Cancer & Cannabis Awareness - Part 2

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Episode Transcript

(00:01):
From the WA and M Studio onthe campus of Florida A and M University.
This is Mary Forum Radio, aweekly conversation on the education and research
of the medical marijuana being conducted atBAMMUTI. Hi. I'm Heidi Outway,
your host for this conversations on Cannabisvirtual form, brought to you by the
Medical Marijuana Education and Research Initiative atFlorida and University. In this conversation,

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we're talking about the increase in peopleturning to medical cannabis as a treatment for
cancer. So let's talk and learnabout this subject with our guests. Doctor
Johnny Bernard is a Board certified radioradiation oncologists specializing in treating cancer with radiation.
Doctor Bernard has published numerous articles researcharticles on cancer and he's a qualified

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physician under Florida law who now integratesmedical cannabis for his patients. Doctor Bernard,
Welcome to the Forum. Thank you. Doctor Mandief Singh Diva is a
professor of pharmaceutical sciences at Florida andM University. He is a recognized leader
on drug delivery and has published nearlytwo hundred articles and given nearly three hundred

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presentations worldwide. In his role asa Section leader of Pharmaceutics at FAM you
he is now leading research on cannabisand cancer. Doctor Mande, Welcome to
the forum. Oh, thank youso much. IM glad to have you.
And our other guest is Sephanie Siiel, a cancer survivor who will be

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sharing her remarkable story about using cannabisas a treatment. She now holds a
Master of Science degree in medical cannabisand she's working to pioneer medical cannabis therapies
for young adult cancer patients. Stephanie, Welcome to the forum. Thank you
to everyone joining us on this liveprogram. Please share post and tag a

(01:53):
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we want you to send us yourquestions in the comment box and we'll
do our best to have our gueststo answer them. We also want you
to tell us what you think aboutthis form by completing the survey that will

(02:14):
be posted in the comments on YouTubeand Facebook. After the live program,
your name will be entered into adrawing on November ninth, twenty twenty three
to win a one hundred dollars giftcard provided by one of Mary's partners.
Now, let's start this conversation oncannabis. So, doctor Bernard, you
know, we kind of talked aboutthe research, we talked about you know,

(02:34):
Stephanie's personal story, you know,and everything we've talked about talks about
the benefits. But you know,are there risks for cancer patients to consider
using cannabis as a medical treatment.Are there any risk involved? There's always
risk with anything that you try.Ye, cannabis, those risks are very
minimal though. So the main riskthat we worry about with medications is the

(02:59):
risk of a lethal overdose if youtake too much. So we don't have
that risk with the cannabis. Soit can call it some problems that make
you feel like you shouldn't have takenthat much, but there's no risk of
lethal overdose because it doesn't affect breathing, which most medications would if you took

(03:20):
too much and stop breathing. Butyou can have some effects. So if
you take too much thac sometimes thatcan cause significant anxiety or paranoia in some
people. Sometimes you can have heartpalpitations, Sometimes you can have dry eyes,
dry mouth from it. There issomething called cannabis hyperormesi syndrome. If
you're very consistent user and user ofhigh amounts that sometimes your body can eventually

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reject that where you can have alot of nausea of vomiting and it happens
every time you use cannabis and theonly cure to resolve it is to stop
cannabis. So that's a risk ofusing it as well. Now when people
who are very young, like undertwenty one, So if you go to
most recreational states, you have tobe twenty one to use, but medically

(04:12):
you can typically get it at eighteenor even younger if you have other positions
to corroborate your need. But inyounger people we are concerned with the brain
still developing and potential for a varietyof different mental disorders ranging from depending on
the age of the child, rangingfrom ADHD or schizophrenia developing later in life,

(04:39):
or autism things like that. Soit is how old they were when
they are ingesting. So we don'trecommend this to ladies who are breastfeeding or
are pregnant. They can still doCBD, but not THAC. Doctor Mandy,
did you want to add to that, Yeah, I mean I do

