Finding Love at the Angola Prison Rodeo- Karla's Story

When Karla saw Joseph featured on the TV series" Louisiana Lockdown", she felt something she couldn’t ignore and decided to send him a message. Their relationship quickly grew, and when they finally met at the Angola Prison Rodeo, they just knew that this was the type of connection they had only dreamed of.

In this episode, Karla opens up about her first experience at the rodeo, the bond they built, and how loving Joseph has changed her perspective on prison reform and second chances. Karla might have been 3 years old when Joseph committed the crime that gave him this 100 year sentence as a juvenile, but that has never been an issue to them- but it did get them featured in the Sun magazine! Together, they dream of marriage, building a future and a family that proves it's not where you meet your soulmate that matters, it's who they are that does.

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Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Four days later I get a call andI answer that phone call and the
first thing he says is they tookeverything from me and I was in
shock. I was like what do you need?
Welcome to More Than an Inmate'sGirlfriend.
I'm your host, Jay, and thank you for joining us.
Today we are diving into an episode centered around the

(00:25):
rodeo and I'm going to leave it at that because we go into
detail a lot more in in the episode about it.
I don't want to keep you too long in the intro here because
it is a longer episode. Very quickly, the one thing that
I want to mention, I had to cut down the episode.

(00:45):
And in cutting down the episode,I had to remove a part where
Carla gives praise to a prison in Louisiana and specifically a
warden. And I feel really guilty about
having to cut it. So I wanna give a brief mention
of it because she did say this and I wish I could have fit it

(01:06):
in somehow, but I couldn't. And she says that the prison,
David Wade in Louisiana has beenreally helpful and has responded
to her and she really appreciates the word in and
they've changed. And she wants people to kind of
give that person a second chance'cause I guess it's had a bad
rap. I think it's important because

(01:27):
there's so much negativity around the Department of
Corrections that when there is agood situation, a good story, I
really want to make sure it's highlighted.
So anytime that anything good oranyone has something good to
say, I really want to like hold on to that.
And I don't want to let the episode go without mentioning
that it was important to me. So she did say that.

(01:50):
Other than that, I'm going to keep it nice and short and
sweet. Please continue to share the
episode. Please follow the show.
It is very important and commentif you want to comment.
Obviously follow the show if youlike the show.
If you don't like it, don't follow it.
Follow us on social media at More than an Inmates GF on
TikTok and at Podcast under score prison GF on Instagram.

(02:13):
We're also on Facebook and we are getting into the second
season. We're starting to dig deep and
get into some really juicy episodes, so I'm looking forward
to it. So with that, I'm going to leave
it. Here is Carlos episode on the
rodeo and her man Joseph. I hope you like it.

(02:36):
Welcome Carla. Thank you so much for coming and
joining me today. No problem.
I cannot wait to speak to you about your loved one and your
experiences. But for those of you that don't
know yet, how did you first comeacross your fiance?
So it was the Labor Day weekend of 2023, and I remember my

(02:58):
ex-husband a few months prior tothat told me about a documentary
called Louisiana Lockdown. Fast forward to Labor Day
weekend, I was by myself and I decided to play it.
I was like, you know what? I'll watch it.
I got nothing else to do. And then episode 1, it's like
the intro to the prison. And I saw episode 2 and started

(03:21):
it and I was shook. I was like, who is this man?
I felt like an instant connection to him and it was
like I couldn't hear a word he was saying.
I was just staring at him and I even was like in awe because I
just felt like this connection there that I didn't even hear

(03:43):
the charges. He was in there for how long his
sentence was. I just saw him on the TV.
Wow. Has that ever happened to you
before? It has never happened to me
before. I didn't even hear him say his
name or his nickname. The feeling was so surreal that
there was such an emotional connection there and I could
feel it. It's like the type of experience

(04:03):
where you just have to live it yourself to understand, so it
was pretty crazy. And then was it immediate that
you were like, I need to know this person?
So after that happened, I was like, hold up, hold up.
I came back to reality and I waslike, we have to rewind because
I miss like why he's in prison, how long he has, and when he

(04:25):
said his charges and how long hehas, I said, you got to be
kidding me because it was 100 years.
So I did watch episode 2 and a little bit of episode 3.
And then I actually just got there for a little bit and was
like, Carla, like, this is crazythat you're even considering
writing a letter because I thought I would have to write a
letter at that time. And then I paused, watched the

(04:48):
rest of it. It took me like 6 hours.
And exactly at one AMI sent my first e-mail to him.
Oh my gosh. And have you ever written to
anybody who's incarcerated before?
No, I didn't even know they had emails or tablets.
I thought I would have to write a letter, but I looked up.
How do you write to an inmate inLouisiana?
How do you find 1? Is this man even still alive?

(05:10):
That's what I was. Thinking this is wild.
Yeah, so then I figured out theyhave tablets.
It's like, oh, fancy. Yeah.
And then I searched him up. All I had was his first and last
name and the prison. And I was hoping he was still
there. If not, that would make it more

(05:30):
complicated. And there were three Joseph
Ward's who popped up. Oh, gosh.
And there was 1 Joseph Ward who was black.
The other two were white. But based off the ages I did a
estimate and I selected the one I thought it would be.
Oh my God. It was the right one,
thankfully. But yeah, that's how I found him

(05:53):
through the Louisiana inmate Search.
And then I've had this e-mail introducing to myself because
I'm like, what does someone say?I saw you on TV and I was
amazed. That sounds so weird.
So I actually said, dear Redneck, I used his nickname
that was on the documentary and I introduced myself like who I

(06:13):
am, a little bit about my family, my hobbies.
And then I was like, this is kind of strange for him to get a
letter or an e-mail like this from a stranger.
So I'm going to put a photo withit because I was like, if I was
him I would want to know what stranger is talking to me right
now. Yeah, I feel the same way.
I sent a picture, too, because Iwas like, I feel like it's

(06:34):
cheating. You're talking to someone that
you don't even know what they look like, and I know exactly
what you look like. I feel like that's not fair,
right? Exactly.
Yeah, I get it. So on the Louisiana website it
doesn't have their pictures. No.
And was he surprised to get a message from you, or had he
received a lot of messages over the years?
Yeah, so after we emailed back and forth, I did ask that

(06:57):
question and he said I usually just delete these messages
because I've gotten so many of them over the years from men and
women. And he told me something about
your message made me reply. Wow, that's weird.
I know. And how did it develop?
Were you guys friends first? So when I tell you at first I

(07:20):
literally thought he was love bombing me, I'm not kidding you
because it was about 7 days intoit.
He comes back with I love you, you're my soul mate.
I'm like OK why don't we meet each other first?
You never know. I said you could think I'm
immature in person because I'm so much younger than you are.

