March 26, 2025 • 28 mins
On This week’s episode, Dr. Michael Koren Interviews local media entrepreneur Randall Thomas, host of PB and Jax. They discuss how “The Internet is a Weird Place.” They examine the algorithms, platforms, and biases that make up our experience on the internet. Mr. Thomas explains how the algorithms determine what gains traction and that all a creator can do is hope to increase their chances of something going viral. They wrap the discussion up by looking at how this race for clicks might affect medical information on the internet.Â
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Announcer (00:00):
Welcome to MedEvidence!, where we help you
navigate the truth behindmedical research with unbiased,
evidence-proven facts Hosted bycardiologist and top medical
researcher, Dr.
Michael Koren.
Dr. Michael Koren (00:11):
Hello, I'm Dr .
Michael Koren, the executiveeditor of MedEvidence, and we're
going to do something a littlebit different today.
I have a great guest RandallThomas is here.
And, Randall, you're a mediaentrepreneur and you have a
fascinating background.
You'll have to tell theaudience a little bit more about
that, but I wanted to get youhere on our podcast to one learn
(00:31):
how the internet works, and wewere having this discussion.
You were just telling me thatthe internet is weird, and I
think that's probably true, butyou'll have to explain that a
little bit more clearly foreverybody.
And, in particular, what we'refinding so interesting from the
MedEvidence! standpoint is thatwe do some podcasts and we get
(00:51):
tens of thousands of people andthen others that I think that
are even more compelling, andit's hard for me to get my
mother to watch it.
And so why is there such a bigdifference and what have you
learned in your experience tohelp us figure that out?
Randall Thomas (01:02):
Absolutely Well, first and foremost, for
the intro purposes, obviously,Randall Thomas, I'm the host of
PB&Jax, which stands forPioneers and Builders in
Jacksonville, florida.
I'm also the host of anupcoming podcast series called
Frontline Visionaries and, ontop of that, on the board at
PS27, which is a venture capitalcompany here in town, so doing
a lot of work.
Dr. Michael Koren (01:22):
That's interesting.
You'll have to dig into that alittle bit more Venture capital
public school
Randall Thomas (01:26):
Would love to.
And so I get the opportunity tomeet a lot of great people, just
like you do, sit down and havegreat conversations about what's
going on in Jacksonville thegood, the bad, the ugly and
we've been doing it for close toa year now and I've had my own
familiarities with the internetand how it works and I've
learned a couple of things I'mhappy to share.
How weird it really is.
Dr. Michael Koren (01:47):
So let's start from the beginning.
So tell us where you grew upand got involved in this space.
Randall Thomas (01:53):
Absolutely Born and raised in Austin, Texas.
That plays a big part in theentrepreneurship front.
I was in Austin before the boom.
Okay, so the road I grew up onwas called FM 620, Farm to
Market 620.
That road's now a toll road, mychildhood home was bought for
(02:15):
about $125,000.
And now on Zillow I think it'sgoing for 1.1 million.
So I'm pre-boom 2006, as theboom was starting to take shape,
I joined the Navy, gotstationed here in Jacksonville,
florida.
Stayed for about 10 years, gotout of the Navy, and decided
reside here here in Jacksonville, moving forward.
So this month, February, hasbeen 18 years since I've been in
Jacksonville Florida.
Dr. Michael Koren (02:33):
Well, that's terrific, and welcome to our
fair part of the world,
Thank you.
So how'd you get involved in this area of
being a media entrepreneur?
Randall Thomas (02:44):
Yeah, it's a wonderful question.
It's a fun journey.
So I am not your legacy newswatcher.
I had been watching the newsduring the pandemic just to stay
involved.
But one thing I noticed was wewere doing a lot of stuff on gun
violence.
We were doing a lot of stuff oncar accidents, we were doing a
lot of stuff on COVID, but weweren't really touching on what
(03:06):
was going on in the city.
Who was building products, whowas making moves?
Who were our entrepreneurs?
There's a million stories thatyou could tell in this city that
you know, because we're sodisjointed, people weren't
getting the message, right?
The north side doesn't careabout the beach, the beach
doesn't care about Mandarin.
Mandarin doesn't care aboutdowntown.
So how can we spread the wordof what people are doing?
(03:28):
You know, are we buildingSilicon Valley type startups?
Are we bringing freshperspectives and new ideas?
Are we just this legacy town?
So I tried really hard to talkto some people about creating a
podcast or creating a newsletter, creating something that would
allow people to be clued intowhat's going on in the city.
(03:48):
Unfortunately, nobody wasreally doing it, and so I
clambered and I clambered and Iclambered and I said, well, if I
want it bad enough, I'll justdo it myself.
So did some digging, talked tosome people, said, hey, do you
think this is a good idea?
Do you think this is a goodidea?
Do you think this is a bad idea?
Most people thought it was agreat idea and that's how PB&Jax
(04:09):
was born.
That's how it started.
Pb&jax has been great.
We've met with some phenomenalpeople.
We've met with entrepreneurs,small business owners, nonprofit
executive directors.
We've met with city leaders.
We've met with even rappers.
So we've had a good eclecticmix of people in the town that
(04:29):
are doing great things.
It's gotten a lot of buzz.
I shared before we started herethat even in December alone we
got over 100,000 impressions forthe show, which tells me that
there was some buzz around thetown and people were really
excited about what was going on.
So now I'm PB&Jax; to keep.
We're going to two episodes aweek and I'm kicking off a brand
(04:51):
new podcast on February 21stcalled Frontline Visionaries,
and we're going to be meetingwith industry leaders whether
that's EV, batteries,manufacturing, logistics, et
cetera people who are movingtheir companies down here we're
going to talk to them why theythought Jacksonville was the
place to be.
Dr. Michael Koren (05:08):
Interesting, very interesting.
Well, you can now talk aboutMedEvidence! as a
Jacksonville-based organizationthat is growing rapidly and is
now influencing medicaldiscussions around the world,
which is part of what we'redoing, but we'll get into that
in a second.
But I still want to get intosome of these other concepts a
little bit more before we diginto that.
(05:28):
So you said you got to 100,000impressions, so what strategies
did you use to get to that levelof interest?
Randall Thomas (05:35):
Taking it back just a second.
I did a lot of reading on thistopic before I ever engaged in
it, so I wasn't going incompletely blind.
What I did was I was in thereading I did.
I noticed that if you havelinks in the message, it
typically gets deprioritized.
So starting the message off
Dr. Michael Koren (05:58):
Deprioritized .
In whose algorithm?
Randall Thomas (06:02):
TikTok, instagram and LinkedIn, for sure
.
I don't know about YouTube,okay, so if you have a link in
the description right up, it'lldeprioritize, if you'll notice.
If you go on LinkedIn or TikTokor Instagram, you'll see that
people are putting the story orthe link in the comments now.
So that's a strategy.
(06:22):
The first line for me is alwaysa hook, and the way I set the
hook is I take a single linethat was said in the podcast by
the guest that was meaningfuland had some value and set the
tone for why people wanted tohear more about what that line
meant.
So once you set the hook, nowyou've gotten the interest right
(06:43):
and the biggest thing in 2025is we're fighting for attention.
We're in the TikTok era, we'rein the Tinder era.
We're in the Instagram era.
Linkedin if you open theLinkedIn app, the second button
on the bottom is a video button.