(04:59):
agree with doctor brenand that if youtake less amount of TSC. If I
know, there are a lot ofprescriptions where they have twenty to fifty person
of TSC. Now if pations takea lot of those formulations will height one
of TSC. That can lead toa lot of the problem Doctor Banna mentioned.
However, if you keep TSC undercontrol and work with other cannabinoids like

(05:26):
CBD and CBG or the turpins,and I love beta carifullin. I studied
all the turpins which are out there, and I found that number one was
beta carifullin, followed by mercy.So I swear by that that beta garaplin
is a fantastic turpine. You combinethat with other cannabinoids, you can have
as good a benefit as you canhave with TSC combinations. So I try

(05:48):
to use no TSC in my formulations. I tried to stay away from that
from what I need reasons. ButI do agree that if you stick with
the CBD and that you know area, the toxicity is very minimal. Of
course, you can't give it topregnant moment and breastfeeding. That can cause

(06:08):
a lot of other issues. Sothat part are very clear on at this
time in the selfic community. Butother than that, I feel that the
underlage effect and not even to talkabout humans. We all humans have pets.
I healed my pet via canabinoids combinationwith other drugs. So my pet

(06:31):
was supposed to be like passing awayin a month or two what the doctor
said that. But then I putin my knowledge, put in the canabinoid
regimen in and they accordingly got theright formulation, as you know, Sephanie
mentioned from the market and while thebet love a year longer if you just
passed. So so all I'm sayingis that canabinoids have a lot of benefits

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we don't know about yet, andthat's where we need more clinical studies.
There's a lot more to be donethe way I look at it, and
we just gread the surface at thispoint. Yeah, Stephanie didn't want to
add anything. I'm sorry, jumpin there just real quick. So we
mentioned the term terpenes for for forfor a while, but I don't think

(07:21):
we've defined what it is for forthe viewers out there. But terpenes are
other ingredients and cannabis and actually inother and other plants as well. But
they're responsible and contribute to the smell, taste and if and even different colors
of the cannabis bud. And theydo have other properties as well to help

(07:45):
with different symptoms, such as helpthem with anxiety and depression and inflammation and
that and that sort of thing.So I just wanted to make sure the
viewers know what we were talking aboutthat. Stephanie, did you want to
add anything to what both doctor notin doctor Mande just shared regarding the dosage
and combinations. Yes, And youknow now that I've been using medical cannabis

(08:11):
for so long and five years andnow I've you know, find my strains
that I prefer and we grow them, and and that you know, that
creates a whole different relationship with yourmedicine and with yourself and with the dosing
and with the plant. And it'sa it's a whole new empowering, empowering
way to be as a patient wherenow I'm completely responsible for my medicine from

(08:37):
seed today to ingesting. Wow.Wow. So we talked a lot about
you know, knowing what to take, the dosage, to take, the
strain, to take, the methodof you know, intake of the cannabis
plant, and I could just imaginethat we have people that are cancer patients

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right now that are listening and watchingin one Okay, I'm interested in trying
medical cannabis to help me feel betteras I go through this experience. I'm
going to go and I'm going togo to my you know, qualified physician
here in Florida. But then,Stephanie, you reference you walked into your
dispenser and you're like, I don'tknow what you know what it's like overwhelming,

(09:22):
right, So what advice or thebest steps do you give someone who
says I'm going to do this andI'm going to go into a dispensary.
What do they need to know?What do they need to do? Doctor
Bernard, I guess I'll go withyou, and then Stephanie Ortephanie, whoever
wants to jump in on that,because that's a loaded question. But I'm
sure someone is saying, I wantto go in and I want to get

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I want to I want to walkout and walk out feeling better. I
don't want to feel high or whatever. That is, what are the best
practices? So we have to goahead. I would tell them to start
with the lowest amount and go slow. You know, figure out what ever
and whateverever method of ingestion is mostcomfortable and familiar for them, go with