(07:41):
He's like I just know it. And then he didn't even ask me
to be his girlfriend. He just started to call me his
girlfriend and then it really developed quickly.
I would never say we were the pen pals or friends.
It kind of just went from strangers to soulmates in a
week. Wow.
And did you tell anybody that you were doing this, or did you
keep it a secret? So the first week I didn't tell

(08:04):
anyone because like, how do you even explain that to people?
But then I slowly told my friends who I'm actually no
longer friends with them becauseof this situation.
At first they were like, oh, I think Carla's just on a little
adventure. She's having a little bit of a
crisis. This isn't that serious.
Let's have her have some fun. You know, it wasn't serious to

(08:28):
them until I got back from the rodeo that they were like, what
do you mean you're going to go see him in an actual visit?
So before we get into the rodeo part, was that the first time
you met him? Yes, not the first time I've
seen him because we can send videos to each other.
Oh cool. And he sent me a video and then

(08:49):
he asked me to send him one backto verify that I was not a
cabbage because people in his camp were like, oh, she's fake,
She's really a man, She's playing you.
She's not even going to show up.She doesn't look like that.
So then I want to say maybe day four of talking, he asked me to
send the video back, and I did. And I proved to him I was a real

(09:10):
person. And then did he invite you to
the rodeo? He did tell me you have to come
to the October rodeo so we can meet.
And at this point, I had no intention of going because I
thought 600 inmates would be there.
And I've never been around an inmate or around people who have
committed crimes or a prison, a jail, nothing.

(09:34):
And I did say to him, why don't we shoot for like the April 1?
Because at this point was Labor Day like in September, and when
he said October, like that's next month.
And I'm like, whoa, how about wedo April?
And then he kept mentioning October.
And I was like, you know what? You know what, Carla, if we're
going to do this, we might as well just get it over with and

(09:56):
go 100% in. We are going to the October
rodeo even though it's a few weeks away.
Oh my gosh, that's crazy. Yeah.
And I watched the documentary soI would feel the same way as
you. And I remember when I went to a
prison and it's very secure and I was still nervous.
So I can't imagine going to a place where there is a large

(10:17):
number of people that have committed some of them very
serious crimes and they're just intermingled with the
population. So are you far from the rodeo?
Did you have to travel far that day?
Yeah, it was. So I stayed overnight just
because it is 6 1/2 hours one way.
Oh wow, and did you go alone? Yeah, I did.

(10:39):
Oh my. Yeah, I walked in the rodeo.
I was the 12th person to be there.
Got there at 8 O clock. It was just a bunch of inmates
and 12 free people. And that is how I found him so
quickly. I walked in all alone and he
actually approached me. He found me and I was kind of
relieved he found me because when I saw him I would have

(11:01):
never recognized him because forsome reason in my head I was
looking for the man on the documentary even though he sent
me a video. Right, the documentary was from
like 10 years ago. And obviously everyone gets
older. Yeah, and he definitely did look
older than he did in the documentary.
It all worked out. It's crazy because I tell people

(11:23):
this all the time. I don't view him as a 42 year
old. I still view him as the 28 year
old I saw on the documentary. Right.
And so that experience of going in, I'm sure you've been to
rodeos before. Was it very different than a
regular rodeo? So that was my first rodeo I've
ever been to. Oh so.
You didn't even know what you were walking.

(11:44):
Into yeah, I've never been to a rodeo, so I even have the
comfort of knowing the rodeo events that people do nothing.
And did you know what to wear? Is there restrictions?
So I did call the Angola rodeo people OK and ask if there's a
dress code and they said no. So I was like what would Barbie

(12:04):
wear to a rodeo? Cuz I was going for Rodeo Barbie
and that's why I got my outfit that I wore.
I love it Which. The outfit they did not care
for. I found that out later on.
So going back to when you guys first saw each other, he looked
a little bit different than usual.
Did you have any different feelings?

(12:25):
I mean, you finally saw him in. Person No, it was the same.
It literally didn't matter that he wasn't the person I was
expecting. I was so happy to see him still
had that instant connection there.
So all of that didn't even matter.
Was he shy? Was your interactions a little
awkward at the beginning or was it just comfortable?

(12:47):
It was comfortable. So Joseph naturally is an
introvert, but when he walked upto me, he hugged me right away.
He told me that like he was scared for his life to do that
because he's naturally an introvert.
But how he introduced himself, he would think he was outgoing.
He was like, I was very nervous and terrified, but I was like, I

(13:09):
have to do it. Yeah, and did he get to spend
the whole day with you? Yes, we spent about 8 hours
together that day. Because in the documentary it
looked like, or if I remember correctly, they said some of the
guys are behind fences like theycan't interact and then some of
them can. Is that true?
Yeah, so honestly, that day at the rodeo, I really stayed

(13:31):
around where Joseph was. I unfortunately did not walk
around and see anything else besides where Joseph was.
And I think there are men behindlike fences.
I did not see them myself. I saw mostly in my who were
walking around in the area I wasin and that day Joseph did have

(13:52):
to work a few of the events, butI just stood near him as he was
working. And what was he doing at the
rodeo? He was working the barrel racer
event. They have like opening the gate
and I just stood there on the side with all these barrels
racers coming in and out on their horses.

(14:12):
And I'm also terrified of horses.
Oh, wow. And that day I was on guard with
these horses. I was like not getting too
close, making sure I'm far enough away I don't get trampled
or something. I was staring these horses down
like I know where each horse is right now.
Forget the guys that are incarcerated, it's all about the
horses attacking. Yeah, honestly, when I got there

(14:36):
I was more scared of these horses than of the men.
That's crazy. And how was it like the
interaction with people versus guys that are incarcerated?
They're obviously dressed different.
In the documentary they were anyways, so you know who's
incarcerated and who's not. Are the interactions weird?
No. So I met a few other people on

(14:59):
that documentary that day. I met a man named Travis.
And I didn't meet a whole lot ofother inmates, which probably
Joseph did not want me to. But I did meet plenty of prison
employees, like guards. He introduced me to quite a few
of them, so many that I do not remember a majority of their
names. So I met mostly like prison

(15:21):
employees. Oh.
Wow, interesting. And you felt comfortable the
whole time. Yeah, I never felt uncomfortable
that day at all. From the prison guards to the
inmates, Like 100% safe. Wow cool.
I feel weird, like the whole idea of the rodeo and AJ and I

(15:41):
had found out about the rodeo a couple months ago and, and we
talked about it and we're like, I feel like it's weird like the
poker one where like the bull oryeah, like it's just part of it
feels like not OK. But then when I watched the
documentary, I was like, well, it's a really cool opportunity
for these guys to not only earn some money, but like prove that

(16:04):
they're rehabilitated. And so I have all these mixed
feelings about it. How do you feel overall about
the rodeo and how does Joseph feel about it?
So for me, when I first heard about the rodeo, when I watched
it, I immediately thought, wow, people are paying $20 to see
these inmates get hurt like they're not human beings.

