March 17, 2025 • 35 mins
In this episode, Charles and Dan break down Chapter 4 of Dating Essentials for Men by Dr. Robert Glover: Discover the Secrets of Abundance that Naturally Attract Women. They explore how adopting an abundance mindset can transform not just dating, but all aspects of life, from relationships to career and personal growth.
Key Takeaways
- Scarcity vs. Abundance Mindset
A scarcity mindset leads to neediness, overanalyzing, and inauthentic behavior, whereas an abundance mindset fosters confidence, self-sufficiency, and genuine connection. - How Abundance Attracts
When you believe there are plenty of opportunities (dating, friendships, career growth), you naturally become more attractive by reducing desperation and fear of rejection. - The Role of Gratitude
Recognizing and appreciating the people and experiences in your life reinforces abundance, making you more resilient and fulfilled. - Empathy, Leadership & Masculinity
A tangent discussion on Elon Musk’s controversial take on empathy, questioning whether a lack of empathy stems from a scarcity-driven survival mentality. The guys explore why empathy is actually a strength and key to meaningful relationships. - Authenticity Over Performance
Acting a certain way to impress others only leads to short-term connections. True confidence comes from embracing your authentic self, improving who you are, and letting go of external validation.
Self-Assessment: Are You Stuck in a Scarcity Mindset?
Ask yourself these questions to gauge whether scarcity thinking is affecting your relationships, career, and personal well-being:
- Am I holding onto toxic relationships because I fear I won't find better ones?
- Do I believe there's a limited number of good partners, friends, or mentors available to me?
- Did I avoid asking for help or support because I felt like I had to do it all myself?
- Am I playing small or avoiding risks because I'm afraid of failing?
- Do I believe that success is a zero-sum game where someone else's win means my loss?
- Did I hesitate to share an idea or speak up today because I thought others might take my opportunity from me?
- Did I view someone else's success with envy rather than inspiration?
- Am I focusing more on what I lack instead of what I already have?
- Do I believe I have control over my circumstances, or do I feel like I'm at the mercy of external forces?
Practical Application:
- Develop a daily gratitude practice to reinforce abundance.
- Reflect on past relationships (romantic or not) to recognize the gifts they provided.
- Notice when you're "performing" for approval rather than being your authentic self.
- Use the self-assessment questions regularly to shift away from scarcity-driven habits.
Next Episode:
Overcoming Anxiety with Women (Chapter 5) – a deep dive into handling social and romantic anxiety with confidence.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Charles (00:00):
I've noticed this in my own life too.
Whenever you're interactingwith, whether it's an
interviewer or a girl you'd liketo go out with, as soon as your
brain starts getting to theplace of if I say this, then
they'll think this.
That's when you know thatyou're operating from a place of
deprivation and scarcity,Because, yeah, you're trying to
craft what you say and do tothis expectation, which may or
(00:23):
may not be correct, but eitherway, it's still you trying to
put it on an act, because, deepdown, you think what I really am
is not good enough.
So I've got to put on thisperformance so they'll think
that I'm good enough, for awhile at least, so that I get
the job, so that I get the date,so that I get the relationship.
Welcome back to the MindfullyMasculine Podcast.
This is Charles.
In this week's episode, Dan andI will continue our discussion
(00:46):
of dating essentials for men byDr Robert Glover.
Topics covered include theabundance mindset versus
scarcity thinking, empathy,stress and leadership,
authenticity in relationshipsand social dynamics, lessons
from past experiences, the roleof therapy, coaching and support
systems, success, fame and thetrade-offs of wealth, critiques
(01:10):
of self-help language and quote,miracle thinking and other
topics.
Please check out our websitemindfullymasculinecom, for any
news worth reporting, as well asaudio episodes and full video
episodes.
Dan (01:24):
Thanks and enjoy morning charles, how you doing I'm well,
dan.
Charles (01:28):
Thank you very much.
This is chapter four, versiontwo.
We recorded this several weeksago and it was to be released.
We're recording this onthursday, march 13th.
We're supposed to release it onmonday, the 10th.
But there was a audio problemthat I could not fix with my
various ai audio processingtools.
Why welcome?
Yeah, after I was trying audioproblem that I could not fix
with my various ai audioprocessing tools.
Why welcome?
Yeah, after I was trying for awhile, I was like I fail, I'm
(01:51):
giving up, we will just.
No, it's my fault for not, uh,doing a test before we started
recording yeah, I like that Ianswer better yeah, I do too.
Yeah, the more things that aremy fault, the means more control
the universe I have.
So everything's my fault, whichputs me in control of
everything that's all workingout for you.
It's great personalrelationships.
Really, really, oh, it's thebest.
Yeah, everything's my fault.
(02:12):
Everything that goes wrong ismy fault.
Everything that goes right isjust good luck and, as a result,
I am I am to blame foreverything bad that happens.
Yeah, this one's aboutabundance.
It's quite a way to live.
Yes, so we are.
The last episode that ourlisteners would have heard from
(02:32):
us would have been chapter three.
I don't remember what it wastitled, but let's see if I have
it open.
Actually, chapter three waseliminate your fear of rejection
forever.
So that's the last episode thatwe successfully edited and
released.
This one is discover thesecrets of abundance that
naturally attract women.
And there was an interestingthing I saw this week that I
(02:54):
posted to my personal instagram,which was a quote, not a.
It was something elon musk saidin the last week about how
empathy is like the worst thingand the fall of civil of Western
civilization the idea thatempathy is a bad thing.
And the person that was postingit responded to it with a quote
(03:17):
from Margaret Mead and that's aname I recognize, but I don't
know what she's famous for.
Margaret Mead was an Americancultural anthropologist, author
and speaker, and what she saidwas the easiest way to tell when
we essentially made the changefrom a bunch of random hominid
(03:38):
hunter-gatherers to acivilization.
When you look back in thearchaeological record, it's the
first time that you encounter amended femur bone, because that
is the time that, as a species,we decided it's worth me giving
up on some of my time, effortand my own survivability to
nurse this other person back tohealth so that we could all move
(04:02):
forward together.
And that really does fly in theface of empathy being a problem
, I would say and I'm on herside empathy.
Empathy is a civilizationbuilder, not a civilization
crutcher.
But the problem is when you'reliving a life where you
essentially feel like your ownpersonal survival is precarious,
(04:24):
where you could be killed atany moment, you could die at any
moment, you could be ostracizedby your tribe at any moment.
Then how could you take time toempathize for what other people
are going through You're tooworried about?
I'm in danger, I have to stayalive, and empathy is a luxury
you can't afford.
So I thought how sad forliterally the richest and
(04:48):
arguably most powerful man onthe planet to say empathy.
Empathy is too dangerous for me.
I can't take time to empathizefor other people.
Dan (04:58):
Yeah, just um that's the thing too, is just, I think
there's shades of empathy rightand you can take it to an
extreme right.
Anything else, I think.
And maybe what does that looklike In his position?
It's going to look differentthan somebody who has no
resources or a lot lessresources.
So maybe his definition ofempathy are maybe some of the
asks he's been asking and maybethat's what triggered, I don't
(05:19):
know.
Charles (05:21):
He's a smart guy and it's possible he doesn't know
what the word empathy means.
But what?
Dan (05:26):
what is the thing it's like for him?
Maybe he's defining empathyabout all the big asks.
He's probably getting all thetime for things.
Charles (05:34):
I don't know what you think.
He's conflating empathy andcharity.
Maybe, yeah, maybe, but whoknows?
But thankfully Elon doesn't runmy life at this point just yet
thankfully, Elon doesn't run mylife at this point, just yet,
but I, yeah, I think I took himat face value, which is to say
to take time to put myself insomebody else's shoes, to
understand what they'reexperiencing.
(05:54):
That's a dangerous thing for usto do.
We shouldn't do that.
Dan (05:56):
It makes no sense as a leader.
He obviously he runs a coupleof companies, right.
How can you be an effectiveleader if you don't understand
the people that you're leading?
Charles (06:07):
And to me, that's a solid question.
Another thing I've heard abouthim recently is that for people
that have experienced workingfor one of his companies, you
hear one of two things eitherthat was the worst experience of
my life I'm never going to doit again, or working for him was
amazing I'm never going to doit again.
There's not a lot of peopleyeah, usually the people that do
(06:28):
have an experience with him.
It's a profound, changingexperience, life-changing
experience for them, but it'susually one that says either it
really affected me in amazinglypositive ways, but I don't want
to do it again, or it affectedme in very negative ways, but I
don't want to do it again.
Dan (06:42):
I'm going to challenge that , because how can you run any
company if you've got turnover?
