Is Your Child Getting High? Learn the Signs and How to Get Help - Part 1

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Episode Transcript

(00:01):
From the WA and M Studio onthe campus of Florida A and M University.
This is Mary Forum Radio, aweekly conversation on the education and research
of the medical marijuana being conducted atBammu Hi. I'm Heidi Otway, your
host for this conversations on Cannabis virtualform, brought to you by the Medical
Marijuana Education and Research Initiative at Floridaand M University. In this conversation,

(00:27):
we're talking about kids and teens whouse cannabis illegally and how to help parents
learn the signs and how to gethelp for their child. So let's talk
and learn about this subject with ourpanel of experts. Our first guest is
Joe McGuire, the executive director ofthe National Drug and Alcohol Screening Association.

(00:48):
She is a parent who learned herchild was using cannabis and now uses that
experience to help others. Joe,Welcome to the Forum. Tell us more
about yourself. Thank you, Heidi. I had been involved in prevention education
in schools for two decades before mycareer took a little bit of a left
turn into drug and alcohol testing.Sort of an unexpected path for me,

(01:12):
but it was shortly after I startedthat career. I was brand new into
it, just learning new things thatI had never considered before. When one
evening, my oldest son came intomy room and woke me up in the
middle of the night and told methat I needed to run downstairs because his

(01:33):
brother had just tried to take hisown life. And I just could not
comprehend that this was happening in myhome to my child. I was the
involved parent. I knew where mykids were at all times. This was
a highly gifted young man that wasan excellent student, and there I was
a couple of hours later in thehospital emergency room speaking to a social worker

(01:59):
who in formed me that my sonwas using a lot of cannabis. And
I mean still to this day whenI think about that moment, I still
can feel that shock all over again, because it was not something that I
ever expected or could have imagined.And that led to a very long journey

(02:22):
with a young man who was verycommitted to his cannabis use at a young
age. And through that and mycareer, which happened to be in drug
testing, you know, the timingjust came together for me to learn about
what was happening in my own homeand help educate others. Thank you for
being on the show. I'm lookingforward to hearing more about your story and

(02:44):
your son and where you all aretoday. Bill Lynch is a hold on,
let me go back to my notes. Moved because I got so cal
up in your story. Bill Lynchis a clinical pharmacist who serves on a
number of associations in groups focus ondrug control and addiction awareness. Bill,
welcome to the forum. Tell usmore about yourself, sure, Thank you

(03:07):
for having me today. Good afternooneveryone. My name is Bill Incha'm actually
a clinical pharmacist in the Philadelphia area. Actually practice in southern New Jersey within
major academic institution it's there, andalso maintain an adjunct faculty position with our
medical school, especially with the Departmentof Emergency Medicine. And we're actually a
pharmacist who practice on the overnight shift. So I see unfortunately a lot of

(03:27):
youth coming in with this difficulty withmarijuana and many other substances, and so
we've been involved in this for quitesome time as a practicing pharmacist for over
thirty six years, and then alsomaintain my officiating licenses for both swimming and
soccer as a referee, and I'vecoached soccer for fifteen years, so we've
dealt with this as a parent,we've dealt with this as a coach,
We've dealt with as a healthcare professional. And we're hoping to shed some light

(03:50):
on some of the situations going onout there that'll be beneficial to your audience
today. So thank you again forhaving me. Appreciate it. Thank you
for being on our panel and roundingout our panel of experts as Brittany paying
Bruce, a licensed mental health counselorwho owns a private practice in Florida serving
multicultural and multi generational populations. Brittany, welcome to the forum. Tell us

(04:10):
more about yourself. Thank you somuch, Heidi for having me. As
you stated, I'm a licensed mentalhealth counselor. I'm also a licensed in
the state of Georgia, and I'vebeen in practice for a number of years,
and a great number of my clienteleconsists of adolescents, and so quite
naturally, the adolescent population experiments withcannabis us and so I enjoy working with

(04:38):
that population. But as you stated, I worked with several different clientele aging
from ages four up until I haveno age cap. I think my oldest
client is in their seventies, andso I've been doing counseling for a long
time. I've also worked in thesubstance abuse field as well as in community
based counseling. So I really enjoyit and and I kind of got into