(16:25):
And then I also had a brief thought about the animals, like,
are they treating them right? And then when I saw it in
person, I still feel very torn on it.
People are paying because eitherthey have family members who are
inmates and I totally understandwhy you would go to see your
family member and to support them.

(16:46):
But also there are quite a few people, probably hundreds of
people, who go because they are cheering on inmates, because
they want them to get hurt. Really.
There are people that actually go there for that.
I mean they'll never tell you that but you can sense the vibe
for sure. I just feel like people are
there to support them but othersmay have more I'll intentions

(17:09):
that they'll never say out loud but they're thinking it.
And then also me personally, I would never purchase hobby craft
from those inmates. Not because I don't think it's
good, I think a lot of it is fantastic, but the prison does
take a majority of their profit,so I feel like I'm paying to

(17:30):
promote slavery. Yeah.
And they wouldn't have promoted that.
So you would know that because of Joseph.
Yeah, Joseph, as an inmate, he feels a little differently than
I do. He says that it was a great time
because he was able to feel free, even though when he did
the rodeo event years ago, therewas a high risk of him getting

(17:52):
hurt. And as you saw on the rodeo
documentary, he did get hurt. But he said it's just worth it
because I feel so free doing it.And I'm sure a lot of them do
feel free and they may not acknowledge or do not want to
think about that the prison is profiting off of them and people
are paying to watch them get on the animals and potentially get

(18:14):
hurt. But Joseph does think that it's
a good experience for him to have.
He doesn't really see it negative until I point out some
things to him. So like 6 months into the
relationship, I was like, I can't believe you really liked
participating in the rodeo because I just feel like they're

(18:34):
promoting slavery. And I explained some things to
him like you get paid $20 a weekand you're taking care of all
these animals and major corporations are making money
off of you and the prisons making money off of you.
And he never, I really viewed itlike that until I said that out
loud because I never wanted to say that out loud to him in the

(18:54):
beginning because I didn't want to hurt his feelings or to get
into a disagreement about it. So I just kept it to myself.
But towards when we got to know each other over the months, it
did come out and he definitely views it as it was a good
experience for him. But he understands that I
explained what the major corporations are profiting of

(19:17):
and what the prison is profitingoff.
Now he has a deeper understanding.
I think it was a little hard forhim to grasp that on his own
because he's been doing these rodeos for over 10 years and he
also was not educated on these facts.
I feel like it's such a catch 22because they're profiting off

(19:37):
these guys, but yet the guys feel like they're getting so
much out of it when really right, they're not.
But it is way more than they would normally get, so for sure.
How do you even like you said they are profiting, but then
it's hard to make that distinguished.
Like is it OK to support it? Is it not OK to support it?

(19:58):
I don't even know. I'm sitting here like I don't
know if. Yeah, I know other Louisiana
prison wives, the ones I talked to, they love going to see their
loved one, of course, so they will always go.
But then they do acknowledge too, like what's going on behind
the scenes with the Prophet. Right.
And on the documentary, it does feel like these guys are trying

(20:20):
to go. I think was it Travis, the one
that almost didn't go and then ended up winning that round?
Yeah, so I think Travis is the one who had all those write ups
and he had to go to the warden to get approved to go to the
rodeo. So in the story, it's like
everybody wants to go and they make it seem like it's a really

(20:41):
big deal and all these guys try really hard to make it there.
So that's actually true then. I wasn't sure.
Yeah, so the rodeo is voluntary.They don't have to go, but they
want to because it's another opportunity to be free for a few
seconds and to see family and friends.
For a long term right, has Joseph ever shared with you

(21:05):
anytime where something's gone wrong there or when you were
there, did anything go wrong? When I was there, not
necessarily things going wrong during the rodeo, like security
wise. I think a few years back,
though, there was a inmate who was accused of harming a teenage
girl who was a minor in one of the bathroom.

(21:29):
Yeah, but I think that's really it for like security things that
have happened at the rodeo. I can't remember of any other
events security wise. Because I remember for me, when
I visit my husband before, when I first met him, he was allowed
to be in street clothes. And then they changed the laws

(21:50):
that he has to be in state issued clothing.
So like khakis when they go to visitation now.
And it still feels kind of like I'm just visiting him, like it's
not really real. And I remember one time we were
taking pictures and then he put his hand in his pocket just for
nothing. And then they were like, stop,
empty your pockets. And it was like, all of a

(22:10):
sudden, like in the flick of an instant, you're reminded that
he's a ward of the state, right?And we have to show our pockets.
And it was nothing. He wasn't doing anything.
Obviously, we weren't doing anything sketchy, but it was
just a very quick reminder of, oh, wait a minute, there are
people watching US 24/7 while we're visiting.

(22:31):
Did you feel that? Yeah, honestly, I felt like no
one was watching us. I felt like we were very free
there. However, it turns out they were
watching us. So how did your day end?
Tell me. So I walked away around 2:00 PM.
It was awesome. The whole day went so well.
However, as I was walking away, I hear this yelling and I

(22:56):
briefly turn around and I can nolonger see Joseph and I see all
these people around him. And I thought the yelling was
like joking because they saw us all day long, you know, no
issues. And I'm like, oh, he's fine.
They're just kidding with him talking about the prison
employees. And I keep walking and I get my

(23:16):
car and go after this. I did not hear from him for four
days. And at this point I was like,
maybe he's busy. Maybe he just wasn't a feeling
all of a sudden. Maybe it's getting too much.
So it's like, OK, maybe we just need to move on here.
Well, four days later, I get a call and I answer that phone
call. And the first thing he says is

(23:37):
they took everything from me. What?
And I was in shock. I was like, what do you mean?
And he said after you walked away, they put me in handcuffs
and put me in the dungeon, whichis like the hole.
And I got some trouble. And then the next thing he says
was you're still coming to see me at our scheduled visit,

(23:58):
right? Because at the rodeo, we planned
another visit. And I was like, of course I'm
coming to see you. It doesn't matter that you're
not a trustee and they took it away from you.
That doesn't matter. I, I don't care because in his
mind he did tell me, I thought since I wasn't a trustee anymore
that you wouldn't want to be with me.

