingprofessionals and bring your
(32:06):
stuff.
It's going to be a safety netof not making bad decisions.
It's going to be wise counselfor how to move your marketing
forward, and you're going to getsome really high-level creative
services and feedback frompeople doing this every day.
Yeah, it's going to be awesome.
Don't do it alone.
So that's going to be the MavenMarketing Mastermind.
And then, of course, we haveroom on our roster for a couple
(32:28):
of companies in this firstquarter, a couple of companies
in this first quarter.
If you are considering, likeyou know, getting some real help
and doing this one-on-one Frankand Maven is at a point where
we can take on a couple of moreyou know, one-on-one businesses
for the right company that'sright.
So you can inquire about any ofthat at Maven Monday at
frankandmavencom, and this isgoing to be a great year.
Caleb Agee (32:52):
Get it.
Brandon Welch (32:54):
We are here for you.
We don't make any money on thispodcast.
We're doing this to make theworld of entrepreneurs better,
more confident, less wastefuland, ultimately, prosperous,
because we believe that smallcompanies owner-operated
companies are the biggestopportunity for influence in the
world.
Caleb Agee (33:08):
Mm-hmm.
Brandon Welch (33:09):
And that's why we're here.
That's right.
We'll be back here every Mondayanswering your real-life
marketing questions, becausemarketers who can't teach you
why are just a fancy lie.
Caleb Agee (33:21):
Have a great week.
I think it's okay to have a marketing plan that is
this simple and it works.
More people should have asimple marketing plan and it
grows the company.
We work really hard at a fewthings and we grow them by
literally millions of dollars.
Brandon Welch (00:15):
Welcome to the Maven Marketing Podcast.
Today is Maven Monday.
I'm your host, Brandon Welch,and I'm joined by Caleb.
Is that a new shirt, AG?
No way Does it look like a newshirt to you.
We were just talking aboutwearing duplicate shirts and I
think I think you could find acouple times we've worn these
shirts yeah, I was.
Caleb Agee (00:35):
Brandon made me take my jacket off, just so you
could see that I wore the shirtagain.
Yeah, I don't know how manytimes I've.
Brandon Welch (00:41):
I think it's a good color on you.
It's good.
It's good.
Yeah, go the Steve Jobs route,right yeah.
Yeah, Find what works and letit keep working New year old
shirt right, yes, yes, this isthe place where we help you
eliminate waste in advertising,grow your business and achieve
the big dream.
Caleb Agee (00:56):
Hey, I wanted to say thank you to.
We just rounded another year,thank you.
That was our first full year ofrecording this podcast.
We're celebrating and it'sawesome.
We're excited about it.
We got a unique compliment thisweek from one of our fans Jason
, I'm looking at you.
He said that we reminded him ofthe duo from Psych the two
(01:18):
characters on the sitcom.
So I'm going to take that as acompliment.
Yeah, I took it as a highcompliment, okay.
I'm going to take that as acompliment.
Yeah, I took it as a highcompliment, okay, because it
means that we are funny andenjoyable, smart and handsome
and handsome.
That's got to be that way, yeah, so come on, son.
Brandon Welch (01:30):
So new year.
Last week we actually droppedan episode that was not recorded
in the new year.
I don't know if you caught that, but I've been out of town,
I've been on the road.
We're back.
This is actually our firstepisode of recording this year
Together.
We thought we ended the yearwith our very best advice on
creating marketing plans.
(01:51):
You can go look at steps one,two and three from the midweek
to December.
Then we gave you kind of arecap and 25 tips for 2025.
We dropped.
Last week we had AlexSwire-Clark, one of the most
brilliant dudes I've ever met,talking about behavioral
psychology and how to alignyourself with your team and how
to get out of the way and letthem grow your company.
(02:13):
Isn't that a novel concept?
Yeah, and this week let's bringit back to this idea of a
marketing plan, because ifyou're in small business or if
you are selling to a smallbusiness right now, chances are
everybody's still kind ofrounding out what this year is
going to look like as far astheir marketing efforts.
If you're wise, you're planningthat right now.
You're not waiting until ithappens to you.