(05:00):
this by way of my profession,by way of adolescents coming in readily admitting
that they use cannabis, and soI was kind of led into it through
my profession. So I'm really excitedabout being here today. Yeah, this
is going to be a great conversation. And to everyone joining us on this
live program, please share post andtag a friend on Facebook to have them

(05:23):
join us. If you're on YouTube, share the links so others can join
as well. During the forum,we want you to send us your questions
in the comment box and we'll doour best to have our guests answer them.
We also want you to tell uswhat you think about this forum by
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After the live program, your namewill be entered into a drawing on December

(05:45):
twenty eighth, twenty twenty three towin a one hundred dollars gift card provided
by one of Mary's partners. Solet's get this conversation on cannabis started.
Joe, I want to go backto you and and the journey that you
went through with your son to helphim overcome his use of cannabis. Tell

(06:06):
us more about what happened when youall left the hospital and you learned that
he really wanted to you know,he was really into using cannabis. Well,
there was no leaving the hospital forhim. They held him until there
was a room open in a treatmentfacility, and that began kind of a

(06:27):
revolving door in and out of treatmentfacilities. A mandated treatment when a child
has a serious suicide attempt. Really, the state comes in and says,
this is what the treatment will beand what it will look like, and
for how long The challenge was?Heidi that other people had already helped cement

(06:50):
his ideas of what cannabis should beand was for him, and any attempt
on my part to educate or helpwas, you know, not very readily
heard, and I had to learnsome hard lessons and that I should have
been having conversations much sooner. Ijust I you know, it was one

(07:14):
of those things where I kind ofexpected that my children knew better than this.
I think a lot of us feelthat way, and I did not
have early conversations on this topic toget my point of view across. And
so he was hearing, you know, this is medicine and it can help
with depression and anxiety and all ofthese things which he was feeling in in

(07:38):
his middle school years. And itwas unfortunately the parent of another student that
introduced this to the boys to helpwith anxiety. And you know, it
just kind of was shocking for meto learn that years later when he should.
You know, my son shared thatwith me. But the journey of

(07:58):
going through the then preceding use ofyou know, he did have a little
while where he would experiment with otherthings, and I mean he ended up
eventually becoming a homeless person living onthe street because he just did not want
to cease use and it caused aprogression of other behaviors and incidents. And

(08:24):
I mean I found myself with ayoung man who was nineteen twenty years old
living on the streets of La whichI don't live in La, you know,
with a sign begging for food,just like any homeless person you see
out of your car window. Thatwas my child. And you know,
long story shore because of brevity,it really took. What it took a

(08:48):
few years later was he went throughsome horrible experiences, as you can imagine,
he decided he wanted to get offthe street. He wanted to get
a job. An employer actually offeredhim a job if he could pass a
drug test, and he did.And I've always found that very ironic because
I'm in workplace drug testing. ButI had nothing to do with that scenario

(09:09):
whatsoever. It was just, youknow, that kind of kismet thing that
that's what helped him. And nowhe's a computer science major in a very
prestigious program, you know, andso he's doing beautifully well. But I'm
blessed that I have my child,because that's not how these stories often go.

(09:31):
So it's been a very long road. And the one thing that I
want to say to parents out thereis I did miss a lot of the
signs along the way that I thoughtwere just normal adolescents, like sleeping too
much, you know, absent mindedness, and a kid who's normally very sharp,
mood swings that were very erratic.And I even went to the local

(09:56):
pediatrician that we had had for years, and she missed it too because she
knew our family and never considered thatdrug use was on the table. So
it's quite a journey, and Ido have a passion to be there for
parents who are experiencing this as well. Yeah, thank you for sharing that
remarkable story. Bill, I'm goingto turn to you. You're a pharmacist,

(10:18):
a father, and a coach.I'm sure you've had some stories that
you could share with our listeners aswell. Sure. Unfortunately Joe's telling her
story about her son is that whenI actually tell everyone is that I can
tell you for certainty that the worstsound in the world is the guttural waal
of a mother who's just lost theirchild and practicing I practice, and for
as long as I have, I'veseen way too many of those stories unfold