Most of the people are sayingthat I would think most of the
people there'd be high turnover.
Charles (06:50):
Is there.
Dan (06:51):
I don't know.
I don't know either.
I'm just thinking how can yourun a successful company with so
much chump?
I don't know.
So I'm sure there's people outthere that are like that, and
I'm sure people said that alsowith Steve Jobs and Bill Gates
and a lot of these otherProbably yeah, a lot of people
who are used to getting theirway every single time.
Charles (07:08):
Yeah, but that's the thing.
One of the ways you can offsetthe harm of high turnover is if
you have the companies with thecoolest reputations that
everybody you pay enough and youdraw the companies with the
coolest reputations thateverybody, you pay enough and
you draw the highest talent,then it's yeah Once.
Once somebody gets burnt outand says I'm done with this, you
got 10 other people that wantto be able to add SpaceX or
(07:30):
Tesla or whatever to theirresume.
It just really struck me that Iconsider a lack of empathy very
closely tied to a scarcity ordeprivation mindset.
And it's man.
If the richest guy in the worldcan have a scarcity or
deprivation mindset, then we'reall at risk.
(07:52):
Right, he literally has morestuff than, or the potential to
acquire more stuff than, anybodyelse, but he's still, but he's
a human being.
Yeah, that thing.
I don't know how much metals inhis brain.
Dan (08:04):
It's built into our biology to protect ourselves.
Charles (08:06):
And it's also a question to ask ourselves too.
For people who are driven toachieve at that high level, it's
okay.
What is it that happened to you, that you're we're all either
running away from something orrunning towards something.
Dan (08:18):
And both of those are stressful situations.
Yeah, from something or runningtowards something, and both of
those are stressful situations.
Yeah, I really believe that'swhere we revert back into a
scarcity and a non-empathetictype of mindset is when we're
feeling that high level ofstress and when you are wanting
companies at that level.
Is there any day where you'renot feeling stressed about
something?
I think that's really thetoughest thing is finding that
time and being able to find thatbalance where you are taking
(08:41):
your foot off the gas a littlebit, being able to to relax it.
I'm not saying that it can'thappen, but I think you're
fighting your own biology.
If you are in this fight orflight, absolutely you're in and
now you're asking something.
Okay, uh, you need to stopprotecting yourself and do
something for somebody else andyou almost need to like down all
the the feelings you have aboutyourself and thinking about
(09:02):
yourself and what you need andwhat you want to do in order to,
I think, truly be empatheticand to really be a a good
listener and and be there yes,not.
Charles (09:12):
Not only that, he also does what I guess he considers
to be bragging about the factthat he's never been to therapy
and so where I don't knowanybody who has homegrown the
tools inside their own brain forbeing able to deal with high
stress, whether that's inpersonal relationships or in
(09:33):
their job.
You get those tools from otherhumans.
It's very because if, withoutthose tools, all you're doing is
reverting back to okay, whatkept me alive when I was a kid,
going through trauma or goingthrough not having my needs met,
and in just about every case,those tools that work for you
when you were a scared six yearold are not going to work for
you.
They may keep you alive as anadult, but they're not going to
(09:55):
keep you happy, they're notgoing to keep you fulfilled,
they're not going to keep youfulfilled, they're not going to
keep you content.
And so if you've not gottenthose tools in your adulthood,
then yeah, you're just going torely on your old programming.
And I don't know I can't speakto how happy for fulfilled of a
(10:16):
guy he is.
I can say just from what I'veseen of him and how he relates
to people online and how hetalks about his relationships
and interviews.
If you gave me the optiontomorrow to wake up with his
money and his mindset, manypeople won't believe me.
That'll be an honest way.
I said I would pass.
I would rather stay me with myproblems and my blessings than
taking on his.
Dan (10:36):
Right, look, there are going to be.
It doesn't matter how muchmoney you have, you're going to
have problems.
It's if they're just going tobe different problems and we
don't have money, and so that'sthe question is do you want to
trade your problems for hisproblems?
Charles (10:47):
yeah it's hard for me to think of.
It's hard for me to think ofanybody who I can look at and
say I would rather trade bankaccount balances with them and
trade problems with them, whereI would not want to be, as being
as rich as him sounds prettynice, but being as famous as him
definitely not being stuck inthe daily political
controversies that he's involvedin no, I don't want that many
(11:10):
people to know my face, know myname, know how I behave in all
these different circumstances.
Dan (11:16):
I just love languages.
Charles (11:18):
We have a lot of different languages.
I definitely don't speakAfrikaans or whatever he grew up
learning, but yeah, I don'tknow it.
Just I did feel some pity forhim when I read his quote about
empathy and I was like man,somebody else, with his
circumstances.
It would be very believable tohear them say, okay, I got where
I am.
It would be very believable tohear them say, okay, I got where
(11:40):
I am.
And now my only job is to workon empathy and make the world a
better place by understandingpeople, caring about people,
contributing to people, and itseems like that is the opposite
of feeling like empathy is theenemy no-transcript.
Dan (12:24):
I just don't understand how you can be so successful and
not have or not display empathyright, and maybe it's just in a
way that he's not recognizing.
Charles (12:34):
Let's say that he is an empathetic person, and he's
just scared of owning the factthat he's an empathetic person,
which is a whole other set oflike.
I'm going to say this in apublic forum to a reporter so
that it gets repeated, because Ifeel like the people who like
and respect me this is what theyneed to hear me say.
So I'm going to say it.
(12:55):
That's almost worse.
Dan (12:56):
Right.
That goes back to hold thiswhole.
No more, mr Nice guy, right.
Dating essential for men typeof thing.
It's doing things based on whatyou think other people are
expecting of you or other people, instead of owning it yourself.
Charles (13:11):
Yeah, and owning yourself Glover talks about I
think it might be in chapter 10.
If being a stereotypical niceguy is not the way to get girls,
then the opposite of that isbeing an asshole.
So I'll be an asshole to getgirls.
No, the opposite of it is justbeing emotionally regulated and
strong man who's kind toeveryone and doesn't give to get
(13:35):
and doesn't act nice to getpeople to like you.
And yeah, it's just, I don'tknow.
There's certainly there's acrisis affecting men and it's.
The result is a lot of peopleacting the way they think
they're supposed to act insteadof being who they really are.
Dan (13:51):
It's a scary thing, right?
Because in either case, inwhole black and white you're
just talking about we'll getinto the chapter 10, but it's,
yeah, you're either nice toeveryone, which is a little bit
of an act, because you're notaddressing your own needs, or if
you're an asshole to everybody,that's also an act.
Right, you're still not reallyaddressing who you are.
Right, and both ways is easierputting up this front,
pretending to be something thatyou're not, because you've got
(14:12):
now this barrier between you andthe real world, and so you
don't have to be vulnerable, youdon't have to really open
yourself up, because if somebodypulls you on something now, it
hits because you have no barrierin front of you, you have no
act that you're holding on yeah,when you're getting rejected,
and everybody who puts on an actdoes get rejected, you've got
(14:32):
this internal, probablyunconscious thing that says,
okay, it's all right, becausethey were rejected, the act they
weren't rejecting me.
That's not exactly what I think.
Charles (14:41):
Exactly rejecting me.
That's not exactly what I think.
Exactly that's not exactly theywere reacting.
They were rejecting the versionof me that I decided to pretend
to be.
Dan (14:45):
The irony of it is that you can get rejected a lot less if
you're actually being yourself,I think because people will
recognize that and it willaffect you less too.
Charles (14:53):
Where which is very counterintuitive you think, okay
, yeah, if I'm the real me andpeople reject me, that'll hurt
so bad.
No, if you're the real you andpeople reject you, then you're
like okay, good, I found outthat that person and me we don't
vibe, we're not each other'skind of people, and so I don't
need to obsess over them, Idon't need to be caught up with
the what ifs.
I can just say, okay, I was thereal me.
(15:14):
Where the other?
The opposite is true.
It's if you act or you put onthat front and you act like
somebody you're not, and then itdoesn't work out, and I've had
this experience myself.
It doesn't work out.
Then you're constantly thinkingwhat if I had either?
What if I chose a different act?
Or what if I actually did?
Let them see the real me?
Maybe this relationshipwouldn't have failed.
And then you've got to carrythat regret around with you,
(15:36):
which is also no fun.
But, yeah, if you can just belike, okay, I'm just going to be
me, I'm going to work at makingthat me the best version of
myself that it can be, I'm goingto, I'm going to do the work to
my mind, my body, my spirit,all that stuff to say okay, I
want to be the best version ofCharles that Charles can be.