But we thought, hey, we talkeda lot of theory, we gave you the
(02:39):
steps we use and we've usedrepeatedly to grow hundreds of
companies, but we pulled threerandom ones out and we're
calling this episode MarketingPlans that Are Making Millions
and for obvious reasons, we areanonymizing some of this.
But these profiles, we'reliterally giving you the actual
numbers how we built the budget.
(02:59):
We're going to go mostly budgetand marketing mix, because
that's a big question right now.
We could get super theoreticaland go into the messaging and
share campaigns which we do fromtime to time.
Yeah, but we're going to giveyou three clients that are
definitely growing by doubledigits and have been growing by
double digits, and all of thesewould have been in the category
of making millions of dollars onreturn from that marketing
(03:20):
investment.
Caleb Agee (03:21):
Isn't that?
Brandon Welch (03:21):
exciting.
That is exciting.
It's really exciting from thatmarketing investment Isn't that
exciting.
That is exciting, it's reallyexciting.
Yeah, so kind of a shortepisode, but just so you can
hear it and go huh, where am Iat from that?
Right, we're going to jump in.
We have a legal client, we havea medical client and we have a
home improvement client.
Those are the three areas thatare kind of in home run
territory for Frank and Mavenjust over the years.
(03:42):
For whatever reason, that's whatwe settled into.
These principles and thisbalance should apply to anybody
who is in a service or expertservice industry.
You would nuance a little bitfor retail as far as percentages
but, the balance and the mixbetween medias is probably the
same if you're serving a localmarket.
Caleb Agee (04:00):
Yeah, and then there would also be nuance for
hospitality and food service aswell.
I think a little bit of a tradethere, yep.
And then there would also benuance for, like, hospitality
and food service as well.
I think a little bit of a tradethere, yep.
Brandon Welch (04:08):
We'll talk about that as we go along, but let's
just say you are a brick andmortar or serving a community or
a region or a lot of these areactually multi-regional clients,
but the principle applies downto the city and town that you
would be working in.
So, you want to talk about thelegal client.
Caleb Agee (04:29):
Yeah, so this attorney group, it's multiple
attorneys obviously here.
They have been working togetherfor about 10 years, obviously
growing the company.
When we started working withthem, um, they had one office,
one office yeah.
(04:49):
And they've.
They've really growntremendously over that time and
now they have nine in it's kindof a regional across it, across
the entire area In the South isharea.
Brandon Welch (05:00):
Yep, yeah and um, they've doubled the size of
their business in just underthree years and I will say that
the three years we worked withthem before that, they doubled
their business in that, yeah.
But just so you know, I'm justgoing to give some random
revenues of these guys 2.1million four years ago, 3
(05:24):
million three years ago, 3.8million what would that be two
years ago?
And then, this last year wasjust under 4 million and there
were some external factors.
We're going to talk a lot aboutexternal factors right now, or
throughout some of these,because what you'll see, yes,
(05:46):
you want to set annual growthgoals, yes, you want to be
mindful of cash flow and whatyou're able to invest in a
marketing plan, but what you'llsee is it's not necessarily what
you did now or even in the lastyear.
You will see, with all of theseplans, that even when there's a
hiccup on a six or 12-monthbasis because, frankly, like in
(06:08):
the last couple of years, it'sbeen weird- for some categories,
life happens.
Caleb Agee (06:11):
There's been some headwinds.
Brandon Welch (06:12):
Things happen At some point.
You always slingshot past thatand if we were to data plot the
five-year trend, it would bedoing a more aggressive, steep
climb.
Caleb Agee (06:22):
Yeah, is that fair?
Yeah, I think it's fair.
Brandon Welch (06:25):
But you could easily say in four years they've
doubled their business.
Well, you could say in threeyears they've doubled their
business actually.
So how did we do that, caleb?
Caleb Agee (06:34):
Yeah.
So we're going to give you justthe quick numbers, the overview
of their marketing plan.
We always think in three typesof customers.
Today customers are buying whatyou're selling today.
Tomorrow customers are peoplewho are not buying.
I'm giving you a quick recapPeople who are not buying today
but will eventually.
And then yesterday customersare people who have bought from
(06:55):
you in the past and you want toget them to come back for repeat
purchases or referrals.
Brandon Welch (07:00):
Or bring their friends and family.
Yep.
So, nate the camera guy, who isthe bigger group of people?