(10:41):
with that kind of ending. Andit's happy to hear Joe's ending with regards
to her son how well he's doing, because, as Joe mentioned, unfortunately
that's not always the case, andit's going to be pretty traumatic and devastating
to family. So that's how Igot involved in it. I mean,
we did youth group with our churchand we had kids going to stuff and
we'd coach wayum cee soccer since theywere five until we did travel and went

(11:03):
through four states and the whole bit. And you know what's Joe's saying is,
as a parent, all our kidsare good kids. All these kids
are actually good kids. The peopleare listening have good kids. Well,
those good kids also make decisions thatmay not be good decisions, and when
they do, they can get intothe spiral that can quickly get out of
control. And then they're the peoplethat I see because for some reason they
have to come to the hospital,they have to come to the emergency room,

(11:24):
and they're using a bad place andwhen they are, we have to
intervene. And by seeing that waytoo often and way too much, that's
how I got involved in educating thisbecause when you hear about trank and xylazine
and iso isinita zine and fentanyl,that's not what the kids are starting with.
And that was my thing. Howare they getting there? They're getting
there with alcohol and they're getting therewith marijuana. That's how they're getting there.

(11:45):
And so that was my need togo intervene and get become involved in
that, and from at least somearea of expertise and what we deal with
this all the time. We cangive youth and young adults that factional information
they need to make better informed decisions. That's why thank you. I mean,
what's your story. How did youget into cannabis education with your patients?
It just kind of came to mejust by way of the clientele that

(12:09):
I deal with. As I saidearlier, some of the adolescents would readily
admit that they use cannabis, andof course, as a therapist, I
explore reasons why, and part ofmy job is an educational piece as well,
to provide them some of the factsof why this may not be the

(12:30):
best decision and some other ways ofdealing with it. And so, by
way of clientele, I have alarge population that are adolescents and they do
experiments as they call it, orthey do try it and they like it
and they continue. And so froma therapists standpoint, you know, I
committed to exploring, exploring the whyseexploring other ways of helping them to deal

(12:54):
with the underlying things that may begoing on, like the anxieties and like
the depression. And so that's reallyhow I got into it. And as
I said it before, I workeda little bit in substance of use at
a facility that didn't just specifically dealwith cannabis use, but a lot of
it. Once you do their biocyclesocial you see that it did start with

(13:18):
cannabis. And so it just reallykind of made me commit to the opportunity
that I have to provide education andto be even more committed to teaching different
coping skills to deal with whatever theunderlying issue is. Yeah, so Brittany,
both you and Joe kind of touchedon the why. I want to
explore that a little bit more.Bill, what are your thoughts on the

(13:39):
why? And I want to haveeach ofview all kind of talked through.
Why do young people kids, Imean middle school kids, high school kids,
I mean even our kids in college. You know I say kids in
college because I have a kid incollege, right, Why are they using
cannabis and they know it's illegal.There's lots of reasons, I mean in

(14:00):
this experimentation, one of them isto fit in. When is it fit
in with your friends? To besocial? Those kind of things. One
of the things I mentioned all thetime is because I'll see it on are
into the hospital. Is a lotof times, it's not what kids are
running too, it's what they're runningaway from. And so the issue with
that is if cannabis actually makes themfeel better, even for the short time
and nothing negative happens, obviously cannabismust be okay to use, and they

(14:24):
continue to use it. And theproblem with that is that actually reinforces the
behavior, and a lot of themare actually self medicating. If you're anxious
and you use it, it makesyou less anxious, I guess it's working.
If you're depressed and you use it, it makes you less depressed,
it must be working. And likeI said, when nothing negative happens,
it must really be working. Andnow of a sudden, over the use
of cannabis over a longer period oftime, malvas a sudden, the negative

(14:46):
things start to kick in and that'swhere they start to have significant problems.
And by then they're down this pathfar enough to be where it can be
pretty problematic and traumatic. So youknow, I have had the opportunity to
speak in schools, and whenever I'min a school assembly, I ask the
students, why do your friends usecannabis? And the hands go up and

