November 12, 2024 • 45 mins
After her own birth mother tried to abort her twice, Julie Brumley found herself frozen in an unconscious trauma response for decades until she found the power of somatic trauma healing.
Julie is an adoptee and trauma-informed coach who has been coaching men and women for more than 15 years to overcome addictive behaviors and heal the primal trauma of abandonment. She is also the CEO of Coming Home to Self, a company dedicated to helping adoptees heal.
Julie now uses somatics, nervous system regulation, personal experience and her masters in counseling to help other adult adoptees find their way out of their own trauma and into a life of radical self-belonging.
LINKS:
Website - http://www.cominghometoself.co
Insta - https://www.instagram.com/juliebrumley_/
FB - https://www.facebook.com/julierasbrum
FB community - http://www.facebook.com/groups/theresilienceprojectforadoptees/
Connect With Melissa:
-Email Melissa here: mindyourownkarma@gmail.com
-Click here for the Mind Your Own Karma Website
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-Click here for a comprehensive list of adoptee/adoptee trauma-informed practitioners.
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Mind Your Own Karma – The Adoption Chronicles Podcast educates listeners on the realities of adoption through the stories of adoptees, birth parents, and adoptive parents. We delve into their journeys, exploring identity, the emotional impacts of adoption, and the complexities that are involved when a child is removed from their biology.
We also tackle tough topics like transracial adoption and adoption ethics, featuring experts and advocates. By sharing these diverse perspectives we hope to not only educate the world, but also give hope and healing to those deeply affected by adoption trauma.
*** This podcast's mission is on adoption education. If you have an expertise that you think would be beneficial to anyone touched by adoption and would like to
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
And I just remember thinking something is really wrong that,
that, that I couldn't even receive her love, you know?
So that was kind of the beginning of it.
And it impacted all of my relationship.
I was afraid to get on the floorand play with my children.
Well. I was afraid that if I got on
the floor that they would betrayand leave me.
(00:22):
I mean, it was. It didn't make any sense.
Hey there, it's Melissa Brunetti, and welcome to the
Mind Your Own Karma podcast. Hey there, Karma crew.
(00:44):
Thanks for joining me for this episode of Mind Your Own Karma
The Adoption Chronicles. Today I have Julie Brumley on
the show. Julie is a trauma informed
adoptee coach who has been coaching men and women for more
than 15 years to overcome addictive behaviors and heal the
primal trauma of abandonment. She is also the CEO of Coming
(01:07):
Home to Self, a company dedicated to helping adoptees
heal. After her own birth mother tried
to abort her twice. She found herself frozen in an
unconscious trauma response for decades until she found the
power of somatic trauma healing.Now she uses somatics, nervous
(01:28):
system regulation, personal experience, and her master's in
counseling to help other adoptees find their way out of
their own trauma and into a lifeof radical self belonging.
Here is my interview with Julie Bromley.
We are welcoming Julie to the show today.
Hi, Julie. Hey, so good to see you.
(01:49):
Yeah, I'm glad to talk to you. I've been on your website.
I probably was on there for an hour looking at all your somatic
work, and I was geeking out. And so I'm happy to finally talk
to you in person. Here.
But you are an an adoptee, so let's kind of start there.
Tell us a little bit or what youknow about why you were put up
(02:10):
for adoption. Yeah, so my first mother was 16
when she found out she was pregnant.
She actually had Still, the story still cracks me up.
She had hitchhiked from San Diego County on semi trucks at
(02:32):
16 years old to Colorado and ended up in my birth father's
courtyard at a party, hooked up.And that next morning my birth
father left to go to work, and when he came home, he found her
in bed with his two roommates. And so he kicked her out like
(02:55):
right away. So literally what I tell people
is, have you seen Mamma Mia, 'cause that's basically my
story. I was the child of one of three
guys. You know, like that was one of
the first things my birth motheractually said to me when I met
her over the phone in 2010. She goes, it was the 70s.
(03:15):
It was one of three guys. Would you like to know about the
night? And I was like, no.
Holy crap. Yeah, it was very interesting.
So basically my birth father didn't know I existed at all
'cause she didn't know which oneit was, obviously.
So that's kind of how I came to be and was conceived.
(03:37):
And then between 12 and 16 weeks, my birth mother actually
attempted to abort me twice. I know.
I saw that on your website. I was like, what?
Yeah, that and you know, after all the the schooling that I've
done and all of the research that I've done on that period of
development in the womb, my brain was already fully
(04:01):
developed at that point. And so I know it impacted me.
There was for years and I couldn't put words to it until
probably let me think it's jealous.
Probably four years ago was whenI first put words to that
feeling that I had when she attempted to abort me twice.
(04:24):
I think it was I'm defective, like I need to be gotten rid of
and, and I know a lot of adoptees feel that way, but I
could not put the actual verbiage to it until actually I
went through EMBR. But I think that feeling, and
it's interesting too, because itwas 1973.
So if you know, January is when Roe V Wade passed that year.
(04:50):
So she legally could do what shedid and, and probably would have
even illegally before. I think I, I don't know.
But but sadly she, I think she struggled with drugs and
alcohol. And when I met her in 20, her in
(05:10):
2010, she wasn't very physicallywell.
And 10 years later she actually passed in 2020 of COPD and
cirrhosis of the liver. So I mean, that tells you
something. I mean, she was only, that's
2020. I mean, she was only 60, I
think. I mean, she was young, she
passed. So, so that's kind of the story
(05:33):
of me coming to be into the adopted world, right?
And what's interesting about my relinquishment story, I don't
think I realized how much this impacted me until the last few
years. But when I was born, I was, as a
lot of people from my era were taken directly from her.
(05:54):
Like I, they didn't give me to her.
I didn't sit on her stomach or her chest, None of that.
There was no skin to skin for usback then and immediately taken
to the nursery and this random woman.
This is what's crazy, Melissa. This was literally in the
paperwork that my social worker gave me in 2010 because she knew
I was getting my master's in counseling.
(06:15):
So she said I'm going to give you as much as I can.
I was adopted from California. So you, you got to know it's not
much. It was 6 pages, which that's
amazing to be honest, but everything was, you know, the
non identifying information, youknow, all of this and all of
these know all of this. But but one of the things that
(06:36):
was said was there was a random woman that came into the the
hospital room where my birth mother was and said, please
don't give her up for adoption. I'll take her like, well, you're
still that would still be adoption.
But my birth mother and sister who and her sister who were
there were like, what are you doing here?
How did you even get in here? And how did you even know that I
(06:58):
had a bit what is happening? You know?
So that caused a problem and they complained.
Then she had the gall to go to the nursery and hold me.
I do not even know how that evenhappened.
Wait, this random woman did that?
Oh my gosh, yes. And then came back to the room
and said to my birth mother, I just held her.
(07:19):
I want to take her home. I, I mean, I, I, I read that and
I think how did that even I wasn't even allowed, Like I
don't even anyway. So all of that's happening and
then I end up being sent to a foster home, obviously, because
that's what usually happens. And I did, that's what they did.
I was in foster care for seven weeks because my birth mother
(07:43):
had not signed any papers, she hadn't relinquished me her
rights and she actually disappeared.
So the social worker went to find her after the birth and she
wasn't there anymore. And of course it was the age of
there's no answering machine So what do you do?
So she just had to wait. So 4 weeks later, my birth
(08:04):
mother shows up in her office and is ready to actually sign
the papers. Craziness.
So what ends up happening after seven weeks is my foster family
basically says to the state, we can no longer accommodate her.
And so they gave me back to the state.
So here we have 4:00, well, three at this point, three times
(08:27):
where I've been passed to different caregivers, which that
happens to a lot of adoptees. But what people don't understand
is how that impacts us and we don't have words for it.
I couldn't fend for myself and go, I don't want to go here, you
know, or I don't want to be withthis other person.
I had no words. I just could cry.
(08:47):
You know, and then we sound likecrazy people as adults saying
that that affected us at at an infant as a newborn.
They're like, no, it's. Like, you're lucky.
Yeah. I mean, it's, it's just, it's
unbelievable. So I was, you know, given back
to the state and then within 24 hours they called my, my
(09:08):
adoptive parents and we're like,we have, we have somebody who's
just been given to us. Can you come see her right now?
My mom was literally 2 hours away on vacation, thankfully
close enough. And so she drove and held me for
45 minutes. They came in, took me out and
said, can you take her home now?And both my parents were like,
(09:29):
sure, I think we want her, but we.
She's getting kicked out of the system.
Can you take her own? It's crazy.
So I end up back with them. This was literally last week,
October 31st was when I was brought home on Halloween.