And then somebody is like okay,I see you, but it's not for me.
(15:58):
You're like okay, if I'm notfor you, then you're not for me
either, and we can move on.
Dan (16:06):
And I think the part that's really important is to know
that's okay, you will be okay,the other person will be okay,
you can handle it.
It's not going to be a problemif that one person you don't get
along with.
I think it's naive to thinkthat going with expectation
which a lot of us do is thateverybody is going to like us
and everybody shouldn't like us.
Charles (16:20):
Yeah, they should for sure.
Dan (16:21):
And that's the thing is again.
To go back to control issueslike we can't control other
people.
We can't control theirupbringing and what they think
and what they're bringing to thetable, as much as we'd like to.
Charles (16:31):
Yeah, it's so bringing this back into the abundance
mindset is it's so important tounderstand that there is a world
full of people maybe not full,but there's a lot of people in
the world, certainly enoughpeople in the world that will be
into who you are.
And if you don't believe thatto be true, then, yeah, you're
(16:51):
always going to be trying to tryand stay one step ahead of
other people's expectations ofwhat do I need to be, what do I
need to do in this situation toget them to like me, how do I
need to act, what performance doI need to put on so that and
that.
Really, I've noticed this in myown life too, when, whenever
you're interacting with it,whether it's an interviewer or a
(17:12):
girl you'd like to go out with,as soon as your brain starts
getting to the place of, if Isay this, then they'll think
this.
That's when you know thatyou're operating from a place of
deprivation and scarcity,because, yeah, you're trying to
craft what you say and do tothis expectation, which may or
may not be correct, but eitherway, it's still you trying to
(17:35):
put it on an act, because, deepdown, you think what I really am
is not good enough, so I've gotto put on this performance.
So they'll think that I'm goodenough, for a while at least, so
that I get the job, so that Iget the date, so that I get the
relationship.
And then you will either yourperformance at some point will
falter and they'll be like, waita second, this isn't who.
This is who you told me youwere.
You're not acting like the guythat you acted like before I
(17:58):
went out with you or before Ihired you for this job, or
whatever, and then it fallsapart, or you'll just get tired
of acting and you'll getresentful of having to be on
stage so often, and then you'lljust have these random blowups
that also will destroy the jobrelationship or the personal
relationship or whatever.
Dan (18:17):
And I think a lot of the reason we do that is because we
put so much weight and stockinto that relationship.
Charles (18:24):
Yeah.
Dan (18:24):
And I think that happens when we don't actually practice
some of the things that he'stalking about here the
appreciation for the people wealready have in our lives and
that we've had in our lives.
A lot of times we take it forgranted or forget about all the
things that the people in ourlives have brought us in terms
of happiness and health andmental health and everything
else, and so he talks about inthe book he talked about in this
(18:46):
chapter, specifically thankingand figuring out what each
person in his life has broughthim, and he started to
appreciate them more and he feltbetter about himself as well.
And I think, if you can developa practice where you are
thinking about not just thethings that you have to
appreciate but the people thatyou have in your life, right,
(19:11):
well, just one gift that each ofthem gave you, whether you are
in touch with them at this pointor not.
those gifts then can make yourealize, hey, there are a lot of
people out there who like mefor me, and I don't need to put
on this act because now I'm lessdependent on this relationship
for my own happiness.
Yeah, the evidence and hopethat you can find somebody else
if this isn't working out.
Charles (19:33):
And the difficult part of that, which is a level that I
have not yet gotten to myself,is the part where you can look
at a relationship you had andmaybe the only thing you got out
of it in the end was resilienceand being able to actually have
that's a great way of thinkingabout it To actually have
legitimate gratitude andappreciation for that.
Okay, all all this personreally taught me was how to
survive when really rough stuffhappens.
(19:55):
That's, I believe people arecapable of it.
I believe I might be capable ofit, but I it's hard for me to
look at those difficultrelationships, or it's hard for
me to look back at it now andsay I'm legitimately grateful
that I went through whatevernegative experience that
relationship subjected me to andsay that I'm thankful for the
(20:15):
person I was able to becomethrough surviving whatever
happened.
I think that's an importantstep, but it's not for the
novice.
Dan (20:23):
Here's the thing is, it's not a black or white and either
or.
For me, when I look at past, ifI had a really heated argument
with a neighbor that I reallydon't like, I really can't get
to the point of where oh, I'mgrateful for that and I would
absolutely do that again I don'tthink I get, I can't get there.
What helps me deal with that isgoing.
That wasn't an enjoyableexperience, but at least I'm
(20:47):
grateful that I got through itand I know in the future how I
would do things a little bitdifferently.
And, yeah, I'm a little bitmore resilient.
But I'm not replacing that ortrying to fool myself into
thinking that was a greatexperience and I'm grateful that
I would choose to have thatagain, to learn that lesson.
Because that's when I start togo oh, this whole grateful, and
(21:07):
that's bad, because then I startto spiral, Whereas I'm like oh,
this whole like appreciation,gratefulness, stuff is, eh, is
there really a lot of legitimacyto this whole thing?
And I start questioning morethan I should.
And so I'm trying to balance,not ignoring my reality and the
feelings I had at the time andnot try to change those in my
(21:27):
current thinking.
But go, okay, I had thatexperience, but what else did I
have in addition to that?
And that's helped me feel thatthis is a believable situation
and then that I'm making thebest of what had happened.
Charles (21:43):
Yeah, it's tough finding a balance there where
it's like how can I?
When you look back on pastexperiences, I think your mind
has a tendency and I guess itcould be what he calls a
paradigm effect where we tend towhitewash past experiences as
either that was 100% good orthat was 100% bad, when really
any experience is rarely 100%anything.
(22:05):
But it does seem when you thinkof that job, that vacation,
that relationship that I've seena lot of.
I posted something yesterday,the day before that COVID-19 was
declared a global pandemic fiveyears ago this week, which in
some ways it's five years ago.
Man, in some ways that feelslike it was decades ago and in
(22:26):
other ways it feels like thatwas like last year.
And, yeah, I and I also get alot of memories that pop up on
my phone because I use the,whether using the Apple app or
the Google pictures app it'llpost and say here's what you
were doing two years ago, threeyears ago, five years ago, 10
years ago, whatever.
And it's yeah that thatpandemic experience was
(22:48):
certainly a very it was a mixedbag.
There were a lot of fun timesand there were a lot of
stressful times and there were alot of ups and downs.
Dan (22:55):
There's a lot of change Exactly.
Charles (22:57):
Yeah, it was a very volatile time and it's
interesting to see yourselftrying to categorize oh, was
that a good time or was it a badtime?
All times are a mix of goodtimes and bad times because,
unless you're in a constantstate of severe depression where
I could say okay, you might beable to look back at a certain
time of your life and it feltlike it was all bad.
(23:18):
But yeah, it's interesting thetricks that our brains try to do
on us to just make thingssimple, to make things easy.
Like, just look back at people,places, times in our life and
try to just put it in a verytidy little box that says this
relationship was good, but thisone was bad.
(23:39):
This job was bad, but this jobwas good.
And I get why we have theimpulse to do that because life
is complex and taking the timeto analyze and understand
everything that we go through totakes a lot of energy.
Dan (23:53):
Yeah, You're fighting biology also, right.
Charles (23:57):
Yeah, cause your body, including your mind, is always
in a.
Okay, but what if I?
What if, five minutes from now,I'm starving to death?
What if the thing I ate lastwas the last thing I ever get to
eat?
I've got to hold on to all thatenergy as long as I possibly
can.
Dan (24:11):
I'm going to streamline everything, and good Matt.
All right done, let's move onto the next.
Charles (24:15):
Yeah, and I don't.
The people that seem fairenough, but, whether it's micro
or macro, the people that seemto be the happiest and the most
fulfilled and the mostsuccessful as they define
success are the people that dothe hard work to ask these
questions and try to figure themout, and usually they're doing
that with help with a coach, agroup, a therapist, whatever.
(24:38):
It seems to me that you have tohave people in your life that
are willing to go through thosehard questions and answers with
you, because otherwise, yeah,we're just going to default to
shortcuts and to the easy stuffyou just got to believe that
it's going to pay off, thatdelayed gratification of putting
the time, effort and askingthose hard questions to figure
things out.
Dan (24:59):
You really need to believe and understand that you will
feel better by doing that,rather than the instant
gratification of going all right, good, bad.
Let's move on, because there isa little bit of instant
gratification with that.
It's just, oh, I don't, youknow, I understand the world, I
understand the world, that senseof completion, it's just, I
don't need to, yeah, and I don'tneed to deal with anything that
might be uncomfortable comingup.