(10:05):
that and then find the lowest dosthat you can and go slow with it,
Doctor Brenard. So we have amedical cannabis consultant on our staff that's
trained by me, but also hasa background in pharmacy. She was a
pharmacy tech and also she was themanager of several dispensaries throughout the state of

(10:28):
Florida, so she has kind oflike the pharmaceutical background and the cannabis background
as well. But our patients getcounseled by her on different strains if they're
looking for specific terpenes, that sortof thing. But we make sure patients
know all the different routes that areavailable about the different dispensaries and answering any

(10:52):
questions that they have, so thatgoes on within our practice, and then
once they go to the dispensaries,a lot of the dispensaries do have people
who are dedicated to provide an additionaldevice about their specific products that they have
in that particular dispensary. Because thereare thousands of different strains of cannabis and
each one carries different ones, soour practice doesn't know what a particular dispensary

(11:13):
would have. So that's where thosedispensary workers come in to let let patients
know what they have and that particulardispensary. Yeah, thank you for that.
So then I'm going to flip thequestion just a little bit to another
direction. So in Florida, recreationalor adult use marijuana is illegal. But
also if you go into your conveniencestores or the grocery stores or the gas

(11:37):
stations these days, you're going tosee all and in stores in general,
you see all these different CBD typeproducts, right, the Delta eights,
the Delta nines, you know,cannabis infused beverages, you know, the
adedibles and everything. So what ifa cancer patient says, I don't want
to go to I don't want togo to can, I don't want to
go doctornar. I just don't wantto I want to just go in the

(11:58):
store, pick up some gummies,go home and do my thing. Thoughts
on that? What would you sayto those folks who are considering that or
wanting to do that. So Congresspassed a law that made HIMP legal.
So it can be so legally withinthe United States, but that industry is
highly unregulated, So patients could begiven CBD or whatever it's claimed to be

(12:26):
advertised on the label Delta atec orDelta ten or whatever, but that's not
necessarily going to be in the product. So there's no standard testing that these
companies have to go through. Sothere was a news story a couple of
years back they went to like tendifferent CBD places within the state of Florida

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and tested their products, actually wentto a verified lab, tested the products,
and only one of them actually hadthe amount of that was advertised in
it, and some of them didn'thave CBD in it at all. So
you never know what you could begetting, and they could be putting different
ingredients in there to make you feela high that's not necessarily going to be

(13:13):
helping you, just to keep yougoing in there to buy their product.
So I would advise people to notdo it that way, to go to
medical doctor, get your card,and go to our state regulated dispensaries because
they have to go through extensive testingto make sure there are no bad products
in there, such as pesticides andall different kinds of alcohols that could be

(13:41):
in there that could be harmful toyou, like betain propane, that sort
of thing which is used in extractingcannabis. So you're going to make sure
you get a verified product that's goingto be healthy and safe by going to
the dispensers. And they also havethat certificate of analysis that you can just
scan and you can see exactly it'sin the product before it's right. And

(14:01):
some places do have that, someof them don't. But like I say,
just never know what else could bein there that they're not telling you.
Jim Mandive, I saw you shakingyour head while doctor Bernard was talking.
Did you want to ask something tothat? Yeah, I want to
add something to that. He's veryright and that there are so many products

(14:22):
unregulated on the market. And Iknow every company has to do a CooA
for their product. Now, alot of companies what they do they do
a COO A for the CBD orthe CBG or the various components they are
taking which is lying in their drumin their company. But when they make

(14:46):
into a formulation they disclosed foulation containsthis this this A lot of times they
don't do a second COAU. Youknow, after they have made the formulation,
that is that CBD still intact ornot after they made to the whole
process. Furthermore, you know,like I'm going to IRND. MDA wants
a thirty day data, thirty daydata of stability. They want to see