And the story goes the doorbell rang, the dog barked and Julie
cried because I it was people would come to the door.
(09:51):
And so my window was right by the front door and that's where
I was sleeping. So my dad ended up my doctor dad
ended up sitting outside the door so that nobody would knock.
I mean, it was just, it's a cutestory, but but I could not, I,
I, I wouldn't wake up. I would try, but I was sleeping
the entire time and my mom triedto wake me up 24 hours.
(10:11):
I did not wake up. And it just tells you some.
I mean, she was scared. She called the doctor like, what
am I supposed to do? I can't get her to wake up.
And he said, you know, she probably feels safe, let her
sleep. And, and I don't know if it was
that I felt safe or that I was literally sleeping off the
trauma of what I had just gone through.
I'm gonna say you're exhausted, yeah.
(10:33):
So that's kind of that's how I ended up in my adopted family.
Oh my God, that's crazy. that Lady that came and held you must
have worked at the hospital or something.
Why would they just let her in like she's an administrator or
something? Like, I mean, she can't.
Just go. So odd.
That's scary. That's scary.
(10:56):
So how are you told you were adopted?
Do you remember being told? Did you always know?
Always new. There was never a time in my
life where I remember being sat down and told I just knew.
And as a matter of fact, I thinkfor a long time I thought
everybody was, oh, funny, I didn't.
I just didn't know any different, right.
(11:17):
My brother was adopted. He was two years, nine months
older than me. And so I, and he was the only
adoptee I knew all of my life. There was no adoptees in my life
growing up, just me and him. And so we lived in a small town
in in Colorado called Grand Junction.
I don't know if you've ever. Yeah.
So that's where I grew up. We actually moved from
California when I was seven there.
(11:38):
And that's where I grew up. But yeah, I, I just didn't know
anybody. I remember the first time I
actually ever experienced any type of prejudice or I don't
know what you would call it. I can't think of the right word
right now, was when I was hanging out with a friend.
I think it was in early middle school.
(11:59):
So I probably was like 5th grade, 5th or 6th grade.
And I told her I was adopted, Discrimination.
That's the word I was looking for.
And she said to me, I told her Iwas adopted.
I remember it's vivid too. We were out on my backyard swing
just swinging and playing. And I told her I was adopted.
And she goes, oh, I can't be your friend.
I need to go home. I was like, what does that even
(12:24):
mean? And she literally called them.
Off. Yeah.
And, and I was like, so adopt, being adopted is bad.
Like, I don't even know what to do with that.
I've never thought it was bad. I don't even know what to think.
So yeah, that was the first timeI ever realized something was
wrong with being adopted. Yeah.
How did you feel growing up then?
(12:45):
OK, so after that happened, how did how did you, how did what,
how did that affect you after that?
I mean, did you start questioning everything?
Did you talk to your mom? Like what?
Yep, I what ended up happening was, you know, in school when
they have us do those, what are they called heritage things
(13:06):
where we have to like like. A family treat.
Our background. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I remember saying to my mom, what is mine?
I don't know what mine is because I knew I was adopted.
And she said, oh, you're just Norwegian and Swedish like us,
you can just adopt ours. And I remember thinking inside,
but I'm not. So what do I do with that?
(13:27):
And I, but I didn't have anything else to go off of.
So that was the first feeling oflike powerlessness that I think
I felt. And then I remember I have vivid
memories of which is interestingbecause I don't have a lot of
childhood memories at all, but Ihave this vivid memory of
standing in my hallway. And I've talked about this
before on another podcast, I think, where I stared at my
(13:49):
picture of our family and was trying desperately to figure out
how I looked like them, which I knew I wouldn't, but I was like
trying to like will myself to look like them, you know what I
mean? And so if somebody said to me,
Oh my gosh, you look like your mom, I'd, I'd be like inside.
(14:09):
We hear that all the time when when that happens with adopted
mom and adopted daughter and theadopted daughter's like, well,
no. And the adopted mom was like,
I'm so glad you think he talks about me, You know, so just
really interesting. Like there was and I just, it
was a vacant feeling and I don'tknow how else to describe it
besides vacancy. There was something missing for
(14:31):
me. And so looking at that picture
felt like, how do I find that? I don't even know where to
begin. But it didn't even dawn on me
that I could search at that point.
It, it really didn't. It just asked a lot of
questions, like, do we have any information?
And my mom, it wasn't that she wasn't forthcoming, it was that
(14:55):
I don't think she knew what to say.
And, and this isn't, she's a wonderful woman.
I, I mean, gosh, I don't wanna say anything negative.
She, she did the best she could with the information she had in
the 70s. I mean, come on.
And so I just don't think she knew how to support me with
(15:16):
that. And how could she?
There just wasn't anybody to help her know how to do that.
I mean, back then we were blank slates.
We didn't know anything. We didn't remember anything.
And so, you know, so yeah, they didn't have anything to to work
with or didn't you know, they didn't know back then.
So you you only know, didn't. Yeah, you.
(15:36):
Yeah, totally. You only know what you know.
And so for me, I, you know, I have no hard feelings, no
nothing with with them, neither one of them.
Sadly, my, my adopted father died when I was 15.
And so it was a very traumatic time for me because as we know,
(15:58):
death, that was my first death that I experienced.
It's so reminiscent of somethingthat we've already experienced.
But before we had words, 'cause obviously our our birthday
didn't die per SE, but they definitely there was a huge loss
and we lost culture, we lost medical history.
(16:19):
We lost so much just with that one event that I think my body
remembered and it it was a really rough time for me.
And I just remember thinking, I need to push through.
I need to show up for my mom. I need to be strong like the I
need to keep busy. I can't allow myself to deal
with the grief that I feel because I'm listening to her
(16:41):
crying every night and I can't, I mean, she was married to this
man for 25 years. I, I mean, I can't, I mean like
heart wishing you know, and. You don't want to be another
burden on her, you know, trying to.
I don't. Want to be you.
Yeah, totally, totally. Oh my gosh.
So yeah, I kind of went off on atangent, sorry.
(17:03):
That's fine. So growing up now as an adult,
how do you see adoption? How has it shaped you, you
think? I think there's been, there's a
couple of things that come to mymind. 1 is it's, it protected me
(17:26):
from some things for a while. And, and what I mean by that is
the fog that we talked about, I believe that it kept me in that
fog for a while until I was actually ready to deal with it.
So in a lot of ways, I'm grateful for that.
(17:47):
I think in recent years, probably in the last five, I've
begun to realize how much it hasimpacted me though, like in my
present relationships, in just even in friendships.
I have this memory before I had come out of the fog where my
(18:07):
best friend, still my best friend went to Costa Rica and
she was there were no phones where she was and she drove an
hour after being there probably for a couple of weeks just to
call me and she called me. We talked and at the end of the
conversation she said I love you.
(18:28):
And my knee jerk response, I'm telling you, Melissa right away
was no, you don't. There was no I didn't stop but
think about saying those words. That's just what came out of my
mouth. And she was like what?
She was livid with me. How could you?
I drove. Well, I mean, she just went off
and I and I, in that moment I realized, wow.
(18:51):
What was that? What was that and where did that
come from? And so she was so great 'cause
she was willing to explore that with me.
And actually one of her other really dear friends was an
adoptee. So she'd seen some of that
before, but I didn't know what it was.
I just, there was this deep belief I was unlovable.
And so that was my response, right?
(19:12):
So that was the beginning of me kind of coming before even, I
don't know, this was before I'd even found my birth family.
So, yeah, I mean, it was like inthe early 2000s.
And I just remember thinking something is really wrong that
that that I couldn't even receive her love, you know?
So that was kind of the beginning of it.
(19:33):
And it impacted all of my relationships.
I was afraid to get on the floorand play with my children.
Wow. I was afraid that if I got on
the floor that they would betrayand leave me.
I mean, it was. It didn't make any sense.
And until I could actually put words to all of that, which
didn't honestly happen until about 5:00-ish years ago, did I
(19:57):
realize that I myself could havepotentially damaged some
relationships and had to kind ofgo back and do some repairing.
Even with my, at that time teenage children, They're now
adults and we've been able to doeven more repair.
But they're, they've been so amazing through all of this and
being able to see, they've watched it all.
So they, they get it, I think. And oh, there's so much more I
(20:21):
could go into with them, but I think how it's.
It's it, it has impacted my relationships.
The the negative patterns in my relationships are how I realized
I really need help because I'm not able to receive what people
are telling me because my fear that they're gonna leave anyway.
So why would I even allow intimacy?
Because if I allow it, I'm just gonna get burned anyway.