They're doing short formcontent now and they're
prioritizing it.
So in the world of podcasts,especially video podcasts,
(07:05):
trying to grab somebody'sattention in the first 10
seconds is a must.
So start with a really goodhook.
Give an introduction or give anice summary about what the
podcast is about, who they are,what they do, what kind of value
they're going to bring, howyou're going to make sure that
the audience is the main focalpoint in the subject and why
(07:27):
they're going to find value init.
And then, as I post a mini clipand along with everything I
just said, that's like 30seconds, that's on something
what I've deemed to befascinating in the call or in
the podcast and then we postthat and we send it out and
we've been doing well with it.
Dr. Michael Koren (07:45):
Interesting, Well, good for you.
And what's your businessstrategy in terms of monetizing
what you've done today?
Randall Thomas (07:51):
On PB& Jax, it's important that I share.
I have no intention on taking adollar ever, not because I
can't or not because we haven'thad offers, but so much of what
I did this for was to how I'vepitched it is.
If you're building a businessand you've put the foundation,
you're starting to build thehouse and you're trying to get
(08:12):
everything off the ground toimagine me as a deflated air
mattress that we're slidingunder the foundation and we're
just going to air it up.
Dr. Michael Koren (08:19):
Okay, we're going to get you off the ground.
Randall Thomas (08:21):
Right.
So everything I want to do isto help people get their message
out, get a couple extraeyeballs on them, and since I've
pivoted, now we're doing alittle bit of small business,
we're doing a little bit ofnonprofits, and I would not feel
well taking a dollar based offthe fact that I'm just trying to
give back.
However, with FrontlineVisionaries
Dr. Michael Koren (08:40):
It's okay.
As an entrepreneur, you'reentitled to take some money out
of your efforts.
It's work.
Randall Thomas (08:44):
That's why Frontline Visionaries was
created
Okay.
So we're going to really heavily push the
marketing front on the FrontlineVisionaries stuff.
We're really going to push forsponsorship.
We've already had a couple ofinquiries, which has been great,
and ideally we're going to have, um, you know, CEO level guests
of fortune 500 companies where,uh, people are really wanting
(09:05):
to tune in and then you knowthat'll attract some, some
sponsorships.
And then I I don't know whatthe payout is on views and
streams on the different Spotifyand Apple podcast links, but
you know, if we get to thatpoint, that'd be great too.
Dr. Michael Koren (09:17):
All right.
Well, that's an exciting growthplan, so good luck to you on
that.
Randall Thomas (09:21):
I appreciate that.
That's great.
Dr. Michael Koren (09:23):
So you mentioned a couple of things I
just want to follow up on.
You mentioned about a publicschool that's backed by private
equity, so how does that work?
Randall Thomas (09:32):
I don't know that a public school.
Dr. Michael Koren (09:34):
You said PS
Randall Thomas (09:35):
Oh, ps, yeah.
So PS doesn't stand for publicschool.
Dr. Michael Koren (09:40):
I'm from Staten Island, New York, and
that's what it meant there, soplease educate me.
Randall Thomas (09:44):
No, of course.
So PS27 is a venture capitalcompany.
It's founded here inJacksonville Florida.
Until last week it was the onlyventure capital company in
Jacksonville Florida that hadsome weight.
Since there's been anannouncement that Chang Robotics
launched a $50 million venturecapital fund, which is fantastic
and it's wonderful for the cityof Jacksonville.
Dr. Michael Koren (10:03):
So PS stands for?
Randall Thomas (10:05):
Couldn't tell you.
Dr. Michael Koren (10:05):
Okay,
Randall Thomas (10:06):
couldn't tell you because I don't think
Dr. Michael Koren (10:07):
it's so it has nothing to do with public
schools.
Randall Thomas (10:09):
It doesn't Okay.
So the founder, his name's JimStallings.
I was thinking maybe his firstname was P.
I've been trying to figure itout ever since I joined the
board, but Jim, he's a militaryofficer who retired, worked for
a big bank, retired from there,felt bored.
He's about as entrepreneurialas anybody I've ever met.
(10:29):
Thought that he should investin some companies.
He started taking meetings atthe Starbucks at Sawgrass.
People were pitching theircompanies to him and then his
first investment was in a veganice cream company.
Dr. Michael Koren (10:42):
Got it
Randall Thomas (10:43):
And he got a return on that investment and he
got hooked.
Dr. Michael Koren (10:46):
So the PS is just some sort of fun looking to
help startups or early phasecompanies become successful.
Randall Thomas (10:53):
That's exactly it Early stage startups.
That's on the private equityside, and then PS27 has a
foundation side, which is whereI'm on the board, and what we do
is we do community outreach, wepartner with local communities,
we partner with localconferences, we partner with
fundraising efforts and wepartner with companies in town
who are trying to back theseearly stage startups and get
(11:16):
their names on them.
So that's what PS27 is in thebusiness of doing
Dr. Michael Koren (11:20):
Got it Well.
Thank you for clearing that upfor me.
Randall Thomas (11:21):
Happy to
Dr. Michael Koren (11:22):
I'm a proud graduate of PS48.
Randall Thomas (11:25):
Public school, that's right.
48?
.
Dr. Michael Koren (11:27):
I was completely confused by that
concept.
Randall Thomas (11:29):
No worries,
Dr. Michael Koren (11:30):
all right, so move on to the next thing.
And you mentioned that theinternet is a weird place, so
explain that a little bit more.
Randall Thomas (11:38):
It is weird as it relates to you have a podcast
, I have a podcast.
We're trying to get our messageout to the masses.
How these companies, thesedifferent websites and these
social media platforms haveorganized their algorithms to
get the content out.
That in itself is weird.
It's hard to gauge.
You never know.
No two websites are the same.
(11:58):
Trying to promote on TikTok andtrying to promote on Instagram
are two different things.
Trying to promote
Dr. Michael Koren (12:03):
why is that
Randall Thomas (12:04):
I couldn't tell you?
I mean, first off, I know thatthey're owned by two different
companies, right?
Dr. Michael Koren (12:07):
So it's the algorithms that boost things.
There's an incredible number ofpossibilities for viewers, and
whatever gets presented to themwill have the most impressions.
Randall Thomas (12:16):
That's it.
And then, from my understanding, the TikTok algorithm is
supposedly more impressive thanthe Instagram algorithm.
The reason why they wantedTikTok to stay in business was
because the algorithm was builtso well, but the way that it
works is you have to post acertain amount of times a day.
The time of day that you postmatters.
How many people engage with itearly on to generate buzz, that
(12:39):
matters.
So I hate to say that it's luck, because sometimes, if you get
it down, if you know that twoo'clock or 2 pm on a Wednesday
is a great time for you to postand you get 10 likes in the
first 60 seconds, you're goingto have a pretty good chance of
this thing to get in front ofsome other people.
However, if you post it at 10am on Monday and people haven't
(13:02):
logged into their LinkedIn andthey don't see it until 5 pm,
you're not going to have thevirality chance diminishes.
So trying to time up youraudience and when you think that
they'll be online and how youcan get them to engage has been.
It's still something I'mworking on, but one of the
things maybe you can try this,it's worked for me: I've built a
(13:24):
network of people who, when Ipost the video, they go and
engage with it within the firstminute.