People buying now or people whowill buy in the future?
Fine, yeah, that tomorrowcustomer, that's right.
(07:20):
I'm thinking realtors, I'mthinking car guys, I'm thinking
cosmetic surgery, I'm thinkinganything that is a longer-term
buying purchase.
Let's just say it's more thanthree or four years, right, yeah
, things we don't buy every day.
There is mathematically a very,very, very finite and small
(07:40):
amount of people in the markettoday.
Now, those are worth goingafter and if we can earn them
and influence them and win themover at a profitable pace, great
.
But what you always have toremember with today marketing is
that there's way more peopletrying to get the customer at
the finish line.
Caleb Agee (07:58):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (07:59):
And so that customer, for starters, is more
critical.
They're more price sensitivethe closer they get to the
finish line.
And if they haven't alreadydecided who they're going to do
business with, they're going togo to compare you on either
price or how fast they can getthe solution, or how easy or
what we call convenient theyperceive you to be, versus the
others.
That's right.
(08:19):
So you have to strategically bealigned to compete there.
You have to have some priceconcessions, you have to be
competitive and build yourbusiness from a strategy level
not just from a marketing level,but from a strategy level to be
a viable option.
Because if you say, buy today,buy today, buy today, buy today,
(08:39):
and you're not positioned to bethe best choice for today, then
no matter how much noise youmake, you're kind of throwing it
to the wind.
Caleb Agee (08:44):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (08:46):
So when we are talking about these today,
marketing budgets that we'regoing to tell you like literally
exactly what they're spendingin every category, keep in mind
that these would work a lot, lot, lot less and if we did not
have the long-term payoff andthe long-term momentum of these
(09:09):
companies winning over futurecustomers.
In roofing, if you take theaverage roof gets replaced one
out of every 15 yearsno-transcript.
Caleb Agee (09:25):
Yeah, I don't think it might even be closer.
Is it 15?
Might even be closer to 20 or25.
Brandon Welch (09:30):
Let's just say it's 15.
It's probably closer to 20, butthat's 6% per year.
Okay, that's one divided by 15.
And if I divide that by 12months, there's only one half of
1% of people in the marketliterally right now that care
about roofing that could ever bea Today customer, this month,
this month, in 31 days, in 31days.
So if you're measuring yourmarketing off of a two or three
(09:53):
or four month window, especiallyif it's more of a branding type
or what we would call atomorrow campaign, it's just not
mathematically sound to do thatFast forward 12 months.
There are a lot more people whowould have come around, it's
that 6% right, it's that full 6%.
Now we can do something withthat, right, yeah, so keep that
in mind and keep in mind howlong it takes somebody to buy in
(10:15):
your category.
Like, if I just had a you knowattorney service, how long does
my trade say it's going to bebefore I come back to needing
that again?
That's right.
So this client, partner, clientof ours, tell us what they're
spending, caleb all right.
Caleb Agee (10:32):
So in the today customer acquisition category,
um, they're spending googlesearch ads.
They're.
They're spending fifty seventhousand dollars a year.
Okay, um, that ebbs and flows alittle bit based on, um, you
know, the demand and the amountof available inventory on Google
(10:52):
, but by and large, and that ispurely for this client, purely
Google search ads only NotYouTube, not anything fancy.
Not Performance, max orDiscovery or Display or anything
like that.
Brandon Welch (11:04):
That's literally.
They typed in this attorney'stype service.
Attorney, if you're me orattorney's type service which is
in the category of-.
Caleb Agee (11:10):
Attorney near me, or , yeah, attorney in my town,
whatever, or their very name,right, and so they spent $57,000
on that.
And then on meta ads, which isFacebook and Instagram ads,
mostly lead generation, which iswhy we put it in this today
category.
It actually serves tomorrow alittle bit as well.
But we put it in this todaycategory.
It actually serves tomorrow alittle bit as well, but we do
(11:31):
have to.
We put it in one one of theothers.
So, um, they spent 69,000, sojust under 70,000, um, in today
category.
Brandon Welch (11:39):
Yeah, um, I'll, I'll speak a little bit to that
particular account.
Um, we have a lot of those thatmet a budget um towards calling
them to action, to likeseminars or like downloadable
things that they can, you know,get a little bit of information.