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today and for thirty days a CoA. They want two co reports. Nobody's
doing that. So so people areselling in the market milkshakes CBD milkshakes right,
and people are paying extra money forthat CBD maybe is hardly much there,
a lot of its help degrade itin the process lying outside and isly

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oxidized. So and did they studyeventive a conference a couple of years ago,
they were showing that all these milkshapingsold, there's hardly much CBD left
in there. So we are payingfor basically a CBD which claims to be
one hundred percent maybe ten percent leftover there, which won't do anything for
you. So bottom line that youmust go to a you know, regulated

(15:56):
pharmacy or dispensary where they can educateyou, because that's stefanitely stole. That
education is the key. A lotof people don't have a time or the
you know, I think the timeBasically they have a desire, but not
the time to go there and andresearch it because of them have something so
much pain or depression or anxiety orwhatever whatever. They just want to get

(16:22):
better, so try anything. SoI think that with such loose regulation,
that's where I think the missing linkis that if we can somehow educate people
more or get more data put togetherfrom clinical data, maybe we can build
more confidence through more publications to moreyou know public you know, disclosures that

(16:48):
do this way and you'll get success, Like we know, but take a
pill ups and so I'll feel betterfor my blood pressure or color straw something
like that. If we can youknow, regulate that in that direction,
maybe we can have a lot ofpeople. But there's a lot of applications
and we just heard today not onlyin cancer, in anxiety, depression,

(17:08):
you know, uh uh Alzheimer's,you know, in in utable bowl syndrome.
There's so many applications. Uh.Neuropathy. I'm working with the periful
neuropathy through chemotherapy and diabetes and alsoin the nerve regeneration. I'm working with
a collaborator in Niversity at Miami whoworks in spinal cord injury and I sent

(17:33):
her my formulation. It's my formulationI made of CBD in some you know,
some some axor zrooms you can callit. And and she saw I
said, wow, this is great. And he's so we have on a
grant to gather to the d OD for spinal cord injuries to heal them
with CBD formulations. So so there'sa lot of applications we don't know about,

(17:56):
and a lot of research is goingon and has to be done more.
Yeah, I do understand this thing. Yeah. So Stephanie, I
imagine in the work that you're doingwith young people who have cancer, you
know, what are some of thequestions that you're getting from them. I
mean, we did a show recentlywhere they sit down in South Florida.
They had remember what you know,the ice cream truck right the food truck

(18:21):
and is selling these products, youknow, unregulated the products what we're talking
about in the delta in an icecream truck. So it looks like candy
is the brown. So tell me, you know, in your experience working
with young people, I mean,what are the questions they have and they
what are they saying to you aboutcannabis use as a medical treatment. The
questions will be very similar. They'llask about the ones like at the gas

(18:41):
stations, you know, should Itouch those? And you know, my
advice is very much similar that youdon't know what you're getting with those,
and it's going to be synthetic.It's going to be chemical if if it's
even what it says it's on thelabel, because it's completely unregulated, and
you know, just letting them knowthat it's still kind of the wild West
out here in medical cannabis. Youknow, even in the states that have

(19:06):
a legal medical cannabis market, thatoverlap of like the CBD market and the
lack of education of the general publicof understanding the difference between the two.
It's yeah, it can be veryconfusing. Luckily, most of the patients
that I work with we're in afully legal state where we have medical dispensaries
and we have recreational dispensaries. Yeah. Yeah, Well, this was a

(19:30):
really fascinating topic, and as wewrap up, I want to give each
of you all the opportunity just toshare some closing advice with cancer patients who
are considering cannabis use as a treatmentfor them. So doctor Mendiaive'm to start
with you, then I'll go todoctor Bernard, and then I'll close with
Stephanie. Doctor Mendi Okay great.I mean I will advise any gust of