So I let them know that it'sposted, I let them know it's out
, and then they go log in andtake care of it for me.
So just building a tribe ofpeople who's willing to push it
forward.
Dr. Michael Koren (13:35):
Sure, and certainly we've been interested
in that area as well, but we'vealso had a lot of discussions
about using establishedplatforms like YouTube versus
building our own website, and Iguess the pluses and minuses of
either approach.
Randall Thomas (13:52):
I think the pluses are that you would give
yourself an opportunity to havereach in both areas if you build
up your website to a certainpoint where SEO can kick in and
Dr. Michael Koren (14:02):
SEO?
Randall Thomas (14:03):
search engine optimization.
So whenever somebody types infor reference, let's say, the
effects of inflammation on thebody, if MedE vidence! can be in
the top three or four links onGoogle, from there you're going
to be in a really good spot toget views.
(14:23):
However, if you don't postenough or you don't have enough
information on your website togenerate interest on Google and
get it up the ranks, you mightnot get the views that you're
looking for.
The other positive I would sayabout having it on both and
specifically on the website itprofessionalizes your website.
So if somebody goes to yourwebsite and they see all the
data and they see all theconversations and whatnot, but
(14:46):
they go to the video side andthey see your podcast and
whatnot, it legitimizes thewebsite in my opinion.
And obviously, on Youtube, eventhough the algorithm's tough to
nail down, if you can get onethat takes fire, you can post
one at the right time and getthe algorithm to push it forward
.
You can have your entire showchange overnight.
(15:06):
If you get a couple of poststhat go viral and people start
to have real name recognition,you have a real opportunity
there.
Dr. Michael Koren (15:14):
Interesting.
Now we talked a little bitbefore we got on air about the
difference between a virtualsetting for podcasts versus a
live studio setting.
So we're in a live studio andyou mentioned that this is not
your usual way of doing podcasts.
So how does it feel and how doyou compare it with your virtual
methods?
Randall Thomas (15:33):
I think this is great.
First and foremost, I wassharing earlier that I want to
transition my podcast to be inperson.
It's easier to pick up on cues,you can see how people are
responding to the questions andhow they're answering and kind
of deviate the conversationbetter.
The reason I've been utilizingthe virtual method and it's been
(15:54):
helpful is you guys try to bookpeople all the time.
Trying to coordinate is tough,so getting people just sending
them a link, there's no drivetime, right?
So if we book this for an hourlet's say 30 minutes to get here
, 30 minutes to go home, we'recarving out two hours, whereas
if I'm doing a 50 minute episodeof PB and Jax, we just put in
(16:15):
50 minutes.
So there is a huge conveniencefactor.
The other reason I would preferon site, like in person, over
virtual if you have a poweroutage or the internet goes out,
there goes your show.
So you know if we, even if thepower went out here, uh, maybe
the mics are plugged into thewall, but you have a battery in
(16:36):
the camera and you have a lightthat works you can still
continue to record and sothere's value in both, and I
think this is more authentic,and then, obviously, we have
more convenience on the otherside.
Dr. Michael Koren (16:47):
Yeah, that's key.
That's key is authenticity.
That's one of the watchwordsfor MedEvidence! is that we want
to have authentic discussions,and our concept is that we don't
want to tell people they'reright or wrong.
We don't want to just justifypreexisting opinions, which most
of the internet seems to befocused on, but we want to have
(17:08):
discussion between people, andpeople can observe those
discussions and then glean theirown insights, and so it's
fundamentally different thanother podcasts, and sometimes
people like it and sometimesthey don't.
But we're learning more andmore that it's very variable
about what gets picked up andwhat doesn't.
So I'm finding this to be afascinating conversation.
Randall Thomas (17:26):
Yes, sir, I agree.
Dr. Michael Koren (17:28):
So now I'm going to just look at you and
again, being live, I can talkabout things and make points.
So you're wearing your PB&Jlogo on your shirt, on your
tennis-type shirt, and a verynice logo, very clever the old
PB&J.
So it probably elicits warm andfuzzy feelings of our
childhoods.
So that was really clever andthat's cool.
(17:50):
There's a picture of theJacksonville skyline which holds
up, Okay, not bad, not bad fora small city.
But then you're wearing aFlorida state cap and you didn't
mention that as part of youreducation.
So tell me about that.
Why did you wear that?
And I would think somethinglike that could maybe help some
(18:10):
part of your audience but maybealienate another part.
So what's your thinking there?
Randall Thomas (18:14):
We've had some fun discussions on the podcast.
We've had some Florida Gatorson.
I've had some Georgia Bulldogson and, if anything, it might
alienate some, but it seems tocreate engaging conversation.
Dr. Michael Koren (18:29):
So you always wear that during all your
podcasts.
Randall Thomas (18:31):
I wear
Dr. Michael Koren (18:32):
or do you change hats depending on what
you feel on that day
Randall Thomas (18:35):
90% of the hats I wear are Florida State hats.
Okay, the other 10% are.
They're not Texas Longhorn hats, but they're Texas hats because
that's where I'm from, so bornand raised in Austin, as I
mentioned.
I left when I was 19.
Grew up a huge Texas Longhornfan and I still am to this day.
Joined the Navy, never went toschool while I was in the Navy,
got really bored in the pandemicand I had the GI Bill sitting
(18:57):
around, so I decided to go backto school.
I applied to every school inthe state of Florida and got
into every one of them exceptfor Florida.
I got into the university butnot the school I wanted to.
I decided to go to FloridaState.
At that point, became aSeminole and have been going to
school ever since, and this MayI graduate.
(19:18):
So I decided to go back when Iwas bored.
I'm not bored anymore, but Idid make a promise to my mom
when I was 18.
I said, hey, I'll finish school, you have my word.
And so this was me completingthat promise.
Dr. Michael Koren (19:30):
Okay, so you do have actually an affiliation
with Florida State.
Announcer (19:35):
I do Okay, all right.
Dr. Michael Koren (19:36):
Well, that explains that, but I thought it
was interesting that you worethat, because in the modern age,
if people are just looking toagain confirm their previous
biases, somebody that likes theUniversity of Florida may look
at you immediately and justclick off and that you always
run into that threat.
Randall Thomas (19:54):
We do.
I will say this I feel verystrongly that if what I'm trying
to do is to provide value to myaudience and I'm doing that by
bringing on a guest that's worthhearing what they have to say
they'll stay to hear what thatperson has to say and not based
on what my hat looks like.
I'm willing to run that risk.
If, for some reason, I findthat the numbers tank or I get a
(20:16):
bunch of comments on theYouTube videos where they say
you know, hey, the Seminolessuck, maybe I'll consider taking
the hat off.
But for now it's been fundialogue and I'm'm a proud
Seminole, so I want to make surepeople know it and it hasn't
deterred
Dr. Michael Koren (20:31):
should I be wearing a hat of some sort?
is that
Randall Thomas (20:33):
I mean you can?
when I have when you come on thepodcast.
That'd be great you should wearuh, let's get you a fedora
Dr. Michael Koren (20:39):
a fedora.
Randall Thomas (20:40):
I think that'd be great let's put a feather in
it all right I think
Dr. Michael Koren (20:42):
we'll go with the fedora
Look, okay, we can try that.
Okay, well, that's cool.