The client gives a little bitof value and then they they lean
into the next step.
But some of that is is also inthe category of like tomorrow
(12:03):
advertising, because it's justvideo views and kind of pushing
the brand in general becauseit's just video views and kind
of pushing the brand in general.
Caleb Agee (12:10):
So yeah, so that is their today.
Their today budget all in was126,000 for the year this is in
2024.
And then their tomorrowcustomer budget.
They spent 144,000 on broadcasttelevision.
They spent 14,000 on a localmagazine advertising and then
68,000 on seven differentbillboards.
(12:32):
Um, remember, they're regional.
So, they're billboards in um,in around their town and the
towns they serve.
And then, uh, they spentbetween.
They spent about 18 to 20 grandon um video production for
those TV ads and all the thingsthere.
Brandon Welch (12:50):
Yep, it's a great campaign.
Love seeing them.
And then the yesterdaymarketing category, which is
almost always the cheapest butvery often the most impactful.
Caleb Agee (13:02):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (13:03):
Four grand total on Christmas cards graphics
mailers.
Caleb Agee (13:08):
Just random thank yous and feel goods.
Brandon Welch (13:13):
Sometimes this client does appreciation events.
I didn't see one in theirbudget last year.
Caleb Agee (13:17):
No, I don't think so .
Brandon Welch (13:18):
We should make them do another one.
And then, if you count all inemail marketing just to their
past customers, with thecreative services and the
software and all that, it's fivegrand.
Caleb Agee (13:28):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (13:28):
Okay, their entire budget is $369,170.
Or sorry, $770.
Yeah, and that was the breakout.
35% of that went to todaycustomers, the other basically
went to tomorrow customers.
There's maybe half a percentthat went to yesterday customers
, that's right, you know.
Half a percent that went toyesterday customers, that's
(13:48):
right.
Caleb Agee (13:48):
So and then if you put that, you know they were
right at about 4 million.
Put that 369,000, that's justjust under 10% 10% cost of
marketing Yep All in.
Brandon Welch (14:00):
That is a real plan.
Caleb Agee (14:01):
That is the real results $4 million company spent
$369,000 and that's how theybroke it down.
Brandon Welch (14:08):
Yes, and I might add, they're very happy.
Yes, they are.
They are living good lives, allthe partners there.
So, yeah, take that for what itis.
Yeah, so keep in mind we'regoing to talk at the end about
that 30 to 40% in today versus60 to 70 in tomorrow.
Okay, Yep.
Next is a medical officeMedical office.
Yep, next is a medical officeMedical office.
(14:28):
So these guys treat some reallyspecific conditions in the,
we'll just say, like thearthritis space and some other
chronic related diseases right,yeah.
Specialist doctors okay.
Yeah, we've worked with them fora long time, so we have a ton
of insight into this client andwe've worked with them for a
(14:49):
long time, so we have a ton ofinsight into this client.
Their category is somewhat Iwon't say gloomy, but it's
somewhat cold to the touch, justbecause it's not like it's kind
of for really specific thingsand it's for people who are kind
of in really bad areas, rightyeah.
Caleb Agee (15:10):
It's hard to find patients that make sense for
them, because of the specificservice that they offer Yep.
Brandon Welch (15:14):
So I'm just going to talk about the last three
years 40% growth in the lastthree years.
But if you look at last yearversus this year, it was
literally a 97% increase.
Almost doubled the size oftheir business.
Okay, that's crazy.
We've been building that rampfor a long time.
Caleb Agee (15:28):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (15:28):
And some things just kind of came to light and
they were able to start offeringsome services.
This year that slingshot it.
But they've had that 20 to 40%growth for every year for as
long as we've worked with them.
And that's remarkable becausethey're in a pretty medium sized
market.
They're not in like some bigfishbowl where they got tons of
(15:56):
people with these ailments andthey have to work really hard to
even be able to serve one, butthey're going to do a little
over 4 million.
So we're taking some of our Iwould say our medium size like
small businesses definitely notin startup phase, but also not
these last two are not like our10, 20, $30 million clients,
because I think that's morerelevant and definitely, if it
works at a smaller level, youcan expand it when you get
bigger right, that's right yeah.
So the plan for them?
We spend a lot on Facebook, orMeta.