So, avoiding that pain, that'sanother way of just getting that
(25:21):
instant gratification.
Yeah, it's.
It is a weird form of delayedgratification.
Charles (25:26):
Yeah, and some of the hardest, most difficult
experiences of my life have beenthe ones where, especially with
personal relationships, like Ithought I, I thought that I had
this person, I thought I had ourrelationship, I thought I had
the world around me figured out,I thought I knew how everything
worked, and then somethinghappens that blows that
narrative completely out of thewater and you're like okay, what
(25:49):
else am I wrong about?
What else do I know for sureand I am a hundred percent
incorrect about?
And that is I think I take thatharder than most other people
do, or maybe that's just mewanting to think I'm special, I
don't know, but it is one of thethings that will definitely
shake me to the core, becauseI'm a bit of a control freak.
I want to be.
Dan (26:08):
Yeah, well, you're also really smart and a lot of
different areas, and I can seethat being a detriment, because
then you get like thisassumption that yeah, I'm really
good at doing this one, or ifyou're really good at doing this
one thing, or you're reallysmart in this one area, and not
(26:30):
bring that level of expectationof performance, of
acknowledgement, awareness andknowledge to another area that
you really don't have thatexpertise in and it's so hard to
let that go.
I've been there, so, yeah, Ican see why it's very difficult
for a lot of us to be able tohave that open mindset and go,
(26:54):
okay, I don't have this figuredout, but it'll be okay, I will
figure it out.
Charles (27:00):
It's just going to not be on a timeline that I'm used
to at this point, right, yeah, Ithink in my case, not to turn
it all back around me, but let'sdo that anyway.
Yeah, in my personal case, Ihad caregivers that were very
chaotic and, as a result, I hadto at least I felt like I had to
anticipate what theirexpectations were going to be
(27:21):
from me moment to moment inorder to get what I need.
And so I built this pattern ofokay, charles, you get by on
your wits and about figuring outwhat motivates people and what
people are after, so that youcan give it to them and then
they'll meet your needs.
And then and then, when thosetime periods come up in your
life where you're like, okay, Ithought I had this person
(27:44):
figured out, and they went anddid the opposite of what they
were expecting is okay.
Now I'm not only doubting them,I'm doubting my ability to
understand what it was that madethem tick.
And now it's okay.
This essentially this multi-toolthat I kept in my pocket that
always got me through life turnsout this tool is broken, and I
didn't even know it was broken.
And so now what do I do?
And I did one one thing I wantto talk about.
(28:05):
He's got some tips on how todevelop an abundance mindset.
And then I also looked up somequestions what can you ask
yourself on a daily, weeklybasis to see if you're suffering
from a scarcity mindset?
And I want to share thosequestions.
So, first, how to develop anabundant mindset, a daily
gratitude practice.
I'm going to see if maybethere's got to be an app for
(28:28):
that, where the how we feel app,where you then set up friends
with it.
So when you say here's what I'mfeeling, it'll send out a
message to somebody else who hasyour code.
I'm going to see if there'slike a buddied up gratitude act.
So we'll I'll do some researchon that.
If I find one, I'll share itwith everybody.
So here are some of thesequestions that you can ask
yourself to see how thatdeprivation mindset may be
(28:49):
affecting you.
Am I holding onto toxicrelationships because I fear I
won't find better ones?
Do I believe there's a limitednumber of good partners, friends
or mentors available to me?
Did I avoid asking for help orsupport because I felt like I
had to do it all myself?
Am I playing small or avoidingrisks because I'm afraid of
failing?
Do I believe that success is azero-sum game where someone
(29:11):
else's win means my loss?
Did I hesitate to share an ideaor speak up today because I
thought others might take myopportunity from me?
Did I view someone else'ssuccess with envy rather than
inspiration?
Am I focusing more on what Ilack instead of what I already
have?
Do I believe I have controlover my circumstances or do I
feel like I'm at the mercy ofexternal forces?
(29:32):
So I will save these and dropthem in the notes for this, for
this episode, so that we canshare it with others and see if
maybe asking these questions ona daily basis can lead to some
positive change.
I am copying and pasting theminto my notes app right now.
Okay, he gets into theimportance of expecting and
(29:52):
creating miracles, which is oneof the things in this chapter
that annoys me.
Pleasant surprises and miraclesare not the same thing.
I hate the self-help thing thathas happened to the word
miracle, where it's like everygood thing that happens in my
life that I didn't expect tohappen is all of a sudden a
miracle, and, being a formerchurchy boy and somebody who
(30:16):
attended Bible college, it's nomiracle has a pretty specific
definition.
It's when it's when thesupernatural makes a direct
intervention in the physicalworld and someone who was dead
for multiple days comes back tolife, or someone who whose arm
was amputated in war, it growsback and they instantly have
both arms again.
(30:37):
Yeah, um, those things don'thappen.
Even the miracle of childbirthis really something that happens
a billion times a year is amiracle.
Not the way I define it.
Yeah, yeah, and as far as I'mconcerned, miracles do not
happen, so don't sit aroundwaiting for them.
But you can optimize your lifeso that pleasant surprises
(30:57):
happen more often, and that'sthat should feel good enough.
It doesn't have to be a miracle, for oh, that was unexpected.
I had a really niceconversation with a stranger on
the subway today.
Yeah, like that.
You shouldn't have to view itas so rare that it must've
required supernaturalintervention for it to happen.
If anything.
Dan (31:14):
Yeah, you're building up the the tension there before you
actually go out and be in theworld, right?
Charles (31:22):
If the creator of the universe has to personally get
involved for something nice tohappen to you, that is a
scarcity mindset more thananything else.
That is really that flies inthe face of an abundance mindset
.
You can't try to convincepeople that good things happen
every day and there are nicepeople that want to get to know
you and there are beautifulwomen who might find you
(31:43):
attractive and want to get toknow you better.
That's a direct opposition tothe idea that if something good
happens to you it's a miracle,Right?
Dan (32:00):
miracle.
Right to me, it's when you usethat word.
It almost is so unbelievablethat it's almost like doing the
disservice.
It's actually doing theopposite of what he's advocating
for here.
I feel like, oh, if you'regonna go out there expecting
miracles, yeah, guess what, yougo out there and you don't have
a miracle, in a couple of daysyou may not not start, you may
not be coming out anymore,because you're like I didn't
have any miracles today.
I had a couple of pleasantsurprises but didn't have any
(32:20):
miracles.
Yeah, I just okay Again.
This is probably just his wayof attracting attention to the
book and the and making animpact here.
Charles (32:30):
Let's see how old he is Trying to get people to.
I'm Googling how old the guy isTrying to get people to get
excited about his techniqueshere, or not techniques his
philosophies.
Let's see, dr Glover was born in1952.
So in this, yeah, he's a smartguy, he's got a lot of good
(32:51):
ideas.
I don't want to say, justbecause I don't like the way he
says something we should nowthrow the baby out with the
bathwater, right, right, but youknow, that is there.
She Exactly A worse one, I dareI say.
When did Gen X start?
Let's see it better, not be GenX.
What generation?
I know that's what I'm saying.
(33:11):
Is someone born in Boomer?
No, what year was In?
52?
He's got to be.
Yeah, that's definitely Boomer.
Yeah, okay, good, he's a Boomer.
This is like the 60s, though,right, 65 is when Gen X started.
Seems awful.
Okay, I believe 65 to 80 iswhat most people Is it always 25
(33:33):
years?
That's 15 years.
Dan (33:35):
65 to 80 is 15 years oh my God, yeah, seems like 25 to me.
Charles (33:42):
Yeah, what you're?
74?
, 74.
74.
Not 74 years old.
You were born in 1974.
Dan (33:47):
Just to clarify that you don't laugh like a 74-year-old,
do you?
Charles (33:49):
Yeah, you were born in 1974.
I was born in 1977 and I thinksomebody, somebody was saying
that 77 wasn't gen x, but Ithink most, yeah, someone.
According to google, the topresult is somebody born in 77 is
a millennial no that's what itsays.
If millennials were 81, thisone says millennials were 77 to
(34:12):
95.
Dan (34:13):
So I'm like the first year, millennials, notials, not even
to the millennial, the end ofthe century.
Charles (34:18):
It's because they came of age at the millennia, not
they were born at the millennia.
Generation X, according to this, is 65 to 76.
They also there's a term I'veheard before I think I even
joined a Facebook group forXennials X-E-N-I-A-L-S, a micro
generation, also known as theOregon Trail generation, born
between 1977 and 1985,straddling the cusp between Gen
(34:41):
X and millennial.