(20:43):
My dad died. My, you know, I mean, there was
so many like proofs that it was really difficult And, and sadly,
I think that was one of the contributing factors to the
divorce that I just recently would have been divorced and
that I never would have thought that would happen.
(21:03):
I'm not saying it's all my fault, but I do take
responsibility for that piece because there was just so much
fear and being able to break that barrier, fear and turn it
into belief within myself that Idon't need this outside people
to validate me and tell me that I'm OK.
(21:25):
I don't, I'm I'm inherently worthy without that.
And so I think that's been kind of the journey that I've been on
in most recent years. Have you ever left a therapy
session feeling like you achieved major breakthroughs,
only to discover that the issuesyou wanted to eliminate continue
to sprout up and grow? With somatic, mindful, guided
(21:47):
imagery, we get to the root of your symptoms easily, gently and
efficiently. So you can spend less time
wedding and more time cultivating.
Yeah, so coming out of the fog was that kind of recent as well,
'cause I, I've kind of been starting to see this pattern
(22:10):
even with myself, where when we start finding our authenticity
and that we are enough and we start feeling that self love and
independence and all. And, you know, the courage to be
who we are. That a lot of times that's when
divorce happens, you know, because it's like they're like,
I know for my ex, it's probably like, who's this person?
(22:31):
Like, this isn't the same. I, I was an actor in my own
life. I always say that.
And then when I started living authentically, it was like, of
course there was some people that weren't thrilled with the
outcome of that. But I mean, was that kind of
your experience too? Like you're coming out of the
fog and then all these like changes happening.
It yes, it just was slow. So when I was really smacked
(22:56):
across the face with this was in2010 and I was I was at an
intensive for my master's program.
So we actually lived in Hawaii at the time, which was amazing.
Well, just dad and I had to fly here to Virginia, which is where
I live now because I went to Liberty University for my
(23:16):
master's degree. And so I was at this this
intensive and the professor was a foster parent and she heard me
talking about being adopted and immediately stopped everything
and said, you need to deal with that.
And I was like, deal with what? Like, I have no idea what you're
(23:36):
talking about my adoption. And she said, yes, because you
have skeletons in your closet and if you don't deal with it,
you will harm people. And I was like, Oh my gosh.
So that was 2010. And that's, I had already
started looking, but nothing hadever come to fruition.
She never signed a consent for contacts.
So I was like, she doesn't want to see me.
(23:57):
I'm not going to keep searching,but when that happened and I'm
about ready to get my degree to help people, it was an absolute.
I felt like my eyes were opened and that was when the fog really
began to lift and I came home and started really actively
searching. Called my social worker in San
Diego. Her name was Terry Meeks.
I say her name every time because she was amazing.
(24:21):
She's the one that got me those 6 pages.
She knew the degree that I was getting and she said to me, I
understand what you need, so I will give you everything that I
can, but what you need to understand is what you're about
to read is very gnarly. She literally used those words.
And so that's when I found out that she attempted to abort me
(24:42):
all, all of that. And so that's literally when it
started. And I think my my husband at the
time felt very protective and didn't even want me to read that
information 'cause he was just so afraid of how it would impact
me, which I can fully understandthat fear.
(25:03):
And he wasn't fully wrong because as soon as I read that
part where it said that she attempted to do that, I couldn't
read anymore. It felt like my brain fragmented
into multiple pieces and I spentprobably the next 10 years
trying to put it back together. It just really, really messed
with my head. Then I met her, I met my birth
(25:25):
mother and realized that there just, it wasn't the most healthy
thing. Probably saw her 3 * 3 or 4
times before she died. And I was there actually when
she not when she actually died. But I was there in the area and
30 minutes later after she died,I, I ended up being there with
my half sister and, and that wasan interesting experience.
(25:49):
But I think once that happens, that's when I really started.
So 2020, so 10 years later, that's when I started actually
beginning to pick up the pieces.I realized I have unfinished
business. She's now gone and I don't have
to be indebted to her with any of this 'cause she'd even
offered, I'll allow you, I'll pay for your DNA test to find
(26:11):
out who your birth father is. She and she also told me I think
he's dead, which I don't know how she would even know that.
So I just believed her because what I we don't know these
things until we know them. And so I started EMDR, which is
a trauma therapy if people don'tknow what that is and actually
(26:32):
was discovered to help treat PTSD and I could not.
It took me 4 months to even access my baby cell, partly
because I couldn't. The whole body thing, I my brain
and my, my head was detached from my body.
It was completely dissociated. And so when she asked me where
(26:55):
do you feel it in your body, I was like, I have no idea.
It was all here. I feel it in my head.
There's tension in my head. She was like, OK, I don't know
how you know. And so she told me at the end of
that, Julie, you need to do somesomatic work.
If you don't do somatic work, I'm not sure if your marriage is
going to survive. She actually said those words
(27:16):
and which I'm grateful she did. And so I proceeded to try to
find what that would be. I, I searched and found somebody
who was a quack, to be honest. She basically told me to blow
bubbles and feel the water when I wash dishes.
I was like, OK, which sure, someof those are grounding tools
(27:38):
that you can use, but we, it's alittle bit deeper than this
lady. So, so that was in 2021, right
around the time that I had askedmy husband at the time for
23andMe, because I realized now that my birth mother is gone, I
want to find my birth father. But at the time it was
(27:59):
subconscious. I just wanted to know what
MyHeritage was 'cause back to that time when my mom told me I
could just be half Norwegian, half Swedish.
I always wanted to know. So it in my mind I wasn't
thinking about finding my birth father 'cause I thought he was
dead or whatever, you know? But I think subconsciously
that's what I wanted. So I did 23 me a month later,
(28:22):
January of 21, I find out I'm 52% Italian, which flipped me
out. But I also was very excited
about it. Totally.
I know it was so fun and found out that my birth father was
100% Oh my gosh. And of course he had no idea I
existed. So that was an interesting
experience talking to my half sister who they're my sisters.
(28:44):
I mean, if you saw pictures of us, you would be like, what?
I mean, I, you know, my face andtheir face.
It was amazing for me after looking in the hallway at that
picture, so long to be able to look into a mirror.
As you know, I mean, I'm sure you understand and have heard
this many times. So very, very empowering for me.
(29:06):
And he was so they were all so welcoming.
Still are still in reunion with them, you know, 3 1/2 years
later. And we have really good deep
conversations. They're willing to lean in,
they're willing to learn. And, and even with, you know,
the stuff that I'm trying to do and helping the adopted
community, I'll sometimes send posts to them and say I'm, I'm
(29:27):
gonna post this. Are, are you OK with it?
Because some of it talks about them, you know, and it's been so
cool because they aren't, they don't shy away from the hard
conversation. So, so when I send them that,
like my youngest sister, she's like 16 1/2 years younger than
me, will respond back, that sounds totally accurate.
You absolutely should post that.And then my birth father is so
(29:49):
sweet. You know, it affects him because
I'm his daughter. And so he just felt like, wait,
you don't feel like you need us?And I'm like, no, no, no, no,
that's not what that meant. But being able to lean into that
conversation, even this last week to talk about it was just
so like, to me, it felt it was like a hug.
(30:10):
Like they, they, they want to know, they want to understand.
And, and it's hard for them to because they haven't experienced
what I've experienced, right? But if I don't include them in
it, they're not going to know. And then it's going to continue
the distance. So that has been really healing
(30:31):
for me to be off. Definitely, yeah, that's you're
super lucky there. I really, I really am.
I don't take that lightly. True.
How did your dad take finding out that he had another
daughter? OK so so my half sister.
So she is about a year and a half younger than me and she's
(30:55):
who came up on 23andMe and she lives about 7 1/2 hours South of
here in North Carolina. And so I was like, oh, she's in
the same time zone. This is really good.
So I messaged her thinking, you know, I'll just this is me being
breezy. If you remember the friends
episode where she's on the phonetrying to find some a a dude.
And anyway, it just made me laugh.
That's how I felt. I was like being breezy, stopped
(31:20):
her Facebook page a little bit and was very, you know, gave her
very little information. I don't want anything from you.
I'm just looking for medical info.
I'm wondering if you might be connected to my birth dad side,
you know, stuff like that. And it took her two days to
respond, which to me is shocking.
Usually it would take weeks. You know, you hear these
stories. And she she the reason why it
(31:42):
only took her two days is because she stalked my Facebook
page and knew immediately that Iwas her sister.
I mean, she just was like, you look exactly like Shaylee, her
my other sister. And so she was like, you are
absolutely my sister, even when her husband, which I understand
and love him. So but he was like, I don't
know, I think we need to shy away.
(32:02):
And and then then Mariah went showed her, showed him a picture
of me and he goes, Oh, shoot, that's your sister.