(24:18):
And I was like, that is crazy because I said it doesn't matter
if you're a trustee if you're not a trustee, at the end of the
day, you're still in prison. And I know that I didn't come to
see you because, oh, he's a trustee.
And that's the only reason I came to see you, because even
though you're an inmate, I wanted to meet you.

(24:41):
So at that point, our next visitcame.
And what I saw was shocking. When I walked in, I saw a screen
and him shackled in an orange jumpsuit.
And at that, yes, at that moment, I only have a second to
take it all in before they made me sit down.

(25:03):
And I thought to myself, Oh my God, I'm really in a prison.
Yeah. That was the first time I've
really ever processed I was in apenitentiary.
And you were dating someone who was incarcerated.
Yeah. Crazy.
I've never seen that. I've never seen my husband
shackled. When you said that just now, my
heart almost stopped. I can't imagine how that must

(25:26):
feel because I'm sure you loved him at this point and you're
seeing. Yeah, yeah.
And not only was he in the jumpsuit with the shackles, the
screen, he looks like a mess forsure.
Very disheveled. So like he's been through it and
he was sweating so much. It literally looks like he just

(25:46):
got out of the shower. That's how wet he was.
So in the hole and I guess the whole dungeon, it is very hot
and it's even though it was likeOctober, it's still really hot
in Louisiana. And I guess where he's at, it's
like a small confined space in the hole.
So you sweat and you're only allowed to leave one hour out of

(26:07):
23 hours. And I guess you could take a
shower. You could call people.
And in my head, I just saw you in street clothes.
Yeah, looking your back at your highest point.
And a few days later, we are notrock bottom and you're in a
jumpsuit shackle. That's so sad, how long was he
in the dungeon for? I would say like two or three

(26:32):
weeks before he got moved to a disciplinary camp.
In the documentary, is that the one where they go and do field
work and stuff? So in the documentary he was
moved to something called Camp DCamp D is mentioned in the
documentary and I didn't really catch that until I rewatched it.
While he was at Camp D, he didn't even get an opportunity

(26:55):
to work to go in the field. He was still at the bottom level
where they just keep you in the cell for 23 hours.
Wow. And you mentioned the trustee,
and I think a lot of people probably don't know what that
means. Can you elaborate about what it
is and how hard it is to actually get it?
Yeah. So a trustee is a trusted inmate

(27:17):
who has good behavior. You can trust them to do the
right thing, trust them to not try to escape, trust them to do
their job on their own without alot of supervision.
And it usually take 10 years. Joseph was able to make trustee
in about 8. And he was able to make it a

(27:37):
little sooner because he had a warden at Angola who was willing
to take a chance on him before he really hit his eligibility
date to become one. And the warden said, I want to
put my trust in you, do not break it.
And Joseph, that's how he was a trustee since 2008, 2009.

(27:58):
And you got to also be classified as a low risk
offender. And obviously being a trustee
when you get in trouble, your worst fear is getting your
status taken away. So that's kind of how they
promote good behavior continuously through the trustee
system is because when they takeit away, you could go into a

(28:20):
field, you could have a really bad job, you could be self
confined. But usually when you get in
trouble as a trustee, that's nota permanent status change.
You can work your way back up tobeing one.
Oh, OK, so it wasn't like he completely lost it.
It was temporary. Right.
Yeah, He lost it in total for three months.

(28:41):
Oh, lucky, because I mean, the amount of time and energy that
he would have put into getting it.
And then you said 2008 and this happened in 2023.
So he was able to maintain trustee for that long.
Yeah. Wow.
And it sounds like it's such a pride thing, something that he's
really proud of. Oh, yeah, for sure.

(29:02):
Even still to this day, he talksabout Angola.
I was this, I had this job and Angola is very unique or he had
a very good job there. A lot of freedoms.
And the other prisons in Louisiana don't have the exact
Angola system. So he's been a trustee at other
prisons. In 2023, when he left Angola, he

(29:25):
became a trustee at Elaine Hunt and the freedoms were not the
same. And that did backed his pride a
little bit. He would say, well, I Angola, I
was able to do this and that andthat.
Elaine Hunt, you're barely a trustee when you're a trustee.
And so the change in prison was definitely a lot for him, going

(29:46):
from all the freedoms as a trustee to becoming a different
type of trustee. And Elaine Hunt and then David
Wade, there's a different lifestyle for him for sure, that
messed with him a little bit. Right.
So that's why when he ended up in the dungeon and he said
they've taken everything away from him, they really took
everything from him because thisreally is so important.

(30:07):
Yeah, they took everything from his status to his belongings to
even his clothes because he was in the orange, so.
How did your relationship develop during that time?
Did you guys get stronger? Yeah, and this is so crazy to me
because you would think when it's very new and the pressure
is so high and it's stressful and there's a lot of unknowns

(30:29):
that that would break people. But even though he only could
Call Me Maybe once or twice a day for three months, those one
to two phone calls, I made sure I answered no matter what.
And we always, every single day of those three months, except
for one day, we talk because I knew this is the only chance
that he has today to call me. So I have to be around my phone.

(30:50):
My phone was attached to me all the time in those three months,
just in case, and we actually got so much closer.
And I think 1 silver lining to this campy dungeon experience
was it really made us stronger and closer so much faster than I
think we would have gotten if hewas a trustee.
Yeah. And I think the fact that you

(31:11):
stayed through those difficulties, like going and
visiting him, knowing it would just be through a screen, Yeah.
And then the limited contact, a lot of people, and I know my
husband says this too, is that alot of times women just drop off
in that moment. Yeah, that was his concern
Joseph. When he called me right after
the roadie like 4 days later, that was his concern because he

(31:33):
said he'll be so mad if I say this.
I'll say anyway, you could hear him start to cry on the phone
and he said do you still want tobe with me?
So your husband's definitely right that that thought did go
through Joseph's head. Yeah, and I was talking to
another guy that's incarcerated and he's a lifer and he's like

(31:55):
the change that when you find a good woman and you know you
found a good woman, he's like the impact that you can have on
this man's life is next level. Like you can't compare it to
outside. Yeah.
That's such a different so the thought of him losing you, it
must have destroyed him. So to have you stay, I can

(32:15):
imagine it makes sense that yourrelationship would solidify so
much in those moments. Yeah, yeah, I think that he
probably was a nervous wreck forthose four days he didn't call.
And you were too, though. Yes, I was.
I was like, what happened? Did he not like me anymore?
Did he ghost me? Is he just too busy?