Why is that the Oregon Trailgeneration?
I believe because we it'speople who are of an age where
they played Oregon Trail,probably on an Apple II computer
when they were a kid.
All right.
Dan (34:54):
I played.
It wasn't an Apple II, it wasan older version of that in the
library.
But I remember Ori on Trail.
That was great.
Charles (35:01):
Yeah, yeah, so according to this I'm a
millennial, which I don't know.
If that's true, I feel like Ilike musically and stuff.
I identify more with Gen X, butbut the women I date are
millennials.
Yeah, so I think we can stopour chapter four at that point
and move on.
Our next episode that ourlisteners will hear will be
chapter five, which is titledovercome anxiety with women, and
(35:26):
that's already in the can,ready to be released.
But the next episode you and Iwill be recording is our final
episode for this book, chapter10 activating women's basic
biological urges Cringe.
I hate some of the titles hepicks for these things Basic
biological urges, among otherissues that I will have with
chapter 10, which we willdiscuss.
(35:47):
Good man, thanks, dan.
Talk to you soon.
Thank you so much for listeningto the entire episode.
We certainly appreciate it.
Again, check out our website,mindfullymasculine.
I've noticed this in my own life too.
Whenever you're interactingwith, whether it's an
interviewer or a girl you'd liketo go out with, as soon as your
brain starts getting to theplace of if I say this, then
they'll think this.
That's when you know thatyou're operating from a place of
deprivation and scarcity,Because, yeah, you're trying to
craft what you say and do tothis expectation, which may or
(00:23):
may not be correct, but eitherway, it's still you trying to
put it on an act, because, deepdown, you think what I really am
is not good enough.
So I've got to put on thisperformance so they'll think
that I'm good enough, for awhile at least, so that I get
the job, so that I get the date,so that I get the relationship.
Welcome back to the MindfullyMasculine Podcast.
This is Charles.
In this week's episode, Dan andI will continue our discussion
(00:46):
of dating essentials for men byDr Robert Glover.
Topics covered include theabundance mindset versus
scarcity thinking, empathy,stress and leadership,
authenticity in relationshipsand social dynamics, lessons
from past experiences, the roleof therapy, coaching and support
systems, success, fame and thetrade-offs of wealth, critiques
(01:10):
of self-help language and quote,miracle thinking and other
topics.
Please check out our websitemindfullymasculinecom, for any
news worth reporting, as well asaudio episodes and full video
episodes.
Dan (01:24):
Thanks and enjoy morning charles, how you doing I'm well,
dan.
Charles (01:28):
Thank you very much.
This is chapter four, versiontwo.
We recorded this several weeksago and it was to be released.
We're recording this onthursday, march 13th.
We're supposed to release it onmonday, the 10th.
But there was a audio problemthat I could not fix with my
various ai audio processingtools.
Why welcome?
Yeah, after I was trying audioproblem that I could not fix
with my various ai audioprocessing tools.
Why welcome?
Yeah, after I was trying for awhile, I was like I fail, I'm
(01:51):
giving up, we will just.
No, it's my fault for not, uh,doing a test before we started
recording yeah, I like that Ianswer better yeah, I do too.
Yeah, the more things that aremy fault, the means more control
the universe I have.
So everything's my fault, whichputs me in control of
everything that's all workingout for you.
It's great personalrelationships.
Really, really, oh, it's thebest.
Yeah, everything's my fault.
(02:12):
Everything that goes wrong ismy fault.
Everything that goes right isjust good luck and, as a result,
I am I am to blame foreverything bad that happens.
Yeah, this one's aboutabundance.
It's quite a way to live.
Yes, so we are.
The last episode that ourlisteners would have heard from
(02:32):
us would have been chapter three.
I don't remember what it wastitled, but let's see if I have
it open.
Actually, chapter three waseliminate your fear of rejection
forever.
So that's the last episode thatwe successfully edited and
released.
This one is discover thesecrets of abundance that
naturally attract women.
And there was an interestingthing I saw this week that I
(02:54):
posted to my personal instagram,which was a quote, not a.
It was something elon musk saidin the last week about how
empathy is like the worst thingand the fall of civil of Western
civilization the idea thatempathy is a bad thing.
And the person that was postingit responded to it with a quote
(03:17):
from Margaret Mead and that's aname I recognize, but I don't
know what she's famous for.
Margaret Mead was an Americancultural anthropologist, author
and speaker, and what she saidwas the easiest way to tell when
we essentially made the changefrom a bunch of random hominid
(03:38):
hunter-gatherers to acivilization.
When you look back in thearchaeological record, it's the
first time that you encounter amended femur bone, because that
is the time that, as a species,we decided it's worth me giving
up on some of my time, effortand my own survivability to
nurse this other person back tohealth so that we could all move
(04:02):
forward together.
And that really does fly in theface of empathy being a problem
, I would say and I'm on herside empathy.
Empathy is a civilizationbuilder, not a civilization
crutcher.
But the problem is when you'reliving a life where you
essentially feel like your ownpersonal survival is precarious,
(04:24):
where you could be killed atany moment, you could die at any
moment, you could be ostracizedby your tribe at any moment.
Then how could you take time toempathize for what other people
are going through You're tooworried about?
I'm in danger, I have to stayalive, and empathy is a luxury
you can't afford.
So I thought how sad forliterally the richest and
(04:48):
arguably most powerful man onthe planet to say empathy.
Empathy is too dangerous for me.
I can't take time to empathizefor other people.
Dan (04:58):
Yeah, just um that's the thing too, is just, I think
there's shades of empathy rightand you can take it to an
extreme right.
Anything else, I think.
And maybe what does that looklike In his position?
It's going to look differentthan somebody who has no
resources or a lot lessresources.
So maybe his definition ofempathy are maybe some of the
asks he's been asking and maybethat's what triggered, I don't
(05:19):
know.
Charles (05:21):
He's a smart guy and it's possible he doesn't know
what the word empathy means.
But what?
Dan (05:26):
what is the thing it's like for him?
Maybe he's defining empathyabout all the big asks.
He's probably getting all thetime for things.
Charles (05:34):
I don't know what you think.
He's conflating empathy andcharity.
Maybe, yeah, maybe, but whoknows?
But thankfully Elon doesn't runmy life at this point just yet
thankfully, Elon doesn't run mylife at this point, just yet,
but I, yeah, I think I took himat face value, which is to say
to take time to put myself insomebody else's shoes, to
understand what they'reexperiencing.
(05:54):
That's a dangerous thing for usto do.
We shouldn't do that.
Dan (05:56):
It makes no sense as a leader.
He obviously he runs a coupleof companies, right.
How can you be an effectiveleader if you don't understand
the people that you're leading?
Charles (06:07):
And to me, that's a solid question.
Another thing I've heard abouthim recently is that for people
that have experienced workingfor one of his companies, you
hear one of two things eitherthat was the worst experience of
my life I'm never going to doit again, or working for him was
amazing I'm never going to doit again.
There's not a lot of peopleyeah, usually the people that do
(06:28):
have an experience with him.
It's a profound, changingexperience, life-changing
experience for them, but it'susually one that says either it
really affected me in amazinglypositive ways, but I don't want
to do it again, or it affectedme in very negative ways, but I
don't want to do it again.
Dan (06:42):
I'm going to challenge that , because how can you run any
company if you've got turnover?
Most of the people are sayingthat I would think most of the
people there'd be high turnover.
Charles (06:50):
Is there.
Dan (06:51):
I don't know.
I don't know either.
I'm just thinking how can yourun a successful company with so
much chump?
I don't know.
So I'm sure there's people outthere that are like that, and
I'm sure people said that alsowith Steve Jobs and Bill Gates
and a lot of these otherProbably yeah, a lot of people
who are used to getting theirway every single time.
Charles (07:08):
Yeah, but that's the thing.
One of the ways you can offsetthe harm of high turnover is if
you have the companies with thecoolest reputations that
everybody you pay enough and youdraw the companies with the
coolest reputations thateverybody, you pay enough and
you draw the highest talent,then it's yeah Once.
Once somebody gets burnt outand says I'm done with this, you
got 10 other people that wantto be able to add SpaceX or
(07:30):
Tesla or whatever to theirresume.
It just really struck me that Iconsider a lack of empathy very
closely tied to a scarcity ordeprivation mindset.
And it's man.
If the richest guy in the worldcan have a scarcity or
deprivation mindset, then we'reall at risk.
(07:52):
Right, he literally has morestuff than, or the potential to
acquire more stuff than, anybodyelse, but he's still, but he's
a human being.