(16:19):
So Facebook and Instagram 60grand 60 grand a year, five
grand a month.
I'm going to say half of thatis like hardcore lead generation
and the other half would besome like brand type stuff.
Yes, we are at a phase inAmerican media where you can use
Facebook as I'm not going tosay a replacement for TV, but it
(16:43):
does sort of the same thing ifyou do it the right way.
Caleb Agee (16:46):
Yes.
Brandon Welch (16:47):
If you have a long-term approach to Facebook,
or I'm going to say Facebook andMeta and Instagram.
Caleb Agee (16:52):
Yeah, all the same.
Brandon Welch (16:53):
Yeah, all the same, and the same is kind of
true with YouTube TV ads it usedto be.
There was no reason to go useany media besides TV or radio or
billboards or something to tryto become locally famous.
There's enough of agenerational shift that it can
kind of make sense now.
So, they're spending 60 grandon meta ads and on tomorrow
(17:17):
media.
Caleb Agee (17:18):
Yeah, they're.
They're spending 80 onbroadcast television $80,000.
And then they've got, you know,five to 10 grand in production.
They got to keep the ads freshevery year.
So we consider that part of thetomorrow customer cost.
Brandon Welch (17:32):
Yep.
And then their yesterdaymarketing was just basically
their email marketing software.
Four grand Yep, whoop-dee-doo,but, dude, I bet if we looked it
was probably a million dollarsof their sales that came from.
From talking to past people, so, overall, about 175,000,
174,453 to be exact, was theirmarketing budget, because we
mine the dollars and centsaround here.
Caleb Agee (17:51):
That's right.
Brandon Welch (17:51):
Frank and Maven, don't we?
Caleb Agee (17:52):
That's right.
Brandon Welch (17:53):
So if you do the math there, they have right at
33% in the today category, orlike meta ads, and the other
70-ish percent, 65-70%, is goingto tomorrow marketing.
Pretty remarkable, right?
That's pretty great.
And they're another one likedoubled the size of their
business in the last few years,right, mm-hmm.
(18:14):
Anything to add to that?
Caleb Agee (18:16):
Yeah, no, I think it's okay to have a marketing
plan that is this simple.
Brandon Welch (18:19):
And it works.
More people should have asimple marketing plan and it
grows the company.
Caleb Agee (18:23):
It really does we work really hard at a few things
and we work really hard at afew things and we grow them by
literally millions of dollars.
Brandon Welch (18:29):
Yes, what?
So keep that in your backpocket, Like we think of modern
day marketing it's got to be.
It's got to have the shinyobjects in it.
You will win far faster bydoing the James Clear method,
which is just a little bitbetter every day.
That compounding interest, thatsteamroller, that snowball that
builds up and just says I'm notbig right now, but if I do a
(18:51):
little bit of winning overpeople every single day, fast
forward two years, I'm going todouble in size.
Wow, okay, let's see we have ahome improvement.
Well this client is in theroofing category, a little bit
older of a company.
We've been working with themfor a while.
Caleb Agee (19:15):
I will tell you.
Brandon Welch (19:16):
most of the growth we're about to talk about
has happened in the last fiveyears.
Caleb Agee (19:18):
They're approaching 20 years in business, but they
got really aggressive andconsistent in their marketing
Halfway through that Halfwaythrough.
Brandon Welch (19:27):
Yeah, maybe like two-thirds of the way through.
So, um, we think they've takenover the most like market share
in their space.
I think they're.
Caleb Agee (19:41):
They're at least neck and neck with the with the
legacy business.
Brandon Welch (19:43):
Which that other business in their town has been
there for 60 years.
Caleb Agee (19:47):
That's crazy, and and they're they're overtaking
them right.
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (19:51):
So here's the numbers.
Now, keep in mind, roofing hasa lot of external factors, okay,
and I'm going to give you likeit has to do a lot with the
weather.
So if you have a good weatheryear, that's actually bad for
roofing, right, and that's whatknocks a lot of roofers out,
like the guys that come induring a storm and build this
(20:12):
big company and buy big trucksand build big overhead and then
next year there's not a storm.
A lot of them go out ofbusiness.
But let's see, four years ago,$13 million, well, $12.8 million
.
Let's see the next year, nostorm year.