(15:09):
they often say, well, everyoneknows it helps with anxiety, it helps
with depression, you know, Andthat's really where they come at it from.
I think some of us think thatit's you know, especially if we're
of an older generation, we thinkit's like it's a party drug and they're
all getting together and partying. AndI'm sure that that is a part of

(15:31):
it on some level. But becausewe have normalized medical marijuana in our society,
our kids really are buying into selfmedicating. And that's what I'm seeing
and that's what I saw with myson, and that's what I see with
the young adults that are in mylife, is they really believe that,

(15:52):
well, if I'm taking charge ofmy own health care, which is another
message that we put out there,which is not a bad mess such,
right, they really see this asas just a part of my healthcare management
strategy. And it's massively misguided becausethey don't understand and we are not responsibly

(16:12):
getting the message out there that theharms that this causes to be adolescent brain.
The kids don't They just don't seethat piece of it. We're really
grateful for this program and for whatyou guys are doing to help get that
point across. But that's what Ihear from the young people in my life.
Brittany, did you want to addto that. Yeah, I definitely

(16:34):
agree with what Bill and Joe havestated. And a lot of what I
heard, too is just to relax. This whole thing about it helps me
to unwind. It helps me tokick back, maybe after a long day,
not really dealing with the things thatare causing them not to be able
to relax. Children or adolescents,just as adults, they deal with different

(16:59):
stressors and as Joe stated, that'stheir way of self medicating, that's their
way of relaxing. And you know, I totally agree with Bill on sometimes
it's what they're running from. Sometimesthe stressors are not just school. Sometimes
the stressors are home life. Sometimesthe stressors are peer relationships or just internal

(17:19):
things that they may deal with andnever share. And so that's one of
the major things I hear. Itjust helps me relax. I feel better
when I use Yeah. So,you know, we're based in Florida,
and you know, if you drivearound and I'm sure and I've been in
other states as well, but yousee the stores that have the Delta Eights,
the Delta nines, the CBD andall these different products, right,

(17:42):
So I would think that a kidcan't just walk in and buy it,
right, So I want to kindof circle back to where are they getting
the cannis's from? Where are theygetting it? Who wants to start with
that? I'll start. I mean, we've seen from reports in other states

(18:02):
that students in youth surveys largely report, like eighty percent of them report that
they get it from a friend orfellow students older sibling that has a medical
marijuana card, so they're hanging outwith. You know, those age lines
are really tight when you're looking atseventeen year olds, sixteen, seventeen year

(18:26):
olds in high school, the eighteenor nineteen year old sibling that they all
went to school with last year ormaybe are still in school with that qualified
to get their medical marijuana card,even at twenty one plus, your sibling
that's still hanging out at home.Very common, and it's just like an
open supply chain. That's the numberone place that we hear about it in

(18:48):
youth surveys. Brittany, Bill,you got what are you hearing? I
would definitely agree with with a Joe. And it's not just the older siblings.
It's you know, older people whodon't have I guess the moral standard
of this is wrong. To givethis to a youth who will just readily
make it accessible, whether it's formonetary gain, and so they give it

(19:14):
to them. It could be youknow, of course, adolescent seek out
those people who are willing to giveit to them, even if it's not
an older sibling. And so Itotally agree with Joe. They get it
from an older person who can legallyobtain it, and they get it by
that means as well well. Andthey'll also get it on the room.

(19:37):
Don't think they don't try to walkinto the dispenser of that store to just
see if they're going to sell itto them. And if it's a cash
sale and they're able to do it, that's fine. But I think it's
actually easily masked now. I mean, when we're thinking about it's going to
be marijuana with your guards, ofone the telltale smell if terpens are out
of marijuana, it's not gonna smelllike marijuana. If I hide an a
vaping device in a vaping cartridge andit's flavored, I'm just smoking vanilla.