Yeah, that thing.
I don't know how much metals inhis brain.
Dan (08:04):
It's built into our biology to protect ourselves.
Charles (08:06):
And it's also a question to ask ourselves too.
For people who are driven toachieve at that high level, it's
okay.
What is it that happened to you, that you're we're all either
running away from something orrunning towards something.
Dan (08:18):
And both of those are stressful situations.
Yeah, from something or runningtowards something, and both of
those are stressful situations.
Yeah, I really believe that'swhere we revert back into a
scarcity and a non-empathetictype of mindset is when we're
feeling that high level ofstress and when you are wanting
companies at that level.
Is there any day where you'renot feeling stressed about
something?
I think that's really thetoughest thing is finding that
time and being able to find thatbalance where you are taking
(08:41):
your foot off the gas a littlebit, being able to to relax it.
I'm not saying that it can'thappen, but I think you're
fighting your own biology.
If you are in this fight orflight, absolutely you're in and
now you're asking something.
Okay, uh, you need to stopprotecting yourself and do
something for somebody else andyou almost need to like down all
the the feelings you have aboutyourself and thinking about
(09:02):
yourself and what you need andwhat you want to do in order to,
I think, truly be empatheticand to really be a a good
listener and and be there yes,not.
Charles (09:12):
Not only that, he also does what I guess he considers
to be bragging about the factthat he's never been to therapy
and so where I don't knowanybody who has homegrown the
tools inside their own brain forbeing able to deal with high
stress, whether that's inpersonal relationships or in
(09:33):
their job.
You get those tools from otherhumans.
It's very because if, withoutthose tools, all you're doing is
reverting back to okay, whatkept me alive when I was a kid,
going through trauma or goingthrough not having my needs met,
and in just about every case,those tools that work for you
when you were a scared six yearold are not going to work for
you.
They may keep you alive as anadult, but they're not going to
(09:55):
keep you happy, they're notgoing to keep you fulfilled,
they're not going to keep youfulfilled, they're not going to
keep you content.
And so if you've not gottenthose tools in your adulthood,
then yeah, you're just going torely on your old programming.
And I don't know I can't speakto how happy for fulfilled of a
(10:16):
guy he is.
I can say just from what I'veseen of him and how he relates
to people online and how hetalks about his relationships
and interviews.
If you gave me the optiontomorrow to wake up with his
money and his mindset, manypeople won't believe me.
That'll be an honest way.
I said I would pass.
I would rather stay me with myproblems and my blessings than
taking on his.
Dan (10:36):
Right, look, there are going to be.
It doesn't matter how muchmoney you have, you're going to
have problems.
It's if they're just going tobe different problems and we
don't have money, and so that'sthe question is do you want to
trade your problems for hisproblems?
Charles (10:47):
yeah it's hard for me to think of.
It's hard for me to think ofanybody who I can look at and
say I would rather trade bankaccount balances with them and
trade problems with them, whereI would not want to be, as being
as rich as him sounds prettynice, but being as famous as him
definitely not being stuck inthe daily political
controversies that he's involvedin no, I don't want that many
(11:10):
people to know my face, know myname, know how I behave in all
these different circumstances.
Dan (11:16):
I just love languages.
Charles (11:18):
We have a lot of different languages.
I definitely don't speakAfrikaans or whatever he grew up
learning, but yeah, I don'tknow it.
Just I did feel some pity forhim when I read his quote about
empathy and I was like man,somebody else, with his
circumstances.
It would be very believable tohear them say, okay, I got where
I am.
It would be very believable tohear them say, okay, I got where
(11:40):
I am.
And now my only job is to workon empathy and make the world a
better place by understandingpeople, caring about people,
contributing to people, and itseems like that is the opposite
of feeling like empathy is theenemy no-transcript.
Dan (12:24):
I just don't understand how you can be so successful and
not have or not display empathyright, and maybe it's just in a
way that he's not recognizing.
Charles (12:34):
Let's say that he is an empathetic person, and he's
just scared of owning the factthat he's an empathetic person,
which is a whole other set oflike.
I'm going to say this in apublic forum to a reporter so
that it gets repeated, because Ifeel like the people who like
and respect me this is what theyneed to hear me say.
So I'm going to say it.
(12:55):
That's almost worse.
Dan (12:56):
Right.
That goes back to hold thiswhole.
No more, mr Nice guy, right.
Dating essential for men typeof thing.
It's doing things based on whatyou think other people are
expecting of you or other people, instead of owning it yourself.
Charles (13:11):
Yeah, and owning yourself Glover talks about I
think it might be in chapter 10.
If being a stereotypical niceguy is not the way to get girls,
then the opposite of that isbeing an asshole.
So I'll be an asshole to getgirls.
No, the opposite of it is justbeing emotionally regulated and
strong man who's kind toeveryone and doesn't give to get
(13:35):
and doesn't act nice to getpeople to like you.
And yeah, it's just, I don'tknow.
There's certainly there's acrisis affecting men and it's.
The result is a lot of peopleacting the way they think
they're supposed to act insteadof being who they really are.
Dan (13:51):
It's a scary thing, right?
Because in either case, inwhole black and white you're
just talking about we'll getinto the chapter 10, but it's,
yeah, you're either nice toeveryone, which is a little bit
of an act, because you're notaddressing your own needs, or if
you're an asshole to everybody,that's also an act.
Right, you're still not reallyaddressing who you are.
Right, and both ways is easierputting up this front,
pretending to be something thatyou're not, because you've got
(14:12):
now this barrier between you andthe real world, and so you
don't have to be vulnerable, youdon't have to really open
yourself up, because if somebodypulls you on something now, it
hits because you have no barrierin front of you, you have no
act that you're holding on yeah,when you're getting rejected,
and everybody who puts on an actdoes get rejected, you've got
(14:32):
this internal, probablyunconscious thing that says,
okay, it's all right, becausethey were rejected, the act they
weren't rejecting me.
That's not exactly what I think.
Charles (14:41):
Exactly rejecting me.
That's not exactly what I think.
Exactly that's not exactly theywere reacting.
They were rejecting the versionof me that I decided to pretend
to be.
Dan (14:45):
The irony of it is that you can get rejected a lot less if
you're actually being yourself,I think because people will
recognize that and it willaffect you less too.
Charles (14:53):
Where which is very counterintuitive you think, okay
, yeah, if I'm the real me andpeople reject me, that'll hurt
so bad.
No, if you're the real you andpeople reject you, then you're
like okay, good, I found outthat that person and me we don't
vibe, we're not each other'skind of people, and so I don't
need to obsess over them, Idon't need to be caught up with
the what ifs.
I can just say, okay, I was thereal me.
(15:14):
Where the other?
The opposite is true.
It's if you act or you put onthat front and you act like
somebody you're not, and then itdoesn't work out, and I've had
this experience myself.
It doesn't work out.
Then you're constantly thinkingwhat if I had either?
What if I chose a different act?
Or what if I actually did?
Let them see the real me?
Maybe this relationshipwouldn't have failed.
And then you've got to carrythat regret around with you,
(15:36):
which is also no fun.
But, yeah, if you can just belike, okay, I'm just going to be
me, I'm going to work at makingthat me the best version of
myself that it can be, I'm goingto, I'm going to do the work to
my mind, my body, my spirit,all that stuff to say okay, I
want to be the best version ofCharles that Charles can be.
And then somebody is like okay,I see you, but it's not for me.
(15:58):
You're like okay, if I'm notfor you, then you're not for me
either, and we can move on.
Dan (16:06):
And I think the part that's really important is to know
that's okay, you will be okay,the other person will be okay,
you can handle it.
It's not going to be a problemif that one person you don't get
along with.
I think it's naive to thinkthat going with expectation
which a lot of us do is thateverybody is going to like us
and everybody shouldn't like us.
Charles (16:20):
Yeah, they should for sure.
Dan (16:21):
And that's the thing is again.
To go back to control issueslike we can't control other
people.
We can't control theirupbringing and what they think
and what they're bringing to thetable, as much as we'd like to.
Charles (16:31):
Yeah, it's so bringing this back into the abundance
mindset is it's so important tounderstand that there is a world
full of people maybe not full,but there's a lot of people in
the world, certainly enoughpeople in the world that will be
into who you are.
And if you don't believe thatto be true, then, yeah, you're
(16:51):
always going to be trying to tryand stay one step ahead of
other people's expectations ofwhat do I need to be, what do I
need to do in this situation toget them to like me, how do I
need to act, what performance doI need to put on so that and
that.