So any thoughts about what yourobservations are for medical
podcasts.
What are people looking for?
What's your experience?
MedEvidence tries to beextraordinarily objective by
often getting two people thatmay not have the same opinion
(21:05):
discuss things, may not have thesame opinion discuss things,
and often it's to physicians sothat we can talk about the data
and then sort of triangulate onthe truth, if you will.
So tell me what your experiencehas been in the healthcare
space.
Randall Thomas (21:18):
There's been two things.
So number one one thing I'venoticed by doing the PB and Jax
show and being a part of ThinkBold which is something we
haven't talked about yet, it's aconference that's here in
Jacksonville in April is we havethis real underground movement
of people who want to modernizeand be progressive in what we're
doing.
They want to recreate theAustin and Nashville effect here
(21:39):
in Jacksonville, Right?
Austin and Nashville andJacksonville, they all have
something in common they're bothtax-free states with cities.
They're larger cities withrivers flowing through the heart
of their downtown.
Two of those cities havecapitalized, one of them has not
.
That would be us.
What I'm finding in the medicalpodcast space, just like any
other space, is what are peopledoing to disrupt the current
(22:04):
industry in any way?
Could be any industry, but let'ssay, in medical Med Evidence!
is a really good example of this.
Everybody will theirpreconceived biases.
They'll read papers, they'llread articles, they'll read
headlines and they'll just it'llreaffirm how they feel and a
lot of times that's based ontheir political beliefs.
You guys came in here and said,well, listen, we're going to
read this out and we're going totell you the truth and we're
(22:24):
going to give you exactly whatthis means.
And there's no room.
You can interpret it how youwant, but we're going to give
you the facts.
That's a disruption to me.
So, when people are thirsty forinformation, real information,
I think that's a big thing.
For medical podcasts, I thinkanybody that's using technology
to make a difference in medicaltechnology like, let's say, I
(22:46):
think I saw the other day thatthere was a little bug that you
can put inside somebody's bodyand it'll help them remove a
blood clot that's a new thing,but I think people would love to
hear about that.
So, how people are utilizingtechnology, uh, to differentiate
the space, and then how, uh,people are accessing their
information, I think those wouldbe two big things.
The other, uh, big one for mewould we've talked about how
(23:07):
controversy can create clicksand whatnot and how that's
important, but there's a lot ofthings that are going on in the
medical space right now that arevolatile conversations.
The CEO of UnitedHealthcare.
Dr. Michael Koren (23:19):
Sure.
Randall Thomas (23:20):
Somehow people are split on that.
Dr. Michael Koren (23:22):
Yeah, that's crazy.
Randall Thomas (23:24):
It is crazy Somehow people are split on that
, but people want to talk aboutit.
Dr. Michael Koren (23:27):
Yeah, so that's Brian Thompson, who was
basically assassinated bysomebody that went to my
daughter's university,university of Pennsylvania,
Randall Thomas (23:36):
oh, wow.
Dr. Michael Koren (23:37):
Who was considered to be an incredibly
bright guy, valedictorian of hisclass in a fancy private school
in Baltimore, went through IvyLeague school and got both a
master's degree and his BA andthen, for whatever crazy reason,
within two or three years afterhe graduates, he becomes an
assassin.
Yep, and as if thataccomplished something,
Randall Thomas (23:58):
Well, it clearly didn't.
Dr. Michael Koren (23:59):
Right.
Randall Thomas (23:59):
Right.
So the hot topics are theUnitedHealthcare CEO, the
different states that are inhealthcare companies that are
dropping policies.
They're making hardcore changesand pivots to what they're
going to allow people to usetheir insurance for and stuff
like that.
So controversial topics wherepeople can feed the biased soul,
(24:23):
I think those for medicalpodcasts.
That's definitely a directionpeople are going in and, like I
said, disruptors and differentways to gain real life
information.
Dr. Michael Koren (24:33):
Cool, Randy, anything else you think we
should be chatting about?
I think we covered a lot ofgreat ground.
Randall Thomas (24:39):
I agree.
I have a question you just hadDr.
Fauci on, I did, and we're inthe business of giving the most
thoughtful answer we can thinkof and let people interpret this
.
Dr. Michael Koren (24:48):
Yes.
Randall Thomas (24:49):
The pardon.
It went back to 2014.
Dr. Michael Koren (24:52):
Right.
Randall Thomas (24:53):
Why did we go back a decade?
Dr. Michael Koren (24:55):
I have no idea.
So just for the audience.
So I did an interview with TonyFauci.
Interestingly, justcoincidentally, by the way, it
was probably the last publicinterview he gave before Joe
Biden gave him a pardon and, asI understand it, the pardon went
back in time, but it also wasgoing to reflect anything that
(25:20):
would happen in the future.
So I think, unfortunately, itgave some people the impression
that there was something to bepardoned for.
So, for example, President Bidenalso pardoned his son and there
was a lot of very uncomfortableproblems that the son had that
were well known.
(25:40):
But Dr.
Fauci doesn't fall into thatcategory.
If you actually look at hiscareer, he became quite famous
back in the Reaganadministration.
Here's a guy that's beenworking with presidents since
Ronald Reagan and he was veryinfluential to try to get AIDS
research moving forward and waspart of the solution for all the
(26:01):
way back in the 80s.
So anyhow, we call the podcastwith Dr.
Fauci 'Hero or Villain' andwhat we're finding is that
people have already made uptheir minds and they don't even
want to watch the podcast.
But in fact I think you'll findit interesting and everybody
that has watched it think it'sfascinating to see how this
person who they havecharacterized in some way reacts
(26:24):
to another physician.
We're just two doctors talkingand we have some things in
common.
We both grew up in New York, weboth trained at New York
Hospital, Cornell, so we havesome things we can share just
for rapport purposes.
But I thought Tony got intosome really, really interesting
things and again, my personalbias is that, how can you not
like this guy?
given the fact that he's reallydedicated his entire career.
(26:46):
He may not agree witheverything he did during COVID
and he even says that some ofthe things he would have done
differently.
So he's very forthright aboutthat.
But until you actually see whathe's like as a human being, I
would advise people maybe notpass judgment one way or another
.
Just check it out
Randall Thomas (27:01):
There was no winning once the pardon came out
right.
So people were going to saythere's something to hide.
Or the other side is going tosay it's to protect them from a
witch hunt, right?
Right, so that's what I'm saying.
Dr. Michael Koren (27:10):
Yeah, and again, we recorded this before
he got the part.
I had no idea, otherwise Iwould have asked him the
question.
Yeah, but that occurredactually a few days before, yep
Randall Thomas (27:20):
Hopefully a little bit of controversy at the
end here will help you with thealgorithm.
Okay, it's weird.
It's a weird place.
Dr. Michael Koren (27:25):
You never know.
But it's fascinating and wewere talking about before, is
that we did a relatively benignshow benign meaning just sort of
straight down Main Street interms of triglycerides, which is
a form of blood fat which issomething we study here in
research, and we got tens ofthousands of hits on that.
And so far, with the Tony Fauciinterview, it's a lot less and
(27:48):
you would think the opposite.
So you never know.
Randall Thomas (27:51):
Yeah, 100%.
We'll go back to the originalthesis.
The internet's a weird place,all right.
Dr. Michael Koren (27:55):
Well, Randy, thank you, this has been a
wonderful conversation.