(19:52):
patients is to fus to get itokay from your owncologists that there's okay for
them, would take AIDS if ifthey say go ahead, it's your call.
We have no concern with that,and I will say that, Hey,
go to a dispensary, talk tothe physician there, the pharmises there,
get fully informed, read upon.It's your life and you have cancer

(20:15):
and you want to live, andyou can live. You can live a
long life free of cancer if youjust follow the guidance which these people give,
plus your own reading that also helps. So I think, you know,
like anything else, if you wantto lose weight, only you can
do it. Nobody else can doit for you. That only work for

(20:37):
a short term when they same way. If you want to fight cancer,
you have to fight it with youand your family and the help of these
physicians and the pharmises who are thereto help you. That's all I will
say. Thank you God, Bernard. I would say, come and see
medical marijuana. Doctor early, evenbefore your cancer treatment starts. I've seen

(21:03):
people go through cancer treatments using andpeople not using, and the people who
go through using tend to do muchbetter than the people who are not or
just using prescription medication. So Iwould say come early, and then even
after your treatment. A lot oftimes there's still issues unnecessarily cancer related if

(21:25):
the cancer is being cured, butsometimes there's issues relating to side effects from
treatment that are still lingering. Orsometimes just having a diagnosis of cancer leads
to anxiety and depression and trouble sleeping, and the cannabis can help with those
things as well. So number one, we want to improve quality of life
for our patients, and number two, to be able to use one product

(21:51):
to help treat multiple different issues thatyou're having, versus using lots and lots
of different prescription medications and getting onthat never end inspiral needing more and more
medications because of the medications you're taking, cause and side effects that need more
medications to treat. Oh my goodness, all right, Stephanie, I would
say go to a medical doctor ora medical cannabis doctor early. I would

(22:15):
agree with that, before you evenbegin. If possible. And I would
also say to go with an openheart and an open mind for yourself and
to have patience. To have patiencewith yourself and with cannabis itself, because
the first train you try might notwork for you immediately. You might have
to try a couple times before youfind what does work for you. And

(22:37):
also be open to cannabis being notjust healing for you, but it can
be a healing communal medicine as well. Again, since I'm in a recreational
place, what was really kind ofbeautiful about what cannabis also gave to me
during my treatment is it allowed meto make my medicine a communal moment.

(23:00):
When I had my family with me, you know, we would be able
to sit and take that medicine intogether and deal with the fears and deal
with the anxiety. Indeed, likeyou know, I'm the youngest in my
family of four, I'm very loved, and you know, there's a whole
lot of anxiety and it's very it'svery hard to watch someone you love go

(23:22):
through something when you can do nothingabout it. But when you're able to
sit there with them while they're takinga medicine that completely improves their quality of
life and removes all the suffering relatedto what they're going through. That can
that's really a beautiful moment that canbring you closer to those around you and
what would otherwise be an extremely isolatingand disempowering experience. Yeah, thank you

(23:45):
all for this conversation. So Stephanie, doctor Bernard, and doctor Mandeep,
I really want to thank you forbeing our guests on this Conversations on Cannabis
virtual form brought to you by theMedical Marijuana Education and Research Initiative at Floor
and University. Thank you to everyonewatching this program. Tell us what you
think about this form by completing thesurvey that will be posted in the comment

(24:07):
box on YouTube and Facebook after thislive program. If you complete the survey,
your name will be entered into adrawing on November ninth, twenty twenty
three, twenty twenty three to wina one hundred dollars gift card provided by
one of Mary's partners. We alsowant to encourage you to go to the
Florida Department of Health Office of MedicalMarijuana Use website to learn how to obtain

(24:27):
a legal medical marijuana cart in thestate of Florida and We also encourage you
to go to Florida and M University'sMerry website to learn more about this initiative,
it's educational programs, and additional informationabout cannabis use in Florida. Thanks
everybody. The views and opinions ofour invited guests are not necessarily the views

(24:49):
and opinions of Florida Agricultural and MechanicalUniversity or the Medical Marijuana Education and Research Initiative