(32:37):
I had all these things go through my head.
And I at the time, I was friendswith somebody who was also a
prison wife in Louisiana. And they said, do you think he's
under investigation? And I'm like, he didn't do
anything. Well, it turns out he was.
Yeah. So he had been incarcerated for
quite a long time when you guys met.
Is this the first big relationship that he's been in

(32:58):
or had he dated previously? So I am actually Facebook
friends with someone. They both said they didn't
really date. They went to visit him a few
times. So we'll call it a little sling.
This sling was like a few monthsand it happened in 2012.
Right now she is living her bestlife, married and has kids and

(33:19):
I'm happy for her, but aside of that there has been no
relationship ever. Wow.
And because he was so young, howold was he when he was
incarcerated? 17. 17 So him being a juvenile
offender and you met him when hewas in his late 30s or early
40s, right? So he basically grew up there.

(33:42):
Yeah, he went in at 17 and I methim when he was 40.
Yeah. It's crazy.
And so my husband has been in for 14 years and his track
record at the beginning was not the greatest.
He's only very recently, we're talking in the last year and a
half, two years, decided to change his life and be positive.

(34:03):
But your fiance has really stuckit pretty much since the
beginning, correct? So prior to O 9, Joseph said he
was a fighter when he was 17, his teenage years in Angola.
He was not the best person to bearound.
In fact he fought so much they put him on the boxing team.

(34:26):
So up until 2009, he was not a joy to be around for sure, and
he definitely was doing the most.
And what made him change? He discovered his passion for
animals and horses that really it actually was therapeutic to
him. He says it helped him stop
getting so mad, stop being angry.

(34:47):
And he said, I knew in order to be around those horses, I needed
to maintain a trustee status. And that means not acting out.
So it's really the motivator forhim was the ability to have all
those freedoms and to be around horses.
That did change him a lot. And because he basically grew up

(35:08):
in there, I'm curious about because you said at the
beginning that you had been previously married.
How do you think that he's different than men that haven't
been incarcerated or haven't grown up in the prison system?
Do you find there's a lot of difference?
I do my my ex-husband. He's actually from Louisiana as
well so apparently Louisiana menare attracted to me but he is.

(35:31):
Joseph is so different from someone who's free, especially
men. I have never met a man who is
such a good communicator, or someone who takes direction or
understands boundaries or wants to work through problems without
yelling. Joseph has never yelled at me.
Now I have yelled at him as me. Yeah.

(35:56):
So he is so calm. He always wants to work through
things. He never gives up on the
relationship. He's never told me this is too
much. It's just like day and night.
And I always talk about this with my friends who also have
somebody in jail or prison. And it's crazy that all these
men in prison get, like, bad raps about them when Joseph is

(36:19):
the best man I've met. So I'm like, how is someone who
is classified as a violent offender and has been in prison
for 25 years out doing all the men I've met out here?
Yeah, I know. It's weird.
I still don't understand it. Yeah, and there is a large age
gap between you guys. Did that ever become an issue
for you? No, so I actually talked to

(36:41):
Joseph about this. I joke with him that he's an old
man and he's like, you know, 14 years is not really that many
years. I'm like, yeah, it is Joseph.
I said when you got arrested I was 3.
Just so we can process that. It's never been a problem.
And I always tell him either I'mmature or you are immature.

(37:04):
We haven't figured out which oneyet.
I love it. So it hasn't really bothered you
guys, but it did get you into anarticle, correct?
It did, yeah. So I was in one of those Kristen
White Facebook groups and I guess the reporter got in from
The Sun newspaper and she messaged me and she said, hi,

(37:26):
Carla, I'm a reporter from The Sun newspaper and I saw 'cause I
like introduce myself on the Facebook page.
So she was looking through all them.
I saw your introduction and The Sun is interested in writing
about you because you have something unique.
And what I've noticed a pattern of that usually the woman is
older or they're the same age asthe man, but you're one of the

(37:50):
few who is substantially youngerthan the man in prison.
I would like to write about it. So I actually have never really
noticed ages of people when I went to visit or even in the
prison groups until that was brought to my attention through
the reporter and I started to get more observant.
And I do notice that either the ages are very close together or

(38:12):
the woman is older. Trey Rare, you see a younger
woman with a man in prison. And honestly, I hate that that's
a stereotype for prison wives. They say, oh, they're older,
they're desperate, they're overweight.
And I hate that that's a stereotype for us because it's
not true exactly. But yes, that is the reason that

(38:34):
the son was interested in writing about us.
That's crazy, but you're right. And after we talked to you the
first time, we were like, is there anyone in our community,
in our circle or that we've met so far that's husband or
boyfriend is older than them? And you're right.
Yeah, I think you're the only one.
Yeah, usually I see maybe they're like two or three years

(38:55):
apart or the woman is like 5 years plus older than him, which
I did also notice that a majority of my friends in the
prison life community are older than me too.
You know what? I noticed that too.
And you are young. You're younger than me too.
Yeah, but it is true that most of them are older even than me.
And like me and my husband, I'm technically older than him, but

(39:17):
by like 9 months. But other than that, I don't.
Yeah, it's mostly a couple yearsolder or more.
It's weird how that happens. And I don't know why because out
here I've always or mostly datedpeople that were older than me.
And when the reporter interviewed you, what was that
like? Was it like pretty
straightforward? Was it weird?
Were they invasive? No, so they were super nice.

(39:41):
Our article was in the Sun, UKUS, Ireland, Scotland and
Australia and then it was boughtby a magazine called The Closer
and that's Life, which are UK based.
And the whole process was honestly great.
I was a little hesitant because I've heard horror stories about,

(40:02):
but they interview you, you do the interview and all of a
sudden they're writing about something that you would didn't
even said and take it. Context.
But in all the articles there were three.
They actually sent the article to me to approve before they
published it, which I appreciate.
It. Yeah, for real.
And they said if there's anything you're uncomfortable

(40:23):
with, anything you want us to take out to reword, just let us
know. And I told them some changes I
wanted in the articles and they made those changes and they were
posted. They didn't say anything that
they weren't supposed to say or twist anything, or they didn't
make it like headline catching, of course, because that's their
job. But outside of that, they were

(40:46):
really upfront and honest about their work.
And I agree, I love the article and we will post it so people
can read it because it is reallynice and the pictures are really
beautiful. Even though they probably didn't
take them, you took them. Yes.
And it's just really representednicely, so I really liked it.
So then out of everything and looking through your

(41:07):
relationship, what would you sayis the hardest thing that you've
gone through so far? The hardest thing we've gone
through is parole. So a law was changed in
Louisiana where you have to be 3years right up free to be
eligible for parole and it was in July that law changed.