I mean, like that's from lookingat me.
So I'm trying to get to the yesterday.
I'm sorry. So basically she, she called him
and he was actually at my younger sister's house and she
said you need to go outside. You don't need to be around.
(32:24):
Cause Shaylee at this time was very pregnant with her
three-year old now and was like,she doesn't need to hear this
yet. You need to hear it first.
So go outside And she told him. And he was like, I don't
remember this. I need to sit with this and
think about, I mean, why Woody, it was 47 years ago.
(32:47):
I'm 51 now, but it was 47 years ago one night, like I, I
wouldn't expect him to. So he sat on it for like my
memory is, and he'll probably correct me after listening to
this, but, but I think it was like a day.
And I think he even called 23andMe and was like, were your
tests accurate? Not that he didn't want me, it's
just he didn't understand, you know, and and then he remembered
(33:12):
and he that's where the story came flooding back, where he
told me about the, the party in the courtyard and all that stuff
that I already. Told.
That part I did not know for years.
She just told me it was one of three guys.
So, but it made so much sense tome.
And then he said to Mariah, he said, this is the blessing.
You can absolutely tell her to e-mail me.
(33:33):
And so that was a Wednesday I emailed, That was a Thursday.
I emailed him on Friday and we went back and forth an e-mail
and then we talked on Sunday forthe first time in January of
2021. And it's been pretty much
nonstop with all of them since then.
And I'm, I mean, I spent my first Christmas with them, you
know, like after that, he came out for my birthday that same
(33:58):
year just to get to know each other, you know, so I have felt
very, very loved. And they've, they lean into the,
the challenge and the conflict. They don't run from it.
And so because they're like, we're family, whether we know
each other or not, you are biologically us.
And so we want to know you and how healing and soul settling
(34:24):
that was for me. But I think I will say this, I
had to learn that my worth and belonging doesn't actually come
from that because there's still going to be things.
And we've had our ups and downs,and those ups and downs
initially shook me through my core.
(34:46):
And once I realized, wait a minute, this is just like any
relationship. I may not know them and I wasn't
raised with them, but I still need to be willing to go in
these hills and valleys and blah, blah, blah.
And it's going to be like this in every relationship that I
have. I'm the only relationship that
I'm going to have forever that Ineed to be close with.
(35:07):
Not that I'm not going to be close with anybody else, but I
need to have that solid within me, inherent worthiness and not
expected to come from outside, not expected to come from them.
And so that's been a lot of the work that I've been doing in the
last few years. Yeah, we have to learn to be
intimate with ourselves, you know, first.
(35:29):
Otherwise you can only have a relationship to the degree that
you have a relationship with yourself.
I mean, really? So.
So what's been the most challenging aspect of your
adoption journey and how have you worked through those
challenges? It's a really good question.
(35:51):
I think I think probably the most challenging and the most
prominent has been in the last few years.
It's been the losing of the relationship that I had for 28
years. It's the fact that me
differentiating more, I think, led to that.
(36:12):
And that was really devastating,to be honest.
Yeah, I think it was me realizing I can be OK like I
just talked about. I can be OK on my own.
(36:33):
I don't need another human telling me that I'm worthy,
telling me that he won't leave, telling me you don't have.
Am I making sense? And I think once I started, I
think what was difficult for himand why it became the hardest I
think for me was when I first found them, there was like this
(36:57):
honeymoon phase that is talked about by Nancy Barrier when she
goes through all of this, right when she teaches us in our
little the book coming Home to self.
I don't know if you've ever readthat book, but she talks about
the honeymoon phase and that it can last about a year.
And I tried to explain to him what was going on, which he
couldn't. How could he understand?
He'd never experienced that. And so here I am.
(37:20):
Like I get butterflies when theymessage me.
It's not just my dad. It's when my sisters do.
My brother. I mean, I have four or three
other siblings that had never had sisters before.
So there it was literally like Ihad a new boyfriend.
That's how it felt for probably the first year.
(37:40):
And I think him watching that was really hard and, and I
don't, I don't know how else to say it like, 'cause he would say
to me, I feel like some of that should be for me.
And I'm, I'm missing that. And, and I all I could say I
didn't have words for him at that point.
I'm like, I don't, I don't know what to I need.
(38:03):
I need this, like this is repairing things that I didn't
know needed to be fixed, that that were broken inside of me.
And it's not I, I'm not putting it all on them, but it's this
whole idea of the mirroring, thereflection, the learning what it
feels like to want affection from somebody that you feel
(38:26):
biologically connected to. I, I, the only time I'd ever
felt that was for my children. And it scared the bejesus out of
me. Melissa Like the first time my
son came out I was like I'm going to ruin him.
I don't know how to raise a kid.I don't know how to nurture.
I did. I was never nurtured because my
mom tried but I pushed her away because after being relinquished
(38:50):
4 different times I didn't trusther initially of course.
So anytime she tried to nurture it was like talk to the hanch as
an infant. It just is so sad to me because
I just feel like we lose so muchin those first weeks of our
lives that we work a lifetime torepay.
(39:12):
Yeah, definitely, definitely. So what would you like
struggling adoptees to know? That there is healing.
I I, I really believe that. I hear from a lot of people that
healing, heal, or being healed isn't possible.
(39:34):
Yes. And I actually kind of agree
with that statement. I do not think past tense
healing is when we say healed, Iwill never have arrived.
I will did that make sense? I, I will be actively healing
for the rest of my life. But I do believe that healing is
(39:54):
possible. I do believe that we can find
our identity within ourselves. I do believe that there are
layers. And layers of us that are worthy
of becoming known and we just have to be willing to explore
them and be curious and be compassionate and loving of them
(40:14):
and not exiling them like those fragmented pieces that happened
for me. I had to learn how to show them
compassion and how to love up onthem.
And now I feel like that part ofme, my internal family system
that we talked about those parts, do you really feel like
they belong? And they're quieter now, like
(40:35):
they're not as loud and screaming because I've really
been able to show them compassion.
Yeah, yeah, the somatic piece like we were saying is what's
been missing, especially for preverbal trauma and those triggers
that were like, why am I acting like this?
Why am I doing this? You know, yeah, it just it, it,
(40:58):
it does get stored in the body. And that somatic piece is huge.
And I hope that more adoptees take advantage.
So tell everyone about your website and what you're, what
you're offering and things and we'll have all the links in the
show notes. Yeah, totally.
So my website, my my company actually is called Coming Home
to self. When I name that, it didn't even
(41:22):
dawn on me that that was the I have the book right here, but
that was the book name I forgot.And so I'm just hoping I don't
get in trouble. It was it like came to me as I
was, I was like, that's what I want to call my company because
that's what I feel like I've done anyway.
So the program that I'm in rightnow is called revolution.
And it's something that really Ifeel like we need to start a
(41:44):
revolution where adoption is concerned.
And so that's the reason why I named it that.
It's called revolution, uncovering your birthright.
And what I believe about that isour birthright is within us.
Our identity is there. We just need to go back and find
it and enjoy that little baby self that didn't get the nurture
that they so desperately wanted.We can provide that.
(42:07):
And so we moved through 7 phasesthat I've had to move through
myself that I really feel like once I was able to get it all
out on paper. And it's really interesting
because everything has to do with sevens for me.
And it's not surprising when I, I was in Proctor care for seven
weeks, so that number 7 and I was born September 7th.
(42:27):
So it's just really interesting.And that's my favorite.
It's my favorite number. And so, and it's the number of
completion. So it's beautiful.
But we go through 7 phases and those phases are self-awareness,
self acceptance, self compassion, self responsibility,
self transformation, self love, and self belonging.
And what I've learned is it's really challenging to have self
(42:50):
belonging if we have no awareness.
They all build upon each other and it's hard to have acceptance
if we're not aware either. But it's also hard to have
compassion if we don't accept. You see what I'm saying?
So they build upon each other and there's pieces that we
really delve into four weeks in each one of those themes that
(43:12):
that we delve into for the adoptee.
And it's cool because we have some professionals coming in and
actually speaking from their ownperspectives too, Not just me,
because I don't have all the answers.
I'm, I'm a work in progress justlike all of us.
But I want to pass off the things that have helped me get
to where I am too. Yeah, definitely.
(43:34):
So we'll dive into that. We're going to have Julie on for
another episode and we're going to dive into a little bit more
about what she does in the somatic piece.
So I hope everyone joins us for that.
What an incredible conversation today.
A huge thank you to Julie for sharing her adoption journey
with us, the highs, the challenges, and those powerful
(43:57):
moments of self discovery. You know it takes a lot of
courage to revisit some of thoseparts of our stories and even
more to share them so openly on a podcast.