Okay, they still did 9 million.
Now, that's really remarkable.
They did that by everydayservice and if you know anything
(20:34):
about the roofing business,that's pretty dang remarkable
okay.
Year after that they did have astorm, but it was, I will say I
remember.
This year it was an equallysized storm as the year before,
where they did 12.8, but thistime they did 16.2 million.
Caleb Agee (20:48):
Yeah.
They got a lot more of thestorm business Scraped through 4
million.
Yes, in the same circumstances.
Brandon Welch (20:55):
Yes, yeah, and this last year, the storm.
There was a storm, but itwasn't like this big event.
It was like more of kind ofsome small storms added up Just
under 18 million $17.7 millionin revenue.
Caleb Agee (21:10):
Still about 10% growth.
Brandon Welch (21:12):
Yeah, and that's crazy.
It's crazy, talk right.
Caleb Agee (21:19):
Your 20th year in business doing 10% growth.
That's great.
Yeah, people enjoy that.
Oh yeah, it rounds off a lotusually.
Brandon Welch (21:27):
So what do we do to make that happen?
Caleb Agee (21:29):
okay.
So this plan has a few moreitems in it than the last last
couple.
Obviously they're scratching at18 million um today.
Customers, though same twothings google search ads and um
at 140 000 total annual budgeton google search um meta ads 25
(21:50):
000, so that's Facebook andInstagram ads Um, a little bit
of lead generation and a mix umbetween that and maybe some
tomorrow branding.
Customer awareness right, yes,in the tomorrow category they
spent 143,000 on broadcasttelevision.
They also spent 10,000 on anews app sponsorship for that
(22:11):
same station, so it's $153,000to the local TV station.
We added YouTube last year tothe tune of $24,000 as well, and
billboards for $12,000.
So-, um, that's kind of roundsout there everything.
(22:32):
And then roofing is such a um,it's such a longterm product
there.
Yesterday marketing um isreally just referrals it.
You know very, very rarely.
They're just now wrapping intheir age of business to where
they can do a roof for somebodywho they've done in their first
year of business.
Brandon Welch (22:51):
It's funny enough they they actually told me this
year they actually did finallyre-roof one of their original
roofs.
Caleb Agee (22:58):
Oh, that's crazy.
Brandon Welch (22:59):
I think that happened this year.
It was really crazy.
Caleb Agee (23:01):
Short of a storm.
Nobody's changing their roofagain for 20 years.
Nope, not just because right.
Brandon Welch (23:09):
And then yesterday marketing.
They actually don't spendanything on that.
They do phone calls and theyjust work their past customers
and they're really, you know,they get involved in the
community, they help, you know,the kids' baseball teams and
things like that.
So that could be somewhatyesterday marketing, but they're
not actually emailing or doinganything regularly on that.
Caleb Agee (23:27):
All-in marketing budget ended up being $394,591.
Brandon Welch (23:34):
Isn't that wild 2%, that's 2.2%, wasn't it?
Caleb Agee (23:40):
2.2% of top line revenue.
Check the notes, brandon.
I did check the notes.
Brandon Welch (23:45):
You're like it's a 2.2% of top line revenue in
that company.
I mean, these people have anamazing business, amazing family
, they are changing lives, theyare the good guys they are, they
have built a legacy, they havesomething, if you know.
If a second generation wants totake it over, they can.
But there's a lot of peoplethat would buy that business for
(24:07):
a very, very, very hefty sum,where you know the owners, if
they ever wanted to, would neverhave to work again or worry
about money.
Caleb Agee (24:17):
Much of anything.
Yeah, much of anything right.
Brandon Welch (24:19):
Yeah.
So what did you see there?
You saw very simple plans.
You saw a lot of broadcast inlocal markets.
That is still the mostefficient, the cheapest way, the
most efficient way to reachlarge groups of people.
Caleb Agee (24:37):
That's right.
Brandon Welch (24:38):
And to have your brand name become known, liked
and trusted.
We are mixing it more with, ifwe're looking at like sub-30s,
like the millennial audience,the old millennials and the you
know, and even some of theyounger millennials, who you
call an old.
Yeah, exactly, Really tough toreach them in broadcasts, like
(24:59):
consistently.
But that's the only caveat.
But guess what?