Really, I've noticed this in myown life too, when, whenever
you're interacting with it,whether it's an interviewer or a
(17:12):
girl you'd like to go out with,as soon as your brain starts
getting to the place of, if Isay this, then they'll think
this.
That's when you know thatyou're operating from a place of
deprivation and scarcity,because, yeah, you're trying to
craft what you say and do tothis expectation, which may or
may not be correct, but eitherway, it's still you trying to
(17:35):
put it on an act, because, deepdown, you think what I really am
is not good enough, so I've gotto put on this performance.
So they'll think that I'm goodenough, for a while at least, so
that I get the job, so that Iget the date, so that I get the
relationship.
And then you will either yourperformance at some point will
falter and they'll be like, waita second, this isn't who.
This is who you told me youwere.
You're not acting like the guythat you acted like before I
(17:58):
went out with you or before Ihired you for this job, or
whatever, and then it fallsapart, or you'll just get tired
of acting and you'll getresentful of having to be on
stage so often, and then you'lljust have these random blowups
that also will destroy the jobrelationship or the personal
relationship or whatever.
Dan (18:17):
And I think a lot of the reason we do that is because we
put so much weight and stockinto that relationship.
Charles (18:24):
Yeah.
Dan (18:24):
And I think that happens when we don't actually practice
some of the things that he'stalking about here the
appreciation for the people wealready have in our lives and
that we've had in our lives.
A lot of times we take it forgranted or forget about all the
things that the people in ourlives have brought us in terms
of happiness and health andmental health and everything
else, and so he talks about inthe book he talked about in this
(18:46):
chapter, specifically thankingand figuring out what each
person in his life has broughthim, and he started to
appreciate them more and he feltbetter about himself as well.
And I think, if you can developa practice where you are
thinking about not just thethings that you have to
appreciate but the people thatyou have in your life, right,
(19:11):
well, just one gift that each ofthem gave you, whether you are
in touch with them at this pointor not.
those gifts then can make yourealize, hey, there are a lot of
people out there who like mefor me, and I don't need to put
on this act because now I'm lessdependent on this relationship
for my own happiness.
Yeah, the evidence and hopethat you can find somebody else
if this isn't working out.
Charles (19:33):
And the difficult part of that, which is a level that I
have not yet gotten to myself,is the part where you can look
at a relationship you had andmaybe the only thing you got out
of it in the end was resilienceand being able to actually have
that's a great way of thinkingabout it To actually have
legitimate gratitude andappreciation for that.
Okay, all all this personreally taught me was how to
survive when really rough stuffhappens.
(19:55):
That's, I believe people arecapable of it.
I believe I might be capable ofit, but I it's hard for me to
look at those difficultrelationships, or it's hard for
me to look back at it now andsay I'm legitimately grateful
that I went through whatevernegative experience that
relationship subjected me to andsay that I'm thankful for the
(20:15):
person I was able to becomethrough surviving whatever
happened.
I think that's an importantstep, but it's not for the
novice.
Dan (20:23):
Here's the thing is, it's not a black or white and either
or.
For me, when I look at past, ifI had a really heated argument
with a neighbor that I reallydon't like, I really can't get
to the point of where oh, I'mgrateful for that and I would
absolutely do that again I don'tthink I get, I can't get there.
What helps me deal with that isgoing.
That wasn't an enjoyableexperience, but at least I'm
(20:47):
grateful that I got through itand I know in the future how I
would do things a little bitdifferently.
And, yeah, I'm a little bitmore resilient.
But I'm not replacing that ortrying to fool myself into
thinking that was a greatexperience and I'm grateful that
I would choose to have thatagain, to learn that lesson.
Because that's when I start togo oh, this whole grateful, and
(21:07):
that's bad, because then I startto spiral, Whereas I'm like oh,
this whole like appreciation,gratefulness, stuff is, eh, is
there really a lot of legitimacyto this whole thing?
And I start questioning morethan I should.
And so I'm trying to balance,not ignoring my reality and the
feelings I had at the time andnot try to change those in my
(21:27):
current thinking.
But go, okay, I had thatexperience, but what else did I
have in addition to that?
And that's helped me feel thatthis is a believable situation
and then that I'm making thebest of what had happened.
Charles (21:43):
Yeah, it's tough finding a balance there where
it's like how can I?
When you look back on pastexperiences, I think your mind
has a tendency and I guess itcould be what he calls a
paradigm effect where we tend towhitewash past experiences as
either that was 100% good orthat was 100% bad, when really
any experience is rarely 100%anything.
(22:05):
But it does seem when you thinkof that job, that vacation,
that relationship that I've seena lot of.
I posted something yesterday,the day before that COVID-19 was
declared a global pandemic fiveyears ago this week, which in
some ways it's five years ago.
Man, in some ways that feelslike it was decades ago and in
(22:26):
other ways it feels like thatwas like last year.
And, yeah, I and I also get alot of memories that pop up on
my phone because I use the,whether using the Apple app or
the Google pictures app it'llpost and say here's what you
were doing two years ago, threeyears ago, five years ago, 10
years ago, whatever.
And it's yeah that thatpandemic experience was
(22:48):
certainly a very it was a mixedbag.
There were a lot of fun timesand there were a lot of
stressful times and there were alot of ups and downs.
Dan (22:55):
There's a lot of change Exactly.
Charles (22:57):
Yeah, it was a very volatile time and it's
interesting to see yourselftrying to categorize oh, was
that a good time or was it a badtime?
All times are a mix of goodtimes and bad times because,
unless you're in a constantstate of severe depression where
I could say okay, you might beable to look back at a certain
time of your life and it feltlike it was all bad.
(23:18):
But yeah, it's interesting thetricks that our brains try to do
on us to just make thingssimple, to make things easy.
Like, just look back at people,places, times in our life and
try to just put it in a verytidy little box that says this
relationship was good, but thisone was bad.
(23:39):
This job was bad, but this jobwas good.
And I get why we have theimpulse to do that because life
is complex and taking the timeto analyze and understand
everything that we go through totakes a lot of energy.
Dan (23:53):
Yeah, You're fighting biology also, right.
Charles (23:57):
Yeah, cause your body, including your mind, is always
in a.
Okay, but what if I?
What if, five minutes from now,I'm starving to death?
What if the thing I ate lastwas the last thing I ever get to
eat?
I've got to hold on to all thatenergy as long as I possibly
can.
Dan (24:11):
I'm going to streamline everything, and good Matt.
All right done, let's move onto the next.
Charles (24:15):
Yeah, and I don't.
The people that seem fairenough, but, whether it's micro
or macro, the people that seemto be the happiest and the most
fulfilled and the mostsuccessful as they define
success are the people that dothe hard work to ask these
questions and try to figure themout, and usually they're doing
that with help with a coach, agroup, a therapist, whatever.
(24:38):
It seems to me that you have tohave people in your life that
are willing to go through thosehard questions and answers with
you, because otherwise, yeah,we're just going to default to
shortcuts and to the easy stuffyou just got to believe that
it's going to pay off, thatdelayed gratification of putting
the time, effort and askingthose hard questions to figure
things out.
Dan (24:59):
You really need to believe and understand that you will
feel better by doing that,rather than the instant
gratification of going all right, good, bad.
Let's move on, because there isa little bit of instant
gratification with that.
It's just, oh, I don't, youknow, I understand the world, I
understand the world, that senseof completion, it's just, I
don't need to, yeah, and I don'tneed to deal with anything that
might be uncomfortable comingup.
So, avoiding that pain, that'sanother way of just getting that
(25:21):
instant gratification.
Yeah, it's.
It is a weird form of delayedgratification.
Charles (25:26):
Yeah, and some of the hardest, most difficult
experiences of my life have beenthe ones where, especially with
personal relationships, like Ithought I, I thought that I had
this person, I thought I had ourrelationship, I thought I had
the world around me figured out,I thought I knew how everything
worked, and then somethinghappens that blows that
narrative completely out of thewater and you're like okay, what
(25:49):
else am I wrong about?
What else do I know for sureand I am a hundred percent
incorrect about?
And that is I think I take thatharder than most other people
do, or maybe that's just mewanting to think I'm special, I
don't know, but it is one of thethings that will definitely
shake me to the core, becauseI'm a bit of a control freak.
I want to be.
Dan (26:08):
Yeah, well, you're also really smart and a lot of
different areas, and I can seethat being a detriment, because
then you get like thisassumption that yeah, I'm really
good at doing this one, or ifyou're really good at doing this
one thing, or you're reallysmart in this one area, and not
(26:30):
bring that level of expectationof performance, of
acknowledgement, awareness andknowledge to another area that
you really don't have thatexpertise in and it's so hard to
let that go.