(41:29):
We were under the assumption that his parole eligibility
would be in 2025 and since that law changed, it was changed to
2026. And we did get some wrong info
as well which made it even worsethat his parole eligibility
wasn't until 2028. But that's incorrect.
So at that time I heard 20/26/2028.

(41:52):
I heard both numbers and all I could think about was like, OK,
but it's not in 2025. I don't care if it's in 2026 or
2028. It's not this year.
And I was prepared for 2025. And when I learned that it has
changed, I literally cried all day.
And a majority of my prison friends, my friends have

(42:13):
significant others who are life without parole.
And I didn't really want to tellthem my problem because, I mean,
I'm sure they would have been super sympathetic and
understanding. But to say that to somebody who
some of their husbands are on death row, no parole eligibility

(42:34):
at all, I kind of had to keep itto myself because I didn't want
to be that person, have a mentalbreakdown over that.
So that was the hardest thing. I told Joseph I need some time
to myself during that day when Ifound out, but call me at 7:00
PM because Joseph is new to relationship.
So if I just said I just need time to myself, he would have

(42:56):
thought the worst. Like, Oh my God, he's never
going to answer my phone call again.
He's gone. And even though I told him call
me at 7:00, he still thought theworst.
He still thought I was leaving him.
So that was probably the hardestthing we've been through because
it's not a write up. It's not like, oh, you got in
trouble, your status got taken away.

(43:18):
That's really like our life, theparole eligibility date.
So that was a really hard thing to get through.
But I will say second place to that was his last transfer
happened December 15th. And the holidays are hard in
general with like you see everyone out here with their

(43:40):
families and their husbands or their wives and their kids and
like your person is in prison. And then he called me December
15th and is like, hey, I don't know when you'll hear from me
again because they're shipping me out like a week before
Christmas. So that means I couldn't even
visit him for Christmas or in January.
How to wait till February? It was a rough time.

(44:02):
Yeah, it's so impactful when youlose touch with your loved one
and you can't see them when anticipated.
And yeah, no control. Yeah.
And I think why that transfer inDecember was so hard was because
the previous year he was transferred in November and I
couldn't see him for November orDecember or January.

(44:25):
So this was the second Christmasin a row that I could not see
him. So that's also what triggered me
in that one. Yeah, and what can you do?
Because it's not his fault, but yet you're still upset.
Same thing with the parole. It's not his fault, but you're
still upset. So how do you do that?
So with the transfers, he was able to have immediate family

(44:46):
come visit him, but I'm the onlyperson who comes to visit him
and I am not related to him so Iam not immediate family.
So he has no visitors during theholidays.
So it was very traumatic. And then you have the fact that
people are trying to be like Merry Christmas all the time,
Christmas music, and you're liketrying to be happy and you just

(45:10):
can't. Yeah.
Be happy. I had the same problem.
I was supposed to get married onChristmas Day and then they
cancelled it and they cancelled my visit and all that stuff.
And you're just like, I don't want to be around anybody.
And I had people inviting me to their dinners and stuff and
super grateful for it for sure. But it was like, I can't, like
I'm just going to bring down thewhole mood because it's crushing

(45:30):
exactly the one person you want to see.
You can't. And yeah, it's like a adjustment
that you have to make because it's not your fault that you
can't see your loved 1. And when you were speaking about
that whole thing about your friends being lifers, my
husband's a lifer. I go through the opposite side
because I'll have friends that AJ, for example, her boyfriend,

(45:54):
this law might be changing and it makes him eligible for parole
immediately. OK.
And she's like, telling me aboutit and she's super excited about
it. But then she's like, I feel bad,
like, talking to you about this because of the situation you're
in. And I'm like, yeah, but I'm
really excited. I hope Dee gets out.
Dee has earned it, right? So yeah, it's hard because she

(46:15):
felt the same as you. She didn't want to be that
person. But at the same time, I'm like,
no, that's OK. Like I made this choice to
marrying a man who's deserving alife without parole.
Right. Right.
I understand that's gonna be a minute before he gets out, but
it's so tricky because you're right.
It's almost like, it reminds me of like people who are trying to
conceive and then have families and it's sensitive, right?

(46:39):
That's a sensitive. Oh, for sure.
Topic. So what are your guides?
Future plans? So this is one of the benefits
about me being so much younger. Yeah, our ability to have a
family will come true when he's parole.
So that's not a concern. And we plan to get married.
It could be in two weeks actually.

(46:59):
So I will keep you updated on that.
Yeah. Do you plan on living in
Louisiana? How we do it right now, if he's
forced to live in Louisiana, we'll live there.
If he's not forced, he can transfer.
We will not live there. OK.
Are you worried at all about himcoming home?
So I feel like as an MWI, you always have those worries in the

(47:23):
back of your mind. It's always that 1%.
And especially because you can hear all the bad stories and you
have people out here who tell you like, they're never
rehabilitated, they're violent people and all those things.
And it can just get to you. Like it really can.
Like Joseph is always like, oh, but that's not us.

(47:43):
But I'm like, but you don't liveit.
You don't see the comment on Facebook.
You don't hear what people say. So I do have a 1% concern.
I'm like, is he going to be the same person that I know when he
gets out? When you take away the guards
and the cameras and the supervision and the monitoring,
which me and him have actually set boundaries and these

(48:06):
boundaries were recently creatednot because he was breaking
them, but because of our upcoming marriage.
We are signing a prenuptial agreement and in the agreement
has boundaries that I've set forhim.
And they're things that I would have problems with, like him
getting a visit from a random female without letting me know.

(48:30):
Let's see him going to a strip club when he gets out.
Just things that would bother me.
Yeah, and you put them in the prenup?
So we, I did. Wow, yes, I did.
Because I told him this isn't just a financial prenup.
I want you to know the things that you cannot do that would
really hurt me in this contract.And he read through it.

(48:51):
We read through it together. I did have to break some things
down to him, but I did have to break things down.
Especially when you've been locked up that long, you've
never had a chance to experiencelife or even hear the word
prenuptial or post nuptial or see a wedding ceremony.
So we did have to do some explaining.