We'll definitely have you back.
Randall Thomas (27:58):
No thank you.
Announcer (27:59):
Thanks for joining the MedEvidence! podcast.
To learn more, head over toMedEvidence.
com or subscribe to.
Welcome to MedEvidence!, where we help you
navigate the truth behindmedical research with unbiased,
evidence-proven facts Hosted bycardiologist and top medical
researcher, Dr.
Michael Koren.
Dr. Michael Koren (00:11):
Hello, I'm Dr .
Michael Koren, the executiveeditor of MedEvidence, and we're
going to do something a littlebit different today.
I have a great guest RandallThomas is here.
And, Randall, you're a mediaentrepreneur and you have a
fascinating background.
You'll have to tell theaudience a little bit more about
that, but I wanted to get youhere on our podcast to one learn
(00:31):
how the internet works, and wewere having this discussion.
You were just telling me thatthe internet is weird, and I
think that's probably true, butyou'll have to explain that a
little bit more clearly foreverybody.
And, in particular, what we'refinding so interesting from the
MedEvidence! standpoint is thatwe do some podcasts and we get
(00:51):
tens of thousands of people andthen others that I think that
are even more compelling, andit's hard for me to get my
mother to watch it.
And so why is there such a bigdifference and what have you
learned in your experience tohelp us figure that out?
Randall Thomas (01:02):
Absolutely Well, first and foremost, for
the intro purposes, obviously,Randall Thomas, I'm the host of
PB&Jax, which stands forPioneers and Builders in
Jacksonville, florida.
I'm also the host of anupcoming podcast series called
Frontline Visionaries and, ontop of that, on the board at
PS27, which is a venture capitalcompany here in town, so doing
a lot of work.
Dr. Michael Koren (01:22):
That's interesting.
You'll have to dig into that alittle bit more Venture capital
public school
Randall Thomas (01:26):
Would love to.
And so I get the opportunity tomeet a lot of great people, just
like you do, sit down and havegreat conversations about what's
going on in Jacksonville thegood, the bad, the ugly and
we've been doing it for close toa year now and I've had my own
familiarities with the internetand how it works and I've
learned a couple of things I'mhappy to share.
How weird it really is.
Dr. Michael Koren (01:47):
So let's start from the beginning.
So tell us where you grew upand got involved in this space.
Randall Thomas (01:53):
Absolutely Born and raised in Austin, Texas.
That plays a big part in theentrepreneurship front.
I was in Austin before the boom.
Okay, so the road I grew up onwas called FM 620, Farm to
Market 620.
That road's now a toll road, mychildhood home was bought for
(02:15):
about $125,000.
And now on Zillow I think it'sgoing for 1.1 million.
So I'm pre-boom 2006, as theboom was starting to take shape,
I joined the Navy, gotstationed here in Jacksonville,
florida.
Stayed for about 10 years, gotout of the Navy, and decided
reside here here in Jacksonville, moving forward.
So this month, February, hasbeen 18 years since I've been in
Jacksonville Florida.
Dr. Michael Koren (02:33):
Well, that's terrific, and welcome to our
fair part of the world,
Thank you.
So how'd you get involved in this area of
being a media entrepreneur?
Randall Thomas (02:44):
Yeah, it's a wonderful question.
It's a fun journey.
So I am not your legacy newswatcher.
I had been watching the newsduring the pandemic just to stay
involved.
But one thing I noticed was wewere doing a lot of stuff on gun
violence.
We were doing a lot of stuff oncar accidents, we were doing a
lot of stuff on COVID, but weweren't really touching on what
(03:06):
was going on in the city.
Who was building products, whowas making moves?
Who were our entrepreneurs?
There's a million stories thatyou could tell in this city that
you know, because we're sodisjointed, people weren't
getting the message, right?
The north side doesn't careabout the beach, the beach
doesn't care about Mandarin.
Mandarin doesn't care aboutdowntown.
So how can we spread the wordof what people are doing?
(03:28):
You know, are we buildingSilicon Valley type startups?
Are we bringing freshperspectives and new ideas?
Are we just this legacy town?
So I tried really hard to talkto some people about creating a
podcast or creating a newsletter, creating something that would
allow people to be clued intowhat's going on in the city.
(03:48):
Unfortunately, nobody wasreally doing it, and so I
clambered and I clambered and Iclambered and I said, well, if I
want it bad enough, I'll justdo it myself.
So did some digging, talked tosome people, said, hey, do you
think this is a good idea?
Do you think this is a goodidea?
Do you think this is a bad idea?
Most people thought it was agreat idea and that's how PB&Jax
(04:09):
was born.
That's how it started.
Pb&jax has been great.
We've met with some phenomenalpeople.
We've met with entrepreneurs,small business owners, nonprofit
executive directors.
We've met with city leaders.
We've met with even rappers.
So we've had a good eclecticmix of people in the town that
(04:29):
are doing great things.
It's gotten a lot of buzz.
I shared before we started herethat even in December alone we
got over 100,000 impressions forthe show, which tells me that
there was some buzz around thetown and people were really
excited about what was going on.
So now I'm PB&Jax; to keep.
We're going to two episodes aweek and I'm kicking off a brand
(04:51):
new podcast on February 21stcalled Frontline Visionaries,
and we're going to be meetingwith industry leaders whether
that's EV, batteries,manufacturing, logistics, et
cetera people who are movingtheir companies down here we're
going to talk to them why theythought Jacksonville was the
place to be.
Dr. Michael Koren (05:08):
Interesting, very interesting.
Well, you can now talk aboutMedEvidence! as a
Jacksonville-based organizationthat is growing rapidly and is
now influencing medicaldiscussions around the world,
which is part of what we'redoing, but we'll get into that
in a second.
But I still want to get intosome of these other concepts a
little bit more before we diginto that.
(05:28):
So you said you got to 100,000impressions, so what strategies
did you use to get to that levelof interest?
Randall Thomas (05:35):
Taking it back just a second.
I did a lot of reading on thistopic before I ever engaged in
it, so I wasn't going incompletely blind.
What I did was I was in thereading I did.
I noticed that if you havelinks in the message, it
typically gets deprioritized.
So starting the message off
Dr. Michael Koren (05:58):
Deprioritized .
In whose algorithm?
Randall Thomas (06:02):
TikTok, instagram and LinkedIn, for sure
.
I don't know about YouTube,okay, so if you have a link in
the description right up, it'lldeprioritize, if you'll notice.
If you go on LinkedIn or TikTokor Instagram, you'll see that
people are putting the story orthe link in the comments now.
So that's a strategy.
(06:22):
The first line for me is alwaysa hook, and the way I set the
hook is I take a single linethat was said in the podcast by
the guest that was meaningfuland had some value and set the
tone for why people wanted tohear more about what that line
meant.
So once you set the hook, nowyou've gotten the interest right
(06:43):
and the biggest thing in 2025is we're fighting for attention.
We're in the TikTok era, we'rein the Tinder era.
We're in the Instagram era.
Linkedin if you open theLinkedIn app, the second button
on the bottom is a video button.
They're doing short formcontent now and they're
prioritizing it.
So in the world of podcasts,especially video podcasts,
(07:05):
trying to grab somebody'sattention in the first 10
seconds is a must.
So start with a really goodhook.