(19:59):
I'm smoking bubblegus, wedding cake whenit's really got THHC oil in it.
And then with regards to teach tooil. The other thing that this is,
even though we're talking about cannabis,this is all about THC potency,
and THC potency is with driving allthese problems. I will show notoriously my
son. He is not even tenyears out of high school, and when
he was born in nineteen ninety five, the average concentration TC was only three

(20:22):
point ninety six percent. When hegraduated high school was only twelve and a
half percent. In some of theseconcentrates and distillates and dabs and things that
have been in Colorado for quite sometime. I know Joe's familiar with are
can be well over ninety percent.That's a game changer. And when someone
gets that, they can have anacute psychotic event that they're coming to the
hospital and long with long term problems. So that's where they're getting it from,

(20:45):
is their friends, their family sometimesoffered to them, sometimes families using
it. And the other issue isthat you know, sometimes some of these
youth, unfortunately they're exposed in uteroberefour they're even born, and that actually
what we call primes the pump,and so when those nor get used to
that being there, and then nowwhen they're born they have it where they're
laying in their fascinet and the parentsare smoking right there and they're inhaling again

(21:07):
or backseat the car where they're driving. And then now finally at the age
of twelve they're going to try it. It's like fireworks go off in their
mind, like, oh, thisis what I've been waiting for for twelve
years. And the instant that it'ssupposed to them directly, they have a
much easier time in becoming hooked oraddicted to it that quickly because of that,
even in euro and then young lifeexposure. Wow, I want to

(21:30):
touch back on you talked about vaping, and then Joe earlier talked about the
signs that parents should be looking forbecause we know that, you know,
I see kids vaping and I'm like, you're a little what are you doing?
You know, and I'm not yourparent, but I just want to
you know, what are you doing? So let's talk a little bit more
about the signs and what to noticeabout the vaping. Well, the vaping

(21:53):
is a big one because the datais clear individuals who are younger and younger
you who actually engage in vaping willmigrate to marijuana within one year. That's
pretty much documented twenty one studies showingyou this. They move over to to
using marijuana. So that's not uncommonto have that happen. And then the
other thing is because vaping has becomeso popular and it's also something that's easily

(22:15):
concealed, it's a thing. Sothey'll have it in those long sleeve of
their hoodie and they push the buttonand they have it. The don't even
take it out. They just golike this and they actually inhale through it.
That way. They'll have when theyput their backpack up on their desk
in school and it's in that frontsip of the luck pocket and they push
that button, they lean forward andthey actually inhale whatever. So I joking
said everybody, because it's this timeof the year, it's the most wonderful

(22:36):
time of the year. I tellyou people all the time, how many
people out there have vanilla extract inyour home for all these great bake goods
for this time of year. We'llgo look it up. Vanilla extract is
seventy percent proof it's thirty five percentalcohol. So when people use that and
then you just oh, it's justvanilla because you're cooking. But the thing
there is also when you see thetelltale signs when you have a sudden smell

(22:56):
bubblegum in the kitchen and like,no one's too doing bubblegum, where's the
smell coming from. That's a keything with regards to the vaping, and
the vaping is the big popularity onebecause of again it's easy concealment. It's
easy to get cartridges. And thething I tell everyone is you need to
think of a vaping device as adelivery system. It's similar to a syringe
for me in the hospital. Ican put any medication I want in there

(23:18):
and just give it a little bitund your skin and your muscle Intrevenously,
anyone can put anything in that cartridge. It goes in that vape and get
exposed at and including marijuana, andespecially we're concentrated when people actually use the
cannabis oils and those kind of thingsthey put in it. Yeah, So
Brittany, Joe and Bill, thankyou all so much for being guests on
this Conversations on Cannabis virtual form broughtto you by the Medical Marijuana Education and

(23:41):
Research Initiative at Florida and M University. Thank you to everyone watching this program.
Tell us what you think about thisform by completing the survey that will
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If you complete the survey, yourname will be entered into a draw on
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(24:03):
card provided by one of Mary's partners. We also want to encourage you to
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this initiative, it's educational programs andadditional information about cannabis use in Florida.

(24:30):
Thanks everyone. The views and opinionsof our invited guests are not necessarily the
views and opinions of Florida Agricultural andMechanical University or the Medical Marijuana Education and
Research Initiative.