(49:12):
But in that prenup, that's whereI laid down the ground rules so
we do not have any miscommunication.
And when I was doing this, I waslike, this is the first time
I've actually ever told any man like straight up what would
bother me. And it felt nice doing that
knowing that I knew he wasn't going to like freak out or yell,

(49:33):
probably at most just need some explanation behind it.
But it all went well. And I would say to anyone who is
an MWI who has some concerns about the future is maybe not go
to being as a prenuptial. You could just write down a list
of boundaries that you have and you expect those boundaries to

(49:54):
be respected in prison and outside of prison.
I agree. I think when Nick and I didn't
sign a prenuptial, and we thought about it and we talked a
lot about it, yeah, But we had so many hours of conversation
around exactly what you said, like different boundaries,
different feelings about different things, different
anticipations, because you neverknow.

(50:15):
And Nick served a long time. He hasn't served 25 years.
But if he might be, by the time he comes out, who knows what
we're going to face. It's going to be hard.
The adjustment, the anxieties, the fears.
It's crazy. And we're MWI also, which is met
well incarcerated for those people that don't know what that
is. So yeah, it is super important.

(50:35):
I agree with you. And I love the idea that you
ironed out not only financial but also emotional and
expectations to your marriage. That's cool.
Yeah, for sure. I think even in marriages out
here, those are more used for finances.
But I created mine for a little bit of finances, but more for
like behaviors. I feel like people should do

(50:57):
this more out here. Same.
It's a great way to put things all on the table before you get
into a marriage. You're acknowledging what you're
signing, everyone understands, so you're not married and all of
a sudden you're having problems and boundaries.
Right. And expectations.
And as you're talking, I'm thinking about the people that I
know that have prenuptial agreements and I'm like, wow, I

(51:20):
think those are the happiest marriages that I know because
they did have one, they did havea conversation, which is
interesting. So yeah, for sure you have a
good friend who's going to come on here who's met before
incarcerated. So MBI.
Yeah. Yep.
Do you find that your relationships are different
because there's so much talk about MBI versus MWI?

(51:43):
Yes. And I've actually, I've met her
in person. I've heard her talking on the
phone to her husband. So I know quite a bit about them
and I would say a big differenceis some of the problems that may
arise. So with my friend, her husband
who is in jail right now, they lived a life together.

(52:04):
So they went to bars together, to places, experience things
together. So I think when you have done
that and then it's taken away from you, both people have a
hard time. I think that the free person has
a hard time because they just remember the memories and it's
so sad and it's hard for them tocontinue life without you.

(52:26):
And then the person in jail may feel like, why are you there
without me? And obviously have the worst
fears I probably could have. What happens if they find
someone else? What happens if they get hurt
and I'm not there to help them? All those things versus me and
Joseph. And you've never experienced any
of those things together. So we don't have the concept of,

(52:46):
oh, I saw your old friends at the bar I went to.
We don't have those issues and that type of situation.
We also don't have the stress. And my heart goes out to her and
her husband because I can't evenimagine the stress they're under
with the initial jail intake, tothe lawyer, to the pretrial, the

(53:09):
trial, the sentencing. Then he has to go to a prison
and through the take process again.
And you may not know how long you'll hear from him.
And then you have in Louisiana, in jail, you don't have in
person visits. They're 15 minute visits over a
video once a week. And that would crush me alone,
I'm not going to lie. But then with MWI, you may not

(53:31):
have those type of pressures that you have re entry pressure.
You have parole requirement. And they will also have that
too. Yeah, sometime down the road.
Me and her were actually talkingabout this concept yesterday.
And I also feel like in my case,I met Joseph at the tail end of

(53:53):
his time before he could be eligible for parole.
I met him around his 23 year mark and he needs 25 years and
he made 25 years this year. So I didn't have to experience
those 23 years and the ups and downs and him getting used to
jail and used to prison. I walked in to a seasoned inmate

(54:14):
who's been there for decades. So I didn't have to experience
those types of hardship. But then also, I feel like with
an MWI, you always have the unknown of.
I wonder what they'll be like out here.
You have to somehow learn about their past life.
Like I always want to know aboutJoseph's past life.

(54:34):
And I don't know what he looks like before the age of 20.
There's no photos of him. Seriously.
Yeah. His family don't have any photos
to him. The only picture I have of him
is at 20 years old and it's his mug shot when he got to Angola
because he was in jail prior to that.
I don't even have his initial mug shot photo when he was 17.

(54:55):
I just know what he looked like when he was 2028, sometime in
his 30s and in his 40s. So there's a lot of gaps missing
and I just want to get to know that person.
He also doesn't have any friendsthat he kept outside of prison
who knew him growing up. So that's really hard when that
happens because you're kind of cut off at the age of 20 and now

(55:16):
you're just living in suspense. Like what were you like?
Though? I would say that's the hard
part. But then also with an MBI like
you may have known them going into jail or prison, but those
experiences can change people and that person getting out
might not be the same person whowent in.
Yeah, that's what exactly what Iwas thinking as you were
speaking because we spoke to a guy a couple weeks ago and he

(55:39):
was saying, like you, it doesn'tmatter who that person was when
they went in, they're not going to be the person when they come
out. And that needs to be known and
emphasized because it don't matter if you knew them or you
didn't. They're a new person and they
come out right and you have to adjust.
Life changing. Yeah, and he's like people who

(55:59):
met while you're incarcerated. You've never seen him walk down
the street before. You've never seen him interact
at a Walmart with crowd. You've gotten a little bit more
because of the rodeo. But he's right.
I've never seen Nick outside SO.Yeah, and I think even at the
rodeo there's still cameras, still guards, so it's not
completely free, but it's the freest example I will have.