For those of you listening, I hope today's episode offered you
some insight or validation for whatever stage of the adoption
journey you're in or curious about.
(44:19):
Whether it's navigating identity, finding belonging, or
facing the unexpected emotions that come up, remember that each
story is unique and deserves to be honored.
And don't forget, Julie will be joining us again next week to
dive into our healing journey and talk about how somatic
therapy was a huge game changer for her and her clients.
(44:42):
You won't want to miss it. Thanks for listening today Karma
Crew. Don't forget to take what you
need and leave what you don't. And always remember to mind your
own karma. I'll see you next time.
This podcast is created for educational purposes by the
telling of adoption experiences.The views expressed in this
(45:04):
podcast may not be those of the host or Mind Your Own Karma.
And I just remember thinking something is really wrong that,
that, that I couldn't even receive her love, you know?
So that was kind of the beginning of it.
And it impacted all of my relationship.
I was afraid to get on the floorand play with my children.
Well. I was afraid that if I got on
the floor that they would betrayand leave me.
(00:22):
I mean, it was. It didn't make any sense.
Hey there, it's Melissa Brunetti, and welcome to the
Mind Your Own Karma podcast. Hey there, Karma crew.
(00:44):
Thanks for joining me for this episode of Mind Your Own Karma
The Adoption Chronicles. Today I have Julie Brumley on
the show. Julie is a trauma informed
adoptee coach who has been coaching men and women for more
than 15 years to overcome addictive behaviors and heal the
primal trauma of abandonment. She is also the CEO of Coming
(01:07):
Home to Self, a company dedicated to helping adoptees
heal. After her own birth mother tried
to abort her twice. She found herself frozen in an
unconscious trauma response for decades until she found the
power of somatic trauma healing.Now she uses somatics, nervous
(01:28):
system regulation, personal experience, and her master's in
counseling to help other adoptees find their way out of
their own trauma and into a lifeof radical self belonging.
Here is my interview with Julie Bromley.
We are welcoming Julie to the show today.
Hi, Julie. Hey, so good to see you.
(01:49):
Yeah, I'm glad to talk to you. I've been on your website.
I probably was on there for an hour looking at all your somatic
work, and I was geeking out. And so I'm happy to finally talk
to you in person. Here.
But you are an an adoptee, so let's kind of start there.
Tell us a little bit or what youknow about why you were put up
(02:10):
for adoption. Yeah, so my first mother was 16
when she found out she was pregnant.
She actually had Still, the story still cracks me up.
She had hitchhiked from San Diego County on semi trucks at
(02:32):
16 years old to Colorado and ended up in my birth father's
courtyard at a party, hooked up.And that next morning my birth
father left to go to work, and when he came home, he found her
in bed with his two roommates. And so he kicked her out like
(02:55):
right away. So literally what I tell people
is, have you seen Mamma Mia, 'cause that's basically my
story. I was the child of one of three
guys. You know, like that was one of
the first things my birth motheractually said to me when I met
her over the phone in 2010. She goes, it was the 70s.
(03:15):
It was one of three guys. Would you like to know about the
night? And I was like, no.
Holy crap. Yeah, it was very interesting.
So basically my birth father didn't know I existed at all
'cause she didn't know which oneit was, obviously.
So that's kind of how I came to be and was conceived.
(03:37):
And then between 12 and 16 weeks, my birth mother actually
attempted to abort me twice. I know.
I saw that on your website. I was like, what?
Yeah, that and you know, after all the the schooling that I've
done and all of the research that I've done on that period of
development in the womb, my brain was already fully
(04:01):
developed at that point. And so I know it impacted me.
There was for years and I couldn't put words to it until
probably let me think it's jealous.
Probably four years ago was whenI first put words to that
feeling that I had when she attempted to abort me twice.
(04:24):
I think it was I'm defective, like I need to be gotten rid of
and, and I know a lot of adoptees feel that way, but I
could not put the actual verbiage to it until actually I
went through EMBR. But I think that feeling, and
it's interesting too, because itwas 1973.
So if you know, January is when Roe V Wade passed that year.
(04:50):
So she legally could do what shedid and, and probably would have
even illegally before. I think I, I don't know.
But but sadly she, I think she struggled with drugs and
alcohol. And when I met her in 20, her in
(05:10):
2010, she wasn't very physicallywell.
And 10 years later she actually passed in 2020 of COPD and
cirrhosis of the liver. So I mean, that tells you
something. I mean, she was only, that's
2020. I mean, she was only 60, I
think. I mean, she was young, she
passed. So, so that's kind of the story
(05:33):
of me coming to be into the adopted world, right?
And what's interesting about my relinquishment story, I don't
think I realized how much this impacted me until the last few
years. But when I was born, I was, as a
lot of people from my era were taken directly from her.
(05:54):
Like I, they didn't give me to her.
I didn't sit on her stomach or her chest, None of that.
There was no skin to skin for usback then and immediately taken
to the nursery and this random woman.
This is what's crazy, Melissa. This was literally in the
paperwork that my social worker gave me in 2010 because she knew
I was getting my master's in counseling.
(06:15):
So she said I'm going to give you as much as I can.
I was adopted from California. So you, you got to know it's not
much. It was 6 pages, which that's
amazing to be honest, but everything was, you know, the
non identifying information, youknow, all of this and all of
these know all of this. But but one of the things that
(06:36):
was said was there was a random woman that came into the the
hospital room where my birth mother was and said, please
don't give her up for adoption. I'll take her like, well, you're
still that would still be adoption.
But my birth mother and sister who and her sister who were
there were like, what are you doing here?
How did you even get in here? And how did you even know that I
(06:58):
had a bit what is happening? You know?
So that caused a problem and they complained.
Then she had the gall to go to the nursery and hold me.
I do not even know how that evenhappened.
Wait, this random woman did that?
Oh my gosh, yes. And then came back to the room
and said to my birth mother, I just held her.
(07:19):
I want to take her home. I, I mean, I, I, I read that and
I think how did that even I wasn't even allowed, Like I
don't even anyway. So all of that's happening and
then I end up being sent to a foster home, obviously, because
that's what usually happens. And I did, that's what they did.
I was in foster care for seven weeks because my birth mother
(07:43):
had not signed any papers, she hadn't relinquished me her
rights and she actually disappeared.
So the social worker went to find her after the birth and she
wasn't there anymore. And of course it was the age of
there's no answering machine So what do you do?
So she just had to wait. So 4 weeks later, my birth
(08:04):
mother shows up in her office and is ready to actually sign
the papers. Craziness.
So what ends up happening after seven weeks is my foster family
basically says to the state, we can no longer accommodate her.
And so they gave me back to the state.
So here we have 4:00, well, three at this point, three times
(08:27):
where I've been passed to different caregivers, which that
happens to a lot of adoptees. But what people don't understand
is how that impacts us and we don't have words for it.
I couldn't fend for myself and go, I don't want to go here, you
know, or I don't want to be withthis other person.
I had no words. I just could cry.
(08:47):
You know, and then we sound likecrazy people as adults saying
that that affected us at at an infant as a newborn.
They're like, no, it's. Like, you're lucky.
Yeah. I mean, it's, it's just, it's
unbelievable. So I was, you know, given back
to the state and then within 24 hours they called my, my
(09:08):
adoptive parents and we're like,we have, we have somebody who's
just been given to us. Can you come see her right now?
My mom was literally 2 hours away on vacation, thankfully
close enough. And so she drove and held me for
45 minutes. They came in, took me out and
said, can you take her home now?And both my parents were like,
(09:29):
sure, I think we want her, but we.
She's getting kicked out of the system.
Can you take her own? It's crazy.
So I end up back with them. This was literally last week,
October 31st was when I was brought home on Halloween.
And the story goes the doorbell rang, the dog barked and Julie
cried because I it was people would come to the door.
(09:51):
And so my window was right by the front door and that's where
I was sleeping. So my dad ended up my doctor dad
ended up sitting outside the door so that nobody would knock.
I mean, it was just, it's a cutestory, but but I could not, I,
I, I wouldn't wake up. I would try, but I was sleeping
the entire time and my mom triedto wake me up 24 hours.
(10:11):
I did not wake up. And it just tells you some.
I mean, she was scared. She called the doctor like, what
am I supposed to do? I can't get her to wake up.
And he said, you know, she probably feels safe, let her
sleep. And, and I don't know if it was
that I felt safe or that I was literally sleeping off the
trauma of what I had just gone through.
I'm gonna say you're exhausted, yeah.
(10:33):
So that's kind of that's how I ended up in my adopted family.