Give an introduction or give anice summary about what the
podcast is about, who they are,what they do, what kind of value
they're going to bring, howyou're going to make sure that
the audience is the main focalpoint in the subject and why
(07:27):
they're going to find value init.
And then, as I post a mini clipand along with everything I
just said, that's like 30seconds, that's on something
what I've deemed to befascinating in the call or in
the podcast and then we postthat and we send it out and
we've been doing well with it.
Dr. Michael Koren (07:45):
Interesting, Well, good for you.
And what's your businessstrategy in terms of monetizing
what you've done today?
Randall Thomas (07:51):
On PB& Jax, it's important that I share.
I have no intention on taking adollar ever, not because I
can't or not because we haven'thad offers, but so much of what
I did this for was to how I'vepitched it is.
If you're building a businessand you've put the foundation,
you're starting to build thehouse and you're trying to get
(08:12):
everything off the ground toimagine me as a deflated air
mattress that we're slidingunder the foundation and we're
just going to air it up.
Dr. Michael Koren (08:19):
Okay, we're going to get you off the ground.
Randall Thomas (08:21):
Right.
So everything I want to do isto help people get their message
out, get a couple extraeyeballs on them, and since I've
pivoted, now we're doing alittle bit of small business,
we're doing a little bit ofnonprofits, and I would not feel
well taking a dollar based offthe fact that I'm just trying to
give back.
However, with FrontlineVisionaries
Dr. Michael Koren (08:40):
It's okay.
As an entrepreneur, you'reentitled to take some money out
of your efforts.
It's work.
Randall Thomas (08:44):
That's why Frontline Visionaries was
created
Okay.
So we're going to really heavily push the
marketing front on the FrontlineVisionaries stuff.
We're really going to push forsponsorship.
We've already had a couple ofinquiries, which has been great,
and ideally we're going to have, um, you know, CEO level guests
of fortune 500 companies where,uh, people are really wanting
(09:05):
to tune in and then you knowthat'll attract some, some
sponsorships.
And then I I don't know whatthe payout is on views and
streams on the different Spotifyand Apple podcast links, but
you know, if we get to thatpoint, that'd be great too.
Dr. Michael Koren (09:17):
All right.
Well, that's an exciting growthplan, so good luck to you on
that.
Randall Thomas (09:21):
I appreciate that.
That's great.
Dr. Michael Koren (09:23):
So you mentioned a couple of things I
just want to follow up on.
You mentioned about a publicschool that's backed by private
equity, so how does that work?
Randall Thomas (09:32):
I don't know that a public school.
Dr. Michael Koren (09:34):
You said PS
Randall Thomas (09:35):
Oh, ps, yeah.
So PS doesn't stand for publicschool.
Dr. Michael Koren (09:40):
I'm from Staten Island, New York, and
that's what it meant there, soplease educate me.
Randall Thomas (09:44):
No, of course.
So PS27 is a venture capitalcompany.
It's founded here inJacksonville Florida.
Until last week it was the onlyventure capital company in
Jacksonville Florida that hadsome weight.
Since there's been anannouncement that Chang Robotics
launched a $50 million venturecapital fund, which is fantastic
and it's wonderful for the cityof Jacksonville.
Dr. Michael Koren (10:03):
So PS stands for?
Randall Thomas (10:05):
Couldn't tell you.
Dr. Michael Koren (10:05):
Okay,
Randall Thomas (10:06):
couldn't tell you because I don't think
Dr. Michael Koren (10:07):
it's so it has nothing to do with public
schools.
Randall Thomas (10:09):
It doesn't Okay.
So the founder, his name's JimStallings.
I was thinking maybe his firstname was P.
I've been trying to figure itout ever since I joined the
board, but Jim, he's a militaryofficer who retired, worked for
a big bank, retired from there,felt bored.
He's about as entrepreneurialas anybody I've ever met.
(10:29):
Thought that he should investin some companies.
He started taking meetings atthe Starbucks at Sawgrass.
People were pitching theircompanies to him and then his
first investment was in a veganice cream company.
Dr. Michael Koren (10:42):
Got it
Randall Thomas (10:43):
And he got a return on that investment and he
got hooked.
Dr. Michael Koren (10:46):
So the PS is just some sort of fun looking to
help startups or early phasecompanies become successful.
Randall Thomas (10:53):
That's exactly it Early stage startups.
That's on the private equityside, and then PS27 has a
foundation side, which is whereI'm on the board, and what we do
is we do community outreach, wepartner with local communities,
we partner with localconferences, we partner with
fundraising efforts and wepartner with companies in town
who are trying to back theseearly stage startups and get
(11:16):
their names on them.
So that's what PS27 is in thebusiness of doing
Dr. Michael Koren (11:20):
Got it Well.
Thank you for clearing that upfor me.
Randall Thomas (11:21):
Happy to
Dr. Michael Koren (11:22):
I'm a proud graduate of PS48.
Randall Thomas (11:25):
Public school, that's right.
48?
.
Dr. Michael Koren (11:27):
I was completely confused by that
concept.
Randall Thomas (11:29):
No worries,
Dr. Michael Koren (11:30):
all right, so move on to the next thing.
And you mentioned that theinternet is a weird place, so
explain that a little bit more.
Randall Thomas (11:38):
It is weird as it relates to you have a podcast
, I have a podcast.
We're trying to get our messageout to the masses.
How these companies, thesedifferent websites and these
social media platforms haveorganized their algorithms to
get the content out.
That in itself is weird.
It's hard to gauge.
You never know.
No two websites are the same.
(11:58):
Trying to promote on TikTok andtrying to promote on Instagram
are two different things.
Trying to promote
Dr. Michael Koren (12:03):
why is that
Randall Thomas (12:04):
I couldn't tell you?
I mean, first off, I know thatthey're owned by two different
companies, right?
Dr. Michael Koren (12:07):
So it's the algorithms that boost things.
There's an incredible number ofpossibilities for viewers, and
whatever gets presented to themwill have the most impressions.
Randall Thomas (12:16):
That's it.
And then, from my understanding, the TikTok algorithm is
supposedly more impressive thanthe Instagram algorithm.
The reason why they wantedTikTok to stay in business was
because the algorithm was builtso well, but the way that it
works is you have to post acertain amount of times a day.
The time of day that you postmatters.
How many people engage with itearly on to generate buzz, that
(12:39):
matters.
So I hate to say that it's luck, because sometimes, if you get
it down, if you know that twoo'clock or 2 pm on a Wednesday
is a great time for you to postand you get 10 likes in the
first 60 seconds, you're goingto have a pretty good chance of
this thing to get in front ofsome other people.
However, if you post it at 10am on Monday and people haven't
(13:02):
logged into their LinkedIn andthey don't see it until 5 pm,
you're not going to have thevirality chance diminishes.
So trying to time up youraudience and when you think that
they'll be online and how youcan get them to engage has been.
It's still something I'mworking on, but one of the
things maybe you can try this,it's worked for me: I've built a
(13:24):
network of people who, when Ipost the video, they go and
engage with it within the firstminute.
So I let them know that it'sposted, I let them know it's out
, and then they go log in andtake care of it for me.
So just building a tribe ofpeople who's willing to push it
forward.