(56:24):
And how would you say this experience has changed you?
I have became so strong, so sympathetic for somebody.
And I say that because prior to this I was definitely the person
to be like, lock them up and throw away the key.
No sympathy. And I hate saying that now

(56:44):
because now that I know so much about prisons and Department of
Corrections and how things are not what they seem to be.
And like, wow, Carla, that was really close minded back then.
And Joseph even knows how I usedto be like, everyone in prison
is guilty. That's how I used to think.
And I used to be like those correctional officers, they're

(57:05):
risking their lives. They're probably the greatest
people. They probably have great morals,
every single one of them. That's how I thought.
Now there are CE OS who really have a passion for corrections.
I don't want someone to get thattwisted.
Just like there's passionate teachers, passionate cops,
passionate players, there are those.
But like any other job, I have learned there are corrupt

(57:29):
people. Yeah.
And I actually used to be like, for maximum sentences until I
met Joseph Cool. And I heard his story.
The story I heard was what the documentary said.
So it does not look good for someone who's like maximum
penalties because they just exaggerate auto robbery,
kidnapping. And for someone who was so for

(57:53):
long term sentences and harsh conditions, in that moment, it's
like I don't even know who I waswhen I was like, I don't even
care. I need to talk to this man.
And that moment when I was able to look past those convictions
and still send that e-mail, I think that was a life changing
experience for me. And overall it really has opened

(58:15):
up my eyes as to why we should question sentences and question
judges and look things over. I think every 10 years people
should be able to have their case reevaluated and re looked
at and maybe the sentence is tooextreme.
Maybe the juvenile shouldn't have had such a long sentence.
Have some sympathy. And I definitely have evolved

(58:39):
for sure. It made me more open minded.
I have become friendly with people who've gotten out of
Angola knowing that they potentially could have murdered
somebody. I don't care.
I'm like, look, we all make mistakes.
You proved that you're rehabilitated, and that's all
that matters. And the old Carla would have

(59:00):
been like, Oh my God, stay away from my person.
I actually love that you said that, all those things because.
And I was never someone who's like Max Sentence.
But it's important to be honest about what we think.
And it's also enlightening because it makes me feel as
you're talking, that it's possible to change someone's
opinion, you know, and that we don't know what we don't know

(59:23):
until you know. And then once you know, you're
like, oh, wait a minute. And I did have similar kind of
hesitations when it comes to someone who's taken a life
because, yeah, they've taken a life.
Like this is a big deal. And I remember early on in my
relationship, I told him that I never wanted to talk to someone
who had actually taken a life. And then it so happened that I

(59:45):
did. And he was like, you just.
And I was like, oh, and I remember the first time I was
super uncomfortable and almost judging this person, right, that
I really didn't know. And then when I had this
interview with someone who's incarcerated, who had taken a
life, and then he told me he's like, you just had a full on
interview with someone who had taken a life.
And I'm like, wow. You're right.

(01:00:07):
And yet this interview was so insightful and this person
hasn't grown so much and there'sso much knowledge and they've
helped me so much along this journey.
And it just puts it all into perspective that it's awful and
we don't want to take away from victims.
And that whole experience is so crushing and the whole thing
around it, but we have to also look at the whole circumstance

(01:00:29):
around that person and what theywent through to get them to that
place where they made this, yeah, grave mistake.
For sure the people who got out of Angola, I have messaged them
having a panic attack, I've asked them for help, I've asked
them questions, what do things mean?
How do I get things done? And they have always been so

(01:00:49):
helpful to me and considering tothe world they are a felon and
convicted murderers. I'm just like these people need
pardons because I'm not scared of these people.
I would feel comfortable with them and they're willing to get
me the answers I need and assistme and I think about it's a
shame at the world will always label you as a convicted felon

(01:01:14):
when I can see they have good hearts and even my mind has even
changed on the death penalty. I used to be pro death penalty
and let's execute them sooner rather than later until I was
educated on the death penalty and how there's been quite a few
people on death row who actuallydid not commit the crime.

(01:01:34):
Yeah, or not enough evidence, even if you think they did
right, even this year, it's beena bad year.
And there are some people that have been executed where it's
questionable enough that, you know, these governors and these
prisons, they're playing God, basically, and choosing to end
someone's life, which is equallyas bad as what happened, right?

(01:01:56):
I just feel like it's not our job as humans to do that unless
maybe if it's absolutely known and whatever, different story.
But yeah, it's interesting. And I love how people are able
to grow and we're able to grow. And I agree with you.
And it doesn't mean that there aren't monsters out there.
It doesn't mean that there are people that shouldn't be in
there forever. But the option should be
available. Yeah, I think that's the concept

(01:02:19):
that going from one extreme to anew viewpoint.
But there are bad people in person who do deserve to be
there, but there also are peoplewho have changed their lives.
And I'm not sure if you've ever thought this through, but I'm
like, if only I was there the day that this crime went down, I
could have stopped him knowing Iwas literally 3 years old.

(01:02:41):
I think it's myself. If only I was there, I could
have stopped this. Or sometimes I know this sounds
so selfish, especially for an MWI, but I'm like, how could you
do this to me? Like why are you in prison?
Why did you do this to me? And I know that sounds like
crazy considering I signed up for it, but I still think that

(01:03:03):
I'm like why did you have to do this?
Me too. I find myself a lot like.
I wish I would have known you because I would have done
everything in my power. I would have taken out every
loan. I would have sold anything.
I literally would have done anything for you to get a good
lawyer because your lawyer is the reason you're incarcerated.
It's ridiculous that you're eventhere.

(01:03:23):
But to him, he's like, yeah, I would do it all over again
because I was a criminal. And he's like, yes, I did not
commit a murder. There's no question.
But he's like, I doesn't mean that I wasn't a bad person.
I just gotten out of prison for burglary.
I wasn't doing great things. And he's like, if I didn't have
these 14 years in prison, who knows what I would have been

(01:03:44):
doing. Maybe I would have actually
killed someone. But yeah, I think about it all
the time. I'm like, I wish I would have
been there. You wouldn't be incarcerated.
I would have given my soul to pay a lawyer to get you off on
this, but right, Everything happens for a reason.
Exactly. Anyways, we've talked on about
so many different things, but isthere anything else that you

(01:04:05):
want the world to know about Joseph before we go?
So Joseph at Angola was known tobe not the friendliest person,
kind of a loner to himself, would socialize here and there.
But I need the world to know. And anyone who has been locked
up with Joseph, he is the sweetest person I ever met in my

(01:04:29):
life and I can't wait for girls to know who that sweet Joseph
is. And the documentary, can you
name which episode it is? Yes it is Louisiana lockdown.
You can watch the whole thing onDiscovery Plus and Joseph's
episode is episode 2 prison suicide and it does go into a

(01:04:53):
little bit of episode 3. I'm not sure what episode 3's
title is though. So me and Nick watched it
because it was on Animal Planet and you had mentioned it, so we
watched it together. He really enjoyed it and he told
all the guys in there that they all had to watch it too because
you were going to be on the podcast.
It's usually on Animal Plant once a month and they usually

(01:05:17):
air 2 episodes but one of them is always Joseph's episode and
the second episode is just a random 1.
So I don't know why they always air Joseph's episode with a
random episode. But I told Joseph it's a shame
that you can't get royalties forthis.
Right. It was a great episode.

(01:05:38):
Well, thank you so much for joining me.
I loved talking. To you, thank you for having me.
You're welcome. Take care.
All right, you too.