Oh my God, that's crazy. that Lady that came and held you must
have worked at the hospital or something.
Why would they just let her in like she's an administrator or
something? Like, I mean, she can't.
Just go. So odd.
That's scary. That's scary.
(10:56):
So how are you told you were adopted?
Do you remember being told? Did you always know?
Always new. There was never a time in my
life where I remember being sat down and told I just knew.
And as a matter of fact, I thinkfor a long time I thought
everybody was, oh, funny, I didn't.
I just didn't know any different, right.
(11:17):
My brother was adopted. He was two years, nine months
older than me. And so I, and he was the only
adoptee I knew all of my life. There was no adoptees in my life
growing up, just me and him. And so we lived in a small town
in in Colorado called Grand Junction.
I don't know if you've ever. Yeah.
So that's where I grew up. We actually moved from
California when I was seven there.
(11:38):
And that's where I grew up. But yeah, I, I just didn't know
anybody. I remember the first time I
actually ever experienced any type of prejudice or I don't
know what you would call it. I can't think of the right word
right now, was when I was hanging out with a friend.
I think it was in early middle school.
(11:59):
So I probably was like 5th grade, 5th or 6th grade.
And I told her I was adopted, Discrimination.
That's the word I was looking for.
And she said to me, I told her Iwas adopted.
I remember it's vivid too. We were out on my backyard swing
just swinging and playing. And I told her I was adopted.
And she goes, oh, I can't be your friend.
I need to go home. I was like, what does that even
(12:24):
mean? And she literally called them.
Off. Yeah.
And, and I was like, so adopt, being adopted is bad.
Like, I don't even know what to do with that.
I've never thought it was bad. I don't even know what to think.
So yeah, that was the first timeI ever realized something was
wrong with being adopted. Yeah.
How did you feel growing up then?
(12:45):
OK, so after that happened, how did how did you, how did what,
how did that affect you after that?
I mean, did you start questioning everything?
Did you talk to your mom? Like what?
Yep, I what ended up happening was, you know, in school when
they have us do those, what are they called heritage things
(13:06):
where we have to like like. A family treat.
Our background. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I remember saying to my mom, what is mine?
I don't know what mine is because I knew I was adopted.
And she said, oh, you're just Norwegian and Swedish like us,
you can just adopt ours. And I remember thinking inside,
but I'm not. So what do I do with that?
(13:27):
And I, but I didn't have anything else to go off of.
So that was the first feeling oflike powerlessness that I think
I felt. And then I remember I have vivid
memories of which is interestingbecause I don't have a lot of
childhood memories at all, but Ihave this vivid memory of
standing in my hallway. And I've talked about this
before on another podcast, I think, where I stared at my
(13:49):
picture of our family and was trying desperately to figure out
how I looked like them, which I knew I wouldn't, but I was like
trying to like will myself to look like them, you know what I
mean? And so if somebody said to me,
Oh my gosh, you look like your mom, I'd, I'd be like inside.
(14:09):
We hear that all the time when when that happens with adopted
mom and adopted daughter and theadopted daughter's like, well,
no. And the adopted mom was like,
I'm so glad you think he talks about me, You know, so just
really interesting. Like there was and I just, it
was a vacant feeling and I don'tknow how else to describe it
besides vacancy. There was something missing for
(14:31):
me. And so looking at that picture
felt like, how do I find that? I don't even know where to
begin. But it didn't even dawn on me
that I could search at that point.
It, it really didn't. It just asked a lot of
questions, like, do we have any information?
And my mom, it wasn't that she wasn't forthcoming, it was that
(14:55):
I don't think she knew what to say.
And, and this isn't, she's a wonderful woman.
I, I mean, gosh, I don't wanna say anything negative.
She, she did the best she could with the information she had in
the 70s. I mean, come on.
And so I just don't think she knew how to support me with
(15:16):
that. And how could she?
There just wasn't anybody to help her know how to do that.
I mean, back then we were blank slates.
We didn't know anything. We didn't remember anything.
And so, you know, so yeah, they didn't have anything to to work
with or didn't you know, they didn't know back then.
So you you only know, didn't. Yeah, you.
(15:36):
Yeah, totally. You only know what you know.
And so for me, I, you know, I have no hard feelings, no
nothing with with them, neither one of them.
Sadly, my, my adopted father died when I was 15.
And so it was a very traumatic time for me because as we know,
(15:58):
death, that was my first death that I experienced.
It's so reminiscent of somethingthat we've already experienced.
But before we had words, 'cause obviously our our birthday
didn't die per SE, but they definitely there was a huge loss
and we lost culture, we lost medical history.
(16:19):
We lost so much just with that one event that I think my body
remembered and it it was a really rough time for me.
And I just remember thinking, I need to push through.
I need to show up for my mom. I need to be strong like the I
need to keep busy. I can't allow myself to deal
with the grief that I feel because I'm listening to her
(16:41):
crying every night and I can't, I mean, she was married to this
man for 25 years. I, I mean, I can't, I mean like
heart wishing you know, and. You don't want to be another
burden on her, you know, trying to.
I don't. Want to be you.
Yeah, totally, totally. Oh my gosh.
So yeah, I kind of went off on atangent, sorry.
(17:03):
That's fine. So growing up now as an adult,
how do you see adoption? How has it shaped you, you
think? I think there's been, there's a
couple of things that come to mymind. 1 is it's, it protected me
(17:26):
from some things for a while. And, and what I mean by that is
the fog that we talked about, I believe that it kept me in that
fog for a while until I was actually ready to deal with it.
So in a lot of ways, I'm grateful for that.
(17:47):
I think in recent years, probably in the last five, I've
begun to realize how much it hasimpacted me though, like in my
present relationships, in just even in friendships.
I have this memory before I had come out of the fog where my
(18:07):
best friend, still my best friend went to Costa Rica and
she was there were no phones where she was and she drove an
hour after being there probably for a couple of weeks just to
call me and she called me. We talked and at the end of the
conversation she said I love you.
(18:28):
And my knee jerk response, I'm telling you, Melissa right away
was no, you don't. There was no I didn't stop but
think about saying those words. That's just what came out of my
mouth. And she was like what?
She was livid with me. How could you?
I drove. Well, I mean, she just went off
and I and I, in that moment I realized, wow.
(18:51):
What was that? What was that and where did that
come from? And so she was so great 'cause
she was willing to explore that with me.
And actually one of her other really dear friends was an
adoptee. So she'd seen some of that
before, but I didn't know what it was.
I just, there was this deep belief I was unlovable.
And so that was my response, right?
(19:12):
So that was the beginning of me kind of coming before even, I
don't know, this was before I'd even found my birth family.
So, yeah, I mean, it was like inthe early 2000s.
And I just remember thinking something is really wrong that
that that I couldn't even receive her love, you know?
So that was kind of the beginning of it.
(19:33):
And it impacted all of my relationships.
I was afraid to get on the floorand play with my children.
Wow. I was afraid that if I got on
the floor that they would betrayand leave me.
I mean, it was. It didn't make any sense.
And until I could actually put words to all of that, which
didn't honestly happen until about 5:00-ish years ago, did I
(19:57):
realize that I myself could havepotentially damaged some
relationships and had to kind ofgo back and do some repairing.
Even with my, at that time teenage children, They're now
adults and we've been able to doeven more repair.
But they're, they've been so amazing through all of this and
being able to see, they've watched it all.
So they, they get it, I think. And oh, there's so much more I
(20:21):
could go into with them, but I think how it's.
It's it, it has impacted my relationships.
The the negative patterns in my relationships are how I realized
I really need help because I'm not able to receive what people
are telling me because my fear that they're gonna leave anyway.
So why would I even allow intimacy?
Because if I allow it, I'm just gonna get burned anyway.
(20:43):
My dad died. My, you know, I mean, there was
so many like proofs that it was really difficult And, and sadly,
I think that was one of the contributing factors to the
divorce that I just recently would have been divorced and
that I never would have thought that would happen.
(21:03):
I'm not saying it's all my fault, but I do take
responsibility for that piece because there was just so much
fear and being able to break that barrier, fear and turn it
into belief within myself that Idon't need this outside people
to validate me and tell me that I'm OK.
(21:25):
I don't, I'm I'm inherently worthy without that.
And so I think that's been kind of the journey that I've been on
in most recent years. Have you ever left a therapy
session feeling like you achieved major breakthroughs,
only to discover that the issuesyou wanted to eliminate continue
to sprout up and grow? With somatic, mindful, guided
(21:47):
imagery, we get to the root of your symptoms easily, gently and
efficiently. So you can spend less time
wedding and more time cultivating.