I've been there, so, yeah, Ican see why it's very difficult
for a lot of us to be able tohave that open mindset and go,
(26:54):
okay, I don't have this figuredout, but it'll be okay, I will
figure it out.
Charles (27:00):
It's just going to not be on a timeline that I'm used
to at this point, right, yeah, Ithink in my case, not to turn
it all back around me, but let'sdo that anyway.
Yeah, in my personal case, Ihad caregivers that were very
chaotic and, as a result, I hadto at least I felt like I had to
anticipate what theirexpectations were going to be
(27:21):
from me moment to moment inorder to get what I need.
And so I built this pattern ofokay, charles, you get by on
your wits and about figuring outwhat motivates people and what
people are after, so that youcan give it to them and then
they'll meet your needs.
And then and then, when thosetime periods come up in your
life where you're like, okay, Ithought I had this person
(27:44):
figured out, and they went anddid the opposite of what they
were expecting is okay.
Now I'm not only doubting them,I'm doubting my ability to
understand what it was that madethem tick.
And now it's okay.
This essentially this multi-toolthat I kept in my pocket that
always got me through life turnsout this tool is broken, and I
didn't even know it was broken.
And so now what do I do?
And I did one one thing I wantto talk about.
(28:05):
He's got some tips on how todevelop an abundance mindset.
And then I also looked up somequestions what can you ask
yourself on a daily, weeklybasis to see if you're suffering
from a scarcity mindset?
And I want to share thosequestions.
So, first, how to develop anabundant mindset, a daily
gratitude practice.
I'm going to see if maybethere's got to be an app for
(28:28):
that, where the how we feel app,where you then set up friends
with it.
So when you say here's what I'mfeeling, it'll send out a
message to somebody else who hasyour code.
I'm going to see if there'slike a buddied up gratitude act.
So we'll I'll do some researchon that.
If I find one, I'll share itwith everybody.
So here are some of thesequestions that you can ask
yourself to see how thatdeprivation mindset may be
(28:49):
affecting you.
Am I holding onto toxicrelationships because I fear I
won't find better ones?
Do I believe there's a limitednumber of good partners, friends
or mentors available to me?
Did I avoid asking for help orsupport because I felt like I
had to do it all myself?
Am I playing small or avoidingrisks because I'm afraid of
failing?
Do I believe that success is azero-sum game where someone
(29:11):
else's win means my loss?
Did I hesitate to share an ideaor speak up today because I
thought others might take myopportunity from me?
Did I view someone else'ssuccess with envy rather than
inspiration?
Am I focusing more on what Ilack instead of what I already
have?
Do I believe I have controlover my circumstances or do I
feel like I'm at the mercy ofexternal forces?
(29:32):
So I will save these and dropthem in the notes for this, for
this episode, so that we canshare it with others and see if
maybe asking these questions ona daily basis can lead to some
positive change.
I am copying and pasting theminto my notes app right now.
Okay, he gets into theimportance of expecting and
(29:52):
creating miracles, which is oneof the things in this chapter
that annoys me.
Pleasant surprises and miraclesare not the same thing.
I hate the self-help thing thathas happened to the word
miracle, where it's like everygood thing that happens in my
life that I didn't expect tohappen is all of a sudden a
miracle, and, being a formerchurchy boy and somebody who
(30:16):
attended Bible college, it's nomiracle has a pretty specific
definition.
It's when it's when thesupernatural makes a direct
intervention in the physicalworld and someone who was dead
for multiple days comes back tolife, or someone who whose arm
was amputated in war, it growsback and they instantly have
both arms again.
(30:37):
Yeah, um, those things don'thappen.
Even the miracle of childbirthis really something that happens
a billion times a year is amiracle.
Not the way I define it.
Yeah, yeah, and as far as I'mconcerned, miracles do not
happen, so don't sit aroundwaiting for them.
But you can optimize your lifeso that pleasant surprises
(30:57):
happen more often, and that'sthat should feel good enough.
It doesn't have to be a miracle, for oh, that was unexpected.
I had a really niceconversation with a stranger on
the subway today.
Yeah, like that.
You shouldn't have to view itas so rare that it must've
required supernaturalintervention for it to happen.
If anything.
Dan (31:14):
Yeah, you're building up the the tension there before you
actually go out and be in theworld, right?
Charles (31:22):
If the creator of the universe has to personally get
involved for something nice tohappen to you, that is a
scarcity mindset more thananything else.
That is really that flies inthe face of an abundance mindset
.
You can't try to convincepeople that good things happen
every day and there are nicepeople that want to get to know
you and there are beautifulwomen who might find you
(31:43):
attractive and want to get toknow you better.
That's a direct opposition tothe idea that if something good
happens to you it's a miracle,Right?
Dan (32:00):
miracle.
Right to me, it's when you usethat word.
It almost is so unbelievablethat it's almost like doing the
disservice.
It's actually doing theopposite of what he's advocating
for here.
I feel like, oh, if you'regonna go out there expecting
miracles, yeah, guess what, yougo out there and you don't have
a miracle, in a couple of daysyou may not not start, you may
not be coming out anymore,because you're like I didn't
have any miracles today.
I had a couple of pleasantsurprises but didn't have any
(32:20):
miracles.
Yeah, I just okay Again.
This is probably just his wayof attracting attention to the
book and the and making animpact here.
Charles (32:30):
Let's see how old he is Trying to get people to.
I'm Googling how old the guy isTrying to get people to get
excited about his techniqueshere, or not techniques his
philosophies.
Let's see, dr Glover was born in1952.
So in this, yeah, he's a smartguy, he's got a lot of good
(32:51):
ideas.
I don't want to say, justbecause I don't like the way he
says something we should nowthrow the baby out with the
bathwater, right, right, but youknow, that is there.
She Exactly A worse one, I dareI say.
When did Gen X start?
Let's see it better, not be GenX.
What generation?
I know that's what I'm saying.
(33:11):
Is someone born in Boomer?
No, what year was In?
52?
He's got to be.
Yeah, that's definitely Boomer.
Yeah, okay, good, he's a Boomer.
This is like the 60s, though,right, 65 is when Gen X started.
Seems awful.
Okay, I believe 65 to 80 iswhat most people Is it always 25
(33:33):
years?
That's 15 years.
Dan (33:35):
65 to 80 is 15 years oh my God, yeah, seems like 25 to me.
Charles (33:42):
Yeah, what you're?
74?
, 74.
74.
Not 74 years old.
You were born in 1974.
Dan (33:47):
Just to clarify that you don't laugh like a 74-year-old,
do you?
Charles (33:49):
Yeah, you were born in 1974.
I was born in 1977 and I thinksomebody, somebody was saying
that 77 wasn't gen x, but Ithink most, yeah, someone.
According to google, the topresult is somebody born in 77 is
a millennial no that's what itsays.
If millennials were 81, thisone says millennials were 77 to
(34:12):
95.
Dan (34:13):
So I'm like the first year, millennials, notials, not even
to the millennial, the end ofthe century.
Charles (34:18):
It's because they came of age at the millennia, not
they were born at the millennia.
Generation X, according to this, is 65 to 76.
They also there's a term I'veheard before I think I even
joined a Facebook group forXennials X-E-N-I-A-L-S, a micro
generation, also known as theOregon Trail generation, born
between 1977 and 1985,straddling the cusp between Gen
(34:41):
X and millennial.
Why is that the Oregon Trailgeneration?
I believe because we it'speople who are of an age where
they played Oregon Trail,probably on an Apple II computer
when they were a kid.
All right.
Dan (34:54):
I played.
It wasn't an Apple II, it wasan older version of that in the
library.
But I remember Ori on Trail.
That was great.
Charles (35:01):
Yeah, yeah, so according to this I'm a
millennial, which I don't know.
If that's true, I feel like Ilike musically and stuff.
I identify more with Gen X, butbut the women I date are
millennials.
Yeah, so I think we can stopour chapter four at that point
and move on.
Our next episode that ourlisteners will hear will be
chapter five, which is titledovercome anxiety with women, and
(35:26):
that's already in the can,ready to be released.
But the next episode you and Iwill be recording is our final
episode for this book, chapter10 activating women's basic
biological urges Cringe.
I hate some of the titles hepicks for these things Basic
biological urges, among otherissues that I will have with
chapter 10, which we willdiscuss.
(35:47):
Good man, thanks, dan.
Talk to you soon.
Thank you so much for listeningto the entire episode.
We certainly appreciate it.
Again, check out our website,mindfullymasculine.
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