Mom and dad, grandma andgrandpa still have money and
they're still spending it,especially on medical legal.
Medical, yeah, and homeimprovement, home improvement,
yeah, Because they're probablyin the house they're going to
stay at until you wheel them offto the you know they definitely
need doctors.
The assisted living place ormove to Florida, or whatever.
Legal assistance Yep so greatcategories to be in, but the
(25:20):
principle would remain the same.
You want 40-ish percent of yourbudget, probably tops 40%, tops
on like just hardcore.
Are you ready to buy it?
Are you buying today?
But that will work so much, somuch, so much better if you have
already been there for months,years and, in these guys' case,
some of them decades, of beingthe known, liked and trusted
(25:42):
company.
That's right, and a very, verybig key for all three of these
things is they're creative asdadgum memorable.
Yes, we make people laugh, cryor get angry at their ads.
Caleb Agee (25:51):
Just copying this plan won't make it work for you.
That's the danger, why wehesitate talking about these
things.
Yes, because people could belike oh well, if I just spend
this 2% of top line revenue onmy $18 million company, I'll
have it all solved.
No, nope, that is not the case.
Brandon Welch (26:09):
You are always more effective the more
memorable you are.
That's right.
Like saliency, relevancy,persuasion in your ads, that
lifts all boats.
That is the ultimate leverageon any ad campaign.
And all three of these things,all three of these guys have it
undeniably Like you could walkinto a grocery store and
somebody, you could mention thename of these companies and
(26:31):
somebody would tell you whattheir ad said.
Caleb Agee (26:34):
Or if they're in the ad, people would stop them and
be like are you, they get?
Brandon Welch (26:38):
requests for autographs right at restaurants
and stuff like that.
So that can be you too.
This is not an episode aboutcreative, but we have lots and
lots of episodes about how towrite and build memorable
campaigns.
That's right, but other thanthat it's not complicated.
We'd pick one or two things andwithin these broadcast
(26:58):
schedules just so you know, it'sbeen the same programs for a
lot of years.
Caleb Agee (27:02):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (27:02):
Been the same audiences for a lot of years.
We just stay there and we gohey, if there's a, if there are
50,000 people that watch thisprogram every day, we need 6% of
them a year Yep, and then weknow how many we could hopefully
convince to be our customers,right?
Caleb Agee (27:16):
Yeah, before we talk about that roofer example from
the beginning, right yeah.
Brandon Welch (27:19):
And these guys probably won't ever serve a
total of 50,000 people, right,they might serve 1,000 a year,
right?
Yeah, if they're lucky, right.
So keep that in mind.
It's slow and steady, wins therace.
It's win them over.
Be there, be there, be there.
One day they will think of youfirst and, as Roy says, feel the
best about you.
Roy H Williams, what's theother takeaways?
Caleb Agee (27:41):
Yeah, I think we're harping on it, but invest in
tomorrow.
A lot of businesses market likethey're going out of business
next month, and I think that'sthe key to actually going out of
business next month is is justbeing hand to mouth.
Um, the difference maker isbeing consistent and being there
(28:02):
all the time, being willing toinvest and be slow and steady
and and have that pace.
What I also find is businessowner.
We talked to a lot of businessowners that aren't our clients
as well.
Business owners that arestruggling with cashflow, high
expenses, profitability,especially as it pertains to
marketing.
They are usually doing way toomuch today marketing.
(28:25):
They're focused on or they'retrying things and they're
picking it up and putting itdown, and then they're trying
something else, picking up andputting it down, instead of
staying on a course and sayingI'm going to be great here, I
will make a presence, I willmake myself known.
They wait a couple months andsay, ah, didn't work.
And then they throw it out,jump into some other lane and
(28:47):
say now I'm going to be, I'mgoing to try this.
And those are the same businessowners that I hear saying you
know how do I find profitabilityin my marketing?
Yeah, how do I get?
But the ones who have been onthe same track, the same train,
the entire time, are the oneswho are enjoying 2% cost of
marketing.
Brandon Welch (29:06):
Those are the ones we choose to work with.
Yeah, because you know what,when you have a longterm out
outlay, it's just like anyfriendship, any marriage, any
good working relationship, anyrelationship in humanity.
Caleb Agee (29:19):
Yeah.