Yeah, so coming out of the fog was that kind of recent as well,
'cause I, I've kind of been starting to see this pattern
(22:10):
even with myself, where when we start finding our authenticity
and that we are enough and we start feeling that self love and
independence and all. And, you know, the courage to be
who we are. That a lot of times that's when
divorce happens, you know, because it's like they're like,
I know for my ex, it's probably like, who's this person?
(22:31):
Like, this isn't the same. I, I was an actor in my own
life. I always say that.
And then when I started living authentically, it was like, of
course there was some people that weren't thrilled with the
outcome of that. But I mean, was that kind of
your experience too? Like you're coming out of the
fog and then all these like changes happening.
It yes, it just was slow. So when I was really smacked
(22:56):
across the face with this was in2010 and I was I was at an
intensive for my master's program.
So we actually lived in Hawaii at the time, which was amazing.
Well, just dad and I had to fly here to Virginia, which is where
I live now because I went to Liberty University for my
(23:16):
master's degree. And so I was at this this
intensive and the professor was a foster parent and she heard me
talking about being adopted and immediately stopped everything
and said, you need to deal with that.
And I was like, deal with what? Like, I have no idea what you're
(23:36):
talking about my adoption. And she said, yes, because you
have skeletons in your closet and if you don't deal with it,
you will harm people. And I was like, Oh my gosh.
So that was 2010. And that's, I had already
started looking, but nothing hadever come to fruition.
She never signed a consent for contacts.
So I was like, she doesn't want to see me.
(23:57):
I'm not going to keep searching,but when that happened and I'm
about ready to get my degree to help people, it was an absolute.
I felt like my eyes were opened and that was when the fog really
began to lift and I came home and started really actively
searching. Called my social worker in San
Diego. Her name was Terry Meeks.
I say her name every time because she was amazing.
(24:21):
She's the one that got me those 6 pages.
She knew the degree that I was getting and she said to me, I
understand what you need, so I will give you everything that I
can, but what you need to understand is what you're about
to read is very gnarly. She literally used those words.
And so that's when I found out that she attempted to abort me
(24:42):
all, all of that. And so that's literally when it
started. And I think my my husband at the
time felt very protective and didn't even want me to read that
information 'cause he was just so afraid of how it would impact
me, which I can fully understandthat fear.
(25:03):
And he wasn't fully wrong because as soon as I read that
part where it said that she attempted to do that, I couldn't
read anymore. It felt like my brain fragmented
into multiple pieces and I spentprobably the next 10 years
trying to put it back together. It just really, really messed
with my head. Then I met her, I met my birth
(25:25):
mother and realized that there just, it wasn't the most healthy
thing. Probably saw her 3 * 3 or 4
times before she died. And I was there actually when
she not when she actually died. But I was there in the area and
30 minutes later after she died,I, I ended up being there with
my half sister and, and that wasan interesting experience.
(25:49):
But I think once that happens, that's when I really started.
So 2020, so 10 years later, that's when I started actually
beginning to pick up the pieces.I realized I have unfinished
business. She's now gone and I don't have
to be indebted to her with any of this 'cause she'd even
offered, I'll allow you, I'll pay for your DNA test to find
(26:11):
out who your birth father is. She and she also told me I think
he's dead, which I don't know how she would even know that.
So I just believed her because what I we don't know these
things until we know them. And so I started EMDR, which is
a trauma therapy if people don'tknow what that is and actually
(26:32):
was discovered to help treat PTSD and I could not.
It took me 4 months to even access my baby cell, partly
because I couldn't. The whole body thing, I my brain
and my, my head was detached from my body.
It was completely dissociated. And so when she asked me where
(26:55):
do you feel it in your body, I was like, I have no idea.
It was all here. I feel it in my head.
There's tension in my head. She was like, OK, I don't know
how you know. And so she told me at the end of
that, Julie, you need to do somesomatic work.
If you don't do somatic work, I'm not sure if your marriage is
going to survive. She actually said those words
(27:16):
and which I'm grateful she did. And so I proceeded to try to
find what that would be. I, I searched and found somebody
who was a quack, to be honest. She basically told me to blow
bubbles and feel the water when I wash dishes.
I was like, OK, which sure, someof those are grounding tools
(27:38):
that you can use, but we, it's alittle bit deeper than this
lady. So, so that was in 2021, right
around the time that I had askedmy husband at the time for
23andMe, because I realized now that my birth mother is gone, I
want to find my birth father. But at the time it was
(27:59):
subconscious. I just wanted to know what
MyHeritage was 'cause back to that time when my mom told me I
could just be half Norwegian, half Swedish.
I always wanted to know. So it in my mind I wasn't
thinking about finding my birth father 'cause I thought he was
dead or whatever, you know? But I think subconsciously
that's what I wanted. So I did 23 me a month later,
(28:22):
January of 21, I find out I'm 52% Italian, which flipped me
out. But I also was very excited
about it. Totally.
I know it was so fun and found out that my birth father was
100% Oh my gosh. And of course he had no idea I
existed. So that was an interesting
experience talking to my half sister who they're my sisters.
(28:44):
I mean, if you saw pictures of us, you would be like, what?
I mean, I, you know, my face andtheir face.
It was amazing for me after looking in the hallway at that
picture, so long to be able to look into a mirror.
As you know, I mean, I'm sure you understand and have heard
this many times. So very, very empowering for me.
(29:06):
And he was so they were all so welcoming.
Still are still in reunion with them, you know, 3 1/2 years
later. And we have really good deep
conversations. They're willing to lean in,
they're willing to learn. And, and even with, you know,
the stuff that I'm trying to do and helping the adopted
community, I'll sometimes send posts to them and say I'm, I'm
(29:27):
gonna post this. Are, are you OK with it?
Because some of it talks about them, you know, and it's been so
cool because they aren't, they don't shy away from the hard
conversation. So, so when I send them that,
like my youngest sister, she's like 16 1/2 years younger than
me, will respond back, that sounds totally accurate.
You absolutely should post that.And then my birth father is so
(29:49):
sweet. You know, it affects him because
I'm his daughter. And so he just felt like, wait,
you don't feel like you need us?And I'm like, no, no, no, no,
that's not what that meant. But being able to lean into that
conversation, even this last week to talk about it was just
so like, to me, it felt it was like a hug.
(30:10):
Like they, they, they want to know, they want to understand.
And, and it's hard for them to because they haven't experienced
what I've experienced, right? But if I don't include them in
it, they're not going to know. And then it's going to continue
the distance. So that has been really healing
(30:31):
for me to be off. Definitely, yeah, that's you're
super lucky there. I really, I really am.
I don't take that lightly. True.
How did your dad take finding out that he had another
daughter? OK so so my half sister.
So she is about a year and a half younger than me and she's
(30:55):
who came up on 23andMe and she lives about 7 1/2 hours South of
here in North Carolina. And so I was like, oh, she's in
the same time zone. This is really good.
So I messaged her thinking, you know, I'll just this is me being
breezy. If you remember the friends
episode where she's on the phonetrying to find some a a dude.
And anyway, it just made me laugh.
That's how I felt. I was like being breezy, stopped
(31:20):
her Facebook page a little bit and was very, you know, gave her
very little information. I don't want anything from you.
I'm just looking for medical info.
I'm wondering if you might be connected to my birth dad side,
you know, stuff like that. And it took her two days to
respond, which to me is shocking.
Usually it would take weeks. You know, you hear these
stories. And she she the reason why it
(31:42):
only took her two days is because she stalked my Facebook
page and knew immediately that Iwas her sister.
I mean, she just was like, you look exactly like Shaylee, her
my other sister. And so she was like, you are
absolutely my sister, even when her husband, which I understand
and love him. So but he was like, I don't
know, I think we need to shy away.
(32:02):
And and then then Mariah went showed her, showed him a picture
of me and he goes, Oh, shoot, that's your sister.
I mean, like that's from lookingat me.
So I'm trying to get to the yesterday.
I'm sorry. So basically she, she called him
and he was actually at my younger sister's house and she
said you need to go outside. You don't need to be around.
(32:24):
Cause Shaylee at this time was very pregnant with her
three-year old now and was like,she doesn't need to hear this
yet. You need to hear it first.
So go outside And she told him. And he was like, I don't
remember this. I need to sit with this and
think about, I mean, why Woody, it was 47 years ago.
(32:47):
I'm 51 now, but it was 47 years ago one night, like I, I
wouldn't expect him to. So he sat on it for like my
memory is, and he'll probably correct me after listening to
this, but, but I think it was like a day.