Dr. Michael Koren (13:35):
Sure, and certainly we've been interested
in that area as well, but we'vealso had a lot of discussions
about using establishedplatforms like YouTube versus
building our own website, and Iguess the pluses and minuses of
either approach.
Randall Thomas (13:52):
I think the pluses are that you would give
yourself an opportunity to havereach in both areas if you build
up your website to a certainpoint where SEO can kick in and
Dr. Michael Koren (14:02):
SEO?
Randall Thomas (14:03):
search engine optimization.
So whenever somebody types infor reference, let's say, the
effects of inflammation on thebody, if MedE vidence! can be in
the top three or four links onGoogle, from there you're going
to be in a really good spot toget views.
(14:23):
However, if you don't postenough or you don't have enough
information on your website togenerate interest on Google and
get it up the ranks, you mightnot get the views that you're
looking for.
The other positive I would sayabout having it on both and
specifically on the website itprofessionalizes your website.
So if somebody goes to yourwebsite and they see all the
data and they see all theconversations and whatnot, but
(14:46):
they go to the video side andthey see your podcast and
whatnot, it legitimizes thewebsite in my opinion.
And obviously, on Youtube, eventhough the algorithm's tough to
nail down, if you can get onethat takes fire, you can post
one at the right time and getthe algorithm to push it forward
.
You can have your entire showchange overnight.
(15:06):
If you get a couple of poststhat go viral and people start
to have real name recognition,you have a real opportunity
there.
Dr. Michael Koren (15:14):
Interesting.
Now we talked a little bitbefore we got on air about the
difference between a virtualsetting for podcasts versus a
live studio setting.
So we're in a live studio andyou mentioned that this is not
your usual way of doing podcasts.
So how does it feel and how doyou compare it with your virtual
methods?
Randall Thomas (15:33):
I think this is great.
First and foremost, I wassharing earlier that I want to
transition my podcast to be inperson.
It's easier to pick up on cues,you can see how people are
responding to the questions andhow they're answering and kind
of deviate the conversationbetter.
The reason I've been utilizingthe virtual method and it's been
(15:54):
helpful is you guys try to bookpeople all the time.
Trying to coordinate is tough,so getting people just sending
them a link, there's no drivetime, right?
So if we book this for an hourlet's say 30 minutes to get here
, 30 minutes to go home, we'recarving out two hours, whereas
if I'm doing a 50 minute episodeof PB and Jax, we just put in
(16:15):
50 minutes.
So there is a huge conveniencefactor.
The other reason I would preferon site, like in person, over
virtual if you have a poweroutage or the internet goes out,
there goes your show.
So you know if we, even if thepower went out here, uh, maybe
the mics are plugged into thewall, but you have a battery in
(16:36):
the camera and you have a lightthat works you can still
continue to record and sothere's value in both, and I
think this is more authentic,and then, obviously, we have
more convenience on the otherside.
Dr. Michael Koren (16:47):
Yeah, that's key.
That's key is authenticity.
That's one of the watchwordsfor MedEvidence! is that we want
to have authentic discussions,and our concept is that we don't
want to tell people they'reright or wrong.
We don't want to just justifypreexisting opinions, which most
of the internet seems to befocused on, but we want to have
(17:08):
discussion between people, andpeople can observe those
discussions and then glean theirown insights, and so it's
fundamentally different thanother podcasts, and sometimes
people like it and sometimesthey don't.
But we're learning more andmore that it's very variable
about what gets picked up andwhat doesn't.
So I'm finding this to be afascinating conversation.
Randall Thomas (17:26):
Yes, sir, I agree.
Dr. Michael Koren (17:28):
So now I'm going to just look at you and
again, being live, I can talkabout things and make points.
So you're wearing your PB&Jlogo on your shirt, on your
tennis-type shirt, and a verynice logo, very clever the old
PB&J.
So it probably elicits warm andfuzzy feelings of our
childhoods.
So that was really clever andthat's cool.
(17:50):
There's a picture of theJacksonville skyline which holds
up, Okay, not bad, not bad fora small city.
But then you're wearing aFlorida state cap and you didn't
mention that as part of youreducation.
So tell me about that.
Why did you wear that?
And I would think somethinglike that could maybe help some
(18:10):
part of your audience but maybealienate another part.
So what's your thinking there?
Randall Thomas (18:14):
We've had some fun discussions on the podcast.
We've had some Florida Gatorson.
I've had some Georgia Bulldogson and, if anything, it might
alienate some, but it seems tocreate engaging conversation.
Dr. Michael Koren (18:29):
So you always wear that during all your
podcasts.
Randall Thomas (18:31):
I wear
Dr. Michael Koren (18:32):
or do you change hats depending on what
you feel on that day
Randall Thomas (18:35):
90% of the hats I wear are Florida State hats.
Okay, the other 10% are.
They're not Texas Longhorn hats, but they're Texas hats because
that's where I'm from, so bornand raised in Austin, as I
mentioned.
I left when I was 19.
Grew up a huge Texas Longhornfan and I still am to this day.
Joined the Navy, never went toschool while I was in the Navy,
got really bored in the pandemicand I had the GI Bill sitting
(18:57):
around, so I decided to go backto school.
I applied to every school inthe state of Florida and got
into every one of them exceptfor Florida.
I got into the university butnot the school I wanted to.
I decided to go to FloridaState.
At that point, became aSeminole and have been going to
school ever since, and this MayI graduate.
(19:18):
So I decided to go back when Iwas bored.
I'm not bored anymore, but Idid make a promise to my mom
when I was 18.
I said, hey, I'll finish school, you have my word.
And so this was me completingthat promise.
Dr. Michael Koren (19:30):
Okay, so you do have actually an affiliation
with Florida State.
Announcer (19:35):
I do Okay, all right.
Dr. Michael Koren (19:36):
Well, that explains that, but I thought it
was interesting that you worethat, because in the modern age,
if people are just looking toagain confirm their previous
biases, somebody that likes theUniversity of Florida may look
at you immediately and justclick off and that you always
run into that threat.
Randall Thomas (19:54):
We do.
I will say this I feel verystrongly that if what I'm trying
to do is to provide value to myaudience and I'm doing that by
bringing on a guest that's worthhearing what they have to say
they'll stay to hear what thatperson has to say and not based
on what my hat looks like.
I'm willing to run that risk.
If, for some reason, I findthat the numbers tank or I get a
(20:16):
bunch of comments on theYouTube videos where they say
you know, hey, the Seminolessuck, maybe I'll consider taking
the hat off.
But for now it's been fundialogue and I'm'm a proud
Seminole, so I want to make surepeople know it and it hasn't
deterred
Dr. Michael Koren (20:31):
should I be wearing a hat of some sort?
is that
Randall Thomas (20:33):
I mean you can?
when I have when you come on thepodcast.
That'd be great you should wearuh, let's get you a fedora
Dr. Michael Koren (20:39):
a fedora.
Randall Thomas (20:40):
I think that'd be great let's put a feather in
it all right I think
Dr. Michael Koren (20:42):
we'll go with the fedora
Look, okay, we can try that.
Okay, well, that's cool.
So any thoughts about what yourobservations are for medical
podcasts.
What are people looking for?
What's your experience?
MedEvidence tries to beextraordinarily objective by
often getting two people thatmay not have the same opinion
(21:05):
discuss things, may not have thesame opinion discuss things,
and often it's to physicians sothat we can talk about the data
and then sort of triangulate onthe truth, if you will.