Brandon Welch (29:20):
When you are consistent and you avoid the big
ups and downs.
Caleb Agee (29:23):
you just it's a rule of life.
Brandon Welch (29:26):
It really is.
Caleb Agee (29:26):
Like everybody, it's the beginning of the year Seed
time and harvest.
You're thinking about exerciseand eating well, and all the gym
memberships are selling likehotcakes, but the people who
will actually lose the weightare going to be the ones who
still show up in July and.
October and December and nextyear, when the year rolls around
.
It's not even a thing,consistency.
Brandon Welch (29:44):
Consistency.
Right, yeah, that's right Seedtime and harvest.
So don't be that guy that triesto swing.
Don't be the guy that throws20% at marketing and expects
your business to grow leaps andbounds in a short term.
If you've got the money tospend and you want to do that
consistently, great.
You'll eat a lot of marketshare.
You'll eventually come out ontop.
Caleb Agee (30:07):
But don't do that with a short-term expectation.
Brandon Welch (30:10):
Last thing don't ever forget to do yesterday
marketing.
That's right, all of these guysare doing it in some way, shape
or form, but it's really reallycheap.
It's the cheapest.
It's also a form of consistency, like we're talking about,
right?
Yep, so okay, it doesn't haveto be complicated.
Put 30%-ish in today marketing,70%-ish in tomorrow marketing.
Always do yesterday marketing.
(30:30):
Fill one glass at a time.
That means do one media in eachcategory really well before
you're adding another.
Invest in tomorrow.
Don't advertise like you'regoing out of business next month
.
And when the external factorsslow you down, so long as it's
not a direct cash flow, justhave the courage to see it
through.
You will come out on topbecause your competitors are
(30:51):
going to get scared and they'regoing to stop making noise, but
you're the one that's there,confident, strong, showing up
for your people all along.
That's right.
Caleb Agee (31:01):
And isn't that a?
Brandon Welch (31:01):
beautiful thing.
Hey, we're really excited forthis year.
We have some new things comingyour way.
We have the Maven MarketingAudit If you're sitting here
going, hey, how strong am I inmy marketing plan?
How do I stack up to thismagical Maven method these guys
keep talking about?
We have an easy way for you tofigure that out
(31:22):
Mavenmarketingauditcom.
We had to fix a few glitches onit, but it is now working and
it'll take you about fiveminutes.
You'll get a really clearprintout of how your marketing
is doing for you.
Yeah, and if you want, you canschedule a call with a Frank and
Maven method professional andgo through those and we'll give
you some like solid next stepsas to what you should do in your
(31:44):
marketing.
And then, if you want a littlebit more help from there, we
have a new mastermind productthat is almost ready.
You'll be able to join that.
Stay tuned to these episodes.
We'll be sending some emailsout on that and you can join our
community of marketers and getrub elbows with other small
business owners or marketingprofessionals and bring your
(32:06):
stuff.
It's going to be a safety netof not making bad decisions.
It's going to be wise counselfor how to move your marketing
forward, and you're going to getsome really high-level creative
services and feedback frompeople doing this every day.
Yeah, it's going to be awesome.
Don't do it alone.
So that's going to be the MavenMarketing Mastermind.
And then, of course, we haveroom on our roster for a couple
(32:28):
of companies in this firstquarter, a couple of companies
in this first quarter.
If you are considering, likeyou know, getting some real help
and doing this one-on-one Frankand Maven is at a point where
we can take on a couple of moreyou know, one-on-one businesses
for the right company that'sright.
So you can inquire about any ofthat at Maven Monday at
frankandmavencom, and this isgoing to be a great year.
Caleb Agee (32:52):
Get it.
Brandon Welch (32:54):
We are here for you.
We don't make any money on thispodcast.
We're doing this to make theworld of entrepreneurs better,
more confident, less wastefuland, ultimately, prosperous,
because we believe that smallcompanies owner-operated
companies are the biggestopportunity for influence in the
world.
Caleb Agee (33:08):
Mm-hmm.
Brandon Welch (33:09):
And that's why we're here.
That's right.
We'll be back here every Mondayanswering your real-life
marketing questions, becausemarketers who can't teach you
why are just a fancy lie.
Caleb Agee (33:21):
Have a great week.
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