And I think he even called 23andMe and was like, were your
tests accurate? Not that he didn't want me, it's
just he didn't understand, you know, and and then he remembered
(33:12):
and he that's where the story came flooding back, where he
told me about the, the party in the courtyard and all that stuff
that I already. Told.
That part I did not know for years.
She just told me it was one of three guys.
So, but it made so much sense tome.
And then he said to Mariah, he said, this is the blessing.
You can absolutely tell her to e-mail me.
(33:33):
And so that was a Wednesday I emailed, That was a Thursday.
I emailed him on Friday and we went back and forth an e-mail
and then we talked on Sunday forthe first time in January of
2021. And it's been pretty much
nonstop with all of them since then.
And I'm, I mean, I spent my first Christmas with them, you
know, like after that, he came out for my birthday that same
(33:58):
year just to get to know each other, you know, so I have felt
very, very loved. And they've, they lean into the,
the challenge and the conflict. They don't run from it.
And so because they're like, we're family, whether we know
each other or not, you are biologically us.
And so we want to know you and how healing and soul settling
(34:24):
that was for me. But I think I will say this, I
had to learn that my worth and belonging doesn't actually come
from that because there's still going to be things.
And we've had our ups and downs,and those ups and downs
initially shook me through my core.
(34:46):
And once I realized, wait a minute, this is just like any
relationship. I may not know them and I wasn't
raised with them, but I still need to be willing to go in
these hills and valleys and blah, blah, blah.
And it's going to be like this in every relationship that I
have. I'm the only relationship that
I'm going to have forever that Ineed to be close with.
(35:07):
Not that I'm not going to be close with anybody else, but I
need to have that solid within me, inherent worthiness and not
expected to come from outside, not expected to come from them.
And so that's been a lot of the work that I've been doing in the
last few years. Yeah, we have to learn to be
intimate with ourselves, you know, first.
(35:29):
Otherwise you can only have a relationship to the degree that
you have a relationship with yourself.
I mean, really? So.
So what's been the most challenging aspect of your
adoption journey and how have you worked through those
challenges? It's a really good question.
(35:51):
I think I think probably the most challenging and the most
prominent has been in the last few years.
It's been the losing of the relationship that I had for 28
years. It's the fact that me
differentiating more, I think, led to that.
(36:12):
And that was really devastating,to be honest.
Yeah, I think it was me realizing I can be OK like I
just talked about. I can be OK on my own.
(36:33):
I don't need another human telling me that I'm worthy,
telling me that he won't leave, telling me you don't have.
Am I making sense? And I think once I started, I
think what was difficult for himand why it became the hardest I
think for me was when I first found them, there was like this
(36:57):
honeymoon phase that is talked about by Nancy Barrier when she
goes through all of this, right when she teaches us in our
little the book coming Home to self.
I don't know if you've ever readthat book, but she talks about
the honeymoon phase and that it can last about a year.
And I tried to explain to him what was going on, which he
couldn't. How could he understand?
He'd never experienced that. And so here I am.
(37:20):
Like I get butterflies when theymessage me.
It's not just my dad. It's when my sisters do.
My brother. I mean, I have four or three
other siblings that had never had sisters before.
So there it was literally like Ihad a new boyfriend.
That's how it felt for probably the first year.
(37:40):
And I think him watching that was really hard and, and I
don't, I don't know how else to say it like, 'cause he would say
to me, I feel like some of that should be for me.
And I'm, I'm missing that. And, and I all I could say I
didn't have words for him at that point.
I'm like, I don't, I don't know what to I need.
(38:03):
I need this, like this is repairing things that I didn't
know needed to be fixed, that that were broken inside of me.
And it's not I, I'm not putting it all on them, but it's this
whole idea of the mirroring, thereflection, the learning what it
feels like to want affection from somebody that you feel
(38:26):
biologically connected to. I, I, the only time I'd ever
felt that was for my children. And it scared the bejesus out of
me. Melissa Like the first time my
son came out I was like I'm going to ruin him.
I don't know how to raise a kid.I don't know how to nurture.
I did. I was never nurtured because my
mom tried but I pushed her away because after being relinquished
(38:50):
4 different times I didn't trusther initially of course.
So anytime she tried to nurture it was like talk to the hanch as
an infant. It just is so sad to me because
I just feel like we lose so muchin those first weeks of our
lives that we work a lifetime torepay.
(39:12):
Yeah, definitely, definitely. So what would you like
struggling adoptees to know? That there is healing.
I I, I really believe that. I hear from a lot of people that
healing, heal, or being healed isn't possible.
(39:34):
Yes. And I actually kind of agree
with that statement. I do not think past tense
healing is when we say healed, Iwill never have arrived.
I will did that make sense? I, I will be actively healing
for the rest of my life. But I do believe that healing is
(39:54):
possible. I do believe that we can find
our identity within ourselves. I do believe that there are
layers. And layers of us that are worthy
of becoming known and we just have to be willing to explore
them and be curious and be compassionate and loving of them
(40:14):
and not exiling them like those fragmented pieces that happened
for me. I had to learn how to show them
compassion and how to love up onthem.
And now I feel like that part ofme, my internal family system
that we talked about those parts, do you really feel like
they belong? And they're quieter now, like
(40:35):
they're not as loud and screaming because I've really
been able to show them compassion.
Yeah, yeah, the somatic piece like we were saying is what's
been missing, especially for preverbal trauma and those triggers
that were like, why am I acting like this?
Why am I doing this? You know, yeah, it just it, it,
(40:58):
it does get stored in the body. And that somatic piece is huge.
And I hope that more adoptees take advantage.
So tell everyone about your website and what you're, what
you're offering and things and we'll have all the links in the
show notes. Yeah, totally.
So my website, my my company actually is called Coming Home
to self. When I name that, it didn't even
(41:22):
dawn on me that that was the I have the book right here, but
that was the book name I forgot.And so I'm just hoping I don't
get in trouble. It was it like came to me as I
was, I was like, that's what I want to call my company because
that's what I feel like I've done anyway.
So the program that I'm in rightnow is called revolution.
And it's something that really Ifeel like we need to start a
(41:44):
revolution where adoption is concerned.
And so that's the reason why I named it that.
It's called revolution, uncovering your birthright.
And what I believe about that isour birthright is within us.
Our identity is there. We just need to go back and find
it and enjoy that little baby self that didn't get the nurture
that they so desperately wanted.We can provide that.
(42:07):
And so we moved through 7 phasesthat I've had to move through
myself that I really feel like once I was able to get it all
out on paper. And it's really interesting
because everything has to do with sevens for me.
And it's not surprising when I, I was in Proctor care for seven
weeks, so that number 7 and I was born September 7th.
(42:27):
So it's just really interesting.And that's my favorite.
It's my favorite number. And so, and it's the number of
completion. So it's beautiful.
But we go through 7 phases and those phases are self-awareness,
self acceptance, self compassion, self responsibility,
self transformation, self love, and self belonging.
And what I've learned is it's really challenging to have self
(42:50):
belonging if we have no awareness.
They all build upon each other and it's hard to have acceptance
if we're not aware either. But it's also hard to have
compassion if we don't accept. You see what I'm saying?
So they build upon each other and there's pieces that we
really delve into four weeks in each one of those themes that
(43:12):
that we delve into for the adoptee.
And it's cool because we have some professionals coming in and
actually speaking from their ownperspectives too, Not just me,
because I don't have all the answers.
I'm, I'm a work in progress justlike all of us.
But I want to pass off the things that have helped me get
to where I am too. Yeah, definitely.
(43:34):
So we'll dive into that. We're going to have Julie on for
another episode and we're going to dive into a little bit more
about what she does in the somatic piece.
So I hope everyone joins us for that.
What an incredible conversation today.
A huge thank you to Julie for sharing her adoption journey
with us, the highs, the challenges, and those powerful
(43:57):
moments of self discovery. You know it takes a lot of
courage to revisit some of thoseparts of our stories and even
more to share them so openly on a podcast.
For those of you listening, I hope today's episode offered you
some insight or validation for whatever stage of the adoption
journey you're in or curious about.
(44:19):
Whether it's navigating identity, finding belonging, or
facing the unexpected emotions that come up, remember that each
story is unique and deserves to be honored.
And don't forget, Julie will be joining us again next week to
dive into our healing journey and talk about how somatic
therapy was a huge game changer for her and her clients.
(44:42):
You won't want to miss it. Thanks for listening today Karma
Crew. Don't forget to take what you
need and leave what you don't. And always remember to mind your
own karma. I'll see you next time.
This podcast is created for educational purposes by the
telling of adoption experiences.The views expressed in this
(45:04):
podcast may not be those of the host or Mind Your Own Karma.
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