So tell me what your experiencehas been in the healthcare
space.
Randall Thomas (21:18):
There's been two things.
So number one one thing I'venoticed by doing the PB and Jax
show and being a part of ThinkBold which is something we
haven't talked about yet, it's aconference that's here in
Jacksonville in April is we havethis real underground movement
of people who want to modernizeand be progressive in what we're
doing.
They want to recreate theAustin and Nashville effect here
(21:39):
in Jacksonville, Right?
Austin and Nashville andJacksonville, they all have
something in common they're bothtax-free states with cities.
They're larger cities withrivers flowing through the heart
of their downtown.
Two of those cities havecapitalized, one of them has not
.
That would be us.
What I'm finding in the medicalpodcast space, just like any
other space, is what are peopledoing to disrupt the current
(22:04):
industry in any way?
Could be any industry, but let'ssay, in medical Med Evidence!
is a really good example of this.
Everybody will theirpreconceived biases.
They'll read papers, they'llread articles, they'll read
headlines and they'll just it'llreaffirm how they feel and a
lot of times that's based ontheir political beliefs.
You guys came in here and said,well, listen, we're going to
read this out and we're going totell you the truth and we're
(22:24):
going to give you exactly whatthis means.
And there's no room.
You can interpret it how youwant, but we're going to give
you the facts.
That's a disruption to me.
So, when people are thirsty forinformation, real information,
I think that's a big thing.
For medical podcasts, I thinkanybody that's using technology
to make a difference in medicaltechnology like, let's say, I
(22:46):
think I saw the other day thatthere was a little bug that you
can put inside somebody's bodyand it'll help them remove a
blood clot that's a new thing,but I think people would love to
hear about that.
So, how people are utilizingtechnology, uh, to differentiate
the space, and then how, uh,people are accessing their
information, I think those wouldbe two big things.
The other, uh, big one for mewould we've talked about how
(23:07):
controversy can create clicksand whatnot and how that's
important, but there's a lot ofthings that are going on in the
medical space right now that arevolatile conversations.
The CEO of UnitedHealthcare.
Dr. Michael Koren (23:19):
Sure.
Randall Thomas (23:20):
Somehow people are split on that.
Dr. Michael Koren (23:22):
Yeah, that's crazy.
Randall Thomas (23:24):
It is crazy Somehow people are split on that
, but people want to talk aboutit.
Dr. Michael Koren (23:27):
Yeah, so that's Brian Thompson, who was
basically assassinated bysomebody that went to my
daughter's university,university of Pennsylvania,
Randall Thomas (23:36):
oh, wow.
Dr. Michael Koren (23:37):
Who was considered to be an incredibly
bright guy, valedictorian of hisclass in a fancy private school
in Baltimore, went through IvyLeague school and got both a
master's degree and his BA andthen, for whatever crazy reason,
within two or three years afterhe graduates, he becomes an
assassin.
Yep, and as if thataccomplished something,
Randall Thomas (23:58):
Well, it clearly didn't.
Dr. Michael Koren (23:59):
Right.
Randall Thomas (23:59):
Right.
So the hot topics are theUnitedHealthcare CEO, the
different states that are inhealthcare companies that are
dropping policies.
They're making hardcore changesand pivots to what they're
going to allow people to usetheir insurance for and stuff
like that.
So controversial topics wherepeople can feed the biased soul,
(24:23):
I think those for medicalpodcasts.
That's definitely a directionpeople are going in and, like I
said, disruptors and differentways to gain real life
information.
Dr. Michael Koren (24:33):
Cool, Randy, anything else you think we
should be chatting about?
I think we covered a lot ofgreat ground.
Randall Thomas (24:39):
I agree.
I have a question you just hadDr.
Fauci on, I did, and we're inthe business of giving the most
thoughtful answer we can thinkof and let people interpret this
.
Dr. Michael Koren (24:48):
Yes.
Randall Thomas (24:49):
The pardon.
It went back to 2014.
Dr. Michael Koren (24:52):
Right.
Randall Thomas (24:53):
Why did we go back a decade?
Dr. Michael Koren (24:55):
I have no idea.
So just for the audience.
So I did an interview with TonyFauci.
Interestingly, justcoincidentally, by the way, it
was probably the last publicinterview he gave before Joe
Biden gave him a pardon and, asI understand it, the pardon went
back in time, but it also wasgoing to reflect anything that
(25:20):
would happen in the future.
So I think, unfortunately, itgave some people the impression
that there was something to bepardoned for.
So, for example, President Bidenalso pardoned his son and there
was a lot of very uncomfortableproblems that the son had that
were well known.
(25:40):
But Dr.
Fauci doesn't fall into thatcategory.
If you actually look at hiscareer, he became quite famous
back in the Reaganadministration.
Here's a guy that's beenworking with presidents since
Ronald Reagan and he was veryinfluential to try to get AIDS
research moving forward and waspart of the solution for all the
(26:01):
way back in the 80s.
So anyhow, we call the podcastwith Dr.
Fauci 'Hero or Villain' andwhat we're finding is that
people have already made uptheir minds and they don't even
want to watch the podcast.
But in fact I think you'll findit interesting and everybody
that has watched it think it'sfascinating to see how this
person who they havecharacterized in some way reacts
(26:24):
to another physician.
We're just two doctors talkingand we have some things in
common.
We both grew up in New York, weboth trained at New York
Hospital, Cornell, so we havesome things we can share just
for rapport purposes.
But I thought Tony got intosome really, really interesting
things and again, my personalbias is that, how can you not
like this guy?
given the fact that he's reallydedicated his entire career.
(26:46):
He may not agree witheverything he did during COVID
and he even says that some ofthe things he would have done
differently.
So he's very forthright aboutthat.
But until you actually see whathe's like as a human being, I
would advise people maybe notpass judgment one way or another
.
Just check it out
Randall Thomas (27:01):
There was no winning once the pardon came out
right.
So people were going to saythere's something to hide.
Or the other side is going tosay it's to protect them from a
witch hunt, right?
Right, so that's what I'm saying.
Dr. Michael Koren (27:10):
Yeah, and again, we recorded this before
he got the part.
I had no idea, otherwise Iwould have asked him the
question.
Yeah, but that occurredactually a few days before, yep
Randall Thomas (27:20):
Hopefully a little bit of controversy at the
end here will help you with thealgorithm.
Okay, it's weird.
It's a weird place.
Dr. Michael Koren (27:25):
You never know.
But it's fascinating and wewere talking about before, is
that we did a relatively benignshow benign meaning just sort of
straight down Main Street interms of triglycerides, which is
a form of blood fat which issomething we study here in
research, and we got tens ofthousands of hits on that.
And so far, with the Tony Fauciinterview, it's a lot less and
(27:48):
you would think the opposite.
So you never know.
Randall Thomas (27:51):
Yeah, 100%.
We'll go back to the originalthesis.
The internet's a weird place,all right.
Dr. Michael Koren (27:55):
Well, Randy, thank you, this has been a
wonderful conversation.
We'll definitely have you back.
Randall Thomas (27:58):
No thank you.
Announcer (27:59):
Thanks for joining the MedEvidence! podcast.
To learn more, head over toMedEvidence.
com or subscribe to.
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